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Boy Moms and Gentle Parenting · Mom Wars

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: From the front lines of the mom Wars. Here's Bethany
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: Mandel and Kara Kennedy.
• 0:08
  Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to another episode of your favorite podcast.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: I am the American host. My name is Bethany Mandel.
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: I'm a mom of six and a frequent writer for
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: The New York Post and The Washington Examiner, among other places.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: And I homeschool my children. And that's all I have
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: for tonight, and I am joined by my beautiful Spice
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: Girl co host. If you watch this podcast on our
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: sub stack instead of just listening to it, you will
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: see the Spice Girl from my beautiful co host.
• 0:37
  Speaker 3: Awry Kennedy. I'm also only one email behind being caught up,
• 0:43
  Speaker 3: which I know.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: I know, so tell everyone. I feel like we're ships
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: passing in the night, and we sound way fancier than
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: we usually are because you just got home.
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: I just go home from Belgium. And then we just
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: decided that Nick is going to fly to Anchorage, Alaska
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: at nine am tomorrow. Why he's writing a piece about
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: a TV show. This is like the most insane reason
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: for somebody to talk to Alaska. It's it's us being manic.
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: And so he's writing a piece about a TV show
• 1:21
  Speaker 3: that is based in Alaska, and he is interviewing somebody,
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: and the guy that he's interviewing was like, Oh, I'm
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: in Alaska for a week, Let's do it on zoom
• 1:32
  Speaker 3: and Nick was like, h maybe I could come. And
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: it's one of the very few states that he's never
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: been to. So I was like, you should just do it.
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: That's great.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: I love it, I love I love you, supporting his spontaneity.
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and then I kind of started to regret it
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: because I was like, oh, actually have a lot to
• 1:53
  Speaker 3: do this week. But by then we were it was booked,
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: we were done, right, So it's too late, exactly. I'm glad.
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: I'm happy for him. I think it's going to be fun.
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: And you are going on the trip for lifetime.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: Yes, So I'm leaving tomorrow evening. I will be taking
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: off this time tomorrow, so I am going to Greece
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: for a week with my husband and six children, and
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: then after Greece, we're going to Israel for like five weeks.
• 2:23
  Speaker 3: So so fun. Tell me about the pack in situation,
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: because I've seen you very stressed out Instagram stories.
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: First of all, I will say anything that we forget,
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: we can bring, but the problem is some of my
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: children who will remain nameless. People who know my children
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: know which wat child this is. I have been taking
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: things out and then putting other things in, like taking
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: out clothes and putting in urine soaked underwear, taking out
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: shoes and putting in shells, and so that has been
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: a very frustrating experience because it feels like brushing your
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: teeth while eating oreos at the same time. So that's
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: been very stressful. Yesterday I also almost got into two
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: car accidents, oh nice, which really added to my stress.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: Stress level is a great deal. One of them, I
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: was driving my dog to the vet and just for
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: a checkup because we're leaving him, so I wanted to
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: make sure he was in tiptop's shape and up to
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: date on all his vaccines. So I'm driving and a
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: truck decides that it needs to pull out and it
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: doesn't have enough room, so it starts to it starts
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: to like hit like it goes to hit me, and
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: then I have to veer into oncoming traffic to avoid it.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: And thank god, there was no other car coming in
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: the other direction, so I didn't get into a horrible
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: car accident, so that put me out like an eleven.
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: And then I pull into the parking lot of my vet,
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: and my dog is he's very neurotic. He's very anxious.
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: He's like a very Jewish dog. And so he recognizes
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: where we are, whining outside my door right now. My god,
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: he's my hardest child. He recognizes where we are, and
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: he jumps on my lap as I'm driving through the
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: parking lot looking for parking and starts peeing all over
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: me because he's scared. I like almost got an accident
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: like five minutes prior. And then I'm driving through the
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: parking lot getting slowly urinated on by my dog. That's
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: just like shaking like a leaf.
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: Wait, hang on, so the dog is all new as
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: you drive?
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: No, never, but he jumped onto my lap as I
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: was looking for parking because he recognized where we were.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: So he's shaking like a leaf, drooling like mad, and
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: slowly urinating. He's only five, He's not an incontinent old dog.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: He's just scared. So then I pulled that dog. I
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: pull him into the vet. We do the whole thing.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: It takes like fifteen minutes. He's fine, and then he
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: could not get out of there fast enough. He was
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: like ripping my arm out of its socket. So yesterday
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: was like a very stressful day because of the VET,
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: the two almost car accidents, and then just every time
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: I packed something, I would turn around and it was
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: unpacked and replaced with an impractical item like urine soaked
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: underwear or shells or flashlight or goggles. There were so
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: many things that were put into that child's back.
• 5:40
  Speaker 3: I don't know how you do it.
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that was It was a really really stressful day.
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: Today was better, and we're mostly packed.
• 5:46
  Speaker 3: Now.
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: We have to like put their electronics in they're all
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: charging right now, right now. And other than that, I
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: think we're good. I checked into the airline, and being
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: the psycho that I am, I was searching. Apparently this
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: air line does kids fly free promotions like once a year.
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: I'm tempted. I'm not gonna lie. Yeah, six kids for free,
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: I doubt so. I guess we'll see how tomorrow goes.
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: But I don't know, well, we'll find out. Yeah, it's
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: pretty stressful.
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: I mean, going for such a long time is kind
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: of stressful. But you also just have to accept that
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: there's going to be some issues that you just have
• 6:28
  Speaker 3: to solve this time.
