Latest / Half the Picture / #31 - MICHAEL SOCHA

Transcript

#31 - MICHAEL SOCHA · Half the Picture

• 0:00
  What I do naturally is just try and enjoy myself on set.
• 0:03
  I'm a bit of a joke, I suppose, and a bit of a piss-taker.
• 0:06
  Well, I think that's the way I would cope with movie nerves,
• 0:08
  because I'm terrified, ultimately, all the time.
• 0:10
  Other than action, and then I'm just sort of in a weird sort of blissful state,
• 0:14
  and then they go caught, and then I'm back to being a bit of an obad, I think.
• 0:26
  Hello, Michael. Welcome to Afterpicture. How you doing today, sir?
• 0:28
  Yeah, Remor, I thank you. Can you really ice cream van?
• 0:31
  I can't. You know what? I can't air a little bit of an ice cream van.
• 0:34
  Give us a second. I'm going to go and get an ice cream.
• 0:39
  Yeah, I'm good, mate. I'm good. I'm really good. How are you doing?
• 0:41
  I'm doing very well. It's a real pleasure to have you on the show,
• 0:44
  because I've been aware of your work and I've found of your work for years.
• 0:48
  I mean, going back to the Shea Meadows, this is England days.
• 0:50
  So, yeah, such a pleasure.
• 0:52
  Oh, nice one. Well, thank you for having me. Cheers.
• 0:54
  No worries. So, I mean, to give people the idea of the stuff you've done,
• 0:57
  I mean, you've worked with so many people. I mean, I just mentioned Shane there,
• 1:00
  but the breadth of work you've done across your career is fantastic.
• 1:03
  You know, this is England being human as well.
• 1:06
  Another fantastic show. You know, once by the time of Wonderland,
• 1:09
  Chernobyl, the toxic town, Gallows Pole. I mean, like, you know, your work is fantastic.
• 1:14
  And of course, you've got the cage coming out with Sheridan Smith.
• 1:16
  I guess that's your next big thing you've got coming out, is that right?
• 1:19
  Yeah, I'll be out soon, I think.
• 1:21
  Yeah, end of the month, I want to say.
• 1:23
  Yeah, is it the 20th? Are we allowed to say 26th?
• 1:26
  I don't know. That's it.
• 1:27
  That's what Lydia said. So, I think we're good.
• 1:29
  We're all right with that one. Cool. Yeah, 26th, then.
• 1:31
  26th of April.
• 1:32
  We're all good. Yeah.
• 1:33
  So, yeah, I mean, you're an actor who seems to, you know,
• 1:35
  know very much what they're doing and is, you know,
• 1:37
  is obviously greater what you do.
• 1:39
  And I guess there's a kickoff question.
• 1:41
  Quite, I guess quite a broad question.
• 1:42
  But like, what would you say makes a good actor?
• 1:45
  What would you say makes a good actor?
• 1:47
  Well, I mean, I can only say what I think,
• 1:50
  what I enjoy when I watch an actor is basically,
• 1:53
  I've got to believe him.
• 1:55
  I think what makes a good actor is somebody that an audience will believe
• 1:59
  in sometimes very bizarre, odd, unrealistic circumstances sometimes.
• 2:06
  I mean, that's just me.
• 2:07
  That's what, when I look at actors and I make a judgment,
• 2:11
  I suppose it's always about whether I believe them or not.
• 2:13
  That's the key thing.
• 2:14
  So, if believability and kind of authenticity is the key.
• 2:17
  I think so. Yeah.
• 2:19
  And is that what you strive for across like all the work you've done?
• 2:22
  100% I think I always try and make it as believable as a can.
• 2:29
  But I suppose when I approach a role,
• 2:32
  I always try and believe what's being said to that character
• 2:37
  or myself or whatever I want to do to him.
• 2:41
  So, I think a lot of the time,
• 2:45
  if I'm working with a really good actor and I can really believe what they're saying
• 2:49
  and I'll try and respond adequately and appropriately to the situation.
• 2:55
  And that's how I've always tried to do things.
• 2:57
  And I think that was sort of taught to me when I went to the ITV workshop years ago.
• 3:05
  It was all about believing what's going on.
• 3:08
  And there's the old saying acting is reacting.
• 3:11
  But I think a lot of the time it's true.
• 3:12
  If you can just really figure out,
• 3:14
  I'll create a way to believe that you're in the same situation as you character
• 3:23
  than I could be audience do believe you.
• 3:25
  Yeah, because you started acting for quite an early age, I want to say.
• 3:27
  Because you brought up in Derby and then you discovered acting quite an early age.
• 3:32
  I mean, how did you discover it?
• 3:35
  So it's a really long story.
• 3:36
  But there was a school production of books in my life when I was in
• 3:44
  year six, I remember it.
• 3:45
  And I really wanted to play Bugsy.
• 3:47
  But I didn't get the part of Bugsy.
• 3:49
  I got a part of Knuckles, but I enjoyed that.
• 3:52
  I had a great time and it was something that I'd never done before.
• 3:54
  And I'm not from like an acting background or it wasn't anything that I'd even thought about.
• 4:02
  Until I saw the Bugsy Milo musical and they were doing it at a school and I was like,
• 4:07
  I wanted to, I remember watching the film at school.
• 4:13
  The teacher was like, right, we're doing this this year.
• 4:15
  Watch this film.
• 4:17
  And I remember me and my best mate at the time were just, that's so cool,
• 4:21
  just bloody gangsters and guns.
• 4:23
  And then I auditioned for it, I didn't get it.
• 4:26
  And I was really disappointed actually.
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  And I couldn't wrap quite a grip on why I was so disappointed.
• 4:32
  But me mum, then she looked at the Derby even in telegraph and saw that there was a
• 4:37
  an amateur dramatic production of Bugsy Milo and I should go for it.
• 4:46
  It just wasn't really my world when I was 11, 12.
• 4:50
  It just wasn't, I think that I don't know, considered or thought.
• 4:54
  It just went really like cool, I don't think, when I was that age.
• 4:58
  But I auditioned for it anyway and I got the part of Bugsy and then that was it.
• 5:02
  And I just, I started doing plays.
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  I started, I did a couple for the Derby Youth Theatre.
• 5:08
  And then when I was 14, I auditioned for the, it was then called The Carlton Workshop.
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  And eventually I'd got in.
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  I didn't get in the first time.
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  They put me in the reserve group whatever it was.
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  And then I remember getting the information.
• 5:23
  I think it was like new years one day, one year.
• 5:26
  And they told me that I was in the group when I was just, I was buzzing.
• 5:30
  And then from there, I learned so much and worked so many amazing actors.
• 5:36
  But a lot of casting directors and directors would use the workshop to get the kids.
• 5:42
  And I think I was really lucky at that time there was a lot of independent films
• 5:46
  knocking about in short films and I'd done enough by 18 to get an agent who I've been with ever since.
• 5:56
  And would you say acting became a kind of escape for you?
• 5:58
  Because reading about how you started and where you came from in Derby,
• 6:03
  quite a very working class environment.
• 6:05
  Sometimes could be quite a tough environment for what I understand.
• 6:08
  Did acting kind of provide a kind of escape from that sometimes?
• 6:11
  Or 100%.
