Latest / Beheaded / Dying on a Prayer | Mabel Brigge

Transcript

Dying on a Prayer | Mabel Brigge · Beheaded

0:04
SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome to Beheaded.
0:06
SPEAKER_01: Welcome to season five, episode six.
0:09
SPEAKER_01: I'm Megan Moore.
0:10
SPEAKER_01: And I'm Elizabeth Black.
0:12
SPEAKER_01: Merry belated Christmas.
0:14
SPEAKER_01: Happy Christmas.
0:15
SPEAKER_01: In January.
0:16
SPEAKER_01: In the end of January.
0:18
SPEAKER_01: That's okay.
0:19
SPEAKER_01: As you know, those of you who've listened for a while, sometimes it takes a few weeks for Megan and I to get together and exchange gifts.
0:26
SPEAKER_01: Or a couple months.
0:28
SPEAKER_01: But today it's a few weeks.
0:30
SPEAKER_01: That's not that bad.
0:30
SPEAKER_01: That's not bad.
0:31
SPEAKER_01: We okay, to be fair, Megan had her gift ready for me last time we met when we did the Calico Jack episode.
0:38
SPEAKER_01: And I felt bad because I walked into her house and she's like, Merry Christmas.
0:42
SPEAKER_01: And happy new year.
0:44
SPEAKER_01: And then she gave me her gift and I was like, I can't do this right now, but I'll get back to you.
0:49
SPEAKER_01: And I was an asshole, but You weren't an asshole.
0:51
SPEAKER_01: You were honest.
0:52
SPEAKER_00: I was.
0:53
SPEAKER_02: I was like, well, did you just forget the gift or do you even have the gift?
0:56
SPEAKER_02: And you were so on, you're like, I haven't even thought about shopping.
0:59
SPEAKER_01: I like, yeah, it wasn't like a I knew I had to get the gift, but like between being out of town, coming back, getting things ready for work, like you know, that whole week when you're just kind of getting back into the swing of things, I was like, I just need a minute.
1:11
SPEAKER_01: It's fine.
1:12
SPEAKER_01: And we like to get our books, which we'll discuss, pointing to them if you're watching the YouTube.
1:18
SPEAKER_01: Um, but we like to get our books from a very specific place.
1:21
SPEAKER_01: It's like this old bookshop.
1:23
SPEAKER_01: So I was like, I just it's far away, it's not like it's on the way to anything.
1:26
SPEAKER_01: And so it's like we go to different locations of the same bookshop, but like yours is way out of the way, too.
1:33
SPEAKER_02: Sort of, but it's always a fun trip to go.
1:35
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:36
SPEAKER_02: Like I don't mind it because it's a nice Saturday afternoon.
1:39
SPEAKER_02: There's nothing better than like kind of sleeping in a little bit on a Saturday, you know, taking the pup out for a walk, reading a little book, and then driving to the bookstore and then having lunch and coffee.
1:51
SPEAKER_02: And it's always a fun, like I make a whole thing of it.
1:54
SPEAKER_02: I really like it.
1:55
SPEAKER_02: It is nice.
1:56
SPEAKER_01: And I did like when I got your book, um, I rerouted a like like a like how to get there from like a place I was on like it was like a Wednesday or whatever.
2:06
SPEAKER_01: I was like, okay, I'm gonna go here and go there.
2:08
SPEAKER_01: And I thought it was gonna be this big expedition, and it was like next door.
2:12
SPEAKER_01: Oh funny, sweet.
2:14
SPEAKER_01: So I just got there and it was like again, I love this bookshop.
2:18
SPEAKER_01: It's just like the smells of the old bookstores.
2:21
SPEAKER_01: It's great.
2:22
SPEAKER_01: Oh, and you just like it's very organized, the one we go to, because again, multiple locations, but each location, it's like here's British history, here's French history, and it's broken up by like Churchill and King Henry VIII.
2:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and it's like it's very specific.
2:38
SPEAKER_02: And every time you go, you there's new discoveries because it's an old bookstore, so it's not like you go and see the same thing that's finding, and there's a lot of collector's items and first edition, sign copies, and so we always try to find something very unique and something that really caters to the other person's interests, and we have all you know, we're pretty unique gals, we got all kinds of interests.
3:00
SPEAKER_02: It expands beyond just the blood and the executions.
3:04
SPEAKER_02: Yes, I mean my book is a little bit about bloody execution, that's fine, but mine is not, but so every Christmas we exchange a some type of like special book, and then on birthdays we do a coffee table book.
3:17
SPEAKER_02: Because nobody buys coffee table books for themselves.
3:19
SPEAKER_01: No, because it's like a coffee table book is a big expense.
3:22
SPEAKER_01: Usually they're like they're not cheap, they're anywhere between like you know, 75 plus to like 150, 200 bucks sometimes.
3:29
SPEAKER_01: So it's a nice gesture to be like, here's a coffee table book for your home.
3:34
SPEAKER_01: Because again, it's hard to buy for yourself, and like unless you specifically tell someone I want this coffee table book, you never get what you want.
3:40
SPEAKER_01: So I love that me and Megan have done this for years now, where it's like birthdays are the coffee table book, and then Christmas is like find an old book from an old bookstore.
3:48
SPEAKER_02: I love it.
3:49
SPEAKER_02: It's it's always I highly recommend if you have book lover friends out there, family members.
3:55
SPEAKER_02: Um, and I will say though, for the coffee table books, don't buy online because we've both fallen victim victim to this on separate occasions.
4:04
SPEAKER_02: Where online they make it seem like it's a really nice coffee table book, and then you get it and it's tiny.
4:10
SPEAKER_02: You're like, wait, this isn't like a display book.
4:12
SPEAKER_02: This is a shove it behind something kind of.
4:15
SPEAKER_01: The first time that happened with Megan, like I got her this cute.
4:18
SPEAKER_01: Well, again, online it looked so cute.
4:19
SPEAKER_01: It was like a- And it is cute.
4:21
SPEAKER_01: It's cute, but like, you know, it was supposed to be this awesome book on London and Ireland.
4:26
SPEAKER_02: Was it Ireland?
4:27
SPEAKER_02: Yes, Ireland.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: Damn, okay.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: One of course.
4:29
SPEAKER_02: Because it's green, it's pretty.
4:30
SPEAKER_02: I like the book.
4:30
SPEAKER_01: It's pretty, but like, you know, when I first saw it online, I was like, that's perfect.
4:34
SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be this nice centerpiece on her coffee table.
4:36
SPEAKER_01: And when I got in the mail, it was like this rinky dink, like, not small, but like smaller than I thought.
4:42
SPEAKER_01: Like maybe an eight by ten.
4:44
SPEAKER_02: I was like, what is this?
4:45
SPEAKER_02: I also get fooled on used online bookstores because I got you one that they said was in good condition, and I got it, and I wouldn't even like want to tell it, it was falling apart, it was all written in, there's paper clips all through it, it was dirty.
5:01
SPEAKER_02: This is not good condition.
5:03
SPEAKER_02: This isn't even like slightly used, this is extremely damaged, and yeah, yeah.
5:08
SPEAKER_02: So, all that said, go in person, make an experience of it, grab your iced coffee and whatever, and and get your friend a great book.
5:16
SPEAKER_01: Yes, which really quick, we're gonna discuss which books we got for each other.
5:19
SPEAKER_01: You go first because if I explain what you got me, is that how it goes?
5:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I'll explain what you got me.
5:25
SPEAKER_01: Okay, so I'm gonna pick this up, and again, if you're watching the YouTube, this is like a light green, leather-ish not leather what would you call this material?
5:36
SPEAKER_01: Canvas material book yeah, um, book, and it is The Wind and the Willows, and it is a 1919 edition.
5:44
SPEAKER_01: So if you like open the first, I'm gonna have you sound the sounds mark.
5:50
SPEAKER_01: Smell it.
5:52
SPEAKER_01: Does it smell like no, it was 1908.
5:54
SPEAKER_01: 1908 is when it was uh Oh, 1914 originally.
5:58
SPEAKER_02: Okay, does it smell like World War I?
6:01
SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's World War I.
6:03
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
6:03
SPEAKER_02: It was a dark time for the one in the willows.
6:05
SPEAKER_01: It's like uneven pages, kind of yellowish.
6:08
SPEAKER_02: Think about all the children hiding, afraid like scared of what the future would be.
6:13
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, afraid of bombs and coming down, and their parents were like, Let's read the one in the willows.
6:18
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like that always cheers.
