Latest / Exit Algorithms / From Chiropractor to Roll-Up CEO: Healthcare, EOS & AI | Dr. Justin Brown (#39)
Transcript
- speaker-0: Welcome to exit algorithms, the podcast where we decode what it really takes to unlock growth, streamline operations and prepare your business for a high value exit. I'm your host, Pete Vera. Today, Dr. Justin Brown is in the building. He's a turned serial entrepreneur, owner of friends and family spinal care, CEO of Sir Bigger Collective. and co-founder of I Help Moms, an on-demand parenting platform connecting experts to parents globally. Justin, so excited to have you here. Welcome to the show. speaker-1: Pete, this is awesome. I'm glad to talk about building businesses that matter and how to build value in those businesses and ultimately how to exit those businesses to certainly make a lot of money and also ⁓ a huge impact and make a difference. speaker-0: Yeah, absolutely, Jess. I'm really excited to have you in particular with your background. know, I don't meet a lot of, well, you'll be my first doctor on the show. So But I think it's not all that common for people in the medical field to ⁓ have a ⁓ entrepreneurial itch like you have. I'd love to share, if you don't mind, can you share a video about your background and your journey? speaker-1: Yeah, I I grew up in a family of business owners, a couple of generations of business owners and kind of just scrappy, hungry people, you know? And so, you know, I think our dinner table conversations were probably a little bit different than the average. And I also happen to have this kind of passion for science and for hands-on healthcare ⁓ found chiropractic through... ⁓ it helping me in my experience, you know, getting back on the field as a soccer player and then ultimately, ⁓ regaining my, my energy. had suffered with chronic fatigue syndrome and I found this unique type of care called upper cervical chiropractic care. And so that was kind of that ⁓ ⁓ ⁓ slash entrepreneurial spirit. kind of combined with the healing arts and healthcare chiropractic. So they ⁓ of came together, which uniquely kind of positions us where we're at right now. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, awesome. Wow, okay. it was started your journey or at least into the chiropractic niche was a trauma event, sounds like, which shocker was soccer. speaker-1: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I just collided with one of my best friends, really, and ⁓ his head smashed into my chin and ⁓ ended up with blood all over my shirt and I got ⁓ my chin stitched together. so that was like, first thing was like, okay, ended up getting stitched up and all of that, but I never really had any problems that I knew of ⁓ otherwise with my health. ⁓ ⁓ There was definitely a trauma, there was a whiplash that happened inside that because it kind of came up from underneath almost as like if you imagine, you know, like an uppercut to the chin. So my head snapped back, my neck whipped back and I had an injury to my upper neck but I didn't really feel it, right, for a long time. And so the doctors who I had seen at that time didn't have training to really check my alignment. of my neck or look at my nervous system, it was more of, well, you're not bleeding anymore and you don't pain, so you're fine. Right. And so years passed on and ⁓ I started dealing with severe fatigue issues. ⁓ asleep through the day, like multiple times through the day, scared drive at night ⁓ out fear of falling asleep at the wheel. And ultimately fell asleep at the wheel. But these were. Uh, really all of the things that led me to find this unique type of chiropractic care called upper cervical, uh, you know, of the 75,000 chiropractors, about 3000 in the world practice this style. And so it's not very well known. Um, and so it's, it, but I found the help with this because it was this really scientific based system of measurement and very specific, gentle scientific alignment. And then ⁓ this series of measurements that happened throughout my care that really were able to clear out that stress to my upper neck really open my nervous system. So I was able to, you know, feel normal. Like my body could heal actually, and I could get deep restful sleep for the first time in a long time. And so ultimately that was my journey to kind of finding this ⁓ and okay, well, this is clearly my calling. ⁓ And really what I've done for the last 20 years. Really ever since I've graduated. So yeah, it's been 20 years and We start started out in Seattle, Washington practicing underneath the really top-notch doctor and got a lot of great training and then Set up my practice here South Florida, which is where our headquarters are ⁓ ⁓ we have since trained right around 35 chiropractors in our headquarters and were sending a lot of those carpenters out to ⁓ kind start their own practices and that was great. And then we ultimately reworked our system to really take care of our people. And I think that's one of the things that oftentimes business owners don't do is they'll grow these people underneath of them, but then they don't necessarily grow them in a way that they feel taken care of to the sense where they're like, well, why would I even leave? Because I can actually be taken care of. better as a intrapreneur, like inside underneath this umbrella without the risk. So mitigating risk, maximizing upside. so people do find that