Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / SCOTT PETERSON: BURNED MATTRESS, DUCT TAPE PROVE I DIDN'T MURDER LACI

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SCOTT PETERSON: BURNED MATTRESS, DUCT TAPE PROVE I DIDN'T MURDER LACI · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
0:07
Speaker 2: Scott Peterson. Does it never end with this guy? Remember him?
0:13
Speaker 2: He was sitting on death row for years for the
0:16
Speaker 2: murder of his wife, Lacey and their.
0:19
Speaker 1: Unborn child Connor.
0:21
Speaker 2: Yes, well somehow he did a backflip and he's no
0:25
Speaker 2: longer on death row, and now he says he's totally innocent,
0:30
Speaker 2: claiming that a burned mattress and duct tape will prove quote,
0:36
Speaker 2: I didn't murder Lacey. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.
0:41
Speaker 2: Thank you for being with us.
0:44
Speaker 3: Scott Peterson convicted of killing his wife Lacey and their
0:48
Speaker 3: unborn son Connor. Now twenty two years later, he's speaking out.
0:56
Speaker 2: He's speaking out now, really, he's speaking out now when
1:00
Speaker 2: he had the opportunity at trial to take the stand
1:04
Speaker 2: and explain to the jury how he's innocent and he
1:07
Speaker 2: did not kill his wife and unborn child, Connor. So
1:12
Speaker 2: now he's speaking out for the cameras, okay, where nobody
1:17
Speaker 2: such as me can cross examine him.
1:20
Speaker 1: Wow, that'll be a piece of cake.
1:22
Speaker 2: I just wonder how much money he or his family
1:25
Speaker 2: is making off speaking out now. That said, I want
1:29
Speaker 2: you to hear and I'm really looking forward to this
1:33
Speaker 2: coming out on Netflix, American Murder Lacy Peterson. It's going
1:40
Speaker 2: to be followed by a documentary. Oops almost in documentary,
1:47
Speaker 2: but documentary in which Peterson allegedly speaks. But that said,
1:53
Speaker 2: I want you to hear this from Netflix American Murder
1:58
Speaker 2: Lacy Peterson.
2:00
Speaker 4: I was having Christmas Eve at my house and she
2:02
Speaker 4: was going to have Christmas Morning at her house, and
2:05
Speaker 4: that's pretty much when everything started. Scott called me to
2:12
Speaker 4: find out if Lacy was at my house and I
2:15
Speaker 4: said no, and he said, well that she's missing. Missing.
2:19
Speaker 4: What do you mean missing? I mean, people don't use
2:23
Speaker 4: that term lightly. So I told him to call her
2:28
Speaker 4: friends and find out if anybody had seen her.
2:35
Speaker 1: Christmas Eve. I got a call from Scott Licy's missing.
2:39
Speaker 1: Have you talked to her today? What do you mean missing?
2:43
Speaker 1: Where could she possibly be?
2:45
Speaker 5: He called and said the same thing to me, that
2:47
Speaker 5: she's missing, and I was like, what do you mean missing?
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Speaker 4: Called me back and said that nobody has seen her.
2:56
Speaker 4: I told Ron called the police, and I called a
2:58
Speaker 4: friend of mine to come and pick me up. Because
2:59
Speaker 4: it was so I've said, I mean instantly, it was panic.
3:02
Speaker 2: Instantly you are hearing American Murder Lacy Peterson, it's going
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Speaker 2: to air on Netflix, and joining me right now, an
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Speaker 2: entire all star panel very intimately familiar with the Scott
3:16
Speaker 2: Peterson case. But first a special guest, Sky Borgman, joining
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Speaker 2: us out of la the director of American Murder, Lacy Peterson. Sky,
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Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. You know what just
3:29
Speaker 2: right there that takes me right back to the trial
3:33
Speaker 2: and all the times that I have spoken with Lacey's mother,
3:36
Speaker 2: Sharon Roache. And you know what, Sky, I will never
3:40
Speaker 2: forget as long as I live. I had been out
3:43
Speaker 2: in front of the courthouse. It was so hot, race
3:45
Speaker 2: back in because Sharon was going to testify, and as
3:49
Speaker 2: I recall, she had on this beautiful yellow outfit, and
3:52
Speaker 2: I was almost late, and they would shut the doors
3:55
Speaker 2: and let nobody in.
3:56
Speaker 1: I got in at the end, entirely back row.
4:00
Speaker 2: I had to sit on my backpack so I could
4:03
Speaker 2: see Sharon, and she described, amongst so many other things,
4:08
Speaker 2: sky burying her daughter, her skeletal remains, and in the
4:17
Speaker 2: casket she buried baby Connor in Lacey's skeleton arms, so
4:26
Speaker 2: that in death she could hold the baby.
4:28
Speaker 1: She was looking forward to so much. And I will.
4:32
Speaker 2: Never forget Sharon Roache as long as I lip that
4:38
Speaker 2: woman has lived through hell Sky.
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Speaker 6: Yeah, she really hasn't. She's an incredible woman, and she
4:46
Speaker 6: really looks she hasn't. She hasn't really wanted to participate
4:49
Speaker 6: in a documentary about Lacey, and we were so honored
4:53
Speaker 6: and so happy that she chose to talk with us.
4:57
Speaker 6: And I think a lot of the reason behind that
4:58
Speaker 6: is because there have been these other documentaries that are
5:02
Speaker 6: saying that Scott Peterson is innocent and very much focused
5:05
Speaker 6: on Scott, and she wanted our documentary, her documentary, any
5:10
Speaker 6: documentary that she speaks on, to really.
5:12
Speaker 1: Be about lazy.
5:14
Speaker 6: And I hope that we accomplish that in a way
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Speaker 6: that makes Sharon proud. I certainly think it will, and
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Speaker 6: I think our documentary is very lazy, for it is
5:23
Speaker 6: always what I'm the most interested in when I'm telling
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Speaker 6: stories is having the victim really be at the forefront
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Speaker 6: of the story.
