Latest / The Diva Details / Stay, Split, or Start Over: Navigating Affairs, Apologies, and Protecting the Children

Transcript

Stay, Split, or Start Over: Navigating Affairs, Apologies, and Protecting the Children · The Diva Details

0:01
Welcome to the Diva Detail. Welcome to the Diva
0:05
Detail, where bold, confident women embrace life
0:09
unapologetically. From love and sex to wellness
0:13
and reinvention, we keep it raw, real, and powerful.
0:17
No filters, no limits, just fearless
0:21
conversations to help you thrive. Let's dive in with Diva
0:33
Hello, beautiful people. This is Diva Mia. Welcome back. I just wanted
0:37
to talk to you a little bit today about
0:42
healing after an affair and staying in
0:45
a marriage sometimes when you have kids after an affair and trying
0:50
to work it out and what that does to you and to the children.
0:53
And how to try to make things work the best
0:57
way you can. I've been trying to get back on the dating apps and I
1:01
have been running into a lot of men that were also
1:04
cheated on. The cheating rates, I believe we talked about, were 20% men
1:08
cheat, although it goes up to about 36% if you include
1:12
the emotional cheating, something like 18%, 16 to 18%
1:15
of women cheat. And this is overall. So it's not,
1:19
you you have about a 1 in 5 chance of being cheated on,
1:23
whether you're male or female, maybe 1 in 4 for a female.
1:26
There's people out there that have gone through severe trauma.
1:29
And I wanna, I wanna, you know, I wanna bookend
1:33
the whole trauma idea is I know trauma happens when you're a child. I know
1:37
trauma happens when you're in war, but there's different kinds of trauma.
1:40
Trauma happens when someone dies, but emotional trauma from
1:43
an affair can linger. And I'm seeing that more
1:47
and more cuz I've been talking to people that have been divorced for
1:51
3, 4, 5, 6 years, and they're still, you can tell even on the
1:55
first conversation, they're still not healed. Healing is such a strange
1:59
thing, and sometimes just asking questions can trigger people.
2:03
I went through an affair in my own marriage. I did not stay. As soon
2:07
as I found out, I got a divorce. We'd spent nearly 3
2:10
decades together. I ended up going through therapy. I ended up
2:14
going through energy healing, and as well as I went through divorce coaching. And I
2:18
think all of those things happen. My recommendation is if
2:21
you've gone through an affair and whether you're staying or not, you need to get
2:25
into therapy right away. You shouldn't be waiting. Everyone needs it,
2:28
especially men too, because men have even more difficulty talking
2:32
about their feelings. I've met some men that have gone a little bit to therapy,
2:36
but you can tell they need quite a lot more just so that they can
2:39
resolve the trauma that they've experienced.
2:43
The night I found out that I had been cheated on was very
2:47
traumatic. I had no idea that finding out was just the beginning, not the end,
2:50
and it would get way worse over time. This episode though is about why an
2:54
affair feels like trauma and when you get cheated on,
2:57
an apology doesn't fix it. I know sometimes it's nice to
3:01
hear an apology. Sometimes people give it, sometimes people don't.
3:04
When you're cheated on, sometimes you feel like, man, I just wish they'd apologize and
3:08
give you a little bit of dignity and a little bit of respect, but sometimes
3:11
they don't. Sometimes they don't apologize. Then you're left thinking,
3:14
what the heck is wrong with me? Sometimes both people feel differently when
3:18
the dust settles. What about the kids? What do the kids take from it?
3:21
What it does to everyone's sense of self-worth, even the children.
3:25
For those of you who didn't stay, you're single now and you decided to leave
3:28
your cheating partner, we're going to talk about how hard it is to
3:32
date again after being cheated on and how to tell whether
3:35
you're ready or still need more time and how easy it is to
3:39
find a partner that again will cheat on you. Because before we start,
3:43
this gets heavy. Sometimes we attract the same types of people into
3:46
a new relationship if we haven't fully healed. If you're
3:50
in the middle of it right now, take care of yourself while you're listening because
3:54
this is going to be a rough episode for some people. It's very emotional.
3:57
There's childhood traumas that people have to heal when they
4:01
get cheated on. Sometimes there's adult traumas that people need to heal when
4:04
they get cheated on as well. Pause this if you need to. Remember this,
4:08
this is a conversation. This is not therapy. If something hits
4:12
hard or triggers you, Take it to someone that can sit with you for a
4:15
while and you can take the time and the space that you need to.
4:18
But let's start with the word trauma. Some people hear it and think it's dramatic.
4:22
It's an affair, not a car crash, right? But think about what
4:26
a partner is. For most of us, that person is our safe space.
4:29
They're the person we go to with all of our vulnerabilities,
4:33
the one place we can put our guard down, the one person we trust
4:37
in the whole world. When they violate that trust,
4:40
it can be devastating. The danger comes from the exact
4:43
person that you are supposed to trust. Your nervous system gets
4:47
dysregulated and it doesn't know how to register
4:51
the sadness because that person brought you joy before. It registers
4:55
a threat now when you think about that person. This betrayal trauma and
4:59
harm that comes from someone you depend on, it's trauma.
5:03
It's a very traumatic thing to trust someone and to have
5:07
them violate that trust. For me, it felt like the floor was gone, not just
5:11
the marriage, but my own judgment. If I missed this,
5:14
what else had I missed? That's the part people underestimate. An affair
5:18
doesn't only damage the future, it rewrites the past.
