Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Simon Exton & Si Hart about their choice of The Web Planet (4/6)

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Talks to Simon Exton & Si Hart about their choice of The Web Planet (4/6) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:40
  Hello and welcome back to hamster with a blunt penknife
• 0:43
  this time on tales of the isotope galaxies were returned
• 0:46
  for our regular visit to vortice where Joe Ford Fields an
• 0:50
  irresistible pull. So I heart has come across a
• 0:52
  gaping Chasm and Simon Exon has come down with a nasty face
• 0:55
  case, the van and grubs. This is the creator of needles.
• 0:59
  Welcome to the web Planet episode 4.
• 1:02
  Oh that was beautiful. Honestly, absolute filth but
• 1:07
  beautiful. If Many a capon Chasm, so that's
• 1:12
  fine. I have heard that rumor.
• 1:14
  In fact, I'm sure all three of us have.
• 1:19
  Yeah, we are episode 4 of the web Planet.
• 1:23
  If I could just ask Sy, we're gonna do we record the first
• 1:27
  three episodes of this was in June and here we are at the end
• 1:32
  of September, I think him up in 2020, you know, it was earlier
• 1:37
  than June, I think it was over, okay.
• 1:39
  Okay, it was a while ago and we've all admitted off-camera
• 1:44
  that we've completely forgotten what we talked about in the
• 1:46
  first three episodes. So at the risk of repeating
• 1:48
  ourselves, shut up and pay attention or because well,
• 1:51
  really indecisive. So, if we say it twice, I'm sure
• 1:54
  it's very intelligent. Do you guys remember anything at
• 1:57
  all? Well, talked about the web
• 2:00
  Planet, I do remember that? Yes, it's about William Hartnell
• 2:05
  a bit. I remember particularly his
• 2:07
  Bonkers performance in episode 1, And Solomon, totally slagged
• 2:12
  off, Donna Noble. I remember that.
• 2:15
  I didn't I liked off Catherine, Tate, I like Donna Noble.
• 2:18
  I don't think she's well plate, looking for, one right way to
• 2:25
  address this, what we're into go would sign like to count as into
• 2:33
  this episode please. Well, should we do a quick recap
• 2:36
  first? Because we probably all
• 2:37
  forgotten what's happened. What?
• 2:39
  Hey, what would you say? So, I started this and I had it
• 2:42
  thrown at me. Recently, the Recaps all yours
• 2:45
  off you go, right? Well the Tardis family have
• 2:48
  landed on what is to date the best realized Alien Planet.
• 2:54
  They've met a load of really Camp butterflies some very Butch
• 2:58
  chance and The talking hair dryer with a gold jewelry
• 3:05
  fixation. Oh, yeah, it was at the
• 3:07
  Cliffhanger when I came down, isn't the Cliffhanger to this
• 3:11
  one, where they were in and rest in fall down that big hole.
• 3:17
  Oh, yes. And because we're about to meet
• 3:19
  the fourth different alien race of this?
• 3:23
  Yeah, this world aren't we? I forgot the mobile footstools.
• 3:26
  Yeah, the jumping duvets. What they called the Opera.
• 3:30
  Yeah, Opera Honestly, it's a performance and a half Italian
• 3:35
  and I do you would pay attention but it's better laughter.
• 3:37
  The beginning of this, I think when they were filled with this,
• 3:39
  there was a bit of a giggle as you can hear someone in the
• 3:42
  background laugh and the red off as they head down that Chasm and
• 3:45
  you know, the operator, then they're Millennials.
• 3:47
  Because they've got white dreadlocks called Shamanism and
• 3:53
  really bad art. That's a commentary you're here
• 3:59
  for today, folks. All right, Well most of your
• 4:03
  listeners are opposites and age high and sexuality.
• 4:07
  Yes Simon would you care to count us in?
• 4:13
  Absolutely. So are we doing three or five or
• 4:16
  whatever you absolutely down for you?
• 4:19
  Well, we've already wasted enough time.
• 4:21
  Let's do three. Okay, go on.
• 4:24
  Three, two, one, go. The best realized alien world
• 4:31
  today. Yeah.
• 4:33
  What's this competition? The says there's a fiery
• 4:36
  marinus. All right.
