Latest / Zero Shot Podcast DEMO / Khabib Nurmagomedov: The Champion's Journey from Dagestan

Transcript

Khabib Nurmagomedov: The Champion's Journey from Dagestan · Zero Shot Podcast DEMO

• 0:03
  Lex Fridman: The following is a conversation with Khabib Nurmagomedov, one of the greatest fighters of all time, who retired from the
• 0:11
  UFC undefeated with a perfect 29 -0 record.
• 0:16
  It was a huge honor for me to meet him, to train together, and to have this deep conversation.
• 0:23
  We had this conversation entirely in Russian.
• 0:29
  Khabib expresses heartfelt gratitude for the love and support they's received over the years.
• 0:35
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: from the bottom of my heart, for your love and support all these years.
• 0:40
  I love you all.
• 0:42
  Lex Fridman: Now, let's dive into the conversation with Khabib.
• 0:46
  This is the Lex Freedman Podcast.
• 0:48
  And now, dear friends, here's Habib Nurmagomedov.
• 0:53
  Let's try in Russian if we can, like you suggested.
• 1:30
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Can you try to explain or maybe reflect on what factors in that gym, those training sessions, that life in
• 1:38
  Dagestan created so many champions?
• 1:41
  Sure.
• 1:42
  So, we're talking about the gym, the one located in Mahajkala.
• 1:46
  And Mahajkala, for the people who don't know, it's the capital of Dagestan.
• 1:51
  This was back around the years from 2000 to 2010, and even later on.
• 1:57
  In 2019, we opened up a big gym, a major facility that is still functioning to this day.
• 2:04
  But before 2019, we all actually trained in that gym, where there was practically nothing.
• 2:10
  It was just a school gym with nothing but mats, a single punching bag, one climbing rope, and a kind of
• 2:18
  indoor basketball court.
• 2:21
  And if we go even further back, before 2000, before
• 2:30
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on the challenges of wealth and the expectations placed on young athletes.
• 2:36
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Would that same wealthy father, would he force you to do such a brutal sport?
• 2:41
  A sport where you come home every day.
• 2:44
  With injuries.
• 2:47
  Where you come home with an exhausted body.
• 2:50
  You come home with bruises.
• 2:51
  Would he really do that?
• 2:52
  That's the question.
• 2:54
  And, the kid himself, who lives a life of luxury, would he even want to do this?
• 2:59
  When we look at it statistically, the answer is no.
• 3:04
  Lex Fridman: where you need that hunger.
• 3:05
  You have to be in a position where you are truly in need.
• 3:08
  And, it's interesting that there's a psychological side to this as well.
• 3:12
  's success in wrestling.
• 3:14
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: how Dagestan has produced so many wrestling champions.
• 3:17
  You mentioned football.
• 3:18
  Let's look at other countries.
• 3:21
  Why has Brazil produced so many great football players?
• 3:28
  Lex Fridman: Khabib emphasizes the high competition level in Dagestan's gyms, where many talented wrestlers train.
• 3:36
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Well, first important factor is the competition level is incredibly high.
• 3:42
  You come to the gym, and in every spot, you have good wrestlers, 10 or 15 guys
• 3:50
  Lex Fridman: right there, and the coaches are great.
• 3:54
  You know, it so happened that my father broke through in the media, and then I became a champion, and the
• 4:02
  other guys became champions too.
• 4:04
  And my father's philosophy, it really resonated, and he became known for it.
• 4:09
  Yeah.
• 4:10
  But there are coaches in Dagestan that not many people know about.
• 4:16
  They are known locally, but they are very good.
• 4:20
  And actually, they have the knowledge, they have the approach, they have the philosophy.
• 4:25
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: They could also be at the same level as my father was.
• 4:28
  I believe there are really quite a few of them.
• 4:31
  In terms of the coaching, I think Dagestan was extremely lucky.
• 4:35
  It probably goes back to the 1950s, when wrestling really took off here, starting with Ali Aliev, our legendary
• 4:43
  wrestler, a five -time world champion who went to the Olympics three times.
• 4:47
  That's where it started, with his generation.
• 4:50
  There was Zagalaf, Abdulbekov, Ali Aliev, those are the well -known names.
• 4:54
  I mean, those guys are famous, but there were so many other less -known wrestlers who later on, after they retired, they all became great
• 5:02
  coaches themselves.
• 5:03
  And these coaches, they raised a very large number of guys
• 5:06
  Lex Fridman: Switching to the topic of football culture.
• 5:09
  Why does Argentina have so many football players?
• 5:12
  Of course, you have Germany, France, and all that.
• 5:15
  European, yeah.
• 5:15
  The whole European side.
• 5:17
  But, those are completely different cultures.
• 5:19
  Yes.
• 5:19
  Well, in Brazil, their strength is in their numbers.
• 5:22
  How many people do they have?
• 5:23
  The population is huge.
• 5:25
  More than 200 million.
• 5:27
  And, people really love it there.
• 5:29
  It's a huge tradition.
• 5:30
  Because, you know, without a real love for this sport, you can never achieve any success.
• 5:35
  You truly have to love what you are doing.
• 5:37
  So, they have the tradition and they have the love for it.
• 5:40
  And, that is why they play for all the top clubs.
• 5:43
  Well, I think they just win by numbers.
• 5:46
  Yeah, that's a powerful aspect of their culture.
• 5:49
  How much people, how much the whole nation loves to play football.
• 5:53
  And, if you add to that a system that creates strong teams, that's how you can produce so many football legends.
• 5:58
  Yes, take Dagestan, for example.
• 6:01
  We love football.
• 6:02
  I just know how much people in Dagestan love football.
• 6:04
  Yes, we have wrestlers, fighters.
• 6:06
  There are many of us.
• 6:07
  But, for football players, there is no ecosystem like that.
• 6:10
  Not so well organized where a kid can, for example, play at school, then go to some academy, then get noticed there, and then get picked up by a
• 6:18
  club.
• 6:18
  We don't have that system.
• 6:19
  It's just kids running on the streets, playing on the streets, following football.
• 6:26
  Discussing the role of coaches in sports.
• 6:28
  who are really good at wrestling.
• 6:31
  And then some of those coaches, they kind of switched over to fighting, let's say to grappling, to
• 6:39
  MMA.
• 6:39
  And they started coaching in combat sambo as well.
• 6:42
  And it just kept going like that.
• 6:45
  You know, it was moving forward step by step.
• 6:49
  And so, we have a huge number of really great coaches.
• 6:52
  I believe this is one of the single most important keys to the success of Dagestani wrestlers and fighters, the coaching
• 7:00
  staff of Dagestan.
• 7:01
  Is it more about technique, or is it really just about serious, incredibly hard work?
• 7:08
  Well, you have to look at the traditions.
• 7:10
  Because generally, it's just the way it is in Dagestan.
• 7:13
  Everyone wrestles, everyone fights.
• 7:15
  It's part of our culture.
• 7:17
  You know yourself, fighting is like 50 % wrestling.
• 7:21
  Every parent wants their children to wrestle, to be physically strong.
• 7:26
  Our approach to kids is that a child must be strong.
• 7:29
  They must be able to stand up for themselves, for their family.
• 7:33
  It's something that has traditionally always been in every single one of our clans, every family, every
• 7:41
  village.
• 7:42
  It's just in our blood.
• 7:48
  Moving from It's blood to playing PlayStation, what changed?
• 7:53
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Let's say playing on PlayStation.
• 7:56
  There is no system.
• 7:58
  There is no selection process where kids can go and show themselves so they can be noticed and get signed.
• 8:04
  I think Brazil and other countries, and, of course, Europe, they have it.
• 8:09
  So, yeah, we have big problems with football.
• 8:12
  Lex Fridman: However, in our sports, where you can wrestle, where you can fight, in that sense, we have a system.
• 8:18
  For example, the gyms, you know, in Makashkala, let's say for combat sports.
• 8:22
  I'm not even counting, like, freestyle, wrestling, or other styles.
• 8:27
  There may be 40 or 50 gyms for combat sports, and all are full.
• 8:31
  If you win in Dagestan, you move on to the North Caucasus level, then to the Russian nationals.
• 8:36
  If you're champion of Russia, you go to the worlds.
• 8:39
  In amateurs, they notice you, and you make a name for yourself.
• 8:42
  There is a certain ladder here.
• 8:45
  But in many other sports here in Dagestan, we don't have such a well -structured ladder for people to climb.
• 8:51
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Can we look at this philosophically again?
• 8:53
  I mean, you've seen so many wrestlers, fighters.
• 8:56
  Lex Fridman: Why exactly were these gyms creating so many champions?
• 9:00
  I'm just honestly curious, because it's rare in any sport, one gym or a small number of gyms creating so many champions.
• 9:07
  Reflecting on Dagestan's cultural influence.
• 9:11
  Well, in the past, it's not like I really felt it.
• 9:14
  I knew Dagestan's history, but maybe with time, you start to see it in a whole new light.
• 9:19
  Every year, you change a bit on a mental and psychological level.
• 9:26
  Now, I understand.
• 9:27
  I really do.
• 9:29
  You cannot just be born physically and mentally strong.
• 9:36
  Khabib shares his personal connection to Dagestan.
• 9:40
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Many people, many empires invaded our land.
• 9:43
  So, do you feel that inside you, in your blood, your heart, like all of this history?
• 9:50
  Lex Fridman: Mental toughness is crucial for maintaining success as a champion. Khabib attributes their success to their father's coaching.
• 9:58
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Your environment shapes you no matter what, where you grew up, how you grew up, the conditions, and who you had around you.
• 10:06
  And after all, genetics are also a part of who you are.
• 10:10
  So, when you add all this up, yeah, I just feel like all of this has come together inside me.
• 10:17
  Lex Fridman: It's interesting because in sports, we know many of the names of the great fighters and wrestlers.
• 10:25
  Yet, when it comes to war, there are so many people who fought, heroes, truly great warriors.
• 10:32
  Exploring the historical context of Dagestan.
• 10:35
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I mean, it's worth pointing out, and you've actually written about this, that this isn't just a recent thing.
• 10:40
  It's been going on for hundreds of years.
• 10:43
  Yes, that's
• 10:43
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on the legacy of Dagestan.
• 10:47
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Some we know by name, but most of them will never actually know and will never know.
• 10:53
  You write about Imam Shamil, that he's an important figure for this region and a hero as well.
• 11:01
  Well, Imam Shamil, he was known for resisting an empire as huge as Russia.
• 11:08
  Dagestan is so small and he had so few people with him.
• 11:11
  Lex Fridman: Discussing the geographical significance of Dagestan.
• 11:15
  right.
• 11:16
  These lands, Dagestan specifically, have seen powerful armies sweep through time and time again.
• 11:23
  Because of that, people here have always had to fight to survive, refusing to back down, refusing to give up their land or
• 11:31
  lose their identity.
• 11:32
  Their homes, their villages, their families, and land.
• 11:37
  If we look back a thousand years in history, maybe 1500 years, there was the Khazar Khaganate, the
• 11:45
  Arabic Caliphate, then the Iranian Empire, or the Persian Empire, I should say.
• 11:52
  Then the Russian Empire, Timur passed through there, the Mongols.
• 11:57
  And if we look at the geographical location of Dagestan, for those who don't know, the Caucasus Range runs
• 12:05
  across the whole region like a wall, and then it slopes down
• 12:08
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: right where the Caspian lowlands are.
• 12:12
  So you've got the sea on the right, the mountains on the left, and the Caspian lowlands
• 12:36
  Very large armies passed through.
• 12:37
  And it was bound to leave a mark on the people.
• 12:43
  We have so many languages, more than 30 different languages, and people just don't understand each other.
• 12:50
  Take Islam and me.
• 12:51
  We have different languages, come from different backgrounds.
• 12:54
  Islam is lag, and I'm avar.
• 12:56
  When we talk, it's not like it's a dialect.
• 12:59
  We don't understand each other at all.
• 13:01
  But since Islam has been with us for nearly 25 years, he actually picked up some avar over time.
• 13:08
  Lex Fridman: It created many different languages and traditions.
• 13:12
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Basically, of course, Islam is our primary religion, but Dagestan has actually absorbed a lot of cultures and
• 13:20
  faiths.
• 13:21
  Even our food culture, it is incredibly rich.
• 13:24
  Lex Fridman: We have European, and Asian, and Caucasian, our own unique cuisine.
• 13:30
  So, on the people, on the people themselves, the last 1500 years of history have left a
• 13:38
  huge mark.
• 13:39
  If you're into history, and you start reading about Dagestan, I think you'll get completely immersed, and be amazed by what a unique
• 13:47
  place it is.
• 13:48
  So, all of this left a huge mark.
• 13:51
  Look at the terrain.
• 13:52
  It's a coastal plain, and then, the mountains rise up.
• 13:55
  For instance, take someone like Timur.
• 13:57
  When he passed through with a huge army, he stayed in the Dagestan lowlands, but never went up into the mountains.
• 14:03
  Why?
• 14:04
  Because you've got hundreds of thousands of troops, soldiers traveling with horses, and supplies.
• 14:10
  If they had started going up into the mountains, where it's cold, and there are no roads, it would have been too tough for
• 14:18
  them.
• 14:18
  So, the highlanders somehow managed to stay independent.
• 14:23
  But the lowlands, the Caspian lowlands of Dagestan, they kept changing hands.
• 14:29
  Massive empires would roll in, and all of that left a mark on the people.
• 14:35
  Gate of the Gates, Bab -ul -Abwab.
• 14:37
  Historians wrote about it, say, a thousand or fifteen hundred years ago.
• 14:43
  Great historians from various countries.
• 14:45
  People have written so much about Dagestan.
• 14:48
  It went by different names back then, but they wrote a ton about this exact region.
• 14:54
  Khabib talks about the influence of history.
• 14:57
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: He, he was like a regular fighter, let's say, a soldier for 10 years.
• 15:02
  And then, when he became the leader, he went on for another 25 years.
• 15:08
  So, 35 years of his conscious life, he spent fighting not just some random empire, but what was then, if
• 15:16
  not the most powerful, definitely, one of the strongest empires of that era.
• 15:23
  And that is
• 15:32
  who came from their villages, from their clan, from their ethnic group.
• 15:38
  But in, world history, they're barely known.
• 15:44
  Like, take Shamil.
• 15:46
  He's a leader, right?
• 15:47
  So, everybody knows him.
• 15:48
  But there are plenty of heroes who've been forgotten.
• 15:51
  But yeah, their own people remember.
• 15:53
  Villages hold on to history.
• 15:55
  Plus, we have to admit that conditions in the mountains are incredibly harsh.
• 16:01
  That's part of it too.
• 16:02
  Lex Fridman: Just surviving up there is a real struggle.
• 16:05
  See, back then, people in the mountains walked all through the summer just to survive the winter.
• 16:09
  Because winters are harsh with heavy snow completely cutting off villages.
• 16:14
  People just stay inside and try to outlast
• 16:17
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: And in the summer, they work.
• 16:19
  Terrace farming was a huge thing for us.
• 16:22
  Our terraces are among the most, you could say, famous and ancient in the world.
• 16:28
  They're known as the Chok Terraces.
• 16:30
  Now, those are the famous ones.
• 16:32
  But every village had terraces.
• 16:34
  There's a place out there called Maghitl, right across from our village.
• 16:39
  People worked over there.
• 16:40
  But here, in the village, is where they lived.
• 16:43
  I mean, you think, why didn't they just build the village right there, in the place where we grow all our food?
• 16:49
  Because enemies could easily ride in on horseback.
• 16:53
  An army could easily get to you there.
• 16:55
  So they built the village in rugged terrain, somewhere tough to invade.
• 17:00
  For instance, our village is Sildi.
• 17:02
  It's from the word sea, which is like a castle or a fortress or a tower.
• 17:06
  Lex Fridman: They built it that way so an army couldn't reach them.
• 17:10
  You'd have to hike down one mountain and then climb up a whole different mountain.
• 17:15
  And right there, they'd plant things like grain, potatoes, basically, you know, all their food.
• 17:22
  See, if we had built over there, if we lived there and grew our crops in the same place, since it's all terraced land, an army could just
• 17:30
  walk right up, launch raids, and so on.
• 17:32
  Back in the day, that's how people lived.
• 17:35
  And so, all of this took a toll on people.
• 17:39
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Physically, psychologically, and mentally.
• 17:42
  And honestly, well, you just can't be born in these conditions, live here, stay here, and be mentally weak.
• 17:50
  You just have to be tough.
• 17:52
  There's no other way to survive.
• 17:54
  So you just built a sports complex there.
• 17:57
  Yeah.
• 17:58
  Pretty legendary, you know.
• 17:59
  Could you talk about that?
• 18:00
  Yes, that was my father's whole plan.
• 18:03
  He really wanted it way up in the mountains.
• 18:06
  First, it's great for the fighters.
• 18:08
  Right now, I just flew out here to Las Vegas.
• 18:11
  We're sitting here, like, doing this podcast together.
• 18:14
  But I came out here for Umar's fight.
• 18:17
  And I should say, Umar did his main training there, at the new base in Sildi.
• 18:27
  Lex Fridman: Khabib emphasizes the importance of mental toughness and the need to stay focused amidst distractions like fame and money.
• 18:35
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: As soon as they get there, what are they supposed to do?
• 18:40
  That's it.
• 18:41
  They already made it, they've reached their goal and there are just so many distracting factors, money, flights, you know,
• 18:48
  meetings, contracts, video shoots, there are just so many distracting factors.
• 18:54
  And so, if a person doesn't know how to handle all of this, then that person comes down from the top real fast.
• 19:02
  And I'm saying this based on my own experience, from what I've seen all around me with the ones
• 19:07
  Lex Fridman: Reflecting on the challenges faced by athletes.
• 19:10
  He spent almost a month at that place.
• 19:13
  And because it's 15 to 1600 meters above sea level, man, it's tough to train there.
• 19:21
  And, uh, and the thing is, when you spend about three to four weeks there, you just have more oxygen in your
• 19:29
  blood, you have more testosterone, you improve physically, you know, your stamina builds up, and so on.
• 19:38
  And this base was sort of my father's dream.
• 19:41
  He started building it back in 2016, 2017.
• 19:46
  Money was tight back then.
• 19:48
  It was really hard, but we built it little by little.
• 19:51
  In 2020, my father passed away, but I kept the project going just a little differently, on a bigger
• 19:59
  scale.
• 20:00
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Right now, the base is open, and a hundred people can be there at the same time.
• 20:05
  Training, eating, sleeping, and, uh, our guys hold their training camps up there.
• 20:14
  So, this was sort of my father's dream that I have pretty much brought to life.
• 20:21
  Lex Fridman: Khabib's journey back to his roots in Dagestan reflects a powerful story of legacy and commitment to training champions.
• 20:29
  It's a powerful story.
• 20:31
  To return to the place where you were born up in the mountains, in order to build a sports complex where champions train.
• 20:39
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Mahachkala Gym is a great place, but the mountains are special.
• 20:43
  Mountains are mountains.
• 20:45
  Mountains are mountains.
• 20:45
  Your home village, no matter
• 20:47
  Lex Fridman: Khabib emphasizes the importance of finding meaning beyond financial gain, highlighting the joy of creating opportunities for others.
• 20:56
  what, on some sort of deeper level, somehow gives you that, you know, like Americans love to say positive energy.
• 21:04
  Not everything has to be done for money.
• 21:06
  And, uh, you know, you shouldn't just look for profit in everything, let's say, financially.
• 21:12
  There are certain things that don't bring me anything at all, except for expenses, but I still do all of it because,
• 21:20
  um, because it brings me a lot of happiness and meaning.
• 21:25
  First of all, it creates a lot of jobs.
• 21:29
  People can work and earn a living.
• 21:32
  Second, it's because my father really wanted this.
• 21:35
  Third, let's say, the guys can train and improve up there, both physically and spiritually.
• 21:42
  There are just so many benefits there.
• 21:45
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I don't know if it's okay to ask something like this, but I would dream of coming out there to Dagestan and not just to Mahachkala, but to
• 21:53
  Sildi.
• 21:53
  Lex Fridman: The challenges of traveling to Dagestan, emphasizing the importance of sharing their story.
• 22:00
  Is that even possible for me?
• 22:03
  I think we could film a really good story out there.
• 22:06
  I'm not sure about a podcast, but I'm sure we could shoot a really nice vlog there.
• 22:13
  So, can you tell me a bit about the journey from Mahachkala all the way to Sildi?
• 22:18
  Four hours.
• 22:19
  Well, 3 .40.
• 22:20
  Through the mountains?
• 22:20
  Yeah, 3 .30, 3 .40 through the mountains.
• 22:23
  The road is a real winding one, not an easy ride.
• 22:26
  If it gets to be too hard for you, we can just take a helicopter.
• 22:30
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: It's no problem at all.
• 22:32
  Like, 40 to 50 minutes from Mahachkala to Sildi.
• 22:36
  Otherwise, keeping it more down to earth, we go by car, so there's absolutely no problem.
• 22:41
  I could never get used to a wealthy life, it's just, it's not in my blood to be like that.
• 22:46
  All right, then we'll go by car.
• 22:48
  Yeah, we could go on horseback, but a car is better.
• 22:51
  No, no, by car is better, on horseback takes way too long.
• 22:54
  So you, you mentioned money and we were just talking about comfort because right now there are so many champions,
• 23:03
  they win so much, things are going so well.
• 23:07
  How much harder is it to stay a champion when the money and the fame start coming in, when all that stuff starts showing up?
• 23:15
  Well, those are all distracting things.
• 23:17
  When you become a champion, there's a massive amount of attention on you.
• 23:22
  Sometimes, it's contracts, sometimes you end up having to fly a lot, you start getting busy with things and little by little you begin to miss your
• 23:29
  workouts.
• 23:30
  You miss one, you miss two, you miss three.
• 23:34
  And all of that takes a toll and the person who used to train with such a drive, with a hunger to be the best as soon as they
• 23:42
  actually become the best, they just don't know what to do next.
• 23:46
  And they live their whole life just to become, stay on the
• 23:54
  top.
• 24:01
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on the mindset required to maintain success, emphasizing the importance of self-awareness and humility.
• 24:09
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: they become champions, it's hard for them to take it.
• 24:12
  It happens differently.
• 24:14
  A man sometimes doesn't even know what he is capable of.
• 24:18
  Sometimes he just can't really understand himself until he achieves success or becomes famous, wealthy,
• 24:26
  and powerful.
• 24:27
  That is exactly when he discovers his true qualities.
• 24:32
  When he is limited in something, in money, in power, in everything that success eventually brings him,
• 24:40
  he doesn't really know how he's going to act.
• 24:46
  Lex Fridman: In this new role, doesn't know how he'll behave once he becomes big, famous, and a champion.
• 24:52
  Nobody knows.
