Latest / Miss Understood with Rachel Uchitel / Lillo Brancato From A Bronx Tale Talks About Wasted Talent, Redemption, and Life After Prison

Transcript

Lillo Brancato From A Bronx Tale Talks About Wasted Talent, Redemption, and Life After Prison · Miss Understood with Rachel Uchitel

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: I remember being in a small town in Italy, struggling
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: to order coffee. I just couldn't get my point across
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: and it felt like I was missing out on really
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: connecting with the place. It's exactly why Babbel is a
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: game changer. It focuses on practical language skills, things you'd
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: actually say in real life situations, not just textbook phrases.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: Imagine chatting easily at a cafe in Rome or asking
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: directions in Tokyo. With Babbel, this can happen in just
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: three weeks if you practice daily for only 10 minutes.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: It's designed by language experts, ensuring you learn conversational skills
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: that natives really use. Plus, you can fit lessons into
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: any part of your day, making it super convenient. So
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: if you've ever wanted to dive back into a language
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: or learn a new one, now is your chance. Visit babbel.com
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: slash pod to save up to 60% off your subscription.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: That's B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash P-O-D. Start your journey to
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: real conversations in a new language today.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: Hi, guys.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to Misunderstood. I'm your host, Rachel Yucatel. So
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: our guest today is somebody that I had been trying
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: to get on for a long time. I think he's
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: somebody who really epitomizes what this show is about and
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: being misunderstood. We know Lilo Brancato as playing the role
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: of C, which was Robert De Niro's son in the
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: film A Bronx Tale. He narrated the film. He was
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: a complete breakout star. And from that, his life changed.
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: He got, you know, to be on shows like Sopranos
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: and a bunch of other things. But if you, by
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: the way, if you haven't seen the Bronx tale, you
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: should go watch it because it's one of those really
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: timeless movies that I watched it the night before I
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: interviewed him. And you know, it's just as fascinating and good.
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: And then my daughter saw it and she just fell
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: in love with him. So, but what was interesting is that,
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: you know, while you can watch somebody on screen and
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: really feel for them, you have no idea what's going
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: on behind the scenes. And Lilo had developed a drug
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: problem and, so bad that he decided one night in
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: looking for drugs to go burglarize a friend's house and
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: during that burglary as many of you may know a
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: undercover cop was shot and killed Lilo ended up going
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: to prison. He was sent there for 10 years. He
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: got out after eight. And he's been spending all of
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: his time giving back in the treatment community and helping
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: people that are addicts. So he really opens up about
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: his time in prison, how it became a pivotal moment
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: in his life, which he now channels into helping others.
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: It's an inspirational story of redemption and hope. And I
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: really hope you guys give a chance to listen to
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: my interview with Lilo Brancato.
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: I'm not understood.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: Hey, Lilo, thank you so much for joining me. I
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: really appreciate you being with Misunderstood.
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: So I've been so looking forward to talking to you
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: because you're like the perfect guest for my kind of show.
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: Somebody who maybe had a narrative that was created by
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: the media, from people knowing you just from, you know,
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: being in the movies and then something else happening. And
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: so I think it's so important for someone like you
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: to be able to tell your story and your words
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: and also talk about what it's taught you and all
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: the lessons and the power of second chances. Because I
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: think so many people... Really feel like once somebody has
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: done something or something's happened, it's really hard to come
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: back for it or people just don't give the forgiveness
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: that they can. So I think you're a really good
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: example of someone who's done the work and really shown
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: how to make a wrong turn, but how to make
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: a right turn from that. So I think you're really
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: a really important, inspiring person.
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: Thank you. I appreciate you saying that. Yeah.
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: Um, so let's start with how like most people know you.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: I think everyone, um, has seen a Bronx Dale if
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: they haven't, you know, they should, obviously. Um, it's something
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: that if you watched it today, it has the same
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: effect on you as if you watched it, you know,
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: years ago, because it's just such a phenomenal film and
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: you are such a phenomenal star in it. When you
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: were a child, did you want to be an actor?
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: No, that just happened. Um, I was working at a
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: florist back in like the early nineties. I was just,
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: you know, I was, and there was Christmas time. So
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: we had the Christmas wreaths and I was bringing them outside.
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: And I remember I had an Atlanta Braves hat on
• 4:35
  Speaker 3: and this guy asked me something. And when I looked
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: up at him, he was like, oh my God, did
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: anyone ever tell you you look like Robert De Niro? And,
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: you know, I gotta be honest with you. I didn't
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: even really know who he was. I heard the name
• 4:46
  Speaker 3: Robert De Niro, but I didn't really know who he was.
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: And then, you know, like growing up Italian and, you know,
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: every Italian knows who De Niro was. So when I
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: asked my dad and my mom, like, yeah, you know,
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: the guy from, so we started watching his movies and
• 4:57
  Speaker 3: I saw how great he was. And, you know, I
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: wanted to so much then at that point, I don't
• 5:02
  Speaker 3: know if I wanted to be an actor or I
• 5:04
  Speaker 3: wanted to be Robert De Niro. Um, but then, you know,
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: in 1992, July 5th, 1992, that's when they discovered me
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: on the beach. Um, I had heard about the Bronx
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: tale and I know like my cousin read for the part,
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: they went to his school. I know a lot of
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: kids that actually read for the part, but I just
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: thought it would be such a long shot.
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: So they had like, they had like an open casting
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: and just people in your area were, were getting involved.
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: So you didn't really have to have any experience.
• 5:30
  Speaker 3: That's what they wanted. That was like a prerequisite. That's
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: what they wanted. They wanted to make this film as
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: authentic as possible. And that's, I mean, obviously you need
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: the star power to get the film made. So you needed,
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: you had De Niro and you had Pesci, but, you know,
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: and the fact that it was his directorial debut was
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: also a big selling point. But then he went with
• 5:50
  Speaker 3: all unknown actors. And, you know, I have to say
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: 30 years later, I can look back and say he
• 5:55
  Speaker 3: made the right choice. Of course.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: So tell me about the process of you trying out
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: for the film. What was that like?
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: Um, Well, like I said, they discovered me that day
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: on the beach. The guy, this guy, Marco Brecco, he
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: was handing out flyers. And then my brother saw the
• 6:09
  Speaker 3: flyer and, you know, automatically knew that he should come
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: get me out of the water because I looked like
• 6:15
  Speaker 3: De Niro. Like, you know, I love De Niro. You know,
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: like this is my moment. This is my shot right now. And,
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: you know, my brother could have not said anything and
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: it wouldn't have probably happened. But he did. He came
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: to get me out of the water. The guy was
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: there and I started doing, he was like, wow, you know,
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: he does look just like him. So then I did
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: a couple of impersonations for him. He invited me to
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: the Belmont Playhouse in the Bronx where the actual film
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: takes place, although we didn't shoot it there. But I
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: went there later on that night, no acting experience. He
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: gave me the scene when I was shaving. And I said, hey, Dad,
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: but originally De Niro was shaving. And I walked to
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: him because the story changed a little bit. But then
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: the way it worked out, where the scene was in
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: the film, later on was it worked out that scene
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: right before the date. So it made more sense that
• 7:06
  Speaker 3: I was shaving, but that was the scene. Um, and
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: you know, he, you know, the guy Marco told me
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: to like, take a few minutes, learn it, learn the lines,
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: and then we'll do it. And I just, it just
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: seemed something that was very familiar to me. It just
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: seemed like something I was able to do, like just
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: looking at it, even though it was my first time,
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: it didn't seem like that. It's just like, okay, interior
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: bathroom night, hey dad, let me ask you, you know?
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: So just like, it just was there. I didn't have
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: to really do anything to play this character.
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: Had you ever read, sorry to interrupt you, had you
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: ever read sides or screenplay like that?
• 7:43
  Speaker 3: Nothing, nothing. And to take it a step even further,
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: as far as this character, my dad, my adopted dad,
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: he's Sicilian. His name is Lilo, like me. And that's
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: a very Sicilian name, just like Hello, Gino. My father's
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: from a town In the province of Agrigento, there's a
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: little town called Naro. He's the, that, you know, like
• 8:04
  Speaker 3: in Italy, all these little towns, like have little saints
• 8:07
  Speaker 3: that come from these towns. And my father's town was
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: San Gallogero. You can look it up. San Gallogero di Naro, N-A-R-O.
• 8:16
  Speaker 3: So this name to me was like something, I got
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: cousins that come from Sicily on summer vacation. That's, their
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: names are Gallogero. So like when I heard this name,
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: it was like, it was just meant to be. I
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: was the age, and it was just like, It seemed
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: really surreal, like just the way it was all, all
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: the stars were aligning and everything was just happening all
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: at once. And it just happened so fast. But, you know,
• 8:39
  Speaker 3: I went in that night. He loved everything I did.
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: And this was back in the day, like the VHS
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: tapes and stuff like that. So he put me on tape,
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: loved everything. They sent the tape to Manhattan. They'd sent
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: it to Tribeca. I was working at a law office
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: at that time. My dad was a builder. So the guy, Corey,
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: who used to do contracts, the contracts for him, the
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: real estate stuff, the real estate contracts for the houses,
• 9:04
  Speaker 3: he gave me a summer job. So I was working
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: for him, filing. And I was making like $ 10 an
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: hour off the books in 1992. That was a lot
• 9:12
  Speaker 3: of money. I remember you used to give me a check.
• 9:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good living.
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, in 1992. 15-year-old kid. So I came home from
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: work that night. And I remember I was making English muffins.
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: And they called. And this woman sounded very professional. Like, hey,
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: how are you? So I thought she wanted my dad
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: because my dad gives estimates. He does jobs. He builds stuff.
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: extensions and all that. So I said, you want to
• 9:35
  Speaker 3: speak to my dad? She said, are you Lilo? And
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: I said, yeah. She says, oh, I'm so-and-so from Tribeca Productions.
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: We saw the tape. We really loved it. We want
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: you to come down. So now when I went down
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: that first day, it was like a million kids there
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: reading for my part. Then I got invited back and
• 9:50
  Speaker 3: there was less invited back, less, less, less, less. So
• 9:53
  Speaker 3: the point was just me. And then eventually they went
• 9:55
  Speaker 3: and introduced me to De Niro. Everybody was introduced on
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: a first name basis. So when they said we're going
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: to go upstairs to meet Bob, it kind of like
• 10:02
  Speaker 3: caught me off guard. So we met him. It was
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: like unbelievable. I couldn't even believe it. I don't know
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: if you ever saw a film that he did called
• 10:08
  Speaker 3: Mad Dog and Glory. No. No. It was like an
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: early 90s movie. If you see that film when I
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: first met him, that's weird. He had just finished that.