• 4:38
  Yeah. What's the next best thing?
• 4:44
  You reckon? Scar.
• 4:47
  Ostara hesitant What when's that?
• 4:52
  That was in the Daleks Joe. Remember, seeing I mean, after
• 4:56
  this what how I left it laughter?
• 4:58
  This was the Space Museum. Well, you think that, well,
• 5:08
  realize that there's a pole, it's dusty.
• 5:13
  I quite like the jungle with Dive Master Plan, you know?
• 5:17
  Yeah, that's really well done. Isn't it?
• 5:19
  Can't be a black-and-white jungle.
• 5:21
  I've had it fallen down. A ruddy.
• 5:23
  Great hole. Yeah.
• 5:28
  I love is this frosted beings? My yes.
• 5:31
  Yeah. He's a really nice character.
• 5:33
  They are all giving really like decent illnesses.
• 5:38
  Underneath those masks. And the manometer are one of the
• 5:43
  very few times. That aliens actually come across
• 5:46
  as alien. They have a normally it's just
• 5:50
  humans that look a bit different but they're the way of speaking
• 5:54
  their motivation. All of that is very human, the
• 5:56
  manometer a completely different.
• 5:57
  They have a different way of speaking.
• 5:59
  They have a different way of moving.
• 6:01
  They got that because they got choreographer into to work with
• 6:06
  them. They do all the hand moves that
• 6:09
  made, okay. It looks like they're doing bad
• 6:11
  voguing but it does look really alien.
• 6:17
  I love it. So when they get really angry
• 6:19
  each other and they go that's really great way.
• 6:23
  All got when Helio First turns up and we'll turn up to that.
• 6:26
  It's like I mean one hilio is such a drama queen.
• 6:31
  It's not true, it's absolutely hey.
• 6:33
  But me in the web Planet, I'll tell you but it's like new gay
• 6:39
  turns up. But work and even worse Barbara
• 6:48
  as the office fag hag and his friend.
• 6:54
  Oh dear it's not going to be popular.
• 6:57
  Talk about yeah Prestige act to Uncle.
• 7:01
  Martin Java is a Prestige actress was he's just starting
• 7:03
  out. It was something new actor at
• 7:05
  this point, wasn't he? He was just starting out his
• 7:07
  career and they offered him a says His autobiography about
• 7:11
  this, he said he was offered This brilliant part of a heroic
• 7:16
  Prince was going to come sweeping into the story and then
• 7:20
  realize that it was actually an insect Prince and he hadn't
• 7:25
  realized that sort of from The Proposal that was given and then
• 7:30
  he was he talks quite a lot about being drilled by Rosalind
• 7:34
  winter and what I dragons she was and how she she sort of made
• 7:38
  them all. Do the hand.
• 7:40
  Pants and practice everything together.
• 7:42
  And he said, every time he tried to sneak off from those lessons,
• 7:44
  she would be calling him back and not taking any nonsense and
• 7:49
  drilling everyone sort of quite heavily.
• 7:51
  He's marvelous on the DVD do on the documentary because he goes,
• 7:55
  you know, I was under the impression.
• 7:57
  This wasn't Doctor Who and these Doctor Who people it was all
• 8:00
  about Prince. Hey Leo, you know the hero of
• 8:02
  the piece is actually in about four scenes.
• 8:08
  Did you guys bring your second off to you?
• 8:14
  One of the things I really like about them an opera is that you
• 8:17
  could tell that their ages, because they really struggle
• 8:19
  with all the names. And I'm really like that.
• 8:22
  They have different versions of the names for everyone because
• 8:26
  they can't quite pronounce the Earth names properly.
• 8:30
  And that's really that's something.
• 8:32
  We don't have a seed. Again, this is a hair instead of
• 8:35
  yeah. Opera opera, did you say that
• 8:41
  model? Shot of it, Go of the crater of
• 8:43
  needles, where it pans down, you've got the webbing over it.
• 8:46
  And then like all these needles sticking out and the creator of
• 8:50
  needles from looked at the set looks fantastic and Barbara and
• 8:55
  frost are walking through it. And there, are they burn optra
• 9:02
  generally doing fuck all in the background.
• 9:04
  To be honest, they don't really seem to be doing very much.