• 24:53
  Some people say and wish, oh, if only I'd made it like that, I would do things this way.
• 24:59
  I think it's better if people don't throw around such big words, because you never know how you'll carry
• 25:07
  yourself once you actually get there.
• 25:10
  You know, it's such a delicate thing getting up there and still remaining human.
• 25:18
  Khabib reflects on the importance of humility. The importance of humility.
• 25:23
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: When it comes to you, I see that everyone here just loves you.
• 25:27
  Even early on in your career, millions of people loved you.
• 25:31
  That is also a tough thing to deal with because maybe
• 25:36
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares insights on personal growth.
• 25:38
  who came before me.
• 25:40
  And back then when I was training with my father, his students who went on to become world champions, just how they
• 25:48
  finish their careers and so on.
• 25:49
  And it's what I saw from my own observations of other types of sports, how they came back down, as far as
• 25:57
  I've learned.
• 25:58
  Khabib reflects on the journey of champions, emphasizing the importance of perseverance and dedication.
• 26:05
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: This is a very delicate moment.
• 26:08
  If a person climbing all the way to the top, if they can handle all of that, that already shows they have an
• 26:15
  incredibly serious mindset.
• 26:17
  Reaching the championship and staying there, reaching it is one thing, but staying a champion, that's totally different.
• 26:25
  Lex Fridman: You're saying that even on a local level, once you become a champion, that's already the tough moment
• 26:33
  because a lot of people who start winning, like you said, they stop fighting, they quit doing MMA and
• 26:41
  switch over to fitness, they find themselves at comfort.
• 26:46
  But holding on to it is hard, even on a local level.
• 26:51
  Every single time you become more and more of a champion, you won the Sambo championship, you keep winning more and more and every time it
• 26:59
  gets harder.
• 27:00
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Yes, and it depends on the person's goals.
• 27:03
  If you want to become an amateur champion just to prove something to yourself, that's one thing.
• 27:09
  But if you view amateur sports as a springboard to jump right into professional sports and become a champion among professionals,
• 27:17
  that's a whole different thing.
• 27:18
  There are different paths.
• 27:20
  first, you build an amateur career just to get into the pros and go even further from there.
• 27:27
  Second, after you've made it into the pros, you become a champion.
• 27:31
  And third, after you become a champion, you have to stay there.
• 27:36
  Not everyone has what it takes.
• 27:38
  It is incredibly tough.
• 27:39
  If you look at the numbers, you can literally count these champions on one hand.
• 27:43
  How many of them are there?
• 27:45
  Maybe 15, 20, 30 people?
• 27:48
  Let's say 50 over the last 30 years and how many have tried.
• 27:52
  For example, 50 achieved it over 30 years, over 35 years of MMA combat sports, but how
• 28:00
  many tried?
• 28:01
  Hundreds of thousands.
• 28:02
  And look at that number, such a tiny amount actually reached the end goal.
• 28:07
  So for you to actually make
• 28:09
  Lex Fridman: it into this tiny list, you really have to be like just a truly unique
• 28:16
  person and a fighter and, you know, a student and a person who can accept guidance from
• 28:24
  a coach who when they are being guided, discard the cons and take only the pros.
• 28:31
  But there are people who take criticism very hard and very negatively and are very sensitive, let's say, when they take criticism
• 28:39
  from a mentor.
• 28:42
  more.
• 28:43
  So it all has to click.
• 28:45
  And some accept criticism at the very beginning, but then once
• 28:48
  Exploring the mental challenges of competition.
• 28:52
  who wants to stop your dream.
• 28:53
  So here, the boundaries expand just a little bit.
• 28:57
  Right here, you're already not playing humble.
• 28:59
  Right here, you just step out, and you want to clear your opponent out of your way, and
• 29:07
  that's it.
• 29:08
  Because your goal is to be the best in the world, and they are blocking you.
• 29:12
  Excuse me, but in this situation, there's no way you can act all humble.
• 29:17
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Okay, but when you were training in the gym, what was it that gave you this strength?
• 29:22
  A hatred of losing, or a love for winning?
• 29:28
  I think it was the hatred of losing.
• 29:31
  Yes, definitely.
• 29:32
  I mean, you know, of course, you want to win, but for me, there was always this driver, like, no way,
• 29:41
  I am not losing, you know.
• 29:47
  Lex Fridman: Villages in Dagestan deeply honor the memory of their warriors, but many remain unknown in world history. Shamil is a notable leader, yet countless heroes have been forgotten.
• 29:59
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I mean, what actually goes on in a champion's head, in yours, when you sat
• 30:07
  alone thinking about your life?
• 30:09
  Who am I really?
• 30:11
  And what do I do to keep being a champion or to become one?
• 30:16
  Well, first of all, from the very beginning, if you realize that what you're chasing isn't the most important thing in life, then it gets
• 30:24
  easier for you.
• 30:25
  And then, you know, there are some people whose, let's say, ultimate goal is to be successful, powerful,
• 30:33
  and to make
• 30:39
  Lex Fridman: Despite their contributions, many warriors from Dagestan are barely known in world history. Shamil stands out, but countless others remain unrecognized.
• 30:51
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: it, I was, how do you say it, addiction.
• 30:58
  I was fixated, like, when people have this addiction, but for me, it was commitment, that I absolutely had to prepare perfectly
• 31:05
  for the fight.
• 31:06
  Lex Fridman: Discussing the importance of mental strength.
• 31:09
  it big.
• 31:10
  At the end of the day, after all, we are not really such big, important people.
• 31:17
  And, like, I believe it's wrong to just crown yourself king, because
• 31:27
  if we put it, to put it bluntly, if we're being honest here, we can't even
• 31:35
  control the basic need to go to the restroom.
• 31:40
  Maybe to some, yeah, to some people, this will probably seem a bit crude, but we all go to the restroom,
• 31:48
  excuse my language, if we can't control even this.
• 31:52
  So, what can we actually control in this life?
• 31:56
  Look how many people
• 31:56
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: we know, how many great people have left this earth.
• 32:00
  It doesn't really matter how, like, big, strong, or famous you are, how wealthy you are, champion, or no champion, either way, they
• 32:08
  put us all in the exact same grave, you know, two meters down, or like, a meter, or a meter and a half.
• 32:15
  Different confessions, different religions, they bury people in different ways.
• 32:19
  So, I actually believe that every single person should have this realization, that we are just
• 32:27
  not some kind of big, important people here who just decide and get to control everything.
• 32:34
  We don't get to do that.
• 32:36
  In my case, I was raised under the guidance of my father.
• 32:40
  My father was a coach, and my goal was always to become, to prove to my father that
• 32:48
  out of everyone, even though he trains many other people, he trains everyone.
• 32:54
  I mean, I'm also here, I can show him he doesn't have to look very far.
• 32:59
  I'm right there, and under his guidance, I can become a champion.
• 33:04
  I looked up to him and followed his example, trained hard, and it was like, you know, a kind of a
• 33:12
  challenge, to prove to him, that look, I am right here, father, and everything you teach, I will take it all in
• 33:20
  zealously, worthily, I'll follow your program, do it right, and I will become a champion, and that was exactly the
• 33:28
  kind of goal I had, to prove it first and foremost to my father, and secondly, to the entire world, that I can become the
• 33:36
  best wrestler or fighter, but I never thought of being crowned king, after
• 33:43
  Lex Fridman: I became a champion, I was never going to walk around like, look how cool
• 33:47
  Khabib talks about the influence of family.
• 33:53
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: should burn within you, driving you to become a champion, right?
• 33:56
  As you said, hundreds of thousands, millions of people want to be a champion, but only one can be.
• 34:02
  Yeah, but that is actually about you confronting your opponent.
• 34:07
  You've got to put a barrier inside your mind, where on one side you're a humble person, but on the other
• 34:14
  side you're different because you have a goal, your goal.
• 34:18
  Of course, you should still follow a code of honor.
• 34:21
  You should be a man, a righteous man, and know what you can and cannot do.
• 34:26
  You should always do that, but in the end, your opponent is the person
• 34:32
  Lex Fridman: Exploring the role of discipline in sports.
• 34:35
  When they would give me a fight, I always tell this to my guys, whenever they would give me a fight, on a professional level, a
• 34:43
  hundred days before
• 34:49
  Training for a fight means never missing a session, even if it means flying to Moscow. I would always schedule my flights to ensure I could train in the morning before leaving.
• 34:59
  I couldn't miss any training sessions, I would literally have, like, this panic, like, for example, I'd fly somewhere, and I have,
• 35:07
  let's say, 85 days left until the fight.
• 35:11
  Like, I knew that I had to fly.
• 35:13
  For example, if I was flying to Moscow, I would always pick a ticket, so I could absolutely do my morning training session first,
• 35:21
  then I'd take off around lunchtime, and once
• 35:26
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I arrived in Moscow, for whatever reason, I had to fit it all around my training schedule.
• 35:33
  Either I had to meet up before my training sessions, or I had to meet up after my training sessions, and I simply could not miss that evening training
• 35:40
  session, because I had to train during the day from four to five hours, two in the morning, and two to two and a half in the evening.
• 35:49
  And I needed to, I would prepare myself that way, looking at who was in Moscow
• 35:56
  Lex Fridman: Khabib's father built a gym at home to train local kids.
• 36:01
  right then, wondering who I could pull into a training session there.
• 36:05
  Well, the person had to match my level as well.
• 36:09
  Not just like I showed up there, played around with him.
• 36:12
  I needed a fight back.
• 36:14
  I would arrange in advance who was going to come.
• 36:17
  Maybe some sparring, maybe I'd do wrestling, maybe I'd hit the weights, maybe a striking workout.
• 36:23
  So I had this, let's say I always had this tough and scientific approach to it.
• 36:29
  so I believe that more than anything, I didn't want to lose rather than I wanted to win.
• 36:37
  Of course, winning is also a huge pleasure, but more than anything, I just didn't want to lose.
• 36:42
  So in all those hard training session, you were thinking about not losing.
• 36:46
  That's the fuel.
• 36:47
  The fuel.
• 36:48
  Four to five hours every single day.
• 36:50
  Every day.
• 36:50
  There is a story that I heard.
• 36:54
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Sadulaev, the legendary wrestler, told a story that he went to a hotel.
• 36:59
  I think it was in Moscow, to train in the gym.
• 37:02
  And he was the only, it was during the night, I don't know, he was the only one
• 37:09
  Lex Fridman: It's remarkable that two legends met by chance and trained together. they were a two-time Olympic champion, and I believe they never skipped training.
• 37:18
  who was there.
• 37:19
  And you came down and you actually trained together.
• 37:23
  And he said a lot of great things about you.
• 37:26
  He said that you gave him some really deep wisdom, which helped him to win the gold medal at the
• 37:34
  Olympic Games.
• 37:36
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I'm curious, could you tell us now what you told him?
• 37:39
  What kind of wisdom did you give him?
• 37:42
  I can't remember exactly, but we had really great conversations.
• 37:45
  Lex Fridman: It's a great story that the two of you, like two legends like that, just met completely by chance.
• 37:51
  Well, look, he's a two -time Olympic champion, right?
• 37:53
  Right.
• 37:54
  I think he doesn't skip his training either.
• 37:57
  He never missed one back then.
• 37:59
  I believe that we both ended up there because we both hate to lose.
• 38:04
  and we both really want to win.
• 38:07
  And you know, recently
• 38:08
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I came across this idea.
• 38:11
  There are athletes who simply want to win, and then there are some for whom victory isn't enough.
• 38:18
  They want domination.
• 38:19
  I believe that he is one of those as well.
• 38:22
  They want domination.
• 38:23
  And for that, what does a person have to do?
• 38:26
  They have to train.
• 38:28
  They have to grind morning and night.
• 38:31
  And there was this thing with us.
• 38:34
  Lex Fridman: After morning prayers, my father never let us sleep. We would train at 7 a. m. and then head to the gym for more training.
• 38:43
  After the morning, my father never let us sleep.
• 38:46
  When I say the morning, I mean after Fajr, the dawn prayer.
• 38:50
  He just wouldn't sleep himself, so we couldn't either.
• 38:53
  So every morning, six, seven, we'd be out doing our morning.
• 38:58
  people might call
• 39:01
  At the stadium, we would run kilometers, do sprints, and work with resistance bands. This was our rigorous morning training.
• 39:10
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: a warm -up, but when you show up at the stadium in the morning, you run five kilometers, you do sprints, you work with resistance bands,
• 39:18
  you work on the pull -up bar, you do push -ups, dips, jumps, you know, the bands,
• 39:25
  then work with a partner, drilling, and so on.
• 39:29
  That's about two hours of work.
• 39:31
  Lex Fridman: You drop two, two and a half kilos there.
• 39:34
  Not really a warm -up, but father always called it that, right?
• 39:38
  That was a full morning training at 7 a .m.
• 39:41
  Then I came home to rest and at 4 o 'clock we'd head to the gym.
• 39:46
  The training would start at 5 o 'clock and end at 7.
• 39:50
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: By 8, I'd be home and by 11, I'd rest up.
• 39:54
  And yet, I kept thinking that something was missing.
• 39:59
  Like, I know that I have a start, a competition coming up in like 40 or 30 days and I would wake up and I'd be like, let me
• 40:07
  go to this sea, I'm going to go down to the sea, do some running, some sprints on the sand, work out, and so on.
• 40:13
  And so many times
• 40:14
  Lex Fridman: I would often go out for a third training session at night, even if my father advised against it. I was committed to my training.
• 40:22
  I ended up going out for a third training session as well.
• 40:27
  Sometimes father would say, rest, in the morning, we're going to have a heavy workload.
• 40:31
  But sometimes I wouldn't tell father, I'd just go out at night, head out and train.
• 40:45
  Discussing the dedication required for success.
• 40:48
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I'd train for an hour or an hour and a half, come back and crash.
• 40:53
  Next morning, I'd get up and start all over again.
• 40:56
  And just this routine, non -stop.
• 40:58
  And when I see guys, you know, when they do just one training session, or like they say, on Wednesday
• 41:04
  Lex Fridman: we have a morning training, then an evening sauna session.
• 41:08
  What do you mean?
• 41:09
  You have to fight in 50 days.
• 41:11
  You have a huge fight ahead and you want to take a rest in the middle of the week?
• 41:16
  Well, rest on Sunday.
• 41:19
  On Saturday, do a morning training, hit the sauna in the evening, take a complete rest on Sunday, and start all over again on Monday.
• 41:27
  To be successful, you need a fanatical approach to training. You can't just show up; you have to be addicted to it.
• 41:35
  A person has to always be, you know, a little bit, let's say, just a little bit crazy, but in a good sense of the word.
• 41:43
  You have to be addicted to it and to want this incredibly bad.
• 41:47
  You have to take a fanatical approach to the training process.
• 41:52
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Just showing up and working out, that's what hundreds of thousands of guys are doing around the world.
• 41:59
  To stand out from that, from this crowd, let's say, who have the exact same goals as you do, to stand out from
• 42:07
  that, you have to take a fanatical approach to it.
• 42:10
  Well, look, I'm training with John Danaher, and they train like that too.
• 42:15
  They train three times a day.
• 42:17
  And it actually feels right this way.
• 42:19
  I mean, of course, this is how you have to train.
• 42:22
  Because of that, John has one of the best students in the world.
• 42:26
  And after all, they don't just take some random place.
• 42:28
  Lex Fridman: Those with a fanatical attitude toward training will rise to the top. You can't be mediocre.
• 42:35
  I mean, they're not somewhere in the middle.
• 42:37
  They're at the top, and look at their whole approach.
• 42:42
  Some people, look, a person with that kind of approach just can't be somewhere in the middle.
• 42:49
  It's impossible.
• 42:51
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: If you have a fanatical attitude, the right attitude toward the training process, on top of that, you have to be fanatical
• 42:59
  about it.
• 43:01
  You love what you do.
• 43:02
  And in the end, there will be results.
• 43:06
  Well, just look at John, and look where his guys are.
• 43:09
  He creates champions.
• 43:10
  Lex Fridman: John finds champions in everyone who comes to them. their system is designed to elevate every athlete.
• 43:17
  He finds a champion in everyone, across every category, right?
• 43:22
  He makes, he creates champions, not just one or two, but all of them.
• 43:27
  He finds a champion in everyone, across every category.
• 43:32
  Look, the people who come to him, he has a system, let's say, right?
• 43:37
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Under this roof, under his roof, there is a system.
• 43:41
  People come here, and they become champions in this system.
• 43:45
  So there are people there who are champions.
• 43:48
  These are specific, established names.
• 43:51
  And there are other people who came and left.
• 43:55
  Lex Fridman: Some athletes enter the system but leave after a year or two. They struggle to endure the challenges.
• 44:02
  They enter that black room, so to say, an uncomfortable place.
• 44:07
  They went in, stood for a year, a year and a half or two, and left.
• 44:13
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Nobody talks about them.
• 44:14
  These are the people who came in, broke mentally, and left.
• 44:18
  And there aren't just a few of them.
• 44:20
  There are a lot.
• 44:22
  Usually, most people give up.
• 44:23
  There are many who give up.
• 44:25
  But then, there are the ones who come in and stay there for a long time.
• 44:30
  Long, long time.
• 44:31
  And after some time, they achieve success.
• 44:35
  They become the best.
• 44:37
  They prove to themselves that once
• 44:41
  Lex Fridman: Those who endure the system can achieve great things. They can be trusted with significant responsibilities.
• 44:49
  they enter the system, they could stay there for a long time, endure, and become the best.
• 44:55
  They prove that they are already capable of many things.
• 44:59
  They can be trusted to supervise big, important projects.
• 45:04
  I would even say, for example, 2000 years ago, they could easily rule entire cities.
• 45:12
  So, a person
• 45:15
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: who has gone through it physically, who has lived through it, who has faced challenges, passed the tests,
• 45:23
  they are capable of a lot, highly capable.
• 45:27
  You don't just walk into martial arts and become the best.
• 45:30
  It's very difficult.
• 45:31
  It means that you go through pain, you make sacrifices, you give your time, you face setbacks,
• 45:39
  and failures in training.
• 45:41
  The mental strength and capacity mean a lot there.
• 45:45
  And when I talk about his system, look, I mean, those schools that became the best, let's say, in football or in
• 45:53
  freestyle wrestling or, let's say, in MMA, in grappling or in judo, it's really hard to enter one of the
• 46:00
  best schools in the world, to stay when they are breaking you, throwing you, choking you, to improve as a person and
• 46:08
  as an athlete and to become a champion, it takes at least 12 years, 10 to 12 years, maybe
• 46:16
  15.
• 46:17
  For some, it took longer.
• 46:19
  And to get through the grind for these 15 years and then to break through and become the best is worth a lot.
• 46:27
  Have you had those tough moments where you're almost broken psychologically?
• 46:33
  Lex Fridman: My father's approach was to ensure I earned everything. they would give me money for clothes only after I completed tasks.
• 46:45
  I now understand how far sighted my father's approach was.
• 46:49
  First, he tried not to give me anything for free.
• 46:52
  Only sometimes I could get something for free, for example, before a holiday, like Aid Alfitr,
• 47:00
  or before school started.
• 47:02
  Father would give money, I'd go buy clothes at the market for back to school, that kind of thing, you know, and at
• 47:10
  other times
• 47:12
  My father set a strong personal example. they encouraged me to read and learn about the world.
• 47:19
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: he always told me, well, if you want it, you need to earn it, you want me to give you money just like that, there would be some work
• 47:27
  around the house and so on that I had to do, and I knew that encouragement would always be there, my father always
• 47:35
  had this kind of approach, he set a very strong personal example, very strong, and I really learned a lot from him,
• 47:43
  took a lot, and then, as you mentioned, there was the book Countries and Peoples, someone gave it to him as a gift,
• 47:51
  my father read through it, and he realized that it was perfect for me, for a child
• 47:59
  maybe 12 at the time, that book was part of my life for about 2 or 3 years, something like that, it was about
• 48:07
  193 countries, their geography, history, all the details, for each country, it describes its geographical
• 48:15
  location, which countries it bordered, its major rivers, mountains, cities, history, economy, finances,
• 48:23
  just brief information about every country, my father said, you'll tell me about each country, and I'll give
• 48:30
  Lex Fridman: Discussing the influence of mentors.
• 48:32
  You know, just sitting there, finding it hard to breathe and everything is going wrong, lost in some
• 48:40
  situations.
• 48:42
  And when you were young, was there ever a moment like that?
• 48:47
  Because the guys from Dagestan on the team, really great guys, by the way, all say they've never seen you broken in
• 48:55
  training, not even losing, really.
• 48:59
  But when you were young, did it ever happen?
• 49:01
  Look, I've been in this grind since I was a kid.
• 49:06
  Wherever my father coached, there were always, let's take the year 2004, for example.
• 49:12
  My father put together the Dagestan national team for combat sambo and in mixed martial arts, which was called no -holds -barred
• 49:20
  fighting.
• 49:26
  I learned a lot from my father, who always encouraged me to earn what I wanted. His approach shaped my mindset.
• 49:34
  money for it, and I thought, alright, I knew this was like my own little capital, just sitting there,
• 49:42
  waiting for me, all I had to do was come, take that book, read it, understand it, then my father would take the book and
• 49:50
  say, now, tell me
• 50:08
  At that time, I was like 14, 15 years old.
• 50:13
  I wrestled with them, grappled, was in this uncomfortable environment for myself, where we always had the
• 50:21
  rule that the youngest has to do everything and he is always wrong.
• 50:26
  And I had to deal with that.
• 50:29
  Yeah.
• 50:29
  Especially in the gym.
• 50:30
  They throw you, hit you again and again.
• 50:33
  You have to show up morning and evening, day after day.
• 50:37
  This place hardens you.
• 50:39
  They say how the steel was tempered.
• 50:42
  Steel isn't tempered for nothing.
• 50:44
  How many times do you have to strike the steel before it becomes a sword?
• 50:49
  That doesn't just happen by itself.
• 50:51
  Did you believe in yourself then?
• 50:53
  Some of the guys who were at those camps back then, they're grown men now.
• 50:58
  Even then, they were older than me by 10, 12, maybe 15 years, and they always used to say, Habib,
• 51:06
  we honestly thought you were going to become some kind of scholar or scientist.
• 51:12
  Because my father was always making me read and write, read and write.
• 51:19
  I would copy out entire books by hand.
• 51:27
  My father encouraged me to read about the world, and I would copy out entire books by hand.
• 51:34
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: what you read, and he would check, he would look through it, the countries were arranged alphabetically, A for Andorra, Angola,
• 51:42
  and so on, B for Belgium, Brazil, and so on, everything went in alphabetical order, I started from A and read them all,
• 51:50
  straight to the very end, like every single time, when I needed the money, I did that, and for example,
• 51:58
  I go over the first 40 countries, he checked a box, and then I continued, that's
• 52:05
  Lex Fridman: my father would test me.