6:19
SPEAKER_02: Daddy's coming home soon.
6:21
SPEAKER_02: Stop! But daddy already died and they didn't know it because the letter was late in the mail, and he he was like, Read the book, Daddy Got Me.
6:29
SPEAKER_01: We shouldn't joke about fathers dying, Megan.
6:32
SPEAKER_01: Really insensitive of you.
6:34
unknown: Okay.
6:36
SPEAKER_01: I'm kidding.
6:37
SPEAKER_01: As you know in this show, we make light of dark things, you just deal with it.
6:41
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, so um, this was originally published in 1808, but this edition 1908.
6:47
SPEAKER_01: Whatever.
6:48
SPEAKER_01: You did that thing last time.
6:49
SPEAKER_02: I was like, in 2018.
6:52
SPEAKER_02: No.
6:52
SPEAKER_01: The first two numbers don't matter.
6:54
SPEAKER_01: Um, 1908, and then reprinted in February 1919.
6:58
SPEAKER_01: And there's this like note that someone wrote to their uh, I guess whoever they gave it to.
7:03
SPEAKER_01: And then I'm gonna go to the house.
7:05
SPEAKER_01: And this is like it took us a while to decipher, but we think it says The Wind in the Willows, in quotation marks, was first written by or in weekly letters, it's hard to read.
7:18
SPEAKER_01: It's very sloppy cursive.
7:20
SPEAKER_01: To a little schoolboy, the author's only son who dies before his father.
7:26
SPEAKER_01: And war?
7:27
SPEAKER_01: I don't know, it doesn't say, but it just says that this was written in November 17th, 1934.
7:32
SPEAKER_01: So I love, we love reading like the handwritten notes that people like give to each other because I feel like before there were Hallmark cards, you would just find a book and be like, oh, this made me think of you.
7:41
SPEAKER_01: So Megan and I have a lot of old copies of books where it's like someone's like, Hey, this reminded me of our trip to France.
7:47
SPEAKER_01: I hope you like it.
7:48
SPEAKER_01: It's so sweet when they get the little message.
7:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like 1926.
7:50
SPEAKER_01: You're like, okay.
7:52
SPEAKER_01: So again, excellent job, Megan.
7:54
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna put it in my bookcase here, and that's gonna be on display.
7:57
SPEAKER_02: Well, the reason I got the wind in the willows is for those who have recognized, for whatever reason, we end up referencing like Mr.
8:04
SPEAKER_02: Toad.
8:05
SPEAKER_02: Mr.
8:05
SPEAKER_02: Toad's, I always say wild ride.
8:07
SPEAKER_02: I know that's that's the ride at Disneyland, but Mr.
8:10
SPEAKER_02: Toad and Rat and Badger and I don't know why these come up as references so frequently for us, but I felt like the wind in the willows was appropriate considering the references that we have.
8:21
SPEAKER_01: And I have read the book before, so I love that this is gonna be more of a display piece.
8:25
SPEAKER_02: Sorry for the noise.
8:26
SPEAKER_01: No, you're fine.
8:27
SPEAKER_01: So Megan's gonna show her book now.
8:29
SPEAKER_02: I got a lovely large book.
8:31
SPEAKER_02: Look how large it is.
8:33
SPEAKER_02: Large.
8:34
SPEAKER_02: Um, straight up just called Thomas More.
8:37
SPEAKER_02: So that is right up my alley.
8:39
SPEAKER_02: Perfect.
8:40
SPEAKER_02: It is um the advanced praise for Richard Maurice's.
8:43
SPEAKER_02: Maurice?
8:44
SPEAKER_02: Maurice.
8:45
SPEAKER_02: Maurice.
8:46
SPEAKER_02: Maurice.
8:46
SPEAKER_02: Maurice's Thomas More.
8:49
SPEAKER_02: Um and it's a biography, but it looks like an extremely detailed, very thorough.
8:55
SPEAKER_01: I how many pages does it have a page number on?
8:57
SPEAKER_01: It's a big boy.
8:59
SPEAKER_01: It's a big book.
9:00
SPEAKER_02: It's got uh like 500, but they're a lot.
9:04
SPEAKER_02: But they're big, yeah.
9:05
SPEAKER_02: A big 500-page book.
9:07
SPEAKER_02: Um, and this is from 1984.
9:11
SPEAKER_01: Oh, the days of 1984.
9:14
SPEAKER_02: I wasn't quite born yet.
9:15
SPEAKER_02: I'm a couple of things.
9:16
SPEAKER_02: I think it was a little bit older than maybe just this copy is 1984.
9:21
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
9:21
SPEAKER_02: But I think the oh yeah, it's copyright.
9:24
SPEAKER_02: 1984.
9:25
SPEAKER_02: No, no, no.
9:26
SPEAKER_02: Doesn't it look much older?
9:27
SPEAKER_02: No, there's previous ones, 1976.
9:31
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
9:31
SPEAKER_02: Maybe.
9:32
SPEAKER_02: I don't know, but it's it's you know, the late 1900s.
9:37
SPEAKER_02: Is that what people say now?
9:38
SPEAKER_02: Still very historical.
9:39
SPEAKER_02: Um, but I'm very excited to dive into this for those who have known me talk about this again and again and again.
9:45
SPEAKER_01: And Megan took a picture in front of this portrait that's on the cover at Heaver Castle.
9:49
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's the actual portrait of Thomas More, and there's a really cool, like, me in front of it, which uh I I I always brag about this, but um I am a distant relative of Sir Thomas More.
10:03
SPEAKER_02: Descendant.
10:04
SPEAKER_02: Descendant.
10:04
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
10:05
SPEAKER_02: Uh, on my mother's side.
10:07
SPEAKER_02: So this means a lot to me because I like to read anything about Thomas More.
10:11
SPEAKER_02: I appreciate him as a man.
10:13
SPEAKER_02: He's actually kind of controversial when you read some of uh or like watch some documentaries and whatnot.
10:18
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
10:18
SPEAKER_02: Um, there's a cool thing on history hit with Susanna Lipscomb and a few of our other favorites, and they talk about how he had like a sailor's mouth.
10:28
SPEAKER_02: Like he like he was always like swearing a lot and talking really raunchy.
10:33
SPEAKER_02: No, yeah, that's what they were saying, is like he was kind of known for being like this kind of like blunt, like dirty joke type of guy.
10:40
SPEAKER_02: Shut up.
10:40
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I've never heard of that side of the game.
10:43
SPEAKER_02: Because he seems so polished and pious, yeah, because he's like all about the Catholic Church and everything.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: Wow.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, evidently he so I'm like, yeah, that's my grandpa.
10:52
SPEAKER_02: My great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great grandpa.
10:54
SPEAKER_02: Great, great, great, grandpa.
10:55
SPEAKER_02: Was it great times 15 or something?
10:57
SPEAKER_02: I think 15 generations ago is what it was.
10:59
SPEAKER_02: Anyways, yeah, so that was our book exchange, and it's always a fun tradition for us.
11:03
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
11:04
SPEAKER_01: And and really quick, too, along that same line.
11:06
SPEAKER_01: Like, again, I've mentioned this on the podcast probably gosh years ago now, but you know, my grandma always told us that we were related to someone royal, and she never knew it was the Boleyn family, it was Mary Boleyn specifically.
11:20
SPEAKER_01: Um, so she came over because she visited Arizona, where we are.
11:24
SPEAKER_01: Um, she's never been out to Arizona, like we had her over for dinner, and I was like, oh, I might as well show her pictures of our London trip.
11:31
SPEAKER_01: So I showed her specifically Heaver Castle pictures, and you know, my grandma was like 89.
11:36
SPEAKER_01: Right.
11:37
SPEAKER_01: So I wasn't sure how much she was really like, you know, like like interested in the content anymore.
11:42
SPEAKER_01: But I showed her, I was like, hey, like you always talked about this growing up.
11:46
SPEAKER_01: Now I'm gonna show you that Megan and I went there, like we took pictures at Heaver Castle, like this was Anne Boleyn's bedroom.
11:51
SPEAKER_01: There was pick portraits of Mary Boleyn there, and she got like really emotional.
11:56
SPEAKER_01: And she actually, because again, like my family came from like England to Virginia to Nebraska to like wherever in the West.
12:04
SPEAKER_01: So she's actually going to like a funeral this upcoming week in Nebraska, and she was like, I kind of want to show these photos to like our family and show them like where we came from.
12:13
SPEAKER_01: Like, we always talked about this, we never quite knew the direct lineage or the names of everyone.
12:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, so it was kind of emotional showing her.
12:20
SPEAKER_01: Like, I just meant it more as like a hey, after dinner, let's just look at these photos.
12:23
SPEAKER_01: But I think it was like deeply personal to her.
12:25
SPEAKER_01: That's really cool.
12:26
SPEAKER_01: And I hope I hope she appreciated it, but it was a nice moment, you know.
12:29
SPEAKER_02: And I feel like that's that is how any place where Anne or Thomas Moore walked.
12:35
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, when we went to Tower of London too, I kind of get that feeling also, even if you're not a descendant or you're related to them, but just knowing that this is where they walked, this is where they were, it just all the stories you can only read so much and watch so much, and then watch dramas and reenactments and everything, but it becomes so real when you're standing where they stood and where it all happened.
12:57
SPEAKER_02: It just does get emotional, it kind of hits home a little bit.
13:00
SPEAKER_02: So that's why we do this.
13:02
SPEAKER_02: That's why I think for anybody who's just a history lover, yeah.
13:05
SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, I think some people are the extreme opposite where they're all about the future and science and all about the progressive, and that is good, that's awesome.
13:14
SPEAKER_02: But for us history lovers, it's kind of about that nostalgic and reminiscing in the past, and yeah, this really happened.
13:21
SPEAKER_01: And it's nice to know, and I think when we had our interview with Dr.
13:24
SPEAKER_01: Owen Emerson, he said this, but you're only separated by time, you're not separated by space.
13:30
SPEAKER_01: Like this is the same place they were, like the only thing that separates you and them is just that time.
13:36
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know, the time.
13:37
SPEAKER_02: That was a beautiful message.
13:39
SPEAKER_02: He was talking about how when you're in Anne Boleyn's room, she would have seen the sun setting the same way.
13:44
SPEAKER_02: The the direction the sun hits these windows doesn't change, yeah, despite it being 500 years later.
13:50
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
13:51
SPEAKER_02: And yeah, you know, trees change and surroundings change and all of that, but it it's it feels like yeah, time kind of disappears when you're standing in the same place.
14:04
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
14:04
SPEAKER_02: It's very moving.
14:06
SPEAKER_02: And that's wherever you go, where it's like some type of historical place.
14:10
SPEAKER_02: Um, so we're gonna step back in time a little bit.
14:13
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
14:13
SPEAKER_02: You're gonna go back to tutor era.
14:16
SPEAKER_01: Today's a good old tutor episode.
14:18
SPEAKER_01: We like to sprinkle them in the world.
14:20
SPEAKER_01: Or running out of not really, like, but there's still a ton either.
14:24
SPEAKER_01: There's still a lot.
14:24
SPEAKER_01: We've covered a lot of the big tutor executions and this one, like you know, and others.
14:29
SPEAKER_01: Like, there's still so many.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: There are and what we like is if you're again a fan of the show and you have been for years, like you can start connecting the dots.
14:37
SPEAKER_01: Like, oh yeah, like I remember that person you talked about, or I remember this era, or what King Henry VIII was doing at this time.
14:44
SPEAKER_01: So it's always nice to just like revisit and reinforce the information you already know and fill in some gaps.
14:50
SPEAKER_02: Makes you feel kind of smart, right?
14:52
SPEAKER_02: You're like, I love that when there's a reference that we've of someone who we've already done an episode on.
14:56
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, know them.
14:58
SPEAKER_02: You're like, see season two.
14:59
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
15:00
SPEAKER_02: And we're gonna probably drop some of those in there.
15:02
SPEAKER_02: We will.
15:03
SPEAKER_02: Um, today we're talking about someone who you may not have heard of.
15:06
SPEAKER_02: I don't think she's anybody, I could be wrong, but as far as I'm aware, I've never seen her pulled into any type of like historical drama, like the Tutors or you know, any of those shows.
15:20
SPEAKER_02: I keep referencing the tutors.
15:22
SPEAKER_02: I know there's more out there, but that's our era.
15:24
SPEAKER_02: That's the one we know the best.
15:25
SPEAKER_02: There's there's a lot of them, but I've never seen a reenactment of her.
15:29
SPEAKER_02: Uh, her name is Mabel Brigg.
15:32
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
15:32
SPEAKER_02: Like the name Mabel.
15:34
SPEAKER_02: Mabel.
15:35
SPEAKER_02: Uh, we're gonna start off with uh don't know much about her early life.
15:39
SPEAKER_02: We do know she was born in 1506, and she was a servant.
15:44
SPEAKER_02: Uh, she was a servant for many different households.
15:46
SPEAKER_02: She started off as a servant for William Fisher of Wellwick, and all we really know that he said about about Mabel was she fasted a lot.
15:55
SPEAKER_02: She was very religious for the Catholic religion.
15:58
SPEAKER_02: Right.
15:58
SPEAKER_02: And she did these fastings as part of her religion.
16:01
SPEAKER_01: And um, Elizabeth is gonna get more into the fastings and what that means, but I feel like you can connect with that a little bit about Lent and I was gonna say, yeah, for me, and I've I've talked about this on the podcast before, but like, you know, I grew up Catholic and like we are still very much of the tradition of Lent, the Lenten season.
16:19
SPEAKER_01: So it's like the 40 days before Easter, you know, you're supposed to give something up.
16:24
SPEAKER_01: And I'm sure a lot of you have heard of this or are Catholic yourself or have Catholic friends or whatever, but you're supposed to give up something for Lent.
16:30
SPEAKER_01: It's supposed to be a quote unquote fast in a certain way.
16:34
SPEAKER_01: And I think most of us are like, no fast food, no chocolate, no dessert.
16:38
SPEAKER_01: Like you get dry January.
16:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, ooh, gross dry January.
16:41
SPEAKER_01: It's not even Lent yet.
16:43
SPEAKER_01: But um, um, so again, like during the Lenten season, uh, you know, it it's it's just a time where you're supposed to observe these certain traditions, and one of them is on Fridays you're not supposed to eat red meat.
16:55
SPEAKER_01: So that's where like Fish Friday comes in, right?
16:58
SPEAKER_01: Fish fry.
16:58
SPEAKER_01: Fish fry.
16:59
SPEAKER_01: Um, so you know meat on Fridays, and you're supposed to fast on Ash Wednesday when it starts, which fun fact is the day after Mardi Gras.
17:06
SPEAKER_01: So if you've never known what Mardi Gras is about, it's Fat Tuesday.
17:10
SPEAKER_01: So that's like literally your last day to party before Ash Wednesday begins, and you're supposed to fast.
17:16
SPEAKER_01: Um, so fast Ash Wednesday, fast Good Friday, which is the Friday Christ died, and then Easter Sunday is the following Sunday.
17:25
SPEAKER_01: So anyway, that's just like a little bit of the Catholic tradition.
17:27
SPEAKER_01: We'll get more into what that all means in context of this story.
17:31
SPEAKER_01: Um, but so so I've always been kind of familiar with the concept of fasting.
17:35
SPEAKER_01: I know in in Judaism too, like like um they have a lot of different uh fasting holidays where it's like for I think in we didn't really know this, well at least my family didn't growing up Catholic, but like it has to do with sunset as well.
17:50
SPEAKER_01: Like you're you sh you're you're supposed to fast during the day, but sunset's like is when the fast breaks or things like that, you know.
17:56
SPEAKER_01: So so between like Muslim, like Catholic, Jewish, like the all these different faiths have different kind of requirements for fasting, like what you're supposed to eat and not eat, if you can have water or not have water.
18:07
SPEAKER_01: So anyway, we'll get into those details.
18:09
SPEAKER_01: But for me growing up Catholic, it was always kind of like yeah, you felt no meats and milk.
18:14
SPEAKER_01: No meat during Fridays.
18:16
SPEAKER_01: You could have milk.
18:16
SPEAKER_00: Oh, you can have milk.
18:17
SPEAKER_01: And I hate to say most Fridays I forgot about the meat thing.
18:20
SPEAKER_01: So I'd be like, Oh, I didn't have meat yesterday, and I'd be like, You had pepperoni pizza.
18:24
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, damn it.
18:27
SPEAKER_02: Oh.
18:27
SPEAKER_02: Uh so Mabel was working as a servant, and her employer said, Yeah, she fasted a lot and she's very religious.
18:36
SPEAKER_02: But despite how how religious she was, she wasn't that great of a woman because supposedly she um did steal from him.