• 9:07
  Much. See we don't they are one of the
• 9:10
  background there isn't, it's just voguing in front of a
• 9:14
  pillar. I mean, it's clearly off its
• 9:15
  face on something. Yes, apparently I was reading
• 9:19
  this up today because I did do a little bit of homework for this
• 9:22
  episode was that they are, they had imported seaweed from
• 9:26
  Cornwall that was brought up, but it started to cook under the
• 9:30
  studio light. So there's no smell of rotten
• 9:33
  seaweed, will you get off the coast?
• 9:36
  You get off. What were they doing there?
• 9:42
  What are they actually doing this?
• 9:43
  Seaweed like that is explained so it's what they build the
• 9:46
  carcinoma from. Okay, I goes through the acid
• 9:50
  pools, doesn't it? Gotcha, gotcha.
• 9:54
  Okay. Now there's all be is attempting
• 9:56
  to brain control vehicle. Who's amazing.
• 10:01
  What they can do with their mandibles?
• 10:05
  Answering that how powerful does Harper look in this story but
• 10:13
  he's completely in. Come on his knee.
• 10:18
  Simon. Yes.
• 10:19
  And he's he's, he's now in the hair dryer and so you can only
• 10:25
  really clearly see his chin. And he's obviously, monumentally
• 10:29
  pissed off at being my third by this, disembodied voice.
• 10:33
  And it's It's a fantastic performance.
• 10:42
  And you know that he's lying through his teeth that he's
• 10:44
  doing it really well. How many cigarettes a day?
• 10:49
  Do you imagine the actress who played the voice of the Animus
• 10:53
  has to tell you all that is one croaky voice should be done.
• 10:56
  Kept some full strength and she was about four but it's a really
• 11:01
  sexy voice as well as it would not.
• 11:04
  Had a, this is the first female villain.
• 11:06
  We've had really apart from, what's a facing, the keys of
• 11:11
  marinus for the last couple. Episodes.
• 11:13
  Oh, the one who when she's become lady painful.
• 11:15
  That's the one but shit. I'm Catherine Fleming, I think
• 11:19
  it is. Isn't it?
• 11:20
  Who plays the voice of the Animus?
• 11:21
  She's superb. She's so Sinister.
• 11:25
  Do you see? Vicki there, like, with her?
• 11:28
  Her eyes rolled up and go? Hey, that could you could take
• 11:30
  the piss out of that, but she's completely committed.
• 11:33
  I think, are we did definitely talk about whatever I never says
• 11:36
  one thing three but I think it's worth.
• 11:39
  It's worth reminding just how good an actress she is.
• 11:42
  Is because Vicki is a character is given almost nothing to do
• 11:48
  she, she inserts the Revolt in the space museum.
• 11:51
  That is about her only really positive role.
• 11:54
  But she's one of those actresses that is always there and doing
• 11:57
  things and she's there in a performance in the background.
• 12:06
  And she's always entertaining yet.
• 12:09
  She's always reacting and listening and looking and doing
• 12:13
  things which is really, really good.
• 12:15
  I think she's absolutely tremendous but I kind of how
• 12:19
  they got Susan Wright. Yeah I've got a question for
• 12:23
  Simon. Do you think that is generally
• 12:26
  the case Classic series that you kind of got sketchily written
• 12:31
  Companions and the actors have to fill in a lot of the gaps.
• 12:35
  Yes, for the most part I mean certainly 60 stuff.
• 12:39
  So you got Susan who is weird granddaughter, Vicki, who is
• 12:43
  replacement granddaughter, Ian and Barbara teacher and teacher.
• 12:50
  Stephen space pilot that we forget about in three seconds.
• 12:53
  Flat. Katerina.
• 12:59
  Yeah. Yeah Katarina is Dreadful odo's
• 13:03
  forget about three seconds flat even after she's appeared.
• 13:06
  Well don't do dope changes from pretty much from episode to
• 13:09
  episode. Sorry kingdom is very good and
• 13:12
  has a good and consistent background.
• 13:17
  Ben and Polly. Possibly have a little bit more
• 13:22
  to them, or is that just because their performances are so good
• 13:26
  thing initially, initially that first story, they're very well
• 13:29
  characterized and then they start falling into certain traps
• 13:32
  as they go along with the cliches or the companion but
• 13:36
  you're right, the performances are so charismatic.