• 6:12
  Like I said, I was quite, I was embarrassed when I first started acting.
• 6:20
  Because I mean there was sort of football or boxing or
• 6:23
  other sort of things that you do outside of school that were considered normal.
• 6:27
  But I quite enjoyed acting.
• 6:29
  And between the sort of group of friends that I had, it wasn't normal.
• 6:33
  And I was quite embarrassed to begin with.
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  But eventually it was just like who I was and what I like doing.
• 6:40
  And there isn't very many opportunities for that sort of stuff in Derby.
• 6:45
  I mean there is acting classes, but you have to pay for them.
• 6:50
  And I'm always under the impression that
• 6:55
  especially when you're young you say sort of kids that have got a bit of die,
• 6:58
  we've got a bit of money behind them who's found me can sort of
• 7:01
  afford a spot in a, you know, I don't know, a theatre school or whatever you
• 7:07
  want to call it.
• 7:10
  I just, yeah, I was just a little bit, it was a bit hard.
• 7:16
  It was another thing to do and people never really got it until I got
• 7:19
  a bit older and it was just like I said, it became part of who I was.
• 7:24
  And you mentioned there the workshops you did because I know that you went to,
• 7:27
  so I think when you were 14 you eventually went down to Nottingham
• 7:30
  and joined the television workshop there which was kind of quite famous.
• 7:34
  I mean a lot of actors came for there like Samantha Morton and Vicki McClure.
• 7:37
  I mean, what did you learn there?
• 7:39
  What did that teach you about acting?
• 7:41
  Again, it was the truth behind acting.
• 7:45
  But also it was the fun and being around like-minded people and people with
• 7:49
  the sort of similar, with the similar backgrounds of yourself.
• 7:53
  But we do, you do plays, you do, you really sort of get to the bottom of every intention,
• 7:59
  of every scene.
• 8:00
  You do the work a lot at the time, but also you know, you'd be taking on weird camps,
• 8:04
  not weird camps, but like, you've been taking on trips to go and see this play or
• 8:11
  you know, a musical group come in and teach out and play drums.
• 8:15
  It was just, there was all sorts of activities going on at workshop and it was all
• 8:19
  for free, you didn't have to pay for it.
• 8:21
  But I think at the bare bones of it, it was just learning how to
• 8:24
  how to put yourself in that situation.
• 8:30
  But you tried different techniques, you never go with different things,
• 8:33
  but at the core of it all, it was just sort of putting your own personality in the scene.
• 8:39
  And it was only when you were, it wasn't that long after that that you landed your first,
• 8:43
  I guess you could say, major role in this is England, right?
• 8:45
  As Harvey, I want to say you were about 18 when you did that?
• 8:49
  Well, when I did the film.
• 8:50
  Yeah.
• 8:51
  Yeah, I think I was 16, 17, 16, 17, which is, yeah, which is amazing.
• 8:56
  I mean, am I right in thinking that Shane, that you didn't even have to audition for Shane
• 9:00
  for that role? It just kind of came together.
• 9:04
  I didn't have to audition.
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  I remember Ian Smith at the workshop was saying, oh, you've got a part in the film.
• 9:11
  So this is the other thing.
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  I think when I went to workshop, there was no real,
• 9:17
  it wasn't like something you'd go to and think I'm going to be in films.
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  It was sort of then you went to for a, for a fall.
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  It was something you went to because it was, it wasn't escape.
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  It was somewhere to go, somewhere to have a laugh with, with friends,
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  alongside doing something that you really love.
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  So there was no real expectation for getting roles.
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  It was just something you did for purely for fun, with
• 9:43
  there was no real risk to not immediately.
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  It had nothing to lose.
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  It was all just, you go there, have some fun.
• 9:49
  You might get cast, although I just keep going.
• 9:51
  You love fun anyway.
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  And Ian Smith, I think that word with Shane,
• 9:55
  and was like, I'm after, like Shane said, it was after a certain role.
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  And Ian was probably like, I've got the guy for you.
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  And then they ended up on, on, this is England.
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  But that was the first set I'd ever been on.
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  And I had no idea what to expect.
• 10:08
  What to expect.
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  I've been, I didn't know me where around the set.
• 10:12
  I really remember once I'm handing me coats to like a focus puller or something.
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  They're like a warm coat.
• 10:17
  I didn't know what to do with it.
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  I knew that I couldn't wear it for the scenes.
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  I was like, can you take that?
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  I don't know what to do with it.
• 10:23
  And just not known.
• 10:26
  I didn't realise that people did it for work.
• 10:31
  I didn't realise that all these people, all the crew did it as a job.
• 10:35
  I thought it was just a hobby that everyone quite enjoyed.
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  That everyone did in their spare time.
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  They've got a few weeks off.
• 10:40
  So let's make a film.
• 10:41
  I didn't know the people really got paid for it.
• 10:46
  But it was, I mean, I did, I think, three days on the film, this is England.
• 10:52
  And it was just fun.
• 10:53
  But also, it was a, what I've eventually learned was it was a different environment.
• 10:58
  It wasn't, I was lucky that I learned a lot of sort of script work with a workshop.
• 11:02
  But on this is England, there wasn't no script.
• 11:08
  But again, that was what workshop taught.
• 11:10
  It was improvisation.
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  One of the first things I ever did,
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  where I mean, even the audition process for workshop was all improv.
• 11:15
  We'd just go into a circle and you'd try and persuade someone to get out of a chair.
• 11:19
  Or you just have a laugh.
• 11:21
  You learn to have quite thick skin, I think, in that environment.
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  Because being that sort of young kids in an improvisational setting,
• 11:28
  you're going to start taking a piss out of people.
• 11:30
  You're going to sort of dig up people's locks, I suppose, and whatever.
• 11:36
  Well, you learn to have quite thick skin and be able to take one for the team for the sake of art.
• 11:43
  Because what's interesting to me, one of the main interesting things to me about
• 11:46
  like your work on this is England and with Shane, is that as I understand, Shane's sets are very,
• 11:50
  they're interesting because there's a lot of improvisation, as you say on set.
• 11:53
  There's a, they're famous for kind of the improvisational qualities and,
• 11:56
  and the work he does with his actors.
• 11:57
  I mean, what did you learn from Shane?
• 11:59
  Like, I mean, across all the work you've done together because you've,
• 12:01
  you obviously went on and had a great, you know, partnership beyond the film.
• 12:05
  But what would you say you've learned the biggest thing you've learned from him?
• 12:08
  Welcome. So actually, Shane gives you a lot of time.
• 12:11
  Shane, what I learned, I suppose more recently, Shane, I don't think he wants you to do something
• 12:19
  that you're not capable of doing in your normal life.
• 12:24
  It doesn't really expect you to act.
• 12:29
  As obvious as this may sound, he sort of wants you to beat.
• 12:32
  So he'll, he'll want, he'll either work from taught you sort of, you'll draw from who you are
• 12:37
  and whether you're able to sort of beat who you are on camera as opposed to be,
• 12:44
  as opposed to being somebody, somebody else.
• 12:49
  And when I watch Shane's work, you just see the truth that aren't every film who's ever done.
• 12:56
  You always see just cracking performances.