18:44
SPEAKER_02: So she was eventually fired for theft.
18:47
SPEAKER_02: Right.
18:48
SPEAKER_02: Let go.
18:48
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
18:49
SPEAKER_02: Um from the water.
18:49
SPEAKER_01: And really quickly, we should note too that she was a widow at this time and already had two kids.
18:55
SPEAKER_01: So she was fairly young, that she's like in her 20s at this point.
18:58
SPEAKER_01: That's true.
18:58
SPEAKER_01: But that's true, you know, when she came to these households to be a servant, she was already a young widow and already had two children.
19:04
SPEAKER_02: And we know nothing about her husband.
19:06
SPEAKER_01: No, nothing.
19:07
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:07
SPEAKER_02: Or her kids.
19:08
SPEAKER_02: Or her kids.
19:09
SPEAKER_02: So glad we can educate you.
19:12
SPEAKER_02: Glad to be here for you.
19:13
SPEAKER_02: And that is the show.
19:15
SPEAKER_02: So have a great evening.
19:16
SPEAKER_02: Enjoy the rest of your day.
19:17
SPEAKER_02: Bye.
19:18
SPEAKER_02: Uh, okay, so then she gets fired.
19:20
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
19:21
SPEAKER_02: She then works for this guy named Nelson at Raymond Garth.
19:25
SPEAKER_02: No, Rice and Garth, which is now a be uh bed and breakfast in Yorkshire.
19:30
SPEAKER_02: Oh, we should have gone there.
19:31
SPEAKER_02: No, right?
19:32
SPEAKER_02: Next time.
19:32
SPEAKER_02: I was trying to like look up more about this guy and the where he lived and all that kept coming up was BB stuff.
19:39
SPEAKER_02: Also, Mabel Brig is also the name of a homeowners association.
19:44
SPEAKER_02: I saw it.
19:44
SPEAKER_02: So if you mostly like where is it?
19:46
SPEAKER_02: Do you I don't know, but state like there wasn't a ton on like despite how interesting this woman's story was, and we were really intrigued by it.
19:55
SPEAKER_02: Right.
19:55
SPEAKER_02: It was kind of hard to pull information, and I just kept getting stuff on this HOA.
19:59
SPEAKER_01: It's like Mabel Brigg Homeowners Association.
20:02
SPEAKER_01: That's what they should do to rebrand certain things.
20:05
SPEAKER_01: It's like, you know, Jeffrey Epstein.
20:07
unknown: Oh god.
20:09
SPEAKER_02: He's a hot topic right now.
20:10
SPEAKER_01: No, he is a if you ever were his publicist and wanted to bury.
20:14
SPEAKER_02: I don't want anything associated with that.
20:16
SPEAKER_01: No, I know, but I'm saying, like, in 20 years, 30 years, when people kind of forget about him, you could be like, okay, everyone, welcome to the Jeffrey Epstein HOA.
20:24
SPEAKER_02: So insensitive.
20:25
SPEAKER_01: I am not, I'm not insensitive.
20:27
SPEAKER_01: I'm just saying, wouldn't that be funny if you created a whole lot of it?
20:29
SPEAKER_01: That'd be hilarious.
20:30
SPEAKER_01: You're right.
20:31
SPEAKER_02: How about the Anne Boleyn insurance company?
20:36
SPEAKER_01: No, we can't vary her name.
20:38
SPEAKER_02: Life insurance.
20:39
SPEAKER_01: Life insurance by An Boleyn.
20:41
SPEAKER_02: No, divorce lawyer.
20:43
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
20:43
SPEAKER_02: Anyway.
20:44
SPEAKER_02: Um from there, she then is hired by John Locker.
20:50
SPEAKER_02: Right.
20:50
SPEAKER_02: Locker?
20:51
SPEAKER_02: I think Locker.
20:52
SPEAKER_02: Locker.
20:53
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
20:53
SPEAKER_02: I didn't quite understand this.
20:54
SPEAKER_02: It was said in several places that she said that Nelson was paying her employment still, but she was working for this guy, John.
21:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, her payment at this point gets very um blurred.
21:07
SPEAKER_01: Like who's paying her for what and why?
21:10
SPEAKER_01: Is she getting paid?
21:11
SPEAKER_01: Is she just some woman living in some man's house?
21:14
SPEAKER_01: But the fact that it is muddy, I think, suggests other scandal.
21:18
SPEAKER_02: There probably was some, like, yeah, it was like, if you kind of read the like, oh, like, and then she was, you know, under the employment of so-and-so, under blah blah blah, being paid by Nelson.
21:30
SPEAKER_02: Like, okay, none of that made sense.
21:31
SPEAKER_02: But she did show up at this guy's store with her two kids, and uh, you know, he employed her as a servant of the household.
21:37
SPEAKER_02: Right.
21:38
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
21:39
SPEAKER_01: So by this time, it is summer 1537.
21:43
SPEAKER_01: So she's about 31 years old, 32 maybe.
21:46
SPEAKER_01: And she meets somebody who's in the same town named Isabel Buck.
21:50
SPEAKER_01: So Isabel Buck kind of suggests to Mabel like, hey, I recently lost a child and I can't do this fast I normally do.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: She probably was aware of Mabel's reputation of doing these religious fasts, and she's like, Can you do this fast on behalf of me?
22:07
SPEAKER_01: Which is kind of a weird request, right?
22:09
SPEAKER_01: Like you know it's gonna work.
22:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like, okay, so you can't do the fast, so you're asking someone else to do the fast.
22:15
SPEAKER_01: Does that have the same meaning?
22:17
SPEAKER_01: So they even went so far as to like get a priest involved.
22:20
SPEAKER_01: Like they're like, this priest has to sanction your fast on behalf of me.
22:24
SPEAKER_01: It was like a very formal thing that they agreed to.
22:27
SPEAKER_02: And the reason for the fast was weird.
22:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and when you asked um Mabel, like, what why did you agree to this fast?
22:35
SPEAKER_01: What's this fast about?
22:36
SPEAKER_01: Her her the way she defended it was like, oh, this was a charitable cause.
22:40
SPEAKER_01: Like I did it for charity, but that's kind of all she said.
22:43
SPEAKER_01: She was just defending it like this was a a nice favor that I did to the bucks to the to Isabel and her husband.
22:49
SPEAKER_02: Because Isabel lost money, supposedly.
22:52
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
22:53
SPEAKER_02: And the fast was to pray so hard to find the lost money.
22:58
SPEAKER_02: So that was the charitable cause of not eating.
23:01
SPEAKER_01: Right.
23:02
SPEAKER_01: And in exchange, they gave her a peck of wheat, which is a certain like measurement of wheat, and a half yard of linen.
23:09
SPEAKER_01: So they said, if we give you this, you'll perform the fast for us.
23:12
SPEAKER_01: Um, and the fast was a strict fast, also known as a black fast.
23:16
SPEAKER_01: Um, it was also, if you are like looking into this historically, known as a Saint Tree Trininian's fast.
23:25
SPEAKER_01: And so we're gonna get into this background a bit.
23:28
SPEAKER_01: So this was a very strict fast, and it's kind of based on an ancient form of Christianity.
23:33
SPEAKER_01: So back in the 8th century, they practiced fast like this.
23:38
SPEAKER_01: Because I think once modern times caught up, they were more lenient with fasting, especially like in our modern time, like once you get to the industrial era, they're like, well, we can't have all these like workers who are supposed to be putting in 12-hour days, like they can't just be passed out on the job, and their excuse is like, oh well, I'm fasting today, I'm weak.
23:57
SPEAKER_01: So over time, obviously these restrictions have loosened.
24:00
SPEAKER_01: But back in like, you know, before 8th century, and then even now in the 16th century, you know, they're still kind of saying, Hey, we have these very strict fasts that we go by, and that means no food or water, like you're not allowed anything.
24:15
SPEAKER_02: That is unhealthy, yeah.
24:17
SPEAKER_01: Because even again, fasts that were strict, you still have water because that sustains you as a human.
24:23
SPEAKER_01: No milk.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: They said, yeah, they said no milk, no meat, no eggs, like no dairy, like nothing, and no alcohol.
24:32
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
24:33
SPEAKER_01: Which at these times, most I think people drink a lot of like mead.
24:37
SPEAKER_02: It was probably safer than the drinking water that they had.
24:40
SPEAKER_01: It was distilled.
24:41
SPEAKER_01: They drank so much because they had to, because it was probably again healthier and cleaner, quote unquote, than a lot of drinking water.