out. They'll leave and try to go do it on their own. And they may do it, but they might go, gosh, I kind of liked it better the way it used to be. And so I know if you're a business owner and you're listening to this, you're probably thinking, yep, I remember this guy. I remember this great sales guy. He did awesome with us, he made great money, had all the flexibility in their schedule, but tried to go recreate it and for one reason or another wasn't able to do it. I mean, we all know those stories. So we got smarter about our comp structure and really kind of figuring out how to take care of people. ⁓ since that time, we've acquired three, we actually acquired a couple offices, started at De Novo office, like a new office, sold those back 22. And then we ended up in the last 10 months, we've acquired three offices ⁓ we have plans to acquire another here in the next five years. speaker-0: Yeah, wow, exciting. awesome. Yeah, love to hear the origin story because I feel like that's really important to ⁓ having long impact. You first experience what a it your life for the better and now you get to do that to ⁓ thousands of of I love that. speaker-1: Yeah, and that was the hard part for me really kind of stepping up as a CEO, you know, I only have four hours of patient care anymore now, Pete. So it's like, okay, I had to really get clear in my head, I can help a lot more people by not putting my hands on people. And that was challenging, right? Like I know E-Myth talks about that, right? I don't know if you've ever read E-Myth or revisited, but it's like, listen, you can be great at baking pies and you can have the best pies in town. But if you want to know, spread your pies across the US, you got to get out of the kitchen. that's you know, where we've made that transition. And so I'm to really support the doctors that are in our organization. have 15 doctors currently in the organization. So a lot of my time is supporting them. And the other pretty 50 % of my time is ⁓ in, you know, and flow and ⁓ that piece. ⁓ Yeah, it's definitely a transition that people have to go through from being the person that's doing it all, doing all the marketing, doing all the sales, doing all of the actual providing of the service, right? All those pieces stepping up and ⁓ away ⁓ and kind above that day to day and really leading, right? So what I realized is I had to really... up level my leadership skills in order to be able to get to that point because I was just used to doing it, right? A lot of us that are our business owners, we're just super highly effective at getting it done. We can just go by sheer force, we can just make it happen, but that's unscalable. And so, you know, by really getting better at leading and taking care of people and working with people, we've been able to... then kind of get to where we're at now. ⁓ with a hold code, like we have a holding company overseeing essentially managing shares. And then we've got our MSO, which is like a managed service organization, which is where we have our CMO, our CFO, our controller, and a few others that allow to service the entities. And then the entities. are operating companies and the entities or the chiropractic offices that, you know, we're able to support them and grow them. so it's good. And it's interesting because we, you know, I just got back from HPE, which is healthcare private equity. One of the, think it's the biggest from what I understand down in Miami. It's one of the really the McDermott puts it on and McDermott. did a great job, really. They did a tremendous job putting this on. But they put all the private equity, investment bankers, family offices, kind of they put them together and then they bring businesses like me. And so we start to have these conversations. And one of the things they're interested in is like, what's your growth post acquisition? They want to know, do you have some secret sauce? Because if you just acquire, but you're not growing after acquisition, It's just almost taking on like more stress, more headaches, more people without more upside, right? And so they want to know, okay, like, do you have operational excellence? Do you have something unique or special about your company that going to make it scalable and then also ⁓ essentially extremely valuable? speaker-0: Yeah, got it. ⁓ that's huge. I love that. Yeah, actually like to go into that a little more, ⁓ it's so top of mind for you. Do you mind sharing the maybe start with the kind of the overall strategy for listeners that might not be super familiar with the nuances of EBITDA arbitrage through acquisition. I'd love to hear. ⁓ sort of your thesis behind your holding company and your overall strategy. speaker-1: Yeah, so mean, is very fragmented, meaning that there's been very little kind of organization collectively. So it's a lot of ⁓ individual practice owners, ⁓ a of people that are really good clinicians, people that are really, you know, passionate, highly passionate, not necessarily super high level business ⁓ acumen. so, but there's just been lack of consolidation and organization. So it really creates this problem for doctors that they don't have transitional value, meaning they lot it like ⁓ of those practices don't really sell. They ultimately they close the doors or they're passed on in the family, which is fine, right? That's obviously great for legacy. But that's the issue in this industry. And