Latest / The Standard / Substance over Sizzle — The Truth About Athlete-Agent Relationships | Ep. 33 Justin Brashear

Transcript

Substance over Sizzle — The Truth About Athlete-Agent Relationships | Ep. 33 Justin Brashear · The Standard

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_01: Alrighty, cool.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_01: Well, team, welcome to the standard podcast, where we raise the bar, we rebuild the culture and call out the lies or misconceptions that nobody else will.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: This isn't motivation, this is a movement.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Thomas Rowe, hosted by I'm Thomas Rowe, and today we're with my host, my co-host, Aaron Charles.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_01: And today we're sitting down with Justin Brasher, a former collegiate and professional baseball player who now works exclusively with athletes as an attorney, advisor, and agent.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: Justin is an NFL PA certified contract advisor and the founder of College Athlete Consulting, a platform designed to educate and empower the next generation of athletes.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: Justin wrote the book, literally, on athlete-agent relationships.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: His book, Substance Over Sizzle, is a starting point for any athlete looking to build a healthy agent-athlete relationship and take control of their career trajectory.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_01: He's also the host of Now It's Legal, a sports law podcast, where he breaks down the legal and business sides of sports that most athletes never learn until it's too late.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: What makes Justin unique is that he's lived both sides.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: He's played the game at the collegiate and professional level and now represents athletes who are navigating the same journey.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: He understands the pressure, the promise, and the pitfalls.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: And he's committed to making sure the next generation of athletes don't get taken advantage of.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: We're diving into the truth behind what it really takes to build identity, discipline, and legacy in sports and in life.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: Let's get into it.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the Standard Podcast.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: Justin, we're super stoked to have you here.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you guys for letting me be here.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's uh it's an honor to be to be on the show, and and I've enjoyed getting to know you guys, so I look forward to it.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_01: Right on.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: So let's jump right in.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: You played college and professional baseball, and now you're working as an attorney, advisor, agent exclusively with athletes.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_01: What does raising the standard mean to you and what you're with the work that you're doing?
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it's a great question.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_02: I think that, you know, largely, you know, what athletes deal with these days is is not a lack of information.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's more of an abundance of misinformation.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_02: And so what we really predicate ourselves on and what we're trying to do in the uh in the representation space is really more educate people and empower people to understand what is out there for them, the right questions for them to ask, the things to look for, you know, the green flags, the red flags, and even sometimes the beige flags, but just giving them an opportunity to really understand, you know, what that relationship should look like.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_02: And it's not a uh it's not a it's not one where it's you know, I'm I'm the person who's been there and done that and lived it, and I have all the education and experience, and I'm gonna tell you what to do.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's hey, we're gonna go through this process together, we're gonna operate with extreme honesty and transparency.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_02: You're gonna, you're gonna guide the ship.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just gonna help you get all the information you need to help put you in the right course.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_02: So for us, it's a it's about you know, athletes are athletes have long time, you know, for a long time been told to shut up and play ball.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_02: And nowadays, especially with the the advent of NIL, there's so many more opportunities for for young players to come along and establish themselves as business people, as as entrepreneurs, as you know, community members, before they ever play a, you know, play a down or face a pitch in the you know in the batter's box or take a free throw.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_02: Just gives them an opportunity to sort of get out there.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: Right on, no doubt.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: And what would you say is the biggest lie that you feel the culture of the sports industry has sold athletes about agents, contracts, and protecting their interests?
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: I think the biggest lie that I see repeated is that the grass is greener somewhere else.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_02: The transfer portal is is certainly something that is is a wonderful thing when used correctly.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_02: But I've seen far too many athletes be led into the portal with bad information, misinformation, clickbait, you know, this is what these numbers actually are with people that don't know what they're talking about, people that don't understand how to how a roster is actually built and don't understand the the, you know, in college sports, the academic piece behind it.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I mean it's important to graduate because if you don't graduate, then what's the rest of your life going to be like when you're done playing?
