Latest / The Hearing God Podcast / Fully Known by God

Transcript

Fully Known by God · The Hearing God Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the Hearing God Podcast.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Anthony Moore.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm Dan Lamus.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_01: For over a decade, Anthony and I have been diving deep into weekly conversations about the prophetic, the mystical, and the matters of the heart.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: And we invite you into these weekly conversations.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: We hope you feel like an honored guest at our table.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: So pull up a chair, settle in, and let's get started.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, here we are.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: Here we are.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_01: How's it going?
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_01: Here we are.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: How's it going, Dan?
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: It's going well.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I am always always grateful for this time we get to spend together.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: Uh it always seems to pull out of me things that uh I wish I had somebody to chat with.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: And we get here, and it's like, yeah, I can talk about all that stuff.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: And I uh right off the top, I would say um I'm uh I'm really grateful for just that that that simple verse out of Ephesians chapter six, be strong in the Lord, yeah uh and in his mighty power.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah and I can't remember if last episode I mentioned it, but God still really has me there.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I can't remember if it was another conversation or what was that.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's good.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: But God has me in this place where in the Amplified Bible, uh that first part, be strong in the Lord, the Amplified Bible uh has in parentheses draw your strength from your union with Christ.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that phrase.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: That's good.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: Draw your strength from your union with Christ.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and I'm I just am kind I've kind of just been sitting with that.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: God's been showing me, I don't know how to do that, I guess.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: And and I've been appreciating just saying, yeah, I uh I want I want my strength to come from that.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like I want my strength to come from union with you, Jesus.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've been really enjoying that.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and of course, as God always does, whenever there's some place, something that he's blessing me with, he's also challenging me deeply with it.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: There's always that that part of, oh man, that seems like quite a challenge to step into.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: But I'm I'm recognizing more and more that that my frailties are an amazing invitation to do exactly that, draw my strength from my union with him.
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I was I was thinking it and it it seems to be like, I don't know if this is just you or me, uh, or just the way I think there is a reality to humanity at where we uh we have this regret.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I think it's like regret, or at least it's something like it, some sort of negative emotion tied to our neediness.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: And yes, right.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: And then and yet uh, you know Paul is pretty clear that we should be boasting in our weakness.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's such a paradox.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it is a it's a it's a thing that, you know, because uh I'm not sure it's not been I I would say uh if I took a survey of the last 12 months, I don't know if I would have done a lot of boasting.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like I would have probably, you know, I have would have had some prayers where I'm like, okay, we're choosing to we're choosing to boast in our weakness.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: Right, yeah.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_00: But the sort of the honesty of the heart is like, well, this is more of an act of faith than it is necessarily of so does the regret show up as uh I hate that about myself?
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think it's like frail in this way, I hate that.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think honestly, I I feel like at times like the enemy will like I have I've had to say this uh fairly fairly recently.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: Uh should I like I would I sort of know if I like I don't know if I would be like prophesying it over myself, but like I would it would say so it would come out something like this should I begrudge the fact that I'm needy?
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_00: Like as I'm saying it almost rhetorically to to I don't know if it was to me or to the the the forces around me who are trying to uh convince me to feel bad or are you supposed to begrudge that I'm needy?
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: Am I should I yeah, should I begrudge the fact that I'm needy?
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: So it's almost uh it's a answer being no right, yes.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's the I think that's the you know it's a little bit like this uh there's this it's like a rhetorical question, and and I'm not gonna I I think happens sometimes throughout the the Bible.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's like maybe in the old testament account of a certain thing or like this, like should I, you know, the this it is a rhetorical question.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: Should a man like me right in the job that I'm doing come down and be with this person?
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like there's it's it happens from time to time, but it's like what is what is the expectation right now of me?
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Like, should I should I regret the fact that I'm needy?
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: Should I feel bad about the fact that you know that I am I am weak?
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: And it's almost as if it's a little bit like in my heart, anyway, it's almost like this, it's this uh act of defiance, right?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like knowing, knowing full well according to the word of God, right?
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: There is like totally this place of boasting in your weakness.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: And not only like because of the strength of the Lord.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so so I I think a little bit that's where that's a little bit where uh I I have been, and um sometimes, frankly, it kind of takes my breath away.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's that cringy, yeah.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'll it'll it'll be in real time in a given day or a given assignment.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, walking into the assignment will be the sense of you know you can't do this, right?