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Speaker 1: In a sky.
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Speaker 2: It's really a huge fat to get Sharon to speak
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Speaker 2: because it's so painful for her even now to talk
5:46
Speaker 2: about Lacey going.
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Speaker 1: Missing and what happened.
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Speaker 2: And I want to bring it back to what we
5:51
Speaker 2: just played from the upcoming Netflix documentary which is called
5:56
Speaker 2: American Murder Lacey Paterson Sky because I'm about to go
6:01
Speaker 2: to a veteran trial lawyer who will disagree with me,
6:04
Speaker 2: Richard Herman. But I remember when my son, and it
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Speaker 2: was just for a few moments, we were in this
6:13
Speaker 2: giant baby superstore. He was about too It's got a
6:16
Speaker 2: twin sister, Lucy, and I was way down on a
6:21
Speaker 2: shelf from floor to ceiling looking for organic sunscreen.
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Speaker 1: Don't even ask, but I stood up.
6:27
Speaker 2: I said, well they don't have it, and I turned
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Speaker 2: around and there was Lucy.
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Speaker 1: I know John David.
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Speaker 2: I did not call my husband and say John David's missing.
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Speaker 2: I started screaming to the top of the lungs my
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Speaker 2: son's gone, and running through the stores. Hu's like a
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Speaker 2: warehouse with Lucy under my arm like a football, screaming
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Speaker 2: his name.
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Speaker 1: He's gone right there.
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Speaker 2: You capsulize it, Sky, who says Lacy's missing. Missing is
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Speaker 2: what you determine after all effort are exhausted, then she's missing.
7:03
Speaker 2: You start with saying, hey, have you say Lacey.
7:05
Speaker 1: That's how you start. Yeah, it's true.
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Speaker 6: I mean, like I understand maybe that there was some
7:11
Speaker 6: super weird behavior from Scott Peterson. But I think even
7:15
Speaker 6: beyond the strange behavior that Scott exhibits, when you really
7:18
Speaker 6: look at the evidence, to me, it sort of stacks
7:22
Speaker 6: up and says one thing, and that's what the jury
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Speaker 6: decided on twenty years ago.
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Speaker 2: When you say you look at the evidence and it
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Speaker 2: stacks up and says one thing, which evidence particularly speaks
7:32
Speaker 2: to you, Scott.
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Speaker 6: Look, it's circumstantial, let's be real, but it is a
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Speaker 6: big stack of circumstantial evidence. What speaks to me the
7:38
Speaker 6: most are, honestly, the conversations he had with Amber Fry,
7:42
Speaker 6: the woman that he was in a relationship with while
7:45
Speaker 6: he was still married, while Lacy was still alive, and
7:48
Speaker 6: he talks about the end of his relationship, the end
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Speaker 6: of Lacey, the end of his wife. Before Lacey's goes
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Speaker 6: missing on December ninth, he talks about his marriage being over,
8:01
Speaker 6: that his wife is dead. So he's sort of projecting
8:03
Speaker 6: in a way, and that to me, and I believe
8:06
Speaker 6: that to the jury members, at least the ones that
8:08
Speaker 6: we spoke to, that was really the tipping point for
8:11
Speaker 6: them to go. This was premeditated. This is something that
8:14
Speaker 6: Scott was planned.
8:15
Speaker 2: Joining me high profile trial lawyer Richard Herman defense attorney
8:19
Speaker 2: joining us out of Vegas but practices all over the country,
8:23
Speaker 2: and Richard Bheerman dot com Richard go ahead. Second verse,
8:29
Speaker 2: same as the first hit me.
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Speaker 7: The sky is right. The case is completely circumstantial and
8:34
Speaker 7: circumstantial evens is strong. However, there's no murder weapon, there
8:38
Speaker 7: are no witnesses, there's no determination of cause, time and
8:42
Speaker 7: day to death. We have a trial judge who completely
8:45
Speaker 7: screwed up and sentencing during the penalty phase, and therefore
8:49
Speaker 7: the death penalty was reversed taken off. These are errors
8:53
Speaker 7: in the case. Nancy. We want the search or truth.
8:56
Speaker 7: That's what you want. That's what we all want. And
8:59
Speaker 7: the defense is going to do everything they can to
9:02
Speaker 7: show how the Medestinal police was horrible, how they did
9:05
Speaker 7: not do a proper investigation here, how it means and
9:09
Speaker 7: evidence is missing, which missing.
9:12
Speaker 2: They did an exhaustive investigation. And let me start off
9:17
Speaker 2: with what Sky just played for us. Day one moment,
9:21
Speaker 2: one minute one. Scott Peterson is lying. He lied to
9:26
Speaker 2: Amber Fry.
9:27
Speaker 1: What is he? Clairvoyant?
9:28
Speaker 2: Herman? He says to his mistress, Oh, this is my
9:32
Speaker 2: first Christmas without my wife. She's dead, and then a
9:36
Speaker 2: few weeks later, guess what, she was dead and he
9:39
Speaker 2: had his first Christmas without his wife. You really want
9:42
Speaker 2: me to think somebody else engineered that?
9:46
Speaker 1: Seriously?
9:46
Speaker 2: I mean really, just take off your hat as defense
9:50
Speaker 2: attorney and be straight, just this one time. That's bs
9:56
Speaker 2: He predicted it. Two weeks later it came true. Joining
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Speaker 2: me and Hendricks, investigative journalist and author of Down the Hill,
10:03
Speaker 2: My Descent into the double murder in Delphi, Susan and
10:07
Speaker 2: I covered the Peterson trial together.
10:09
Speaker 1: Day after day after day.
10:11
Speaker 2: Susan Hendricks the reports that Lacy Peterson was walking her dog.