• 13:38
  They're just papers over all the cracks.
• 13:41
  Yeah. And it's they and certainly 60s
• 13:45
  companions. Either fall into the hero role
• 13:49
  or Granddaughter /, surrogate granddaughter that needs
• 13:54
  rescuing roll which kind of gets.
• 13:58
  You don't really see after the 60s until we get to our dreck.
• 14:03
  That's true. Yeah, I want measure and Nyssa.
• 14:05
  So my question for you then soy is what's the exception to the
• 14:10
  rule? That who's the classic
• 14:11
  companion? The comes fully formed in the
• 14:13
  writing and then the acting just adds the Polish.
• 14:17
  Oh no, that's a very good question.
• 14:19
  I mean, at least for a while now, well, that's very true.
• 14:25
  Well, that's that's very good because there are some who do
• 14:29
  come fully formed and are ready to go.
• 14:32
  Go. I think it always seems to be
• 14:34
  the ones who are sort of the stronger female character.
• 14:39
  So someone like, Zoey and Liz and I've been probably sort of
• 14:47
  the to Rome owners and Lila laughs.
• 14:50
  Hey Leela as mouth. Sure.
• 14:52
  And then and in a lot of those cases you've also got then the
• 14:57
  actor bringing something to a really well-written part or a
• 15:01
  better. Written companion parts that
• 15:04
  isn't necessarily what they're just adding extra extra value to
• 15:11
  what's what's there. So I mean we've talked about
• 15:14
  Louise Jameson just being such a thoughtful actor and it's either
• 15:18
  they're in Tom Baker's face is like I've got up my game, you
• 15:21
  know. Did you both see, there's a
• 15:26
  couple of details. I've just seen a minute ago.
• 15:29
  They've got like down in the optra caves.
• 15:32
  They've got like sort of murals on the walls of that sort of Art
• 15:37
  and then when they put the ins hands into some strange Gunk,
• 15:42
  wait, because I'll come back this like an adhesive.
• 15:46
  Isn't it? Where there has a rather than
• 15:48
  having handcuffs? Well, seaweed or something like
• 15:50
  that? It's lots of lovely little
• 15:52
  touches to make this really The alien.
• 15:54
  Yeah, I mean, that the slight problem with that art is they
• 15:58
  say, oh, this is our goal, these are our God's, the man, optra
• 16:01
  are God's. And what they've got is weird
• 16:05
  things with lots and lots of legs.
• 16:07
  So it's kind of like a half millipede, half spider that
• 16:10
  looks nothing like a butterfly. I love to I love those.
• 16:14
  The ones on the skateboard you talk about the the Venom browse
• 16:17
  know, they the pictures that they the Opera have drawn.
• 16:21
  And there's, you know, they were dressed in is talking them
• 16:25
  around and saying the opteron your gods, they your Kinsmen and
• 16:30
  before that bit, they point out the art and say you taught them
• 16:35
  a nocturna, our are gods. But the pictures are it's like
• 16:40
  a, it's like a blob with lots of legs coming off it.
• 16:44
  I think Richard my probably do it about two minutes, but it'll
• 16:48
  add a bit in detail. Better culture to the opera did
• 16:51
  Richard. Martin ever do anything in two
• 16:52
  minutes? It's direct his camera script.
• 16:57
  I don't know, I got a question. They should know what, right?
• 17:00
  I know, I'm not averse to using a bit of a saline, you know?
• 17:04
  But they go to town over the lens in this.
• 17:07
  I've I think that's a bit distracting.
• 17:09
  Lastly, yeah, I believe it adds to the weird atmosphere, doesn't
• 17:16
  it? Yeah, I think it works quite
• 17:18
  well. The problem is, there are
• 17:19
  certain scenes and particular when they come on, we come up to
• 17:23
  the big battle scene later where they've obviously had to use all
• 17:25
  of the cameras and as one that doesn't have the Vaseline on
• 17:28
  open it, when it swaps between cameras, you've got clear to
• 17:33
  weird alien. Now, when it's doing weird
• 17:36
  alien, I It works really well. And this is part of the, this is
• 17:42
  the best realized alien planet. We we've seen because it's not
• 17:47
  just the set, it is that distorting Gunk on them on the
• 17:55
  camera, you know, you know, and I know.
