Latest / Karl and Crew / Being Prepared with an Answer with Abdu Murray; Sharing His Story Through Film with Nick Vujicic; and A Ride to Redemption with Joby Walters

Transcript

Being Prepared with an Answer with Abdu Murray; Sharing His Story Through Film with Nick Vujicic; and A Ride to Redemption with Joby Walters · Karl and Crew

• 0:01
  S1: Coming to you live in studio. It's Carl and crew
• 0:05
  S1: on Moody Radio.
• 0:07
  S2: Well, my friend's husband and her had a bit of
• 0:10
  S2: a dispute. Who was right?
• 0:14
  S3: I'm not getting in the middle of that one. Just
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  S3: to tell you.
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  S2: Not a marital spat, okay? Just a simply difference in
• 0:21
  S2: a difference in understanding. And here is how I became
• 0:24
  S2: involved in that. Was on one of those AAU basketball
• 0:29
  S2: trips with, um, with my, I'm trying to remember which
• 0:33
  S2: kid it was. This was with my daughter. We were
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  S2: on an AAU trip to some place for where you
• 0:38
  S2: go and you stay in a hotel for a couple
• 0:41
  S2: of days. And the kids usually play games all weekend.
• 0:45
  S2: So you're, you're looking at the schedule going, do we
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  S2: have the 8:00 game? AM I going to be dragging
• 0:49
  S2: myself up? Although when everyone else is complaining about the
• 0:52
  S2: 8 a.m. game, you want to know who's not the
• 0:55
  S2: morning radio host? Oh, I'm never complaining about the 8 a.m. game. Why?
• 1:00
  S2: Because I've been up for hours. Well, that's.
• 1:02
  S3: Sleeping in, really, if you think about.
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  S2: It. Exactly.
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  S3: So, okay.
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  S2: So we were this was the evening and they had
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  S2: had games that day. And so the girls were playing
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  S2: in the pool at the hotel, which is a big
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  S2: part of the fun of those trips. The half the
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  S2: fun is the games, and the other half is the
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  S2: craziness that happens in the hotel. They're running around the
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  S2: hallways in your pajamas and your Nike slides going in
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  S2: the pool, knocking on people's doors, just doing stuff that
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  S2: kids do on trips. So they're playing in the pool.
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  S2: And the this other mom and I, we were kind
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  S2: of supervising. So we're sitting in the chairs beside the
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  S2: pool and she, we, we, I don't even remember how
• 1:41
  S2: this came up, but she said that her husband had
• 1:44
  S2: said something about people and she and said that, you know,
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  S2: everyone's a child of God. And so she said, and I,
• 1:57
  S2: I corrected him. I said, well, no, that's not actually true.
• 2:04
  S2: So they were divided on this. The husband said. Everyone's
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  S2: a child of God. Therefore, something had to be true.
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  S2: I don't even remember what the what the qualifier was,
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  S2: but that was where he landed. Everyone's a child of God.
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  S2: And she said, and I told him, no, everyone's not
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  S2: a child of God. And so I said, well, I
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  S2: got a thought on this. So who was right? The
• 2:31
  S2: husband or the wife? Is everyone a child of God?
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  S2: Because that's commonly said, if you've listened to this program
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  S2: for any length of time, you know the answer to
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  S2: this one and you know how strongly I feel about it.
• 2:45
  S2: But this was like, like Carl said, like throwing red meat.
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  S3: Yeah.
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  S2: It's like, this is actually something we talk a lot
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  S2: about on the show. So would you like me to
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  S2: share with you? But before I get to the answer,
• 3:01
  S2: I would love for you to weigh in on this
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  S2: simple little question. Is everyone a child of God or no?
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  S2: What do you say? Text us 800 555 7898. Who
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  S2: was right? Husband or wife? Is everyone a child of
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  S2: God or not? And why is it so important that
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  S2: we know the difference?
• 3:23
  S1: Standing on the rock each and every day. You're listening
• 3:27
  S1: to Carl and Crew.
• 3:29
  S2: Thank you for weighing in on this little, uh, this
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  S2: little divide. And I should emphasize, this was a very
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  S2: friendly disagreement between a husband and wife, where one thought
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  S2: made an off hand comment about everyone being a child
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  S2: of God, and the other said, no, I actually don't
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  S2: think that's true. And so who is right? So many
• 3:50
  S2: of you weighed in on this, and absolutely, the wife
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  S2: was right on this one when she chimed in to say, no,
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  S2: not everyone is a child of God. This is a
• 4:01
  S2: commonly misunderstood one for a couple of reasons, as we've
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  S2: been tackling some of these other things that are often
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  S2: attributed to the Bible that aren't everyone's a child of God,
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  S2: I think is how it's intended. Everyone is loved by God.
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  S2: Everyone has value and in the eyes of God.
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  S3: And created in his image.
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  S2: Image of God. So I think it's often said to
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  S2: intended to mean those things value, worth, love, image bearers,
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  S2: all true. But it is not unloving to make the
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  S2: distinction that in terms of being a child of God,
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  S2: that is not something that happens automatically, and I. Karl says,
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  S2: I'm big on this one and I. I only am
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  S2: because to understand the. God. If you don't understand this,
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  S2: then you'll misunderstand the gospel.
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  S3: Yes.
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  S2: Correct.
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  S3: Yes.
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  S2: So I want to take you to John one. I
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  S2: want to read to you. I'll start with let's see.
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  S2: Let's start with verse nine and go on to verse
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  S2: 13 says, the true light, which gives light to everyone,
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  S2: was coming into the world. He was in the world,
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  S2: and the world was made through him, yet the world
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  S2: did not know him. He came to his own, and
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  S2: his own people did not receive him. But to all
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  S2: who did receive him, who believed in his name, he
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  S2: gave the right to become children of God, who were
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  S2: born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh,
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  S2: nor of the will of man, but of God. But
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  S2: to all who did receive him, verse 12 again, who
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  S2: believed in his name, he gave the right to become
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  S2: children of God. So I want to make a couple
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  S2: of observations on this very simple, very straightforward passage. We
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  S2: see that a couple of things have to happen. First,
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  S2: that becoming a child of God is a right. You
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  S2: have the right to become children of God. Well, who
• 6:01
  S2: determines that? Well, it's according to the will of God. Well, how?
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  S2: How does one become a child of God? How does
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  S2: one obtain that right? To all who receive him. So
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  S2: there's a receiving. And Carl likes to talk about the
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  S2: wide receiver in football.
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  S3: Absolutely.
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  S2: It's not just a wide. Or does he say, whoa,
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  S2: what was what's the word he always uses.
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  S3: Was it the wide receiver. No. It'll come to me.
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  S2: If you've heard Carl talk about this wide receiver. He
• 6:32
  S2: draws a distinction between receiving and something else, and I
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  S2: can't remember. So you need to help me out with
• 6:36
  S2: this one. Text me if you remember it. To all
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  S2: who receive like a receiver brings in the ball, there's
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  S2: a receiving that happens. It's not just a handout. Like
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  S2: it's not just a set of beliefs. Who believed in
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  S2: his name. He gave the right to become children of God.
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  S2: So not everyone is a child of God.
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  S3: No.
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  S2: And if you're not a child of God, what are you?
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  S2: You think about the process by which someone becomes a
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  S2: a citizen of any country. Every country established its own
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  S2: set of protocol rules.
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  S3: The rules.
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  S2: The parameters, the circumstances that make you a citizen. Let's
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  S2: just take of the of the U.S. how does one
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  S2: become a citizen of the U.S.? Well, for the most
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  S2: common way is that you're born here. And if you
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  S2: were born here, then you are a citizen for the
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  S2: most part, right?
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  S3: Yeah.
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  S2: Sometimes through parents.
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  S3: Yes. True.
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  S2: So I have a nephew and now a little niece
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  S2: just born recently. My brother, who's a U.S. citizen born here,
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  S2: now lives abroad. But because of his.
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  S3: Who he is.
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  S2: His citizenship. Yes, his children. Though they live in another country,
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  S2: they have the right to become citizens of the U.S.
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  S2: and then, through naturalization, there's a whole process. When you
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  S2: meet the legal requirements, you can become a citizen. You're
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  S2: given the right to become a citizen of the U.S.
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  S2: until you are a citizen of the U.S., you are
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  S2: not right. And when you become a child of God,
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  S2: you belong to him. Here's the uncomfortable reality. There's not
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  S2: this sort of neutral zone where you don't belong to anybody,
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  S2: where you're kind of an orphan, and then you are
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  S2: adopted into God's family, sort of. But when you read
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  S2: the scripture, when you're not a child of God, you're
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  S2: a child of Satan until you become a child of God.
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  S3: That is so hard to hear.
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  S2: It sounds it sounds harsh, right? Even getting the words out,
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  S2: because you don't want to look around and say that
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  S2: somebody's a child of Satan, because that sounds like a
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  S2: horrible insult. But let's look to the Word of God.
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  S2: This is still in the book of John. John eight.
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  S2: This is Jesus's interaction. He says, he says to them,
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  S2: If God were your father, you would love me, for
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  S2: I have come here from God. I have not come
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  S2: on my own. God sent me. Why is my language
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  S2: not clear to you? Because you were unable to hear
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  S2: what I say. You belong to your father, the devil,
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  S2: and you want to carry out your father's desires. He
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  S2: was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth.
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  S2: For there is no truth in him. You belong to
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  S2: your father, the devil. I mean, it sounds like he's
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  S2: insulting them, but he's. He's just speaking what is true
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  S2: about them? It's the children. When you become a children
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  S2: of a child of God by believing in him, receiving
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  S2: him not just intellectually, not just believing a set of ideas,
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  S2: but through personal relationship with Jesus Christ. You're given all
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  S2: of the rights that come along with being God's kid
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  S2: until you are God's kid. You belong to Satan.
