Latest / GAIN Momentum / The Digital Guest Experience with Radisson Hotel Group | with Francesco Sforza
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- GAIN Momentum episode #76: The Digital Guest Experience with Radisson Hotel Group | with Francesco Sforza === Adam Mogelonsky: Welcome to the GAIN Momentum Podcast, focusing on timeless lessons from senior leaders in hospitality, travel, food service, and technology. Our co-host today is Zoe Koumbouzi, and our special guest today is Francesco Sforza. He is the Guest Experience and Product Development at Radisson Hotel Group. Francesco, how are you? Francesco Sforza: Hi, very nice to be here. All good. Better with you.. Adam Mogelonsky: Great to have you, and you're coming today from Madrid. Francesco Sforza: Indeed. Yes. Adam Mogelonsky: Awesome. And Zoe's in Barcelona. So I'm talking to two people in Spain and therefore it's, you know, we have to talk about what distinguishes Spanish and also Italian hospitality. Uh, to touch on your, your career, um, ear earlier career, uh, Francesco. So let's start off here with your current role. Guest experience and product development, what does that mean in the context of, of hotels? Mm-hmm. Francesco Sforza: Sure sounds very fancy. Yeah. So the, when we say guest experience design, you know, it's a lot of thing. It's really, it's really hard to explain. Usually in, in a nutshell, uh, I would say it's the definition, the, the crafting of every touchpoint that, um, a guest as we with our brand basically. Um, this goes from the first digital interactions on our brand web. Um, of course during their state and. During post-day engagement activities as well. Um, of course, I mean, it's a very cross-functional, uh, role. I would say we, we really collaborate with a lot of teams also internally in, in the company. But the final aim is indeed ensuring that our guest journey is as seamless as, uh, as possible and most important, aligned with our brand promise. Uh, which basically bottom line, it translate into guest expectations. Um, as you can imagine. Uh, what we always say, a, an experience, uh, defined in a, in a meeting room, uh, in my case in Madrid. Um. Almost all the time. It's perfect on the slides, you know, uh, then when, when implementing the experience, it's when the real challenge come, comes into the, into the signal. So, um, as part of this guest experience design, it's crucial also the connection with the operations team to understand what actually can be done, what cannot be done, uh, what are the system that we, we can leverage actually to, uh, to deliver this. Uh, guest experiences. So the contact with the, with details is, is essential. Um, in the end, you know, um, the, we always foc for companies always focus usually on guest experience, but we always ask to our team members to deliver great guest experiences. But if we don't give to the employees the right tools to, to deliver these great guest experiences, um, I think the, the whole overall system has kind of a, a bottleneck. Adam Mogelonsky: That's very interesting. Of course, this. Is the timeless lesson, which is you can put anything on a slideshow, but then it still comes down to the nitty gritty and the nuances of implement implementing. So how do you help to work with other departments that maybe are operations, food and beverage wellness? How do you work with other departments to ensure that that's all translated into something that guests really value and enjoy? Francesco Sforza: Yeah, I mean, first of all. Um. You know, like officially I work at Radi and uh, headquarters. Uh, but we always refer to us as corporate support office as a, rather than an headquarters because our business is really hotels. So in the office we're just like a bunch of people meant to support hotels. So it's really, I would say a bottom up approach, uh, because in the end, our hotels know, uh, the, our guests better, better than, than than anyone, I would say. Um, so. The first input is always the, the dialogue with with details. Then of course we, we are in charge of having, let's say, the more strategic vision of, of, of the experiences. Um, so usually in terms of process, we, we map these experiences. We have, let's say our desired outcomes of this, and then we, we. All the, the teams to give their inputs, their feedback, uh, and let's say to usually to re-scope beat and, and set some, some boundaries, uh, to our creativity. Um, so this is the, the process then, then of course, I mean the, the projects are very, are very broad also in their nature. You know, we, we can go from like. Pure, like design of ux, of online checking system till the selection of the showers, uh, that our guests are gonna experience in, in our hotels. You know, so according to the nature of the project, different internal stakeholders are involved every time in, in this definition. Adam