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The Eva LaRue Interview · Legally Brunette

0:01
Speaker 1: Hi, guys, Welcome to a new episode of Legally Brunette.
0:04
Speaker 1: I will be your host Emily Simpson with Shane Okay,
0:07
Speaker 1: before we get into the Eva LaRue story, we're just
0:11
Speaker 1: going to do some updates on the Anna Kepner situation,
0:14
Speaker 1: which we talked about on a previous podcast. When we
0:17
Speaker 1: first brought up this case, obviously there's not a lot
0:19
Speaker 1: of information out there. This is the eighteen year old
0:22
Speaker 1: cheerleader that was found dead recently on the carnival cruise
0:25
Speaker 1: called Horizon. Her body was found stuffed underneath the bed
0:29
Speaker 1: in her cabin, covered in US Yes, covered in life
0:32
Speaker 1: best and she was wrapped in a sheet. Now there's
0:35
Speaker 1: some more information that has come out, so we're gonna
0:37
Speaker 1: we're gonna update you guys on that. So Anna Kupner
0:40
Speaker 1: had an ex boyfriend who has come out and told
0:42
Speaker 1: reporters that after Anna's memorials. This was after her memorial service.
0:46
Speaker 1: He said that there was one time when he was
0:48
Speaker 1: on a FaceTime with her. This I remember him saying.
0:50
Speaker 1: It was like three o'clock in the morning and she
0:53
Speaker 1: was lying down and her stepbrother tried to jump on
0:56
Speaker 1: top of her or sit on top of her. Something
0:57
Speaker 1: like that, and he actually saw this on the face time.
1:00
Speaker 2: Like horse playing.
1:01
Speaker 1: You know, I don't know, he didn't give like a context.
1:03
Speaker 2: I just think that she doesn't seem like normal will
1:06
Speaker 2: be here.
1:06
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think he just found it just really inappropriate
1:09
Speaker 1: and strange.
1:10
Speaker 3: He said.
1:11
Speaker 1: He reported the encounter to Anna's parents and said she
1:14
Speaker 1: had complained about being uncomfortable around her stepbrother before, but
1:18
Speaker 1: the parents didn't believe his claims. Obviously, if he's going
1:21
Speaker 1: to the dad and the mom, the mom or the
1:24
Speaker 1: step mom is the biological mom of the stepbrother, and
1:28
Speaker 1: then Anna has a.
1:29
Speaker 2: Dadtive we it's father daughter and mother's son right getting married.
1:33
Speaker 3: Yes.
1:34
Speaker 1: The ex boyfriend went on to describe Anna as his
1:36
Speaker 1: first love and said he would have been on the
1:38
Speaker 1: cruise with the Keptner family earlier this month if they
1:40
Speaker 1: hadn't broken up. He claims that she was scared of him,
1:44
Speaker 1: and the ex boyfriend's father, Stephen Weston, told Inside Editions
1:48
Speaker 1: separately it was because he always carried around a big knife. Now,
1:53
Speaker 1: I think this kid. What I've read this hasn't been
1:55
Speaker 1: confirmed by the FBI because they haven't really released any information,
1:58
Speaker 1: but from what I have read multiple times, this stepbrother
2:01
Speaker 1: is sixteen years old, So if this is true, if
2:04
Speaker 1: he's carrying around a big knife, I don't know if
2:08
Speaker 1: as a parent that would be something that I would
2:11
Speaker 1: be okay, like.
2:12
Speaker 2: That was his regular daily I don't know.
2:15
Speaker 1: I mean animal Carrie snacks around in her pocket, but
2:18
Speaker 1: I mean I would be concerned if I had a
2:20
Speaker 1: child that was a young teenager that was carrying around
2:24
Speaker 1: real weapons. Investigators have preliminarily ruled that the teen died
2:29
Speaker 1: as a result of asphyxiation from a bar hold, And
2:32
Speaker 1: I guess a bar hold is when someone holds your
2:35
Speaker 1: arm across.
2:36
Speaker 2: Your neck or it could be an object or an object, yeah,
2:39
Speaker 2: as opposed to strangulation, I think, which is probably more
2:42
Speaker 2: of the hands around the neck or rope.
2:45
Speaker 1: Anna Kepner's body showed no signs of sexual assault, nor
2:48
Speaker 1: were drugs or alcohol found in her system, though the
2:52
Speaker 1: full autopsy and toxicology reports have not yet been made available.
2:57
Speaker 1: But I guess there has been some type of statement
2:59
Speaker 1: that she died of axiation and that there were no
3:02
Speaker 1: drugs or alcohol found in her system. Anna's birth mother,
3:06
Speaker 1: Heather Right, told news outlets that she learned of her
3:08
Speaker 1: daughter's death through an online search. She wasn't contact. I'm
3:13
Speaker 1: not sure. I feel like that's probably in a strange relationship.
3:16
Speaker 1: Like I don't know if Anna actually has a lot
3:18
Speaker 1: of contact with her biological mother.
3:19
Speaker 2: I don't know. I didn't see much that showed there was.
3:22
Speaker 1: And I believe there's been two stepmothers, So I think
3:25
Speaker 1: the dad was married previously to a different stepmother, and
3:28
Speaker 1: then now he's just been recently married again in twenty
3:32
Speaker 1: twenty four to this recent stepmother. I guess her name
3:35
Speaker 1: is Sean Tell.
3:36
Speaker 2: We'll see how long this one lasts.
3:37
Speaker 1: Okay, So Anna's birth mother said that she learned about
3:40
Speaker 1: her daughter's death or an online search. I guess she
3:42
Speaker 1: had heard about it or someone.
3:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, but she should have heard it from the father first.
3:47
Speaker 1: She should have, but I don't think that he reached out.
3:50
Speaker 2: My point is he obviously didn't. He allowed enough time
3:54
Speaker 2: had passed, as she found it out through other means
3:58
Speaker 2: that it didn't come from the other parent, So he
4:00
Speaker 2: obviously doesn't have much communication with her.
4:03
Speaker 1: Similarly, Anna's step grandfather, whose name is Christopher Donahue, and
4:08
Speaker 1: if you remember the last name Donahue, that is when
4:12
Speaker 1: we talked about on this previous podcast. There was someone
4:15
Speaker 1: named Martin Donahue who posted on Twitter, and he posted
4:19
Speaker 1: very early on saying that it was the stepbrother and
4:23
Speaker 1: that the family's not talking about it and he wanted
4:25
Speaker 1: to get that information out there. He gave details about
4:28
Speaker 1: how her body was found, and his last name was Donahue.
4:31
Speaker 1: And this step grandfather named Christopher Donahue said, I don't
4:35
Speaker 1: know why Anna was staying in a room with her stepbrother.
4:39
Speaker 1: The swirl of public claims around Anna's death has revived
4:42
Speaker 1: long simmering disputes. In March thirty first, at twenty twenty three,
4:45
Speaker 1: a divorce petition filed in Brevard County, Anna's former stepmother,
4:49
Speaker 1: Tabitha Kapner that's the other stepmom previous to this one,
4:53
Speaker 1: alleges that Christopher Kaepner, the father, had a history of
4:56
Speaker 1: physical and mental abuse toward the minor children and toward
4:59
Speaker 1: the petitioner, and she sought sole parental responsibility for the
5:02
Speaker 1: children she shared with him and supervised time sharing. She
5:06
Speaker 1: was married to Christopher Kaepner after he split with Anna's
5:09
Speaker 1: mother and before he married his third wife, Sean Tell.
5:12
Speaker 1: So I was right, there were the two step mothers,
5:15
Speaker 1: and so I feel like the biological mother didn't have
5:17
Speaker 1: a lot to do with Anna as she was growing up.
5:19
Speaker 1: It looks like the dad's had full custody. He's been
5:21
Speaker 1: married a couple of times, and it looks like there's
5:23
Speaker 1: some right.
5:24
Speaker 2: And clearly they went on a trip together her as
5:26
Speaker 2: an eighteen year old, so she didn't it's not like
5:28
Speaker 2: you know, she was dragged along.
5:30
Speaker 1: Well, let me tell you about So I just read
5:32
Speaker 1: a recent article that just came out today. So the
5:35
Speaker 1: grandfather and the grandmother who were on this cruise did
5:40
Speaker 1: an interview. So I finally figured out we talked about previously.