10:18
Speaker 2: We have been over and over and over those reports.
10:23
Speaker 2: Those witnesses may have seen Lacy Peterson walking her dog
10:28
Speaker 2: on a different day, at a different time. I have
10:32
Speaker 2: heard about the dog walking ad nauseum, and it.
10:37
Speaker 8: Was brought up in the original trial, I mean Nancy
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Speaker 8: in the original trial, and I remember watching you and
10:44
Speaker 8: you covering this. I feel like, although circumstantial, everything came
10:48
Speaker 8: together in terms of what Scott did in the days
10:52
Speaker 8: leading up to this, and what stands out to me
10:54
Speaker 8: the most would be the boat that apparently no one
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Speaker 8: knew that he owned, and of course the interviews that
11:02
Speaker 8: he did at the time, that raspy voice in a
11:05
Speaker 8: whisper with no tears, talking really low and calmly about Lacey.
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Speaker 8: But there are people, groups of people on Twitter now
11:14
Speaker 8: known as x that believe he is innocent, including his
11:18
Speaker 8: sister in law, who, by the way, became a lawyer
11:20
Speaker 8: to prove this. But I think you're right. The first
11:23
Speaker 8: verdict that came back was the right one for Scott.
11:27
Speaker 8: It'll be interesting to hear him speak, but I will
11:30
Speaker 8: say I'm looking forward to the Netflix documentary to hear
11:33
Speaker 8: more about Lacey and her family.
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Speaker 2: Okay, back to the evidence at trial, and I'm going
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Speaker 2: to remind everybody, and I'm sure Sky Vorgman found this
11:41
Speaker 2: as she was creating this incredible documentary. It's airing on Netflix.
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Speaker 2: American Murder Lacy Peterson. The testimony from those that knew
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Speaker 2: Lacy the best before she was murdered states that she
11:54
Speaker 2: can no longer walk the dog as she had done.
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Speaker 2: It was time for her to give She was not
12:01
Speaker 2: out walking her dog. That's not what happened now, Sky.
12:09
Speaker 2: It's being argued that those witnesses that think they saw
12:13
Speaker 2: her walking the dog after she'd already been kidnapped, they
12:17
Speaker 2: have been interviewed.
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Speaker 6: They have been interviewed. They were interviewed at the time
12:21
Speaker 6: they were interviewed before the trial by Modesto PD, And
12:25
Speaker 6: what Modesto PD continues to say is that nobody could
12:29
Speaker 6: positively identify a person walking a dog as Lacy Peterson.
12:35
Speaker 6: They may have seen a pregnant woman walking Golden retriever,
12:39
Speaker 6: they may have seen a.
12:41
Speaker 1: Non pregnant woman walking a different dog.
12:43
Speaker 6: They may have seen a woman in a white top
12:46
Speaker 6: and black pants walking, But nobody that knew Lacey, that
12:49
Speaker 6: knew who she was, could say I saw Lazy Peterson
12:53
Speaker 6: walking Mackenzie at whatever time in the afternoon. That's what
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Speaker 6: Modesto Police says. There are police records to back it up.
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Speaker 2: This was not somebody who was waiting for his wife
13:04
Speaker 2: to come back.
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Speaker 5: Contacted by telephone, Scott Peterson said, quote, I hope their
13:11
Speaker 5: efforts helped find my wife and kid. Her father told
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Speaker 5: NBC News quote, I'm glad they are looking in the
13:17
Speaker 5: right direction.
13:18
Speaker 1: I know he did it.
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Speaker 9: At this point of the investigation, we think we know
13:23
Speaker 9: what's going on, but we can't prove it yet. He's
13:28
Speaker 9: predicting his wife is missing. Two weeks before she's missing.
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Speaker 9: Maybe he made five anchors and we can only find one.
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Speaker 1: Her hair is wrapped.
13:38
Speaker 9: Up in a pair of needlenosed pliers in his boat
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Speaker 9: that nobody knows about. We are feeling we have enough,
13:46
Speaker 9: let's take him down, but we couldn't find the body.
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Speaker 3: We had a list of circumstantial evidence pointing at Scott,
13:56
Speaker 3: but the DA in Stanslaw County, he told us privately, said,
14:00
Speaker 3: you know, bring me a body or you don't have
14:01
Speaker 3: a filing.
14:02
Speaker 2: You're hearing just a tiny tidbit from American murder Lacy
14:07
Speaker 2: Peterson airing on Netflix, And what a minage that was
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Speaker 2: of evidence that later came out at trial day one,
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Speaker 2: Lacey's dad says, I know he did it. They knew
14:23
Speaker 2: on day one, but the prosecutor there in Stanislaus County said,
14:26
Speaker 2: not going forward without a body, and can I remind
14:29
Speaker 2: everyone how day after day after day, Scott Peterson was
14:34
Speaker 2: tracked by GPS tracker going out to the edge of
14:40
Speaker 2: San Francisco Bay looking out at the.
14:43
Speaker 1: Water where she then washed ashore.
14:48
Speaker 2: First came a little baby's body, and then came Lacy.
14:53
Speaker 2: What about that Richard Herman, that doesn't speak to you?
14:56
Speaker 2: That out of all the places Scott Peterson could have
14:59
Speaker 2: been looking for his missing wife, he happened to hone
15:03
Speaker 2: in on the body of water where she was ultimately found.
15:08
Speaker 10: Which speaks to me more is the DNA evidence on
15:11
Speaker 10: the duct tape and other items that the Innocent Project
15:15
Speaker 10: of California finally is getting access to to run tests
15:19
Speaker 10: on because they believe there are other persons attached to that,
15:24
Speaker 10: to that document, to those to that duct tape. Can
15:26
Speaker 10: you imagine if they were Can.