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  S3: Man, that's like a gut punch.
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  S2: Why is it so? Why is it that. Why is
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  S2: this one a hard one to talk about? Because it
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  S2: draws a clear line of distinction. And sometimes we don't
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  S2: really like to do that because as we've talked about
• 10:19
  S2: earlier this week, we talked with Sam Storms about this,
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  S2: how it can things that sound unloving. Sometimes we want
• 10:28
  S2: to assume that they're not true. Like, well, well, God
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  S2: is love. That's absolutely true. God is truth. So truth
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  S2: and love both. God embodies both. So coming up, I
• 10:44
  S2: want to open up the phone lines on this Freedom
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  S2: Friday because that's one of my favorite things to do
• 10:48
  S2: on Fridays is to hear your story. And I want
• 10:51
  S2: to simply ask you, when did you go from being
• 10:55
  S2: a child of Satan to becoming a child of God?
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  S3: Wow.
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  S2: I want to celebrate the fact that we belong to God,
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  S2: because that's a right given to us according to God's will,
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  S2: because we received and we believed in his name. When
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  S2: did you go from becoming a child of Satan? Even
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  S2: if you didn't, even if your life didn't look crazy.
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  S2: It didn't. I'm not saying that you were worshiping Satan.
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  S2: I'm not saying that you were into things that appear
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  S2: to be very dark, but spiritually speaking, you're either a
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  S2: child of Satan or a child of God. When did
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  S2: you go from becoming a child of Satan to becoming
• 11:30
  S2: a child of God? 800 555, 7898. Let's hear some
• 11:36
  S2: testimonies this morning. I would love, love, love to talk
• 11:39
  S2: to you. 805 5557898. What an absolute privilege to be
• 11:46
  S2: called a child of God. First John three one says this.
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  S2: See what kind of love the father has given to us,
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  S2: that we should be called children of God, and so
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  S2: we are. Want to jump down to verse ten. This
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  S2: is now first John 310. By this it is evident
• 12:04
  S2: who are the children of God, and who are the
• 12:06
  S2: children of the devil? Whoever does not practice righteousness is
• 12:10
  S2: not of God, nor is the one who does not
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  S2: love his brother. When we belong to God, we have
• 12:15
  S2: the ability not to live a sinless, perfect life. We
• 12:19
  S2: know that we are being sanctified. We are being perfected.
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  S2: But when we belong to God, we have the ability
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  S2: to have victory over sin to overcome. So we belong
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  S2: to him, or we belong to Satan. And there's no
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  S2: in between. That's clear in scripture. And so I wanted
• 12:40
  S2: to ask you this morning on this Freedom Friday, let's celebrate.
• 12:44
  S2: When did you go from becoming a child of Satan
• 12:46
  S2: to being adopted into God's family, becoming his kid? 800 555, 7898. J.
• 12:55
  S2: Calling in this morning from Hernando, Florida. Tell me, when
• 12:58
  S2: did you go from becoming a child of Satan to
• 13:00
  S2: becoming a child of God?
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  S4: Yeah. Good morning. Um, my born again date was November
• 13:07
  S4: the 11th of 2007. And, um, I was, uh, a
• 13:13
  S4: lifelong battle with, um, a lot of negatives and it
• 13:18
  S4: led to suicidal tendencies. And just, I had a, I
• 13:21
  S4: had a moment where I was reflecting on life and
• 13:24
  S4: I just, you know, said, God, if you're there, I
• 13:27
  S4: need to know, I need you to show me in
• 13:30
  S4: such a way that that no one, no thing, not
• 13:32
  S4: even myself and my own, you know, deceiving ways which
• 13:36
  S4: I learned to know later. You know, nothing would take
• 13:39
  S4: that away from me. And he did. He came to
• 13:41
  S4: me through his word. He showed me his truth. And
• 13:44
  S4: and that was the beginning of, of 20 years. Now that,
• 13:49
  S4: as I mentioned, uh, before, you know, the battle rages on.
• 13:54
  S4: But as you just also stated that it's, it's in
• 13:58
  S4: his word and it's in his truth and his revealing.
• 14:01
  S4: It's not on my part. It's not on anything that
• 14:04
  S4: anyone or anything else could ever try to defer what
• 14:08
  S4: he has said. And so he has called me his
• 14:11
  S4: son through his word and through the the ways that,
• 14:14
  S4: you know, I've turned my life over to him. It
• 14:16
  S4: hasn't been perfect. It's not been easy. And I don't
• 14:19
  S4: think it ever will be until we're with him just
• 14:21
  S4: because this life is made to have that. But as
• 14:24
  S4: Jesus said, we can be of good cheer because he
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  S4: has overcome the world and we can trust in that.
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  S4: So that was the that was the moment that life
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  S4: changed for me to all measures. and in all circumstances.
• 14:37
  S4: And and I know that. And that's what has overwhelmed
• 14:40
  S4: me this morning just by catching your program.
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  S2: Yeah. Jay, thank you so much from Florida. So appreciate
• 14:45
  S2: your call. Great reflections there. And you just think it
• 14:50
  S2: let that hit you this morning. What a privilege it
• 14:53
  S2: is to be called a child of God. I mean,
• 14:56
  S2: that is not something to be taken lightly. Thanks for
• 14:59
  S2: your call. I want to go back to to the phones.
• 15:01
  S2: We've got John calling in from right here in Chicago. John,
• 15:05
  S2: when did you become a child of God?
• 15:07
  S5: Um, in 1993, I was at work, uh, in the
• 15:11
  S5: back of a car, and we didn't know if we
• 15:12
  S5: were going to work. And I got into the car.
• 15:14
  S5: I grew up as a Catholic, but never really went
• 15:16
  S5: to church. And, um, and then I was hearing him
• 15:19
  S5: talk to another guy about Christ and he was, and
• 15:22
  S5: I started asking questions. He passed me back the Bible
• 15:24
  S5: and it literally took me 15 minutes. I was broken
• 15:26
  S5: because of all my teenage years of anxiety and all that.
• 15:29
  S5: And then I, I was ready and he, he gave
• 15:32
  S5: me this opportunity to invite Christ in my life. And
• 15:34
  S5: and I did. And then I just remember the first
• 15:38
  S5: few days, I remember just like seeing that guy and
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  S5: he almost had a glow around him. I just wanted
• 15:42
  S5: to sit near him. And then I just would be
• 15:44
  S5: I was getting discipled from him and going to church.
• 15:47
  S5: But I just like, I remember just God showing me things.
• 15:49
  S5: I remember it was like, I felt like the birds
• 15:51
  S5: were singing, you know, like the next few weeks. I mean, and,
• 15:54
  S5: and I just was like, I, I was, you know,
• 15:56
  S5: like I was realizing, hey, I shouldn't disrespect my dad.
• 15:59
  S5: And slowly but surely God was speaking into my heart and.
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  S3: I.
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  S5: Started to take off. I was so hungry. I didn't
• 16:05
  S5: know anything about the Bible, but I, I just grew
• 16:07
  S5: and grew and grew, you know?
• 16:08
  S2: Yeah. John, thank you so much from Chicago. Appreciate your
• 16:12
  S2: call this morning. Uh, Dana, first time caller from Fort Myers. Myers, Florida.
• 16:16
  S2: When did you go from being a child of Satan?
• 16:19
  S2: As hard as that sounds, it was spiritually true of you.
• 16:22
  S2: Of me? How did you become a child of God?
• 16:26
  S6: Well, I wanted to know God in a personal way.
• 16:29
  S6: I always wondered, why did Christ die? I didn't understand
• 16:32
  S6: why he died. And I want to know him in
• 16:34
  S6: a personal way. So I went out and I bought
• 16:36
  S6: a living Bible, and I couldn't understand that. And then
• 16:40
  S6: I started to go to a few churches and I
• 16:42
  S6: said there was no God was not there. It was
• 16:45
  S6: just kind of a dead church. And then the Lord
• 16:48
  S6: brought two ladies to my house. We sat and we
• 16:51
  S6: had tea. They never mentioned Christ. They never mentioned the gospel.
• 16:54
  S6: But before they left, they left me a gospel tract.
• 16:58
  S6: And I read that gospel track about 15 times and
• 17:01
  S6: still couldn't understand. And, and so I said, Lord, help
• 17:05
  S6: me understand what you want me to understand. And at
• 17:08
  S6: the back of that gospel track was a prayer. And
• 17:10
  S6: I knew I was supposed to say that prayer from
• 17:12
  S6: my heart, which I did. And it was October 11th, 1976,
• 17:17
  S6: at 445 in the afternoon that Jesus Christ saved my soul.
• 17:21
  S2: Yeah. Dana, thank you so much. First time caller from
• 17:25
  S2: Fort Myers, Florida. Wow. Beautiful story. Uh, Brian from Silas,
• 17:30
  S2: Alabama calling in this morning. Thanks for calling in, Brian.
• 17:33
  S2: When did you go from being a child of Satan
• 17:35
  S2: to becoming a child of God?
• 17:38
  S7: Uh. Good morning. In 1998, I was married with one child. Uh,
• 17:46
  S7: doing our own way. Me and my wife both. And
• 17:49
  S7: God found me in my lowest part. In my mire.
• 17:55
  S7: In the bedroom of the home we was living in.
• 17:59
  S7: Face down in some forest green carpet. Just bawling. I
• 18:04
  S7: come to Christ there. And later me and my wife,
• 18:08
  S7: we both joined our local church. Uh, my wife saved.
