Latest / The Week in Bible Prophecy / Demonic Encounters | Carl Teichrib

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Demonic Encounters | Carl Teichrib · The Week in Bible Prophecy

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  Speaker 1: The Week in Bible Prophecy, a Prophecy Watchers podcast.
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  Speaker 2: Welcome to the podcast today, everybody. I am sitting here
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  Speaker 2: talking with Carl tygrib Welcome Carl.
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  Speaker 3: It's a pleasure to be with you. I'm excited for
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  Speaker 3: this conversation.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah. I think this is a very healthy conversation for
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  Speaker 2: every single Christian because you know, to have the opportunity
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  Speaker 2: to talk with you and certainly you know your book
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  Speaker 2: Game of Gods as well. For those of you that
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  Speaker 2: don't have the book, we'll get a little summary of
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  Speaker 2: what that is. But also I think what's happening here
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  Speaker 2: in our world is especially in the Christian Church. And
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  Speaker 2: maybe you can comment on this, maybe we'll jump in
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  Speaker 2: right on. That is my impression, even as a pastor
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  Speaker 2: for sixteen years, is that the church has become more
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  Speaker 2: and more sanitized as it relates to believing. Well, I
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  Speaker 2: mean they might believe that we live in the supernatural,
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  Speaker 2: but actually actually really believing it in that regard, I mean,
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  Speaker 2: we have to believe it because the Bible says it,
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  Speaker 2: Angels exist, demons exist. Well, you know, I've never seen one.
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  Speaker 2: I've never seen an angel. Talk if you will about
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  Speaker 2: your experience in what you've seen, you know, over your ministry,
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  Speaker 2: the time of your ministry, and that just the nature
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  Speaker 2: of the supernatural nation of the Bible, and how it's
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  Speaker 2: kind of been sanitized and maybe dismissed and ignored.
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  Speaker 3: You're making a good point. We have sanitized it, and
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  Speaker 3: I think we've sanitized it because, boy, this is hard
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  Speaker 3: for me to maybe express. Maybe we really don't understand
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  Speaker 3: how important the truth of scripture is. I don't. Maybe
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  Speaker 3: maybe we're too glib about it. We don't fear God,
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  Speaker 3: we fear man. You know. I think there's there's at
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  Speaker 3: least some you know, to some extent that comes into play.
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  Speaker 3: I've been to lots of crazy places, as you know,
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  Speaker 3: we've we've had some of these conversations and people are
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  Speaker 3: all all, you know, almost always asking have you seen
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  Speaker 3: demons or have you seen this? You know, do you
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  Speaker 3: feel the evil? Do you feel the darkness? And I'm
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  Speaker 3: not going to excuse if somebody says, hey, I felt something,
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  Speaker 3: I don't. I don't. In fact, I don't see in
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  Speaker 3: scripture where it's portrayed how I'm supposed to feel something. No.
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  Speaker 3: In fact, I find spiritual warfare. It really boils down
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  Speaker 3: to the issue of truth first, who is true Jesus Christ?
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  Speaker 3: What is true his word? And then it becomes an
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  Speaker 3: issue of all, right, can we break down the strongholds
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  Speaker 3: of false beliefs, wrong ideas? Can we bring down the
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  Speaker 3: strongholds of those barriers that we have placed already in
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  Speaker 3: our minds and in our hearts and then allow the
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  Speaker 3: truth of Jesus Christ and his word to come in.
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  Speaker 3: So there's this we almost have a sense of either
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  Speaker 3: we don't believe it's true or we sensationalize. So there's
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  Speaker 3: almost no in between ground. There's got to be one
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  Speaker 3: of the other. Either there's you know, demon hiding behind
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  Speaker 3: the cop or something. There's got to be something. I've
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  Speaker 3: been to piles of events, modo piles, and I can't
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  Speaker 3: say I felt very much except maybe empathy because I
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  Speaker 3: recognize their humanity. I sometimes have felt some depression in
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  Speaker 3: the sense of my goodness. I can't believe where this
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  Speaker 3: is going. The Christian community is going to get broadsided.
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  Speaker 3: This this is serious, and of course there's a weight
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  Speaker 3: that comes with it it depressions. Maybe they're not the
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  Speaker 3: right word, but there's a weight that comes with that,
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  Speaker 3: a sense of responsibility. But yes, I have actually had
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  Speaker 3: an encounter. I've had a few different encounters. And before
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  Speaker 3: the program, I was showing you some pictures of a
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  Speaker 3: blood ritual that I saw that I sat through as
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  Speaker 3: a Christian researcher at a pagan event. It was a
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  Speaker 3: ritual called the marriage of Heaven and Head. Know, and yes,
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  Speaker 3: it's very graphic and that all that goes with it.
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  Speaker 3: And we were told that two demons would stand before us,
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  Speaker 3: the demons had names, that it was a very detailed
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  Speaker 3: and elaborate hour long ritual, and nothing happened. There were
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  Speaker 3: no demons that stood before us. And I can't say
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  Speaker 3: that it was because I was in the room and
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  Speaker 3: there's a researcher, and that maybe is something your audience
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  Speaker 3: needs to understand. I'm not going there to say, hey,
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  Speaker 3: I'm one of you guys, ye are looking.
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  Speaker 2: For there's a researcher. Yeah, bring back these truths to
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  Speaker 2: the people that like the church that needs.
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  Speaker 3: Here, right and Wanda, I take my research very seriously,
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  Speaker 3: like very seriously. That in many respects is a heartbeat
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  Speaker 3: of what I do. I do other things, I edit,
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  Speaker 3: I lecture, I speak. Now, I'm a researcher first, that's
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  Speaker 3: where I come alive, trying to dig through and understand,
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  Speaker 3: all right, where does this worldview challenge come, how is
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  Speaker 3: it being lived out? How do we see it move
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  Speaker 3: from the theoretical to the practical. So I've seen stuff.
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  Speaker 3: Last year I was with our friends Brian and Audrey Vandercleay,
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  Speaker 3: and in twenty twenty three, the three of us went
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  Speaker 3: to a regional burning Man event in Alberta, and I
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  Speaker 3: did have an encounter with a demoniac there and it
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  Speaker 3: was interesting. I'm there doing social surveys literally that's research,
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  Speaker 3: by the way research is, and just sitting on Google
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  Speaker 3: or on YouTube since taking literally a page with questions
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  Speaker 3: and probing questions and trying to get down into the
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  Speaker 3: nitty gritty of what you believe and why you're here
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  Speaker 3: and how this is changing you or transforming you. And
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  Speaker 3: so there was a camp, oh not far, just like
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  Speaker 3: fifteen seconds down the path from where our camp was
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  Speaker 3: set up, and everybody in that camp had already done
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  Speaker 3: the interviews. I had multiple interactions, and there was a
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  Speaker 3: gentleman there who had made some advances, and I had
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  Speaker 3: we already dispelled all that and we had just oh right,
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  Speaker 3: this is just now a cordial cordial thing. Anyways, I've
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  Speaker 3: had these interactions with this group, and before the temple burned,
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  Speaker 3: because this is a regional burning Man event, and of
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  Speaker 3: course the big burn in Nevada has a human effigy
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  Speaker 3: and a big temple. Same with the regionals, they do
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  Speaker 3: the same. They have a temple, they have an effigy.
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  Speaker 3: And this is just before the temple burns. I'm walking
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  Speaker 3: by this camp and this gentleman trots out towards me,
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  Speaker 3: and as I said, we've had a lot of interactions,
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  Speaker 3: and I know his name is Christopher. We're already on
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  Speaker 3: a one on one basis, and he comes up to
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  Speaker 3: me Mondo, and he goes in a very normal way.
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  Speaker 3: He says, you're the first person I saw when the
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  Speaker 3: event began. I've seen you all weekend and now right
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  Speaker 3: at the end because the temple's going to burn. This
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  Speaker 3: is the end of the event. Here here again. And
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  Speaker 3: then something snaps, something changes, and it is weird. And
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  Speaker 3: he's in my face and I mean bang, he's in
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  Speaker 3: my face and he's growling. His whole demeanor has changed
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  Speaker 3: and he's growling at me. Where do you get your power?
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  Speaker 3: And I'm I'm frozen, I'm just standing there because I'm
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  Speaker 3: not expecting this. No, no, exactly, it's this is now
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  Speaker 3: we're unto a law weirdo, and you know, like, what
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  Speaker 3: does this mean? And immediately I just said to him
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  Speaker 3: and I didn't I mean, I didn't freak out. I
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  Speaker 3: just said to him, I have the spirit of Jesus
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  Speaker 3: and me and he starts growling at me, Are you Jesus?
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  Speaker 2: No?
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  Speaker 3: But I have his spirit in me? And then he
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  Speaker 3: breaks away. His composure changes. He looks like Christopher, he
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  Speaker 3: looks normal, and he looks at me. He goes, my
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  Speaker 3: name is Christopher. This is just bizarre because my name
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  Speaker 3: is Christopher and I found out during this weekend that
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  Speaker 3: that means christ. And then he's as again. He's back
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  Speaker 3: in my face and he's growling I am the anti Christopher.