24:48
SPEAKER_01: So so this was very, very strict.
24:50
SPEAKER_01: And the only time you could maybe have a meal if you were observing this fast was after sundown.
24:56
SPEAKER_01: You could have one meal, and again, it still had to be like a strict diet meal.
25:01
SPEAKER_01: It was like you were allowed maybe bread with some herbs and salt.
25:05
SPEAKER_01: Like you we still weren't allowed to have the rest of what we just mentioned.
25:08
SPEAKER_02: Okay, sounds sounds fine.
25:11
SPEAKER_02: Sign me up.
25:12
SPEAKER_02: Sounds like January for me.
25:14
SPEAKER_02: So this is your dry January.
25:16
SPEAKER_01: And so typically, again, like Catholics especially observe this specific type of fasting at Lent.
25:21
SPEAKER_01: Um, and again, Ash Wednesday, like we mentioned, Good Friday, like we mentioned.
25:25
SPEAKER_01: And some of them went so far as to do every Wednesday and Friday with the black fast.
25:30
SPEAKER_01: So it was like, again, just stricter times.
25:32
SPEAKER_01: And then the holy week, which is the the final week of Lent, you're supposed to do this every single day.
25:38
SPEAKER_01: And so, and again, your Lenten supper is just bread, salt, herbs.
25:42
SPEAKER_01: Maybe they'd allow you a little bit of water if you're feeling weak.
25:46
SPEAKER_01: So, again, this kind of lightened throughout history, but in these days, the they they did like a three-day black fast.
25:52
SPEAKER_01: And the whole point of the fast was that you would put your mind to something that you really wanted.
25:58
SPEAKER_01: Kind of like, you know, when you do like yoga modern day, they're always like, set your intention for your practice.
26:03
SPEAKER_01: Like, what is it you really want out of today?
26:05
SPEAKER_01: And it's supposed to be beyond like, oh, I want to feel good about my body, or I want to find my friends' money.
26:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you're supposed to like, yeah, like like have your intention set on something.
26:15
SPEAKER_01: So they say during this three-day black fast, you have to set your intention.
26:19
SPEAKER_01: So, of course, because Isabel Buck is like employing her, she's like, focus on my lost money, focus on my things.
26:25
SPEAKER_01: Because you're like my surrogate.
26:27
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so is it that someone took the money?
26:29
SPEAKER_02: Did she just misplace the money?
26:31
SPEAKER_02: Does she think she's gonna be led down to where she dropped it?
26:34
SPEAKER_02: It like none of it.
26:35
SPEAKER_01: I'm not quite sure, you know.
26:37
SPEAKER_01: This this all gets very foggy as to who's paying her and why.
26:40
SPEAKER_00: Why are we doing this, Table?
26:42
SPEAKER_00: Why are we?
26:42
SPEAKER_01: How did we get here?
26:44
SPEAKER_01: Right, right.
26:44
SPEAKER_01: Um, but you know, the the intention was she focuses on a certain intention and she has to pray to like a specific saint.
26:51
SPEAKER_01: She can't just say, oh, the the money should be found.
26:53
SPEAKER_01: She has to like pray to a certain saint during this time and ask for these things.
26:58
SPEAKER_01: Um so again, whenever she was asked about it, they're like, Why are you fasting?
27:02
SPEAKER_01: She's like, it's charitable.
27:03
unknown: Yes.
27:04
SPEAKER_02: Who's the saint of lost things?
27:06
SPEAKER_02: I should know this.
27:08
SPEAKER_02: There's a saint for that.
27:10
SPEAKER_01: Francis?
27:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
27:11
SPEAKER_02: Does that sound right?
27:12
SPEAKER_02: Right.
27:12
SPEAKER_02: That might be right.
27:13
SPEAKER_02: Can I came out of nowhere?
27:15
SPEAKER_02: I'm not jumped with a random side story.
27:17
SPEAKER_02: Please do.
27:18
SPEAKER_02: Sorry, not to like totally divert and we never, we never uh you know go off topic.
27:23
SPEAKER_02: Praying for something lost made me think of something.
27:26
SPEAKER_02: Okay, so I had a weird story that happened.
27:28
SPEAKER_01: The problem is I can't remember what I've forgotten.
27:30
SPEAKER_02: Okay, Neville.
27:32
SPEAKER_01: The year is 2013.
27:35
SPEAKER_01: Modern times Huntington Beach.
27:38
SPEAKER_02: Uh, yes, we were, but I was in Newport Beach with my mother, and we were shopping at this like pretty large outdoor shopping area.
27:45
SPEAKER_02: For those who are familiar with Orange County, Fashion Island, it's like a pretty Fashion Island.
27:50
SPEAKER_02: You know, we have listeners from around the world, and they may not know Fashion Island and Newport Beach.
27:54
SPEAKER_02: It's a large outdoor shop shopping with all the stores.
27:57
SPEAKER_02: All the stores are there.
27:59
SPEAKER_02: So my mom and I are shopping, and mind you, I I wore these like super cute wedgie heels, but knowing me, I knew that my feet were gonna get blisters.
28:09
SPEAKER_02: So I had little like flats in my purse.
28:12
SPEAKER_02: Right.
28:12
SPEAKER_02: And we'll get back to the flats, but I had those in my purse to like as backup shoes just in case.
28:17
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
28:18
SPEAKER_02: And I had just gotten a new bracelet from my mom that was like a really nice, like silver, it was for my birthday, and beautiful.
28:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
28:27
SPEAKER_02: So um, at one point I looked down and I realized the bracelet was missing.
28:32
SPEAKER_02: And I was like really upset because I just like I just got it that weekend, and I'm with my mom who just got it for me.
28:39
SPEAKER_02: She's like, well, let's just like retrace all of our steps, right?
28:42
SPEAKER_02: And my mom, who's Catholic, starts praying to the saint of lost items, and she maybe Saint Francis.
28:48
SPEAKER_02: I think it might, it rings a bell.
28:50
SPEAKER_02: You should probably Google that.
28:51
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I could probably Google it if I wanted to, but so my mom is praying, and I'm like, no, I'm just gonna like retrace my steps.
29:00
SPEAKER_02: And I did, we went to like backwards, like four different stores.
29:04
SPEAKER_02: Like, I went to Gap, I went to Lucky Brand.
29:06
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, okay, I looked at this rack, I looked at this rack, and I actually found the bracelet.
29:11
SPEAKER_02: Where was it?
29:12
SPEAKER_02: Um, it was in like one of the racks of clothes that I was looking at.
29:16
SPEAKER_02: It was like laying on the bottom, like it slipped off.
29:18
SPEAKER_02: So we found it.
29:19
SPEAKER_02: I was like really stoked.
29:20
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and my mom and I are giggling, like, I can't believe we found it.
29:23
SPEAKER_02: Like, this place is huge, and it that was at like one of the first stores we went at, so I lost it pretty early on.
29:28
SPEAKER_02: Right.
29:29
SPEAKER_02: And then we're we're chatting, we're talking, we're laughing, and I look down and I see a shoe on the ground, and I was like, that looks like my shoe.
29:37
SPEAKER_02: And I look in my purse, and I only had one of my flats, and it was the second flat that somehow fell on my purse.
29:43
SPEAKER_02: And my mom was like, Well, St.
29:45
SPEAKER_02: Prime Francis overdid himself.
29:46
SPEAKER_02: You are finding lost things you didn't even know you lost yet.
29:50
SPEAKER_02: It's like I lost this five years ago.
29:52
SPEAKER_02: Anyways, it's it really kind of like tripped me out a little bit because my mother was just so confident.
29:57
SPEAKER_02: She was like, Yeah, well, that's what happens when you pray to the saints.
30:00
SPEAKER_02: It's so true.
30:01
SPEAKER_02: And I was for a moment, I was like, Whoa, like I didn't even know I lost my shoe when I lost it.
30:06
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
30:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
30:07
SPEAKER_01: It is crazy, like, because again, Megan and I both grew up Catholic, but like, like, because my grandma would always say that, like, anytime you had an issue, she'd be like, Oh, pray to this saint.
30:16
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, a specific saint for a certain thing, yeah, whether it was health or lost things or wherever.
30:22
SPEAKER_01: Like, and they were so confident that that would work because it always worked for them.
30:26
SPEAKER_01: They're like, pray to that saint and you'll find it.
30:28
SPEAKER_01: Like, pray to this saint and everything will be okay.
30:30
SPEAKER_01: And you're just like, what?