so people aren't getting good value. They're working for 25 35 55 years and they're getting really really poor valuation if anything at all So most don't actually get sold which is a problem and I saw this happen my own mentors I saw this happen with a lot of different people so it had been poorly demonstrated and I'm sure those other industries that had the similar scenario where that that happens frequently so ultimately saw this problem and ⁓ also realize our product is really good and our presence is really poor. we have really high quality product, highly effective, high-stance, super safe, but the visibility and I would say the usage as a whole is relatively poor still. And yet there is this upswing of people that are super interested in health and wellness that are interested in strategies that they can implement for their family to get well and stay well. You you've seen obviously this kind of post-boom, ⁓ boom, and people that are like almost turning their back to sort of the traditional medical model in a way and saying, ooh, I don't know that I can really trust the medical model anymore to give me the best information about my health. Just kind of based on their experience of what they've gone through over the last decade. So people are now leaning more into strategies for natural health and wellness, ⁓ that's exactly what we provide. So that's really the essence of ⁓ product. But again, our presence, our market share is really poor. So you have this huge total addressable market, right? Our TAM is big, but our presence is small. So there's this huge gap. There's this opportunity, right? speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: And yet there's poor organization. So by getting organized, by coming together, we professionalize the product, we can improve the delivery, we can maximize the delivery, we can improve our marketing, we have greater resources. And so the thesis is that we're stronger together. ⁓ that by coming together, our valuation goes from really small, really poor or non-existent to ⁓ strong. speaker-0: Mmm. speaker-1: really scalable and really valuable. ⁓ And so what's happening. know, private equity loves health care. Private equity loves predictable ⁓ money models. equity ⁓ likes fragmentation. So essentially, whether it's private or family office, which is probably more fitting for us, speaker-0: Hmm speaker-1: You know initially anyhow that you know that they they really like this type of industry they like this business They like seeing certainly retention and Recurring revenue, which is really what what our model is so They ⁓ they really like type of business, but it does take professionalization It does take organization. It certainly takes you know high quality care, it takes great providers, it takes people that get it. So a lot of what I do is educate because most people in my industry don't really understand this idea of enterprise value. They don't understand this idea of taking ⁓ a one or two X multiple and taking that to eight or 12, right? Like there's nothing we can do in our business that's gonna eight X our business like in the next three, like you're probably just not gonna eight X your business, right? Like if you do awesome, you're going to have a lot of enterprise value. But if you can't do that, which is most industries that you just in all likelihood, you're not going to 8x your business organically, this is an opportunity to do so. So it's a great opportunity for our partners that come on board and get access to enterprise value. and they don't have access to enterprise value without coming onto our platform. And so that's the secret sauce right there. And so I think there's a lot of business owners that still don't fully understand that. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, that's a crucial concept right there. speaker-1: to crucial concept. speaker-0: I love it. Yeah, so not only is it a huge opportunity in the marketplace for your customer or clients, there's also a big opportunity for owners as well of chiropractics like your niche, ⁓ upper right? speaker-1: Correct. Yes, exactly. So this is a huge opportunity for people in our niche to not only one, be a part of something that's going to just improve our access and our presence in the marketplace. We're building the premium chiropractic brand, like hard stop. So we're building that. And then the other piece of it is that Yeah, they're going to tap into some value that they just wouldn't otherwise have access to. And it's an exit pathway. So people don't have an exit plan. Nobody has an exit plan in my industry. And there's probably a lot of industries like that. I don't know if people in the HVAC industry or in the logistics industry, do they have clear exit plans? I don't know. a lot of people in my industry don't have an exit plan because they love doing what they do. Right? People love doing what they do. It's extremely rewarding to do what we do. And so they kind of begrudgingly don't think of it. They sort of put their head in the sand and kind of think it's going to work out. And 80 % of the time it doesn't work out. this is a great pathway for people to be able to continue practicing because people stay with us. don't you know, buy and kick them out. You know, that's not the way it works. We acquire and we keep them on board ⁓ ⁓ a pathway forward for them to continue doing what they do and