• 18:12
  S7: All my children are saved. Now, we are currently very
• 18:18
  S7: active in the church. I'm a deacon, uh, my wife,
• 18:21
  S7: a Sunday school teacher. I'm a discipleship training teacher.
• 18:24
  S2: Yeah.
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  S7: The Lord's done amazing things for us.
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  S2: Yeah. Brian, thank you so much for your call. You know,
• 18:31
  S2: the beautiful thing is, is even each time I say it,
• 18:34
  S2: the words, it's hard to to get out say that
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  S2: someone we were once children of Satan. But I think
• 18:41
  S2: it's important that we are reminded of that this morning,
• 18:44
  S2: of the privilege it is to be a child of
• 18:46
  S2: God that that's not that's not automatic. It wasn't our effort.
• 18:50
  S2: It wasn't our striving. We can't. Nobody's born a child
• 18:54
  S2: of God. It's not by birthright. It's not by human effort.
• 18:58
  S2: It's by the will of God. When we believe and
• 19:01
  S2: we receive him, that's when we're given that right. And
• 19:04
  S2: so I want to speak to you this morning. Maybe
• 19:06
  S2: you're a little uncomfortable because you you're not a child
• 19:10
  S2: of God. And now you're hearing me say that that
• 19:13
  S2: means you're a child of Satan. The beautiful thing is
• 19:16
  S2: you don't have to stay there. And there's not some
• 19:19
  S2: long to become a U.S. citizen to be given the
• 19:22
  S2: right to become a citizen of this country. It can
• 19:24
  S2: be a very lengthy process. There's not some long process
• 19:28
  S2: for you to go through to become a child of God.
• 19:33
  S2: You have to do a couple of things. By the
• 19:36
  S2: power of the Holy Spirit, you're seeing some things more clearly.
• 19:40
  S2: You're seeing your sin. You're seeing that you are separated
• 19:43
  S2: from God. Those are spiritual realities. We're born with our
• 19:47
  S2: back to God. We're born trying, bent on going our
• 19:50
  S2: own way from the very beginning. Sin is the default
• 19:53
  S2: that we are not born good. We are born into sin.
• 19:58
  S2: But here's the thing. If you are ready to confess
• 20:00
  S2: that you are a sinner, that you need a Savior,
• 20:04
  S2: and that it's not just some higher power, that it's
• 20:08
  S2: through Jesus Christ alone that we are given this right
• 20:11
  S2: to become children of God, then you can become a
• 20:14
  S2: child of God today. You can be adopted into into
• 20:18
  S2: God's family as one of his kids. Today. Right now.
• 20:23
  S2: But count the cost. Count the cost because this isn't
• 20:27
  S2: a light thing. This is giving the totality of your
• 20:31
  S2: life all of who you are to him. It's the
• 20:35
  S2: best life you can imagine. But I don't want to
• 20:38
  S2: tell you that somehow it's an easy life. Because there's
• 20:42
  S2: a war. There's a war at work. There's a war
• 20:46
  S2: that's going to want to pull you back toward the darkness.
• 20:48
  S2: But when you belong to God, he's got you. So
• 20:51
  S2: if today you know a few things, maybe for the
• 20:54
  S2: first time, you're a sinner, that you need a savior
• 20:59
  S2: and that you know that it's Jesus that you believe
• 21:03
  S2: he went to the cross for you because you needed it,
• 21:07
  S2: I needed it. He died a gruesome, horrific death, but
• 21:12
  S2: then was raised on the third day. And because he
• 21:16
  S2: defeated death, we do too. My body will die. Your
• 21:21
  S2: body will die. But we die once we die, and
• 21:26
  S2: then we are ushered into eternal life where we never
• 21:31
  S2: have to be separated from God again. So today you
• 21:35
  S2: want to become a child of God. So by the
• 21:38
  S2: power of the Holy Spirit that that happens, I want
• 21:41
  S2: you to have an honest conversation with God. There's no
• 21:45
  S2: special prayer to pray. You don't have to be in
• 21:48
  S2: in a church or with a pastor. You have that
• 21:51
  S2: honest conversation with God where you cry out to him
• 21:55
  S2: and you tell him, I'm a sinner. I know it,
• 21:57
  S2: I repent, I turn from the way that I'm going,
• 22:01
  S2: and now I follow you. I believe, and I receive.
• 22:07
  S2: I said earlier that Karl often draws a distinction between
• 22:10
  S2: two things, and he uses a football metaphor. Thanks for
• 22:13
  S2: those who helped me out on this one. It's not
• 22:15
  S2: a wide acceptor. It's not just a belief, a set
• 22:20
  S2: of beliefs. It's a receiving to those who believe, to
• 22:25
  S2: all who did receive him, who believed in his name,
• 22:28
  S2: he gave the right to become children of God. So
• 22:31
  S2: if that's you, have that honest conversation with God. And
• 22:35
  S2: I want to pray for you. Lord, I thank you
• 22:38
  S2: that today you are welcoming new members into your family.
• 22:43
  S2: I thank you that you desire that all would come
• 22:46
  S2: to know you. We're born into sin, but God, there's this,
• 22:53
  S2: this void, this hole that only you can fill. And
• 22:58
  S2: for the person today who's turning to you, who's turning
• 23:01
  S2: from their sin, who's repenting, who's now receiving you, God,
• 23:07
  S2: I pray that you would keep them, protect them. God,
• 23:11
  S2: give them great joy. I pray that by the power
• 23:14
  S2: of your spirit this would all make sense to them.
• 23:17
  S2: It would be clear, as clear as can be. God,
• 23:20
  S2: despite my feeble words, Lord. There would be a complete
• 23:24
  S2: clarity in this moment. Lord, that you are doing a
• 23:28
  S2: new thing, that you are adopting them into your family,
• 23:32
  S2: that today they no longer are a child of Satan.
• 23:35
  S2: They belong to you. I thank you, Lord for that
• 23:38
  S2: privilege of being called your kid. Bless this person God,
• 23:43
  S2: whose turning to you, thank you that you adopt us
• 23:47
  S2: into your family. What a gracious God you are. In
• 23:50
  S2: Jesus name, Amen. If that's you, I've got something I
• 23:55
  S2: want to send you. Today. You became a child of God.
• 23:58
  S2: We got to send you something so we can celebrate.
• 24:00
  S2: We can welcome you into the family. Just text the
• 24:02
  S2: word new to 805 557898. Get this resource from us.
• 24:08
  S2: Just text new. You're becoming a child of God today.
• 24:11
  S2: Text new to 805 557898. Welcome to the family.
• 24:17
  S1: Tune in whenever you like. Check out the Cast and
• 24:20
  S1: Crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 24:23
  S2: Well, it is not often that you get to feature
• 24:26
  S2: a story of someone who was once an enforcer for
• 24:30
  S2: the Hells Angels Motorcycle Club. I don't even know where
• 24:34
  S2: to start. George Jobey Walters joining us right now. He
• 24:39
  S2: has a memoir out Cut Free A Hells Angels Ride
• 24:43
  S2: to Redemption. Where do we start? Jobey. How in the
• 24:47
  S2: world did you get into this motorcycle life? You loved
• 24:49
  S2: the bikes or you loved everything that came with it.
• 24:52
  S8: Young man. Nelsonville, Ohio in school, working his way through
• 24:56
  S8: pumping gas into motorcycles, got a motorcycle and rode myself
• 24:59
  S8: to school. And then a young man that stepped on
• 25:01
  S8: a Greyhound bus with a handshake from his father, headed
• 25:04
  S8: off to the army, looking at him and saying, be
• 25:06
  S8: a man. And that man came back and, uh, what
• 25:10
  S8: he could identify with was where family, where's love? What
• 25:14
  S8: do I have? I have nothing, I need to find it.
• 25:17
  S8: And I got on a motorcycle and that's when it began.
• 25:21
  S8: And it was a 40 year run, a 40 year
• 25:24
  S8: run on that bike. And I give it up in
• 25:26
  S8: Arizona and identified as a cowboy. It was a rough time.
• 25:30
  S8: It was a tough time.
• 25:32
  S2: Yeah. So, Joby, let me jump in here. So what
• 25:35
  S2: did the motorcycle gang. The motorcycle club? I don't even
• 25:38
  S2: know what word you'd use for it. But loyalty was
• 25:41
  S2: important to you. Did it feel like that was the
• 25:43
  S2: place where you found belonging? Where you found freedom, where
• 25:46
  S2: you found some sense of family despite some of the
• 25:49
  S2: darkness associated with it?
• 25:51
  S8: Yes, yes I did when I ran into the Hells
• 25:53
  S8: Angels again. You know, after being a cowboy, a packer,
• 25:57
  S8: a guide, a wrangler in one of the best, you know.
• 26:00
  S8: And I just thought I wanted to build a motorcycle again.
• 26:02
  S8: And that's the only thing that ran me into Hells Angels.
• 26:05
  S8: An old friend, that friend knew my past. Knew other
• 26:07
  S8: clubs that I'd run with on my journey. I was
• 26:10
  S8: still searching for that family and that identity. I could
• 26:14
  S8: identify with it. Yeah, I had brotherhood for a while,
• 26:16
  S8: I thought I did. But there's men out there that
• 26:19
  S8: don't need that patch on their back. They're too scared
• 26:21
  S8: to get away with it. But others, when you come
• 26:24
  S8: back to that table, the politics within the fighting, within
• 26:29
  S8: the fighting outside prison. I got tired of it. And
• 26:32
  S8: I tried to outrun a lot of things. And I
• 26:35
  S8: outrun the Lord for 40 years.
