Latest / Full Spectrum Cycling / Weekly Dose of Fat – 6-7-14 – with Paul Ellis from HED – Show #7

Transcript

Weekly Dose of Fat – 6-7-14 – with Paul Ellis from HED – Show #7 · Full Spectrum Cycling

0:00
The weekly dose of fat for Saturday, June 7th, 2014, show number seven.
0:06
[upbeat rock music] From the Fatbike.com studios in the beer capital of America, please welcome your hosts, Sven and Gomez.
0:25
[upbeat rock music] Welcome to the program. This is Sven. And this is your Uncle Gomez. [speaks Spanish] The sponsor of this here radio show is Surly Bikes.
0:37
You can find Surly Bikes at the finest bicycle retail establishments and surlybikes.com.
0:44
The podcast book of etiquette says that we should let you know that you can find all of our shows at fatbike.com/radio, and now on iTunes. [bell ringing] And look for us on Facebook and Twitter.
0:59
We've got a spectacular Fat Bike sideshow program lined up this week. We've really pulled out all the stops. You mean, like, I edit out all the stops?
1:07
[laughs] [bell ringing] Before we get started, we wanna send out some healing vibes to our amigo, Scott Quiring. Scott crashed his 29er trying to follow a fat bike and broke eight ribs and his arm. Ooh. Man, ouch, Scott.
1:21
I, I hope you feel better, man. That's, that's gruesome. Heal fast. Was, was it a moose? What'd he get... What got in his way? I think he just took a fat bike line. The w- the way- [laughs]...
1:30
I heard the story was he was following his buddy, Ken, on, on a fat bike and stacked bad. Shred the gnar. Don't let the gnar shred you.
1:38
Well, we've got f- Colin Ford back in the studio just in case we need anything hawked. Colin's like Andy from Conial- Cone and O'Brien. Conehead O'Brien. [laughs] Conehead- Hey, cone man... O'Brien.
1:51
[laughs] Maybe we should have him bring his guitar next time, and he can be the band, too. Later in the show, we have Paul Ellis from Hed Cycling checking in to tell us about his Ethereal 907.
2:03
So get ready for einen carbon-gasm. And we've got some new gear in the test kitchen. And what goes better with bikes than beer? Beer.
2:18
What's in that fat bike radio cooler this week, Gomez? Well, when I was over in Michigan earlier this week, I visited our amigos at Jade Cycles in Holland.
2:28
Colin had told me while I was in Holland to drop in to the New Holland Brewing, uh, Company there, right downtown, and, uh, and try... What was it, Colin? Uh, the Pilgrim's Dole. It's a wheat wine.
2:41
It's like a barley wine, but made with wheat. It's super strong. Yeah. Well, they didn't have that, 'cause it's seasonal, but I did have a couple of delicious beers there.
2:50
But I brought back a, uh, sixer of New Holland Monkey King. Monkey King is a farmhouse ale. Farmhouse. Farmhouse. Farmhosing. [laughs] It's, uh- I think I'm a hoser...
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6.6% alcohogy and scores a 23 on the IBU test. Let's pop some caps. [clears throat] Pass those beers. Pass them beers out there, son. [bottles opening] Oh, I don't have my fancy bottle opener this week.
3:20
Can I borrow your f- What kind of bottle opener you got? I wanna borrow your fancy bottle opener. Well, this week, uh, in honor of our special guest, we have this hoopty, uh, carbon fiber- Hope to...
3:28
and, and steel, uh, just a beautiful bottle cap opener that'll be part of one of our prize packages in- Yeah... for upcoming shows. I was just gonna say, that's too nice for you to keep.
3:39
We're gonna have to give it to a listener, I think. Oh, hell yeah. So, uh- Giveaways... here we go. We, we try to give stuff away to you folks. You just have to follow the instructions and, uh...
3:49
[bottles clinking] Cheers, boys. There we go. Ooh. Wheaty. They usually have wheat in them, yeah. Um, but it's, a lot of what you taste is the yeast. The- The-...
4:04
farmhouse ales should really have a very strong yeast character in them and- Yeasty. [laughs] It's a f- Let me change my answer. Yeah, it's yeasty. Yeasty. I don't- [laughs] I'm not the beer, you know, connoisseur here.