5:43
Speaker 1: We weren't sure how the rooms were divided up, and
5:45
Speaker 1: I wasn't sure of what family members.
5:47
Speaker 2: Actually, that's right. Did we find out?
5:48
Speaker 1: Yes, So there were nine people total in this family
5:53
Speaker 1: that were on the cruise.
5:54
Speaker 2: No kidding, So do we know you don't have deliver
5:56
Speaker 2: them all. But we got father, daughter, and step son.
6:01
Speaker 1: Okay, So let me break it down. This is how
6:02
Speaker 1: the rooms were. So there are two younger girls who
6:06
Speaker 1: stayed with the parents. So that's Chris Kepner and his wife, Chantel.
6:11
Speaker 1: So that's four people in one of the state rooms. Okay,
6:15
Speaker 1: So then the second state room had three teenagers. That
6:18
Speaker 1: was Anna Keepner, that was the stepbrother who's allegedly sixteen,
6:22
Speaker 1: and then it was her biological brother. So there's three
6:25
Speaker 1: teenagers in that stateroom. And then the third stateroom on
6:29
Speaker 1: this cruise was the grandparents, Jeffrey and Barbara Kepner.
6:33
Speaker 2: Okay, so we know that she was rooming with thee
6:36
Speaker 2: the stepbrother. That's that the rumors are swirling. Yeah, that
6:40
Speaker 2: he's a person of interest or a suspect, right.
6:42
Speaker 1: And that also she was fearful of him, and that
6:45
Speaker 1: he carried around a knife and apparently he'd been would.
6:48
Speaker 2: And appropriately in the same room. Okay, I don't know.
6:51
Speaker 1: Here's the thing, and you're you're a parent, you have
6:54
Speaker 1: you have children eight from age twenty four to ten.
6:58
Speaker 1: I understand that they're considered siblings, but when you have
7:01
Speaker 1: step siblings that aren't related by blood and have just
7:05
Speaker 1: recently met because she just married the dad a year
7:08
Speaker 1: ago in twenty twenty four, so you've got a sixteen
7:11
Speaker 1: year old boy and an eighteen year old girl.
7:13
Speaker 2: Yeah, which is much different than our arrangement because these
7:16
Speaker 2: are they're close in age and they're older.
7:18
Speaker 1: Right, So that's my point.
7:19
Speaker 2: You have a sixteen year old always ad sex.
7:21
Speaker 1: Right, and an eighteen year old girl staying in a
7:25
Speaker 1: small stateroom on a cruise together who.
7:28
Speaker 2: Is not naturally that's not, you know, necessarily a recipe
7:32
Speaker 2: for murder.
7:33
Speaker 1: Though it's not a recipe for murder. But I'm just saying,
7:35
Speaker 1: as a parent, I would find that inappropriate and I
7:37
Speaker 1: would never let that happen.
7:38
Speaker 2: I just wanted to make certain that it doesn't mean
7:40
Speaker 2: like they're no to be homicide, but it does mean
7:44
Speaker 2: it could be uncomfortable, it could be awkward. It may
7:46
Speaker 2: not be the type of relationship that they're comfortable with
7:49
Speaker 2: and they're respecting each other, you know. I mean even
7:51
Speaker 2: sometimes brothers and sisters don't want to stay in the
7:53
Speaker 2: same room.
7:54
Speaker 1: No, I agree, I'm not say I'm just saying when
7:56
Speaker 1: it's step it's even a little more.
7:59
Speaker 2: Specially, I don't know how long have they been step siblings.
8:01
Speaker 1: Only a year I said they were married. They were
8:03
Speaker 1: married with twenty twenty four, So I'm.
8:05
Speaker 2: Saying a question. But okay, right, that fills in some
8:08
Speaker 2: gaps because last time we were talking, were saying they
8:10
Speaker 2: all showed up to breakfast except for her. They were wondering, like,
8:13
Speaker 2: how did they find out she was missing? Like did
8:15
Speaker 2: they just overhear it or were they calling for her?
8:18
Speaker 2: What they do when she didn't show up? And we
8:20
Speaker 2: were wondering who was in the room with her? Now
8:22
Speaker 2: we know at least they stayed. She stayed with her
8:25
Speaker 2: brother and stepbrother, right, so what the brothers get up,
8:28
Speaker 2: go to breakfast, and then they're like, we don't know
8:31
Speaker 2: where this is.
8:32
Speaker 1: The question is when this occurred, where was the biological
8:36
Speaker 1: brother because I'm assuming he was not in the room
8:39
Speaker 1: at the time.
8:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, we don't know. I don't know, but that's
8:43
Speaker 2: very plausible, right, And then the.
8:45
Speaker 1: Question is where did he sleep? Did he come back
8:48
Speaker 1: to the room and she wasn't there and he didn't
8:50
Speaker 1: think that was strange? I don't know. I have so
8:51
Speaker 1: many questions about what happened. All we know is at
8:54
Speaker 1: the end of the day, that she's not alive, that
8:58
Speaker 1: the stepbrothers suspect that he did leep in the bed
9:00
Speaker 1: that night, that I've read that allegedly that he woke up,
9:03
Speaker 1: that he you know, whatever happened happened.
9:04
Speaker 2: Also of them are on you know, the list of
9:08
Speaker 2: to be interviewed even if it's the brother, Well, right,
9:11
Speaker 2: brother doesn't automatically rule out homicide, right, but the brother
9:15
Speaker 2: also maybe in a party, but he might know a lot.
9:18
Speaker 1: I'm sure. Right now the FBI is pulling all the
9:21
Speaker 1: surveillance videos so they know who went in and out
9:23
Speaker 1: and what time, and then they're pulling all the key
9:25
Speaker 1: card data so they know who went in and out
9:26
Speaker 1: of that room. And also the grandmother in this interview
9:30
Speaker 1: that I just read, claims that the step brother told
9:34
Speaker 1: her that he doesn't remember what happened in the room
9:36
Speaker 1: that night, and that he was hospitalized right after this
9:42
Speaker 1: cruise into some type of mental health treatment, and that
9:45
Speaker 1: he's been released.
9:46
Speaker 2: But he's trying to claim that he had.
9:48
Speaker 1: Some psychotic break or something I.
9:51
Speaker 2: Don't right, blacked out and doesn't have any memory and
9:54
Speaker 2: can't be held accountable and therefore you should be released.
9:56
Speaker 1: Well, that's a lot of free meditation. I don't know.
9:58
Speaker 1: I don't, I don't know, but I mean.
10:00
Speaker 2: That it's possibly trying to go in that direction.
10:02
Speaker 1: Possibly, but obviously we need more information on what happened
10:05
Speaker 1: that night.
10:06
Speaker 2: Okay, But may I say something, So even if that
10:08
Speaker 2: were the case, even if he had a crystal ball
10:09
Speaker 2: that could say, yeah, he blacked out, he had no
10:11
Speaker 2: he had an episode, like he had no bad intentions whatever,
10:16
Speaker 2: You still got to put him in prison. Yeah, because
10:19
Speaker 2: that could happen again. Absolutely, So it's like, okay, fine,
10:22
Speaker 2: we're not going to put you in prison. As it's
10:24
Speaker 2: not always as a matter of punishment. Sometimes it's a
10:28
Speaker 2: matter of keeping with anxiety.
10:29
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. The grandmother also claimed in the article there
10:33
Speaker 1: was some more details about that evening. She said that
10:36
Speaker 1: Anna did leave dinner early that night because she said
10:39
Speaker 1: her braces were bothering her. She might have gotten them tightened.
10:42
Speaker 1: You know how when you get your braces tightened, it
10:44
Speaker 1: really bothers you and hurts. Yea, So she left dinner
10:47
Speaker 1: early that night because her braces were bothering her. But
10:49
Speaker 1: she said then she she went and changed and reappeared
10:53
Speaker 1: later at the casino and gambled a little bit like
10:56
Speaker 1: twenty dollars with her grandmother and grandfather. Then she told
10:59
Speaker 1: her grandma, I don't feel well. I'm going to go
11:01
Speaker 1: back to the room. And then the grandmother claims that
11:03
Speaker 1: was the last time that she saw her, and then
11:06
Speaker 1: the next morning they are all at breakfast I'm not
11:08
Speaker 1: sure if they're looking for her or what. Those details
11:10
Speaker 1: have not come to show up for breakfast and show
11:13
Speaker 1: up right. And then the grandfather heard a medical alert.
