Latest / Clearly Hormonal / Ep 21: The Perfect Storm: Parenting through Puberty & Perimenopause with Kianna Carter, LICSW

Transcript

Ep 21: The Perfect Storm: Parenting through Puberty & Perimenopause with Kianna Carter, LICSW · Clearly Hormonal

• 0:01
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Welcome to the Reset Recharge podcast with your host, Dr.
• 0:05
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Komal Batia, a board certified endocrinologist, internist, and obesity medicine specialist.
• 0:11
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: This podcast is focused on empowering women's health and aims to help you reset your understanding of your metabolic health.
• 0:18
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And recharge the conversations you are having with your healthcare providers.
• 0:22
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: While I am a physician, this podcast is purely for educational purposes.
• 0:26
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: No individualized medical advice is being given on this podcast.
• 0:30
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: If you do find information that is helpful, please discuss it with your healthcare provider at your next visit.
• 0:40
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Hi everyone.
• 0:40
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Welcome back to Reset Recharge.
• 0:42
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I'm excited to introduce our special guest for today, Kiana Carter, who is a licensed, independent clinical social worker with over a decade's worth of experience in behavioral health.
• 0:53
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: She specializes in adolescent and young adult mental health and is currently the Youth Engagement Services program clinical manager.
• 1:01
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: That is a mouthful.
• 1:04
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: At Mary Bridge Children's Hospital in Tacoma, Washington.
• 1:07
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: She also has a private practice therapist and I've known Kiana for a few years now on a personal level as well as professional.
• 1:15
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And I'm really excited to have her here today to talk about how we navigate.
• 1:20
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Menopause while our kids are going through puberty, and this is a time where hormones are all over the place.
• 1:27
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: They're colliding with each other within ourselves.
• 1:30
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And it can be really hard when you are a woman who's going through perimenopause and menopause and then also trying to parent a child who is going through similar changes, but you really don't necessarily have.
• 1:42
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: An even playing field or even an understanding of what the other person is going through.
• 1:46
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So Kiana is here to help us demystify that.
• 1:49
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So thank you for joining us.
• 1:50
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, thank you so much for having me.
• 1:52
  Kianna Carter: I'm excited to be here.
• 1:54
  Kianna Carter: And I think that this is a really important topic to dive into.
• 1:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 1:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: How can you share a little bit about your clinical background and what led you to focus on both adolescent and women's mental health?
• 2:05
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, so most of my clinical background up until I went into medical social work was rooted in community mental health.
• 2:12
  Kianna Carter: And so a little bit of like context for people who are not familiar with community mental health, you don't necessarily have the opportunity to, tailor what types of clients you're getting.
• 2:22
  Kianna Carter: It just is who, whoever walks into the clinic.
• 2:25
  Kianna Carter: So I really had an opportunity to diversify who I was seeing when I was working at that clinic.
• 2:30
  Kianna Carter: And for me, young women and adolescents were the clients that stuck out and like really resonated and aligned with my clinical focus.
• 2:39
  Kianna Carter: So I had the opportunity to be able to work with young women.
• 2:43
  Kianna Carter: Adolescents.
• 2:44
  Kianna Carter: And then that was what led my transition over to Mary Bridge Children's Hospital to continue working with adolescents in the ER experiencing behavioral health crisis.
• 2:52
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And that's like the most extreme example of what you see.
• 2:56
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And so you have this nice.
• 2:57
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Spectrum of care that you're providing.
• 3:00
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: You see people who are in crisis, but then you're also doing the day-to-day health maintenance.
• 3:05
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And the nice thing is we see that you're working across generations here.
• 3:09
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So what kinds of emotional or relational patterns are you seeing when mothers are in perimenopause and their kids are entering puberty?
• 3:18
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, I mean, it really is a perfect storm, right?
• 3:21
  Kianna Carter: Yep.
• 3:21
  Kianna Carter: In the worst way possible.
• 3:23
  Kianna Carter: We notice a lot of overlap.
• 3:24
  Kianna Carter: Like both individuals are having increased mood swings, like increased irritability, heightened sensitivity.
• 3:32
  Kianna Carter: They're shifting like sense of identity.
• 3:34
  Kianna Carter: We have moms who are transitioning into another period in their life, and we also have our adolescents who.
• 3:40
  Kianna Carter: They're being flooded with hormones and they're, it's developmentally appropriate, right?
• 3:44
  Kianna Carter: They're trying to figure out who they are in the context of the world, and they want autonomy and they're pulling away from their caregivers, and that in turn is hurting caregivers feelings sometimes.
• 3:54
  Kianna Carter: So it really is this unfortunate, perfect storm that needs a lot of compassion and I think demystifying around how to navigate it in a way that.
• 4:04
  Kianna Carter: Keeps the sanity intact within households.
• 4:07
  Kianna Carter: So it's quite, it's quite a storm to watch.
• 4:10
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 4:11
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Well we are very lucky we have people like you doing that work.
• 4:14
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: You know that I have a 13-year-old son who is just about, into the puberty and I am in that perimenopausal age range.
• 4:21
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So this is a great importance to me to hear this topic out.
• 4:25
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I'm sure there's a lot of other moms and parents out there who are trying to navigate the same thing,.
• 4:31
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I loved that you pointed out that, each life stage is different and somebody is growing into their next life stage, no matter what age they're at.
• 4:40
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So we have that, that's happening physiologically.
• 4:43
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And there's a mental emotional impact of that.
• 4:45
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: How do cultural expectations influence how women experience this dual?
• 4:50
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Role of caregiver and then self navigator through these hormonal shifts.
• 4:54
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Right.
• 4:55
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Because we haven't talked about perimenopause and menopause and the impact on women.
• 4:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: This seems like a tough crossroads for people to be able to navigate.
• 5:02
  Kianna Carter: No, absolutely.
• 5:03
  Kianna Carter: I think that that's a great point.
• 5:05
  Kianna Carter: It's challenging, right?
• 5:06
  Kianna Carter: When we think about the dual roles that mothers carry and there are some cultural considerations to take in.
