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Anna Gibson - Post Sunapee Scramble Interview · The Steep Stuff Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: What is up, fam?
• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Steep Stuff Podcast.
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: I'm your host, james Lauriello.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: I'm so excited to bring you guys an episode today with the 2025 US Mountain Running Champion and Sun and Peace Scramble Champion, miss Anna Gibson.
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: Guys, I'm so stoked to have had this conversation.
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: We caught up just a few, probably about a week removed from Sun and Peace, so everything kind of had an opportunity to sink in and we talked about the race itself.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: We talked about the strategy around the race.
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: Ana was pretty candid and kind of where she was coming back from Zagama and what it was like, kind of traveling halfway around the world to go race Sunapee the following weekend and then have just an amazing result.
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, guys, this is a great episode.
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: Just a short one.
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: We're going to be doing a long form interview with Ana, probably in the next few months, but this is just a catch up episode to kind of talk about her race, debrief it and you know, see where the stoke level is going into Broken Arrow, as Ana has a very rare and unique opportunity to potentially make both teams to go represent Team USA in the Pyrenees in September.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: So, without further ado, I hope you guys enjoy this one, ana Gibson.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: Ana Gibson, welcome back to the Steep Stuff podcast.
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: How's it going?
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: Thank you Good.
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: It feels like we just chatted before Sonapit.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: I know, I know We've got some big news you are the 2025 US Mountain Running Champion.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: Congratulations on your win.
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: It's a big big deal.
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: Absolutely amazing race, amazing execution.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: How?
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: does it feel?
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I'm really excited.
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: It still doesn't feel that real and like if you had told me that this was going to be the outcome, like the week before Sunapee, I would have probably laughed at you.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: Like I really wanted to make the world's team, but I thought that winning would be a challenge.
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: Um, and I'm just super excited that it worked out that way.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: I gotta be honest with you, like going into the race, one of the things you said to me in our pre-Sanapy interview you were, like I want to make this team.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: Like I, I have to make this team, and I forget the way you said it was something along the lines of, like it just needs to happen.
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: Like I'm, I haven't made Team USA yet and this is just the way it's got to go.
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: It was a very resolute and it was a very confident answer you gave me and it was cool to watch you make it happen.
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: It was really fun to be on the live stream too.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Obviously, there was a lot of camera hiccups so I couldn't see the entire race, but just to see how poised you were throughout the race, it didn't seem like you were very rattled at all.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: Obviously, allie races very aggressive.
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: You kind of sat back on her wheel, let the race unfold in front of you.
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: How did it feel?
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: Was it under control the whole time or was it kind of at any point in time?
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: Were you redlining?
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: How did the race play out for you?
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean Allie definitely is an aggressive competitor.
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: At the very beginning of most races she's in the front and so when she went off pretty hard, I was not stressed.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: I was like, okay, this is pretty much to be expected when Allie McLaughlin is here.
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: This is what happens, and I've raced with her a fair amount.
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: After the race, be like you paced that so well, that was so smart, all that.
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: I'm like this was not smart.
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: This was not me trying to be strategic.
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: I felt bad on lap one, Like I was not feeling good in my body and the uphill was okay, going through the top like couple seconds behind Allie with Lauren Gregory, um, so I was like in a good position, but I was just like mentally really fatigued and like kind of struggling to like get competitive, I guess.
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: And then, as we started the first downhill, like same thing I just felt like kind of uncoordinated, like a little bit of mental fatigue and like fog.
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh my gosh, what is going on?
• 3:41
  Speaker 2: Like I'm so tired from Zygoma, what have I done?
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: And I like had this feeling like this is about to go off the rails, like this is about to be a really hard day for me.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: Um, and then I basically just like put my head down.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: I was like I'm going to try as hard as I possibly can to get top three.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: That's all I can control and we'll just see how the day plays out.
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: I'm like I can't quit, I gotta, gotta keep pushing through this.
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: And so I kind of just put my head down and I started to grind.
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: Um, and then all of a sudden, like I looked up halfway up the second climb and I saw Allie and Lauren right in front of me and I was like wait, what?
