Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / TORPEDO HITS MONSTER-SURGEON: FAKE ALIBI BUSTED, WIFE & NEW HUBBY MURDERED IN BED

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TORPEDO HITS MONSTER-SURGEON: FAKE ALIBI BUSTED, WIFE & NEW HUBBY MURDERED IN BED · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:00
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
0:07
Speaker 2: A torpedo hits the defense as a Monster surgeon ex
0:12
Speaker 2: hubby gives a fake alibi two police and it's a
0:17
Speaker 2: busted wide open this after the murder of his ex
0:21
Speaker 2: wife and her new husband in their own bed. And
0:25
Speaker 2: tonight the monster Surgeon's ex girlfriend speaking out and did
0:30
Speaker 2: a clerical error spark a murder spree? And Nancy Grace,
0:36
Speaker 2: this is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for
0:38
Speaker 2: being with us. He's talking about on the dating apps,
0:41
Speaker 2: how he wants children, how he wants to settle down,
0:44
Speaker 2: yet he's all alone. I wonder why they were married
0:49
Speaker 2: and murdered in the same home.
0:53
Speaker 1: Tony Knights.
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Speaker 2: Did he hunch over his computer screen watching Monique?
0:58
Speaker 1: Does nobody watch true crime?
1:04
Speaker 2: Reportedly, the Monster Surgeon blurts out in alibi before he immediately.
1:10
Speaker 1: Invokes his right to the Fifth Amendment, but it's too late.
1:14
Speaker 1: He's busted in a lie.
1:17
Speaker 2: Joining us an all star panel, but first rate out
1:19
Speaker 2: to Crime Stories investigative reporter Dave mac What in the
1:22
Speaker 2: hey you think this is a guy who is an
1:26
Speaker 2: honor student. First of all, he performs at a very
1:28
Speaker 2: high level on the football field. Okay, then he is
1:33
Speaker 2: D's List honor student through undergrad then he gets to
1:37
Speaker 2: med school, then he is an honor student in med school,
1:41
Speaker 2: becomes a vascular surgeon who is licensed to practice medicine
1:47
Speaker 2: in multiple states, and he blurts out of fake alibi, idiot.
1:52
Speaker 1: What happened, Nancy?
1:54
Speaker 3: It seems as though before his arrest, police actually got
1:58
Speaker 3: up with doctor McKee and asked, Hey, where were you
2:02
Speaker 3: on this particular night on December thirtieth, not an uncommon
2:06
Speaker 3: thing to do with an ex spout, And his story, Nancy,
2:11
Speaker 3: is that he had booked a room at his hospital
2:14
Speaker 3: where he's a surgeon, OSF Saint Anthony Medical Center in Rocker, Illinois,
2:18
Speaker 3: and that that's where he was the entire night. Investigators
2:22
Speaker 3: are able to bust that wide open.
2:27
Speaker 2: Joining me now, the investigative reporter for The Mirror and
2:31
Speaker 2: the Irish star Lena Mandenburg rot Row.
2:38
Speaker 1: Oh, what a tangled web we weave.
2:40
Speaker 2: When first we practiced to deceive busted? What happened, Yolina?
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Speaker 4: Well, he left his phone at the hospital, and he
2:47
Speaker 4: booked a sleep room at the hospital where he's a surgeon,
2:51
Speaker 4: which would be a normal, believable thing many many doctors do.
2:56
Speaker 4: He left his phone, which we assume allegedly if he
3:00
Speaker 4: went out there was so it doesn't ping off the
3:03
Speaker 4: cell phone hours and so everything looks legit. However, all
3:06
Speaker 4: investigators had to do was probably check the video feed
3:10
Speaker 4: and the surveillance videos from the hospital where he works.
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Speaker 4: It's really easy to overcome that alibi, even though it
3:17
Speaker 4: seems very legitimate for a doctor like him.
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Speaker 2: Alina Vandeburgh joining us from The Mirror and the Irish Star.
3:25
Speaker 1: You're absolutely correct.
3:27
Speaker 2: Randy Kessler, veteran trial lawyer, defense attorney out of the
3:31
Speaker 2: Atlanta Jurisdiction and professor Emory Law School and former chairman
3:38
Speaker 2: of the ABA Family Law Section, that's the American Bar Association,
3:42
Speaker 2: author of Divorce, Protect Yourself, your Kids, in your future.
3:45
Speaker 2: You better write another book, Shut your pie hole. That's
3:48
Speaker 2: just a suggestion for a title. Don't you just hate
3:52
Speaker 2: it when you get a medical doctor criminal defendant, because
3:56
Speaker 2: you do know they know more than everybody else. But
3:59
Speaker 2: the way I see it, having a medical doctor is
4:02
Speaker 2: a criminal defendant client is like asking me to go
4:05
Speaker 2: perform heart surgery. Now ask me to go try a
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Speaker 2: serial killer.
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Speaker 1: Sure you're on. You've got a medical.
4:12
Speaker 2: Doctor trying to outsmart the justice system. Or maybe he
4:18
Speaker 2: just took his cues from Brian Coberger. Oops, he got
4:22
Speaker 2: convicted for quadruple murder. So does the doctor, in all
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Speaker 2: of his wisdom, try to outsmart law enforcement by planting
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Speaker 2: a phony alibite, leaving his cell phone to ping at
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Speaker 2: an overnight cut at a hospital.
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Speaker 5: You know, I don't think it's limited to just doctors.
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Speaker 6: A lot of people try to outsmart their legal system,
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Speaker 6: and it's just it's a system that we've been in.
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Speaker 6: You and I, you know, maybe harder for me to
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Speaker 6: represent lawyers or former prosecutors because they know the system
4:52
Speaker 6: and they're smart. But yeah, someone who's smart but hasn't
4:55
Speaker 6: done this, like you said, someone who's a doctor asking
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Speaker 6: you and you try to do surgery. You might be
5:00
Speaker 6: smart enough to figure it out, but there's nothing that
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Speaker 6: replaces years of experience, years of understanding the system. And
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Speaker 6: that may be his downfall, trying to hew smart the system.
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Speaker 6: Even if he's smarter than everybody, there's something about experience
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Speaker 6: and living it and being in it, and he hasn't
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Speaker 6: lived and he hasn't been in it, and looks like
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Speaker 6: that's going to be his.
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Speaker 2: Downfall, Okay, reminder, Randy Cassler, you're the defense attorney. You're
5:22
Speaker 2: supposed to be trying to fight your way out of
5:25
Speaker 2: this paper bag.
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Speaker 1: He's put himself into. Hey, Dave Mack, I.
5:29
Speaker 2: Understand that you have uncovered an estimation as to how
5:33
Speaker 2: long that cell phone stayed in the hospital cot.
5:37
Speaker 3: We you know, Nancy, In this particular case, police were
5:40
Speaker 3: able to find out that doctor McKee's cell phone was
5:45
Speaker 3: left in a cot at the hospital for fourteen hours.
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Speaker 3: Again based on our normal of what we do with
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Speaker 3: our boats.
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Speaker 2: Okay, wait a minute, Wait a minute. Okay, Kessler, did
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Speaker 2: you hear that out smarting law enforcement, he left his
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Speaker 2: cell phone in his cot, his overnight cot at the
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Speaker 2: hospital for fourteen hours. Way key, Way keep mc key's
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Speaker 2: time to get up fourteen hours.
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Speaker 5: Doctors work very hard, Nancy, doctors.
6:21
Speaker 6: You know, we all know the stories about residency, and
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Speaker 6: you're spending three days of wide wake. Mistakes happen, you
6:26
Speaker 6: know what, Sometimes there are things more important than retrieving
6:29
Speaker 6: your cell phone. He might have had all the things
6:31
Speaker 6: to do, though a lot of explanations. The phone might
6:33
Speaker 6: have been broken, or he might have thought it was broken.
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Speaker 6: There are a thousand reasons, But you leave your cell
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Speaker 6: phone at the hospital on.