15:28
Speaker 2: You answer the question, the question I asked you about
15:34
Speaker 2: Scott Peterson repeatedly going and gazing out at the San
15:38
Speaker 2: Francisco Bay, the body of water where Lacey and Connor
15:43
Speaker 2: were found, and you.
15:44
Speaker 1: Won't answer it.
15:45
Speaker 2: Out of all the places on earth he could go
15:48
Speaker 2: look for his wife, he goes there where she was,
15:52
Speaker 2: where her body had been thrown.
15:54
Speaker 10: Yeah, I know you want me to answer that. I
15:55
Speaker 10: don't want to answer that. I'm to look at other.
15:57
Speaker 11: Items here, I bet.
15:58
Speaker 10: I mean that's not good, that's not good. But there
16:01
Speaker 10: are other items that could exonerate him. And every item
16:05
Speaker 10: is going to get turned over, piece by piece by piece.
16:08
Speaker 10: Man's liberties at stake, and they have every right to
16:11
Speaker 10: do that, and you, as a former decorative prosecutor, you
16:14
Speaker 10: want the search for the truth, and we'd let it
16:16
Speaker 10: get to the bottom line of everything. And at the
16:18
Speaker 10: end of the day, if the evidence is not there,
16:21
Speaker 10: or the DNA evidence doesn't show anything, then this condition
16:24
Speaker 10: is going to stand.
16:25
Speaker 7: Twenty two years already he's in prison.
16:27
Speaker 2: See, you don't want to talk about the hard evidence.
16:30
Speaker 2: You don't want to talk about And let me remind everybody,
16:33
Speaker 2: as sky Borgman stated and Richard Herman has stated in
16:36
Speaker 2: the past, not today. Of course, he was not going
16:38
Speaker 2: to mention that unless I pull it out of him.
16:40
Speaker 2: But I'm not a DDS, I'm a JdE. I can't
16:43
Speaker 2: pull teeth. But Richard Herman knows as well as all
16:46
Speaker 2: practicing lawyers that the black and white letter of the
16:49
Speaker 2: lawyer law is circumstantial evidence is as powerful and probative
16:55
Speaker 2: as direct evidence, such as an eyewitness or DNA or
16:59
Speaker 2: a fingerp Circumstantial evidence under the law is given the
17:04
Speaker 2: same way if a jury so decides as direct evidence.
17:09
Speaker 2: Speaking of the so called DNA evidence on a duct
17:13
Speaker 2: tape to which Richard Herrman is referring, listen.
17:17
Speaker 11: In an attempt to get a new trial, Scott Peterson's
17:20
Speaker 11: team sought to have DNA testing done on over a
17:23
Speaker 11: dozen pieces of evidence. After presenting their case, the judge
17:27
Speaker 11: ruled that a single fifteen point five inch long piece
17:30
Speaker 11: of duct tape that was found on Lacy Peterson's pants
17:34
Speaker 11: at the time of her autopsy will be tested for DNA.
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Speaker 11: All the other evidence that Peterson's lawyers were asking to
17:41
Speaker 11: have new DNA tests on were denied.
17:44
Speaker 2: Okay to Susan Hendricks is joining US investigative journalist who
17:48
Speaker 2: was on the case from the very beginning.
17:51
Speaker 1: Scott Peterson, who is somehow.
17:54
Speaker 2: Mashed at Wiggles's Way Off Death Row and the double
17:57
Speaker 2: murder of Lacy and Connor, is now saying a burned
18:00
Speaker 2: out mattress and what he thinks is going to be
18:04
Speaker 2: DNA on a piece of duct tape will prove he's innocent.
18:08
Speaker 1: Tell me about the duct tape, Susan.
18:10
Speaker 8: Yeah, I believe we will find that out because the
18:13
Speaker 8: judge ruled that that piece of evidence could be retested
18:18
Speaker 8: that was found on a pair of pants with Lacey's
18:21
Speaker 8: remain So I believe that's in September that we shall
18:24
Speaker 8: see that what will be on that duct tape and
18:26
Speaker 8: like you said, Nancy, if it is something that will
18:29
Speaker 8: free Scott Peterson, if he's not the person, that's what
18:32
Speaker 8: everyone would want. And we've been talking and I see
18:36
Speaker 8: pictures of Lacey on Loopierre and I remember speaking with
18:39
Speaker 8: Fred Goldman years ago and he said, that's the most difficult.
18:42
Speaker 1: They will always.
18:43
Speaker 8: Remain that age. And I can't imagine for Sharon what
18:48
Speaker 8: she has to see and continues to go through. You
18:52
Speaker 8: remember seeing her in that yellow in the courtroom and Connor,
18:56
Speaker 8: her grandson, being buried in the arms of Lacey. The wrenching,
19:00
Speaker 8: heartbreaking situation that she is still in twenty plus years later.
19:05
Speaker 8: But again, Connor, her grandson, would have been what mid
19:09
Speaker 8: twenties and Lacey a lot older, But she is stuck
19:12
Speaker 8: in that moment and those are the memories that her
19:15
Speaker 8: family has.
19:16
Speaker 2: Joining me is a renowned pathologist, doctor Eric Easen, Doctor Ason,
19:23
Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. The state of Lacey's
19:27
Speaker 2: body when she was discovered, to my understanding, is that
19:31
Speaker 2: she was basically skeletonized. Her pants, her maternity pants were
19:38
Speaker 2: still loosely I think around the lower part of her skeleton.
19:45
Speaker 2: Now there is a move a foot and it has
19:48
Speaker 2: been granted by the judge for DNA testing to be
19:53
Speaker 2: performed on duct tape found on those pants. Now, what
19:58
Speaker 2: does that tell me? That Lacey was duct tape and
20:02
Speaker 2: likely weighted down when she was killed. Baby Connor, however,
20:08
Speaker 2: was almost pristine. His little body had been protected by
20:12
Speaker 2: the thick uterine lining and wall of muscle. So when
20:18
Speaker 2: that uterus finally decomposed, he basically floated out of her
20:24
Speaker 2: stomach and washed ashore. The person that found baby Connor
20:29
Speaker 2: said he looked like a little baby doll.