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: So sure for us, I think that's the that's the really big important thing is that we want to make sure that you know athletes make decisions for themselves, and those decisions are based on real good, solid information.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: Right on.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_01: You also wrote a book, Substance over Sizzle.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_01: What does that title mean and why did you feel it was important to write the book for athletes?
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, thank you for that.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_02: So uh it was a fun project.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I was approached by a publishing company and and and really started working through it.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't I didn't have any real idea where it was gonna go when we got started with the project, but it sort of evolved alongside of my preparations for you know representation and transfer portal.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_02: But reality, man, looking back on my career, you know, like I was a blue chip recruit coming out of high school.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I I played at, you know, I could have I could have gone anywhere in the country.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_02: And so I was set through a lot of a lot of recruiting pitches, you know, I set through a lot of agency pitches.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: I hired an agency, I fired an agency, I hired another agency.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think that, you know, besides my own personal experiences, watching teammates go through things, you know, the the industry, again, going back to the lie, right?
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_02: It's always but the grass is greener somewhere else.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: The reality is that there's a lot of what we call sizzle, right?
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like the pitch decks and the cool, you know, the cool logos and the cool gear that guys get and the you know the swag bags that get sent out for you know camp or whatever it is, those things are great, right?
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_02: But the reality is, is your agent actually doing something to further your career on the field, off the field, you know, are they handling things in your personal life, or are they using your skill set as a player to make themselves look good?
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_02: And that was really the that's really where the question began because so many times, you know, we get caught up in situations where we talk to we talk to young athletes and and you know, the ones that we're fortunate enough to represent, like they get that, you know, they get that we care, they get that we are, you know, we're strategic business partners with them, and it's not sizzle, you know, like if if you know I text, I have several players who were in with this massive polar vortex that came through, several players that are in places that were snowed under, you know, and I was dead serious about bringing generators to them or or sending food to them or whatever it was.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's something that's important.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's you know, when you go back and look at a career after you played and you think about the times that, you know, my agent was there.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: You know, my agent was there when I got married.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_02: That was that was a big deal for me.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_02: My agent was there, you know, when I got released and and you know, had opportunity provided for me.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_02: And my agent was there for me when I didn't even know he was there for me, right?
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_02: So he negotiated a deal that got me, I left school early, so he had the rest of my school paid for.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: So I graduated from college for 700 bucks, you know.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_02: Those kinds of things are are are informative into my life as an agent now, based on what I went through in the past.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: And so those things are, like I said, that's the substance behind the the relationship that's really there.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_02: The sizzle is just when you come in and you have a really fancy pitch deck or you have a you know a fancy logo or something, you send somebody, you know, all kinds of uh gifts and stuff like that.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_02: That's again, that's nice, but are you actually doing your job?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: And so the name of the book kind of evolved, you know, it started out.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: My initial thought was the concept of no wild pitches.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_02: So when I was playing ball, I thought I was fortunate to play for Coach Mike Bianco at Old Miss, and I was a catcher, so he was extremely hard on us.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_02: And he had this theory that there's no such thing as a wild pitch.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_02: So that means, you know, if a runner is on base and a ball gets behind the catcher and the runner takes another base, it's either going to be a pass ball, which is the catcher's fault, or it's a wild pitch, which is the pitcher's fault.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_02: And under Coach Bianco's mindset, everything that got past you is your fault.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_02: And so it was a it was an accountability thing, it was a preparation thing, it was a communication thing.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, all those things are very much, I think, have made me into the person I am.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: They made me into the player that I was.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that that process of going through that, the substance behind some of those, some of those opportunities and experiences has allowed me to have a much better second career than I had as a first career.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_02: My first career was great.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I played longer than most people play.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_02: I was drafted twice.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_02: I got to do a lot of things in the game of baseball that not many people get to do, but my second career has been a lot better.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: And so the idea behind the book was really to bring that to light and to allow young athletes the opportunity to read it in their own space and time and to empower themselves to know that you're allowed to ask questions on your own behalf.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_02: You're allowed to make sure that you're comfortable with the person that you are hiring to go out and to try to help you, you know, achieve your career goals and dreams.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_02: So that was really the basis behind it.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it goes back to the main issue.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: I see.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: I see too many young people get taken advantage of and lied to with bad information, you know, and and and whether it's ill-intentioned or not, it's irrelevant.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: If, you know, once once the cat's out of the bag, it's it's done.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_02: So it was really important.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's it's also really important for me, Tom, to help people understand, like, you know, the transfer portal, if you look at the stats on the transfer portal right now, there are thousands of players who no longer are playing football.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_01: That's right.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_02: Because they didn't have, they didn't do the work they needed to do, or they or they trusted someone to do the work and that wasn't done properly, or you know, whatever reason is.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_02: But the reality is like you need to have that information, that's substantial information you need to have before you make that type of decision.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_02: And though that concept applies to everything you do in life.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, it was it's it's a it's a life lesson that's given through the lens of sport and and a little bit of some fun stories.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna turn it over to Aaron for segment two, which is identity and legacy.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_01: Aaron, take it away.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, Justin.
