Latest / Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast) / From a Failing Business & Debt to a $100M Fashion Business, Meet Showpo’s Jane Lu (aka The Lazy CEO) (Part 1)

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From a Failing Business & Debt to a $100M Fashion Business, Meet Showpo’s Jane Lu (aka The Lazy CEO) (Part 1) · Imagine If with Doone Roisin | Health, Wealth & Wisdom for Women (formerly Female Startup Club Podcast)

• 0:00
  This is Jane Liu for Female Startup Club. Hello, everyone. Welcome back to the show. It's Dune here, your host and hype girl. If you've just found us, welcome, welcome, welcome. Every week, we're learning from some of the world's most brilliant minds in business, like Jane Liu, the founder of Shopo.
• 0:29
  Jane's story is so inspiring and it is full of ups and downs. And what really stood out to me was her sheer determination to succeed and the absolute resilience to keep going no matter what, because failure just wasn't an option.
• 0:48
  I came off of this episode feeling so inspired and I know you will too. Jane is the queen of building a business while also having serious fun along the way. And she shares so many gems to building this company to $100 million in revenue. And I'm so excited for you to hear it. Also stick around to the end where she shares some of her crazy stories that are going to make you seriously lol.
• 1:15
  But before we jump in, quick reminder on the Girl Code. You know we love it when you help us out with these tiny actions. Podcast review, sharing on social, sending it to a friend, putting a good vibe into the air, whatever it might be. We love it when you stick to the Girl Code. Thank you so much for everyone who's
• 1:31
  doing it now. And side note, you might've heard this in the last episode, but I'm mentioning it again. Now I'm doing a call out for our loyal listeners to be involved in a new content series where you DM us a voice note about something to do with business or something to do with life or something to do with relationships to feature on the show. You can send it to me personally on Instagram or through Female Startup Club's Instagram, but you just need to DM a voice
• 2:01
  If you have any questions, ask the questions, but basically DM us a voice note of something that you want featured on the show. And then we're going to record mini episodes to chat through those topics and questions. And I'm so excited. Okay, let's get into today's episode. This is Jane for Female Startup Club. Jane! Dude! Welcome to the Female Startup Club podcast. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited.
• 2:29
  I love the sign in the background. I feel like for anyone who's not watching this on YouTube, the lazy CEO, where did you come up with that? So it was, well, first of all, Jane Lou was taken. So I was like, crap, what do I do? No, I honestly was just like, I need a...
• 2:47
  I feel like I got on Instagram quite late. Really? Yeah, the ShowPo Instagram account at the very start, and now we've got 1.8 million followers, humble brag. We start off being an account full of like my travel pics, photos of me and my boyfriend, now husband, you know, with the vignette framing, you know. Yeah.
• 3:10
  And for so long, it was just the same account because I thought everything was still on Facebook. And it was just like, I might as well start this Instagram account. And then very, I think it was 2015, which I think is late for Instagram. Because I felt like some of our competitors already had two, 300,000 followers. And then I was like, I should probably create my own Instagram account. What should I call it? The Lazy. Anyway, I thought of the Lazy CEO.
• 3:40
  you know, love what you do and you never have to work. So, you know, I'm lazy because I never work. Also, I love the, I think it's Bill Gates. That's like, if you want something done efficiently, give it to a lazy person.
• 3:54
  Oh, my God. I love that. Yeah. So key. How's your day going? Have you had any wins or oh shit moments to share about, vent about rather? Oh, God. Today started pretty well. I had a mum's group dinner and drank a lot and I woke up without a hangover. I'm like, thank God I've got this podcast today.
• 4:14
  But I feel great. So I think that's a win. It's Friday. That's exciting. And Friday is always fun at work. We get a bit silly. We start drinking at 3 o'clock. Okay, I'm not an alcoholic. This is not too well.
• 4:30
  And how's your day? My day is so great. Now I'm talking with you. These are easily the best moments of my day when I get to have these fun conversations. So I'm excited to get into it. I feel like I know a lot about your story. I've heard you speak. I've heard you on podcasts. I've known you for a very long time. Love your story. And I'm really excited for anyone who might not have heard it yet, especially our listeners who are kind of overseas in the US. Where do you like to start your entrepreneurial story?
