Latest / Get Real with Jim Weiss / Brooks Bell, Colonoscopy Enthusiast and Cancer Survivor, and Dr. Austin Chiang, Gastroenterologist and Chief Medical Officer of Endoscopy at Medtronic

Transcript

Brooks Bell, Colonoscopy Enthusiast and Cancer Survivor, and Dr. Austin Chiang, Gastroenterologist and Chief Medical Officer of Endoscopy at Medtronic · Get Real with Jim Weiss

• 0:09
  Speaker 1: I'm Jim Weiss, chairman and founder of Real Chemistry, and
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: this is the Get Real with the Chairman podcast. So
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: today's guests, Brooks Bell, and doctor Austin Chang were brought
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: together by colorectal cancer as rates are rising among those
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: in their teens, early adulthood and into their forties, and
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: remarkably declining in those over sixty five. But often due
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: to fear and even embarrassment, the signs of colon cancer
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: are ignored or denied until it's too late. In twenty nineteen,
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: Brooks was diagnosed with stage three colon cancer. Today in remission,
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: she's worked with the Colorectal Cancer Alliance and founded Lead
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: from Behind, a nonprofit you may remember from a twenty
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: twenty two video in which Ryan Reynolds and Rob mclhaney
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: filmed their colonoscopies, leading to a thirty six percent increase
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: in appointments nationwide. Her next venture is world class clothing
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: apparel designed to increase awareness of the symptoms of colon
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: cancer and to improve access to colonoscopies in underinsured communities.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: Doctor Chang is a distinguished gastar entrologist renowned for his
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: expertise and digestive health, endoscopy, and social media advocacy. In
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: twenty twenty one, he became the first chief medical officer
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: of Medtronics Endoscopy Business, the world's leading medical device company.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: His debut book, Gut The Owner's Guide, offers an informative
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: introduction to this mysterious part of the body we're all
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: reliant on. I'm thrilled Brooks in Austin could take time
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: out of their schedules to speak with me on get
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: Real with the chem. Hey all, good to see you.
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: Thanks for being with me to talk about one of
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: my favorite regions of the body, the colon. I think
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: I've told people before I started my career at the bottom.
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: The first product I worked on was metamucil, and the
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: second one was pepto bismol. I worked my way up
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: the GI track. I really just wanted to start out quickly,
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: just asking how the two of you two meet.
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: My story is that we met at Metronic when you
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: joined Emtronic.
• 2:25
  Speaker 3: But also we didn't know each other.
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: But he's just a few years behind me in college
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: at Duke, so I kind of feel that we've been
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: in some ways connected our whole careers.
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: Is that the same story, you know, Austin.
• 2:37
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I often forget about the Duke half of it,
• 2:40
  Speaker 4: but you're absolutely right. I'm pretty sure we met like
• 2:42
  Speaker 4: when I first started at Metronic.
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I like the Duke connection. That's fun. I don't
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: like it in terms of basketball because I went to Syracuse,
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: so that's problematic. But otherwise we're good. So let's dive in.
• 2:54
  Speaker 1: The New York Times recently came out with an article,
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: but I don't think we need an article to tell
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: us that more young people than ever will and are
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: getting colon cancer. This was based on an American Cancer
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: Society report. A part of that perhaps driven by the
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: change in colonoskvih to forty five, which I guess we
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: probably don't feel is even young enough. Why does the
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: age range for colonosco visa? Maybe you take this, Austin first,
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: not match the diagnosis ages, Like why are we up
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: in the fifties when it would steam catching it early?
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: The logic doesn't add up, right, It's not a disease
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: of aging. Perhaps anymore.
• 3:35
  Speaker 4: Well, I think the keyword is anymore. I think that
• 3:37
  Speaker 4: we didn't quite know that until recently. Really, and so
• 3:42
  Speaker 4: we're noticing you know, every year, the rates of collectal
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: cancer among younger people keep going up a few percent
• 3:49
  Speaker 4: every single year, which is really alarming. And you know,
• 3:51
  Speaker 4: I understand from a societal perspective it's difficult wing the
• 3:55
  Speaker 4: resources that we have versus like recommending widespread screen for
• 3:59
  Speaker 4: the higher population. But I think we're starting to see
• 4:03
  Speaker 4: that we need more screening among younger people. And I
• 4:06
  Speaker 4: know old Brooks can probably speak to this younger people.