• 13:00
  I suppose the, the madness in the ordinary as a viewer, and that's what I find for
• 13:06
  and I really enjoy watching. I can watch people, I don't care about storyline,
• 13:13
  if the people that are in it are brilliant or I believe the people that are in something,
• 13:17
  I don't need a brilliant storyline.
• 13:21
  So would you say that kind of authenticity that we talked about at the start,
• 13:24
  what you wish you were striving for as an actor, would you say that Shane shares that
• 13:27
  and that's where you kind of maybe learned about that?
• 13:29
  Yeah, 100%. I mean, through both the workshop and Shane, yeah.
• 13:35
  And it's sort of like if, if I was to ever direct something,
• 13:39
  I'd like to do it the way Shane does it.
• 13:41
  But Shane, like, when I did this in England, both a film and the TV show,
• 13:49
  I didn't really pay much attention to the sort of direct and aspect of things.
• 13:55
  But when I worked with him most recently in the Gallows poll on the prep for it,
• 14:00
  I realized how much Shane knows about everything when it comes to film.
• 14:05
  Do you know what I mean? He's an expert in all things related to film.
• 14:11
  I think he's just got a real keen interest.
• 14:13
  And like, I remember that, I remember Shane and the D.O. Pete just getting out all these
• 14:17
  lenses and it sounded like lighting because I didn't have a clue what they were talking about.
• 14:20
  But Shane knows everything, like, you know, in all the lenses, he knew what sort of light he was
• 14:25
  after. And I never really considered it up until when I did the Gallows poll and I was like,
• 14:29
  this man knows his stuff. But every intricate part of film in this man knows about.
• 14:38
  But I suppose when I was younger, it was more, I just, I turned up on set, I did me acting
• 14:42
  in a no-one home. I didn't really consider the other departments as selfish as that reason.
• 14:48
  But then like, you're an actor who also, I mean, when I was sort of digging into the,
• 14:53
  you know, the interviews you've given about your process over the years, like, I know that you're
• 14:56
  a big fan of like research, like you talk about Shane knows his stuff. And for what I understand,
• 15:00
  you also like to know your stuff. Like, I think Gallows poll was six months of research in prep
• 15:04
  before you started shooting. Is that right? Yeah. So when it came to, because I wanted it,
• 15:10
  as I wanted David Hartley to be, I needed to know about what it was like living at that time.
• 15:17
  I needed to, if we're living on a farmstead, I don't want to be scared of a chicken. I wanted
• 15:22
  to be able to, if the occasion ever arose that I needed to pick up a chicken, I wanted to
• 15:28
  competently pick up a chicken. So I ended up working on a farm for a little bit, sharing sheep.
• 15:39
  And sometimes the old school where shit like scissors are big scissors.
• 15:46
  I'm about to, but as a, as a whole cast, we had to learn about the sort of history of the time,
• 15:50
  which I love history anyway. I had to get bigger. I needed to sort of look a little bit more
• 15:57
  imposing. So I was picking the gym and drinking loads of protein shakes. And also, I started
• 16:04
  getting into long distance, walking because David, the story, as he walked from Birmingham to
• 16:11
  Halifax, that's a long old young. So I started doing a bit of that just to sort of get an idea
• 16:17
  of what that would be like. And then it became a real passion of mine. But, but Shane's really
• 16:24
  accommodating. He was like, yeah, that's a great idea. Let's do it. And Shane had come on walks,
• 16:27
  with me. And yeah, there was quite a lot. There's quite a lot of prep for that. But it was
• 16:34
  all just fun. Do you know what I mean? It's everything. All the prep that came with Gallows'
• 16:38
  pole, I just really enjoyed. Farmer's so very lucky that I just got to a load of stuff that
• 16:44
  was dead into it, history, looking after myself and walking far. Yeah. And is it always a fun
• 16:51
  process for you? Is it research always something that you enjoy? Yeah, it is. I mean,
• 16:58
  there is times when I get scared still. I get very nervous before a project. Like, I start my
• 17:07
  first day on this job now as I'm Monday. And we're prepping at the moment. I'm doing vocal coaching
• 17:13
  and sort of looking into the history that I'm on doing. At this point now, I've got a couple of
• 17:21
  days in a week and then I start, but I'm always terrified. Apart before I go on set, I can't sleep.
• 17:28
  It takes me a few weeks to get into a project and feel at home. If that ever happens at all,
• 17:36
  I'm always quite scared. But I think the research sort of dulls that pain a little bit of,
• 17:40
  not necessarily pain, but sort of eases the anxiety a little bit. And at least I know,
• 17:48
  it's a certain degree where the character's coming from. And what else do you sort of do,
• 17:52
  the sort of, I guess, the fear and the nerves? Do you have any kind of beyond research?
• 17:57
  Do you have any other kind of strategies, I guess, or any kind of things that you've developed
• 18:00
  over the years to deal with that? I think what I do naturally is just try and enjoy myself on set.
• 18:07
  And I mean, I'm a bit of a joke, I suppose, and a bit of a piss taker. It's sort of in between
• 18:14
  these, in between the set ups or whatever it is. I don't know, I'm taking the piss a bit.
• 18:20
  I try and enjoy myself, but hopefully I'm not a distraction to other people's work, but I try
• 18:26
  and remember that this is and always should be fun. And I'm blessed to do a job that I don't hate.
• 18:36
  So I think naturally I'll find myself quite distracted and maybe a bit distracting.
• 18:44
  But I can act as the way I'm coping with my nerves, because I'm terrified, ultimately all the time,
• 18:50
  other than when the camera, other than action, and then I'm just sort of,
• 18:53
  and then I'm at peace, and then I'm in a weird sort of blissful state, and then they go caught,
• 18:58
  and then I'm back to being a bit of an odd bed, I think.
• 19:02
  Well, that kind of energy, that kind of camaraderie, is something that you really feel on things
• 19:06
  that you've done like this is England, like the whole cast of this is England, even though there's
• 19:10
  tension and drama in there as well. I mean, it feels watching that, there's such
• 19:14
  camaraderie between you all. I mean, what would the cast like to, and people like Thomas
• 19:18
  Turgus and Joseph Gilbert, I mean, what would the cast like to work with on that?
• 19:21
  I mean, I think that might be me. Problem you say I've worked with on them sort of environments where
• 19:27
  it was just one big laugh, it was a big giggle. I mean, obviously there's a lot of drama, but
• 19:33
  we had so much fun, and everybody in this is Englander, a really good mix of mine.
• 19:41
  Well, I still keep in contact with now. Tom O'Tear, I speak to all the time,
• 19:47
  we meet up at Meadow Hall often for a coffee or whatever, because that's the sort of halfway
• 19:52
  spot between Derby and Grimm's Beat. Shimi, I spoke to Vixie the other day.
• 19:57
  We're all just friends, and there was a real bond there, there was a real tightness,
• 20:04
  because we're all children, really. We're all children, and we sort of grew up together
• 20:10
  in this sort of mad environment. So yeah, it was, it was maybe, maybe I took a little bit of a,
• 20:19
  I maybe I'm sort of acquired something, this is England set that just never disappeared,
• 20:24
  and that being sort of having a laugh on set a lot.
