Latest / Speak In Flow / Dispelling the Myth that Success Means “Burning Out” With Sarah Arceneaux

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Dispelling the Myth that Success Means “Burning Out” With Sarah Arceneaux · Speak In Flow

0:02
Melinda Lee: Hello, welcome to the Speaking In Flow Podcast.
0:07
Today I have Sarah Arsenault, who is a human resources
0:11
professional. She's been in the industry for quite some time for
0:16
over a decade. She's seen it all in human resources, human
0:20
relations, consulting in different industries. She's
0:24
currently working at Lamar advertising company. And I
0:29
brought her on because she's a dear friend, caught like a
0:33
client, a past client. And so she we work together. But she
0:37
has an amazing experience that I want the audience to hear, she
0:42
has worked through a lot of difficult challenges, and some
0:46
of you might relate to it. And so that's why I have Sarah here.
0:49
So Sarah, welcome.
0:52
Sarah Arceneaux: Thank you, Melinda. Thanks for having me.
0:54
Melinda Lee: Yeah, it's good to have you. And so let's dive
0:57
right in. Sarah, like, as I mentioned, I think you are a
1:01
powerhouse, you are confident you're courageous. And and it
1:06
didn't, it came at a price it came with a lot of work,
1:10
overcoming difficult challenges. And so what is something that
1:14
you have had to go through and overcome in your life that you
1:19
can share with with the audience
1:20
Sarah Arceneaux: For sure. So back in 2016, I was diagnosed
1:24
with multiple sclerosis. And multiple sclerosis is an
1:29
autoimmune disease that affects your nerves can give it's a they
1:33
call it the snowflake disease, because it's different for
1:36
everyone. But my issues are mostly related to muscle
1:40
tightness and spasms, pain, some blindness that comes in and out
1:45
with what's called optic neuritis and migraines,
1:48
different things like that fatigue, brain fog, all kinds of
1:52
fun stuff that is not easy to work through. So back in 2016, I
1:58
was actually in grad school online and working full time,
2:03
which is already a lot without having a degenerative disease on
2:09
top of it. And so I ended up taking a semester break from
2:14
school while working, working through what would be best for
2:18
me at work. I learned the hard way that I needed to listen to
2:24
my body, which I now listen to. But back in the day, I would
2:29
have a relapse and MS relapse, and I'd worked through it and
2:33
not and take off a couple of hours here a couple of hours
2:36
there. But I was not allowing my body, the time and the rest I
2:40
needed. And something with MS like many other conditions, is
2:45
that stress worsens it. And it's nothing against my employer,
2:49
it's my own self, I've had anxiety my whole life. And
2:52
stress is definitely something that is there. And so I was in
2:57
employee relations, back when I was diagnosed. And that's where
3:01
I started my career in human resources. And that's a high
3:06
stress environment. That is somebody potential sexual
3:09
harassment or discrimination in the workplace. And those pop up
3:14
anytime we are a nationwide company, I could get a call on
3:19
Monday night that I needed to be in New York the next day, and
3:24
have to pack up and go do an investigation so that stress was
3:27
a lot on my body. So as we grew with Lamar, we wanted to start a
3:35
centralised Professional Development Programme within the
3:40
human resources department to focus on building up our
3:43
employees and getting them better at their jobs and better
3:47
leaders. So when that position came available, it was at a time
3:51
where I was telling myself, I need to take a break, I need my
3:56
body, my body needs time to rest. My doctor was advising me
3:59
of that. So I ended up taking a three month leave of absence
4:04
from work. And in between that time I was transitioning from
4:08
employee relations to professional development. So now
4:12
I'm in professional development and can look back at those times
4:15
and say, Man, that was difficult, man, was it a great
4:19
experience, but I'm in the right place now. Because with
4:23
professional development, I'm it's extremely fulfilling work
4:28
that I get to help train others on how to be a better version of
4:32
themselves. And instead of saying you helped me hire
4:35
somebody, they're saying you train me on how to be a better
4:38
leader and you inspired me to be better for my team and that has
4:43
had such a positive effect on my well being both with my health
4:50
and my mental health. And I think it's just, it's all taught
4:55
me to listen to my body and at the end of the day, the The
5:00
better I am to myself, the better I can be for my employer.