20:32
Speaker 1: Not so for Lacey.
20:34
Speaker 2: Explain to me what happened to Lacey's body. This is
20:40
Speaker 2: the piece of duct tape the defense wants tested attached
20:45
Speaker 2: to those maternity pants.
20:47
Speaker 12: So what happened to the body is the death occurred,
20:49
Speaker 12: and it sounds like the body was placed into the water,
20:53
Speaker 12: and over time, the body is going to start to decompose,
20:55
Speaker 12: and that's going to occur from two different processes. And
20:58
Speaker 12: so internally, when death occurs, the enzymes inside the body
21:02
Speaker 12: will start to auto digest the tissue and that's combined
21:07
Speaker 12: with bacteria and other animals that are going to predate
21:11
Speaker 12: on the body and cause further decomposition. And so you're
21:14
Speaker 12: going to end up over time, ending up with a skeleton.
21:24
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
21:30
Speaker 4: She's been gone almost as long as she was here.
21:32
Speaker 4: I just wanted to be remembered as a person and
21:35
Speaker 4: not as a victim of murder.
21:37
Speaker 2: She was alive, She's still lived to all of us.
21:40
Speaker 4: I see dragonflies and I think of her this time
21:43
Speaker 4: of the year. As a matter of fact, her legacies
21:46
Speaker 4: is that she was a loving person. She left her husband.
21:49
Speaker 4: She trusted her husband, and he betrayed her. He betrayed her,
21:52
Speaker 4: and he betrayed everybody else. His family, our family, everybody
21:58
Speaker 4: turned out.
21:59
Speaker 1: To veterans law. You're Richard Herman joining me out in Vegas.
22:02
Speaker 2: Scott Peterson quote speaks out, Really shouldn't he have done
22:07
Speaker 2: that at the time of the trial. He's not going
22:09
Speaker 2: to get cross examined, he's not going to get tested.
22:11
Speaker 2: He's going to say whatever a fluffy piece of bs
22:14
Speaker 2: he wants to say.
22:15
Speaker 10: Yeah. I think it's pretty dangerous for him to be
22:17
Speaker 10: speaking out right now on any TV series. This is
22:20
Speaker 10: what's going to get This could seal it for him
22:22
Speaker 10: because nothing good is going to come from what he's
22:25
Speaker 10: going to say in this documentary. Nothing good he can't
22:29
Speaker 10: exonerate himself. Nobody believes him. He has no credibility personally,
22:33
Speaker 10: so they have to get the evidence elsewhere. But him
22:36
Speaker 10: speaking out, I think that's a very bad move. I
22:40
Speaker 10: can't believe his defense counsel is letting him do it.
22:42
Speaker 10: I wouldn't let a client do it. And it's just
22:46
Speaker 10: it's no good. It's fraught with danger and fitthballs, and
22:51
Speaker 10: a good interviewer probably bury him.
22:52
Speaker 1: So a good.
22:54
Speaker 2: Interviewer, Richard Herman, Yes, if you or I were cross
22:57
Speaker 2: examining him, he'd be limping out of that courtroom. But
23:01
Speaker 2: instead this is a fluff piece, unlike what we're hearing
23:06
Speaker 2: and American Murder Lacy Peterson focusing on Lacey Sky Boardman
23:11
Speaker 2: is with us and she is the director of American
23:15
Speaker 2: Murder Lacy Peterson Sky. I want to bring everybody's attention
23:21
Speaker 2: back to what happened then, Not my opinion, not Richard
23:25
Speaker 2: Herman's opinion of innocence, not what's going to be on
23:29
Speaker 2: a special or a documentary that's going to occur on Netflix,
23:33
Speaker 2: but the actual evidence. I want you to listen along
23:36
Speaker 2: with me in the panel to Ron Grantsky's nine to
23:40
Speaker 2: one one call listen.
23:44
Speaker 7: Yes, my fellow, low call saying, well morning, my daughter has.
23:51
Speaker 6: Been listing this morning.
23:54
Speaker 7: You have done for a walk in the cart from here.
23:57
Speaker 7: God came home with.
23:59
Speaker 6: Came.
24:00
Speaker 1: I forgot your daughter right way, Peter, your stepdaughter lay.
24:06
Speaker 2: Peter, thank e r F right p e r f
24:10
Speaker 2: l if you got the Senecasian.
24:13
Speaker 7: She's forty, she's pack.
24:18
Speaker 1: Why can you hear you the happening and come back
24:20
Speaker 1: that we don't know.
24:21
Speaker 7: We just got a call from our son in law.
24:23
Speaker 7: Get he left your point at night the play off
24:27
Speaker 7: about a half hour ago.
24:29
Speaker 13: Nowhere around anything.
24:30
Speaker 12: He would come up to the dog.
24:31
Speaker 14: Way walked it in here in that party he said.
24:37
Speaker 13: Pardon pregnant.
24:41
Speaker 2: Watery okay, okay, okay, thanks all right, skyboardman. Let me
24:47
Speaker 2: understand something and then I don't want call. Peterson tells
24:51
Speaker 2: his father in law, at least his dad he went
24:54
Speaker 2: playing golf.
24:56
Speaker 1: Crazy me, I thought he said he went fishing.
24:58
Speaker 4: Yeah.
24:58
Speaker 6: That's one of the intric interesting things about this too,
25:02
Speaker 6: is this fishing or golf story that Scott put out there.
25:06
Speaker 6: From my understanding, he told he told ron Gramski that
25:09
Speaker 6: he went golfing, and he told one other neighbor that
25:12
Speaker 6: he went golfing. Everybody else he told he went fishing.
