Latest / Edan Haddock - Total Talent / Why Talent Acquisition Leaders Must Stay on the Tools

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Why Talent Acquisition Leaders Must Stay on the Tools · Edan Haddock - Total Talent

• 0:51
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to Eden Haddock Total Talent.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: I'm your host, Eden Haddock, Head of Talent and People Experience at Movember.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_00: This podcast is where I get real about talent acquisition, talent management, and leadership in our industry.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: It's not about polis theory, it's about what actually works when you're in the thick of it.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: So today's episode is about something that's really defined my leadership style, and that's staying on the tools.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't mean just knowing how to source or run an interview, right?
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: I mean actively doing it.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: Even when you're sitting in a leadership seat, having a seat at the table, I have always actively maintained my craft.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: Because here's the reality: credibility is earned, not given.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: And the best way to earn it as a TA leader is by proving you can still do the work, not just talk about it.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: We'll cover today while proving your craft, why proving your craft early on matters, why ivory tower leadership is dead, how AI is shaking everything up, duh, the big talent trends I'm seeing in 2025, and how succession planning connects internal and external hiring.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: I'll also share a bit of my own journey, how I've kept myself on the tools across every leadership role.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: So here's the thing.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: When you first step into leadership or leadership into a new role, people are watching you.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_00: They want to know: can you actually deliver?
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_00: Do you really understand the challenges your team faces?
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: Or are you just another person with a title?
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: I've seen leaders step into roles and immediately try to remove themselves from the work.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: And almost every time it backfires.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_00: And that's not exclusive to our interview.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: But the reason why it backfires is because their team quickly realize this person just doesn't get it.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: Let me give you an example.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_00: Early in my career, I stepped into a leadership role where the organization had major hiring challenges, hard-to-fill technical roles, budget constraints, very skeptical hiring managers.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: But instead of rushing straight into strategy mode, which I easily could have done, I picked up a portfolio of those roles myself.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_00: I sourced, I ran interviews, I sat on all of the interviews, and I closed candidates.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_00: And because I was on the tools, I could then walk into leadership meetings and say, here's what I've learned.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: Here's what the market is telling us.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: And here's the strategy that we need to pivot towards.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I didn't jump straight into strategy.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: I had the data to back it up.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: So that's a very, it's a completely, I'm gonna say a completely different conversation to presenting a generic strategy with no grounding.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: Being on the tools also makes you a better partner to the business.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: When a hiring manager tells you this role is impossible to fill, you can respond with empathy because you've lived it.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: You felt the rejection emails, you've had those late night sourcing sessions, you know the grind.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how you build trust.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: And I then want to lead into leadership.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to talk about ivory tower leadership.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: We've all seen it.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: The leader who spends more time polishing decks than engaging with candidates, who measures success in KPIs, but never speaks to a candidate or a hiring manager directly.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna call it that style of leadership is finished.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: Why?
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_00: Because today's organizations move too fast.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: Our technology moves too fast, our ways of working and our change moves too fast.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: If you're not close to the work, you can't adapt quickly enough.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: You'll make decisions that sound good on paper, but don't actually work in practice because you're not living it.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: And then your teams, they see straight through it.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: If your team doesn't believe you understand their challenges, why would they trust your direction?
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: And I'll be blunt.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: Respect in talent acquisition leadership isn't commanded, it's earned.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_00: And the fastest way to lose it is to sit in an ivory tower and expect your team to do what you can't.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_00: If you want to be effective today, in 2025, you need to lead from alongside and not from above.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: I talked about technology and I talked about AI very briefly just there.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to shift gears into something that's really rewriting our playbooks.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: And that is the AI revolution.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: As we know, AI is already in everything.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's in our sourcing platforms, our chatbots, scheduling assistance, skills assessments.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: Some vendors even promise AI can basically replace recruiters altogether, right?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_00: Here's the spoiler, it can't.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: But here's what AI can do: it can cut down time to hire by automating repetitive tasks.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: We know that.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: It can help you identify candidates you might never have found manually.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to devote an entire episode to that.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: It can provide insights into patterns, like which candidates are likely to accept an offer, where are they from?
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: What is their background?
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_00: What is their industry?