• 52:09
  Let's just say that my knowledge of geography comes from back
• 52:15
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: then.
• 52:16
  Did you realize how big the world was?
• 52:19
  No.
• 52:20
  As a child, you don't understand?
• 52:21
  At that time, I didn't understand, but since then, I had this desire to travel.
• 52:26
  I really wanted to travel, visit different countries, see wonders of the world, the Coliseum, the pyramids.
• 52:34
  But all of this is from childhood, from what I read and wrote.
• 52:38
  Lex Fridman: It wasn't just about reading, I also had to rewrite it, I had to write it down, I always wrote down what
• 52:46
  I read.
• 52:47
  And actually, this is very good advice for parents, you know, they can use this with their children
• 52:55
  too.
• 52:57
  They can tell them to sit down and copy books by hand.
• 53:02
  First of all, eyesight improves, reading improves, writing, how you write improves,
• 53:10
  your handwriting, and it stays with you when you read and write.
• 53:14
  It really develops a child.
• 53:17
  Not only I believe that, I actually do advise parents to motivate their kids this way.
• 53:25
  Discussing the importance of education.
• 53:28
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: There was always this control.
• 53:30
  It wasn't like he'd say, Habib, go do this.
• 53:33
  And you could just walk away and not do it.
• 53:35
  When he said, go do it, you did it.
• 53:38
  My father never forgot anything.
• 53:40
  He had a phenomenal memory.
• 53:42
  He'd be like, did you do it?
• 53:43
  And everything he told you, he remembered.
• 53:46
  He just did.
• 53:47
  He checked you.
• 53:48
  He was like, come here.
• 53:49
  And he'd check.
• 53:50
  I knew.
• 53:51
  It wasn't something I could get away with.
• 53:53
  So, you know, since childhood, I was lucky that my father always kept me close.
• 53:59
  And I found myself in this environment among fighters
• 54:03
  Lex Fridman: who at that time, well, I don't know, they just didn't compete in America and Europe back then.
• 54:10
  But in the post Soviet space, they were the best at that time.
• 54:15
  And it helped me a lot to become mentally strong.
• 54:19
  Khabib reflects on the role of family.
• 54:22
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You can simply create some kind of challenge that children benefit from and reward them for it
• 54:29
  after it is done.
• 54:32
  This really helps develop a child's mind.
• 54:36
  I actually saw advice from the great writers who said they remembered doing the same thing when they were
• 54:44
  young.
• 54:45
  When they first started writing they just simply copied other legendary writers.
• 54:51
  You read their work and then you type it out yourself and you start absorbing that style into your bloodstream.
• 54:59
  Well, it needs to be done in childhood.
• 55:02
  Sure.
• 55:02
  When the child is ready to learn and his mind is open, let's say, as a metaphor, when his table is
• 55:10
  clean, not occupied with clutter, then as a father, you can help them place all the right things on the
• 55:18
  table in the proper place.
• 55:21
  Let's say, put the food in one place, flowers in another, something like that.
• 55:28
  It is important.
• 55:33
  Lex Fridman: The importance of creating challenges for children to foster growth.
• 55:38
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Tell me more about your father.
• 55:41
  You've read a lot.
• 55:43
  You didn't just fight.
• 55:44
  You were well rounded and you told several stories about this.
• 55:48
  There is a book.
• 55:49
  What is it called?
• 55:51
  Countries and Peoples.
• 55:53
  Yes, from my childhood.
• 55:54
  It is, really.
• 55:55
  Yes.
• 55:56
  And it went on.
• 55:57
  The approach was the same.
• 55:59
  Tell that story because I think it's important for the parents listening to us to understand this.
• 56:05
  You're not just trying to create a champion.
• 56:08
  You're trying to raise a well rounded person, a wise person, a person with depth.
• 56:13
  Yes, you have to give the right motivation to kids with proper communication.
• 56:19
  My father was very good at this.
• 56:21
  I now realize interacting with my own kids how wise he was and how deeply he understood this.
• 56:29
  Because when a child is 8, 10 years old and when they are it is important to
• 56:37
  have the right approach.
• 56:38
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares his thoughts on legacy.
• 56:41
  That's why I believe I was very lucky.
• 56:44
  My father did the right thing.
• 56:46
  He provided me with the right kind of information.
• 56:50
  and I learned a lot just from being around him.
• 56:53
  I learned so much just from his presence.
• 56:56
  He was there at home and then we also went to competitions.
• 57:11
  when you're a teenager, sometimes you're tired, sometimes you want to break free.
• 57:16
  All of that was there.
• 57:19
  But my father had the right approach.
• 57:23
  He influenced me a lot and in the right way.
• 57:26
  And there's the physical component too of hard work.
• 57:30
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: There's a story you told about the time he made you dig a big hole just because it was difficult.
• 57:48
  There was a children's camp there, an old Soviet style pioneer camp, where we stayed doing our runs in the forest.
• 57:56
  Together we built a small training area there with a rope, a punching bag, a pull -up bar.
• 58:02
  We did sprints there, we pulled resistance bands.
• 58:05
  After running in the mountains we would come back and work there, there were almost no mats.
• 58:10
  We built the base ourselves.
• 58:12
  It had a dining room on the first floor and an attic space where we slept.
• 58:17
  We would come downstairs, eat, go outside, train in that little sports area, then run in the forest.
• 58:24
  It was somewhere around 1200 meters above sea level, a conifer forest.
• 58:30
  We spent the whole summer there.
• 58:32
  There with train in the morning and there was nothing to do all day.
• 58:36
  And in the evening we had training sessions again.
• 58:39
  But during the day, so we wouldn't be busy with unnecessary things, my father sometimes gave us work.
• 58:46
  And we asked why are we digging this pit?
• 58:49
  He say well people used to use it like a refrigerator.
• 58:54
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares his thoughts on the importance of hard work in training.
• 58:58
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: He always had this kind of unique approach.
• 59:01
  Well what's the philosophy here?
• 59:03
  That you got to be busy all the time.
• 59:05
  Working hard doing something difficult.
• 59:07
  Yes it's very dangerous to give a child free time in adolescence.
• 59:13
  They should always be busy.
• 59:14
  Learning new information improving acquiring new skills.
• 59:18
  A person should always be busy.
• 59:21
  When you're 16 well what can be on your mind?
• 59:23
  You should constantly develop and improve.
• 59:27
  And by this time you should already I believe have decided what you want to become.
• 59:32
  You should already be investing in what you want to turn into.
• 59:40
  By the way you had several very good conversations with Neuralan with Adam which I highly recommend.
• 59:47
  And one of them your brother Abu Bakr told a story that when you were young there were several street fights maybe many
• 59:55
  I don't know.
• 59:56
  He said he was the one who got you into it.
• 59:58
  You were kind of bigger and he needed protection at that time.
• 1:00:03
  You were that protection.
• 1:00:04
  Can you tell us these stories?
• 1:00:08
  Lex Fridman: How often did you fight on the streets of Dagestan?
• 1:00:12
  Well let's start with the fact that I never bullied anyone.
• 1:00:16
  Never.
• 1:00:16
  Although I physically could bully yes let's say I had the capability.
• 1:00:22
  I wasn't the kind of person who started the fights.
• 1:00:27
  You didn't start?
• 1:00:28
  I didn't.
• 1:00:29
  Well tried to finish.
• 1:00:30
  Well maybe there were some moments but mostly no.
• 1:00:35
  Mostly I didn't start.
• 1:00:37
  Abu Bakr sure he was like that.
• 1:00:40
  In my circle I had some guys who were a little bit like that.
• 1:00:44
  He said that he was a troublemaker.
• 1:00:47
  He was a troublemaker and because of him I got into trouble many times.
• 1:00:53
  When you are let's say 14 15 years old and your brother is fighting you don't really ask
• 1:01:01
  who's right or who's wrong.
• 1:01:03
  You just go in you start to as we say you interfere you just have to go in right?
• 1:01:09
  But when you're older more conscious when you're 20 25 or 30 years old this is when
• 1:01:16
  you really start telling him you know Abu Bakar I think you're wrong here.
• 1:01:23
  Yes we'll finish this right now but in the future I wouldn't want you to get involved because I think it's wrong
• 1:01:31
  right?
• 1:01:31
  Well as kids we just didn't ask we just went right in.
• 1:01:36
  When we moved to Makach 1999 let's say the end of 1999 so
• 1:01:44
  we were many brothers more than 10 of us we lived in one house some were in school some in college some
• 1:01:52
  in university but we all had one routine we trained in the morning then went to school we'd come home rest do homework
• 1:01:59
  then train in the evening come home and rest without mothers just by ourselves father gathered everyone
• 1:02:07
  he took in close his nephews cousins relatives those who didn't have a father and so on
• 1:02:15
  he took them in and we all lived in one house we cooked cleaned did laundry all by ourselves it was like well
• 1:02:22
  some kind of army life you know
• 1:02:25
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: and when the brothers had some problems let's say misunderstandings we didn't
• 1:02:33
  go easy on those guys and even those who lived around there near that house in that
• 1:02:41
  district in the settlement everyone knew that there were lots of brothers living there so they had to be
• 1:02:49
  careful and we had a football field there it was right in front of the house and everyone who came to play
• 1:02:57
  there we constantly had fights there misunderstandings there were older brothers
• 1:03:04
  they were always watching us keeping us from!
• 1:03:08
  don't do that watch your mouth but we had our own little group the age difference between us was maybe 2
• 1:03:16
  -3 years there were 5 or 6 of us we'd always go outside and play football
• 1:03:22
  Lex Fridman: if our team was losing then the game would just turn into a whole different sport and that's how
• 1:03:30
  we were growing up we spent 6 -7 years there
• 1:03:35
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: almost 10 years we were living together growing training a lot has happened over that time
• 1:03:42
  but I was never
• 1:03:45
  Lex Fridman: well maybe just a couple of times okay mostly I was never the initiator of fights with some
• 1:03:52
  exceptions I just remember since childhood my father always told me you don't need to use force
• 1:04:00
  on the street my father looked at all of this in a completely different way what is your
• 1:04:08
  understanding of the difference between the street fight and sports there is a very big difference
• 1:04:36
  I can say I actually had a major turning point in my life
• 1:04:44
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: let's say the one that in terms of psychology really changed my whole attitude towards
• 1:04:51
  MMA back in 2002 2003 my father kept me in wrestling
• 1:04:58
  Lex Fridman: he trained MMA combat sambo but wanted me to stay in wrestling my cousin who was older than
• 1:05:06
  me by a couple of months
• 1:05:08
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: he was training with my father his freestyle wrestling was weak so my father sent him to me to the place where I was training
• 1:05:16
  Lex Fridman: it was called the school of higher sports mastery the local guys from the city know this place he came to
• 1:05:23
  practice and got into it with the guy in our gym who was heavier maybe one class heavier
• 1:05:31
  this guy was the best in his weight winning daghestan and the city too so they got
• 1:05:39
  into a conflict
• 1:05:40
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: they were arguing my brother had just joined he was new to our
• 1:05:48
  freestyle wrestling gym
• 1:05:49
  Lex Fridman: right but I knew the other guy!
• 1:05:52
  well they paired up and they got into it well that's my brother right so the guy goes let's meet
• 1:06:00
  up after and they agreed as we say to step outside after the training
• 1:06:05
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I remember it was raining heavily a real downpour the guy brought his brother
• 1:06:12
  I came with mine
• 1:06:14
  Lex Fridman: we went outside and they started fighting one on one I remember he shot in
• 1:06:21
  lifted and took him down Abdurrahman my brother threw up a triangle and he choked him out
• 1:06:29
  when we went out I was thinking Abdurrahman will lose to this guy
• 1:06:34
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I even visualized it happening the whole thing like this guy beats him and then I start
• 1:06:42
  fighting well I'm not going there for my brother to lose in my head I was getting into a fight but he threw!
• 1:06:53
  with my own eyes how someone chokes another person with a triangle and they lose consciousness they
• 1:07:01
  fought he put him to sleep
• 1:07:03
  Lex Fridman: we had to pull them apart me and other guys fights over Abdurrahman won
• 1:07:10
  and on the way home I'm like Abdurrahman wow
• 1:07:13
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: you impressed me I came home and immediately told my father I said that was in
• 1:07:22
  2002 or 2003 if I'm not mistaken
• 1:07:26
  Lex Fridman: At 14, I decided to switch to combat sports, inspired by Abdurrahman, a top wrestler who couldn't handle the pressure.
• 1:07:36
  I am 14 years old I said I'm switching to combat sambo I said what Abdurrahman did the one he choked
• 1:07:44
  out is not just anyone in the gym he's one of the best wrestlers but he couldn't do anything
• 1:07:51
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: my father said you'll go to wrestling but you'll come to me I'll teach you you'll learn techniques here and so on
• 1:08:00
  but I want you to gain wrestling skills
• 1:08:04
  Lex Fridman: Training with my father made me realize that MMA was my true calling, despite his initial reservations.
• 1:08:11
  I started going three days to train with my father three days to wrestling and at that moment I realized that no matter how
• 1:08:19
  strong the wrestler is lying on the back is where the wrestling normally ends but MMA
• 1:08:26
  only begins there and I was like I thought I need this I need this mixed style I realized this was for
• 1:08:34
  me I started going to my father's trainings despite that he didn't let me he didn't want me to do fighting I
• 1:08:42
  think most people don't know this my father wanted me to do freestyle wrestling or judo but in my head I already had this mixed style
• 1:08:50
  I always wanted to compete I was already getting tapes to watch I always wanted to compete where there are
• 1:08:58
  no rules where I could fully use my skills maximum freedom yes judo sambo freestyle
• 1:09:05
  grappling jiu -jitsu more people knew jiu -jitsu than grappling
• 1:09:10
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: after that I switched and from there my journey slowly started which I had already begun that's when I started
• 1:09:18
  the amateur journey
• 1:09:22
  Lex Fridman: As I competed more, I realized that each match built my confidence and experience, crucial for my success.
• 1:09:30
  then when I started getting good results as an amateur I realized that I can switch to pro and achieve
• 1:09:38
  success sambo in combat sambo I competed in all kinds of sports everything that involves
• 1:09:46
  wrestling and fighting I competed everywhere I competed in freestyle in judo in grappling in combat sambo I competed
• 1:09:53
  in sport sambo in hand -to -hand combat in pancreation my father put me in all competitions he would say you
• 1:10:01
  have a competition here and another one there now you are preparing for this one you will compete in this weight under these
• 1:10:09
  rules in this sport and he was sending me everywhere he would tell me you will need this in the future the more competition experience you have
• 1:10:17
  the more relaxed and confident you'll feel it builds up over time when I was young I was losing as well I go to a judo competition
• 1:10:25
  win two matches and lose two matches I would ask father why are you sending me there this is not my sport and he said no go and
• 1:10:33
  compete so okay I went I cut weight the next day
• 1:10:39
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: you come in you see 50 competitors in your weight class you let this weight this competitive energy
• 1:10:46
  pass through you and psychologically you get better better better each time you become more relaxed about it
• 1:10:57
  affected me although then
• 1:11:01
  Lex Fridman: I learned that preparation starts long before the fight, shaping my approach to competition.
• 1:11:07
  I didn't agree with my father back then I thought why should I compete in other sports he said you
• 1:11:15
  can wrestle right well go wrestle I was saying but judo isn't my sport it's hard for me there
• 1:11:23
  he says well you went on four times look you won twice then lost twice you competed four times
• 1:11:30
  you're 15 years old you're just developing do you know valuable this experience is for you
• 1:11:37
  four matches in one day now when I'm coaching I understand the psychological approach
• 1:11:45
  how important it is I realize now how correctly he prepared me for the big stage
• 1:11:53
  the preparation was already happening then when I was 15 years old for example when I went into
• 1:12:01
  the biggest fight in combat sports history when I fought in 2018 here in Las Vegas
• 1:12:08
  at that point I was already at my peak prime time I was 30 years old
• 1:12:16
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I went through all possible competitions as an amateur and a professional and you
• 1:12:24
  know what I was ready
• 1:12:28
  Lex Fridman: Preparation for a fight begins long before the actual event, shaping my mindset and strategy.
• 1:12:35
  this preparation it started back then when I was 15 it's not like they give you a fight and you prepare
• 1:12:42
  for two months preparation starts long before
• 1:12:47
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: you even step into the octagon so this experience of competitions which started at 15 it continued
• 1:12:54
  it expanded yeah of course so can you explain what was going on in your head
• 1:13:03
  Lex Fridman: I approached each fight with the mindset that I needed to outlast my opponent, focusing on strategy over brute strength.
• 1:13:10
  I didn't want to lose I just didn't it never occurred to me that I could get hurt that someone could
• 1:13:18
  hurt me that I might break a finger somewhere I never had that in my head that I could get hit that I get a scratch
• 1:13:28
  know if you can call it perfection I didn't want to lose and to not lose I knew I needed to compete
• 1:13:36
  a lot and improve training is one thing but competing is different I understood that the more I competed
• 1:13:44
  the more experience I would gain I had to go through it it was constantly on my mind this understanding that I
• 1:13:52
  must compete a lot came to me at an early age since I was 15, 16, 17, 18, and I never
• 1:14:00
  stopped thinking about it.
• 1:14:01
  So it was always in the back of my mind.
• 1:14:05
  Were you confident that you would win?
• 1:14:08
  In my youth, no.
• 1:14:09
  Were you afraid to lose?
• 1:14:11
  Yeah, in my youth, I wasn't always so sure.
• 1:14:13
  I just wasn't.
• 1:14:15
  Because I never stood out.
• 1:14:17
  Yes, I had a coach for a father and how many trainers have kids who compete but
• 1:14:24
  aren't successful.
• 1:14:26
  And then when I went to the big leagues, you know, I had already fought.
• 1:14:31
  I had done 16 professional fights across the post -Soviet space.
• 1:14:35
  Later, when I was already signed to the UFC, there I already had this feeling.
• 1:14:41
  You know, with each fight, I was getting mentally stronger.
• 1:14:47
  My mind was becoming more and more solid, like concrete.
• 1:14:52
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: When I went out there, I knew, yes, these are fights.
• 1:14:58
  Yes, you can take a hit.
• 1:15:00
  Yes, anything can happen when knees, elbows, fists are flying.
• 1:15:05
  Lex Fridman: I focused on feeling my opponent's energy and using it against them, refining my skills with each fight.
• 1:15:12
  When you can get caught in a choke, you know.
• 1:15:15
  But I thought if they don't knock me out, how will they beat me?
• 1:15:21
  I have 15 minutes.
• 1:15:23
  15 minutes is enough to make a person tired.
• 1:15:27
  I'm like, okay, if you wanna stop me, come here.
• 1:15:31
  I'll give you that chance.
• 1:15:34
  Let's get in the octagon.
• 1:15:36
  I had this impatience during fight week.
• 1:15:39
  I wanted to go in there and feel my opponent.
• 1:15:43
  I just wanted to be inside the cage for them to close us in.
• 1:15:49
  For the referee to say, ready, ready, fight.
• 1:15:53
  And here I wanted to feel, to grapple with him and feel his strength, his skills, his energy,
• 1:16:01
  and for it not to stop.
• 1:16:03
  And with any opponent
• 1:16:06
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I felt from the beginning, I didn't actually have superhuman strength.
• 1:16:11
  But from the beginning, when I grabbed them in the first minute, and then in the sixth or seventh minute, I could feel
• 1:16:19
  them fading.
• 1:16:21
  Lex Fridman: I believe that every detail matters in a fight, from strategy to emotional control.
• 1:16:27
  I was, let's say, like squeezing this energy out of them.
• 1:16:32
  And I was getting better and better, minute by minute.
• 1:16:38
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Can you break down the technical details of your top pressure?
• 1:16:42
  That pressure
• 1:16:43
  Lex Fridman: Exploring the technical aspects of fighting.
• 1:16:46
  How does it work?
• 1:16:47
  Can you explain the philosophy behind it?
• 1:16:49
  Over the years, I've learned to use my strength properly.
• 1:16:53
  There's this sport called Aikido.
• 1:16:55
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I don't like it much, but I like their philosophy, where your strength might work against you.
• 1:17:03
  I think for a lot of listeners, this is going to be a brand new sport.
• 1:17:06
  But there is this sport called Aikido.
• 1:17:09
  And the whole philosophy behind
• 1:17:11
  Lex Fridman: it is using your opponent's force against them.
• 1:17:14
  That's what I learned to do.
• 1:17:17
  And I have learned to force an opponent into positions where they have to escape wasting their energy.
• 1:17:24
  Like when we were sparring yesterday.
• 1:17:27
  That's exactly what I wanted.
• 1:17:29
  I wanted you to feel that energy, that heavy top pressure.
• 1:17:33
  We could have just played around.
• 1:17:35
  I could have gone easy on you.
• 1:17:37
  But I wanted you to feel the real heavy pressure.
• 1:17:41
  And of course, please don't think it was a sign of disrespect.
• 1:17:44
  It's quite the opposite.
• 1:17:45
  No, it was respect.
• 1:17:46
  I just wanted you to feel that, you know, how exhausting it can be.
• 1:17:52
  I think you felt it yourself that it was a bit different from the kind of grappling you've dealt with before.
• 1:17:59
  I'm sure of it.
• 1:18:00
  The only one who's even close to that is, I mean, you're the absolute number one.
• 1:18:04
  But the only thing is, when I trained with Roger Gracie in a different sport, you get that same feeling with him.
• 1:18:09
  Like the guy is just insanely heavy.
• 1:18:11
  Pressure, pressure.
• 1:18:13
  Well, Roger, he's the greatest too.
• 1:18:15
  He's the greatest in his own sport.
• 1:18:18
  What makes a person unique is his style.
• 1:18:21
  His style and his approach to his work.
• 1:18:26
  I always approach my craft very professionally, you know, respectfully.
• 1:18:31
  I believe that if you're gonna be in this game, in this sport, you have to completely dedicate yourself
• 1:18:39
  to it.
• 1:18:40
  But I think you had a deep understanding of how to break an opponent, both physically and psychologically, just looking at your style.
• 1:18:47
  The evolution of their career.
• 1:18:49
  They were so big.
• 1:18:51
  They were two of the most famous athletes of their time.
• 1:18:57
  Roosevelt was promoting Joe Louis, you know.
• 1:19:00
  At that moment for America, it was like something incredible that a white president was promoting a black world
• 1:19:08
  champion.
• 1:19:08
  And on the other hand, Hitler stood behind Schmeling.
• 1:19:11
  It was what, 1936, 1938 that they had...
• 1:19:16
  They fought twice?
• 1:19:17
  Twice.
• 1:19:18
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:19:19
  They fought two times.
• 1:19:20
  This wasn't just a good boxing match.