11:16
Speaker 1: I assume as soon as the housekeeper walked in and
11:18
Speaker 1: found that body, that there was some type of medical.
11:20
Speaker 2: Alert that went automatic, notice right and alert right.
11:24
Speaker 1: And then the room number was I guess the room
11:26
Speaker 1: number was said over the speaker. The grandfather recognized the
11:28
Speaker 1: room number, knowing it was one of their state rooms.
11:31
Speaker 1: He goes to the room, he sees her. He claims
11:34
Speaker 1: she had bruises on her neck. They knew that she
11:35
Speaker 1: was dead just upon walking in and seeing the body.
11:38
Speaker 1: I guess people were removed from the room.
11:41
Speaker 2: I hoped he never know what that's like.
11:42
Speaker 1: All right. So that's all the information we have so far,
11:44
Speaker 1: and Anna Keepner, obviously we will keep following the case
11:47
Speaker 1: and keep updating you guys on it as it goes along.
11:50
Speaker 1: We're going to take a little break now, but when
11:52
Speaker 1: we come back, we will be interviewing Eva LaRue and
11:54
Speaker 1: her daughter Kaya. We're excited today. We're going to have
12:06
Speaker 1: a guest on here in just a few minutes. Her
12:08
Speaker 1: name is Eva LaRue. If you were a fan of
12:11
Speaker 1: CSI Miami. She was an actress on that for many years.
12:14
Speaker 1: So Eva LaRue has a new two part series out
12:17
Speaker 1: on Paramount Plus. It is called My Nightmare Stalker. So
12:22
Speaker 1: for more than a decade, Eva LaRue endured a terrifying
12:26
Speaker 1: stalking campaign carried out by an anonymous man who signed
12:30
Speaker 1: his threats as Freddy Krueger. This started back in two
12:33
Speaker 1: thousand and seven and continued all the way until twenty nineteen.
12:38
Speaker 1: The CSA Miami and she was also on All My Children.
12:41
Speaker 1: Actress received dozens of graphic threatening letters aimed at both
12:46
Speaker 1: her and her young daughter. LaRue's experience is explored in
12:50
Speaker 1: this two part Paramount Plus documentary My Nightmare Stalker, The
12:54
Speaker 1: Ava LaRue Story, which debuted back on November thirteenth, which
12:58
Speaker 1: Shane and I have both watched now. The harassment began
13:01
Speaker 1: when Eva and her daughter Kaya started receiving disturbing letters
13:05
Speaker 1: filled with violent threats from a sender who called himself
13:08
Speaker 1: Freddy Krueger. And the letters are so graphic, yeah, I
13:14
Speaker 1: mean horrific. After years of harassment, the investigation identified the
13:19
Speaker 1: stalker as James David Rogers. He was an Ohio man
13:23
Speaker 1: just a little shout out to my home state, people
13:26
Speaker 1: of Ohio.
13:27
Speaker 2: My people there there are people never disappointing the true
13:29
Speaker 2: crime and.
13:30
Speaker 1: You know what, also talking about Ohio. I don't know
13:33
Speaker 1: if any of you out there are a big fan
13:35
Speaker 1: of forensic files like I am. But if you watch
13:38
Speaker 1: forensic files religiously like I do, I don't know why,
13:43
Speaker 1: but many of the episodes I take place in Ohio.
13:47
Speaker 2: I think it's probably because they have better resources and
13:49
Speaker 2: access to get the yeah, the interviews and the all
13:54
Speaker 2: the investigation journals and whatever.
13:57
Speaker 1: Right, So anyway, another shout out to Ohio. According to
14:01
Speaker 1: federal authorities, he sent a total of thirty seven letters
14:04
Speaker 1: between two thousand and seven and twenty fifteen, many of
14:07
Speaker 1: them describing horrific fantasies involving Eva and also her daughter.
14:13
Speaker 1: His behavior escalated in twenty nineteen when he began calling
14:17
Speaker 1: Kaya's high school, leaving explicit voicemails of what he was
14:21
Speaker 1: going to do to her.
14:22
Speaker 2: And none of these messages, whether it be by voicemail
14:26
Speaker 2: or letter, were like I love you or anything saying
14:30
Speaker 2: like I want you. It was just violent.
14:34
Speaker 1: So he did start out, I believe, in the beginning
14:36
Speaker 1: with some letters that were adoration of love and like
14:40
Speaker 1: I'm obsessed with you and I'm in love with you
14:42
Speaker 1: and you know, and then it went I mean, then
14:45
Speaker 1: it just went psychotic.
14:47
Speaker 2: So by no, I was like, never mind, I want
14:49
Speaker 2: to dismemory you, you know.
14:51
Speaker 1: And it makes me think, was there some is that
14:53
Speaker 1: what happens when someone doesn't get a letter back? I mean,
14:56
Speaker 1: when he wrote the initial letters, was it because he
14:59
Speaker 1: was expecting some type of adoration back, like she was
15:02
Speaker 1: going to write him back and be like I love
15:04
Speaker 1: you too. Random man in Ohio, Freddy Krueger. And then
15:08
Speaker 1: when that didn't happen, that's when he goes off the
15:11
Speaker 1: deep end. And then it goes from love and I
15:12
Speaker 1: want to marry you and be with you too, now
15:14
Speaker 1: I'm going to dismember you, and.
15:15
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know.
15:17
Speaker 1: But so by using the DNA discovered from the envelopes
15:20
Speaker 1: and in putting that into genetic genealogy databases, the FBI
15:25
Speaker 1: connected Rogers to the threats. This led investigators to Ohio,
15:29
Speaker 1: where they confirmed the match using DNA from a discarded
15:32
Speaker 1: soda straw. Rogers was arrested in late twenty nineteen and
15:36
Speaker 1: later pleaded guilty to multiple charges of stalking and sending
15:40
Speaker 1: threatening communications. He received a forty month federal sentence and
15:44
Speaker 1: apologized in court, while Eva LaRue told him she forgave him,
15:48
Speaker 1: but she would never forget because she would always carry
15:51
Speaker 1: the fear with her for life. He was released in
15:53
Speaker 1: twenty twenty.
15:54
Speaker 2: Four, two years Yeah.
15:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I guess because he never followed through
16:03
Speaker 1: with any type of overt act, I guess that would
16:07
Speaker 1: make it more than just the threatening part of it.
16:11
Speaker 2: Yeah. He never Yeah, he never committed a violent act,
16:15
Speaker 2: just words. So I guess that's even though it could
16:17
Speaker 2: be you know, equally as frightening.
16:20
Speaker 1: Right because you don't. You don't.
16:22
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe even more frightening because you don't. Yeah, it's
16:24
Speaker 2: a mystery right when it's going to be carried out
16:27
Speaker 2: if it will.
16:28
Speaker 1: Can you imagine though, the torment we're going to get
16:30
Speaker 1: into this because she's going to come on and we're
16:32
Speaker 1: going to ask her. But that many years of living
16:34
Speaker 1: with that kind of fear, and to have a daughter
16:38
Speaker 1: and to live every single days thinking is he outside,
16:41
Speaker 1: is he in my car? Is following my car?
16:44
Speaker 2: Is he in my and not knowing what he looked
16:46
Speaker 2: like so you don't even know is it that person?
16:48
Speaker 2: Is it that person?
16:48
Speaker 3: Right?
16:49
Speaker 1: And coming home at night and coming into your house
16:52
Speaker 1: like putting the key and then coming in and thinking
16:54
Speaker 1: is there someone in my home? Did he get in?
16:56
Speaker 2: Because I come home, I hear the cat and it
16:58
Speaker 2: worries me, right, I get cat worried. But I don't
17:01
Speaker 2: know it's the cat at first.
17:03
Speaker 1: We have three dogs and the cat scared you when
17:06
Speaker 1: you come home.
17:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, because the dogs are obviously dogs. Cats are like
17:09
Speaker 2: under the table and the tablecloth.
17:11
Speaker 1: Now we know Shane's scared of cat.
17:13
Speaker 2: No, until when I don't know what's a cat? Okay,
17:17
Speaker 2: I don't know what's a cat?