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Speaker 1: Ho wait put him up? Did you just say his
6:43
Speaker 1: cell phone may have been broken? Who knows? Was he
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Speaker 1: just say his cell phone may have been broken.
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Speaker 6: It could have glitched. He could have thought it doesn't work.
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Speaker 6: He could have had other things to do. Nancy, you're
6:54
Speaker 6: not guilty of murder because you leave your cell phone
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Speaker 6: behind for half a day, half a day.
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Speaker 1: I like the way you said, I'm going to use
7:00
Speaker 1: that an opening statement. Half a day. I had thought
7:04
Speaker 1: about it like that.
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Speaker 2: Kessler a whole half a day as he is arranging
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Speaker 2: his alibi busted. Okay, let me go back to Dave
7:13
Speaker 2: mac Annulena Mandenburg.
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Speaker 1: Dave Matt you first, now, how did this happen?
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Speaker 2: Because I know he immediately blanketed himself in the fifth Amendment,
7:22
Speaker 2: which is of course the right to remain silent. You know,
7:26
Speaker 2: I've seen Dave mac and I think we saw some
7:29
Speaker 2: of these at Crime Can last year. Defense attorney's business
7:32
Speaker 2: cards and it's got their name and their address and
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Speaker 2: their email address and their phone number on the front
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Speaker 2: and on the bat it says, don't say a word.
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Speaker 2: Number one, use your phone call number two to call
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Speaker 2: your lawyer, not your mommy, your lawyer. Three, don't say
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Speaker 2: a word. Four, don't say a word. So how is
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Speaker 2: it that McKee said a word? Yet oh so evoked
8:01
Speaker 2: his Fifth Amendment privilege.
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Speaker 3: Any questions that were asked of McKee happened before they
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Speaker 3: put the cuffs on him, before he's getting his chicken sandwich.
8:11
Speaker 3: So think about it, Nancy. As police begin an investigation,
8:14
Speaker 3: the first call is, hey, where were you? You know
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Speaker 3: your ex wife is dead and we need to know
8:20
Speaker 3: where were you during this time. We know you didn't
8:22
Speaker 3: do it, but you know, we got to have it.
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Speaker 3: And so that's where he immediately blurted, apparently, And that's
8:28
Speaker 3: where it starts, Nancy. He already locked himself in and
8:32
Speaker 3: again his phone being left in a cot for fourteen
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Speaker 3: hours kind of fits into the rest of the premeditation
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Speaker 3: of this case.
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Speaker 2: You know, speaking of pre meditation, I want to throw
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Speaker 2: this to Joseph Scott Morgan, not only blood spatter expert,
8:47
Speaker 2: but forensics professor at Jacksonville State University, which has an
8:51
Speaker 2: incredible criminal procedure program.
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Speaker 1: Author of Blood Beneath.
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Speaker 2: My Fate on Amazon and star of a hit series Bodybags.
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Speaker 2: At Joe Scott Morgan, Joe Scott, you have investigated I
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Speaker 2: believe ten thousand or so death scenes of all sorts
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Speaker 2: of deaths. It could be on natural causes, heart attack,
9:12
Speaker 2: it could be accident, it could be suicide, it could
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Speaker 2: be unexplained, and of course homicide my specialty.
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Speaker 1: So let's talk just for a moment.
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Speaker 2: Jumping off with Dave mac and Yolanda Mandenburg had told
9:27
Speaker 2: us premeditation. Jackie had a great idea.
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Speaker 1: He didn't need.
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Speaker 2: His GPS on the phone because he had driven that
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Speaker 2: route so many times between his home, his expensive high
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Speaker 2: rise in Lincoln Park to his ex wife, Monique Teppi's home.
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Speaker 2: Can you imagine he didn't need directions He knew exactly
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Speaker 2: how to get there.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, he did.
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Speaker 7: And here's one interesting thing, Nancy, this whole scenario is
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Speaker 7: kind of flipped on its head compared to some of
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Speaker 7: the other cases that we cover. You think about electronic breadcrumbs, right,
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Speaker 7: how many cases have we covered where you have a
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Speaker 7: phone that's traveling in tandem with an alleged perpetrator going
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Speaker 7: to one location. If you think about this, was he
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Speaker 7: attempting to leave this phone behind to put people.
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Speaker 5: Off the scent?
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Speaker 7: Because you know you're talking about premeditation, right, I'm just
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Speaker 7: feeding right back into what you're saying. Had he seen
10:29
Speaker 7: you talked about true crime, had he seen enough to know? Okay,
10:33
Speaker 7: probably ought not take the phone with me so that
10:35
Speaker 7: it puts me immediately outside the home. But yeah, if
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Speaker 7: there had been, if there is a stalker element into this,
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Speaker 7: he's going to know this like the back of his hand, Nancy.
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Speaker 7: He's going to know maybe all the nuances of that home,
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Speaker 7: will certainly know the location points of entry. He's going
10:51
Speaker 7: to know about the surrounding windows, low windows, how do
10:55
Speaker 7: I get into a particular area in the house, how
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Speaker 7: many people are there? And then you can drive down
11:01
Speaker 7: the road without your phone. I think that we're under
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Speaker 7: the impression nowadays that we have to have have it
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Speaker 7: with us, that we have to be tethered to it,
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Speaker 7: and that ain't the case. So I find this fascinating,
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Speaker 7: this aspect that and thought about it till you had
11:14
Speaker 7: mentioned it. It is fascinating that he might lead this
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Speaker 7: alone or leave it back at the sleep room there.
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Speaker 7: You know where most doctors take call from. If you're
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Speaker 7: on call, you have a room that's set aside for
11:26
Speaker 7: you in the hospital and you'll sleep there. But you
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Speaker 7: know the damning part to this, Nancy, is that as
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Speaker 7: a vascular surgeon, let that sink in. That's a critical job.
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Speaker 7: If you are absent your phone, you can wind up
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Speaker 7: putting patients at risk.
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Speaker 5: Nancy.
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Speaker 2: You know another thing, Joscott Morgan is even when I
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Speaker 2: know the route, many times I will put on ways
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Speaker 2: just to see is there traffic? Is there slow down?
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Speaker 2: Has there been an accident? Should I go a different way?
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Speaker 2: But he didn't need that. According to police, he was
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Speaker 2: driving through the night to get there. But what you're
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Speaker 2: saying very very probative. And I want to go to
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Speaker 2: John doctor John Delatory, joining US licensed psychologist mediator specializing
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Speaker 2: in forensic psychology. Got a question for you, doctor Delatory.
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Speaker 2: I've just been thinking about this theory. He didn't need
12:27
Speaker 2: his phone because he had driven the route to his
12:30
Speaker 2: ex wife's home with her husband and two children many
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Speaker 2: many times before. This was about a four hour drive ish.
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Speaker 1: Why would he not take his phone?
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Speaker 2: Clearly he left it there in the overnight cot to
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Speaker 2: create an alibi.
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Speaker 8: No, absolutely, I mean when you think about it, and
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Speaker 8: I know Joseph Scott Morgan just talked about you know
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Speaker 8: we don't need to be tethered to the phone, but
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Speaker 8: there's an inherent behavioral chain that nowadays, we're so used
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Speaker 8: to just having it on us that it's instinctive for
13:05
Speaker 8: us to just grab it. We may not need it,
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Speaker 8: but we certainly just have it on us, and we
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Speaker 8: feel kind of naked when we don't. So what that
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Speaker 8: tells me is that he felt more inclined to engage
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Speaker 8: in the behaviors that he wanted to engage in, such
13:21
Speaker 8: as making this drive, that it was so overwhelming, it
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Speaker 8: was so compulsive that any other behavior chain, which includes
13:29
Speaker 8: grabbing your phone and having everything else that you need
13:31
Speaker 8: to make the drive, having any of that stuff kind
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Speaker 8: of was pushed to the side. So this is a
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Speaker 8: singular goal. That's the only thing that's driving this individual.