• 1:19:22
  Just a good fight.
• 1:19:24
  This was politics.
• 1:19:25
  Those were nations.
• 1:19:26
  This was politics.
• 1:19:28
  This was nations.
• 1:19:29
  Everything.
• 1:19:30
  It all came together.
• 1:19:31
  And it's the same thing with Ali, too.
• 1:19:33
  Muhammad Ali with the Vietnam War, all that stuff.
• 1:19:36
  Yes, yes.
• 1:19:37
  And his...
• 1:19:38
  And even religion is tied into it.
• 1:19:39
  Everything here came together.
• 1:19:41
  They simply went beyond sports.
• 1:19:43
  Yeah.
• 1:19:44
  It was the exact same thing when I fought Conor.
• 1:19:47
  That fight went beyond our sport.
• 1:19:50
  It impacted every sport.
• 1:19:52
  Because athletes of all kinds of different sports, everyone who loves to compete, it didn't matter if it
• 1:20:00
  was football, basketball, soccer, or boxing.
• 1:20:04
  Everyone was following this.
• 1:20:06
  And honestly, will there be a fight like that?
• 1:20:10
  Well, it's hard for me to say, but I think it'll happen.
• 1:20:14
  It'll happen for sure.
• 1:20:15
  There will always be champions.
• 1:20:17
  There will always be rivalries.
• 1:20:18
  But when it'll happen, that's just a matter of time.
• 1:20:22
  So it's not entirely about the athletes.
• 1:20:24
  It's about everything combined.
• 1:20:26
  Yeah, it's everything combined.
• 1:20:27
  The way he talked, what he stirred up, the lines he crossed, touching on family, religion.
• 1:20:33
  And then somehow, on one side, you had Conor, this really interesting champion who knew how to hype himself up.
• 1:20:40
  And on the other side, you had this undefeated somebody from nowhere, from the mountains.
• 1:20:46
  You know how it is.
• 1:20:47
  It all somehow, all of it just kind of happened naturally.
• 1:20:51
  And it wasn't staged.
• 1:20:54
  It was real.
• 1:20:55
  We had a real rivalry.
• 1:20:56
  Unlike the way a lot of people now just hype up interest in a fight.
• 1:21:00
  But people feel that energy.
• 1:21:01
  It doesn't go anywhere.
• 1:21:03
  Reflecting on the challenges of competition.
• 1:21:06
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I've always been right there, always fighting for position.
• 1:21:09
  I always...
• 1:21:11
  Look, I mean that...
• 1:21:13
  I just always had this thought in my head.
• 1:21:16
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares insights on strategy.
• 1:21:19
  My grandfather always told me, a dog that latches onto that one weak spot always wins.
• 1:21:26
  It's the same with a fighter.
• 1:21:28
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: When you're fighting on pure instinct, you feel your opponent's weakness.
• 1:21:32
  You know where they're weak, and you have to keep pressing right there.
• 1:21:37
  For example, let's say I'm fighting Connor, right?
• 1:21:42
  His strengths are his striking, his timing, and his speed.
• 1:21:47
  His boxing.
• 1:21:49
  Why would I stand and strike with him?
• 1:21:51
  What am I supposed to do?
• 1:21:52
  I have to put pressure on his weak spot.
• 1:21:54
  So, uh, that's what separates the fighters who reach success, the highest level of success, and
• 1:22:02
  become the best of the best.
• 1:22:04
  Lex Fridman: They, they know how to find an opponent's weakness, and they pressure it relentlessly.
• 1:22:10
  So, so, it all comes down to having the right strategy here.
• 1:22:17
  Your fight with Connor, I think, was the biggest fight in UFC history.
• 1:22:22
  That's for sure.
• 1:22:23
  Well, actually, in all of sports, do you think there will ever be another fight of that magnitude in the UFC?
• 1:22:29
  Is it even possible?
• 1:22:32
  Well, let's, let's look at the history here.
• 1:22:36
  I mean, our sport is still very young.
• 1:22:40
  Say, 35 years old, starting from the 90s.
• 1:22:44
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Put it this way.
• 1:22:46
  Take, for example, the sport most similar to MMA, which is, well, let's say, boxing.
• 1:22:52
  How old is boxing?
• 1:22:54
  150 years?
• 1:22:55
  Like, when you think boxing, what, what pops into your head?
• 1:22:59
  Thriller in Manila.
• 1:23:00
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:23:01
  Well, I, I love Mike Tyson a lot, too, so.
• 1:23:04
  Well, Tyson had big fights, but Mike Tyson never had that, uh, signature rival like Muhammad Ali had in Joe Frazier.
• 1:23:11
  Lex Fridman: Yeah, he just didn't have one.
• 1:23:13
  I mean, who do we have?
• 1:23:15
  Evander Holyfield?
• 1:23:16
  Look, Holyfield, Tyson is no Muhammad Ali.
• 1:23:39
  Yes, there was public interest, but there wasn't the energy that there was with Muhammad Ali and Joe Frazier.
• 1:23:46
  Yeah, if I can just pause for a second, I'll check on perplexity.
• 1:23:50
  List of biggest boxing fights of all time.
• 1:23:52
  It's Ali and Frazier, like you said.
• 1:23:54
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:23:55
  The first, the third.
• 1:23:57
  Well, when he lost.
• 1:23:58
  And then the third fight, the Thriller in Manila.
• 1:24:00
  And Foreman, I must say Ali versus Foreman.
• 1:24:03
  Well, Foreman, that was the year, I think, 74, right?
• 1:24:06
  The fight was watched by up to a billion people worldwide.
• 1:24:09
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:24:10
  It was one of those things.
• 1:24:11
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Yeah.
• 1:24:12
  Well, it was actually a very big fight.
• 1:24:14
  Sugar Ray Leonard, Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard versus Thomas Hearns, Hagler versus Hearns.
• 1:24:20
  Well, Hagler.
• 1:24:21
  Hagler and Duran in Montreal.
• 1:24:23
  Yeah.
• 1:24:24
  Sugar Ray Leonard and Duran in Montreal.
• 1:24:26
  When they fought.
• 1:24:27
  When he admitted after the fight that he lost the mental game and broke down before the fight.
• 1:24:32
  But then Sugar Ray beat him later.
• 1:24:35
  Yeah, he came back and won.
• 1:24:36
  Yeah.
• 1:24:37
  Well, if you look at it out of everything that stands out, I think you can mention Frazier and Muhammad Ali.
• 1:24:44
  And there was also Joe Louis against the German Max Schmeling.
• 1:24:48
  Hitler stood behind Schmeling and Roosevelt stood behind Louis.
• 1:24:52
  For those who don't know this story, I just watched it recently.
• 1:24:56
  It was something incomparable.
• 1:25:02
  Lex Fridman: Surviving in Dagestan is a struggle; people walk all summer to prepare for harsh winters. The mountains shape their resilience and identity.
• 1:25:12
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: People can tell what's real and what's fake.
• 1:25:15
  And because of that, we went beyond our own sport.
• 1:25:19
  That's what made this fight so massive.
• 1:25:21
  Well, when you look into your heart back then and now, did you have anger?
• 1:25:26
  Did you have hatred for him?
• 1:25:29
  Back then and even now, I'd still keep a cool head.
• 1:25:34
  Nothing has changed.
• 1:25:36
  When you let your emotions take over, when they are off the charts and you completely lose control, that's a very
• 1:25:44
  bad place to be.
• 1:25:46
  So, you'll tire out faster.
• 1:26:24
  The second you let it all slip, everything becomes a total mess.
• 1:26:30
  So, once the fight was finally done, I just let all my emotions out.
• 1:26:35
  I had to step right in and prove it and punish him and show them I'm better, that I'm better than him and put a final end
• 1:26:43
  to this whole bitter rivalry.
• 1:26:44
  When all of that was over, your emotions came out.
• 1:26:47
  That's where my emotions just went over the edge.
• 1:26:50
  But until the fight was completely finished, starting from training, you know, at the press conferences, at the weigh
• 1:26:58
  -ins, everywhere in front of the media, everywhere, I kept myself completely under control.
• 1:27:02
  And I was very good at it.
• 1:27:05
  Honestly, looking back, it's been almost eight years now.
• 1:27:10
  Looking back, well, I'm a little surprised.
• 1:27:13
  At that point, I was a very emotional guy too.
• 1:27:16
  Over these eight years, a lot has happened in my life.
• 1:27:19
  But I'm surprised that I kept it together.
• 1:27:21
  And, well, you know, it wasn't easy for me to keep myself within my limits, to keep myself under
• 1:27:29
  control like that.
• 1:27:30
  But here, again, I'll come back to what I said.
• 1:27:34
  I was very lucky.
• 1:27:36
  My father called me at that time.
• 1:27:39
  I was here two months before the fight.
• 1:27:43
  His advice helped me out so much.
• 1:27:45
  Because for me, it was not just that it mattered.
• 1:27:49
  It was actually the most important thing for me back then, just to know my father's reaction.
• 1:27:57
  How he was taking everything that was happening.
• 1:28:01
  Because there was just so much media coverage.
• 1:28:04
  So, I knew my father was watching.
• 1:28:06
  Lex Fridman: Understanding the distance in relationships, Khabib reflects on the traditional dynamics with his father, emphasizing the respect and distance that shapes their bond.
• 1:28:17
  It was important for me to know his take.
• 1:28:21
  I'd call and ask.
• 1:28:22
  And my father would even tell me things I hadn't even asked him about.
• 1:28:26
  He'd bring it up on his own.
• 1:28:28
  Because, you know, the way it is with us, between me and my father.
• 1:28:32
  In our traditions, in our part of the world, in our family for generations, in our village, there's just always this distance with your father.
• 1:28:40
  Like, when you walk in, there are just so many things you can't let yourself do in front of your father.
• 1:28:46
  You have to be, like, sort of like a soldier in front of a general, right?
• 1:28:50
  On the strictness of familial relationships, likening the respect for their father to a soldier's discipline.
• 1:28:58
  If you can even make that comparison, if a soldier stands at attention like that, then with us, it's even
• 1:29:05
  stricter.
• 1:29:06
  Like, even, just to give an example here.
• 1:29:10
  For instance, imagine you're a father sitting there, right?
• 1:29:15
  And your two -year -old kid walks up to you and wants to play with you.
• 1:29:20
  You can't even, like, do that baby talk thing with your own kid.
• 1:29:23
  Khabib emphasizes the unique bond with his father, explaining that their relationship is built on respect and distance, akin to a soldier's demeanor.
• 1:29:34
  You don't have that kind of friendship.
• 1:29:36
  You know it's a friendship, but...
• 1:29:37
  It's different, yes.
• 1:29:38
  There's a certain distance that you must keep around your father.
• 1:29:42
  You always have to be, like, completely buttoned up.
• 1:29:45
  Yeah.
• 1:29:46
  You have to stand like a soldier in front of your father.
• 1:29:49
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You don't let your emotions take over.
• 1:29:53
  At that point, just to know what my father thought, who was, like, all the way across the ocean,
• 1:29:58
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on the mental challenges they faced during their last fight, emphasizing the weight of their father's absence and the pressure to succeed.
• 1:30:08
  who couldn't just fly out and be there to support his son and just be there by my side.
• 1:30:15
  But for me, since he didn't have a visa, I just had to know exactly what he thought.
• 1:30:20
  I didn't care what anyone else thought.
• 1:30:23
  I didn't care about the opinions of, like, millions, tens of millions, hundreds of millions watching this fight.
• 1:30:30
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I only ever cared about one person and his take, what he thought and what he'd say to me.
• 1:30:36
  But I couldn't call him and say, Father,
• 1:30:40
  Lex Fridman: The unique feelings experienced during their last fight, emphasizing that they were irreplaceable and tied to that moment.
• 1:30:47
  what do you think about this?
• 1:30:49
  Well, we never had that.
• 1:30:51
  Well, you had to wait.
• 1:30:52
  I would just call and wait to hear what he'd say.
• 1:30:56
  And my father, he knew exactly where to draw the line because he was in the exact same position with his own father since
• 1:31:03
  his own father was still around.
• 1:31:06
  And then he had a son too, right?
• 1:31:09
  And he understood me, how I felt about him, since his relationship with his own father was the same way.
• 1:31:16
  And in that sense, back then, my father really kept me grounded mentally.
• 1:31:21
  He even told me something once.
• 1:31:27
  Do you know how diamonds are, like, actually made under great pressure?
• 1:31:33
  He says, you're under great pressure and you have a choice.
• 1:31:39
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You can break down and give up or you can get through it all properly, clearly, with dignity.
• 1:31:47
  Go in, prepare right, make weight, recover.
• 1:31:50
  Go in, win, and settle it once and for all.
• 1:31:53
  And those exact kinds of moments, they really, they deeply impacted me.
• 1:32:00
  So because of those words, you could cut everything off.
• 1:32:03
  Yeah.
• 1:32:04
  Focus.
• 1:32:05
  Lex Fridman: Khabib emphasizes that the feelings experienced during his last fight were unique and irreplaceable, tied to that specific moment and opponent.
• 1:32:14
  Well.
• 1:32:15
  Mentally.
• 1:32:16
  Mentally.
• 1:32:17
  Like, if a million people showed up right there and told me right outside where I was staying, at the hotel, right?
• 1:32:24
  Like, if a million people gathered right under my window and said, hey, we've got your back.
• 1:32:30
  And honestly, just one call from my father, it wouldn't even compare.
• 1:32:35
  Because that one call from my father, that one piece of advice, his support, his voice, it charged me up way more than
• 1:32:43
  absolutely everything else combined.
• 1:32:57
  The mental challenges they faced during their last fight, emphasizing the weight of their father's absence and the pressure to succeed.
• 1:33:05
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Yeah.
• 1:33:06
  But with you, it seems like Connor was not able to mentally affect you.
• 1:33:11
  Did he manage to get into your head even a little?
• 1:33:14
  No.
• 1:33:15
  Not at all.
• 1:33:17
  I had a clear understanding that physically and mentally, I was just way
• 1:33:24
  stronger than him.
• 1:33:26
  I didn't doubt myself for even 1%.
• 1:33:30
  Well, people, they can say whatever they want.
• 1:33:35
  He's got a massive fan base too.
• 1:33:37
  Maybe
• 1:33:37
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on his toughest fights.
• 1:33:40
  confidence that is just really hard for me to even put into words.
• 1:33:46
  And I just deeply believed that I was better than him and that I was stronger than him.
• 1:33:52
  And that in this matchup, well, I was supposed to win.
• 1:33:56
  I just had this rock -solid faith in myself.
• 1:34:00
  Up until that moment, is it fair to say that this was your toughest fight?
• 1:34:07
  Up until that moment?
• 1:34:08
  Correct.
• 1:34:09
  100%.
• 1:34:09
  Because fighting's all psychology, you know.
• 1:34:14
  It's a mental game.
• 1:34:16
  Mentally speaking, that was my toughest fight.
• 1:34:21
  At that point, yeah.
• 1:34:22
  But a tougher fight came later.
• 1:34:24
  With Gaiji?
• 1:34:25
  With Gaiji.
• 1:34:26
  There were a lot of factors that made it so tough.
• 1:34:29
  The fleeting nature of success and recognition, emphasizing that true fulfillment comes from personal connections rather than public accolades.
• 1:34:39
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Yes.
• 1:34:39
  So can you explain, you said somewhere that actually, unfortunately, or at least from my perspective,
• 1:34:47
  unfortunately, we never got to see your absolute limit?
• 1:34:51
  Were you - Not in fights, no.
• 1:34:54
  You've never seen my limit in fights.
• 1:34:56
  But you said that Gaiji
• 1:35:00
  Lex Fridman: was the closest to it because of the whole process.
• 1:35:04
  Can you explain why it was a tough fight, your last one?
• 1:35:07
  First and foremost, it was because I had lost my father.
• 1:35:10
  It was hard to pull myself together.
• 1:35:13
  Everything piled up at once.
• 1:35:15
  My father was gone.
• 1:35:16
  And training without my father?
• 1:35:20
  Without the person
• 1:35:21
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I was doing all of this for, the person I wanted to become champion for, first and foremost, to prove to him,
• 1:35:31
  to prove to him that I could become the best.
• 1:35:38
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on the concept of legacy, emphasizing that true legacy is about inspiring future generations rather than just personal accolades.
• 1:35:49
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: when we start talking about legacy.
• 1:35:52
  What even is a legacy?
• 1:35:53
  What does legacy mean?
• 1:35:55
  Right?
• 1:35:57
  For me personally, it is public recognition.
• 1:36:00
  Like when people come up to you, like parents come up with their kid and they say, you know, you inspire our son to get into sports.
• 1:36:07
  You're a real role model for him.
• 1:36:09
  And in that exact moment, it's like, you just, you start to realize that none of this was in vain.
• 1:36:17
  But here's the thing.
• 1:36:19
  Does everyone approach every champion like that?
• 1:36:22
  Every successful person?
• 1:36:23
  Do people even come up to them at all?
• 1:36:26
  That's the question.
• 1:36:27
  There are people who became champions.
• 1:36:30
  There are people who rose to the top of their field, but they just don't inspire anyone.
• 1:36:37
  And, well, people look at you like, yeah, you were a champion, you know, but nobody wants to be like you.
• 1:36:45
  There are so many people like that who achieve success, but they,
• 1:36:53
  they don't inspire the younger generation because the youth, they look at you and they just don't see you as a
• 1:37:01
  good person.
• 1:37:03
  And looking at it that way, sports, it's such a double -edged sword.
• 1:37:08
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares personal stories from his career.
• 1:37:12
  I had injury after injury after injury.
• 1:37:16
  But, mentally speaking, I stayed completely sharp.
• 1:37:22
  Well, this is, when you got injuries, your mental game can slip a little.
• 1:37:28
  Or things at home are going bad.
• 1:37:30
  All of that impacts a person.
• 1:37:32
  One, two, three, four.
• 1:37:34
  All these things affect you.
• 1:37:36
  You become, let's say, not, not sharp.
• 1:37:40
  You lose your fire, your fire leaves you, your focus leaves you, your head is somewhere else.
• 1:37:46
  Even though you are physically there, mentally, you are somewhere else.
• 1:37:50
  But, I always stayed there.
• 1:37:52
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I knew it.
• 1:37:54
  Nobody had any idea that was going to be my last fight.
• 1:37:57
  No one knew about the talk I had with my mother.
• 1:38:00
  But you knew and you were sure.
• 1:38:02
  Well, I knew for myself.
• 1:38:03
  This is my last fight.
• 1:38:05
  I was never going to step into the cage again.
• 1:38:08
  I knew it.
• 1:38:08
  And I had to finish it
• 1:38:10
  Lex Fridman: right then and there.
• 1:38:11
  Because, putting myself through all of that yet again, it would have just been too hard on me if I got injured and
• 1:38:19
  the fight fell through.
• 1:38:22
  And putting my mother through all that stress again.
• 1:38:55
  that you said you were already starting to miss it while the fight was still going on.
• 1:39:01
  Yeah, inside the octagon.
• 1:39:03
  I knew it would never happen again.
• 1:39:05
  I stepped in there and I just took it all in.
• 1:39:08
  I was fighting and just every single moment, every moment, every single move, I felt it deep
• 1:39:16
  down.
• 1:39:17
  And in my head, I already knew.
• 1:39:20
  This was the final run.
• 1:39:21
  Everything I'd been doing my entire life, it all came down to this, that competitive rush.
• 1:39:27
  I'll never feel that anywhere else.
• 1:39:29
  I knew deep down, this was my last fight.
• 1:39:32
  What kind of feelings were those?
• 1:39:35
  I've never felt anything like that again.
• 1:39:36
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: right there, on that exact day, that very evening, with that opponent, inside that cage.
• 1:39:42
  I've never had them before that night and never had them since.
• 1:39:46
  And I don't think I'll ever be able to feel that way again.
• 1:40:10
  They train their whole lives for them.
• 1:40:12
  Do you ever think about that?
• 1:40:14
  That in our lives, if we're lucky, we only get maybe one or two moments like that, at that absolute peak?
• 1:40:22
  Yes, yes, yes.
• 1:40:23
  Very rarely.
• 1:40:24
  Very rarely.
• 1:40:25
  It's so rare.
• 1:40:26
  What is happiness really?
• 1:40:28
  The way I see it, it's when you experience certain feelings for a very short time.
• 1:40:34
  You can't be constantly happy, like you achieve something and then you're happy for years.
• 1:40:40
  It just doesn't work that way.
• 1:40:42
  The Almighty didn't build us that way.
• 1:40:44
  You get there, even when you become a champion and you fully feel that moment.
• 1:40:49
  You win.
• 1:40:50
  Lex Fridman: it.
• 1:40:50
  Is that all I worked for?
• 1:40:52
  There's nothing more like that.
• 1:40:54
  You know, like, can I have seconds?
• 1:40:57
  You can't have seconds.
• 1:40:59
  It's like in our cafeteria.
• 1:41:01
  Can I have seconds?
• 1:41:03
  So well, you become champion.
• 1:41:05
  You win.
• 1:41:06
  Then you wake up the next day.
• 1:41:08
  That's it.
• 1:41:08
  Your daily routine continues.
• 1:41:10
  It doesn't end.
• 1:41:11
  You've already got different things going on, different problems, other tasks now.
• 1:41:16
  And you're like, it all went by so fast.
• 1:41:19
  Then you wake up the next day, pack your bags, head to the airport, fly out, land back home.
• 1:41:25
  Everyone's celebrating.
• 1:41:26
  And just like that, the next day, everyone's gone.
• 1:41:29
  That's
• 1:41:51
  A lot of people get it twisted
• 1:41:52
  How did Lex Fridman shape what happened?
• 1:41:57
  If we can, I want to talk about MMA and football in that same context.
• 1:42:02
  Let's start with MMA.
• 1:42:04
  Who do you think are the greatest fighters of all time?
• 1:42:08
  You said you have a few favorites.
• 1:42:11
  Shogun, George St.
• 1:42:13
  Pierre, and Fedor Emelianenko.
• 1:42:17
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Let's talk about those fighters and maybe others who interest you.
• 1:42:20
  They all had different, distinct styles.
• 1:42:23
  So tell me why Shogun?
• 1:42:25
  You've always said that he was important to you as a fighter.
• 1:42:28
  And naturally, he had legendary moments in Pride in 2005.
• 1:42:32
  Lex Fridman: His soccer kick.
• 1:42:33
  Yes, that's right.
• 1:42:35
  Well, Shogun Rua, he, when I was 15, 16 years old, he was the Pride champion.
• 1:42:42
  At that time, for me, it was the best organization in the world.
• 1:42:45
  The best fighters in the world competed there.
• 1:42:48
  Fedor, Crow Cop, Shogun, Wanderlei Silva, Anderson Silva.
• 1:42:53
  Man, they had everybody.