Mogelonsky: So just for clarity, it's not just digital experience that you deal with, but also a lot of ff and e uh, furniture fixtures and equipment as well. Francesco Sforza: Yeah, well, it, it really depends. Then of course in, in that case there are also some procurement teams involved. But, I would say the, the real, um. Let's say Advantage, not Advant. The thing that I like about Radian is that the experience, it's seen as an overall thing, and it's not clustered in silos anymore between like digital and physical. Um, we now, it's very cool saying fi, but it's actually the, the reality, you know? Maybe it sounds like a paradox, but like from most of our guests, the physical experience is actually the one they experience from their device. And the one that we, we consider as physical experience intel is actually the more abstract ones, you know? So there, there are no defined boundaries anymore between, uh, physical and digital. Um, and that's why I think it's a hundred percent needed to, to have just one experience. Adam Mogelonsky: Right. So you, you mentioned one experience and we're talking now about Radisson Hotel Group. So let's take a step back and, you know, we have two guests here and we. You're trying to sell us on Radisson Hotel Group. What do you love about the brand and what distinguishes it? Francesco Sforza: so in, in terms of, um, company and then of course our brands as well. The, the real thing that, uh, I think it makes the difference, um, in Radisson compared to other company, um, is the behavior of our team members, both at corporate level and uh, hotel level. Um, you know, we have our, yes I can philosophy, which is not just a, a motto, let's say, uh, but really. Means that everyone is empowered to find new way to surprise our guests. You know, um, of course, like being a, a, a digital, um, a digital, physical, global company, um, we need to have a huge set of standards. Uh, but at the same time, um, everyone feels empowered actually to. Let's say slightly deviate from, from, from the standards, um, and experiment things. So this, this attitude is shared really like at all level across the company. Um, and I think our guests are actually perceiving this. Um, and it's basically just an attitude, um, which is shared by, by everyone. So we are a huge company, but in the end we are in a startup environment. So I would say we really co-create with our guests and our employee, and we always try, you know, to decline all of our VA value proposition in adapting as much as possible to, to our, our guest needs. Adam Mogelonsky: You know that whole word. Co-creating and that really is something very powerful. And I know you probably pay a lot of attention to that. And specifically for Radisson, when we're talking about co-creating, you have nine, nine subsidiary brands, I believe. So you have nine points of co-creating with nine different guest types. how do you manage that? And can you touch on maybe one or two particular sub-brands that to help show that difference? Francesco Sforza: Yep. Let's say we have a, a portfolio of, uh, now 10, 10 brands. which, uh, I would say compared to other big hospitality players, it's not even a lot because you know, you have like. Very complex brand architectures, um, across the industry. Um, this is actually a, a good point because, you know, we have. In the end, the hospitality industry, and maybe it's not super clear to, from a guest perspective, let's say as actually two final customers, the, the guest which is staying at in our hotels and also the owners of the properties. Um, so these brands are not facing only like the guests that physically is, it's staying at the hotel. And like the purpose of each brand is like, let's say, um, fulfilling the needs of both the guest and the owner. Um, we have a very strong brand team, I have to say. They define, uh, the brand and their brand personas in a very, very clear way. They also developed some, some brand pillars, um, which, and this, I think it's important, are reviewed on a, on a regular basis. So our brands are something evolving. It's, it's not something fixed, um, fixed there, uh, across the time. You know, and, and that's also why I think we, we don't have so many brands because we were actually able to evolve our, our brands during, during the time, This brand ideation is then, let's say the starting point from my team. What, what we do, you know, so our, our mission, if, if you wanna say it like that, is actually bringing this brand to life, uh, how, um, through brand standards, uh, brand guidelines and operating procedures basically. And these are basically the things that are gonna shape the, the, the guest experience. Of course it's, it's not easy in terms from, let's say Indian. It, it's a business. Okay. So, uh, let, let's be honest, uh, not gonna lie. So, we have on the one hand, the, the