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: Last year exactly, actually this week. It was the week
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: before Thanksgiving, we went to Puerto Rico, and on that
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: trip only I got food poisoning. So I had activated charcoal,
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: which I swear by everyone else took it. No one
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: else got sick, and it stopped me from throwing up.
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: So that was that. Four of my six children got
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: strapped and I had I called my pediatrician and I
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: was like, here's the situation, and she was like, Okay,
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: I'm not allowed to tell you to give other children
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: the prescribed medicine that I only prescribed for one child,
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: but if I did recommend that this is the exact
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: dose you would give to each child based on the
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: last weight that we had in the office. And so
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: that was very nice for my pediatrician.
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: Wait, so did you have some medication?
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, from the first kid, and we had barely enough
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: to give it to the rest of the kids, and
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: then I brought them to the pediatrician to get them
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: prescriptions to get them the rest of the way. So yeah,
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: so four of.
• 7:37
  Speaker 3: Them took them to a pediatrician, and.
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: So when we got home, I brought them to the
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: pediatrician because one kid left with it, and then the
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: rest got it while we were there, so we all piggybacked.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: Not we all, but like the other three children piggybacked
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: off the first child's prescription. So four of the six
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: got strap. I got food poisoning. And then my seven
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: year old his name, his online name is Ultima. We
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: were in the middle of the rainforest and he slipped
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: in the creek and slammed his tailbone so hard we
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: thought he broke it, and he couldn't walk. And so
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: we had gotten into the rainforest by each carrying a child,
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: because I have a child and Seth has a child.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: My fifth is mine, our sixth is Seth's. But then
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: we had to figure out how because then Seth had
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: to carry our seven year old back through the rainforest
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: like it was a really intense hike, And so I
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: put the three year old on my back, carried the
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: two year old, and then Seth carried our seven year
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: old through the rainforest.
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: You still managed to have a good time.
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: Though, we did. Oh. And then on the way home,
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: our flight was delayed five hours, and they waited until
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: we were boarding to disclose that Reagan Airport had closed
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: and that they were flying us into a different airport,
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: landing at two thirty in the morning. And they did
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: that so that we were trapped to get on the
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: plane because the entire airport was closed. There was no taxis.
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: We were stuck, like you had to get on the plane.
• 9:20
  Speaker 2: So boo Jet Blue on that one. Yeah, and so
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: we got on the plane and then we landed at
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: Dulles at two thirty in the morning, and then we
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: had to catch a shuttle to Reagan. We didn't get
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: there until three thirty.
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: Oh my god.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: And then we got our car and we decided that
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: we were not going to grab our bags. We told
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: Jet Blue at Dallas Airport. We were like, you have
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: to get our bags back to our house because we
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: can carry six children through the airport at three thirty
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: in the morning with the house Like, that's that's on, y'all.
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: So they delivered our bags the next day. So then
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: we walked into our house at five am.
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: That's not that's not good.
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: No, But I will say that that trip gave me
• 10:05
  Speaker 2: confidence to do London by myself because they were real champs.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I kind of had this epiphany. I didn't take
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: the baby to Belgium but I was on a flight
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: with a lot of toddlers, and after that, I was like,
• 10:23
  Speaker 3: all in all, I was on the plane for two
• 10:26
  Speaker 3: hours delayed, and then an eight hour flight, so ten hours,
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: and these toddlers were like really not happy, and I
• 10:33
  Speaker 3: was like, you know what, I should just go more
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: places with it, because nothing is worse than a ten
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: hour flight.
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: It's like, if I go to Florida, what's the worst
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: that can happen in two hours? Not much.
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: My kids have flung their whole lives. They've gone all
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: over the place. My older three did Paris with me
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: about a year ago, a year and a half ago.
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: It was amazing. Older five we recorded a podcast episode
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: about that, if folks want to go back. It was
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: like around May June, I brought my older five to
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: London with me by myself. That was amazing. Also, you know,
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: that Puerto Rico trip was unfortunate. That was not a
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: great situation. But all in all, I think my kids
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: are good travelers because they've had a lot of practice.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: We've done a lot of road trips over the years,
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: and there are troopers and it's so much fun. I
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: really like traveling with my kids.
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think this is kind of why Nick and
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: I jet set in right now, because we're like, before
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: it gets too hard, we're just gonna leave into it.
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: A we're kind of codependent. So he went to India
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: ten days, I went to Belgium for a couple of days,
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: and now he's going to go to Alaska. So I
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: feel like we're just like learning to be by ourselves.
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: That's really sweet.
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 11:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah, Hello, I'm James Lawix and I'm at the diner.
• 12:09
  Speaker 4: You know, classic American diner chrome long boomerang pattern for
• 12:13
  Speaker 4: my co account with little jukeboxes. We love these.
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: And you can join me here every Saturday, where we
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: talk about whatever happens to spring into my mind at
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: the moment. There's no predicting where it will go, except
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: that it'll be done in about thirty minutes. Join me,
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: won't you, every Saturday from the Ricochet Audio network Ricochet yea,
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: join the conversation.
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: So I want to talk about two completely unrelated things, okay,
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: and I think the first one is what I sent
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: to you on Instagram right before we started.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: I watched it. I saw yet your angry comments as well.
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes, so there was this woman. Do you remember
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: what her Instagram handle was. It was like Grandma hold
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: on it was it was Grandma camp Planner. Her name
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: is Grandma jan on Instagram. And one of my best
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: friends sent it to me as like rage bait, and
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: it worked. And so she had a whole video about
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: how it's okay to plan a vacation wherein your daughter
• 13:32
  Speaker 2: in law, she says, sons and daughters in law, but
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: you know, she only has daughters in law.