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: Like I'm actually doing well right now, and like I kind of started to feel good and I like had this moment of like excitement and like a little bit more mental clarity and I was like okay, the race starts now.
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: I'm going to hammer, it's going to be great.
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: And then, like that's kind of when like the race felt like it actually started for me and I started to feel really good.
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: That's interesting, man.
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: I mean you looked like I said I got his hand it to you.
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: You played it off really well, cause I was like it looked to me as a commentator.
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: I think Danny and MK agreed and you just seemed very smooth, very calm, very composed.
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: There was no look of like panic on your face by any means.
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: So you, you played.
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: your poker face was pretty solid on that.
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: Um, so this actually really brings up a great conversation because, like when we did the pre-race interviews or, excuse me, the pre-race selections, when we're kind of picking who was going to make the team, it was interesting.
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: Like that was one of the conversations that come up, came up was like how are going to fare doing the back-to-back Zagama and then going to Sunapee and Tom Hooper was like it's a short race, she'll be fine.
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: And here I am, I'm old, so I'm 34.
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: So I'm thinking to my head.
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: I'm like, dude, there's jet lag, there's diet, there's sleep, there's all these things you got to adjust to.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: I'm like, how is she going to pull this off?
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: Like, if she does it, that would be amazing.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: Did you at any point in time like maybe, maybe, talk about that, like how you were able to kind of overcome all those things and you kind of just did it and it wasn't.
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: None of those things were an issue for you, or were they?
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: I mean during the week leading into Sunapee, I would say they were an issue.
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: Like I definitely had some jet lag, was trying to pretend like I didn't, like digestion was weird, was trying to pretend like it was fine.
• 5:47
  Speaker 2: You know, it's all the same stuff.
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, that stuff all happens and it all affected me.
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: But I think like this was a totally novel situation for me to be in.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: I've never run a trail marathon and I've never tried to double back and make a world's team, so I had no idea what was going to happen and like I could objectively look at us mountain champs and be like I think I should be in the top three at this race.
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: I think I can win this.
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: If it was like in this bubble of having fresh everything, but like coming after Zagama, I was like, honestly I don't know, like there there is no data for me to draw and to say that this is a good idea or to like think that this is going to go well for me.
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: It might not, but I feel like like last year I did Broken Arrow VK and then came back and raced at the US Olympic trials and like something about that combination where, like I had this really fun weekend.
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: Like did great at Broken Arrow, was like super stoked on life and just kind of riding the high and then showing up at the trials, which is like one of the most intense experiences you can go through as a track athlete.
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: Like I felt so much more like at peace and so much more calm going into that event and like all the pressure was kind of taken off because I'd already had a great week and so I kind of feel like I was like this was not intentional at all, but like the double between Zagama and mountain champs this year like felt very similar, whereas like well, the worst case scenario is I just got 11th at Zagama and I tried something really hard that like other people weren't trying, and so just like like kind of taking confidence away from that and like being a little bit less like stressed and intense about the whole, like us mountain champs experience and trying to qualify for worlds.
• 7:27
  Speaker 2: Um, so yeah, I don't know if those things all affected me for sure, but I just like I feel like the the pressure was off in a way that it it wouldn't have been if I had just solely focused on trying to qualify for worlds.
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: Oh, dude, that's really smart the way you approach that.
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: And the only reason I say it is because, like you know, I mean I can honestly say, just because I know Allie pretty well and you know I know some of the other competitors, like I definitely feel like there were like a lot of the women put a lot of pressure on, like you could tell.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: So maybe that, like I wonder if that does impact your race in a lot of ways and like maybe just taking that pressure off from a mental component just like really helps, like just like you know, yeah, well, I mean it's like okay, there's different like elements to look at.
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: There's like the physical component where it's like, objectively speaking, running Zagama a week before mountain champs is not the best physical preparation.
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: Like my quads were still sore on Saturday before mountain champs.
• 8:21
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh my God, I only have one more day.
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: It's been six days since the gamma and I'm still broken.
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: Like this is crazy.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: Never been so sore in my life.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: Um, so like physically speaking, not the best way to prep, but like.