5:03
Melinda Lee: Yeah. And what would you advise people who are
5:08
still in it like if they are know that they have a difficult
5:12
time they're feeling really overwhelmed, tired? Or their
5:15
body's saying, hey, stop, what would you how do you know when
5:19
to put the brakes on? For you? Yeah,
5:24
Sarah Arceneaux: I'm learning how to say no, is a very
5:26
difficult thing that I still have a problem with, was
5:30
definitely the yes woman I took on every project, and overloaded
5:35
myself. And I think, being new to my career, I also was like, I
5:39
need to do the most, I need to be the most I need to not stop
5:43
in order to be able to advance, which is not necessarily the
5:46
truth. When you overload yourself, you end up burning
5:49
yourself out physically, emotionally, health wise, all of
5:53
those things. And so I think taking a look at at, we'd like
5:59
to say in our trainings, it's not work life balance, because
6:01
it needs to be balanced, it doesn't have to be equal, it
6:03
needs to be balanced. So making sure that you're giving yourself
6:07
enough time to rest to have that self care, and to not take on so
6:12
much that you feel like you always have to be on is the best
6:15
way to set up, set yourself up for success. Because if you
6:18
overload yourself, and you don't recognise the cues that your
6:21
body's giving you, then you're going to end up doing worse for
6:26
yourself. And it's going to end up catching up to you
6:28
eventually, like it did with me.
6:30
Melinda Lee: And what are the cues that your body gives you,
6:33
Sarah Arceneaux: um, mine are mostly pain related. I get
6:37
muscle spasms, and I now work from home after COVID, which has
6:41
been great, and has been a lot better for me, but I have pain
6:46
and then I have brain fog that happens. So I have all these
6:49
thoughts in my head and I try and say them and it will not
6:52
come out no matter what I say or the wrong words come out. And so
6:55
when I start to get like that, I have to make sure I go take a
6:58
1015 minute break, settle myself relax completely. And then I can
7:04
I can get back to work or if it's really bad take off a day
7:08
or so to really recover. And I think those mental health days
7:13
or whatever kind of health day that you need. Taking that time
7:17
is important. Because you're not going to be your best self at
7:21
work unless you are your full self, which you can't be if you
7:25
have all of these signals of overwork going on in your body.
7:29
Melinda Lee: Do you actually wait till it's pain? And then
7:31
you stop or have you figured out a way you go through it?
7:39
Sarah Arceneaux: Usually I wait. Usually I wait for the pain
7:42
because I mean, with MS depending on on how you are my
7:46
my pain level, I don't really go under a pain level of three out
7:51
of 10. So when my pain starts getting up and up, and we're
7:55
hitting a five or six, usually towards the end of the day,
7:59
that's when I usually end up trying to try to take a break
8:02
and rest. But I've also found things that have helped me which
8:07
changing positions. So I have a standing desk, I will sit in a
8:10
chair, I will use a standing desk or I'll sit on the couch
8:14
throughout the day to mix it up. So I don't get to that pain,
8:17
that pain level to where I need to stop myself. So I think
8:22
creating those adaptations for yourself, recognising the signs
8:27
and telling yourself Oh, my stomach's hungry, I haven't
8:30
eaten because I've been working through lunch, go eat, having
8:33
those breaks for yourself are so important.
8:36
Melinda Lee: I think it's so true. I mean, I want to just
8:38
share a little bit on my mom, because she was constantly on
8:41
the go constantly at it. And I she did not listen to her body
8:46
at all. So I liked how you said that. I noticed if it's a 345
8:50
and it's getting to five, I want to stop. But there are so many
8:53
of us in our society, when we just push through it, we don't
8:56
listen to our intuition into our bodies. And then we think, Oh,
9:01
well, we'll rest late or there's no time to sleep. And then and
9:04
then and then you don't listen to those cues anymore. And then
9:07
something like this happens where your body needs to go
9:09
through something just to alarm you. And then it's almost too
9:11
late. So So I think it's important for people to be
9:15
listening and more, you know, settling their minds so that and
9:19
allowing yourself to say no to these things. What was that like
9:24
for you to say start saying no. How did you fortify that voice?
9:30
Like you had to because you're in pain. But then what was it
9:33
like to finally start to see it and use your voice like that?