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, uh like I know I'm too frail to do this totally in whatever way, yeah, but I'm going, God.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_01: Right, doing this because I know it's God's, I don't think it's the Holy Spirit saying to me, you know, you can't do it.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_01: Well, who knows?
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_01: No, no, no.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: Again, because it's even hard to sort out that question.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, yes, it is well, it it depends on, I suppose, the fruit of where that is, right?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and again, like you could answer it regardless of who it is.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it would be no, I'm actually I'm actually very proud of myself that I'm that week, I'm gonna lean on Jesus.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly, right?
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I would say that the you know, shame would be one angle, but invitation would be the other.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, right.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like I'm proud because God uses frail people.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, like it's that's kind of the rebuttal.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of like big deal that I'm frail.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm proud of my God because my God works through frailty.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: That's kind of and that's that's like there's no, and again, it's the you know, again, not to zoom way out, but it really is so that his glory would be on display in and through us.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: Because if I was strong enough to do all this stuff, yeah, it would be hard to wade through that to where's God in this?
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: And some some of it is is like I think, you know, ask anybody, any well-meaning believer, do you want God to be glorified in your life?
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right?
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, of course, yeah.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: No, let's begin with all the ways that you are weak.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like think that is a real it is a real part of it.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's a real part of it, right?
• 7:51
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think, I think for me, I think my act of defiance to the to the sort of the shame, I maybe it's shame, but at least the uh the the feeling bad that I'm I'm weak on the best of days, right?
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like I think it's a I think it's the act of defiance.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, should I should I feel bad about this?
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_00: Should I regret the fact that I'm so needy?
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: Should I like Lord, you know what, you know what to do, right?
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like you know how to so convince my heart that I am not this is not a shameful thing.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right, right.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: Convince my heart that there's no there's no need to regret uh my weaknesses, that I can't keep all the plans tethered together.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: I can't keep right, you know, all the all the you know, you know what I'm saying?
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like I can't manage m my internal world.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, all of that comes from but but what it does, I think, you know, I think what we want to get into is a little bit what happens when we pray.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, uh, is the imitation of that the it's the that the Lord knows what's happening within us.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: And we've said this, he knows even more than we do.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: He searches the heart, he knows the motives of our hearts, and I think uh we talk about just the invitation, uh maybe the heart posture of what of what it means to be to come before the Lord, presenting yourself, kind of doing a here we are, yeah, like here I am.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you I am inviting not only not only do you see me and know me, like without me offering myself, right?
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, but what happens when we actually flip that a little bit and we invite the gaze of God upon our hearts.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I guess I just maybe as a as a little bit of a precursor to our conversation, if we haven't had one already.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_00: Uh just that, just let me read from Psalm 139.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: And it just says, starting at verse one, and we're just gonna read a couple uh four verses, I think.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: Uh it says, Oh Lord, you have searched me and known me.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: And there's an exclamation mark at the end of that.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_00: So you have searched me and known me.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: You know when I sit down and when I rise up, you discern my thoughts from afar, you search out my path and my lying down, and you are acquainted with all my ways.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: Even before a word is on my tongue, behold, O Lord, you know it all together.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: I guess we'll just we'll stop there.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: Uh basically there's a you know, again, there's a powerful these are powerful statements that David is making about the Lord.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_00: That the Lord uh has searched David.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_00: So if the Lord has searched David, the Lord has searched Anthony, yes, and the Lord has searched Dan, yeah, and knows you know, knows the intimate details of your life, he knows your thoughts, he knows the direction, and he's acquainted with all of your ways.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, he's acquainted with uh your tendencies, he's acquainted to when uh a person may come at you and say a th certain thing, yeah, right?
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_00: Either good or bad.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: Uh he he he's acquainted with how you're gonna respond to that.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right, I like that, yeah.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: He's acquainted uh you know, even before something is on your lips, right?
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_00: Which you know that but he knows it before it comes out.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's the yeah, it's like all he's the ultimate one who knows what I'm like.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, like no one knows what I'm like the way you do, God.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's that you're familiar with all my ways.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's not just he knows what I did.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: Or what I'm prone to do.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_01: He knows what I'm like.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and he knows why you did what you did.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, even if you don't know why you did what you did.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's right.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: He knows why.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that's just anyway.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I well, it's interesting because you have searched me, Lord, and you know me.