• 13:38
  Speaker 3: Has boys. She's a boy mom, you can tell them.
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: And so she says she wants to plan a vacation
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: and it's okay with only her biological children, not her
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: in law children. And she is getting destroyed on Instagram
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: right now. And I I was always very unforgiving about
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: this kind of stuff until I had boys. Have you
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: ever read the book Love You Forever? No? It is
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: the creepiest book. Have I talked to you about this
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: book before?
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: Yes?
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So she she is a stalker of her son,
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: and she ends up putting a ladder into his bedroom
• 14:26
  Speaker 2: window as an adult and climbing through his bedroom window
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: and just holding him in his sleep because it's the
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: only way she can see him.
• 14:33
  Speaker 3: I feel like I'm going to be like that with
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: my babies.
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: So you won't be because you have daughters.
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: I don't know. Oh my god, I just love her so.
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: Much, I know, but she'll love you back. Let me
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: tell you. You remember when you were like fourteen and you
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: loved a boy and it was unrequited. You remember that feeling.
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: That's what it's like having sons. It is torture because
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: they so Okay, I have four boys. I have a
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: ten year old, an eight year old, a four year old,
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: and an almost three year old. My ten year old,
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: I don't remember the last time he let me touch him.
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: Oh wait, I do.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: He had the flu, that's it. He like sat next
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: to me and snuggled me when he had one hundred
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: and four fever, and I was like, I'll take it.
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: I don't care if I get sick. You remember the
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: last time this happened. I love it, every second of it.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: I soaked it up. I was like, I can't get
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: my baby.
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: Just went to kiss. You know how obsessed I am
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: right now? Oh, ut'll have like disgusting stuff all over
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: her face and I'm like, yeah, come.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: On, six kids in I'm still obsessed.
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: When my sixth kisses me on the face.
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: I'm like, yes, I just want to snug all the time.
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, my eight year old, like will will walk near
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: me and not put up a fight if I hug him.
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: My four year old, he's mine. He's the fifth He
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: is the sun in the sky. That child is heaven
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: on earth. He So we have this thing that we've
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: had for like a year and a half where we
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: pretend to get married. It's so codependent. And I say
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: I do, and then he says I do, and then
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: we kiss and then we're married.
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: Oh my god.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: And that he's my boyfriend.
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: Boy. Mom's insane, though. I'm like, I'm scared if I
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: have a boy.
• 16:38
  Speaker 2: It's intense.
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: Man, I should probably just have all girls.
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: Boy mom life is intense. So anyway, So this woman
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: on Instagram, I feel sympathy for her.
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: Because explain, explain what let's explain.
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: Oh okay, So she she says she wants to take
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: a vacation with only her sons, not her daughters in law.
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: And that's not a thing. As sympathetic as I am
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: to her, Like, you can't say to your daughter in
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: laws like stay home or like or what you you
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: They bring the grandchildren and the daughter in law stays
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: home like on what.
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: Though?
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: If I was the door, I feel like, yeah.
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: I mean i'd be you can a woman who says,
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: leave your wife at home for an entire vacation like
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: their entire marriage, I'm sure is figuring out how to
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: navigate grandma jaan.
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah yeah, yeah yeah.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: And so her entire social media footprint is being a
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: long distance grandma. And I just I want to be
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: a fly on the wall. I want to be friends
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: with the daughter in laws because can you imagine? I know,
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: I want to find them. It's just it's it's got
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: to be honestly so validating. And this is the comment
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: I made on on the insta must this comment must
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: be so validating for your daughters in law? Yeah, because
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: she is just getting absolutely wrecked.
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: Well, this is the problem with boomers that they have
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: to be told because I think a lot of the
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: time like they've just got I hate boomers, so you
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: know my disdain for booliths. A lot of the time
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: they just go through life and nobody tells them that
• 18:21
  Speaker 3: their behavior is unacceptable. And sometimes it just takes a
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: person to do that me.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: So she recorded a follow up video where she explained
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: why she wasn't wrong the first time. Oh my god,
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: of course it's even better than the first.
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: That's incredible. I didn't see that one.
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah. In the second video, it's clear she does only
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: have sons, and she says, well, no, no, you don't understand.
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: I raised them and I was a single mother and
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: now they're just gone.
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: I b respect them.
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: Again. I am so sympathetic my oldest who's ten, who
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: he was my favorite for a very long time. He
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: had this like really really difficult food allergy that I
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: had to nurse him pretty much NonStop, like twenty four
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: hours a day for like ten months, and he cried
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: all the time. The only time he didn't cry was
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: when I nursed him. I changed my diet super radically
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: so that I could keep nursing him when we figured
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: out what his allergies were, and I just like, I
• 19:26
  Speaker 2: gave all of myself to him. And now he like
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: won't even hug me before he goes to camp for
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: a month, but he does it just to torture me,
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: and he loves seeing how much at torptures.
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: You need to play hard to get That's what Seth says.
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: You need to be more like unbothered That's what Seth says.
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: I always see these mother and these like horrendous mother
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: in laws. Obviously I don't have a mother in.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Law obviously because Nick's mom is dead. Yeah, you have to,
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: you have to.
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, she disappeared. I see these posts from time to
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: time where like the mother in law's crowbarring her way
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: into the room and in the delivery and like, yeah
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: is demanding that the newly postpart and mother cook a
• 20:16
  Speaker 3: big meal for her to come and stay or whatever.