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  Speaker 3: I am the Antichrist, and I just okay, you know, ay, no,
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  Speaker 3: something's going on. This is not normal. And I look
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  Speaker 3: at him and I say, I am the pro Christopher.
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  Speaker 3: I am the pro Christ And then he's made some
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  Speaker 3: bizarre mention of he'll rule the world and love and
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  Speaker 3: power and something. It was just weird. And then it
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  Speaker 3: breaks and he walks away, and I have no idea,
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  Speaker 3: and I walked the way to Mondo and I'm like,
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  Speaker 3: what just happened. I've been to witchcraft events. In fact,
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  Speaker 3: just a few weeks ago, I was at Paganicon, gathering
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  Speaker 3: abroughly one thousand witches and wickens and druids in the
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  Speaker 3: Twin Cities area. I've been to it a few times.
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  Speaker 3: As a researcher. I'm going to these places and for
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  Speaker 3: the most part, you don't have any bizarre encounter. The
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  Speaker 3: issues are more often than not over what is true
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  Speaker 3: and who is true? That's really where this boils down to.
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  Speaker 3: But nevertheless, I had this encounter. So this is the
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  Speaker 3: first time and well I mean, I mean I've been
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  Speaker 3: doing this full time since ninety seven, so this is
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  Speaker 3: the first time I've had something like that. And I
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  Speaker 3: know that there's going to be people hearing this conversation.
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  Speaker 3: Who's going to be going, Yeah, I've had something similar,
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  Speaker 3: because the demonic is real. Yeah, absolutely, And I am
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  Speaker 3: convinced that that was a demonic encounter because of the
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  Speaker 3: nature of the question that was asked, where do you
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  Speaker 3: get your power? He didn't snap and go how come
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  Speaker 3: it's cloudy outside, you know, or any of the mundane
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  Speaker 3: kinds of conversations that we would have. No, it went
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  Speaker 3: immediately down to the core, you.
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  Speaker 2: Know, on that Let's put it in context a little bit.
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  Speaker 2: It just at least from my outside perspective. So you
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  Speaker 2: were were you, I don't imagine you were going around
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  Speaker 2: doing miracles, No, raising the dead, healing the sick, having
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  Speaker 2: a conversation. Yeah, any sort of external demonstration of quote
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  Speaker 2: quote power. But yet this demoniac or let's just say this,
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  Speaker 2: this spirit, this unclean spirit, so to speak. It was
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  Speaker 2: interesting how he was defining.
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  Speaker 3: Power right, good point.
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  Speaker 2: Huh, yes, that you're he saw something there and here.
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  Speaker 2: So in that sense, what would you say, let's kind
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  Speaker 2: of read between the lines or maybe read into it.
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  Speaker 2: What was he defining as your power?
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  Speaker 3: Obviously it was something spiritual because when I mentioned that
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  Speaker 3: my power comes from Jesus Christ, that was immediately where
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  Speaker 3: that conversation went. It didn't land on anything else. It
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  Speaker 3: didn't land on politics, it didn't land on anything else.
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  Speaker 3: It landed on something that had a spiritual implication.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, would you say too that as he as he mentioned,
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  Speaker 2: you had interacted with him over and over and no
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  Speaker 2: doubt this, this this demon had seen you think at
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  Speaker 2: least at the basic level. It was the power of
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  Speaker 2: resistance and protection that he's he's seeing in you. Again,
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  Speaker 2: you're just going out there, you're having conversations, right, but
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  Speaker 2: yet this this this being is looking at you and
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  Speaker 2: looking on somehow you are resistant by the power of
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  Speaker 2: Christ in you.
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  Speaker 3: The Obviously, again we're now entering the realm of let's say,
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  Speaker 3: healthy speculation, because.
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  Speaker 2: We don't exactly, we really don't know.
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  Speaker 3: Nevertheless, I'm I've entered their church, you know, I've entered
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  Speaker 3: their space, and that's what I do. I entered their
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  Speaker 3: space and so something didn't didn't fit, something didn't click properly.
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  Speaker 3: And for whatever reason, that entity, that spirit, since that
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  Speaker 3: knew that there was something there that wasn't different about you, right,
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  Speaker 3: there was something unusual and that caused that that reaction
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  Speaker 3: or encounter. And again, this is the only time on
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  Speaker 3: DOO I can ever say I've had something like that.
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  Speaker 3: And I don't even know if I've ever really talked
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  Speaker 3: about this on air. It's just it was. I mean,
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  Speaker 3: it's still kind of fresh in my mind because it
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  Speaker 3: was last summer, and and it was abrupt. It was
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  Speaker 3: really abrupt, and that's kind of what blew me away.
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  Speaker 3: Was just how abrupt And then at the same time,
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  Speaker 3: I'm not I didn't run away, there was nowhere to
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  Speaker 3: run to. I mean, what am I going to do?
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  Speaker 3: It's not about that, hello, It's a defeated entity, a
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  Speaker 3: defeated enemy. Every knee will bow, that the knee Christopher's
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  Speaker 3: knee will bow. And I do hope, honestly, I do
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  Speaker 3: hope he bows in love at some point, but the
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  Speaker 3: entity that's inhabiting him will bow as well. I think
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  Speaker 3: going to bow in judgment. You know.
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  Speaker 2: I think this is a good a good time to
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  Speaker 2: remind people as we think about spiritual warfare. Again, what
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  Speaker 2: I've seen often in the church is again we like
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  Speaker 2: we give lip service to it, and and it's like, hey, yeah, yeah, yeah,
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  Speaker 2: spiritual warfare. You know, if he's in six twelve, we
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  Speaker 2: wrestle well against flesh and blood. But he goes on
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  Speaker 2: Prince all these powers and he lists these things, and
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  Speaker 2: so we acknowledge that. But it's a good reminder for
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  Speaker 2: people that here you are, in twenty seven years of ministry,
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  Speaker 2: that this was one of the first times or a
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  Speaker 2: few times, you know, if I understand correctly, where you've
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  Speaker 2: had an actual, real, overt, visible, audible interaction with another entity.
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  Speaker 2: And I want to read a passage of scripture here
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  Speaker 2: because something that you said earlier. This is Paul writing
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  Speaker 2: in Secretyans ten, which again goes along with Ephesians six twelve.
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  Speaker 2: He says here in verse three, for though we walk
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  Speaker 2: in the flesh, we are not waging war according to
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  Speaker 2: the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not
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  Speaker 2: of the flesh, but have divine power to destroy strongholds,
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  Speaker 2: We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion raised against the
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  Speaker 2: knowledge of God. And we take every thought captive to
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  Speaker 2: obey Christ, being ready to punish every disobedience when you're
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  Speaker 2: audience is complete. So you know, in my my brain
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  Speaker 2: works in exte Jesus, and so I tend to outline things.
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  Speaker 2: And I've done that for so long as a pastor.
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  Speaker 2: You teach the Bible every week, and and so I'm thinking, okay, Well,
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  Speaker 2: what jumps out to me is you know you have
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  Speaker 2: we have warfare. But twice he says, it's not in
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  Speaker 2: the flesh, but it is powerful, So that means it's real.
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  Speaker 2: He we have strongholds, arguments, and thoughts that are all
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  Speaker 2: lined up in parallelism, and so it goes back to
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  Speaker 2: what you said earlier, that truth. Yes, can I just
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  Speaker 2: jump in, jump in what what.
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  Speaker 3: What is the focus here in terms of of the
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  Speaker 3: the weapons of our warfare? What in what is the
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  Speaker 3: focus in that passage arguments and strongholds of thought?
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  Speaker 2: Yep?
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  Speaker 3: Taking every thought captive. That's that's where the bawlground lies.
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  Speaker 2: That's and that exactly because you have you know, uh,
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  Speaker 2: I think we tend to blur. We see Jesus and
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  Speaker 2: we could read the Gospels, you know, and I'm not
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  Speaker 2: probably matter of an hour, right if we're for a
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  Speaker 2: good read or whatever. But we get in there and
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  Speaker 2: we see Jesus casting out demons, and you know, every
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  Speaker 2: other page or whatever in the Gospels. But yet, for
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  Speaker 2: the rest of the New Testament, I mean a couple
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  Speaker 2: times in the Book of Acts, you have some situations.
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  Speaker 2: But the New Testament is filled with truth. But it's
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  Speaker 2: not a manual for how to go out and cast
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  Speaker 2: out demons. You never see this is how you do it,
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  Speaker 2: et cetera. We see it in the Gospels, and so
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  Speaker 2: we see it there and so we get this vision
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  Speaker 2: of spiritual warfare. All that's casting out a demon or
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  Speaker 2: that's in your case talking with this potential entity or
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  Speaker 2: this demon here saying something. But in reality, Paul never
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  Speaker 2: describes spiritual warfare in that way. He doesn't discount it, right,
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  Speaker 2: he doesn't. He doesn't because in Acts sixteen he calls
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  Speaker 2: out the python spirit right, come out of her. But
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  Speaker 2: here he's saying, hey, guys, there's warfare. It's in if
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  Speaker 2: he's in six twelve, there's a reality of these spiritual strongholds.