9:37
Sarah Arceneaux: It was difficult. And to add to that a
9:40
little bit to my story is that I'm very close were friends with
9:44
quite a few of my co workers, one of which had told me I love
9:49
you as a friend more than I love you as a co worker and you're
9:52
not going to work here any longer not not in a threatening
9:55
way but you're not going to work here any longer if you've run
9:57
yourself to the ground. She told me that a couple of days later,
10:01
two other people told me that because I was seriously burnt
10:05
out and overworking and I you could physically on my face tell
10:10
how sick I was feeling. So I think listening to yourself, but
10:15
also listening to other people being like, we don't want you to
10:18
do more. Don't say yes. Is something to listen to, too. But
10:24
once I started saying, No, I think the biggest thing for me
10:27
was, people still like me, I'm still a good co worker, doesn't
10:32
matter. I said, No, and they're not gonna fire me. Awesome. And
10:41
I think that the biggest thing that I found is that I now would
10:46
rather say no, or Yes, I'll do that in six months, then take it
10:50
on now and then say, Oh, I didn't have time. Let me push
10:53
back that deadline, push back that deadline, because I used to
10:55
say yes, all the time, and not get things done. Super timely,
10:59
right. So now I'm able to find a better balance by spacing things
11:05
out, spacing things out for both my stress load, for getting
11:09
deadlines complete, and all of those things, and really being
11:12
realistic with what you can do in the timeframe. Because I
11:15
think that was a big, a big part of my stress level too, was,
11:19
again, trying to do the most and be the best, and overloading
11:23
myself. And putting too much on myself. It wasn't that my boss
11:28
necessarily did ask, but I could have said no, because I had more
11:31
things on my plate. So I had too many things. And that's what was
11:34
causing my stress level, not necessarily the base level of my
11:37
job. It was what I was taking on. At my job. I was doing it to
11:41
myself.
11:42
Melinda Lee: Right, right. And there's so many of us so many of
11:45
us that are just there were leaders or heart centred
11:48
leaders, we want to do the best we want to put ourselves out
11:52
there. We want to climb we want to make more money, all these
11:55
things drive us we want to prove, right? Hey, we got this
11:59
and you can and what I love what you what happened with you is
12:03
you said no. And you allow people what when you say no,
12:07
you're also allowing people to actually to show you you're
12:10
still love, you're still enough. And opportunities can still come
12:15
like if we keep on pushing and proving we're actually not
12:17
allowing for these opportunities show up for you to pace at a
12:23
good pace that is good for you and still see fruition and
12:27
results, even at your pace that you want to go on. It's
12:32
absolutely yeah,
12:34
Sarah Arceneaux: absolutely. And, and I've come to a place
12:37
where I love my job so much. I really do. And I thanks to your
12:43
your help as a speaker coach to I've started facilitating
12:48
training for Lamar advertising company, which I never in my
12:51
life would have thought that I would have been a corporate
12:53
trainer. I just never. Even though my undergrad degree was
12:56
in HR education. I just never thought that would be me even
12:59
though I I taught my teddy bears when I was in kindergarten, and
13:03
my room and all of that.
13:07
Melinda Lee: Well, I remember in you were like you're seeking
13:10
were you speaking inside, like on the RV, or you had visions of
13:13
yourself talking? Yes, you had visions of yourself speaking and
13:19
in your mind are ready. And let's talk about when you first
13:23
came to me when you were like, hey, Melinda, I'm going to do
13:26
this training for this cut for our company. And it's a big
13:29
deal. Because you're training executives, you're training the
13:32
leaders of the company, and a part of you had that impostor
13:36
syndrome. So you've done it before with your teddy bears,
13:39
and you had visions of it, but you still felt like who am I to
13:42
do this? Yep, yeah, yeah, remember that? I do.
