Latest / Share Your Fire / Share Your Fire, Ep. 3 -- How to live to be 100 (Dr. Laura Wilhelm)
Transcript
- John Verrico: Hi there, everybody, and welcome to our show. This is going to be a fantastic show today. I've got an amazing guest, Dr. Laura Wilhelm. Dr. Laura has been doing some incredible research into things called blue zones. And blue zones are kind of unique places in the world where people have a tendency to live longer. And it's a combination of things that helps them along those ways. And I've actually really interested in this because the whole concept of becoming a centenarian in this day and age is really it seems far fetched, but it is also more possible. So Dr. Laura, welcome to the show and let's talk about long life. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Love to do that, John. Thanks so much for that introduction. Yes, I as you know, I'm a global consultant. I I have written articles under the rubric of my company and the slogan is breaking global barriers to success. And I have found a signature project that I think is going to occupy me for the rest of my life because I I too am aging like everybody else. And I picked up on the research of the blue zones because we have one near where I live in Los Angeles. I I live in in West Hollywood and about an hour's drive away, there's a blue zone called Loma Linda, California. John Verrico: Well you know, that's really it's amazing to think that there's a place right in California and and near Los Angeles no less. Yes. Which is such a busy, crazy area, has you know, pollution and all kinds of issues, and yet there is an area there that is a concentration of people who have really discovered longevity. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yes, it the reason being that it this is San Bernardino. It's in a mountainous area, which many of the blue zones are, and that that protects them often from the pollution. And it it also makes makes their life pretty remote. That they they often do not travel to cities or or you know densely populated areas. They just live a very simple life in their their remote little areas. And that that tends to enhance longevity greatly. You learn to get along with the people that live there. John Verrico: imagine that. Getting along with neighbors. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: along with your neighbors supporting your neighbors support you know being looking out for everybody in the community it it becomes a value of the of the of the blue zones areas. John Verrico: It you know, those are those are values that almost tend to be lost nowadays, especially in the in the real urban areas where absolutely people wanna they wanna be more private and kinda stay to themselves because they don't want to get involved with other people. When I grew up Dr. Laura Wilhelm: A lot more stranger danger in big cities as I feel like trusting sometimes. There are dangerous people that you do have to stay away from, unfortunately. If you go to small we love Palm Springs. Palm Springs is a small resort about a two hours away from Los Angeles, and celebrities often use it as a retreat from the from the busy urban areas. And for the first time in 20 years, we went to Palm Springs and someone held a door open for me at the 7 Eleven. It's it's just yeah, it's a smaller, closer, knit, friendlier community and it's it's very enjoyable. John Verrico: There's something about the the unity of community that takes place in in small areas like that. and I remember growing up everybody was involved with everybody and it yeah, there was just so much it it was easier and and smoother. And now there's five of these areas around the world, right? There's one in Japan, in Sardinia in Italy, there's in Costa Rica, and in Greece. And the other one is there in California. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yeah. Those are the ones that have been discovered, but I bet there are others. It's just the this gentleman, Dan Butner, is sponsored by National Geographic to go and visit these areas. And those are the ones he's managed to to uncover so far. But I I would imagine Soviet Georgia is is known known for being like this too. People live to be over 120 years old. Wow. John Verrico: I was just going to say, what defines a blue zone? Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Blue zone areas where the entire population tends to divide standards of longevity. So the the average is at least ten years older than what you get in the Western countries, with many people becoming centenarians. John Verrico: That is that is staggering. So imagine I Dr. Laura Wilhelm: And they occur naturally. John Verrico: Years old. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Singapore is trying to create itself as a blue zone through government policies and and very deliberate practices, but the blue zones that are known about are occurring spontaneously. It's it's just part of the the local lifestyle and culture to to do things that are conducive to high longevity. John Verrico: So, so let's say you don't live in one of these blue zones and you would like to have a long life. Let's talk about kind of in in these blue zones, I would imagine there's a combination of geographic and topographical elements that contribute to this, but it's also people in these zones have a tendency to have certain types of life practices. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: No question yet. Dan Bootner has has isolated nine blue zone principles that seem to be common to all of these regions. And not every single practice person practices all nine, but generally it'll be six or seven. I mean, they're they're doing most of these things most of the time. And anybody anywhere in the world could practice these principles and live longer and enjoy lifestyle. John Verrico: Let's talk about what these nine principles are and nine things that we can do to to live a longer, healthier life. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Okay. Yeah. They're so what what's good about them is they're very holistic. They integrate body, mind, and spirit. So the body principles are generally plant based eating. In Greece, when you think of the Greek diet, usually it's it's heavily focused upon beans and grains and fish and seafood and and low fat dairy, occasionally red meat, but not very much. And that's what you'll also see in in in Sardinia. Yeah, small islands. Sardinia is actually a microcontinent. It has a very diverse biosphere. So you can get all all kinds of different healthful foods in it within a small region. That's one reason it's become it's become a blue zone. So definitely dietary practices are are making or breaking centenarians all over the world. And then lifestyle habits, one of the biggest recommendations I would make as a as someone that's becoming something of a blue zones expert is to get rid of your gym membership because it's actually much more helpful just to to do daily exercise. John Verrico: then then good. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Buy to a gym two or three times a week, but but around the house, be more strenuous, do more manual labor. You know, walk walk to work or take your your bicycle to to the store. Just just do things, find stairs to climb. You don't need stair climbers at the gym. You just find stairs and walk up and down them. Don't take the elevator. grow a garden where where you have to do quite a lot of yard work. My father does this. That's I think that's one reason he's made it to a very solid, you know, old age in his eighties. He he loves doing yard work. And it it it doesn't have to be anything spectacular. It's just just a matter of staying busy. John Verrico: I was just gonna say staying active. Yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Staying active and doing things that you enjoy. Yeah, John Verrico: Physically active, yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: physically active, low low grade physical activity that is also enjoyable. If you like music, turn it on around the house while you're doing your housework. John Verrico: And dance. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: And dance. Yeah. Dance and dance. Just again try try to get that joie de vive you know in integrated into your into the less pleasant aspects of life. And I think that's what you definitely see, especially in Sardinia and Icaria. People just really enjoy they they go out all night long and and do Greek folk dancing and drink wine and you know talk to each other and they they don't that they're they're more about the journey rather than the goals. They just wanna live in the moment. John Verrico: Interesting that you mentioned wine there. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yes. Moderate intake of wine apparently is seen in most centenarians. I'm a teetotaler, I don't drink drink any alcohol at all, but I might add a little bit of wine just just knowing that it probably is more beneficial. John Verrico: Well, you know, it is supposed to be a plant based diet and Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Plant based and it's homemade. It's homemade. It doesn't have preservatives. Yeah, John Verrico: Well that's true too. Yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: and you get the tannins, you get, you know, some of the the minerals and things from the the the the barrels that the wine is made in. So there there are healthful benefits to the to the wine. But a lot of it are you still there? John Verrico: Yeah, as I was saying, I may have to look into that a little more too. Try to decide which wines I want to drink. Absolutely. I'm not a big wine drinker, but I'm not a big drinker either, so we have that in common. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: many of these areas. I've spent time in Italy and Greece and also Croatia, which has a very similar climate and very similar culture. And the the homemade wines are delicious. They're very light. And they're you know, they they go down very pleasantly with the the plant-based foods. So it I think wine is definitely something I'll add to my diet. John Verrico: I I remember when I was in the Navy and I I traveled around to the Mediterranean areas and and and it's very, very true. The wines there are very different. especially go to the the you know the little local pubs and and things like that because those the the people there are making their own and they're doing them, yeah. They're they're they're growing stuff in their you know in their own gardens and that's part of the menu. It was absolutely amazing. The food was so much Better there. And I also have found too, and this is I'm not sure if this is true because I haven't sampled this. I have become gluten sensitive in my senior years. Yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: I think that's John Verrico: And I'm finding, and some people that I know who also have gluten issues here in the United States, when they go to Europe and especially around Italy and the Mediterranean zones there, when they eat the local breads and pastas there, they don't have a problem with it. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Right. Exactly. Yeah. So so in in the the documentary on Netflix that Dan Moot Bootnard made, he shows the people in I think it was Italy making sourdough bread. And apparently sourdough somehow, you know, magically reduces the glycemic load of the bread. John Verrico: Amazing. I d have noticed that when I buy gluten free breads, they're all sourdough based. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yes. John Verrico: Yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yeah, and in say in Germany, ju it not known for blue zones, but in Germany the beer and the bread are very much more nutritious. They have a lot of B vitamins because they're not heavily processed. So the the beer and the bread are very, very good. John Verrico: I have a tendency to think that a lot of the we would find a lot in the blue zones that people are not eating processed foods. Right. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Right. Not eating processed foods and not eating as much food. So the Japanese, especially, I think, are are very weight conscious. It's like you just eat until you're eighty percent full. And then if you need more food later, you can have a little snack, but you you don't you don't stuff yourself. You John Verrico: See that goes so against the culture I was growing right. It was like it was the clean your plate thing when I was a kid. You gotta finish everything. And what's interesting is in the Italian thing. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Quickly in the United States 'cause we're such workaholics. Well, that's true too. John Verrico: Yeah, and then you don't notice it and you don't appreciate it either. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Don't appreciate it and you eat too much. You you you don't wait for it to satiate you. You just you just keep eating until you're full. John Verrico: And that is a big mistake that a lot of us make. But I remember too that when when you cleaned your plate. It meant that you wanted more. If you ate it all, then you wanted more. And so Dr. Laura Wilhelm: It's associated with good behavior. It was polite to eat all the food that your relatives kept stuffing you with from the minute you left. John Verrico: I remember a fr a friend of mine from high school had come over for for dinner one time and my grandmother had made my grandmother was visiting and she had made lasagna and you know a portion of lasagna was about the size of a brick. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: yeah, absolutely. John Verrico: And he powered through the whole thing. It was I mean it was really good. You can't help yourself. You gotta finish it because it's so good. Yeah. But he powered through it this whole big brick and he goes, Boy, that was just so amazing. And he cleaned his plate and he like used the bread to clean up the gravy. And well, he really, really enjoyed it. And my grandmother put another brick in his plate. Yeah. And he went Dr. Laura Wilhelm: He loved it, have some more, right? John Verrico: Exactly. Exactly. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yes. Well, my I as we were talking about in the the pre-chat, I I I come from extended families on both sides. So my parents both came from Illinois and we had dozens, if not hundreds, of relatives that would see us every summer and they could not stop feeding us. My brother and I were the first grandchildren on both sides of the family. So we I mean, honestly, we we would eat it from you know, sun up to sundown. John Verrico: That's it. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Just because food is such a pleasurable set of memories for us that you you really have to work not to not to use it to to you know as emotional eating or you know to to fulfill other needs than than you know survival. So you have to be very careful with the programming that you receive sometimes in very affluent countries like the United States. So it's good to look at these little blue zones where people know that, you know, enough is enough and enjoy what you do have and moderate your intake and everything. John Verrico: I I I love it. So that we're we're before we run out of time, which tends to happen because we get into these great conversations, I wanna talk about some of those those other practices. You said there's nine principles and we talked about basic ones and Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Mind principle, so yeah, diet activity. Yeah, mindset. So we we talk about mindset all the time with with Jim Britt, personal development, self-help is is all about the psyche. And in the blue zones, they have that going too. That they in in Nicar in not Nicaragua, Costa Rica, they have something called the plan de vida. So if if you have a plan for your life. all of your act activities fit into that. And it it tends to push you through challenges if if you have the goals, the goals and the the principles set. And that's highly developed, especially in Japan as well. You think of the Jip Japanese as being especially diligent and and conscientious kinds of people and they they believe that yes, you know, ever everything should go according to a plan. John Verrico: And so actually having a plan for your life rather than just taking a day at a time or whatever. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Or right. And and presuming that you're going to live a long life and preparing for the different stages of life. So I've I've talked about this a little bit. Eric Erickson was a a famous psychologist, but not is not that well known in the United States. He's he's well known in Europe and he worked with Freud, but he died in its nineties and he realized that people kept evolving over time. It didn't just stop in your forties or fifties. You know, as long as you live, you're going to have have conflicts you'll have to resolve and challenges you'll have to face. And definitely in the blue zones, people know that. They're they're preparing early on for the the long haul. And I think that makes a very big difference. John Verrico: You know, there's an ancient proverb, and I think it's I think it's Chinese in its origin. but I could be wrong. So don't hold me to the Chinese origin, but but just knowing that this proverb basically says that if you live long enough, everything will happen to you. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yeah, absolutely. I think that's exactly what the Japanese foresee. They pray to their ancestors for guidance all the time. It's like it's all been done. It's all it it isn't like you're you're reinventing the wheel. You're just trying to to plug into the the wisdom of the ages. John Verrico: And and and just just knowing that, you know, at at any point in time you'll be doing well, maybe not so well, you'll be hungry, you'll be full, you'll have money, you'll need money, you'll be Dr. Laura Wilhelm: It'll go up, it'll go down, but it's the wheel of life. John Verrico: And you don't and so here's the key, I think, too, that probably is a is a high awareness factor in these zones is is the realization that because everything can happen to you, you don't really know what's going on in other people's lives at any given time. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Right. That's absolutely John Verrico: So they they kind of treat each other with a little bit more openness and generosity and compassion. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Because probably people are carrying some sort of cross and they may not be talking about it much, but the y you have a sense life is it can be pretty hard. Yeah. And that you need to be gentle. John Verrico: I think we we realize as we as we go through life, in some chapter of our life we'll be the hero of the story. In another chapter we could be the victim. And in yet another chapter, we may very well be the villain in somebody else's story. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Exactly. You you never really know what role you're going to play. And you can't completely anticipate what's to come. You can plan for it, you can hope for it, you can pray for it, but you know, life life life lives its own destiny and then you're just there to try to join the journey, I think. John Verrico: that's it. Let me ask, what other advice what advice would you give to our our listeners here? Obviously, not everybody is going to be able to move to Okinawa or Sardinia or or Costa Rica or Cario Greece or even to Loma Linda in California. You know, yeah, these are blue zones. there are some like I said, geographic and topographical things that that assist. You mentioned too, like Loma Linda is is in a mountainous area kind of above the pollution and and the craziness of downtown Los Angeles. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Right, absolutely. John Verrico: so yeah there's those kinds of of of factors, you know, with topography and and weather and all those things that are contributors. But there's these much more importantly are these nine essential principles that people really adopt. So let's just kind of quickly review the kind of those nine key things that people should perhaps adopt in their lifestyle to or to take a look at at least and evaluate to to look at perhaps having a longer, healthier life. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Okay, yeah. So we talked about plant-based predominantly diet. So predominant plant-based diet, not eating too much or too little, you know, eating eating enough, fo focusing on the more nutritious foods, eating throughout the day. John Verrico: Mm-hmm. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Don't have huge meals but have smaller meals throughout the day. And that's you usually see that in warmer climates generally. Just eating enough to to satisfy you and then moving on. Knowing that you can eat in a couple more hours and continue to nourish yourself. so breaking down your meals, having regular exercise rather than bursts at the gym or weekend warrior, you know, softball games or whatever. Stay active throughout the week. Find excuses to to add activity to your life so you can climb stairs instead of take elevators. put on music while you're doing household chores or cooking dinner. You know, just be more active doing anything that you do have to do. And then the having a great deal of family and community support. If you're not religious, you can still join civic clubs, you can do political activity, you you can engage in many different ways. It doesn't have to be religious, but but you should you should be very community oriented. And then just having that that idea that life is long and you're planning for the long haul and not not unduly worrying about the hard times, knowing that they're they're likely to pass and that that that things can improve. It's just a matter of of staying the course because you have the long-term goals in sight. John Verrico: I like that one too, the because you know there's another old saying that I heard this is it wait, actually I think John Lennon said this. it'll all work out in the end. And if it hasn't worked out, it's not the end. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Exactly. You you just have to keep going. Yeah, I think too, y you see, especially like in Okinawa, people came out of World War Two. They I mean, any any terribly catastrophic thing that ever happened happened to somebody in their family. So they they have a sense of perspective, which Americans often do not. You haven't in and encountered, you know, real grief or real loss or real choice, even in a lot of cases. And when you're faced with real challenges, it can be difficult to process that. Whereas these people have a history of you know, absolute cataclysmic horror in some cases. Right. And anything that happens to them is gonna be nothing by comparison. John Verrico: And that's an interesting perspective to to keep. I think another thing to remember too is no matter what you're facing, you're not alone in in life. And and you know, that realization can help us to get through. That's a real good mindset to have as well. And I think a lot of these people are in that. I know that my my paternal grandfather, not my Well, not my blood grandfather because he unfortunately passed away very young. But my grandmother's second husband, the guy that I knew as my grandfather, you know, he lived well into his upper eighties and and and was very much into, you know, whatever he was not afraid to ask for help. but he was also not afraid to to to lend assistance to anyone at any time. And so, you know, you get that kind of a perspective from people. No question. Realize that and that's why, you know, he made it to his late eighties. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yeah, and I think that that becomes a philosophy over time you realize that you're very content. You're content because you've accepted reality. You're content with the nature of reality. And I I think if you can get that kind of serenity, you're gonna live a lot longer. John Verrico: I love it. I love it. And and as we look forward to having a longer life and realizing that that we're not alone and but there's also the things that we can do. The staying active thing is is really important. There's so many times and and it's a combination of staying active and and the mindset, right? George Burns, who is my absolute favorite comedian who came out of Dr. Laura Wilhelm: The finder of font? John Verrico: came out of the vaudeville era. You know, he he had said, you don't have to be you can't help getting older, but you don't have to be old. And I love that because the older just means the numbers are adding up, but old is is a mindset. And Dr. Laura Wilhelm: But tremendous amount of of life lessons and s and insight and perspective that you gain because of these difficult times that that give you a sense of confidence. John Verrico: There is there's a Twilight Zone episode called Kick the Can. I don't know if you recall that one, but it's it takes place in a in a nursing home in a senior center. And one of the one of the residents notices some kids outside playing this game called Kick the Can. and he recalls, you know, being a child and playing that. And he goes, Maybe the secret of life is to never stop playing. And so he rouse up his, you know, his cohorts in the nursing home and he gets them to all go outside and and play kick the can. And of course, there's a couple of them that said, No, we're old, we can't do this, we're old. They kept they kept they they in their mind they could not do it because they were old. And the others who went out and played kick the can because they refused to accept the fact that they were old and said, Well, why not? Why can't we go out and play? They went out, they played, they played kick the can, and magically. They all became young again. Of course, that's you know not really gonna happen, but but they, you know, that it was a very telling point in that, you know, when when we stop playing, when we when we lose the wonder in life, you know, that's when we start to feel old. And in our mindset, if we say we're old and we can't do this, then you are old and you can't do that. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yeah, the it's human psychology one one. Yeah. John Verrico: Yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Either either you think you can or you think you can't, and it's always true. John Verrico: Either way you're right. Yes. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yeah, but I another notable feature of life in Blue Zones is that people stay integrated t with younger people. John Verrico: yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Like you're you're helping to raise your grandchildren and great grand grandchildren. They're t teaching you computer skills and you're teaching them math and maybe you're showing them them how to knit or something. You're you're do you know, you're exchanging knowledge all the time with the younger generation. John Verrico: that is beautiful. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: And they have that verve, you know, they they have the energy and they have the desire. And I think that that keeps you feeling much younger too. John Verrico: I love it. I think the key too, you know, and and this has come out as pretty evident from this discussion is right, don't isolate yourself. You know, w the more interaction you have with your with your fellow humans, especially people who bring fresh perspective or people who bring a a different energy, all those things come together, right? The more the more variety we have around us, the the more we're going to get out of life. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Well, it's sort of you see it with older people. It can be a knee-jerk reaction just to r to recheck youth culture. You know, you don't like their music, you don't like their clothes, you don't you know, you don't want to deal with computers. Yeah, John Verrico: My day. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: yeah. Yeah, my back in my day we, you know, rode horses. And anyway, be that as it may, you realize that that cultural progress is taking taking place at astronomical rates, it might be a good idea to try to keep up with it. And the people who can teach you are the ones who love you. And they could be younger people. John Verrico: I love it. I love it. I think I had told you in before we we started recording, I mentioned my mother who back in the early 50s was actually one of the Roquettes. And she gave up dancing and all of that stuff to get married and have a family because that was the mindset. You know, you don't do two things. And and my my father ultimately she ultimately divorced my father when I was in high school. And so the tap shoes came out of the closet and she started performing again. She went back to work. She was working in the fashion industry, selling you know, fashion clothes in a in a women's boutique and they would do fashion shows and then that went into talent shows. And so mom kind of came out of all of this again, and and the tap shoes came out and she started performing, and then she remarried. And so it all went away again. And another decade goes by, and her second husband passes away. And then nothing happened for a long time. And then at the age of 70, she met a 58-year-old singer, married a 58-year-old singer. And at 70 years old, the tap shoes came back out of the closet and mom started performing again with her husband, singing and dancing. And they were performing in senior centers where, you know, mom was kind of getting close to actually by the end of it, mom was older than half the residents. Mom was 85. And up to two weeks before up to two weeks before she passed away, she was still dancing and singing and performing. So music is very, very important. Staying active, very, very important. Staying out there, interacting with people, doing for others. All those things are really, really vital, I think, to having a a a full and fulfilling life. And Dr. Laura Wilhelm: I think it's also good to do private things that really engage you like writing and journaling. John Verrico: Yes, yes. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: yeah, wa watching movies you really like. I mean you're you know, you're you're getting the classic Hollywood films or whatever. You're really thinking about things. You know, keep keep up with the news, keep up with current events. It it just keep your mind open to to novelty and new experience. Doesn't always have to be in the community. John Verrico: A absolutely and that's really good too. Yeah. If you've got a pat Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Cultivate the inner space as well. John Verrico: Yeah. Whatever your passion is and and a lot of times it's artistic, you know, do it, you know. And you know draw, right. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: May now have time for it. Yes. Things you maybe had to give up when you were raising your family or working outside the home or you know, that were otherwise occupied. Now you can enjoy it when you're getting older. John Verrico: That's exactly it. One of the mindsets that I I try to keep in mind, and this sometimes gets me in trouble because I get involved in too many stuff, too many things. But when opportunities when opportunity comes up, I I use two words. Why not? Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Right. John Verrico: Just give it a try. Now my wife says I have helium arm. So, you know, I'm constantly getting constantly volunteering for stuff. But I think that's what, you know, is trying to it keeps me youngish. You know, I'm I'm I'm in my late 60s now. but I don't feel like I'm old yet. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yeah, I think it's better to feel a little scattered than very stagnant. You know, it's like, okay, you tried that, you didn't like it, or you didn't stick with it, or but at least you're you're making the effort to to innovate. Yeah. No question. And I I the other thing, the blue zones people, they would probably like things like miniature golf or bowling. You know, it doesn't matter, it's more social. You're not really trying to win. You're just trying to enjoy it. John Verrico: there you go. Yes. Yeah, drop the competitiveness. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Yes. Don't have to compete anymore, but you you do enjoy, you know, social sports like volleyball, things like this. John Verrico: I like that. What a wonderful mindset. It really, really is. And I think will it'll help people to have a a better, longer, happier, more fulfilling life. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Let's hope so. John Verrico: Yeah. Dr. Laura, thank you so much. I think our listeners, I hope our listeners are going to enjoy this. If somebody wanted to reach out and get in touch with you, how would it's the best way to do that? Dr. Laura Wilhelm: The the two best ways to do it are by email and on LinkedIn. So it's Dr. Laura Christon, K-R-I-S-T-A-N, Wilhelm on LinkedIn. And then my email is D-R.com. John Verrico: I will put both of those in the show notes for people so they can reach out and get in touch with you. And and then also I will put a link to anything that you would like to send me that I can push out to folks about the blue zones and the the studies that you're doing there. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Okay. Hopefully we can have some more conversations because Dan Bootner is also about our age and he's gonna keep working. Sure he'll keep keep finding these little pockets of centenarians. And he's trying to roll out some of these findings around the United States. So you may be hearing about him more. And I I am trying to get the word out. John Verrico: Excellent. Maybe we can get him on the show too. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Very good. Okay, John, great. Talk to you later. Have a great day. John Verrico: And share your fire. Thanks for sharing your fire with us today. Yeah. Dr. Laura Wilhelm: Glad to do it. Thank you. John Verrico: All right. Take care. Thanks.