• 10:31
  SPEAKER_00: I want to know who Justin is beyond all the accolades, everything that we've talked about.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: Just who are you and what are the most important values to you?
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_02: I am I'm a child of God, first of all.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: I am a I'm a husband, I'm a father, you know, I have I'm a family man.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: I I, you know, I I really that's why I do the things I do.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_02: You know, as a as a lawyer, I was successful, but it got me to a point where I wasn't really there mentally or spiritually or emotionally like I needed to be for my family.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so I decided to sort of get away from that.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_02: I I operate with extreme transparency and integrity.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I I like to build teams, I like to work with people, I like to actually get a lot of I get a lot of satisfaction watching other people accomplish things.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I like to help them.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: I like to help them do that.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I'm a I'm a believer in in the good in the world.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a believer in the opportunity that sport brings to people.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: And and I'm very fortunate and very blessed and very humbled to be in the position I'm in.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: I love I have the same desire as I love seeing other people when it's so fulfilling.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I what I love about you is you've lived both sides.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: So as an athlete, you've navigated the system.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: And as an advisor, you're helping athletes navigate the system as well.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: So, what does legacy beyond contracts and deals mean to you for these athletes?
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I I said this that long ago, and I think it's probably the easiest way to say it.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I want to take care of the grandchildren that my clients don't know about yet.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: So I want, I want to make sure that these young people are understanding the opportunities they have placed in front of them right now to set the course and trajectory for their life.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_02: And if done correctly, you know, their grandkids may never have to worry about paying for college or or have to worry about, you know, little things that go on.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_02: That that's just the way that the the sport industry is these days, the kind of money that can be uh earned.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: But then it's not only about that, it's about retaining it and it's about putting it to use for your family.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and a lot of what I do with the athletes I work with, I do in my own personal life.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_02: You know, my my both of my children have college savings funds, they both have 401ks or IRAs, whatever.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: I don't, I don't know.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_02: Actually, I send the money to my investment people and trust them to do their jobs.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_02: But they're taken care of, right?
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_02: And so I'm working for them right now.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: And for me, that's what it's about.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I also really like to work with athletes who like to make their communities better, whether it's their hometown or wherever they're playing.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we we want to make a difference and we want to leave an impact wherever we go.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, I encourage, I encourage my clients to read to the schools, go to the churches, you know, find the nonprofits, find the food banks, whatever it is, and donate time, talent, treasure, whatever, and be a part of the community.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: Because again, you know, the game, the game is great, but the game ends for everybody.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: And so you have to have some of that humanity that is built in.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, I I think back about my favorite, my favorite messages even now are the ones I get randomly on, you know, Instagram or or whatever.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_02: And it's a kid that, you know, when I played 20 some odd years ago, his mom was like, Hey, you saw here's a picture, you signed this autograph for my kid, and it made his day.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_02: It was another, it was a Tuesday for me, but for that kid it meant a lot.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_02: And so, yeah, having experienced that and then being able to turn around and see these young people that I'm fortunate to work with now going through that again, it's really fun to be able to highlight those opportunities for him.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: So, hey man, like this is a big deal for these kids.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: You know, this is something that's gonna that they're gonna remember forever.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_02: And so, yeah, legacy again, like I said, is is is about the next generation, it's about who's coming behind you and leaving something better than you found it.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_00: What?