• 5:12
  Kianna Carter: To account, I think a huge piece is feeling like we have to do it all and then that like residual shame comes forward when it feels more challenging.
• 5:22
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 5:22
  Kianna Carter: And so demystifying and really challenging that stigma and shame around that is huge, right?
• 5:28
  Kianna Carter: Like we name it.
• 5:29
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 5:29
  Kianna Carter: And we're able to move forward because it's normal.
• 5:32
  Kianna Carter: Like we have to normalize this in order for things to shift because we can't always do it all.
• 5:37
  Kianna Carter: And it.
• 5:37
  Kianna Carter: It shouldn't be that expectation, but I think culturally we're bumping up against that, that regardless of what you're going through, you have to still be it all.
• 5:46
  Kianna Carter: And that is just not sustainable.
• 5:49
  Kianna Carter: And that's where we see like the storm come through, right?
• 5:52
  Kianna Carter: Where it's like we're seeing an erosion and people's just.
• 5:56
  Kianna Carter: Basic wellness and ability to navigate
• 5:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 5:59
  Kianna Carter: Is a very normal part of the lifespan.
• 6:01
  Kianna Carter: It makes it more challenging, right?
• 6:03
  Kianna Carter: It doesn't have to be hard.
• 6:04
  Kianna Carter: So I think the work of de-stigmatizing this and normalizing it is a really huge step in helping moms transition a little bit more seamlessly.
• 6:14
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: That's great.
• 6:14
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And yeah, it's I think more women are finding community in that as well.
• 6:19
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yes.
• 6:19
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah, absolutely.
• 6:21
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: We're trying to talk about our experiences, whereas before it was like very siloed.
• 6:26
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: It was a very siloed experience.
• 6:27
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So you've described your work as trauma informed when women are going through perimenopause, how might past trauma be reactivated for them, especially when they're parenting teens?
• 6:38
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Because I look at my.
• 6:39
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Son and I see what he's going through and it brings back things that maybe I went through at the same time, and obviously we're different gender identities and what females, cisgendered females go through is different than what cisgendered males go through.
• 6:52
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And then the whole spectrum in between.
• 6:54
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So how do you see that as a big or a component of how to navigate this?
• 6:59
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, I mean I think that that's a huge piece, right?
• 7:02
  Kianna Carter: Like trauma, I always like to say is not something that is just healed once and then dissipates, right?
• 7:09
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 7:09
  Kianna Carter: It's something that we live with lifelong and it's not just in our conscious mind of healing.
• 7:14
  Kianna Carter: Like trauma lives in our nervous system.
• 7:16
  Kianna Carter: It lives in our bodies, and so when our bodies are having these significant hormonal changes coupled with some environmental stuff, like we're watching our kids go through.
• 7:26
  Kianna Carter: Puberty and like the natural, like progression of challenging moments in life.
• 7:32
  Kianna Carter: Again, it's a perfect storm where it's like these residual pieces of trauma are coming up for us.
• 7:37
  Kianna Carter: It's not again, I sound like a broken record, but I think normalizing that is huge too because it's not a reflection of regression.
• 7:46
  Kianna Carter: This is this, it's a normal part, right?
• 7:48
  Kianna Carter: Like trauma breaks in our system and it heals.
• 7:50
  Kianna Carter: But it's still a festering wound.
• 7:53
  Kianna Carter: And so that is going to come up and being compassionate with yourself and being curious about why that's coming up rather than going into a place of shame.
• 8:02
  Kianna Carter: And yeah, making it feel like it's a moral or values based like transgression on you is, it's not helpful.
• 8:08
  Kianna Carter: It more so is about like, how can I regulate?
• 8:11
  Kianna Carter: And like being curious about that part of yourself that's coming up.
• 8:14
  Kianna Carter: What can I do to support my nervous system as these things are coming up in real time and being able to wield that knowledge of knowing that we're having hormonal shifts and there's a lot of different pieces moving.
• 8:26
  Kianna Carter: But I think the biggest like piece is not shaming yourself in that process.
• 8:31
  Kianna Carter: It's not a reflection of your lack of healing or.
• 8:34
  Kianna Carter: Like willingness to change and grow.
• 8:37
  Kianna Carter: This is a normal part of the lifespan.
• 8:39
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So interesting.
• 8:40
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: It's so much easier to show compassion to others than to yourself, right?
• 8:44
  Kianna Carter: 1000%.
• 8:46
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah, I know I've been in that position before where I'm listening to people's stories all day and.
• 8:51
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I can extend that compassion.
• 8:53
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So I can see how that translates over to personal relationships as well outside of work.
• 8:57
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So what are some common themes that you hear from women who feel emotionally overwhelmed or disconnected from their kids during this time?
• 9:05
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: What are some common stories you're hearing?
• 9:08
  Kianna Carter: Common things that I oftentimes hear right, is just like that really short fuse that's coupled with this sense of shame or that it's something that's like very personalized to them, right?
• 9:20
  Kianna Carter: And some type of failing on their part.
• 9:23
  Kianna Carter: And that's just, it's not the case, right?
• 9:25
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 9:25
  Kianna Carter: Like we, we all have different coping mechanisms that regulate us at varying capacities, and so.
• 9:32
  Kianna Carter: I think it is huge to recognize that this is a harder chapter in our lives and we have to treat it as such.
• 9:39
  Kianna Carter: We are not on the same playing field that we have been historically.
• 9:43
  Kianna Carter: And so the tools that have served us and maybe regulated us in the past are not what they currently are current within this like capacity.
• 9:52
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 9:52
  Kianna Carter: And so I think a huge thing that I notice is just like the clashing of my child is not listening.
• 9:57
  Kianna Carter: They are pulling away like very normal developmental cues, right?
• 10:02
  Kianna Carter: And it, it's taken pretty personally.
• 10:04
  Kianna Carter: And so there's that hypersensitivity and not understanding like where our adolescent is coming from.
• 10:10
  Kianna Carter: And so I do think it is important for caregivers and parents.
