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To Introduce Our Guest Star - Episode Fourteen: Fran Brill · Muppet Fan Podcasts with ToughPigs.com

0:11
Hello, I'm Gareth. Barry Clough and I'm Johannes
0:15
and welcome to to introduce our guest star.
0:17
I'm up at Van podcast for tough things.com in this show, Joe and
0:20
I are taking it in turns to surprise each other with each
0:23
week's guests this week. It's me, well, I'm not the gas
0:26
for this week. I'm bringing the guests, they'll
0:28
be so dull, surprise, if And if you really disappointing, when
0:31
that book, anybody? It's just me.
0:33
And the mailer you guys. Let's talk about one time.
0:39
Well, Joe. Alright, well, real guest is
0:41
coming. Who's not me?
0:42
And Joe you have a chance to ask a few questions here.
0:44
Take a guess at who it might be. All right, let's let's start
0:48
this. This nonsense off, it went up.
0:50
It Sesame your Henson Sesame. Very little Muppet but there's
0:55
some up it in there. Okay.
0:57
Okay. Is this person a puppeteer Yes.
1:01
All right. I guess person has II mean that
1:06
definitely narrows it down some but not a whole lot.
1:08
There's a lot of Sesame. Puppeteers.
1:10
Yeah. Is this person currently on
1:12
Sesame Street? Like are they currently a cast
1:14
member? No.
1:17
Well, whoever I was thinking, it's not if you offend, it's not
1:23
that person. This person Works directly with
1:27
Jim Henson. Yes, I have one more, one more
1:31
guess, before I before I guess the name, this is going to give
1:36
it away. If the answer is, yes, yep, to
1:38
your knowledge. Did this person where platform
1:41
shoes while performing to my knowledge, I believe.
1:45
So, yes. All right, I'm gonna guess that
1:49
this person we're going to talk to you.
1:50
Today is the great Fran. Brill Joe my guest today is the
1:55
star of movies such as What About Bob and did not run, but
1:58
you probably know her best as that best.
2:01
Is that girl who was in love with a big blue frog on The
2:03
Muppet Show. Okay, so maybe not that.
2:05
But perhaps, you know, a better is Mary from Elmo's sing-along
2:07
guessing game. No, no.
2:09
What about disappear at Ron x-38?
2:12
That is a real character. She played are at finding, you
2:14
probably know our best at the first female Puppeteer hide by
2:17
Jim Henson in 1970, where she joined the cast of Sesame Street
2:20
and originated Rolls by Prairie Dawn, little bird.
2:23
And Zoe amongst the host of others.
2:26
She's one of the Legends Joe, would you please welcome to, to
2:29
introduce our guests are the brill the nth waka waka Fran
2:33
Brill. Here we go friend.
2:36
Thank you so much for joining us.
2:38
How exciting I go? Big surprise fix it.
2:42
Actually was a huge surprise. He was very excited.
2:46
I'm very excited. We've never done like, like a
2:49
full interview with you. I don't think we've done little
2:52
things here. Hold on your list, you're not,
2:57
not true, not sure. Why do we had to try to get you
3:00
the last season. But but but I had the wrong
3:03
email address. That's right.
3:06
We had some kerfuffle bear but I've never met him.
3:08
Jared, you come to the state's ever.
3:11
I've been to the steaks. I've been to the set of Sesame
3:13
Street, but I haven't been to the states in Over six years
3:19
now, really? Hoping to get there like soon.
3:22
Well, you know, there is covid. Yes.
3:25
So that really, that really messed up my plans.
3:29
Well, right, and you don't want to come here.
3:31
When you can't go see any theater or can't go to anything.
3:36
Exactly. We're supposed to go to New
3:41
York, which we usually do every year, and we see some friends.
3:46
And we go see like four shows And three days and we had, oh
3:52
gosh we had tickets to all sorts of things to the shows of now
3:56
closed. And then we're it ends up that
4:01
we're going to see Wicked again because we liked it so much
4:04
8,000 years ago. Whenever it first opened we saw
4:07
the original past and I'm just hoping we won't be disappointed
4:12
when we see the present cast because it's hard to beat
4:15
Kristin Chenoweth and Idina, Menzel.
4:19
But anyway, yeah, it's just messed up travel plans and all
4:23
sorts of stuff. But everybody's, everybody is in
4:26
the same state. This covid thing is so
4:29
inconvenient, I hate without the inconvenience of the whole
4:32
thing. Yeah.
4:33
Yeah, I think it's time for it to be over and move on and go do
4:38
something on mars or something. Yeah, yeah, really.
4:41
If only the ring feeder back because what we can't see live
4:45
theater. It is.
4:47
That's right, theater. Sure.
4:48
And then the restaurants and the hotel's, you know that a domino
4:52
theory is so bad for the economy of New York.
4:55
I mean it just goes on and on, but we have tickets to the music
4:59
man, which we got at least three years ago and then it didn't
5:04
happen. And then it didn't happen the
5:06
next season. And now their course, they're
5:09
this huge, the Gershwin Theater, and I mean, we have great seats
5:15
and they had problems. You know, when First open but
5:19
now knock on wood. You know, the show is it hasn't
5:25
opened yet, but they've been in previous and they haven't
5:27
canceled. So let's hope nobody is sleeping
5:32
with somebody, you know, out of the cast.
5:36
Well, I, uh, that's Hugh Jackman, right?
5:39
Oh gosh, yeah. I'm a big big fan.
5:42
My boy you? Yeah, he's my uncle.
5:45
That's not true. Um, well, he's He's Wolverine
5:48
and he has a healing Factor. So if he gets sick, he'll be
5:50
he'll be fine. That is if you know, I've never
5:53
seen his Wolverine, I don't like the picture of my Hue like that
5:58
I have seen everything else is one-man shows you know you name
6:03
it. I even took my niece to see who
6:09
flew in from Colorado to see you in his one-man show.
6:14
He was he traveled the world that to her it was like a few
6:17
years ago. Yeah, so we went to Atlanta and
6:20
saw his show their what a spectacle that was, but that,
6:24
you know, it's great. It's great seeing them live.
6:26
And, well, it's funny. I forget Hugh Jackman's famous
6:29
sometimes because he has a holiday hassle, literally 10
6:33
minutes from where I live. And so I'd say probably, once
6:37
every six months, you'll be at like a local shopping center and
6:40
Hugh Jackman walks past. And so next time I see him I'll
6:44
be like hey Fran Brill from Sergi Martin Please mention my
6:49
name. I'll do it.
6:55
Australia is like, you know, so he can live a life there if she
7:01
chooses to without being harassed.
7:03
Absolutely. We're a little bit more
7:05
excitable here in the States, you know.
7:08
But, you know, in New York people are pretty cool when they
7:10
see a famous person, you know, most beautifully.
7:14
Did you did you get recognized a lot when you were here?
7:16
Did you ever loving? Normal voice.
7:19
Here's look like when I well, I know I wasn't recognized as a
7:23
puppeteer I was recognized as an actress because I did a lot of
7:27
shows in New York. So in fact, I met my husband,
7:34
wait a few years ago and I we ended up talking.
7:38
He knew who I was, but it wasn't that unusual to have somebody
7:42
say, oh, you friend Bruno, and I'd say yes.
7:45
And I love you and such and such a play and And so he didn't do
7:49
that, but he knew I was doing Saturday Night Live at that
7:55
time. So we're talking about 1977 or
7:59
something like that. I'm not sure what year that was.
8:02
It was early on. Got a 75.
8:05
Oh, excuse me. You guys know everything.
8:07
I only I only know that because I actually pulled up your
8:10
character from Saturday Night Live and okay, so well that was
8:15
Joe and I were trying to discuss how to pronounce the name.
8:19
Bosch. Okay, let's vazh.
8:39
Yeah, I can remember what I did. It was probably some silly, high
8:43
voice. Again, what was it?
8:47
Like then for you doing, like, SNL had just started.