• 20:29
  And how important do you think it is to have a laugh on set when you're working, or when you're
• 20:34
  on set? I mean, I'm only speaking for myself really, but I have to, I have to, because
• 20:42
  there's some really, sometimes you have to do some quite dark stuff, and a for me to deal with it,
• 20:49
  I have to sort of do the dark stuff and then just go back to being myself. I can't sort of
• 20:54
  linger in that darkness, but it's, I do, like the either side of the work itself, which comes
• 21:03
  quite a lot, I mean, you'll do a take, call them reset, then you do a take, and then I'm in a
• 21:09
  flow, but then there'll be a reset, and then it's like, okay, we've got 30 minutes, maybe,
• 21:14
  up, 5 to 30 minutes of sort of normality, which I enjoy, I have to go, I have to go away from
• 21:22
  the work, be Michael again, and then I can add a quickly go back and be whatever character I
• 21:28
  can't linger in a character, I think I get eddake, I've tried to, I'm about eddake.
• 21:38
  So the whole kind of method acting school, it doesn't really appeal to you in that sense of
• 21:42
  staying in character, the way that people think of method acting when you're staying character,
• 21:45
  when the camera's not rolling, that doesn't appeal to you.
• 21:48
  So I can't knock actors who do it, I think fair play, if that's what you want to do,
• 21:56
  but I did have a conversation with an actor very recently, and he was, I was talking about
• 22:01
  the method acting, and I said, it's not really from me, and then he asked me, he goes, well,
• 22:05
  when you're learning your lines, you're in character, I said, oh yeah, you said, when you're
• 22:09
  just about to do a take, you get an inter character, I said, yeah, right, I'm, and then he says,
• 22:14
  well, what are you doing there? And I thought, oh wow, okay, and my method acting, he goes, well,
• 22:20
  maybe, but you're not doing it all day, for then brief little moments, you are a method.
• 22:25
  So I thought, oh, okay, that's quite interesting. So I mean, I remember on the, on the
• 22:32
  gallows pole, remember we were doing workshops for, for the show, I was, I was, I was getting
• 22:40
  myself into a bit of a state, and I was sort of deliberately keeping myself away from the cast,
• 22:44
  and I was deliberately locking myself up, and we were working in this, um, my office space,
• 22:49
  and I, a lot of the door, and I didn't like the door, but the door, and just got myself into it.
• 22:54
  I don't know, that's an act of state. And it honestly gave me a day. Do you know what I mean,
• 22:59
  I went home feeling like shit, and I, I'm not sure that it necessarily helped, but I'm not,
• 23:06
  I'm, I wouldn't know an alternative because I can't, I can't turn back time, but,
• 23:13
  yeah, I don't know, I, I love me acting, I love playing a character, but then I also
• 23:18
  quite enjoy being me again after. Yeah. Yeah. So I don't know when to switch it off and then
• 23:24
  go back into it. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's, but again, I can't knock any, I can't knock
• 23:30
  another person's method. They've got to, and that's something I've, I've sort of,
• 23:34
  as a, as I've worked on more jobs, I've realized that just because I don't do it that way,
• 23:41
  it doesn't mean that that's a bad way of doing it. It's just not the way I do it. Um, so yeah,
• 23:46
  each of their own is just maybe not necessarily for me. For sure. And then around the time of
• 23:51
  this is England, when it went from movie to series, I mean, another, you know, great role that
• 23:56
  you took on was Tom in being human. Of course, Tom the werewolf. I mean, how did that
• 24:00
  role come about? I can't really remember to be honest with you. I know that I got that job
• 24:04
  during, I don't know if this is in England 86 or, or 88, I think it was 86, but it was like,
• 24:14
  because they're not really done much. I've done like the odd episode here and there of something,
• 24:20
  but I'd never really had like a, like a semi-regular part. So when I got the part, it's sort of like,
• 24:27
  am I an actor now? Is that what I'm doing? Am I, am I, is this how I'm paying bills?
• 24:34
  I mean, I was buzzing to get it. And it was good because the character was so different to,
• 24:39
  to, um, Harvey. I just, it was, it came at a time that was just sort of perfect for me because
• 24:46
  I went from sort of one extreme to the other. Yeah. And of course, you know, another great writer,
• 24:51
  who was the showrunner on that with Toby Witthouse. I mean, you've worked with so many great writers
• 24:55
  and directors of your career. And then he's no exception. I mean, what was it like sort of
• 24:59
  speaking his words and playing that part, you know, under his, the umbrella of him being the showrunner?
• 25:05
  I mean, I guess compared to someone like Shane. What was that like?
• 25:08
  So yeah, it was completely different because I'm on a set now where I'm surrounded by vampires,
• 25:14
  ghosts and werewolves and prosthetics and, and special effects. It really was one extreme to
• 25:21
  the other, but it was, and also it was just because there was a script, which you know, I mean,
• 25:27
  I'm working up it up a script and then I had to sort of tackle, um, hey, fun. Like it always is,
• 25:36
  it was just a load of fun. I got to run around as a, as an aware puppy. And again, I mean,
• 25:43
  even though it was a completely different character to Harvey, it was still sort of trying
• 25:49
  to draw a draw on a vulnerability that was probably within me anyway. You're not a meme.
• 25:56
  And because you mentioned genre, I mean, because you've worked again, like so many different
• 25:59
  writers you've worked, if you also worked across so many different genres, like with Shane,
• 26:02
  kind of social realism and then being human, it's, you know, it's horror and comedy and fantasy.
• 26:07
  It's such a mishmash and then obviously things like, you know, once put a time, you know, again,
• 26:11
  like kind of fantastical. I mean, do you enjoy the kind of genre hopping that you've done?
• 26:15
  I mean, do you have any favorite genres that you've worked in?
• 26:18
  No, I really don't. I don't have a, I don't have a fate. I mean, I'm lucky to have jumped
• 26:24
  between genres, I suppose. But it's never something where, um, sort of made a conscious choice or said
• 26:31
  to me, agent, okay, it's time for fantasy or let's get back into some sort of gritty stuff.
• 26:36
  It's, it's a matter of reading and going up, wow, okay, yeah, I want to do this.
• 26:40
  And it's audition for that one. I enjoy all aspects of, um, of acting, I suppose. I enjoy
• 26:46
  playing comedy. But I tell you what happens with me is that I enjoy to say if I've done a comedy,
• 26:52
  I think right, it's time to do a bit of, I won't, I won't go right. It's time to do a bit of drama.
• 26:56
  I sometimes go, it's not up to me. I don't get the choice. But I'd like to do a bit of drama. It
• 27:02
  seems that once I've done a certain drama, I want to move on and try something else. But I'm happy,
• 27:08
  sort of mixing and jumping in. Yeah, I enjoy all genres, I think.
• 27:14
  And then the cast of being human. I mean, you again, another fantastic cast. I mean, what was it
• 27:18
  like bonding with them? I mean, like the setup being, you know, you guys were all basically
• 27:22
  housemates and living together. I mean, what was it? Does that, how it felt when you were making that
• 27:26
  show, that closeness? So I was scared before I joined a bit being human because it was a well-established
• 27:33
  show with a well-established cast. And I'd just come from this as England where even before you start
• 27:39
  filming, you're having mad bonding days and you're going out and you're sort of doing a little bit
• 27:43
  of character work and just, you know, I mean, we're all in the sort of same boat. And I was a little
• 27:48
  bit nervous to go on that set because I just thought these are a bunch of people who have been
• 27:52
  doing the show for a couple of years. I'm just, I don't know how I'm going to fit into this,
• 27:58
  but they were all absolutely beautiful. They sort of welcomed me with open arms and I had
• 28:02
  loads of fun with them. And they let me do you feel welcome? 100%. Yeah. Yeah, they were brilliant.
