Latest / Ghost Cult Magazine Podcast / PODCAST: Episode 715 - Inside Rivers of Nihil's Fifth Album: An Interview with Brody Uttley

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PODCAST: Episode 715 - Inside Rivers of Nihil's Fifth Album: An Interview with Brody Uttley · Ghost Cult Magazine Podcast

• 0:00
  This Record really was kind of like us cutting all of the fat
• 0:03
  off of, you know, what we were doing.
• 0:05
  That's not to say that like, there was anything wrong with
• 0:08
  the work because it's still like I'm insanely proud of that
• 0:10
  record and we all are and like we couldn't have gotten here
• 0:14
  without having written that record 100%.
• 0:16
  But on this record, we really wanted to just like kind of go
• 0:20
  for the throat. And that's not just like over.
• 0:23
  Let's not just commentary on lamp.
• 0:25
  Oh, it's brutal. Like we just you know, their
• 0:27
  songs on this record that are going for the throat but they're
• 0:29
  beautiful, you know, they're not they're not super brutal.
• 0:32
  So like we just really want to like cut to the chase of like
• 0:36
  what this band can do and do well and like really like just
• 0:40
  lean into that and I feel like we succeeded, I feel like it's
• 0:43
  you know it's 50 minutes long. It's like the shortest record
• 0:46
  that we've written since 2015. And there's like, not really a
• 0:50
  second of music on this record that like, even now like
• 0:54
  basically year after recording it, that I can look back on and
• 0:57
  be like maybe we could have cut that out.
• 1:06
  Once up everybody. It's your boy Keith.
• 1:08
  He goes. Cold man.com.
• 1:09
  I am super stoked to be joined once again for.
• 1:12
  I think the second time in my career in the third fourth
• 1:14
  interview with the band in their history with Brody of, rivers of
• 1:18
  nihil. How are you doing, sir?
• 1:20
  I'm doing good man. Thanks for having me on.
• 1:22
  Thanks for being back. I think the last time I saw you
• 1:26
  in person, I was still living in Brooklyn.
• 1:28
  And I saw you guys that same bias several times, including
• 1:32
  the infamous, the infamous. Where owls live?
• 1:36
  I'm definitely in the front with my little on sometimes, like,
• 1:40
  head, punched me. I was just trying not to get
• 1:44
  hit, but I wanted to be right up front for that show.
• 1:47
  Oh, I'm glad to say that I followed the band for their, you
• 1:51
  know, the whole Arc of the band so far and you know, listen
• 1:55
  anybody that's doing music 10, 15 years is a challenge.
• 1:59
  It's like a marriage you have to keep abandoned together.
• 2:02
  It's hard through changes, but you guys as a persevered and I'm
• 2:06
  super stoked about this self-titled, new album in kind
• 2:09
  of a new era of the band. Yeah.
• 2:11
  Yeah, definitely. It's It's good to be here,
• 2:14
  though. Yeah, of course of course man.
• 2:17
  And you know of course first and foremost self-titled record and
• 2:21
  a record that has a self-titled song.
• 2:23
  You usually have a thing about 80s bands that were like when
• 2:26
  you had a band named for a song, it was probably not a good idea.
• 2:30
  But you know, first of all like, why the self-titled record now
• 2:34
  after all these years and and of course the self-title, which is
• 2:40
  Awesome by the way. Yeah, that's great.
• 2:43
  Thank you. Thank you.
• 2:44
  Yeah, well I mean we, you know, the first four records were kind
• 2:50
  of under this conceptual Arc you know like this.
• 2:53
  They were the four seasonal albums.
• 2:56
  First album was a spring theme. Second summer, third fall and
• 3:01
  then the last record was the winter and being that we kind of
• 3:05
  finished up that seasonal Suite. You know also taking into
• 3:09
  consideration that You know, we're we're and we finished the
• 3:15
  last record that we were going to have to figure out what, you
• 3:19
  know, what the next record was going to be called, you know
• 3:22
  what, the what the the topics we're going to be discussed and
• 3:26
  all that kind of stuff. We knew it was going to have to
• 3:29
  be, you know, something different, something new because
• 3:32
  it in a lot of ways, even not taking the lineup changes and
• 3:36
  everything like that and consideration, we were entering
• 3:38
  a new era of the band because we were closing out the, the
• 3:41
  seasonal albums. So we are already knew.