30:32
SPEAKER_01: Like in your modern brain that's so rational, you're like, no, please, like that would never work.
30:36
SPEAKER_02: But somehow it always does.
30:39
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
30:39
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
30:40
SPEAKER_02: I've been like exposed to so many different mixed religions because my mom is Catholic, my dad is Jewish.
30:45
SPEAKER_02: Right.
30:46
SPEAKER_02: My husband introduced me to Christianity, just non-dom denominational, um, which is just everything, just talk to Jesus.
30:53
SPEAKER_02: So, you know, it's but it's whatever works for you, and that's what works for my mom.
30:57
SPEAKER_02: It's yeah, I guess it does work because I got a shoe and a bracelet out of it.
31:01
SPEAKER_02: So, anyways, not to digress, but speaking of praying to the saints and what that meant, it just made me think of that story.
31:08
SPEAKER_02: And you know what?
31:09
SPEAKER_02: I maybe praying for the lost money works to the it could.
31:13
SPEAKER_01: One time I I didn't pray, but I found a stone that I lost in my ring.
31:17
SPEAKER_01: Like I was walking to a college class, which was like probably two-mile walk or something crazy, and then like I lost the stone, was upset during class.
31:25
SPEAKER_01: When I walked back, it was like something.
31:28
SPEAKER_01: Like it's this big, it's teeny tiny.
31:30
SPEAKER_01: Somehow you see that's like yeah.
31:31
SPEAKER_02: It is weird when those things happen.
31:33
SPEAKER_02: I think it's meant to be.
31:34
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, so um, so once we kind of unpack the story of Mabel Brig, we find that like she's kind of had a history of this working for her, and we think that's why Isabel like hired her because it was kind of known like that she had done this before, where she had like prayed, uh had this fast, and apparently one time she prayed for like someone to get seriously injured andor killed, and like soon after the guy broke his neck.
32:02
SPEAKER_01: So, like she she was kind of she she's your mom in this situation.
32:07
SPEAKER_01: Coincidence we don't know also she's like, Oh, I'll just do a fast and we'll make it happen.
32:11
SPEAKER_02: Every source said he broke his neck, and we don't know if that means that he actually died or not.
32:16
SPEAKER_02: That's true, but breaking your neck is a pretty serious situation.
32:19
SPEAKER_02: I feel like that's hard to get back from.
32:22
SPEAKER_01: I didn't know a girl once who broke her neck at a Steve Aoki concert because Steve Ayoki landed on her.
32:29
SPEAKER_01: Wait, and she legit broke her neck, but she's fine.
32:32
SPEAKER_01: He landed on her.
32:33
SPEAKER_01: She was like, I think it was like a pool party, and she was underneath like a floaty.
32:38
SPEAKER_00: Oh.
32:38
SPEAKER_01: And she's like holding up a floaty, and he, you know, Steve Ayoki's famous for like the famous like cakes in the crowd and then jumping on the crowd.
32:46
SPEAKER_01: So he jumped on the floaty, straight up broke my friend's neck.
32:49
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
32:50
SPEAKER_01: She was on the ground and she couldn't move, and they had to come to her with like a neck brace.
32:54
SPEAKER_01: And she's like, again, I quote unquote fine now.
32:56
SPEAKER_01: I hope she's like doing okay, but I had a lot of physical therapy and yeah, that's not something you like get out of quickly.
33:02
SPEAKER_01: I think she had a lot of money.
33:03
unknown: Probably.
33:05
SPEAKER_01: So, but that's yeah, so you can technically break your neck and be like alive.
33:10
SPEAKER_01: Someone's gonna break your neck, make sure they're rich and famous, maybe make sure it's Steve Aoki, asshole.
33:15
SPEAKER_01: Damn.
33:16
SPEAKER_01: Um, anyway, so uh so so there's also some like speculation about this black feast or excuse me, black fest, because um, yes, it's like a Catholic thing, it's a very religious thing, but there are certain things to suggest that it also might be like a Gaelic harvest festival thing, which is a little bit more folklore and like like earthy because this day, like like she she did it during this um event called Lamus.
33:46
SPEAKER_01: So Lamus is um a term for loaf mass day.
33:51
SPEAKER_02: A loaf, like a loaf, like a breadloaf.
33:55
SPEAKER_02: Okay, yeah.
33:55
SPEAKER_02: Loaf.
33:56
SPEAKER_01: And they say they say loaf refers to the Eucharist, like the body of Christ.
34:00
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
34:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so so it's very blurred lines between is this Christian or is this potentially not Christian?
34:08
SPEAKER_01: Because it falls between the summer solstice and the autumn equinox.
34:13
SPEAKER_01: So it's like this halfway point between those two um quote unquote holidays.
34:18
SPEAKER_01: And uh there used to be certain church processions that would lead to bakeries, and you would like celebrate this like a loaf fast a little bake crawl, bakery crawl.
34:27
SPEAKER_01: Bakery crawl, this little crawl, yeah.
34:29
SPEAKER_01: This little pilgrimage to get some bagels.
34:32
SPEAKER_01: So it got like kind of blurry between like, well, is she that Catholic and is she that pious?
34:38
SPEAKER_01: Because yes, it seems like what she's doing is like a traditional Catholic fast, but she's doing it at a certain time that might suggest maybe this is more Gaelic or folklore.
34:48
SPEAKER_01: Um, it also coincides with something I think, or sorry, this is the Gaelic word for it, but it's called lug naschon.
34:56
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna say that completely wrong.
34:58
SPEAKER_02: This is new for us.
34:58
SPEAKER_02: We normally fuck up languages pretty bad, but we've never fucked up Gaelic before.
35:02
SPEAKER_02: Right.
35:03
SPEAKER_02: This is new for us.
35:04
SPEAKER_02: New Gaelic fuck up.
35:05
SPEAKER_02: Good job, good job.
35:05
SPEAKER_02: Lugnoshal.
35:07
SPEAKER_02: I can't even read your writing if I wanted to.
35:09
SPEAKER_02: You're right.
35:10
SPEAKER_02: Also, every time you say folklore in my brain, I just think it's folklore.
35:14
SPEAKER_01: There's enough Taylor Swift references on this episode.
35:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, so anyway, so uh so this was like a whole thing of like, okay, was she being pious and devout to her Catholic faith?
35:28
SPEAKER_01: Was she actually praying for the thing she should pray?
35:30
SPEAKER_01: Lost money, like less money, or was she being a bit more devious with Isabel because it fell on that specific day?
35:39
SPEAKER_02: Well, we're gonna get into that.
35:42
SPEAKER_02: So, her employer, Locker and his wife Agnes, Don and Agnes, uh, they come out in January 1538.
35:52
SPEAKER_02: Which is like six months later, by the way.
35:54
SPEAKER_02: They've been brewing on this for a little bit.
35:56
SPEAKER_02: So clearly it's not settling with them well.
35:58
SPEAKER_02: They know that she did this three-day fast, they know that it was at this timing and all the references, sorry for the noise, references for um uh, you know, what it could be pertaining to.
36:11
SPEAKER_02: And they come out and they basically call her out on her shenanigans and they say, they say Mabel was fasting with the intent to kill King Henry VIII, our buddy, the current king on the throne.
36:25
SPEAKER_02: It's 1538.
36:27
SPEAKER_02: This is two years after Anne Boleyn was was beheaded.
36:29
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
36:30
SPEAKER_02: His current wife is Anna Cleves right now.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: No, he actually was in between wives because Jane Seymour died in 1537.
36:39
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: Right.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: And Anna Cleves wasn't until I think a few years later.
36:43
SPEAKER_02: Oh, and so he's literally in between life wives.
36:45
SPEAKER_02: He's mourning Jane Seymour, right?
36:46
SPEAKER_01: And at this time, too, in the Tudor period, uh Thomas Cromwell, who we've talked about, he was our episode finale last season.
36:53
SPEAKER_01: Um, he's doing the whole desolution of the monasteries thing.
36:56
SPEAKER_02: Oh, fun time.
36:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
36:58
SPEAKER_02: So great time to be alive in the world.
37:00
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, great time to be a Catholic, evidently, in England to be doing your extreme fasting and uh praying to saints.
37:06
SPEAKER_02: So they come out saying he was she was doing this fast with the intention to kill not only King Henry VIII, but also randomly the Duke of the Thomas Howard, the third Duke of Norfolk.
37:16
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, who's in balloon and Catherine Howard's uncle.
37:21
SPEAKER_02: Duke of Norfolk.
37:22
SPEAKER_02: Norfolk.