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Speaker 8: To include not having his phone just in case he
13:45
Speaker 8: gets on call, just in case he needs to perform surgery,
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Speaker 8: all of that stuff is pushed to the side so
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Speaker 8: he can complete one particular goal, and in this instance,
13:53
Speaker 8: it's making.
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Speaker 2: That drive to his ex wives place and corroborating this,
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Speaker 2: which would be a great for the state to argue
14:01
Speaker 2: in opening statements. Let's see the video of who we
14:04
Speaker 2: believe to be the monster surgeon doctor Michael McKee, skulking
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Speaker 2: along in that private alley there you go right there.
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Speaker 2: See that's a private alley, Joe Scott Morgan for people.
14:19
Speaker 1: That live on that street.
14:21
Speaker 2: See it's the back of the tepee's home and they
14:24
Speaker 2: park there and walk in through a back door and
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Speaker 2: then across that alley or the next street over their
14:32
Speaker 2: backyard where they park.
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Speaker 1: This is a private alley.
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Speaker 2: Now, who would know about that other than somebody that
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Speaker 2: lived there, other than somebody that knew that route Joe
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Speaker 2: Scott Morgan.
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Speaker 7: Yeah, an alleyway is very specific to the geography of
14:49
Speaker 7: the location. And you know, this is kind of a
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Speaker 7: I don't want to say personal space, but it's you
14:55
Speaker 7: would have to have some kind of knowledge of a
14:57
Speaker 7: thoroughfare because you're trying to get from point A to
14:59
Speaker 7: point B. And And also this goes to another point, Nancy,
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Speaker 7: when you think about it, is he attempting to mask
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Speaker 7: his movement relative to this, not, you know, for whatever reason,
15:10
Speaker 7: not thinking that people there might be CCTV on the
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Speaker 7: alley as well. As a matter of fact, I got
15:15
Speaker 7: to tell you something, if you're trying to if you're
15:18
Speaker 7: trying to keep yourself safe, and this is a blind area.
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Speaker 7: I would want CCTV back there all the much more
15:25
Speaker 7: so because that's where a perpetrator might come in to
15:29
Speaker 7: burglarize your home or do any other kind of nasty
15:32
Speaker 7: business to you and your family. I can't imagine that
15:35
Speaker 7: he would not be aware of this, or at least
15:37
Speaker 7: have some inkling. He could be on videotape because he's
15:40
Speaker 7: just therapy.
15:40
Speaker 1: Did you see that, Joe Scott? Yep, did you see
15:43
Speaker 1: that last photo?
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Speaker 2: This is the photo where you see allegedly McKee walking
15:48
Speaker 2: along around three four am in the morning when he's
15:51
Speaker 2: supposed to be sleeping overnight back at his hospital.
15:53
Speaker 1: But then there was the.
15:54
Speaker 2: Other shot and look at that that there's nobody there
15:58
Speaker 2: but trash cans. That's the bad side where we believe
16:01
Speaker 2: he was walking.
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Speaker 7: Yeah, and being a native New Orleanian in our homes
16:07
Speaker 7: down there because the spaces are so tight and the
16:10
Speaker 7: truck will drive back there. This is not an area
16:13
Speaker 7: you're going to go hang out in Okay because it's
16:15
Speaker 7: generally populated.
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Speaker 1: Well, it's not the main thoroughfare.
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Speaker 2: I lived on an alley near the courthouse forever when
16:21
Speaker 2: I was prosecuting guys. Another issue has reared its ugly head.
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Speaker 2: Other than the defendant, the surgeon, vascular surgeon Michael McKee
16:33
Speaker 2: boarding out an alibi before invoking his right to remain silent. Hey, Kessler,
16:39
Speaker 2: I don't know if you know this or not, but
16:41
Speaker 2: he has been put in a billion b as In Brother,
16:46
Speaker 2: billion dollar facility that is focused on healing with comfy mattresses,
16:55
Speaker 2: natural light, and a Gatorade on demand station.
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Speaker 1: I'll let you that.
17:00
Speaker 2: I don't have any of that, but oh, there you go.
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Speaker 2: I want to live there? Are they selling condos there?
17:05
Speaker 2: But Kessler, I've just been corrected. It wasn't a four
17:09
Speaker 2: hour drive. It was nearly a seven hour drive that
17:15
Speaker 2: he departed upon without any directions Kessler seven hours. Clearly
17:23
Speaker 2: he left the phone behind to create an alibi, just
17:28
Speaker 2: like Brian Coberger turned off his phone while he committed
17:32
Speaker 2: the murders, which he pled to people online. Quit telling
17:35
Speaker 2: me he's innocent. He pled guilty. Brian Coberger did it?
17:39
Speaker 1: Accept it? So same thing here, just like.
17:43
Speaker 2: Morephew Barry Morphew allegedly turned off his cell phone at
17:49
Speaker 2: one juncture, then turned it back on. It's when you
17:53
Speaker 2: have your cell phone on constantly, then you turn it
17:55
Speaker 2: off at the time of the murders, then you turn
17:58
Speaker 2: it back on. Really, that looks even worse. So it's
18:03
Speaker 2: seven hours, seven hour drive Kessler. How long was.
18:08
Speaker 1: His phone broken? Did he call T mobile and ask
18:10
Speaker 1: for help?
18:11
Speaker 5: So he turned his cell phone off?
18:12
Speaker 6: Maybe he didn't want anyone to bother Maybe he knew
18:15
Speaker 6: he was going to do something, he was going to
18:16
Speaker 6: surveil him. And then you got an individual walking through
18:19
Speaker 6: an alley that you are sure is him, and you're
18:21
Speaker 6: guilty of murder because you walked.
18:23
Speaker 5: In an alley in the middle of the night.
18:24
Speaker 6: And even if it's him, there's so many questions here,
18:27
Speaker 6: so many ways for the defense to pick this apart.
18:29
Speaker 5: Oh that's him. I can identify the mole on his cheek. Yeah,
18:32
Speaker 5: you see every little detail about him. I'm sure that's
18:34
Speaker 5: him right there walking.
18:36
Speaker 6: Couldn't be anybody else of the three hundred million Americans
18:38
Speaker 6: in this country that walk around and are in the streets.
18:41
Speaker 6: You know, I think he got a whole lot of
18:43
Speaker 6: nothing so far. The fact that they got in, you know,
18:46
Speaker 6: lying about stuff. There could be one hundred reasons why
18:49
Speaker 6: he left his cell phone. There could be one hundred
18:50
Speaker 6: reasons why he didn't use GPS. You know what, I
18:54
Speaker 6: need more than that. And he's got a good lawyer now,
18:56
Speaker 6: so I'm looking forward to seeing this defense.
19:00
Speaker 2: Okay, Kelseer, It's not just it's not just identifying him
19:04
Speaker 2: walking along with his pool to the right.
19:06
Speaker 1: Every time you take a step.
19:09
Speaker 2: That person walking, that person walking down the alley was
19:16
Speaker 2: followed from doorbell cams and other surveillance straight to a
19:22
Speaker 2: car belonging to doctor McKee.
19:28
Speaker 1: So it's not just the right mole, the mole on
19:30
Speaker 1: his right cheek that you brought up.
19:33
Speaker 2: It's everything. Hey, I want you to look at a photo.
19:36
Speaker 2: This is more food for thought. I want you to
19:39
Speaker 2: look at doctor McKees before shot. This is him on
19:44
Speaker 2: his dating app compared to him in court. There he
19:50
Speaker 2: is on the dating app. Now look at this shot
19:53
Speaker 2: of him in court.
19:55
Speaker 1: Kessler.
19:56
Speaker 2: There has been rampant allegations that he's totally steroided up.
20:02
Speaker 2: Do you see them back and forth and before and
20:04
Speaker 2: after what happened.