8:51
Like, I think you guys were the first things and what was that?
8:53
Like, for you guys performers, but I know, I know there's been
8:58
some like contention between say, you know, what, some people
9:02
think of, I think, was it one of the Riders referred to them as
9:05
the muck mucking fuch puppets? That's pretty clever.
9:11
Yeah, well it was just a bad bad, it was like oil and water.
9:16
The Muppet humor is nothing like Saturday Night Live humor and
9:21
they really didn't know quite what to do with us and he's I
9:25
can't remember if this was a handsome company script or I
9:30
think it probably was now just think if I'm not mistaken it was
9:35
under contract the S&L writers had to write all of the ethanol
9:38
content. Which is part of the problem
9:40
that you didn't have pens and people to this room.
9:43
Yeah. Yeah.
9:43
And so it wasn't really funny or clever clever, is better than
9:49
funnier. Anyway, and it was just, yeah,
9:52
it was just a bad bad match. But I had, we were kind of
9:56
really seriously in our own world.
9:58
We did not mix and mingle with a live performance for performers
10:04
and I don't remember much of it at all.
10:09
We gave it a couple performances.
10:11
I guess I unleash trackable this.
10:13
But anyway, you know, it wasn't even that big a deal because
10:18
Saturday Night Live wasn't that big a deal?
10:20
It wasn't like oh my God, you know where the guest stars, not
10:24
none of that. And that was all like this real
10:27
Stevens. There is only Bernie brillstein
10:31
just putting together. All this clients on to one show,
10:33
is that about, right? That's what I've always assumed
10:38
that. That's very funny.
10:40
I, you know, I never met him. Ten percent from everybody.
10:44
Yeah, clever. But, you know, the Muppets were
10:49
getting to be pretty big at that time.
10:51
Don't you think anyway? It just yeah it didn't mix very
10:55
well. But it also seemed like that was
10:57
the era in which Jim Henson was kind of putting together his his
11:02
real for what he wanted, the Muppet Show to be.
11:04
And it's like, let's just get on.
11:05
As many late-night shows, talk shows.
11:08
Variety shows looking out there and experience.
11:11
Yeah, he was doing a lot of talk shows at that time with Kermit
11:14
on his hand, which was completely forbidden for you
11:18
know, most of the time. I know his puppeteers.
11:22
We were told never to have our picture.
11:25
The puppet on our arm on our hand because he didn't want to
11:30
ruin it for the kids. And then you see him, you know,
11:36
Kevin is the one that broke that thing, apart completely, he just
11:40
said, this is ridiculous. You know, people know who we are
11:43
and whatever but you were you're always you could be interviewed.
11:47
I could be interviewed but not with, you know, a puppet It's
11:53
interesting. Let me give him good and it
11:55
seems like that. That sounds more like a sesame,
11:58
rule than an overall mother. Not that, you know, you're
12:02
probably right with the Muppet Show characters but you didn't
12:06
want to damage the children. Exactly.
12:08
Right. You know, freak out, is it?
12:10
You know, they don't freak out anyway.
12:12
They, when they come to the set, you've seen that I'm sure any
12:15
number of times they look at you, they look at the puppet and
12:18
then they just end up looking at the puppet and having a
12:21
conversation with the puppet. Yeah.
12:23
I don't do that. I still do that now.
12:26
Yeah. Right.
12:27
You're right. Even like I interviewed Kermit
12:29
has probably got about 18 months ago, Kermit over zoom.
12:32
And now Vogel had to tell me at one point.
12:34
Jericho be stopped my arms, getting saw and I was like, I
12:36
forgot you were there. Oh my God, you had him up for
12:40
ages and whiter long. I like, oh yeah, sorry, I forgot
12:43
you existed for a moment, right? Well, I got it.
12:46
I mean, I understand how that can happen.
12:49
It said, the magic I don't know and it's something that Can't
12:53
explain to people, they have to just experience it for
12:55
themselves. Right, that's right.
12:59
That's right. Yeah, it is.
13:02
It is some some crazy thing that happens when this becomes alive.
13:06
That's all and it's much more interesting talking to this than
13:10
to this friend. You are so interesting to talk
13:13
to you don't don't sell yourself short.
13:17
Actually I want to tell a story with a drink.
13:23
No one's actually ties into to the idea of you being recognized
13:27
on the street. I don't know if you remember
13:28
this years ago, I was my wife and I were on a game show.
13:34
We were flown out to LA and we're on this game show.
13:38
It was called The Idiot Test. It didn't last very long man, I
13:45
don't go he wants you can go Go onto Netflix right now.
13:48
I think it's still on Netflix and see us and we were flying
13:54
back to New York from LA and it was really late at night and
14:00
we're walking through the airport and it's like dead and I
14:04
seek a deer. I think it was JFK but I got a
14:13
couple walking toward toward me and there's again Many people
14:16
out and I go God that woman looks so much like Fran Braille,
14:20
but I just got my bets on the brain all the time then we get
14:23
closer and holy crap. It's friend real.
14:26
It was you. It was you and your husband know
14:31
you're on your way to Peru if I'm not mistaken.
14:36
Yeah. Is that nice?
14:37
Yeah, you were gonna hike Machu Picchu or something like that.
14:40
We we did go to Machu Picchu and we have Peru.
14:46
Vivian friends, because the husband the mail Park went to
14:55
got it, got his master's with my husband at NYU, so they were not
15:00
roommates for good friends. So they had invited us to come
15:05
stay with them for a few days. I'll give you an interesting
15:08
factoid about Peru. A bet you guys don't know this.
15:12
Do you know that you cannot buy an umbrella in Lima?
15:17
I did not know that. Is there a reason?
15:20
Yeah, it doesn't rain really, it never.
15:23
Looks like something you're not allowed to get a number Ella in
15:26
Lima. You just cannot find.
15:28
I thought I was gonna be one of those between my losses.
15:30
Yeah, it's very Misty all the time bad
15:44
for people with curly hair. I want like a poncho.
15:48
Not an umbrella. That is correct.
15:50
You probably don't even know. Yeah, for the day.
15:56
I love it. Well, in any case, so we stopped
15:58
doing some low and and we had signed an NDA saying we're not
16:04
allowed to talk about the game show or if we had won or lost or
16:07
whatever it was and I said you had asked us, how did you do?
16:10
And we went well you know if we're going to tell anyone, it
16:14
might as well be you. So we told you that we Had lost
16:17
miserably on this game show. So until they are there was only
16:21
one person who knew and it was terrible.
16:27
No, I don't remember that part of it.
16:29
I don't but I wouldn't have told anyway so that's that's funny.
16:34
I'll have to look that up. Yeah, idiot.
16:37
Enjoy watching us. Lose on the idiot test.
16:39
It's spelled with one t. So idiot EST.
16:43
One word. I'm pretty sure it's a terrible
16:45
title. Isn't a good show the episode
16:48
your face. If I remember I think the screen
16:50
grab is my face. Yeah so you won't have to watch
16:52
them all. We can just watch the Joe
16:55
episode where he failed miserably.
16:57
That's right. Oh, dear God.
16:59
But how come you and your wife did it at the same time?
17:03
Was it all? We were.
17:05
Yeah. It was all couples or like it
17:07
was Couples or sisters or roommates or whatever they're
17:09
all in pairs. Yeah.
17:12
Okay. Yeah.
17:12
Because that's very unusual and look, we flew us out to LA for
17:18
free and like I mean I won in that in that case already, like
17:21
if we didn't come away money. Yeah.
17:24
So, It's all right. Would you ever go on another one
17:27
of these shows? Again, I would absolutely go on
17:30
another game show and and because I did it once.
17:33
Now, when I watch other game, shows I go, okay?
17:36
I could I do that. Can I be on Supermarket Sweep
17:38
when I do well? And now I'm not watching the
17:40
show anymore. I'm strategizing how I would run
17:43
through this fake supermarket and answer these trigger
17:45
questions and not get Starstruck by Leslie Jones.