37:23
SPEAKER_02: I can never say that.
37:24
SPEAKER_02: Norfolk.
37:24
SPEAKER_02: I think it's Norfolk.
37:25
SPEAKER_02: Norfolk.
37:28
SPEAKER_02: The hard part is when we you only hear British people say it.
37:32
SPEAKER_02: You want to mimic the British accent to say it correctly.
37:34
SPEAKER_02: But like in American, is it Norfolk or Norfolk?
37:39
SPEAKER_02: Norfolk.
37:40
SPEAKER_02: Folk folklore.
37:43
SPEAKER_02: The Duke of Folk.
37:44
SPEAKER_02: Norfolk get about it.
37:47
SPEAKER_02: Norfolk get about it.
37:49
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, good.
37:49
SPEAKER_02: No, that didn't work like it did in my brain.
37:52
SPEAKER_02: Anyways, um, this guy, he's the douchebag who was the judge, one of the judges on trial for Ambern, her own uncle who did her out.
38:01
SPEAKER_02: So you know what?
38:02
SPEAKER_02: I'm not I'm not like for or against taking either of them out, but allegedly these are the people that she wanted dead in her life.
38:12
SPEAKER_02: Um, so and then that's what it comes out to, where Agnes is like, yo, this girl has a history, and she's not doing these fastings just for charitable work.
38:20
SPEAKER_02: She brings up again the man that she fasted trying to kill him or do a serious harm, and he ended up breaking his neck.
38:27
SPEAKER_02: And it turns into a full-on investigation.
38:30
SPEAKER_02: Right.
38:30
SPEAKER_02: Sir Ralph Eller, he starts this investigation very specifically on March 11th, 1538.
38:38
SPEAKER_02: He brings them to trial to York.
38:41
SPEAKER_02: And everyone up on trial, it's Mabel Brig, it's Isabel Buck, it's Isabel's husband, and her father-in-law.
38:50
SPEAKER_02: So her husband's father as well.
38:51
SPEAKER_02: Right.
38:52
SPEAKER_02: Because supposedly they were trying to like interfere and bribe as a part of the investigation.
38:57
SPEAKER_02: We don't know how or what they were trying to do.
38:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
39:00
SPEAKER_02: I'm assuming they were trying to pay off the investigator, like, just turn a blind eye.
39:04
SPEAKER_02: Yes, it's fine.
39:05
SPEAKER_02: It's not a big deal.
39:07
SPEAKER_02: I kind of want to take a moment to talk about what's going on in tutor history with allegations of witchcraft.
39:14
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
39:15
SPEAKER_02: Because that's what this is leading towards.
39:17
SPEAKER_02: On one hand, we have someone who claims that she is a pious Catholic woman and she was doing this fasting to help her friend.
39:23
SPEAKER_02: On the other hand, everyone else is saying, no, you're doing this fast as like satanic work.
39:31
SPEAKER_02: Right.
39:32
SPEAKER_02: To intentionally kill the king of England.
39:34
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
39:35
SPEAKER_01: And we have to remember at this time, like, when we talked about Anne Boleyn and her maybe involvement in the arts of black magic, like, this wasn't a thing yet, right?
39:46
SPEAKER_01: It's not like Salem witch trials where you could just be like witch.
39:49
SPEAKER_01: Like, no one really knew what that meant yet.
39:52
SPEAKER_01: Like they were still exploring the early foundations of like how you could accuse be accused of being a witch, like what it meant to be involved in dark art.
40:01
SPEAKER_01: So, like, it's still very new.
40:03
SPEAKER_01: People didn't quite label it correctly or know how to like speak about it, because it was just like she's doing something devious.
40:10
SPEAKER_03: We don't like it.
40:12
SPEAKER_01: It could be adultery, it could be like you know, it could be this and that.
40:15
SPEAKER_01: So it wasn't, I think, until a little bit later in history that they actually deemed it like, oh, it could be witchcraft.
40:21
SPEAKER_01: But they just like were starting to realize what that was at this time.
40:25
SPEAKER_02: Um, it wasn't really until James I of England slash James the Sixt of Scotland, but that was early.
40:32
SPEAKER_02: That was Mary Queen of Scots' son.
40:34
SPEAKER_02: Right.
40:35
SPEAKER_02: That was um early to mid-1600s, is when this started really getting getting down to it.
40:42
SPEAKER_02: Um, but Henry did have speculations about witchcraft, and it's kind of a fine line because I think the tutors are known for being very in tune with alchemy and astrology and predictions, even.
40:57
SPEAKER_02: Um that was more deemed like science.
40:59
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it it was this fine line of when is it used for dark arts and bad intentions, and when is it used to make good in the world and predict good things, and you're just using the science of the stars and alchemy and all of that.
41:14
SPEAKER_02: So it kind of like it there's blurred, there's there's there's blurred lines for sure.
41:20
SPEAKER_02: And um, you know, we can also use Elizabeth Barton as an example.
41:23
SPEAKER_02: Oh perfect example.
41:25
SPEAKER_01: We we reference Elizabeth Barton in our first season, the Nun of Kent, if you remember her.
41:31
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I think they're put in the same bucket at this time of like like Elizabeth Barton was having, I think, visions, right, of King Henry VIII dying, and because she was very public about all of that, like she was executed.
41:46
SPEAKER_01: So I think they threw a bunch of women in this big group of like, these are women that are up to no good.
41:53
SPEAKER_01: They're making predictions about the king's death, like they're treasonous.
41:57
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
41:58
SPEAKER_02: And that is where again, where how is this being used for?
42:03
SPEAKER_02: I feel like Henry got he he saw it as bad whenever people wanted him dead, but it was good when they were using these powers to be like manifests.
42:15
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um, all of that.
42:16
SPEAKER_02: So I'm gonna jump ahead just a little bit and then we're gonna get back to Mabel.
42:21
SPEAKER_02: So bear with us, we're going around the timeline a little bit.
42:24
SPEAKER_02: So so Mabel is in 1538.
42:27
SPEAKER_02: Fast forward a few years later into 1542, you can tell which witchcraft is still really heavy on Henry VIII's mind.
42:35
SPEAKER_02: Right.
42:35
SPEAKER_02: So at this time, while witchcraft was really big in Germany, in Eastern Europe, in France, and Spain, it it really wasn't significant in England.
42:47
SPEAKER_02: However, Henry did release an act where he claimed any type of witchery is a felony and it was like an automatic death sentence.
43:01
SPEAKER_02: Right.
43:02
SPEAKER_02: Regardless of how you were using the witchcraft or potions or prophecies or whatever it is that you were dabbling in.
43:09
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
43:10
SPEAKER_02: Um, something that was also kind of a big deal at that time because witchcraft was something that you could be tried for, like Mabel.
43:18
SPEAKER_02: But in this act, it's called um the Henry VIII Witchcraft Act, so very to the point.
43:26
SPEAKER_02: Very literal.
43:27
SPEAKER_02: Um he actually removes the right of a benefit of clergy.
43:33
SPEAKER_02: And what that means is prior to this act being released, if someone was accused of witchcraft and they were sentenced to death, if they were able to read a passage from the Bible, they could spare themselves from death because it was proof that they weren't a witch.
43:49
SPEAKER_01: They had a lot of weird tests to prove if you're a witch or not.
43:52
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and that was kind of a big deal to people because they're like, oh gosh, like they don't even have an out, it's just automatic death.
43:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
43:58
SPEAKER_02: Um Some torture techniques that they really started using during this period of time as well to just to prove if someone was a witch.
44:06
SPEAKER_02: Um, the sleep deprivation, just keeping them up for days at a time, dunking, which was dipping them in the water.
44:13
SPEAKER_01: And this one we've talked about before.
44:15
SPEAKER_01: It was like if you drowned, it proved you weren't a witch, but then you're dead.
44:21
SPEAKER_01: And if you floated, it proved you were a witch, so you would live, but then they'd kill you anyway, because you're a witch.
44:27
SPEAKER_01: It was like it was a really situation there.
44:31
SPEAKER_01: Sophisticated techniques.
44:32
SPEAKER_02: I like this word, pili winks.
44:34
SPEAKER_00: I don't know that one.
44:35
SPEAKER_02: It's basically thumb screws.
44:37
SPEAKER_00: Ew.
44:38
SPEAKER_02: But it sounds better when you say pili winks.
44:40
SPEAKER_02: Cutesy.
44:41
SPEAKER_02: We're gonna put you into pili winks.