• 17:58
  And so I knows that rich my cover that Vaseline, but if
• 18:02
  somebody was new to Doctor, Who I know, why would you choose
• 18:05
  this story? I do not know, but You've
• 18:07
  probably just think man the cameras back then yeah that's
• 18:11
  him feel feel they like yeah and it is I don't know, I just think
• 18:16
  to a casual viewer that would be a bit of a distraction except
• 18:20
  that it jumps between external scenes and scenes inside the
• 18:24
  carcinoma. Okay, so some people inside the
• 18:30
  outside and pay attention to what he's saying hey what's
• 18:34
  interesting to know how it runs he is take, may be interested to
• 18:39
  know how it appeared on the TV in 1964.
• 18:44
  Yeah, and yeah, it was all 65, isn't it?
• 18:49
  Sort of, and on the tiny little screen that you've got at that
• 18:54
  point and the four or five lines, whether that would have
• 18:57
  made a big difference. So, we're watching this on a
• 19:00
  massively bigger screen, even on our computer, monitors bigger
• 19:05
  than it would have been seen possibly at for the majority of
• 19:08
  the audience at the time and it's yet difficult to know how
• 19:12
  it would have come across. A smaller.
• 19:15
  I'm after they're doing as a favor there.
• 19:16
  Get us useful. Our fucking lens flare in
• 19:19
  triples time up. I look what's going on here?
• 19:25
  Oh, they're attacking the zombie.
• 19:28
  Yeah, it's just a bit where I go.
• 19:29
  Sorry, isn't that a bit? That's a bit later, isn't it?
• 19:34
  Okay, I've got him on his back. Oh, he's powerless now, he's not
• 19:38
  going to get back up. Look at them picking up, that
• 19:41
  Venom Grappler. Don't show the actor.
• 19:43
  Get out too, huh? I mean, that's against The Rock,
• 19:51
  which is exactly the sound effects there with the Splat and
• 20:00
  that's really quite horrible. That was amazing.
• 20:02
  You're not again. No, but it does.
• 20:10
  It does suggest some require Pleasant is going on, doesn't
• 20:13
  it? Because I wouldn't show us in
• 20:16
  the earlier. Episode, The Wings coming off
• 20:19
  the man optra. No, but they're happy to show
• 20:22
  up. Cockroach been splattered
• 20:24
  against a rock. Do we see later on when the
• 20:28
  woman shoves her face in the acid?
• 20:30
  So let them get through underground.
• 20:33
  We see I put her head in to the tulips in the background.
• 20:37
  Yeah. Asshole.
• 20:38
  Rific, that bit, there are some really great tips in this story
• 20:43
  and the only way that they were able to get away with that, hold
• 20:50
  ripping the Wings off thing is because the man optra are so
• 20:53
  alien because if you had somebody who obviously bloke in
• 21:00
  a rubber suit where you were ripping the arms off, there is
• 21:02
  no way. Yeah, they would be able to get
• 21:05
  away with that, in case of Amazon is pretty violent, but
• 21:08
  they stopped short of paying dances arms being pulled off
• 21:10
  while Android. Don't they?
• 21:12
  That the closest you get is linton's hands in Attack of the
• 21:15
  The men. Yes, that's pretty horrific but
• 21:18
  as well. They are all the bit in the
• 21:20
  Leisure Hive where you see all the dislocated body parts.
• 21:24
  Yeah. After that are to the after a
• 21:28
  visit to load when has been quantal to death.
• 21:31
  It's a brick if a Brazilian dismemberment.
• 21:37
  Yeah, okay, the doctors looking a bit for now.
• 21:41
  Well he's going. Oh fuck.
• 21:44
  They've just realized that I'm lying.
• 21:45
  Through my teeth, how do I get out of this?
• 21:48
  And you could just see all of that going across his face, it
• 21:52
  But can you help me? Have you seen Adventure in space
• 21:56
  and time? Yeah.
• 21:58
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 21:59
  Bill Hartnell can do this with a look.