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: And I'm like, did these people really exist? Like are
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: they really that bad? I just can't imagine it.
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: It's so funny because I when we had boys, I
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: crawled up Seth spot so far about calling his mom.
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: I was like, have you spoken your mom lately? Have
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: you talked your mom as I'm doing, you know what
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: you should do model calling your mother for our sons,
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: just saying did it work? No?
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: No?
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: I mean he is like the very quintessential son. It's
• 20:53
  Speaker 2: very frustrating, and he lucked out because my parents are dead.
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: There was a really funny Instagram reel that I sent
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: to my sister in law that these two women were
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: having a conversation on like a podcast and the one
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: of the women said, well, I know how I'm going
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: to keep my son, and the other woman said, well,
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: how do you propose doing that? She said, my son's
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: going to marry an orphan. And I was like, I
• 21:20
  Speaker 2: didn't know I was such a hot commodity as an orphan.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: You're welcome Mandel family.
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's amazing.
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: I don't think my in laws appreciate how much, like
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: how much they lucked out getting an orphan.
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: I wonder how this woman and now I'm going to
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: store her on Instagram?
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah I did.
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: I wonder how she is as a grandmother.
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: So she I did stalk her as I was making
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: dinner tonight. So one of the one of the videos
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: that she recorded was a video to her grandchildren from
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: long distance on the occasion the sacred occasion of Hollow
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: and she talked to them about how much she loved
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: their costume and how she hoped they had a fun
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: time trigg or treating. And I cannot imagine how overbearing
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: this woman must be if this.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: Is her Instagram presence, Yeah all so just move, just move.
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: So but I would not be surprised if her grandchildren's
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: family are actually like her sons are actually no contact
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: and this is how and this is how she's getting
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: it out. Oh my god, this is so I can.
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: I can speak ill of the dead, and I have
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: done so in the past. My grandmother, who was the devil,
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: used to pretend to all of her friends that she
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: was like the best grandmother on the planet. And she
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: would she would brag about me and my cousin. Meanwhile,
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: like me and my cousin haven't spoken in like I
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: don't know, fifteen twenty years, and we were both hot messes.
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: And she would walk around and when I would the
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: rare occasion I would go visit her, she would make
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: me go to the clubhouse at her because she's in
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: like a retirement community, and she'd make me go, and
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: on the way there, she'd like prep me about all
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: the lies that she had told about me. And she'd
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: be like, don't tell anyone that you go to Ruckers.
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: Tell them you go to a better school, tell them
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: you go to Princeton. And I'm like, oh, okay, but
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: but I don't know anything about Princeton. What if someone
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: goes to Princeton and they're like, what about those tigers
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: or something? I don't know what the team name is.
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: And then she was like, yeah, that's you probably don't
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: seem smart enough to go to Princeton. And I was like,
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: oh cool, thanks, grandma, and she would she would like
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: buy me like more provocative shirts so that I would
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: show off a little bit of tea for everybody, Like,
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: look at those boobs. I never had those boobs. I'm like, whoa, Grandma,
• 23:54
  Speaker 2: that's weird that you.
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: Want me to have them.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I didn't. I didn't want to disappoint. But now
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: hopefully people understand that I'm actually not the devil. And
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: then my grandmother was the devil. And like, telling your
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: like eighteen year old seventeen year old, sixteen year old
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: granddaughter to like wear a low cut shirt to show
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: off her tits is like a really weird thing to say.
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: I do honestly.
• 24:19
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not great. Great, it's not great. No, do
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: you like cartoons? Hate her?
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: Wait?
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: Say this again? Do you like cartoons? Hate her? The blog?
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: I too?
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, me too. I didn't expect you to know her that.
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: I thought I was going to have to explain. No, no, okay,
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: did you see her Latey's peace? No, okay, it's called
• 24:43
  Speaker 3: a gentle parent because I'm scared of my kids scared.
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: Yes, I did see that.
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: Actually, did you read it?
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: I skimmed it.
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: Okay, I skimmed it too. Should we talk about it?
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: We should talk about it. So I kind of hated it,
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: So I that's why I only skimmed it. I don't
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: gentle parent as a as a preview to my comments,
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: I think that it is not super healthy. Nor is
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: parenting in a manner that makes your children not hate
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: you a super healthy thing to do. Your parent, your
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: kids might hate you no matter what. Yeah.
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: Well, this was my problem with the piece is that
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: so most people I know who hate their parents hate
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: them because their parents were too kind of pathetic, promissive.
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah I can see that. Yeah yeah, and not that
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: they were too strict.
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: So I kind of wanted to massage here and be like, hey,
• 25:43
  Speaker 3: I don't think that if I going to resent you
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: for telling them not to. Although, can I just say so,
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: I don't gentle parent books that I don't already parent
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: yet because my baby's won.
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: But I love that you say that. By the way,
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: you're not the perfect parent, as every mom of one
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: one year old is.
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: I'm already like I don't parent her because she's one one.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's correct, that's rare.
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: But also she terrifies me. So maybe I am going
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: to be a gentle parent because I'm scared of her.
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: Like if, oh my god, so every morning, take her
• 26:17
  Speaker 3: out of bed, take it downstairs. If I don't heat
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: up her milk fast enough, she is throwing, screaming, throwing
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: herself around on the floor, and like, there's nothing you
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: can do with the one year old. She doesn't get it,
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: she doesn't know she's being unreasonable.