• 3:44
  We were going to be looking for something new for this record.
• 3:47
  But then when we had, the the lineup change it really began to
• 3:54
  feel like totally New Era for the band like from the ground
• 3:58
  up, really we spent a lot of time thinking thinking about
• 4:02
  like what the record should be called and You know, we saw that
• 4:07
  being how strong, we believe this new material is and how it
• 4:13
  is like a new era of the band. And You know, it does feel like
• 4:18
  a powerful record to us, we really felt like putting the
• 4:23
  band's name behind it. You know, not dissimilar to the
• 4:26
  way that like, you know, Metallica put their name behind
• 4:29
  their fifth record. I mean, there's no denying that
• 4:32
  that was something that we looked at for an influence when
• 4:36
  it comes to giving the album a name, you know, we felt like
• 4:41
  this was like a real point in our career where we could be
• 4:45
  like you know, you know this is rivers of nihil.
• 4:48
  Now you know, if you know who we are, like pay attention and if
• 4:54
  you don't know who we are, you know, maybe start here because I
• 4:57
  know when I was a kid. And I would be looking through
• 5:03
  bands that I didn't know at all, when I would be looking through
• 5:07
  their albums, a lot of times if I saw like the album name that
• 5:11
  was also the band named, I would end up starting there, you know,
• 5:14
  because I figured there was probably something about that
• 5:17
  record that was, like, important to the band, whether it was, you
• 5:21
  know, their first record their debut, or whether it was, you
• 5:24
  know, a turning point in the band or something like that.
• 5:27
  I always kind of gravitated towards self-titled records, you
• 5:31
  know, as a starting point as a young fan of music.
• 5:34
  So that was another thing that we can, we considered like being
• 5:38
  that it is a new era for the band.
• 5:41
  You know, anyone who's not been along for the ride thus far, you
• 5:46
  know, giving this name the cell, this one, the self-titled
• 5:49
  moniker might be, you know, a good idea because it could give
• 5:53
  people a place to start and then you know, once they once we all
• 5:57
  on board with the new stuff and they can dig back as far as they
• 6:00
  want to really, Right on, thank you for that answer.
• 6:03
  I will say there's definitely material here.
• 6:07
  That sounds very familiar like your old friend coming back for
• 6:11
  a visit with a six-pack and then there's some absolute Bonkers
• 6:15
  new stuff that I think the band is incorporated.
• 6:18
  I know you're the one member of the band that doesn't sing, but
• 6:21
  let's start talking about vocals, right?
• 6:23
  Because obviously looked it was a big change when Jake left and
• 6:25
  Adam started to become a more prominent vocalist Andy coming
• 6:28
  in but this vocal approach on this record.
• 6:32
  Absolutely took. My breath away is probably one
• 6:35
  of my favorite things about the record.
• 6:36
  Besides the songs of cells is vocal performance.
• 6:38
  Is some, don't get scared, everybody.
• 6:41
  There's some gnarly. Brutal vocals of different
• 6:44
  shades, but the singing on this record is honestly mind blowing.
• 6:51
  I got to be real. Yeah, well thanks.
• 6:54
  You know. Having having Andy kind of come
• 6:59
  into the fold on this record, you know, something that we
• 7:02
  weren't expecting, of course, you know.
• 7:04
  But when the opportunity did present itself for him to kind
• 7:12
  of come and start working with us, we were pretty excited about
• 7:15
  it because obviously you know, he's got a super unique voice,
• 7:21
  you know, you could pick him out of a crowd like in a second and
• 7:25
  you know, we're we've been best friends with the guys
• 7:29
  specifically me and Adam. We've been best friends with the
• 7:32
  guys since like 2007. I mean, we're black crowd
• 7:35
  initiated, his other band is from Reading as well.
• 7:37
  You know, our bands came up playing shows together before
• 7:40
  our bands, even existed. We were going to a lot of the
• 7:44
  same shows together. I mean I remember Me and Adam
• 7:48
  and Andy all ended up at the same Meshuggah cynic faceless
• 7:52
  show back in like 2008, I think something like that.
• 7:56
  It was right after Meshuggah, put out of Zen right after her.