• 1:42:55
  Overrim, Dan Henderson, the Noguera brothers, the Emelianenko brothers.
• 1:43:00
  They were the best at that time, for me, and honestly, for MMA as a whole.
• 1:43:05
  And right there in second place, in my opinion, shining
• 1:43:37
  His style was actually at a very high level.
• 1:43:39
  The way he fought, no other fighter ever did.
• 1:43:43
  At that time, he really impressed me.
• 1:43:46
  Then he crossed over to the UFC and became the UFC champion.
• 1:43:54
  And UFC fights?
• 1:43:56
  And the pride fights?
• 1:43:57
  At that time, I didn't have a computer, internet, none of that.
• 1:44:02
  I remember there was this video rental place with grab tapes and watch all these fights with my
• 1:44:10
  father.
• 1:44:12
  Mauricio Shogunrua, to me, was like the gold standard of a fighter back then.
• 1:44:18
  I'd say right alongside Fedor.
• 1:44:20
  And George St.
• 1:44:22
  Pierre.
• 1:44:23
  And by the way, when you watched the fights with your father, did you watch them for fun or analyze them too?
• 1:44:30
  Mostly we analyzed them.
• 1:44:32
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: We'd sit like this and he'd say this, this, chokes, striking, wrestling.
• 1:44:37
  Lex Fridman: We were constantly analyzing.
• 1:44:39
  There was a fight in 2006 or 2007, I don't even remember the exact year.
• 1:44:48
  approximately around that time
• 1:44:49
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: when George St.
• 1:44:50
  Pierre fought Sean Shirk.
• 1:44:52
  We even re -watched that fight a couple of times.
• 1:44:55
  Then George St.
• 1:44:57
  Pierre fought BJ Penn, the second fight, I think, after the fourth round when there was a stoppage.
• 1:45:04
  Then, well, there were many, many fights and my father actually admired the fighting style, the fighting
• 1:45:12
  style of George St.
• 1:45:13
  Pierre.
• 1:45:14
  Lex Fridman: He really impressed us.
• 1:45:16
  And my father, my father always emphasized his timing of takedowns after striking, how he closed the distance.
• 1:45:26
  and honestly, my whole, you know, like teenage conscious years growing up, like my formative years
• 1:45:33
  transitioning into an adult, it was all tied to, tied to pride in its prime.
• 1:45:40
  And after the UFC bought pride and those fighters crossed over that whole boom in 2006, 7,
• 1:45:48
  8, and 9, the rise of the UFC.
• 1:45:51
  I remember that era so vividly.
• 1:45:54
  My father and I re -watched so many of those UFC fights.
• 1:46:49
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: My father actually invited him.
• 1:46:51
  He was sending out invitations to different schools back then.
• 1:46:55
  It was study or school where he used to train.
• 1:46:58
  Federer's coaches were sent an invitation.
• 1:47:02
  He came with his brother Alexander.
• 1:47:04
  They both made it to the finals back then.
• 1:47:06
  I just remember $5 ,000, $3 ,000, $1 ,000.
• 1:47:10
  Lex Fridman: First, second, third place.
• 1:47:12
  At heavyweight, they gave a car.
• 1:47:14
  When the two brothers arrived, they beat everyone to get to the finals.
• 1:47:19
  They didn't fight each other.
• 1:47:20
  One of them took first place.
• 1:47:22
  That was Federer.
• 1:47:23
  Alexander took second place.
• 1:47:25
  I remember back then when he was warming up, I was standing next to him while he warmed up.
• 1:47:30
  It was this building, you know, a venue that fits maybe 1 ,500 people.
• 1:47:34
  And over there was this partition, like a wall.
• 1:47:37
  And everyone was warming up behind that wall.
• 1:47:40
  At that time, well, practically very few people even knew who Federer was.
• 1:47:43
  But I knew Federer.
• 1:47:45
  I knew who he was, that he was the pride champion.
• 1:47:48
  At that time, he beat Noguera, beat Mark Coleman, beat Randleman.
• 1:47:52
  This was before his championship fight against Crow Cup.
• 1:47:55
  I would come over and just sit there, watching how he warmed up, what he did.
• 1:48:00
  I just remember very well, I don't know, maybe Federer will see this podcast.
• 1:48:04
  He had a thermos.
• 1:48:06
  He had a thermos and he was just drinking tea.
• 1:48:09
  And I remember he fought Ibrahim Magomedov.
• 1:48:12
  He was also a legendary fighter of ours, a heavyweight who fought in pride too.
• 1:48:18
  He fought against him.
• 1:48:19
  It was either his first or second fight.
• 1:48:21
  And he was warming up incredibly well.
• 1:48:24
  I remember how he was warming up his nose and his ears.
• 1:48:28
  I watched him and it was unusual for me at that time.
• 1:48:31
  I never warmed up my nose and ears.
• 1:48:33
  I just remember how Federer was really working on his nose, his ears, his whole face.
• 1:48:39
  And he went, fought, came back.
• 1:48:42
  This was in Mahajkala, 2004.
• 1:48:45
  It's the same as UFC champion now, coming and fighting at the Dagestan Combat Sample Championship.
• 1:48:51
  Can you imagine that?
• 1:48:53
  Back then, it was the best heavyweight organization in the world.
• 1:48:56
  He comes there and fights.
• 1:48:58
  So he finished the fight, goes back, and he had this big thermos with him.
• 1:49:02
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: His team was sitting separately over there.
• 1:49:07
  He was drinking tea.
• 1:49:08
  He just fought, walked back, poured some tea, and drank it.
• 1:49:11
  He had something to snack on with it, maybe honey or something.
• 1:49:14
  I just don't remember.
• 1:49:15
  And I was, wow, Federer is right here.
• 1:49:18
  For me, that was just such a, you know, great source of motivation back then.
• 1:49:22
  It's really hard to put those emotions into words.
• 1:49:27
  By the way, maybe you could ask him about that on the podcast.
• 1:49:30
  About the thermos?
• 1:49:31
  No, no.
• 1:49:32
  About the tea, what was in it?
• 1:49:34
  Time, mint, what did he put in there?
• 1:49:38
  Well, I would love to talk to him on this podcast, but I think he rarely does interviews.
• 1:49:46
  I think you can reach him.
• 1:49:48
  I can help you.
• 1:49:50
  Well, if you could put in a good word for me.
• 1:49:52
  Yeah, of course.
• 1:49:53
  I think it would be interesting for people to hear him.
• 1:49:56
  Absolutely.
• 1:49:57
  Yeah.
• 1:49:59
  But psychologically, he's kind of like you in a way.
• 1:50:04
  You mean calm?
• 1:50:05
  Yeah.
• 1:50:07
  Yes, that calmness.
• 1:50:08
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on the importance of mental strength.
• 1:50:11
  when it's boiling inside and on the surface you stay cold, cold -blooded, calm, and you can handle all these different emotions that hit you at the
• 1:50:19
  same time.
• 1:50:20
  There are a lot of them and they all hit differently.
• 1:50:23
  When you compete, what makes a fighter and athlete at the highest level so unique is that so many
• 1:50:31
  different emotions hit you at the same time.
• 1:50:34
  Fear, nerves, the fact that people are watching you, the thought that you might perform badly, that you
• 1:50:42
  might not show what you've trained for, that you might mess it up, that you might, I don't know,
• 1:50:50
  fall.
• 1:50:50
  So much enters your head and you can put each emotion
• 1:50:58
  it emotionally, but you stay cold -blooded.
• 1:51:02
  And you know that if you don't handle these emotions that are coming at you, if you don't handle this pressure, then
• 1:51:10
  it will be difficult for you to compete because the main competition is against yourself first.
• 1:51:15
  You fight yourself, you beat yourself, and only then do you actually start competing with your opponent.
• 1:51:23
  So, I think it happens to everyone, not just him or me.
• 1:51:27
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: The big difference here is how much you can control it.
• 1:51:32
  Feodor himself famously said, the only person who can defeat me is me, the only person who can beat me is me.
• 1:51:39
  He was talking about that fight with yourself, I'm sure, because if you lose to yourself, then you'll lose to your opponent very easily.
• 1:51:47
  Lex Fridman: There's an interesting thing I came across.
• 1:51:50
  Adam Satiev said that high -level athletes often make a mistake and what they do wrong is
• 1:51:57
  that when they feel fear, they tend to ignore it.
• 1:52:02
  He believes that you have to confront that fear and overcome it.
• 1:52:08
  Yes, psychologists talk about how to work through those thoughts when they arise.
• 1:52:15
  You know, when fear comes up and you feel it, that's
• 1:52:19
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: absolutely normal.
• 1:52:21
  It's what the Almighty put in us.
• 1:52:25
  People get scared, people get cold, people feel pain, people get hungry.
• 1:52:31
  These are things that are inside all of us.
• 1:52:34
  The real question is how you deal with them, how you overcome them within yourself.
• 1:52:40
  Lex Fridman: 100 % you can't ignore it and you must work through it.
• 1:52:43
  You have to answer the questions.
• 1:52:45
  Why did this happen?
• 1:52:46
  Could I do it this way instead?
• 1:52:48
  And this comes only with experience.
• 1:52:51
  Only with experience.
• 1:52:53
  And the more you compete, you know, the more you train and the more you face it.
• 1:52:59
  Some people actually try to avoid that moment.
• 1:53:03
  But the more you face it, the better and better you'll become each time.
• 1:53:11
  it's the same with athletes.
• 1:53:13
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: They get nervous.
• 1:53:14
  That's what we call the jitters, right?
• 1:53:17
  At first, whenever someone competes, they get the jitters.
• 1:53:20
  But when you keep competing over and over again, you gradually learn
• 1:53:25
  Lex Fridman: how to channel those nerves in the right direction.
• 1:53:30
  Then it gets easier for you.
• 1:53:32
  And in order to get there, you have to compete.
• 1:53:35
  And what is competition?
• 1:53:37
  You meet this fear face to face.
• 1:53:39
  You don't avoid it.
• 1:53:41
  A lot of guys are staying away from competitions.
• 1:53:44
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: When they're young, they have this tension, this self -consciousness, this fear, the jitters.
• 1:53:50
  They're nervous.
• 1:53:51
  They can't sleep at night.
• 1:53:52
  Lex Fridman: You have to go through all of that yourself.
• 1:53:55
  Nobody can do it for you.
• 1:53:57
  A coach can train you.
• 1:53:58
  A coach can teach you.
• 1:53:59
  But all he can say is, practice, practice, practice.
• 1:54:03
  practice.
• 1:54:04
  Then there's you, alone with your own feelings.
• 1:54:08
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: When you lie down, when you wake up, when you walk, when you're by yourself, when you eat.
• 1:54:15
  There are so many moments when a person has to go through all of this on his own.
• 1:54:21
  And when you have to go through this over and over again, some people back away.
• 1:54:28
  They don't want to face
• 1:54:29
  Lex Fridman: it.
• 1:54:30
  And what do you need for that?
• 1:54:33
  Patience.
• 1:54:34
  You have to come and endure it and go through all of it, through your skin, through your muscles, through your mind.
• 1:54:41
  You must let all of this pass through you and overcome it.
• 1:54:45
  And each time, you'll get better at it.
• 1:54:49
  A good example of that is the third person
• 1:54:52
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: you mentioned, George Saint -Pierre, who, by the way, sends his regards.
• 1:54:56
  I train with him a lot and he has a very deep respect for you.
• 1:55:00
  But he didn't give me much good advice because when I told him I was going to train with you, he told me, what did he say?
• 1:55:07
  He texted me, if you die, you die.
• 1:55:10
  That's what he said.
• 1:55:12
  Good advice.
• 1:55:13
  He's a wise man.
• 1:55:14
  Didn't support me and said, say hi.
• 1:55:17
  Tell him I say hi too.
• 1:55:18
  As we were talking about, he himself has spoken about this, that he was afraid and always felt fear
• 1:55:26
  before every single fight.
• 1:55:30
  That's interesting.
• 1:55:31
  One of the greatest fighters in history, yeah.
• 1:55:35
  And even he feels fear.
• 1:55:37
  He's not afraid to admit it.
• 1:55:39
  Everybody has fear.
• 1:55:41
  Everybody gets afraid.
• 1:55:42
  But I don't know how big that fear was for him.
• 1:55:46
  I really don't know.
• 1:55:48
  We never discussed it.
• 1:55:50
  But I've watched a lot of his interviews, his fights, and his training camps.
• 1:55:57
  The way he analyzed his past fights and all that, the way I see it, he's a very sensitive person.
• 1:56:04
  There are people like that too.
• 1:56:06
  Some guys take all of this very lightly.
• 1:56:09
  Like, okay, we fight tomorrow.
• 1:56:11
  We'll see who my opponent is and how he shows up, right?
• 1:56:15
  But there are others who find it very difficult to handle psychologically.
• 1:56:21
  But the Almighty gave me this kind of calmness.
• 1:56:25
  Sometimes I'd get to the arena and they bring you in four hours before they fight.
• 1:56:32
  They have to weigh you.
• 1:56:34
  They have to do doping control.
• 1:56:37
  And they have to tape you up.
• 1:56:39
  There are so many athletic commission procedures.
• 1:56:42
  Every state has different rules.
• 1:56:45
  How they bring you into the arena and all that.
• 1:56:48
  Sometimes I'd get there four hours early and think, what am I supposed to do?
• 1:56:53
  So I make myself a little bed and say, please, keep it quiet.
• 1:56:58
  I would lie down.
• 1:57:00
  I could sleep there for an hour, maybe an hour and a half.
• 1:57:03
  That's it.
• 1:57:04
  Wake up, warm up.
• 1:57:05
  And then, I could go out and fight.
• 1:57:08
  And some guys, they don't sleep for two days before
• 1:57:10
  Lex Fridman: they fight.
• 1:57:11
  Believe me, there are fighters who don't sleep the night before a fight and it's very hard on them.
• 1:57:18
  It's not really fear.
• 1:57:20
  It's hard to describe with just one emotion.
• 1:57:24
  It's too many emotions that come over a person and they can't fall asleep.
• 1:57:29
  It's panic.
• 1:57:31
  It's fear.
• 1:57:32
  It's worry.
• 1:57:33
  It's nervousness.
• 1:57:34
  It's the jitters.
• 1:57:35
  All of that builds up and the person just can't fall asleep.
• 1:57:40
  So, in that regard, the Almighty gave me a little more calmness than others.
• 1:57:47
  I had, you know, such a cool head and calmness before the fights.
• 1:57:52
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Now, you're in this new position as a leader and you're looking at all these athletes,
• 1:58:00
  these young guys who are already at the very top of the world and I think they're all very different from one another
• 1:58:07
  psychologically, physically, and stylistically.
• 1:58:12
  Lex Fridman: What can you say as a coach?
• 1:58:14
  I know you're not a coach but as a leader, how do you figure out what each person needs?
• 1:58:19
  Like now, we were watching Umar prepare.
• 1:58:23
  Yeah.
• 1:58:24
  That each person needs something different.
• 1:58:26
  Yes, everyone is different.
• 1:58:28
  Different styles, different mentalities, different mindsets, different approaches to fight weak and to
• 1:58:36
  preparation as a whole.
• 1:58:37
  but you have to adapt to all of it.
• 1:58:40
  Here, you can't just take one approach.
• 1:58:43
  Let's say we take my approach and apply it to everyone else, to Usman,
• 1:58:51
  Islam, and Umar.
• 1:58:53
  It doesn't work like that.
• 1:58:56
  Everyone needs their own approach.
• 1:58:58
  I knew them since they were nobody and I know them now when they are the best.
• 1:59:03
  So, you have to treat each one differently.
• 1:59:06
  I'm very lucky to have Javier Mendes.
• 1:59:08
  He's been by my side since 2012 and when I became a coach, after I finished my career, he
• 1:59:16
  was there with me as a coach.
• 1:59:18
  I switched from being a fighter to a coaching role.
• 1:59:22
  My father was no longer with us and together with Javier Mendes, we've been guiding them for these last six
• 1:59:29
  years and his experience helps me tremendously.
• 1:59:34
  Because there is no coach, no MMA coach with the kind of results Javier Mendes has, you know.
• 1:59:42
  So many champions, double champions, UFC fighters, so many people have trained under him.
• 1:59:49
  From Frank Shamrock all the way to Islam Makachev.
• 1:59:54
  So many fighters have trained under him, which makes things very easy for me.
• 1:59:59
  Because I have Javier Mendes by my side and he can help me with so many things.
• 2:00:06
  What do you think is the secret behind Javier's genius?
• 2:00:08
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Why is he such a great coach for so many different athletes?
• 2:00:14
  It's the mental side of things.
• 2:00:16
  I'm not going to say he's one of the best at holding pads or anything like that.
• 2:00:21
  But his understanding of MMA itself, his approach to training camp, to the whole preparation process,
• 2:00:30
  and the amount of attention he pays to sparring inside the cage.
• 2:00:35
  I'm not talking about those sparring sessions with 50 people in the gym and everyone is sparring with each other.
• 2:00:42
  For example, when I was preparing for a five -run fight, he would always bring in two or three high -level opponents,
• 2:00:50
  constantly rotating in fresh sparring partners.
• 2:00:53
  And he would watch and analyze.
• 2:00:55
  I don't remember him ever missing a single sparring session since 2012.
• 2:01:00
  Can you imagine?
• 2:01:01
  14 years have gone by and right now we're in training camp.
• 2:01:06
  Lex Fridman: He's there for every training session, morning and evening.
• 2:01:10
  He's at every sparring session, watching everyone, coaching them, giving advice, guiding them.
• 2:01:15
  He's incredibly dedicated to what he does.
• 2:01:18
  He's either all -in or he steps away completely.
• 2:01:23
  He never shows up and gives only 50%.
• 2:01:26
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I remember one situation.
• 2:01:29
  Abubakar was getting ready to fight in WSOF and I had another student fighting there as well.
• 2:01:35
  Abubakar went through the entire preparation with us but the other guy didn't.
• 2:01:40
  When we got there, I told the coach, Coach, can you work his corner with me too?
• 2:01:45
  He said, You know, Habib, I haven't seen his preparation.
• 2:01:48
  I don't know what he's capable of.
• 2:01:50
  He didn't train under me.
• 2:01:52
  But since you're asking, I'll do it.
• 2:01:54
  But for the future, remember, I don't really like to corner guys I haven't prepared.
• 2:02:01
  I didn't understand him then but now I do.
• 2:02:04
  This was 2016 or maybe 2017.
• 2:02:07
  I don't want to be wrong.
• 2:02:09
  And now, I understand.
• 2:02:11
  Lex Fridman: Now when people ask me, I'm like, I didn't prepare you.
• 2:02:15
  I don't know how ready you are.
• 2:02:17
  I'm not ready to go in there and give all my energy to someone who didn't go through camp with me.
• 2:02:25
  Now I understand that.
• 2:02:26
  At that time, I told the coach, Can you come out and corner him with me?
• 2:02:30
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: He said, No problem.
• 2:02:33
  We went out there, Abu Bakr won his fight and the other guy's fight ended in a draw.
• 2:02:40
  But that's not really
• 2:02:59
  I don't know how he prepared.
• 2:03:01
  I don't know how ready he is to go into those deep waters.
• 2:03:05
  That's why I try not to corner just anyone.
• 2:03:08
  I learned that from Javier.
• 2:03:11
  So you need to know he can go into those deep waters.
• 2:03:15
  How deep he can go?
• 2:03:17
  I need to know exactly
• 2:03:18
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares insights on training partnerships.
• 2:03:21
  you train with?
• 2:03:23
  You guys joke around all the time so it's easy to forget
• 2:03:28
  Khabib reflects on Daniel Cormier's journey from Olympic champion to UFC heavyweight champion, highlighting his unique qualities as a training partner and coach.
• 2:03:39
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: how great he really is.
• 2:03:40
  What can you say about him as a training partner, as a coach, as a person?
• 2:03:45
  When we talk about DC, we have to go back to 2004, 2008.
• 2:03:52
  He was a two -time Olympian.
• 2:03:54
  He represented Team USA at the Olympic Games and that carries a lot of weight in this sport, especially in the
• 2:04:02
  96 kilo division.
• 2:04:05
  And he is a two -time Olympian.
• 2:04:08
  Lex Fridman: Then he transitioned to MMA, won a few fights on the regional scene, went to Strikeforce, won fights there, they
• 2:04:16
  put him into the Grand Prix, he won the Grand Prix, became heavyweight champion, and then went to the UFC.
• 2:04:22
  The best results come from the worst conditions. Cormier moved to the UFC, cutting weight to compete at 205 pounds, showcasing their dedication.
• 2:04:32
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: When he moved to the UFC, he cut down to 205 pounds to make room for Cain Velasquez because they were best friends.
• 2:04:41
  Lex Fridman: Cain was the heavyweight champion.
• 2:04:43
  So he moved to 205 and they both became champions, one at light heavyweight and one at heavyweight.
• 2:04:50
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Later, when Cain lost the title, he moved to heavyweight and won there too.
• 2:04:56
  He is one of the most unique athletes who has ever lived.
• 2:04:59
  Lex Fridman: How many athletes do you know who competed at the world championships, at the Olympic Games, in freestyle wrestling,
• 2:05:07
  then transitioned to MMA and became Strikeforce champion, UFC light heavyweight champion, and UFC
• 2:05:15
  heavyweight champion?
• 2:05:17
  And he is also remembered for his rivalry with one of the greatest, if not the greatest, John Jones.
• 2:05:24
  But by the time
• 2:05:25
  Dagestan's history influences the resilience of its people. The importance of mental strength in the fight game, especially as fighters age.
• 2:05:35
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: he fought John Jones, he was no longer at his peak.
• 2:05:39
  I think he was already pushing 40.
• 2:06:10
  Lex Fridman: Daniel Cormia is one of those people who I think can truly inspire others.
• 2:06:18
  So who usually wins when you guys wrestle?
• 2:06:22
  You?
• 2:06:23
  Or DC?
• 2:06:25
  Well, he's got a few years on me.
• 2:06:27
  But back in my prime, when I was competing at lightweight, I weighed around 85, maybe 86 kilos.
• 2:06:36
  DC was always around 107, 110.
• 2:06:40
  Those are completely different weight classes.
• 2:06:42
  DC was better at wrestling, and as an Olympian too.
• 2:06:46
  All joking aside.
• 2:06:48
  So you feel, back then it was really tough of course, but now it's different.
• 2:06:53
  Now I can go after him.
• 2:06:56
  But I learned so much from Cormier.
• 2:06:58
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: As a person, a wrestler, and a fighter.
• 2:07:01
  You know, we spent our best years together at AKA, from 2012 to 2020.
• 2:07:09
  We've shared so many memories and moments together as well.
• 2:07:14
  I just think it's a shame that people don't talk about him as one of the top 5, top 10.