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: He had that like mustard colored hair. It was like
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: a weird color. So that's when I first met him.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: He turned around and he had the hair. And I
• 10:25
  Speaker 3: was just like this little kid and he was coming
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: at me. And then, you know, but he said, I
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: like everything that you're doing. Don't change a thing. You
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: all perfect for this and see other, you know, maybe some,
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: you know, more possibilities. So then, you know, we were
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: working together. I would lead with 30 different roles, you know, because,
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: you know, initially I got to tell you the end
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: of the story before I could tell you this part,
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: because I don't want to like, So one day he said, listen,
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: I want you to dress like you're going to church.
• 10:51
  Speaker 3: We're going to do a screen test and we're going
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: to put you on film. So that's when he auditioned
• 10:55
  Speaker 3: all the finalists. At this point, I thought I was,
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: I thought I had the part. So this kid, the
• 10:59
  Speaker 3: kid who shot Sonny at the end of the film,
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: he came up to me. He's like, Hey, my name's Phil.
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: I'm going to be reading for Collojour as well. So
• 11:07
  Speaker 3: now I'm like really nervous because I didn't know there
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: was anyone else because I didn't see anyone else coming
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: to audition. So it's just common sense. You don't need
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: to be in the business to know that that's a
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: good sign.
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: Wasn't he a little older than you?
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: He was. You're absolutely right. He was 21. I was 16.
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: The film would have been a little different. Obviously, he
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: was good to have made it to that point. But
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: I guess the decision was made because it works better
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: when the kid's younger. Because at 16 years old, you
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: still didn't go right or left. Right. You know what
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: I mean? At 21, you're already like there. You're already
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: on your way to like prison. You're on your way
• 11:45
  Speaker 3: to like, you know.
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: You could still be molded and you're still learning those lessons,
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: which becomes such a big part of that movie.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: And so I think it's probably important that they.
• 11:52
  Speaker 3: Pick some of yours. And more impressionable.
• 11:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: You're absolutely right.
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: So, all right. So finish your story. I apologize.
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: No, well, yeah, so everyone read that it was me
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: versus the kid versus this guy, Phil. And there was
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: one scene where he beat us.
• 12:06
  Speaker 4: Being a student is expensive. Rent, books, your morning coffee,
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: your mid-morning coffee, your I'm-about-to-fall-asleep-in-the-middle-of-a-lecture coffee. So here's something that
• 12:17
  Speaker 4: won't break the bank. A subscription to the Irish Times
• 12:21
  Speaker 4: for just € 5 a month. Get every article, 165 years
• 12:25
  Speaker 4: of journalism, daily puzzles and exclusive newsletters. All for less
• 12:28
  Speaker 4: than the price of your daily coffee habit. The Irish
• 12:31
  Speaker 4: Times for just € 5 a month. The ultimate student discount.
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: When Sonny said, where did you go with my car?
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: He went first. They beat him up really bad. They
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: were really slapping him. I was outside with my dad. Well, listen,
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: we're hearing it. Bang, smacking him. So then when I
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: went in, I was afraid because I thought they were
• 12:47
  Speaker 3: going to beat me up too. But they didn't. Later on,
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: De Niro told me, we didn't have to beat you up.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: You did it without us having to do that. I
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: was like, oh, all right. Like, wow, that was like
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: the greatest compliment ever. Robert De Niro said, like, you
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: didn't need to do that. I was like, oh, okay. Wow. But,
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: you know, that was Thursday. Then by Monday, Sunday, they
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: called me. They said, Bob wants to see you. I
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: went in on Monday and he basically told me, you know,
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: you got the part.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: How did that feel when he told you?
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: I was on the eighth floor and to go up
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: to his floor, you need the key for the elevator.
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: But he overlooks overlooking the balcony and the balcony. He
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: could see my dad used to drive me down there
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: every day. He's my biggest supporter. Rest in peace. So
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: he was down there and De Niro because him and
• 13:28
  Speaker 3: my dad were the same age. And they were like friends.
• 13:31
  Speaker 3: They used to talk. And De Niro speaks Italian well.
• 13:34
  Speaker 3: So did my dad. And my dad bought him this
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: wine that he liked. And they were like, you know,
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: because De Niro has a son too, Raphael. He's my age. Wow.
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: So he's got a son. So like they had a lot,
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: you know, De Niro was a very down-to-earth guy. So
• 13:46
  Speaker 3: when he gave me the part, he had his arm
• 13:48
  Speaker 3: around me and he brings me out to the balcony. And,
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: you know, and I told my father, I got the part.
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: And then my father looked up at me. So it
• 13:53
  Speaker 3: was a really nice time. I called my mom. He said,
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: if you want some privacy, you could use the room.
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: the phone in the bathroom. So I went in the
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: bathroom and I called my mom and she was all
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: excited and stuff. So it was a really nice time.
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: I just, I still like at that point, I still
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: couldn't believe that it was happening. Cause like I said,
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: from the forest, this is like something like a dream
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: come true to have been in a film with De
• 14:16
  Speaker 3: Niro in this, well, not even in this capacity, more
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: just to be in a film with him and to work,
• 14:21
  Speaker 3: but to be in a film, in this capacity with
• 14:24
  Speaker 3: an hero, like this guy is like choosing you to
• 14:26
  Speaker 3: play this role. And you know, a film that he's
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: gonna put a stamp on, like this is the first
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: time I'm directing. Bang, here it is. You know, so that's,
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: you know, you gotta really, really trust someone.
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: Even me, like if I write stuff and you know,
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: I have ideas to do things, and that's one of
• 14:44
  Speaker 3: the biggest things, one of my biggest concerns. Can I
• 14:46
  Speaker 3: trust this person? Cause like I like to write like
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: really intricate, complex characters. And this is like, you know,
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: stuff that I've seen in these places I've been. Because
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: people are all, you know what I mean? Yeah. And
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: it's like, and then it comes down to truck. And
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: I trust this person. You're going to show up every day.
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: Are you going to be able to do this? You
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: know what I mean?
• 15:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: And that's a lot. And just now putting myself in
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: those shoes, that's really important. And it makes it so
• 15:11
  Speaker 3: much more special for me to have been in that
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: film knowing what this guy, I mean, I'm not even
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: close to what De Niro is. De Niro is De Niro.
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: And to say, I'm going to make this film with
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: this guy and I hope you love it. You know
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: what I mean? It's really, it says a lot.
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: Well, you really, I mean, I rewatched the film two
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: nights ago because I knew I was having you on.
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: You made the film.
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: I mean, you have Chaz Palminteri in there, you have
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: Robert De Niro, obviously you have a bunch of different
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: people that are phenomenal, but you narrate the whole film
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: and then you're really in it and you make all
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: the difference to the film, honestly. So what was that
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: like acting with them though? Were you nervous being in
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: scenes with them? Were you, I mean, did they coach
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: you at all? What was your relationship that built on
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: those days with them?
• 15:56
  Speaker 3: I got to say, you know, one thing that I did,
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: that was my first film. So everything that was done
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: on that set and everything in preparation, I thought was
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: all standard. This is the way it's done, but it's not,
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: it's not. There was so much preparation, so much rehearsal.
• 16:11
  Speaker 3: De Niro would have a video cam. We didn't have
• 16:13
  Speaker 3: the phones, you know, this is back in 92. He'd be,
• 16:16
  Speaker 3: we'd be on the sidewalk, you know, on regular days,
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: you know, on the, like on the locations, like there
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: was a lot of preparation. So by the time we
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: got there, it was like nothing.
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: I'm so excited to tell you guys about our new sponsor,
• 16:31
  Speaker 1: Green Chef. Green Chef is the number one meal kit
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: for eating well with dinners that you can personalize to
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: your own taste and lifestyle. I try to be very
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: conscious of what I eat and I love that everything
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: in Green Chef is pre-proportioned for me without.
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: Having to measure.
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: And as the only keto meal kit, Green Chef makes
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: sticking to a carb conscious lifestyle so easy. I take
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: my health very seriously, and I love it that Green
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: Chef does as well, by bringing me seasonal recipes featuring
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: certified organic fruits and vegetables, organic cage-free eggs, and sustainably
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: sourced seafood. It's summertime, which means if you're like me,
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: you're busier than ever with activities, kids at home, holidays.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: And what I love about Green Chef is that everything
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: is done for you. All you have to do is
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: throw it together and it's ready in literally less than
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: 30 minutes.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: It's so fast.
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: It's really going to save me time this summer with
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: my crazy schedule and it will totally save you time.
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: And not only that, the food is so good. I'm
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: personally so excited to try the lemon basil caper pork
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: with sauteed cauliflower, bell pepper, Almonds and feta cheese.
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: It looks so good and healthy.
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: And oh my gosh, I'm looking here. The fig and
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: prosciutto pita pizzas with feta, mozzarella, tomato, and kale salad
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: with hazelnuts look like an amazing and super fast lunch option.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: that even my daughter, Wyatt, is excited to try. I
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: have to admit that cooking is not my favorite activity.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: And not only that, I really suck at it.
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: But I do love great food.
• 17:47
  Speaker 1: And actually, I also love staying home. So Green Chef
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: is going to be the best of both worlds for me.
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: So give Green Chef a try today. Use our special
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: discount code for a great deal. You're not gonna believe this.
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: You get 60% off plus free shipping. So go to greenchef.com
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: slash understood60 and use code understood60 to get 60% off
• 18:05
  Speaker 1: plus free shipping.
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: That's all lowercase, by the way.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: And again, that's greenchef.com slash understood60 and use code understood60
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: to get 60% off plus free shipping. Green Chef, the
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: number one meal kit for eating well.
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: You know, I mean, obviously the cameras rolling, you know,
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: the stakes are a little higher, but we did build
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: that level of comfort amongst each other as actors and
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: build that, built that chemistry that when it was time
• 18:35
  Speaker 3: to go, you know, we were ready.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: And did you know it would be such a hit?
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: No, I didn't think so. I thought it was, I
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: thought it was a gamble, you know, because it's like,
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: we are all unknown actors. People could have watched it
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: and said, where did they make this piece of shit?
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: Why didn't they use real actors? Because, excuse my language,
• 18:51
  Speaker 3: but it could have went that way as well. You know?
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: But I, you know, I just kind of felt something
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: special going on, you know, every day being there. And
• 19:01
  Speaker 3: I felt very confident in what I was able to
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: do under De Niro's, you know what I mean? Yeah.