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: Then there's the whole emotional and mental side where, like what we were just talking about and to me like being able to like be in a better spot in your head is better, and like that that was like worth more than trying to be in the best physical spot, if that makes sense.
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: Like the benefits kind of outweighed the downsides for me so interesting.
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: What did you, what'd you think of the course?
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: Like that course was stupid hard.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: I mean, I thought so from far away I wasn't there, obviously, but like it seemed like some of the muddy sections, like did you follow it all?
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: Were you able to like make, make good contact the whole time and like not slip?
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: Like, like I said, looking at you on the on the live stream, you were pretty smooth.
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: You tell me, like what did you think?
• 9:15
  Speaker 2: Um, I mean I thought the course was pretty fun actually.
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: Um, it definitely was like pretty different than running anywhere in the West, like just different type of rocks, like super Rudy it rained like two and a half inches a day before the race, so super muddy, um, and just like kind of a different type of course than I'm used to racing.
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: Like I haven't even done a short course race like that in a long time, but like kind of classic distance.
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: Um, I mean, the closest thing is like the Cirque series and I haven't done that in a couple of years and I didn't race the last year's mountain jam, so it was just kind of like a whole new experience.
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I mean the descent was honestly really fun and I think it got more fun as the day went.
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: On the second lap after so many people had run through it because the guys were in front of us and then we had done one lap on it already, so it's essentially like four laps worth of people running on it.
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: By that point it was way more muddy and just soft and squishy, so you could just put your feet down wherever and not pay quite as much attention.
• 10:10
  Speaker 2: It just was super fun and super playful.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: That's crazy.
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: So you touched on this.
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: It seemed like on the second climb you started getting your footing back, started feeling yourself again and got yourself back into the race.
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: And is that where you made kind of the decisive move and were able to get away, because it seemed like from what we could see was once you.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: I think it was like once you hit the glades, like you were gone, like you had a little bit of separation there between Allie and Lauren.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: So, like I was saying earlier, like I caught up to them probably like halfway up the second climb and no-transcript, but like at least I can get a head start into the downhill and then I'll still make the team, hopefully, because the fourth and fifth person won't pass me.
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: And so I kind of just like made this very decisive move around the two of them and I was like I just turned on the jets and I just started hammering and I actually thought like surely they'll come with me, like one of them will will match this pace and like be with me.
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: And neither of them did.
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: And so I kind of just like took off and was just running through the woods by myself like up the second half of this climb and had no idea how far behind me they were.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: And then like got up to the top of the mountain and there's kind of like an open space where you could like sort of hear like what was happening behind you and I could look back and see and like knew I had like a pretty good lead.
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: And then I just like ran as hard as I possibly could on the downhill and like the second time I ran it at 45 seconds faster than the first time.
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: So it was like I don't know, I feel like I just was like really out of it the first lap and then the second lap, like finally, just like snapped out of whatever funk I was in.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: It was just like yo, I'm here, I'm ready to race, and yeah, just kind of like turned it on.
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: At what point in time did you realize, like, was there any point where you're like I got this, like I'm going sizzler, like I'm going to win this race?
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: Or like did you have, like when you knew you hadn't broken the elastic and you were kind of by yourself?
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: Or were you running scared at the end Cause you I'll go back to it, like I said, you looked smooth.
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: Like did you look like you were scared at all?
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: I mean it dawned on me that it was a possibility.
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: As I was like halfway down the downhill and like still couldn't hear anybody cheering for Allie and Lauren behind me, I was like, okay, like I actually still have a pretty good gap, I think.
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: But I couldn't look back because it was like pretty technical footing and there were, like I was passing, like competitors in the men's race and so I was like trying not to trip over people and just like kind of hectic on the downhill so like you couldn't look at behind you at all.
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: Um, but like a couple of minutes from the finish line I like passed my friend, matt Chorney, who was actually my high school coach, who's like now still a good friend of mine.
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: Um, and he was there racing and had like finished his race and then run up a couple of minutes like onto the course and like the final descent, and I like looked at him.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: I was like yo, how much time do I have?