optionality, know, and it's good to have options. I always say it's really good to have options. It's good to make decisions out of inspiration versus desperation. So, you know, we create some optionality, we create a pathway forward, we create the ability for people to continue to practice. So it's kind of unique in that sense that they're actually kind of getting multiple bites of the apple right out of the gate because they're getting the benefit of the acquisition, but they're getting the benefit of continued salary, continued upside, continued profit share. And then they also get this access to this exit valuation, which is just tremendously different than what you can receive as a solo practice in the marketplace. speaker-0: Yeah, wow. Yeah, it's really a win-win for everybody. speaker-1: Patients also, right? Like it's a when you've got these patient base that really on that doctor. mean, they become part of their life, ⁓ part their healthcare strategy. And if that practice closes, those people are left high and dry. And that's problem. we always say we put the patient at the forefront patient-centric care, and then ⁓ we're care of our providers. So our providers get taken care of. And then we also, clearly are taking care of our shareholders. So ⁓ shareholders are taken care of. So it's really, it is, it's a win for everybody around ⁓ so it makes sense. speaker-0: Yeah, definitely. mean, and you prevent a bunch of layoffs, right? Employee layoffs, like they've been working for at that facility for 20 plus years and then all of a sudden have to find a new job. It's just unnecessary, right? If you can provide an easy, easy way out. Exactly. speaker-1: Yeah, exactly. I mean, and then it just kind of goes out saying, you know, there's the economy of scale that come in, you know, when we're able to actually, you know, get together with, you know, top marketing and put that together, it makes a lot more sense. you know, you just got more buying power. We don't have a very large cost of goods sold, like our COGS is super low, but essentially, you know, it does allow for a community. It's a mastermind. So rather than us being in silos, having to try to make these business decisions where we're sort of throwing stuff at the wall or trying to get advice from this person and then to this YouTube expert and then talk to this advisor and then go to AI, it's really like, it's meeting of the minds. It's this mastermind, which is kind of what we have at DMSWS. mean, like ⁓ we get right? We have a little bit of a community there. But that's what we get as far as Inserv bigger is that we have these calls and we're able to share ideas and share best practices and work through challenges together. you know, we're just by and large, you're going to make better decisions. You're going to have more effectiveness when you've got a community. I mean, we're seeing we're literally doubling practices within six months. So it's pretty wild. mean, not not every practice is doubled, but a couple of them have. post-acquisition. So people are having more fun. I'm a big proponent of team sports. played sports, love sports, and just more fun to do things together. ⁓ And got diversification if something happens in city, another city can kind pick up. You know what I mean? it's like, if I'm not draining three pointers that day, I can pass it low and ⁓ my center is going dunk it. speaker-0: Be honest. speaker-1: Right? So it's just you create this community, you're creating diversification, you're creating, you know, essentially increased value, increased value to patients. know, we backfill offices and hire so we don't have ⁓ single point of failure. So, you know, we we build in redundancies and, ⁓ ultimately we're able to take care of our people better, right? Because when we, when we're able to do those things and grow these practices, there's to take care ⁓ of. of the people and if the people are taken care of and we align incentives, then they're happy and that's important and we gotta really take care of the people that work with us. speaker-0: Yeah, man. Yeah, that's exciting. Um, yeah, you know, I love Justin, if you could share a bit about your, you know, go a little bit further into that process of scaling, you know, from your first opening up your own practice to, you know, hiring more employees. Were there some, uh, what were some of the challenges you had in, in jumping past and giving more responsibility to people so you can focus working on the business? speaker-1: Yeah, I think lot of it really just comes down to humility. ⁓ lot of times, like, and I was there, it was like, ⁓ well, nobody can do this the way I do it. So have to have that. think ultimately it's becoming a better leader of people. So they have to start with humility and go, you know, there's probably people that can even do this way better than I can do it. And so I think that's the starting point. You know, it's training systems. Training systems are vital. If you don't train your people, they don't know what to do. And if they don't know what to do, they're not going to be effective. a huge proponent of training, have training systems. Training isn't people on board do. ⁓ I completed my training. training is something has to happen all the time. I mean, I'm a CrossFitter. If I want to be fit, I have to keep training. If I don't keep training, I'm ⁓ not going to very fit. ⁓ My body doesn't