• 28:09
  And really bloody good as well, really good actors because that's the thing in it. It's
• 28:14
  had you be how in that sort of environment, in that world, to say those sort of lines with conviction
• 28:24
  and truth, that was the hard part, I suppose. And that's the, yeah, I think to be able to
• 28:35
  sort of be truthful in that environment because it's, you can sort of put yourself in certain
• 28:41
  environments and sort of say, I've sort of been there. I've done that, but I've never been a
• 28:46
  vampire chasing werewolf before. So bringing that kind of authenticity, like we were saying, to
• 28:51
  the kind of fantastical and kind of preposterous, like vampires and werewolves was that that was
• 28:57
  the challenge. That was the challenge. Yeah, but then you just got a, as an act of belief,
• 29:01
  do you, you're a vampire hate in werewolf? And then, and then sticking with the kind of fantastical
• 29:08
  genres you worked in because it was, I want to say it was shortly not too long after then that you
• 29:12
  went across the, you know, the seas to America to Canada to do once upon a time. That was,
• 29:17
  that was not too long after. I mean, what was your experience like working on that? I mean,
• 29:20
  going from kind of British homegrown projects like this is England being human to kind of big,
• 29:24
  you know, American, Canadian, you know, shoot and production. What was that like?
• 29:30
  I remember getting that I remember putting myself on tape for at first.
• 29:35
  And then the manager going, oh, the really into you, you need to put yourself on tape again,
• 29:41
  but at the office because I think I was using my phone or something like that with my friends,
• 29:46
  a flattened clap them and then do like, right, we just make a better tape for a, for a pilot.
• 29:52
  I didn't even know what pilot was. I didn't, I didn't know the clue what I was doing. So they flew
• 29:57
  me over and then we did a, we shot a pilot for I think about 11 days or whatever it was.
• 30:02
  And it was the first time working in a, like a green screen studio.
• 30:09
  And then I learned with a pilot, it might not go ahead. And even if it does go ahead,
• 30:15
  it might not use you. So I was like, okay, call whatever that was fun. And it was the first
• 30:21
  time I'd flown business class on a plane and it was all just, wow, this is fantastic. It
• 30:26
  gave me a knots on a plane. And then I got back to England and sort of forgot about it.
• 30:32
  And then I was working on a job called Silent Witnesses and Silent Witness. And then the agent was
• 30:39
  calling me about three in the morning. I was in a hotel room and I had a group call with me,
• 30:46
  agent, me manager and the like, they're going ahead with the series and you're going to have to
• 30:50
  relocate to Vancouver, which were all sort of new foreign terms to me. I never, I didn't know
• 30:57
  what relocating meant. I didn't know what, what, what, what it entailed. So then I went over and
• 31:06
  yeah, stayed in my group of two years doing an ABC show. Incredible. And then like the press
• 31:13
  aspect of it was just something I never experienced before that going to a Comic-Con in Sunday A
• 31:20
  going to New York and seeing, I don't know, all sorts of posters and it was, yeah, crazy.
• 31:27
  I really, my time in my life. Would you say it was a bit kind of overwhelming?
• 31:32
  100% yeah, because it sounds like a lot. Yeah, I didn't, I didn't have a clue. I didn't,
• 31:39
  and I think the, I loved the character. The character I played was just incredible. I really felt
• 31:48
  from I thought it was funny. I understood where he was at. I loved playing that character.
• 31:53
  But the either side of it again is like an aspect that I was a bit unfamiliar with.
• 31:59
  I like to be on my own in a, in a city and understanding a set properly, understanding that
• 32:05
  this is what could happen. You could be a, you could be an actor and then be taken away from everything
• 32:10
  that you've known and drive yourself into work and this is a way of life. I think it was sort of
• 32:20
  like a slow progression from this is England to being human to once upon a time. It was like wow,
• 32:27
  okay, so if you want this, if you want this career, this is what could happen. You could end up sort
• 32:34
  having to deal with your own, having to deal with isolation and being on your own
• 32:40
  alongside doing the stuff that you really love. And was that isolation, did that sort of give you
• 32:45
  paused, whoever you would continue down that road? Because, you know, as you say, like, because you
• 32:49
  would, being human in this England was so much like British homegrown projects. And then once
• 32:53
  about time was this massive American kind of, you know, show. I mean, did it kind of give you
• 32:58
  pause that kind of, some of those sort of challenges? It's sort of reflecting that I understood it
• 33:05
  to be honest with you. At the time, I just, I just, I didn't really understand why I was feeling
• 33:10
  sometimes a bit sad. And I was young as well. I was, I was, I know, 24, 23, 24 when I got the job.
• 33:22
  And I was just, it was all quite overwhelming. It really was overwhelming.
• 33:27
  Yeah, it's sometimes a little bit difficult to deal with, but if I learned from it, I learned,
• 33:33
  I learned some hard to deal with the way I am alongside the work.
• 33:38
  But you didn't feel like it was maybe for you as well at the same time. That kind of,
• 33:44
  I loved the work. But maybe I didn't realise how
• 33:49
  lucky I was to be able to do the work. I just, I just, it was a really sort of
• 33:56
  odd time for me, I think, being over there. There was so many things that I loved, but then
• 34:01
  a few things that I struggled with. But I think as of grown older, and I've worked on
• 34:07
  other productions, I sort of get it a bit more now. I sort, I understand. But also, I think,
• 34:12
  kind of, who I am now, where I don't think I did back then, sort of grown up a little bit,
• 34:17
  I figured out who I am, which I think it's 24, 23, 24, I don't think I did.
• 34:26
  Well, I mean, I've got to ask you, but another project that I've yours, that I'm a big fan of,
• 34:29
  one of the one more recent projects he did was Toxic Town with Jody Whitaker, another brilliant
• 34:34
  piece of work. I mean, as I say, you've carved out your career working with some amazing writers,
• 34:38
  and Jack Form was the writer on that who obviously then went on to do adolescence, another brilliant
• 34:42
  show. I mean, and he had worked with you on this as England, you know, written this as England.
• 34:46
  I mean, what is it about Jack that makes him such a special writer as an actor to work with?
• 34:51
  I think Jack is a, a grafter. I think Jack puts a lot of time into whatever project he's working on.
• 34:58
  He knows the stuff. I remember, like, Jack with, when I first met Jack on this as England, he was just
• 35:07
  fully immersed in the projects. To the point where he wanted a little part in it, he played
• 35:13
  carrotball in the, in my party scene, but Jack, he writes some, but I've never seen anything that
• 35:22
  Jack's written that I'm not enjoyed, but I don't know. It's just maybe a magical gift for Jack.
• 35:31
  I always find being attached to anything that Jack's written, and you're very fortunate.
• 35:37
  You're lucky, and you know you're in something special.
• 35:40
  And if you followed on his career, I mean, I'm guessing you've seen adolescence, right?