17:50
It's ruined the experience of watching game shows for me.
17:53
Aye, aye! Aye.
17:54
Is on the Australian Deal or No Deal back in 2007 or 2008.
17:59
I didn't win anything. So the Australian one of the US
18:03
wanted different in that, the like we don't have the models
18:07
opening the briefcase we have, like people who weren't chosen
18:11
to be contestants opens briefcase.
18:13
So I was over. I had numbered slide number 25.
18:16
But the thing was, if you guessed what was in your
18:18
briefcase, you won. I think a couple of grand or
18:22
something like that and I was down to the last Last three well
18:26
we briefcases left and the briefcase that the contestant
18:30
had and I was wrong and I was so disappointed, that's
18:35
heartbreaking. It was like a really I'd spent
18:38
that money in my head. I'm like I got a 50/50 chance
18:41
here or 33% chance. Well what am I going to spend my
18:44
couple of grand on? I was 18 19 at the time that oh
18:47
my gosh. Got nothing.
18:50
We slightly on topic and I don't know if it's on YouTube or not
18:56
but we did a parody of that called Deal or No Deal on Sesame
19:01
Street. And I played with this
19:02
hysterical and hopefully hysterically funny contestant.
19:08
It's a really cute thing with remember that.
19:11
Oh, you do know it. I was a meal on no meal, wasn't
19:14
it? Meal or no meal.
19:17
Yeah that's right. The banker.
19:19
It was the baker. It was a monster behind the
19:22
monster. That's right.
19:26
You've done a bunch of those schemes show parodies,
19:28
especially like early in the Sesame days.
19:30
I know you did a lot of the, like, What's My Line type of
19:33
parodies things like that dreary dreary?
19:37
Yes, well they took was a, it's always been a good book for the
19:41
444 puppets and for Sesame Street.
19:45
I think to use things like that, it's funny and it's slightly
19:50
familiar and it but it's renamed, you know, those are my
19:54
favorite things to do the pair Artis.
19:57
Oh my God, we would laugh so so much more than anybody in the
20:01
audience ever would. It was, they were just so funny
20:04
and Joey wrote a tremendous amount of them, you know, you
20:08
know what? His greatest idea since I left.
20:11
Have you guys think? But you don't know it.
20:18
It's not for us anymore. Let me that's, that's the thing
20:20
is like, I know they Sesame that note with no more Cove, Ewing
20:24
there, it doesn't have that that double layer of it's, for kids
20:27
and adults. So yeah, we can watch it to see
20:30
what's going on, but it's not entertaining for us as adults
20:33
anymore. Yeah.
20:34
I think they'd lost the funny. I mean, I shouldn't speak
20:39
unkindly, but what I understand, and I really should watch is
20:44
that. Like puppets for a purpose, you
20:47
know what I mean? Instead of innate something
20:51
growing out of, you know, instead it's very societal.
20:55
What's the big? What's the problem of the month
20:57
or the week? And if it's not funny why would
21:01
kids watch it, you know? Well and I mean the thing that I
21:05
keep coming back to is it's become a show that has forgotten
21:09
its roots, because it's popular today because It's got decades
21:17
and decades worth of entertaining content.
21:20
Not because we go back and go. Oh God, I'm so glad taught me
21:22
the letter D. It's like, no, it's great Bert
21:24
and Ernie sketch. This great song or whatever it
21:26
was and it doesn't go after that stuff anymore.
21:31
So it's not it's not creating a product that another 10 20 years
21:35
from now people are gonna look back and go got.
21:37
It was just so much fun the way they you know, taught us about
21:41
bullying or whatever the top right, right.
21:44
Yeah. What a shame.
21:45
Mmmmm. Well, you know, when new people
21:47
come in they got a we rework the wheel and, you know, they just
21:52
have to change, everything is happening.
21:54
Every time we had a new executive producer.
21:58
And since I was involved off, and on for many years, I was,
22:02
you know, I was part of that thing of seeing, how are they
22:07
changing the show? Let's move around the corner and
22:10
your kind of 5 and create this enormous set and all these These
22:15
shops and things and I you know it didn't last a lot of this
22:19
confusing 34 years and that was it.
22:22
Hmm. Well it's like I remember so I
22:25
interviewed Franco has a few years ago from a guy walking and
22:29
he'll I heard you say Frank Frank Frank Frank also have you
22:33
heard of him? It's crunch.
22:39
But we had a full conversation about some of the best part of
22:42
Sesame Street, where the sketches are, didn't teach
22:45
anything. They were just there to be
22:46
funny. So like he was talking about the
22:49
one with. I think it's Rapunzel where it
22:52
doesn't love that. Yeah, so Gary Nelson.
22:54
Yes, which is genuinely hysterical, or when Bert's
22:59
playing checkers with Bernice? Yeah, and like, there's no
23:03
education of value to them. What to However, they were just
23:06
there to be funny and those just don't really exist anymore.
23:11
No, no, except on YouTube except I know.
23:15
Well, yeah. So you can watch the old ones
23:17
but like new stuff just doesn't do that stuff anymore.
23:19
And so, it's funny when I've done my interviews with Muppets
23:24
over the years. My first thing is, this needs to
23:26
be funny because that's where I think these characters Thrive,
23:30
Elmo, thrives being funny Cookie, Monster thrives being
23:32
funny. So that's like, first and
23:36
foremost. What I'm thinking about when I
23:37
do these interviews. Yes, I was Disappointing to sort
23:41
of watch the show and it just doesn't have that same thing
23:44
that I had back 20, 30 years ago.
23:47
I know. I think it must be miserable for
23:49
the puppeteers, you know, who are there now, it's to be
23:54
didactic is just, it's not funny.
23:58
Where's the humor? Where's the humor?
24:00
That's keeping caregivers sitting there with kids.
24:04
You know, you know, probably they'll reinvent the wheel
24:09
again. And make it funny again.
24:12
Is my guess they, I know they thought that a lot of the humor
24:16
was so so far over the heads of the kids that they changed that.
24:23
I mean, they let Joey go and he's the one that really kept
24:28
the show zany and wonderful, they just probably decided know,
24:36
it's a cruel world and we need to teach these children things.
24:39
And You know, it's like there was a swing to the other
24:43
pendulum, but like, everything in life, it'll go swimming kind
24:46
of back again. We'll see.
24:49
I'm not hold my brother. Have you got a moment from your
24:56
time on the show, like a sketch or something?
24:58
That you remember, is particularly funny.
25:00
Like, you just remember that being a really funny sketch or a
25:02
really funny day or whatever? Yeah, yeah I do.
25:06
That would be. This is an oldie Singing in the
25:09
Rain. You know, it's funny.
25:12
I love it. Your Muppet wiki page at the
25:14
moment and I have that picture up because I was going to ask
25:16
you about it. It's great.
25:18
It just it was a great combination of very funny
25:22
writing. The premise was fantastic
25:24
teaching kids. The difference between wind rain
25:27
and snow and it gave area course to do.
25:31
Her thing, which is getting frustrated, which is very funny.
25:35
But I think when she would get frustrated So yeah, that's one
25:39
of my faves, another one. Is Zoe, had a Zoe mobile,
25:48
remember that anybody for anybody, that's parked out back?
25:54
Yeah, it's got Sparkles, but yeah, it was very clever and I
25:59
used to get in there and scrunch down and, you know, the crew
26:03
would pull me along, but it was a nice little gimmick for her.
26:07
So anyway, she would not let anybody drive the Zoe mobile,
26:12
but her, it was Her thing, she loved it and there was a show
26:17
they wrote for telly and baby bear who begged and pleaded to
26:22
could they drive the Zoe mobile and she really she said no no no
26:28
I don't want you to and then finally they convinced her she
26:31
lets them Drive the Zoe mobile and they crash it and he was
26:36
just the most wonderful scene where Zoey?
26:42
You know, it was a teaching forgiveness, really?