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Col- that's why we got Colin. He can explain what I'm tasting. Is this, is this the same yeast that I taste in real Bavarian, uh, weissbiers? No. It's different. It's, it's, you know, from the same kind of region.
4:29
Farmhouse ales or saisons, you know, they're also called that. They're kind of from, uh, from France, so it's in the region, but it's not quite the same. Are all farmhouse ales cloudy?
4:46
They should be. They can vary in color from amber to golden, pale. But usually they should be cloudy, little bit of sediment on the bottom of the bottle, and a billowing cloudy head on this beer. It was awesome. Head.
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Trousers. Now. And we've just pulled the triple segue. The head guest, the head opener, and the flamboyant head of this beer. Cheers. Boom. [laughs] Boom. Cheers. Bam. That's internet radio. Oh, it's the best.
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[laughs] Moving right along, next up on our flying circus, we have this week's special guest, Mr. Paul Ellis. But first, a message from the Old Familiar Comb Company. When was the last time you de-thatched your beard?
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The Old Familiar Comb Company has combined a bottle opener with a comb, perfect for raking icicles or bugs out of your beard and mustache, and then you can open a cold beer to celebrate.
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Old Fam combs are laser cut from stainless steel and hand finished to give you a quality metal hair comb that also opens bottles.
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Visit oldfamiliarcombcompany.com to find out how to purchase the fat bike gentleman's best friend. Coming up next, Paul Ellis from HED Welcome back. Sven and I want to welcome Paul Ellis to the radio program.
6:12
What do we call this circus again, Sven? The Weekly Dose of Fat. Welcome, Paul. Thanks for joining us today. Thanks for having me. So Paul, tell our listeners what you do at HED. Let's see.
6:24
At HED I do a little bit of, little bit of everything. My focus, though, is, uh, international sales, a little bit of the marketing side.
6:32
I suppose I'd be calling it, like, the manager of the marketing, so I just do the ad placement and budget, and then I turn it over to the, the, uh, graphic guys.
6:41
You know, I got into this whole madness through mountain biking, so I've kind of gotten into the fat bike side after we released the Big Deal rims. So I've taken a liking to that side of the business as well.
6:52
You know, I, I do a lot of events and, uh, do some coordinating of, like, Eurobike and Interbike and the Fat Bike Birgie. You know, I had a grou- group up there and displayed some stuff.
7:02
Yeah, that was a cool event up there- Yeah, I jumped up a little bit... the Birgie. Definitely a good event up there. Yeah, good showing for you guys. It was a really fun event. I really enjoyed it.
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Um, and I'll go back forever. So long as they have it, I'll be there. Very good. Uh, Gomez tells me you're quite a racer, and he said you were born with a carbon fiber spoon in your mouth.
7:20
I asked him to tell me what he meant, and he told me to ask you about it. [laughs] Yeah, he's right. I, uh, you know, I don't...
7:28
I, I got into it, I bought my first fat bike last winter and, uh, I went straight carbon all the way, as much carbon as I could get on the bike.
7:35
So, you know, I only know the 23-pound fat bike, not the, not the 35, 40-pound fat bike. So to me, everything about the fat bike is light. It's lighter than, as light as my mountain bike, really, so.
7:47
Yeah, you came in at the right time, that's for sure. [laughs] Yeah. So let's get right into that, uh, skinny fat bike of yours. You ride a 907, right?
7:57
Yep, the white out frame, so the carbon frame with, uh, the 907 fork, and that's, you know, just pretty much stock the way they come. I have the orange one in case I ever wanna go deer hunting with it.
8:08
I won't, you know, no one will shoot my bike or anything. Okay, good. That's important in Wisconsin and Minnesota and places like that. [laughs] That is a big deal. So what kind of drivetrain you running? Um, let's see.
8:18
For drivetrain on that thing I have, uh, the SRAM X- X1, whatever it's called, the, um, 11-speed stuff, so the 1 by 11. Very nice. Um, and then I pair it up with the Race Face Next SL crank. Again, carbon.
8:35
Um, gearing-wise, yeah, I think, I think I have a 40 or 32 on the front, and it seems to be fine for what I wanna do with it. You got, uh, like bar, stem, seat post, grips? What's in the rider control department?
8:48
Yep, yep, so that way I did, um, some orange Race Face grips. Um, the Race Face Next SL handlebar. Pretty wide, I think like 720 or something. Pretty wide. Kind of like it like that.