• 26:37
  S2: Yeah.
• 26:38
  S8: And in my book, you have but God with Ephesians
• 26:41
  S8: two one through ten. And underneath that, the box which
• 26:45
  S8: saved my life, that was the spark that lighted the
• 26:48
  S8: fire in me. I knew I wanted to get out.
• 26:51
  S2: Yeah. Job, you mentioned that you incarceration. You spent some
• 26:54
  S2: time in prison. You had been running, running from God.
• 26:57
  S2: But on the run from the law also. And then
• 27:00
  S2: you mentioned a box that someone sent to you that
• 27:03
  S2: your lifelong friend sent to you while you were in prison.
• 27:07
  S2: Tell me what was in that box.
• 27:10
  S8: I'll tell you what it was before prison. It was
• 27:12
  S8: when I when I was running, I was running from ATF, U.S.
• 27:15
  S8: marshals and Lord. And my intention was to outrun all
• 27:19
  S8: of them. And Tom said, George, how do I get
• 27:22
  S8: Ahold of you? You know, Tom sent me a box.
• 27:26
  S8: I opened that box and it changed my life right there.
• 27:29
  S8: But when I opened that Tom's Bible there in the
• 27:31
  S8: literature in it that a lot of people dedicated themselves to,
• 27:34
  S8: to send with him tape player cassettes. I opened it,
• 27:38
  S8: I looked up and said, I'm with you, Lord. I'll
• 27:40
  S8: follow you. And that was my calling. When I came
• 27:43
  S8: back to face my stuff and got caught, half million
• 27:47
  S8: dollar bail, you know I was in trouble. But I
• 27:50
  S8: took the Lord to prison with me. I didn't find
• 27:52
  S8: him in there. And that's what that box did for me.
• 27:55
  S8: That's what Tom did for me.
• 27:56
  S2: Yeah. So once you you said you. It's interesting. You
• 27:59
  S2: said you didn't find him in prison. You took him
• 28:01
  S2: to prison. So you didn't run when you were intercepted
• 28:05
  S2: by the FBI. How long did you spend in prison?
• 28:08
  S8: I did two and a half years, and I thought more.
• 28:11
  S8: I thought they were going to nail me, I wouldn't talk.
• 28:13
  S8: I didn't tell them nothing. I went to prison by myself,
• 28:15
  S8: but I had quit. I had dropped that identity. And
• 28:19
  S8: what happened was the judge looked at me and I
• 28:21
  S8: turned around and looked at the three Hells Angels in
• 28:23
  S8: the back room that come to see what's going on.
• 28:25
  S8: And I pointed my finger at him and I said,
• 28:27
  S8: I'm done. Leave me alone. I'm finished. And I turned
• 28:30
  S8: to the judge and I said, I don't want to
• 28:33
  S8: hurt anybody anymore. I'm guilty. And he told me, he said, Joby,
• 28:38
  S8: he said you were in a no no win situation
• 28:40
  S8: from the get go. And I looked up and I said,
• 28:42
  S8: Praise God, I knew I won, I knew I had won. Yeah,
• 28:46
  S8: I was at peace when I went to prison for
• 28:48
  S8: two and a half years instead of 8 or 9,
• 28:51
  S8: and other things had been dropped from me on, on
• 28:53
  S8: the ATF raids and the Lofton incident, you know, charges
• 28:56
  S8: were dropped. I had little time. It's amazing.
• 28:59
  S3: Yeah.
• 29:00
  S8: God, what God can do. And I preached in prison.
• 29:02
  S8: I was a peace in there.
• 29:04
  S2: George Jobey Walters with us right now. His book Cut
• 29:07
  S2: Free A Hells Angels Ride to Redemption. You know, your
• 29:10
  S2: story is remarkable. You have a passion now, a mission
• 29:14
  S2: to reach people who were once like you were, especially
• 29:18
  S2: those in prison. Why is your heart so tender toward
• 29:20
  S2: those who have been incarcerated?
• 29:22
  S8: Because they're searching for something. And what I searched for,
• 29:26
  S8: why I went where I went and joined, what I joined,
• 29:29
  S8: and the darkness, you know, that was in it. And
• 29:32
  S8: here's what they're looking for. There's three things. And everybody
• 29:35
  S8: out there is they want love. They want respect. And
• 29:39
  S8: by all, they want forgiveness. And I can agree with
• 29:42
  S8: that because I was looking for that love and every
• 29:45
  S8: room I ever walked into with a patch on or not. Today,
• 29:47
  S8: because of the glow of God in my face, I
• 29:50
  S8: want respect and the Lord has had me forgiveness. He's
• 29:53
  S8: blessed me with grace, with faith, and I'm looking at
• 29:57
  S8: how he does me with mercy. Today. I'm looking at
• 30:00
  S8: him for that and he's given it to me.
• 30:02
  S2: Yeah, you're a different man now, aren't you, Toby? You
• 30:06
  S2: still got still have a little wild man in you.
• 30:08
  S2: But it's a redeemed wild man, right?
• 30:10
  S8: Yes it is. You know, we all sinned in the day.
• 30:13
  S8: I talked to the Lord every day and clear out
• 30:15
  S8: on a ranch. I smile now I'm happy about this book.
• 30:19
  S8: But where I live, I ask the Lord, this way
• 30:21
  S8: out there. I'm off the grid with my horses and hounds.
• 30:23
  S8: And I take care of the middle of a ranch.
• 30:26
  S8: And I ask God, why clear out here? And I
• 30:28
  S8: look across what God gave me, and I ask him,
• 30:30
  S8: why out here? Why way out here? With everything I
• 30:32
  S8: got going on in my message. And the Lord told me,
• 30:35
  S8: he said, so you'll get to know me better.
• 30:37
  S2: Wow.
• 30:38
  S8: Yes, and I do.
• 30:40
  S2: The book is called Cut Free A Hell's Angels Ride
• 30:42
  S2: to Redemption. George Jobey Walters, our guest. If you want more,
• 30:46
  S2: just text cut to 805 557898. Text cut 805 557898. Jody,
• 30:57
  S2: so appreciate your time this morning.
• 31:00
  S1: Get to know the team behind the scenes. Follow Carl
• 31:03
  S1: and crew on Facebook and Instagram.
• 31:06
  S2: Well, you know, when I was a kid and didn't
• 31:09
  S2: have a lot of wisdom, I remember there was this
• 31:12
  S2: talk show that was popular. And, you know, I'm almost
• 31:16
  S2: ashamed to admit that I kind of enjoyed this show
• 31:19
  S2: because it was, but it was I mean, it was trash.
• 31:23
  S2: And one of the big things that they would do
• 31:25
  S2: on this show is they would do paternity tests. And
• 31:29
  S2: so people would come on. I'm not going to say
• 31:31
  S2: the name of the show, but you probably know which one.
• 31:33
  S2: People would come on and they would have these dramatic
• 31:36
  S2: reveals of you are not the father or you are
• 31:40
  S2: the father.
• 31:41
  S3: Father. Yes.
• 31:42
  S2: And it was and there was always a lot of emotion.
• 31:44
  S2: And it was of course, dramatized for, for daytime trash TV.
• 31:49
  S3: Yes. Of course.
• 31:50
  S2: But the anguish of not knowing who you belong to
• 31:56
  S2: is real. Many people live with that. Maybe not knowing
• 32:02
  S2: who their father was or knowing who their father was,
• 32:05
  S2: but not having a relationship. And so that how much
• 32:09
  S2: more so is the not knowing who you belong to spiritually.
• 32:12
  S2: And that's a real that's a real thing when you
• 32:15
  S2: wrestle with do I, my child of Satan, or am
• 32:18
  S2: I a child of God? We've got a resource that
• 32:22
  S2: we made available. We've made available many times, and I
• 32:25
  S2: want to I want to give it to you today.
• 32:27
  S2: It's nine ways to know that you stand with God
• 32:29
  S2: and God stands with you. If you've wrestled with do
• 32:32
  S2: I am. AM I a child of God? Do I
• 32:34
  S2: belong to him? How can I be sure this is
• 32:38
  S2: this may not settle it completely for you, but this
• 32:41
  S2: is going to give you a good biblical place for
• 32:43
  S2: how to wrestle with that. Nine Ways to Know You
• 32:45
  S2: stand with God. He stands with you. Just text the
• 32:48
  S2: word stand. I'll send it to you. Text stand STAND,
• 32:51
  S2: stand to 805 557898. Just text the word stand 805 557898.
• 33:01
  S1: Tune in whenever you like. Check out the Cast and
• 33:04
  S1: Crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 33:07
  S2: Why do you believe what you believe? Think about it.
• 33:11
  S2: The why we used to in the studio. For years
• 33:14
  S2: we had this big. We got these.
• 33:16
  S3: Letters.
• 33:17
  S2: Is it in there now?
• 33:18
  S3: They're hanging here in the engineering. Oh, yeah. We keep
• 33:20
  S3: them up. We keeping those letters up?
• 33:22
  S2: You used to be in the in our in our
• 33:24
  S2: studio where we have the microphones. Um then there's on
• 33:27
  S2: the other side of the glass, we have a studio
• 33:29
  S2: where the engineering happens. So we're, we're facing each other,
• 33:33
  S2: but we're in separate rooms. So I guess this why
• 33:35
  S2: is now in the, in the control room and it's
• 33:38
  S2: a big w h why separate letters, big block letters
• 33:42
  S2: that Carl wanted because he wanted to keep that question
• 33:47
  S2: constantly in front of us. Because it's very easy to
• 33:50
  S2: forget the why, to get to the what, the how,
• 33:54
  S2: the when, but to miss the why.