• 7:59
  Faceless put out, planetary, Duality and right after Scenic
• 8:02
  put out, tracing are. And like I remember the three of
• 8:05
  us were at that show and just like, you know, I felt like that
• 8:09
  was like a really transformative experience for the three of us
• 8:12
  and now But my point with all this is like we come from, We're
• 8:16
  cut from like the same cloth and a lot of a lot of ways.
• 8:19
  And we have a really old, you know, musical language between
• 8:23
  us. So bringing him in was really
• 8:25
  great because we just Get each other we've known each other for
• 8:29
  so long. I mean and he's obviously sang
• 8:31
  on the title track for where I was.
• 8:33
  Know my name, you know, and he's been involved with the band, you
• 8:38
  know, whether it's just, you know, coming to the shows or,
• 8:42
  you know, being around when we're riding stuff, he showed us
• 8:45
  stuff that he was working on for Black Crown.
• 8:47
  Like there was a lot of Tape trading going on behind the
• 8:51
  scenes, you know? So, um, and he has this like
• 8:55
  Pretty interesting perspective on rivers of nihil because he's
• 8:59
  been involved but not really involved for like the entire
• 9:03
  time that we've been a band. He has this cool third person
• 9:07
  perspective, on our career, really.
• 9:09
  So him coming in, its kind of giving us a fresh view on what
• 9:14
  we do, what we've done, you know, what we sound like,
• 9:17
  because I think we've been doing this for so long that sometimes
• 9:20
  you lose sight of like, what what is what does your band
• 9:23
  sound? Like, what is your sound and
• 9:25
  like, on this record, in a lot of ways?
• 9:27
  I think any helped us, kind of like ReDiscover what that was,
• 9:31
  just because he's been watching us for so long.
• 9:33
  You know, he was kind of able to come in and like identify things
• 9:36
  that like, hey, this is like Totally something that you guys
• 9:40
  would have done on this record or, you know, this is totally
• 9:42
  like a youth thing and, you know.
• 9:45
  Anyway, but so he's he's kind of just he knows the band.
• 9:49
  He knows us and I think all that history that we have together
• 9:54
  really brought something special to the table when it came time
• 9:57
  for him to add his vocals to the album.
• 10:00
  He's super good at like hearing harmonies and stuff that like we
• 10:03
  wouldn't have heard before, he's really great at.
• 10:06
  Like if I write something instrumentally, he kind of has a
• 10:10
  melody in his head for vocals. He's really great at helping me
• 10:14
  tweak like my riffs and stuff so that they like, you know, oh if
• 10:18
  it results to this like it would sound bigger, you know, during
• 10:21
  like the singing part if you change just one little thing
• 10:24
  and, you know. Yeah.
• 10:26
  So I mean, it's the vocals. The vocals are definitely like
• 10:30
  the big like level up on this record.
• 10:33
  I would say, I mean we have, you know, three dudes singing you
• 10:37
  know, like I'm the only one that's not in the band now
• 10:40
  singing. So yeah.
• 10:41
  It's cool. Like it's like kind of like it's
• 10:44
  like a massive on kind of feel in a lot of ways.
• 10:46
  You know you have that three-part Harmony kind of thing
• 10:49
  going. Like a death metal BG's or
• 10:51
  something, I guess, but yeah, it's been really great and, you
• 10:55
  know, he's been super easy to work with like Feel like this
• 10:58
  album just kind of happened, like, I think, and I said, in a
• 11:02
  positive way, a lot of Records feel like they're a real grind
• 11:05
  to write, you know, and I feel like this material just kind of
• 11:09
  like came out happened, really naturally.
• 11:11
  You know, a lot of the time, leading up to this record was
• 11:15
  really hard for all of us personally and and as a band but
• 11:20
  I think once we got through all of the, the rough stuff, you
• 11:23
  know, and things kind of calmed down and then, you know, the new
• 11:26
  lineup kind of Took shape, you know, I think it was just like
• 11:30
  we all speak the same. You know, musical language and
• 11:33
  understand each other on a pretty like in a pretty deep
• 11:37
  way. So I think that all just like
• 11:39
  really translated to How this record came to be and ultimately
• 11:44
  how good the performance is ended up being especially the
• 11:47
  vocals, you know? Like it it definitely like I
• 11:50
  said, is like, You know, I want to say it's a star of the show
• 11:53
  but it's definitely like the most noticeable difference from
• 11:56
  any of our previous records. I mean, there's just Some
• 12:00
  absolutely insane. Vocal moments on this record.