necessity of having like, purpose, uh, brands that comes with per, with a purpose, with, um, uh, really like emotional brands. And on the other end we have business need of scalability. How we try to merge this, it's through our brand standard approach, I would say. So basically, uh, within Radisson we have what we call, uh, brilliant basics that are, let's say the. The basics, the essential things of an hospitality experience and kind of represents the, like Radisson quality stump, you know? So no matter the brand, no matter the location, you are sure that all Radisson hotels have these brilliant basics. So these are global standards. There are cross brands, cross, cross geography. on top of this, then each brand has its own, let's say, differentiating standards. Um. And then for, I don't know, how familiar are you with, with Redon brands, but you know, we have Redon Blue, which is usually like the, um, the top choice for, for business traveler. Uh, which you, you are sure that like anywhere in the world you go to a Redon Blue, uh, you have all the services you want for last, last minute issues, I mean. Traditional guest expectations. In parallel, you have Radisson Red, which still delivers the, let's say the main Radisson, um, quality standards, but it's a brand which is more vibrant. So maybe a, a guest in a Radisson red is not expecting to have, you know, like the traditional room service or, um, you know, with, with the metal clash when you deliver the order. But maybe you're expecting something more fun, more casual, like a food box delivered to your room or something like this. Now, of course, some of the standards are more strict, some others, because in the end we, we still need to, uh, keep, let's say a brand guardianship. Let, let's put it like that. Um, some others are, are more flexible because on the other hand, we really, uh, as, as a global company, we really have the challenge of adapting these brands to different geographies, different guest needs, feeder markets, and very important, I discover on my own experience. Local, uh, legal regulations, which is, especially for, for digital products, uh, it's really hard, you know, because usually you think, okay, it's a digital product. It's easy, it's worthwhile online checking solution. But then in each country you have different, you know, like, uh, legal, especially data regulation. But in general to, to conclude, um, our brand standards team really plays a key role, uh, in this, um, in the real way of writing down the standards. Let me give you a practical example, uh, because I think it's, uh, a bit abstract. Like we'll never mandate to our hotels to have a chocolate muffin at breakfast. But, the standard, uh, would rather say you need to have one sweet local pasty according to your market. So we ensure that, let's say the main guest need having, uh, in this case, I don't know, a sweet breakfast is fulfilled. But it wouldn't make sense to mandate a chocolate muffin. I don't know, in India for instance. You know? So our, our brand standards are also like, meant in, in a flexible way. Um, and it's a win-win situation, you know, because like from a guest perspective, they experience the local, um, they, they still have their, their need fulfilled. And from an owner perspective. Um, it, it's also a win-win because, you know, like there are some, some geographies, I don't know, in avocado toast, maybe in Copenhagen is part of guest expectations, but I don't know if any in, if in other regions it's, it's like that and maybe like importing like, uh, avocados, like in the Nordics, uh, it wouldn't make sense from a business perspective, you know? So that's why I think like even with less brands than, um. Then many of the hospitality companies, uh, our owners, uh, are still choosing us because we are, we're quite flexible. Adam Mogelonsky: So to pick out a thread, there are about localized frameworks, and that's a good segue to discuss Spanish hospitality. You know, you mentioned just data compliance and people may think with GDPR it's just the EU is all the same. Really what we know is that there's so many localized nuances, even from just Spain to France, to Italy, et cetera. So I'm wondering if you could talk about perhaps one Radisson hotel in either Madrid or somewhere else in Spain that you love and how you've really worked to create that localized experience. But within the framework of Radisson Hotel Group. Francesco Sforza: let's say that, um, in general, I mean, I, I moved to Spain since, um, more, more or less one year. Okay. Um. I was actually in Belgium before. of course, I think this is clear, like this hospitality culture. It sparked, I would say, of the Spanish heritage. If you look at, uh, like the Spanish also competitive, uh, environment, let's say it, it's really plenty of, um, hospitality and tourism businesses here in Spain because it's