• 2:07:19
  Well, top 10 for sure.
• 2:07:21
  One of the top 10 greatest, no question.
• 2:07:23
  Absolutely.
• 2:07:23
  Yeah, I definitely think so.
• 2:07:25
  It's a shame, but you see this in football and in other sports too.
• 2:07:28
  One rivalry can overshadow an entire legacy.
• 2:07:31
  For DC, it's John Jones.
• 2:07:33
  Well, John Jones was the better athlete.
• 2:07:37
  There's no doubt about that, but DC was right there with him.
• 2:07:41
  Yes, John Jones won, but DC gave him a real fight.
• 2:07:47
  He was that very person, you know, who actually made John Jones train harder.
• 2:07:54
  People shouldn't forget that.
• 2:07:56
  I'm sure John Jones prepared for that fight like it was the hardest fight of his life.
• 2:08:03
  Lex Fridman: Well, we've talked about different athletes, about Umar, but now let's talk about Islam Makachev, one of your
• 2:08:11
  closest brothers, who's at the very top of the world.
• 2:08:14
  You've known each other, you've trained together for more than 20 years.
• 2:08:19
  In your opinion, what makes him such a special wrestler and fighter?
• 2:08:23
  Why has he reached such heights?
• 2:08:26
  Why is he a great fighter?
• 2:08:28
  Well, let's start with the fact that Islam has been doing this his whole life since childhood, and I've known
• 2:08:36
  him since childhood too.
• 2:08:37
  We went to the same school, lived in the same neighborhood, trained at the same gym, and he was my father's student.
• 2:08:44
  And it's worth mentioning, he was one of my father's favorite students.
• 2:08:49
  Yes.
• 2:08:50
  One of the best students.
• 2:08:53
  My father saw in him this potential for greatness in how hard he trained.
• 2:09:00
  That's what I was talking about at the beginning of the podcast.
• 2:09:05
  When you go into the dark, uncomfortable room and stay there for a long time, no matter how hard it gets.
• 2:09:14
  He knew how to make sacrifices, he was very disciplined.
• 2:09:19
  Nobody reaches this level by accident.
• 2:09:23
  It's impossible without exceptional natural gifts, and he has them, he's gifted,
• 2:09:31
  Allah blessed him with those gifts, and he's deeply devoted to what he does.
• 2:09:37
  We basically grew up together, right?
• 2:09:41
  I'm three years older than Islam, and I was always a little bigger, a little older than him.
• 2:09:48
  So, when we were amateurs, I competed in slightly heavier weight classes.
• 2:09:54
  But we worked together a lot, and Islam benefited tremendously from training with me.
• 2:10:01
  we trained together for many years, and he never had to go anywhere to find a sparring partner,
• 2:10:08
  because he always had one in the gym.
• 2:10:11
  So, I developed by training with the older guys in the gym, the stronger guys, the better guys, when I was young.
• 2:10:18
  Then, when they left, I was the one in front.
• 2:10:21
  Islam kept growing, growing, growing.
• 2:10:23
  Now, I left, Islam is the one in front, and now other guys are developing through him.
• 2:10:29
  This is a kind of chain, that exists in a gym, in a training system, that produces the best fighters in the world.
• 2:10:37
  And in this chain, Islam was always behind me.
• 2:10:41
  If I was behind someone, Islam was behind me.
• 2:10:44
  Now, others are following, Islam, Usman, Amru, and other guys.
• 2:10:50
  You could put them against any of the best fighters in the world
• 2:10:53
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: right now, and they would perform very well.
• 2:10:57
  So, in this chain, we've had since 2003, and now it's already 2026,
• 2:11:05
  that's 23 years, Islam was the one coming up behind me.
• 2:11:11
  And now, there are younger guys coming up behind Islam.
• 2:11:15
  and it's no secret that Islam will turn 35 in October.
• 2:11:19
  But what makes me happy is that there are younger guys coming up behind him.
• 2:11:24
  I left, Islam stepped in, one day Islam will leave too, and others will take his place, and this cycle, it never ends,
• 2:11:32
  it keeps going, and it keeps pulling the next generation forward.
• 2:11:36
  At the beginning, a lot of people are involved, but as you gradually climb higher, higher, and higher, the road gets narrower,
• 2:11:44
  and fewer and fewer people remain.
• 2:11:47
  And alongside Islam, a lot of guys were developing while training with me.
• 2:11:52
  But Islam made it all the way because of his work ethic, his discipline, and
• 2:11:59
  let's call it sacrifice.
• 2:12:03
  He gave up a lot to reach this level.
• 2:12:06
  This isn't easy.
• 2:12:08
  You have to make sacrifices.
• 2:12:11
  You have to make sacrifices.
• 2:12:13
  You have to give up parties.
• 2:12:16
  You have to sacrifice sleep.
• 2:12:18
  You have to sacrifice your time.
• 2:12:21
  There are so many things you have to give up.
• 2:12:24
  You have to dedicate your entire life to this sport, putting aside all the things that can distract you.
• 2:12:31
  You train, you sleep, you eat, you wake up, and then you do it all over again.
• 2:12:37
  Only then can you reach the level that Islam reached.
• 2:12:41
  That's what makes him unique.
• 2:12:43
  Lex Fridman: Were there any small but interesting differences between you and Islam, psychologically speaking?
• 2:12:51
  There are many.
• 2:12:53
  Psychologically he's very solid too.
• 2:12:55
  I've been around him through so many training camps and so many fights.
• 2:13:00
  He's built very strong mentally.
• 2:13:02
  Of course we're different in certain things, but in terms of our fighters attitude toward their work, we have a lot in common.
• 2:13:10
  A lot.
• 2:13:11
  You also train a lot.
• 2:13:12
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 2:13:14
  A lot.
• 2:13:14
  And I think he, well, first I have to say, I watched you train yesterday and it made
• 2:13:22
  me really happy to see that you still love this so deeply.
• 2:13:26
  You know, it's hard to love something for such a long time.
• 2:13:31
  People finish and move on.
• 2:13:32
  Yes.
• 2:13:33
  They retire and move on, but me, it's been six years since I retired, and I still haven't let go of wrestling, of
• 2:13:41
  competition.
• 2:13:42
  I still go to the gym, do cardio, lift, wrestle, grapple.
• 2:13:47
  I never let it go.
• 2:13:48
  It's still with me.
• 2:13:50
  And yesterday I told you that last week I did 200 minutes of live grappling.
• 2:14:10
  Khabib reflects on the relationships formed in the sport and their significance.
• 2:14:15
  I love it, I love this energy, I love that feeling after wrestling.
• 2:14:19
  You wrestle, let's say, 40 minutes.
• 2:14:21
  Yesterday, I still wanted more.
• 2:14:23
  Just now, I wrestled with you, with Islam, maybe 20 minutes, but still, it's not enough to get that feeling,
• 2:14:32
  that 100 % feeling.
• 2:14:34
  I need around 40 minutes of wrestling, something like that.
• 2:14:39
  I don't think most people listening to us will understand that.
• 2:14:45
  But, I think some people watching, especially grappling and jiu -jitsu fans, will understand
• 2:14:52
  me.
• 2:14:53
  The importance of maintaining focus and discipline in training.
• 2:14:57
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Well, to be honest, sometimes there are cameras around you, and for me at least, that's harder.
• 2:15:04
  I like it when there are none.
• 2:15:06
  I usually trained with no cameras.
• 2:15:09
  With you, was one of the rare occasions when I come to the gym, and you allow.
• 2:15:14
  When I allow it, yes.
• 2:15:16
  Thanks for that.
• 2:15:17
  Yeah, yeah, yeah, this is very, very rare for me.
• 2:15:20
  Even with embedded, with UFC, with everyone who comes, I always say don't film.
• 2:15:26
  Thank you, brother.
• 2:15:27
  I don't know why, but cameras get in the way for me because this sport, this preparation, it happens here, and that
• 2:15:35
  whole world where celebrities matter, it gets in the way.
• 2:15:39
  Yes, it gets in the way, but 99 .9 % of our training sessions happen without cameras.
• 2:15:47
  Well, thank you, brother.
• 2:15:48
  Let me ask you this.
• 2:15:50
  A lot of people say you're number one, the greatest of all time.
• 2:15:54
  Do you think Islam has a chance to become the greatest MMA fighter of all time?
• 2:16:02
  Lex Fridman: Well, I've never said that, and I never set out to become number one or to become the greatest athlete, and so
• 2:16:10
  on.
• 2:16:10
  I never had that.
• 2:16:12
  My goal was always to become the best in my sport, to become a world champion, to prove to myself
• 2:16:20
  that I could do it.
• 2:16:22
  But it's hard to choose just one person.
• 2:16:25
  Even now, look, there's always going to be Saint -Pierre, there's always going to be Demetrius Johnson, there's always
• 2:16:33
  going to be John Jones, there's always going to be Fedor.
• 2:16:37
  If people want to include me in that conversation, if Islam gets into that conversation, if there's Cain, Velasquez,
• 2:16:45
  Cormier, and so on, I'd be happy about that.
• 2:16:48
  And that's my goal, that someone from our team, from the people closest to me, gets there too.
• 2:16:54
  If John Jones is there, why can't Islam be there?
• 2:16:58
  If Demetrius Johnson is there with 11 title defenses, why can't Islam be there?
• 2:17:04
  It's a good question.
• 2:17:05
  Why not?
• 2:17:06
  I'd like him to break all those records, to overtake John Jones, Demetrius Johnson, and Saint -Pierre,
• 2:17:14
  no matter how much respect I have for them.
• 2:17:17
  Islam has a chance.
• 2:17:18
  But time is starting to run out a little.
• 2:17:21
  This worries me because, for example, Jones fought at light heavyweight, and now at heavyweight, time is a little
• 2:17:29
  kinder to those divisions.
• 2:17:32
  Khabib highlights the importance of discipline in achieving success.
• 2:17:36
  Even at 38, you can still compete at the heavier weights.
• 2:17:40
  Discussing the challenges of aging in sports.
• 2:17:46
  really catches up.
• 2:17:47
  I think active fighters, retired fighters, wrestlers, athletes,
• 2:17:54
  especially those who competed in these weight classes, will understand what I'm talking about.
• 2:18:02
  When you're 35, and when you're 32, and when you're 38, you're a totally different athlete.
• 2:18:09
  From where you are now, you can see the entire fight business, and you know Dana White very well.
• 2:18:15
  I'd say he's one of those rare geniuses in sports business, in business, period.
• 2:18:24
  I don't think the UFC would exist without Dana White.
• 2:18:27
  There are important people there, of course, but he's really at the center of it all.
• 2:18:32
  What can you say about him?
• 2:18:34
  What qualities, what traits have made him such a successful businessman?
• 2:18:42
  First of all, I think, if you look at it, I also kind of, well, not kind of, I understand his
• 2:18:50
  position a little.
• 2:18:51
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I also ran my own league for a couple of years.
• 2:18:54
  I know what the relationship between a promoter, well, a league owner, and the fighters is like, not just as a fighter,
• 2:19:04
  dealing with a league owner.
• 2:19:06
  I've been on both sides of it.
• 2:19:10
  he's very good at separating business from personal relationships.
• 2:19:14
  For him, the two never, never overlap.
• 2:19:17
  Lex Fridman: He draws a clear line between them.
• 2:19:20
  In business, he's extremely cold -blooded.
• 2:19:25
  He's made decisions, some major decisions, regardless of whether people
• 2:19:33
  like them or not.
• 2:19:34
  and those decisions, they were best for the league and for the UFC.
• 2:19:39
  He always had that mentality, you know, like in those mafia movies where family comes first, right?
• 2:19:47
  Well, for him, the UFC always came first.
• 2:19:51
  That's the only way he was able to push their brand forward.
• 2:19:55
  Of course, a lot of people contributed to that success.
• 2:19:57
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: There were a lot of them.
• 2:19:59
  You have to give credit to Bruce Buffer, to Joe Rogan, to the commentators who were there.
• 2:20:06
  There were a lot of things that made the UFC unique, but the cherry on top was always Dana.
• 2:20:13
  Dana did an incredible job promoting the UFC, and he still does.
• 2:20:17
  No matter
• 2:20:18
  Lex Fridman: The relationships formed in the sport and their significance.
• 2:20:22
  what, the UFC is always there.
• 2:20:25
  You know, no matter how unsuccessful a particular event might be, the UFC is still the UFC.
• 2:20:33
  When they go into a new market outside the United States, even if a show doesn't go so well, people will still come back for the next
• 2:20:40
  event simply because it's the UFC.
• 2:20:43
  Over the last 30 plus years, they've established themselves as the premier MMA league in the world, and they put on the best fights.
• 2:20:51
  So in that respect, I think a huge part of the credit goes to Dana.
• 2:20:55
  The fact that the UFC has come this far is a major achievement.
• 2:20:59
  Building a league like that is incredibly difficult.
• 2:21:01
  Yeah, a lot of people have money, and a lot of people have tried.
• 2:21:04
  Many have come in, but building what the UFC has built is extremely hard.
• 2:21:08
  And what they've achieved now with Paramount, that's something unique.
• 2:21:13
  It's a unique achievement.
• 2:21:14
  In just 30 years, they've grown to a level that some entire sports needed 100 or 150 years to reach.
• 2:21:22
  And you have to give credit
• 2:21:25
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: where it's due, and that credit goes to one person, Dana White.
• 2:21:28
  So I think that his genius as a promoter, the way he promotes and pushes fights, and
• 2:21:35
  pushes his league as a whole, that is just remarkable.
• 2:21:40
  In my opinion, that's something a lot of people could learn from him.
• 2:21:44
  You mentioned Joe Rogan.
• 2:21:46
  You know, he's a friend of mine.
• 2:21:48
  I love listening to his podcast, but I've never actually heard the two of you have a conversation together.
• 2:21:54
  Do you think that's something that could happen in the future?
• 2:21:57
  Yes, of course.
• 2:21:58
  I know you have a great deal of respect for him, and he has a great deal of respect for you.
• 2:22:01
  I can't wait to hear the two of you talk.
• 2:22:04
  Same here.
• 2:22:05
  If we're talking about the people most responsible for promoting the UFC, I'd put Dana first.
• 2:22:10
  But second place, without question, goes to Joe Rogan.
• 2:22:13
  It's honestly hard to imagine the UFC without him.
• 2:22:15
  Lex Fridman: It'll be hard when he's no longer part of it.
• 2:22:19
  And what he's achieved in his own field, what he's achieved in podcasting, he's the best.
• 2:22:25
  And what he's built, the way he commentates, the way he communicates, his knowledge, his charisma,
• 2:22:32
  the way he carries a conversation.
• 2:22:35
  I think a lot of people could learn from him.
• 2:22:38
  And as for me going on his podcast, I think it's inevitable.
• 2:22:41
  God willing, if we're given the time and the health, we'll have a lot to talk about.
• 2:22:45
  There are so many different topics we could discuss together.
• 2:22:48
  So a conversation with Joe Rogan would be very interesting.
• 2:22:52
  I'd definitely like to talk to him.
• 2:22:54
  I agree.
• 2:22:55
  But it's interesting.
• 2:22:55
  Right now, you and I are speaking Russian.
• 2:22:57
  Yes.
• 2:22:58
  Language is a tricky thing.
• 2:23:00
  Yeah, exactly.
• 2:23:00
  With him, you need to come prepared.
• 2:23:02
  Yes.
• 2:23:03
  Because if you show up unprepared, he will just eat you alive.
• 2:23:07
  You have to be ready.
• 2:23:09
  It's a mental battle too.
• 2:23:10
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Yeah.
• 2:23:10
  And by the way, you know, you've mentioned a few times that you'd like to improve your Arabic.
• 2:23:18
  Language is such an interesting thing.
• 2:23:20
  Lex Fridman: It opens doors to understanding.
• 2:23:22
  It allows you to understand culture and history on a much deeper level.
• 2:23:27
  Absolutely.
• 2:23:27
  Without the language, it's very difficult.
• 2:23:29
  I'm starting to study Arabic now, but I've been reading the Quran since I was a child.
• 2:23:35
  I know the alphabet very
• 2:23:38
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: well, the pronunciation rules.
• 2:23:39
  I can read it well.
• 2:23:41
  But the Quran and Arabic as a spoken language are different.
• 2:23:45
  I wouldn't say they're drastically different, but they are different.
• 2:23:50
  If you want to speak it conversationally, you need to study grammar and learn it in a different way.
• 2:23:56
  Lex Fridman: In the summer, they farm on terraces, a practice that has ancient roots. These terraces are strategically built to withstand invasions.
• 2:24:05
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I'd also like to ask you about Ali.
• 2:24:08
  Ali Abdelaziz.
• 2:24:10
  He's such a central figure.
• 2:24:12
  He represents so many champions.
• 2:24:14
  What do you respect about him?
• 2:24:16
  What do you think makes him a genius?
• 2:24:18
  Because he's such a unique person.
• 2:24:21
  Well, I met Ali in 2014.
• 2:24:25
  We've been working together ever since.
• 2:24:29
  Over the years, a lot of fighters came to him through me.
• 2:24:49
  I'd also like to note that Ali, you know, he has one unique quality.
• 2:24:55
  People either really love him or really hate him.
• 2:24:59
  You can't just be neutral about him.
• 2:25:01
  You know, like, yeah, I know Ali is alright.
• 2:25:04
  No one will say about him, well, you know, I know him.
• 2:25:07
  He's a good guy.
• 2:25:09
  Lex Fridman: You'll have strong feelings for him.
• 2:25:11
  Either you hate him or you really love him.
• 2:25:14
  And I am in that category of people who really, how do I put it, who are
• 2:25:22
  very fond of him.
• 2:25:23
  Yeah.
• 2:25:24
  And I have a good relationship with him.
• 2:25:26
  I know his family.
• 2:25:28
  I know his children.
• 2:25:29
  His kids grew up before my eyes.
• 2:25:31
  When I first met him, he only had two or three children.
• 2:25:34
  Now he has more.
• 2:25:38
  This is the kind of person he is.
• 2:25:41
  You need to get to know him better to really appreciate him.
• 2:25:45
  And he will stand by you until the very end.
• 2:25:49
  And yeah, of course, there are people who have mixed feelings about him.
• 2:25:55
  But that's my point.
• 2:25:57
  It's hard to feel indifferent about Ali.
• 2:25:59
  Yeah.
• 2:26:00
  I know Ali.
• 2:26:01
  He's a very good guy.
• 2:26:02
  I know it's different with him.
• 2:26:04
  People will either tell you, I know Ali and I absolutely love him or I know Ali and I can't stand him.
• 2:26:10
  So it's fair to say that most people who really know him and work with him tend to stay with him for
• 2:26:18
  life and respect him.
• 2:26:20
  That's important.
• 2:26:21
  And his judo isn't bad either.
• 2:26:24
  He showed me.
• 2:26:25
  It was.
• 2:26:26
  It was.
• 2:26:27
  Right.
• 2:26:27
  You were just wrestling yesterday.
• 2:26:29
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: All right.
• 2:26:29
  Let's talk about football now.
• 2:26:31
  I want to ask you something and I need to be careful here because after yesterday, I realized just how much you know about the game.
• 2:26:39
  I can't even pretend I know what I'm talking about anymore.
• 2:26:42
  I need to tread carefully.
• 2:26:45
  Yes.
• 2:26:45
  If we're going to go there.
• 2:26:46
  Yeah.
• 2:26:47
  Don't make any mistakes.
• 2:26:50
  Lex Fridman: Khabib recalls the Champions League final in 1998, highlighting his father's influence in nurturing his love for football.
• 2:26:58
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I hope you did your research.
• 2:27:00
  I'm shaking now.
• 2:27:01
  You're prepared.
• 2:27:02
  Wait.
• 2:27:03
  We could talk about a lot of interesting teams.
• 2:27:06
  You talked about the moment when you fell in love with football.
• 2:27:09
  That was the Champions League final in the 1998.
• 2:27:14
  Lex Fridman: It was Real Madrid against Juventus.
• 2:27:17
  It was the moment when you realized that Real Madrid was your team.
• 2:27:22
  The club you've continued to love and support ever since.
• 2:27:25
  Yeah.
• 2:27:26
  Tell me about that very first moment when you watched the game with your father.
• 2:27:32
  What do you remember?
• 2:27:33
  Khabib reflects on memorable football moments.
• 2:27:37
  Billions, yes.
• 2:27:38
  What do you remember most about that game and what did you fall in love with?
• 2:27:40
  Well, first of all, my father was a huge football fan.
• 2:27:44
  He was a good player himself.
• 2:27:46
  When we lived in the village, they played almost every day.
• 2:27:49
  Football has always been very popular.
• 2:27:51
  Where I'm from, the kids, the young people, everyone plays.
• 2:27:54
  In fact, we still have this tradition in the village.
• 2:27:57
  as long as I can remember, it was a tradition for each street to
• 2:28:05
  put together its own team for a tournament with group stages, then the quarterfinals, semifinals, and the final.
• 2:28:12
  So it became a real tradition and everyone would, everyone there follows football, the kids, the young people.
• 2:28:20
  And my father played too.
• 2:28:23
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Whenever there was a big match on, I'd always sit with him in front of the television and watch.
• 2:28:31
  The first football memory I have that's really clear and conscious goes back to 1996.
• 2:28:38
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares his memories of the 1998 World Cup, emphasizing the excitement of watching football.
• 2:28:45
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: England lost on penalties at home and Germany advanced to the final.
• 2:28:50
  A few days later, we watched the final as well.
• 2:28:55
  We were at someone's place.
• 2:28:56
  We didn't have a TV at the time or maybe our channel wasn't showing the match.
• 2:29:00
  I don't remember.
• 2:29:01
  We watched it at somebody's place.
• 2:29:03
  It was Germany against the Czech Republic.
• 2:29:05
  Germany won that final.
• 2:29:07
  I remember Oliver Bierhoff coming off the bench and scoring.
• 2:29:11
  That whole period is still very vivid in my memory.
• 2:29:16
  Lex Fridman: They reflects on the players they admired, emphasizing the influence of football legends on their passion for the game.
• 2:29:23
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Again, I don't remember where we watched it, but it was the final 1 -0.
• 2:29:28
  Real Madrid won.
• 2:29:29
  I can still remember the players who were on the pitch.
• 2:29:42
  There was a period when actually in the settlement where I lived
• 2:29:50
  in the village, I was pretty much the only kid who had a football.
• 2:29:55
  So the older guys would come over.
• 2:29:58
  I was maybe 9 or 10, and these were boys who were 15 or 16.
• 2:30:02
  They'd say, Habib, bring the ball out.
• 2:30:05
  But I'd give them a condition for bringing the ball out.
• 2:30:07
  When you're 10 years old, nobody is putting you on a team with 15 -year -olds, you know.