20:06
Speaker 6: So if he took steroids, if he worked out, if
20:09
Speaker 6: he ate a lot of food, if he grew his
20:11
Speaker 6: beard out, if he didn't shave, You know, most people
20:12
Speaker 6: don't really manicure themselves for their mugshot and for the
20:15
Speaker 6: jailous photo for when they're getting You know, he's had
20:18
Speaker 6: a lot going on in his life.
20:19
Speaker 5: I don't know why he looks different. He's older.
20:21
Speaker 1: Can I say, Yester the place work out? This is
20:24
Speaker 1: not I think I can hear that.
20:26
Speaker 2: But did you actually say he's got a lot going on?
20:29
Speaker 2: Did you just say that?
20:31
Speaker 6: Obviously he's got a lot going on. You know, he's
20:34
Speaker 6: a busy surgeon. He's being accused of a crime. I
20:36
Speaker 6: mean you're going to convic some money because they look different,
20:39
Speaker 6: because they are now bigger, because they've got.
20:41
Speaker 5: More muscle or more fat, or more hair on their face.
20:44
Speaker 5: I mean, what is the basis for you said?
20:47
Speaker 1: I don't know how you get muscles in your head
20:49
Speaker 1: and your face. Crime stories with Nancy Grace.
21:02
Speaker 2: I want you Kesseler as you're trying to bail him out.
21:06
Speaker 2: I want you to hear minate Teppi's wedding vows and
21:11
Speaker 2: I think I know who she's talking about when she
21:15
Speaker 2: describes a waterfall of tears.
21:19
Speaker 9: From day one, I knew you were something special.
21:22
Speaker 5: I had quite a journey to get to you.
21:24
Speaker 9: Countless bad bumble, dates of wrong relationships and waterfalls of tears.
21:31
Speaker 5: But it was worth every cringing second because.
21:33
Speaker 8: It led me to you.
21:36
Speaker 9: Throughout all of this, I knew that God was guiding
21:39
Speaker 9: me to my person and that when I met him
21:44
Speaker 9: it would be the most magical thing ever.
21:48
Speaker 5: And boy, is that an understatement.
21:51
Speaker 9: I finally found my lobster and it honestly couldn't be
21:56
Speaker 9: a person with a more beautiful heart.
21:58
Speaker 5: I will love you forever and I'm so lucky to
22:00
Speaker 5: be missus.
22:01
Speaker 1: To the firearm.
22:02
Speaker 3: It appears he planned more of what to do rather
22:05
Speaker 3: than the aftermath of it.
22:06
Speaker 7: When you purchase a suppressor, you have to be registered
22:10
Speaker 7: with the ATF, unless purchased on the black market or
22:14
Speaker 7: something that he build.
22:15
Speaker 2: I can't wait to get a hold of his digital footprint,
22:20
Speaker 2: and I.
22:20
Speaker 1: Stand by that.
22:21
Speaker 2: I cannot wait to get ahold of his digital footprint
22:23
Speaker 2: and find out what websites he was on. What was
22:26
Speaker 2: he saying about himself? How did this guy get women?
22:29
Speaker 2: And speaking of getting women, guess what his ex girlfriend,
22:34
Speaker 2: who I believe is a doctor herself, is speaking out.
22:38
Speaker 2: Doctor Michael McKee turned murder defendant, ex girlfriend speaks.
22:44
Speaker 1: Let's listen he.
22:46
Speaker 10: Did tell me a little bit about his divorce at
22:49
Speaker 10: the time. So, and again I want to preface this
22:51
Speaker 10: with this is his side of the story and what
22:52
Speaker 10: he spoke to me. This is not truth. This is
22:55
Speaker 10: obviously very biased. But what he told me was that
22:58
Speaker 10: one that he came home from residency and Monique had
23:01
Speaker 10: the Initially she took everything. She left the house completely
23:04
Speaker 10: empty and also took their dogs. He was just left
23:07
Speaker 10: very stunned because he didn't see this coming and he
23:10
Speaker 10: was like completely devastated.
23:12
Speaker 1: Hmm.
23:12
Speaker 2: This is a woman who I believe to be a
23:15
Speaker 2: medical doctor that says she is McKee's ex girlfriend. She
23:19
Speaker 2: seems reliable and credible, and in the moment, you're going
23:22
Speaker 2: to see photos of her with McKee and her family.
23:26
Speaker 1: But I want to analyze what we just heard.
23:29
Speaker 2: Okay, straight out to doctor John DELATORI, licensed psychologist specializing
23:34
Speaker 2: in forensic psychology. Doctor Delatory, I'm hearing he did tell
23:39
Speaker 2: me a little bit about his divorce at the time.
23:41
Speaker 2: Don't people know, the people that are on the dating market,
23:44
Speaker 2: nobody wants to hear about their bad excess.
23:47
Speaker 1: Why it's like that, Yeah.
23:51
Speaker 8: So I think you know at some point in this
23:53
Speaker 8: whatever this relationship was it became, you know, kind of
23:57
Speaker 8: obvious that uh, all of the past baggage needed to
24:01
Speaker 8: be brought up for whatever reason. Maybe he was already triggered.
24:05
Speaker 8: Maybe Michael McKee was already triggered to kind of say
24:09
Speaker 8: all of this stuff. But it isn't really something that
24:11
Speaker 8: you say at the beginning. So maybe they had already
24:14
Speaker 8: had somewhat of an intimate relationship meeting they could speak
24:18
Speaker 8: to one another about this. But she's correct, and that
24:20
Speaker 8: she's only getting one half of the side of the story.
24:24
Speaker 8: The other half of the side of the story is
24:25
Speaker 8: certainly that he could have not been a very good
24:28
Speaker 8: guy to his ex wife and that's why his ex
24:32
Speaker 8: wife decided to take everything in the dog and leave.
24:35
Speaker 2: Now interesting right here to Elena Mandenberg joining us investigative
24:40
Speaker 2: reporter with the Mirror and the Irish Star and the Express.
24:45
Speaker 2: My reading of the divorce papers was that they had
24:50
Speaker 2: been living separately for some time.
24:52
Speaker 1: Is that correct? Yes?
24:55
Speaker 4: And the divorce papers site that they were incompatible, So
24:59
Speaker 4: if they're there were any issues, she never went to
25:02
Speaker 4: the police. All we have is rumors to friends, conversations
25:06
Speaker 4: she had with friends about his personality and his behavior.
25:10
Speaker 2: Okay, So Dave Mack Crime Stories investigator Port, you know
25:13
Speaker 2: where I'm going with this. If they were already separated,
25:16
Speaker 2: living in two different households, all right, And he says
25:21
Speaker 2: he came home and everything was cleaned out. That sounds
25:25
Speaker 2: like a lie because she would have had to drive
25:28
Speaker 2: several hours and take his stuff. She already had her
25:31
Speaker 2: stuff in her place, based on what was said in
25:34
Speaker 2: the divorce papers.
25:37
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's just being the victim selling a story that's
25:39
Speaker 3: totally not true. He tried to separate her from her
25:43
Speaker 3: family right away, which is what controlling men do, because
25:47
Speaker 3: she was very, very close to her family, as evidenced
25:49
Speaker 3: by all of the things we have seen over the
25:51
Speaker 3: last couple of weeks from the family and extended family.
25:54
Speaker 3: And the first thing he does that McKee does, he
25:58
Speaker 3: moves her way to Virginia, and which again kind of
26:02
Speaker 3: goes back to the beginning. They were only married seven months, Nancy,
26:06
Speaker 3: and they began they separated, and I think, just based
26:10
Speaker 3: on the way divorce rules work, stayed to stay. That's
26:12
Speaker 3: why I took you a year. I think it would
26:13
Speaker 3: have been a divorce lot quicker had they been able to.
26:16
Speaker 3: But she wasn't living with him like that.
26:18
Speaker 1: You know.