• 4:09
  Speaker 4: They're noticing more symptoms and whatnot that previously you wouldn't
• 4:14
  Speaker 4: think colorectal cancer would be an explanation for those symptoms,
• 4:17
  Speaker 4: and now we really have to keep that in mind.
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: The American Cancer Society predicted that roughly one hundred and
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: fifty three thousand new diagnoses would be made in the US,
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: of which nineteen thousand, five hundred and fifty would be
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: people younger than fifty and millennials have twice the risk
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: of colon cancer compared with people born around the nineteen fifties,
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: which again I don't know if we have a lot
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: of reasons for that, but let's talk. Maybe the government
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: gets involved. Brooks. You spoke at the White House as
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: part of the Cancer Moonshot this ambitious federal program to
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: reduce cancer desk by fifty percent over the next twenty
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: five years. Can we hear more about what you talked
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: about there?
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we had an amazing panel at the White House
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: and Karen Knudsen from the American Cancer Society was on
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: the panel, as was Lisa Richardson from the CDC, and
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: also Angie Davis and Michael Sapienza, the CEOs of to
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: the top nonprofits in the coloratal cancer space, and we
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: covered a lot of ground. Some of the things we
• 5:19
  Speaker 2: talked about on the panel, it was the issue with
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: health equity and the disparity in low income and African
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: American folks their outcomes are much worse than people who
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: are white, on how to address that, and we also
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: talked about the early onset kind of to speak to
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: your earlier question. One of the issues with early onset
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: is that the change is dramatic, is growing quickly the
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: cases in younger people, but the overall number of people
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: who are getting calling cancer who are young is still
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: quite low. It's about one and twenty four people in
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: their lifetime will get calling cancer, but only one in
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: two hundred and sixty will get it. Before they're fifty.
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: And so if we're.
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: Looking at trying to catch a case in two hundred
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: and sixty people, no one can afford to screen all
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: two hundred and fifty nine other people just to catch
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: that one case and at an effective price. And so
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: that's the reason it hasn't moved down. We basically have
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: to wait for that number to be a little bit
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: higher for that to make financial sense for the government
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: or for anyone to be able to cover it. But
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: it's still very difficult when you are like me, like
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: I was that two hundred and sixtieth person and got
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: it earlier. But that is the reason I think that.
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: Back to the panel at the White House, I think
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: one of the big takeaways was something pretty simple and
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: that everyone agreed that coloractal cancer is really important because
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: it's one of the few preventable cancers, and that is
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: a message that is not understood widely enough, and it
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: doesn't get enough funding despite being one of the few
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: preventable cancers. There's a lot of dedicated research dollars. I
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: go towards the they're big three or four cancers, they
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: have dedicated funding, and coloratal cancer hasn't actually been recognized
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: in the same way, and so it is chronically underfunded
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: by the government. And I think that's one reason that
• 7:12
  Speaker 2: it is still the second most deadly cancer. More people
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: die of colon cancer than breast cancer, and it's why
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: it's just not getting enough attention, and it's skyrocketing young people,
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: and there's a big health equity issue, and we have
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: an effective, like amazing solution for preventing it, which is
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: a colonoscopy. There's already a solution and that's paid for
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: when you're forty five that people are not even getting
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: when they become qualified for it because there's a stigma
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: around both colon cancer and colonoscopies. And that's a marketing problem.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: And so because it's a marketing problem, it's a solvable problem.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: We just need to start talking about colon cancer differently
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: and in a creative way. And I think that's something
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: I find to be pretty fascinating. I think it's pretty
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: exciting to be able to have that.
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: Kind of impact.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: That's a great segue. I wanted to ask Austin, you
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: were also invited to speak at the White House, but
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: in your acting role as a healthcare leader and social
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: media right and there was a social media round table,
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: so speaking of getting it out there in a creative,
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: relatable way, how did that conversation go? And then I
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: let's talk a little bit about your book and the
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: series and some of that, because I think all of
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: that could help in this cause. Yeah.