• 10:15
  Kianna Carter: Not parents, moms and children, to be able to sit down and have these open and compassionate conversations with one another about we're both going through things and so how do we navigate this in a way that's compassionate and understanding and how do we like make this household sustainable
• 10:31
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: initial inability to show that grace to each other and to ourselves is so hard.
• 10:35
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So how do you help moms recognize when their nervous system is dysregulated?
• 10:40
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Because we're in such a.
• 10:41
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Busy world where we have work, we have family, we have our self-care that we're trying to do, right?
• 10:46
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Because that's everywhere.
• 10:47
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Take care of yourself.
• 10:48
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And it's so to see out of that haze of busy to even know that your nervous system might be dysregulated.
• 10:55
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I was talking to my husband after I saw my doctor last week and she said, oh, have you ever considered that you might have anxiety?
• 11:02
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And I said, no, I'm just stressed.
• 11:05
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And I came home and I told Hersh, I was like, you know, maybe I have anxiety.
• 11:09
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And Hirsh goes, maybe, and you know, my husband, he does not have a filter about that, but I was like, wow, you kept that in for 20 years.
• 11:15
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: We've been together for 20 years.
• 11:18
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: He was like, I was just waiting for you to come to that conclusion.
• 11:20
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So
• 11:21
  Kianna Carter: patient.
• 11:22
  Kianna Carter: He is
• 11:22
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: right.
• 11:23
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So patient.
• 11:23
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So we'll keep him.
• 11:26
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So, I'd love to hear how you help moms recognize that when their nervous systems are dysregulated, because case in point, it took me 20 years and somebody saying it to me for it to be even a possibility of my mind.
• 11:40
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 11:40
  Kianna Carter: Like even on your radar,
• 11:41
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: exactly.
• 11:43
  Kianna Carter: It's challenging, right?
• 11:44
  Kianna Carter: I think to your point, like we have so many like stimuli in our day-to-day life that it is challenging to be able to like really slow down and recognize and tease apart.
• 11:53
  Kianna Carter: Is this stress or is there like something more chronic and reoccurring and deeper happening?
• 11:59
  Kianna Carter: And I mean there's no easy way around like identifying some of those nervous system triggers.
• 12:05
  Kianna Carter: But there, there's some strategies, right?
• 12:07
  Kianna Carter: Like we have to.
• 12:08
  Kianna Carter: Slow down, which is really counterintuitive, particularly in our current like cultural like landscape.
• 12:15
  Kianna Carter: But it's important, right?
• 12:16
  Kianna Carter: Because I think sometimes like we get into this space where we are acclimated to a dysregulated nervous system, and that's just what we operate with that baseline.
• 12:26
  Kianna Carter: And so slowing down and really listening to your body.
• 12:30
  Kianna Carter: Somatic therapy is huge, and I love it as it relates to how trauma impacts our bodies and being able to slow down because our nervous system and our conscious mind they do not really converse, right?
• 12:43
  Kianna Carter: Like they are speaking two different languages and our nervous system doesn't understand logic.
• 12:48
  Kianna Carter: It is able to talk to us through like physiological symptoms, so like slowing down and notice.
• 12:53
  Kianna Carter: Saying are you experiencing rapid heart rate when like interfacing with certain stressors?
• 12:57
  Kianna Carter: Are you noticing increased, like irritability?
• 13:01
  Kianna Carter: Are you noticing yourself, like experiencing muscle tension?
• 13:04
  Kianna Carter: Like these are things that we have to clue into, and sometimes they're so nuanced and necessarily easily identifiable that if we're not looking for them, we're not gonna find them.
• 13:13
  Kianna Carter: And so there's a level of like mindfulness coupled with that, like somatic experiencing.
• 13:18
  Kianna Carter: That helps kind of tease that out.
• 13:21
  Kianna Carter: But I do think it is important that like those body scanning experiences happen because the body is going to let you know what's happening.
• 13:28
  Kianna Carter: You just have to be looking for it and listening.
• 13:31
  Kianna Carter: Wow.
• 13:31
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So that's very interesting because I didn't actually learn about that until very recently in my life.
• 13:36
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 13:36
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And it.
• 13:37
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Something that I've been trying to do and to your point, it can be very hard to sit in that discomfort.
• 13:44
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: It's very uncomfortable to be in that position where you are trying to pin things to what's.
• 13:51
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: What you're feeling in your body how do you help people get past, I guess that dis that initial discomfort of doing it?
• 13:57
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I think over time, hopefully it gets a little easier.
• 14:00
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Right.
• 14:00
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: But initially it sounds like it can be very, or I've experienced that it can be very hard to start.
• 14:05
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, no, it can be incredibly challenging and I think the hardest part to sit with is that a level of discomfort and wading through that is to be expected, right?
• 14:15
  Kianna Carter: Like we're getting in tune with something that is maybe not necessarily serving us and might be connected to a more core wound that we're experiencing.
• 14:24
  Kianna Carter: And so we do have to get familiar and uncomfortable with that.
• 14:27
  Kianna Carter: We've lived beside it for a really long time.
• 14:30
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 14:30
  Kianna Carter: A lot of us carry around that trauma.
• 14:32
  Kianna Carter: But to actually look it in the face and have to interface with it is a different beast of itself.
• 14:38
  Kianna Carter: And so I always like to, when I'm setting the stage of like, how do we go about this?
• 14:42
  Kianna Carter: Like incorporate some coping mechanisms.
• 14:44
  Kianna Carter: So it's like you're not going up against this empty handed, right?
• 14:48
  Kianna Carter: So like being able to, one, notice that you're getting dysregulated, whether that's like a physiological response, rapid heart rate, muscle function, increased like.
• 14:58
  Kianna Carter: Body temp and being able to do some like somatic experience type tools.
• 15:02
  Kianna Carter: There's a therapeutic modality called EMDR, and so they really focus on bilateral stimulation.
• 15:08
  Kianna Carter: So activating both parts of your brain and really being able to tell your body and your nervous system like you were safe.
• 15:15
  Kianna Carter: Because logically we know that, but your nervous system doesn't.
• 15:18
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 15:18
  Kianna Carter: And so butterfly tapping is a huge one where people sit and they tap.