26:19
Speaker 2: Another thing I noticed in the divorce papers is that
26:24
Speaker 2: nothing was mentioned about getting furniture back or splitting household
26:28
Speaker 2: goods at all. Nothing about the dog arguing over the
26:32
Speaker 2: pots and pans. Randy Kessler, this is your Billywick. If
26:36
Speaker 2: this is true what he tried to feed his ex
26:38
Speaker 2: girlfriend that oh I came home and all this stuff
26:43
Speaker 2: was gone and the dog was gone. He didn't try
26:45
Speaker 2: to get any of that back in the divorce papers.
26:48
Speaker 2: I mean, I believe it was you that told me
26:50
Speaker 2: one day that people will kill each other over the
26:54
Speaker 2: pots and pans. But he didn't have any of that
26:58
Speaker 2: in the divorce papers. He didn't man did none of that.
27:00
Speaker 2: He did not ask for the dog, or the pots
27:02
Speaker 2: and pants, or the sofa, or the plant, or the
27:05
Speaker 2: TV or the Nintendo switch, none of that, which makes
27:08
Speaker 2: me think he's lying to this ex girlfriend.
27:12
Speaker 6: There's no way to decide how people feel based on
27:14
Speaker 6: looking at the divorce papers.
27:15
Speaker 5: Number one, he was probably telling you the ex girlfriend.
27:17
Speaker 6: When the relationship ended, she just left and took everything
27:20
Speaker 6: and took the dog, not the day of the divorce,
27:22
Speaker 6: not when she filed for divorce, relationships end a lot
27:24
Speaker 6: sooner than when people come to see me and hire
27:27
Speaker 6: me to file for divorce. The relationship has usually been
27:29
Speaker 6: over for a while. Number two, the dogs that have
27:31
Speaker 6: been gone for a long time. Number three. Apparently reading
27:34
Speaker 6: the divorce papers, he got a lot right. She basically
27:37
Speaker 6: wanted out. That's clear. She didn't have to put in
27:39
Speaker 6: there that he was violent. She just said, the marriage
27:41
Speaker 6: is over. That's all you need to play and she
27:44
Speaker 6: let him.
27:45
Speaker 1: You were so right about that.
27:46
Speaker 2: You were so right about that because he even got
27:50
Speaker 2: the money back for the engagement ring and the wedding man.
27:53
Speaker 1: Now there's a classy dude.
27:57
Speaker 6: Hey, you know, the bottom line is somebody wants out
28:00
Speaker 6: and somebody doesn't. And it sounds like she wanted out
28:02
Speaker 6: and he didn't want.
28:03
Speaker 5: Out as much.
28:03
Speaker 6: So she said, you know, what what will it take
28:06
Speaker 6: to end this right now? And he apparently said, this
28:08
Speaker 6: is what it's going to take, and they reached an agreement.
28:10
Speaker 6: They got it done. Why nobody knows. You can speculate
28:13
Speaker 6: all day long.
28:14
Speaker 1: Man, Look at the before and after.
28:16
Speaker 2: Guys, Hey, that shot you just showed New York Control Room,
28:19
Speaker 2: the one just before that. Look at him there, and
28:22
Speaker 2: look at him in his most recent bookend. This is
28:27
Speaker 2: where allegation is a steroids. Oh, somebody has a rash
28:29
Speaker 2: on their neck.
28:31
Speaker 1: Allegations of steroid use.
28:33
Speaker 2: Okay, I'll get ooh, there you go, and that is
28:37
Speaker 2: not just gaining weight. Wait, his neck is as big
28:40
Speaker 2: as a Virginia ham. That is either working out day
28:44
Speaker 2: in and day out or steroids. Okay, I'll get to
28:50
Speaker 2: the steroids in a moment. Not to John Delatory, but
28:52
Speaker 2: I want to go back to the ex girlfriend.
28:56
Speaker 1: Look at her. Do you believe her? Because I find
28:58
Speaker 1: her very credible.
28:59
Speaker 10: Listen, he didn't really talk about his parents. He did
29:01
Speaker 10: tell me he was adopted by an older couple and
29:05
Speaker 10: he just like they were good parents, but he just
29:07
Speaker 10: never talked about them. He never talked to them. I
29:10
Speaker 10: would call my mom like every day, we would. We
29:12
Speaker 10: have a great relationship. But he was just much more reserved.
29:14
Speaker 10: He never really When I asked him more, he just
29:16
Speaker 10: didn't really want to talk about it. So I kind
29:17
Speaker 10: of left it at that. This is him, This is
29:20
Speaker 10: a celebrating New Year's with a bunch of my friends
29:22
Speaker 10: and family, and this is me right here, and that's him,
29:26
Speaker 10: which is crazy.
29:27
Speaker 1: Okay, So if she's lying.
29:28
Speaker 2: She's gone to great links to photoshop pictures which looked
29:32
Speaker 2: very real to me. But that said doctor John Delatory,
29:37
Speaker 2: that's a blaring, blinking, flashing knee on light a warning.
29:43
Speaker 1: That's a red flag.
29:45
Speaker 2: He never talked about his parents. He never talked to
29:49
Speaker 2: his parents. When I would bring them up, he didn't
29:51
Speaker 2: want to talk about it. You know, that's something I
29:55
Speaker 2: look at. How does the guy treat his mother?
29:59
Speaker 8: Yeah, no, it is because the relationships that you have
30:03
Speaker 8: with your parents are often going to be the prototypes
30:06
Speaker 8: for the relationships that you have with other people, right,
30:09
Speaker 8: Because if you have these positive and secure attachments with
30:12
Speaker 8: your parents, you can assume that other people are going
30:15
Speaker 8: to have those kinds of attachments, so you can have
30:18
Speaker 8: those kinds of attachments with them. And I think it
30:20
Speaker 8: becomes a red flag when it becomes there's no clear
30:24
Speaker 8: reason as to why you would have this disconnect, as
30:28
Speaker 8: to why you would go no contact with your parents.
30:31
Speaker 8: People go no contact for all different kinds of reasons.
30:34
Speaker 8: But if he's willing to say and put himself out
30:37
Speaker 8: there to say that my ex wife took all my
30:39
Speaker 8: stuff and the dog, then why is he kind of
30:42
Speaker 8: obfuscating why he's no longer having any contact with his parents.
30:46
Speaker 8: So as the ex girlfriend, you start seeing these little patterns.
30:50
Speaker 8: You start seeing these little flags come up and being
30:53
Speaker 8: raised as to who exactly am I spending my time with,
30:56
Speaker 8: Who exactly is this person and what is he capable
30:59
Speaker 8: of doing?
31:00
Speaker 1: Well?
31:00
Speaker 2: I mean, Kessler, and all of your divorce clients that
31:02
Speaker 2: you've dealt with over the years, plus all your criminal
31:05
Speaker 2: defense you've represented, it's trying to pile up. I mean,
31:09
Speaker 2: I could believe, okay, it's the ex wife's fault, but
31:13
Speaker 2: now there's no contact with the parents. He doesn't want
31:17
Speaker 2: to talk about them, he's not in touch with him,
31:19
Speaker 2: So now it's the mom and the dad and the
31:23
Speaker 2: ex wife. I know it's him, He's the problem. He's
31:28
Speaker 2: the only common denominator. Do you ever have clients like that, where, oh,
31:32
Speaker 2: she did this, and she did that, and my teenage
31:34
Speaker 2: daughter won't speak to me, and my son hates me,
31:36
Speaker 2: blob pretty soon, Do you ever get it it's you,
31:41
Speaker 2: not them?
31:43
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean we sort of have that old joke
31:45
Speaker 6: that you know, sometimes it's the person who says, I'm
31:47
Speaker 6: only in jail because you called the police. Everything's the
31:49
Speaker 6: other person's faulting. This is a little more complicated, right.