• 13:24
  Speaker 2: Like are they coming for me?
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: And he's like, nah, you're good.
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: And that was kind of when it dawned on me.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: I was like, okay, I'm actually about to do this.
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: This is crazy.
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: Um, I passed a couple of my Brooks teammates who had already finished and the guys race and like I don't know, I could just tell by like kind of just the vibe of the know and you have that like extra level of excitement.
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: You're just like I got this wow, that's amazing.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: It was so cool at the end too, like just to like the commentators and like getting to share that moment with you guys, like when we had some of the conversations after.
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: You could just see that, feel the excitement it was.
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: It was very special, it was very cool.
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can ask you this throughout the race, were you getting like time up Because, like, did you get any time updates?
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: Cause you guys I'd say the three of you, you Allie, lauren, I mean you guys were pretty far ahead of Rena and Courtney Covinger kind of moved up the field as well, like would you, were you kind of like knew that you guys were kind of far and away, you had enough of a gap, or did you not have an idea that throughout the race, um, to be honest, I didn't have that much of an idea of what was going on behind me.
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: Like the only point I knew that like fourth and fifth were pretty hot on my heels was like as I came down the first descent and like went through the start finish area to start lap two, like I could hear people cheering for courtney and behind me I was like, oh my gosh, like they're coming.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: And then I don't know.
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: From that point on, like I didn't really have any idea what was going on, or like how far behind anybody it was or how I didn't even know how far ahead Lauren and Allie were for a while.
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: Like I was just kind of in this like weird no man's land for a little bit, where I was like I don't know.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: And that's when I put my head down and I was like, okay, I'm just going to like do everything I can do.
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: All I can control is like my level of effort today and whether that means I get first or that means I get 10th, like that is what it is and that's just racing in a nutshell.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: So, yeah, I didn't really know what was going on?
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Did you surprise yourself at all, or were you like?
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean, like I said, like I think I, I like I've had a really great winter of training, like I've been working extremely hard, I've leveled up in ways that like it's so obvious that in training I'm aware that I'm like much better, like I don't even need the race validation to prove that to me.
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: But, um, like I have that level of confidence but I just didn't know, was the gamma thrown in there Like this was a total wrench in the idea of like winning and I just had no idea that like I could do something like that, that like my body could like turn it around so fast and I could recover so well.
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: Um, so I definitely like just the whole experience was surprising and like I'm still surprised.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, I I feel like the last week, even after both of these events, like just feeling so good and recovering so well.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: I'm like this is crazy.
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: Um, I don't, I don't really know what's going on here, but, um, yeah, try not to question it too hard.
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: It's really.
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: It's just interesting to me Cause, like before and after the race, like I had this conversation about you with both, with Michelino I talked to a couple of different people and I was like, do we even know?
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: Like's interesting because you're very young in the sport.
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: Now you have the Suge accolade by becoming a mountain running champ.
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: Obviously you've raced the last few years, but I don't think you've realized, in the sense of from a racing perspective, realized your potential in the sport.
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: It's very possible.
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: There's a lot more for you to do and accomplish.
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: Would you agree with that as like, as far as you've kind of developed and where you know your potential is heading this year?
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: Well, thank you.
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean like it's definitely really exciting and it's it feels like I'm just like continuing to like peel back layers where I'm like whoa didn't know I was capable of that, or like whoa didn't know I could recover that fast, or whatnot.
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: Like I'm just having all these like cool realizations and like learning crazy stuff.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: So that's definitely like very confidence inspiring.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: And I think also just like all of my favorite races and all of my best performances have been like in the midst of just like making kind of quote unquote crazy decisions like the the broken arrow VK trials combo and like this whole situation and like throwing in some bike races, like doing some long ski days, like it's just all these things that like I just want to do and know that maybe they're not the most traditional pathway to success, but like I just do them and then it works out and I'm like okay.
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: So I think I just need to keep doing this.
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: Like I just need to keep like following the things that like I kind of have like a desire to do and that I'm like passionate about and not think so hard about like whether it's the right thing by other people's standards or like by like a training perspective, you know.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, it's interesting.