• 12:03
  Yeah, much agreed. And you help me with my segue
• 12:06
  there because, yeah, absolutely, Mastodon Vibes, but also, I
• 12:09
  think Andy sometimes reminds me of ICS Vortex when he was in
• 12:13
  dimmable here. Yeah.
• 12:15
  And then all of randomly, like, how you guys use the gang vocals
• 12:19
  and the group vocals in, and the harmony vocals in spots really
• 12:24
  reminded me of, you know, something about like, how yes
• 12:27
  you used to do when they had a Trevor Rabin, Chris Squire, and
• 12:31
  John Anderson all the same time in the 80s or like you know,
• 12:33
  classic Pink Floyd and even like just the vocal stacking.
• 12:38
  So, beautiful job, beautiful composing.
• 12:40
  Nothing feels forced is beautifully works with the song
• 12:44
  beautifully, but it's a little surprised you on every track
• 12:47
  that it's all, you know, featured, but, you know.
• 12:49
  Yeah, just wonderful. And then again, don't get, don't
• 12:51
  get nervous. Everybody, so brutal record with
• 12:54
  heavy, yes, riffs and, and great parts and a lot of gnarly
• 12:58
  vocals. Also but just Like, I had to
• 13:00
  call this out first and foremost.
• 13:01
  So, is it safe to say? It's not quite a concept record.
• 13:05
  You always think of in a way. Holy records of concept records
• 13:07
  to me, but it does feel like the music is interconnected.
• 13:10
  Yeah, I would say that this album as compared to say, like
• 13:17
  the last two records, the work and where else, know my name, I
• 13:20
  would say that, like, the hard like conceptual through line on
• 13:24
  this record is like, maybe less defined on the last two records.
• 13:29
  I feel like this record covers like, Broader subjects.
• 13:33
  But kind of, it does kind of have like a, an overall granted.
• 13:38
  I'm I don't write the lyrics or anything.
• 13:40
  So I'm kind of, like, spouting this off, from what I've talked
• 13:45
  to Adam about and stuff like that.
• 13:46
  But this record, you know, the the rivers of nihil Title.
• 13:52
  You know, for a long time we've got we've been asked like what
• 13:56
  does the band name mean and and you know we've never like really
• 13:59
  had a good answer for a long time.
• 14:02
  I was like, I would just tell people like, oh just means
• 14:05
  rivers of nothing. You know, it's like dark.
• 14:08
  You know. That was really as like far as I
• 14:11
  got with it but Biggs kind of he kind of came up with this.
• 14:16
  You know, idea for this record where, you know, each song talks
• 14:21
  about, you know, a different kind of thing, a different kind
• 14:24
  of topic. But overall, I would say this
• 14:28
  stuff could all be like put under the umbrella of this idea
• 14:31
  that, you know, the world has a lot of There's a lot of
• 14:37
  opportunity to be pulled into like the darkness.
• 14:40
  You know, whether it's you know, depression and anxiety.
• 14:43
  Paranoia, you know stuff that's going on politically stuff
• 14:47
  that's going on. Socially Wars, you know, like,
• 14:49
  money problems, like drug addiction.
• 14:52
  You know, just like, there's so much there's so many Things in
• 14:56
  the world especially now that can just really like, pull you
• 15:00
  into like these really, really dark places, it's almost easier
• 15:03
  to end up there. It feels like it's easier to end
• 15:06
  up there than to not end up there.
• 15:07
  A lot of the time and I think the rivers of Niall rivers of
• 15:11
  nihil is like really kind of like a it's like a metaphor for
• 15:14
  that place like that place of like darkness and despair that
• 15:18
  you can kind of like fall into so easily in life and be sucked
• 15:22
  away into and some people will spend their whole lives trapped
• 15:25
  in it. But ultimately you know you want
• 15:27
  to try to like reach for the light and you know, like find
• 15:31
  like the good in the world and find the good in those around
• 15:36
  you and and whatnot. So I think Like I said, you
• 15:40
  know, it's not really like a concept album per se, but does
• 15:45
  kind of have this like, you know, general idea of like
• 15:49
  finding the light in the darkness and trying not to, you
• 15:54
  know, be pulled into this. River of Nile, I guess.
• 16:00
  Nicely done. I would say all it's a, it's a
• 16:02
  vicious record. There is.