17:18
Speaker 1: Hi Eva, how are you? Thanks for coming on today. Great,
17:23
Speaker 1: nice to meet you as well. First of all, I'd
17:25
Speaker 1: have to say I'm a big fan of the CSI
17:27
Speaker 1: shows and CSI Miamis to watch it back in the day.
17:30
Speaker 3: So it's just exciting yours.
17:33
Speaker 1: Oh, thank you, oh, thank you so much. And my
17:36
Speaker 1: husband Shane, well, thank you, well, thank you so much
17:41
Speaker 1: for coming on legally Brunette and discussing your story. As
17:45
Speaker 1: Shane and I watched the two part series last night
17:49
Speaker 1: just to prepare and kind of understand what you went through,
17:51
Speaker 1: but I just want to start. Let's just start at
17:53
Speaker 1: the beginning. Now, when you first started receiving, like the
17:57
Speaker 1: first letter, was it something that you took seriously or
18:00
Speaker 1: was that kind of par for the course with who
18:02
Speaker 1: you are. You're an actress, you're on TV, you've been
18:04
Speaker 1: on soap operas, obviously you're in the public eye.
18:07
Speaker 3: We from the very first letter, we took it seriously.
18:11
Speaker 3: It was like a stock my body because I'd never
18:15
Speaker 3: got you know, for all the years that I've done
18:17
Speaker 3: soap operas and and all the years that you know,
18:21
Speaker 3: and at that point, I'd only been on CSI for
18:23
Speaker 3: two years CSI Miami, and I had never gotten any
18:28
Speaker 3: kind I mean you obviously, you know get the I
18:31
Speaker 3: don't like your character, you know, like that kind of
18:35
Speaker 3: run of the mill, I don't like your you know,
18:37
Speaker 3: like who you're being or whatever. But I had never
18:40
Speaker 3: gotten that kind of crazy, uh.
18:46
Speaker 4: But but violent and hateful and graphic, graphic and massive
18:53
Speaker 4: kiss like all of an heinous, depraved, And I'd never
18:57
Speaker 4: gotten anything like that ever before.
18:59
Speaker 3: So from the very first letter, I took it seriously.
19:02
Speaker 3: And then the letter started coming one right after the
19:04
Speaker 3: next we got one the next day, We got one
19:06
Speaker 3: the next day. You know, he would go on these
19:08
Speaker 3: ram pages where we would get like eight letters and
19:12
Speaker 3: then we wouldn't get any for a month or a month,
19:15
Speaker 3: and then he'd go on a rampage again. And then
19:18
Speaker 3: sometimes it would be a couple of months before we
19:20
Speaker 3: get them. Sometimes it would be six months, and we
19:22
Speaker 3: would think, oh, maybe he got off you know us, and.
19:28
Speaker 1: He moved on.
19:29
Speaker 3: Yeah, you don't hope he moves on to somebody else,
19:30
Speaker 3: but that he like got a life or something, or
19:32
Speaker 3: maybe like maybe you.
19:33
Speaker 1: Got a girlfriend or something. Maybe exactly you found some
19:36
Speaker 1: happiness that so he's not spending his time.
19:40
Speaker 3: You know, maybe you know anything, right, And then all
19:42
Speaker 3: of a sudden they'd start coming out of the blue again.
19:44
Speaker 3: So I really think, I mean, it really boils down
19:46
Speaker 3: to that that insanity, that mental health issue, that the
19:52
Speaker 3: obsessive you know where where people they talk about people
19:56
Speaker 3: get into their addiction. Like when you see that blank
19:59
Speaker 3: whether it's alcoho or drug addiction or whatever, you see
20:02
Speaker 3: that blankness in their face because they're in their addiction
20:07
Speaker 3: in that moment, there's no breaking them out of that
20:09
Speaker 3: obsession with.
20:10
Speaker 1: That thing, right, exactly. I Hi, Kaya, I apologize. Kaya's
20:15
Speaker 1: on here too, your daughter.
20:16
Speaker 5: How much are you now, Kaya, I'm twenty three.
20:19
Speaker 1: Oh twenty three. That sounds so young, doesn't it. It
20:22
Speaker 1: sounds so yung so Kaya. In the series, you talk
20:26
Speaker 1: about how your mom protected you for the majority of it. Correct,
20:29
Speaker 1: you didn't really know what was going on and what
20:31
Speaker 1: she was dealing with emotionally, and so it wasn't really
20:34
Speaker 1: until when he contacted the high school where you were at.
20:37
Speaker 1: Is that when you kind of became aware of how
20:39
Speaker 1: serious it was and what was going on.
20:42
Speaker 5: Not exactly, I would say, my mom kept the details
20:45
Speaker 5: from me growing up, Okay, me knowing exactly what he
20:48
Speaker 5: was saying in the letters. Obviously I know what they
20:50
Speaker 5: are now, But it was one once I started becoming
20:54
Speaker 5: a teenager, you know, and I was going out with
20:56
Speaker 5: friends the mall across the stream from my high school,
20:59
Speaker 5: and even you know, getting into the later years of
21:01
Speaker 5: middle school, that I knew how serious it was. And
21:05
Speaker 5: really I feel like there was always an energy of,
21:09
Speaker 5: you know, how dangerous he was, that we needed to
21:12
Speaker 5: be cautious. So even though she wasn't detailing the you
21:16
Speaker 5: know what the letters were saying, there was always an
21:19
Speaker 5: energy around it that it was like I am in
21:21
Speaker 5: danger constantly when I'm out, even in the house, you know,
21:24
Speaker 5: there is someone lurking and trying to find us. So
21:27
Speaker 5: but once he called the high school, it just kind
21:30
Speaker 5: of crossed a whole other level where it was he
21:33
Speaker 5: now had access to me, where some place that I
21:36
Speaker 5: would be every day for eight hours a day, and
21:39
Speaker 5: where my friends were, where my teachers were, you know,
21:42
Speaker 5: and where I could be around and I had, you know,
21:45
Speaker 5: cheer practice. So it just kind of crossed a whole
21:48
Speaker 5: new line for me that I really didn't feel safe,
21:51
Speaker 5: and he was also pretending to be my dad, and
21:53
Speaker 5: you know that had all this information about me that
21:58
Speaker 5: I now couldn't protect myself and neither can cheat.
22:01
Speaker 2: Do we know how he located your school?
22:04
Speaker 5: I think through Instagram probably there was a photo where,
22:08
Speaker 5: you know, I think it was my my senior night
22:12
Speaker 5: and my dad and my mom had obviously my mom
22:14
Speaker 5: was there, but my dad had come out too, and
22:15
Speaker 5: there's a photo with me and them, and I have
22:18
Speaker 5: this big nd on my you know, cheer uniform, and
22:22
Speaker 5: it just sucks because that was just a celebratory day,
22:26
Speaker 5: you know, my senior night of high.
22:28
Speaker 1: School and you just want to post it and celebrate
22:31
Speaker 1: the evening.
22:32
Speaker 5: And both your there on her Instagram and it's just
22:35
Speaker 5: you know, you've.
22:37
Speaker 3: It's one of those ship ups when you're just not
22:39
Speaker 3: thinking about you know, you're just like living your life
22:43
Speaker 3: sor year.
22:44
Speaker 5: Yeah, and there's only two Notre Dames, so you know,
22:48
Speaker 5: there's Notre Dame Academy or Notre Dame High School and
22:50
Speaker 5: it's just like, you know, he right.
22:53
Speaker 1: He you know he might have called the other one too,
22:56
Speaker 1: who knows, you know, until he made a connection, you
22:59
Speaker 1: know that that that he was your dad. And then
23:02
Speaker 1: they they were asking you, right, didn't they come to you?
23:04
Speaker 1: Then they were like, your dad's here to get you
23:06
Speaker 1: or he's coming to get you or something like that.
23:08
Speaker 5: They called me into the front office and it's funny
23:11
Speaker 5: because I love my dad and he's very much a
23:13
Speaker 5: part of my life.
23:14
Speaker 1: But he lived in Palm Desert, so he was two
23:17
Speaker 1: hours away.