26:45
If you are looking for what was behind the story, it was
26:50
teaching forgiveness, how things can somebody can do something
26:55
and it hurts but they didn't mean to hurt you.
26:57
At least that's what I am furred.
27:00
And so I remember Lisa Simon shot it and they showed it.
27:07
They heard the moment of her really getting so sad but they
27:13
did not shoot Zoey's face. They shot the boys, they shot
27:19
their reaction to this and I kept waiting and waiting for a
27:23
close-up and I honestly was in tears.
27:26
I you know I'm an actress. I was really and I you know sort
27:30
of making her cry and sobbing. I'm waiting for my clothes
27:35
diapers always close up. And that that broke my heart
27:39
that really broke my heart, that they did not show something.
27:44
It's so is oh yeah right. Reaction is the one you need.
27:48
Anyway. Yeah so I remember that show for
27:51
Bittersweet reasons. No, my God, I didn't know there
27:56
were so many. Well somebody who your God old
28:00
can say well speak meds, are we? As I'm sure you're aware at the
28:03
time of recording that granted. This might come after a few
28:05
months but at some Fork, Coding. So he's been quite popular
28:10
because there's been a massive Resurgence of the clips of Elmo
28:13
and Rocco. I know, I just terrible and
28:17
Kevin and I have talked about it as like, oh my God, this but we
28:21
love doing those scripts. We could, we could just barely
28:26
stopped from laughing ourselves up because, you know, I just
28:30
think everybody's great in them. I think Kevin was fantastic,
28:33
finding that side of Elmo And I thought Zoe was great just being
28:38
you know, just no, no, you know, Rocco can here, Rocco, can you?
28:44
I do, I love doing those. Is and I was really happy that
28:47
that happened because they did they did stop doing them because
28:54
again, they thought it modeled bad behavior, you know, and
28:59
would teaching kids that I was teaching kids.
29:02
Something that they shouldn't do.
29:06
I don't see why. But anyway they yeah, they
29:11
stopped that and you know, they don't I don't think they use
29:14
prairie dog. On much anymore, all which also
29:17
breaks my heart because they think that having a little girl
29:23
who's very sure of herself. I'm not going to use the b word,
29:28
which is bossy. You know, what's wrong with
29:31
showing a little girl who's smaller than everybody, who is
29:35
confident in herself? And is a perfectionist.
29:38
And wants things done really, really?
29:40
Well, I don't know. They just That doesn't sell
29:46
these days. It has to be, I don't know.
29:50
I think they're on, you know, a track that I would prefer they
29:53
were not on but I'm gone. So there's not much I can do but
29:57
that's what I've understood from Stephanie when I've talked to
30:00
her. Because she she keeps
30:02
apologizing me because she took over the character.
30:06
I said for god sakes. It's not you.
30:08
It's how they feel about Prairie and using her are not using our
30:13
do. Well, it's also like you said,
30:15
It ever since Joey misery, no left, the the writing team.
30:18
There's not many people left who care about the larger world of
30:23
Sesame, you know, beyond the core characters.
30:26
You know, bringing back some of the old folks or, or even just
30:30
like having a world that exists Beyond, you know, cookie and
30:34
Elmo and Abby and Grover like and characters, like Bert and
30:38
Ernie or Snuffy, like, they're not around that much.
30:40
So of course, they're never gonna get around to Prairie
30:42
Dawn, or, you know, or right? Whoever know, I know Roxy.
30:47
Yeah, yeah. I don't know.
30:49
I guess everybody has their time but I think they also decided to
30:54
just zero in on a few key. Everything.
30:58
I mean the humans are gone except for is Crystal on the go.
31:03
Yeah. Chris and Alan Alan and Balan.
31:07
Wila Rock Nina which one day? Yeah.
31:10
Nina. Well so you like that Nina.
31:13
Oh right? Yeah.
31:15
Adorable Sookie. She's great.
31:16
Yeah. So yeah I mean but that's just a
31:20
small amount to they're just dreams you know?
31:23
I mean I I understand that everything has to be reworked
31:30
that's all and we reimagined and that's what's going on.
31:35
Now you know I'm just glad I don't write the thing that I
31:41
just can't wrap my brain around is is the idea that sesame To be
31:45
just one thing like Sesame has been around for over 50 years
31:49
and there are many different types of fans and people who are
31:53
just interested in this show and the franchise.
31:55
Why can't it be multiple things? Why can't we have the cord show
31:59
where we have you know it's Elmo and Cookie and a p and the
32:05
social impact Outreach stuff over here.
32:07
The fun stuff over there like that, like there could be a lot
32:11
of different things going on at once, but they decided that's
32:14
not what they want to do. And so they're losing folks like
32:17
us as fans and folks, like you, who, you know, could be a small
32:21
part of the show, in some way, a part of the, you know, be some
32:25
sort of ambassador to Sesame Workshop at.
32:27
Like, they're not really interested in that anymore.
32:30
Yeah, is Telly on anymore. Not really lock.
32:34
Sometimes we spoke about that. So I lost my daughter was with
32:38
Martin Robinson and we had a full conversation about the fact
32:41
that tell he's not around anymore, because they're not
32:44
sure that You know, kids should be exposed to someone who is
32:49
filled with anxiety and stuff like that.
32:51
Whereas I think they need to be exposed to people with anxiety
32:54
because it shows them that their own anxieties are.
32:56
Okay. Speaking of someone who has
32:58
anxiety issues, it is necessary, I think for kids to see that,
33:04
but for whatever reason, sesame, just like that, we don't really
33:07
need that anymore. And I think that's awful.
33:12
I don't know, we'll just have to start our own show kid.
33:15
Kids that's guard. The three boxes will make it.
33:20
My arm already hurts from keeping in the air too long,
33:23
just thinking about it speaking of that.
33:26
So I I understand you know, like why it's it actually is a very
33:32
satisfying thing for you that you've been able to step away
33:34
from Sesame the last few years. But do you do Miss puppeteering?
33:39
Like just the act of having a puppet on your arm and
33:42
performing in that way. And this is the Jurors.
33:46
I mean, sometimes I will say something around the house you
33:49
know, as Prairie Dawn because that's my husband's favorite
33:53
character or is Zoe because I like the feeling of them inside
33:58
me, you know. Yeah.
33:59
I like I like them. So I miss doing them or mrs.
34:04
Cross worthy, which it was some bizarre character that.
34:09
Yeah, it was based at once I saw that puppet, I went oh my God.
34:15
It's just like, I'm a crook from the Methodist Church that we
34:17
went to. And and so I just kind of took
34:21
that and came, you know, a version of Emma, crook with
34:26
false teeth that didn't fit her particularly well, so yeah.
34:31
I mean those characters are just so fun because you feel so free
34:37
and stupid doing them and it's a good feeling to feel, you could
34:40
feel like that. So I missed that sometimes when
34:44
I'm in the car, I'll do something as Zoe, you know.
34:49
Just I mean, I know she's there. She said me somewhere.
34:53
It's so odd. That whole thing of channeling,
34:56
somebody you really isn't a part of you.
35:00
But you're using yourself to create that character, I don't
35:05
get it. I call it channeling more than
35:07
any. We didn't see you.
35:09
You created the character of mean, you basically created all
35:12
these characters, he performed. Even if they came to you.
35:15
You know, pre-existing on the page and you perform them for so
35:20
long that it's got to be a huge part of you.
35:23
Even after you've left it behind for a few years.
35:26
Like you can't take the girl out of pretty dumb, but you can't
35:29
take preyed on out of the girl. All right?
35:32
That's true. I feel like ten years from now.
35:36
I could just go right into those characters.
35:39
Yeah, you know, some people have asked me, well, is it hard to go
35:43
from Zoe to Prairie Dawn? Absolutely not.
35:46
They're two different people, completely different people
35:49
there. Why would I get confused?
35:52
You know, it's just a completely different person.