• 16:03
  I know you guys had something to prove to yourselves coming in
• 16:06
  here and I know metal blade or your management would never
• 16:09
  pressure. You guys to continue to top
• 16:12
  yourself, but it's a fierce record.
• 16:14
  Like there's some absolute Bangerz and and a lot of
• 16:18
  hostility. These lyrics are extremely
• 16:21
  again. I use the word gnarly to
• 16:23
  describe some of the vocals. Also, gnarly, they're content
• 16:26
  like it's, it's extreme and, you know, in the best way and I
• 16:31
  really did get again, not not one of The Lyricist and I do
• 16:34
  love that it's a collaborative lyrical process Just Like Old
• 16:37
  songwriting. I imagine I'm sure you guys will
• 16:39
  bring in your own things and I know big is like to drive that
• 16:42
  process in the past but like it's really feels like a
• 16:46
  complete record and it's not like you know it's it that's why
• 16:50
  I was like it's feels like a concept is a songs, do feel a
• 16:53
  little interconnected a bit in the classic sense but you had
• 16:58
  love how just it's harsh, man. It's good.
• 17:00
  It's good for the soul right now.
• 17:01
  Yeah, yeah. Good to hear me.
• 17:04
  We need that right now. We need, we need some, we can't
• 17:06
  be resting on our laurels in This Day, 2020.
• 17:09
  Everything's on fire. Like, he's, you know, some
• 17:14
  catharsis added this life and music and art is the way to go
• 17:18
  just for you personally, you know what do you do, you know to
• 17:22
  get ready for a record? Do you don't reference anything
• 17:25
  you've ever done before? Do you just you know what my ass
• 17:28
  ideas. I feel like every guitar player
• 17:30
  has like a tape somewhere like oh my wrists I haven't used yet
• 17:33
  and things like that or you just purely come up with a brand new
• 17:36
  thing every time to bring to the table.
• 17:39
  I feel like on this record I spent more time Examining our
• 17:44
  past works that I have on any other record.
• 17:47
  You know, I think on the work you know that was definitely
• 17:51
  like a covid album. It was like we wrote it like
• 17:54
  when we had just endless time and like I mean it's reflected
• 17:58
  so obviously and like what that album ended up being like it's
• 18:02
  like an hour and 10 minutes long.
• 18:03
  I mean, some of the songs are like I mean we had to make that
• 18:07
  record for ourselves. So like prove to ourselves that
• 18:09
  we could like make this big problem like almost like the
• 18:13
  Wahl SS kind of project, you know.
• 18:16
  Just you know an album that was like maybe a little bloated at
• 18:21
  times you know. Like there's just Some sections
• 18:24
  of that record that are just so self-indulgent, you know, you
• 18:29
  know, I I feel like it couldn't have been written during any
• 18:31
  other time than during covid, you know.
• 18:32
  And and I think that record was like a direct response to this
• 18:37
  success of owls. You know, we wanted to kind of
• 18:39
  like take things in a totally different direction.
• 18:42
  You know, we wanted to everyone wanted Al's 2.0 and we were like
• 18:46
  we were like, no, we're not gonna give it to you.
• 18:48
  We're gonna do something totally weird.
• 18:49
  And, you know, it freaked a lot of people out at first, but you
• 18:54
  know, most of the people came around to like really love and
• 18:56
  the work and like now, You know, I hear that record referred to,
• 18:59
  you know, buy a lot of people in the same kind of breath, as
• 19:03
  we're all else and my name, like those two albums together.
• 19:05
  But like this on this new record I would say as a post to like
• 19:10
  previous albums where I kind of tried to like usually what ends
• 19:13
  up happening is all I'll pick like a an album, you know, from
• 19:18
  an artist that I really like that.
• 19:19
  I kind of want to like use as like a guideline to like what I
• 19:23
  think, you know, our next album could go like me and Biggs will
• 19:27
  talk about stuff early on to just kind of like You know,
• 19:31
  layout bullet points of Life. What we want to, you know, what
• 19:35
  do we want to include in this? Like, do we want?
• 19:37
  We want like a recurring, melodic Motif for recurring,
• 19:40
  rhythmic Motif for, you know, do we want a continuation of a song
• 19:45
  from a previous record, you know, like a part two, all that
• 19:48
  kind of stuff. But on this new one, I found
• 19:51
  that we just kind of, at least meet for me.