23:17
Speaker 5: He wasn't the he wasn't the first collar or the
23:19
Speaker 5: second color on the sheet list. So they called it
23:22
Speaker 5: and were like, hey, do you want to text your
23:24
Speaker 5: dad separate because like he's he's here or he's saying
23:28
Speaker 5: that you know he's gonna come pick you up, and
23:30
Speaker 5: it is kind of what led into me texting my mom,
23:33
Speaker 5: being like, there's no way he would have called my school.
23:35
Speaker 5: He would have called my mom first, or my mom's
23:37
Speaker 5: assistant or you know. So that kind of was the
23:40
Speaker 5: whole spiral of like this is so at a character.
23:43
Speaker 5: And then he had finally texted me back saying no,
23:46
Speaker 5: I didn't. It was like a light went off, like
23:49
Speaker 5: I just knew and I hadn't thought about him. He
23:52
Speaker 5: wasn't always at the forefront of my mind.
23:54
Speaker 3: You know, you can't live.
23:56
Speaker 5: In fear constantly, and so it was just kind of
23:59
Speaker 5: like this weird sub unders thought. It was like it's him,
24:01
Speaker 5: Like just alarm.
24:02
Speaker 3: Bells went off.
24:04
Speaker 1: Now Eva. I mean, I'm a mother too, And so
24:07
Speaker 1: when all this is going on and you have a daughter,
24:10
Speaker 1: what was it like on a daily basis, like just
24:12
Speaker 1: to try to protect her because you know, you want
24:14
Speaker 1: to give her freedom, you want to go out with
24:15
Speaker 1: her friends, you want her to go to cheerleading practice,
24:17
Speaker 1: you want her to be a normal teen, but you
24:19
Speaker 1: also aren't exactly normal because of the position that you're in.
24:23
Speaker 1: So what was it that you had to do on
24:24
Speaker 1: a daily basis to make sure that she was safe
24:26
Speaker 1: or that you felt like she was safe.
24:28
Speaker 3: That was the worst part of it, because, like you said,
24:31
Speaker 3: as moms, as parents, it's our that's our only job, right,
24:36
Speaker 3: your only job is to is to keep your kids
24:39
Speaker 3: safe and to make sure they make it through adulthood
24:42
Speaker 3: and all of the things. And I felt at a
24:44
Speaker 3: complete loss at times because you know, we ended up
24:47
Speaker 3: having to move twice when he ended up finding our address.
24:50
Speaker 3: We I did everything I could, you know, we were
24:54
Speaker 3: you know, a lot of people have said to me,
24:56
Speaker 3: well you know why, you know, didn't you have security
24:59
Speaker 3: or didn't you have Well, you know, some of the
25:01
Speaker 3: biggest stars on the planet have gazillions of dollars for security.
25:05
Speaker 3: Look at Brad Pitt and somebody ended up in his
25:07
Speaker 3: actual bed, got you know, Sandra Bullock and somebody she's
25:12
Speaker 3: crouched in her in her closet while somebody was in
25:15
Speaker 3: her rummaging through her kitchen. You know these it doesn't
25:18
Speaker 3: matter the amount of security. And of course I didn't
25:21
Speaker 3: have that kind of budget. I had whatever within my
25:26
Speaker 3: budget to secure myself with. But but it doesn't seem
25:30
Speaker 3: that that really matters in the end. So you're constantly
25:34
Speaker 3: scared to death, not just for yourself, but for your child,
25:37
Speaker 3: because you know, when they get to be a teenager,
25:40
Speaker 3: they're out doing stuff they probably shouldn't be doing anyway,
25:43
Speaker 3: and they're outside of your realm of constant surveillance. So
25:49
Speaker 3: all you do is pray and you hope that uh.
25:52
Speaker 3: And I had to try to keep her as aware
25:54
Speaker 3: as I could without the actual words of the letters
25:59
Speaker 3: in form in her head, because I just couldn't, and
26:04
Speaker 3: you know, as it was, she was already anxious all
26:07
Speaker 3: the time.
26:07
Speaker 1: So yeah, now I would just assume that on a
26:10
Speaker 1: daily basis, you're constantly on the lookout, Like every time
26:13
Speaker 1: you go into your house or leave your house. Are
26:16
Speaker 1: you just constantly aware of your surroundings all the time?
26:19
Speaker 3: Yeah, And every time you walk into the house, you're
26:21
Speaker 3: constantly afraid of what you might find, what you might encounter,
26:24
Speaker 3: what you know you just never know, And so it's
26:28
Speaker 3: a hyper vigilance that is really interesting. I just found
26:31
Speaker 3: this study just last week. They did a study on
26:36
Speaker 3: women's specifically who had either dealt with some sort of
26:40
Speaker 3: violence or stalking specifically, or some sort of major trauma
26:45
Speaker 3: that they would have to be hyper aware for the
26:47
Speaker 3: rest of their lives, and they're at a higher rate
26:51
Speaker 3: of stroke of heart failure of all these different because
26:56
Speaker 3: of the hyper vigilance. Your body just can't stay on
27:00
Speaker 3: that level of energy all the.
27:02
Speaker 1: Time, right, I mean, that's not normal. It's not to
27:05
Speaker 1: have to function at that type of level all the time.
27:08
Speaker 1: I can't imagine. I mean, the heart rate up all
27:11
Speaker 1: the time, and just the hyper like you said, the
27:13
Speaker 1: hyper vigilance, that's not normal. You never have the opportunity
27:16
Speaker 1: to relax your mind ever, which we need as humans,
27:20
Speaker 1: and you don't have the opportunity to do that. Now
27:22
Speaker 1: Now that he's gone to prison and he's been released,
27:27
Speaker 1: I mean, was the was the fear alleviated when he
27:29
Speaker 1: went to prison? Did you feel any sense of justice?
27:34
Speaker 3: It's interesting because freedom finally, or we had that sweet
27:38
Speaker 3: spot of freedom where we really could relax. We knew
27:41
Speaker 3: where he was for three years, and so that was
27:45
Speaker 3: a really beautiful sweet spot. But and it was interesting
27:49
Speaker 3: because it was it was a precedent setting case for
27:52
Speaker 3: the FBI. It was the first ever adjudicated case with
27:56
Speaker 3: forensics genealogy, which was this brand new technology that our
28:01
Speaker 3: heroes the two Steves created while solving the Golden State
28:05
Speaker 3: killer case, and so our US attorneys, the two women
28:11
Speaker 3: who represented us were while they were excited that he
28:16
Speaker 3: got anything, because they were afraid he would get nothing. Really,
28:22
Speaker 3: I think they weren't as I think they weren't as
28:25
Speaker 3: verbal with me about it beforehand. I think they were
28:30
Speaker 3: more afraid that he wasn't going to He was just
28:32
Speaker 3: really going to get absolutely nothing, and they didn't tell
28:36
Speaker 3: me that beforehand. So when he got three and a
28:38
Speaker 3: half years, they seemed to be happy, like, oh, thank god,
28:42
Speaker 3: and I was like, what do you mean thank god? Here?
28:45
Speaker 3: I was like, how did he not get three years?
28:47
Speaker 3: And three years? There's two of us. Not only that,
28:50
Speaker 3: but he threatened to kill my ex husband and unfortunately
28:53
Speaker 3: his letters were outside you know, they were statute of limitations,
28:56
Speaker 3: so it had already been seven years and they were
28:58
Speaker 3: outside jurisdiction. But that doesn't take away from the fact
29:02
Speaker 3: that he threatened to kill my ex husband. That doesn't
29:04
Speaker 3: take away from the fact that he threatened to kill
29:06
Speaker 3: any administrator, teacher, and student at Kaya's school. That doesn't
29:12
Speaker 3: take away from the fact that, I mean, we know
29:14
Speaker 3: that there were other there were other women that he
29:16
Speaker 3: was stalking that unfortunately wouldn't come forward. And I understand why,
29:20
Speaker 3: because when they when that kind of violent attention is
29:27
Speaker 3: attached to you and it finally goes away.
29:31
Speaker 1: You you don't want to go backwards.
29:33
Speaker 3: You don't want you don't want to poke the bear.
29:35
Speaker 3: You don't want to come forward. You want it to
29:36
Speaker 3: be gone and done. And so I see why people
29:40
Speaker 3: have never done a documentary on it, and I see
29:42
Speaker 3: why people don't even come forward to prosecute it, because
29:45
Speaker 3: they just want it to be over right. And so
29:50
Speaker 3: another girl, and it's not my story to tell, so
29:52
Speaker 3: I won't say who she is, but another girl from
29:56
Speaker 3: One Life to Live, a young girl. Her mom called
29:59
Speaker 3: me day and said, are you getting letters from Freddy Krueger?