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_01: I I I feel like there's a dynamic to that that he's continually searching and knowing me.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's not wow.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um the as as if there was a moment in your life where you had a crisis of faith, right?
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_01: Where you said, okay, here is my moment that God's brought me to to actually embrace the fact that He knows me, He searched me.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_01: I know that I can recognize sin in my life because He's searching me and knowing me, and I'm bringing that to the cross, I'm repenting of it, and I receive the life that God wants to give me.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's not as if everything leading up to that moment was all the searching and knowing that God was gonna do.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Like there's an ongoing not only have you searched me and known me as I come to any time of prayer.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_01: Like since the last time we talked, God, you've searched me and known me.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: You you are searching and knowing me right now.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it wasn't like God took a snapshot of who I am or who I was 10 years ago, right?
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: He's well I'm glad that's over with that.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_01: I had to face all of that.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: The searching and knowing of God.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: What a what a thing to endure.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_00: But I think I think it's the ongoing thing.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_00: It's being known by God, yeah.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: That's a profound thing.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because I what it what it triggers in me is reminders of times in my life and ways, even to this day, that I don't let myself be known by God.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like God knows me and He searches me, right?
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_01: But I can block that as far as my own experience goes.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: I can I can resist that and say, well, I don't really know if I want him to know me.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because we oftentimes uh, and I know that we've talked a little bit about hiding, right?
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: And uh from time to time we might talk about it, but but you know, according to scripture, and according to this, like we have no participation in this.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we have no like like God's gonna know you, like God's going to search you, right?
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: He knows your motives, he knows your heart, he knows what you're like, independent of whether you're like you're okay with it or yeah, exactly.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_00: Like you're you're not, you're not, you're not choosing, you're not, you have no way, you have no means of blocking the searching gaze of God.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_01: No, like no drawer is I I can't say, oh, you can't know what's in that.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: There's no room, there's no room in your life that God doesn't know what's going on there.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's that is uh so and that happens independently of your choosing or not, right?
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: He just knows.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that's on that the but the the the shift comes when we realize that and we welcome that.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: I yeah, totally agree.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's right, and so it's like the the shift comes when we go, okay, we read this and go, all right, God, you search me and know me, you know when I sit down, like and the the realization of like whether or not I want this to happen, right?
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: This is gonna happen.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and also right, that that surrendering to this searching is actually the best thing for me.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, right.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: So it's not that it's gonna prevent because I'm putting walls up in my own mind, I'm not actually I'm I'm only hurting myself in that.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: But what happens is when I just say, all right, I'm gonna not try to put up any walls, right?
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to welcome the gaze of God.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to open, I'm going to have an open here I am with open hands, right?
• 16:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like that, I'm going to have an open-handed, open-hearted approach.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: And then I think to me, it's like God's like, all right, now we have something we can work with.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: Let's get, let's get started.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: Like, so yeah, I think the shift comes in in choosing a heart posture that welcomes rather than trying to prevent.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: Because again, we're running.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: God's saying, all right, I see that you're running.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: There's no part of you that's hidden from me, but let me know when you want to stop, you know, running and hiding.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_01: Because on that theme of what happens when we pray, uh ultimately what ultimately what I'm usually after in prayer is knowing the healthiest thing for me is to know God and be known by God.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_01: I want to I want to partner with Him.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I I personally, and I think, and I know you're here too, and you're and you might have a different way of describing it, but but I want I want my whole day to be a practice of prayer.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like I want I want to know that what I'm doing all day, I'm mingling with God in prayer.
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: And I might have a certain time or a couple times in a day where I stop and actually set a time set time aside to actually talk to God and listen intentionally, but I want that to be the way I do my day.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so in light of that, you know, what happens when we pray?
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I I I have to own the fact that that I can I can re I can resist being known by God.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: Where was I going with that?
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_01: Uh something beautiful you just said, and I was trying to respond to it.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like I going down my own rabbit trail.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: Excellent.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: Isn't that awful?