5:21
You go back through the vacations, anniversaries, things that didn't
5:25
feel right but you overrode in your mind, ordinary Tuesday nights and ask,
5:29
was that real? Were they having an affair? Were they cheating on
5:32
me then? Were they texting someone while we sat next to each other at
5:36
dinner? Your memories get contaminated. It is rough.
5:39
Then there are the symptoms. I honestly thought I was losing my mind. First,
5:43
many betrayal partners describe reactions like that look like post-traumatic
5:47
stress syndrome. And if you stay, it's almost like you're inevitably
5:51
making the post-traumatic stress syndrome worse. Intrusive thoughts and images happen
5:55
throughout the day. Sometimes you can't sleep. Your mind will race and you can't
5:59
fall asleep at night. And then you replay what happened. You imagine scenes
6:03
and random moments and you become hypervigilant. If you're sticking
6:07
around, you're going to be checking their phones, the bank statements,
6:10
location, and never fully relaxing. So if you're
6:14
in a marriage and you decide to stay, whether it's for the kids or something
6:17
else, realize you're gonna have a heightened cortisol level nonstop.
6:21
You're gonna be stressed out. You're gonna have anxiety around
6:24
the relationship. Certain triggers, maybe a song, a restaurant, or a name,
6:28
it can trigger you out of nowhere and
6:31
cause anxiety. Or if you run into their affair partner, oh my
6:35
gosh, that can set you off. You might start to lose sleep
6:39
and your appetite may change. Your mind's gonna race at 3 o'clock in the morning
6:42
and all of a sudden you'll be woken up. It doesn't matter whether you're with
6:46
the person for a year or 3 decades. Nonetheless, you're gonna have triggers and
6:50
you'll have emotional swings. Sometimes you might be angry in the morning and
6:54
then desperate for closeness at night. Then on the weekends, you're just numb,
6:58
going through the motions, trying to get by. I will tell you, it gets
7:02
better. It does get way better over time, but you have to go through the
7:06
pain. And I want you to remember something. When things happen like
7:10
this, there are lessons you can garner from them. So many lessons.
7:14
And if you've been cheated on more than once with either the same partner
7:17
or different partners, there's a lesson there. You need to take it and you need
7:21
to learn it. What boundaries did you allow to get overridden with this person?
7:24
Why did you allow those boundaries to slip? But let's get back on the
7:28
cheating. Sometimes with those emotions, you know, one hour
7:32
you may want your spouse at your house and the next you want them
7:35
to hold you. It makes no sense. You may even miss and
7:38
long for the person that cheated But that's okay. You just
7:42
have to let that go. Problem is sometimes it's hard. The person who hurt you
7:45
is also the person your body still turns to for comfort. Your body
7:50
may still want them. You're being asked to find safety in the source of the
7:53
injury. If you stay, being intimate with the partner is tough
7:57
because especially for women, we find safety in our partners.
8:01
And once they rip that away, it's really hard to find your way back.
8:05
There's whiplash in normal responses and you
8:09
could be blindsided by all of this. It's not a sign you're broken though.
8:12
I wish someone had told me that what I'm telling you now is that you
8:16
just need to take your time to heal. After talking to
8:19
these men that have stayed in relationships after
8:23
they've been cheated on and tried to stick it out, they're causing their
8:26
own self-trauma, which may mess them up for future dating because
8:31
they're sticking in relationships where they were cheated on and they're trying to work
8:35
it out. And honestly, I don't know if they ever do. And sometimes it messes
8:39
with their psyche. And even if do get apology outta your partner and
8:43
you decide to work it out, sometimes the apology's not
8:46
enough. My ex-husband never apologized and I'm actually okay with it. I got my closure
8:51
in other ways. Sometimes you need to just move on with or without
8:55
the apology. Now, if your spouse apologizes and you believe
8:59
them and there's true sincerity, that's when you actually have the ability
9:03
to work things out. The question is, should you? And that's gonna be up to
9:07
you. 'Cause sometimes when people apologize, they're sorry for what they did,
9:10
but they're not gonna change their behavior. They're gonna do the exact same
9:14
thing again because sometimes cheaters, they just, they have an addiction towards
9:18
it and the apology is nice, but if they're addicted to the rush
9:22
they get when they cheat and when they manipulate you, it's not
9:26
a good place to be. There's a trap there. An apology is a door,
9:29
not a destination. It says, I'm willing to start the repair.
9:32
It doesn't do the repair. And here's the truth. A lot of people don't
9:37
have the mental and emotional strength to fix
9:40
themselves and you can't fix them. And that's the truth. If they're willing
9:43
to work it out, because there are people that stay in relationships or get back
9:47
together after an affair, but the person that cheated has work
9:51
to do. And a lot of people aren't willing to do the work.
9:54
They want the quick comfort. They want the laziness. They want the ability
9:59
to just keep doing the same thing they're doing without actually ever having to
10:03
self-reflect and look inside. Because when they look inside,
10:06
they may not like what they see. They may see someone that
10:09
was terrible to other people and they have to
10:13
self-reflect on all those things that they've done. And a lot of people don't
10:16
wanna do that. So when you stay in a relationship with someone that doesn't wanna
10:21
self-reflect, you're just prolonging the pain for yourself.
10:24
They have to take full ownership if you're gonna stay in this relationship
10:28
with them. No, I'm sorry, but you were distant. Or no, I'm sorry, but you
10:32
didn't gimme the care and attention I needed all the time. Now the character
10:36
flaw's in them, not in you. The state of your marriage needs to be explored
10:39
later. There are things that you could probably have changed, but that's what communication is
10:44
for, not affairs. If there's an issue, you communicate it.