30:03
Speaker 3: Because my daughter's getting letters and they're saying if you
30:06
Speaker 3: don't believe, if he's saying, if you don't believe, I'm
30:08
Speaker 3: going to do what I'm saying, I'm gonna do, just
30:10
Speaker 3: ask Ivlarush knows I mean business. So I don't know
30:13
Speaker 3: how long she was getting those letters, but the FBI
30:15
Speaker 3: contacted her when we were getting ready to prosecute, and
30:20
Speaker 3: and she didn't return calls. So but she would have
30:25
Speaker 3: he would have gotten more time, you know what I mean.
30:28
Speaker 2: So it was a correlation. It was the same suspect,
30:31
Speaker 2: the same suspect. Yeah, same Staler, Yeah, same stocker.
30:35
Speaker 1: Now the genealogy, the genetic the DNA, that's really interesting.
30:39
Speaker 1: First of all, it's it's so interesting that you were
30:41
Speaker 1: on CSI Miami and that was what like the irony
30:43
Speaker 1: of it isn't right lost on me.
30:45
Speaker 2: That that was your job.
30:47
Speaker 3: You were a specialist, right, And then in real life
30:52
Speaker 3: we were here, we were pretending to have a technology
30:54
Speaker 3: that we would not have for twelve more years.
30:57
Speaker 1: Right, And so we actually just did an episoded a
31:00
Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago on the Golden State Killer, and
31:02
Speaker 1: that was so interesting for us to talk about. When
31:05
Speaker 1: you run the DNA through codis, which I'm sure they
31:07
Speaker 1: did because I assume they got the DNA from the
31:09
Speaker 1: envelope and the stamp and everything they were right, and
31:12
Speaker 1: they run it into the databases and then nothing comes up.
31:16
Speaker 1: Now they've been able to do that and to put
31:17
Speaker 1: it into like twenty three and meters and ancestry and
31:20
Speaker 1: all those things, and then I know it's very complicated.
31:22
Speaker 1: I know, forensic expert at all, But I do understand
31:26
Speaker 1: that they kind of find someone related, they make a
31:29
Speaker 1: family tree, they do all the and then I guess
31:31
Speaker 1: they found, you know, some things that correlated with what
31:34
Speaker 1: he had been writing to you, so they narrowed, you know,
31:37
Speaker 1: they zeroed in on him, and that's how they found him.
31:40
Speaker 1: But anyway, I just I feel like that's new technology,
31:44
Speaker 1: but it's going to become more prevalent, because we've been
31:46
Speaker 1: talking about it a lot lately. Is how now they're
31:49
Speaker 1: using these genetic databases, which is very interesting.
31:51
Speaker 3: It's incredible what the guys did. We called them lovingly,
31:55
Speaker 3: we call them Steve Squared because there's two Steve's, so
31:58
Speaker 3: Steve Kramer and Steve and they were both with the FBI.
32:01
Speaker 3: Steve Kramer was a lawyer with the FBI, and Steve
32:04
Speaker 3: Bush had been head of SWAT and he had had
32:08
Speaker 3: an horrible, tragic accident. It almost killed him. It ripped
32:12
Speaker 3: his back in half and he wasn't even supposed to survive,
32:17
Speaker 3: but he got kind of patched back together and he
32:20
Speaker 3: ended up being stuck on a desk and his friend,
32:23
Speaker 3: Steve Kramer had been a big fan of Michelle McNamara
32:29
Speaker 3: and Michelle McNamara was the one who was a journalist
32:32
Speaker 3: who had coined the phrase Golden State Killer, because before
32:36
Speaker 3: Golden State Killer had been the Vicelia Ransacker, the the
32:41
Speaker 3: Hillside Strangler, east Side Strangler, at one right, all these things,
32:45
Speaker 3: because he had he had killed and raped and all
32:49
Speaker 3: the thing all over California. Well, he ended up seeing
32:54
Speaker 3: a podcast she did read an article that she wrote
32:57
Speaker 3: for the La Times, and called Paul Hull, who was
33:00
Speaker 3: the investigator on the case at the time and had
33:02
Speaker 3: been for like, you know, twenty plus years, and said,
33:06
Speaker 3: I'm with the FBI. Is there anything that we can
33:08
Speaker 3: do to help you? Is there? Maybe We've got some
33:11
Speaker 3: tools that you don't have. And Paul Hols was like, sure,
33:14
Speaker 3: come on board, and so they kind of created this
33:16
Speaker 3: little ragtag team of about six people. Kramer pulled on
33:20
Speaker 3: Steve Bush and said, you know, you're stuck on a
33:23
Speaker 3: you want to do this with me? The FBI said
33:25
Speaker 3: you are absolutely not allowed to do this on FBI time.
33:28
Speaker 3: It's not you know, I didn't know this. I'm sure
33:30
Speaker 3: you two do know this, but murder is not FBI jurisdiction.
33:35
Speaker 1: I don't know if I did you know that.
33:37
Speaker 3: I did not sure. If it's part of a Rico case,
33:43
Speaker 3: part of a trafficking case, then yes, but murder.
33:48
Speaker 2: Is local artfice, your local murder is yeah, for your
33:51
Speaker 2: sheriff department.
33:52
Speaker 3: So he said, you know, so the FBI said, you
33:56
Speaker 3: can do this on your off time if you want
33:58
Speaker 3: to stay basically worked weekends doing this thing. And it
34:02
Speaker 3: was Steve Kramer who said it was the advent of
34:05
Speaker 3: twenty three and meters and ancestry dot com and jedmatch,
34:08
Speaker 3: and he said, this is a whole new pool of
34:11
Speaker 3: genetics of DNA that we didn't have before because, like
34:14
Speaker 3: you said, all we had was CODIS that was the
34:16
Speaker 3: only DNA base for all law enforcement. And he said,
34:21
Speaker 3: I know it's going to take some time until enough
34:23
Speaker 3: people actually upload their DNA into It's going to take
34:27
Speaker 3: some years, but I think we can do this. So
34:29
Speaker 3: it took them four or five years. But and I
34:33
Speaker 3: think here's the thing too. A lot of people wrongly think, oh,
34:36
Speaker 3: I would never put my DNA in those databases because
34:39
Speaker 3: now law enforcement and insurance company, me and everybody will
34:44
Speaker 3: have my information. But it's actually not true. They are vaults.
34:47
Speaker 3: They don't share with law enforcement. They don't share with
34:49
Speaker 3: anyone unless you check the box that says I want
34:53
Speaker 3: to find other family members. If you wanted to find
34:56
Speaker 3: other family members, then you've made yourself public. Now you
34:58
Speaker 3: made yourself public.
35:00
Speaker 1: Right, and everyone clicks, I want to find my other family.
35:03
Speaker 3: They do, like what was data up to in the
35:05
Speaker 3: sixth race, you know, so they do, and then after
35:08
Speaker 3: a few years there was enough millions more data points
35:12
Speaker 3: and you know, DNA points that when they uploaded the
35:15
Speaker 3: Golden State killers DNA into these databases, they got they
35:18
Speaker 3: got a hit on a fifth cousin, and then they
35:21
Speaker 3: just reverse engineer.
35:22
Speaker 1: They just you know, they made like the family tree
35:24
Speaker 1: and they work their way down to other members then
35:27
Speaker 1: until they do zero you.
35:29
Speaker 3: Know, gumshoe detective stuff and knock on doors and say
35:32
Speaker 3: who do you know? And that's what they were doing
35:34
Speaker 3: with my stocker. So my case was the very next
35:37
Speaker 3: case they picked up after they solved Golden State, because
35:40
Speaker 3: the FBI had said to them, well, that was a
35:42
Speaker 3: nice fluke, good for you. You'll never replicate it. It's
35:45
Speaker 3: not a technology is not replicable, and they said, just
35:48
Speaker 3: give us a case, and yeah, and they picked up
35:51
Speaker 3: my case next, and they said again, it's not FBI
35:55
Speaker 3: just you may not do this on FBI time. And
35:59
Speaker 3: they just did it to tell the story about eating
36:02
Speaker 3: chips and guac and beer on the weekends and making
36:05
Speaker 3: this family tree and finding our stalker. It was really incredible.