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: Absolutely. I think my social media journey has been ten
• 8:30
  Speaker 4: years in the making, and it really stemmed from being
• 8:34
  Speaker 4: a clinician and noticing that patients are coming into the
• 8:37
  Speaker 4: hospital because of a lot of misinformation that they were
• 8:40
  Speaker 4: getting told through media, conventional media and social media. And
• 8:45
  Speaker 4: I felt ten years ago that there were very few
• 8:47
  Speaker 4: kind of actual trained voices speaking about healthcare topics. And fortunately,
• 8:53
  Speaker 4: over the years, there's been so many more health professions
• 8:56
  Speaker 4: that have gotten on social media and lended their voices
• 8:59
  Speaker 4: to the areas that they're experts in. And unfortunately, I
• 9:02
  Speaker 4: think that it took a global pandemic to really highlight
• 9:04
  Speaker 4: the role that social media has and shaping public opinion
• 9:07
  Speaker 4: of health professionals and potentially public health outcomes as well.
• 9:11
  Speaker 4: But I've taken it to myself to try to craft
• 9:15
  Speaker 4: my messages in a fun way, kind of like Brooks,
• 9:17
  Speaker 4: and hopefully get the message out to people who don't
• 9:20
  Speaker 4: even know that they need this type of information, right, Like,
• 9:23
  Speaker 4: it's one thing to get a message out to someone
• 9:25
  Speaker 4: who's already looking at the information, but something like collocqtual
• 9:28
  Speaker 4: cancer screening is about getting the word out to people
• 9:31
  Speaker 4: who don't even know that this is a condition that
• 9:33
  Speaker 4: they need to be screened for. And one way I
• 9:35
  Speaker 4: think to dispel some of that stigma that Brooks was
• 9:38
  Speaker 4: describing was to do it in a fun way and
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: just speak openly about it. And social media is a
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: great tool for that. So I've been very fortunate to
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: be a part of this entire effort across multiple platform
• 9:49
  Speaker 4: I was working with other creators online and working with
• 9:53
  Speaker 4: the social platforms directly, and ultimately that's sort of what
• 9:56
  Speaker 4: led to my role in the healthcare leaders in social
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: media around table the White House.
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: How do we make colon OSCO be prep fun? I mean,
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: I gues isn't that one of the issues? And then
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: what's the new tech? I know you're working on one
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: thing specifically at Medtronic, but what are some of the
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: things we can look forward to them? Either we'll make
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: this fun or maybe not necessary and maybe easier. Can
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: you talk to the audience about what the options are,
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: and I think the prep is still something that we
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: have to go through. It's improved over the years. I
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: think there are multiple options now al like some of our
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: lower volume than others, So there are various options nowadays.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: And I know that there's the folks out there who
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: are trying to develop like an edible version or other
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: types of more palatable options. But yeah, despite how long
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: kolonosophy has been around, there's still a lot of innovation
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: around how to improve the quality of a colonoscopy. And
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: when we were at south By, that was what we
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: were focusing on, was really educating the folks there about
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: artificial intelligence and how that can help doctors through their
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: jobs better by detecting more precancerous polyps. And we're seeing
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: that without any added to the patient. Really, the artificial
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: intelligence can help point out where certain pops are so
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: the doctors don't potentially miss those poll ups. And so
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: the whole point of getting a clon osky right is
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: to identify and locate where these pollups are and remove
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: them on the spot. Although there are other screening options
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: out there that are less invasive, like stool tests and whatnot,
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: those tests aren't as preferred because you're not able to
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: locate and remove the problem on the spot. Brooks, you
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: can speak to this, tell us a little bit about
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: your journey and what you learned from it.
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: I was diagnosed with calling cancer about five years ago
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: at age thirty eight. And before that I was a
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: data analytics entrepreneur. I ran a data analytics and marketing company,
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: and I was in the business of persuading people to
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: get to buy sneakers and sign up for new credit
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: cards and trying to do that in an effective way.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: And getting call on cancer, of course, was a shocking thing,
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: life changing experience, and I was lucky enough to have
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: a successful therapy and treatment.
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: And to come out unscathed.
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: I'm cancer free now, five years later.