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_01: But yes, but where it but but I guess where I was gonna go with it is um owning owning owning my part of intentionally letting God know me.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's like I'm imagining a room that I don't really want God to be in that room today, but I know he already knows what's in there.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: There's something subtle that is me saying, it's okay for you to go in there, God, but I don't really want to be in there with you.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_01: But there's something beautiful and powerful that happens when I say, I want to be in that room of my life with you.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: Right, God.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: I I come on in, I'm not happy with what's going on in that room.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm bitter in there or whatever it is.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_01: I'm afraid.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that'll often happen to me.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'm weak in that room.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, God puts a challenge before me.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I'm gonna put that off because I don't think I can do that.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: And God's like, well, I know you can, right, and I'm sort of in the room.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_01: God's saying that to me.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm in here waiting for you in this room, and I'm like, yeah, well, I have other stuff I need to do, God.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't want to go in that room, but the healthiest, but really honestly, the most challenging thing happens when I walk in that room and I'm content to be there with God.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, all right, let's do this.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna roll up my sleeve, step into this project or whatever it is.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: Cause I think I think what it what it is is like a little bit just to go somewhere with that.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: I think the I think it's the that it's the invitation to see with eyes of God in that in that space.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: Meaning, meaning like when you and I are aware of our weaknesses, right?
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: We we are basically aware of our limitations, right?
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_00: When you I can't do that, or the last time I did that, it was went, it didn't go great.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_01: And so we're probably agreeing on those limits, right?
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: We're agreeing, we're agreeing with those limitations, yeah.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_00: And so what what the beautiful thing is is when we shift our gaze to say, God, you know, you know, back to boasting about our weaknesses, where we acknowledge the fact that there is a reality that we can step into where God comes and breathes on our weaknesses and does unimaginable things.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: And so yeah, so I I think that's a there's a there's something powerful in there for us because I know the feeling of, and again, you do, and hey, welcome to humanity, yeah, where we can get caught and often do get caught just being fixated on our weaknesses.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: And how that however that plays out, whether it's like a particular skill or whether that's a particular set of circumstances, like characteristic, characteristic, like yeah, a thing, a a weakness that we might have, or just those um, it could be a set of circumstances or a season that you're going through where you know this plus this plus this equals I'm not doing so great.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_00: But the the beauty of it is is there's ever this invitation to to like see the unseen, right?
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_00: There's the there's the ever this invitation to avert your gaze from Whatever you think your limitations are, and then not run away from whatever that is, right?
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_00: You could use that your limitations as a reason to say I'm not going to keep going down this road.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_00: Or I could say, I I want to see with the eyes of God.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_00: And if the eyes of God says, you know, all things are possible, right?
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 22:22
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: Or if the eyes of God says, my plans, my my strength is made perfect in your weakness.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: If the eyes of God say those things, then that at some level, there's this transference of God's grace in and through us.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_00: So that we can keep, we could actually persevere.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_00: We could actually keep going in the midst of Yeah.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: What you're describing happened for me this very day in my prayer time.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: Like I oftentimes honestly, at the beginning of the week, we happen to be recording this on Monday.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um, most Mondays are like that for me.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: Most Mondays coming to prayer is I don't think I can do this.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: You know?
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: And and I know God's gonna help me, but it is definitely there.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: And that the journey you just described, like, what will I agree with?
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, like, will I be willing to agree with what God sees?
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: Which report?
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_01: Whose report will you believe?
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we will be believe the report of the Lord.
• 23:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's it is that in in man, that is a place of of power.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_01: The reassurance, like, because it's a step of faith to go into a time of prayer, laying yourself bare before God saying, My opinion is I can't do this.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I need you to talk to me.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like, just here I am.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and that I need to hear what you think, God.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I think, and again, I uh I I don't want to lose like the power of the surrender, right?
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like I don't want to, yeah, yeah.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: I want to just like let's acknowledge what happens when we surrender.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: There we surrender our perspective.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we surrender our wisdom.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we surrender, uh good point, right?
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: We surrender those things that bringing what I think as an offer exactly, right?