• 19:05
  Speaker 3: And his guidance and, I mean, you know, because he's like,
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: he was directing you as an actor. Like, It was
• 19:14
  Speaker 3: better for me. I think he wasn't directing me as
• 19:16
  Speaker 3: a director. He was directing me as an actor from
• 19:18
  Speaker 3: one actor to another, not, not saying this is the
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: way I think you should do it. Cause he's not
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: like that. I can't even explain it, but it was
• 19:27
  Speaker 3: like from one actor to another. And for me, it
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: helps me. Right. Because there was no, no minced words.
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: It was just like this, you know what I mean? Right.
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: De Niro's very straightforward. He's not a man of many
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: words and he's just like, just think of what it is.
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: You know, like, and that's, those are like nothing. Those
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: are like three, three of what it is, nothing. But
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: when you do think of what it is and you
• 19:45
  Speaker 3: think of yourself in the situation and the cameras roll
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: and it just, I don't know, he just did it right.
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: And I just felt like I was never nervous and
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: I was where I needed to be.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: Wow.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: Um, I'm just curious, what was your relationship like with, um,
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: Chaz because you spent so much time with him, at
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: least on camera?
• 20:02
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah. We, you know, I said this in interviews.
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: I remember one time I saw this interview when I
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: was a kid. It was like I had three fathers
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: at that time. I had my own dad and then
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: I had De Niro and then I had Chaz. So
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: we were very close. We were very close. I remember Chaz.
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: I remember back then my favorite store was The Gap.
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: So I remember he said that, you know, because we
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: were close and, you know, kind of took me under
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: his wing. And he said before we do the film,
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: he took me on a little shopping spree. have, you know,
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: spend like a thousand dollars at the gap, which, you know,
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: it's like back in 92, which more than it is now,
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: it was just a very nice gesture, you know?
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: So, so you were close with these guys.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: So, all right, the movie comes out, it's a huge hit. Um,
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: how did that affect you? What, what kind of went
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: on in your life after that?
• 20:46
  Speaker 3: Well, once that happened, you know, you start seeing all
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: these people come out of the woodwork from everywhere, relatives
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: that you didn't know, or they were there, but they
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: never chose to reach out until now. And just like everything,
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: And everything was happening at a really fast pace. And
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: it seems like, because you don't have that experience, it
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: seemed like everyone wanted to be your friend. And it's
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: just like, just the way they were coming at you,
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: it just seemed like it was okay to do the
• 21:13
  Speaker 3: things that I was being exposed to. Just because these
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: people seem so cool and they all have my best
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: interest at heart. And it was like the hugest recipe
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: for disaster.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: Right. So all of a sudden you're being offered all
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: these different temptations and all these things that normally may
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: not have come down your path, but they did. And
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: at this point, I'm assuming you're making more money than
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: you had had from $ 10 an hour.
• 21:34
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: And that could sort of feed any. fun times or,
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: you know, bad times, so to speak. So talk to
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: me about that. I mean, so obviously drugs, I have
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: to bring it up, have been a big part of
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: your past because they're a big, you know, addiction is
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: a big part of who you are now and who
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: you're helping. So everyone has a first time. How did
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: you get involved with drugs the first time?
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: I mean, it was, I mean, you want to consider
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: weed because, you drinking is so socially acceptable, even though
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: I was a little kid, 12, 13 year old, but
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: like on New Year's Eve with all my aunts and
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: uncles and my cousins, of course you have a little champagne.
• 22:10
  Speaker 3: And of course you have one, two glasses, you're already drunk.
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: So I don't even know if you want to count that.
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: But the first time I smoked weed was with the
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: kid who shot Sonny in the Bronx. He was doing
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: his scenes, right? And he's still my friend. I just
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: talked to him like three weeks ago. He would hate me,
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: but he came to see me when I was away.
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: He's a really good guy. His name is Phil Garbarino.
• 22:29
  Speaker 3: So one night, you know, they had the car service
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: for me usually to take me home. And someone said,
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: you know, it's going to be a little bit of
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: a wait if you want to wait or Phil Gardnerino
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: could take you home. He said, no problem. So I said,
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: I'll just, you know, I'll go with Phil. So, you know,
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: we were driving. We were in the Bronx. And I
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: remember looking at his ashtray and he had some roaches.
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: And I didn't know what they were. So I was like,
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: what is that? And he was like, roaches. So then
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: he started saying it was weed. So we smoked. I
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: didn't get high the first time. And then we smoked
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: on set because I had an apartment. Because when I
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: had my tutor and stuff and I used to let
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: my friends, because I was the lead, I had the
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: biggest apartment. So I used to let my friends go
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: in there. I gave them the keys. So these guys
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: are in there smoking weed. So now when I went
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: in there, I smelled it. Oh, it's only Lilo. So
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: we grabbed it from under the rug, under the carpet.
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: And they started smoking it. And because I thought I
• 23:15
  Speaker 3: was high the first time, but I wasn't. So I smoked.
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: I took like two hits. And then I had to
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: do the scene when I asked, is it better to
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: be loved or feared? That was the first time I
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: was ever high. Watch that scene again. You can see
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: my eyes. Yeah, I didn't know. It's so embarrassing. But
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: it's because, like I said, I thought I was high
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: the first time and I thought I was going to
• 23:33
  Speaker 3: be able to handle it. And that was the first time.
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: And thank God I didn't have a lot of dialogue.
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I was just going to say, I mean,
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: did they ever notice that you started to change a little?
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: Being a student is expensive. Rent, books, your morning coffee,
• 23:48
  Speaker 4: your mid-morning coffee, your I'm about to fall asleep in
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: the middle of a lecture coffee. So here's something that
• 23:54
  Speaker 4: won't break the bank. A subscription to the Irish Times
• 23:58
  Speaker 4: for just € 5 a month. Get every article, 165 years
• 24:02
  Speaker 4: of journalism, daily puzzles and exclusive newsletters. All for less
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: than the price of your daily coffee habit. The Irish
• 24:08
  Speaker 4: Times for just € 5 a month. The ultimate student discount.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: While you were working on that film?
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: That was the only day.
• 24:16
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: That was the only day. That's not really when it
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: was noticeable. That's when I started entering the belly of
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: the beast. That was just like, a little drink and
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: some smoking weed. And that's pretty much about it. But
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: then like later on after the film had come out,
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: that's when I started with like the, you know, the hallucinogens,
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: but the cocaine, that's when I discovered that.
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: So I, you know, addiction is a really interesting thing
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: because a lot of people will, you know, frown upon it.
• 24:42
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: And, and act like they're above it. But quite frankly,
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: I think that everyone's been in like related to addiction
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: in some way, shape or form. If they are not
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: an addict, they have been affected by, by addiction in
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: some way from somebody in their family, a loved one,
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: a friend. And I think it's really important to make
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: mention of that because I think, honestly, addiction in all ways, shapes,
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: and forms can affect everybody. And it's a really important topic.
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: For me personally, I was never an addict, but my
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: father died of a cocaine overdose when he was 44
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: years old.
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: I was 15.
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: It obviously affected me. And it changed my life in
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: the way that I was always scared to try drugs
• 25:20
  Speaker 1: because I knew that I had an addictive personality. And
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: he was someone who always, you know, would frown upon
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: drugs and say that it was not for him and
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: it was for people lesser than him that couldn't handle
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: it and blah, blah, blah. And then as soon as
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: he got into it, it became such a big part
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: of his life. I mean, he didn't even have a
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: septum in his nose anymore because he had done so
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: much cocaine. So, you know, anyways, I just think that
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: it's such a big thing that people should really pay
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: attention to and listen to because it's not just people
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: that have like lost control or don't give a shit.
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: There's so much more to it.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: And it usually stems from some sort of pain or
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: trauma is what I have found.
• 25:55
  Speaker 3: Right. Well, that's, that's, yeah, that's, that's the real gateway,
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: you know, that the pain, the trauma and, you know,
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: like addiction manifests in so many different ways. You know
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: what I mean? Like people just, they hear the word,
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: it's not only like the people have shopping addiction, sex addictions,
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: you know, there's so many, I actually wrote a screenplay
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: called Never Meet Your Heroes. It's about addiction. My character's
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: a gambler, Joey Preston, and I'm going to, have Terrell
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: Hicks from the Bronx Tale. She's going to play my wife, Joanne.
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: The girl who played your girlfriend.
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but we're not the same characters as a Bronx Tale.
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: This is all off the top of my head and
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: it just shows how addiction manifests and how it's passed
• 26:35
  Speaker 3: on genetically. How that addictive gene is passed on genetically.
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: And then with trauma being the catalyst, it can set
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: it off. It's nature versus nurture. And this is what
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: I do at the treatment center. I teach this kind
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: of stuff. So I'm getting like real life experiences and
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: stuff I personally experienced. And then maybe I'll get a
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: little piece from what this girl just said. Holy shit. Wow.
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: What did she just say? You know, like it's crazy.
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: Some of the stuff you hear, but it's just like,
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: and just how you said, you know, you were afraid
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: to go that way. I see what these kids go
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: through now, just spent their own stuff. I would be
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: afraid to relapse. I would be afraid to relapse. I
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: hear the horror stories like these kids today are much
• 27:14
  Speaker 3: worse than my generation. Like they'll shoot anything. They'll shoot
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: marijuana if they could. It's like the craziest thing, but
• 27:21
  Speaker 3: this is where I'm getting this story. I would say
• 27:23
  Speaker 3: it's about 90% done. I could shoot it right now,
• 27:27
  Speaker 3: but I just want more complexity. I have everything on
• 27:29
  Speaker 3: index cards. I have all apps. I have it, you know,
• 27:32
  Speaker 3: I have it in script form too, but as new
• 27:34
  Speaker 3: stuff comes to me, I just write it on index
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: cards and then I put it in the script. I
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: love it. It gives me like, for me now, this
• 27:40
  Speaker 3: is a high. Yeah. Like writing is a high.
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: It gives you a purpose and something to look forward to,
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: which I think is so important.
• 27:47
  Speaker 3: And you know what? Sometimes like, Back in the day,
• 27:50
  Speaker 3: like if things weren't going my way, I was a
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: little upset. I'd go drink and get high. But now
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: when I feel like that, I don't even, that's the
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: furthest thing from my mind. When I do that now,
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: I get the index cards. And it's crazy because when
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: I'm like that, it's when the best stuff comes out
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: of me. It just comes out so naturally. Sometimes I'll
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: have writer's block where I'm like the happiest guy and
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: everything's cool and nothing comes. And then like one night
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: of me just like being upset at my brother or something,
• 28:16
  Speaker 3: I go get the index card and I just wrote
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: a backstory for the whole family. I can tell you
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: where they come from. I can tell you the father's
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: a bus mechanic at Liberty lines. Like all this stuff
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: is like, cause I see this, you know, I don't know.
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: It just brings it out of me. So it's a
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: good thing.