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: You came to it late, Why, I mean, was it
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: because you didn't recognize it as a problem or did
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: your doctors?
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: I was at a conference in late twenty eighteen and
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: went to the bathroom, looked down and saw that I
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: had blended my stool. And I called a doctor that
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: morning from my telehealth kind of application, and she was like,
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: based on your age, you know, it's probably hemorrhight. She
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: was like, we all get hamorrhized, don't worry about it,
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: live your life. So I felt relieved for a second,
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: and then I went back home.
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: I was still bleeding, and I.
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: Decided to get a primary care doctor to come and
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: actually examine me, and so I did that. She examined me,
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: she didn't find a hemorrhte and she was like, well,
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: I didn't find a hemorrhoid, but it's still probably a
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: HEMORRHOI and I didn't like that logic, so I thought
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: she was going to refer me to colonoscomy, but she didn't.
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: So after that, I decided to cold call a gasterentrology
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: and requested kolonoscopy. And even that was kind of difficult
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: because I was not referred and they told me I
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: be charged quite a bit of money to have the meeting,
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: so I had to overcome quite a bit of resistance.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: And finally when I saw a gaserentrologist, they said, if
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: you've been waited for two months, as not a hand ride,
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: and then I described what it looked like and everything.
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: They're like, that doesn't sound like it's a hemorrhyd and
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: she's there were like, and you're not too young for
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: a colon cancer and They fortunately took it very seriously
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: and got me for kolonoscopy four days later, and sure
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: enough it was a tumor causing all the trouble. And
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: later after it was staged, if we found out that
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: it was already stage three and had it grown a
• 13:40
  Speaker 2: single millimeter deeper into my colon wall, my chances of
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: survivor would have dropped ten points. So I mean it
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: was essential that I got in as quickly as I did,
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: But I think a lot of people in my own
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: situation probably would have just been relieved to have another
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: answer memor ride, and I think that's a problem. So
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: that's why I'm pretty passionate to be able to put
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: myself out there, use my colon cancer story to talk
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: about kolonoscaby's in a different, more exciting, more funny way,
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: and educate people that colon cancer is perventable.
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: Kolonoskbies prevent it and are not that bad.
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: And that led you to team up what with I
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: think you got involved with Colon Cancer Alliance and Ryan
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: Reynolds and some other guys and pioneered I think an
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: interesting set of programs lead from behind. But you know,
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: I think your tail, while cautionary is also obviously instructive,
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: and what it's saying is you got to take control
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: of your own healthcare because it seems like our health
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: system is really about treating the problem after it occurs.
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: I've seen this with my own wife's situation in terms
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: of getting aggressive diagnostic done that could save not only
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: your life, but time, money, energy all the way down
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: throughout the system. So tell us what prompt How did
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: that go with Ryan Reynolds.
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of amazing that actually happened.
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: After I finished my treatment, I was inspired to try
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: to do something about it, and so I joined the
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: board of a coloradonal Cancer Alliance and asked them to
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: partner with me to basically build a nonprofit within a nonprofit,
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: And I started Lead from Behind kind within the Coloradonal
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: Cancer Alliance.
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: And the purpose of Lead from Behind.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: Was to talk about colon cancer and klonosopi's differently than
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: they'd ever been talked about before. And the strategy was
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: to try to find a celebrity to get a colonoscopy
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: just because they're forty five, not because of any other reason.
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: That is not a big deal to get your kolonospi
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: when you're forty five and you don't need to be
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: sick or old or whatever. And we approach Ryan Reynold
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: and his marketing team to see if they'd be interested,
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: and amazingly they said yes. And Ryan was turning forty
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: five and so was his business partner, Rob mclaney, and
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: so they got colonosopies together.
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: They had a bed around it, they made it really fun.
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: Incredibly, they both found polyps and that became part of
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: the narrative and really underscored the reason that you want
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: to do kolonosopy's early. And what's so amazing is that
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: the video was so great. If you haven't seen it,
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: you can go get it. You just google like Ryan
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: Reynolds kolonoscopy on YouTube. So when they did it, we
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: had sixteen million.