• 35:44
  Yeah, of course. Incredible piece of work. I mean, what did you make of that?
• 35:48
  Yeah, I loved it. I texted because I'm good friends with Steven, and I texted him and
• 35:52
  made it after. I think I watched it with my mom, because this is exactly what happened with me,
• 35:57
  once we'd watched it, me and my mom had a really long conversation. And I said,
• 36:00
  that's Steven. I was walking around Liverpool, actually. I was at a museum, and I saw a picture
• 36:05
  Steven, and I was like, I'm going to talk to him about a lesson to the set. I was showing the picture
• 36:09
  that I've just seen in the museum, and I talked to him about a lesson. And he said, that's exactly
• 36:13
  what we want. We want people to talk about it. It's, that was a piece of genius. I loved
• 36:19
  other lessons. It was no surprise, wasn't it, when it just swept all the Emmys and like,
• 36:23
  you know, Steven Graham getting all this, you know, as he should, you know, all this, all this
• 36:27
  attention and accolades. I mean, you know, because, yeah, as you say, you worked with him on
• 36:30
  this as England. What kind of sort of working relationship does you guys have, or like, you know,
• 36:34
  have happened over the years? So I didn't have any scenes with Steven in 86, or any of
• 36:41
  that this is England, but it was a round. But I didn't really see much of him. And I knew
• 36:48
  of Steven. I know of his work and we had a lot of mutual friends. And then he cast me in a thing
• 36:54
  called, uh, what like a pamphot years ago, which was a sentimental wrestling movie,
• 37:01
  which was just a whole heap of fun. Um, and then he also, he, he ran, because I had a little
• 37:08
  part in time, which was amazing. But he rang me up to ask if I'd do this little part in,
• 37:13
  I was like 100%. But I think Steady is one of those sort of people that, that is a, a
• 37:20
  brilliant, brilliant act of course, with brilliant person. He's so kind. He's somebody that I look
• 37:26
  up to in many levels and I look up to his, his work and, and that who he is as a person.
• 37:35
  He's just a really generous, kind, beautiful mouth, um, and puts our people first all the time.
• 37:44
  But yeah, he's a, he's special that man. Just on watch is, is a very special man.
• 37:49
  Truly. I mean, it's funny, because we had Eddie Marzan on the pod recently, you know,
• 37:53
  another fantastic actor, his work to Steven. And he was telling me that, uh, when him and Steven
• 37:58
  had scenes together and stuff like gangs in New York, they couldn't look at each other in the eye
• 38:01
  because they would just start cracking up. Like, there's, he seems like it's got a very great
• 38:04
  sense of humor as well. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, he's somebody who enjoys it.
• 38:10
  Do you know what I mean? It's, there's no airs and graces with Steven. He's not an actor
• 38:13
  pretending to be an actor. He's an actor as a good time and he's also grateful for being an actor.
• 38:19
  He's, and I think he can't, I, I, I just think he has fun. I think he has great fun on sets.
• 38:25
  He understands the work. He's bloody good at it, but he has a good laugh and all, which I think
• 38:29
  is so important. Yeah. He can feel that in his performances and the energy. And, and then go
• 38:35
  about to Tox Town though. I mean, were you aware of that story when you signed on to the project
• 38:39
  or was it? No, it was a news to you. I didn't have a clue now. I didn't, but then I did
• 38:44
  me research and find it all sort of disgusting. But I think with that one as well working with
• 38:53
  Jolie Whitaker, who is another person who's just an amazing actor, but also understand of this,
• 39:00
  it's, it's something where it should, that should be enjoyed. I became friends with Jolie as well.
• 39:07
  But yeah, Toxie Town was brilliant. And I love working with Minke as well. The direct, she was
• 39:12
  incredible. And Amy Lee Wood, again, just another fantastic cast. Yeah, it really was and Dempsey was
• 39:18
  in it as well. Of course, I've got to be Carlisle. Yeah, he, you go back quite away with Robert
• 39:24
  Carlisle, right? Back to when you were, you know, just starting out in summer, right? That was
• 39:28
  the movie you guys made. Yeah, I can believe it. I think Bobby was the, was the sort of most
• 39:36
  high profile actor I'd ever worked with on summer. And he was just, I think I always sort of assumed
• 39:42
  that high profile actors or successful actors or whatever it is were just a bit arrogant and
• 39:49
  up themselves, but he weren't. He was just, he was lovely. He was lovely. I remember he signed me,
• 39:57
  besides, because I didn't want to disturb him, but I'm not telling his trailer one day, and I
• 40:01
  just said, probably, do you mind me? We just signed this for him on the reality. It's like they
• 40:05
  probably only got me into his trailer every night. It was what I remember. There was a scene that I
• 40:10
  had to do, where I couldn't, you know, when you're asleep, when you're trying to be asleep,
• 40:17
  put your eyes at, like, moving. You know, I wanted to be asleep in the scene, but I was aware that
• 40:24
  my eyelids were doing the movie thing. I said, Bobby, I don't know how to stop doing this
• 40:30
  weird twitching with my eyes, and he was like, calm down, just focus on one bit of your, you know,
• 40:34
  that sort of calmed me down. I think I got into a bit of a, a bit of a state about my eyeballs,
• 40:40
  moving. I was asleep. He's a beautiful man. Yeah, he's got, he's got it down, hasn't he?
• 40:46
  Everything from the eye acting to, you know, just acting. He's bloody good at that, bloody.
• 40:50
  Even his eyes are closed, he's bloody good at hip.
• 40:55
  And then another thing that sort of is fascinating to me, like, going back and looking at your
• 40:59
  career, I mean, because you're not only, you know, the amount of stuff you've done on
• 41:02
  screens big and small, but also, I mean, the music videos that you've, that you've done for
• 41:06
  bands over the years, I mean, you've worked with artists like Cassabian and, you know, like,
• 41:10
  Jake Bug, you know, these great artists and you've paid in their music videos. I mean,
• 41:12
  are you a big music man yourself? Do you love your music?
• 41:16
  Yeah, I do, but there's always like a, so would do with the, the Cassabian thing.
• 41:21
  I worked with Dan Cadant, and he just asked me to do it. He sent me the song, was like,
• 41:27
  do you fancy this? I was like 100%. I think it's the only time I'll ever get to play
• 41:31
  Richard III. So yeah, it gives a go. But Jake Borg, I was a massive fan. I saw Jake book for
• 41:38
  the first time. It was Shane's 40th birthday party. I think it was. And Jake was, was there doing
• 41:44
  a little set. I was like, this is incredible. And then I did the, the, the, oh, God, the rudimental
• 41:54
  thing. That was sent to me as a brief. And it was a brief that I was fully on board with.
• 42:00
  And to be honest with you, I couldn't care less about the song. I was just like, whatever, whatever
• 42:05
  the director wants to say here, I'm, I'm going to latch onto it because the idea was great.
• 42:12
  I mean, I'm not really a dancer. I think that kind of shows in the music video. But
• 42:18
  yeah, I just like the message I enjoyed what, what, what Luke was trying to sort of portray.