something that, uh, I think it's really developed. Um, and for instance, it's a, it is a different. With Italy. Uh, Italy of course, like tourism is, uh, I think is one of the first like driving, driving sector of, of the economy. But, uh, it's plenty of hotels, of hospitality businesses, but usually like the companies behind are not really Italian, you know, like there's not this, um, hospitality entrepreneurial mindset. I would say. Well, well, URI, Spain, I think. In terms of education, it's more, it's more evolved. Uh, and this is reflected also in the, in the legislations. Um, now, uh, it's sad to, to admit because I'm Italian, but the Italian legislation in terms of um, like da data collection, hospitality sector, it's really, um, not up to date. I would say. it's really hard to develop, uh, um, automation digitalization in, in Italy. Uh, there are some, like fiscal requirements. Um, the online check, a a real online check is not even like possible in Italy. Uh, while in Spain. In Spain, it's possible. For instance, stated that I, I would say that in general, in terms of like daily operations, there are no. Particular, um, let's say differences, um, in the, in the Spanish hospitality environment, let's say. Um, but of course, um, Spain as the Canary Islands, which, uh, I, I would really focus my, my answer on this. So the Canary Islands are actually, I think the Spanish region where the hospitalities like. Not developed, like more like, uh, we can open like an entire podcast episode, um, on this. Uh, and, and, and actually, I mean, of course it's a more like, uh, leisure driven hospitality. It's more resource oriented, entertainment oriented. Um, but really the competition there, it's crazy. So, Actually, we have a lot of best practices from, from our, our Spanish, uh, properties in the Canary Islands. Uh, I personally recently visited them. Uh, I was taking care at the time of, um, implementation of econ church services. Um, and I really, I really found a, a great response from, from Utah, you know, because sometimes, uh, also when it comes to implementing this digital tools, there's also some like educational, cultural barriers. Uh, just. Like openness to change and these kind of things. While in the Canary Islands, I found a really, uh, engaged team, uh, willing to, to do more and change their, their way of working. So, so yes, so, so basically, I mean the, we did a overall, let's say, resort project. There's like some, some people in the, in the company, let's say, focusing on this more leisure, uh, oriented, uh, properties. Um, and within this. We decided to offer our guests the possibility to manage their entire stay at their fingertips through the implementation of a a web app. Um, which. Again, from a guest experience perspective, amazing. But when it comes to the hotel level, it really need to, to change the entire way of working. You know, like we have this, um, I think in all hotel stores, this role of the reception, which basically, you know, yeah, we, we keep hiring like reception. But, um, in the end, like it's a pure admin finance department is a bit like everything, you know. Um, so, so I think that the, the goal, uh, for, for us with this econ search implementation was really, of course announcing the guest experience, but also like redistributing the, the tasks, um, the hotel tasks between the the virus department. Uh, and it was a real, really nice Zoe Koumbouzi: So Francesco, thanks so far. I think it's really interesting how you talk about different kind of levels of, of digital knowledge, let's say in digital legislation in various regions of the world. And I'm wondering if you, you know, going back to having, ensuring that staff are. At the center point of your digital implementations, whether you find any differences or any challenges or how you approach implementing the different staff in different regions of the world. Francesco Sforza: So, um, I would say of course there are some patterns, um, in terms of like nationalities and sometimes are not even patterns, I would say maybe stereotypes, you know, like, uh, it, it's a bad thing to say, but sometimes st stereotypes are, are true. Um, but, um, it's also true that, um. Fortunately, I would say, um, regardless of the, of the region, our properties are located, our staff is usually very multicultural, so it's very hard to find, I don't know, the Spanish hotel with like all Spanish employees or the, Danish hotel with Danish employees. Uh, usually is a, is a mix of, of cultures. Um. With different backgrounds and way of communications, I would say. So it, it's really nice to usually, I mean, when, when I visit details, there's always, um, one person within the, the operations team that like naturally, um, becomes, let's say my make point of contact because maybe like in that case, communication, it, it's easier or their, their