• 15:22
  Kianna Carter: For a consecutive period of time.
• 15:25
  Kianna Carter: And so just some like really simplistic and create somatic tools to be able to get a sense of what it's like to experience an a regulated nervous system.
• 15:36
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah, that's So Kiana, for our listeners who may not know what e MDR is, can you tell us what that stands for?
• 15:42
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, so it is eye movement desensitization and reprocessing therapy.
• 15:47
  Kianna Carter: Okay.
• 15:47
  Kianna Carter: Okay.
• 15:48
  Kianna Carter: This modality is used very heavily with folks who have experienced post-traumatic stress disorder and just any real experiences with trauma, and it really is rooted in being able to regulate the nervous system.
• 16:01
  Kianna Carter: So it looks a lot different than like traditional psychotherapy and talk therapy.
• 16:05
  Kianna Carter: It really is targeting your nervous system and trying to help regulate it.
• 16:10
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: That's really neat.
• 16:11
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I, that was one acronym that I had not heard of, so I'll definitely be looking that up and I'll pick your brain for resources for that we might be able to post.
• 16:20
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So far we've talked about talk therapy, we've talked about somatic techniques, we've talked about EMDR, and I wanna make sure I have that linked for all of our listeners.
• 16:29
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Shifting gears a little bit, we've talked about.
• 16:31
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: The moms or the parents or the guardians in this situation who are trying to get their own nervous system regulated.
• 16:37
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So when we are looking at parenting through puberty, with your background in adolescent mental health, how do you advise parents to hold boundaries while staying emotionally in tune with their kids?
• 16:48
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Because the thing is I think nowadays we.
• 16:51
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And maybe this is not everybody, but there's almost this push to be more of a friend to your kid than a parent to your kid.
• 16:57
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And I think this is probably one of those critical junctures where they really need you to stay in that parent role.
• 17:02
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And that can be very hard because of all of these other competing things around you.
• 17:07
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, no, you are absolutely right.
• 17:10
  Kianna Carter: It's, I think it's just challenging at baseline to set boundaries with our adolescents, and then we throw in perimenopause and it's just a whole other just layer of stuff.
• 17:20
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah,
• 17:20
  Kianna Carter: I think again, right to be a little bit of a broken record, like we have to take care of ourselves and know our limitations and recognize like when we have hit those points as caregivers and as mothers, right?
• 17:32
  Kianna Carter: And knowing like when do I need to step away and then come back when I feel a little bit more regulated.
• 17:37
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 17:37
  Kianna Carter: There's.
• 17:39
  Kianna Carter: Or like missteps around, need to step away and gather yourself or to regulate before returning parenting adolescence is hard.
• 17:47
  Kianna Carter: It's just, it's hard at baseline even when you have the easiest kids.
• 17:50
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 17:51
  Kianna Carter: Like it's still difficult.
• 17:52
  Kianna Carter: They're dealing with a ton of different things and it's, I think we can all look back at adolescence and like kind of cringe at moments.
• 17:58
  Kianna Carter: We all have those standout moments.
• 18:00
  Kianna Carter: But I do think to your point, like there is definitely this cultural phenomenon of wanting to be like friends with our kids.
• 18:09
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 18:09
  Kianna Carter: And it's not that we can't like have that empathetic and like connected sense of, being connected with our kids, but we can also be firm.
• 18:18
  Kianna Carter: Firm does not mean punitive.
• 18:20
  Kianna Carter: Like we can lead with love and compassion around a boundary and.
• 18:24
  Kianna Carter: Still set it.
• 18:25
  Kianna Carter: Like an example might be, I had a teen client, I don't know, maybe a year ago when we were doing some family therapy.
• 18:30
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 18:30
  Kianna Carter: And I was working around like some boundary setting around curfews.
• 18:34
  Kianna Carter: Like an older teen.
• 18:36
  Kianna Carter: We talked about like validation, right?
• 18:38
  Kianna Carter: I understand that you're frustrated that you can't go to this party, but we had agreed upon the fact that.
• 18:44
  Kianna Carter: Your curfew is 10 and the party doesn't start till 11.
• 18:47
  Kianna Carter: And so it feels pretty clear.
• 18:49
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 18:50
  Kianna Carter: Like we can validate that that's frustrating and we can validate that FOMO is a thing right now.
• 18:55
  Kianna Carter: That's, but the boundaries still exists.
• 18:57
  Kianna Carter: And that's important, right?
• 18:59
  Kianna Carter: Because you're leading with love and not like compromising those boundaries.
• 19:03
  Kianna Carter: You're holding a child to an expectation and we're not wavering on that.
• 19:07
  Kianna Carter: Is it challenging to watch them like stomp off and slam their door and maybe whisper something a little not so kind on the way back.
• 19:14
  Kianna Carter: Absolutely.
• 19:15
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 19:15
  Kianna Carter: But I think that's the piece of being intentional as a caregiver about like your own, like wellness, right?
• 19:22
  Kianna Carter: And making sure that like you're taking care of yourself.
• 19:25
  Kianna Carter: Also validating and recognizing like this is, yeah, it is a challenging time period to be a parent and setting boundaries.
• 19:32
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: That is a great piece of advice.
• 19:33
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Do you have any tips on how parents might model that?
• 19:37
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Like emotional regulation or keeping their emotions in check and, so that they and their teens can maybe do that together?
• 19:44
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: They and their adolescent kids can do that together, and maybe I don't know what that looks like.
• 19:49
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, I mean I've been reactive
• 19:51
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: in those moments.
• 19:52
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Not my proudest moment, but I can admit it.
• 19:56
  Kianna Carter: Humans, I only parents and family sessions or like one-on-ones that like we, there are going to be moments that we slip, right?
• 20:03
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 20:03
  Kianna Carter: And I think the real work, like in those moments when we slip is like, how do we own that?
• 20:09
  Kianna Carter: And how do we like make this That's so true.
• 20:10
  Kianna Carter: Perhaps like a teachable moment, like knowing when to apologize because you're modeling behaviors that.
• 20:17
  Kianna Carter: You want to instill in your adolescent, like being able to own up when maybe you've made a misstep or done something that you're not super proud of.