10:47
You don't go around and sleep around on them. The choice
10:51
to have an affair belongs completely to the person who made it, and you've got
10:54
to name the specific harm. Not, I'm sorry I hurt you. No, you lied
10:58
for months or weeks or days or however long it was.
11:02
They made you doubt your own instincts because when they lied to
11:06
you and you asked them a question, they lied straight to your face. Sometimes when
11:09
they end the affair clearly and completely, they may still have ongoing
11:14
contact with the person that, especially if they're
11:17
at work, and that keeps the wound open. So if
11:20
whoever cheated on you is still talking to the person
11:24
that they cheated with, it can be a serious problem. There's transparency that
11:28
needs to be answered too, because honestly, without the betrayed partner having
11:32
to dig into details, the transparency has to come from the person
11:36
that had the affair. Because if they're not telling you everything and they're not transparent,
11:41
You'll get a drip of information here and there. And as the
11:44
drip, it makes it worse. It would have been better for them to just come
11:47
clean in the beginning. But as you hear things over and over again,
11:50
every single time that erodes more trust. If you're going to work it out with
11:54
somebody, make sure there's full transparency in the beginning and you decide and
11:58
discuss how you're going to work it out. And you also need to have patience
12:01
because it's not going to take one apology. It's going to take several. The person's
12:05
going to have to show up in the relationship more than they did before.
12:09
So if they cheated on you and you're dealing with that pain, That person
12:13
is going to really have to show up and be sincere. Sometimes it works out.
12:17
Sometimes it doesn't. I don't know what the percentage is, but a lot of times
12:20
it takes time to heal and patience is the hardest part.
12:24
I think that's where most people struggle. The apology lives in the atonement phase,
12:28
but atoning isn't one event. It's months of the partner who strayed
12:33
sitting with the other person's pain without getting defensive and
12:36
really self-reflecting on what they could have done differently. And what
12:40
they need to fix in themselves. 6 months in with, with a spouse, you can't
12:44
say, how many times do I have to say I'm sorry? Because you may have
12:47
to say you're sorry 50 times. Sometimes when they say
12:51
that, they act like they're disgusted with you. And it's like almost like a second
12:54
betrayal. You're going to take some time to heal. It just is whether you're with
12:58
them or not. Sometimes it's better if there's a breakup, like if
13:01
you break up for a while, they go do some work and then you can
13:04
potentially come back together. But if you stay right after the affair,
13:08
Realize that pain doesn't have an expiration date. That's the problem.
13:12
It takes time for people to work through it. The honest truth
13:16
is the hurt may come back for a while. What finally shifts is for
13:20
us when the apologies stop being words and becomes a pattern, and you
13:24
see the person really trying and you see the person not
13:28
repeating the same behavior or the same pattern. If you're the cheating
13:32
partner and your partner asks for your phone because they don't trust you,
13:35
you're going to have to give it. So don't be hiding things again.
13:39
Don't be hiding your phone. Give them information readily.
13:42
If you're addicted to porn or adult sites
13:47
or adult content, you need to get away from that because that actually does rewire
13:51
your brain. And what they're finding, it doesn't cause happiness.
13:54
It causes quick little dopamine hits. And then people are actually more
13:58
depressed after because there's an emptiness there. And that emptiness
14:03
gets bigger every single time. Your partner is going to have to start being more
14:07
empathetic towards you. And caring and giving you more. Sometimes we
14:11
only hear one side of this story too. So I wanna give both. The portrayed
14:15
partner that stays sometimes
14:18
feels lonely in a strange way because they slept next
14:22
to someone every night and they still had an affair. And there
14:26
may be shame around it. They may have so much shame about around what
14:30
they do that they can't even look at the other person the same way.
14:33
Friends can make it worse because you may have girlfriends that say,
14:36
what the heck? Why did you stay in this relationship? They'd never put
14:40
up with it. Or you may have male friends that are saying, why would you
14:42
let a woman treat you that way? Or why are
14:46
you sticking around after she cheated? So friends can make it worse because people find
14:50
out. Suddenly a private conversation is complicated.
14:53
It feels like you're voting against your own self-respect. If you're the betrayed
14:57
partner, you might be carrying several of these at once: grief for the relationship you
15:01
thought you had and you're going to stay and try to repair it,
15:05
anger that shows up late, sometimes months after things look calm,
15:09
and you may have fear of being fooled again if you were cheated on.
15:13
And then there's self-doubt on both sides. There's a lack of perception of self-worth
15:17
at least, and you may be ambivalent. You may still love them completely, but not
15:21
sure that you wanna stay in this relationship. You can say it in the same
15:24
breath. You may love them to your core, but now because
15:28
of the betrayal, you don't get any sense of safety or trust with them.
15:32
And to be fair, When people cheat, they don't realize how
15:35
much shame and guilt they will experience and how heavy
15:39
it is, and they may shut down for a while. Some of them go quiet.
15:42
Some of them just try to find another person to dull the pain.
15:46
If you break up with them and they find another person to dull the pain,
15:49
it doesn't have a reflection on you. It just shows how empty they are.
15:53
If they don't do healing work, honestly, if you're a serial cheater,
15:57
there's something really wrong. And sometimes people feel like
16:01
they're going to be permanently deposed. Defined by some of the worst things they've done
16:05
because it's really bad to cheat on a partner.