13:47
Sarah Arceneaux: And I did trainings previously, where I
13:51
came up with a material. And I can talk all day long when
13:54
something I came up with, but we did it through the training
13:57
through Franklin Covey. So I had six hours worth of presentation
14:00
material that was not my own, which was completely daunting to
14:04
me. And when I met you all of the thoughts of I'm not going to
14:09
remember what they said they're going to ask me a question. I
14:11
don't know the answer to the Zoom isn't going to work. The
14:15
they don't, I haven't been a actual manager of a person for
14:19
very long, so they're not going to trust that what I have to say
14:22
is accurate. I had all of these self doubts going through my
14:28
head. And as I mentioned earlier, I've struggled with
14:30
anxiety. So it was ruling me and I knew that I was coming up with
14:35
this, this facilitation and the next few months and then you
14:38
just happen to pop into one of my professional organisations,
14:42
met you and you were talking about Unshakable Confidence. I
14:44
was like, Well, yeah, I kind of need that. And so working with
14:49
you and your core method, I was able to neutralise those self
14:55
doubting thoughts, and I've shared with you and I'll share
14:58
with everyone I Recently, in the past two weeks, I was doing my
15:03
Franklin Covey presentations. And long story short, it wasn't
15:07
an internet problem, it was a computer problem. My computer
15:11
didn't have enough memory and zoom was quitting on me probably
15:15
20 different times during a two hour session with all these
15:18
executives on the phone, panic attack was ensuing inside. But
15:22
on the outside, I was still keeping it together at some
15:25
point, it would just I would see my little mouse it would have
15:28
like the little thinking thing and like it's about to crash,
15:30
just take a deep breath, it'll come back up and I kept talking.
15:32
So at some point, I barely even felt that it that it went went
15:38
away. And then when I got the new computer, I told you I was
15:41
like bring it on computer what you got come on mess with me.
15:43
I've got this so that unshakeable confidence. You
15:46
definitely helped instil in me and it's, it's been interesting.
15:50
I'll tell Melinda all the time. You have some voodoo magic. I'm
15:54
from Baton Rouge, Louisiana. So we got the Voodoo down here in
15:57
New Orleans. don't necessarily believe in it. But I believe in
16:01
Melinda and your voodoo magic ways of neutralising all these
16:04
thoughts in my head. Thank you
16:07
Melinda Lee: so much. And those thoughts were real. I mean, they
16:10
actually had a legitimate reason to be there. Because like you
16:13
said, yeah, that technology may not work. Yeah, you didn't have
16:16
as much experience as all of these executives. Yeah, the
16:19
materials not used. So those are actual, they were in when
16:23
anybody goes through something that is high stakes, it's
16:27
important, these thoughts will come up. And, and I think
16:31
they're valid. And I think what you and I did the work that we
16:34
did, we did it, we did give it respect, and we work through
16:39
each of them. So that you can see that they're their thoughts,
16:43
and they needed to be heard, they needed to be respected. And
16:46
then they actually start to dissolve and neutralise out of
16:50
our nervous system. And then so when you when you got presented
16:54
with even what would have happened if we didn't work
16:57
together, and you have that computer problem, what do you
16:59
think would have? Like, really, I'm gonna play it out like this
17:02
for fun? What do you would have done,
17:06
Sarah Arceneaux: I would have cried, probably cried, there
17:09
probably would have been tears, I wanted to throw my computer
17:13
across the room. And I might have if I didn't, if I didn't
17:18
have that confidence, I think that, um, I really don't know,
17:23
because I just kept going to, I have my bullet points. I know
17:28
what I'm talking about. And I kept Melinda, Melinda and her
17:31
immersion session would say, I don't know what I'm gonna say,
17:34
but it's gonna be great. And the amount of times I was like, I
17:36
don't know what the heck is gonna happen with this computer,
17:39
but I'm gonna get through it. And this training is going to be
17:41
great. I just kept telling myself that and I could power
17:44
through it. And so I think if I didn't have that, in the back of
17:48
my head, I might have been like, we need to stop this training
17:51
until I figure out what's going on. I was able to adjust on the
17:55
fly, when I don't think I would have been able to do it as
17:59
gracefully as I did, if that makes sense.
18:02
Melinda Lee: Yes, yes, yes. Right. Yeah, totally. Because
18:07
your your, your mind is going haywire, the nervous system is
18:10
going haywire. And then so we're not able to think very clearly.
18:13
And so you're able to think clearly you're able to move
18:17
through it and adjust and, and still and then there was a some
18:22
feedback,
18:24
Sarah Arceneaux: I was about to say that and then after the the
18:26
last one I ended up I was at with our help desk was there and
18:31
they said if it doesn't work, I'm gonna go get you the best
18:33
computer I got. So literally, we took a 20 minute break from the
18:36
training I was supposed to talk about, we'll talk through how to
18:39
adjust on the fly, what I was going to remove from it, got
18:43
back into it and went into it. So this last group had half of
18:46
me with technical issues and half of me with the computer
18:49
working properly. And the regional manager once everything
18:53
was done, who's the head of the group that I was there was about
18:56
30 People said before everybody gets off the phone, I'd really
19:00
like to say how much I appreciate Sarah's efforts here.