• 2:30:11
  Lex Fridman: They'd go, all right, bring it out, and I'd get to play.
• 2:30:14
  And the kids my own age didn't make the team.
• 2:30:16
  You know how it is when there are a lot of kids around.
• 2:30:20
  Of course, the older boys would take charge.
• 2:30:23
  They decide who's playing.
• 2:30:25
  Normally, when you're 10 and they're 15, there was no chance you'd get picked.
• 2:30:28
  But I was very lucky I had the ball, so I always made the team and got to play with them.
• 2:30:33
  That's where it all started, really, you know.
• 2:30:35
  That love for football started in my childhood.
• 2:30:39
  My father and I always watched the big matches together.
• 2:30:42
  Discussing the impact of family on sports interests.
• 2:30:45
  I was just running.
• 2:30:47
  I ran to my grandfather's house and said, Grandpa, put on Channel 1.
• 2:30:52
  I think it was Channel 1 that was showing the opening.
• 2:30:54
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Ronaldo was playing in that tournament.
• 2:30:57
  So I sat there watching and my grandfather looked at me.
• 2:31:00
  I was 10.
• 2:31:02
  He looked at me and said, Why are you interested?
• 2:31:05
  I said, I want to watch.
• 2:31:07
  I sat and watched.
• 2:31:08
  The Brazilians won both matches back then, I think.
• 2:31:11
  They won against Morocco and lost to the Norwegians.
• 2:31:14
  The opening match was Brazil against Scotland.
• 2:31:16
  2 -1, right?
• 2:31:17
  Yeah, 2 -1.
• 2:31:18
  So basically, from childhood, I already had that love for football.
• 2:31:23
  And then it just grew.
• 2:31:24
  I started watching the Champions League, the Euros, the World Cup, and later the domestic leagues.
• 2:31:29
  Lex Fridman: Mostly the Premier League.
• 2:31:33
  So that's where this passion comes from.
• 2:31:36
  And what about national teams?
• 2:31:38
  Brazil was your team growing up, right?
• 2:31:41
  That legendary Brazil team?
• 2:31:43
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I like Brazil, yes.
• 2:31:44
  I also like the Netherlands.
• 2:31:46
  Those national teams, Brazil and the Netherlands, those were the ones that really appealed to me.
• 2:31:51
  And what about clubs?
• 2:31:53
  What were the main teams that you supported?
• 2:31:55
  It varied.
• 2:31:56
  I never had one national team that I'd say was my favorite team.
• 2:31:59
  Ah, you didn't?
• 2:32:01
  I didn't.
• 2:32:01
  Today, I don't feel the same way about the Netherlands.
• 2:32:04
  But back
• 2:32:04
  Lex Fridman: then, I really liked the Dutch team.
• 2:32:06
  A lot.
• 2:32:08
  One Der Saar, Reitziger, one Bronkhorst, Overmars, Davids, Zeehdov, one Nistelrooy, McKay.
• 2:32:16
  That old lineup.
• 2:32:18
  Kluivert.
• 2:32:19
  Now it's not the same.
• 2:32:21
  That era is gone.
• 2:32:22
  They just don't have players like that anymore.
• 2:32:24
  In that sense, there's been a bit of a drop off for the national team.
• 2:32:27
  The same with Brazil.
• 2:32:28
  Back then, they were incredibly strong.
• 2:32:31
  But today, it's not at that same level anymore.
• 2:32:33
  But when it comes to the club, the club I follow, that's Real Madrid.
• 2:32:36
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: That's the one.
• 2:32:37
  But if we're talking about leagues overall, then because of the competition and the way the league is played, I'd say the English Premier League.
• 2:32:46
  And in the Premier League, do you follow Man U, City?
• 2:32:49
  Lex Fridman: Not in a way where I have one team.
• 2:32:52
  No.
• 2:32:52
  I like them.
• 2:32:53
  They're both top clubs.
• 2:32:54
  They're big clubs.
• 2:32:55
  I watch them.
• 2:32:56
  I follow them.
• 2:32:57
  It just depends.
• 2:32:58
  But it's not like I have one favorite.
• 2:32:59
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I do like City.
• 2:33:01
  Manchester City.
• 2:33:02
  In recent years, they've been winning almost everything.
• 2:33:04
  They've dominated for the last 10 years.
• 2:33:07
  But if we look more closely at Manchester City, there's been a bit of a dip over the last two seasons.
• 2:33:15
  Lex Fridman: And then you also have the rise of Arsenal in the last couple of seasons.
• 2:33:19
  A very well -structured team under Arteta.
• 2:33:21
  They're really on the rise this season.
• 2:33:23
  They're leading the league, doing well in the Champions League.
• 2:33:26
  They're leading domestically as well.
• 2:33:27
  So I don't know how far they'll go.
• 2:33:30
  But they're aiming for the treble this season.
• 2:33:33
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I want to ask, because we lived through such a moment in sports history that we might never see anything like it again.
• 2:33:41
  I'm talking about this rivalry between Messi and Cristiano Ronaldo.
• 2:33:48
  Of course, since you love Real Madrid, you know, you naturally love Cristiano Ronaldo.
• 2:33:54
  But what can you say about it?
• 2:33:56
  A lot of people call him the absolute best.
• 2:33:58
  And for many, Messi is number one.
• 2:34:01
  There's also a very good book about their rivalry.
• 2:34:03
  I recommend it.
• 2:34:05
  It basically tells the story of modern football through their rivalry.
• 2:34:10
  Messi versus Ronaldo won rivalry almost 20 -year era.
• 2:34:15
  Yeah.
• 2:34:16
  Two goats in an era that remade the world's game.
• 2:34:19
  So it's been 20 years.
• 2:34:21
  So what can you say?
• 2:34:22
  Why do you consider Cristiano Ronaldo a great footballer?
• 2:34:25
  What do you like about him?
• 2:34:27
  Let's start with Ronaldo.
• 2:34:28
  Lex Fridman: Ronaldo.
• 2:34:29
  Well, he's a natural born athlete.
• 2:34:33
  He is, um, God gave him that athleticism and he managed to maintain
• 2:34:38
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: There are many who have lost it.
• 2:34:40
  There are many players who have talent, physical ability, but they are lazy.
• 2:34:46
  But he has it all.
• 2:34:48
  Lex Fridman: Athleticism, talent, hard work, everything.
• 2:34:52
  And then there's this.
• 2:34:53
  He played in Manchester.
• 2:34:55
  He moved.
• 2:34:57
  He shone in Portugal at Sporting, then moved to Manchester.
• 2:35:01
  And it's not easy to make your mark at Manchester.
• 2:35:04
  From 2003 to 2008, he became a star there.
• 2:35:07
  And what he achieved in 2008, just look at how many individual trophies he won and how much he won with his team.
• 2:35:14
  You can even look it up.
• 2:35:16
  Just search what Cristiano Ronaldo achieved in 2008.
• 2:35:20
  It's simply unbelievable.
• 2:35:23
  And then he moved from Manchester.
• 2:35:25
  He transferred to an even more difficult club, Real Madrid.
• 2:35:29
  Nine years at Real Madrid.
• 2:35:31
  Five years at Manchester United.
• 2:35:33
  Then nine years at Real Madrid.
• 2:35:35
  That's about 15 years.
• 2:35:37
  You're under constant pressure at the two biggest clubs in the history of football.
• 2:35:43
  And at both clubs.
• 2:35:44
  At both clubs.
• 2:35:45
  He became the best.
• 2:35:46
  That's very difficult.
• 2:35:48
  Yeah, look here.
• 2:35:49
  Three Premier League titles came during his time at Manchester United.
• 2:35:52
  Look at 2008 specifically, what he accomplished then.
• 2:35:55
  He won the Premier League.
• 2:35:57
  He won the UEFA Champions League.
• 2:35:59
  Individually, he won the Golden Boot top score in the Champions League, the Premier League, every major trophy.
• 2:36:06
  Right.
• 2:36:07
  But the point is that at Manchester, he spent five years performing at the highest level under enormous pressure.
• 2:36:14
  Then he spent nine years at Real Madrid.
• 2:36:16
  Yeah.
• 2:36:17
  After that, he moved to Juventus, but only for a short time.
• 2:36:20
  And this is the part people tend to forget.
• 2:36:22
  He spent three seasons at Juventus and he also won both the Italian Championship and the Super Cup there and scored 100 goals.
• 2:36:31
  And just the fact that for 20 years, let's say 22 or 23 years, he's been at the highest level.
• 2:36:39
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Look at how many goals he's scored.
• 2:36:41
  And now he's closing in on 1 ,000.
• 2:36:43
  Will Messi ever reach that number is the big question.
• 2:36:45
  Next season, he scores 40 goals in a season and he's less than 40 goals away from the 1 ,000 goal mark.
• 2:36:53
  That's how unique he is in that regard.
• 2:36:55
  But just because I'm a Real Madrid fan doesn't mean I downplay what Messi has achieved.
• 2:37:01
  It's impossible to downplay what Messi has done.
• 2:37:04
  You have to give him the credit he deserves.
• 2:37:06
  But I wouldn't want to put one of them above the other.
• 2:37:08
  If I'm being honest, both of them watching each other, competing with each other, they stayed there.
• 2:37:16
  Lex Fridman: Would Messi be Messi without Ronaldo?
• 2:37:18
  Would Ronaldo be Ronaldo without Messi?
• 2:37:19
  Those are big questions.
• 2:37:21
  I'm convinced they watched each other closely.
• 2:37:23
  They always have and they still do now.
• 2:37:25
  For almost 20 years, they've been watching each other, pushing each other and constantly improving.
• 2:37:31
  They were already the best, but that drove them even further.
• 2:37:34
  By competing against one another, they pulled so far ahead of the rest.
• 2:37:39
  Yes.
• 2:37:39
  Whether you're talking about achievements, trophies, and all that.
• 2:37:43
  And in that sense, their rivalry truly elevated the entire sport.
• 2:37:47
  More people started following football because of them, watching the games.
• 2:37:52
  So I believe both of them deserve tremendous respect.
• 2:37:55
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Yeah, I'd say I completely agree with you that if Messi hadn't had Ronaldo and Ronaldo
• 2:38:03
  hadn't had Messi.
• 2:38:04
  Yeah.
• 2:38:05
  Would they have gone that far?
• 2:38:05
  I don't think so.
• 2:38:06
  That's an open question.
• 2:38:07
  I don't think so.
• 2:38:08
  Yes.
• 2:38:09
  But for me, there is nobody like Messi.
• 2:38:11
  His pure love for the game for its own sake.
• 2:38:13
  You're a Barca guy?
• 2:38:14
  Yes.
• 2:38:14
  Oh, really?
• 2:38:15
  Yeah, I can tell from the way you're talking about it.
• 2:38:17
  The way you got me.
• 2:38:20
  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 2:38:20
  Nothing against it, but yes, sure.
• 2:38:23
  Well, I mean, Iniesta, Xavi, Busquets, Iniesta, Puyol, that was a legendary team.
• 2:38:30
  Yes.
• 2:38:31
  No, but look, you can compare them like this.
• 2:38:35
  Iniesta, Xavi, Busquets, Messi, Ronaldinho, Piquet.
• 2:38:41
  Ronaldinho, yes.
• 2:38:42
  Ronaldinho.
• 2:38:43
  He was a bit earlier.
• 2:38:44
  That Barcelona team, from roughly 2008 to 2012, that four -year period, only one team in history can compare with them.
• 2:38:52
  Real Madrid from 2014 to 2018.
• 2:38:56
  They won in 2014, in 2016, 2017, and 2018.
• 2:39:01
  The only interruption was Barcelona's team with Neymar.
• 2:39:04
  With Neymar, yes.
• 2:39:05
  With Suarez and Messi, that was 2015.
• 2:39:07
  Well, let's leave that aside.
• 2:39:09
  But, you know, with Modric, Kroos, Casemiro, Ronaldo, Benzema, Marcelo, Carvajal,
• 2:39:17
  Casillas, and this team, compared to Victor Valdez, Piquet, Puyol, Dani Alves,
• 2:39:25
  Jordi Alba, Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta, Villa, and Messi, for me, those are the two greatest teams.
• 2:39:32
  Different generations, different squads.
• 2:39:35
  For me, they truly represent a, represent true dream teams at football, at
• 2:39:43
  club level.
• 2:39:43
  That's the comparison.
• 2:39:45
  But if we look at the national team level, you could pick France in
• 2:39:53
  1998.
• 2:39:54
  Yes.
• 2:39:55
  That 1998 France team is very close to a perfect team.
• 2:39:59
  And also, 2002 Brazil.
• 2:40:03
  Lex Fridman: Khabib reflects on the influence of football legends.
• 2:40:06
  You want to watch Edgar Davids running around the field in those glasses, his hair bouncing behind him, right?
• 2:40:12
  You still wanted to watch the way Barthez played in goal.
• 2:40:16
  No matter how many bizarre goals he conceded, you still wanted to watch him play.
• 2:40:21
  Or Oliver Khan, the way he stood in goal and directed the whole team.
• 2:40:25
  The way he would rush out to the ball, the way strikers were afraid of him.
• 2:40:30
  I mean, so many strikers have admitted that they were afraid if they found themselves one -on -one with Oliver Khan in the penalty
• 2:40:38
  area.
• 2:40:39
  You always wanted to watch Roberto Carlos take a free kick or storm down the left flank.
• 2:40:45
  You always wanted to see Cafu or Michel Salgado make an overlapping run.
• 2:40:50
  The way Vieira stood there as the defensive midfielder or somebody like Maldini or like Rio Ferdinand or somebody like
• 2:40:57
  that, you wanted to watch Casillas in goal.
• 2:41:00
  So, you know, for me and maybe for our generation, those players had something special.
• 2:41:05
  Can you try to explain what charisma is?
• 2:41:08
  Like you said, there are good players and then there is Zidane.
• 2:41:11
  It's very difficult to explain.
• 2:41:13
  You either have it or you don't.
• 2:41:15
  Exploring the role of mentors in sports.
• 2:41:18
  In 2002, they were extremely strong.
• 2:41:20
  Yes, you had Ronaldo.
• 2:41:22
  You had Ronaldo, Rivaldo, Ronaldinho, Roberto, Carlos, Cafu.
• 2:41:27
  Right.
• 2:41:28
  You had Emerson, you had Cleberson, I think, Ruki, Junior, Lucio, Ed Milson,
• 2:41:35
  and beyond those superstar names, there were also very strong players who kind of stayed in the shadow of those stars.
• 2:41:42
  Stayed in their shadow.
• 2:41:44
  So, Brazil, 2002, France, 1998, and then there was then later Spain
• 2:41:52
  from Euro 2008, the 2010 World Cup, and Euro 2012.
• 2:41:56
  at period two, Spain, the Spanish national team was close to perfect.
• 2:42:01
  I wanted to go back to France.
• 2:42:03
  You mentioned Zidane.
• 2:42:05
  I really, really respect and admire him.
• 2:42:08
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: There was this moment psychologically very interesting, almost Shakespearean moment in his career when it ended with
• 2:42:16
  that, how do you even call it, a headbutt, a headbutt to the chest.
• 2:42:21
  What's interesting is, I don't know, looking at your fight with Connor, when emotion builds up,
• 2:42:29
  for most of it, you're focused on the game, but in the end, you let that emotion out.
• 2:42:34
  What do you think about that headbutt?
• 2:42:36
  I wouldn't want to judge him.
• 2:42:39
  Wouldn't want to be some kind of judge of what he did.
• 2:42:43
  No.
• 2:42:44
  Well, he did what he did.
• 2:42:45
  We don't know what was really going on there.
• 2:42:49
  But as a player, of course, he was unique.
• 2:42:51
  Lex Fridman: He won the Euros, the World Cup, reached finals, won the Champions League, the Spanish and the Italian Championships, and Cups too.
• 2:43:00
  It's just unique.
• 2:43:01
  And the way he played, I just always remembered him for the way sweat was just pouring off him, the way he ran, how he gave everything in every single
• 2:43:09
  match.
• 2:43:10
  He had incredible stamina, incredible endurance.
• 2:43:13
  I think a lot of people listening to this podcast may not have watched Zidane playing live.
• 2:43:19
  When I say live, I mean watching him play in real time.
• 2:43:26
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: It's like, you know, it's like something one of Zidane's coaches once said.
• 2:43:32
  If you don't know what to do with the ball, give it to Zidane.
• 2:43:37
  He'll figure it out.
• 2:43:38
  So, you see, that's the thing.
• 2:43:41
  It's a quality.
• 2:43:43
  Not every player has.
• 2:43:46
  You're taking the ball.
• 2:43:48
  You're taking responsibility.
• 2:43:50
  You're taking the initiative.
• 2:43:52
  You are not afraid to fail.
• 2:43:58
  Lex Fridman: The significance of football in their life, emphasizing the emotional connections formed through the sport.
• 2:44:05
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Right.
• 2:44:05
  I personally didn't see his games live.
• 2:44:07
  I was younger then.
• 2:44:09
  But I did watch many of his matches later on.
• 2:44:12
  I remember the goals he scored in World Cup finals in 1998 and 2006, especially the headers, and even that penalty,
• 2:44:21
  the Champions League final, European Championships, the way he played, the way he handled the ball, the way the ball
• 2:44:28
  was glued to his feet, his movements, and then his charisma.
• 2:44:35
  Lex Fridman: It's rare to find all of that in one player.
• 2:44:37
  You don't see that combination often.
• 2:44:39
  There are many very good players, but sometimes they're just not that interesting to watch.
• 2:44:46
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You know what I mean?
• 2:44:48
  I don't want to give specific examples because someone might take it the wrong way, so I won't name anyone.
• 2:44:54
  but there are players
• 2:44:55
  Lex Fridman: who are phenomenal in terms of their physical attributes, fast, explosive,
• 2:45:03
  effective, but they don't have charisma, that energy that makes people want to watch them, and I don't think that's their fault.
• 2:45:12
  But with Zidane, everything came together.
• 2:45:14
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You always wanted to watch him play.
• 2:45:16
  You always want to watch Ronaldo play.
• 2:45:18
  You always want to watch Beckham play.
• 2:45:24
  Lex Fridman: This highlights the impact of football legends on his journey.
• 2:45:28
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Personality, right?
• 2:45:29
  Yes, but there are so many different forms of it.
• 2:45:31
  Zidane, in a way, almost moved slowly.
• 2:45:34
  In a way, but he'd carried the ball from midfield into attack incredibly quickly.
• 2:45:40
  So, it's very hard to put into words, hard to explain
• 2:45:45
  Lex Fridman: it.
• 2:45:45
  And both Ronaldo's had that.
• 2:45:47
  I mean, the Brazilian Ronaldo too.
• 2:45:49
  The way he played in those World Cups.
• 2:45:51
  Yes, it was just phenomenal.
• 2:45:53
  98, 2002.
• 2:45:55
  Even in 2006, when he was already past his peak, he was so fascinating to watch.
• 2:45:59
  Seriously, how many people turned on their TVs just to watch Ronaldo?
• 2:46:03
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: People knew that was it.
• 2:46:04
  That in 2010, he wouldn't be playing.
• 2:46:06
  And even in 2006, he wasn't really in his prime.
• 2:46:10
  But still, so many people turned on the TV just to watch him play.
• 2:46:16
  And Zidane, 2006 was really, you know, the peak of that whole generation of legends that had been building since 98,
• 2:46:23
  2000, 2002, and 4.
• 2:46:26
  All the cream of the crop came in.
• 2:46:28
  Most of them weren't at their physical peak anymore, but the names were still there.
• 2:46:33
  Honestly, I think that for football fans, I'd recommend just looking up the teams and the lineups from the
• 2:46:41
  2006 World Cup.
• 2:46:43
  Look at the rosters.
• 2:46:45
  Every single team had stars you wanted to watch.
• 2:46:47
  Lex Fridman: Speaking of teams, what style of football do you like?
• 2:46:51
  You prefer short passing, long balls, individual plays, you know, like Maradona carrying the ball, or, of course, Cristiano
• 2:46:59
  Ronaldo taking the ball and scoring himself?
• 2:47:02
  Mostly, those who take the initiative.
• 2:47:04
  You like that?
• 2:47:05
  Yeah, definitely.
• 2:47:06
  I like players who are willing to take the initiative.
• 2:47:09
  I was recently talking to Zlatan about this and he said, it drives me crazy
• 2:47:29
  They take the initiative, take control of the game, drive the team forward, make mistakes, but they keep trying.
• 2:47:35
  And then, there are others who hide, he says.
• 2:47:38
  They get the ball and immediately pass it to someone else.
• 2:47:40
  Just don't give it to me.
• 2:47:41
  Not me.
• 2:47:42
  Not me.
• 2:47:43
  They just want to get rid of the ball.
• 2:47:54
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Think about that.
• 2:47:55
  You take the first penalty.
• 2:47:56
  You miss it.
• 2:47:58
  Then another penalty comes along and you still step up to take it.
• 2:48:01
  Because if you miss two penalties in the same game, you're under a lot of pressure, right?
• 2:48:05
  But that's the point.
• 2:48:06
  You're not afraid to fail.
• 2:48:07
  As a leader, you take the initiative and you're willing to take risks.
• 2:48:11
  That's honestly the beauty of it, the beauty of sports in general.
• 2:48:16
  Lex Fridman: Terraces were built to protect against invasions, ensuring survival in a harsh environment. This reflects the resilience of Dagestani culture.
• 2:48:26
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: If there's no risk, then you can't put yourself in the category of
• 2:48:34
  athletes people will talk about as some of the best ever.
• 2:48:38
  especially when it's a high -level game like the World Cup.
• 2:48:43
  Yes, the more risk, the sweeter the victory.
• 2:48:45
  There must be risk.
• 2:48:46
  That's why they often speak of Maradona as a great player.
• 2:48:50
  There are many great players.
• 2:48:52
  He's great.
• 2:48:53
  One of them, yeah, for many reasons.
• 2:48:55
  But one reason is that he kind of carried the team on his shoulders.
• 2:48:59
  He took the initiative and carried them.
• 2:49:01
  That's when he led Napoli, you know?
• 2:49:04
  when he led Napoli to the league title.
• 2:49:06
  Who knew Napoli then?
• 2:49:09
  Lex Fridman: Maradona came from Barcelona to Napoli and made them champions.
• 2:49:12
  And the whole stadium was named after him.
• 2:49:15
  Many guys played in Napoli, but there was never anyone like Maradona.
• 2:49:19
  And recently
• 2:49:20
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I saw somewhere, or I think someone pointed out, the pressure on the
• 2:49:28
  guys who are transferring to Napoli.
• 2:49:30
  Whoever you are, you will always be in Maradona's shadow.
• 2:49:34
  And you stay in the shadow because fans will never give you the credit you might deserve because they will always compare you
• 2:49:42
  to him.