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: I think, like it provides a lot of inspiration and I'll kind of turn this sort of like one step further to even like from a training perspective right.
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: Like you're not a gigantic high volume person and one thing I really like about you is like you're on the bike, you're running also, you're doing a lot of different modalities and it shows that that system really can work and you don't have to run 160 miles a week to have success in the sport.
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: Like you can be a U S mountain running champion and do the things that really excite you and do a bunch of different things.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: You don't have to just be pigeonholed to one thing, if you will.
• 18:39
  Speaker 1: So I think it's very inspiring to a lot of others that you know that don't do crazy volume but might be doing other things like on the bike and whatnot too.
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, that's definitely my hope.
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: Like I I kind of just like want this, my story, to like help people see that they're like you don't have to specialize a hundred percent in running to be good at running.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: Like I don't know, I mean, I would say I'm not I'm not a high mileage person, but I am kind of becoming like a high volume person.
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: Like I do a lot of training and it's all like very planned out and structured and like it's organized.
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: So like I don't want to give off the idea that like I'm just doing stuff very haphazardly, Like that's not it.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: Um, but I do think like building in the things that you love to do into your training plan, like working with a coach who like knows you and supports what you want, and like figuring out how do I put these things in my training plan and make this like how I do things week to week to week.
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: Um, I think like that's the takeaway for sure what was the feedback from David?
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: like I both like talked to him in dms and like he was in our live chat freaking out like having the day, like he's going nuts.
• 19:44
  Speaker 1: I love David's excitement.
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: His enthusiasm is like no one else.
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: What was that conversation like after the race was?
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: I'm sure he was so excited for you.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, classic David fashion, just like the most supportive, most excited person.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: He like sent me a voice message that I got while I was like actually in drug testing, which is kind of a bleak place to be like in a room.
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: You're like shivering because you just raced and you're cold and wet and like trying to chug water so you can pee in the cup just bleak environment overall.
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: And I like opened this voice message from David that was just like so excited over the moon and I like saved it.
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: I'm like on some sad day in the future I'm going to listen to this thing and it's going to like cheer me up immediately.
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: Like he's just was so excited and I think like overall for him, I mean like to have five out of the eight sub ultra like classic team be coached by him.
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: Like that's just amazing and I mean he'll deny it to to the end of the day that like it had anything to do with him.
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: But I'm like no, no, no, like let's be clear, it has everything to do with him.
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: Like it's what I was just talking about with like training and making it really personalized and individual to each, each person's needs and desires, and like passions, and it's like the positivity before and after every single race, like even if you have the worst day ever, like he still shows up and is like I mean he could have sent me that same exact message on my worst race, and like that's just something he would do.
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, it's just like very unwavering support for sure.
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: He's amazing yeah.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: I and yeah, he's.
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: It was cool to see like just how, how just involved he is in his athlete's life.
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: Like you know, it's cool.
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he's, he's as good as it gets Broken arrow.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: Does this change the calculus at all from, like a pressure perspective?
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: I know you love the VK.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: I mean you've done so well and had so much success.
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: I have a feeling like this could be your race as well, Like you have such potential to go do the damn thing and make both teams Like how does this change your calculus?
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: Is the pressure?
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: Uh yeah, which is exactly what I like.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: That's.
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: This is where I'm like this is so good.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: How this played out for me, like um broken arrow is so fun.
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: It's also one of the most overwhelming experiences as an athlete Like there are so many people there.
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: There's so many friends to see from like every part of my life.
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: Like all my sponsors are there.
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: There's just like so much to do, and I think, like if I look at the whole weekend as a whole and then think about adding the pressure of like if I still hadn't qualified for Worlds and I was like really trying to still make that happen, that weekend would just be a lot.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: And now I'm like, oh, the pressure's off.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: Like I want to race well, I want to try and win for sure, but like also now I can just go and enjoy the experience and like be a hundred percent present and not be stressed, and I I think that's just like honestly, that's the best way for me to have a good race, um, and also for the way way for me to like just make it be the absolute most fun.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: So I'm really looking forward to it.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: I love it.