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  Speaker 2: But again, strongholds, thoughts and arguments and the the opposite
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  Speaker 2: of that. And it all comes down to any opinion
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  Speaker 2: that's raised against the knowledge of God, which is the
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  Speaker 2: scriptural truth. Right, So I would say that the primary,
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  Speaker 2: not the only, but people needed to cure carefully. The
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  Speaker 2: primary realm of warfare is relates in truth knowledge as
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  Speaker 2: we see here, how we're praying, what we're believing, the
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  Speaker 2: things that are behind the scenes. But it's done in
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  Speaker 2: the thought world.
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  Speaker 3: It is.
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  Speaker 2: And talk about that.
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  Speaker 3: Well, if you take a look at Genesis chapter three,
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  Speaker 3: they're very our downfall. What transpired? What's the first problem?
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  Speaker 3: The first problem we understand what the lie is. The
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  Speaker 3: lie is an untruth, okay, and what does that untruth.
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  Speaker 3: Tell you it says, transgress God's law? Did God really say? Now,
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  Speaker 3: transgress what God has said? And by transgressing, by eating
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  Speaker 3: the fruit, you can be as God. You will have wisdom,
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  Speaker 3: your eyes will be opened, you will know good and evil.
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  Speaker 3: And part of that is true. We do know good
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  Speaker 3: any ill. We have both before us all the time.
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  Speaker 3: But the primary, the primary emphasis is you will be
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  Speaker 3: the same as your maker. You'll be the same as
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  Speaker 3: your creator. You will be as God. If you just
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  Speaker 3: transgress to what God says, you can become God. That's
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  Speaker 3: an argument. There's a logical, reasonable argument that now can
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  Speaker 3: be made back and forth with this.
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  Speaker 2: Well, pull out the words again, words jump out of me.
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  Speaker 2: Did God really say? There's a word there? And you
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  Speaker 2: will know, you'll have this certain knowledge. Yes, So people
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  Speaker 2: need to remember right at the beginning, it is about
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  Speaker 2: that's spiritual warfare. Spiritual warfare. He didn't go and try
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  Speaker 2: to demon possess him. He didn't go and attack them physically.
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  Speaker 2: He did it in the realm.
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  Speaker 3: Of thought, right, in knowledge and in raising those big questions.
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  Speaker 3: Right did God really say? And so one of the things,
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  Speaker 3: as you're going through the Gospels, you're seeing over and
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  Speaker 3: over again, Believe, Believe, Believe John three sixteen. It's about belief.
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  Speaker 3: What's the foundational problem that we see in Genesis chapter three, Well,
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  Speaker 3: it's obviously disbelief. There's a moment of disbelief, and you
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  Speaker 3: all of a sudden have bought that lie. You have
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  Speaker 3: bought the argument. And Paul is saying, tear down that argument,
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  Speaker 3: tear down those strongholds. I'll ultimately, honestly Mondo, and as
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: I'm going through scriptures and I have really had to
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: wrestle with spiritual warfare, and I'm not going to discount
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: other people's experiences because you have experiences. We all have experiences,
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: but we still have to run them through the lens
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: of scripture. We still have to run them through what
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: God's word says. The bottom line is our spiritual warfare
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: is about first who is true Jesus Christ, and then
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: what is true? It is word true. That's really where
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: it boils down to. We can do all kinds of
• 19:02
  Speaker 3: other things. We can we can do all kinds of
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: activities in the name of spiritual warfare, but unless it
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: really gets to the issue of who is true and
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: what is true, I think it becomes nothing more than
• 19:16
  Speaker 3: trappings or has that potential. It becomes now here's a system,
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: here's the twelve steps or the you know whatever that's.
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: Gonna cast out a demon or something. Yeah, whatever that
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: might or might not be yet.
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: Right exactly, And now we start to ascribe things having
• 19:34
  Speaker 3: spiritual properties that maybe don't have spiritual properties. Maybe my
• 19:37
  Speaker 3: twelve steps don't have spiritual properties. Maybe it's in the
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: realm already of my imagination. Maybe what I need to
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: do is maybe take every thought and clean my own thoughts. Yeah, exactly,
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: Please my own thoughts. They're bad already, I know that.
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: Take them captive.
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the world of flesh and the devil, you know,
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: have that. We see that in Aphesian chapter two, right,
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: you know, the enemy, the prince of power of the air.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: And so we see this and the thoughts that come men,
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: they certainly again we live in our spirits are born again, right,
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: we know that. But we're still entrapped at the moment
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: in this physical body of decay of flesh. You know,
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: impulse is a Roman seven and your members is death
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: and so but we have the new nature dwelling here.
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: And so when the thoughts come in, I always ask, well,
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: is that my thought, is that coming from me, whether
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: it's condemnation or lies or whatever, it's coming from the flesh,
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: or is it coming from the devil, so to speak,
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: or is it coming from the world. Whatever they're saying.
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: Maybe I've heard something, we're reading, you know, whatever, hearing
• 20:37
  Speaker 2: whatever the world's saying. But again, at the end of
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: the day, ninety nine percent of the battle, it starts
• 20:43
  Speaker 2: in the mind.
• 20:44
  Speaker 3: Yes, yes, I do believe. There are doctrines of demons. Yep.
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: I think the very first doctrine of demon that you
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: see is found in Genesis chapter three. Ye imagine that
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: there's a doctrine right there from a demon yep, from Satan,
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: the father of demons, the father of lies. And I
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: do believe as I've been to so many different events,
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: and I'm watching doctrines coming forward teaching.
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, doctrines. Absolutely, it's arguments, right, I mean, that's what
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: we're talking about.
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: Bingo, including political doctrines yep. And I'm going, oh boy,
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: that actually is grounded in an erroneous worldview based out
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: of Genesis chapter three. So I'll give you an example
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: of my country. We have carbon taxes. I hate them.
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: I just hate them, and I don't hate them purely
• 21:30
  Speaker 3: because I'm paying another tax, which ironically is actually a
• 21:33
  Speaker 3: tax on top of a tax I think I'm buying gas,
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: I'm paying like three taxes on top of my carbon.
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: It's just it's nuts, it's ludicrous. It comes south of
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: the border border and it's like, oh, your fuel is
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: so cheap compared to ours, and we're the ones pumping
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: out of the ground as you guys are as well.
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: We have it from Canada. South of the border is
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: not Mexico.
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: I'm sure that the fuel is probably cheaper there too.
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: I don't know, but okay, so we have these carbon
• 22:01
  Speaker 3: taxes back in the year two thousand and carbon the
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: idea of putting a price on carbon goes before the
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: year two thousand. But back in the year two thousand,
• 22:10
  Speaker 3: I was a delegate to the United Nations Millennium Form,
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: and I've talked about that, and I've wrote about my book,
• 22:14
  Speaker 3: and I've been to other UN and other global governance events.
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: Because there's a political side to what I do. Ideal
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: in politics, I've dealt in I was one of the
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: early researchers diving into transhumanism. I dealt, of course with
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: paganism because there is a theological understanding of what we're
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: doing politically, economically, socially, culturally, you name it, but you
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: know it's interesting. So I was part of this subgroup
• 22:39
  Speaker 3: on rebuilding or remaking world order, and one of the
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: things that we were discussing is having a new financial arrangement,
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: a new financial order, and that included things like putting
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: special levies and special taxes on things like air travel,
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: cross border travel, putting a tobin tax on international monetary transactions,
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: of some very specific details about how we could implement
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: a way of bringing money into the coffers of the
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: international community so that the United Nations could have an
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: empowered budget. Because they're dependent on national contributions, how can
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: we give them an independent monetary basis so that they
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: can operate begin to operate more fully as a system
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: of global governance. So we had conversations about things like
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: putting together an international security arrangement, collective security, common security,
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: a whole bunch of different things. But in terms of
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: taxing things, one of the topics that came up is
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: carbon tax because and this is where it gets back
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: into the spiritual, into the worldview side of it, because
• 23:48
  Speaker 3: we need to do this, not just simply so we
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: can give the United Nations power, because so far, my
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: carbon taxes, as far as I know, aren't being funneled
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: to the UN. I guess maybe in part they are
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: because of our national contributions.
• 24:02
  Speaker 2: Are they just funnel straight to the Canadian government? Right?
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: They fill up to the Canadian government, right, which just
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: kind of goes where exactly, not back into our roads.
• 24:13
  Speaker 3: Tell you again, crossing from Canada to the US. You're
• 24:18
  Speaker 3: Canadian listeners, they'll get it. But what struck me was
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: there was a world view behind this that we're doing
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: this to save mother Earth. We're doing this to save
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: the environment. It's about guys, creature, right. And when we
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: came out with the carbon tax a number of years ago,
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: and I went, oh, I have no choice. When I
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: put the bowser in my gas tank, I got, you know,
• 24:43
  Speaker 3: and fill up. I am now forced to pay a
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: tithe and an offering to Mother Earth. Hi, welcome to
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: the world of pagan politics. That's where we're at. So
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: let's be honest about this. And we've had this converse,
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: I know a little bit before we began, and I've
• 25:02
  Speaker 3: talked to others about this I've had so many people
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: say to me, Carl, you're on the front lines. Let's
• 25:09
  Speaker 3: be honest. We're all behind the lines, all of us,
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: and the battle is right in front of us all
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: the time. It's in my own mind. I'm battling with it.