• 33:56
  S3: And to and to make sure you know the why.
• 33:59
  S3: You understand the why.
• 34:00
  S2: So back to my question. Why do you believe what
• 34:04
  S2: you do? Why are you a Christian? Far too many
• 34:09
  S2: people answer that question by saying things like, well, I
• 34:14
  S2: was raised in a Christian home. Yeah, well, I've always
• 34:17
  S2: gone to church. Can I say lovingly that those aren't
• 34:23
  S2: compelling answers? For what? Why? You're a Christian now. Being
• 34:28
  S2: born and raised in a Christian home is an awesome thing.
• 34:31
  S2: I was born and raised in a Christian home.
• 34:33
  S3: Yeah, great.
• 34:35
  S2: That's awesome. If you spend a lot of time in
• 34:37
  S2: church growing up, awesome, that can help set a real foundation.
• 34:42
  S2: But why are you a Christian? Would you be a
• 34:47
  S2: Christian if you lived in another part of the world
• 34:49
  S2: where you grew up? Not going to a church, but
• 34:52
  S2: going to a mosque or a temple? Persecution because we
• 34:57
  S2: want our answer to transcend Cultural norms, family expectations. This
• 35:04
  S2: is what we've always done. Why are you a Christian?
• 35:09
  S2: We're going to feature a testimony this morning from somebody
• 35:11
  S2: who I respected deeply. I've had many great conversations on
• 35:15
  S2: the show with Abdu Murray. He was born and raised
• 35:19
  S2: in a Muslim culture, and he was devout.
• 35:24
  S3: Proud, Muslim.
• 35:25
  S2: Proud.
• 35:25
  S3: Muslim. He says that.
• 35:26
  S2: And he had thought through pretty deeply why he was
• 35:31
  S2: a Muslim. And so when he started to ask Christians
• 35:34
  S2: why they were Christians, he found their answers pretty uncompelling
• 35:42
  S2: pretty weak. And he admits now that he's been on
• 35:46
  S2: this journey, that he even had a sense of kind
• 35:49
  S2: of a pride of shutting them down a little bit
• 35:52
  S2: because he recognized they hadn't thought through very deeply why
• 35:55
  S2: they believed what they believed.
• 35:57
  S3: Exactly.
• 35:57
  S2: And in fact, they had a hard time even articulating
• 36:00
  S2: when pressed what they believed coming up. He took it
• 36:06
  S2: took him nine years to become a Christian after being
• 36:11
  S2: a Muslim for most of his life. He said not
• 36:15
  S2: because it took me nine years to discover what was
• 36:18
  S2: true once I really started an honest search. But because
• 36:22
  S2: it took me nine years to wrestle with what accepting
• 36:25
  S2: what I knew to be true was going to mean
• 36:28
  S2: for the rest of my life. My family. My culture.
• 36:33
  S2: Cool testimony coming up from Abdu Murray on this Freedom Friday.
• 36:37
  S1: It's Carl and crew on Moody Radio.
• 36:41
  S3: Are you prepared.
• 36:42
  S2: To make a defense of the faith, to give a
• 36:44
  S2: reason for the hope that you have in Christ? This
• 36:47
  S2: comes out of First Peter 315. It can feel a
• 36:50
  S2: little intimidating. You can feel like I never went to
• 36:53
  S2: Bible school. I don't have any kind of like formal training.
• 36:57
  S2: So being prepared to make a defense sounds like some
• 37:00
  S2: sort of, like, courtroom thing. Is that possible for the
• 37:03
  S2: average person? Got a special guest joining us. He's become
• 37:07
  S2: a favorite here in Carlin crew. Abdu Murray, he's a speaker.
• 37:09
  S2: He's an author. He's president of Embrace the Truth. The
• 37:13
  S2: most of his life. He was a proud Muslim until
• 37:15
  S2: a nine year journey investigation pointed him to the Christian faith. Abdu,
• 37:21
  S2: thanks for being with us again. In your own story.
• 37:24
  S2: You obviously did not know this verse, but you wanted
• 37:28
  S2: to be someone who had a good, clear reason as
• 37:30
  S2: to why you believed what you believed. Is that accurate?
• 37:34
  S9: Oh, that's absolutely accurate. In fact, when I was asking
• 37:37
  S9: Christians why they were Christians, when I was a Muslim,
• 37:40
  S9: they didn't give me reasons. They just gave me like
• 37:42
  S9: sort of history, like, oh, why we go to the
• 37:44
  S9: Presbyterian Church on Christmas and Easter. So I guess I'm
• 37:46
  S9: a Presbyterian. And I thought to myself, well, you don't
• 37:50
  S9: do that with anything in your life. You don't prepare
• 37:52
  S9: for school that way. You don't prepare for your job
• 37:55
  S9: or retirement or your marriage without thinking about it. Why
• 37:59
  S9: wouldn't you think through your eternity with that? And along
• 38:03
  S9: the way, there were Christians who actually were prepared to
• 38:06
  S9: share their faith. And they did. And they did it
• 38:08
  S9: not only intellectually, but also emotionally compelling ways where they
• 38:13
  S9: married the two things together. And although it took me
• 38:16
  S9: nine years, it wasn't because the answers were hard to find.
• 38:18
  S9: It's because the answers were hard to accept. But the
• 38:21
  S9: answers were there. And I think God, for those Christians who, uh,
• 38:27
  S9: were prepared to share their faith because they encountered someone
• 38:29
  S9: like me who needed reasons, not just emotions, but also reasons.
• 38:33
  S9: And I do believe those things walk hand in hand.
• 38:35
  S9: And the good news is the Christian faith offers you both.
• 38:37
  S2: Yeah. Now, when you look at your own journey, you know,
• 38:39
  S2: it's interesting that you noted that there were historical reasons
• 38:43
  S2: that Christians gave, if you were honest. I mean, how
• 38:47
  S2: much of what of your commitment to your Islamic faith
• 38:51
  S2: was rooted in tradition and cultural belief as well.
• 38:55
  S9: Yeah. And that was the thing that that I was
• 38:57
  S9: confronted with when I started to read the Bible, I
• 38:59
  S9: came across a passage where John the Baptist is challenging
• 39:03
  S9: people in Luke chapter three with the commensurate count in
• 39:05
  S9: Matthew chapter three, where John the Baptist is saying, look,
• 39:09
  S9: tradition doesn't save you guys. Truth is what saves. And
• 39:12
  S9: the truth is, is that Jesus is who he says
• 39:14
  S9: he was and these kind of things. Well, that challenged
• 39:17
  S9: me because I was asking Christians, why are you a Christian?
• 39:19
  S9: They'd say tradition. I'd say, not good enough. But then
• 39:22
  S9: John the Baptist actually, as I was reading this book,
• 39:25
  S9: not to believe a word of it, really, but reading
• 39:27
  S9: this book, he challenged me, why are you a Muslim?
• 39:30
  S9: And I had put Christians on the defensive for so
• 39:32
  S9: long that many of them hadn't actually had that chance
• 39:35
  S9: to ask me that. Had they asked me, I would
• 39:37
  S9: have gone into, oh, this is why I believe the
• 39:39
  S9: Quran wasn't changed. And this is why I believe Islam
• 39:42
  S9: is the greatest religion in the history of the world. Um,
• 39:45
  S9: but the real reason fundamentally was because I was raised
• 39:50
  S9: that way. And so I found reasons to justify my
• 39:53
  S9: belief that the question I had in my in my
• 39:55
  S9: own heart was, do I have enough good reasons or
• 39:59
  S9: do I just want this to be true? Um, and
• 40:02
  S9: I went on a long journey to find out if
• 40:04
  S9: it's true, not just do I want it to be true.
• 40:06
  S9: And the good news is, is that I found the truth.
• 40:08
  S9: The bad news was in the interim was that it
• 40:10
  S9: wasn't the thing I was raised in. But hallelujah. Honestly,
• 40:14
  S9: I the struggle was worth it. Um, and if you're,
• 40:17
  S9: if anybody is sitting there and they're doubting and they're wondering,
• 40:19
  S9: do I believe this because I'm supposed to. Let's say
• 40:21
  S9: you're a Christian. You're wondering the same question, do I
• 40:23
  S9: believe it because I'm supposed to don't believe it because
• 40:26
  S9: it's true. And the reality is when you look, you
• 40:28
  S9: will find a lot of answers for your questions.
• 40:31
  S2: You know, that's so reassuring to for someone to hear,
• 40:34
  S2: I'm sure, because any sort of doubts can feel so
• 40:38
  S2: unnerving when you go, why do I believe? Maybe you're
• 40:42
  S2: you're listening and you're wrestling with that right now and
• 40:44
  S2: feeling like I don't I maybe I don't have good reasons.
• 40:47
  S2: And it's, I'm glad that you give the encouragement to,
• 40:50
  S2: to not to shrink back from those doubts. Don't try
• 40:52
  S2: to stuff them away and say, okay, I'm just I
• 40:55
  S2: don't want to think about it. I don't want to wrestle.
• 40:58
  S2: I want to just kind of stay in this place
• 40:59
  S2: that I've been. But the wrestling is, is where we
• 41:02
  S2: gain confidence, right?
• 41:04
  S9: Absolutely. 100%. I mean, look, doubt is not this dirty word.
• 41:08
  S9: I know that the Bible says anything is not of faith,
• 41:10
  S9: is sin, but doubt is not the the opposite of faith.