25:18
Speaker 6: I mean, I've tried to figure out the psychology behind that.
25:21
Speaker 2: If it was just saink, I know the psychology. You
25:24
Speaker 2: probably remember when I just told you the story about
25:26
Speaker 2: when my son went missing in the Baby's er Us superstore. Yeah,
25:29
Speaker 2: that story has never never changed. Has it changed, Shackie.
25:33
Speaker 2: I've been telling it since he was almost two years old.
25:36
Speaker 2: He's sixteen. Now, Why, because that's what happened. I haven't
25:40
Speaker 2: changed it too. I was waltzing through sax Fifth Avenue. No,
25:44
Speaker 2: I haven't said I was jogging. I haven't changed a
25:46
Speaker 2: story that we were out in a park. Why because
25:49
Speaker 2: that's not true. I think I know why he changed
25:53
Speaker 2: his story, And I'm going to get.
25:55
Speaker 1: This from Susan Hendricks.
25:56
Speaker 2: Susan Hendricks, joining US investigative journalist and author, covered the case.
26:01
Speaker 1: Isn't it true that he changed his story?
26:05
Speaker 2: Scott Peterson changed his story from golfing to fishing at
26:11
Speaker 2: the San Francisco Bay, the marina where Lacey's body turned up,
26:16
Speaker 2: after it came out that the guy collecting tickets or
26:20
Speaker 2: letting people in and out of the parking area at
26:24
Speaker 2: the marina remembered him.
26:27
Speaker 1: So he was busted.
26:29
Speaker 8: He really was, and he had an explanation at the
26:31
Speaker 8: time for anything that came his way, saying, well, the
26:35
Speaker 8: weather in a whisper really wasn't good for golfing, so
26:38
Speaker 8: you take a boat that no one knows you own
26:40
Speaker 8: and go out on a boat when the weather's bad.
26:42
Speaker 8: And I remember on December eighth, which screams premeditation to me,
26:47
Speaker 8: he googled the tide, the bay tide for that time.
26:51
Speaker 8: So I believe that Amber Fry gave him a motive
26:54
Speaker 8: to do what he did, and he was able to
26:56
Speaker 8: change the story from golfing to in his boat. You're
26:59
Speaker 8: right now, see when he was busted, when he was caught.
27:03
Speaker 8: And it doesn't surprise me that this narcissistic psychopath, in
27:06
Speaker 8: my opinion, wants to speak out now because he believes
27:09
Speaker 8: that he's charming enough to do so, and that what
27:12
Speaker 8: he says may charm those who believe he is guilty.
27:16
Speaker 15: We'd like to thank all of you for being here
27:18
Speaker 15: and helping us is trying to find our daughter. I
27:25
Speaker 15: would just like to send a message out there that
27:28
Speaker 15: whoever has her, please please please let her go bring
27:31
Speaker 15: her back.
27:32
Speaker 12: So much.
27:34
Speaker 4: What a bock.
27:36
Speaker 1: Please close our backs.
27:43
Speaker 15: We want her and our grandson home safely and immediately,
27:48
Speaker 15: so please bring her back to us.
27:51
Speaker 2: That is painful to watch. That is Sharon, that Slicy's
27:56
Speaker 2: mom and Ron Grantsky dad, her stepdad, begging for her
28:02
Speaker 2: safe return with my sky boardman Director of American Murder,
28:05
Speaker 2: Lacey Paterson Sky You know, I remember that moment, and
28:13
Speaker 2: even now when I see Sharon speaking in your special,
28:19
Speaker 2: it seems like all that is still just just below
28:23
Speaker 2: the surface.
28:24
Speaker 6: It is. I mean, I don't know if anybody could
28:27
Speaker 6: ever recover from the loss of a child. I know
28:29
Speaker 6: Sharon moves on, she lives her life, it doesn't consume her,
28:33
Speaker 6: but she misses Lacey every day and she loves Lacey
28:36
Speaker 6: every day. And it's a terrible tragedy. And I think
28:39
Speaker 6: with all of the appeals, look, Scott Peterson and the
28:43
Speaker 6: team behind him have been appealing for the last twenty years.
28:46
Speaker 6: This hasn't it hasn't gone away. Scott has been there
28:50
Speaker 6: presently and Sharon has to be on the receiving end
28:53
Speaker 6: of that and she hears what's happening. And now with
28:56
Speaker 6: this new DNA evidence, that they've put forward. It's hard
28:58
Speaker 6: for her, it's hard for the entire family.
29:01
Speaker 2: Speaking of Scott Peterson, take a listen to face to
29:05
Speaker 2: face with Scott Peterson. A reminder he had a chance
29:09
Speaker 2: to say on this in front of a jury, but
29:10
Speaker 2: he knew he would be cross examined.
29:13
Speaker 1: Listen, thanks for talking with me today.
29:27
Speaker 3: He didn't want to be a dad, didn't want to
29:29
Speaker 3: pay childson board, didn't want to space spousal and this
29:31
Speaker 3: is the way he thought about getting out of it.
29:37
Speaker 2: I believe my brother in law, Scott has been wrongfully
29:40
Speaker 2: convicted of that murder. Okay, what about a burned out,
29:47
Speaker 2: formerly bloody mattress. Peterson says, we'll exonerate him. To Susan Hendricks,
29:53
Speaker 2: investigative journalist, what's he talking about.
29:55
Speaker 8: Yeah, there were two people arrested, though connected to I
29:59
Speaker 8: believe it was a burglary or robbery in the area
30:02
Speaker 8: during that same time period. But it doesn't mean, Nancy,
30:05
Speaker 8: that two bad things couldn't have happened during the same time.
30:08
Speaker 8: And I believe those involved in that have been questioned
30:12
Speaker 8: and wanted to prove so much so that they were
30:14
Speaker 8: not involved in the disappearance of Lacey but that tape
30:20
Speaker 8: on Lacey's remains on her pants and the DNA testing,
30:23
Speaker 8: will that show anything that will prove that Scott is innocent?