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: Our curriculums, schools are battling with it, our churches are
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: battling with it. Hollywood is mombarding us with ideas. The Internet.
• 25:25
  Speaker 3: If there's a portal to all the evils in the world,
• 25:28
  Speaker 3: it's called the Internet. I go off to crazy places.
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: I got my smartphone in from of me. This is
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: everybody's portal to crazy places. Yep. Totally, including social media yep,
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: for sure. And so I mean, I get a lot
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: of I get a lot of feedback that's supportive, and
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: I get a lot of feedback back that's really push
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: us against what I do. And that just comes with
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: the territory. And I get that. And I'm like, you
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: don't get how ironic that is. As you return on
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: the television, right as you're responding to me on Facebook yep,
• 26:04
  Speaker 3: or in a YouTube comment, knowing what this is, knowing
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: that it's a platform. But it's a platform that every
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: evil imagination already has has a voice.
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: See see, let's let's stop here for a moment, because
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: you know, for for those in the audience that are listening,
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: I think they have bought in, however, subconsciously, to the
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: idea that again, you go to some you you go
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: to these physical locations, and you, as you mentioned, you
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: are observing in you know, a pagan festival, a witch
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: is meeting, you know, Wickan or whatever, that burning man whatever,
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: You're on location in some of these places. But they
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: have bought into this subtle distinction that, oh wow, the
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: real danger is there, rather than when I turn on
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: my television, when I go on to social media, and
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: so because there you're physically in a place where you
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: might encounter something like you like your reference. But if
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: I turn the television or going to social media and
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: with my phone, I'm safe over here.
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: Or if I walk into Walmart or McDonald.
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, even if it's even if they're just stay
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: in their house, that they're they're they're in their mind,
• 27:17
  Speaker 2: they're putting the danger physically and the location, when in reality,
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: the true danger, as you mentioned in Genesis three, is
• 27:25
  Speaker 2: in ideas, it's in the thoughts, it's in the words
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: that I find it fascinating that when what do we
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: see in Genesis one, God said, and it was, and
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: so you have right there, right out of the gate.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: God is revealing to us in the theology of Genesis
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: one and two, the power of his word to bring
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: immediate the creation itself has to respond like the light
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: was there was there was no option. And then of
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: course we see in Genesis three. You know, we see
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: that over and over through through six days. But then
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: immediately in Genesis three we see the challenging of God's
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: words and the doubting, and then that of course the transgression.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: To me again, I think people need to these that
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: might be critical of what you do. I think if
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: Ephesians five to eleven, and it says, take no part
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: in the unfruitful works of darkness, but instead expose them,
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: for as shameful even to speak of these things that
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: they do in secret. But when anything is exposed by
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: the light, it becomes visible, and he goes on. So
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: here you are, you're going in, you're researching, you're understanding
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: in order to bring that information back and to expose
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: it to again the people that need it. But comment,
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: if you will in Matthew four. I'll just say this
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: and kind of let you run with it. We know
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: that Matthew four luke for Jesus was tempted by Satan.
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: So Satan shows up. I mean, this is the real deal, right,
• 28:51
  Speaker 2: like in justs three. He's there now here's We know
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: that Jesus is the creator. I mean he's John one. Right,
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: nothing was created without him. He could have looked and
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: he was the creator of Satan. He was a creator.
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: Nothing was made that has been made that was apart
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: from him. So the authority, the power, I mean, the
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: true essence, that the existential being here, there's no comparison, okay, right,
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: God the son is there.
• 29:16
  Speaker 3: Right we forget that actually the supernatural world is a
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: created world exactly.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: Yes, hello, so here here he is. And he could
• 29:23
  Speaker 2: he could literally in relatives speaking, he hit it. He
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: could afflict him like a flea away. But Jesus doesn't, right,
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: he says it is written, right, Satan tempts him. It
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: has written three times, all quoted from Juteronomy, you know,
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: the wilderness and wanterings so as relates to again another
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: insight into spiritual warfare. Jesus, the King, the Creator, could
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: afflicted him away in a very physical way. Whatever that means.
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: But he quotes the scripture, right is that? I mean?
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: What is what did Jesus do with that? What's what's
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: the pattern that he wants us to learn about? It?
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: My word? I'm just gonna say my word. No, it's
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: not my word. It's his word. It's the authority of
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: his word, the authority and power of his word. And
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: it's not that words themselves have power. I can't. We
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: speak things and they have influence and they have ability.
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: But God, because he is a transcendent being, because he
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: is outside of time, space and matter, and by his
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: very character his nature, when he speaks, You're right, he speaks.
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: He could have just flicked sat in a way for
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: him to speak the universe into being. He has that progative.
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: It's it's his progative. It's his word. It's the expression
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: of his of his of his character, his will. I
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: see all this and I'm going awesome. That is Christ,
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: God made flesh walking among men still as a man,
• 30:58
  Speaker 3: pointing back to literally his own word as being the
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: final authority. I love it. It's powerful, it's beautiful, it's
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: both God. Because Jesus is a man of flesh walking
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: among us as God, which is so awesome because the
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: other world religions are like, you can become a god.
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: You're just a man of flesh, but you can eventually
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: become a god. You know, break the cycles of karma.
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we heard that before, right, right, right?
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: Or or do all the temple rituals and go to
• 31:35
  Speaker 3: Salt Lake City and you know, become you can become
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: a god or whatever. Do all the right things, your
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: personal righteousness without Christ, do all the good things. I'm
• 31:46
  Speaker 3: a good person. My wife as a wonderful testimony in
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: that she always she was a good girl, and she
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: always did good things, and she believed that her goodness
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: was good enough. Wrong. Stop, how do we have you know?
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: And I'm going to reverse that as well. We also
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: have people always are saying to the effect of, well,
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: God can never accept me because I've done so many
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: bad things. Stop Stop who put your bad things higher
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: than God? Who put your goodness higher than God? Stop
• 32:22
  Speaker 3: playing God? That's the problem. Even in those comments we're playing.
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: To have the title of my book Games of God.
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: And here we see Jesus he could just flick sate
• 32:33
  Speaker 3: in a way, but he demonstrates his own power through
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: his own word, and we can now do the same,
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: not in the sense that we are Jesus or but
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: we can quoth yeah. Yeah, And when Christopher came to
• 32:46
  Speaker 3: me and he said, yes, where do you get your power?
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: I have no power? Yep, I have none. I'm a
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: mortal man. I am going to take the dirt nap
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: someday and Christ himself will resrect me. But I can't
• 33:02
  Speaker 3: do it. No, no, no, I'm the spirit of Christ
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: within me because he's the author of life. And being
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: the author of life, wow, why would I not want
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: to position myself with him? And then Mando, This is
• 33:17
  Speaker 3: one of the things as a young man really bothered me.
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: And I really love Genesis. I love Genesis, especially the
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: first eleven chapters. Has gripped me. But it really bothered me.
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: Why this issue of death? Why is death this consequence
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: to disobeying God that we see in the garden, Like,
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: isn't that pretty extreme? You ate a fruit and now
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: you're going to die? Like, wow, that's extreme. Hold on,
• 33:45
  Speaker 3: if God is we're looking at reason and logic now,
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: if God is the author of life, by turning my
• 33:53
  Speaker 3: back and doing what he says not to do. I
• 33:56
  Speaker 3: have now walked a different road. Logically, have chosen a
• 34:01
  Speaker 3: path of death because I have said no to the
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: author of life. So why does Christ's resurrection matter so much?
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: Because the author of life reverses the fall and defeats death. Awesome, awesome?
• 34:18
  Speaker 3: So then why are we afraid? Why are we afraid?
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: I mean people are like, oh, I hear this a lot, Carl,
• 34:23
  Speaker 3: you must be so brave going to where you go.
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: You gotta be kidding me. You got to be so
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: brave just to step foot out of your house right now.
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: You know, the world's a crazy place. And yet at
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: the same time we do why because they're supposed to
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: be ambassadors for Christ going to all the world. Where
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: are the exceptions to that statement?
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, not disciple nations. I mean it's it's.
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: The word, all right, pretty clearly doesn't mean that you
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: become them. I can now empathize with them. I can
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: I can feel their pain. Let me tell you, when
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: I go to Burning Man, I probably get more pushback
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: going to Burning Man than anything else, some really interesting
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: pushback and some It's created some great conversations, And I'm like, yeah,
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: you know, I empathize I can empathize when I go
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: to their temple and I see that so at burning man.