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'm coming and I'm I'm putting that in the wounds of Jesus.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm saying I don't want to live by that.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and I acknowledge God that uh what I know about myself is limited.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right, I and I'm acknowledging that I don't see myself, even though again like it'd be funny, it would be funny to write a preface for Psalm 139.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: God, I have searched me and known me.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it really sucks.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, God, you have searched me and you know me.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's the that's the beauty of it, is it just the surrender, the laying down, uh, the laying down of our own wisdom, our own knowledge of our own limitations, yes, our understanding.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_00: And again, right, it's it's uh it's just there's just something powerful, but it does create an opening for God's grace to come.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and his mercy and his kindness and his power and his anointing.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: And right, you know, and again, we find ourselves in these places where God will like, regardless of, you know, again, we're we're fixated a lot on performance.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_00: Like when I was in a situation, you know, last week and this is how it went.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I I I make judgments, you know, good or bad, about how I think I did in that.
• 25:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_00: And but but even in the middle of that, right, good or bad, you know, we could have uh, you know, again, we could have uh set of circumstances where it where the thing that I want to happen happens, right?
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_00: If I if I go into a situation and I knock it out of the park, yeah, right, yeah, uh, God, God could very well be like, yeah, that was great.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like and also, or also, uh, actually, it didn't go as well as you thought it did.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, it could go either way, right?
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_00: Or and and conversely, on the same in the on the on the other side of the coin, we could go into a set of circumstances where things didn't go how we thought they would go.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: And God was like, God could either be like, Yeah, I know, and let's work, so let's talk about that.
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: Or he could say, I did something through that that you have no idea.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, right.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so it says in like the circumstances the sir the circumstances are kind of irrelevant a little bit.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, maybe God will, and again, God may and probably does use them to confront some of the motives of our heart, right?
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_00: But I think this the circumstances are uh irrelevant to God's ability to accomplish something in and through our life.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I so I would I would like to say that over over my lifetime of learning to pray, lots of successes, failures, times of dormancy, all that stuff, in but then in but what I've learned about prayer is that that this awareness that like like the psalmist in Psalm 139 comes to I am fearfully and wonderfully made.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like coming to that conclusion of God being known by you, yeah, be known fully, you're familiar with me.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: The more you like I become aware of wow, you actually want to commune with me, God.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but you begin to realize, wow, I need to take a step back and realize it's awesome to be the new creation.
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_01: It's awesome to be a new creation in Christ.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: That that wow, I don't think I understand how you have framed me, God.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like how you have made me.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I I really don't give it enough.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: I don't give it enough, I don't know, credit is not the word I'm looking for.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_01: I don't make enough space to just enjoy the fact that man, I'm capable of much more than I thought because you know me.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_01: Because you know my thoughts and you're familiar with all my ways.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like you, wow, who, who who is man that you like it's a wonder's a wonder, there's a wonder to like when, like in light of who God is and his attentiveness, yeah.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like his who am I that God would have given me and his attentive, like his uh tenderness, his uh a tender, what was uh his loving kindness, right, right, towards me, right?
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: Not just us.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: I think we can get I think we can get us a little bit more than we can get me.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_00: But really zoomed in on me, yeah.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: And and believing that God is has a is tender hearted towards you, right?
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_00: So meaning like meaning that he is aware and he's sensitive to our our plight, right?
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I our needs, our circumstances, the our desires, the thing that the deep longings in our heart, that he's attentive to those things, right?
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so I just think that there's a but there's uh in light of that, right?
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: So in light of who I am and in light of who God is, uh when we when our heart comes to grips with that, there's a wonder.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_00: There is a wonder that is uh that's a natural overflow of that revelation, right?
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: Of that thought, of that, um, when that hits us in the heart, right?
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_00: There is like who am I, right?
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_00: That like that you are mindful of me, right?
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_00: That's there, it just comes out.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: There's a awe and a wonder at the at the nature of God, as it at his at his ways, at his goodness, at his love, at his mercy.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know what I'm saying?
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_00: There's this thing that comes out when we're in light of sort of like the relational dynamics of who God is and what he's done and the eternal nature of God.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then kind of like the the weak, uh, you know, insignificant, uh, frail, the my life is a vapor.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: The when I compare juxtaposed the two, right?
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_00: The two people in this, yeah, in this equation, right?
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_00: There is a wonder of like that who who am I, right?
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so I just I thought that is this is a really interesting thought of just it's good, yeah.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_01: No, totally.