background is more similar to mine, so the communication is faster. Uh, but then it's really, it's really nice to see. Uh, within a hotel team, which usually it's kind of a family environment, like each one is very, um, aware of what are their strengths and their weaknesses. So they really like, um, when it comes to implementation projects, they really naturally, uh, assign themself the, the task or the, you know, the, the things they have to do, uh, according Zoe Koumbouzi: Yeah, staff buy-in is so crucial and I think, you know, you must really take them into consideration in the, in the process of deciding what you're gonna implement and how you're gonna do it. So yeah. Thanks. Francesco Sforza: And, and for everything. Sorry. Uh, to, to, uh, the, the trainings are, are, are, are essential. Um, and, and these, I think. Especially now with, uh, all this digital products, uh, digitalization of services and everything, because, you know, like we sometimes, okay, we, we have the, the job roles. The job positions in our minds are the ones of the past, you know, like an housekeeper, a, a chef, a concierge, but um, a housekeeper that needs to use a complex digital system for which like, even like. Um, even I needed, I don't know, two weeks to study. It's not doing like, let's say the traditional housekeeper role or a front office agent that needs to use like complex, uh, management systems, online systems, uh, purchase, uh, purchasing systems. Um, it's not anymore a receptionist. So we, we really like, should highlight the importance of the training for anything. Adam Mogelonsky: It's very interesting because your role is guest experience and product development, but realistically, when you're looking at technologies, the end user. You have to also be staff experience focused, and I'm wondering about your role and what you look at as trends and developments in what you see to help the end user, the housekeeper, the front desk clerk, to make the technology more intuitive to thereby free up their time or free up their energy to better help the guest and thereby improve the guest. Do you, do you work in that capacity? Francesco Sforza: Well, let's say not directly, but uh, of course it's something I'm exposed to. Um, I would say in general, um, you know, like. And I'm, I'm, this is a quote from my, my colleague, you, you, Zoe met. Um, we always need to develop trainings for employees, but we never develop trainings for our guests. Like when you check in, not only, not only at sison, but I don't know, you would do an online check-in for, for your flight tomorrow. You're not trained on how to do the, the online checking. Um, because the, the UX design, um. It's very intuitive and it has been developed with probably huge budget behind to make it as intuitive as possible. So from a guest perspective, you don't need the training. Wow. I think that, not, maybe not anymore, but like in, in like recent years, let's put it like this. It was a bit like skipped this, this focus on the employee facing part, you know? Then now, so, so like the, the consequence of this is that then like, huge training needs were, were required. I think that now, uh, we are shifting, let's say behavior, um, and we are like giving the right importance also in to the employee, employee facing part of the, of the digital tools. Adam Mogelonsky: so let's, let's backtrack here because when we're talking about the guest experience and we're talking about essentially what now is the mobile experience, and I'm wondering if you could talk about specifically for the mobile experience, what you are seeing that is really revolutionary or is really helping push that forward. To then have a, an impact on the overall guest experience, but also just helping to differentiate the brand. Francesco Sforza: You mean from a digital point of view? Adam Mogelonsky: Yeah. Francesco Sforza: Yes. So, um, I actually, uh, was last week in, in, in Berlin where we had a, our annual corporate summit and like digital products, AI was really like, um, a lot on, on the agenda. Um, of course, I mean, technology yes, plays a, a key, key role, both from a guest experience and operational perspective. Um, I'm sure. You know already that, uh, Radisson developed its own PMS system, um, which makes you understand immediately how importantly technology it's seen, uh, within the company. I was actually very impressed when I first joined the company two years ago that they had developed the, their own PMS, Of course this came with some, some challenges for, especially for our IT teams, um, as basically back then, uh, we were an hotel company basically producing a software. So you can imagine it was not really at the time our core expertise. Uh, but today thanks to this, we have really the chance of being able to personalize our, our guest experience, um, in real time. Of course. I mean, thanks to the, the data we, we can, we can have. But in general, let's say we can evolve our systems based on our needs, uh, without, let's say having to wait for, for the market basically to, to develop things. But I, I would like to say that even if digitalization today is really on the spot everywhere, and for sure it's, it's crucial. Um, for us it's really essential to let always our guests choose. 