31:52
Speaker 6: Obviously a successful guy, he's a very accomplished surgeon. He's
31:57
Speaker 6: made it through difficult studies, difficult schools, difficult jobs. So
32:01
Speaker 6: it's even harder for us to get our head around
32:03
Speaker 6: the fact that he might be totally off certing. You know,
32:05
Speaker 6: he's going to have a lot of defense to be
32:07
Speaker 6: able to say, look, you can't hold it together and
32:09
Speaker 6: be a great surgeon without some sort of stability, some
32:11
Speaker 6: sort of common sense, some sort of knowledge.
32:14
Speaker 5: It makes the case much more interesting. Yes, we definitely
32:16
Speaker 5: have people of it.
32:17
Speaker 2: I guess you've heard of Doctor Jekyll and mister Hyde. Right, Hey,
32:23
Speaker 2: one boy, I guess you got to hear this from
32:25
Speaker 2: the ex girlfriends. Hey, by the way, and I don't
32:27
Speaker 2: blame her, has now deleted her TikTok.
32:30
Speaker 1: She was at TikTok at s rummy, listen.
32:35
Speaker 10: He also has been to my family home. That's him
32:38
Speaker 10: right there. This is me and my family members. But
32:44
Speaker 10: it's honestly shocking, and I'm grateful that the Lord protected
32:46
Speaker 10: me from moving forward in that relationship. The reason why
32:50
Speaker 10: it ended was I honestly wasn't feeling it. I don't
32:54
Speaker 10: mean to be disrespectful, but he was just kind of
32:56
Speaker 10: boring and he was very much like kind of surface level.
32:59
Speaker 10: There was no like I couldn't go deep with him.
33:02
Speaker 10: And yeah, that's why I couldn't form like a deep
33:05
Speaker 10: connection with him because of that, I think in a
33:07
Speaker 10: wall up where he just like could not go deep
33:09
Speaker 10: with any conversations. Really, so that's why it ended.
33:13
Speaker 2: Doctor Delatory, doctor John Delatory joining us psychological consultant to
33:20
Speaker 2: Project Absence, which is a non profit searching for missing people.
33:25
Speaker 2: You can find him on Twitter, install and TikTok at
33:29
Speaker 2: doctor John Delatory.
33:31
Speaker 1: What does that mean? Uh?
33:34
Speaker 2: She says he had a wall up, they couldn't connect.
33:40
Speaker 1: How does that fit in with your observations.
33:43
Speaker 8: Here's the thing that I think I need to know
33:45
Speaker 8: before I can make a definitive decision. What was his
33:48
Speaker 8: bedside manner? We're in a unique position where we can
33:52
Speaker 8: see how someone interacts with other people on a regular basis,
33:56
Speaker 8: because it is certainly possible that doctor McKee has no
34:00
Speaker 8: bedside manner, that he views people as simply objects that
34:04
Speaker 8: he either has to fix or the other has to control.
34:07
Speaker 8: And so it's certainly possible that he has no depth,
34:10
Speaker 8: because there is no depth to him, that he has
34:14
Speaker 8: no real ability to connect to other people, and because
34:17
Speaker 8: he views them as just simple broken things that he
34:21
Speaker 8: knows how to fix, or things that he knows how
34:23
Speaker 8: to break over time, that there's nothing else there. And
34:27
Speaker 8: this ex girlfriend was able to pick up on that
34:29
Speaker 8: and extricate herself from this relationship. But the more we
34:33
Speaker 8: know about what his bedside manner is, the more we
34:35
Speaker 8: can tell whether or not this was an under an
34:38
Speaker 8: underlying psychopath or sociopath, you know.
34:41
Speaker 1: Doctor John Delatory.
34:42
Speaker 2: I've never dilved into it in front of a jury
34:46
Speaker 2: because it was irrelevant under the law, but I've studied
34:49
Speaker 2: it when I was prosecuting killers.
34:52
Speaker 1: And since the.
34:54
Speaker 2: Affect of a serial killer, the affect of a killer,
35:00
Speaker 2: knows what the ex girlfriend says fit into the profile
35:05
Speaker 2: of a psychopath.
35:09
Speaker 8: One of the biggest things that we look at when
35:11
Speaker 8: it comes to the psychopathy checklist is shallow affect. Now,
35:16
Speaker 8: by shallow affect, what that means is you can mimic, right,
35:19
Speaker 8: the psychopath is able to mimic emotions, They're able to
35:23
Speaker 8: mimic empathy, They're able to kind of demonstrate that just
35:27
Speaker 8: on a surface level, but you can't connect with them
35:30
Speaker 8: one human being to the next. Humans are really good
35:33
Speaker 8: at understanding when they're actually being connected, when they're when
35:37
Speaker 8: they're actually developing that intimacy. Psychopaths don't have that. And
35:42
Speaker 8: psychopathy isn't dictated by your by your intelligence. It absolutely
35:46
Speaker 8: is not. You can be highly intelligent, or you cannot
35:49
Speaker 8: be highly intelligent and still be a psychopath. Your job
35:52
Speaker 8: doesn't here or are those things. A sociopath is similar,
35:57
Speaker 8: But a sociopath is looking at the overall kind of
36:00
Speaker 8: construction of the world around them, the society and communities
36:04
Speaker 8: that they that are around them, and wants to buck
36:07
Speaker 8: that system. They want they want to to destroy those
36:11
Speaker 8: systems that are in place that are holding them down.
36:14
Speaker 8: The psychopath wants to hurt other people because they think
36:17
Speaker 8: that they're more right that that the narcissism is such
36:21
Speaker 8: that they are above other people, while the sociopathics to
36:25
Speaker 8: tear down the system as a whole.
36:27
Speaker 2: The ex girlfriend may be the closest will ever get
36:30
Speaker 2: to his true nature because there is no way this
36:33
Speaker 2: guy's taking the stand.
36:34
Speaker 1: There's nothing good about a silencer.
36:37
Speaker 5: I love silencers.
36:39
Speaker 3: That was an additional witness that was saying the owner
36:43
Speaker 3: of this silencer is guilty.
36:45
Speaker 2: Why does this vascular surgeon have a silencer?
36:49
Speaker 3: Kyd BMS, keep your damn big mouth.
36:53
Speaker 2: Shut straight out to a special guest joining us, Elena Mandenburg,
36:58
Speaker 2: investigative news reporter for The Mirror, the Irish Star and
37:03
Speaker 2: The Express.
37:04
Speaker 1: You'll wine again. Thank you for being with us tonight.
37:06
Speaker 1: So where is McKee tonight?
37:10
Speaker 4: He is at the James A. Carton's Correction Center in
37:14
Speaker 4: Franklin County, Ohio, which is brand new, billion dollars build,
37:20
Speaker 4: billions of dollars sunk into this project, and honestly mostly
37:26
Speaker 4: looks like a rehab center.
37:28
Speaker 1: For it is a jail and not a prison.
37:31
Speaker 4: So it is a place people will go and either
37:35
Speaker 4: they will see their day in court and be free,
37:38
Speaker 4: or they will move into the prison system. So if
37:42
Speaker 4: Mickey is guilty and convicted, he'll he won't be staying
37:46
Speaker 4: in this nice facility for very long. I have a
37:49
Speaker 4: feeling it was mostly built to address, you know, the
37:52
Speaker 4: drug addiction and population in Ohio, and Franklin County does
37:58
Speaker 4: cycle through, you know, nearly twenty thousand people a year
38:01
Speaker 4: operates one of the largest jail systems in the state.
38:05
Speaker 2: Well, wait a minute, Elena Mandenburg, twenty thousand people. So
38:10
Speaker 2: does the Hilton, So does the Mandalay, so does the
38:13
Speaker 2: Waldorf Astoria. Do they have to stay in a place
38:17
Speaker 2: it looks like it looks like the lobby of one
38:20
Speaker 2: of those futuristic hotels where there's very spark sparse.
38:26
Speaker 1: Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa? Wait? What is that? Go go back? What?
38:32
Speaker 1: What are those balls? Doctor Dwayne Hendrix?