what I did a year ago. It cares what I'm doing today. your business is the same. ⁓ has to be continually trained and and skilled. ⁓ I people all the time, hey, what's one skill you have that's being underutilized? What's something either great at or passionate about or want to learn that would have a significant contribution towards mission? you know, people come up with some stuff, right? And, know, it's all sudden you've got, you know, more design work being done. You've got people using AI. You've got better comp structures. You've got, you know, whatever, whatever it is. mean, so there's lots of, there's lots of ways to, really kind of become better leader for your team. The piece I would say is, I mean, you need to have standard operating procedures. And the thing about those is that they do change, right? They change all the time. So when you learn how to do something better, you change it, you up-level it. that's it. mean, tech stack is a tricky part for us right now. So we're tangled in our tech stack. there's opportunity for us to improve that. But just trying to utilize technology to the best of ⁓ our and ⁓ really the team to use AI as much as possible. I know that's something you're passionate about as well, Pete, is really kind of getting people to understand the use cases. Right, people don't use it because they're scared of it or whatever their story is around it. But once they kind of understand it, you can't not use it, right? It's just like either use or get left behind. ultimately getting team to like really adopt, ⁓ know, that and making that the culture. I think as a leader, you got to be a culture driver. You know, as you get bigger, it's easy to lose kind of the ⁓ essence of. the brand of the business. so I think that's key. Meeting rhythms, like we follow EOS. that's been a big part of our growth is following the entrepreneur operating system and some of the principles that we've learned through traction and getting our meeting rhythms, ⁓ weekly, know, same page meetings with our leadership team. Certainly we have, you know, monthly meetings with our clinic directors. have quarterly meetings. So each of our clinics has quarterly meetings and they're clear on clarity as a gift, right? Clarity is kindness. So getting clarity around, where are we going? Why are we going there? And what's your role in getting us there? if people have that, you're going to probably be a lot more effective. You're probably going to get there a lot faster. If you don't know that, if the employees don't know that, if the team isn't aligned, they're clocking in or checking out. So it's really a matter of kind of getting everybody rallied around the vision, them clear on what their contribution is towards that vision, and then having some level of accountability towards making sure we're hitting the mark under not necessarily like a pressureful environment, but an environment of encouragement and support and pressure if necessary. And being able to let people go if it just doesn't fit them. I, you know, people in my industry keep people way too long. We try people, we think we can fix them because we're like, you know, kind of this idea of this white knight, you know, ⁓ syndrome where we can, we'll serve, we'll help them, we'll grow them. And then like, it's just not a fit. They're just not the right person for that seat. So we'll tend to carry like a dead weight way too long and it drags down the company. we, you know, just being okay releasing people. Necessary Endings is a great book I read that really helped me to realize that people that aren't a good fit for our company are a great fit for other companies. It doesn't mean they're bad people. They're just, it's a bad fit. And any of the people that we kind of grumble about, well, who hired them? Well, I did. So it's my fault. And who trained them? Well, I did, or my team did. So I'm gonna look at where's the gap, what's the problem? And then just constantly creating a compelling future. People need to have a compelling future. If they don't know where they're going, they're not interested, right? They're gonna go find somebody who's got a more inspiring vision with a compelling future that they can see themselves in. And so I think that's really the piece. So all these things are really around people. I don't know if you heard that. That's the kind of thread is really people on leadership. And that allows for scaling. speaker-0: Yeah, wow. So many good nuggets in there. That answer. Thank you, Justin. I love it. Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say. That team element, actually mentioned it earlier, but it just comes through. And, ⁓ know, as you talk, you can see how it is at every single step to emphasize the people on your team, right? speaker-1: It's yeah, it's really everything. I we were just as we're as strong as our people. We're a people organization that take care of people. so, yeah, mean, ultimately, it's us attracting super high quality people of high character and high vision alignment. So if we have high character people with high vision alignment, so vision and values, right? What are the vision and values? If they're both high, that's going to be a really strong. addition to the collective. If they're high character but sort of low as far as their competence on how to grow, then we can help them. We can serve them. If they're low character, we can't help them. That's just bad fit. If the values align, if we fundamentally ⁓ don't have the belief systems around what we do, why we do it, why it's important, then it's gonna be ⁓ lot of friction and a lot of stress that is gonna slow us down, especially at the pace that we're at right now. speaker-0: Got it. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense. and you mentioned technology is a big element too. I imagine you're uniquely positioned to start implementing since you have started a company before, right? You're involved with iHelp Moms? ⁓ speaker-1: Yeah, I help moms. Yeah, my wife runs I help moms. I had some involvement with the investor relations. outside of that, my wife runs this incredible app called I help moms.com. Check it out. Especially if you have kids 0 to 10. It's a very cool app. Actually, yeah. So she's been running that desktop. It's in the Apple Store. Should be approved this week. So if you're listening to this, you got to go please download I help moms.com free download. support Michelle Brown, incredible lady. yeah, her story is incredible. I mean, she was an orphan and got adopted by she's from India. She was so born in the slums of Calcutta, India. And so if you know anything about that, she had zero future, but ultimately got adopted. And so it was given to kind of a second lease on life. And ⁓ what ⁓ her own in having our first daughter wasn't what she and needed a lot of help ⁓ around the clock. essentially, realized that most people can't afford that or just don't have access to that. And so she created this app that basically gives you access to all these specific experts that can help with potty training and breastfeeding and sleep training and all these important things to make a healthy, thriving baby grow and thrive into a toddler and then ultimately into a healthy child. So yeah, it's a very cool app. You got to check that out. Yeah, technology is, I mean, obviously just integral to any of our businesses anymore. I don't think that you can run a super high scalable business without having a strong technology component. so technology, we run electronic health records. have certainly CRM's, client relationship management software. have marketing software. We have... Certainly our websites and our landing pages and Facebook integration and meta ads and Google ads and AI, all sorts of things happening on the back end. So yeah, we also have platforms we run our SOPs off of and those type of things. I've seen many of us are on Zoom all day. So technology is really integrated inside of our day to day. It's interwoven within our communication systems, all the things that are necessary to operate our business and keep things moving in the right direction. Technology is big piece of it. It's really a matter of how can we reduce the number of tabs that are open and the focus, which then increases our ability to be effective. So getting integration a big deal now. So we... You know, we're constantly looking at, our AI auto attendant, right? How's our AI auto attendant speaking into our online scheduling, which is speaking into our electronic health records, which is speaking to our reporting systems. So you can see how this starts to get pretty convoluted pretty quickly. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, for sure. lot of noise. ⁓ speaker-1: Yeah, yeah. So, you know, technology is great. It's just, you know, matter of getting it to all work together. speaker-0: Right. speaker-1: So that's something we're working on Pete and ⁓ it's evolving, mean, tech has changed drastically in the last 12 months, 24 months. So yeah, I mean, it's constantly evolving and AI is infiltrating every single system at this point. So yeah, it's really interesting. I'm kind of curious how you're implementing AI yourself with your systems and your business. speaker-0: Yeah, for sure. I I'm not surprised at all to hear it's really at every part of business. think it's required no matter what business it is. You said, for example, because you're just a service-based business and still is heavily reliant on technology on all the back end. Yeah, I use it every day, hours a day. I'm on a Perplexities browser, Comet right now. I engage it to generate ideas, to bounce things off of, to help me draft things. yeah, it's become a really just makes you a better, you know, able to do a lot more 100 % every step of the way. speaker-1: Yeah, yeah, it's just an effectiveness tool, right? Like it's an efficiency tool. It's an effectiveness tool. And that's really interesting. I love to learn more about how you're, you know, some of the use cases and ⁓ I haven't dove into perplexity too much yet, but I've got a combo of chat, grok and ⁓ ⁓ right now. But, you know, it's just trying to find what's the best platform for use cases. And then to ⁓ potentially even get them to work together, right? So that's another idea. It's like, how do you sort of get these all to work together? So we're using Claude and plod. don't know, plod is another thing. we are utilizing even our EHRs now, like listening to conversations, taking notes for us and that type of thing. So yeah, it's a wild west in AI. It's very interesting and fascinating time. It's a wonderful time to be alive, that's for sure. speaker-0: A hundred percent. Yes. Yeah. And the use cases just keep on growing. you know, like the more you use it, the more you realize other that you can