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: So your platform's called College Athlete Consulting, and your mission is to educate and then empower the next generation of athletes.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: I would love for you to tell our audience what separates athletes from those that succeed and maybe those that don't.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_02: I think the most important, the most important telling factor in whether an athlete's gonna have success is the six inches between their ears.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: You know, every time, every level you go up, the game's gonna get faster, the people that you play against are gonna get stronger, they're gonna play more competitively, it's gonna be tighter, it's gonna be cleaner.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: But it's about how you can prepare, how you can overcome the adversity, how you can deal with some of the some of the, you know, you go from being the guy or the or the star player, the the girl, like her, right, on your team.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: You go to college, you may be the backup for a couple years.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: And you go to Pro Bowl, you may be, you know, it may be a couple years before you before you actually make it.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: You have to be mentally tough enough to deal with that.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_02: You have to continue to treat yourself and prepare like a professional.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think that's the biggest thing that a lot of people don't think about because everyone's so focused on you know the physical side.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_02: I want to get faster, I want to get stronger, I want to get quicker.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's all necessary.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_02: But I think what truly separates elite athletes and elite performers more so than elite athletes is their mental capacity to continue to move past the adversity they're gonna deal with.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like I represent NFL caliber offensive linemen.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_02: That is a 100% injury rate position group, right?
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_02: So for us, it's you know, the preparation of our athletes to get their bodies in a position where there's they're flexible, they're strong in a lot of ways.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: You know, their body is their body is hydrated, their body is rested, their body is well nourished, and then they go play the game, and they play the game in a in a way where they're the ones that are bringing the violence to the to the opponent, right?
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: And then after the game, we we go straight into recovery, we go straight into film, we go straight into getting better and learning from what we learned, you know, learning from the the experience we had on Saturdays and Sundays.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_02: And that mentality carries over every week and every month and every year, those guys get better and better and better.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_02: And so I think the biggest thing for athletes these days, like I said, it's the six inches between your ears.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_02: And that's that's warfare most of the time for a lot of people.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, it is.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's the hardest game, I think, for all of us to master.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: What's one truth that you wish every athlete, parent, or coach, I think, just understood about I think the landscape of athletics today?
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_02: That's a great question.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um I think that I think the reality is uh, you know, and I think people know this, but you know, when you're when you're building a team, whether it's you know, from a coach that's recruiting players or the player that's trying to put people around them, or the parents who are concerned about the people who are around the athletes, I think that inherently most people are gonna do what's in their own subjective best interest.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_02: And and and that's there's nothing wrong with that.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: I think that if you understand that going into it and you figure out a way where your subjective best interest aligns with the subjective best interest of the people that you're working with or playing for, you're gonna have a much better relationship and experience throughout that process.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_00: That's such a great answer.
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, I'm gonna turn it back over to Thomas.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right on, Justin.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, we're getting into segment three, the advice across all stages.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_01: So if you can sit down with yourself as a young athlete navigating the recruiting and professional process, what do you wish someone had told you about agents, contracts, and protecting your interests?
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_02: Man, that is a great question.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_02: Not all agents are the same.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, not all agents are bad.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that the most important thing, it kind of goes back to what I just told Aaron is that you know you have to make sure that the vision and the process with the people that you're gonna work with are gonna align.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's very difficult in the in the agency process, particularly on the NFL side, where you're trying to build relationships with players over a three to four month window when they're in the middle of playing their season.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_02: And you're trying to build a relationship of trust and of understanding because you are now working together to establish someone's career at the next level to help them achieve a goal and a dream.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_02: It relies on a very trustworthy relationship.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_02: I think if if I could go back as a player, I would probably tell myself the most important thing.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I and look, this is I Coach Baco is one of my favorite people of all time.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_02: I love him to death.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm actually very thankful there was not a transfer portal when I was in college because it forced me to stay through some adversity.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: But if I could go back, you know, I I sat the bench for two years pretty much.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: I was a backup, I had to earn my right to be there, and I did.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_02: But I think that if I would have done it now, I would have probably gone the JUCO route where I could have played, I could have guaranteed that I was gonna play every day because that way you can you you can continue to work on your skills.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_02: You can't do, I mean, you can do a lot in practice.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: You can do a lot in the filming, you can do a lot in the weight room, you can't do as much as if you're actually playing on the field, right?