• 4:58
  Oh, I know. Sometimes I can get really deep, really early. So you just give me this wind it up signal. No, let's do deep. Let's not wind it up. Okay. Because I think to give it context, I do need to go back quite a bit. Yeah. So I had no fashion or retail experience. I was an accountant working. So straight out of high school, I got jobs working for the big four. So...
• 5:21
  working at KPMG. And then after that went to Ernst & Young. And I honestly, I didn't even realize early enough that I actually hate accounting because even when I went for the job, I didn't even know what accounting was. I was just like, oh my God, corporate job, wear a suit, salary, high rise buildings, men in suits. This is so exciting.
• 5:44
  Anyway, so I did at some point realize, oh, wow, accounting sucks. It's so boring. And then at that time, a friend came to me and was like, let's start a business. And I was like, oh, that's so exciting, blah, blah, blah. Like, I don't care whatever it is. Let's just do it. So she had a finance background. But for some reason, she was like, let's start a pop-up store. So we started these pop-up stores selling products from emerging designers. And it was literally like going around to like...
• 6:13
  you know, markets, handing out these fake, not fake business cards, but like without, you know, where you have title CEO. And then trying to pretend it's like a much bigger business, getting people to stock with us. Anyway, so we started running these pop-up stores.
• 6:31
  It was just so much manual work. It wasn't – the swords were breaking even. And then my friend was like, oh, you should quit your job so we can work on it full time. And then I was just really hating my job. So it wasn't like –
• 6:47
  that I was so passionate about the business. I just really kind of hated my job. So I think I was like using it. On the one hand, I was like, oh, she convinced me to quit. But I think I just really wanted to get out. And I think it was the start of the middle of the global financial crisis. People were starting to get me redundant. So I was like, oh, I don't want to like get fired. Maybe I'll quit first, which is stupid because I should have like waited for it. Should have waited for that redundancy package. That could have been seed capital. But anyway, never mind. Live and learn.
• 7:16
  So I quit my job and I started in that first month building a website because I'm like, this pop-up store was so much work because it's not a regular pop-up store that could run for a few weeks or like a few months. We were popping up on the daily inside a bar because they were not using – because we were like, okay, this is a high foot traffic area next to the main shopping center in Sydney, like Pitsbury Mall.
• 7:39
  And so it was getting high for traffic and then we were able to get cheap rent because they weren't using it during the day because it's only popular at night. And we would bring them people, you know, we would actually bring people into the bar. So it was a win-win. But we were physically setting up all the racks, all the clothes, just to sell for that day. How much money would you make like on a day? Maybe like $2,000, $3,000. It was just breaking even. Mm-hmm.
• 8:03
  And so we're just not – and, you know, at that stage, you also don't take a salary. So it's not profitable when you actually factor in all the labour. And were you buying the stock up front or – No. So because we were approaching emerging designers, we approached them with a consignment model, which meant that we took all of their stock and we only paid them after it sold. And I'm glad you asked because this is important because it actually then helped me with the show pro business.
• 8:32
  And so it was great because we had this like, I guess, because they were emerging designers, they were just looking for new ways to get stockists because they couldn't just easily get stockists and we didn't have any money. So it was a win-win. So anyway, when I quit my job, I spent that whole month building a website because I was like, this pop-up model is not sustainable. If we actually built it online, then we could...
• 8:55
  So many more people. A lot of people, we were getting a lot of, I guess, travelers that were like popping in to, you know, shopping the CBD. I'm like, well, they can still keep shopping from us when they go home. This is back in 2010, by the way. Yeah, this is early e-com days. Australia was like, I feel like 2012 is when, you know, people started to even learn about e-commerce. Yeah.
• 9:20
  The website took me like a month to build, took photos of everything. It was built on Wix, which isn't even mobile compatible. Like I didn't think about this at the time. It was on Flash. I didn't even think about those things at the time. Anyway, so coincidentally, this business partner went overseas for a holiday. So when she came home, I was like, oh my God, I can't wait to show you what I've been doing. I've been building this website where like this is going to be...
• 9:44
  like a game changer. And she was like, actually, you know, I've been thinking, I don't want to do it anymore. And she had actually been secretly job hunting. I just, I know. Meanwhile, I've just quit my job. Anyway. And then she, I was like, just look at the website. Let's just give it a go. And she's like, no, I'm done. Refused to look at the website. Told me that no one shops online.