• 20:25
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 20:25
  Kianna Carter: And being able to model that as a parent.
• 20:27
  Kianna Carter: Even in those moments when you're like, I shouldn't have snapped on you and like I was super reactive.
• 20:31
  Kianna Carter: That's huge.
• 20:32
  Kianna Carter: But to your point, like your earlier question, co-regulation is huge and I think that sometimes that is also how we navigate that storm is like.
• 20:42
  Kianna Carter: Being able to model that behavior so that eventually our adolescent can absorb some of that.
• 20:47
  Kianna Carter: So like the example, I love a quick Take five.
• 20:50
  Kianna Carter: I love when a conversation is just not heading in a productive direction.
• 20:55
  Kianna Carter: And modeling that as a parent and like being able to stop the conversation and saying I need to take five.
• 21:00
  Kianna Carter: And then let's resume this conversation.
• 21:02
  Kianna Carter: I just need a minute.
• 21:03
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 21:03
  Kianna Carter: To just pull back together.
• 21:04
  Kianna Carter: I wanna finish it.
• 21:05
  Kianna Carter: It's really important to me that we get to the bottom of this.
• 21:08
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, let's take five and come back together.
• 21:10
  Kianna Carter: Because that opens the opportunity too, that maybe like our kids can utilize that too.
• 21:14
  Kianna Carter: And it's not a practice of avoidance, it's a practice of understanding when a conversation is becoming unproductive and when we're reaching a place of dysregulation and having that awareness and knowing that we need to stabilize.
• 21:28
  Kianna Carter: But come back to the conversation and talk.
• 21:31
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, so I think that that's a huge one.
• 21:33
  Kianna Carter: I think too when we're thinking about like just regulation and whatever coping mechanisms we're working with, it's nice to bring our kids into the fold.
• 21:42
  Kianna Carter: Like if you are doing box breathing or you're doing like body scans, teach them, maybe do it with them.
• 21:49
  Kianna Carter: Such a great idea might like woo woo in the moment.
• 21:52
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, and I always tell my team clients like.
• 21:55
  Kianna Carter: I hear you, right?
• 21:56
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 21:56
  Kianna Carter: Like I, it's a little, out there, but.
• 21:58
  Kianna Carter: Just, just go with it and like you can be a little silly with it, but sometimes bringing'em into the fold of that practice can be helpful too, because not only are you getting an opportunity to practice that tool, you're teaching it to them and have giving them an opportunity to learn a tool that they can use out in the world at home, or whatever the case is.
• 22:16
  Kianna Carter: So co-regulation can be super helpful and I think beneficial in just like opening the door of being compassionate to one another.
• 22:25
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 22:26
  Kianna Carter: Issues.
• 22:26
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: It's really cool.
• 22:27
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Rose started elementary school here.
• 22:29
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: When I went to the first parent teacher night, they talked about how it was a social emotional learning school.
• 22:34
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Mm-hmm.
• 22:34
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And I had never heard about that.
• 22:36
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And so they were telling us this technique about how they were teaching kids to identify their feelings starting in Kinder Garden and associate them with a color and then go do an activity if they were feeling any color other than green, to kind of help them get back to their baseline.
• 22:51
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And this sounds almost like.
• 22:53
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: In parallel with that for both to do together.
• 22:57
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Right.
• 22:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I wish I'd had that tool when I was a kid and growing up.
• 23:00
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I feel like I'd be such a more functional adult, but we grew up with what we grew up with, so.
• 23:07
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah, here we are.
• 23:08
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: We talked a lot about, these hormonal shifts and things like that, and there that seems to be typical for being a teen, but what are some signs that a teen may need more support or intervention?
• 23:18
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: What are things that we can distinguish?
• 23:20
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Like yes, there's going to be emotional ups and downs, there's gonna be things where we can't connect, but what are some signs that parents can look for that.
• 23:27
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: They may need to do something more for their kid.
• 23:29
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, so I think that this is a great topic because it is incredibly hard to differentiate and tease out, right?
• 23:37
  Kianna Carter: Like what is like a pretty typical developmental sign that you know you're going through.
• 23:44
  Kianna Carter: Versus when have we entered the realm of you may need some additional supports and it's a bit more exacerbated.
• 23:50
  Kianna Carter: So we know like at baseline, like our exploring and want autonomy, they want independence.
• 23:55
  Kianna Carter: They are sometimes a little bit more irritable.
• 23:59
  Kianna Carter: Their sleep patterns might change.
• 24:01
  Kianna Carter: All these different pieces that things that we really wanna be mindful of.
• 24:04
  Kianna Carter: Is that these are temporary and situational and it's not something that's going to happen over like a long term like span.
• 24:11
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 24:11
  Kianna Carter: And it's also not going to erode at like their like daily like functioning capacity.
• 24:19
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 24:19
  Kianna Carter: So things that we wanna start to pay attention to and things that I have noticed just in the span of working with adolescents that.
• 24:26
  Kianna Carter: Are always red flags as a clinician in my book is drop in academic performance.
• 24:30
  Kianna Carter: If you've historically been a pretty, yeah, be a student and you are declining like at a significant rate, that's a red flag.
• 24:39
  Kianna Carter: Like what's happened in there.
• 24:40
  Kianna Carter: It doesn't sound like there's ever been any educational challenges.
• 24:43
  Kianna Carter: It's what's going on with that.
• 24:45
  Kianna Carter: Okay.
• 24:45
  Kianna Carter: I think another piece is like social isolation more so than that independence and like pulling away and like, mom, I don't go to the mall with you today.
• 24:52
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 24:52
  Kianna Carter: It's.
• 24:53
  Kianna Carter: It is concurrent and it's over a long span of time, and it's usually followed with apathetic mood.
• 24:59
  Kianna Carter: Like just presenting pretty like depressive, right?
• 25:03
  Kianna Carter: Like pretty flat.
• 25:04
  Kianna Carter: There's just a disconnect, loss of motivation.
• 25:07
  Kianna Carter: Maybe they're not engaging in activities that they used to enjoy.