16:08
The partner that cheated may be impatient and they may feel hopelessness
16:13
and will the pain ever end? There's also a hidden grief for the person that
16:17
cheats, for the affair partner or for who they were thought they were because it's
16:21
unspeakable. It festers. It's a grief that they're gonna mourn
16:24
deep down inside whether they realize it or not. And then if
16:28
you stay with them, they're gonna always be afraid of saying the wrong thing to
16:32
you to set you off because you're still healing. And you're still going through your
16:35
PTSD and they may set you off. If you shut down
16:39
and you're the affair partner, when someone wants to communicate,
16:42
you're gonna have to override that because communication is gonna be your number one
16:46
skill in order to resolve the disaster that has been created.
16:51
One person's withdraw— withdrawal may look like coldness. The other person's pursuit
16:55
looks like punishment. Underneath, both people are afraid and scared,
16:59
and you have to grow together in order to make it happen. Again,
17:01
sometimes I think it's better to take a break. If you find
17:05
each other again, great. Great. If not, let it go. There will also be an
17:09
imbalance if you stick with the partner for a while. You may feel like if
17:13
you're the one that got cheated on, that you have a little bit of moral
17:16
power over the relationship. Early on, it's right for the relationship to center
17:20
the betrayal partner's healing, but if that becomes permanent,
17:24
you end up as a prison guard and you're constantly overseeing
17:28
your prisoner who you expect to cheat at any moment. Part of
17:32
the long-term recovery is slow, careful return to being 2 equal
17:36
parts and normalcy. The Trauma will carry forward no matter what,
17:40
even if you go with a new person. Everybody wants a timeline.
17:43
They want to know how long until the pain is going to stop. Both parties
17:46
do. But you can't really give one because everyone's different.
17:50
People tell me that I heal fast, but I still carry trauma from people cheating
17:54
on me. It comes with— stays with you forever.
17:58
I don't think you can forget, but it is good to forgive
18:02
and move on. Recovery is rarely a straight line. Sometimes it comes in waves.
18:06
Sometimes you feel great for a week and then you have a
18:10
day, maybe it's an anniversary or something triggers
18:13
you and it can give you a flashback. Over time,
18:17
those flashbacks get smaller though and further apart, but a
18:21
big one can still come out of nowhere years later. Here's the truth.
18:24
Some people take years to heal. Like I said, I've been meeting people that
18:28
are 4, 5, 6 years out of being betrayed and they
18:32
would never cheat on their partners. They're very high-quality people, but these men
18:36
got betrayed as well. And when you're with somebody, even if it was
18:39
a one-time, it's still a betrayal. If it was a long-term
18:43
affair, that's even deeper because every single time was
18:47
a betrayal. And the lies, the comfortability that people have
18:51
when they lie is a problem you need to work on as well. It says
18:54
a lot about your integrity and your character. Sometimes everything might be good,
18:59
you think, in the relationship or the marriage, and the person still cheats.
19:03
There's sometimes people just have issues.
19:06
The question is, if it was serial cheating, do you really want to stay with
19:10
that person? If it was a one-off, you might be able to work it out.
19:12
But if they constantly have a desire to cheat, it's not
19:16
going to work because that person is looking for any opportunity to
19:20
cheat in the future. A trigger years later, if you break up with the person
19:24
or even if you stick around, doesn't mean healing hasn't happened. It just means the
19:28
injury was real. And something triggered you? It's okay to have a big
19:31
heart. It's okay to have a kind heart. You just need to set more boundaries
19:35
around that heart of yours. The question isn't whether the wave comes,
19:39
it's what you do when it does. Do you turn towards
19:43
each other or do you turn away from each other? And if you turn away
19:46
from each other, that's your answer. A few other ways that you can have emotional
19:50
triggers that carry forward that people don't even expect is on anniversaries.
19:54
Sometimes The discovery date of the affair, the holidays,
19:58
the happenings during the affair. You may have last Christmas said
20:01
you had to work late and you were having an affair. There could
20:05
be sexual intimacy problems. It can become loaded. Some couples feel intense
20:09
closeness right after discovery and then they pull back. And sometimes
20:13
you feel like you're being compared against everyone else and intrusive
20:17
images can follow you into the bedroom. Trust in other areas as well, like money,
20:21
work, friendship, travel, anything that resembles the old situation
20:25
can spike anxiety. And then if you argue a lot,
20:28
if you're the type of person that has fights with your spouse,
20:31
an argument about being late can secretly be an argument about the affair
20:35
because they don't trust that you were truly late.
20:38
Maybe you were sneaking around at work. Maybe you were sneaking around somewhere else.
20:42
Maybe you had a hotel room. They're going to constantly be looking at the bills.
20:46
It creates a sense of hypervigilance on the person that got cheated on,
20:49
probably for a long time until they feel like they can trust you again.
20:53
Some people find it harder to trust friends, coworkers, even themselves
20:57
in the future. They just don't trust anyone because the person that
21:01
was nearest and dearest to their heart violated them
21:04
by having an affair or cheating with multiple people. Sometimes you
21:08
have explosive fights about nothing, and it was never about nothing.
21:12
It was about the person that was cheated on thinking that something else may be
21:15
going on. And it may just be that the old wound is talking.
21:18
So realize it can create trauma ongoing in
21:23
body and wounds that constantly reopen. And the children
21:28
will absorb this as well. So if you're staying in a relationship, they're gonna absorb
21:32
the fighting. They're gonna see an unhealthy relationship.
21:35
They're gonna see that one of the partners stuck around even
21:39
though they were cheated on. This is the part I think about most. I am
21:43
so grateful that my children saw me walk away, even though it was tough in
21:46
the beginning when I was shut down. There was a week I didn't even
21:50
really get out of bed. It was such a traumatic experience. But once
21:54
I got over it, my children saw how strong I was and I
21:58
could move on. If you're sticking in the relationship, remember that is going to have
22:02
an effect on their psyche as well. They're going to see that, yes, you're trying
22:05
hard, but should you be trying hard? Most parents think
22:09
that, and sometimes kids really don't know the facts, but they do.