• 42:24
  It's a great video. I mean, like that sort of stripping away of the kind of, because it's all
• 42:28
  about these men in a circle, basically, and the set up being that they, you know, they're kind of,
• 42:31
  they're going to talk about their issues. Instead of talking, they just start dancing and they kind
• 42:34
  of start peeling back their kind of vulnerability. Yeah. Yeah. It looks like, it's a great idea.
• 42:39
  And it looks like it was good fun to film as well, because the dancers you guys do, you know,
• 42:44
  great. I mean, we had one day, we had one day rehearsals. And then we had one day to shoot it.
• 42:48
  And by the end of the rehearsal day, I was like, got this fine. It's absolutely fine. And then
• 42:53
  the following day, we had to shoot it. And I was, I was messing up a lot. I couldn't get my feet
• 42:57
  right. I think the way they've done it, the most sort of salvage, whatever bits I did remember
• 43:02
  from the actual dance. And then the Cassabian video. I mean, like you, it just looks like the most
• 43:07
  fun ever, like you and Lena Heady just like running around town drinking, eating curry and, you know,
• 43:12
  and getting drunk and you dress as rich as the third. I mean, that must have been a lot of fun too.
• 43:16
  100% and such was there. Yeah, it was, it was a beautiful day. I mean, I'm fortunate that I've
• 43:24
  worked with so many directors that I just, I just like, you know what I mean, it's like,
• 43:31
  even with the cage without, I just like him. I think he's passionate. And I just like the man.
• 43:37
  So I know that when I'm working with somebody like with the, with the
• 43:40
  Cassabian music, I'm working with the director that I get on with that trust. So I'm just willing
• 43:50
  to up on that. And how important do you think trust is where you as an actor, like an director
• 43:56
  between an actor and director? So important. This, I think there's sort of a mutual sort of trust
• 44:02
  and understanding that, um, like working without from the cage, it's like, I trust him to make
• 44:11
  the right choice, but I also trust him to listen to me if I've got an idea. I think some directors
• 44:18
  have got an idea that can't be messed with. There's no room for sort of compromise,
• 44:28
  but the certain actors, the certain directors that I've worked with over the years that are just,
• 44:32
  it's a mutual, it's a mutual endeavor. You're having, you're having conversations and you sort of
• 44:38
  meeting in the middle sometimes or, or because I trust them, I'm willing to sort of go to a place
• 44:44
  that I didn't expect or anticipate, but I love a guy because I trust you. You know what I mean?
• 44:51
  Hmm. Yeah, you'll go the extra mile in a sense. Well, more than I'll try a different way
• 44:57
  of doing it, even though at the time it might not have seemed, it might not have seemed, um,
• 45:04
  like consistent with the actors' journey or the way the things have got. And in my mind,
• 45:09
  I've sort of gone through the scene and I've gone, this is the way it should be done,
• 45:14
  character-wise. And the director will go, have you thought about this?
• 45:18
  And if I trust the director and I rate the director, then I'll go, I'll have a go,
• 45:23
  and sometimes an op-buck sort of morpher than the nodding, I'll go, wow, okay, I didn't consider
• 45:29
  that and I'm actually really glad you asked me to do it that way.
• 45:33
  Hmm. They'll give an idea in a direction that will just be completely kind of new and fresh.
• 45:38
  I haven't thought about it. Yeah. Which is why I love auditions, because if you go for,
• 45:44
  you get sent a few scenes, you maybe get sent the script, but you'll learn it, you'll put your
• 45:52
  import and you made your decisions. You go into your audition and the director will go,
• 45:57
  right, well, that's not how I saw it, try this. And then I'll try something and I'll be like,
• 46:03
  oh, wow, yeah, I didn't consider that. But that felt really nice. And that's what happened in the,
• 46:09
  in the cage audition with Owen and Shaheen. There's a few times I was like, I'd be thought about
• 46:14
  this and I was like, no, I hadn't. And it worked.
• 46:22
  And with the cage then, because we're, yeah, we're touching on it because that's the next
• 46:26
  project you've got coming out. What can we expect from it? I mean, because the premise alone is
• 46:29
  just, you know, it's quite exciting premise. What can we expect from the show?
• 46:32
  Well, just it is very exciting. It's a thrilling crime story.
• 46:41
  I remember reading the scripts and being like, oh, God, no, that's not going to happen. That's
• 46:46
  happening. That's happening. That's happening. And I was sort of, there's so many ups and
• 46:51
  downs. There's so many twists and unexpected highs and lows throughout. It's just a really exciting,
• 46:58
  it was a really exciting reading into film. It was really exciting because one day you'd sort of
• 47:03
  you down one avenue and then actually rock one hill. It was, I think it is one of them.
• 47:11
  Here we go. Sort of buckle up sort of projects. A bit of a roller coaster. Yeah.
• 47:17
  And of course, you're working your co-star and we've shared in Smith, who's just another
• 47:20
  fantastic actor. I mean, what was that experience like working with it before? Because I want to say,
• 47:24
  it's your first time working with her or Mike, have I got that wrong? No, it is the first time
• 47:28
  working with that. Yeah, that's just incredible. She's a British icon. And every project that she's
• 47:35
  ever done has always been amazing. And it was just nothing but fun working with Smith.
• 47:42
  She's another one of those actors that is really good at what she does and
• 47:47
  and just enjoys it and I can have a laugh with. Thank God.
• 47:54
  She doesn't take herself too seriously. No, you feel that in her performances. The energy,
• 47:59
  she can balance so many different tones so well. The comedy and humor, but also the drama.
• 48:04
  She can do, when I watch her, I think she can do anything. Well, she can. But then also,
• 48:09
  she's very graceful in allowing me to be a bit of my bed on set.
• 48:14
  Yeah, she's wicked Smithers. She's incredible, incredible.
• 48:19
  Because also the two of you being Northern. I'm not sure exactly which part of the
• 48:23
  north she's from, but she is from the north. Don't cast. Yeah, I mean, you know, so close to,
• 48:29
  you know, because I'm from Sheffield so close to where I'm from. I mean, and I did want to ask
• 48:32
  what this actually because being like a Northern actor yourself and coming from a working class
• 48:36
  background, do you think it's harder for for Northern actors? Yeah, it's from the regions,
• 48:41
  maybe from a working class background. Do you think it's harder for them today still to break
• 48:45
  into the industry and get taken seriously? I mean, I've been really lucky that I've sort of
• 48:53
  maintained the career that I've been able to work. But what I do know that there's
• 48:58
  the rent, all that many opportunities, acting wise, where I'm from, or if there are, then it's
• 49:06
  maybe something that's quite expensive. The workshop that I went to, the one in Notting
• 49:11
  was free when I joined, and because ITV funded it, which ITV pulled that years ago. I think
• 49:19
  just as I was leaving it, they pulled the funded. But for those sort of places, those, I mean,
• 49:26
  especially workshops, you're involved between, in fact, I don't know anywhere that's quite like it.
• 49:31
  So I just think the opportunities aren't necessarily there, especially in Derby.
• 49:37
  Do you think the kind of the received sort of idea is that people need to move to London and
• 49:42
  move to like the big cities to like, to get work? So I don't know anymore, because I think when I first
• 49:48
  started acting, it seemed like the dumb thing. I remember moving to London when I was 19 and thinking
• 49:53
  this is where I've got to be. And I was up in the world with the DOP day before, yesterday,
• 49:59
  and he moved to London when he first left junior, whatever it was. And it was the place you had to
• 50:05
  be to work. But it seems like that it's not there anymore. The work isn't in London.