'cause basically in the end, you know, like the, the way to say like, the customer is always right, it's actually true. So we're always developing and implementing new products. We, we have like check-in kiosks, uh, econ search, uh, apps as, uh, I was mentioning before, uh, mobile room keys. Like, we're always like super innovative and implementing these things, but we always let our guests choose how they want to access the services. Uh, we'll never choose basically on behalf of the guest. Um, you know, it's, it's, this is really a point, especially for a big company like us. Um. We really have like different brands, different customers, we cannot impose, okay, from tomorrow, this is the way to check in for, from tomorrow. This is the way to order a, a room service. Um, so we are now focusing on having as many as use cases as possible, as many channels as possible to deliver the same service. Um, it's like, you know, like all roads, uh, lead to wrong kind of, uh, this is the basically the approach we, we are taking. Adam Mogelonsky: All roads do lead to Rome. Right. Uh, the Appian way. Um, so you mentioned something about room service and that goes now into the on property experience. And I'm wondering if you could talk to some of the technologies that are on-premises to really enhance the onsite experience. What are you seeing there that is helping to create more meaningful guest experiences? Francesco Sforza: from a global perspective, I think that, um. Let's say the main, um, innovation in terms of, uh, digital FMB, uh, are indeed this kind of econ concert services, which is, I know it's a very, like, broad work, but basically, um, very, very bottom line is. It's basically, you know, like, uh, when you are at your, your place at night and you want to order a pizza, you just o open like Uber Eats. So basically this is your expectation right now. Like from a guest experience perspective, you, you want to have everything at your fingertips. Content. It's crucial because you're gonna order the nice looking burger and not the shitty one, of course. Um, and then, you know, like you can personalize, create, offers, promotions, this kind of thing. So with this econ shared services, we're trying to. Basically replicate, uh, these things that guests are exposed to on, on a daily basis and bringing it to the hotel. Um, this is actually a, a broader discussion, but, um. In general, I personally believe that, you know, back in the days, uh, when you would go to a hotel, you would've an enhanced experience compared to the bedroom. You're used to like to be at your, at your, in your flat or whatever. Uh, well now I think it's, it's really hard. Not because like hotels are. Are not good at doing what, what they need to do. But because like the quality of life, let's say, uh, really, uh, it's really way better. So, so basically now it's not anymore a guest going in the hotel and finding the cool thing that they don't have at home. But the, the challenge is now is keeping the pace with the innovations and the products. Guests use that at their own or houses and having it also in hotel, like at your, at your place, I'm sure you have an Amazon Alexa device. You order your dinner on your mobile, then you go to, to the hotel and you don't have all these things and you need to, you know, order room service by calling reception, and like scrolling menu, uh, paper, paper based menu. So. You know, like there, there's kind of a mismatch in terms of, uh, behavior. Zoe Koumbouzi: That's so interesting. I'd never thought of that point of view and I, I think you're so right. So what is it then? So you, so you're trying to keep, keep ahead and keep at the same level as guest expectations in terms of the everyday technology that they use. And what about in room? 