• 25:10
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 25:11
  Kianna Carter: Dropped out of all of their sports or like extracurriculars.
• 25:13
  Kianna Carter: These are things that we really wanna pay attention to.
• 25:16
  Kianna Carter: And those are always like red flags to me as a clinician that like you have like pretty significantly gone off of your baseline.
• 25:24
  Kianna Carter: And what do we do about that?
• 25:26
  Kianna Carter: Other things to pay attention to, which I think are more normalized, like red flags and more so things that are universally like caught suicidal ideation, self-injurious behaviors.
• 25:37
  Kianna Carter: Those are the easy things to spot.
• 25:39
  Kianna Carter: It's harder to be able to tease more of those earlier signs, but again, like I always tell parents like, you need to trust your gut and you know your child.
• 25:49
  Kianna Carter: You know your child better than I do, right?
• 25:51
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 25:51
  Kianna Carter: Like you.
• 25:52
  Kianna Carter: That is your child.
• 25:53
  Kianna Carter: And so if you are getting a feeling that something fills amiss, it never hurts to seek like professional help, right?
• 26:02
  Kianna Carter: If it's really rooted in developmental, stages of change like that will be what it's gonna be.
• 26:07
  Kianna Carter: But I always err on the side of caution because.
• 26:10
  Kianna Carter: Sometimes certain adolescents can mask things really well and we don't want near misses to happen, so Makes sense.
• 26:17
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 26:17
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So it sounds almost like, there is always gonna be some degree of separation as teens pull away from their parents and siblings, but if we see it in all other aspects of life, that's really kind of big red flag that things are probably not going well right now.
• 26:34
  Kianna Carter: Yes.
• 26:35
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And I think the other thing is that teens take a lot of, while trying to get this autonomy, it feels like they may also feel a lot of responsibility for what's happening in their worlds.
• 26:47
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And so how can moms.
• 26:49
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Talk to their kids without About what they're going through.
• 26:53
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: About what's happening in their lives without making the kids feel responsible or overwhelmed.
• 26:57
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Because I think in that quest to be quote unquote friendlier with our kids, we might tend to.
• 27:04
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Overshare or talk about things that they may feel responsible for or burdened by.
• 27:09
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, no, absolutely.
• 27:12
  Kianna Carter: I, it's a hard conversation to have.
• 27:13
  Kianna Carter: And again, yeah, I think it has to be tailored specific to the youth, right?
• 27:18
  Kianna Carter: I think.
• 27:18
  Kianna Carter: That parents have to be very intentional about like addressing these conversations in an age appropriate way, but also taking into account that like your child may need more like a nuanced approach, right?
• 27:31
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 27:31
  Kianna Carter: And so I always go at it from the space of let's start with like more higher level, just context of I just want you to be informed about this and like just come at it from a lens of this is explaining some of my behavior and I want you to have this context and I want us to be, if you have questions for me and coming at it from a place of curiosity.
• 27:51
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 27:52
  Kianna Carter: And opening up the space where it is transparent, but also pretty directly reaffirming that this is not your responsibility to hold.
• 28:00
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, and I am, and I can manage it, but I want you to have this context as well, so you don't think that there's just this major shift and we can even talk about the different like stages of life that we're on, right?
• 28:13
  Kianna Carter: Like I'm going through my own hormonal changes and so are you and
• 28:16
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: yeah.
• 28:17
  Kianna Carter: I have like a humor moment of like we're, on different ends of the spectrum, but kind of experiencing similar things.
• 28:23
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 28:23
  Kianna Carter: So I really do think it is important to tailor it based upon what you think that your adolescent has the capacity to really be able to process and go from there and be open and willing to answer questions for them when it's relevant and like appropriate.
• 28:39
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Those are some great tips.
• 28:40
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I know moms who are listening in will definitely feel like they are walking away with some tools there.
• 28:47
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I, it's so hard to talk to kids sometimes.
• 28:49
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Oh my gosh.
• 28:50
  Kianna Carter: It's so, it's so challenging.
• 28:52
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: It's so challenging.
• 28:53
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: We had, it was a Ro Rose said something snarky to me last week.
• 28:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 28:59
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Or a few months ago.
• 28:59
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I can't even remember when.
• 29:01
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And I called him and I said, Hey, you know, that wasn't very kind.
• 29:03
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And he looks at me, he goes, my bad, my bad.
• 29:06
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I'm going through puberty.
• 29:07
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I'm like, you know, you're so real for that.
• 29:09
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: But also don't tell your endocrinologist mom.
• 29:12
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: It's your hormones.
• 29:14
  Kianna Carter: He's hilarious.
• 29:16
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Oh, he's a character.
• 29:17
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So now to shift a little bit to tools and strategies and things like that.
• 29:23
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: What kind of self check-ins or boundary tools do you recommend for both moms and kids to use to help prevent resentment and emotional burnout when they're going through these changes?
• 29:35
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 29:36
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Again, I think that it varies individualized to the parent and the child, so there's a whole culmination, right?
• 29:43
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I love a good weekly check-in.
• 29:45
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I think that being very intentional about like just getting a temp check with one another is huge.
• 29:51
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And this could be mom and adolescent.
• 29:53
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: It can be a whole family check in.
• 29:57
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Like, how you doing?
• 29:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Like really how are you doing?
• 30:00
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Right.
• 30:00
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 30:00
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Like how has the week been?
• 30:02
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And it's a little bit, it's a bit of a deeper dive than like when they're walking through the door after a long day at school.
• 30:07
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: How was school good?
• 30:08
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 30:08
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Let's ask, what did you do?
• 30:10
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I don't remember.
• 30:11
  Kianna Carter: I don't remember.
• 30:11
  Kianna Carter: Okay.
• 30:12
  Kianna Carter: Cool.
• 30:13
  Kianna Carter: Go do your homework.
• 30:14
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 30:15
  Kianna Carter: This is a little bit more intentional.
• 30:17
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 30:17
  Kianna Carter: And that it's a great practice to really be able to hold space for one another.
• 30:21
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 30:21
  Kianna Carter: And really do like intentional check-ins.