• 10:10
  Like no one shops online. I was like, oh my God, I was so devastated. So, so, so devastated because I've just like given up everything because I've been really academic at school. My parents, you know, we immigrated from China when I was eight. So there's that immigrant philosophy of like, all you want is job security, financial security. And to do that, you work as a doctor, lawyer, accountant. Like to have a big four accounting job is...
• 10:39
  Everything that we wanted as a family, I guess. And so anyway, I couldn't tell them that I had quit my job and I had thrown it away. I never told them when I quit thinking that, oh, well, I'll just tell them when I'm successful. And then when that business failed, I was like, holy shit.
• 10:56
  What do I do? So I kept pretending to go to work. So at this point, I am putting on a suit every day, getting up early, like a full corporate suit, having breakfast with my parents. And my mom worked in a bank in the city at the time. So we would get the bus into the city together. Like I would actually have nowhere to go, but I get the bus in the city and I'm just like...
• 11:20
  What the hell do I do? And so because it was in the middle of the global financial crisis, no one was hiring. So I couldn't even get another job, even if I wanted to. So out of sheer desperation, out of like, just like by default, my only option was to start another business.
• 11:40
  And because I have no other skills, it's not like I'm going to go and be an accountant as a business or anything like that. I had to start an online store. And so I, which is like how I just fell into...
• 11:57
  Online retail. I was very lucky that I got introduced to another girl that also wanted to start the store because I didn't have the confidence to start a business by myself. Which is why, sorry, when that first business partner said that she didn't want to do it anymore, I was like, oh, okay, the end. It didn't even cross my mind to continue doing that by myself at the time.
• 12:18
  Because it seemed just so crazy to start a business by yourself. And also, but like, I mean, yes, you're breaking even, fine. But like $3,000 a day, that's still serious. Like that's amazing to be getting to that point even when you're kind of like just trying something out. Like that's a signal that you are doing something right. You're making sales. You know how to sell. I guess I was surprised that like, oh, you can...
• 12:41
  It's just like if you have a product, I mean, not that it's necessarily profitable, like it can sell. I didn't realize it was so easy just to start trading. Yeah. Even if, yeah. So I guess that did kind of like surprise me. Yeah. Yeah.
• 12:58
  Out of desperation, I turned to like the only friend that I knew who had a business. Because back in 2010, all my friends were corporate. This one guy, I think he was selling like baby formula back into China or something like that. I don't remember. But he was really successful. And I was like, maybe I'll get a job working for him. And I can learn from him. And then he was like, oh, you should go talk to my other friend. She was on an online fashion store as well. I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. I don't want to do online retail. I'm obviously really bad at online retail. Let me...
• 13:28
  I was kind of trying to ask for a job without asking. And then he, you know, and then he was like, no, go meet her. And that was my mentality back then that, one, like, you know, not too scared to start a business by myself, but also like I just failed at that. Why would I do that again?
• 13:46
  Not real life. Now I look back, I'm like, no, you've just failed and you've learned so many things. This is the best time to try and do it again and do it better, which is what I did, luckily. And so we, this girl and I, we've only met a couple of times by this stage. We got drunk one night. I am sounding like an alcoholic. Sorry. Were you thinking like fashion, like same kind of concept, but instead of pop-ups online and was it like show-po already or was it something different back then as a concept? Yeah.
• 14:15
  Yeah, it was this concept. It was, we were called Show, we came up, we got drunk on that. We came up with the name and concept for Showpony, which is what we were called. I remember. We didn't even think it was going to take off because we didn't even check the trademarks for the name, which is why we're now called Showpo. But yeah, we, at the time we thought that, yes, it was going to be an online store, but we still thought bricks and mortar was really important. So we did at some point have up to three little bricks and mortar stores.
• 14:45
  Oh, I didn't know that. But they were – the most successful one was like in the middle kiosk of a Westfield with just three racks of clothes.
• 14:56
  So, but we eventually closed all of them down because we wanted to focus on the online business. And we actually saw just online just take off as part of that. So I want to stick around this area because I feel like this time in your story is still really critical. And I want to know, like, if we can paint a bit of the picture, when did you tell your parents? Like, are you still riding this bus every day with your mom, like, at this time? Or have you announced by this time that you're kind of...
• 15:26
  So, okay, this is a bit of a long story, but I'll try and get there in a succinct way. But we basically, so the first six months of ShowPro, I was still pretending to, yeah, I was still just pretending to work. And so, oh, I'll circle back to why consignment was important. Oh, yeah. Because I...