'cause you, you do digital and also physical fi, I think you called it. Um, so what about interim? How do you combat that? Is there, are there any other ways in terms of design that you, you deal with that So not, not specifically. I mean there's, um, a dedicated, uh, in this case fb, FB team. Uh, if you're. Referring to like a, a broader discussion like, um, in terms of hardwares that, that you have in, in room and not just like systems. Um, there are several I mentioned before, like the, like Google Home Alexa devices. Uh, we are exploring these, uh, potentially you can have like, uh, I, iPads, robots, like this kind of things. But I would say that at this stage it's really more a wow. Experience and actually a, an added value. Um, because everything to, to really be an added value should be Francesco Sforza: like, really well, like inserted into like the overall operations of the, I would say that, um, especially like room surface, um, it, it's something that. I dunno, it, it's not so popular anymore. Uh, let's put it, let's put it like this. Um, especially because the, the quality of the hotel, like dining outlets, um, it's really like higher and higher. Uh, there are some very cool concepts and, and things. So, um, of course in some strategic location, some sort of hotels, uh, room service, it's still essential, I would say. Um, and of course it's, it's a revenue flow, but, um. In general, um, there are, let's say higher priorities in terms of, uh, guest needs than, than the room service outs. Adam Mogelonsky: you mentioned something, uh, an interesting term that I, I keep reverting back to, which is the wow experience. And, uh, I'm, I'm not the one to coin this, um, may maybe you were, but I'm wondering how do you measure that? How do you measure what's gonna make a difference and really. Get guests motivated to keep coming back, to develop that NPS and then to to spend more on site, whether that's f and b or or in other outlets. Francesco Sforza: Yeah, so, um. My answer to this is gonna be pretty simple. It's all a matter of, uh, expectations in the end. So, you know, like, uh, now you have like, uh, like shore rentals, Airbnbs like a lot of services. You know, when you go to an Airbnb, your expectations are usually. A bit lower than during a hotel state? No. But if I rent an apartment, um, even if they put me there like a toothbrush, for me it's a wow experience because I'm not expecting that. Um, well in, in the hotel it's a bit more complex because there are a lot of experiences, um, standards, let's say, that are in guest minds from an old school hospitality, which are actually. You know, like are part of the expectation. So you notice if that thing is missing, but you're not actually having any enhancement in terms of experience by the presence of that item. For example, like how many times do you really use a shower cup In our hotel, I think very, very few times, but if you enter a hotel room and there's no shower cup, you notice that. So the, um, it, it's a matter of expectations. Of course. Each brand, uh, each brand comes with some expectations, and then we really should be, our challenge is again, introducing this wow, things. Are things that are not part of the expectations. Of course, we have a, a team which is completely dedicated, uh, into like guest analytics, guest intelligence, uh, online reputation management. Um, and Zoe, if I'm not wrong, you have also experienced in the past, in, in this field, um, and it's really important for us. Uh, so our, my team's role, guest experience development is, is really like not a standalone team, but it's a, uh, like it's a cycle. It's a continuous assessment with the guest intelligence team. Zoe Koumbouzi: Absolutely the best place to get the insights and the real insights into what your guests are thinking is guest reviews, of course, because they're unfiltered. So yeah, agree. Francesco Sforza: Indeed. And then operationally, operationally speaking, right now I think it's impossible. But, you know, like, uh, our globally, in the hospitality industry, I'm, I'm not referring to, to Radisson specifically, like revenue management is now very strong. And the price is, is dynamic. Okay. And it, it's very, uh, it's very well done and it's working perfectly. So there's dynamic pricing, but then it's impossible to deliver dynamic standards. You know, you know what I mean? So, um, the same hotel room that maybe like on Tuesday, uh, it's, I don't know, uh, the rate of for that hotel room is a hundred Euros. Then on Saturday, maybe it's 300 euros. So there, you know, we we're not able yet to have dynamic standards, but maybe some wow touches in that case would help because the expectations are also set by the price rate. Zoe Koumbouzi: Definitely, I think guest experience is part of revenue management. What they get at your hotel is totally part of. I mean, it's the biggest part of the. Francesco Sforza: yeah, a hundred percent. And indeed, I was saying before, you know, like our brand standards are only setting, you know, the minimum. Uh, so basically what kind of justifies the value for money? But then like each hotel needs to like eventually according to their, their guests and their competitive environment, like, go the extra mile and deliver on top on that. Adam Mogelonsky: You know, it's very interesting that you mention that about how you have dynamic pricing and then somebody's expectations for that weekend where there's some compression event and they're paying $300, 300 euros more than midweek. Now you almost need to have dynamic