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: Views in the first week.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: It was global news and ultimately led to a thirty
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: six percent increase in colonoscopy appointments nationwide and we think
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: that prevented colon cancer and at least a thousand people
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: at least.
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: Right we probably can't quantify it. And Austin, let me
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: give a plug for the book. Your book has easy
• 16:39
  Speaker 1: to follow science and lifestyle advice illustrations with data driven
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: images that show how lifestyle choices impact health. Tips to
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: help you know how to get the best care for
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: your body and gut. And I'm using the word gut purposefully,
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: and chapters that outline how your gut works, how to
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: have a healthy gut, what to do to improve of
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: your gut health. That's different than saying colorectal or some
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: of these other things. Did you choose the gut? And
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: I know gut's a very trendy area today, anyway, did
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: you choose the word gut, Austin? Is that something people
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: can take and listen to better than some of the
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: other words we've used historically. Well, I think the colon
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: and rectum are part of the gut, and so it's
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: not inaccurate to say that it's all part of gut health.
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: And like you said, gut health is trendy, and I
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: think it's smart to capitalize on that. The whole purpose
• 17:32
  Speaker 1: of this book, Got an Owner's Guide is really to
• 17:35
  Speaker 1: have this colorful, illustrated format that you don't often see,
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: and other sections after every chapter where it's devoted to
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: the bunking myths and even explaining kind of what you
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: would encounter when you enter the healthcare system and like,
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: who are the people that you're going to be interacting with,
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: and what is experience like and if your doctor's recommending
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: certain procedures, what are those exactly. I feel like a
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: lot of the books out there the market don't really
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: get into that part of it, whereas this one really
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: not only talks about certain conditions and other things that
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: you can do to take care of your gut, but
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: also like what the procedures that you're going to encounter.
• 18:11
  Speaker 4: So I think that's an exciting piece of it.
• 18:13
  Speaker 1: Brooks. I guess that's what prompted you and inspired you
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: to start World Class Clothing to again make this discussion
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: more accessible and maybe break down some of the barriers
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: to talking about it and dealing with it and facing it.
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: Can you talk a little bit about that brand.
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm very excited. I'm working on a new brand,
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: World Class Clothing, with two other female young colon cancer survivors,
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: and we are inspired by the impact that Ryan and
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: Rob had with their amazing message and gut health, as
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: Austin has said, is very trendy. People are thinking about
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: their guts. There's a lot of issues with guts these days.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: Everyone has issues, whether or not it's colon cancer, IBS
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: or just there's just issues. And what's amazing is colon
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: cancer is so under funded. There is no consumer brand,
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: no like trendy apparel brand that supports colon cancer or kolonoscopies.
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: And maybe there's a reason by that.
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: Maybe colonosopy isn't exactly the coolest thing.
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: But we're kind of like how breast cancer adopted the
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: pink everything right and the shoes exactly.
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: Someone stepped out forty years ago to make breast cancer
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: okay to talk about and something to support, and no
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: one has really done that effectively with colon cancer yet.
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: And so I'm pretty excited because we have with colon cancer.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: We can talk about your ass. I mean, asses are great.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: Everyone who loves ass. We should co opt the ass
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: to support colon cancer or correctal and I think that
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: we can do something really fun and creative with it.
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: We don't have to get people all the way to
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: being all about kolonosquy's in one step.
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: If we can just get them to appreciate that they.
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: Love asses, healthy asses, start to bring kolonoscopies into the
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: conversation around gut health and wellness. I think that would
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: be an amazing first step. And so we're going to
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: to make a brand that is cool called world Class
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: because you can't spell world class without the word ass
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: And so we're going to start there and see if
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: we can start creating more conversations and show that we
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: can actually make klin Ask be sexy.
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: Now I want to shift into a section I'm calling
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: so What's it all Mean? Where we hear about your
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: work and action and how it's playing out in the
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: real world. You were all in the panel with Katie Kuric,
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: who at one point created the Katie Kiric Effect after
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: her husband passed. It's like, we need a voice every
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: generation that's taking this whole issue forward. You have very
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: match missions, right, the two of you are trying to
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: make this relatable. I know my wife has small bowels,
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: so that's within the bigger system, but much more rare
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: and much harder to find and much harder to diagnose.