35:59
Did you have any characters that you felt like we're more
36:02
difficult to get into? Maybe weren't as much a part of
36:06
your own personality. Well I think if I had to push
36:11
myself to be outrageous, I know. Like they were some things we
36:18
shot. Well the lets the Let's Make A
36:21
Meal that's not somebody in my wheelhouse normally you know
36:28
that crazy woman They were some other characters and just later
36:37
and I guess, like a couple of years before I retired, where I
36:42
had somebody to do and I pushed myself to be a zany as I
36:47
possibly could. Because I know it's not easy for
36:51
me to do and I think it's my job to go somewhere, that's not
36:56
comfortable. I can't give you a good example
37:00
unfortunately. But I do like that part of me
37:05
that's always going to be there till I die, but zany part, even
37:09
though, unless usually I'm not very zany with people.
37:13
I meet, I'm rather sober and pleasant.
37:16
But once I feel comfortable with somebody and know they get me
37:20
and have a good sense of humor, then I am beyond stupid.
37:24
I mean really, really Really stupid, you know, I'll just, I
37:31
know, but I it's I like going there, you know, I don't like,
37:35
yeah, it feels good. It's fun.
37:37
You get to cut loose for sure. It's Christmas.
37:41
So, speaking of Cutting Loose a little bit, you've kind of
37:45
peppered, your puppetry career, a bit with the Muppet Show
37:49
characters. I know you were there the very
37:51
beginning when they shot the sex and violence pilots, and you got
37:56
a couple of appearances in the first season, And was there a
38:01
expectation at that time? That you were going to be
38:04
working with that cast of characters more often, or was it
38:07
really just? Like, I'm just here for the day,
38:09
you get me for one day and then I got to go back to New York in
38:12
The Muppet Show in London. Yeah, yeah.
38:15
Well, I can't remember because they're first of all, There Were
38:20
Ten Years where I didn't do Sesame Street at all.
38:23
I was busy acting. Then the Muppet Show came
38:26
around. I don't think I had I've had
38:28
been puppeteering much before that, but Jim, of course, ring,
38:33
ring ring. Would you want to do the Muppet
38:35
Show? And I said, I'd I really at that
38:39
time. Did not want to commit myself to
38:43
five years in London, get out of the game.
38:48
And so I only did two shows I did the Charles aznavour show
38:54
and I did. Yet, I have a gold record on the
38:58
wall. You're in the Paul Williams.
39:02
Episode Williams. Okay.
39:05
I wouldn't have any of the pilots as well and the what?
39:10
The Pilots Sex and violence ballot.
39:12
Yeah, okay. Okay.
39:14
I know that I get about a two cent residual about every couple
39:19
of years, from really shows that I can spend it all at once.
39:25
And what a great show. Yes, no.
39:27
I know. I spelled one, I spend the one
39:30
penny and then I let months go by and I spent on the other
39:35
buddy, but they're really nothing burgers at this point.
39:41
But you know what? I don't think I would have been
39:43
happy. I mean, it's gonna work.
39:47
It's a lot of work that puppeteering stuff is so hard
39:51
and long, long hours in dust. T sneeze, causing environment
39:59
and oh my gosh, no. I mean I I just think you can
40:04
only do that stuff when you're in your 30s and 40s, he gotta
40:08
retire her. My gosh, it's just it's so
40:13
difficult and it's so difficult for everybody to get the tape
40:17
where everybody's good in it and inevitably, I would watch what I
40:21
was doing and go. Oh God.
40:23
No, if only I could do The take but I didn't, you know, I didn't
40:28
feel like I should say, oh I want another take Jim is that
40:32
are, you know, I just didn't feel like I could do that.
40:35
So now I think I did the right thing because I was, you know,
40:40
very happy to do my time television and stuff like that.
40:44
And I would have loved living in London though, I would have
40:48
loved living, you know, in the UK for five years that would
40:54
have been Been great, but I would have had to be doing
40:58
another job, because it wouldn't have been very well.
41:03
And then a few years later, you did go back and you worked on a
41:07
season of the Jim Henson our with, with yes.
41:10
And he did get the players character is a bit.
41:12
So, what was part of your justification for that of going
41:16
back into that fold? Wow, that's a really good
41:20
question. I don't know, because Camille
41:23
had were really replaced. E as the strong female at that
41:27
time. That was what 91, anybody know,
41:31
when that were noted in like, 88 89, okay, a nine.
41:38
You know, I just don't remember what was going on in my life at
41:40
that time, but I must have appealed to me for some reason.
41:46
And if you didn't match, I was difficult to do because the
41:50
director was, was kind of difficult and I just had to
41:55
Fight so much being the female to get my puppet in on camera
42:00
because all these guys are pushing into the screen and I'm
42:04
like fighting to get Vicki, you know, seen in a crowd scene
42:09
that's mostly what I remember is his having to fight because the
42:14
shot was swung, but I enjoyed it.
42:17
I know I enjoyed it and had a good time.
42:21
What? You also played zondra.
42:24
Oh yeah, Sondra and I don't know if you know this but there is a
42:30
not a lot, but there's a small faction on the internet who are
42:33
obsessed with her. What, and who?
42:35
Yeah, there's a lot of, there's a few people out there.
42:37
Who'd they draw, I don't know, because she's a punk rock,
42:40
that's why he's punk rock. I think that's what it is.
42:42
And they just appreciate a punk-rock female character to
42:46
change the unit's here, very much on that show.
42:49
She was in a few. I mean she's only need a few
42:51
episodes and I think she's ever been anything else.
42:53
I think she was in the background of a couple of shots
42:56
because I don't even remember what voice I did for her.
43:01
How did it happen? How do we spell that on the
43:03
internet Z? They 0n dra yeah, I'm checking
43:09
among her Muppet wiki page right now it's unfortunate doesn't
43:12
list out how many episodes she was in but they use the puppet
43:17
in a couple of early. Is like just like in the
43:21
background but the production's. Yeah, yeah.
43:24
Well that's that's well I think that's all Kirk Thatcher.
43:28
Probably loving that character. Yeah, okay.
43:31
Yeah, maybe so yeah. She's just but she's just a
43:35
little fan base so that's pretty cool.
43:38
Yeah, I do remember that when I auditioned for Jim and Frank way
43:43
back when That puppet or somebody.
43:47
That looks something like her was in the box when I stuck my
43:51
hand in and came up with a puppet and said, oh my God, I'm
43:54
auditioning for Frank Oz and Jim because I thought I was going in
43:59
for like, a voice over job. And, you know, I was told new
44:03
new poll. The puppeteers.
44:04
Do their own voices and manipulation, so I don't know
44:08
what I would, but voice I did, but I think it was a puppet that
44:12
looks somewhat like her. And I remember Jim say, You
44:15
know, to try another voice and then try a different voice, not
44:19
because I was doing anything wrong but he just wanted to see
44:22
my range or, you know, my imagination.
44:28
But Vicki I remember I like Vicky Vicky was his seem like
44:33
such a nerd choice for Jim Henson our to me because she
44:38
looks kind of bland, she's kind of scooter but not scooter.
44:42
What was your take on? Like did you have like a
44:44
backstory for the city or anything like that?
44:46
Well, I think just thought you was a nerdy little girl.
44:48
That wanted to, you know, be needed, bye-bye, everybody.
44:54
I mean, she looked nerdy, what whatever we thought nerdy was
44:57
back. In those days, a long time ago,
44:59
now, nerdy is cool. So, you know, it doesn't apply
45:03
its Lucky for us. No, anyway, I don't know, she
45:11
didn't, she didn't really have, I think my feeling was she would
45:15
probably burst into tears very quickly if anything went wrong,
45:19
but they didn't write scripts for her.
45:21
All she did was running with a, you know, what do you call it?
45:26
Yeah, well, your clipboard. Yeah.
45:28
Simple, right? So, you know, not that
45:31
memorable, I can't even remember what other characters they did
45:35
on The Muppet. Show, played one of my favorite
45:38
characters from of any character on the Jim Henson, our was
45:41
Merlin's assistant. When Ralph the dog played Merlin
45:44
the magician that one? That's the one.