22:12
They figure it out. They overhear in a fight. Children are incredibly
22:16
good at reading the room, especially emotionally. They may know that
22:20
there was an affair. They may not, but they may know something's going on.
22:23
They may know that there's more fighting in the house. Mom and dad
22:27
may, you know, you may be sleeping apart. They know that the house got quiet
22:30
and scary for a while and they feel the tension and the kids can fill
22:34
in the blanks. Usually they fill in the blanks.
22:37
Sometimes they may internalize it and think they did something wrong.
22:40
Children, they're not being selfish. They're just how kids make sense
22:44
of the world. So when the family feels broken, a common conclusion is something is
22:47
wrong with me. And it might be me. So a kid that blames themselves
22:52
after your affair, they think they did something wrong, especially if
22:55
they don't know what's going on. That's where child self-worth takes
22:59
the hit. There are patterns that often show up, whether it's
23:03
on the kid, the kid knows it or not. They may have self-blame. They may
23:06
think to themselves, if they'd only been better, my parents wouldn't be fighting.
23:10
They may try to become the perfect child, trying to earn stability by never
23:14
causing any trouble. And/or they may lash out and
23:19
cause as much trouble as they can because they're frustrated. Some children
23:23
even develop eating disorders when they don't feel stable at home.
23:27
When parents are fighting or arguing and they don't understand what's going on,
23:31
sometimes they have to become their own caretaker. They have to comfort themselves,
23:35
or they may have to comfort a crying parent. They have to manage the mood
23:38
of the home. This is called parentification, when your child feels like
23:43
they have to be the parent. It teaches the child that their worth comes from
23:46
fixing other people's pain. Let me tell you, I did this for my mother.
23:50
It required that I become more of a people pleaser, which then carried on to
23:54
future relationships, which made me an over-giver and opened me
23:58
up to date people that were more likely to cheat on me.
24:01
So realize there's a pattern that happens,
24:05
and when it happens to your children, you could be messing them up for life.
24:09
So you need to maybe get them into therapy as well. I wish I would've
24:12
had it. I could have seen that I was open and vulnerable to people
24:16
that would just take advantage of me because I overgave.
24:19
Sometimes they act out in anger. They might have trouble at school. They might sneak
24:24
out. Younger kids can regress into different feelings and emotions. Sometimes negative
24:28
tension feels safer than no tension at all. And that attention,
24:32
even if it's negative, they feel valued then because somebody's
24:35
paying attention to them instead of fighting with each other.
24:39
So sometimes they act out just to get in between the parents. Loyalty binds
24:43
though. Feeling that loving one parent betrays the other is a sense of
24:47
manipulation from one parent to the other. Much worse if a
24:51
child is told about the affair or pulled into taking sides. So there are a
24:54
lot of times, even when you get a divorce, the kids are
24:57
put in the middle. Affairs are ugly business. Cheating is
25:01
just an ugly business. It doesn't do anyone any good long-term.
25:05
It destroys self-worth of the person that cheated. As well as the person
25:09
that got cheated on. Because really, how great of a person are you if you
25:13
have to constantly have affairs and cheat on people? Your lack
25:16
of morality destroys your sense of respect for yourself
25:20
and your own self-confidence. When I got cheated on
25:24
and I got divorced, I was a wreck for about a week and my youngest
25:28
son was not around. He was still with his grandparents, but my oldest son had
25:31
to see it. I do regret that, but I probably should have left my oldest
25:36
son with his grandparents as well. But honestly, he did help me get through it
25:39
a little bit, but he had to take on some roles that later on we
25:42
discussed and talked about that he felt like he had to be the parent
25:46
for a couple weeks. It did cause him to lose a little bit of his
25:48
innocence, which I regret. He was there for me because I had no one
25:52
else, but I wish he didn't have to be.
25:56
It did help him grow up a little bit, but I wish he hadn't had
25:59
to grow up so quickly. There's a hopeful side too. I mean, kids also
26:03
learn from repair. So if they can see you grow into a new loving
26:06
relationship with someone else, and how people are supposed
26:10
to treat each other, a lot of times that helps them repair.
26:13
A child who watches parents actually go through something painful and come
26:16
back together can actually do better. If they see both sides
26:20
being honest, apologizing, and treating each other with respect, it can
26:24
rebuild warmth. And sometimes that relationship
26:28
can then survive any rupture. If you own your mistakes,
26:31
children pick up on that too, that when they make a mistake, if you own
26:35
it, you take responsibility, you can come back together and
26:38
that love can be worked out if you still love each other.
26:41
Sometimes saying it's automatically good or bad for kids is jumping
26:45
the gun because sometimes the way you come back together and the way you
26:49
love each other in the end is the best thing for kids to see.
26:53
But what shapes them most is the emotional climate that they live in from day
26:57
to day. Either way, if you're a parent, don't make your kids confidants.
27:02
Don't constantly expose them to affair details. They're not the adult.
27:06
Older kids may already know and they may ask honest questions
27:10
and you should answer them truthfully. You shouldn't be lying to your children, but make
27:13
sure they're age-appropriate. Ideally, it's best to have them go talk
27:17
it out with a therapist so that they can get any emotions out of
27:21
the way that they feel towards both parents. Tell them it's not their fault though,
27:24
even if they don't ask, because a lot of children think it's their fault.