19:03
Because I was not just a Franklin Covey facilitator,
19:07
which there's nothing against Franklin Covey facilitators or
19:09
any other company. But what he said was, the training material
19:15
was so much more impactful, because it was coming from
19:18
somebody who's been with our organisation for a long time,
19:20
who knows them as managers, who knows our business and could put
19:25
real life examples from our business and from what I've
19:28
dealt with in our human resources department into action
19:31
and speaking with them and being able to really say, like, we're
19:36
talking about building trust with our teams, and we have the
19:40
people who instal the billboards and the people who sell the
19:42
billboards. And one of the biggest things that we hear in
19:45
HR is that there's kind of a divide between the front of the
19:48
house and the back of the house and building that trust is one
19:51
of the most important things and and they told me that they could
19:55
really hear and that point was driven home for me because I had
19:59
all those eggs examples that I could that I could employ in our
20:03
discussion, as opposed to someone from Franklin Covey who
20:06
might be able to start that discussion, but not be able to
20:08
go through it all. And so I really did almost cry when he
20:12
told me that I'm like, keep it together, you're on video with
20:15
all these executives, but it was so fulfilling to hear from
20:19
somebody, I respect it so much that my efforts were
20:22
appreciated, and that they understood because he was like,
20:24
this was a lot of material for you, to learn and to teach us.
20:27
And so we just appreciate your effort. So it was extremely
20:30
rewarding.
20:31
Melinda Lee: Oh, that's beautiful. And what are the
20:35
magic, what a what a great thing to instil like, not only just
20:39
teaching, but you're really instilling the trust in these
20:42
employees and the staff and executive and that really makes
20:46
a difference for them. And then for having to have them to help
20:50
them to have it hit home for them. And, and then to get the
20:53
feedback from the executive that you really respect. And you did
20:59
it. So that's all from think about is all from you going
21:04
through the challenge with Ms. Saying no saying yes to your
21:09
help. And then this opportunity for this new position or this
21:14
new role? That is so much better for you more fulfilling? And?
21:20
Absolutely, it's,
21:22
Sarah Arceneaux: it's been a whirlwind. And when I graduated
21:25
school, I wanted to be the VP of HR at a company or open my own
21:30
consulting firm. And I think that my biggest message to
21:36
people out there is, no matter what you come across, know that
21:41
you can adjust in a way that you will be happy, I never would
21:45
have thought that I would be happy, being a professional
21:50
development manager for the next 50 years of my life. And I
21:53
really could be because it's such fulfilling work. I don't
21:56
necessarily need to be the VP of HR over 30 people in order to be
22:00
successful, I can be successful in my own right, by helping
22:04
leaders be the best leaders that they can be and just adjusting
22:08
that mindset of I don't necessarily have to be the top
22:11
dog. I can be. I can be what's the word I'm looking for. And I
22:18
can be inspiring and impactful in my work without being the top
22:23
of the the top of the tear of the department. Yeah,
22:27
Melinda Lee: I mean, what is success? Right? Is it really a
22:30
title? Right? Is it Oh, really, right? No, no, it's not. I took
22:37
me
22:37
Sarah Arceneaux: a minute. So to my mom, my mom, you are going to
22:41
be interviewing as well. And she is the top dog and she has been
22:46
my inspiration my whole life is to be just like her and get a
22:50
master's degree, which I did and, and try and get into
22:54
leadership. And I learned a lot from her. And I'm super excited
22:58
to watch her podcast recording as well.