45:48
It's just such a like, a simple little catchphrase and every
45:51
single time it was hysterical and now Derek.
45:55
Well, you know, it's awful, but the Rope of the dumb.
45:58
Blond is still funny to me, it always will be and that was the
46:03
only thing that occurred to me to do with her because she was
46:05
like, every gal you saw on Wheel Of Fortune or at back in those
46:10
days. There was always some gal, who
46:14
looked hot. Who is wearing skimpy dresses.
46:17
And who why why? You know.
46:21
It's so it was so crazy on daytime shows.
46:24
So, yeah, but I, yeah, I know. I don't know why, but I've got
46:30
it took a lot of doing her myself.
46:33
That's good. I'm glad to hear that.
46:38
I think the other character that people would remember is in the
46:44
half-hour-long dog. City episode
46:59
Shoots I would say is that it was difficult, but it was so far
47:03
from Sesame Street and it was so clever.
47:06
It was so to have nothing but dogs, it wasn't one human in
47:10
that show and what Kevin? And I had a very good time doing
47:14
that. Yeah.
47:16
And I loved singing that number. Then that that's the only time
47:21
I've actually been able to use my singing voice, you know, you
47:24
remember the the with the name of those.
47:27
Song, it was like jazz and blues bluesy Jazzy song that she sang.
47:34
I'm looking it up because I wish I can't remember the title off,
47:38
the top of my head that there was a song, I'm Gonna Be honest
47:44
and put myself out there. I've actually never seen dog
47:47
City. I know I'm sorry.
47:50
Here is, I've just never found it.
47:54
I was just going to say, I mean, I could send you a Craig Shimon.
47:59
I know produce some DVDs of it, I could probably send it to you.
48:04
Did in this country. I know you're different region
48:06
Jared but like in this country was released on DVD was yeah I
48:12
don't I mean the the Jim Henson our half of it it doesn't isn't
48:16
on the DVD. It's just you know they mean
48:19
Henson company owns it I guess they got the permission from
48:23
Disney to have R Alpha Dog appear.
48:26
So like Ralph is there at the beginning of the end but yeah so
48:30
it's a DVD with a literally, a half hour of content on it.
48:34
The what? We'll find a way to get it to
48:36
you. Gerald will say it.
48:38
Oh yeah. Put it on YouTube.
48:40
No, it's really, really clever. The puppets are unbelievably
48:44
beautiful and there's some animatronic stuff and it's early
48:49
days of animatronics. And I do remember that there was
48:54
they were constantly pumping that smoke but it was some time.
48:59
Yeah. And my God, breathe that in all
49:03
day, was like a no. Oily substance in the air that
49:06
made it look like fog. So I'm Fred Fred Buchholz worked
49:12
on that. He did all the animatronic.
49:15
Do you know Fred the name of it? You don't know her name.
49:20
Oh he's a genius of with all that stuff.
49:23
I don't know if he still works with Henson or not, but he
49:26
created all of these I don't know things going by, whatever
49:33
was a technical mechanical thing.
49:38
He would figure it out. How to do it.
49:40
Sounds like he was kind of the phosphorus aqus of you're right.
49:44
Yeah, yeah, exactly. But I've heard I think maybe it
49:49
was Brian Jay Jones, who told me that that this was one of Jim
49:52
Henson's favorite things that he had directed was, I would, I
49:56
would guess that he had a pretty good time doing it.
49:59
Yeah. Yeah, it was nice.
50:00
It was a very pleasant shoot. I don't remember any crazy
50:05
things going on or anybody, loving anybody.
50:10
Yeah, so that's fun. When you were doing Sesame like
50:15
especially, I'm stinking sort of not, when specimen Zoe was.
50:18
I mean, Zoe was one of the main characters for a long time, 17
50:22
years, 17 years. So you watching you were doing
50:29
And, you know, obviously a lot of that but then you are also
50:32
doing a lot of acting yourself. Like I'm just looking up here on
50:37
Muppet Wiki there's a list of some of your non Henson acting
50:41
credits, how it looks. What's the way to say this?
50:46
How important was it? I guess for you to have sort of
50:50
two separate things going on? Like, I guess because you're
50:52
working so much, the Sesame was it?
50:54
Then you saying well I don't just want to be a puppeteer.
50:56
I want to act as well and going off and doing say Lauren. order
51:00
or Florida. Five times.
51:03
Crazy thing is you know, I never ever wanted to be a puppeteer.
51:08
I mean, that wasn't even something I thought about.
51:12
I I've wanted to be an actress since I was a brownie.
51:16
I don't know what you call them in Australia, but it's little
51:18
girls and then you grow into the Girl Scouts and we did a play
51:23
and I was funny in the play and I remember drinking in that
51:27
Applause and saying it. Six years old or something.
51:30
No listen. Benign.
51:32
Like oh, this is it. I mean, I knew from then on I
51:35
wanted to be an actress. So I spent my whole life in the
51:38
nice, cool. Majored in drama at Boston
51:42
University, fine, arts school, doing Summer Stock.
51:46
I mean, I did 100 plays by the time I was no 30.
51:53
So I have a really strong theatrical background doing Sean
51:58
Shakespeare, you know? I mean I feel like Had a
52:01
classical background. So I always, of course, one of
52:06
the career that Meryl Streep ended up having, where you go
52:10
from a movies to television shows two plays.
52:13
But the problem was this this Muppet thing fell in my lap
52:18
literally. And on top of that, you know Jim
52:22
really wanted me to do it as much as I could.
52:26
He understood that I didn't want to do it full time because he He
52:32
never wanted to be a puppeteer either but he, you know, did it
52:35
so that he could learn about television.
52:38
So he was terrific about all that.
52:40
But of course, when you're doing a show like Sesame Street and
52:43
they have to plan and a plan on your being there in the fall or
52:48
whenever shooting would begin, they couldn't just be
52:52
wishy-washy or I couldn't be wishy-washy.
52:55
So I just had to say, you know, no, I'm not available.
52:58
So, yeah, it was kind of I couldn't really do everything at
53:07
the same time because I also had a big voiceover career, which
53:11
was lucrative and I love doing voiceovers and narrations I
53:14
really did. I mean, all of those to me are
53:17
part of the Performing Arts or part of being an actor, they're
53:20
just different facets of it, you know, a different branch off the
53:24
tree and I still feel like that but my love always was acting
53:31
always always always so um What was the direct question?
53:37
You asked me? I don't recall this point
53:43
because that was a long-winded with my aunt
53:57
because I did it. I enjoyed the people so much.
53:59
Of course I loved all the guys I love the girls it was fun but
54:04
Results are really hard work. And also my face wasn't being
54:07
seen and unfortunately that was important to me, you know, I'm
54:12
sure for whatever reason, I wanted the recognition.
54:17
So yeah, you know, I feel very lucky to have had a fairly
54:22
decent career and all of those things, you know, incredible
54:25
Curry. I mean, I think Meryl Streep
54:27
would kill to play some of the characters you've played.
54:30
I'm just looking at yet list now and I mean, I'm not even going
54:33
to bother can eating them but there's well over 300 characters
54:36
on your Muppet. Wiki what there's a lot of
54:40
things that must be wrong. Then I'll have to look that up
54:43
and give you a correction. Like there can't be three and
54:45
maybe not three hundred, but there's a lot.
54:49
And so, I mean, what did you say?
54:53
Joe coming all the get a little bit.
54:56
There's a lot of one-off characters or give, you know,
54:58
you were in the background and have one quick line, but that
55:02
also was the fun thing of going. Arriving at the set in the
55:05
morning and not knowing what you like there will be a crowd scene
55:10
or something like that and there's this the table full of
55:14
Puppets that they had costumed and it was like, oh, just pick
55:19
out a puppet that you want to do.