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: No, I mean I think you can. I'm actually going
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: to a disagree reading. Yeah, yeah, you can say no stop.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, okay, so.
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it just makes her angry.
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean eventually, like I say no, I.
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: Mean, so so she doesn't talk yet and the only
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: thing that she says is no because she heard it
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: so much.
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: So this is this is where my my non gentle
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: parenting begins, as like right around that age. Actually yeah,
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: maybe I think I started right around there, maybe a
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: little older than she is, but in that circumstance, I
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: would I would withhold what she wants until she stops.
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, she just doesn't stop. I mean maybe I'll give
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: it a couple of months.
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so right around sixteen seventeen months is
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: when that kind of strategy works.
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what I've read. Basically, they can understand enough
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: to be scolded a little bit at like sixteen to
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: eighteen months, but it.
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: Has to be natural consequences, like you can't this is
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: This is the thing that annoys me about gentle parenting.
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: And my mom actually sort a little bit gentle parented me,
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: and it was the worst thing that she did. She
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: would have these like long drawn out conversations with me,
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: and I wanted to shoot myself in the face, and
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: I'm like, just just yell at me and get over with,
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: Like I can't do this, like expose a tory conversation
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: in which you're just just yell and move on. Yeah,
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: but I think everyone everyone's parenting is basically a reflection
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: of their parents one way or the other. And so
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: my grandparents were very abusive, which is why my grandmother
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: was the devil. I'm mostly actually parent how my mom did,
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: except for those long, excruciating conversations she used to subject
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: me to.
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I was thinking this because basically, my takeaway from
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: the cartoons hate her piece, which everybody should read. It's
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: called a gentle parent because I'm scared of my kids
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: hating me. Is that you basically just want to raise
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: a kid who is forgiven enough to not go no
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: contact with you for the pettiest of reasons. And I
• 28:53
  Speaker 3: think my mother did a really good job at that.
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: Like I can recognize mistakes that she made, but I
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: forgive her for them and like don't think about them
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: or holding over her, And I basically want to replicate
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: the way that she raised me. Yeah. I think the
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: older I've gotten as well and becoming a mother, I
• 29:16
  Speaker 3: just feel so much more forgiven in all aspects of
• 29:20
  Speaker 3: my life that I could never even imagine thinking so
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: and generously about somebody or something that I would like
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: never speak to them again.
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I think the key, honestly on the no contact
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: stuff is making clear to your kids as young as
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: possible that like, you're human, yeah, and that you have
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: good intentions. My kids, even my six year old almost
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: seven years No, she's not even almost seven, she's six
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: and a half. I think she understands that I'm human.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: And I think part of that is, you know, when
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: you freak out at a kid being honest and saying like, wow,
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: I had a really stressful day and it's not an
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: excuse for screaming at you like that, and I'm really sorry, yea.
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: And showing them that like, oh, grown ups are people too,
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: really counts for a lot. And it doesn't it doesn't
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: make them feel less safe, and it just makes them
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: feel like part of the team and that we're all
• 30:19
  Speaker 2: in this together and that like there's not this like
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: magical force that's keeping everything together. Yeah, that like it's
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: through hard work and it's through you know, teamwork.
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: And I mean it's probably sad to say as well,
• 30:32
  Speaker 3: but I think that the no contact stuff is just
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: like a generational gap that gen X as a bear
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: in the brunts of because gen Z and millennials have
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: decided that this is their new thing, you know, I
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: don't know.
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: I mean it was funny. I was thinking about this, Actually,
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: did you see Ben? Do you Ben Dreyfus on inside?
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: So he just admitted that him and his siblings are
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: all no contact with their actor or famous father, Richard
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: dreyf And I was thinking about messaging him, and I
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: didn't want to like put my stuff on him when
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: he had just like you know, you know, he's making
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: headlines and whatever. But him and I have gone back
• 31:12
  Speaker 2: and forth very cordially on DM a couple of times.
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: But I was thinking about it and thinking about that,
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: and if my parents were alive, I'm not sure how
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: much of a connection I would have, especially with my father.
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: I would guarantee I would be no contact with my father.
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: My father had drug issues. Having my kids around him,
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: I don't think I would feel safe with that. He
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: was just he was not a good guy, and he
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: made like a very ultimately selfish decision on his way
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: out the door. So I think that I could say
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: with certainty that I would be no contact with my father,
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: and I often wonder what my relationship would be like
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: with my mother.
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: So I was no contact with my dad before he died, really,
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: which meant for really weird death experience. It was like, yep,
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: it was insane. It was so crazy. I was so upset,
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: and I just felt like I had like no control anymore.
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: I felt like, at least when he was alive, had
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: like a little bit of control or choice, like I
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: could choose to speak to him, you know, and then
• 32:23
  Speaker 3: when that was taken away from me, it was just
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: like the most insane grieving process ever.
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I would say in a lot of ways, my
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: father's death was harder than my mother's death because it
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: was like very clean. With my mom. It was like
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: she was my best friend. I loved her more than anything,
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: and I'm going to miss her every day for the
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: rest of my life. My father, there was I mean,
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: it was also he committed suicide, but there was just
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: so much baggage. We never we never closed the loop
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: on and we never could like we never would have
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: resolved the things that happened because he could not admit
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: what he did wrong and I did nothing wrong because
• 33:01
  Speaker 2: I was a child and he had like scapegoated my
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: mom in a lot of ways and I was like, no, homie,
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: don't play. Yeah, So it was hard. It was hard
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: losing him.