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: You have you got this temple and it's a huge,
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: huge structure, just huge, and it starts off as a
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: blank slate. The walls are empty, and everything that's built
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: there by the way is done by volunteers. Okay, so
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: there's already a lot of blood, sweat and tears that
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: go into these things. It's people are pouring themselves out
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: into it. And then as the week progresses, people are
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: posting pictures of deceased loved ones writing on the walls
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: their hurts, their pains, their grief, their anger, their sorrow,
• 35:38
  Speaker 3: writing on the wall. When I was there in twenty seventeen,
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: one of the very first notes I saw with somebody
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: had wrote a declaration of suicide, you know, stuff like this.
• 35:47
  Speaker 3: This last year when I was there, somebody had placed
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: a note, a long written paper and I read it
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: and it was a person saying, Hey, this is all
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: the stuff that's happened in my life. If I am
• 35:59
  Speaker 3: successful in my side, bring my note to the temple. Yeah.
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: It's raw. It's very very raw, is the idea. And
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: you see wedding dresses hanging is the.
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: Idea that to burn bad memories or bad thoughts. I mean, whats.
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: The search for healing, search for something, something that's going
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: to break that past from you.
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: See that That was what when you were talking. And
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: I don't want to interrupt you, but it was you know, people,
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: I think we we we look at you know, there's
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: a lot of sin there. I imagine every you get, everywhere,
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: every where you name it.
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: Go to the university, right exactly. That's scarier actually.
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: But you also have and so I think we we
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: imagine what we think burning man is. I've never been there,
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: but I can imagine even in my own mind, what
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: I think it might be. But if we if we
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: step back for a moment, which like, these are all
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: a bunch of just pagans that are so dedicated to
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: what they're doing. But in reality, I mean some people
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: go there. They're they're inquisitive, they're they're seekers, they're curious.
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: And so you have this whole body of people that, yeah,
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: might not be totally sold out, but they're there again
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: looking for these things. And so as you show up,
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: you're like, hey, I'm here to be sensitive to the
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: Holy Spirit, to reach people who are curious that haven't
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: committed themselves completely to whatever, or that are suffering looking
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: to have an escape from the past. What better answer
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: is the Gospel than to be forgiven and escape from
• 37:24
  Speaker 2: that right exactly.
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: And so you have this outpouring of humanity. Yes, like
• 37:28
  Speaker 3: I said, there's wedding dresses being hung, people bringing the
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: ashes of the urns of the loved ones in photo albums, journals,
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: by the time ono, by the time the temple burns,
• 37:38
  Speaker 3: all of the walls as high as you can reach,
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: and even higher when people start bringing ladders and putting
• 37:43
  Speaker 3: people up on shoulders to write even higher all the walls.
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: Thousands and thousands of expressions of grief and sorrow and
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: joy and everything else is there. And you walk around
• 37:56
  Speaker 3: that and there's a lump in your throat because you
• 37:58
  Speaker 3: realize they're all hurting and they need christep, and they're
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: searching for healing. They're searching there lost, they're having you
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: and I are a common human experience, yep. And it's
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: the Gospel of Jesus Christ that brings them healing. But
• 38:13
  Speaker 3: it demonstrates this yearning, this hope. And when it comes
• 38:18
  Speaker 3: to things like let's say, burning man and there's a
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: great maybe a good way to maybe consider some of
• 38:24
  Speaker 3: this is, yeah, there's all kinds of stuff that happens there,
• 38:26
  Speaker 3: no question. I've seen lots of things. And we kind
• 38:29
  Speaker 3: of joke with our little team and thanks to my
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: friend Basil from Canary Cry Radio who's come with us
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: as well, he's like, there's more nudity. Pardon me, how
• 38:38
  Speaker 3: does he say this? There's less nudity. I gotta get
• 38:42
  Speaker 3: this right. He has a certain way of saying it.
• 38:44
  Speaker 3: It's it's pretty cool. There's more nudity than you're used to,
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: but less than you expected, or something to that, you know,
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: because hey, you know, it's one hundred and ten degrees
• 38:55
  Speaker 3: and if folks are are naked, and after a while,
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: it's just like whatever, by Wednesday, your sunburning places, you've
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: never been snhere, you're putting clothes back on, buddy. You know,
• 39:07
  Speaker 3: anybody who has worked in the hospital or worked in
• 39:09
  Speaker 3: the healthcare industry now is after a while, I was like, yeah, whatever,
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: but people freak out, and I get that, well.
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: They have this initial judgment of that and they freak o oh, clearly,
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: But I think where, you know, and I get that
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: where where would Jesus be right. Well, of course he's
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: at through eleven. He's saying he's got a reputation of glutton,
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: he's going with sinners, and not that he was any
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: of that.
• 39:32
  Speaker 3: No.
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: No, So now are you getting nude when you go there? No,
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: of course not right now. Neither would Jesus. No. But
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: if you're looking for the hurting, Yeah, in their place
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: of sanctuary, so to speak, where they're willing to discuss.
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: They already are sharing and writing their things. I mean,
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: can you go there and remain uncontaminated? Well, if you
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: have the power of Christ in you and you're there
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: on mission and you're there, I mean Secretians five, I'll
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: just just could go back this right verse twenty. Therefore,
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: We implore you, on behalf of Christ, to be reconciled
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: to God. And you were there as an ambassador as
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: light of the world as the salt to say, yes,
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: I'm surrounded by obviously you know there's wickedness there again,
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: I just said anywhere, but some morevert than others. But
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: I'm here as an ambassador on mission to God to
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: bring an appointment to divine appointment to talk with people
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: to share what they need.
• 40:27
  Speaker 3: Oh exactly. And you know something with that passage, it's
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: not a metaphor, it's not any an analogy or or
• 40:35
  Speaker 3: something like that.
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: No, you are you are, you are like you're not
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: like as you are are.
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: An ambassador, and that is crucial. That is critical, And
• 40:46
  Speaker 3: I don't think most people realize what that all entails.
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: And I've had I've had over the years a lot
• 40:52
  Speaker 3: of opportunities rub shoulders in the diplomatic community because of
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: places I've been. And it's interesting when you consider it
• 40:59
  Speaker 3: an ambassador does and what an ambassador is. So an
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: ambassador we think of it just, oh, you're a representative
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: of a foreign government. Hold on. And this came from
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: listening to the US Ambassador to Saudi Arabia, way way
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: way back. This is just after nine to eleven. I'm
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: at a Chicago Council on Foreign Relations meeting and the
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: US Ambassador of Saudi Arabia is giving us a breakdown
• 41:26
  Speaker 3: of what his new position would entail. And I walked
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: away from there Mondo with my jaw kind of on
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: the ground, going, this is our job, So I'll break
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: it down really easy. I'll put it in Christianese for
• 41:41
  Speaker 3: all of us. Being an ambassador is this first and foremost,
• 41:45
  Speaker 3: you are the legal and official representative of your government, who,
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: in our case, happens to be the king of kings. Hello.
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: I cannot think of any position more important than that.
• 41:58
  Speaker 3: We are the official and legal representative. That's huge. So
• 42:04
  Speaker 3: an ambassador takes the time to understand his king's power
• 42:07
  Speaker 3: and position. That's what we do here. As we study
• 42:11
  Speaker 3: God's word, we have to take God's word, and now
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: we know what our lord's priorities are.
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: You're there to represent him perfectly.
• 42:21
  Speaker 3: Bingo, I will do it perfectly.
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: Well, what I mean, what I mean rules, you're you're
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: it's not about you, it's about it's about the It's
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: about your your.
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: Your sovereign exactly. It can't be about me. I'm mortal,
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: he's not, yep. And so you're there to represent his
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: power and position, to represent his interests. An ambassador then
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: takes the time to understand the culture.
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: You put in foreign culture.
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: Right, So the US ambassador talked about how he had
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: how he had to study Saudi Arabia culture. It's history,
• 42:53
  Speaker 3: it's religion, it's economy. He had a study all, not
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: that he would become, that he would be in their world,
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: but not of their world. Hello.
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: Sounds awfully familiar, sounds really familiar.
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: And you're doing it for two reasons. One so that
• 43:13
  Speaker 3: you can effectively communicate your government's message into that foreign
• 43:16
  Speaker 3: land where all citizens first and foremost as Christians of
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: the Heavenly Kingdom. Rather, I know you're an American, you
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: live in America, you're born in America. I'm assuming this. Yeah, Okay,
• 43:27
  Speaker 3: I'm Canadian, born in Canada, raised in Canada. That's my
• 43:30
  Speaker 3: secondary citizenship, that's all that is. My first citizenship is
• 43:34
  Speaker 3: somewhere else, and I represent that citizenship first, not my
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: Canadian citizenship that's second. And so as an ambassador, you're
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: there to represent your government's position. You're there to represent
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: his interests and can now effectively communicate that. Then the
• 43:54
  Speaker 3: other side, to the diplomatic community, that's a little more
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: on the unknown side, at least for the average I
• 44:00
  Speaker 3: get this. The diplomatic community also alerts each other to
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: the challenges coming down the pike. Wake up, this is
• 44:10
  Speaker 3: where the challenges are coming. This is where the pressure
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: points will be. Be alert, set yourself up, don't be
• 44:18
  Speaker 3: taken off guard and some respects Mondo. That's very much
• 44:22
  Speaker 3: what I've been engaging in. Here's where the pressure's coming.