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: She too took years, lost a ton of weight, had
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: a lot of issues, and again a younger women. We
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: just wouldn't have expected it in a woman your age
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: to get this. We thought it was everything else, but
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: when it could very easily be ruled out if you
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: just do the right testing. Quoting a phrase I read
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: from you Brooks verbalizing my bathroom experience. Are you hoping
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: to make verbalizing the bathroom experience as colloquials listening to
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: your gut? Is that a phrase we hear often? I mean,
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: sounds like these are all the things that could help
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: in this effort to get people to go out in
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: the screen earlier.
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: I don't think we need to be giving a family
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: wide report of exactly our texture and frequency of our
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: stool every day. But it's inter verbalizing our bathroom experience.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: But I think that when something is wrong, it's really
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: important to kind of have enough ability to talk about it.
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: I think it's important because shortly after my diagnosis, I
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: met a woman who's husband had passed away from colon
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: cancer at age forty two, and he had just months
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: to live before he died, and he gave her all
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: his passwords, and I think one day after he was gone,
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: she was looking at his old browsing behavior just for
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: fun and noticed that for many, many months, oh for
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: over a year, he had been googling blood in my stool,
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: and he never mentioned it to her until it was
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: really till it was too late, and so because of
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: that fear, I mean, if he had just been willing
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: to talk about it with his wife, maybe he could
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: have been diagnosed earlier before it was fatal. So I
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: think those are the reasons that it's so important that
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: we look at our stool, we can talk about.
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: It when something seems off, and that.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: We bring it up to our doctor or we don't
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: steal like it's this really awkward, super gross thing to
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: the degree that we're ignoring really important symptoms.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: I'm optimistic because, I mean, we got mental health to
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: be discussed much more, particularly through the pandemic. It's you know,
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: a telehealth sensation, and while we can't say it's perfect,
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: there's now more resource, more discussion, there's less stigma. Really,
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: what's next in your partnership and in our collective partnership
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: is carrying on that legacy of what Katie Kuric and
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: others have done continue to do. Do you think we
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: have enough voices in this yet? It sounds like no, right,
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: it sounds like we're not funded enough and we're not
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: vocal enough.
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: Yet there's a lot of work that needs to be done.
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: I think celebrities are starting to put out their kolonoscopies,
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: and I think that is a huge step in the
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: right direction. I think there is been a little bit
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: of a cultural shift in the last five years since
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: I've been starting to pay attention. People need to demand
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: their kolonoscopies. Last time it was published, the average age
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: for your first kolonosopy was age fifty four. I think
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: this was before they lowered it, so I'm sure it
• 23:49
  Speaker 2: has naturally moved down somewhat, but that still there's on
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: average a four year delay from when you become qualified
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: for a covered kolonoscopy to.
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: When you actually get it.
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: If we get people talking about colonoscopies much earlier and
• 24:04
  Speaker 2: be not afraid of the prep and the anesesia and
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: the process, and think about it differently as a fast
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: to cleanse in a nap, then we will prevent a
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: ton of colon cancer just in those four years.
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: There's nothing better than actually taking a look inside your
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: call in. Some of the non invasive tests are great
• 24:23
  Speaker 4: at picking up things early, which is the whole point.
• 24:27
  Speaker 4: Is like actually picking things up early and being able
• 24:29
  Speaker 4: to remove a bit on the spot. And so there's
• 24:32
  Speaker 4: still a lot of innovation. I think things Potentially one
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: day it could change, like how we screen for colorectal cancer,
• 24:37
  Speaker 4: But right now, khlonoscophy is still the best thing that's
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: out there. I always tell a lot of people that
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: if you're going to get a non invasive test, if
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: it comes that positive, you're going to need a colonoscophy anyway.
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: And obviously, compared to actually getting diagnosed with the condition
• 24:52
  Speaker 4: itself colorectal cancer, it's best that you get the colonoscopy
• 24:56
  Speaker 4: so we can actually address it earlier.
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: Right it sounds like the mass is early and often
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: it's the same old thing.
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: I think about an old COVID analogy. The other stool
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: tests are like getting a COVID test. It will more
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: or less tell you if you already are sick, whereas
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: a kolonoscopy is more like a COVID vaccine. It's not
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: one hundred percent, but it will do a great job
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: of protecting you from getting it.