• 30:56
  SPEAKER_01: I so I was I was on a phone call with uh a pastor, a younger pastor, and I was encouraging him about something here today.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_01: I found myself encouraging him out of uh Eugene Peterson quote that I remember from a from the book Run with the Horses.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: And uh the it's a it's a it's a study on Jeremiah's call.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and we've we've touched on this before, but there's this profound quote uh from from Peterson, and it goes like this.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: He's talking about uh when when the Lord speaks to Jeremiah and he says, I'm too young.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_01: But but the but the beginning of the text says the word of the on you know the word of the Lord came to me saying right, and he makes this comment about uh being an authentic and eternal being.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_01: So it kind of it's like it's like being fearfully and wonderfully made.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_01: He says, It was the Jeremiah to whom the word of the Lord came who realized his authentic and eternal being.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_01: Right, and I was encouraging this younger pastor, there is a part of you to whom God speaks, yes, and you need to let that part lead in your life, right?
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like the other parts of you that tend to argue and say you can't do a thing, they you can't afford to let them be in charge.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: There is there is the Dan or the Anthony to whom the word of the Lord comes and has been coming your whole life, yes, it's that part of you that actually should be in charge.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_01: If any part of you should be next in command after the Holy Spirit, is it's it's the it's the version of you to whom the Lord speaks.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I just want to encourage everybody whether you're a novice in prayer, just beginning, or you've been it praying for decades, we're we were God is always trying to get the attention of the Jeremiah to whom the Lord where the Lord came.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he's always he's always wanting to get to the virgin the the virgin, the virgin of me that is that knows, yes, the Lord speaks to me.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: That's who he wants to, he wants to get the attention of that me in prayer.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_00: And I think well I guess I I think that his intent right, that the intent of God isn't just so that um it isn't so that you know all right now the the the sort of the table is set, all our all our you know all the things are out in the open, right?
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: It isn't just so that's yeah right.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: So so I think that's the beginning.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right, right because the things that happen on the other side of that is like you know, God, we already know according to his word that God isn't withholding from us, right?
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_00: Right, yeah, so he's trying to get you into a place or me into a place, even in the right, right, to to to not withhold from him, right, yes, right, right, right.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_00: And so, so when that happens, and we're like God's God's default position, right?
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you know, uh, you know, uh he who did not spare his only son, like how you know, how much more will he give us all things?
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_00: All things, right?
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, so he we already know according to the word of God, uh, the written word of God, that he's not withholding from us.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, and has never and is never going to.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_00: So he's trying to get us into this place of not withholding from him, yes, right.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_00: And so when that happens, yeah, like there is a mystical reality in that place that it it real it creates this opportunity for God to give of himself to us, yeah, right, to impart himself to us, to impart his strength in our weaknesses, to impart his grace, right, his love, his mercy, his peace, his joy, his kindness.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_00: So, and again, I think that's the that's in a little bit like what that's what he's trying to do throughout the day, right, right throughout our lives, right?
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_01: So sometimes it feels like I remember to not withhold from him.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like maybe it could look like that in prayer.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I could suddenly become aware.
• 35:30
  SPEAKER_01: Oh God, I think what's going on here is I'm withholding from you.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, oh okay, yeah, I don't want to do that.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_01: I surrender in a fresh way, or it could be a brand new revelation.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I didn't know I didn't know I had a role.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like it's and we know that too.
• 35:47
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I know that.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know that when my heart is hanging on to something.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, absolutely.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_00: We it's not like again, like there are I know I know when my heart isn't hanging on to something, and I know when my heart is hanging on to something.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_00: There's something that, like, oh God, you can have all of this other stuff, but except this one, I'm not so sure about.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, this part of my heart, I'm not so sure about this part of my life.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm just give me a second, yeah, right.
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, oftentimes to me, it comes down to my agenda.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_01: God, I want you to do whatever you want with my day.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_01: And then my day blows up according to my plan, and I'm like, what?
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's not fair.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_01: You can't touch that part.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_00: You can't just that touch that part.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_00: But the part of it is is that like that he's like, so we know what we know what that's like.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_00: We know what that part of you know, how our heart acts, like the internally, our internal world responds to that prayer.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: God, here I am, have all of me, yeah, right, know me and see me and know me, right?
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_00: And we uh we know, and and so I think here's here's what you know my response typically has been, you know, uh, see this part of my heart, God.
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if I can let it go yet, right?
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_00: But I know you and I know that it's best for me to let that go.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_00: Or to either let it go or open, you know, again, make it available to you.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_00: So surrender, open the door, whatever metaphor is not withholding looks like whatever that metaphor is, right?