9:02
Uh, the stem is our HED GTO stem, you know, a little, a lot shorter, like an 80 or 90 mil. Yeah. Um, seat post-wise, it's a Race Face also, so it all blends together. And some, then the saddle, it's a Fizik.
9:16
I'm kind of... I've got, you know, mo- majority of my riding's on the road, so it's m- a little bit more of a road saddle, I think, I have on it. What tires are you running on that beast?
9:24
Oh yeah, the, uh, 45 North, um, the Dillinger, right? That one. Tubeless with our fat bike rim, the HED Big Deal rim.
9:33
Then we, all those rims we build with CX-ray spokes, black spokes, gold nipples, and then I did the, uh, 907 hubs, so that all blends together real nice. Sweet. And, uh, have you hung that thing from a scale yet?
9:48
Yeah, it's like 13... 23.5 or 6, somewhere in there. Very nice. Um, I suppose it depends how much sealant's in it or not, but yeah, so it's super light. Awesome. Amazing.
9:58
It probably could go a little lighter, but I like... The pedals I use are the, the XG Shimanos, so. You know, there's lighter stuff, but those just work well for me, so I always just never bother with switching them out.
10:10
So, uh, do you think HED will have any new fat bike products when we see you at Interbike this year? Yeah. So before, before Interbike, I think we'll have some...
10:21
Probably look for a wider profile rim from us, um, I would say probably up in the 100 range. Carbon, same, same construction, same design, just a little bit wider profile. Um- Very cool...
10:32
actually just as Interbike approaches, you know, we're getting some snow. Snow won't be far away from us up here in the North. Should match up really well. [laughs] Yeah. Yeah.
10:41
Should match up well with those five-inch, uh, 45 North tires coming out. Yeah, the Dillinger 5. Yep. I have one test- Yeah... I'm testing right now. Those'll be perfect rims for me. [laughs] Yeah. I like those 100s.
10:52
Yeah, that'd be exciting. I, I ag- I agree. I mean, why not go bigger? Pre-selling it to you. Bigger tires, bigger rim, everything bigger. That'd be great. Hell yeah. Put them on your Gomez. Well, cool.
11:01
We appreciate you coming on the show today, Paul, and, uh- Yeah, thanks for having me... look forward to seeing your new stuff, you know? Yeah, definitely.
11:08
And I'll keep, I'll let you know, um, when we have some prototypes ready or whatever, when we can leak you a photo, whatever you wanna do. Killer. Yeah, that'd be cool. Thanks, uh, thanks for being on the show, Paul.
11:19
Hey, thanks Sven. Take care. All right, thanks. Have a good one, you guys. Hi, this is Tim with Reed Cycles.
11:25
When I'm not building fat bikes, I'm cracking an Oscar Blues beer and listening to Sven and Gomez on Fat Bike Radio. Thanks a lot to Paul. Next up, Sven takes a walk on the wild side in the Test Kitchen. Gnome sane.
11:40
Test Kitchen. Well, welcome to the Test Kitchen. In the kitchen. What are we talking about this week? Drinking beer. In the kitchen, drinking beer.
11:49
Uh, well, I recently replaced my E13 crank on my Ape with a Race Face Next SL carbon crank. Installation was pretty straightforward.
12:00
One thing I did notice was that they've got yet another BB cup standard, and I didn't have the appropriate wrench, which, if you're gonna put these on, you're gonna wanna make sure you have ahead of time.
12:10
Luckily the guys at Fixation had one, so I borrowed one from Joel over at Fixation Is it a Race Face only? BSA 30. I think the other...
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There's a couple other aftermarket cup replacements that use it, but it's not a standard yet that I know of Weak Weak. Yeah, why does everybody have to make a tool special?
12:29
Anyway, I know you've had one on Otis, uh, for six months or so. Gomez, what's been your experience? Well,
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I haven't broken it yet That says a lot right there, folks And, uh, every time I, uh, every time I ride with my friend Julio, he's always like, "Oh, sweet cranks, bro" [laughs] But they have just- You know what I think?
12:49
The internet told him to say that [laughs] They just have started to show a little bit of, uh, of creakiness, kind of started after my North Carolina trip and the saltwater. So, uh- Ooh...