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: So I did not read the Ben dry first emails
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: because I got Payold. I want to say, it's because
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: I'm a good person and I hadn't it invade on
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: the privacy, But it's because I got Payold. So did
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: you read them?
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: No, because I also got Paywald. But I did read
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: the USA Today reporting, right, and he he's being charitable
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: and says, you know, it took two to tango. Basically,
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: it sounds like what he did quote unquote wrong was
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: that he expressed so he was he was running his
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: dad's Twitter account like five years ago, and under his
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: dad's name he expressed support for his little brother who
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: had a me too allegation against Kevin Spacey. And the
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: situation that happened was that it was the three of
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: them in the room, the younger Dreyfus brother, Richard Dreyfus,
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: and Kevin Spacey, and apparently unbeknownst to Richard, Kevin Spacey
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: made a move on the younger Dreyfus.
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: Oh wow.
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: And so he came out with it, and under his
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: dad's Twitter account he expressed support for quote unquote his son.
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: But it was really Ben expressing support under their dad's
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: name for his brother. But I can see being not
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: thrilled that that statement was made without his consent under
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: his own name. But why he was actually mad was
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: because it drew attention to him. And then he got
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: me too, because yeah, so that's not really Ben's fault
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: that his dadad is.
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: To me against him, like a plausible one.
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: Not really ish, but I but anyway, I kind of
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: wanted to message Ben and say, you know, my parents
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: are both dead. In a lot of ways, I think
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: that's easier. I wonder what my relationship would be like
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: with my mother. On one hand, she was my best
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: friend and we were extremely close, unhealthily so. But on
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: the other everything she told me not to do I did.
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: I had too many children. That was always her number
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: one rule. Do not have Yeah, do not have more
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: children than you can take care of by yourself. That
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: was like the lesson that I was.
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: You do take care of them by yourself.
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but I don't think I could do six kids
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: permanently by myself. I can do it for five days
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: in London. I could not. I mean, I guess I
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: would figure out how to do something.
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: So she meant as a single mother, Yes.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: Yes, I see, because you can't count on a man, right,
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: and so that I broke cardinal rule number one. Yeah,
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: and the other like core part of her identity was
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: being extremely liberal, right and cool, so she would be
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: one like a Keith Olberman Jensaki, MSNBC viewer if she
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: was alive.
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: I don't know how I think the interest in dinner parties.
• 36:18
  Speaker 3: But also you don't know, I mean that's the that's
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: the sad and tragic part is that, like, you don't
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: know how she would have changed with age. And it's
• 36:31
  Speaker 3: all easy to say, oh, you shouldn't have loads of kids,
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: but then also it's really nice to have a load
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: of grandchildren.
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: So my mom also didn't really like children very much.
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so my mom like my mom had me at twenty,
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: never had another kid and doesn't really like babies very
• 36:54
  Speaker 3: much and just wants to be a full time grandmother
• 36:57
  Speaker 3: and nothing.
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: Really, Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I guess I'll
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: never know. I'll never know. That's like one of those
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: questions that I'll never have an answer to. Hi, this
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: is a young Culter. Welcome to my Ricochet podcast.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: And Coulter every week on Ricochet.
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: You're home to center right conversation.
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: Hey, that was pretty good. I don't know. I mean,
• 37:31
  Speaker 2: one of my best friends is no contact with her mother,
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: and things were on the rocks for a very very
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: long time, and I used to give her guilt about
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: it because my mom was dead and I just could
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: not understand why she wasn't closer to her mother and
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: why she was so she was very standoffish with her mother.
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: She drew a lot of boundaries and I'll never forget this.
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: We decided a couple of us girlfriends decided to spend
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: a weekend at somebody's beach house basically, and so we
• 38:02
  Speaker 2: all drove down to the beach together and my friend
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: very smartly said, why don't you drive my mom? And
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: I was like, sure, I'd love to. So it was
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: me and her mom and my kids behind us, and
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: we car pooled. And so two and a half hours later,
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: we get to our destination and I get out of
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: the car and I don't even unstrap my kids, and
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: I said to my friend, I need to talk to
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: you for a second. And I pulled her aside and
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: I was like, I'm really sorry. I'm really sorry. You
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: were right for years and I let my baggage about
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: my dead mom. Yeah, way too much on what I
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: was telling you. And she started crying and she's like
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: this is so validating. I'm like, I'm gonna go get
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: my kids out of the car now. Hopefully she hasn't
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: suffocated them.
• 38:53
  Speaker 3: What was the main.
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: Issue though, So she did not stop talking for two
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: and a half hours, like it wasn't possible to get
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: a word out, and my friend had just gone through
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: like her daughter had just gone through a very traumatic incident,
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: and she did something really hard and really brave, and
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: I was really proud of her. And her mom spent
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: a lot of the trip being very cruel about what
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: her daughter had done and just cruel about her in general.
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: And it was she was gossiping about her daughter in
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: really mean ways, and I couldn't speak because she just
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: didn't stop, Like there was not a guess and I
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: it was just she just clearly didn't seem to like
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: her daughter or respect her daughter.
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's that's me.
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And so I was just like, she's enough of
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: my friend that I have taken a weekend with my
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: children to come here to this beach to support her.
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, going to gossip about it with you?
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I'm not. I'm not. I'm not going to
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: talk badly about her.
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: Well, particularly with moms and daughters, you get like a
• 40:07
  Speaker 3: Jabbazi aspect.
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: Yes, that was a lot of it. My friend is hot.