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: I think it's so amazing that, and we'll get into
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: that in a minute about how you're helping people now,
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: because I think it's so important for people that need
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: the help here about someone else's experience. That's really been
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: through it. And you've really been through it.
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean?
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: So just talk to us for a minute more about
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: how you realized that you were drinking and you're doing
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: marijuana and whatever, all of a sudden became a problem
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: and you were chasing that high all the time to
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: get yourself into a place where you got in trouble.
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: Well, it didn't happen like that, but I knew it
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: was a problem because like, you know, like when we
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: did it, like, you know, 18, 19 years old and
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: I did it with my other friends there. I didn't
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: go to college. I did after. And I do have,
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: you know, I do have a degree, but it was
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: after I was away. it's like, I always find the
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: need to have to do it. Not all the time,
• 29:17
  Speaker 3: but if I have liquor, if I drank, it's definitely happening.
• 29:20
  Speaker 3: I would take, I would like steal my father's car
• 29:23
  Speaker 3: that I've crashed in the past. I would spend $ 60,
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: $ 30 going in a cab, $ 30 coming back just to
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: go get a 20 bag, you know, like that kind
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: of stuff. And then it just, but that was when
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: it wasn't really that bad. Right. the clay was like
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: weekend warrior type stuff and then you know cocaine psychosis
• 29:40
  Speaker 3: is i do people get like yeah they get like
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: paranoid like that because i used to get like that
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: like really like an extreme case and i knew all
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: the guys and it's going to be in my film
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: too it's going to be meth psychosis though my daughter's
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: going to experience it so one night i'm experiencing this
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: in the car with my friends and i thought these
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: guys were going to kill me for real just the
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: way they're looking at me. These guys I grew up with.
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: So I was like, you know what? I just opened
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: the side door and I jumped out doing 60 miles
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: an hour.
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: Oh my God.
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: Oh, wow.
• 30:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: So enter narcotic pain medication. That's how this, that's how
• 30:13
  Speaker 3: that started. Wow. So now, because I, you know, like
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: I was in the hospital, I had staph infection and
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: give me morphine. And then I started taking the, you know, the,
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: The Vicodin, because that was back in, this was happening
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: in 2000. Okay. So that was Vicodin, Percocet, you know,
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: even before Oxy. It was like right around that time.
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: So then I started taking those and I didn't realize
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: how good they were. And I remember my mom had them.
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: They were all over the house. You go to the dentist, right?
• 30:38
  Speaker 3: So then I was like, wow, these things are great.
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: So I just started taking them. And then it got
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: to a point where I was taking like 40 a day,
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: 50 a day, you know? And that was like 2000,
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: it got bad. You know, I had this one girlfriend,
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: she was six years older than me. And all she
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: wanted to do was get married and I wasn't ready.
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: And I was a lot of drugs. So she moved on.
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: She's married now has kids. I just actually, she actually
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: messaged me recently too. She's doing well. But then I
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: met another girl in 2003. So yeah, Because I'm just
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: a time lapse from 2000 to 2003. Because in 2003
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: is when I met the girl whose father shot the cop.
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: She was like 19 years old. Because now I didn't
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: want someone older just because they wanted to get married.
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: I didn't want to do that. So I figured someone
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: younger would be safe. I met her at the gym.
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: We started hanging out. She had her own place. Her
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: father lived downstairs. And that was like my haven to
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: like do drugs. So I was taking pills and my
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: addiction was getting worse. She was going to Fordham College.
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: She was actually going to go to like go to
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: school to be a doctor, take the MCATs and all
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: of that. So she was like really bright. So in
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: the beginning, things were good, you know, first couple of years.
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: I mean, I met her dad at this point and
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: I seen him, you know, he was a rough guy,
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: serious guy. And, uh, and then by 2000, I would
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: say end of four, 2005 is when I started with
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: the heroin. Because the pills, they were just so hard
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: to get on the street. They were being more regulated
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: by the government. They were just harder to get.
• 32:04
  Speaker 1: And what I just wanted to say is that what
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: people maybe miss the fact on is that all these
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: things you're talking about up until the heroin is stuff
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: that people have in their cabinets. And they can get
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: totally addicted to it and not even realize it's a
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: problem until it moves to the next stage. But that's
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: what's scary, especially now, because kids are doing it like
• 32:24
  Speaker 1: it's nothing. And then you add something in that, by
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: the way, it only takes one time to, you know,
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: be doing Coke that's laced with fentanyl and you're dead.
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: So it just, it's people don't even realize that they
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: have a problem sometimes.
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And that's, I didn't know that it was a
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: problem until like, I remember we've ran out of the
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: pills in the house. So it just was no more.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: I did the ones that the doctor gave me. I
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: ate all my father's, my brother's, one of the medicines.
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: So they are hydrocodone. Those are, you know, and I
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: did them all. So now it's like, all right, no more.
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: So I didn't think twice. I said, all right, you know,
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: whatever it's over, you know? And then I didn't realize.
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: And then when I went to sleep, that's when I
• 33:02
  Speaker 3: realized I couldn't sleep. And then I was getting sick
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: and I felt something, you know, like I felt like
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: I had a flu, but it was a little different.
• 33:10
  Speaker 3: It was a little different. So I'm like, huh, this
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: is weird. What is this? So I'm like tossing and turning.
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: And then I remember who it was that I spoke to.
• 33:17
  Speaker 3: And they're like, yeah, you're probably withdrawing from those pills.
• 33:20
  Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, is that what it is? And then
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: that's when I went to seek the pills. And then
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: that was, I couldn't get those. And then it was
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: the heroin. And then I started with the crack too,
• 33:29
  Speaker 3: because I was doing the cocaine. And it was like
• 33:31
  Speaker 3: the summer, it was like June of 05. when everything
• 33:34
  Speaker 3: really set in motion, June of 05. And then by October,
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: the girl broke up with me. She's like, you know,
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: like I'm going to school to be a doctor. I
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: can't have this distraction. I'm like smoking crack in her
• 33:45
  Speaker 3: house and like bad people are in the house and
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: just really bad stuff.
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: So she broke up with you because of your drug addiction.
• 33:52
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: And so, and up until now, had anyone else kind
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: of confronted you or said, you have a problem.
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: I can't be with you.
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: Did anyone else kind of have some boundaries?
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: Well, the first girl from the one that was older
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: than me, that was one of the issues as well,
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: that I didn't want to get married and I was
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: a drug addict, you know, but I wasn't nearly as
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: bad with the first one that, cause you know, it
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: progressed and it got a lot worse. Yeah. So yeah.
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: Then said like when I didn't expect her to say, no,
• 34:16
  Speaker 3: I don't want to be with you anymore. It was
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: just like, I was devastated. I couldn't believe it.
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: So, wow. And then I went back home and then
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: my drug addiction really spiraled out of control. And every
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: time I would go by the house, her or her
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: twin sister would call the cops. So then I said,
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: you know what, I got to find a loophole. So
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: then I started hanging out with her father. Like, you know,
• 34:37
  Speaker 3: we had a lot, we snorted heroin together. You know,
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: he's a bad guy. He snorted the heroin. So then
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: we became more friendly. So then I would just say,
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: I'm here to see your father. So then one, that one,
• 34:47
  Speaker 3: you know, December 10th, 2005, we'd become, and the only
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: time we had really ever hung out to go get drugs,
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: I'd pick them up at the bar, drive to the
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: spot and then come back, drop them off. And that's it.
• 34:57
  Speaker 3: But he called me at like, you know, I think
• 34:59
  Speaker 3: it was like 12, one in the morning. He calls me,
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: he says, I'm the next step. He says, do you
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: want to go get a drink? That was the first time.
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: And I was like, yeah, all right. Because I knew
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: that would entail smoking crack, snorting dope, you know. So
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: I went, picked him up. We went both crack. Then
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: we went to the strip club that my friend ran.
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: So we didn't go to the metal detector, which was
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: in the trial. Because they would say, how do you
• 35:20
  Speaker 3: get this guy not to know?
• 35:21
  Speaker 4: Being a student is expensive. Rent, books, your morning coffee,
• 35:26
  Speaker 4: your mid-morning coffee, your I'm-about-to-fall-asleep-in-the-middle-of-a-lecture coffee. So here's something that
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: won't break the bank. A subscription to the Irish Times
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: for just € 5 a month. Get every article, 165 years
• 35:40
  Speaker 4: of journalism, daily puzzles and exclusive newsletters. All for less
• 35:43
  Speaker 4: than the price of your daily coffee habit. The Irish
• 35:46
  Speaker 4: Times for just € 5 a month. The ultimate student discount.
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: They'd never seen us because he said to have them
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: go around. So we go to this place, we're hanging
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: out for a few hours. Now we wanted more heroin
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: because like we were smoking crack. We'd go out in
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: the parking lot, smoke crack, go back inside. So that
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: would eat away the heroin. So now we're getting like
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: really sick. And at this point in time, like right now,
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: like 170, like back then I was like 140. I
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: was really like doped out, drugged out. So then I,
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: you know, we decided we needed to get more. And
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: that's when we went to the Bronx. And I was
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: so desperate, and I knew this guy. That's why I
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: was so sloppy making all this noise. Because in my mind,
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: because I knew the guy, and I was so fucked
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: up on so many things, drunk, smoke, you know, practice,
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: that I just broke the window. And it's like when they,
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: you know, who does that in a burglary? Like, I'm
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: not the smartest guy in the world, but I'm not
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: going to make all that noise. I knew the guy.
• 36:41
  Speaker 3: Just the one I said that I knew the guy,
• 36:43
  Speaker 3: he was my friend, is exactly the way it really was.
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: You know, there's stuff in that case.
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: You know, so what I was just going to ask.
• 36:50
  Speaker 1: So what was your intention? Obviously, you were going there
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: to get drugs.
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: Did you know we were going to get a prescription codeine?
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: Because the guy I knew in the Bronx didn't have anything.
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: So this was a desperate attempt. He lived next door
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: to the little kid who played me at nine years old.
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: His sister was my first love. That's how I knew
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: this guy. He used to drive me to Yonkers. Like
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: I would sleep over their house and sometimes her mom
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: couldn't drive me. This guy was a Vietnam veteran. He
• 37:14
  Speaker 3: was like loopy. He was like Rain Man. And he
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: would take me to Yonkers and he used to give
• 37:17
  Speaker 3: me prescription pills back then. So then I don't like,
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: cause we were in that neighborhood. So it kind of
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: dawned on me. Maybe we could go to this guy's house.
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: I know he's in there. I know he likes me.