27:27
Don't recruit them though into badmouthing the other person.
27:32
That's very manipulative and you never want to put children— whether you stay together or
27:35
you get divorced, you never want to put the children in the middle of it.
27:38
And let them see the repairs, the kind words, the laughter, the apologies,
27:41
the snuggling, the holding hands again, the coming back together
27:45
that you did with your spouse. But watch for changes in their sleep,
27:48
their school, their friends, their mood, all those things they may
27:52
need to work out with a therapist or with you. It depends on how close
27:55
you are with your children. And keep their routines steady and predictable
27:59
and safe. Remember though, it is gonna mess with everyone's
28:03
sense of self-worth. Not just your kids. Your kids take a huge hit
28:07
of self-worth. So does yours. Sometimes you may have a thought that you weren't enough,
28:11
that you tried over and over again and they still cheated. You may compare
28:14
yourself to the affair partner. Sometimes you think, what the heck
28:19
about the affair partner? Sometimes it's like, sometimes you may compare
28:22
your job. Were they better off? Were they younger?
28:26
Sometimes they're older. Hear this clearly. An affair isn't a statement about the
28:30
choices of the person who had it. Cheating in any, any type,
28:34
it's about the person who does the cheating. There's a hole in their cup
28:37
that they need to fill up and they need to do that work. It's not
28:41
a verdict on the worth of the person who was betrayed. It never has been,
28:45
but it does do damage to you. If you
28:49
got cheated on, the damage sometimes lingers. Affairs happen
28:52
in all kinds of relationships, including ones when the betrayed partner was loving,
28:57
attractive, and attentive. Of heck, Beyoncé got cheated
29:00
on. Models get cheated on. Superstars get cheated on.
29:05
Some people write songs because they got cheated on. It happens to
29:08
everyone. The person that's the cheater tends to cheat
29:12
again. They're not a person you want to stay with, honestly, typically. Now, some people
29:17
stay. It may be a one-off, but unless they do the work,
29:20
it's gonna have a problem for the rest of your life and theirs. And you
29:24
need to have a good life, not be there to support
29:27
the other person. It has often to do more with what's happening inside
29:31
the person who strayed and their avoidance issues of emotional
29:35
honesty. Sometimes people get scared the deeper a
29:39
relationship goes, and they don't want to feel the vulnerability because it scares
29:42
them. They have a need to feel seen or alive
29:46
or new, and it has nothing to do with anything lacking in their partner.
29:49
I knew that in my head. It took a long time to believe it in
29:52
my body. I think because what happens is your body gets so attached to the
29:56
person, your nervous system still still desires them. But staying can
30:00
add a second layer. What does it say about you when you stay? Some people
30:04
feel they lower their own value by choosing to stay. Here's how I think about
30:08
it now. Staying can be an act of self-respect when it's a clear-eyed choice
30:11
based on real changes you can see. You can keep the right to reassess
30:16
later. If they for some reason are eroding your self-worth or trust,
30:20
then maybe you need to leave later. But you can have the belief that you
30:24
deserve better and still stick with if they're willing to change, but they
30:28
have to be really willing to change 100%. Those who stay can look identical from
30:32
the outside. Sometimes they feel completely different though on the inside.
30:36
And the partner who had the affair, their self-worth often collapses too. They may
30:41
get stuck into, I'm a bad person and this is a dead-end relationship.
30:44
Maybe I should get out. Their guilt and shame, they may never be
30:48
able to look at the person the same way. Shame makes people hide, defend,
30:51
or give up. Their work is moving from shame to accountability.
30:55
Once they fully own the harm without collapsing, in the
30:59
guilt because a collapsed partner can't show up for the repair. So if they're
31:02
still collapsing and haven't done the work, they're not ready
31:06
to repair. And that's why a lot of times you'll see people that are in
31:09
affair relationships or married and they'll just separate for a while.
31:13
They may realize they truly love each other and come back together, but the
31:17
separation can be really good for both partners. Both people are rebuilding
31:20
a self, not just a marriage. The couples I've seen do this the
31:25
best come out of it more honest with themselves than they've ever been. And their
31:28
communication skills in the relationship are stronger. And some people
31:32
may have a stronger relationship after, believe it or not, but there has to be
31:36
a lot of work done. And I personally, for me, I think if you
31:40
are going to stick around, think about a full-on separation for a little
31:44
bit to make sure it's right to stay in the relationship. If you've decided
31:48
to try, here's what makes the biggest differences. And I hear
31:52
it again and again from others. A couple therapist trained in infidelity recovery
31:56
is necessary. You're going to have to go through general counseling.
31:59
Sometimes you're going to have to work on your communication skills before the betrayal
32:03
happened and what's working now. Individual support for each partner.
32:07
You're probably going to have to also have individual therapy because
32:11
the betrayed partner needs a safe place to feel that they can talk, a place
32:15
to fall apart without worrying about hurting anyone. The partner who strayed needs
32:19
a place to understand why so it doesn't happen again and why they keep
32:24
cheating or why they cheated in the first place. You have to have structured honesty.
32:27
A good therapist can guide the questions so you get the truth you need
32:32
without details that become new intrusive images. Don't go into details.
32:36
You can say how many times you cheated, you can give facts, but don't go
32:39
into details about what you did. It creates an image that the person can never
32:43
unsee. Sometimes it's consistent, boring trustworthiness that
32:47
has to occur. Doing what you said. If you say you're gonna be home at
32:50
5 o'clock, show up at 5 o'clock when you said. Trust rebuilds through hundreds
32:54
of small, dull, reliable moments. That's how you rebuild trust.