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: I'll give you. I'll give you one example. Some people
• 44:29
  Speaker 3: might think this is just crazy, and I totally get that.
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: So last year I met the Parliament to World Religions
• 44:35
  Speaker 3: and our little team is there. Great people, great people,
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: and I'd love to see bus loads of Christians come
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: to the Parliament to World Religions. Come with me next
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: time and just interact, walk around, have conversations. You don't
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: need to come there with bullhorns and picket science and
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: reinforce the erroneous ideas they have about you. Please don't
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: do that, but come with grace and truth and have conversations.
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: And that's what we've been trying to do. We go
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: to their workshops, We go to the lectures because this
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: is a big part of trying to understand.
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: How change again demons. These are teachings.
• 45:08
  Speaker 3: So we went to a workshop on psychedelics and the
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: Christian community. Richard Rohre is there. We have representatives from
• 45:17
  Speaker 3: from somebody I can't remember the person's name, who's from
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: a seminary. This huge discussion about how to integrate psychedelics
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: into the Christian community at an institutional level, at the
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: realm of clergy services. Can we how can we bring
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: this into seminaries, How can we bring this into the
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: realm of spiritual healing? Because there's this integration of health
• 45:45
  Speaker 3: and mental health and psychedelics, and there's there's a dynamic
• 45:49
  Speaker 3: that's taking place, and now how can we bring this
• 45:51
  Speaker 3: forward and land this in the heart of Christendom? Okay?
• 45:56
  Speaker 3: It's a hard, big conversation. And then two weeks later,
• 46:00
  Speaker 3: I'm at burning Man and myself, Brian and Audrey, we're
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: at another Christian camp. I'm not going to give the
• 46:08
  Speaker 3: name of the camp because it has a bad name
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: in it and it's not Christian. I'm in my estimation
• 46:14
  Speaker 3: it would be land really solidly on the far left
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: of progressive Christianity, Okay. And the workshop is on Jesus
• 46:23
  Speaker 3: and psychedelics. And now two weeks before that, i am
• 46:27
  Speaker 3: at the Parliament. I'm hearing the institutional arguments being made
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: to bring it in at a more formal level within Christianity.
• 46:35
  Speaker 3: Here at this workshop at burning Man, I'm hearing from Methodists,
• 46:39
  Speaker 3: and I think there's a Baptist and Presbyterian ministers and
• 46:43
  Speaker 3: a whole group of people who are now giving personal
• 46:46
  Speaker 3: justification for how you use psychedelics as a Christian. Now
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: we feel Jesus. Now we can feel a gopy love.
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: Now we see scripture through a whole different lens. And
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: so hm, I'm getting it out from two angles, the
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: institutional side and the justification of it. Wake up, Church,
• 47:05
  Speaker 3: something's knocking on the door, and it's really important. I
• 47:10
  Speaker 3: study psychedelics. I've never done psychedelics. I can't say I'm
• 47:13
  Speaker 3: experienced with that. Don't need to be no, no, thank you.
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: But there's a worldview attached to it that's very serious worldview.
• 47:21
  Speaker 2: Yes, I mean it starts with the worldview first.
• 47:24
  Speaker 3: Absolute, and then it reinforces that worldview. And I do
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: talk about that in the book. And so here we go.
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: It's knocking out the door of Christianity. It's knocking, and
• 47:35
  Speaker 3: now it's starting to knock on our door. How is
• 47:37
  Speaker 3: the church going to respond? What arguments? What positions can
• 47:41
  Speaker 3: we begin to take? What headges are we already putting
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: in place as we see this new message come forward.
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: I teach a modular course at a small Bible college.
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: It's called Miller College of the Bible, Wonderful People, Southern Saskatchewan.
• 47:57
  Speaker 3: It's out in the middle of nowhere, truly out the
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: I live nowhere, and I've taught this modular course now
• 48:04
  Speaker 3: for ten years on secular ant pagan trends, and the
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: first few years I've never had to bring up psychedelics.
• 48:10
  Speaker 3: It was something I've been working with in terms of
• 48:11
  Speaker 3: doing the research, trying to understand the world of the implications,
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: the history, all that goes into it. But in the
• 48:17
  Speaker 3: last oh golly, maybe four or four times or so
• 48:21
  Speaker 3: that I've done the class, I've had students because now
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: I have to bring it up. Now it's already in
• 48:24
  Speaker 3: my curriculum because it is part of the book, and
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: my book is part of that curriculum, and I bring
• 48:29
  Speaker 3: it up, and inevitably I have students coming to me going, yeah,
• 48:35
  Speaker 3: my family, my friends, it's in my youth group. You know.
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: It's not now not being sold so much as as
• 48:44
  Speaker 3: this is something recreational. This isn't this is spiritual? Yeah,
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: there's right, right, there's more of a of a spiritual,
• 48:55
  Speaker 3: more of an experiential sense of I can now feel
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: my Christianity or I can whatever this is I can
• 49:01
  Speaker 3: feel it. Let's quit mistaking dopamine and adrenaline and serotonin
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: and orphins for the for the spirit. I'm saying that
• 49:12
  Speaker 3: on a whole bunch of levels.
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's interesting to me that the average person think
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: about going back to your parliamentary experience there at a
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: seminary level, is you know, you think about the average
• 49:26
  Speaker 2: person that would be a Christian that maybe they're relatively
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: new to being a Christian or ignorant of a good
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: biblical doctrine. The temptation comes, hey, there's a new trend
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: you know, to be uh, you know, to use psychedelics
• 49:40
  Speaker 2: to experience again, going to experience. Stan always wants us
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: to have. He wants us to rely on our feelings,
• 49:45
  Speaker 2: our emotions, and our experiences rather than the truth, right,
• 49:48
  Speaker 2: which doesn't change where our emotions will. But and the
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: average person will be like, oh, well yeah, but my
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: understanding is that that that's bad. And then the response is, well,
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: was that really what God's word means? Right? Going back
• 50:03
  Speaker 2: to Genesis three, right, And so then what happens is
• 50:06
  Speaker 2: Satan is pretty savvy, as we know the doctrines of
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: demons for seventy four that now they've created this whole
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: level of the second thing you mentioned justification, that is
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: an argument of why the Bible doesn't say what we
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: thought it said, and then it brings So you have
• 50:24
  Speaker 2: this argumentative justification of our twisting of scripture, which Satan's
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: good at, no doubt twisting the words. And then the
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: person's like, oh well, okay, if the authority of scripture
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: is what they think gives me the justification, then sure,
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: I'll try it.
• 50:40
  Speaker 3: Right. And we're prone to those fads. We're prone to
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: chasing the experience. I'm not opposed to experiences. I'm not
• 50:48
  Speaker 3: opposed to feelings. We're built that way. Yeah, exactly, which
• 50:51
  Speaker 3: is wonderful. We're built to have dopamine and serotonin and
• 50:54
  Speaker 3: all the incredible neurochemical systems that we have. God designed
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: us this way. But please do not mistake that as
• 51:02
  Speaker 3: truth truth. Do not make that your foundation for what
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: is true and for who is true. That's where we
• 51:09
  Speaker 3: run into problems big time. And so we'll chase the feeling. Hey,
• 51:13
  Speaker 3: we chase the fat.
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: Well, because we can't do I can be confused about scripture, sure,
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: but if I have a I was just bring this
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: up because when I was in Tahoe. I was interacting
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: with a gentleman who was a paoti and he's like, oh, no,
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: this is amazing. I'm talking to angels and these spirits
• 51:31
  Speaker 2: are telling me and they've helped me overcome my anger
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: because I've had anger issues forever. But they when I
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: do payote that they're teaching me how to overcome my anger.
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: And therefore clearly that's good. So goodness for him was
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: based on this experience that he had and on getting
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: a grip or a victory so to speak, over this
• 51:53
  Speaker 2: anger issue. And I'm like second eleven man, Satan will
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: appear as an angel wide or in his ministers, as
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: appearances of righteousness if they can, if they can hook you,
• 52:03
  Speaker 2: but they do it under the cloak of righteousness, helping
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: if they can help it. Jesus it right. You can
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: gain the world right, which would be gained victory over alcoholism, anger,
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: but you lose your soul, You've lost everything exactly. They'll
• 52:16
  Speaker 2: help you get over anger if they can get your soul.
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: Oh absolutely, absolutely, yes yes. And so I mean for
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: us in the Christian community, we're susceptible to this as
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: anything else. I mean, so we chase and I get that,
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: and when I'm going to burning Man, I'm actually dealing
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: with people who are in many respects mirroring or maybe
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: we're mirroring them, mirroring the church and our constant.
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: Pursuit ye seekers, yeah, right, pursuits.
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah. We have God's word, we know what he says.
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: Do we trust him? Do we trust him to be true?