30:26
Speaker 1: That is the big question.
30:28
Speaker 8: And I heard Skuy say that she's wondering how Lacey died,
30:33
Speaker 8: and I don't believe will ever hear exactly.
30:36
Speaker 15: How she was.
30:37
Speaker 8: And I remember through the years hearing her mother say
30:39
Speaker 8: that's what she wonders the most. How much did my
30:43
Speaker 8: daughter suffer and what really happened to her? And I
30:46
Speaker 8: don't see her ever reading the answer.
30:48
Speaker 2: To that.
30:56
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
31:02
Speaker 2: To doctor Eric Ason, certified forensic pathologist. Doctor Ayson, her
31:07
Speaker 2: body was essentially skeletonized. How can you ever get a
31:10
Speaker 2: cod on a skeletonized body?
31:14
Speaker 12: Well, part of the problem is that only the torso
31:17
Speaker 12: was found and the head was never recovered, and so
31:21
Speaker 12: the best guess that I have is that he was
31:23
Speaker 12: either a blunt force head trauma or a gunshot wounded
31:25
Speaker 12: the head, or strangulation or throat slash, something like that.
31:31
Speaker 12: But if the head is never going to be recovered,
31:33
Speaker 12: then the cause of death is probably never going to
31:34
Speaker 12: be found. I definitely know that the torso was found
31:38
Speaker 12: and there were no gunshot wounds or stab wounds or
31:42
Speaker 12: rib fractures or anything that would indicate that the trauma
31:45
Speaker 12: was to the torso, so the cause of death is
31:47
Speaker 12: still unknown.
31:48
Speaker 2: Some evidence that Peterson is touting is said to include
31:51
Speaker 2: a burnt van near the neighborhood, possibly connected to a burglary.
31:59
Speaker 2: The fire investigator in Modesto at the time investigated the
32:03
Speaker 2: burned out van. The vehicle was near the neighborhood and
32:08
Speaker 2: it had a mattress in the back with a brown
32:10
Speaker 2: stain on it. Some people feared it was human blood. Okay,
32:17
Speaker 2: I don't know if that will be enough to exonerate
32:20
Speaker 2: Scott Peterson since it's not connected to Lacy Peterson.
32:26
Speaker 1: That's the issue.
32:28
Speaker 2: Listen to this for me, this elaborate night about her
32:31
Speaker 2: missing and this tragedy and that and that that this
32:35
Speaker 2: will be the first holidays without her.
32:38
Speaker 6: Amber, God, I don't want to play with you. So
32:42
Speaker 6: you know that I.
32:44
Speaker 3: Or missing.
32:45
Speaker 2: Oh, yes, you said you've lost your wife, obviously.
32:49
Speaker 1: Without me staying much, but we were, Yes, you did.
32:54
Speaker 2: I did lost my what my wife? Where Walmart?
32:58
Speaker 1: You lost your wife? Come terminology? She's dead and then
33:02
Speaker 1: she was. But that's not all.
33:05
Speaker 2: Amber Fry, who many people have assailed. It's a perfectly
33:09
Speaker 2: nice person. Now, mother, I've.
33:11
Speaker 1: Spoken to her many many times.
33:13
Speaker 2: She truly believed she had hit the jackpot, found this
33:17
Speaker 2: great single guy.
33:19
Speaker 1: That's just what Lacey thought. But listen to more. This
33:21
Speaker 1: is the This is the call that.
33:23
Speaker 2: Peterson places to Amber during Lacy Peterson's missing vigil.
33:31
Speaker 13: Listen ever, ever, every happy here?
33:53
Speaker 6: Thank you.
33:56
Speaker 15: There?
33:57
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wish you could.
33:59
Speaker 13: Gainst I'm on the eye. I think that you're there.
34:03
Speaker 13: I'm my the idlers getting real.
34:08
Speaker 15: God, you.
34:15
Speaker 13: Error you're there. I can't hear right now.
34:17
Speaker 7: I'll call you on your knear.
34:20
Speaker 4: Em Okay.
34:28
Speaker 2: The Eiffel Tower, my rear end. The Eiffel Tower. Richard Hermann.
34:37
Speaker 2: He's calling his lover, claiming he's aid the Eiffel Tower,
34:42
Speaker 2: and he's making the call during the vigil for his
34:47
Speaker 2: missing wife.
34:49
Speaker 10: That's why you can't put any credibility to things. He's
34:51
Speaker 10: telling this woman. You just can't. And you know she
34:55
Speaker 10: a former messuse or whatever she was. She thought she
34:58
Speaker 10: hit the jackpot with him.
35:00
Speaker 2: So you're telling me you can't believe what he says
35:02
Speaker 2: to his mistress, Then why should I believe what he's
35:06
Speaker 2: saying now in order to get out.
35:08
Speaker 1: Of jail, to save his own skin. Why should I
35:11
Speaker 1: believe him now?
35:12
Speaker 10: Because people say stupid things if they're cheating and they're
35:17
Speaker 10: not honorable, they don't say the right things. They know
35:19
Speaker 10: what they're doing is wrong. So you can't take credibility
35:23
Speaker 10: for anything that he said to her. And here's another thing, Nancy,
35:27
Speaker 10: if he really didn't want to be married, if he
35:29
Speaker 10: didn't really want to be in that relationship, he could
35:31
Speaker 10: have easily got a divorce. He didn't have to kill her.
35:35
Speaker 10: I mean, come on, that's the extreme.
35:37
Speaker 6: No.
35:38
Speaker 14: I met Scott Peterson November twentieth, two thousand and two.
35:42
Speaker 14: I was introduced to him. I was told he was unmarried.