• 40:12
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's terrifying. Oh my god, Am I going
• 40:15
  Speaker 3: to be like that? No? Oh my god.
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: No, you have a wonderful relationship with your mom, and
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: that's I mean, that's that's the really. So I took
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: my oldest daughter. We went on a girl's trip, just
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: me and her. I had a work trip last weekend
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: to Chicago, and I decided to bring her. So I
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: wanted to spend like quality one on one time with
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: her because I don't think she gets that enough. And
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: it was lovely and I'm so glad I did it.
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: And I would do it with my other children if
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: my sons were interested in me, but they're not. I'll
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: do it with my other daughter. But I have a
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: really really nice relationship with my daughter that very closely
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: mirrors my relationship with my mother, that is less codependent
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: by virtual of the fact that I have five with
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: their children. But I I found having a daughter, especially first,
• 41:04
  Speaker 2: to be very healing of the like whole mother daughter
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: bond that was severed twenty five years ago. Twenty years ago.
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: Oh my god.
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it was really nice, and it was funny because
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: I got there and I realized that I had done
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: a similar Chicago girls trip with my mother that I
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: forgot about until I got there, and then I was like,
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: I did this with my mom.
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's so nice.
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: It was really special, And so when I came home,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: I started looking through pictures of like what did I
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: do when I came to chic I wish I had
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: remembered and I could have like, you know, retraced the steps,
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: but I'm glad I didn't, Like, we wanted our own trip,
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: and I don't want to. That's not healthy to like
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: recreate the old trip that I did with my mom.
• 41:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, it's nice though.
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so it was really nice and very you know,
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: it was good. It was it was a fun. It
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: was a fun two days. And the funny part was
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: I always tease them that they bring home like the
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: worst memories of things, like we'll do all these cool
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: things and then they'll remember the stupidest part. And so
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: while we were there, I remembered that I had done
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: this trip with my mother, and I had forgotten until
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: we got to Chicago, and she said, well, what did
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: you do on that trip? I'm like, so, I really
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: only remember we were at like a pizza place and
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: my mom was like really embarrassing with the waiter, and
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: so she's like, oh, so that's your core memory. I'm like, yeah, okay, fair.
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: The other I think I took from that trip was
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: she was embarrassing with the waiter, and then I went
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: I went through the photo album because my mom took
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: like meticulous Oh, so I could see the whole photo album,
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: and I was like, oh, we went to the art Institute.
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: We went to this place, and so yeah, my daughter
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: and I actually did do the art institute.
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, that is so cute.
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And so our core memory of that trip was
• 42:51
  Speaker 2: so we went to the Shed Aquarium, which is right
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: next to Bears Stadium football and we left the aquarium
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: right as the football game was ending, and so there
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: was no cabs and we were in like thousands of
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: drunk Chicago sports fans trying to find a cab and
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: we had to end up walking a mile through like
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: Chicago and mid November with our luggage trying to find
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: a cab. And we almost missed her flight. And there
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: was a blizzard coming that night, and it was during
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: the shutdown, and like air traffic was a total disaster,
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: and if we missed that flight, we would have been
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: we would have just gotten home yesterday, Like it would
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: have been so bad.
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: Oh my god. So you made it.
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: We made it by the skin of our teeth. But
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: it was a really fun trip.
• 43:42
  Speaker 3: And now I'm kidding. Wait, did I tell you that
• 43:46
  Speaker 3: I made my mom meet me in Belgium? Well you
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: told me.
• 43:49
  Speaker 2: You didn't tell me on the pot, but you told me.
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: So it's a pretty short flight for her, right, Yeah.
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: It's a couple of hours. And I was but I
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: was just craving British food so much, and I've been
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: trying to find ways to like smuggle it into America,
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: but obviously you can't, right, so you can't get it
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: through customs. So I was like, do you know, and
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: we'll let you through with some pastys so that I
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: really really want Belgium. And she did it. She did it.
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: She had a bag full of sausage rolls that she
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: had gone together that morning. So sweet.
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: So does she spend the whole time with you there?
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: Yeah, she spent a couple of days. They're two out
• 44:27
  Speaker 3: of the three days.
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: That's really nice.
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I dragged her to the story conference that I
• 44:33
  Speaker 3: went to.
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: What does she think about it?
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: She loved it. She works in that type of field,
• 44:39
  Speaker 3: so yeah, she's a social worker. I love it.
• 44:43
  Speaker 2: No, it's really special that you guys. When is she
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: coming after the baby is worn? Is she coming for
• 44:47
  Speaker 2: the birth.
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: So I'm going for Christmas in a couple of weeks
• 44:51
  Speaker 3: for three weeks to England. Yeah wow, well well so
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: well yeah, okay, Wales isn't England.
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: I don't care.
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: O my god. And then she's going to come for
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: a month when the babies want all three weeks. I
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: can't remember. That's amazing. Yeah. Well, hopefully she'll make the
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: birth this time because last time we had planned the
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: same thing and I went into labor early.
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: Wait, so you so you're the whole family's gonna go
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: to Wales. See how I did that?
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: Yes?
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: And so you have a passport and everything.
• 45:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and I'm I'm kind of terrified, but like, how
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: bad can seven hours be?
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: It'll be fine.
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: On my way to Belgium and back, there was screaming
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: toddlers for the whole thing, and I tweeted about this.
• 45:42
  Speaker 3: But like, it's funny how after you have a baby,
• 45:45
  Speaker 3: a screaming baby is just like you don't even notice it. Yeah,
• 45:49
  Speaker 3: I don't even know, is it?