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: So go somewhere where you're gonna play, give yourself opportunity to develop as a player, as a person, and then let things happen as they're supposed to.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_02: I was in such a hurry as a player, you know, and I think that's got a lot to do with sort of where I came from, right?
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_02: Like I came from a championship environment in high school.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I played for Team USA, won a gold medal.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_02: Go to college, we're winning a lot of games.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: And for me, it was always like the logical next step was to just get to the next level.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_02: When the reality is, I should have enjoyed the process a little bit more.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_02: I should have slowed down, like slowed down, taken my time and really paid more attention.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_02: And so that's a lot of a lot of those lessons, Tom, are what I try to help the players that I work with nowadays, right?
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_02: Like, please don't make the same mistakes I did.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_02: And like I said, I don't have any complaints about my career.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_02: I had a phenomenal career, but I didn't achieve the ultimate goal.
• 20:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I think a lot of that was largely because of the mental incapacities and the rushing through things and not really paying attention to the things that really matter.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_02: Again, going back to the substance over style thing.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, the the the substance over sizzle thing, right?
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_02: Same concept there is, you know, I think that's probably what I would tell myself as a younger player.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_02: That's probably pretty much where I wrote the book.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: That's badass because that is so true that both Aaron and I experienced that as well, is we want athletes to enjoy the process.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone is in such a hurry to get to the next level.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: And what's interesting is what the next level is for you could be something entirely different for me.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: So staying close to what your athletes and families are looking for is awesome.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and on top of that, too, I think that I have a lot of respect, a tremendous amount of respect for athletes who understand that, you know, the NFL or Major League Baseball or the NBA may not be for them.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_02: And their ultimate level is college sports.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's a that's a beautiful and wonderful thing.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_02: I had several teammates who were like that in college, and I think they had a much better experience than a lot.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Us who are trying to get to the big leagues.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_02: And so, you know, and nowadays in college sports, there's so much opportunity, not only from you know NIL and revenue sharing, but there's so much exposure to the athlete now.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that again, a lot of what we talk about is like, hey, you know, if if this NFL thing doesn't work out, let's put you, you know, when you're thinking about schools, let's find the best alumni network or let's find the best on-campus ministry, let's find the things that really matter to you as a human being.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: Let's find those, let's highlight those because it's gonna make your experience better as a player.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_02: If it doesn't work out, you know, if you're if you're part of the 99.9% of people who play football that don't get to play in the NFL, then you're gonna need to fall back on these experiences, these opportunities around you that that are not always there in other places.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: And so again, slowing down, realizing what's out there, being more open and and and available for some of these sort of conversations in the community, I think is a huge advantage for college athletes today.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_01: No question.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_01: You mentioned substance over sizzle again, and I really want our audience to understand this because it's almost like an owner's manual.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_01: You wrote substance over sizzle as a starting point for building healthy athlete-agent relationships.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_01: What do you think are the red flags athletes should watch out for?
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's in the book.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I and I'll get, I mean, I'll give you some of it.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: I think that the number one thing for me is like when I when I look at a situation, and I'm not trying to knock this at all.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: Like, let's let's let's be clear about this.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_02: I have a lot of friends who do, you know, I go, I do it, I take pictures with the players, I'm on the field, I do the thing too.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: I think when it when it turns into a like this is the player that we represent, but that player is more of an asset for us than we are for them, that is a red flag for me.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_02: Got it.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_02: You know, so you see situations where, you know, an agency is gonna pump out all the players that they represent, and they're never gonna tell you anything else besides that like flashy situation right there.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, they're gonna go on the field, they're gonna take the picture, they're gonna post it immediately.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_02: I'd rather send that to the kid's mom, say, hey, I'm really proud of him, right?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_02: He's worked hard to achieve this goal.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_02: This is something that's special and it's a something for your family.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_02: I'm thankful that I was uh I was available and I was able to be a part of that process for him.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_02: A little different, right?