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_00: And it can be full of surprises.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: But, and this is crucial, if you're not on the tools, you won't know which AI tools are actually adding value and which I just hype.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: I've been there, I've been there recently.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: At Movember, we tested AI for screening and scheduling.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_00: Some of it works brilliantly and saves hours.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's what we implemented.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: But some of it that we explored creates bias, misses nuance, or it's just annoying for candidates.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to get it right.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: And if I wasn't hands-on, if I wasn't testing it myself, I wouldn't be able to separate the value from the noise.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: So here's my advice: don't just delegate AI to your team.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Encourage play.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: This is a big thing.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_00: This is experimental.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: This is play.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: Learn it.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: Experiment with it.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: See where it makes sense and see where human judgment is still essential and amplify that human experience.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's critical.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: The play is critical.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: We need to get in there and experiment because this ain't one size fits all, and this is changing fast.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_00: And really, because your credibility as a TA leader in this era will depend on whether you've understood the tools that you're recommending and the tools that you're implementing and the tools that you have on that strategy.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to talk about the trends, right?
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_00: These are the trends that are everywhere.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: Every report is going to tell you these are the trends.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm not breaking new ground here, right?
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm kind of reciting what you already know.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: But the big trend, number one, skills over credentials, finally, hey, I'm not talking skills-based hiring, I'm talking skills over credentials.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: And there are so many benefits to this.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: I am just going to go really, really quick, short, and sharp.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: Companies are finally realizing degrees don't always equal capability.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: The focus is shifting to practical skills and most importantly, potential over experience.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: And then we've got trend number two.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: We're all talking about it.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_00: We've talked about it for years, internal mobility, duh, right?
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: Organizations are under pressure to grow talent from within.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: We know that.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: Candidates want career pathways.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: We have to flex on what that looks like.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_00: The ladders are gone, the ladders are dying, the ladders are going to continue to die throughout the AI revolution.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_00: So leaders need to make sure that internal talent isn't overlooked.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: And we are looking at breadth when it comes to career development.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_00: We're not looking for that next step up.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: And we need to experiment and explore that early on in their journey within an organization so that is crystal clear and forms part of our employer brand and EVP because that's the future.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: The future is breadth.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: The future is change.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: The future is flex when it comes to role design and career pathways.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: Our CEO described it as a jungle gym rather than a ladder.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I completely agree, and it's stuck with me, and I love it.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I continue to explore that.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: Trend number three, candidate expectations.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: We know what they are.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_00: We see the drivers, we see the reports, whether they're coming from Seek, wherever they're coming from, right?
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: The candidate drivers, flexibility, well-being, and purpose, they're just not perks anymore.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_00: They're baseline, flexibility, well-being, purpose.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: That's what's drawing people in.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: If we ignore them, we'll lose that great talent.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_00: Data-driven TA, we've talked about it for over a decade.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: But now's the time that if we're not doing it, we got to do it.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: Because we need that data for AI and we need it for transformation.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: Leaders are expected to bring insights, not just intuition.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: Which channels bring the best hires?
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: What's the return on investment on recruitment marketing?
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: Data has all the answers.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: But again, you can't lead on these trends from a distance.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: You can't talk about skills first hiring if that's your game, if you've never interviewed for skills.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: You can't drive internal mobility if you're not part of succession conversations, if you're not leading the talent management process, or at least playing a part, or running it in partnership with OD and business partnering, however it looks for you.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to be at the table.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: You can't understand candidate expectations if you never actually speak to candidates.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: These trends all demand leaders who are grounded in reality.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: I want to dive into talent management and succession, and I will again devote a full episode to this because it's huge and it's important.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm seeing all the workshops that are being run, I'm seeing people publishing articles, I'm not seeing the practicality of how teams are rolling with this.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm going to talk you through Movember's process in another episode.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: But too often, TA is treated like an external service.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: You go out, you find candidates, you plug them into roles.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: Traditional TA.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_00: Meanwhile, talent management is seen as a separate HR function.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: Career development, succession planning, internal growth.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: But in the best organizations, those aren't separate.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: They're connected.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: And that's where partnership plays a huge role in this.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: Because when you link them, you start asking smarter questions.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: Does this role truly need an external hire?
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_00: Who internally is ready or nearly ready to step into this role?
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: If we do bring someone in externally, how does that impact internal succession?