55:21
I mean everything was so different back then and that was
55:23
the fun. Part is a pickup.
55:25
This puppet and figure out how you wanted.
55:28
That person to be. You wanted this to be old.
55:31
I mean, some of it. He said, you're Imagination
55:35
because of how it was costumed and it wasn't great, hair, gray
55:39
hair blond, or you know, whatever.
55:42
But that was the real creative part.
55:45
I think, for all of us is to just come up with a character
55:49
boy and hit the Sound Stage. Let me especially when you guys
55:53
were doing like, 120 episodes in a year.
55:55
Oh yeah, you gotta just keep moving.
55:57
There's no time to sit and talk about it.
55:59
Great. It's got a camera unfortunately.
56:02
Yeah, that's true. But Dad, that was, those are the
56:05
really good old days. I mean that's just I don't think
56:08
there's anybody still performing for those days except maybe
56:13
Marty and Pam, Marty, and Pam RC are.
56:16
Oh yeah, the two of them still around but that might be it.
56:19
I think. Yeah, I think that might be it
56:21
to everybody's yeah, come and gone.
56:25
Can I ask a quick question? Guess we'll talk about is that
56:27
we before and I'd love to get your take on this.
56:32
Season 40. Zoe.
56:35
Is tiny little. Yes, I think at one point tele
56:40
referred to as homunculus, Zoe she's this tiny little
56:43
character. What happened then?
56:48
Well, they made this teeny tiny incredibly cute, Zoe for a home
56:56
video about Alice in Wonderland so she appeared playing what the
57:03
Dormouse or something like that and I cannot believe that they
57:07
created a little Zoe for that reason.
57:10
For that reason and spend all that money but they did.
57:14
And everybody was just oh my God, she's okay.
57:17
Cute. Oh, what we can do with her,
57:19
maybe, but so I said, yeah, that's fine.
57:23
Let's just, let's just start using her because there's a new
57:26
audience every year. They're not going to know what
57:29
the former Zoey look like, but I don't know that.
57:33
I mean, I remember doing inserts weather with Carmen and Leslie
57:42
some inserts and, you know, boy you can be sure they're not.
57:47
Playing anymore. It was just a Carolyn parental.
57:50
You just agreed with me. She thought it was a really cute
57:53
thing. We should try it and I think
57:58
it's she size-wise didn't go well with anybody because it was
58:04
what she was. She'd just wishing shrunken or
58:07
wishing, you know, tined a little earlier younger.
58:10
It was confusing. So I don't know.
58:14
We did some maybe probably one season with her.
58:17
And then next year, back to good old, but that's a really good
58:21
question. It was just like a, like, an
58:24
internal Logic for performing her of why she temporarily went
58:28
back. Anytime I love to say, yes, I
58:31
dipped into my stanislavski. No, she was just as I've asked
58:37
Carmen about Rosita losing her wings and then getting them
58:42
back. And she, you know, I don't think
58:43
it's obviously nothing official, but like she's had like this
58:46
little thing in the back. Back of her head of like oh how
58:48
she lost them and she misses them and whatever and it's just
58:51
that's part of the character that we never talked about.
58:53
But yeah, I feel like tiny. Zoe is a part of her history,
58:56
she should acknowledge you know, she got caught in the in the
58:59
dryer a little bit too long. And yeah, whatever.
59:03
It was wore, she swallowed something, she swallowed some
59:06
potion the way Alice in Wonderland.
59:09
I just figured with a Mumford went wrong.
59:13
Let's go with that. That would have been a good
59:15
idea. I think it was, it was pointless
59:18
to address it because not everybody only probably the kids
59:22
are were, well, I just don't think it mattered much to kids
59:25
watching your, we probably didn't say, hmm.
59:28
Last year, she, I think they, it was just, that's all.
59:33
Yeah. But she probably just so you can
59:37
just for you that, that logic needed inspiration for what.
59:42
Zoe do in this scene. It's like well she has this
59:44
memory of being shrunken for a minute.
59:51
I think I think little Zoe when she looked in the mirror to look
59:55
just like things OE just like regular.
59:58
Zoe and vice versa did not see what the others.
1:00:02
So maybe maybe someday she will change size again and we will
1:00:06
get will get a giant Zoe. Oh, I'd rather join something
1:00:09
fun. Yeah, and it was it wasn't movie
1:00:12
where he comes out of the saloon.
1:00:14
I want that big of a Zoe head. There was a big fleece, Zoe that
1:00:21
they made product wise, that was, oh yeah.
1:00:25
Or a horrendous looking, you know, with the magic potions
1:00:28
like the size of like two toddlers, really humongous Going
1:00:42
back a second to, to talk about some of your, your non Muppet
1:00:46
work so recently. I decided I wanted to watch all
1:00:50
the movies that Frank Oz has directed.
1:00:53
Just because it's a bit of a hole in my, in my my cinema.
1:00:59
Yeah, loving whatever. And it occurred to me, that
1:01:03
Frank didn't really reuse performers all that often, and
1:01:08
the only ones as far as I could tell.
1:01:10
Well that he used words, Steve Martin and and I'm going to
1:01:13
count you even though I think you only appear in one movie
1:01:16
that he actually. Yeah, because you're not
1:01:20
Muppets. Take Manhattan.
1:01:20
I don't think are you, did you work on that?
1:01:23
Gotcha. So what happened with with
1:01:30
things like best friends with Steve Martin and Rick and Rick
1:01:34
Moranis to this day. So really, yeah, and I don't
1:01:38
know what happened to Rick Moranis But I know that Rick is
1:01:42
a still, a very good friend of Franks because he's mentioned
1:01:45
him. He doesn't, he doesn't seem to
1:01:48
work anymore, him as being very, very, very, very wealthy.
1:01:50
Rick Moranis took a Hiatus from acting when his wife passed away
1:01:57
to raise his kids, Iran. Then once they were once, they
1:02:00
were old enough, that they're out of the house, he kind of
1:02:03
realized he didn't really miss it.
1:02:05
So he never really went wanted to go car.
1:02:07
He and he's making a sequel. I believe to Honey I Shrunk the
1:02:11
Kids so he's a girl good. Is that true?
1:02:15
Yes. I would be interested in its
1:02:17
cold. Well, I saw him shrunk.
1:02:20
All right, we'll see. Well, I saw him a few years ago,
1:02:23
the Henson company. Did he a series of films at BAM?
1:02:30
The, it's a theater in Brooklyn here in New York.
1:02:32
And one of them that they showed was Little Shop of Horrors and
1:02:37
it was like, a sing-along type of thing with props and And like
1:02:40
it was a big like Rocky Horror Picture, Show type of thing.
1:02:42
Yeah, Rick Moranis came and did the intro to that which was
1:02:46
terrific. So you know he's still out
1:02:48
there. Are you still doing stuff?
1:02:49
He's just doesn't like he really wants to act anymore.
1:02:51
Well, he must he must have a trust fund or something.
1:02:55
I mean you know it worked to go that long without working is is
1:02:59
wonderful. That a lot of that Ghostbusters
1:03:02
money, you know, Oh, do you think so?
1:03:06
I hope between that and Honey. I Shrunk the Kids.
1:03:08
I mean, rolling in it. Oh, could you maybe only you
1:03:12
thinking makes that much money from residuals?
1:03:15
Nor probably know, I know claw. Remember I remember correctly?
1:03:18
I heard or read an interview or something with him and I think
1:03:21
he lives quite modestly. I think he made a lot of money
1:03:24
back in the 80s and now he just spends that now and he lives in.
1:03:27
And what are you? Yeah.
1:03:33
We'll get him on this podcast. He was at you upset him up its
1:03:37
tonight? Yeah.
1:03:38
Well we'll ask him all this stuff.
1:03:40
Well well, so my first question is so for What About Bob did you
1:03:46
basically just get a phone call from Frank?
1:03:48
And he's like, hey, I just need someone in this role.