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_02: Like still taking pictures, still there, doing the same thing, having fun enjoying the game, enjoying the work.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_02: But the what you do with it is a little different.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_02: I think that uh one of the first things I would ask if I was someone who was looking for an agent is I would want to know background, I would want to know credentials, I would want to know education, I would want to know certifications, and and are you insured?
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_02: Are you licensed?
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_02: Are you bonded?
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I think those things matter more than who you represent or who you have represented in the past because every player's circumstance is different.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's great to know that people have had opportunities in the draft or you know, gone through free agency or whatever.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's fantastic.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: But that player that's sitting there, you know, hasn't been through the draft yet, hasn't been through free agency yet.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_02: Like their their situation, their their book's still being written, right?
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think what matters there is like, are you of sufficient, you know, background to understand the full concept of what's going on?
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_02: Can you communicate with me clearly enough to understand my goals as a player and what my family's looking for here?
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_02: And then are you capable of executing it, right?
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's a multi-step process.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that if someone's dodging the questions about their education, about their background, and they're shifting it back into, oh, well, look what we did for X player here or X player there, great.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like, but that's a red flag to me.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: Sure.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_01: No question.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: All right, let's get into segment four, the rapid fire round.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna turn it back over to Aaron.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: Aaron, go ahead and take it away.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: Can't hear you.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: You're on mute.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_02: Nope.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: Nope.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_01: Can't hear you.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: Let's try it one more time.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_01: All right, I'm gonna take it.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Here you go, Justin.
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_01: A little curveball for you.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_02: I like I prefer hitting fastballs, man.
• 26:12
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna send you a rope.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: What I'm gonna do is I'm just gonna fire off a word or a sentence to you and just go ahead and kind of free free-for-all finish it out.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_02: Discipline equals preparation.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_02: I I think it equals commitment and it takes sacrifice.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_02: Leadership equals man, you got to be willing to do what you ask people to do for you.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_02: Or I think I think leading from leading from the front, you know, is important rather than leading from behind.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_02: I used to, uh, you know, when I when I was in really starting my practice, my my law practice, and even before when I was practicing law, you know, I would run, you know, my team of paralegals and whatever.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_02: And, you know, I I wouldn't I wouldn't ask them to go get something off the printer or send the fax.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_02: I would go do it.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I took the trash out.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_02: I would work on the weekends if I had to, and I would try to make their life better.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_02: But I think it takes it's it's more of a it's more of a push than a pull, right?
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: Faith equals everything.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_01: Everything, right on.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, everything, man.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: I I look, there's there's not a day that goes by that I don't try to spend a substantial amount of time in prayer and in and thinking about really focusing on gratitude, the things that I'm really fortunate to have.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I look at my life and and again, like from a from an achievement and accomplishment standpoint, you know, I'm very proud of what it is.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_02: I've still got work to do, but you know, I I go home to a beautiful wife and two healthy children.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_02: I've got a roof on my head and food on my table.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'm a very lucky man.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I and I'm faithful and I'm appreciative that what's coming in the future is going to be even better than what I've experienced already.
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: Legacy equals leaving it better than you found it.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_02: Right on.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's from the time I grew up, you know, going the first time I remember the first time I went to uh a cattle ranch when I was a kid, you know, riding the four-wheelers or whatever, and you go through the gates and you open a gate and you leave a gate open, the cows are getting out, and that's a problem, you know.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_02: So you have to leave it better than you found it.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_02: If the gate's barely close, you better lock that sucker up.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_02: You know, if the cows don't have hay, you better go give them a bail.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_02: You know, you gotta leave it better than you found it.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_01: What is one thing you would never compromise on?