38:36
Speaker 2: What in the hey that looks like the Equinox, the
38:43
Speaker 2: fancy workout club in New York? What did you see
38:48
Speaker 2: those balls that you sit on and try to balance
38:52
Speaker 2: and do exercises on them?
38:54
Speaker 1: Can I see that picture again? Those life cycles are better?
38:59
Speaker 1: What book at this?
39:01
Speaker 5: Well?
39:01
Speaker 11: Manci, Just like the reporter just mentioned, this is a
39:05
Speaker 11: new facility. When I served as a ward in the
39:09
Speaker 11: state of West Virginia, there was a big opioid crisis
39:14
Speaker 11: there as well, and Ohio was a leading state in
39:18
Speaker 11: terms of trying to address the opioid addiction. And I
39:20
Speaker 11: believe this jail was designed to deal with those the
39:24
Speaker 11: crisis that they have in the state of Ohio. You know,
39:27
Speaker 11: nearly eighty thousand out of deaths a year out of
39:31
Speaker 11: one hundred thousand opioid deaths. Eighty percent of those deaths
39:34
Speaker 11: are related to opioid addiction. I know you mentioned something
39:38
Speaker 11: about gatorade stations as well, and looking into that, the
39:42
Speaker 11: gatorade stations and electro likes are there to address the
39:46
Speaker 11: for inmates that are withdrawing from opioid addiction. So that
39:49
Speaker 11: is why, because ultimately I had never heard of that before.
39:53
Speaker 11: But ultimately, this is why they designed this facility in
39:57
Speaker 11: the manner that they did, because they're trying to address
40:00
Speaker 11: the issue.
40:00
Speaker 1: What's next? Are they going to drop the Starbucks in there?
40:05
Speaker 5: No, they're not going to draw Starbucks there. No, they're not.
40:10
Speaker 2: No, no extra squirt of sugar free vanilla.
40:16
Speaker 1: What's next? Listen.
40:19
Speaker 12: McKee arrived from Ohio and was booked into the Franklin
40:22
Speaker 12: County Jail the James A. Karnes Correction Center. At his arrangement,
40:26
Speaker 12: McKee pleaded not guilty and waived a request for bond.
40:30
Speaker 12: McKee will remain in Carnes Correction Center until his attorney
40:33
Speaker 12: seeks bail or the case goes to trial.
40:36
Speaker 13: The new jail has a less institutional feel on purpose,
40:39
Speaker 13: as the Sheriff's office excited about biophilic design principles using
40:44
Speaker 13: high ceilings, murals of mountains and ocean scenes, and maximum
40:48
Speaker 13: natural light. Pods are located on the second floor with
40:51
Speaker 13: better access to the natural light via skylights.
40:54
Speaker 14: Design features include use of wood graining, requiring use of
40:58
Speaker 14: headphones when watching, and the presidence of clocks. Extra care
41:03
Speaker 14: spent on mattresses to help inmates abuse putting clocks in
41:06
Speaker 14: the jail, making things seem more normal, less institutional.
41:10
Speaker 2: Okay, Doctor Dwayne Hendrix is with us, Just so you
41:14
Speaker 2: know why he's joining us tonight. Former warden MDC. Brooklyn
41:21
Speaker 2: Warden Sheridan, Oregon Senior Warden, US Department of Justice, Federal
41:25
Speaker 2: Bureau Prisons, Founder, president of a New Dalyite Foundation, author
41:30
Speaker 2: of who Are You See It?
41:33
Speaker 1: Say It? Seize It? Okay, doctor Hendrix, thank you for
41:37
Speaker 1: being with us.
41:37
Speaker 2: I'd like you to peruse these shots inside the carnes
41:41
Speaker 2: Ci Correctional Institute. Now, they have a biophilic design, doctor Hendrix,
41:47
Speaker 2: which incorporates natural materials, light, vegetation, organic forms into the
41:55
Speaker 2: built environment. They are trying to foster a connection with nature,
42:02
Speaker 2: enhance human.
42:03
Speaker 1: Will, being, health, and productivity.
42:06
Speaker 2: Okay, doctor Dwayne Hendrix, why do I want him closer
42:12
Speaker 2: to nature?
42:12
Speaker 5: Well, I mean he is in.
42:14
Speaker 11: The jail allegedly for committing these murders, so that he's
42:17
Speaker 11: there for punished as punishment. But while you're incarcerated, you're
42:21
Speaker 11: not there to be punished further. And the aesthetics of
42:25
Speaker 11: this facility is there to create again in environment.
42:28
Speaker 2: Wait wait wait wait wait what you're not incarcerated to
42:32
Speaker 2: be punished.
42:34
Speaker 5: What I said as punishment?
42:36
Speaker 1: Did you say that he did? Okay? What?
42:38
Speaker 11: Yes, he's there as punishment or not for further punishment.
42:44
Speaker 11: And I'll also say the aesthetics of this facility is
42:47
Speaker 11: not just for those inmates, but they're also for the
42:49
Speaker 11: staff as well, because these are the correctional environment is
42:53
Speaker 11: not something.
42:55
Speaker 1: That the staff.
42:59
Speaker 2: The staff they can go home in front of their
43:02
Speaker 2: wide scream big screen TV and sitting their pit group.
43:05
Speaker 1: That's a jail.
43:07
Speaker 11: Those staff are spending sixteen hours and a lot more
43:11
Speaker 11: than forty hours a week in those environments and having.
43:15
Speaker 2: Give them an awesome staff lounge. You're right, I'd be
43:19
Speaker 2: mad if they didn't. But can I ask you why
43:22
Speaker 2: does a guy charge with double murder shooting people dead
43:25
Speaker 2: in their beds with their children in the next room
43:28
Speaker 2: screaming their heads off. Have natural materials utilizing wood, stone, bratan, bamboo,
43:36
Speaker 2: terra cotta to create tactile connections in nature, maximizing daylight
43:42
Speaker 2: through large windows skylights.
43:46
Speaker 1: I don't know.
43:47
Speaker 11: I'm flummings because you're trying to reduce You're trying to
43:49
Speaker 11: reduce violence.
43:51
Speaker 5: You're trying to reduce violence.
43:52
Speaker 11: You're trying to reduce the amount of mental the mental
43:55
Speaker 11: toll that it takes on those individuals that are incarcerated,
43:58
Speaker 11: as well as the staff that work these environments. That
44:01
Speaker 11: is the reason why that these new designs of a
44:05
Speaker 11: facility like this, and it's for rehabilitative purposes because eighty
44:10
Speaker 11: percent of people that go to prison will or jail
44:12
Speaker 11: will be released back into our communities and after spending
44:15
Speaker 11: several years in prison, you want your neighbors to come
44:19
Speaker 11: back in a better in somewhat better condition mentally.
44:31
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace Scott Morgan.
44:37
Speaker 2: Please help me because I feel like I'm in the
44:40
Speaker 2: crazy house right now.
44:42
Speaker 1: Do you hear Hendrix? Do I respect it? Up until
44:44
Speaker 1: this moment?
44:46
Speaker 2: Biophilic design connection with nature, Maximum Natural Light Company mattresses.
44:53
Speaker 7: What it's a forecross from the Eastern State Penitentiary in Pennsylvan,
45:00
Speaker 7: which I've visited many years ago, which was one of
45:04
Speaker 7: the first places where people were incarcerated. And yeah, this
45:07
Speaker 7: does look more like a treatment facility than it does
45:11
Speaker 7: a place for long term correction. And again, this is
45:17
Speaker 7: a county facility, Nancy. This is merely a holding or
45:21
Speaker 7: stopping point.
45:22
Speaker 1: Can I say the urinal please?
45:26
Speaker 2: You know, Joe Scott, there is a phenomena where men
45:31
Speaker 2: have the performance anxiety if they have to urinate with
45:38
Speaker 2: someone watching them, they just can't do it.