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: He used to drive me home. My father used to
• 37:28
  Speaker 3: give him cucumbers and tomatoes from the garden. So I
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: know we're friends. And these people painted this picture. These
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: guys are bloodthirsty cop killers. It was nothing even close
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: to that. It was not even close to that. It's
• 37:39
  Speaker 3: so every time I hear this and people collect, people
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: drive by me, cop killer. It's the craziest thing. So
• 37:47
  Speaker 3: I'm like, you know, broke the window, all this noise
• 37:50
  Speaker 3: as I'm walking away. Someone said, don't move. Boom, boom.
• 37:54
  Speaker 3: Started shooting. I got shot three times.
• 37:56
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. So I got shot first. So now I'm
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: like holding my stomach, this blood leaking out of my,
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: like through my fingers. And I just can't believe this happened.
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: I'm walking away. More shots. I hear my friend screaming.
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: I didn't even know he had a gun. And when
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: people go, how did you not know? Okay. How about this?
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: I was 30 years old. I was 29, 30 years
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: old at this point. Right? So if I was a
• 38:18
  Speaker 3: gun guy and I was hanging out with people and
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: we were doing this on a regular basis, don't you
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: think there would have been some pattern established? Like maybe
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: in grade school, you hit a kid in the head
• 38:27
  Speaker 3: with a chair. And then at a house party in college,
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: I stabbed somebody. So then you're like, you know what?
• 38:33
  Speaker 3: He's a bad kid. This shit was bound to happen.
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: I've never been in trouble like that. And just the
• 38:37
  Speaker 3: way they spun. So I got shot. This guy. So
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: now I don't know. This guy has a gun because
• 38:42
  Speaker 3: I would have never let him in my car. It's
• 38:44
  Speaker 3: not like this is so, you know, so now I'm
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: already down the street because my fight or flight kicked
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: in by adrenaline. It really works. And this is why,
• 38:53
  Speaker 3: you know, I had the same attorney as Trump, Joe Takapina.
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: Oh, yes.
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: I did. Yeah. Okay. But there was some, you know,
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: like there was an independent witness. I screamed, Kenny, Kenny,
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: as I'm like holding clutch and I'm walking. And I'm like,
• 39:10
  Speaker 3: And I'm screaming, Kenny, that's the guy who lived in
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: the house that they were saying we were robbing.
• 39:15
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: I was just going to ask, where was he? Did
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: he ever come to the door?
• 39:18
  Speaker 3: No, he died. He died in July of HIV. Oh,
• 39:22
  Speaker 3: my God. Imagine that. So I think he was a
• 39:25
  Speaker 3: heroin addict. OK, he was in the Vietnam War and
• 39:28
  Speaker 3: that's where he was a veteran. And that's how he
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: got HIV. and died. I didn't know that. But the
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: fact that I'm shot up and screaming, Kenny should tell you,
• 39:36
  Speaker 3: I don't know he's dead. Number one. And number two,
• 39:39
  Speaker 3: that should show you that should show the jury that
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: this guy wasn't robbing this guy. Yeah, because in a
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: situation like that, that's what's called a spontaneous utterance. It's
• 39:49
  Speaker 3: not a statement. You're you're adrenaline. You're subconscious. is saying
• 39:53
  Speaker 3: these things. This is what you're thinking, right? So why
• 39:57
  Speaker 3: didn't I scream police? Why didn't I scream Armento, the
• 40:00
  Speaker 3: guy I was with? Why didn't I scream mommy? No,
• 40:04
  Speaker 3: I screamed Kenny, the guy who you said I'm robbing, okay?
• 40:09
  Speaker 3: A burglary, if you feel that you have license or
• 40:12
  Speaker 3: privilege to be in there, it's not a burglary. I'm screaming. Why?
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: This is my most legitimate shot at getting help. And
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: if I'm screaming at him, doesn't it make sense that
• 40:22
  Speaker 3: I wouldn't be robbing the guy who I feel at
• 40:24
  Speaker 3: the same time I had the most legitimate shot at
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: saving my life?
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: So did it end up being someone else's house and
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: he had, after he died, someone else bought the house
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: or it was his family?
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: No. I don't know. Oh, because his parents were old
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: because he was a veteran. So he was older, too. Yeah.
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: His parents were really old when we knew him back then.
• 40:41
  Speaker 3: And his mom was like a little like had dementia. OK.
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: But his dad, you know, the dad, I spoke to
• 40:45
  Speaker 3: him a few times. He was an old Italian-American guy. OK.
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: So but you're running away.
• 40:52
  Speaker 1: And the guy that you had gone there with, the
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: father of your ex-girlfriend at this point had shot.
• 40:57
  Speaker 2: The off-duty cop, correct? Did you even know that that
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: had gone down?
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: No, I did not know that went down. Now, around
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: the corner, I was going to get the car to
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: go get him because I felt strong enough. I heard
• 41:09
  Speaker 3: him screaming. So I literally wanted to get the car,
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: get him and get out of there. But once I
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: got to the corner, all that fight or flight, it
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: left me. My legs got weak. There was blood all
• 41:19
  Speaker 3: over my car. And I just literally collapsed, literally against
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: the wall. And at this point, I thought I'm going
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: to die. Next thing you know, cops come. They were
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: down the street at this place called Holy Bagels. They
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: were getting bagels down the street. Next thing you know,
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: they come up because they heard gunshots. It wasn't the
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: 4th of July. So it was like, what the hell
• 41:36
  Speaker 3: is this? So then they come up and they see me.
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: you know, like we're in the Bronx, the kid from
• 41:41
  Speaker 3: the Bronx tale. Right. So it's like, is this real?
• 41:43
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 41:43
  Speaker 3: So the guy's like, I'm like, uh, and he's like,
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: Oh my God. It's from a Bronx tale.
• 41:50
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 41:51
  Speaker 3: I couldn't even believe this shit was happening. Right. I'm
• 41:53
  Speaker 3: like holding off a dear wife about to die. These
• 41:56
  Speaker 3: guys talk about the problem. She's got to ask me
• 41:57
  Speaker 3: how I was working with the hero. Right. So, so,
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: so next thing you know, He says, who shot you?
• 42:06
  Speaker 3: Who the fuck shot you? Was it him? And then
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: I look and I see the guy I was with.
• 42:11
  Speaker 3: He was riddled. He got shot like eight times. He's
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: got a. 357 Magnum and he's got latex gloves on.
• 42:20
  Speaker 3: He's got all this. And they tell him, drop the gun,
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: drop the fucking gun. Dropped it. So then we went
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: in ambulances and that was a crazy night. And people
• 42:28
  Speaker 3: like calling the ambulance, like come here. Cause the cop was,
• 42:32
  Speaker 3: you know, they know him, that's their neighbor. So in
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: other words, like screw these two pieces of shit, come
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: help this guy, come help this guy. That's what it was.
• 42:40
  Speaker 1: So at that point, were you, were you realizing this
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: was a cop that was now down?
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: You didn't.
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: No, not yet. It was like, not this, that morning,
• 42:49
  Speaker 3: because it was already like 5.30 in the morning. We
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: had the emergency surgery. I got my spleen removed, part
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: of my colon. I had a collapsed lung. I was
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: in bad shape. I was on like life support. Not
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: that morning, because obviously I was very out of it.
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: The next morning, I was handcuffed to the bed, right?
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: Imagine that with tubes intubated and all that, handcuffed to
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: the bed. Next thing you know, some guy, this like
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: little doctor, he comes over there.
• 43:11
  Speaker 5: He goes, he goes, are you proud of yourself? Show
• 43:14
  Speaker 5: them the cover of the paper. Are you proud of yourself?
• 43:16
  Speaker 5: He goes, you and your friend killed the cop. He
• 43:21
  Speaker 5: woke me up to tell me that because I was
• 43:23
  Speaker 5: so out of it.
• 43:24
  Speaker 3: And then I was like, I was like, I was
• 43:25
  Speaker 3: like crying. Like, you know, like serious, you know, that's
• 43:29
  Speaker 3: very serious stuff. I mean, not even as a cop,
• 43:31
  Speaker 3: somebody's dead.
• 43:32
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: At the hands of my addiction. Like this is what
• 43:36
  Speaker 3: everyone always talked about this. And now it's here. Now
• 43:39
  Speaker 3: I got, you know, now I kind of see what
• 43:40
  Speaker 3: I got to do to get myself out of this. Right.
• 43:42
  Speaker 3: And these poor family, these people. You know?
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: So eventually, obviously you went to trial and tell us
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: what happened in the trial.
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: You were acquitted of murder, right?
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 43:53
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 43:54
  Speaker 3: Murder to felony murder. When you attempt to commit, commit
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: in furtherance or an immediate flight therefrom. So it's not
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: an intentional thing. If you're part of a felony and
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: the non-participant dies, that's felony murder. You rob a lady's purse,
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: she has a heart attack, she dies, you killed her.
• 44:09
  Speaker 3: That's not just, yeah, that's felony murder. So it's very serious.
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: So I was acquitted of that. I was acquitted of
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: two counts of burglary because we never went in. And
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: then there was two lesser included offenses. The attempted burglary
• 44:21
  Speaker 3: with the firearm, which they couldn't prove that I knew about.
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: And then you had the attempted burglary with serious physical
• 44:27
  Speaker 3: injury to a non-participant. And that's what they convicted me of.
• 44:31
  Speaker 3: The sentencing guideline was three and a half to 15.
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: They gave me 10, which was a little much because
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: there's different cases in that county. went eight years, a
• 44:41
  Speaker 3: guy on a second conviction and they gave me 10,
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: but whatever, you know, um, I went upstate. Um, I
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: didn't even have a high school diploma at that point.
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: Cause I was, you know, all those years I was
• 44:50
  Speaker 3: like messing around with drugs and I got in the
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: movies and I always, I'll always put it off. But
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: now I thought to myself, this is the perfect time
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: to do this. At least I can come home. Because
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: you know what? I dodged a really big bullet. You
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: know what I mean? I could have went away for
• 45:03
  Speaker 3: 25 to life. That would have been the last thing
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: on my mind. But now I know I'm going to
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: be home. I'm still going to be in my 30s,
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: a young guy. I'm going to take care of myself.
• 45:11
  Speaker 3: I'm going to educate myself. And, you know, like people,
• 45:13
  Speaker 3: when I come home, people want to hear my story. Yeah.
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: So it's, I have a vested interest to learn how
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: to speak better, you know, speak well to like, you know, people,
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: you know, just give you more of the, you know,
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: the benefit of the doubt.
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: So you would have really, you learned how to have
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: a really good attitude about being there and take advantage
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: of what you could do and learn there, obviously.