13:04
I'm looking forward to borrowing Fixation's [laughs] wrench as well. [laughs] I just took it back to Joel yesterday- You rode-... so you can stop by there on your way home. It's right off the freeway There you go.
13:12
Yep You rode, you rode them carbon cranks in all that sand? Yep Oh, man They have a nice little, uh, end cap on it And if I ever marry Miss America, I'm gonna do filthy things [laughs] to her too With a carbon crank?
13:25
Maybe [laughs] Is that what, is that what you call this? [laughs] That's what she's into. [laughs] Well, I mean- All right, we're getting off this... she's probably from North Carolina [laughs]
13:34
So in further Test Kitchen news... Testing Testing... Aris Peters raced the Borealis Echo that we're testing at, uh, at last week's Wars Race at Camrock.
13:45
I, uh, did a little interview with Aris at the finish line, and here's what he had to say. This is Gomez at the Battle of Camrock, and I have, uh, Aristotle Peters here, who just raced the fat bike category and won.
13:59
Tell us what you thought about the Borealis Echo Uh, the bike was absolutely amazing. I mean, I've been racing mountain bikes for over 10 years now, started when I was, like, 11. ridden so many different kinds of bikes.
14:10
Never have I had this much fun on a, on a bike, let alone a fat bike. So it's crazy fast in the single track. It's so much fun dropping guys on cross-country bikes when I got these, these big-ass tires.
14:23
[laughs] Tell us about the double jump you did, uh, in the, in the whoops Well, I, I had never even ridden here before, and it was only two laps 'cause they're, they're longer laps.
14:33
Um, I, I saw it on the first lap, and I was... If I coulda kicked myself in the rear end, I would've, but I was racing 'cause I missed it on the first lap 'cause I had no idea what was coming at, coming at me.
14:45
But the second lap, it was just a couple rollers, um, and [laughs] I, I doubled them. Um, it was right after this little rollercoaster section, so I had plenty of speed- Perfect double...
14:56
just, [laughs] just lifted up and sailed it, cleared it real easy into the transition. Uh- Yeah... I even threw a, threw a nice table on one of the jumps out there. This, this bike is very flickable Nice.
15:09
So we've been talking a lot about h- how, the way this bike descends. Tell us about how it climbed today Uh, it, it climbed well. There were some really technical climbs here, and with all the...
15:20
We were, like, the fourth wave to start, so there was a lot of traffic that we ran into.
15:24
Um, and there were guys stepping off their bikes left and right, and, uh, with all the rocks and roots, I was able to just float right over it.
15:32
Nev- there was never any point of hesitation on any of the climbs, even the most technical Cool. Thanks, Aris. Congrats on the win Thanks so much All right.
15:41
There's photos of Aris racing the Echo at the Battle of Camrock in a post that we published on Thursday. Check out the link in the show notes and read more of what Aristotle thought about the Echo. It's pretty good.
15:54
Spoiler alert. [laughs] Spoiler alert. Everybody seems to like that bike. I mean- It's fun Yeah, we've had six people ride it, and, uh, I- It's super fast... I'm jazzed about that bike, so... But what do I know?
16:06
I'm just- They set it up... a guy behind his- They, they pimp it out, too, straight out of the box. I mean, you're paying for it, but it's pimped out.
16:14
And- Oh, wait, I thought it would be totally pimped out if it had the carbon rims. You changing your story now? Oh, oh, ooh, well, uh- Oh, we got you in the, in the half-pimp mode... got me, got me [laughs]
16:26
It would be totally pimped out with carbon rims on Okay, we're back on track again Mm-hmm. [laughs] Uh- Tell us about your shoe study there, Sid [laughs] I...
16:35
It's just a long-term storyline that I'm working on about shoes for platform pedals. Uh, uh, all you guys who ride with clipless probably have only a few pair of shoes at best.
16:45
There just aren't that many choices for a decent shoe for clipless riding, especially on the beach, and that's what I'm concentrating on here. Platform pedals really open up the choices of what shoes you can ride.
16:56
So over the past couple years I've used everything from waterproof hiking boots to sandals to basically everything in between, skate shoes, just about anything. Some of them last about three days on a beach ride.
17:09
Some of them have been pretty good, but there's always problems, and I'm looking for the Holy Grail. My latest purchase is, uh, the Adidas Hydropros.