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: So, so whatever that looks like, I know that at least to confess and acknowledge that part of my heart, right?
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, this part of this part of God, you can have all of this, and I say, accept this one thing.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: Well, we're gonna talk about that, right?
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, because I know God, would you, would you come?
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_00: And for some reason, I'm holding on to this part of my life.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm holding on to this part of my heart, uh, you know, whatever I think, whatever I think my attachment is to it.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_00: I'm holding on to it, and I can't seem to bring myself to surrender.
• 37:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: God, will you can we talk about this?
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not hiding this from you.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, that's right.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'm acknowledging this place in my heart.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I think, honestly, and I think I don't think the Lord, I think the Lord that pleases the heart of God.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I agree.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_00: I I do, I really, I really do rather, you know, even uh even as much as a fully surrendered heart, right?
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like acknowledging before the Lord that I know intellectually that this is bed, it's better for me if I have this surrendered.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_00: For some reason, my heart can't right now.
• 38:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I don't know how, and I can't force myself into it.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_00: But I am inviting you to come and talk to me about this.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think I just think that there's an there's a there's that God is pleased with that posture.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: And again, like I don't think, and he's like, all right, well, here, you know, in Anthony's paraphrase, like I'm speaking for God, but I I honestly believe that he will take that.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's an op that's a that's an opening for him to come and do a work in my life.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_00: And and again, it might not be like the breakthrough might not come in that moment.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_00: It might be uh something that we're gonna continue to talk about over the next days and weeks and even months, right?
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_00: There might be something that that uh that the Lord takes delight in untangling that part of like as like a gardener, he takes delight in untangling that.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm having this I'm having this uh picture of of uh God making his will known to perhaps the the the guardian angels that have been assigned to Anthony's life, uh the the team of them, whatever that is.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_01: And the angels are wondering why you aren't doing a thing.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_01: And God looking to the angels and going, it's okay, he's working through something right now.
• 39:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's like God is so patient and merciful.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like it's like He's like, Yeah, we're working, we're working on something, and he'll be ready, and you guys will kick into gear as soon as soon as we work this out, but it's good, we're working it out, yeah.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that's fair game.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like I just feel like the that in in and really I feel like you're describing to anybody who's listening that likes to use the psalms as a way to help them pray, like understanding why why does it seem sometimes that the psalms are so raw?
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but I think it's because the psalmist, even as they write, they're actually working this process out.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_01: God, here's exactly what I want to do to my neighbors, right?
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_01: Right, and they're just uh, you know, God, get them, get them, God, get them.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_01: And then all of a sudden, this soft landing to the psalm comes through.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_01: But God, I know what you're like.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_01: Make me like you.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, bless, you know, make me a blessing to to people.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like it the you see the candidness in the Psalms.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's really highlighting this very relational dynamic to prayer.
• 41:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like like we whatever we're doing in prayer, it should never be for the sake of hiding from God.
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_01: Even if it's doing it right.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_01: God show me how to do it right so that I don't have to uh fa like face the deeper issues of my heart.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's I mean, again, like I think the it's the this is knowing and being known by God.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right?
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yep.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like there's no perfection in knowing.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like you, you know, like there's no requirement of your and my perfection when it comes to knowing and being known by God.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_00: It's surrender, like it is the willing, it's the willingness, it's the willingness and the uh the refusal to hide.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, right?
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah that's the door.
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_00: That's the door to our like it's that's the door to our receiving the benefit of knowing like a knowing and being known by God.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I and I yes, what a great way to coin it refusing to hide.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_01: So real-time experience in prayer, yeah.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_01: I I can be quite a way in quite a ways into a session of prayer and still be hiding.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_01: A hundred percent.
• 42:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I in what I need to do in real time is to recognize it.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yes and God, I can tell I'm holding back.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_01: And and I I bring it before you.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's what you're saying.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the that's it.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like that to me, that's it.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 42:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like there's a there's a there is a the the hiding doesn't actually say there's a part of my heart that like that I can't, like it's a it's at least acknowledging it, right?
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like it doesn't be knowing and being known by God, there is there is a part of that that even if I come in with a part of my heart that is there's a room that's closed to God, yeah, right, and God wants to get in there.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I go, God, I know it's better for me that you get in there.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I also know that I'm either afraid to open the door, yes, right?