• 22:01
  Yeah. And, you know, he can, yeah,
• 22:06
  everything you need to know about what's going on with that
• 22:08
  character. You see across his face in that
• 22:10
  bit. He is Stan, it made 60s Doctor,
• 22:14
  Who is my absolute happy place, and it's down to the quality of
• 22:20
  the acting. Because Katerina aside, there
• 22:23
  isn't a bad one. What you mean act at all with
• 22:27
  60s Doctor? Who or no?
• 22:29
  Regular cast. Okay.
• 22:31
  Yeah, no. I'm not saying there aren't bad,
• 22:34
  but yeah, I was younger. I loved the underwater Menace
• 22:44
  but you're right. I heard you.
• 22:49
  I mean, you're not wrong. Sorry, sorry, I'm just saying,
• 22:56
  yeah, absolutely, right. I mean, these are all actors who
• 22:59
  have learned their trade doing rep, doing everything so fast
• 23:05
  that they're used to working at the pace of Doctor.
• 23:08
  Who even though it's an exhausting show to do, they're
• 23:11
  used to learning a script a week, getting it having the
• 23:14
  rehearsal time and getting it done almost as a live
• 23:17
  performance in front of the camera at the end of the week,
• 23:21
  and then you carry on and do the next one.
• 23:23
  They've all All learned their trade the hard way.
• 23:26
  And I think that shows in a lot of the performances because
• 23:29
  they, they are capable of doing this in the way that Imagine
• 23:33
  John Pertwee doing. This is a Imagine John Pertwee
• 23:37
  doing forty six weeks a year or whatever.
• 23:40
  It's imagine père David's doing it look a little bit embarrassed
• 23:43
  by all would do not. Am I doing here?
• 23:46
  I'll take the paycheck at the end of the week blessed and they
• 23:50
  all go in with absolute conviction and they all believe
• 23:53
  exactly. He bought they're doing and even
• 23:56
  if they might think this story is Grand fully and completely
• 24:01
  off the wall, they're giving it everything that it needs to be.
• 24:05
  It's taken seriously, all the way through what interests me on
• 24:08
  the documentary where you've got William Russell and Maureen
• 24:12
  O'Brien. They're both talking about the
• 24:14
  story in very complimentary terms that.
• 24:16
  Yeah, we went and we did. So it was completely out there
• 24:19
  and ambitious and I think it's Richard.
• 24:22
  Mine, who's got the biggest? Problems with this because he's
• 24:25
  complaining that he's not the type.
• 24:27
  I think he had a certain Vision. This story, I don't know if
• 24:29
  you've seen any of our work has been done on the web planet of
• 24:32
  like the butterflies flying around me.
• 24:34
  Yeah. And there are moments as I think
• 24:37
  it's at the end, this episode, isn't it where those come flying
• 24:39
  down, where he kind of almost captured the vision that he had,
• 24:44
  but time money, all of those things made that actually, they
• 24:48
  a lot of this had to look a bit amateurish because I just had to
• 24:50
  get it done. Yeah, one of the big special
• 24:53
  effects shots from Episode 6 was just cut out because the the
• 25:00
  carcinoma would dissolved and disintegrate it.
• 25:05
  And Richard Martin was on holiday when the editing was
• 25:08
  being done for episode 6, so he didn't have oversight of it and
• 25:12
  Verity Lambert, just thought it looked a bit shit.
• 25:14
  So she cut it out. While says, well and we saw the
• 25:18
  first time it's been done. But usually, when I spend money
• 25:21
  on things that will put it in, or if something is too horrific,
• 25:25
  they'll take it out because apparently they the dissolution
• 25:30
  of Padma Samba in abominable. Snowman was so horrific that
• 25:34
  that was cut out. And there was a sequence in the
• 25:37
  clothes rack sauce, as well of the pig pin drops.
• 25:39
  His face caving in. And I, yeah, wave went to wind.
• 25:43
  It was so horrific that I would never go to sleep.
• 25:47
  Yeah. And there's the scene in.
• 25:48
  I'm talking space where no was begging to be killed, just know
• 25:51
  that was just too much. I wish John nathan-turner.
• 25:54
  It's a few special effects shots.
• 25:56
  He probably should have chosen to take out but, you know, he's
• 25:58
  like, no we spend money is going in, Simon mum.