• 30:23
  Kianna Carter: And there are tons of resources and books around just like open-ended questions.
• 30:28
  Kianna Carter: Like what was one thing you were really proud of this week?
• 30:30
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 30:30
  Kianna Carter: What was something that was really emotionally taxing for you or challenging that you faced?
• 30:35
  Kianna Carter: This week and how did you work through it?
• 30:36
  Kianna Carter: Are you still working through it?
• 30:38
  Kianna Carter: Is there anything that I can do to be of support?
• 30:40
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, so just diving a little bit deeper.
• 30:43
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 30:43
  Kianna Carter: And normalizing that within like the framework of your family I think is huge because it fosters, right?
• 30:48
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 30:48
  Kianna Carter: Like these ongoing conversations so that when you do have to have the hard conversations or we do have to kind of check in about.
• 30:55
  Kianna Carter: You're a little bit more irritable.
• 30:56
  Kianna Carter: So am I.
• 30:57
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 30:57
  Kianna Carter: Like these aren't left field conversations.
• 30:59
  Kianna Carter: These are things that feel normal for our family structure because we're already having them.
• 31:04
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 31:04
  Kianna Carter: So I'm really big on like being proactive and like implementing those not in the hard moments and just having it be more regulatory.
• 31:12
  Kianna Carter: I love that.
• 31:13
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 31:13
  Kianna Carter: It's a, it fo fosters a safe space.
• 31:15
  Kianna Carter: Something similar to that because we have some kids who are just like, uh, like I'm not really gonna engage verbally with that.
• 31:22
  Kianna Carter: And so I've had over the past few years check-in journals, so maybe it's a big Okay.
• 31:29
  Kianna Carter: And it almost is like the sisterhood of the traveling journal.
• 31:33
  Kianna Carter: And mom writes an entry, dad writes an entry about their week and it can be like cultivated around like an open-ended question or it can just be like, this is what I'm checking in about this week, or this is maybe some things I want you guys to know.
• 31:44
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 31:44
  Kianna Carter: And sometimes.
• 31:45
  Kianna Carter: Easier to express where we're coming through.
• 31:47
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 31:48
  Kianna Carter: By written word.
• 31:49
  Kianna Carter: So that is something that I think is helpful for youth who maybe aren't as big of talkers and maybe express themselves a little bit more in depth via writing.
• 31:58
  Kianna Carter: That's oftentimes a really good intervention.
• 32:01
  Kianna Carter: I think like communication strategies is really huge too.
• 32:04
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 32:04
  Kianna Carter: And being very clear about like how we wanna communicate with one another.
• 32:09
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 32:09
  Kianna Carter: And sometimes I think it's so nuanced sometimes in families where it's like, yeah, you snapped at me, that hurt my feelings, and we're moving on.
• 32:16
  Kianna Carter: But sometimes it can be helpful to have some of those like recalibrating conversations where we're getting clear about like, how do we show up in this space with one another?
• 32:24
  Kianna Carter: And what are hard boundaries for us and where do we know when the line has been crossed?
• 32:30
  Kianna Carter: And being able to kind of set some of that context with one another.
• 32:34
  Kianna Carter: And also like it's not meant to be punitive, invite the adolescent into the conversation or some things that I say or how do I say them That like makes you feel some type of way, share those things with me so we can.
• 32:45
  Kianna Carter: So they have ownership of it, but they can also hear what you're saying too, and it's like this mutual accountability piece.
• 32:51
  Kianna Carter: So I think that that's huge is having conversations around how do we communicate with one another in a respectful and compassionate way.
• 32:58
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: That's great, because we're not always our best selves and sometimes you don't hear your tone when you're speaking to somebody else.
• 33:04
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So that feels almost like the permission to hold a mirror up to the other person and say, I love that.
• 33:10
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So, moving along those same lines.
• 33:13
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And we talked earlier about shame and guilt.
• 33:15
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: How do you guide women who feel shame when they lose it in the moment or they're not being the parent that they want to be in this season?
• 33:24
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Like how do you help them show compassion to themselves?
• 33:28
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 33:29
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 33:30
  Kianna Carter: I mean, it's the age old, you know?
• 33:32
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 33:32
  Kianna Carter: Um, it is so easy to exert compassion to others, but when it comes to ourselves, like any minor, in discretion feels unforgivable.
• 33:43
  Kianna Carter: And I think self-compassion is.
• 33:45
  Kianna Carter: An ongoing practice that like we have to be very intentional with, and it takes looking in the mirror and recognizing like I'm an imperfect human and these things are going to come up.
• 33:58
  Kianna Carter: And right now it may be a little bit more exacerbated because of like this.
• 34:03
  Kianna Carter: Error in life that I'm currently going through.
• 34:05
  Kianna Carter: So how do I show that piece of my self-compassion?
• 34:08
  Kianna Carter: Because my rule of thumb is always like shame is never going to move us in the direction of anything productive.
• 34:16
  Kianna Carter: It is going to exacerbate things and it doesn't really leave a lot of room for growth.
• 34:21
  Kianna Carter: It just leaves us in this festering place.
• 34:24
  Kianna Carter: And so when we can identify like shape is not really productive and how can I show up and be compassionate to myself?
• 34:31
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 34:31
  Kianna Carter: That's where some of the work happens.
• 34:33
  Kianna Carter: And I think too, like to my point earlier, like having those like reunification conversations, if you don't feel good about something that you've done or said, or maybe like in the heightened sense of like reactivity we own up to that and we.
• 34:48
  Kianna Carter: Try and do better next time.
• 34:50
  Kianna Carter: But it is also an opportunity to be able to model that for our children and recognize like sometimes we're gonna do things that we are not proud of and like how do we come back from that and how can we do better next time?
• 35:01
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 35:01
  Kianna Carter: Like should I have walked away five minutes?
• 35:03
  Kianna Carter: Before,
• 35:04
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: yeah.
• 35:05
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Could I
• 35:05
  Kianna Carter: have done some box breathing?
• 35:07
  Kianna Carter: Like what could we have done?