17:17
They're made for canyoneering, which involves a lot of walking in rivers and climbing up rocks, and it, it's another, another try at seeing if we can find, uh, what works really well on the beach Yeah, I have to agree.
17:28
There is no Holy Grail shoe for riding on the beach Not yet, but- But if you're going to find it, you may find it in the realm of canyoneering.
17:37
I did that once when I was younger, and now that I ride a fat bike, all I wanna do is take a fat bike to Utah to the Escalante National Monument and pack for days on end We seek the grail Sounds like an awesome trip.
17:54
That would be great Yeah So, so far I've gone on a couple of break-in rides with them, and they...
17:58
One thing I did notice right off the bat is they've got a pretty stiff sole, much stiffer than, like, a tennis shoe or a skate shoe.
18:05
Not quite as stiff as a dedicated cycling shoe, but not bad, and you got that big platform under there. Gonna do a couple beach rides coming up really soon, so we'll get some beach experience on them.
18:15
Let you more, know more when I know more You can check it out in Sven's Shoe Corner on Fatbike.com [laughs] Yeah, if you guys- Get over there. [laughs] If you guys have beach shoe experience, I'd like to hear about it.
18:28
You can email me at sven@fatbike.com. Hey, I'm continuing my testing with the Paul Components Lite Mounts.
18:37
I've been waiting to get in a Geno Lite Mount from Paul so I can mount lights under the Braze-Ons on my fork down low for better highway vision. Geez. And they just came in yesterday.
18:49
I used to have one on my, uh, Surly Big Dummy for around the, the city riding. They really do a good job of putting the light where it needs to be.
18:56
I'm trying to get something that eliminates the big shadow my handlebar bag creates when I, uh- I had a-... when I, when I backpack... I had a, I had a six-pack rack on the front of that bike for a while.
19:06
Did a good job out of that. Yeah, I guess, you know, obviously the having one on your head would work. Put it on your head. [laughs] I mean- The light coming from my head...
19:15
then when you walk into the bar, you blind everybody and they punch you in your nose. Oh, I don't like that. [laughs] Earlier this week, I took a trip over to Michigan and met with Steve and Scott from Sarma USA.
19:25
We met at one of my favorite mountain bike trails out there at Fort Custer, and I rode their Shaman fat bike on a real single track shakedown. This thing is 22 pounds and change- Geez Louise... carbon frame, fork, rims.
19:42
Uh, look for a story next week about this new player in the fat carbon quiver killer category. Is that real sandy at that- Yeah... trail? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
19:53
Because I remember Michigan riding, there's a lot of sand even on the, the single track. Yeah. I, I liked this bike. Right on. It was a, it was another I, I just did it again. Oops, I did it again. Oops. Hey, Britney.
20:05
Hey, what does mine say? Hey, Britney. [laughs] Also, we got in a Borealis 150 millimeter front hub, Blue Dot compatible- [clears throat]... uh, for Eros' Blue Dot fork. We did a first look on that, uh, last week.
20:19
Leave a link in the show notes. We're gonna build that up with a Northpaw 50 millimeter rim, and we're getting closer to having the bikes ready for our suspension shootout. We'll keep you posted on that.
20:29
[imitates guns shooting] Shootout. Suspension shootout, out, out, out, out. [imitates guns shooting] [laughs] [sings] Drink. Oh, yeah, we d- haven't had a beer stop yet. Beer stop. [bottles clinking] Beer stop.
20:47
[growls] [bottles clinking] I've been testing a, uh, tire combination out on the, uh, fat back, 45 North Dillinger 5 in the front and a Vee Tire Bulldozer in the rear. It's working really well out in the field for me.
21:05
Smooth rolling, great traction, and all the float that that 4.7 inch casing can provide. You got, uh, 90 millimeter rims on that? 90s, yeah. 90s. Huma 90s. Huma 90s. Huma. Yes. That's fine. Big tires equal big fun.
21:21
Last week I headed up to ZuZu Pedals, just off the beach in Port Washington, to check out an inexpensive entry into the fat bike market from SE Bikes. Mm-hmm. The one I checked out is called the Fat.
21:32
That's F with the at sign. Mike was kind enough to lend me their floor model, so I took it out the beach to get some first impressions. The beach was really closed out.