• 15:44
  At this point, when I started at ShowPro, I had no money. I was in debt. I had my university debt, which is $30,000, which in Australia, at least you don't have to pay it back until you have an income. So I didn't have an income. So it's there, but I didn't have to pay for it. When I quit my corporate job, I had to pay back this allowance that they gave you. It's like a scholarship fund, but only if you return to work with them. But I had already spent it. And then I lost money in the first business. So I was in the law of debt.
• 16:14
  And then with starting a business, your two main costs are marketing and inventory. And so without having any money, I was like, well, why don't we try and do consignment again? So we tried to find a supplier on consignment. And luckily for me, my new business partner had a connection. She found us a supplier that was able to work with us on consignment. Right.
• 16:38
  So every day, yeah, so every day I would go into that supplier's office and pick up stock to send out for that day. But at that time, I had, you know, time I had plenty of money. I didn't. So it was fine to do all that manual, extra manual work. So for the first six months, I was just doing that.
• 17:00
  So my business partner at the time had her own successful business. So I was using her office as well to pack the orders. And then after a few months, we opened a little store in Broadway in Sydney. So I was like working the store there, fulfilling out of there, still pretending to go to work.
• 17:17
  But then my husband, boyfriend at the time, husband now, he moved from Brisbane to Sydney to start a graduate job. So we never had a conversation about whether we should move in together. As soon as he got an apartment in Sydney, I just showed up.
• 17:32
  With all of my stock. He's like, Jay, stop telling everyone your business start in your parents' garage because it was my apartment. I'm like, ah. But, yeah, so that's when I had, at least for the next year, I didn't have to keep pretending to my parents because I was just like kind of like avoided them a little bit and just like, okay.
• 17:52
  worked out of his apartment slash the store that we had. In that first year and a half, at our peak, we were maybe making $22,000 a month, which is pretty good. But then we got to a point where we set a plateau and then the business started like declining and they got to a point where the business was only making $5,000 that month, which is like one or two orders a day, which is not a sustainable like business to not be working a job and having enough salary.
• 18:19
  So my business partner actually decided to opt out of the business at that time. She wanted to leave the business because she had her own successful business. And her business was actually growing. So she got out of the business. And I was like, oh, excited to have the business myself. But again, I'm still scared. And I was like, this business isn't actually doing that well. And if it failed and the last business failed...
• 18:45
  both of those failures will be attributed to me. Like I would be the common thread and I would be the failure and I have such a big fear of failing. But then the next month I...
• 18:55
  started, I actually then moved the operations into my parents' garage. And I wish I could tell you what I did because that made a difference, but I did everything better. I started running Google ads, which I wasn't doing before. I spent way more time on Facebook ads and understanding it better. I did way more freaking social media posts, quicker customer service, gave away free shipping.
• 19:18
  bought more stock, just did everything, I think, better. Was it just you? Like you as a solo person? It was just me. Right. I may have had a VA. I'm not sure if I did at this point, but definitely like just me. I also had the store in the city as well to manage, but the store was doing all right. It was making $10,000 a week sales. So that was giving me a bit of confidence, a bit of cash to invest in,
• 19:46
  But my business partner didn't want to do the store in the city because our Broadway store wasn't doing well. So she's like, if you want to do it, you can do it by yourself. So then that gave me the cash to invest into the online store now that the online store was all mine. So the next month that I had the store by myself, it went from $5,000 to $9,000. And then it went to $40,000. And then $75,000. And then $140,000. It just grew up.
• 20:13
  And so at this point, I was in my parents' garage and it was getting bigger and bigger. And I told my parents at this point, I was on unpaid leave from Ernst & Young. Like the Ernst & Young job was still there waiting for me. But at this point, I was also asking my mom to chuck sickies with her job to help me like pack orders on some days that I couldn't keep up. So it was really growing. Oh my God, I still remember like my mom spent this whole day writing like thank you notes. And then it's like...
• 20:41
  an hour before dispatch, I'm like, mom, it's all broken English. You're missing a word. And we had to like, and I'm such a perfectionist. I'm like, no, we're rewriting all of them. Rip it apart. Anyway. That's so cute that your mom was involved. I love that. I always see your mom in your socials.