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_02: The truth.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, good or good, bad, or indifferent, I think that people need to know that, you know, and I go back to my experience as a player.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_02: Like when I got released from my contract, I'll never forget that conversation.
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_02: And and I'll never forget the I'll I tell you this, I'll never forget the hard conversations I had as an athlete.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_02: I remember when when Coach Bianco, you know, we went through some things and talking about my position there at Ole Miss and what it was going through.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, he distinctly told me, hey, you're a you're one of our best players, like physically talented players, but you're not one of our best nine players as a group.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like that's that's interesting to hear as a kid, right?
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_02: As a 19-year-old kid, you got to figure out what that means and put it in place and continue to work.
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_02: You know, when I got released from my professional contract, they just said, Look, man, you were a consummate professional, everything you did.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: This is a numbers game.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_02: And you can do one of two things.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_02: You can you can say, screw you guys, I'm gonna go play for another team and show you, or you can turn the page and go live the rest of your life, you know.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I and I respect I respect that conversation still to this day because I, you know, if if I'd have been lied to, I would have maybe chased something that wasn't real, you know.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_02: And so to realize that, you know, what it was was was was important to me.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_02: So I'll never sacrifice the truth.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_01: Right on.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_01: And what's one message you put on a billboard for athletes about protecting themselves?
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: What is one message you put on that billboard?
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_01: Educate yourself.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_01: Got it.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you're smart.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, look, you go to school, right?
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_02: At least at very bar, bare minimum, you're going to college somewhere.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_02: You have very smart people that are around you.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_02: You have people in the building that generally care about you as an individual, whether they're your coaches or your academic people or your teammates or the trainers.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_02: Talk to people.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_02: Understand what goes on in the greater ecosystem around you, right?
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_02: Understand who the people are that are coming in the building and what are they coming in there for.
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_02: You know, make friends with the equipment manager, make friends with the trainer, make friends with the, you know, like educate yourself on a bigger picture because once the game's over, those people are going to be part of your life still.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, one of my best friends to this day was an equipment manager at Old Miss.
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's awesome.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_02: We talk regularly.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, had I been just so focused on playing baseball and not worrying about meeting people, I wouldn't have my life would not be as as as you know enriched because of him.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right on.
• 31:09
  SPEAKER_01: All right, from uh rapid fire to the hot seat.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: What are Justin's top three sports movies of all time?
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_02: Man.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I I gotta go with I gotta go with the Sandlot at the top.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_02: That was that was something I grew up on, man.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_02: I watched the sandlot all the time.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_02: It was fantastic.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I still I'm trying to get my sonny's four.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_02: We're starting to kind of get into that.
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_02: I think I grew up on the little giants was a great one, too.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_02: And then, man, maybe the Mighty Ducks trilogy.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_02: I gotta put, yeah, I gotta get I gotta get Gordon Bombay in there too.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_01: Right on.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_01: Justin, thank you so much for your time.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_01: But before we let you go, where can people get a hold of you?
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_01: Whether it's a website, an email, or anything.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_02: Sure, yeah.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm on Instagram.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: I have a personal Instagram, JS Brashier, college athlete consultant is also on Instagram, www www.college athlete consulting.com.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_02: Best place to get me is one of those.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_01: Right on.
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: And team, substance over sizzle is available on Amazon.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: Justin, you're a total rock star.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: We really appreciate you sharing your time and your truth.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_01: And if this conversation challenged you, inspired you, and made you think differently, share it, team.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: Send it to an athlete signing their first contract, a parent trying to protect their kid, a coach helping athletes navigate representation.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_01: This is the standard podcast.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: This is a movement that only grows when we raise the standard together.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_01: Talent fades, truth endures.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_01: Let's raise the bar, let's rebuild the culture, let's become the standard.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see you next time.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_01: Justin, Aaron, thank you so much for your time.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: Really super appreciate it.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_02: Love it.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you, guys.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_02: Appreciate all the work you're doing.
• 32:57
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks so much.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_01: Awesome, Aaron.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_01: You're still recording there?