• 2:49:42
  Are you Maradona or not?
• 2:49:44
  And if you're not Maradona, you will never get full recognition.
• 2:49:48
  I want to say that one of the things that makes Messi great, I think, is that he really had to live in such a shadow of Maradona, especially with
• 2:49:56
  the World Cup.
• 2:49:57
  Yes.
• 2:49:58
  It's not easy.
• 2:49:59
  And he came out of it.
• 2:50:00
  Hard to emerge from that shadow.
• 2:50:01
  Lex Fridman: Yes.
• 2:50:01
  And he won the World Cup.
• 2:50:03
  Yeah.
• 2:50:04
  In that sense, you have to give Messi his due.
• 2:50:09
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I'm addressing the Real Madrid fans now.
• 2:50:13
  Ours, yours, both sides.
• 2:50:14
  You're explaining it to them.
• 2:50:15
  Yeah, yeah.
• 2:50:15
  I got you.
• 2:50:16
  Most of them, I think, even if they don't like Barcelona, they still recognize Messi's greatness.
• 2:50:23
  I know that you met Zlatan, you talked to him.
• 2:50:26
  I think he's one of the most self -confident people in football, in the world in general.
• 2:50:34
  What do you think about this confidence?
• 2:50:36
  Of course, he's joking around a little bit, but I think he really believes in himself.
• 2:50:41
  Well, yeah, he does, he does.
• 2:50:43
  I've known Zlatan for years now.
• 2:50:45
  We get along well, and I know his kids, and I like his personality.
• 2:50:50
  I like his confidence.
• 2:50:51
  I mean, he's a unique player.
• 2:50:53
  Lex Fridman: There are not many Zlatans in football.
• 2:50:56
  You know, wherever he played, he always scored.
• 2:50:58
  He's a goal scorer, he is that kind of center forward, and he always carried the team.
• 2:51:03
  He was a leader wherever he transferred.
• 2:51:05
  It doesn't matter.
• 2:51:07
  Milan, Inter, Juventus, when he moved to LA Galaxy or Paris Saint -Germain.
• 2:51:13
  He was a leader everywhere
• 2:51:14
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: he went, with the national team, with his clubs.
• 2:51:17
  He was always the guy driving the team forward, taking the initiative.
• 2:51:21
  And honestly, he cemented his place as one of the greatest players to ever play the game.
• 2:51:29
  And yeah, maybe he was, when it comes to trophies, not individual achievements, but team honors,
• 2:51:37
  Sweden wasn't such a, wasn't exactly the greatest team.
• 2:51:41
  And some of the clubs he played for didn't always win the biggest trophies, but
• 2:51:47
  as an athlete, as an individual, as a person, he is very,
• 2:51:56
  a very strong athlete.
• 2:51:58
  We talked a lot about Dagestan, talked a lot about America.
• 2:52:02
  You're in Dubai a lot these days.
• 2:52:03
  Do you like it there?
• 2:52:05
  Also, you have spoken very highly about Sheikh Hamdan.
• 2:52:11
  What do you like about Dubai?
• 2:52:12
  What do you like about this region?
• 2:52:14
  And what do you respect about Sheikh Hamdan?
• 2:52:18
  Our team's been in Dubai for seven to eight years now.
• 2:52:21
  We train at the Nad Al -Sheba sports complex.
• 2:52:24
  The NAS sports complex, this is under Sheikh Hamdan's office.
• 2:52:28
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares his father's dream of building a sports complex in the mountains, emphasizing the physical and spiritual benefits of training there.
• 2:52:36
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: It's like his home, his place.
• 2:52:39
  We train there, we eat there, we live there.
• 2:52:44
  Sheikh Hamdan helps us with everything and takes care of us.
• 2:52:48
  Lex Fridman: Khabib shares stories of support from mentors.
• 2:52:51
  The way he treats us, what he does for us, his support is just limitless.
• 2:52:59
  He supports us in everything and it's not just one, two or three years, it's already been seven or eight years.
• 2:53:07
  And I am very, very grateful to him.
• 2:53:59
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: We are incredibly fortunate that we have support at the government level.
• 2:54:05
  In Abu Dhabi, we've been supported by Sheikh Mohammed, Sheikh Tachnun, and Sheikh Mansour.
• 2:54:11
  And in Dubai, Sheikh Hamdan has really taken us in like his own team, like younger brothers.
• 2:54:19
  In that respect, we've been incredibly fortunate and our entire team is deeply grateful for their support.
• 2:54:27
  And they've created a country that has become one of the world's central hubs.
• 2:54:32
  People from everywhere travel there.
• 2:54:34
  It's unique, right?
• 2:54:36
  The local population is only around one and a half million people.
• 2:54:39
  Actually, even less than that.
• 2:54:42
  But, you know, there's such an influx of tourists, people, business people, major events, and
• 2:54:50
  everything happening in terms of business and sports is just incredible.
• 2:54:54
  What's happening in Dubai and Abu Dhabi is, it's like nothing else.
• 2:55:00
  The only places you could really compare it to are major global cities like New York, London, Paris, Tokyo, but those
• 2:55:08
  are huge metropolitan areas with populations of well over 20 million people and they have centuries of history behind
• 2:55:16
  them.
• 2:55:17
  And here, they've built cities, an entire country really, in just a few decades and turned
• 2:55:25
  it into a kind of magnet.
• 2:55:27
  It's like a magnet that attracts everyone.
• 2:55:32
  The country's location, its logistics, the sheer number of people coming in.
• 2:55:37
  not just visiting, but wanting to move there, live there, and start businesses.
• 2:55:56
  Can you explain what role God plays in your life?
• 2:56:01
  Lex Fridman: Well, first of all, I was born, raised, and brought up in a Muslim family, in a Muslim community.
• 2:56:08
  Discussing the influence of faith on personal growth.
• 2:56:12
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Since childhood, religion's always been the most important thing for me.
• 2:56:15
  And when I say religion, the first thing I mean is Salah, Namaz.
• 2:56:20
  And my entire life in general, my daily routine, the way I lived, trained, studied, and everything else, has
• 2:56:28
  always been built around Salah.
• 2:56:31
  The rest was scheduled around
• 2:56:33
  Lex Fridman: it.
• 2:56:33
  Even today, when I was choosing time for this podcast, I knew we'd be talking for a couple of hours, so I deliberately picked a time
• 2:56:41
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: right after the midday prayer.
• 2:56:43
  I pray, come here, finish up here with you, and then go pray again.
• 2:56:49
  That's how my life's been, and still is, and that's how it will continue to be, I hope.
• 2:56:54
  I've always tried to organize my life around worship.
• 2:56:59
  Because first and foremost, my purpose in this life is to worship the one God.
• 2:57:05
  Everything that happens after that is secondary, so to speak.
• 2:57:13
  And faith in God, and learning more, and just striving to get closer to God, that continues throughout our
• 2:57:20
  entire lives.
• 2:57:23
  So, in that regard, I'm very grateful to the Almighty.
• 2:57:29
  for opening this door of understanding and reflection for me, for helping me realize
• 2:57:37
  that we are all servants of God, and that our purpose in life is to serve one God.
• 2:57:44
  God.
• 2:57:46
  And as you were explaining, that helped you in your career, in the sense that, you know, psychologically,
• 2:57:54
  by keeping you from letting success go to your head.
• 2:57:56
  That helped me with everything.
• 2:57:58
  Lex Fridman: I've always placed my only hope in the Almighty.
• 2:58:02
  Whatever situation I might face, I've always believed that only the Almighty can truly make
• 2:58:08
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: it easier for me.
• 2:58:10
  and when it comes to not letting success go to your head, not becoming proud, not becoming full of
• 2:58:18
  yourself.
• 2:58:19
  Religion and my faith in Allah have helped me with that too.
• 2:58:22
  I truly believe that only faith can help a person get through life's hardest trials.
• 2:58:28
  trials.
• 2:58:29
  And sometimes I think about people who are...
• 2:58:34
  who suffer the loss of a loved one, someone very close to them.
• 2:58:39
  For example, when I lost my father, I remember thinking to myself, if I didn't believe in the Almighty, if I didn't have faith in
• 2:58:47
  God, and understand that it was predestined, that we all come into this world and then leave it, that
• 2:58:55
  no one stays here forever, that no one belongs to anyone and we all belong to the Almighty.
• 2:59:02
  And that we will all return to Him.
• 2:59:03
  I don't know how I would have coped with it.
• 2:59:06
  I'm a very emotional person.
• 2:59:08
  I think it would have been extremely difficult for me to go through all of that without faith.
• 2:59:14
  In that sense, I feel fortunate to have this understanding.
• 2:59:18
  So faith really helped you when you lost your father?
• 2:59:23
  Lex Fridman: This was the only thing that helped.
• 2:59:25
  Nothing else worked.
• 2:59:26
  I know a couple of people who have lost someone very close to them and
• 2:59:34
  they struggle to accept it.
• 2:59:37
  They would ask, why, why, why?
• 2:59:40
  So many questions.
• 2:59:42
  I told them, to answer that question, you need to go deeper into religion and try to understand.
• 2:59:48
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Why were you even born in the first place?
• 2:59:51
  And why do these thoughts even come into your head?
• 2:59:54
  And what if you didn't have any thoughts at all?
• 2:59:56
  What if you couldn't think, couldn't understand anything?
• 2:59:59
  These thoughts, this awareness, your mind, your abilities, none of that was there before.
• 3:00:05
  Then it appeared.
• 3:00:07
  Why?
• 3:00:08
  That's the question.
• 3:00:09
  None of us existed.
• 3:00:10
  Then we were born, we were little, we weren't aware of anything, we didn't remember anything.
• 3:00:14
  Lex Fridman: Then little by little, we grew up and became adults.
• 3:00:18
  adults.
• 3:00:19
  We became successful, became somebody.
• 3:00:22
  We became who we are.
• 3:00:23
  So, why did all of this come specifically to you?
• 3:00:26
  There are so many questions like that.
• 3:00:28
  And so, these questions are, let's say, a kind of guide through life.
• 3:00:36
  And for me, that's what religion is.
• 3:00:40
  It guides me and helps me.
• 3:00:42
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You often say, Alhamdulillah, all praise to God.
• 3:00:48
  That's very powerful.
• 3:00:49
  That sense of gratitude.
• 3:00:50
  Can you tell us, can you explain why you say it so often?
• 3:00:54
  Lex Fridman: You know the saying, the tongue speaks what the heart is full of.
• 3:01:00
  The way you speak shows what's in your heart.
• 3:01:03
  If you have something dark in your heart, your words will show it, no doubt.
• 3:01:07
  We all have some dark parts in our hearts.
• 3:01:12
  Every single person has them.
• 3:01:14
  Sometimes they come out in what we say, how we express ourselves, what we share
• 3:01:22
  with people and so on.
• 3:01:25
  Everyone has that.
• 3:01:26
  But if your heart is mostly good and pure, then that will also be reflected in your speech.
• 3:01:35
  And I just like praising the Almighty and giving all the credit for my success back to Him.
• 3:01:43
  Because everything we have is given to us by the Almighty.
• 3:01:49
  Throughout the history, there have been many people who made big mistakes after becoming successful, powerful and wealthy.
• 3:01:56
  And they started saying, no, no, this happened to me because I'm so great, because I'm so
• 3:02:06
  intelligent, because I had vision, because I've got the brains, because I'm extremely capable.
• 3:02:13
  That's
• 3:02:13
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: why all of this came my way.
• 3:02:15
  But at the same time, there were many others who worked just as hard, who weren't any less
• 3:02:22
  intelligent.
• 3:02:24
  And the Almighty just didn't give
• 3:02:26
  Lex Fridman: to them.
• 3:02:27
  He chose you and gave it to you.
• 3:02:29
  And you just have to give the credit back to Him.
• 3:02:32
  You shouldn't take the credit for yourself.
• 3:02:35
  That's what I believe.
• 3:02:39
  And it's something I've come to through studying my religion.
• 3:02:42
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: I understand that everything the Almighty has given to me is not because of who I am.
• 3:02:48
  It's simply something God has given me as a test to test me and, in the end, see which of my deeds outweigh the others,
• 3:02:55
  the good or the bad.
• 3:02:59
  Lex Fridman: Because as a believer, I believe that there will be judgment.
• 3:03:05
  And everything we have, everything we do, every action we take, we will be held accountable for
• 3:03:13
  it.
• 3:03:13
  There will be a day of judgment, there will be scales, and everything will be weighed.
• 3:03:20
  What advice would you give young people about life and their careers?
• 3:03:27
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Millions of people are watching you and deeply respect you.
• 3:03:32
  What would you say about how to live your life?
• 3:03:35
  Lex Fridman: Exploring the concept of legacy in sports.
• 3:03:38
  Well, I wouldn't want to speak just from my own perspective.
• 3:03:42
  I'd rather bring people back to the Scripture, to what the Almighty said.
• 3:03:49
  Read.
• 3:03:51
  That's the first word revealed in the Holy Quran.
• 3:03:53
  The first command is read or ikram.
• 3:03:58
  So, to everyone listening to or watching this podcast, I would want to bring them back to that.
• 3:04:05
  Read.
• 3:04:06
  Meaning
• 3:04:06
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: what?
• 3:04:07
  Educate yourself, observe, learn, improve, but don't stay in one place.
• 3:04:13
  And anything a person is truly looking for, if they genuinely want to find it, not
• 3:04:21
  just find an answer, but find the truth, they can reach it, but they can never reach it without reading.
• 3:04:29
  They need to read.
• 3:04:30
  When a person reads, what they read enters them into their body, their heart, their mind, and it
• 3:04:38
  triggers a search.
• 3:04:40
  A search for knowledge begins inside them, but if you don't read, you won't find anything.
• 3:04:44
  Lex Fridman: Just listening to someone is one thing, but reading is something different.
• 3:04:48
  important.
• 3:04:49
  So my advice would be, read and find within yourself the strength to come closer to one
• 3:04:57
  God and seek to understand why we were sent here in the first place.
• 3:05:02
  Moving from listening someone to almost same, what changed?
• 3:05:06
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Today, you and me were almost the same age.
• 3:05:10
  So let's just think about this.
• 3:05:14
  For example, my grandfather on my mother's side passed away in 2003.
• 3:05:23
  Now it's 2026.
• 3:05:26
  He's been lying in the grave for 23 years.
• 3:05:29
  Lex Fridman: Discussing the impact of historical events.
• 3:05:33
  And then there was his grandfather.
• 3:05:35
  Or let's say his great -grandfather who also died and has been in the grave for over 100 years, roughly speaking.
• 3:05:42
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: But what about people who died 2000 years ago?
• 3:05:45
  They've been in the grave for 2000 years.
• 3:05:48
  What's next?
• 3:05:50
  It's a good question, isn't it?
• 3:05:52
  They've just been in the grave all this time and that's it.
• 3:05:56
  So what was the purpose of their life?
• 3:05:59
  A person has been in the grave for 2000 years but maybe lived for 70 years.
• 3:06:04
  Lex Fridman: Roughly speaking, let's say 100.
• 3:06:06
  They live for 100 years and have been in the grave for 2000.
• 3:06:11
  So what matters more, those 100 years?
• 3:06:15
  Or these 2000 years?
• 3:06:16
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: And what happens after those 2000 years end?
• 3:06:19
  People believe different things.
• 3:06:21
  Whether there is a day of judgment or not, that's where the difference lies between a believer and a non -believer.
• 3:06:27
  Lex Fridman: After everyone is resurrected, there will be the day of judgment, there will be judgment and after that people will enter eternity.
• 3:06:35
  Eternity compared to eternity, what are 2000 years?
• 3:06:39
  They're nothing and will live for, let's say 70 years.
• 3:06:44
  And many people choose those 70 years over eternal life.
• 3:06:50
  And if a person understands that these 70 years
• 3:06:53
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: they have here, roughly speaking, 70 or 80 years, are meant to be used to prepare for
• 3:07:01
  what comes after, so that when the day of judgment arrives and after that judgment they can live forever, not in hell, but in heaven.
• 3:07:09
  If that becomes their ultimate goal, then they will strive to do good deeds because they will fear the day of judgment.
• 3:07:17
  And that's really
• 3:07:18
  Lex Fridman: what life is about, preparing yourself for the day of judgment.
• 3:07:22
  That's true.
• 3:07:23
  To truly understand life and its deeper meaning, you have to think about eternity.
• 3:07:27
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: Only then can you really understand your role.
• 3:07:30
  Role.
• 3:07:31
  Actually, it can keep a person away from evil.
• 3:07:35
  From evil and...
• 3:07:38
  And it can stop them from treating other people badly.
• 3:07:41
  Lex Fridman: It can hold a person back.
• 3:07:43
  But if you don't have that understanding, if a person lives completely convinced that there's nothing after death, what's there to stop him from doing
• 3:07:51
  evil?
• 3:07:52
  Just like that.
• 3:07:53
  What do you think?
• 3:07:54
  And on top of that, an even more dangerous combination.
• 3:07:59
  You become powerful, wealthy, and you become famous.
• 3:08:04
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: What now?
• 3:08:06
  Suddenly, every door is open to you.
• 3:08:08
  Just imagine a person like that.
• 3:08:10
  And on top of all that, he doesn't believe in the day of judgment.
• 3:08:15
  He doesn't believe he'll be held accountable for his actions.
• 3:08:18
  That's...
• 3:08:19
  You know, it's like a nuclear bomb.
• 3:08:22
  He can end up causing harm to people everywhere.
• 3:08:26
  But if you know that for everything you have here, you'll eventually have to answer.
• 3:08:31
  That there will be a day of judgment and that you'll be called to account.
• 3:08:35
  And if you fail that test, we'll burn in hell forever.
• 3:08:47
  You'll begin to understand that you're not nearly as important as the image you've created of yourself
• 3:08:55
  in your own mind.
• 3:08:57
  You start becoming more.
• 3:08:59
  As Americans say down to earth.
• 3:09:01
  Yes.
• 3:09:02
  You...
• 3:09:02
  You become more grounded.
• 3:09:04
  You're not flying.
• 3:09:05
  Lex Fridman: You once put it beautifully.
• 3:09:08
  You can allow money and fame to stay in your hand but not in your heart.
• 3:09:14
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You've still got many years ahead of you but you're already an example of someone who's become famous, made money and remained the same
• 3:09:22
  person.
• 3:09:23
  If money stays in your hands and not in your heart, that's a good thing.
• 3:09:28
  But the moment it gets into a person's heart, it corrupts them.
• 3:09:31
  Yeah.
• 3:09:32
  Once it's there, it's very difficult to pull it out of your heart.
• 3:09:35
  If you have wealth in your hands and use it properly for good causes, for the right purposes, for people in need,
• 3:09:43
  for your family, relatives, friends, people from your hometown, that's a good thing.
• 3:09:50
  But as soon as that wealth gets into your heart, it becomes very difficult to share it with others.
• 3:09:55
  And this is...
• 3:09:57
  This is a very dangerous...
• 3:09:59
  Very dangerous place for a person to end up.
• 3:10:03
  And I'm sorry, but as a believer, I believe that most people in hell will be wealthy.
• 3:10:10
  Lex Fridman: One of the reasons millions of people find you so interesting to watch is that you're constantly growing.
• 3:10:18
  First, you were a great fighter.
• 3:10:21
  Now you're becoming a leader.
• 3:10:24
  Your wisdom just keeps increasing.
• 3:10:26
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: You're evolving as a person, but still the core values remain.
• 3:10:30
  It's good to see inspiring for people.
• 3:10:33
  Money and fame haven't changed you.
• 3:10:35
  You're just growing as a human being, as you always have.
• 3:10:39
  I hope it's in the right direction.
• 3:10:41
  It's just...
• 3:10:41
  The thing is, people only see the good.
• 3:10:43
  Lex Fridman: They don't see the bad.
• 3:10:45
  True.
• 3:10:46
  And we all have the good side and the bad side.
• 3:10:49
  Everyone, sadly.
• 3:10:51
  And especially when it comes to celebrities, we only see...
• 3:10:55
  We only show the best side of ourselves.
• 3:10:59
  Even...
• 3:10:59
  Even when you post photos, you only post the good ones.
• 3:11:02
  The pictures where you look your best.
• 3:11:05
  So, I hope that...
• 3:11:09
  The way people see me, as you pointed out, is the way
• 3:11:35
  Sometimes, people even start believing in a fake version of themselves.
• 3:11:43
  For me, I try to stay on the honest path throughout my life to remain true to who I really am
• 3:11:51
  and to show my true self to people.
• 3:11:55
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: let's say, see me very differently.
• 3:11:59
  So, I'm just...
• 3:12:02
  I've tried, I continue to try to be who I am.
• 3:12:06
  That's all.
• 3:12:09
  And I hope that that my ending will be a good one too.
• 3:12:14
  Well, you know, at least that's my hope.
• 3:12:18
  You've stayed the same, but you've also grown.
• 3:12:21
  I mean, today you even managed to say something nice about Barca.
• 3:12:25
  So, see, that's progress.
• 3:12:26
  Lex Fridman: Yeah.
• 3:12:27
  Well done.
• 3:12:28
  Come on, without Barcelona, there wouldn't be Real Madrid.
• 3:12:32
  If the Spanish League didn't have either Real Madrid or Barcelona, it just wouldn't be the same.
• 3:12:37
  They've been competing against each other for how many years?
• 3:12:40
  120.
• 3:12:41
  It's hard to imagine Barcelona and Real Madrid without each other.
• 3:12:43
  And so is the Spanish League without that rivalry.
• 3:12:46
  Yes.
• 3:12:47
  It's impossible to imagine.
• 3:12:48
  So, yeah, we have to give
• 3:12:49
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: some credit, but Real Madrid is the royal club.
• 3:12:52
  Come on.
• 3:12:53
  It's the best.
• 3:12:54
  Yeah.
• 3:12:55
  You know?
• 3:12:56
  And thanks to both of them, we've been able to enjoy truly incredible football for so many years.
• 3:13:00
  For so many years, yeah.
• 3:13:03
  Habib, brother, I don't even have the words to explain how honored I am that you're here talking with me today and
• 3:13:11
  showing me so much warmth.
• 3:13:13
  Lex Fridman: There's no way to fully express what you mean to millions of your fans around the world, including me.
• 3:13:18
  Thank you so much for everything.
• 3:13:19
  Thank you for this conversation.
• 3:13:21
  Thank you.
• 3:13:21
  Thank you very much, Lex.
• 3:13:23
  Thank
• 3:13:23
  Khabib Nurmagomedov: for listening to this conversation with Habib Nurmagomedov.
• 3:13:27
  And again, thank you for everything.
• 3:13:31
  I love you all.
• 3:13:33
  Goodbye, my friends.
• 3:13:34
  See you next time.
• 3:13:35
  All right ,Я