36:08
Speaker 3: They solved our case in two weeks after they got it,
36:10
Speaker 3: after twelve years of being cold.
36:12
Speaker 1: So when they came to you and gave you a name,
36:14
Speaker 1: what was that feeling like? When you add a name
36:17
Speaker 1: a photo, you could see what this guy looked like,
36:18
Speaker 1: who he was, you knew where he lived.
36:20
Speaker 2: What was that like?
36:22
Speaker 3: It was? I can't even describe the amount of emotions.
36:27
Speaker 3: We sobbed tears of relief and joy and disbelief and gratitude,
36:36
Speaker 3: and it was all of it, you know what I mean?
36:40
Speaker 3: It was everything at once.
36:42
Speaker 1: Now, did you think at some point that it was
36:44
Speaker 1: someone that you knew that could be someone close by?
36:47
Speaker 1: Was that was that what you thought? Someone near you,
36:50
Speaker 1: someone in your inner circle maybe? Or did you always
36:53
Speaker 1: think it was just some random person out somewhere.
36:56
Speaker 3: No, At one point we thought it could even be
36:59
Speaker 3: our our landscaper. We thought at one point it was
37:02
Speaker 3: maybe our neighbor. At one point we thought we because
37:07
Speaker 3: we had no face, no name, no identity. It could
37:10
Speaker 3: be anyone anywhere.
37:12
Speaker 2: Right, everywhere you went, you always had fear exrightly, I
37:16
Speaker 2: mean different levels of fear. But if a gentleman was
37:19
Speaker 2: following you but organically, and he was an innocent person,
37:23
Speaker 2: you didn't know if that was him exactly. You didn't
37:25
Speaker 2: know if he was following you or if he just
37:27
Speaker 2: happy to be shopping in the same area. Right, So
37:29
Speaker 2: it was always worrisome for you, right.
37:31
Speaker 3: Right, We were always on high Hilert.
37:35
Speaker 1: So, now that he's spent time in prison and he's
37:37
Speaker 1: been released, has there has he did he have to
37:40
Speaker 1: do any kind of therapy or anything? Was he ordered
37:42
Speaker 1: to do any mental health type of therapy or were
37:46
Speaker 1: they just like, you served your time, now you're done.
37:49
Speaker 3: Well, he was ordered by the court at the time
37:51
Speaker 3: when he was sentenced. He'd been in therapy while he
37:55
Speaker 3: was waiting trial, and he'd been on and then they
37:58
Speaker 3: put him on meds. So in his statement in court,
38:03
Speaker 3: he said, I wish I wish I'd been caught sooner.
38:07
Speaker 3: We're like, yeah too, I wish I'd been grit sooner.
38:10
Speaker 3: I wish I had therapy sooner. I wish I'd been
38:12
Speaker 3: on meds sooner because I realize now how much I
38:15
Speaker 3: needed all these things, which is great. But you know,
38:19
Speaker 3: now that he's released, he's on three years of probation.
38:21
Speaker 3: He's got a restraining order, but is there he only
38:24
Speaker 3: has to check in every two weeks with his probation officer.
38:28
Speaker 3: Is anybody keeping him on his meds? We all know
38:30
Speaker 3: people go on and off their meds all the time.
38:32
Speaker 3: And is he staying in therapy? Like who's paying for that?
38:35
Speaker 3: I don't know, Like maybe he's not. Now I have
38:38
Speaker 3: no idea what kind of maintenance he's meant to stay on.
38:42
Speaker 1: You know, kaya how do you knowing now as an adult,
38:53
Speaker 1: what your mom went through all those years? I mean,
38:55
Speaker 1: how do you feel about everything she went through and
38:57
Speaker 1: how she handled it? Do you have thoughts on it?
39:00
Speaker 1: I mean, I as a mom and I have a daughter,
39:02
Speaker 1: I just think you're so brave and what you went
39:04
Speaker 1: through and still going to work, still trying to be
39:08
Speaker 1: the best mom possible, still trying to give your daughter
39:10
Speaker 1: a normal life, still allowing her to go to high
39:12
Speaker 1: school and be a cheerleader and all the things, and
39:14
Speaker 1: having to deal with that mentally and physically and emotionally
39:18
Speaker 1: and take care of her like it's just so in
39:21
Speaker 1: brave of you and just that's what moms do. I mean,
39:24
Speaker 1: that's what we just right do, right And.
39:26
Speaker 3: It's funny that you that you say brave, because when
39:28
Speaker 3: I hear that, I think, God, I wish I had
39:31
Speaker 3: felt that in the moment, you know what I mean,
39:32
Speaker 3: I wish I had felt brave. But in reality, you
39:38
Speaker 3: do what must be done because there's no other way, right.
39:41
Speaker 5: Right, I feel like now being a young woman and
39:46
Speaker 5: a young adult, being able to separate who you know,
39:51
Speaker 5: just her as my mom to woman to woman, it
39:54
Speaker 5: is really amazing, you know what she went through, how
39:57
Speaker 5: she got through. There's so many times I look through,
39:59
Speaker 5: you know, like my childhood, I'm like, I don't even
40:02
Speaker 5: know how you got through the days. And you made
40:05
Speaker 5: my childhood so magical, Like my my childhood really, you know,
40:09
Speaker 5: for a lot of it did feel so innocent and
40:12
Speaker 5: fun and like, you know, even though there was this
40:15
Speaker 5: looming darkness and over precaution and you know, awareness, there was.
40:19
Speaker 3: Still like I still felt like a kid.
40:21
Speaker 5: And I could you know, believe in Santa and I
40:25
Speaker 5: could you know, believe in the Easter.
40:26
Speaker 3: Bunny for a long time, like it.
40:27
Speaker 5: Didn't taint she she made sure that it didn't taint
40:30
Speaker 5: the rest of like the whimsy and magic of my
40:33
Speaker 5: childhood and my upbringing. And you know, she was always
40:37
Speaker 5: the person that was so like, everyone come over on
40:39
Speaker 5: Fridays and we'll get ready for the cheer gains. You know,
40:41
Speaker 5: she would help curl everyone's hair for the team and
40:45
Speaker 5: help new makeup and put lashes on. And you know,
40:48
Speaker 5: my mom, you know that spirits so high.
40:51
Speaker 2: That's great parenting to protect you from all the evil
40:55
Speaker 2: but yet allow you to have freedom to grow and
40:58
Speaker 2: thrive and develop and all that. Yet she protected you
41:02
Speaker 2: not so much that you weren't aware of, you know,
41:05
Speaker 2: being defensive of yourself and protecting your own self that
41:08
Speaker 2: there is harm out there, but she really protected you
41:10
Speaker 2: from any actual harm coming in your way and preventing
41:13
Speaker 2: you from being a child.
41:14
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.
41:15
Speaker 5: So I really loved my upbringing in my life and yeah,
41:18
Speaker 5: it is all thanks to my mom.
41:20
Speaker 1: So she's a bad ass. So now, how did how
41:23
Speaker 1: did the docuseries come about? Was that your idea evo?
41:26
Speaker 1: Or did someone approach you? And did you hesitate at
41:28
Speaker 1: all about doing it? Because I know you have to
41:29
Speaker 1: relive it. You have to go back and talk about
41:31
Speaker 1: the letters. You have to talk about this man. You
41:33
Speaker 1: have to bring attention to him. Did you hesitate in
41:36
Speaker 1: doing it or was it more empowering to talk about it?
41:39
Speaker 1: Because I find it empowering as a woman. It made me,
41:42
Speaker 1: I tell you, after I watched it, it made me
41:44
Speaker 1: feel a lot more like I need to be more
41:47
Speaker 1: aware of my surroundings and things.
41:49
Speaker 3: Oh good, I'm glad, thank you. I we did. We
41:53
Speaker 3: did go back and forth about whether or not we
41:55
Speaker 3: should do a documentary. I'd originally taken it out as
41:58
Speaker 3: a scripted series and me because I needed that buffer,
42:03
Speaker 3: And then it did. But the whole story hadn't been
42:06
Speaker 3: told yet, because when I took it out as scripted,
42:09
Speaker 3: he wasn't out of jail yet and everything had not
42:12
Speaker 3: come to its complete fruition. So I'm glad that it
42:15
Speaker 3: didn't get picked up then, and the story wasn't being
42:18
Speaker 3: told exactly the way I wanted it to be told.