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever, yeah.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like, but I'm gonna say, Lord, I'm I'm choosing today to trust you with that part of my heart.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_00: And we may leave that prayer moment with the door still closed, right?
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but if we keep coming back, we keep talking about this place, like this is part of being known and like knowing and being known by God.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_01: So you could you could in a prayer say, That's true about me, and I don't know what we're gonna do about it, God, but I know you're gonna help me.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_01: In Jesus' name, amen.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_01: And you could go into your day trusting He is going to be.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: that exactly and like the the door coming open like the the like again the room in my heart that that god i don't want god to come into right it may be let's just say for example it may be three weeks yeah before i actually trust and i'm trust i feel safe enough yeah to with god to open that door yeah and i've known that it's better the whole time yeah right but i've in my head yeah right but i haven't been convinced in my heart yeah the lord of that will yeah the lord i'm gonna say the lord delights in taking those three weeks to talk to me about how I can trust him with that part of my heart yes right that's part of and again he wants that door open I want that door open my heart my heart is less convinced about that yeah but God is delighting in that process yes right so it just yeah I think that that's a I love that yeah I think that's just an important reality because again like we can again we can turn that into a stick right like we can turn that into a stick like why can't I just get my why can't I get my heart there?
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_00: Right why can't I why can't I just something wrong with me there's something right and again we can take that and we can beat ourselves up with we can disqualify ourselves with that but I just thought that I think it's important for for people hearing this uh hearing us talk hearing this conversation is that there is a like your your acknowledgement that there are parts of your life that you you don't want God in right right just acknowledging it yeah and refusing to like and again like coming before him surrendering talking to him about those places your heart like he's a good father he's not going to force his way in yeah right but he is going to talk to you about it.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah right and so I just thought I thought people need to know that like a so wherever you are on that journey right uh that God is kind yes he's loving he's gracious he's merciful yeah and he is interested in like I'm sure there's doors in my heart that I haven't even I don't even know exist right that they might still be closed off to God.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: That's not my intent.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_00: Same right and again but we'll we'll get we'll get to those maybe in yes maybe in 10 years we'll get to them right yeah yeah totally but I just I think I I think I wanted you know just to sort of sum up a maybe I it feels like we're landing the plane a little bit here but I just I feel like people need to know that God's not mad at you.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yes if this is your place.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes absolutely that he's not like that that I want that they need to know that like the kindness of God his kind gaze is upon you even in this place of having places in your heart where it goes that God that hurts too much.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_00: And but yet like even in that statement of faith God I know this feels too whatever this feels too raw I can't do this right now.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_00: Even in the fact of I know this is best for me if you get in here.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_00: Like but that conversation is like being willing it's the it's the coming before me.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_00: God you see this you know this yeah and I know and I know that this is best for me.
• 47:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah but look so so let's keep talking about it.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_01: Let's continue the conversation and so I just think that's uh um that's just a I think wow there is a I think we I think we got somewhere that's so helpful so why don't we maybe I think it's your turn to pray okay yeah but just in yeah just just pray pray for us God thank you for um answer prayer you know Anthony and I often pray God use this conversation use these episodes use these conversations uh for your good and for your agenda and God I I believe you're doing that today through what we've talked about God open up uh even this very psalm psalm 139 uh as as we as we sit with it and consider it God open it up to us help us to get in the place that the psalmist was in as he even wrote it Lord thank you uh for these these the fact that you're faithful to steward our relationship God we we are we give all the credit to you for how close you are to us God you have established a relationship with us you know us you've searched us you know you're familiar with all of our ways God we want we want to be a partner in that and we want to be a faithful partner but our hearts are set on not withholding from you so we surrender and may we experience your grace and mercy even this week uh because of this conversation and we do say yes to you God um God would you come and help us to turn away from performance help us to turn away from earning and just and just surrender to you God and we do echo what what the psalmist wrote we are fearfully and wonderfully made and I pray God that you would persuade our hearts of your good intentions toward us in Jesus' name amen well that's a wrap on this episode it's been a privilege to have you as an honored guest as we all learn to hear God better.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_00: If your time with us has been encouraging and you think this conversation will be helpful to others we would love it if you could share this podcast with the people around you.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time