• 20:57
  doing her thing. Yeah. So it wasn't until September that year. So two years after I started show pro that I actually told, decided to tell my parents at this point, I already haven't had an office in the city as well. I wonder, I'm like, they must've had an inkling, but I was like, I'm going to officially tell them. I feel confident to tell them. So when I did tell them, they were like,
• 21:21
  oh my God, like, first of all, couldn't believe I did this because we have no one in our family that's entrepreneurial. And then spent maybe like 10 minutes trying to explain to them, no, no, no, not last year, two years ago. They're like, but how can it be two years ago? How could you have done? Like, they couldn't believe that it was two years. They were like, but you were going to work. I'm like, no, no, no, I was pretending. Like, I actually had to like convince them that it's legit that...
• 21:46
  You know, I was lying to them the whole time. And they just couldn't believe it. It's such a crazy story because, like, for you especially, having that fear of failure being your, like, absolute driving motivation not to fail, just, like, unwavered dedication to not letting your parents know has been kind of, like...
• 22:09
  an attribute to your major success, I guess. Yeah. It's like it made me have to make it work so that, yeah, it was like a driver. So those early kind of years, obviously you're growing, you're doing all the social stuff, you're doing everything better, it's obviously got word of mouth built into it. You're at a time where like this is really fun, people are learning about shopping online in Australia. Yeah.
• 22:33
  What were the kind of big leaps forward? Because now, you know, you do $100 million revenue in a year. How do you get from that to like here? If we're talking about the big leaps forward, what are the things that changed the game for you? Yes. Okay. I actually thought about this. I have this like, because I, you know, I just recently did my business course. So it made me actually like think about this because, you know, normally I used to be like, oh yeah, you know, you just grow, grow, grow. But I actually thought...
• 23:02
  About the stages. So the first one, I think, is like putting insistence on processes. That doesn't sound sexy, but that means that you can then start hiring people to work in the business so that you can then work on the business and not in the business. So that sounds really obvious and not sexy, but that is definitely like the first step, which is so hard for an entrepreneur because you're also like so...
• 23:25
  You're like, I'm so busy doing it. I'm making money, chasing money. Like I'm not going to sit, slow down and think about systems. And the only reason I even hired my first person to work for the online business was because I was going, I booked this holiday to go to Ultra Music Festival in Miami when the online store wasn't doing that well. And I just had the one store.
• 23:50
  Anyway, so the business was at 70 – at this point we were like making – all of a sudden making like $40,000 in February and this is like the holidays in March and I'm trying to get – I'm telling my friend I've got to get out of – I can't go. But I have a really like twisty arm, rubbery elbow. What's the saying? Yeah. Something like that. Yeah. Yeah. And it's so –
• 24:11
  Anyway, they convinced me to go. I'm like, fine, I'll get someone from the store to work on an online business. And when I came back to the business, yes, she made mistakes. I learned something really important there. Like, yes, she made mistakes. And yes, she actually did. She kind of like fucked me a little in that she was coming into my parents' garage to work in my parents' garage. And then she was like, I was like, just tell me how many hours you work. I'll pay you for it. And she actually wasn't working for like, she kept saying she was working till 9 p.m.
• 24:41
  And I could see the emails have stopped at 3 p.m. And you can only dispatch to a certain time. And my mom was making her dinner because she was like, oh, she's so nice. She's working so late. She was using my internet because her internet, because she used to talk about how she has bad internet at home. She was doing a uni assignment in my parents' garage while my mom was cooking for her and billing me for it.
• 25:01
  But I'm saying this is important because I think a lot of people when they start businesses, they're like, oh, but what if this happens? What if this person screws me? But the greater good was the business kept growing. Yes, she did that to me. Yes, she made mistakes. But that month we made $140,000 and I'm in Miami having the best time of my life.
• 25:21
  You've got to think about the greater good, the bigger picture, right? So, and then that made me go, okay, I'm ready to hire more people. So the next stage is also to hire people that can work on the business with you. I think that really helps. So for me, I hired an operations manager slash general manager type of person. And I really like having people to bounce ideas off. I like working with people. So I think that's really important for me.
• 25:47
  The next stage is to hire for people who are like better at things than you. It's about understanding what you don't like, but also what your blind spots are. And then also concurrently there's a bit of outsourcing, but also in-housing. So certain functions...
• 26:05
  it's better to outsource at some point for someone else, especially digital marketing. It's like a false economy to think you're going to save money by doing it yourself, right, because you won't be doing it as efficiently at a certain threshold, depending on how good you are. Totally, totally.