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah? I mean that's that's a little bit of a
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: hard age to travel. But can I give you a
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: terrible tip that's going to get me canceled?
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: Give her benadrol.
• 46:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know the first person who said.
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: But but test beforehand to make sure it actually knocks
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: her out, because some kids it makes them crazy.
• 46:10
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's terrifying.
• 46:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So you don't want you don't want your.
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: Okay, So we're doing an overnight on the way there,
• 46:16
  Speaker 3: which I think is fine. You know she'll sleep at
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: some point.
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so. So you know the I mean,
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: you've flown with her before, so you know, to give
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: her something to suck on on the way up and down. Yeah, yeah,
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: like a bottle or something or the fool but just
• 46:30
  Speaker 2: like two hours, I have to pack lollipops. Okay, thank
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: you for the reminder me the overnight when I did
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: London with the five kids, I mean my kids, my
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: younger two were younger, and they slept most of the way.
• 46:47
  Speaker 4: Kay.
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you're gonna be okay.
• 46:49
  Speaker 3: I think in my head it's just like if it's
• 46:51
  Speaker 3: really bad, then it's one day. Yeah, it's true.
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: The only thing I would say is really try to
• 46:57
  Speaker 2: get her on the right schedule when you get there. Yeah,
• 47:01
  Speaker 2: keep her up.
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah I was. I had really bad jet lag this time.
• 47:05
  Speaker 3: I never so I traditionally don't believe in jet lag
• 47:09
  Speaker 3: and just think that people should just close their eyes
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: when they when the sun goes down. And my insomniac
• 47:15
  Speaker 3: husband hates this belief that I have and then Calma.
• 47:21
  Speaker 3: This time, I didn't see it for like four days.
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I am usually immune to jet lag, but there's
• 47:29
  Speaker 2: been a couple times I've really gotten my butt kicked
• 47:31
  Speaker 2: very hard. I want to say my last So I
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: went to Italy in May June. That one was kind
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: of brutal. Oh it was June. Yeah, that one was
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: a little brutal. The way home from Asia is what
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: really kills me.
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: That one hurts.
• 47:50
  Speaker 2: I once went to Korea and came home and thought
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: I could parent the next day. And we were like
• 47:58
  Speaker 2: on a hike with friends, and I had I had
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: three kids at the time. I had a one year
• 48:02
  Speaker 2: old and then like I guess, a three year old
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: and a four year old. And I went on a
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: hike and I sat down in the hammock and fell
• 48:12
  Speaker 2: asleep for two hours, and my friend had to parent
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: my children for two hours. And I woke up and
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: I was like the hell And she was like, I
• 48:22
  Speaker 2: say this with love, and I'm not mad, but you
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: should not have planned this the day after you got information.
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: She's a really good friend because I would have just
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: woke you up.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: Well, apparently the kids were like screaming, like ban She's
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: running all around and I was just dead to the world.
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: So hilarious.
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but she was really nice and took care of them.
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: Okay, I have one p s A and then we
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: should go because that died and you need to go.
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: So last week we spoke about public school therapy. My
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: favorite conversation.
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: Shout out, Bryan, I have been.
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: Buked a a pelvic floor birth preparation class. I'm very excited.
• 49:04
  Speaker 3: But that's not what I wanted to say. So one
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: of our listeners messaged me and said that she started
• 49:14
  Speaker 3: pelvic floor therapy during her pregnancy. She's like, twenty three weeks.
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: I'm doing as you do this, as you talk about it,
• 49:23
  Speaker 2: it's like in it's involuntary.
• 49:26
  Speaker 3: I just started. I'm doing it too, And she said
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: that it like changed her life in just a couple
• 49:32
  Speaker 3: of sessions. So just because I wanted to say, because
• 49:36
  Speaker 3: on the last podcast, I said that I wasn't going
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: to do public floor therapy until after I had given
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: birth because that's what I thought that you were supposed
• 49:45
  Speaker 3: to do. That you were supposed to do. Apparently it's
• 49:48
  Speaker 3: great through pregnancy, so that's good to know.
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: I just opened Instagram and saw your picture.
• 49:58
  Speaker 3: I love it.
• 49:59
  Speaker 2: Amazing, wonderful. Yeah, so you are on the hook to
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: send this episode to our amazing producer Brian and give
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: him a description immediately so that we remember what we
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: talked about.
• 50:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I have to. So after we end this, I
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: have to go back and listen to the last thing
• 50:17
  Speaker 3: because I have literally no idea.
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna make you do that. We pledge to try
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: to be good about taping for the next five six weeks.
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: We pledge to try seth My husband is on the
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: commentary magazine podcast three to four times a week, and
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: so he's bringing all of his podcast equipment with him
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: on our vacation, and so if we're being honest, the
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: next episode, I don't know when it's gonna happen.
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: Well, I'm free as a bird and we may be
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: on a better time schedule when I'm in Britain.
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: Anyway, Yes, perfect, All right, this was lovely. Everyone, please
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: subscribe and if people could also like give us reviews
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: on Apple podcasts or Spotify or wherever it brings me joy,
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: because sometimes it feels like we're talking into the ethery,
• 51:11
  Speaker 2: even though I see our download numbers and I know
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: that we're not.
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like we have a lot of we
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: do five styles there.
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but I just want more day. We're both only children.
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: We need them for validation. This is what I need,
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: all right, until next time, Satellite Ricochet join the conversation.