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: This as a baseline is where TA leaders can step up.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: And there are further steps to go.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: There is so much insight here.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: But this is a baseline.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: You're not just fit filling the roles, you're shaping the future leadership bench.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_00: At Movember, this is something I've been really deliberate about.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_00: Making sure hiring conversations don't just focus on who can we get, but also on who can we grow.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: Because we're passionate about that breadth of position and breadth of position design.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: And getting that balance right is critical.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: And let's be clear, it's not one or the other.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: You need great external hires to bring fresh ideas, but you also need internal growth to reward loyalty and build culture.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's that element to it as well.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: And great TA leaders can orchestrate both.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_00: But I don't think we are being educated fast enough in terms of how we can do that and how we can bring this to life.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to bring all of this together.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: Being a talent leader today isn't about choosing between strategy and execution.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's about proving you can do both.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: Execution is strategy in action.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's not mutually exclusive.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: The future belongs to leaders who can roll up their sleeves, who can demonstrate credibility, who can balance vision with delivery.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: Leaders who are willing to stay close to the tools, whether that's running a search, testing AI, as I mentioned earlier, or having those tough conversations with candidates or hiring managers.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: This has been my approach in every leadership role.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: And you know me, I never claim to have all the answers.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_00: But I do know this.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: The more you prove your craft, the more trust you build.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: And that trust is the currency of leadership.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: Before I wrap up, I do want to take some time to talk about something that often gets forgotten when we obsess about tech trends and metrics.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the human experience for candidates.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: Because at the end of the day, no matter how good your strategy looks, no matter how slick your AI tools are, if the candidates are walking away feeling like a number, you've lost.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: And this is important right now.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: Let's face it, job hunting is emotional, it's stressful, it's uncertain.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: It's often tied up with someone's sense of identity and security.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's their health.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: As TA leaders, we sometimes forget that behind every regime is a human being.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: A human being who's nervous, hopeful, and maybe even a little scared.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_00: And again, this is why being on the tools matters so much.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: When you're the one picking up the phone, when you're the one crafting an email, when you're the one talking to someone about their career, you're reminded of the human stakes in our work.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_00: An Industry 5.0, the AI revolution.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_00: We need to amplify our human skills.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: We need to show more care and more empathy.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: And you bring that awareness back into your leadership.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: I'll give you an example.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: At Movember, we've been very intentional about making sure our process doesn't feel like a faceless machine.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: We use AI to speed things up for sure.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_00: We have an AI agent, Joel, and he helps with phone screening.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: But when we pair that with genuine human touch points, simple things like personalized feedback, personalized applications, people embedding Spotify playlists, or conversation.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_00: Lame stat, we've all heard it, but it all sticks with us, right?
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: The research that shows that candidates who have a positive experience, even if they're rejected, are twice as likely to recommend your organization to others, right?
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, we all know.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: We've said it for so long.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_00: And that's employee a brand you can't buy, right?
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: So for me, what does great candidate experience look like?
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: It looks like clarity, being up front.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: It looks like respect, treating every candidate's time as valuable.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_00: It looks like empathy, remembering the job search is a vulnerable time for people.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_00: And most importantly, it looks like authenticity.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: Bring your true self to the table.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: It is critical in this new world we're moving into.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_00: Critical.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_00: We need candidates to actually see and feel what our culture is like.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: And you are the person that is the custodian of that.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: You are that touch point.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_00: I always tell leaders we don't measure time to hire, we measure time to respect.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: And how quickly we show our candidates that we value them.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: And here's the kicker.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: If you, as a leader, aren't involved in the candidate journey, you'll miss this completely.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: You won't see where the friction points are, you won't feel the tone of your comms and whether they're connecting.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_00: You won't experience what it's like on the receiving end.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: So my challenge, as it's always been to TA leaders, is to run through your own candidate process and put your CEO through the candidate process, put your hiring managers through the process.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone needs to apply for a role at your company, see how it feels, and ask yourself, would I want to be a candidate here?
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: And of course, if that answer is no, and there will always be tweaks, fix it.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: Change it, experiment, redesign.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: Because the future of talent leadership isn't just about filling roles.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: And this is so important in the world of AI.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's about building human experiences that leave people feeling respected, whether they get the job or not.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: And that, in my view, is one of the most powerful reasons to stay on the tools.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: So thanks for sticking with me on this deep dive into why TA leaders should stay on the tools.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: We've covered proving your craft, avoiding ivory towers, the AI revolution, emerging trends, linking TA with talent management and succession, and the importance of staying relevant.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: And we finished where it really matters: the human level, with experience.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_00: Again, TA, leadership in TA, it's not about filling roles, it's about shaping experiences, building trust, and leaving every person who touches your process feeling respected.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: If this resonated with you, please share it with a fellow TA or HR leader.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_00: Hit subscribe, keep the conversation going.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's been great talking to you again.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: Until next time, stay on the tools, stay human, and always, always do good.