21:41
The waves were coming in pretty good, so I didn't take it on an extended ride, but what I did learn about it is the current version is an offset frame using a 135 millimeter hub, like a Pugsley style.
21:54
For an inexpensive bike, they did some pretty good speccing on it. It's got hydraulic brakes with mineral oil from Tektro. It's got Shimano shifters, SLX front derailleur, a, a Serra rear derailleur.
22:06
Good, uh, good, uh, serviceable equipment for an 899 retail price point. They obviously had to kinda save money somewhere, and they did it in the wheel area, like a lot of the inexpensive bikes. Pretty tires.
22:20
It uses the, the, uh, Vee Rubber Mission tire, which I think is, uh, somewhere where you'd wanna consider upgrading if you want to get the real fat bike experience. This gets you on your way.
22:31
But you could work with your dealer, and they'd probably upgrade the tires for a little bit more money. Yep, I think that's probably a good call.
22:37
If you're gonna ride this not on the beach, and you're not gonna go into the real low pressure zone, and you're looking just for a trail bike, the Missions actually work pretty well up in the 15 pound pressure neighborhood.
22:48
When you drop 'em down on the beach, they still work okay. It's that transitioning back on the pavement or on the trail when you're at low pressure where those tires kinda have a issue with how they feel.
22:59
Now, this is a nice-looking bike, Porsche red, 899 retail. Does it have a split top tube? It does not. Oh. It does not.
23:06
I heard they're gonna do some, uh, upgrades to it for 2015 as well, so maybe we'll learn something more about that. I want a quad angle fat bike if it's coming from SE. [laughs] Come on now. There you go.
23:16
[laughs] So I, I think a, I think a, uh, BMX inspired first bike for somebody, this is, that's cool stuff. Yeah, SE's pretty good. And we like to put cool stuff on our site, so that's why it's there.
23:27
I talked to Todd from SE Bikes this week, and he did tell me that they might have a new upgraded 2015 Fat at their, uh, Interbike booth. So, uh, they only made about 250 of these first year's models. Is that Todd Lyons?
23:42
Uh, I don't know. Todd Lyons, Ripper? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, it is. Ripper? It is. Yeah, dude, that guy- Yeah, it is. Totally...
23:49
oh, man, I remember looking at that guy in BMX magazines when I was- Yeah, that's, that's who I talked to... so cool. Yeah. Cheers, Todd. Totally. He said, he- [laughs] Yeah, thanks.
23:58
So, uh, if you, uh, if you're looking to get one of these new SEs, you should probably hit up a dealer really quick 'cause they're not gonna be around for long.
24:06
Yeah, I think they went through three or four of 'em up there at ZuZu already. Well, I know a few boys and girls have been waiting all show to hear how many ticks were in my killing jar.
24:15
How was your visit to the tick cemetery? It was pretty gruesome, Sven. Our body count for the last 14 months was 38. Wow. So our bonus prize package winner is Jordan Blacksoon from Anchorage, Alaska with a guess of 42.
24:32
The meaning of life, the universe, and everything. What does he win, Sven? A Surly Gnarred tire. A Borealis Fat Bikes flask and shot glass. A Wolf Tooth Components bottle opener.
24:45
A Fat Bike limited edition embroidered cycling cap. A fatbike.com Black Ops patch and stickers. And positive vibrations.
24:56
All Jordan has to do is contact us at info@fat-bike.com and we'll send out your bonus prize package.
25:03
Next week on the radio program, ladies and gentlemen, we welcome a man genetically engineered to MC bike events and look good in a pair of slacks, Mr. Eric Sovereign, Sov from Surly.
25:17
Well, guys, that's another show in the can. Thank you all for tuning in to the Weekly Dose of Fat.
25:23
We know that we're not the only choice for semi-intoxicated bike mumblings, and we appreciate that you've chosen Fat Bike Radio to keep you company.
25:32
Thanks again to our show sponsor, Surly Bikes, makers of the Pugsley, Moonlander, Krampus, and coming later this summer- The Ice Cream Truck. As well as many other splendid steel bicicletas. That bike rips.
25:48
[laughs] All right, folks, see you next week. Adios, amigos. Wow. [laughs] You've been listening to Fat Bike Radio's Weekly Dose of Fat.
26:02
Find us on the web at fat-bike.com/radio. We'll see you next time.
26:11
[rock music]