• 19:54
  Personally, I just kind of was looking back at our discography,
• 19:57
  looking back at songs that we've played live over the years and
• 20:02
  wondering, like, what is it about these songs that, you
• 20:08
  know, lights people up so hard and what is it about?
• 20:12
  These songs that have kind of, like turned them into beasts
• 20:15
  over the years and like kind of examine that and really just
• 20:20
  like leaned in to on the work, really?
• 20:25
  I wrote a lot of that record on piano.
• 20:27
  I wrote a lot of that record with like orchestral plugins and
• 20:30
  then I kind of filled in the gaps with the heavy stuff, you
• 20:34
  know? And it was reflected in what you
• 20:37
  hear on that album. It's just like there's like 90
• 20:40
  tracks on every song or more, it's like insane.
• 20:43
  It's huge record. And on this one I just kind of
• 20:47
  wanted to I know it sounds, you know, like a classic thing to
• 20:53
  say, but I kind of wanted to get back to basics on this record,
• 20:55
  and I just like, I ended up writing a lot of the songs Just
• 21:00
  with guitar first, you know, like I didn't touch any of the
• 21:03
  like keys or like additional like weirdo instruments that
• 21:07
  like, you know, I leaned on so heavily.
• 21:09
  Like, on the last record, I really wanted to focus on kind
• 21:12
  of getting back to like the Riff, you know, on this record
• 21:15
  and and that's what I realized that like some of my favorite
• 21:20
  stuff that we've written over the years and some of the stuff
• 21:23
  that goes on to be our, the, our favorite stuff, from our fans,
• 21:27
  it's stuff that like I always remember starting as just, like
• 21:31
  a riff like me and a guitar in a room, you know, you know, not
• 21:35
  necessarily with like, even a computer turned on or a
• 21:38
  recording session open or anything, just like me playing
• 21:40
  guitar. So I really want to like go for
• 21:43
  that on this record, you know, just start with the Riff and I
• 21:48
  just Really kind of wanted to get back to like writing with
• 21:51
  like the band up, front, guitar, bass, drums, vocals, you know,
• 21:55
  and then kind of like add in the extra stuff at the end if it
• 21:58
  needed it and if it didn't not adding it in, you know, like I
• 22:02
  feel like we got it. I feel like we like really nail
• 22:04
  the ratio on this one. There's like, just enough Prague
• 22:08
  and adventurousness and, you know, plenty of like the classic
• 22:12
  like rivers of nihil like heavy stuff.
• 22:14
  Like I feel like it's a really great balance.
• 22:16
  And then, you know, adding all the like big vocal stuff on this
• 22:19
  record, really just kind of like, gives it a sound of its
• 22:23
  own while still kind of paying respect to everything that we've
• 22:26
  done up. To this point word, I have a
• 22:29
  sister podcast. I do with my collaborator on
• 22:33
  vinyl and metal series and rock bands and stuff and he is Nick
• 22:38
  is of the opinion that a perfect record is 42 minutes.
• 22:41
  And I'm always like, I think I need a little bit more than 42,
• 22:44
  but he's a 42 is The Sweet Spot. The king is attention.
• 22:47
  Now, I was like, I think it's close to doing now.
• 22:48
  For me. But you know, you could you
• 22:51
  could pick nits You know, stupendous answer their great
• 22:55
  stuff. I'm so pumped for people to hear
• 22:58
  this thing. I don't know if it's too soon
• 23:00
  for you to have a favorite track.
• 23:01
  I definitely have some of mine, but, you know, curious to know
• 23:05
  if you have a favorite moment on the record so far.
• 23:10
  I really I, I really like disparate church for it.
• 23:17
  I like the I really like the vocals on that song.
• 23:19
  I think they came out insane. And I really like the little
• 23:22
  like, Reprise with the saxophone at the end that we do.
• 23:27
  I think that's one of like the really cool moments only album
• 23:31
  just like musically. I really like evidence because
• 23:35
  it's like Justin asked Peter it sounds like something that we
• 23:38
  would have written on monarchy our second album but like
• 23:41
  refreshed with the new lineup and everything it's like it's
• 23:45
  like probably like my favorite like heavy song on the record
• 23:49
  and I really like the logical and because that song, it feels
• 23:54
  like something that we may have written on owls.