42:20
Speaker 3: So when the opportunity came to do it as a documentary,
42:25
Speaker 3: I thought, Wow, that's really real, and that's really close
42:29
Speaker 3: to and do I want to poke this bear? Because
42:32
Speaker 3: he was now out of jail, like this opportunity came
42:35
Speaker 3: and he had just been released, and not only had
42:36
Speaker 3: been released, but at the time, in not twelve years,
42:40
Speaker 3: we never knew if he was in California or not
42:43
Speaker 3: if he was because in all the letters he was saying,
42:45
Speaker 3: I'm around the corner, I'm watching you, I'm watching you
42:48
Speaker 3: leave work. And so we found out that he'd never
42:52
Speaker 3: left the state of Ohio. All of a sudden, he's
42:56
Speaker 3: being released from prison and they released him ten miles
42:59
Speaker 3: from my house in California. Oh wow, they were using
43:03
Speaker 3: taxpayer dollars to set him up right by his victims.
43:07
Speaker 3: It made not one speck of sense. It took us
43:10
Speaker 3: three months of lobbying, and he just got released last November,
43:13
Speaker 3: so this is a year ago. It took three months
43:15
Speaker 3: of lobbying with my US attorneys, my FBI agents, and
43:19
Speaker 3: everybody possible to get him moved back to Ohio.
43:24
Speaker 1: That is insanity to me to think that this man
43:27
Speaker 1: harassed you from Ohio and then he's released from prison
43:30
Speaker 1: in California, but they don't make sure that he ends
43:32
Speaker 1: up back in Ohio. They just release him into California, right,
43:35
Speaker 1: and they're like, and here you go and where he stayed.
43:39
Speaker 3: And he has. And then I said, I said to them, well,
43:42
Speaker 3: then give me his address, because he can find my
43:45
Speaker 3: address now that he's in California. And they were like, oh, no, no, no,
43:51
Speaker 3: he has rights? Oh does he? Because I don't see
43:55
Speaker 3: why he should have rights. To be honest, where are
43:58
Speaker 3: my rights? I should be able to know where he
44:00
Speaker 3: lives if he knows where I live?
44:03
Speaker 1: Right, So I'm going to assume ever since that he's
44:05
Speaker 1: gone to prison and been released from prison, you've had
44:07
Speaker 1: no contact. He hasn't attempted to contact you at all.
44:11
Speaker 3: There's a restraining order, so and he's still on probation,
44:14
Speaker 3: so there's no contact for him during this three years.
44:20
Speaker 3: And he's a year into that three years. But I'm
44:23
Speaker 3: sure he is none too pleased about this documentary. And
44:27
Speaker 3: you know, here's the scary thing. He was. They talked
44:32
Speaker 3: a little bit about what he did for a living,
44:34
Speaker 3: but he was a nurse in a memory care facility.
44:38
Speaker 3: So lord knows what was happening to these people's hate
44:44
Speaker 3: parents who at night, late at night with a person
44:49
Speaker 3: who's got those kind of depraved thoughts right and is
44:54
Speaker 3: willing to act on them.
44:57
Speaker 1: That's a scary thought.
44:58
Speaker 3: Yeah, and with people who won't remember because it's a
45:01
Speaker 3: memory care facility, so what will they know, right and
45:04
Speaker 3: who won't believe them exactly?
45:06
Speaker 1: Well, you know what, thank you Eva for coming on,
45:08
Speaker 1: and thank you Kaya for being here today and sharing
45:11
Speaker 1: your story. Just one last question, is there anything that,
45:14
Speaker 1: like I was saying as a woman, I watched it
45:16
Speaker 1: and now I kind of took away that I need
45:18
Speaker 1: to be more vigilant about what's going on around me.
45:21
Speaker 1: What would you hope that women take away from this?
45:24
Speaker 3: For me? I think it's knowing that you're not alone.
45:26
Speaker 3: Because there's thirteen point five million women, men and children
45:32
Speaker 3: that are stocked every year. And that's just in the
45:34
Speaker 3: United States. That's an insane number. And that's across all
45:37
Speaker 3: social media. It's also DV domestic violence victims. Right now,
45:44
Speaker 3: there's no We just did an interview with someone who
45:48
Speaker 3: told us that her niece's best friend was just murdered
45:52
Speaker 3: last week by her ex boyfriend, who had stocked her
45:54
Speaker 3: for six months. He had six prior restraining orders. He
45:58
Speaker 3: had stopped all six of the ex girlfriends yet and
46:01
Speaker 3: it changed states, moved from state to state with each
46:03
Speaker 3: new girlfriend. And yet he was never tracked or traced.
46:06
Speaker 3: So there absolutely needs to be a database, a national
46:12
Speaker 3: database for stalkers. Because the other statistic is of all
46:16
Speaker 3: the women murdered in the United States last year, eighty
46:19
Speaker 3: six percent were stocked first. So this is a crime.
46:24
Speaker 3: It's considered the crimeless crime stocking because the crime hasn't
46:27
Speaker 3: happened yet. You're just threatened with something, which is why
46:30
Speaker 3: the law enforcement, local law enforcement has their hands kind
46:33
Speaker 3: of tied because nothing's really happened yet. But we know
46:36
Speaker 3: that stalking escalates. We know eighty six percent of the
46:40
Speaker 3: time it's going to escalate into murder, and more often
46:44
Speaker 3: it escalates into rape or some sort of bodily harm.
46:47
Speaker 3: So it's just a matter of time before this crime
46:49
Speaker 3: becomes a crime, and it has to be taken more
46:51
Speaker 3: series and there has to be more stringent sentencing.
46:55
Speaker 1: Exactly right. Well, thank you for sharing your story. I
47:00
Speaker 1: was very brave of you to do that, and kaya
47:02
Speaker 1: you as well. You're very young, but I feel like
47:05
Speaker 1: you're like an old soul because of everything that you've
47:07
Speaker 1: had to go through. I'm sure that you're just mature
47:10
Speaker 1: beyond your years because of what you've had to deal with.
47:13
Speaker 1: But thank you so much both of you for coming
47:14
Speaker 1: onto legally Brunette today and sharing your story.
47:17
Speaker 3: Thanks for having us. Thank you so much of.
47:19
Speaker 1: Course, thanks and nice meeting you.
47:21
Speaker 3: Nice meeting you too.
47:24
Speaker 1: A big thank you to Eva LaRue and her daughter
47:26
Speaker 1: Kaya for coming on legally Brunette today and sharing their story. Again,
47:30
Speaker 1: you guys, if you want to watch, it's called My
47:32
Speaker 1: Nightmare Stalker. It's that Eva LaRue story. It is on
47:36
Speaker 1: Paramount Plus. It's a two part series and it's really interesting.
47:39
Speaker 1: And I also think it's very important what she said
47:41
Speaker 1: there at the end about stricter stalking laws. I mean,
47:45
Speaker 1: it is very true when someone is a stalker and
47:47
Speaker 1: they're repeatedly stalking, there's not a lot of criminal charges
47:52
Speaker 1: or it's just.
47:53
Speaker 2: It's just someone being scary.
47:56
Speaker 1: It's exactly. And then they just get away with it
47:58
Speaker 1: and get away with it and get away with it.
48:00
Speaker 1: And that statistic that she said was really enlightening. The
48:02
Speaker 1: eighty six percent of women end.
48:04
Speaker 2: Up being Yeah, she was an exception to the cool.
48:07
Speaker 1: Absolutely. Also, thank you guys for following legally Brunette. We're
48:11
Speaker 1: on our own feed, so if you haven't found us there,
48:13
Speaker 1: please make sure you do so you can find legally
48:15
Speaker 1: Brunette wherever. You listen to podcasts and we appreciate you
48:18
Speaker 1: guys listening. And as always, I love it when you
48:21
Speaker 1: guys send me DMS and suggests cases. You give me
48:23
Speaker 1: feedback and opinions and I love to read it, so
48:26
Speaker 1: please continue to do that. Thank you guys so much
48:29
Speaker 1: for listening. We appreciate you.
48:30
Speaker 2: Thank you,