• 26:03
  I'll say your name like a Dalek that I'm sorry.
• 26:05
  Silence, the optra. Now we've talked about the
• 26:09
  minute Tara and how they've got into that with a bit of detail
• 26:13
  with some movement the car Costume.
• 26:16
  There's our B, which are joint answer absolute.
• 26:18
  You can buy into that are the ultra bit of a step too far.
• 26:23
  Yes, it's very comical and also they don't make an awful lot of
• 26:27
  sense on. Are we just getting to the bit
• 26:29
  where they the monocular of flying in and It's on film,
• 26:37
  isn't it? Yeah, and he's Martin Jarvis and
• 26:41
  they're pumping out, dry ice, so it's got a lot of atmosphere.
• 26:43
  I think these things look, fantastic, and he starts off,
• 26:48
  being up, himself needed, doesn't really change.
• 26:51
  Does he just learn as he goes on, but this looks fantastic.
• 26:57
  It looks, it looks really alien it away that the series hasn't
• 27:03
  done before and I can't wait to see what this looks like on
• 27:04
  Blu-ray and I I think Phil work gives it an extra polish as
• 27:08
  well, there's a depth to it. I think the, the backgrounds all
• 27:11
  look a bit more impressive on film and it's almost like a
• 27:15
  little glimpse into how this all kind of look that don't.
• 27:18
  And that's like a nice off, but the fieldwork does give you a
• 27:22
  Polish know and I think that's what I think.
• 27:24
  Richard Martin was good on film where he'd got time and you
• 27:28
  think of the scenes in the Dalek invasion of Earth weather out on
• 27:31
  location and that's all superb work.
• 27:34
  And when he does the Dalek versus mechanoids Battle, at the
• 27:38
  end of the chase. Oh, that's good.
• 27:40
  Again, he can cut fast then and he could cut between the cameras
• 27:44
  and keep it moving. And that makes a big difference.
• 27:48
  I think in the studio, he's so pushed for time and you can't
• 27:53
  get things set up how you want them.
• 27:55
  Whereas on film, you've got that little little bit of extra time
• 27:58
  and that little bit of luxury where you can work.
• 28:02
  I'm set things up a bit better. Can I ask him I review guys?
• 28:07
  And honestly you got to ask this question but you know you know
• 28:09
  this podcast you came on I've already ever been in a harness.
• 28:14
  I happen to believe it or not. No.
• 28:23
  Oh okay. Well speaking from experience,
• 28:27
  it's been exactly all these different options, flying about
• 28:30
  these wires. This massive been bloody
• 28:32
  painful. That's how you are.
• 28:35
  They must have. They must have got up in the
• 28:36
  morning to go. Right?
• 28:37
  What my dude from my salary, today, I'm going to dress up
• 28:39
  like a giant butterfly. I think it onto a wire, and fly
• 28:43
  across a BBC set. I mean, they're living the dream
• 28:46
  and like, I don't bungee jumping oh her doubt that really wasn't
• 28:52
  the sort of harness I thought you were asking about Ariel.
• 28:56
  I think we knew what heart is Jones asking it backwards.
• 29:01
  There's a lot of signs of those doctors literally fire off a set
• 29:06
  look I just have been with the zombie loomed up there that's
• 29:09
  really really good and again it's like that scene of the Czar
• 29:12
  be on the Tardis scanner earlier on in the story where it's just.
• 29:17
  Wow this is really good. It's and it you actually get a
• 29:21
  sense at the end there that Barbara is running because
• 29:26
  normally it's sort of will do about three steps.
• 29:29
  We do dear, then we've run out of said, whereas there is a
• 29:34
  sense of space in that that final set And I just want to
• 29:42
  show you both something now. So if you could just both look
• 29:44
  up with your cameras, this is what an enlarged picture of an
• 29:49
  ant looks like in rally. This is what we could have had
• 29:52
  for the zombie. Should they be so inclined?
• 29:55
  Oh my God, I'll put this picture up on Twitter for everyone's
• 29:59
  happiness. Marking chilling on.
• 30:03
  They don't know. They've got massive Smiles on
• 30:05
  their faces. Oh, Simon is about to show us
• 30:09
  something on. Camera, what's that out?