• 23:55
  It like kind of follows like a similar song format to like what
• 24:01
  we did on the silent life. You know it has like these just
• 24:04
  like big riffs, you know, front loaded with big riffs and then
• 24:07
  there's like this big break with like a big guitar solo, big
• 24:11
  saxophone solo and then it goes into kind of like a post like a
• 24:15
  black gaze kind of deaf Heavenly kind of section you know like in
• 24:20
  it really feels like something that we would have written on
• 24:22
  owls. So that's I would say despair
• 24:25
  Church evidence and the logical and are three of my favorites,
• 24:30
  but I think I think disparate church is like, really like a
• 24:35
  good example of like, Something truly of this era and this era
• 24:41
  alone because Annie and I wrote that song together and then
• 24:45
  Patrick our saxophone player came up with the sax part of the
• 24:49
  end like all on his own. So it was like that song was
• 24:52
  truly like collaborative on all fronts and I think it's a really
• 24:56
  great example of like what this lineup is a capable of doing
• 25:00
  together, right on the Spanish church is definitely my favorite
• 25:03
  track on the record. Shout out to Patrick.
• 25:04
  By the way, he was all over this thing.
• 25:06
  Yeah. And and you guys for bringing
• 25:08
  back to sexy sacks again. And again, and I think so many
• 25:11
  bands, I probably wouldn't admit it because, you know, it's just
• 25:14
  such a Time on our instrument for rock music and Prague music.
• 25:18
  But you know right after you guys started doing this axe
• 25:22
  ghost has the big sack Solo in their big hits song like it, you
• 25:25
  know, I think Dorothy The Rocker singer has a song with a
• 25:29
  prominent sacks and the middle like I was like, oh, it's a
• 25:32
  thing now where people like I can't remember that thing.
• 25:34
  That thing is not just Huey Lewis and the News of Chicago,
• 25:36
  this is Minute. Let's put it into some badass
• 25:39
  songs. I'm so pleased, you know.
• 25:41
  So pleased to hear it. Yeah, it's cool.
• 25:43
  It's cool to see. I saw I even saw the one of the
• 25:47
  last sleep token. Singles, even has a sacks all on
• 25:50
  it. So we're we're in the Arenas
• 25:52
  now, right? It's going big, it's going, big
• 25:57
  token fans, tough fan base, though, but good band really
• 26:01
  quick. Just just the last question or
• 26:04
  two for you, you know, we had done a thing last year, Saint
• 26:07
  Vitus clothes and I said offline, how one of my first
• 26:10
  time seeing the band was for owls, several times at us and we
• 26:14
  had done like a retrospective when they closed and I hope
• 26:16
  those guys can reopen somewhere else.
• 26:18
  Yeah, City. But we were like the top shows
• 26:20
  ever invited and that howls full album played through a show was,
• 26:24
  like, in my top 10 ever from memory of living in Brooklyn and
• 26:28
  going to bite us. That was such an insane show,
• 26:32
  just like that. End of that tour, the end of
• 26:34
  that cycle, and to close it with that, I'm sure he did all the
• 26:38
  best festivals and things like that without owls but like, Just
• 26:41
  unbelievable night. Do you have any special memory
• 26:44
  of that night? Yeah.
• 26:46
  I mean it was that that was like, that was just like a
• 26:49
  really important moment for us. I think we We sold that out like
• 26:57
  two nights in a row. Like I think the first night
• 26:59
  sold out like pretty much immediately.
• 27:02
  And then we added a second night since it was at the end of the
• 27:05
  tour. So the first night we did it
• 27:06
  with the bands that we were touring with.
• 27:08
  It was enthuse, wolf, King, and conjurer and then the second
• 27:13
  night we did it with outer heaven and Imperial triumphant,
• 27:18
  you know, just to kind of stagger, you know, the the
• 27:22
  lineup for the evenings. But yeah, that was like pretty
• 27:25
  big deal for us because we grew up.
• 27:27
  We came up as a band like playing shows advice all the
• 27:30
  time. Like I remember one of the first
• 27:32
  times we've played it was we opened the show.
• 27:34
  I think it was a battle cross show and what is what was the
• 27:40
  other band? That was on that show, singers
• 27:44
  Jill. Sorceress and Huntress.