start using it for that'll just make everything more efficient. ⁓ less mistakes and yeah, easy to get overwhelmed with the amount of tools ⁓ available. I'm already, yeah, there's several subscriptions that you end up paying for just because it increases your by so much. ⁓ Right. Right speaker-1: Yeah, it'll be interesting to see when people's AI spend almost, you know, like is like a salary. Right? Like it'll be a sound and maybe that's already, I'm sure that's happening. Especially as you get into agents and you get into all these other like, pieces that, you know, require credits and that kind of thing. It'll be almost like a line item, which is just like your AI employees. Yeah. never stopped working. Right. It's just constantly going. So that'll be interesting. I haven't, really drove into side of things. It's mostly a lot of. like idea efficiencies, pro forma spreadsheet, deal analysis, marketing ideas, even some integration with Canva, those type of things is a lot of our use cases. But I was building out this structure, this comp structure that is really going to be critical for us as we scale. it's like, just to be able to plug that in. I've used a lot with real estate because we have real estate as well. it's it's amazing the outputs and the time, you know, that you're creating amortization schedules, you're building in deal scenarios. you can just, your output is just remarkably better when you're, we're utilizing this. mean, even looking at financial analysis, plugging in balance sheets and P &Ls, it's just like. the amount of analysis and the speed of analysis, especially in due diligence, it's fascinating. really shorten the timeframe necessary to kind of crack into all these things. But at that said, you gotta know your stuff. If you don't know your stuff, AI is actually a tool that people are gonna get exposed with. Because people, what will happen is, Pete, I know we're gonna need to wrap up, but it's interesting, because people start AI-ing each other. And so the AI back and forth, what I found can actually slow deal flow to a halt because everybody thinks their AI is so brilliant, right? Oh, my AI is the best, right? Or my AI is the best. you got AI like negotiating or competing against AI and then there's no middle ground and then they don't, know, the parties may not even really understand what they're talking about. And so in the end, what happens is you get to the stalemate because AI doesn't necessarily have context. So if AI doesn't have context or if it has bad information, which I know everything on the internet is accurate, If it's getting bad information, right? Bad input, then it's going to kick out bad output. And so what AI ⁓ is generating versus reality, like what's real, can be different, like significantly different. so... speaker-0: Yeah speaker-1: I found it where even in calculations it's been inaccurate. I found that if you don't double check it or kind of really know the topic you're diving into, that it can put out wrong information. So I think that if ⁓ really know your topic, ⁓ really understand your inputs and you put in like very highly detailed prompts that you can... really get some tremendous output and it's a tremendous efficiency tool. just be interesting to see when all the AIs are all just working against each other essentially ⁓ it's just hard to gain any ⁓ traction when you've just got bots competing against each other. speaker-0: Yeah, for sure. Yeah, well, I agree with everything you just said. Right now, at least you need a professional to keep AI the rails as you research and draw conclusions. ⁓ we'll see it goes, right? They say we're only between the second and third base, ⁓ if it was a baseball field ⁓ in terms of AI progression. So like we're not even halfway through its total. speaker-1: Exactly. speaker-0: cycle of getting development. speaker-1: Wow, I would be surprised if we were in that first base. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. People say different, different things. Yeah. speaker-1: I guess the rate upon it's just exponential learning. So the is compounding. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: amounts of the inputs compounding, the users are compounding, the data is compounding. yeah, it's pretty, it's really, it's really fascinating to see where we'll be come, you know, 2030. speaker-0: Definitely. All right, Justin, I know we're actually right on time here. So I want to be respectful of your time. I've loved all of the inputs you gave, incredible takeaways. I just want to give you the floor. Any last words, and where can listeners find you easiest? speaker-1: Yeah, so the search can find me at Instagram at Dr. Justin Brown, certainly LinkedIn. Justin Brown, SIRTbigger Collective. If you wanna email Dr. Brown at Family Spinal Care ⁓ or at website sirtbigger.com. So yeah, certainly welcome to Interaction Engagement. Yeah, especially if you're a prospect, maybe in the car-pride industry, if you're hearing this and you want to connect, we have a lead forum right outside of bigger.com. yeah, we'd like to connect and then we get this big vision of ⁓ really taking our product to the masses ⁓ ⁓ up-leveling our impact. So I appreciate it, Pete. This was awesome. Thank you for the opportunity. ⁓ And looking forward to reconnecting with you on our next Mastermind. speaker-0: Absolutely. Dr. Brown, thanks for joining the show. It was awesome.