23:01
Melinda Lee: I know, I'm excited to have her. She'll be here next
23:04
couple of weeks. And so what is what about the MS in your life
23:10
right now? Like how is that also played out in your life? And in
23:14
your, how you see yourself? Or do you not? Like yeah, what is
23:19
that? Like? Um,
23:22
Sarah Arceneaux: it's one of those things where whenever I
23:24
was diagnosed, I used to be like, I have good days and bad
23:27
days, but it's mostly good. And that was more of a placation for
23:31
other people than it was for me because in reality, I have my
23:38
new normal consists of basically a low level of pain. So most
23:43
people would call that a bad day. Right? Right, I've come to
23:47
the point where it's like, I am not in a great place. If I'm in
23:51
really bad pain, I have a relapse, what have you for a
23:54
couple of weeks. But if I'm just at my base level of my new
23:57
normal, where my foots Dragon, my wrist is dislocating my
24:02
migraines happen and all that kind of stuff can happen. But as
24:06
long as I have the support of my friends, my family, my job,
24:11
who's very supportive and has lovely accommodations for me,
24:15
then I can get through anything. And as long as I have that
24:20
support, and as long as I listened to my body, then I can
24:25
succeed. And most days I'm doing pretty good. I've gotten on a
24:29
good metal medicine regimen and advocated for my health and I do
24:34
physical therapy. I do all those kinds of things to keep my
24:38
stamina up and I don't plan on slowing down anytime soon. So
24:42
no. Yeah, I think I think I've I've gotten into the good groove
24:47
of things where we've got the right medicine, the right
24:49
support. I also married a physical therapist, so I won the
24:53
lottery on that one. Um, so it's good. It's good, happy, happy.
25:00
Willie married with two little pups trying to grow a family and
25:04
do it all, while taking care of myself at the same time.
25:07
Melinda Lee: Yeah, that is the epitome, I think most of them
25:11
will want to be where we want to be. Right handling.
25:14
Sarah Arceneaux: I don't do it gracefully all the time. But I
25:16
try.
25:17
Melinda Lee: Hey, there, we're here. It's always we're always
25:21
evolving, always evolving. And I think you are an amazing
25:25
powerhouse. I always saw you, as see you as a powerhouse. Because
25:28
you, you have a confidence about yourself, you walk in, and you
25:32
have this presence. And then you make people laugh. And then and
25:37
then and then you know, I would have never known about all these
25:40
things about you, you deal with so much. And yet, it's still you
25:43
continue to go through, you continue to rise, and especially
25:47
in the role that you're in and powering people is just so
25:50
suitable for you. And Lamar advertising company is really,
25:54
really lucky to have you they know that. And so it's been
25:59
really fun today, and thank you so much for sharing your story
26:02
and your insight. What would you what is a one piece of advice
26:05
more if you would like to share with people about using their
26:10
voice about using your voice about unleashing your leadership
26:17
voice? What is the key thing that they can do? So they might
26:20
be really not using it and and understanding the power behind
26:24
it, they might be afraid. And so what is the one key advice that
26:27
you can give?
26:28
Sarah Arceneaux: I think my biggest piece of advice, and the
26:31
hardest thing you taught me to do is breaking free from the
26:35
script, breaking free from what you think other people want you
26:39
to say and saying what you actually think needs to be said.
26:43
I think that I used to be like, Okay, this is what I should say
26:47
in HR world. And this is what the book says, and this is what
26:51
my experience shows and then try and think through all that write
26:54
the perfect script. And then I go to train somebody and I don't
26:57
say exactly that. And I'm like, I didn't get my point across.
27:00
And the biggest thing that I learned is, especially with this
27:05
Franklin Covey stuff, it's six hours of material, which that's
27:08
a lot of stuff that I can miss. But I realised that as long as
27:12
I'm inspiring them to go back and try and build trust within
27:16
their teams, and I did my job, and being able to get out of my
27:23
head and say if I didn't say every single thing that I
27:25
planned, as long as the big message gets across, right, then
27:29
you're done. You're in the right place, and you're in that sweet
27:32
spot.
27:33
Melinda Lee: Totally. Yeah. Like having that trust. That was
27:37
enough. Like that's so important. And we are enough.
27:42
And what I said is enough, I think many of us will try to
27:45
over teach try to give too much information and we got to cram
27:48
it all in. And then I love that you got to that point of that
27:52
was enough. I did what I did, the big thing that I need to do
27:56
is done and we're good.
27:59
Sarah Arceneaux: Yep. Before you having 20 minutes taken out of
28:02
my presentation would have wrecked me because I'd be like,
28:04
how do I take 20 minutes out and I immediately was like two
28:07
videos remove that activity going. Alright, let's go. And I
28:10
was ready to roll and it was amazing. I was like, I still
28:14
don't know how you did it. Melinda. Magic.
28:18
Melinda Lee: Did it. You did it. We did it. I am so appreciative
28:21
of you. Thank you so much, Sarah for sharing your expertise, your
28:25
experiences and your time today with us. Really appreciate you.
28:30
Sarah Arceneaux: Of course. It's my pleasure. Thank you Melinda.
28:32
Melinda Lee: Thank you