• 41:14
  S9: Distrust is the opposite of faith. Cynicism can be the
• 41:17
  S9: opposite of faith. But doubt, if it drives us to
• 41:19
  S9: actually find answers, is a good thing. John the Baptist,
• 41:22
  S9: who was the forerunner of Jesus, who was so destined
• 41:25
  S9: to be the forerunner of Jesus that when he wasn't
• 41:27
  S9: even born yet, when he came into contact, into proximity
• 41:31
  S9: with Jesus, even when Jesus wasn't born yet, John left
• 41:34
  S9: in his in his mother's womb. That's how close he
• 41:37
  S9: was to Jesus. And yet, when things get hairy in
• 41:40
  S9: his life and he is imprisoned for doing the right thing, um,
• 41:45
  S9: and he's facing beheading. He sends his disciples to ask Jesus,
• 41:48
  S9: are you the one who is to come, or should
• 41:50
  S9: we look for another? In other words, John had doubts
• 41:53
  S9: and Jesus doesn't say, you go tell that faithless, lousy,
• 41:56
  S9: heartless cousin of mine. He doesn't do that. He says,
• 41:58
  S9: go and tell John what you see and hear. In
• 42:00
  S9: other words, go give John the evidence he needs to
• 42:03
  S9: bolster his faith. Then Jesus compliments John on being a person,
• 42:07
  S9: that there's been no greater man born among women than
• 42:09
  S9: John the Baptist. So even though John had expressed doubt,
• 42:13
  S9: Jesus rewarded his sincere question with evidence and with reasons.
• 42:18
  S9: And so if John the Baptist can have his moments,
• 42:21
  S9: we can have our moments too. If they drive us
• 42:24
  S9: to the foot of the cross, to the feet of Jesus,
• 42:26
  S9: to ask him some sincere questions, we'll get answers. We
• 42:29
  S9: really will.
• 42:30
  S2: You know, thinking back to those conversations, you mentioned that
• 42:33
  S2: there were some Christians that you would kind of try
• 42:35
  S2: to interrogate really more to prove them wrong. It sounds like,
• 42:38
  S2: than to actually engage in meaningful dialogue. And you were
• 42:43
  S2: quickly able to kind of shut them down. But the
• 42:45
  S2: ones who engage with you and were able to give
• 42:49
  S2: you reasons. What about those conversations? Do you remember? Did
• 42:54
  S2: they point you to scripture? Did they point you to
• 42:56
  S2: historical fact, or did they just ask you questions that
• 42:59
  S2: made you think more deeply?
• 43:01
  S9: They really did all of those things, and certain people
• 43:04
  S9: did certain things better than others and like all of
• 43:07
  S9: us do. Um, some said, you know what? I got
• 43:09
  S9: to say this this is an important thing. Some said
• 43:12
  S9: the best words you can say to a person because
• 43:14
  S9: they're true. I don't know, but I'll get back to you.
• 43:17
  S9: And then they did. And that showed me a level
• 43:20
  S9: of care and concern for my well-being that wasn't. I
• 43:22
  S9: want to show you that I win arguments or that
• 43:25
  S9: I'm right and you're wrong. They wanted to say, I
• 43:27
  S9: want to look for the truth. That's a really good question.
• 43:29
  S9: They took my questions seriously, and then they looked into
• 43:32
  S9: it and got back to me. A lot of times
• 43:34
  S9: it was pointing to historical realities. A lot of times
• 43:37
  S9: it was pointing to theological realities and things that were
• 43:40
  S9: bothering me. They really adapted their response to the questions
• 43:43
  S9: I actually had. In other words, they listened to the
• 43:46
  S9: questions I had, not the questions they hope I had.
• 43:50
  S9: Because we can. We. We can prepare ourselves historically to say,
• 43:53
  S9: you know, Jesus rose from the dead, which is wonderful.
• 43:55
  S9: We should all do that. But there are times when
• 43:58
  S9: someone says, look, I have questions related to suffering and
• 44:01
  S9: meaning and purpose, and Islam says this, or atheism gives
• 44:06
  S9: me this sort of response, or Buddhism does respond to
• 44:10
  S9: the question they're actually asking. And people actually responded to
• 44:13
  S9: the questions I was asking. Sometimes they were historical, sometimes
• 44:17
  S9: they were scientific, sometimes they were existential. And they carefully
• 44:23
  S9: listened to the questions and answered the questions I actually had,
• 44:27
  S9: not the ones they were hoping I would have.
• 44:29
  S2: It's interesting because you you mentioned the the distinction, which
• 44:33
  S2: is a little bit of a nuance because there are,
• 44:36
  S2: you know, maybe you read a certain book or there's
• 44:38
  S2: someone that you follow. And so you're really competent in
• 44:40
  S2: one area, maybe the historical evidence for Jesus. And so
• 44:45
  S2: you feel well prepared there. So you want to default
• 44:48
  S2: to maybe where you feel more prepared. And that's not
• 44:51
  S2: actually what the person is asking, but it's like, hey,
• 44:53
  S2: but this is what I know. So let me give
• 44:55
  S2: this to you and hope that it helps. Clearly that
• 44:58
  S2: doesn't help.
• 44:59
  S9: Yeah. Well, but it gives you a quick story on this,
• 45:01
  S9: is that I was invited to speak to a Muslim
• 45:03
  S9: guy at his home, and I got to his home
• 45:06
  S9: and he came home from his job. And he was
• 45:09
  S9: a dealer at a local casino, which is just not
• 45:12
  S9: a Muslim thing to do. If you're strict about Islam,
• 45:15
  S9: gambling is forbidden. It's haram. It's called. Yet he was
• 45:18
  S9: there and he came home and my friend wanted me
• 45:20
  S9: to speak to him about the historicity of the resurrection
• 45:23
  S9: of Jesus. So we had this sort of ham handed
• 45:25
  S9: way into talking about it, and we started talking about it.
• 45:28
  S9: But he interrupted me about midway through some of the
• 45:30
  S9: evidences I was giving. He says, look, look, here's my problem.
• 45:33
  S9: He says, you're from south Lebanon. I'm from south Lebanon.
• 45:36
  S9: He's like, my issue is, why does God allow such
• 45:40
  S9: terrible things to happen to our people in the middle
• 45:43
  S9: of a conflict like this. That's my big issue. You see,
• 45:45
  S9: the issue wasn't the resurrection. It was this guy was
• 45:49
  S9: kind of agnostic. He's like, I don't understand God, even
• 45:51
  S9: if he even exists, why he allows suffering. Now, I
• 45:55
  S9: wanted to address that question directly. I shifted my thinking
• 45:58
  S9: towards his existential question about suffering. But here's the good news.
• 46:03
  S9: The cross and the resurrection, the historical cross and the
• 46:07
  S9: historical resurrection actually speak to those issues. So don't shy
• 46:11
  S9: away from the historical stuff. If you can find through
• 46:15
  S9: an honest conversation where they shoehorn in so you don't
• 46:19
  S9: have to lead with that, but you can say, hey,
• 46:21
  S9: I want to hear to understand this. Where does this
• 46:23
  S9: question on the morality of allowing suffering come into place?
• 46:27
  S9: This is now a philosophical and theological and a deeply
• 46:29
  S9: biblical question. We have tons of Scripture about why God
• 46:33
  S9: allows suffering for a greater good. And that leads us
• 46:36
  S9: to the cross and the historicity of the cross, because
• 46:39
  S9: God allowed suffering to happen there for the greatest possible
• 46:43
  S9: good there could ever be the salvation of the whole world.
• 46:45
  S9: So you don't have to shy away from the things
• 46:47
  S9: you know. You just have to make sure you strategically
• 46:50
  S9: and wisely apply them. That's why Paul says, walk in
• 46:53
  S9: wisdom toward outsiders in Colossians chapter four, verse five, where
• 46:57
  S9: he says, walk in wisdom. And what is wisdom? It's
• 47:00
  S9: just tactically applied knowledge to a given situation. So use
• 47:04
  S9: what you know, but use it when you know it's
• 47:07
  S9: the necessary time to use it. But one of the
• 47:09
  S9: best skills you can have to know that is to listen.
• 47:12
  S2: Yeah. Oh, such a good conversation. Abdu Murray with us
• 47:15
  S2: right now, president of Embrace the Truth. Coming up, let's
• 47:18
  S2: get some practical help. If maybe you're feeling overwhelmed, like
• 47:21
  S2: I don't know about the historicity of the resurrection and
• 47:24
  S2: the evidence that Jesus actually was a real man who
• 47:28
  S2: walked the earth. I don't know that stuff. How do
• 47:30
  S2: I even start? I'm intimidated. Coming up. Let's tackle it.
• 47:33
  S2: We've got a special guest with us this morning to
• 47:35
  S2: help you be prepared to give a defense. If someone
• 47:39
  S2: is to ask you a reason for the hope that
• 47:41
  S2: you have in Christ. A little bit of a paraphrase
• 47:43
  S2: from first Peter 315. For the person who's listening right
• 47:46
  S2: now and feels overwhelmed because maybe they've born and raised
• 47:51
  S2: in church, they had to come to a point of
• 47:54
  S2: following Jesus for themselves, but they haven't studied a lot
• 47:57
  S2: of this. They didn't go on a nine year journey
• 47:59
  S2: like you did, where you really parsed out. Why? Why
• 48:03
  S2: should I believe that Christianity is true? What's a good
• 48:06
  S2: starting place to begin to prepare?