• 35:08
  Kianna Carter: And really kind of come at it from a lens of like, how, like how can I do better next time?
• 35:13
  Kianna Carter: So it's hard though.
• 35:14
  Kianna Carter: I think self-compassion is something that continues to be studied and there's no one like avenue of like really getting it down pat.
• 35:24
  Kianna Carter: It is a practice that you have to do again and again and again, and it never feels like profoundly easier.
• 35:33
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Kiana, I just wanted to thank you so much for making time, to be on the podcast.
• 35:38
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: As we kind of wind down the episode, I have a few questions to close with, and the first one is, what's the one thing that you want every mother.
• 35:46
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: To know who's feeling like she's unraveling and everything's kind of falling apart while her kid is too.
• 35:51
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: What do you want her to know?
• 35:53
  Kianna Carter: I think the takeaway for me is that I want them to know that this moment in time is not a reflection of who you are as a caregiver as a whole.
• 36:03
  Kianna Carter: And that just because you are having these small moments does not mean that like it wipes away everything that you are as a parent and everything that you've poured into your family.
• 36:15
  Kianna Carter: And so if I could give one piece of advice, and I know it's challenging, it would be to try and lead with compassion for yourself.
• 36:24
  Kianna Carter: And of course it's challenging, but I also think about as a mother myself, and I think about like how I navigate the world and how I show up.
• 36:32
  Kianna Carter: I'm always, always kind of thinking about.
• 36:34
  Kianna Carter: What is my son gonna absorb from this?
• 36:36
  Kianna Carter: And will this make him a more compassionate human being?
• 36:39
  Kianna Carter: And as mothers, oftentimes we're quite selfless in that sense.
• 36:43
  Kianna Carter: And so if you have to come at it from that direction Sure.
• 36:45
  Kianna Carter: Of like me showing self-compassion for myself is also me modeling that for my child.
• 36:50
  Kianna Carter: And so they can grow up and be a more whole human that can.
• 36:54
  Kianna Carter: Navigate that a little bit more seamlessly.
• 36:57
  Kianna Carter: And so if I can kind of break this, you know, I wouldn't even call it a generational curse.
• 37:01
  Kianna Carter: I would call it like a much larger curse that we're interfacing with.
• 37:03
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, passion.
• 37:05
  Kianna Carter: But if I can start to model that, even if it's hard, my child has a better opportunity to do that more seamlessly because I did the hard thing.
• 37:13
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: That is a beautiful statement.
• 37:14
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: So I hope a lot of women walk away with that, that sense of hope and positivity.
• 37:19
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And in the work that you do with adolescents and families or adolescents and their mothers in particular what hope do you find in that?
• 37:28
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, I find a lot of hope.
• 37:29
  Kianna Carter: I know we talk a lot about like the red flags and like really the trenches of everything, but I see.
• 37:36
  Kianna Carter: Of hope, particularly in the work that I do with adolescents and within family therapy with their moms who are experiencing perimenopause.
• 37:43
  Kianna Carter: Like there's light at the end of the tunnel.
• 37:46
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Yeah.
• 37:47
  Kianna Carter: It really is an opportunity to cultivate compassion with one another and recognize that we can go through hard moments within our lifespan, but we can do it together and we can lead with love and compassion and it just takes us both showing up, right?
• 38:05
  Kianna Carter: And so.
• 38:06
  Kianna Carter: I'm, a little bit more optimistic in that sense.
• 38:09
  Kianna Carter: And I do see like tons of work being done and I think just having a sense of community and de-stigmatizing these stages of life is huge.
• 38:18
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Thank you for the work that you do.
• 38:19
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: I know our community is better for it.
• 38:22
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And as are all of your patients, and thank you so much for sharing your knowledge with us today.
• 38:28
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Where can people connect with your work?
• 38:30
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Are.
• 38:30
  Kianna Carter: Yeah, so for my private practice I'm currently seeing adolescents, so they are always welcome to go over to Mindful Therapy Group and they can just put in my name into the search provider.
• 38:41
  Kianna Carter: And from there our admin team works with getting them connected to me.
• 38:44
  Kianna Carter: In terms of my work with Mary Bridge Children's Hospital.
• 38:47
  Kianna Carter: So we specifically serve youth in Pierce County.
• 38:51
  Kianna Carter: School age.
• 38:52
  Kianna Carter: So really I think our youngest that we've accepted is like six and so they can usually reach us through the Kids Mental Health Pierce County website.
• 38:59
  Kianna Carter: We have a very kind of basic formal drop form that they can go to and fill out for inquiry of services, but that is specific to Pierce County Youth, although we do have an extension.
• 39:11
  Kianna Carter: Have extended the model out to Kids Mental Health Washington.
• 39:14
  Kianna Carter: So different regions of Washington also have our program models in place.
• 39:18
  Kianna Carter: So I encourage folks to check out Kids Mental Health Washington as well, because it is attached to Mary Bridge Children's Hospital, and it's a great coalition that is very community based around adolescent behavioral health and caregiver support.
• 39:31
  Kianna Carter: Yeah.
• 39:33
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: That's wonderful.
• 39:33
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: And then are there any go-to resources you'd recommend for moms?
• 39:37
  Kianna Carter: I think it's gonna be specific to their regions.
• 39:39
  Kianna Carter: I'm really big on like caregiver support groups, so I always recommend folks to look at psychology Today.
• 39:48
  Kianna Carter: I don't know.
• 39:49
  Kianna Carter: Oh, that's a
• 39:49
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: great resource,
• 39:50
  Kianna Carter: but you can filter through and look specifically for groups in your area and dependent upon like insurance coverage or whatever the case is, you can kind of that.
• 39:59
  Kianna Carter: But typically there are lots of support groups in your region, so that's always a really good resource to use for caregiver support groups.
• 40:07
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Fantastic.
• 40:07
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Thank you again, and like I said before, I appreciate all of your time and knowledge that you've dropped with us.
• 40:14
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: We will link all of the resources as well as a way to connect with Kiana in the show notes for the episode.
• 40:20
  Dr. Komal Patil-Sisodia: Thanks everyone, and I'll see you on the next episode.