32:58
And you have to make room for joy. You're gonna laugh together again. If all
33:01
you ever talk about is the affair, you're gonna drown in it. It's suffocating.
33:05
But schedule time to just be 2 people who like each other,
33:08
who play with each other, and who have fun. Understand the why without
33:12
excusing it too. Both sides need to understand the why. Eventually look
33:16
at what made the relationship vulnerable in the first place. While the
33:20
affair stays the responsibility of the person who
33:23
chose There was something that allowed the person to cheat.
33:27
Maybe the person didn't have strong enough boundaries on either side.
33:30
And maybe there was a sense of lack of self-worth or insecurity
33:34
in the person that cheated. Maybe the person that was in the relationship
33:38
overgave and allowed the person to do things that they shouldn't have allowed
33:43
them to do. The affair or contact with the affair partner is
33:46
still going on. That can be a big problem. That may be a sign that
33:50
you may not want to stay or work things out. If the partner who strayed
33:54
keeps minimizing, blaming, or lying about details months later,
33:57
or months have passed with promises but no real change in behavior,
34:01
what are you sticking around for? One partner is punishing the other in ways that
34:05
looks like control or cruelty. So if you got cheated on, you can't be a
34:09
prison guard for the person that cheated. Maybe sometimes it's best to let
34:13
it go. Either of you feels— if either of you feels unsafe or emotionally
34:17
or physically, it's not a good place. And the kids, if they get pulled into
34:21
the conflict, it won't be good for either partner or the children.
34:24
Leaving after attempting to try is not failure. At least you tried.
34:28
Sometimes the most honest results of real repair work is sometimes you just
34:31
have to walk away. Even then, the work matters. It shapes how you
34:35
co-parent and how your kids see a breakup handled with dignity. For me
34:39
and my ex-husband, we are very amicable now, and I actually
34:43
enjoy that. I know he's been through therapy. I've been through therapy
34:47
on my own. And so I think that having an amicable relationship after
34:51
someone cheats is very important for the children. For what it's worth,
34:54
staying with some people is some of the hardest work you're ever going
34:58
to do. Some days you have to say, is your marriage more honest
35:02
now than it was before? Are your kids watching you fight or
35:06
are you guys getting more kind and are you proud of it? Now let's say
35:10
that you decide to move on. On and break up.
35:13
And dating after being cheated on is a
35:17
whole new ballpark. I want to talk to those of you who don't stay because
35:20
maybe you left, maybe they left, maybe you're single now, but you're trying to
35:24
trust someone again. This one's for you because when you open
35:28
your heart again to someone, you are being very vulnerable. And if
35:32
you got cheated on before and now you get cheated on again, it is very
35:35
devastating. Dating after being cheated on, it's hard in a way people
35:38
who haven't been through they don't always understand it. It's not
35:42
just your nerves, it's your whole alarm system. It gets rewired.
35:45
Here's what it can look like. You're going to be suspicious in the beginning of
35:48
good people. A new partner is a few minutes late texting you back, your mind
35:53
creates a whole story. You may test them, you may check their phones,
35:56
you may wait for the other shoe to drop. When things go well,
35:59
it feels like less happiness and sometimes more like calm before the storm.
36:03
You may compare things and you may self-doubt and you may wonder if
36:07
you're enough again. You may avoid, and swiping for months,
36:10
but never meeting anyone is an avoidance technique. If you want
36:14
to go on a date, but for some reason you just can't find anyone,
36:17
that's an avoidance technique. Or maybe you date people you're never truly going to
36:21
fall for because it feels safer. There's also the rebound,
36:24
jumping into a relationship too fast to prove you're desirable or to
36:27
drown out the hurt. A lot of people do this. I would say both men
36:31
and women, they get cheated on or they break up
36:35
with someone and whether they're the cheater or the person that gets cheated on,
36:39
they jump into into a relationship too soon with someone else, and that just makes
36:43
you feel less whole. None of it makes the brokenness go away.
36:46
These are protective reflexes from an injury, but it doesn't raise the big
36:50
question: how do you know when you're ready? There's no magic number
36:54
of months. Readiness is less about time and more about where you are inside.
36:58
Here are some signs you may be ready: you can talk about what happened without
37:01
being flooded with emotions. It, it still matters, but it doesn't take
37:05
over your whole body. You're dating because you want to share your life, not to
37:08
fill a hole or to prove something to someone else, you can still
37:12
see the betrayal as something your ex chose, not proof you're unlovable.
37:16
If you can't sit quietly with yourself, if you can't look yourself in
37:20
the mirror yet, if you feel a sense of a hole in your soul
37:24
or you feel unworthy, you shouldn't be dating anyone else because you're going
37:27
to put all of that into the next relationship. Sometimes you've thought about your
37:31
own patterns, like who you were drawn to and what you ignored,
37:34
without blaming yourself for their choice. You might be ready to
37:38
date then. I think that the more lessons you can garner from it, the faster
37:43
it helps you heal. You can give a new person a fair chance, letting trust
37:46
build gradually based on how they actually behave.
37:50
When old fears show up, you can notice it and say, that's the old
37:53
wound, instead of acting on it. You can feel okay alone with
37:57
or without the new person, not thrilled every day, but okay. And here's one
38:01
thing they don't tell you about. Sometimes there'll be red flags in your
38:05
next relationship, but don't second-guess awesome. I made that mistake in a relationship where
38:09
I was trying to make sure that I wasn't being triggered by my last
38:13
relationship and I ignored red flags. I wrote them down in my journal,
38:17
but I ignored them because I was like, maybe it's just me. Maybe I'm just
38:20
getting triggered because this person seems really genuine. And I ignored red flags.