• 26:21
  When you're in that hiring phase, I just want to ask a quick question here. And this even still applies to like how you hire today. How do you find the people who kind of like have the same values that you do in building a business? And I mean that in that sense of like scrappy, get your hands dirty, just get shit done, work really hard, but also have a lot of fun while doing it and kind of like finding the people that match that culture versus like hiring someone that comes in and is like, that's not my role. I'm not going to do that, you know?
• 26:50
  Yeah. God, I think that's really interesting question. Because I really admire when I see you at your place of work, like when you hosted your LMBDW event a couple months ago, looking at the people who work for you, who embody, you can just feel that everyone embodies the same spirit. Yeah.
• 27:11
  Yeah. No, thank you. I think it gets easier with time because you can just read people. I've definitely still made mistakes. I think about the people that I've hired that
• 27:22
  I think ultimately hiring is almost like dating, right? You have to like do it and make mistakes to learn. So, and I think almost sometimes you need to be burnt to know otherwise. And so I think for like people listening who are like thinking about hiring, being like, oh, I'm scared. Just like it's part of the process in a way. And you just get better at reading people. And then just being really upfront in that early stage.
• 27:49
  You know, I think some people might, yeah, like some people might think they want to get their hands dirty and then they don't. But I guess, yeah. I cut you a little bit off there. But like you were talking about the systems and processes and then the hiring. What have those other kind of big leaps been forward when you've gone through this business course and kind of reflected?
• 28:09
  Another big one is product, growing your inventory. So holding more SKUs, which is a tricky one, right, because also your money gets tied up in stock. So...
• 28:24
  And I feel like a lot of times people, businesses get stuck because their money is sitting all in stock and they don't have the money then to buy more other stock and or to actually spend on marketing to sell the stock. But definitely product expansion is a big one. So we started purely by retailing.
• 28:43
  So we started, you know, getting in more SKUs, getting more colorways of our best sellers, understanding what sells better, you know, and then started to get more accessories and that kind of stuff. And then the next stage, we started doing our own product development, which meant like, okay, we know this sells.
• 29:00
  We're working with our suppliers to let's make it like this because we know this is what our customers want. Because I have no design skills, but product development is, I guess, a lot easier if you're working with the right suppliers who are patient with you. Yeah, you have the vision. Exactly. And then we started, as we got bigger, we started hiring designers and people, you know, hiring people who do know what they're doing.
• 29:26
  who also then brought in new suppliers as well. So it kind of like slowballs in a way. And then we started doing our own new categories. We started, you know, me having a corporate background, I spent so much money of my salary, of my paycheck on these expensive suits. I'm like, let's do affordable workwear.
• 29:42
  And then we started doing affordable occasion wear, formal dresses. And then we were like a big challenge for us. We wanted to cater for more sizes, which is just not done for a business like us at this stage. So that took a couple of years to actually for that to come to life, to extend our sizes. And then we started doing just more categories, affordable wedding dresses, wedding dresses under $200, $300. Oh, I loved that one. That was a good one. Yeah. So –
• 30:09
  Product is a big one and having good merchandise planning. And then I think it's also, of course, like, you know, opening up to new marketing channels.
• 30:21
  And then also opening up more on a global scale. I mean, obviously, I think any online business already can sell globally. Surprisingly, some businesses don't because sometimes I buy things and I'm trying to ship it to internationally as presents and they don't ship internationally. I'm like, why the hell not? I understand certain types of products, but if I'm trying to send a little like baby girl dress to the UK, I don't understand why that doesn't work. Anyway, so...
• 30:49
  That's pretty much it. Like that's that in a nutshell. That's amazing. And it's so like when you say it, you're like, yeah, yeah, like that'll make sense. But then you think about the scale that you've built and it's just so, so exciting and huge. And it's been such this big journey for you. We've covered a lot of kind of like the highlights of getting to that kind of level right.
• 31:11
  What have been some of the hard things that you've faced in building this business? What's like really the shit stuff that you would want to share for other people listening to know that it's not all rosy, good, highlights, real kind of thing?
• 31:28
  Well, I mean, there's a few. Like COVID was definitely tough for us because, and I know that everyone's like, oh, but you sell online. I mean, we still, like, we were still selling quite a lot. But given that we are the size of the business that we are, we have a lot of fixed costs.