• 45:31
  Speaker 3: Right. Absolutely. I always looked on the bright side and
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: that it was a reason why I was there. I mean,
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: obviously I would have been dead. You know how many
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: times I would call my mom from there? Oh, oh yeah,
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: your friend Jimmy died. I saw his aunt the other day.
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: He overdosed in his basement.
• 45:45
  Speaker 5: Oh, wow.
• 45:47
  Speaker 3: Oh, you know Anna's son, Angelo? Yeah, he died. Oh, wow.
• 45:51
  Speaker 3: So many people. And when this was happening and I'm
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: hearing this, I'm like, I'm in the place where I'm
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: supposed to be.
• 45:56
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: I am where I am supposed to be. And it
• 45:59
  Speaker 3: was totally fine. I got my education. I got an
• 46:01
  Speaker 3: associate's degree. Well, first I got my GED. That was
• 46:04
  Speaker 3: pretty easy. And then I majored in business management. I
• 46:07
  Speaker 3: learned so much. Microeconomics, ethics, you know, politics. I learned
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: so much. I learned so much. And I came out
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: of that. I was so satisfied with what I did
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: with my time.
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: Go ahead.
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: No, I was going to say, it's so interesting to me, though,
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: that it's almost like, you know, life imitates art. I mean,
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: it's very similar to what happened in The Bronx Tale,
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: with the exception that you figured it out before you
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: went over to, you know, those guys. You know, you
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: got out of the car, Chaz saved you, and you
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: got out of the car before it all happened, and
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: your life spun down the drain. But, you know, I
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: think it's very interesting how there were so many similarities
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: between I'm curious if you thought about that movie and
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: the lessons you learned from the movie, because there were
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: so many good things about, you know, there's nothing worse
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: than wasted talent, you know, and I wondered if that
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: ever haunted you.
• 46:59
  Speaker 4: Being a student is expensive. Rent, books, your morning coffee,
• 47:04
  Speaker 4: your mid-morning coffee, your I'm-about-to-fall-asleep-in-the-middle-of-a-lecture coffee. So here's something that
• 47:10
  Speaker 4: won't break the bank. A subscription to the Irish Times
• 47:14
  Speaker 4: for just € 5 a month. Get every article, 165 years
• 47:18
  Speaker 4: of journalism, daily puzzles and exclusive newsletters. All for less
• 47:21
  Speaker 4: than the price of your daily coffee habit. The Irish
• 47:24
  Speaker 4: Times for just € 5 a month. The ultimate student discount.
• 47:29
  Speaker 3: God, it still does. You know, but... I try to
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: offset it by just making and being the best me. Yeah.
• 47:35
  Speaker 3: Whether it's in film and television or something else, because
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: that's not what life's all about. You know, there's a
• 47:40
  Speaker 3: lot more to life. A lot of other things that
• 47:42
  Speaker 3: I do, I do enjoy. I do enjoy that as well. Yeah.
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: But yeah, that definitely, the saddest thing in life is
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: wasted talent. You know, although I think it's one of
• 47:51
  Speaker 3: the saddest things in life. For me, the saddest thing
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: in life is when a little baby is born sick
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: and they never did anything and they're just born sick.
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: To me, that's sadder than wasted talent. Right. You know,
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: but it's definitely one of the saddest things. But, you know.
• 48:06
  Speaker 3: But let's talk about one other thing. In jail is
• 48:10
  Speaker 3: where I got sober.
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, I was going to ask you. That's prison.
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: But right after the hospital, I went to Rikers Island.
• 48:17
  Speaker 3: That's city jail. That is the worst. You Google the
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: top worst five jails in America and you'll see what
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: they say. And again, that place is a nut house.
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: You have no idea what a nut house it is.
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: And that's where I did three years. It's hell on earth.
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: Like you have no idea the things that go on
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: in this place. Like 2006, I was in punitive segregation.
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: I was in the hole in the box. They put
• 48:42
  Speaker 3: me in this place for 28 days for smoking. They
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: found sulfur and they found the match under my shoe.
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: So whatever, they sent me to the box. They gave
• 48:50
  Speaker 3: me 28 days. So when you go out to the
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: yard with these, you know, like these are bloods. I
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: didn't even know that there were bloods in New York.
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: I didn't even know there were bloods in New York.
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: I thought it was only Californians. So we go like,
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: when you go to rec, there's 50 cells, you're just
• 49:04
  Speaker 3: locked in, there's a little window, so you gotta wait
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: up by your gate like, yo, yo, I wanna go
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: to rec, yo. And then they see you, they open
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: up the slot. That means they know they gotta cuff you.
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: If the slot's open, then the next gate. Then we
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: go into this one place where they search you. Like,
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: I grew up with all Italians, so Italians call each
• 49:19
  Speaker 3: other cuz. Yo, what's up, cuz? How you doing, cuz?
• 49:22
  Speaker 4: Right?
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: So I called this guy cuz. When we went into
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: the thing, I'm like, yo, what's up, cuz? And the
• 49:26
  Speaker 3: Bloods called each other homie. What's poppin', homie? And the
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: Crips called each other cuz. What's crackin', cuz? Right? So
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: I'm like, yo, what's up, cuz? How you doing, right?
• 49:36
  Speaker 3: So he's like, what the fuck, you say?
• 49:38
  Speaker 4: I'm like, what?
• 49:40
  Speaker 3: Them, right? What happened, right? So then the other kid
• 49:43
  Speaker 3: was like, no, no, he didn't mean anything by it.
• 49:45
  Speaker 3: Just like the worst day in jail. I tell you
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: the worst. I didn't think I've ever said this on anything.
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: This is my worst day in jail. It was like
• 49:52
  Speaker 3: March 2006. So these guys are about to kill me.
• 49:55
  Speaker 3: I'm still strung out. I'm like 145 pounds. I'm like
• 49:59
  Speaker 3: a goldfish amongst all these piranhas and I'm like leaking blood.
• 50:02
  Speaker 3: That's what I felt like, right? But, you know, the
• 50:05
  Speaker 3: fact that I was there for a cop murder, that
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: kind of saves you because they like that kind of stuff.
• 50:09
  Speaker 3: It's not like you're there like, they're like, yo, fuck.
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: You know, like, it's crazy, right? So now, okay, everything
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: gets straightened out. So now, we're on the fifth floor.
• 50:18
  Speaker 3: We got to go down to the yard, walking down
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: the stairs. And we got like, 10, 15 guys on
• 50:24
  Speaker 3: what's called the daisy chain where you get cuffed on
• 50:28
  Speaker 3: your ankles and you're hooked up to another 15 guys
• 50:31
  Speaker 3: and you're shackled everywhere you go, right? I didn't know
• 50:34
  Speaker 3: this was the stairway of death. So what happens is
• 50:37
  Speaker 3: they start going down really fast. If you don't know,
• 50:40
  Speaker 3: you get trampled. You're going to slip and they're going
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: to kill you. So like I almost died in these stairs, right?
• 50:45
  Speaker 3: So like all this stuff. And I'm still getting high.
• 50:48
  Speaker 3: I'm still a fiend. As bad as all this is,
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: like I should learn my lesson. Like I'm about to get,
• 50:52
  Speaker 3: I almost get killed in the stairs. And then we get,
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: and then like we're all in our own little cages.
• 50:57
  Speaker 3: So these guys are smoking weed. This is before I
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: got sober, right? So he was like, you want some?
• 51:01
  Speaker 3: So he started saying, I sold drugs to kids and young.
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: Cause he's all Bronx guys, a lot of Bronx bloods.
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: So I was like, he started rattling off these names.
• 51:08
  Speaker 3: And he said, Mitchell Guido. I'm like, yeah, I know Mitch.
• 51:10
  Speaker 3: So we started talking. So we thought everything was cool.
• 51:13
  Speaker 3: You got the, they get searched like 20 times. Meanwhile,
• 51:15
  Speaker 3: the guy's got blunts. Like, where do you put this
• 51:17
  Speaker 3: stuff that they don't see it? He's got like, it's
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: like he was in the street, right? So he's in
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: the cage across, right? So now he says, I'll save
• 51:25
  Speaker 3: you some. So I'm waiting for him to save it.
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: So then he throws it out of the way, steps
• 51:28
  Speaker 3: on it. I was like, yo, I thought you were
• 51:29
  Speaker 3: going to save me something. And he was like, sure.
• 51:32
  Speaker 3: They totally flipped on me, right? I'm like, oh my God,
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: this guy's crazy, right? So I'm like, we have a
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: couple of words, whatever. I didn't want to make a
• 51:38
  Speaker 3: big deal because I couldn't do anything. He couldn't do anything.
• 51:41
  Speaker 3: So then we got back on the trains because they
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: got 50 cells, 50 little cages. So they got, you know,
• 51:46
  Speaker 3: get everybody. So there's a lot of waiting time. But,
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: you know, I was getting church. I was getting morphine
• 51:51
  Speaker 3: at church. I was getting morphine at church. I had
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: another blood in the next cell block. He used to
• 51:55
  Speaker 3: get me heroin, four bags for $ 100 from Brooklyn. It
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: was called Hard Bodies and putting it around the noodles.
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: And then on November 12, 2006, I went to church.
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: I got 20 morphine, MS Compton. I chewed them. And
• 52:08
  Speaker 3: then I snorted four bags of dope. And then I'm
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: in the corner in the TV room. And I got
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: this guy, Bobby. He's playing Lookout for me. He's looking
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: at me. He's like, with the dose. I'm in the corner.
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: Camera's in the corner, right? And I'm smoking a cigarette
• 52:20
  Speaker 3: that I wrote with So I'm over there like, it
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: felt like my throat was trying to swallow my tongue.
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: I was ODing and I didn't realize what was happening.
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: So I'm like, I have to keep my hand in
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: my mouth. And I said, yo, I don't feel good.
• 52:38
  Speaker 3: I went down to my son. I said, come check
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: on me. He didn't even make it. Another guy was like, dude,
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: your eyes are all white. You're like trying to take it.
• 52:45
  Speaker 3: So I overdosed that day. I still didn't stop doing drugs.
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: I didn't tell them anyone. I said it was my
• 52:52
  Speaker 3: sugar levels went. That's why that happened. But it was
• 52:55
  Speaker 3: the weekend. So they couldn't drug test me till Monday.
• 52:58
  Speaker 3: So I still got that herald. I still got the connect.
• 53:00
  Speaker 3: I'm not telling. They closed my cell off. So I'm going, going, going, going.
• 53:05
  Speaker 3: Then on November 18th was the last time I got high. OK,
• 53:09
  Speaker 3: when I was in the box, I had an attorney
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: visit from Corey. Remember the attorney that I worked for?