45:42
Speaker 1: I'm sure I shrink would know the correct name. But
45:45
Speaker 1: there you go. There's a little privacy wall so they
45:49
Speaker 1: can t t.
45:53
Speaker 5: Yeah.
45:53
Speaker 7: Well again, back to functionality here, Nancy. How long is
45:57
Speaker 7: this guy going to be here. He's going to go
45:59
Speaker 7: to trial. He's going to wind up some in a
46:02
Speaker 7: location that'll be far from this as far as the
46:05
Speaker 7: esthetic goes, He's going to wind up in Ohio State
46:08
Speaker 7: Penitentiary if he goes to trial and he's convicted. And
46:12
Speaker 7: that's a far cry from what you're seeing here.
46:14
Speaker 2: So doctor Dwayne Hendrix, I'm sure you're happy that doctor
46:21
Speaker 2: Michael McKee charged with double murder gunning to people down
46:27
Speaker 2: in their beds and keeping the gun so he can
46:31
Speaker 2: relive the terror he saw on.
46:34
Speaker 1: Maniq's face as he towered over their bed that night.
46:38
Speaker 2: You're happy he has plenty of space to roam around
46:43
Speaker 2: in this billion dollar facility. He's got a lot more
46:47
Speaker 2: space than Spencer and Menique have. They're in a coffin now.
46:52
Speaker 11: No, I'm not happy that he's in a better space because,
46:56
Speaker 11: trust me, if he's convicted, you know, like morning to say,
47:00
Speaker 11: he is stot morning to say, he is going to
47:03
Speaker 11: go to a state penitentiary and spend the rest of
47:06
Speaker 11: his life behind bars, and he's going to have to
47:08
Speaker 11: channel that mister Hyde character because he won't be able
47:14
Speaker 11: to manipulate his way through the things that he's thought
47:17
Speaker 11: he has done throughout his life to get to the
47:20
Speaker 11: point where he is now. So he's going to be
47:22
Speaker 11: more mister Hyde than mister Jekyll in a in a
47:25
Speaker 11: different facility. But I can also as an administrator in corrections,
47:29
Speaker 11: I can see why they've built some of these institutions
47:33
Speaker 11: in this in this way because again, you're trying to
47:35
Speaker 11: reduce stress, you're trying to reduce violence, and you're trying
47:39
Speaker 11: to put individuals in a position so that when they
47:42
Speaker 11: do release, that they'll be better mentally and physically.
47:47
Speaker 5: But no, I'm not.
47:50
Speaker 2: Let me remind you what this what this is all about.
47:53
Speaker 2: What tonight is all about. The reason you are here,
47:57
Speaker 2: the reason I am here. It's about Monique and Spencer TEPPI,
48:03
Speaker 2: that's what it's about.
48:05
Speaker 15: Listen, what's changed since the last person I talked to.
48:09
Speaker 16: There's a body. There's a body.
48:10
Speaker 15: Here's a body inside. Yeah, okay, hold on one second,
48:17
Speaker 15: let me get you on the line with the medic. Okay,
48:20
Speaker 15: on the line.
48:21
Speaker 16: He appears dead. There's a body. Our friend wasn't in transphoned.
48:26
Speaker 16: We just did the wellership, we just came here INtime.
48:29
Speaker 16: He appears dead.
48:32
Speaker 6: Okay.
48:33
Speaker 16: I his blood. He's laying next to his head, off
48:36
Speaker 16: of his and there's blood. I think people shout more
48:40
Speaker 16: than that.
48:41
Speaker 5: Okay, he can tell he's obviously not for you.
48:43
Speaker 2: Ornything?
48:44
Speaker 3: Is it like how to like like? How to like you?
48:46
Speaker 5: Because it doesn't look great.
48:50
Speaker 16: I can't I can't look Okay.
48:52
Speaker 5: All right, I understand.
48:53
Speaker 2: Professor Forensics, Jackson State University, Joseph Scott Morgan. What about
48:57
Speaker 2: the allegations that he's using steroids.
49:00
Speaker 1: Did you see that before and after?
49:03
Speaker 5: Yeah?
49:04
Speaker 7: I did, and again weight gain in bulk and that
49:07
Speaker 7: sort of thing can be explained in any number of ways. However,
49:11
Speaker 7: if an individual is abusing steroids, are integrating them into
49:17
Speaker 7: their life in any way, that's something that generally happens
49:20
Speaker 7: early on when they're beginning to utilize them, and you
49:24
Speaker 7: do see significant growth, But over long term use. Relative
49:28
Speaker 7: to anabolic steroids, you're talking about things that make people
49:32
Speaker 7: a bit delusional. They can be highly reactive, they can
49:37
Speaker 7: actually have a certain level of paranoia relative to them,
49:42
Speaker 7: and so that's something that should be explored. However, now
49:46
Speaker 7: that he is incarcerated, if he was using these before,
49:49
Speaker 7: you could actually see a reduction in size. We'll see
49:53
Speaker 7: how this plays out.
49:54
Speaker 1: Randy Cassel, is steroid use a defense.
49:58
Speaker 6: No, it's a big problem for the actual defense lord
50:01
Speaker 6: because now the public and the jury might say, well,
50:04
Speaker 6: he was a functioning doctor, what would have made him
50:06
Speaker 6: do something? And this is an explanation for them to say, well,
50:09
Speaker 6: we could see how I could push more of the edge,
50:11
Speaker 6: But being on steroids doesn't justify this.
50:14
Speaker 5: If his defense is I did it, but I was
50:15
Speaker 5: on steroids.
50:16
Speaker 6: I think his defense is I didn't do it, so
50:18
Speaker 6: make steroids irrelevant.
50:20
Speaker 2: Dave Matt, what can you tell me about an alleged
50:22
Speaker 2: clerical error that could have sparked a killing spree?
50:28
Speaker 3: Nancy? It is so shocking that this simple clerical air
50:33
Speaker 3: involving the docket number within the court system. Court officials
50:37
Speaker 3: have confirmed that this error in the docket number resulted
50:42
Speaker 3: in the McKee divorce case getting a hearing put on
50:48
Speaker 3: the docket for June of twenty twenty five, and including
50:52
Speaker 3: a scheduled trial date for September. This brought everything back
50:57
Speaker 3: to the forefront for McKee because this was settled in
51:01
Speaker 3: twenty seventeen and here it is in twenty twenty five
51:04
Speaker 3: being brought up. It was a simple air. It was
51:07
Speaker 3: caught and corrected and the scheduled September hearing was canceled,
51:11
Speaker 3: but it was still brought out.
51:12
Speaker 15: Nancy.
51:14
Speaker 2: Jelina Vandenburgh joining us from the Mirror the Irish Star,
51:18
Speaker 2: and they Expresslina, what happens now?
51:23
Speaker 4: So now we go to trial. Now the defense and
51:26
Speaker 4: the prosecutor have each got to work on their evidence.
51:29
Speaker 4: It's unlikely we're going to hear too many updates of details.
51:32
Speaker 4: I reached out to all the lawyers, of course, and
51:35
Speaker 4: they can't comment until the case is over. So, as
51:40
Speaker 4: I said earlier, the prosecutor is going to have, you know,
51:45
Speaker 4: a tough time filling in the little holes and the
51:48
Speaker 4: little pieces beyond a reasonable doubt, and that's going to
51:52
Speaker 4: be the next part.
51:53
Speaker 1: There's no trial date set so far.
51:55
Speaker 4: He just centered the not guilty plea and we're going
51:58
Speaker 4: to wait to find when there is a trial data
52:01
Speaker 4: and if the evidence z to find, that might be
52:03
Speaker 4: sooner rather than later.
52:04
Speaker 1: And if anything.
52:06
Speaker 4: Found complicates the case, then it's going to take some
52:09
Speaker 4: time before we actually see any kind of official details
52:13
Speaker 4: from the case.
52:14
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace signing off, goodbye friend,