• 50:13
  Maybe the creators of worker in London, but the actual jobs themselves aren't necessarily in London.
• 50:19
  And so do you think there should be more opportunities for like, yeah, because if the resources
• 50:22
  aren't up in Derby or, you know, or donkaster or wherever, for young actors to get like experience
• 50:28
  and to get the training that they that they need and deserve, do you think there should be more
• 50:33
  opportunities for those areas? I think this should just be more support for the arts in general.
• 50:40
  It's sort of, it's not promoted enough, I don't think. Even at my school, I could only do one
• 50:48
  subject of art, which was drama, but I enjoyed all the arts. And if it maybe had about access to more
• 50:56
  sort of curriculum based art, I might have got a few more GCSEs, but it just seems that it's not
• 51:05
  really taken that seriously, but I find art so beneficial enough that I think I'm not the only one
• 51:10
  who feels that way. It's just not really backed. It's not really backed financially by the government.
• 51:17
  Do you see that changing? I mean, do you feel like things are changing for the better at all,
• 51:21
  or do you think it's still kind of, it's a slow process? I don't know. From what I gather,
• 51:26
  not much has changed. I still see sort of people crying out for art, or just access to art,
• 51:34
  or just a promotion of all the arts. It's just not within my ear shot, I don't think.
• 51:41
  And how important do you think art is just for, I mean, here's the big question,
• 51:45
  how important do you think it is generally? I mean, what do you think it does for people and
• 51:50
  helps them? I mean, speaking for myself, I find all art, whether it be music,
• 52:02
  drama, painting, poetry, whatever it is, I think to be able to express yourself artistically,
• 52:13
  I think it's just so good for your mental health. It can go to the gym, not my,
• 52:19
  what you read out a little bit, but if you can just sort of express yourself in,
• 52:24
  what I like to do with me and my friends, one in particular, I would just send it to the
• 52:29
  poetry and it can be as light or as dark or wet. It seems that if I'm feeling a certain way,
• 52:34
  if you're having a sad being between, to write it down in a sort of cryptic way, I find fun
• 52:41
  and sort of therapeutic. And again, I don't think I'm the only one who feels that way.
• 52:47
  Does it kind of like you were saying, Erno, about how when you started acting, it was kind of an
• 52:50
  escape. There's an escape as an aspect, but that which actually helps you deal with maybe what's
• 52:56
  going on around you and what you're feeling. Well, it's expression in it. It's actually been able to
• 53:02
  not necessarily voice, but express a certain emotion or feeling or whatever it is and put it
• 53:13
  out there. With acting, I'm able to play out emotions and get paid for it, where I think maybe
• 53:21
  sometimes if, well, most definitely, if I have to play certain emotions that I play on the screen,
• 53:26
  I might be locked up. Do you know what I mean? But that is my escape, that is my therapy,
• 53:31
  as cliche and as over said, as that statement is, it's just, it's the truth for me.
• 53:38
  And do you have a favourite out of interest? Do you have a favourite of all the performances
• 53:41
  you've given and all those expressions that you've just been describing? Do you have a favourite
• 53:44
  performance that you've given or maybe a favourite film that you've made? Do you look back
• 53:48
  on particularly fondly? Okay, so I think my favourite experience film is the most fun I've
• 53:56
  had to film and I say is this isn't 100%. But I did a job show trial where I played a murderer,
• 54:06
  I played a murderer, but I think that was the most fun playing that character. I enjoyed playing
• 54:15
  that character the most, I think, and show trial too. I think it was a character that,
• 54:26
  even though it was a real arrogant sod, just real fun playing him.
• 54:30
  And what, how, why was he so fun to play? Okay, so he was an arrogant thought,
• 54:36
  but it was all a front really for his massive insecurities and I like playing that aspect.
• 54:40
  Also, we had a reason, there's no reason for murder, there's no good reason for murder, but
• 54:46
  he murdered someone for a sort of morally ambiguous sort of reasons. If that isn't his
• 54:56
  own, the right thing to say morally ambiguous. It was a wrong, but he had his reasons for being
• 55:06
  a wrong guy, which I find really interesting. I mean, I don't mind playing a baddie as long as
• 55:10
  that baddie's got a reason for being a baddie and that reason sort of qualifies.
• 55:17
  Whether I agree with it or not is irrelevant, but I mean with that choice, but to play is so
• 55:24
  much fun. Going into those characters and finding, I mean, not to keep saying authenticity,
• 55:30
  but finding the reasons why the wise and the wherefores. Yeah, on that job, it was just,
• 55:37
  there was a lot of performance. So it's sort of, you get your rewards on them sort of jobs,
• 55:44
  you get, so you're being performative, but then when there's little moments of real vulnerability
• 55:53
  and insecurity. So I love that. I love the behavior and then the cause and vice versa.
• 56:02
  And is there anyone that you'd like to work with if you could get the chance?
• 56:05
  Because you've worked with so many amazing people as we say, like Shane and Jack,
• 56:09
  is there anyone out there that you'd love to work with if you could?
• 56:15
  I do can't be so very lucky that I've managed to work with the people that I have.
• 56:18
  And there are so many directors that I'd love to work with.
• 56:23
  And directors that I'd love to work with again, I've had so many brilliant times work on certain
• 56:29
  sets because of certain directors. So yeah, I mean, there's plenty that there really is.
• 56:36
  And there's also these directors that I want to work with again.
• 56:41
  And actors as well, I'm guessing.
• 56:43
  No, no, not at all.
• 56:45
  They're convolics.
• 56:46
  Yeah, of course, I've worked with some amazing actors over the years.
• 56:50
  And also there is there's there's actors that the same actors that I've worked with that I've
• 56:55
  never really, there's actors that I've worked on projects with but I've never got the opportunity
• 57:00
  to work directly with them. Like the actor Johnny Harris is even though like me and Johnny
• 57:09
  are friends, we've never actually acted together.
• 57:12
  I'd love to do something with Johnny Harris. I think he's incredible. He's only favorite actors.
• 57:15
  I first watched Johnny Harris in London to Brighton.
• 57:22
  And I watched an act to be like menacing and horrible but then also within a fucking heartbeat,
• 57:28
  going back to that vulnerable and almost childlike.
• 57:35
  And I just remember watching that and just thinking, that's incredible.
• 57:38
  Whatever he's doing is just incredible. I want to work with him on day.
• 57:42
  Well, I hope that fingers crossed.
• 57:44
  fingers crossed. Yeah, that'll be amazing.
• 57:46
  Well, as I say, like, you know, thanks so much, Michael, for coming on half the picture.
• 57:49
  This was such a pleasure. I mean, it's just been great just to listen to you chat about your
• 57:52
  process and about your memories of making the great things you've worked on.
• 57:56
  I mean, it really has been such a pleasure. So thank you so much.
• 57:59
  Thank you very much. Thanks for having me.
• 58:04
  Hey, everyone. Thanks so much for listening to my chat with Michael Soaker.
• 58:13
  Remember to like and subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode.
• 58:17
  And stay tuned for more exciting interviews and guests coming soon on half the picture.