• 48:08
  S9: Well, the first thing you should do is to actually
• 48:10
  S9: just read your scriptures and really get into the commentaries
• 48:14
  S9: and a good study. Understanding of the historical context and
• 48:19
  S9: the cultural context of the Scripture. I say that not
• 48:22
  S9: because the Bible is always the answer, but it really
• 48:25
  S9: is in many ways. Because, you know, when you look
• 48:27
  S9: at someone who is a Secret Service agent now, the
• 48:30
  S9: Secret Service not only protects the president and other officials,
• 48:33
  S9: but they also are anti counterfeiters. They hunt down counterfeit
• 48:37
  S9: bills as part of the Department of the Treasury. Now,
• 48:40
  S9: when you ask a Secret Service agent, how do you
• 48:42
  S9: spot a counterfeit? They don't study the counterfeits. They study
• 48:47
  S9: the genuine thing. They study the details behind a $50
• 48:51
  S9: bill so that when they see something that's remarkably convincing,
• 48:55
  S9: they're so familiar with the detail that something seems a
• 48:57
  S9: little off and they can kind of tell, even if
• 49:00
  S9: they don't know the detail itself specifically, they can they
• 49:03
  S9: can know this is fake and they can discover it more.
• 49:05
  S9: So the more you know your scriptures, the more you'll
• 49:07
  S9: know the challenges to that. But also you'll know when
• 49:09
  S9: to bring it in to the conversation. So know your
• 49:12
  S9: scriptures more than anything else. The second thing is there
• 49:15
  S9: are some really great resources. And at the risk of
• 49:18
  S9: a shameless plug, if you go to Embrace the truth.org,
• 49:22
  S9: we have a read, listen and watch tab where we
• 49:24
  S9: have a bunch of videos, a lot of articles, and
• 49:28
  S9: some great audio resources as well for people to get
• 49:31
  S9: started in understanding not only the veracity of their faith
• 49:35
  S9: when it comes to the resurrection. Or how can Jesus
• 49:38
  S9: be God? How does. How does the cross make sense?
• 49:40
  S9: What about the Trinity? But you'll also find responses to
• 49:44
  S9: objections like what about science and faith? And hasn't evolution
• 49:47
  S9: put God out of a job? We have a lot
• 49:49
  S9: of great stuff there for you. There are wonderful books.
• 49:52
  S9: There's the case for Christ and the case for Facebook
• 49:55
  S9: by Lee Strobel. A good friend of mine, J. Warner Wallace,
• 49:59
  S9: wrote an excellent book called Cold Case Christianity, where he,
• 50:02
  S9: as a very famous Cold case homicide detective, talks about
• 50:06
  S9: how you can go about an inquiry into the historical
• 50:09
  S9: evidence for Jesus. So it's really, really great stuff that's
• 50:12
  S9: out there. This is an important practical part. Don't be
• 50:15
  S9: paralyzed by the number of books you need to read. Now,
• 50:18
  S9: those are some really great entry level books, and you
• 50:20
  S9: can get more advanced by reading the footnotes in those books.
• 50:24
  S9: I highly recommend that I'm self-taught. I didn't go to seminary,
• 50:27
  S9: but those books were really helpful at the beginning stages
• 50:29
  S9: for me. So the one thing you can do really,
• 50:31
  S9: really well to prepare is to not say much. Just listen.
• 50:36
  S9: By asking artful questions, you can just ask. Hey, what
• 50:40
  S9: do you mean? How do you know? You know if
• 50:42
  S9: someone has a different worldview than you? If you say, hey,
• 50:44
  S9: what do you think of Jesus? Let's say it's to
• 50:45
  S9: a Muslim and they say something. You can say, how
• 50:47
  S9: do you know that's true about Jesus? Or let's say
• 50:50
  S9: someone's an atheist and you say, where do you think
• 50:52
  S9: we came from? Oh, we're just cosmic accidents. Really? What
• 50:55
  S9: do you mean by accident? Explain more. And then how
• 50:58
  S9: do you know that? How do you know that this
• 50:59
  S9: universe wasn't created by a designer? It looks like it
• 51:02
  S9: was designed. How do you justify its lack of design
• 51:05
  S9: if there is such an appearance of design, you see
• 51:08
  S9: what you've done. You've just asked two questions. What do
• 51:10
  S9: you mean? How do you know? And you can stay
• 51:12
  S9: in control of a conversation and learn a bunch about
• 51:15
  S9: the person you're talking to. So you don't need to
• 51:17
  S9: know everything about their worldview. You just need to know
• 51:19
  S9: everything about that person in terms of that specific thing.
• 51:22
  S9: And you can use two questions to get there. And
• 51:25
  S9: then you can come back and you can prepare again
• 51:27
  S9: with saying, okay, this is their this is their issue,
• 51:29
  S9: this is their hang up. And then you read some articles,
• 51:31
  S9: you read some books, you go to some good websites
• 51:34
  S9: and you come back prepared and say, hey, I looked
• 51:36
  S9: into that thing. You said, I saw this. What do
• 51:38
  S9: you think of this? And there you go. You don't
• 51:40
  S9: have to be prepared like a theologian and a PhD.
• 51:42
  S9: Just a little bit of preparation goes a long way.
• 51:45
  S2: You know, at the heart of what you said, that
• 51:48
  S2: you didn't say it explicitly, but it's certainly implied that
• 51:51
  S2: the tone and the the posture of heart is so
• 51:55
  S2: critical here. You know, we live in such a polarized
• 51:59
  S2: society where opposing viewpoints are met with such hostility. And
• 52:04
  S2: even you see people even cutting off relationships where I
• 52:08
  S2: can't even associate with somebody who believes this about the
• 52:11
  S2: world because I'm not safe with them. It has gone
• 52:15
  S2: to a place where I've never seen it in my lifetime.
• 52:18
  S2: How do we enter into that space with humility, where
• 52:21
  S2: it's tempting to meet like fire with fire when you
• 52:24
  S2: feel like somebody is angry and they they want to
• 52:27
  S2: prove you wrong. How do we maintain that posture of
• 52:30
  S2: humility that I believe has to be at the heart
• 52:32
  S2: of every one of these conversations.
• 52:34
  S9: Absolutely. And this is where the ancient wisdom applies to
• 52:37
  S9: modern problems, and why the Bible is eternally contemporary to
• 52:42
  S9: what we're going through and why. I think it's not
• 52:43
  S9: a book written by a handful of fishermen and some shepherds,
• 52:46
  S9: but was really guided by the one who made those
• 52:48
  S9: shepherds and those fishermen. Um, you see Scripture all throughout it.
• 52:51
  S9: The first thing you notice is that it says that
• 52:53
  S9: we're all made in the image of God. So the
• 52:55
  S9: way to combat that is to not contribute to it.
• 52:58
  S9: When you look at someone and you know deeply that
• 53:01
  S9: no matter who you are and who they are, they
• 53:04
  S9: are made in the image of God, that means that
• 53:07
  S9: their opinions and the value of their opinions might be terrible.
• 53:10
  S9: They might have, frankly, idiotic opinions or morally horrible opinions,
• 53:14
  S9: but they are made in God's image. So as a Christian,
• 53:17
  S9: you are required to divorce the value of someone's idea
• 53:21
  S9: from the value of the person. And we're at where
• 53:24
  S9: we're at now because we don't do that. We value.
• 53:26
  S9: We equate an idea and a person. And so if
• 53:30
  S9: we hate their idea, we can hate that person. Well,
• 53:32
  S9: we're not given that luxury as Christians. We just can't
• 53:34
  S9: do that. Then you go to first Peter 315, which
• 53:37
  S9: is the theme verse we've been talking about. And one
• 53:40
  S9: of the things that's important about that is that Peter
• 53:42
  S9: says that not only do we always we always prepared
• 53:45
  S9: to make a defense to anyone who asks you for
• 53:47
  S9: a reason for the hope that is within you. We
• 53:50
  S9: do journalism with respect. Now, what's interesting is that we
• 53:53
  S9: are preparing a defense to anyone who asks you for
• 53:58
  S9: a reason for the hope that is in you. In
• 53:59
  S9: other words, live a life so hope filled that someone says,
• 54:03
  S9: what's with you, man? And then respond to them with
• 54:06
  S9: gentleness and with respect. And then finally, Colossians chapter four,
• 54:09
  S9: verses five and six, where the apostle Paul says, let
• 54:13
  S9: your speech be gracious, seasoned with salt, so you may
• 54:15
  S9: know how you ought to answer each person. He doesn't say,
• 54:18
  S9: answer each objection, each worldview, and each controversy. He says,
• 54:22
  S9: answer each person questions. Controversies and worldviews Views don't need answers,
• 54:27
  S9: but people do. And they use their questions, controversies, and
• 54:30
  S9: worldviews to find them. If you answer a person and
• 54:34
  S9: you offer them hope, and you do it with gentleness,
• 54:36
  S9: with respect, because you see them as made in God's image,
• 54:39
  S9: you will bring the temperature down and there will be
• 54:42
  S9: a lot more light than heat.
• 54:43
  S2: Abdu Murray always, always such a joy to have you
• 54:46
  S2: on with us. If you want more, he mentioned the website,
• 54:49
  S2: which has some great, great resources. Some video helps you
• 54:53
  S2: answer some of the most commonly asked questions. There's a
• 54:56
  S2: top 20 there. Just text embrace to 805, five, five, 78, 98,
• 55:01
  S2: text embrace to 805 557898.
• 55:06
  S1: Tune in whenever you like. Check out the Carl and
• 55:09
  S1: Crew podcast wherever you like to stream.
• 55:12
  S3: Well, his story has.
• 55:13
  S2: Inspired millions upon millions of people. He is one of
• 55:18
  S2: the most heard speakers in the entire world. Nick Vujicic
• 55:23
  S2: is with us this morning. The next story. Nick was
• 55:26
  S2: born with no arms or legs. Doctors offered no explanation.