• 31:45
  It was a really tough time to be – and we were, like, overstocked. You know, because people come to our warehouse and they're like, wow, it's so big. And I was like, I used to look at it as, like, wow, it's so big. During COVID, I was like, far out. That's a lot of stock just sitting there. So that was not only tough, like, financially, but then also –
• 32:07
  We had staff that we had to look after, right? We had a bit of a stand-down period like a lot of business did and having that conversation, getting on Zoom and saying that to all staff was so hard. Luckily we didn't have to make anyone redundant, which is great, I think, to have that come out of it. And that was part of everyone being part of that stand-down. What does stand-down mean kind of like pause salaries and use the government incentives? Yeah. Okay, cool.
• 32:36
  And like I think maybe people had to use their – I don't know if people want to use their leap. I don't actually even remember what we did. But it wasn't long, but it was a really difficult conversation –
• 32:48
  conversation for people to have. And then, you know, yeah. So I think those are the times where you're like, because you're thinking, because part of why you love the business is like you have all that response. It's all yours. You have control. You have responsibility. But when you think you are actually responsible for the livelihood that there's that many people, when times got tough, like that is really scary. At the time, I was also like pregnant. So I'm like trying to not stress myself.
• 33:16
  But then I'm stressing about trying to not stress. So that, yeah. So things like that, it's tough. And I think I tend to not dwell on things that much. And I think I get over things quite easy and I can switch off, which I think really helps me overcome some of those tougher times. Yeah.
• 33:40
  Yeah, I think a lot of times the toughest is dealing with people issues. And I think that no matter what, because I think you do try and be the best employer and person that you can be. But for every, like, however many happy staff members, there's always going to be one that's not. And yeah.
• 34:03
  That's really hard and it really sucks. But it's not possible as a business for everyone, I guess, to be happy. You read about all these other great businesses that... You know, sometimes you read about other great businesses that do so much for their team. Like Mecca, for example. I know it's a great business. I have so many people that work there that tell me it's the best business ever. And then you read one thing about this one disgruntled person. You're like...
• 34:33
  Is it just you? It's just part of the game, I guess, right? Yeah. Is it part and parcel, the saying, of just building a business and managing relationships on different levels? I want to shift gears a little bit and talk about you and your kind of transition into investor and being an investor. I know that you are the new season of Shark Tank is about to come out. Congratulations.
• 34:56
  Love that for you. You're one of the sharks. I'm so excited to watch. Very exciting. Yes. So exciting. I want to kind of like understand what your journey as an investor has been like. What kind of businesses are you investing in? What do you look for? What's exciting to you in categories or companies or founders that are getting you kind of excited to put your money into?
• 35:17
  Well, as an investor, my journey is very brief because this is kind of the start of my investor journey. I've only like ever put in – it's been very small, not at that early stage. It's this early stage angel investing is very exciting. I like businesses that I understand as a consumer that get me excited. And what gets me really excited is businesses that I can see –
• 35:46
  Like what gets me excited about ShowPro is seeing other people wear it and tell me they love it. They wore it for this occasion and how we made them feel. So it's that products that do that, that gets me really excited. An emotional pull and that kind of like physical representation of something out in the world.
• 36:05
  Yeah, or just stuff that people love, that are part of the everyday, things that you can see everywhere that has that mass global, that has obviously global, but it has that, you know, it's like if I can see one of my invested businesses in like a retailer or like being used out on the street, that would get me really excited. Yeah, I love that. So when does Shark Tank air?
• 36:32
  I honestly don't even know yet. Even if I did, I'm not meant to say, but I actually don't. No, but I actually don't. They haven't told us yet. It'll be later this year. Oh, okay. Right, right, right. Oh my gosh. I'm so excited. And so for you, like now that you've kind of kicked off this journey, are you like, are you out there being like, send me a deal flow, send me, send me your decks. I want to see stuff now and sort of take on more of a role as an investor. Or is it kind of like just here and there if you hear about something?
• 36:57
  I wish I could have the capacity. Like, in my head, it's like if Shark Tank gets repeated for season two, I want to maybe, like, it might make sense to build up a structure where I could do more of that. At the time, at the moment, I'm just so stretched as it is. Please don't send me your picture. Anyone who's listening, not now. Maybe next year.
• 37:24
  When you say like your stretch, something I also think about, and I was wondering for you specifically, you know, you work with your husband, you're very kind of aligned in business, personal goals. You're both parents now. You've got a lot going on. How do you keep your relationship spicy? Like how do you keep things like good, healthy, balanced? You know, I work with my husband too, and we're often like, fuck, this is hard. Like it's hard being...