38:24
And you may stick with your new person too long, even though you see some
38:27
red flags, just because you're still getting triggered from your last
38:31
marriage or relationship. So realize sometimes
38:35
the trauma can continue even when you see the red
38:39
flags, you second-guess yourself. And if that happens, you may still
38:43
need more time to heal. You may think about your ex or the affair partner
38:46
most days or check their social media still, and you're already in another relationship.
38:50
That means you're not ready to date. You're dating mainly to get revenge,
38:54
make your ex jealous, or prove you can. That's, that's not a good
38:57
place to be. You gotta love yourself first, honestly.
39:02
Self-love is so important before you get into another relationship.
39:05
You can't assume every new person will cheat and treat them like that, but also
39:09
you've got to keep your guard up because they might. And there are people
39:12
out there that do. You're telling new dates the whole story on your first
39:16
or second date about the affairs because it's still the loudest
39:19
thing in your life, which means you're not ready to date. You may feel panic,
39:23
rage, or numbness whenever things start getting close.
39:26
You may long to see your ex still. You're using dating,
39:29
sex, or constant attention to avoid feeling the grief. And if you're
39:34
the one that cheated, you may be using dating, sex, and constant attention to
39:38
fill up the guilt or try to replace it, but it doesn't go away.
39:42
If more of that second list fits right now, that's not a failure.
39:45
It's information. It just means you're not ready to date. You need some therapy.
39:49
You need to do some self-reflection. You may need to rebuild some friendships or learn
39:53
to enjoy your own company. There's nothing wrong with you. Enjoy yourself.
39:58
Learn about you and find where you need to heal.
40:02
Healing first isn't wasted time. It's how you avoid carrying the last relationship into
40:06
the next one. And when you do start dating, go slow.
40:09
Trust should be earned in small steps, not handed over all at once or
40:13
withheld forever. I made that mistake. I trusted too soon on my last relationship.
40:18
Notice whether someone's words and actions match over time.
40:21
Tell a new partner when it feels right that you've been hurt before and
40:25
what helps you feel safe. A good person will meet you with that patience.
40:29
If they don't want to meet you, that's okay. Just say next. Someone who
40:33
mocks you or uses it against you, that's important data
40:37
to collect. That's important things to understand. One last thing, being cheated on can make
40:41
you believe your, your own judgment can't be trusted and it can make you second-guess
40:45
everything you do, but you'll know you're healed when you start trusting yourself
40:49
again, not because you're sure nobody will ever hurt you because there's always a
40:53
possibility of that no matter what. People are really good at lying these days,
40:58
but because you'd survived it. You get to a place when you heal
41:02
that when someone betrays your trust, you survive
41:07
it because you have in the past and it makes you stronger. Sometimes you see
41:10
the betrayal much sooner and you just don't allow it. If you take
41:14
one thing from today, let it be this: whatever you're feeling or on whichever
41:18
side you're on, it has a shape and a name. The flashbacks,
41:21
the swings, the shame, the fear of trusting again, you're not crazy and
41:25
you're not alone. Alone. If you're a parent, your kids don't need you to be
41:28
perfect. They need you to know that there's— it's not their fault, and they need
41:32
to see you treat each other and yourselves with dignity, whether you stay together or
41:35
not. If you're starting over, take your time. The goal isn't to never get hurt
41:39
again. It's to come home to yourself first and to heal.
41:43
After an affair isn't about forgetting. It's about the pain slowly becoming
41:46
part of your story instead of the whole story. Thank you for listening.
41:49
Be gentle to yourself this week. I hope that you can heal in whatever
41:53
ways you need to. I wish there weren't people out there that violated
41:57
our trust. And cheated, but there are. So you just need to
42:01
be aware of that. You need to protect yourself and you need to
42:04
decide what you're gonna do if it ever happens to you in the future.
42:07
Nonetheless, as you get stronger, you have less and less of a chance
42:11
of meeting those people that have low integrity and low values. You will eventually
42:15
attract the right people to you that will love you more than anything.
42:19
I wish you love. I wish you joy. I wish you happiness, but you need
42:22
to become love first. And become your own joy and your own happiness.
42:26
This is Diva Mia. Have a wonderful week.
42:31
Thanks for tuning in. Like,
42:35
subscribe, and drop a comment. We love hearing from you.
42:38
Visit thedivadetails.com to connect.
42:42
See you next week for more.
42:47
Diva Details podcast and website are intended solely for informational and entertainment purposes. The content
42:51
provided does not constitute professional medical, financial, or legal advice. We are not licensed medical
42:53
practitioners. Financial advisors, or legal professionals. Always consult with a qualified
42:57
healthcare provider for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Any financial topics discussed are based on
43:01
personal opinions and experience and should not be considered professional advice. The content provided does
43:04
not constitute legal advice. The Diva Details and its affiliate contributors and guests are not
43:06
liable for any losses or damages arising from use of our content. The opinions expressed
43:09
in the podcast are solely those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the
43:11
views of any affiliated organizations, sponsors, or partners. All facts discussed in the podcast are
43:14
researched and accurate to the best of our knowledge at the time of recording.
43:16
Information may change over time. No guarantees are made regarding the accuracy, completeness, or reliability
43:19
of any statements or opinions presented. It is the responsibility of the listener to verify
43:21
any and all facts that may influence their decision. This podcast is for information and
43:23
entertainment purposes only and should not be considered professional advice.