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: And so we know that.
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: Vaccines are like a totally different league of protection than
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: the tests, and I think that we haven't made that
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: connection when we think about kolonoscopies on a completely different
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: level than the other screening options. Which are just sort
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: of they're diagnostic. They tell you if you're already sick.
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: For the most part, some of them can detect in
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: some cases apollo up that is on the verge of bursting.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: But you have to get a kolonoscopy anyway to find
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: out if that's the case.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: You know, let me get a little medical and scientific here.
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: Colorectal cancer versus callon cancer. Is there a difference? Is
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: it at all part of the same system. Not really.
• 26:03
  Speaker 4: The rectum is just the last portion of the colon
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: before the exit, So it's all one of the same.
• 26:09
  Speaker 4: And not to be confused with anal cancer, because the
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: process that leads to anal cancer is different and the
• 26:16
  Speaker 4: causes behind that are different. But colorectal cancer, I would say,
• 26:20
  Speaker 4: you can kind of put into the same bucket. And
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: I have to add that Brooks is designs with world
• 26:25
  Speaker 4: class clothing and what I've seen are pretty awesome.
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: So I'm also equally just as excited.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: Right behind me, I have my ass hat, which is
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: going to be an instant bestseller, I guarantee it.
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: So from the book, tell us a little bit about lifestyle, diet,
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: gut health. Does that affect our susceptibility to colon cancers
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: and you are what you eat, drink. Maybe it's in
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: the water. Maybe that's one of the reasons things are
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: on the rise. Can you give us a little bit
• 26:55
  Speaker 1: about what foods are good, what foods are bad? Is
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: there any hard research that would say one or the
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: other would prevent it? I know high fiber diets are
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: well known to be helpful in this regard. That's what
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: I was pitching in metamucil days. What is the conventional
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: thinking now.
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: Well, I don't want to overcomplicate things, but if I
• 27:17
  Speaker 4: had to suggest one thing to anyone listening or watching,
• 27:21
  Speaker 4: is to avoid red meat. That's like the one link
• 27:25
  Speaker 4: that I think has been well established. That said, there's
• 27:29
  Speaker 4: probably a lot out there that has to do with
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: cultural process firds of today's day and age that we
• 27:34
  Speaker 4: haven't drawn those associations with. But that's part of the
• 27:37
  Speaker 4: thinking behind why their a rising rates of cooractal cancer
• 27:41
  Speaker 4: among younger people are just based on how our diet
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: has evolved over the past recent decades.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: And then generally speaking.
• 27:47
  Speaker 4: I think like the book goes into also just how
• 27:49
  Speaker 4: to interpret some of the packaging and labeling of foods
• 27:52
  Speaker 4: because there's a lot out there that are marketing terms
• 27:55
  Speaker 4: that don't inherently have much meaning behind them, aren't actually
• 28:00
  Speaker 4: collections of the actual certifications or screening processes or regulations
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: out there. So just like another reminder to people to
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: really pay attention to what is on the labeling of
• 28:12
  Speaker 4: their food and what they actually mean. But yeah, generally speaking,
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: I don't want to over index either and say that
• 28:17
  Speaker 4: you have to avoid entire food groups. I think as
• 28:20
  Speaker 4: long as you kind of limit your red meat intake
• 28:22
  Speaker 4: and have a balanced diet, I think that's the most
• 28:25
  Speaker 4: important thing, a balance, diverse diet.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: Why is taking care of our gut health getting so complicated?
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: It used to be, you know, here's eat an apple
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: a day. That seemed to be like a fiber that
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: one would eat and things seem I guess because of
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: the overprocessing of food. But there's like a gut health revolution.