• 55:30
  S2: No prognosis. Talk about your early years. You're familiar to
• 55:34
  S2: many of our listeners, but there are some who aren't
• 55:37
  S2: familiar with your story at all. And we'll get to
• 55:39
  S2: see it on the big screen. But tell us a
• 55:41
  S2: little bit about your background.
• 55:42
  S10: Yeah. Born in Melbourne, Australia, in 1982, I was born
• 55:45
  S10: without limbs and there was no medical reason why this
• 55:48
  S10: has happened in my life. But Mum and Dad took
• 55:52
  S10: me home and they knew that God had a plan
• 55:54
  S10: for their son. No one knew what I would be
• 55:56
  S10: able to do without limbs and obviously I myself. Growing up,
• 56:01
  S10: I knew I had no limbs, but I didn't think
• 56:03
  S10: it was such a big deal until I went to school.
• 56:06
  S10: Being faced with bullying and wondering what kind of hope,
• 56:10
  S10: plan and future God would ever have for me. He
• 56:13
  S10: didn't really give me the plan when I asked him
• 56:15
  S10: for one, and so I started believing that he wasn't
• 56:18
  S10: real or he was unfair and at age ten, Attempted suicide.
• 56:24
  S10: Believing that there was no hope or anything really to
• 56:27
  S10: look forward to in the future and, uh. Age 15
• 56:31
  S10: John chapter nine changed my life. Seeing a man that
• 56:34
  S10: was born with his disability being blind, Jesus said it
• 56:38
  S10: was done so that the word would be revealed through him. And, uh,
• 56:42
  S10: he sees. What's beautiful is what I realized is the
• 56:45
  S10: blind man didn't ask Jesus for the plan. He didn't
• 56:48
  S10: ask him, what are you going to do? Who are you?
• 56:51
  S10: And then I'll tell you if I trust you. He
• 56:53
  S10: was still, and he had faith. And I realized, God,
• 56:56
  S10: if you have a plan for me like the blind
• 56:58
  S10: man and you heal me, awesome. But I'm not going
• 57:01
  S10: to wait for the plan anymore. I want your peace.
• 57:04
  S10: I want your purpose. And I know today that even
• 57:07
  S10: when I don't get a miracle, perhaps you can still
• 57:09
  S10: use me to be one.
• 57:11
  S2: Nick's story. The movie is called No Limbs, No Limits,
• 57:15
  S2: the Nick V story. You're going to want to see
• 57:17
  S2: it this weekend. It's a documentary style. There are interviews,
• 57:21
  S2: obviously with you, but with people who have been instrumental
• 57:24
  S2: in your life. From your perspective, how did it feel
• 57:27
  S2: to have your life kind of made into this kind
• 57:31
  S2: of a film?
• 57:32
  S10: You know, my mom has been to me, my hero
• 57:36
  S10: in my life and my father early on in life,
• 57:39
  S10: but the fact that my mom, brother and sister were
• 57:42
  S10: interviewed and then were able to show never seen before
• 57:46
  S10: home footage of me, she had a feeling that this
• 57:48
  S10: was something that we might want one day. And thank
• 57:52
  S10: God she did that. It is surreal. You know, I'm 43,
• 57:55
  S10: so you normally never get a documentary about you generally.
• 57:58
  S10: And if you do, you're either really old or dead.
• 58:01
  S10: And so this is an incredible ministry tool as well.
• 58:04
  S10: It's not just a story. It's understanding that we all
• 58:08
  S10: go through ups and downs, but God does have a
• 58:10
  S10: plan for us all. And we also even interviewed Arnold
• 58:15
  S10: the janitor as an example. He saw me speak in
• 58:18
  S10: front of my public school as a vice president. He
• 58:21
  S10: pulled me aside. He said he basically prophesied over me.
• 58:24
  S10: He said, you are going to be a speaker and
• 58:28
  S10: you're going to go all around the world and speak.
• 58:31
  S10: And I said, speak about what? He said, share your story.
• 58:33
  S10: And I said, I don't have one. And he actually
• 58:36
  S10: organized my first speech. And people's lives were changed. And
• 58:39
  S10: that was the the beginnings of the beginnings. And has
• 58:43
  S10: this been an incredible journey? But it's helping people understand
• 58:46
  S10: that the bottom line that we're looking for is the
• 58:49
  S10: peace of God, which then gives us his purpose as well.
• 58:53
  S10: There's a lot of people going through depression, addiction, and
• 58:56
  S10: we're really, really raw as well. Ali, in this documentary,
• 59:01
  S10: we want people to know that, you know, even though
• 59:03
  S10: you are a Christian, strong in faith, there are always
• 59:07
  S10: going to be times where things come into your mind
• 59:10
  S10: and concerns and fear and even depression that you can't
• 59:13
  S10: just pray away sometimes. And so we really pull back
• 59:17
  S10: the curtain on everything, encouraging everyone that no matter what
• 59:20
  S10: you're going through, God knows that he's with you. He'll
• 59:23
  S10: pull you through. And there's no limits as to what
• 59:25
  S10: God can do with your broken pieces. If you give
• 59:28
  S10: those broken pieces a chance in his hands.
• 59:30
  S2: You know the thing I love about your story, Nick,
• 59:32
  S2: because there's the human interest angle. And, you know, I
• 59:36
  S2: saw I don't know if it was 60 minutes or
• 59:38
  S2: some other one of those type of shows that did
• 59:40
  S2: a story about you. And there is the, obviously the
• 59:43
  S2: personal resolve, the depth of character, the strength, the grit
• 59:47
  S2: that it takes to continue to push forward and to
• 59:50
  S2: achieve all of the things that you have achieved in
• 59:53
  S2: your life. But you are unapologetically about the gospel as
• 59:58
  S2: being the thing that we all need those with limbs,
• 1:00:01
  S2: those without that, that is the deepest need of every
• 1:00:04
  S2: person is not a healthy body, as the world will
• 1:00:08
  S2: look at it, but a saved soul. Right.
• 1:00:10
  S10: Amen. There's not a greater disability than being a lost
• 1:00:14
  S10: soul And sin and death are the biggest challenges that
• 1:00:19
  S10: any human being is going to have. And then if
• 1:00:22
  S10: we do not have that peace and we do not
• 1:00:24
  S10: have that knowledge of eternity and God's love for us,
• 1:00:28
  S10: there's always going to be this crippling fear of what
• 1:00:31
  S10: happens when I'm gone. And everyone, you know then goes
• 1:00:34
  S10: to their own kind of philosophies of, well, you know,
• 1:00:38
  S10: if you're good, you do good. Good's going to happen.
• 1:00:41
  S10: That's not true. And what do you tell someone who's
• 1:00:43
  S10: forced into prostitution, sold by their own mother for $700
• 1:00:47
  S10: for four years old? What's the hope there? And so
• 1:00:50
  S10: I've actually seen transformed, rescued, healed, redeemed sex slaves to
• 1:00:57
  S10: the point where they find God. Their soul is saved,
• 1:01:00
  S10: their heart is healed, their mind is renewed. They find
• 1:01:03
  S10: a job. They save up money to go rescue another slave.
• 1:01:07
  S10: And so the hope is real. And you know when
• 1:01:10
  S10: you have it.
• 1:01:11
  S2: What kind of feedback have you gotten so far from
• 1:01:14
  S2: people who have gotten the preview of the film.
• 1:01:17
  S10: There's 2000 people that have actually seen it up until
• 1:01:20
  S10: this point. Different variations. But we just were at Cebu.
• 1:01:24
  S10: We were at a red carpet last week and everyone's quite,
• 1:01:29
  S10: quite moved. What I love about this film is that
• 1:01:33
  S10: there was a young man who came up to me
• 1:01:35
  S10: after watching it, and he said, thank you for how
• 1:01:39
  S10: you told the story of what God did through you
• 1:01:43
  S10: and for you, without making you the hero of the
• 1:01:48
  S10: story or someone to really look up to. Wow, you
• 1:01:52
  S10: really glorified God. He was. He was 17 or 18
• 1:01:55
  S10: years old and he said, I love that because you
• 1:01:58
  S10: were always giving glory back to God. And in the end,
• 1:02:01
  S10: it's not about you. And that's the point. We want
• 1:02:04
  S10: everyone to know that it's not just a story. It's
• 1:02:07
  S10: about all of our stories. Your history is his story,
• 1:02:11
  S10: and it's the journey of our hearts and our minds
• 1:02:14
  S10: along the way, where every day we have to choose. God,
• 1:02:18
  S10: I trust you one day at a time.
• 1:02:20
  S2: Yeah. This story has everything. I mean, it's overcoming adversity.
• 1:02:24
  S2: It's dealing with your deepest brokenness. It's trying to find
• 1:02:29
  S2: out what does God want me to do with my life?
• 1:02:32
  S2: This powerful, powerful ministry. No limbs, no limits. The story film.
• 1:02:38
  S2: I want to encourage you to check it out this weekend,
• 1:02:40
  S2: wherever you can find a closest theater. We've got that
• 1:02:43
  S2: for you. In addition to some other resources, just text
• 1:02:46
  S2: Nick to 805 557898. Just text Nick 805 557898.
• 1:02:55
  S11: Hey, this is Carl with Carl and crew, and I'm
• 1:02:57
  S11: so grateful that you listened to this show cast. Thank
• 1:03:00
  S11: you mostly for being part of the boom crew as
• 1:03:02
  S11: we help you take your next step with Jesus, you're
• 1:03:05
  S11: a huge encouragement to us. We'll be here again live
• 1:03:08
  S11: every weekday morning from 5 to 9 a.m.. Godspeed.