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: I don't want to point out a specific matchup, but what do you think?
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: You think you can get one back on her and go win that race.
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: What's your take on that?
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: I mean I sure would like to try.
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: It's always hard knowing this time of year.
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: People are all over the map.
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: You can't look at last year's performances and try and come to a conclusion about where they're going to be at now.
• 23:12
  Speaker 2: I mean, like last year Joyce was just like crazy fit and was like way further ahead than she was the year before that, and so it's like I don't know.
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: It's hard to just like choose any one person and be like, oh, I need to beat them or I'm going to run with them or whatever.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: Like honestly no idea, but am I going to try?
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure.
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: Like I think it would be the coolest thing ever to like to be able to win both of these events.
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: Um, that's just like crazy, like totally pinch me if that happens.
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: I think it's totally possible.
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: I um, I thought it was really cool.
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: Brooks.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: Brooks like showed up in a big way at sunopee and like I just love the investment brooks is starting to put into the sub ultra world like such a strong team both on the north american and on the european side.
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: Can you maybe talk about what it was like just from a team perspective?
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: Quite a few like Remy, dan, everybody, courtney, everybody was out there, including some new faces as well.
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: What was that like for you guys to have a house out there at Sunapee and maybe talk about that?
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, oh my gosh, it was the best.
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: When I joined Brooks two years ago, I did not know that it was going in this direction.
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: Like, I mean, maybe they had a grand plan that it was going to turn into this like really cool team environment, but like I was not fully aware of that and I'm just like so, so excited about, like the direction that the team has gone in, that we have this like crusher sub-ultra squad to the point where we can like have our house and like I don't know, just spend the entire weekend together, like laughing about random stuff and like getting to know each other better.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: Um, I mean, I can honestly say like a lot of my teammates are like my closest friends at this point.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: Like they're just we live in different places but they're like they.
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: We spend so much time together in these like really vulnerable moments like before and after racing, that like you just bond in a way that like you don't necessarily with other people, Like it's just, it's really cool, it's super special.
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: Um, and like has kind of a different character than like teammate relationships like in college or in high school.
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: Um, yeah, it's just, it's been super cool and it was amazing just to see everybody there.
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: Like we, we had everybody that raced in the top 10, which is just like kind of unreal, Um, and so we just had like a collectively really good day, which made it even more fun to like share the win with all of them, Cause it felt like we had all just kind of like one in our own way.
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: No, I think it's.
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: It's a beautiful answer.
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: I think it was so cool too, cause, like I mean, you know, a lot of people probably didn't know who Taylor was before, and now a lot of people know who Taylor is, like he's kind of starting to make his career.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: Courtney Cobbinger, sydney Peterson like.
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: But like Sydney Peterson, I had known Courtney.
• 25:43
  Speaker 1: I really I had to say this.
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: But like I did not know much about Courtney before the race and I'm like now I'm like who they are and start to come up, so it's, that's very exciting for sure.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, did you guys have like giant celebration after like party hard how did it go?
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: We definitely did.
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, our house was awesome.
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: Um, shout out to Brooks for like renting us this really Epic mansion.
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: That was kind of in the middle of nowhere.
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: We had like a sauna and a hot tub and this like massive couch like honestly the biggest couch I've ever seen.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: So we like all took a hot tub and hung out on the deck and then we like went and we just like laid on this couch and just like played games and laughed for like a lot of hours.
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: And there were some other random people who ended up coming over to the house to hang out with us just friends of friends and stuff.
• 26:32
  Speaker 2: Um, which was super fun.
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: It was like wow, this is just like the place to be and I'm really glad that I'm here.
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: That's amazing.
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: Are they going to do something similar for Broken Arrow as well?
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, broken Arrow, we have team housing too, I think there's like people are kind of scattered but like we're going to have like kind of a central headquarters, if you will, and that'll actually be like through TrailCon and through Western States.
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: There's like lots of people like coming early, staying late, whatnot?
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: Just to hang out and be there for all of the madness.