• 53:15
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 53:15
  Speaker 3: Him. So you're still there for me. And he's in
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: recovery as well. You know, so like, you know, so
• 53:20
  Speaker 3: since 82. So he was like my mentor, Corey Rabin.
• 53:24
  Speaker 3: And then you have my cousin Pat, who's a judge now.
• 53:27
  Speaker 3: But he was an attorney as well. So they were
• 53:29
  Speaker 3: able to come whenever. It's not like designated visit days.
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: They can come in. So these guys come in and
• 53:34
  Speaker 3: I was like, happy to see them. And then he was,
• 53:35
  Speaker 3: they were like, not happy to see me. They were
• 53:37
  Speaker 3: very disappointed, very disappointed. And just for some reason that day,
• 53:42
  Speaker 3: I really felt it. And they were like, you know what?
• 53:44
  Speaker 3: You got all these people that want to see me
• 53:46
  Speaker 3: in this case. You keep doing this and someone's dead.
• 53:49
  Speaker 3: And for some reason, it just resonated with me. What
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: I should have heard a long time ago, I heard
• 53:54
  Speaker 3: that just at that moment. And I never looked back.
• 53:57
  Speaker 3: When I left that attorney visit that day, I swear
• 54:00
  Speaker 3: to God, it felt like a modern day miracle. That
• 54:03
  Speaker 3: obsession to want to get high was lifted. I went
• 54:07
  Speaker 3: to church. I seen all the same people and it
• 54:10
  Speaker 3: just left me. And then I got addicted to like
• 54:12
  Speaker 3: working out, studying my case and all of that.
• 54:15
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 54:16
  Speaker 1: So I know you have a hard out, so I
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: just want to wrap it up because it's like now,
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: but I do want to just talk about the process
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: and what you are in now and your recovery really quickly.
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: And like the lessons you've learned.
• 54:27
  Speaker 3: Um, well, what do I, I do now I'm director
• 54:30
  Speaker 3: of public relations over at more life recovery. Um, you know,
• 54:33
  Speaker 3: everyone there's basically in recovery as well. One of the owners,
• 54:37
  Speaker 3: his name is Steve, Steven Barone. He was with another
• 54:39
  Speaker 3: company and I was with them first, but this is
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: a little more hands-on, you know, I never really got
• 54:45
  Speaker 3: anything from meetings, like going to NA meetings. They're very cultish.
• 54:49
  Speaker 3: And it just doesn't work for me because it seems like,
• 54:52
  Speaker 3: I don't know, they brainwash you. Like you're the sick,
• 54:54
  Speaker 3: diseased person and you have to come or you go,
• 54:57
  Speaker 3: oh my God, I don't want that. Like that chapter's gone. Like,
• 55:00
  Speaker 3: I don't want to keep saying I'm an addict. I'm Lilo.
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: I'm an addict. You know, I just don't want to
• 55:03
  Speaker 3: do that. And I get so much more because I
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: know like I write up lesson plans and stuff like that.
• 55:08
  Speaker 3: Like you've ever heard like one of the most experience
• 55:11
  Speaker 3: experience based neuroplasticity. You know what that is?
• 55:15
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 55:15
  Speaker 3: You know, like how your brain, like when people say, oh,
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: you only remember the bad stuff. Like that's true to
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: a certain extent, because that's what your brain allows you
• 55:22
  Speaker 3: to remember to protect you for survival, the good stuff.
• 55:25
  Speaker 3: So this is the kind of stuff. And like when,
• 55:28
  Speaker 3: and they see me, I come and dressed up nice.
• 55:30
  Speaker 3: And it's just like such a beautiful thing. You know
• 55:32
  Speaker 3: what I mean? To get some of these kids, their
• 55:34
  Speaker 3: moms and dads message me like months after they left
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: more life and to message me and say, you know, this,
• 55:41
  Speaker 3: you know, my son Sean is doing so well. Thank you.
• 55:44
  Speaker 3: This kind of stuff is so rewarding. Way better than
• 55:48
  Speaker 3: seeing yourself in a movie and stuff like that. Because
• 55:51
  Speaker 3: do you know what I would have done for my
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: parents to stop feeling the way they did when I
• 55:55
  Speaker 3: was getting high? My mom and dad used to cry.
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: My dad was as tough as you can get. Look,
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: that's my dad right there. And he was he built
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: homes and he was he was he wasn't a street guy.
• 56:06
  Speaker 3: But trust me, he was just as tough as one.
• 56:08
  Speaker 3: And he worked like you have no idea. And he
• 56:11
  Speaker 3: was as tough as they got. And the reason why
• 56:13
  Speaker 3: I'm building up the toughness is because when he used
• 56:15
  Speaker 3: to see me like that and he would know he
• 56:17
  Speaker 3: was helpless, you would see that tough guy cry like
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: a baby. And I think about those days and my
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: mom and dad and how they cried because they were powerless.
• 56:26
  Speaker 3: It's like, you know, how much more can we do?
• 56:28
  Speaker 3: We've told you we will do anything. We've told you
• 56:31
  Speaker 3: what you need to do, but now you have to
• 56:33
  Speaker 3: do it. And I just couldn't get myself to doing it.
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: And you have to want it and you, some people
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: have to hit rock bottom and, but you have to
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: want it to make that choice and to do it.
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: And I think it's amazing. I think it's amazing that
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: you are spending your life now trying to change other
• 56:49
  Speaker 1: people's lives or give them the tools and Um, and
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: you know, learn, uh, tell them about your experience to
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: help them get through theirs. Because I think so many
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: people are, you know, they live their life based on
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: shame and guilt and they don't actually know how to
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: start over. And I think it's great to have a
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: friend in you.
• 57:05
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 57:05
  Speaker 3: And it's also, it's just like, you know, when you,
• 57:07
  Speaker 3: when you're in the depths and you're, you're in the
• 57:09
  Speaker 3: grips of the addiction, it kind of steals your ambition.
• 57:13
  Speaker 3: You lose all that ambition. And it's like, and you're
• 57:15
  Speaker 3: right after you've been like so broken down and people
• 57:19
  Speaker 3: look at you a certain way. it's like some people
• 57:22
  Speaker 3: don't even have the courage to come out of their
• 57:24
  Speaker 3: house at that, let alone, you know what I mean?
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: But I want to show them there is some power
• 57:28
  Speaker 3: in that, but it's got to come from you. You're
• 57:31
  Speaker 3: the only person that can do this. You know, you're
• 57:34
  Speaker 3: doing so great. Yeah. You know, how did you do it?
• 57:37
  Speaker 3: I did it because I really wanted to do it. I,
• 57:39
  Speaker 3: you know, I didn't want to embarrass my parents anymore.
• 57:41
  Speaker 3: And I just wanted to be a good person. And
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: someone was dead and so much has happened. And now
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: it's time for me to like turn this around and
• 57:47
  Speaker 3: at least make God say one day it was at
• 57:49
  Speaker 3: least worth, you know, it was at least worth it
• 57:52
  Speaker 3: having this guy in the world for as long as
• 57:53
  Speaker 3: I did. You know what I mean? That's the way
• 57:55
  Speaker 3: I think of it. Like we're guests here, whether it's
• 57:57
  Speaker 3: God or whoever put us here, we're guests and our
• 58:00
  Speaker 3: time is limited. So I think, you know, we've got
• 58:02
  Speaker 3: to make the most of it. And that's what I'm
• 58:04
  Speaker 3: doing now.
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: And just a few quick questions that I think people
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: would want to know. What's your relationship now with Chaz
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: and Bob? Do you still talk to them? Have you
• 58:10
  Speaker 1: heard from them since you got out of prison?
• 58:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, Bob, I don't know if you saw the
• 58:15
  Speaker 3: New York Post thing, Bob. Bob left a comment. But
• 58:17
  Speaker 3: I saw Bob when they did The Irishman, Cherry Populous.
• 58:22
  Speaker 3: He does Bob's hair. I was in a Woody Allen
• 58:24
  Speaker 3: movie called Wonder Wheel with Justin Timberlake and Kate Winslet
• 58:28
  Speaker 3: back in like 15, 16. It's before I shaved my head.
• 58:32
  Speaker 3: And you'll see why I shaved my head. Right. So
• 58:35
  Speaker 3: I went to the audition. The lady was like, you know,
• 58:37
  Speaker 3: the Patricia Bussardo. She was the casting woman. She said,
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: Woody really loved you. It was good because he didn't
• 58:42
  Speaker 3: really know who I was. So he's picked me. She's like,
• 58:44
  Speaker 3: Woody really loved your acting. He loves your voice. She's like, um,
• 58:49
  Speaker 3: would you wear a hairpiece? She said, right? So I said, absolutely,
• 58:55
  Speaker 3: I would wear a hairpiece. So that's when Jerry Poppins,
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: De Niro's hair and makeup guy, he did the hairpiece. Oh, man.
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: So he came down to my house. He does it with, like,
• 59:03
  Speaker 3: saran wrap, and then he, like, he draws the lines
• 59:06
  Speaker 3: where the contours would be and all the lines, you know, like. Wow.
• 59:09
  Speaker 3: they sent this to london it's a wig maker it's
• 59:11
  Speaker 3: like a twenty thousand dollar wig the wig costs more
• 59:15
  Speaker 3: than my salary let's put it that way and i
• 59:17
  Speaker 3: was it was one scene right so he knew where
• 59:21
  Speaker 3: i lived it was right on the hudson river in
• 59:23
  Speaker 3: the high rises in south york because they put all
• 59:25
  Speaker 3: these new buildings so they were shooting the irishman not
• 59:27
  Speaker 3: far where deniro throws the gun in the water So
• 59:30
  Speaker 3: he messaged me on my Instagram. I was on the
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: treadmill at like 5.30 in the morning. He was like, hey, Lilo.
• 59:35
  Speaker 3: He was like, Bob's going to be down here. He
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: would love to see you. Just the fact that he
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: would love to see you means that they have spoken
• 59:42
  Speaker 3: about me before. And for him to say, come down
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: to the set means it's okay. Because if Bobby said,
• 59:47
  Speaker 3: don't bring that kid around, please. I don't want to
• 59:49
  Speaker 3: see him. He wouldn't say that. When he did that,
• 59:52
  Speaker 3: I'm not on parole anymore. It's kind of stupid to say,
• 59:54
  Speaker 3: but I will say this. It was only for De Niro.