35:47
Speaker 14: Scott told me he was not married. We did have
35:51
Speaker 14: a romantic relationship. When I discovered he was involved in
35:55
Speaker 14: the Lacy Peterson disappearance in the case, contacted the Modesto
36:01
Speaker 14: Police Department. Although I could have sold or sold the
36:09
Speaker 14: photos of Scott and I to tabloids, I knew this
36:12
Speaker 14: was not the right thing to do. For fear of
36:16
Speaker 14: jeopardizing the case or the police investigation. I will not
36:20
Speaker 14: comment further.
36:21
Speaker 2: While the case is not all about Amberfry. If it
36:26
Speaker 2: had not been for Amberfry coming forward, I sometimes wonder
36:31
Speaker 2: if the case would ever have been cracked. Joining me
36:35
Speaker 2: an all star panel to sky Boardman, the director of
36:39
Speaker 2: American Murder, Lacy Peterson on Netflix, sky what led you
36:46
Speaker 2: to take on this endeavor because you know a competing
36:49
Speaker 2: streamer is going to come out with another special that
36:59
Speaker 2: is all about but you chose this to be about
37:03
Speaker 2: the facts of the trial and about Lacey and Sharon.
37:07
Speaker 10: Yeah.
37:07
Speaker 6: You know, it's been twenty years since this was really
37:10
Speaker 6: in the media in a significant way, and I remember
37:13
Speaker 6: following it. But what was interesting to me is there
37:15
Speaker 6: were so many things that I either didn't know or
37:18
Speaker 6: details that I'd forgotten, and so sort of diving back
37:21
Speaker 6: into it and doing the research, it just became more
37:24
Speaker 6: and more clear to me what was happening, what was
37:28
Speaker 6: going on during the time, and the different layers and
37:30
Speaker 6: intricacies of this trial, but also how it was Really
37:35
Speaker 6: it's not that much of a head scratcher. You watch
37:37
Speaker 6: it and you're like, this seems to lead to a
37:40
Speaker 6: certain point. It's not a mystery, it's not unknown. It's
37:44
Speaker 6: pretty obvious what happened, and that's really something I got
37:47
Speaker 6: as I was doing the research for this, and it
37:50
Speaker 6: got to be very clear that this was a story
37:53
Speaker 6: about Lacy Peterson, and that the facts that were presented
37:57
Speaker 6: to a trial twenty years ago, years ago are still
38:01
Speaker 6: the facts today.
38:01
Speaker 2: I just wonder why, sky that so many people want
38:06
Speaker 2: to latch on to facts that are not true that
38:12
Speaker 2: were brought up a trial that Jerry heard them. Is
38:17
Speaker 2: it the sensationalism that someone else murdered Lacey? What is it?
38:23
Speaker 6: I think it's sensationalism. I think some of it may
38:26
Speaker 6: be denial. I think people want to believe in goodness
38:30
Speaker 6: in people. But I really feel like there's a lot
38:34
Speaker 6: of misinformation out there as well. You know, as soon
38:37
Speaker 6: as things started getting on Reddit threads and all of
38:39
Speaker 6: these different forums, and somebody grabs onto something and it
38:42
Speaker 6: changes slightly. It's like this telephone game, and it changes
38:45
Speaker 6: slightly again, and it changes slightly again, and it becomes
38:48
Speaker 6: the truth without really looking at the actual evidence at
38:52
Speaker 6: police reports, and so these ideas can sort of start
38:56
Speaker 6: to really grow into something that isn't truthful at all.
39:00
Speaker 2: Hard for me to look at Scott Peterson. I'm looking
39:02
Speaker 2: at him right now, answering softball questions by some producer.
39:10
Speaker 2: When I look at him, Sky, I think about Lacy
39:15
Speaker 2: and how our life was cut short, the murder of
39:18
Speaker 2: a helpless pregnant woman that could barely even go for
39:22
Speaker 2: a walk, and then Connor, their baby boy. She and
39:28
Speaker 2: her whole family were so ecstatic about the first baby.
39:35
Speaker 1: Their world in front of them.
39:39
Speaker 2: I'm just and then I look at him. It's never
39:43
Speaker 2: about Gee. I didn't kill her, so let's find who did.
39:46
Speaker 2: It's never about that, It's always about him. Never a
39:52
Speaker 2: mention of wow, if I didn't do it, who did?
39:56
Speaker 10: Never?
39:56
Speaker 1: Never, Sky. Look if they've come up with theories.
39:59
Speaker 6: They've come up with theory about this robbery across the street,
40:03
Speaker 6: this burglary across the street that happened, and it must
40:06
Speaker 6: have been these burglars that absconded with her, grabbed her,
40:10
Speaker 6: through her in a van and took off with her.
40:12
Speaker 6: But even that, it's just timelines don't match up.
40:15
Speaker 1: The color of the van.
40:16
Speaker 6: They've got this orange man now that's burnt out, that
40:18
Speaker 6: was found a mile away. People reported seeing a white
40:21
Speaker 6: fan in the neighborhood. The timeline of it is completely different.
40:24
Speaker 6: The burglars, since themselves say that they were there early
40:28
Speaker 6: morning hours. They couldn't have been there. The times, the dates,
40:32
Speaker 6: it's all sort of mixed up, and it just doesn't
40:35
Speaker 6: really lead to any consistency in any.
40:37
Speaker 1: Kind of story.
40:38
Speaker 6: And these burglars were burglars, they're not. I think it's
40:41
Speaker 6: a big step to go from being a burglar.
40:44
Speaker 1: To go to being a man.
40:45
Speaker 2: They were a found sky, they were found and questioned
40:50
Speaker 2: and pollyed.
40:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, all I know is this.
40:53
Speaker 2: Looking at Sharon and Rocha now in your Special American Murder,
40:58
Speaker 2: Lucy Paterson, I see that her pain has not lessened.
41:05
Speaker 1: We wait as justice continues to unfold. Goodbye friend,