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: Nice, nice, are you going to hang out for Western States and like see what that's all about?
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: Or, um, I am staying through trail con and then I actually am going to race steamboat gravel, which is like 117 mile gravel bike race in Colorado.
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: So, um, yeah, I got a balance on Thursday.
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: Unfortunately, um, I was very like, torn about what to do with Western States weekend.
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: But, yeah, I'm headed to Colorado.
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: Yo, tell me more about the steamboat gravel.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: So I've been I told you this before like I was injured and I've been like really obsessed with the gravel bike lately and I I'd be remiss if I didn't say I've been like looking up gravel races and I was looking at unbound and bighorn and all these different things, like steamboat was one of the ones that popped up.
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: A cool course, it looks neat, yeah, yeah.
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I'm super excited.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: It's like, um, yeah, it's going to be a full dive into the deep end of gravel bike racing.
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: Like it's fairly competitive Um, actually I would say really competitive for like a race in the United States.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: And uh, super long.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: To like 170 miles is a long ways for me to race, but I like I did a gravel bike race called Huffmaster in February and that one was like 90 miles, um, a little bit more elevation gain, and I think like just the experience of like suffering for that long and having to fuel for that long and focus for that long was honestly really good for my running.
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: And so I'm kind of like, ok, let's run it back, like I need to do this again and let's do it even longer.
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: And yeah, I've been like an ambassador for Pan Amal, which is a cycling brand, and yeah, I've been like an ambassador for Ponermall, which is a cycling brand.
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: So I'm going to go out there and help do a shakeout run for them and just kind of like engage with that, with the cycling community, which I'm really looking forward to.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: That is so cool.
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of like cool crossover.
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: I mean I got to be honest, I've gotten obsessed.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: So it's like a I don't know like it's kind of similar to running like the communities, but it's like a I don't know like it's kind of similar to running like the communities, but like it's also different in its own like unique ways.
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean it's super cool.
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: Like I think there's a lot of crossover, lots of unique personalities, between gravel and trail, and then there's also like so much to learn.
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: Like I think that gravel is like a little bit further ahead, almost, yeah, and I really like how it's like super creative and really adventure oriented.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: I really like how it's like super creative and really adventure oriented and I just feel like I've been like watching every gravel bike YouTube video vlog, whatever for like years and like drawn a lot of inspiration from them for like my running career and like I don't know, just like being a little bit more inventive or taking a more unique approach or stealing like mental tricks that people used for like being tough when they're out on a long day and like, yeah, I think that I just want to like kind of keep dipping my toes into that world a little bit more.
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: It's interesting.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: One thing I do have to say that I've really enjoyed is like playing around with that mental engagement piece is I mean, like you can you can speak to this a lot Like most of your races are what an hour to three hours long tops Right.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: So it's like trying to stay that mental engagement for a long period of time, like I struggle with that significantly I'll I'll like really get excited on a climb, but if it's a descent I'm like this isn't as fun and I start to zone out.
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: I'm like how do I get back into this?
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: Uh, that's totally unrelated to the question that I'm going for, but, like, the question I have is how do you set expectations for a race like this for yourself?
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: Do you do you just like say I'm going to go, do my best and have fun, or are you like competitive, like how do you?
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: How do you approach like a gravel race?
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: I mean great question.
• 30:24
  Speaker 2: Honestly, I have no idea.
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: Um, the first one, I was just like so scared, like I barely slept the night before because I was so anxious.
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: Um, they like started the pro men and the pro women together and so I started my first ever bike race of my entire life with like a very competitive, super hectic field, people who are like literally this is their entire job and it was the most intimidating thing.
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: So that one, I was like no expectations.
• 30:50
  Speaker 2: I just want to like not get in anyone's way, I want to not hurt myself and I want to feel well and learn a bunch of stuff, and that was basically the entire objective of the day and, honestly, I think I'm going into C-Mote the same way.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: I'm like I have no idea, like I don't even have like a concept of where I will end up competitively in this race.
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: Like, yeah, not a clue.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: So I really just want to like soak in the experience and, yeah, work on that like mental toughness and feel well.