• 37:51
  24-7 kind of trying to strive for these goals that you have, especially business goals and financial goals and things like that. But like, you've also got to really work on the relationship side of things. And I often wonder about couples that work together, how they're keeping it together. Yeah.
• 38:06
  Yeah, I mean, it was definitely tougher during tough times like COVID where we're also working from home just like kind of we couldn't even have a drink together and switch off because I was pregnant, right? It was just you couldn't really get away from it. I think having – and I can – you know, like I said, I switch off quite easily but he doesn't as much. So I think it is harder for him. But I think –
• 38:35
  Where?
• 38:38
  we've kept our relationships so great. It's like we can just laugh off every situation. I feel like even when things are tough, we always have a laugh and we don't take ourselves too seriously. And I think that's great. And I think it's also like, yes, things might be, like even when you're going through a tough time, you just have to still take a moment to look at what you have achieved together. And I think that that really helps. And,
• 39:05
  Yeah, I think we, you know, making time for each other and we do really respect each other in the workplace, I think, and that really helps. We don't actually work that much together because he's essentially taken on all the boring bits of work that I don't enjoy doing, which is why I'm also so, like, nice to him because I'm like, you're doing my homework.
• 39:32
  Love that. What do you think your superpower is? Oh, what is my superpower? Maybe I'm just like a cult leader that has like brought in all these other talented people to work together.
• 39:46
  At Shopeo. And I have no real skill, but I've got all these great people working for me. I love that. Jane, the cult leader. The lazy cult leader CEO. The Shopeo Kool-Aid. No, I'm not a cult leader, just in case anyone. Just kidding. Just kidding. I want to shout out your podcast. You recently just launched the new show. I'm so excited for you. What have been the highlights so far? Thank you.
• 40:12
  I just, you must be the same. It's just so fun to like chat to people and learn from people. And I, cause I'm not, I probably don't even have that many still like friends with businesses. So it's actually great to, not that like, just, just by the way it happens, you know, I guess. And there's lots of people that I'm like friends with. Everyone that's been on the show, I'm kind of like friends, acquaintances with.
• 40:38
  But I guess everyone's so busy, you know, like now it's like a really great opportunity to just like actually chat and to really get to know them. So it's been a great like...
• 40:51
  a relationship building thing as well to actually take this, the relationships I've had with these amazing entrepreneurs, like that next level, which has been exciting. I've just really been having a lot of fun chatting. Yeah, it is fun. It's so like, and learning. Yes, 100% the learning. I learned so much through the show.
• 41:14
  Yeah, love it. I want to ask you your final kind of key piece of advice that you give to other founders and entrepreneurs, small business owners when they're building businesses in 2023.
• 41:28
  So I feel like, you know, there's so much content out there to help you build a business. But the only way, and this isn't just like a just do it. I know everyone says just do it. But it's like everyone will tell you this is that. Okay.
• 41:45
  Sorry, I don't know why I'm grabbing a pen. Please keep grabbing the pen. Everyone has their way of like building the business, but you still just need to try it all for yourself because it just differs from person to person, business to business, and then from time to time. What worked for me before might not be working now. And I think it's all about like, it's just testing everything. And like, honestly, it's like you...
• 42:14
  What's that saying? If you're not failing enough, you're not taking enough risks, right? So I think it's just about getting out there and doing it and never risking too much that you don't have the opportunity to do it again and learn from it, especially when it comes to things like buying stock. Oh, that's a good one. That's a really good one. Love that.
• 42:41
  Hey, it's June here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 43:06
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 43:29
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that. Thank you.
• 43:44
  Hey, it's June here. Thanks for listening to this amazing episode of the Female Startup Club podcast. If you're a fan of the show and want even more of the good stuff, I'd recommend checking out femalestartupclub.com where you can subscribe to our free newsletter. We send it out weekly covering female founder business news, insights and learnings in D2C, and interesting business resources.
• 44:09
  And if you're a founder building an e-commerce brand, you can join our private network of entrepreneurs called Hype Club at femalestartupclub.com forward slash Hype Club. We have guests from the show joining us for intimate Ask Me Anythings, expert workshops, and a group of totally amazing, like-minded women building the future of D2C brands.
• 44:31
  As always, please do subscribe, rate and review the show and post your favorite episodes to Instagram stories. I am beyond grateful when you do that. Thank you.