standards to live up to that increased expectation that happens with that yield management. And I'm wondering, do you, this, this is very complicated to operationalize, but could you give us one example of how you've helped designs one of these wow moments? Francesco Sforza: I, I think you notice like we, we recently launched our revitalized rooms. Uh, that one was that one. I think it's really like a wow thing because it's really, um, I would say pioneering initiative. Uh, so and for sure is not yet part of the guest expectations. So, um, that one, basically bottom line, what we did is. They have a very, like scientific background. They produce this plasma powered devices that really like help, uh, to rest better, uh, get more energies, you know, like, um, also have this, uh, life therapy treatment to stimulate cynical. they're, they're growing, uh, a lot right now. Um. Initially their, their focus was more, let's say, in terms of like sport, healthcare. We snow this to hospitality. It's something like super, super recent. We, we just did it. So we are still in the, in the learning curve, let's say. But that one is a, a warm moment because it's not in a part of the yet, uh, part of the guest expectations and guests are actually willing to, to pay a, a premium price for that. So that one, I think, it's a great example. Adam Mogelonsky: Uh, so to finish off here, Franceso, I'm wondering if we could touch on a passion of mine personally that ties into guest experience, which is wellness and, uh, sleep programs. And I'm wondering what you are seeing in that area and what you think, uh, applies best at scale to the guest experience. Francesco Sforza: Yes. So, um, I would say that wellbeing is. As, as a concept in general, uh, market, let's say. Uh, it's now interacting with the hospitality and in general the luxury industry. Uh, just like. Fashion some years ago. Um, I don't know if you, if you agree on this, uh, on, on this statement. Um, and I would say in both ways. Meaning that if today you go to a luxury retail store or to a gym, you almost have a hotel experience including FMB, amenities and hotel services. Okay. at the, at the same time, uh, I would say that like in in our age sleep, it's, I was seeing like, um. An article the other day and they were defining, you know, uh, sleep is the new luxury and it's actually true. Meaning that, uh, like the pace of our lives is nowadays like super fast and it's now like way cooler, having like the, the luxury to stay in bed than partying until late night, you know? Um, so it, it's really important. But just like for, just like, uh, as I said for, for the tech technology and digitalization, uh, I would say that the key at this stage at least, is always letting the guest choose and not assuming that every guest is interested in exercise, in exercising, or doing mindfulness exercise while traveling. Um. When it comes to Addison, since many years now, our hotels are offering, uh, running routes, uh, from hotel in a digital format. Also, like through some, um, kind of like, uh, touristic itineraries while, while running, uh, our guests can download them to, in their mobile devices and, and go running. Um, we launch as well as, what we call rad fit, which is basically an in-room fitness kit. Um, and then of on top on this, we, we, we launched this bio revitalized room. So we are for sure exploring way more, um, wellbeing, um, sleep initiatives. Uh, let's put it like this. Um. But I, I don't think, um, we can, you know, immediately like convert everything into a wellbeing experience because actually like the driver, uh, let's say the travel decision is not only wellbeing, then wellbeing is appreciated while traveling a hundred percent. Um, but it's not actually the main reason for travel. Adam Mogelonsky: Right. I guess, uh, the term we have is wellness secondary travel, where they wanna stay healthy, but they're traveling for some other purpose. And it's up to people like you to design it, but keep it flexible for everyone. Francesco Sforza: Flexibility is key. And also, I mean, these will, then, it really depends on the, on the geographies, uh, this particular topic. But I would say that FMB, it's also very much involved in this. Um, because, you know, like, uh, especially coming back to the room service, uh, uh, discussion we, we were having before. Um. Most of the time, um, you arrive night in hotel, uh, you want to order room service and you have like cheeseburger, pizza, hot dog, like these kind of things, and also like a healthy FMB offering is really crucial. Adam Mogelonsky: Awesome. Francesco, it's been a fantastic conversation, given us a lot to think about in terms of experiential design and how important it is to stay flexible while also creating those wow moments. Thank you so much, Francesco. Thank you, Zoe. Zoe Koumbouzi: Thank you everyone. Very insightful.