• 52:49
  Speaker 3: Or do we continue to seek and seek? All right,
• 52:52
  Speaker 3: I'm going to do the enneagram. I'm going to chase
• 52:55
  Speaker 3: that until the feeling is gone. Then we're going to
• 52:58
  Speaker 3: maybe chase holy yoga until the feeling is gone. And
• 53:02
  Speaker 3: I'm gonna call these things like mountaintop experiences. Then we're
• 53:06
  Speaker 3: gonna chase some form of worship or I'm gonna chase
• 53:09
  Speaker 3: a feeling in the church. When we're all engaged in
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: worship together, it's a great feeling. But that's a feeling.
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: It's a feeling.
• 53:16
  Speaker 3: It's a feeling, right, So we're gonna chase, and we're
• 53:19
  Speaker 3: gonna chase, and we're gonna chase because it feels good
• 53:23
  Speaker 3: until it doesn't, and we chase some more. I go
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: to Berniemann and same people, same thing. We're gonna keep chasing.
• 53:30
  Speaker 3: We're just gonna keep chasing. I've got good friends who
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: come out of the New Age movement, out of the
• 53:35
  Speaker 3: realm of occultism, psychedelics all the rest, and they're like, yeah,
• 53:40
  Speaker 3: we just we chase. We're always chasing because in that moment,
• 53:46
  Speaker 3: in that moment when it just clicks and you venture
• 53:48
  Speaker 3: that state that Okay. I'm an old time sport biker.
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: I love riding motorcycles, all right, and I love adventure.
• 53:55
  Speaker 3: I love that kind of stuff. I'm getting old already.
• 53:57
  Speaker 3: I'm not near as fast as I used to be.
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: But you enter a flow state, Yeah, okay.
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: I grew up raising the quads. I get it.
• 54:05
  Speaker 3: It's timeless, it's rich. Uh, it just clicks, and it's
• 54:09
  Speaker 3: just like wow, how did I get there? And you're
• 54:13
  Speaker 3: just it's it's really an incredible thing. And now God
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: has wired us this way, but now we chase it,
• 54:20
  Speaker 3: or we chase the equivalent of it. Even within our
• 54:23
  Speaker 3: spiritual lives, that sense of this was a rich experience.
• 54:27
  Speaker 3: This is where God has to be, has to be. Hello,
• 54:31
  Speaker 3: what else could it be? So we also in the
• 54:35
  Speaker 3: Christian community run the danger of emulating what the culture
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: has been chasing for millennium. We all do this because,
• 54:41
  Speaker 3: and this is really important, we are sharing a common
• 54:44
  Speaker 3: human experience.
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 54:46
  Speaker 3: The difference though, is are we grounded in Jesus Christ
• 54:50
  Speaker 3: and the author of life? Are we chasing after something?
• 54:54
  Speaker 3: Which is it? Are we trusting? Are we still seeking?
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: And I think, I think that that is the great question.
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: And I think Satan. You know, I wrote I wrote
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: a study guide and commentary on the screw Tape Letters
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: by C. S. Lewis, and I spent years delving into
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: the nature of temptation and uh and what scripture has
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: to say with it again you know, against it? And
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: you know, I again a big, big book over over
• 55:25
  Speaker 2: a thousand scriptures that I referenced. But it was amazing
• 55:27
  Speaker 2: to me that if I was to summarize, I would say,
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: there's two main things of all this, And one is
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: the questioning of the word of God, which is true
• 55:39
  Speaker 2: that the word of God is the answer. But the
• 55:40
  Speaker 2: second thing was the ways in which Satan most of
• 55:44
  Speaker 2: the time again it was it just both of them.
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: Are these are the two pillars of temptation? Questioning God's
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: word and encouraging us to rely on our experiences or emotions.
• 55:53
  Speaker 2: Because when somebody has this experience like this gentleman is
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: selling you he's got this experience with the peote and
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: there I can't take that away. I can't tell him
• 56:01
  Speaker 2: it wasn't true. Exact it was, and so, but the
• 56:04
  Speaker 2: reliance on those experiences at the expense of the clear
• 56:08
  Speaker 2: teaching that's properly interpreted of the scripture. I was like, well,
• 56:12
  Speaker 2: I'm not denying your experience, and you felt a certain way,
• 56:16
  Speaker 2: you've overcome this, but the Word of God says this.
• 56:19
  Speaker 2: So at the end of the day, what trumps what
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: well for many people, their experience then looks at the
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: scripture and says, well, now I need to reinterpret scripture
• 56:28
  Speaker 2: to match my experience. And that's where ultimate spiritual warfare
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: comes down to.
• 56:34
  Speaker 3: Absolutely absolutely. Now we've taken the theoretical and we put
• 56:38
  Speaker 3: into some practical application, but in the wrong way. Yep,
• 56:42
  Speaker 3: I totally agree, and I really think that that let
• 56:46
  Speaker 3: me rephrase that. I say that word a lot. I
• 56:49
  Speaker 3: think I think, no, I know and you know this too,
• 56:53
  Speaker 3: that this is an issue inside the church that we
• 56:55
  Speaker 3: really need to wrestle with.
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and it comes again, it comes back to what
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: I think is, you know, the misinterpretation of scripture. I mean,
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: anybody can quote a scripture as we know. Again, we
• 57:06
  Speaker 2: go to Matthew four, you know, Satan tempts him, Jesus responds, Well,
• 57:11
  Speaker 2: the next one, Satan tempts and Jesus responds by scripture.
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: And then Satan's like, oh, I can do that too,
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: and he quotes Psalm ninety one right, right, So now
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: he's quoting scripture.
• 57:20
  Speaker 3: Yes, yes, And You're like, yes.
• 57:22
  Speaker 2: So Satan has no problem quoting scripture, but he misinterpreting
• 57:26
  Speaker 2: it right, and and then throwing it back and she's like, oh,
• 57:29
  Speaker 2: I can play that game. Sure.
• 57:30
  Speaker 3: Exactly before we we we began this.
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we're wrapping it up here, but this we could
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: go all day.
• 57:39
  Speaker 3: But yeah, So before we began this conversation, I was
• 57:43
  Speaker 3: showing you some images from a pagan event had been
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: been to a number of years ago, and a specific
• 57:50
  Speaker 3: ritual called the Marriage of Heaven and Hell. And I'm
• 57:53
  Speaker 3: there just an observer and explained all that to you,
• 57:55
  Speaker 3: and I showed you some some some pictures from that
• 57:58
  Speaker 3: in that ritual, and this for the for the point
• 58:01
  Speaker 3: of your audience. In that ritual, we had a Christian
• 58:05
  Speaker 3: mystic dressed with his robes standing in his circle of power.
• 58:10
  Speaker 3: And in his circle of power were written the names
• 58:12
  Speaker 3: ad and ee Elohem yahweh alfin Omega biblical terms, biblical terminology.
• 58:19
  Speaker 3: On the other side of the room, it's like a
• 58:21
  Speaker 3: cage match. On the other side of the room. On
• 58:22
  Speaker 3: the other side of the of the cage was a
• 58:26
  Speaker 3: Luciferian in his circle of power, and he had done
• 58:30
  Speaker 3: things that cause himself to bleed out during his ritual.
• 58:33
  Speaker 3: It was a blood ritual, and yeah, it was pretty intense,
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: there's no question about it, very intense. What I found
• 58:41
  Speaker 3: interesting and what really caused me a level of angst
• 58:47
  Speaker 3: and a certain amount of fear that started to rise up,
• 58:49
  Speaker 3: There's no question, was when the Christian mystic is and
• 58:54
  Speaker 3: this is an hour long ritual, Christian mystic is using
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy
• 59:00
  Speaker 3: when he is bringing in theological truths and knowledge into
• 59:06
  Speaker 3: the ritual to conjure up a very specific demon. The
• 59:09
  Speaker 3: demon did not appear. Neither did the demon appear for
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: the Luciferian who tried to conjure his demon. Nothing happened,
• 59:18
  Speaker 3: but it kind of blew me away. He's using theology,
• 59:22
  Speaker 3: he's using God's word.
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: He's not a Christian, but he's using God's word, like
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: Satan's not a Christian, but he's using.
• 59:28
  Speaker 3: Becausing God's word bingo. And it's like you're trying to
• 59:31
  Speaker 3: use this as a fulk crum of power for something
• 59:35
  Speaker 3: that is dark and unholy. Hmmm. Wow, And yeah, I'll
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: go back to the issue real quick of that fear
• 59:43
  Speaker 3: that's rising up inside. And and because I don't want
• 59:49
  Speaker 3: to see demons, I'm not there for that. Some people
• 59:52
  Speaker 3: might say, well, why are there to begin with? Well,
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: because I research researchers.
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: Let's let's just to take a clarity. So you're sitting
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: there and you're you're fine, you have peace in your heart.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 2: You know, you're there on a mission investador. But then
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: as the thing progressed something, you're starting to feel something.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 3: Well, there's yeah, especially when the Christian so called Christian
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 3: mystic is giving.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: His incantation or whatever it is, right.
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 3: Right, that's there's fear.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 2: So fear starts building up.
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 3: This fear is yeah, yeah, okay, I'm uncomfort and I
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 3: should be uncomfortable. Okay, there's a difference all between being
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 3: uncomfortable and being fearful. And now fear is starting to rise.