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: Um, and just like, yeah, learn a lot.
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: I love it, I love it.
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: It's such a cool different thing.
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: One thing I gotta ask you too I noticed like you threw up a story on instagram about bringing your bike with you.
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: But to new hampshire, right, how do you travel with that thing?
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: Like, I just got like a travel bag and I'm like trying to figure out how to take this thing with me cross country.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: Do you just check it and like hope for the best, or how did you get that thing with you?
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: so I actually, in new hampshire, I borrowed a bike from my friend, um, which is very convenient.
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: Um, yeah, I like only rode once during that whole like three week stretch, which is like really like very small amount of riding for me.
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: Um, but make do with what you have.
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: So that trip I didn't bring it, I have brought my bike.
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: Um, I have like a bike bag, um, that I just bought.
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: It's super expensive, but I was like, honestly, this is worth it, and I was going on like a bike trip in Europe and so I was like, okay, well, I guess I'm just going to bite the bullet and buy this really expensive thing and then I'll have it.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: And it's nice, cause it's like one that you don't have to take all the handlebars and all that off, um, you basically just like take both the wheels off and then package it super carefully and, um, yeah, it's a little scary flying with the bike, but it is really fun to have it in some other place that's not home and like get to explore a lot more with it.
• 32:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I brought mine.
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: I'm out in the East right now and I brought mine.
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: I'm like, wow, this is a lot of cool places I would have never gone to if I didn't bring it with me.
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: So yeah.
• 32:44
  Speaker 1: To athletes out there listening.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: Bring your gravel bikes with you, for sure.
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's that little bit of extra freedom for sure.
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, All right.
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: One last question as far as like, are you getting back started now?
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: Are you?
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: Are you still sore?
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: Are you?
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: Are you back into training now for everything?
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: Um, honestly, back into training.
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: I definitely like took a little bit of a step back from like any intensity at all.
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: Um, I did no workouts last week after Sunapee.
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: I just like ran around in the white mountains in New Hampshire for a couple of days, then came back to Jackson, where I'm, where I live, and did like a super fun long run.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: That was like yeah, chill effort and then long bike ride.
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: So I'm kind of just like building volume and like getting back into everything.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: Um, but then, yeah, I start doing some workouts this week and set the sights on broken arrow and beyond.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: Dude, I can't believe broken arrows next week already.
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: It's coming up so fast.
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm home for 10 days.
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: This is like not enough.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: Get used to it.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: You'll be doing a lot of travel this year.
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the cadence of my life.
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: It's like gone for two weeks, back for two weeks, gone for two weeks and then just repeat the whole thing.
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: So crazy.
• 33:48
  Speaker 1: Well, listen, anna.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: I want to say thank you so much for coming back on the podcast.
• 33:52
  Speaker 1: Obviously, this is the first of many, or second of many, conversations.
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: We'll do a long form one in a couple months as we get the summer rolling, but congratulations on becoming the 2025 mountain running champion, and I'm so excited for where the rest of your career takes you this year.
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's always fun chatting with you, and thanks again for also doing the live stream.
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: I know there was a lot of people who are watching that tuned in.
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: Thank you, I can't say a lot of people who were watching that tuned in.
• 34:16
  Speaker 2: So thank you, yeah.
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: I can't say it enough Like how much fun that was, like, like I said, getting I think the best part about it and I was describing this to someone the other day was like getting to just have those interviews with you guys at the end and just feel that like level of like just happiness and emotion and like what, like it was cool, it was very special.
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: So I'll share that with you guys.
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll give you back the rest of your afternoon, or evening.
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: Thank you so much.
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: Appreciate it.
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you.
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: Talk to you soon.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Listen up, guys.
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: The Steep Stuff podcast is brought to you by Ultimate Direction USA.
• 34:46
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• 34:55
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• 34:57
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• 35:12
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• 35:14
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• 35:19
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• 35:26
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• 35:35
  Speaker 1: So hop on ultimate directioncom, get yourself a new vest, a pack or any hydration solution and let me know what you guys think.
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: Thank you.