1:03:49
Can you come please? You know, be married to Bill
1:03:52
Murray. No, no, I had to audition
1:03:55
because he did not want it to look like nepotism or whatever.
1:04:00
And I don't remember, Or how I ended up there, except probably
1:04:05
my agent said, hey guess what somebody called?
1:04:09
And wants you to come in for this?
1:04:12
I had no idea that he was shooting this movie and he I
1:04:16
think he just told the casting director.
1:04:20
Yeah, bring bring Franny an or something like that, but he
1:04:24
walked out of the room when I auditioned, I remember he I
1:04:28
think I remember that correctly. He, he just wanted me to get the
1:04:32
Roll on my own. For my sake is sake whatever.
1:04:38
And that's kind of really what happened?
1:04:42
And then how was it? I still get residuals from
1:04:45
director well that's good. How was he as a director?
1:04:49
Especially after like knowing him and working so closely with
1:04:51
him for so many years? Well, it was fun, watching him
1:04:55
and I think he's a terrific director.
1:04:58
He just had a hard job because you had Richard Dreyfuss and you
1:05:01
had Bill Murray who and their comedy style is completely
1:05:06
different and they just went like that it was just a battle
1:05:11
for him. I felt really bad for him, it
1:05:13
was just a battle. They would rewrite the scripts
1:05:16
and come down to shoot in the morning and they had different
1:05:19
versions, it was just nuts. So I don't think it was easy for
1:05:24
him, you know, but I always think he has great ideas.
1:05:30
He's a very, he's a good actor. He always was a good actor, you
1:05:33
know, even though he didn't act very much, he knows he knows the
1:05:37
process and all the backstory he did on his puppet characters.
1:05:41
Is it shows you know every single character he did this
1:05:46
fabulous including my favorites, am the eagle, you know, there's
1:05:50
this noise. Yeah, I mean, you know, just a
1:05:54
great great character so you know II hope he directs more,
1:06:00
but I think at this point, he's getting up there a little and
1:06:04
age and everybody's into the young directors and, you know,
1:06:08
unless he creates his own work. I don't know, I don't know what
1:06:14
the future holds. He he did talk about after
1:06:16
Muppets guys, talking came out. And people were saying like, we
1:06:20
want more, he said, well, he didn't want to do the same thing
1:06:23
over again but he would consider doing a documentary about his,
1:06:27
his director in her destructing work.
1:06:28
So hopefully he's working on that.
1:06:30
I don't, I don't know if that's something you could do.
1:06:39
Yeah. I guess I just think people want
1:06:44
to see it, you know, it's all about weaving, you talking
1:06:48
about, you're talking to guys who like, basically worship the
1:06:50
ground water so I'm like, whatever Frank does, I'm there?
1:06:53
Yeah, of course. But it's all about, you know, I
1:06:57
know he had peace had. I don't know whether he has now
1:07:00
but he's had projects that he wanted to direct, but the studio
1:07:05
probably didn't bite. I don't know.
1:07:07
Sure, it's very difficult. You've got to be wanted as well
1:07:13
as have a great idea and a great script I am but you know I'd
1:07:17
love to see him maybe direct something with the muppets again
1:07:22
and I don't think that's out of the realm of possibility but I
1:07:29
don't I think that would have happened already because
1:07:31
certainly Bill Beretta and Dave goals and everybody else would
1:07:37
kill to have him direct. But I just think I don't know, I
1:07:42
think they ship the sailed, I hope I'm wrong but I think there
1:07:47
are maybe even afraid of him coming in.
1:07:50
They meaning the studio you know I mean it's really hard for them
1:07:54
to as it is because I'm in touch with these guys to make the
1:08:00
character sound like the characters because they bring in
1:08:03
these writers who think they know the Muppets and then they
1:08:07
have them acting completely different than the way.
1:08:10
They Really are so I wish they could straighten all that out.
1:08:17
I think they have somebody in there now at Disney that they
1:08:20
like which is yes. So it is a big fans of Lee
1:08:25
Slaughter. Who's the current VP in charge?
1:08:28
Yes, it's division at Disney so good.
1:08:30
Yeah, she's got some good stuff in the works.
1:08:32
Exactly be Shalhoub information. The fellow was, I think you're
1:08:35
right. I think as a director probably
1:08:37
not. Yeah, so guys, it's 6:05.
1:08:40
In my part of this and my husband's going to kill me if I
1:08:44
don't go in there and fix his. Okay.
1:08:46
Well, so it is one last question or something.
1:08:50
Yes. Okay, so well then I'm gonna
1:08:53
leave all that in and just go to our next part.
1:08:58
Well, firstly, thank you very much for your time.
1:09:00
Fran, we finish every episode with just some rapid fire
1:09:05
questions, I have bones that Joe has his, as you might, guess
1:09:09
you'll be answering mine. Rapid fire.
1:09:11
As quick as you like what is? What is a food that you hate?
1:09:16
Oh, I can picture it. I can't think of what it is.
1:09:21
I hate it so much Fuller. She's going to get it.
1:09:28
Yeah, he's gone. She hates it so much.
1:09:31
She keeps in the fridge. She wants to grab it and just
1:09:34
time I did. She was so disgusted talking
1:09:36
about it that she left. Although can you say that lovely
1:09:40
picture of her and Zoe on our Shelf behind us?
1:09:44
Oh yeah. Okra okra.
1:09:53
No, I've never heard of. It's horrible.
1:09:56
But down here, people like to fry it up.
1:09:59
It is a, it's a small. Like, I don't know.
1:10:02
It's a vegetable that's gooey on the inside.
1:10:04
It's a horrible. But they put Oprah in stews
1:10:10
like, vegetable stews and soups. And, oh my gosh.
1:10:13
Okay. Okay delicious that wasn't round
1:10:15
fire. Was it?
1:10:17
No, that's all right. What is your go-to karaoke song?
1:10:21
I don't do karaoke. I don't sing in public.
1:10:26
Fair enough. What is the sound of one hand
1:10:29
clapping? That's about it.
1:10:34
That's the sound that's it. Pick a number between one and
1:10:37
257. Seven.
1:10:41
All right, I've got listed incorrect questions.
1:10:43
Yeah, that 250 questions here. Number seven is what was the
1:10:49
last thing you read? Oh, that's a good question.
1:10:53
Well, my brains are going, but I did read the most wonderful book
1:11:00
a week ago. And I read it in one week and I
1:11:03
now I can't remember what it was.
1:11:05
Wait a minute. Oh, cross is okra And she's gone
1:11:12
again. I think we've been that, I guess
1:11:17
get up and leave so many times surprising, actually, if you
1:11:22
think that we would, we would anger more guess by now.
1:11:25
Okay, I can't remember the name of the book.
1:11:27
Can I can I email you? It's on my Kindle and it was
1:11:31
absolutely wonderful and I just we'll get it.
1:11:33
We'll take your word for it. Even want to know what it is.
1:11:36
Oh well, I want to know what it is but but this is a podcast and
1:11:40
if we don't say it out loud, then I'm gonna have to bring it
1:11:42
in but that's all right. Oh, hello there folks.
1:11:46
Jared, he just editing this episode and realize the friend
1:11:48
actually did email me. The book she had been reading
1:11:51
was beautiful country by Gian Julie Wang.
1:11:55
That's beautiful country by Gian Julie Wang.
1:11:58
All right, back to the podcast in our last episode, Martin
1:12:01
Robinson, not knowing who I guess was going to be one dust
1:12:04
to ask. What makes you Delirious with
1:12:07
joy? Most in your life?
1:12:09
Yeah, I guess a good comedy show.
1:12:12
I guess making my husband laughs.
1:12:14
How's that? That's a great answer call.
1:12:17
And finally, without knowing who it is, what question would you
1:12:20
like our next guest to answer? What is the meaning of life?
1:12:26
Oh, I hope we get a good answer for that one friend, thank you
1:12:32
so much for spending some time with us.
1:12:36
Thank you for the amazing stuff you've done over the years.