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: Is it too complicated? We now hear about the microbiome.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: Talk to us a little bit about that. Well, I
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: think it's become more complicated because we're learning more about
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: our gut and the microbiome. Over the past several years,
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: I think has gotten a lot more attention and we're
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: learning more about it, but it's still a mystery to us,
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: so we can't draw too many conclusions from that yet,
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: especially when it comes to colorectal cancer, and so I
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: wouldn't want to put too much weight on that. I
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: think that one of the reasons why it is somewhat
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: confusing is because there is a big market out there
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: where there are a lot of probiotics available. I mean,
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: you go to any drug store nowadays and there are
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: a lot of over the counter probiotics. And the thing is,
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: none of these probiotics are regulated by the FDA, And
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: how are you using them, What sort of bacterial strains
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: are the best for certain conditions, what dostages you should
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: be taking, like, no one really knows. And so with time,
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: hopefully we'll be able to target alterations to the microbio
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: to certain conditions, but as of yet, a lot of
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: it is still up in the air. And so just
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: a word of caution to people out there that those
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: products aren't as regulated as medications or medical devices are.
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: Not to say that they're not potentially beneficial, but they
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: might not benefit everyone consistently, and you might not know
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: if there are certain additives in there that could be
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: causing more harm than good. Austin, you started the hashtag
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: verify healthcare right on social media to educate about GI
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: related conditions. What inspired you to start it? How's it going? Well?
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: Actually, that hashtag was probably back from twenty eighteen, so
• 30:23
  Speaker 4: it's been a while now, And in the moment back then,
• 30:26
  Speaker 4: I think it highlighted fact that there were a lot
• 30:29
  Speaker 4: of folks out there talking about health who weren't qualified,
• 30:32
  Speaker 4: necessarily didn't have the board certifications and licenses to actually
• 30:36
  Speaker 4: be speaking about these topics.
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: And so a lot of people you mean, like people
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: taking the weight loss drugs.
• 30:42
  Speaker 4: Now, well, there are a lot of people out there
• 30:44
  Speaker 4: who are talking about these things, weight loss drugs or
• 30:46
  Speaker 4: any other health topic really without the appropriate credentials, and
• 30:50
  Speaker 4: often it can be very misleading because some of them
• 30:54
  Speaker 4: portray themselves as health professionals. So a point that many
• 30:58
  Speaker 4: of us were fooled by these so called physicians who
• 31:02
  Speaker 4: weren't actually physicians. And so that movement was actually to
• 31:05
  Speaker 4: disclose all of our credentials, those of us who were
• 31:08
  Speaker 4: auditions or other health professionals. We would all disclose what
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: our credentials were, and it's sort of a bigger conversation
• 31:14
  Speaker 4: about Okay, how should we as health professionals show up
• 31:18
  Speaker 4: on social media? And that then led to me founding
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: a five oh one c three nonprofit called the Association
• 31:25
  Speaker 4: for Healthcare Social Media, where we educated other health professionals
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: learn how to use social media, not only how to
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: actually create the content and storytell, but also what the
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: pitfalls were to avoid. I no longer lead that organization,
• 31:37
  Speaker 4: but that's sort of what then led to us interacting
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: with the social platforms directly, and many of us still
• 31:44
  Speaker 4: advise to this day some of these platforms on their
• 31:46
  Speaker 4: misinformation tools and efforts around the back, right.
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's so critical, you know. I can't thank
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: you both enough for taking the time here. My goal
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: in this is that my audience of healthcare provider, pharmaceutical companies,
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: so many others feel inspired to find additional partnership opportunities
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: with the two of you and myself around this somewhat simple,
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: clear message, which is screen early and often prevent the event.
• 32:16
  Speaker 1: And there's a million ways we can put this, but
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: it's going to be a gift that keeps on giving.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: It's so much cheaper and less painful to prevent it
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: than to have to treat it. We know what comes
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: with all that, and I appreciate and was inspired when
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: I saw YouTube putting yourselves out there. So thanks for
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: keeping it going. And let's get world class and your
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: book out in the world as far as wide as
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: we can get it. Thanks so much for today.
• 32:46
  Speaker 4: Stripp, I think so much.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: All right, let's keep up the good work. Hey everyone,
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: thanks for listening in today. The Get Real with the
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: Chairman podcast is a production of Real Chemistry. I want
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: to thank my team, led by executive producer Kate Voss,
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: audio engineer Nick Murphy, and composer Matt Lipkins, and special
• 33:11
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• 33:14
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• 33:16
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• 33:21
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• 33:25
  Speaker 1: thanks for listening and we'll see you on the road.