• 59:56
  Speaker 3: When they said, come down, I had no ride. I'm
• 59:59
  Speaker 3: still on parole and I don't have a car. So
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 3: what I did was I took my dad's car. You know,
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 3: I know it's going against what I was, and I
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 3: am a good person and I do do the right thing,
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 3: but I just thought like, how great would it be
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 3: to see Robert De Niro right now? He's five minutes
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 3: from where I live. So I go down there and
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 3: I got a hat on and I was clean shaven.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 3: So I look probably like from the Bronx. All right.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 3: So He's coming back, and you know that character is
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 3: like 6'4. You know, Frank Sheeran, the character that he played.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 3: So he had to wear the platformers. So he's coming
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 3: at me and I'm standing there with Jerry, right? And
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 3: I'm just like, and Bob's walking because he's done. That
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 3: scene was done. He's walking back to his trailer. He's
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 3: got to pass me on his way. So he looks like, because,
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 3: you know, he had the contacts. He's got these green contacts.
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 3: He looks like Fred Munster. And he also had the
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 3: lines on his face for, you know, the CGI. He's
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 3: got all these weird lines. He's got green contacts. He's
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 3: like this, like this orange hair. And he's got like
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 3: these huge platforms. So this is like, this is the
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 3: first time we saw each other since the movie Heat.
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 3: I remember I was on the set and, you know,
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 3: he introduced me to Michael Mann and it was really cool.
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 3: So this is the first time seeing him and then
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: to see him after everything that has happened and to
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 3: see him looking like this, it was kind of awkward
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 3: for both of us. It was a short exchange, but
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 3: it was very nice. You know, like at first we
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 3: both got a little nervous. And then, you know, and
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 3: then he, pulled me to the side and he asked me,
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 3: he said, are you okay? Are you okay? And he
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 3: asked me like real, like forget about all the bullshit.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 3: Cause he's like, I see he's got a son my
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 3: age and he looked right at me and he said,
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 3: are you okay?
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 4: I said, yeah.
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 3: And I was at, you know, shook his hand. Um,
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 3: he left and, uh, you know, listen, I mean, I
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 3: don't think we'll ever work together again, but what he's
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 3: done for me, you know, thus far and just like
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 3: not only the film, but everything that I learned from him,
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 3: you know, as an actor, it's priceless. You know, like
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 3: you just don't, you don't get that kind of advice.
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 3: Just like I said, I thought everything was standard of
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 3: what went on there, but I really never got that
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 3: kind of advice again at that level. And just that
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 3: I was really able to use and still able to
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: use to this day to be able to act. And,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 3: you know, it's, it's priceless. And, you know, obviously the
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 3: Bronx tale is going to be 30 years old. September 30th,
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 3: it celebrates a 30 year anniversary. I can't believe that
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 3: it's been that long. And to, you know, like to
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 3: look back so many years, you know, later and to
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: say that I was part of something so special and
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 3: just like everything that came from it, you know, like
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 3: bad things, the good things just from that one film.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: And then just like everything, you know, but.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: I have one last question for you. So you had
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 1: a line in the, in the movie and where you
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: said to your father in the movie, The working man
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: is a sucker. So I'm just curious now, do you
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 1: think that the working man is the hero of the
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: sucker or the mobster is the hero?
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 3: I showed you my dad. I never, I always thought
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 3: the working man was the hero. You know what I mean? Like, cause,
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 3: and that's why that movie had such meaning to me.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: Cause when Lorenzo was talking, that was like my own dad.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 3: Cause my dad, like I said, he was a tough
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 3: dude and he could have went that day, you know,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 3: that way. And growing up Sicilian, that's part of the culture.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 3: Cause mafia started, when a lot of people invaded Sicily
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 3: and raped the women. And there was one particular instance
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 3: where this woman was being raped. And in Italian, they say,
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 3: mia figlia, means my daughter. And Sicilians say, ma figlia,
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 3: ma figlia, ma figlia, my daughter. And that's how that happened.
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 3: So these Sicilians, that's part of their culture. And it
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 3: didn't start as a bad thing. It started as a
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 3: good thing to help other Sicilians. from, you know, from
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 3: what they were going through. So my dad was a
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 3: very proud man. And believe me, listen, I got nothing
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 3: against street guys because I know they're tough too. And
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 3: they put their freedom on the line every day. You
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 3: know what I mean? They'll get their daughter that 16,
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 3: at 16, they'll get her that, you know, whatever car
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 3: she wants, but their freedom. So there's something to be
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 3: said for that as well. I'm not saying that they're good.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 3: I'm not saying they're bad, but just to be able to,
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 3: or willing to be able to say, I'm going to
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 3: put my freedom on the line just so my family
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 3: can have something better.
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 4: Mm-hmm.
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 3: There's something to be said for that as well. And
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 3: I would never put that down as well. Just like
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 3: Don Corleone said, it makes no difference to me the
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 3: way a man makes a living to a certain extent.
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 3: But in my own life, my own experience, I remember
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 3: the coldest days in the world. Saturday mornings when I
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 3: know I didn't have school, you know, cereal and cartoons
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 3: and then go outside. I'd hear my dad. I'd hear
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 3: the coffee, the espresso machine on, smell the coffee in
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 3: the house. It'd be cold out. My dad walked so hard,
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 3: so I could barely walk. He's just walking, just putting
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 3: his boots on. I've seen that. His hands look like sandpaper.
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 3: That's real tough stuff. And he would still go to work,
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 3: still go to work. Day. So it's like the hero
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 3: said in the Bronx tale. Day after day. Let's see
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 3: him try that. That's true.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 1: What do you want your legacy to be? How do
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 1: you want people to know you going forward?
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 3: I want people to remember me as someone who has
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 3: made monumentally bad choices, but never counted himself out based
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 3: on those choices and was able to to get back
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 3: to a place where he was happy with himself. But
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 3: in doing so, showed so many others that it's possible
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 3: because a lot of people don't think it's possible. But
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 3: once you see it, like right there in the flesh, like, oh,
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 3: that's the guy from the wrong still. Wasn't he in jail?
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 4: Oh, wow.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 3: He looks great. He was fucked up too. Wow. That's
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 3: how it works. And then the next guy, like, yo,
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 3: and then they start asking you, what's your workout routine, bro?
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 3: You know, once you hear that, you're already get, you
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 3: already got them where you want them. Cause now there's
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 3: interest in something other than that. Yeah. And then you start,
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 3: you know what I mean? And to like, this is
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 3: one thing I'm like, we're always going to be addicted
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 3: to something. These meetings and everything, they expect you to
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 3: go from Jack the Ripper to Gandhi in a week.
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 3: It just doesn't happen. You're always going to be a
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 3: certain way. Your brain is already wired a certain way.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 3: There's the prefrontal cortex. You're dopamine processing system. All this
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 3: stuff is very real. You know what I mean? All
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 3: this stuff is very real and it plays a big
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 3: part as to why you are the way you are. Okay?
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: But let's just have it manifest in something more positive.
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: I mean, listen, any addiction is not good, but you
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 3: can't be in denial. This is what you are. You
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 3: have an addictive personality. That may be the illness. The
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 3: addictive personality Not the drug addiction. That's just something that
• 1:06:27
  Speaker 3: you got addicted to. You know what I mean?
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: And it's one day at a time and everybody can,
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 1: it's never too late to start over.
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: It's never too late to make a better chance.
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 3: Absolutely. And you know what else? I think even more
• 1:06:41
  Speaker 3: than one day at a time. I think it's more
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 3: like one hour at a time. Think of how much
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 3: can happen from right now and then until tomorrow. You
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 3: know what I mean? So one hour.
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: People should check out your Instagram because you give these great,
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 1: inspiring talks.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 2: Is it daily that you do that?
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 3: No, I like to post two a week.
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah.
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: So tell people where they can find you, how they
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 1: can reach you, if they want to contact you, if
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: they have questions, if they want to get involved and
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: hear from you.
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's Lilo Brancato, L-I-L-O underscore Brancato, B-R-A, N C
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 3: A T O. I'm basically on Instagram. I do have
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 3: a Facebook, but Facebook, I only posted two videos that
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 3: I already post on Instagram. So I'm like usually much
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 3: more on Instagram, more active on Instagram. Okay.
• 1:07:29
  Speaker 1: And, and the, the content of those talks that you
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: give twice a week is, um, inspirational messages. What, how
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 1: do you find your content? Is it what, is it
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 1: what you're doing in the, in your meetings that week?
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 3: No, no. Sometimes I'll show a video. Maybe I'll come
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 3: up with it. Then I'll have a video that I
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 3: did and then I'll have, I'll play it. But it's
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 3: just stuff that I see in here. Yeah. Like, Oh wow.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: That would, you know, like I not even ask people like,
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 3: do me a favor. Like if you come up with
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 3: something or you think of something, cause it's hard. It's
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 3: not easy to keep coming up with this stuff. And
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 3: then to write it and then to like, make it,
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 3: have it make sense where there's enough information in that one.
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 3: Cause I don't want to make it too long. Make
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 3: it that one minute. It's got to have the beginning,
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 3: middle and end. It's got to have, you know what
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 3: I mean? The right amount of information to where you
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 3: can actually say, I learned something from that video. Not
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 3: that guy just was on there. you know, because he
• 1:08:19
  Speaker 3: likes to hear himself speak. I'm like, I actually look, no,
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 3: but it's, it's not easy.
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, but you do a great job because I've
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: listened to it and I'm like, oh, that just sounded
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 1: like he was talking to me. You know, I think
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: everyone can grab something from it. So I think it's fantastic.
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 3: Thank you.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 1: I really wish you the best. I think you're truly inspirational.
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 1: I think you really are the epitome of somebody who
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 1: has done the work and deserves a second chance and
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: is a lesson in why people should not judge a
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: book by its cover. You should hear your story because
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 1: there's no, you know, people then understand why you were
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 1: doing what you did to get to where you are now.
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 1: And I think that's so important and I love that
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: you're helping others and I can't wait to see what
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 1: you do next. So I really appreciate you being here
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 1: with me today.
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening to Misunderstood. I'm your host,
• 1:09:16
  Speaker 1: Rachel Yucatel. Please be sure to subscribe to the show
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 1: and give us a five-star rating and review. You can
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: support the show by joining our Patreon at patreon.com slash
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: misunderstood with Rachel Yucatel. Do you have ideas for the
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 1: show or want to reach out? Email us at infomisunderstoodpodcast
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 1: at gmail.com. That's spelled M-I-S-S understood. Thank you so much,
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: and I'll see you next time.
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 4: Being a student is expensive. Rent, books, your morning coffee,
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 4: your mid-morning coffee, your I'm-about-to-fall-asleep-in-the-middle-of-a-lecture coffee. So here's something that
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 4: won't break the bank. A subscription to the Irish Times
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 4: for just € 5 a month. Get every article, 165 years
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 4: of journalism, daily puzzles and exclusive newsletters. All for less
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 4: than the price of your daily coffee habit. The Irish
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 4: Times for just € 5 a month. The ultimate student discount.