• 30:15
  Okay. Is that the toys are be and I
• 30:17
  say it's more scary. You know.
• 30:21
  Look whiter than see Curry, not a toy.
• 30:25
  I want, I want a question. Let's start with site and then
• 30:30
  move on Simon that you'd die faster.
• 30:32
  The same way - Wait. Do you think there is ever a
• 30:38
  point in Doctor Who after this, where the show is as ambitious
• 30:43
  as this? I think it's ambitious in
• 30:47
  different ways but I don't think they ever go for anything quite
• 30:53
  so alien and weird ever again and that includes the new series
• 30:58
  I don't think they they will ever do anything quite as
• 31:01
  outlandish as this. What we're only in the second
• 31:04
  year and anything still goes at this point.
• 31:07
  So but yeah, I don't think there's anything there's no
• 31:13
  story that It is going to create sort of four different aliens on
• 31:18
  a particular, and their world and do it quite like this ever
• 31:23
  again. Simon, I don't think there's
• 31:27
  anything that creates alienness in terms of sort of alien
• 31:34
  creatures, as effectively as this, in terms of, Alien
• 31:41
  strangeness and inventiveness. I think Warriors gate is out
• 31:46
  there for sure. That's weird.
• 31:48
  Yeah, actually, I think Warriors gate in terms of inventiveness
• 31:52
  surpasses this, okay? It's possibly the only time that
• 31:56
  the series does after this because the first two, two and a
• 32:02
  half years, The show's finding its feet and it is inventive, in
• 32:08
  terms of plot, it inventive, in terms of episode length.
• 32:12
  By the time you get into the tail end of season 3, it's
• 32:14
  pretty much crystallized into the science fiction stuff for
• 32:19
  26-episode format. And certainly, by the time
• 32:23
  troughton's coming along, historical Czar out of the
• 32:25
  window. The series is what we know now.
• 32:30
  But for the first couple of years, it was pretty much
• 32:32
  anything goes and yeah story. Starts.
• 32:34
  It could be over in two weeks. It could take the next 12 weeks
• 32:38
  to to finish. It could be historical Earth and
• 32:42
  you don't see any Science Fiction, it's at all, or it
• 32:45
  could be Vikings with some sort of time traveler in it was or
• 32:55
  weird Time stuff in it till Museum.
• 33:02
  You know, I say the only the only time I think of where I
• 33:06
  think the show was as ambitious as this article mind robot,
• 33:11
  narratively speaking creatively speaking and Visually speaking.
• 33:15
  And I think if it was just the four episode 7, the land, the
• 33:18
  fish You are inch apart. But when you add in that very
• 33:22
  experimental episode 1, I think that and that, that surrounded
• 33:26
  by the dominators, you know, which is cliched, science
• 33:28
  fiction, sorry, for over and The Invasion which is, you know, the
• 33:34
  Earth under threat again, which we've done a few times and it's
• 33:36
  so it really stands out where it's surrounded by a lot of
• 33:39
  cliches. I think that's, that's pretty
• 33:41
  ambitious. Yeah, and there's nothing wrong
• 33:43
  with good cliched, science fiction, we're Doctor, Who fans
• 33:49
  It's going to bread-and-butter Celestial toymaker as well,
• 33:52
  although that the surviving episode of that is incredibly
• 33:55
  dull. I think the original version
• 33:58
  that was probably going to be more ambitious than that.
• 33:59
  She turned out for you, Blind Man's buff and homes and things
• 34:04
  like that. Then this in interviews isn't
• 34:08
  complimentary about it and nobody particularly
• 34:12
  complimentary about it. If I want it, I'm wondering
• 34:14
  Russell. T Davies is not going to call
• 34:16
  it. The celestial toymaker, after
• 34:17
  all one rather, you know, just the toymaker will do.
• 34:21
  I think that's where we're going fellas?
• 34:24
  Are you ready to often except so cold?
• 34:26
  Invasion. Very Invasion.
• 34:28
  Oh, talk about cliches. Are you ready to watch the?
• 34:32
  And that would be the last episode escape to Danger Target
• 34:37
  cliche, that what that is? That's the wrong podcast, right?
• 34:43
  Well, let's keep in 2005. Okay.