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 3: And I believe it was the Holy Spirit that reminded
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 3: me that every need will bow, every need will bow.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 3: Every Wickan and witch and Luciferian in that room, every
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: pagan in that room will bow. Every entity that they
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 3: venerate will bow. Every need will bow. You bow and love.
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 3: They bow in judgment. You want them. You want the
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 3: people in the room to bow and love as well. Ultimately,
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 3: that's what you want. My friend Bob Worley, who comes
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 3: with it to me with Bernie Mann, says it very aptly.
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 3: He said, when he's having interactions, he's like, you're my
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 3: brother and Adam, I want you to be my brother
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 3: in Christ. So you want to see a change of heart.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 3: And ironically, so many of these people come out of
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 3: a Christian background, most do. It's really interesting. But that
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 3: fear now has has has caused a situation where where
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 3: again the Spirit is telling me every knee about which
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 3: is just nothing more than an affirmation of Scription ten,
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 3: just affirmation of scripture. And it hits me, why are
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 3: you afraid? You bow in love? They bow in judgment?
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 3: Why are you afraid? Carl Tiker? Why are you afraid? Mando?
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 3: Why are we afraid. Why are we so afraid of
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 3: man but have so so little regard for.
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 2: God, our very caring father and Savior.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. So those are the things that just you know,
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 3: kind of it's raw and it bombards you.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 2: And so at that moment when you replaced these feelings
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: and these lies with the truth of Scripture, it.
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 3: Was wonderful what happened. Yeah, peer was gone.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 2: Fear was gone.
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: Peer was gone. I sat there, I knew, Yeah, I
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 3: know what I'm supposed to do. Yep, I know why
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 3: I'm here. I knew I was there before I ran
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 3: entered the room. And then all of a sudden, that
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: that moment when it was like and then all of
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 3: a sudden, that's gone because you realize, oh, truth has
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 3: not replaced your fear.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: Yep, and the feeling and that again it goes back
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: to spiritual temptation. You have the truth of God. And
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: when we get caught up, it's generally because we have
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: a misundersetting of Scripture. So we sin, or we get
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 2: roped into a feeling or an emotion that causes to sin. Again.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: It could be lust or or love or whatever anger,
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 2: whatever those are right. And yet that again That's what
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 2: I found was the key thing in spiritual infortation in
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: the script letters. And here we are and so you know,
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: as we wrap up, I mean, this has been tremendous,
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: you know for me, you know, talk, share with share
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: with the audience. Where can people know more about you
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: and your particular Game of God's book? What other materials
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: do you have for people to be equipped?
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 3: Ultimately? Sure the book you can actually get it through
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 3: prophecy watchers. You folks carry it, which I'm thankful for.
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 3: You can find it on Amazon. You can read excerpts
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 3: of it at Gameofgods dot ca a. That's my website
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 3: for Canada, Yes, the Game of Goods dot And for
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 3: a while I I edited an online magazine called Forcing Change,
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 3: looking at those philosophical, religious, political forces of change, which
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 3: is why it was titled Forcing Change in case people
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 3: are wondering if I'm trying to force change. No I'm not. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 3: you know, And I ran with that magazine. It was
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 3: an online magazine for nine years. I eventually had Shelvet
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 3: to write the book because I can't do everything. And
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 3: so if people want they can go to foresee change
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 3: dot org and the archives are all there. The material
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 3: is still as relevant today as it was when it
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 3: was written, and you're going to find other articles, there's
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 3: other reports. It's free, just sign up and data mine
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 3: all the information of got on it.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but probably more relevant now because you know, the
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 2: these worldviews don't change in the sense of their fruition.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 2: That that changes and where you see more of it
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 2: more being implemented because of a lack of the boical discernment, for.
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 3: Sure, But the worldview remains.
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 2: The world remains right.
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 3: So to the books, to the books where it kind
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 3: of goes. It's a reference book. It's not necessarily meant
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 3: to be read end to end if you want, you can.
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 3: I've written it that way too, but you can actually
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 3: poke anywhere into it and start digging. So it's really
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 3: a survey and again I use this as a text
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 3: for my class. It's a survey of the cultural, intellectual, spiritual,
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 3: religious change that includes politics from modernity to what I
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 3: call the Age of re Enchantment, which is really post postmodernity. Yeah,
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 3: we could call it Romans one.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly. You know, before we depart here, you know,
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 2: the the change that we've seen in the culture. Really,
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: I would say super obvious, you know, from twenty fifteen
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 2: on as it relates to even you know, gender confusion,
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 2: other the wokeness, the you know, the the the more
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 2: overt nature of Super Bowl halftime shows that are very demonic,
• 1:05:35
  Speaker 2: and other things we see again the left, just this
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 2: the very far wokeism, all this stuff, all these isms, right,
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 2: these are arguments do they would you say that they
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 2: are doctrines of demons that are that have a political
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 2: the I know that the politics can help them implement them. Again,
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 2: where do you see now? Well, you're you're I think
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 2: your Canada is probably a little farther ahead in some
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 2: of these things that we are. But yet we see
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: where it's going even politically. These are movements, right, So
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 2: politics isn't neutral, No, there is a there is a
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 2: worldview that's guiding them, which again ultimately would be a
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 2: doctrine of demons kind of where do you see things going?
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 3: And what's the power of Okay, can I let me
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 3: back up. I'll just add another layer to this as
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 3: one of the slides in my class. So religion, whichever
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 3: religion you're part of, religion informs your philosophy, because philosophy
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 3: is nothing more than the struggle of man trying to
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 3: understand his world. Philosophy informs culture, art, social social arrangements
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 3: that then informs politics. And if it's wrong from the beginning,
• 1:06:59
  Speaker 3: if you're religious worldview is wrong, your philosophy is going
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 3: to be out of kilter, your culture is going to
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 3: be already starting to spin in a wrong direction, your
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 3: politics will land in a wrong place. And sometimes, in
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 3: the case of the Soviet Union, the politics becomes the
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 3: faith itself. Okay, And so we have to understand that
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 3: there is a complex but very very important line between
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 3: religion all the way through to politics. And I think
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 3: as Christians as we're now, we see a worldview class
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 3: all around us. We're watching it on social media all
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 3: the time. Absolutely, we can't be blind to that. We
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 3: have to see it for what it is. Let's take
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 3: our scripture seriously. Let's be students of history. How do
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 3: I say this gently, Wow, wake up, wake up people,
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 3: wake up. Not to the sense of oh, this is
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 3: what the elites are doing. All that is is is
• 1:08:11
  Speaker 3: window dressing behind the worldview.
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 2: The stronghold, right, this is this is what the scripture
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: uses for stronghold. It's right, it's a it's a. It's
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: a it's a viewpoint, it's a it's an idea. It's again,
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 2: it's it's not like, oh, there's a whole bunch of
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: demons gethered over now, this is this is in the
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 2: realm of again thoughts and ideas as we've read.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 3: Right, So let's be ambassadors. Yep, let us be ambassadors.
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 3: We are legally and officially representing Jesus Christ. We know
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 3: his word, we understand his word. We want to properly
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 3: apply his word. Let's understand the culture we find yourself
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 3: find ourselves in and know looking up memes on Facebook
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 3: is not research. Sorry, Throwing memes back and forth each
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 3: other is not spiritual warfare.
• 1:08:59
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 1:09:00
  Speaker 3: Sorry, Let's do real homework and really have a grasp
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 3: that's what an ambassador would do. And then do all
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 3: that so that you can effectively communicate the King's message.
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 3: That's what right from politics, back through culture, back through
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 3: philosophy all the way to religion.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 2: The solution what you just said, The solution is to
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 2: communicate the King's message, which is the properly understood word
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 2: of God.
• 1:09:23
  Speaker 3: Right, And it's not by us forming new political parties.
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 3: It's not by us engaging in the political spe spectrum
• 1:09:29
  Speaker 3: from we're gonna now we're going to take over America
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 3: or take over Canada. No we're not, we're not. We're
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 3: dealing in the realm of what it's true and who
• 1:09:38
  Speaker 3: is true.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 2: Amen to that. Carl, what what a what a great
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 2: way to end this. Appreciate everybody listening today and uh,
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 2: lots of good stuff here and be on the lookout.
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 2: I mean I would say the key what I see
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 2: too as well. The last parting words is the first
• 1:09:54
  Speaker 2: thing that Jesus said as we approached it into the age.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 2: One of the greatest defining factors of the end of
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 2: the Age is that he says, do not be deceived again.
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 2: And this deception again comes through words, it comes through ideas,
• 1:10:06
  Speaker 2: it comes through worldviews, and we know that's one of
• 1:10:09
  Speaker 2: Satan's greatest things. And so discernment. That's my prayer for
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 2: all of you, myself as well, that the Lord would
• 1:10:15
  Speaker 2: continue to give this discernment through his scripture and through
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 2: the power of the spirit. So Carl, thanks for being here,
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 2: Thanks everybody for listening today, and we will see you
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 2: next time.
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: Greetings from the Prophecy Watchers podcast. I'm Karen and I
• 1:10:29
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