• 27:50
  Yes, yes, yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 27:55
  Yeah. It was I think it was a coat
• 27:59
  liner but we opened that show and like there was like no one
• 28:01
  watching us you know and we just kept we played there's so many
• 28:06
  times over the years like in a lot of ways, it feels like New
• 28:08
  York kind of like brought us up more than Philly did even though
• 28:12
  we're like from kind of from Philly, sort of like we met been
• 28:16
  at the lit Lounge playing in the basement of the of that place
• 28:20
  with the binary code and yes, we have like a lot of history with
• 28:23
  New York as a band. And when we were able to come up
• 28:27
  there on the house on that Alice tour and sell it out, two nights
• 28:31
  in a row and like I mean there's a kerang video of it is on
• 28:36
  YouTube. You know, people can watch it
• 28:37
  but yeah just felt like a really important moment in the history
• 28:41
  of the band you know. Like if it felt like things were
• 28:43
  finally clicking, you know, with people like you know, the band.
• 28:47
  really just like level up in such a way on worlds, know my
• 28:52
  name and like there's a first time that we were ever doing a
• 28:54
  like I had lighting tour where we're like shows were selling
• 28:57
  how like people were like Scored the whole room is like screaming
• 29:01
  lyrics and like they never happened to us before.
• 29:03
  Like we when we first started, when we started that tour and
• 29:08
  people were like packing, these shows out, we were just like We
• 29:13
  were like, what, what's going on?
• 29:14
  Like we thought it was just gonna like, we didn't we, we had
• 29:18
  never played headlining gigs to like packed rooms like that
• 29:22
  before, you know, and yes. So it was just like such a
• 29:26
  Change for us. But when but when we did Vitus
• 29:29
  two nights in a row sold out, Like that was like a really
• 29:32
  important like time for all of us.
• 29:35
  I think because we felt like, you know, this is kind of where
• 29:38
  we started in New York and like now we're like we're heading
• 29:43
  invited us. You know where when we started
• 29:45
  playing here like no one gave a shit about us.
• 29:47
  We like probably put our drum kit in the bathroom or
• 29:50
  something, you know. And like walk through the crowd
• 29:52
  and like sold like one sold like one half of a t-shirt or
• 29:56
  something, you know, like it was And now here we are, you know,
• 30:00
  like headlight in these two nights sold out both nights.
• 30:04
  And you know the yeah, the Bible was just like very, very good.
• 30:08
  It just was like it. Definitely one thing that I will
• 30:11
  always remember the vitus shows. I wish I had like Posters of of
• 30:17
  those shows that I could like frame and put on my wall.
• 30:20
  I'm sure I could probably track them down somewhere but yeah, I
• 30:23
  was like a really important moment for the band.
• 30:26
  I think it was like really a sign that like Things are you
• 30:30
  know, it's working finally basically.
• 30:34
  So yeah, I definitely I look back and and that is definitely
• 30:38
  like a key moment in the in the band's history for me.
• 30:42
  Absolutely me too. As a fan, just straight up and
• 30:46
  just for the last question. Thank you for sharing all that.
• 30:48
  I appreciate it. Last question I always like to
• 30:51
  end with the Wild Card question and sometimes a wildcard
• 30:53
  questions write themselves if you had to run out of the house.
• 30:57
  Beside family friends and pets that I hear in the background.
• 31:00
  What guitar and behind you? Are you grabbing if you can only
• 31:02
  grab one in Mercy, only one, I mean, probably.
• 31:09
  Probably this guy, this is this is the one that I've been
• 31:13
  playing for like the last two years.
• 31:16
  And yeah, I probably grab this one just because it's been this
• 31:22
  guitar was with me through like some of the roughest times
• 31:27
  personally, you know, and roughest times just in the
• 31:32
  band's history and I wrote Most of the new record on it.
• 31:37
  So, yeah, I probably have to grab that guy right on.
• 31:41
  Shout out to the typo, negative green, lipstick pickup there.
• 31:44
  Yeah, always good stuff. Brody man.
• 31:47
  So good to see you again, Rivers Nile.
• 31:49
  Coming out, self-titled album coming out May 30th from the
• 31:52
  great Metal Blade records. It's so good to catch up with
• 31:54
  you. Thank you for spending this time
• 31:55
  with us and just best of success.
• 31:58
  Good luck out on the road. We'll see in may only, you know,
• 32:01
  keep it going, man. Keep it going.
• 32:03
  Keep listening. And you keep making more.
• 32:04
  Yeah. Thanks for having me.