44:42
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna put little piliwink on you.
44:44
SPEAKER_02: Um wrenching, which is when they put the rope with a knot and would tie it on your neck and suffocate you.
44:51
SPEAKER_02: They would do it just enough.
44:52
SPEAKER_02: This is just to get confessions out of people.
44:54
SPEAKER_02: This isn't to kill, this is just torture.
44:55
SPEAKER_02: Oh, pricking, they stick needles in you and see if acupuncture.
45:01
SPEAKER_02: Places that didn't cause pain or bleeding meant that you were a witch.
45:05
SPEAKER_02: That's insane.
45:07
SPEAKER_02: Amongst other things.
45:08
SPEAKER_02: So, anyways, that that's what's going on.
45:10
SPEAKER_02: Um so Henry puts in the witchcraft act, his son Edward VI, actually repeals the part about the benefit like removing the benefit of clergy to kind of show like how big of a deal that was.
45:22
SPEAKER_02: They're like, I'm gonna like stick that little clause back in there.
45:24
SPEAKER_02: Oh, jeez.
45:25
SPEAKER_02: Um, 1562, Elizabeth is on the throne, right?
45:29
SPEAKER_02: And she put pulls out the act against conjurations, enchantments, and witchcraft.
45:36
SPEAKER_02: It's like no congregating enchantments.
45:38
SPEAKER_02: No congregating, no conjurations.
45:41
SPEAKER_02: And she actually makes it a little bit um easier for people, which is weird because during this time, this is right before James, so it hasn't hit its peak yet, but she actually kind of regressed on what her father did.
45:53
SPEAKER_02: There was still all the acts of like, yes, witchery can be a felony, but she she implemented that the death penalty was only when harm is caused.
46:02
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
46:03
SPEAKER_02: And lesser offenses would just get imprisonment.
46:06
SPEAKER_01: So if you're just doing witchcraft for a non-harmful way, it's cool.
46:10
SPEAKER_02: It's cool.
46:10
SPEAKER_02: It's cool.
46:11
SPEAKER_02: We're cool with that.
46:12
SPEAKER_02: But if you're trying to say, I want the king of the king of England dead and the random Duke of Norfolk, yeah, then you will go to the gallows.
46:22
SPEAKER_01: We have to remember that like all monarchs are super paranoid at this time and they think everyone is trying to kill them.
46:27
SPEAKER_01: That's true, especially Henry.
46:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, whether it's through poisoning their food or praying you know for their death, like anything that you do to imply the monarch may or like might die, like you die.
46:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's kind of how how it worked.
46:43
SPEAKER_01: So most of our tutor episodes are all about treason, they're all about wishing the king dead, they're all about trying to change the order of succession.
46:51
SPEAKER_01: Like, that is essentially what it boils down to.
46:54
SPEAKER_01: Like, if you're a person who speaks ill against the king, who has visions about you know the death of the king, whatever it could be, no matter how small, like you're the one that's going to die.
47:05
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
47:05
SPEAKER_01: So you gotta be careful, and that's why I think so many people like in this time they just live in fear of their monarchs.
47:12
SPEAKER_01: Like they live in fear of the hierarchy because they're like, Well, I can't speak against the king, I can't demonstrate against the king, I can't do anything except for live my little like servient, you know, subservient life, because otherwise you're you're dead.
47:26
SPEAKER_01: And there's and they make it very public, which is what we can kind of get down to the end of this story.
47:31
SPEAKER_01: Sure, yeah, take us home.
47:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
47:33
SPEAKER_01: So so what happens to our girl Mabel?
47:35
SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, sh after the whole investigation concludes, they find that both Mabel and Isabel Buck are guilty.
47:43
SPEAKER_01: And so they essentially say, like, again, after even though the bribes were trying to happen with Mabel or Isabel's husband and her father-in-law, um, Isabel's punishment was eventually canceled, but Mabel didn't really have anyone to speak for her, right?
47:58
SPEAKER_01: Like, she's a widow.
47:59
SPEAKER_01: So Mabel was sentenced to hang for treason.
48:03
SPEAKER_01: Slash again, witchcraft, which wasn't really articulated, but that's there.
48:07
SPEAKER_01: There's remnants of witchcraft accusations.
48:10
SPEAKER_01: Um, so she's uh sentenced to be executed at York on April 7th, 1538.
48:18
SPEAKER_01: So she goes to the site of the execution and she's actually hanged until strangled, right?
48:23
SPEAKER_01: So she's not just snapping her neck, she sits there for a while.
48:27
SPEAKER_02: I wonder how long, because we've heard stories where it could even take, it could take like an hour, hours, or even half the day, and family members would come and like pull on their feet to try to make it happen faster.
48:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's it's pretty wild.
48:40
SPEAKER_01: Um, I actually had that question recently.
48:43
SPEAKER_01: We were watching a movie, and someone was like, Oh, so do they, you know, how how does it work?
48:48
SPEAKER_01: Is the neck just snap?
48:49
SPEAKER_01: I was like, Well, there's multiple ways.
48:51
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, and if you go to our blackjack catch them episode, either is a specific way the noose should be hang in terms of the length of the next one.
48:58
SPEAKER_01: Oh, if someone asked you about this?
48:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:59
SPEAKER_02: I love that you're an expert on hanging.
49:01
SPEAKER_01: I am an expert now, and I was like, there's a table that shows you, according to the height and weight of the person, how long the rope should be.
49:07
SPEAKER_01: And if they got it wrong, you can either, yeah, if they get it wrong, you either strangle or you decapitate.
49:12
unknown: Yeah.
49:12
SPEAKER_01: If the the correct way is to, you know, have someone just neck snap, but it's not as easy as it sounds.
49:19
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, um, so she's so she had to strangle for a while, and apparently there were like hundreds of people that showed up to her very public execution.
49:27
SPEAKER_01: And again, King Henry wanted this, right?
49:29
SPEAKER_01: Even if he wasn't the one that specifically said, like, this is how she should die.
49:33
SPEAKER_01: Everyone who works for King Henry VIII in his court, like they know this is the intention, is to cause that fear, to cause that like that scare.
49:43
SPEAKER_01: So that way you know you don't talk bad about the king, you don't prophesize about the king's death.
49:48
SPEAKER_01: No matter what scale you do it, even if you say you're just fasting for a charitable cause.
49:53
SPEAKER_01: Better be damn clear what that cause is.
49:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like you, yeah, you better say at the beginning, like this is what the cause is, and it's not King Henry VIII.
50:00
SPEAKER_01: I want him to live.
50:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
50:02
SPEAKER_01: Is anything that suggests otherwise leads you to that that fate?
50:06
SPEAKER_01: And to be clear, if she were a man, she'd be hang-drawn and quartered, which we've talked about in depth on a lot of episodes.
50:14
SPEAKER_01: And that is not a pleasant way to go out.
50:16
SPEAKER_01: So she's a little bit lucky that she just got a standard hanging.
50:20
SPEAKER_02: To be clear, that was for treason.
50:22
SPEAKER_02: Like yeah, the hang-drawn and quartering was for treason with the hang by strangling for treason for a woman.
50:28
SPEAKER_01: Which she was, yeah, treasonous.
50:30
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's just that it was like this like weird mix of treason with like a dash of witchcraft.
50:36
SPEAKER_01: Sprinkle in a little witchcraft, which we're which we still don't understand, but we're gonna throw that at you.
50:42
SPEAKER_01: Right.
50:42
SPEAKER_02: It's it's it's kind of a just a bizarre situation.
50:46
SPEAKER_02: And again, like I realize the story isn't very thick, but the reason that I liked it was there's not a lot of stories of women in tutor history besides the major queens who spoke out against King Henry VIII.
51:00
SPEAKER_02: Right.
51:00
SPEAKER_02: I think we have Elizabeth Barton, now we have Mabel Brig.
51:03
SPEAKER_02: Anne Askew.
51:04
SPEAKER_02: Anne Askew.
51:05
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you have a few that it's a few.
51:07
SPEAKER_01: It's either for religious reasons or somewhat treasonous reasons.
51:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
51:12
SPEAKER_02: There was one other story I found of a woman, but there was so there was like three sentences I could find about her.
51:17
SPEAKER_02: I'm like, if we were to make a 50-minute episode on that, I think people might poke their eyeballs out.
51:22
SPEAKER_02: It's a lot of tangents.
51:23
SPEAKER_02: Uh but I I I do think like it says something that the fact that there is so little on it, I don't know.
51:31
SPEAKER_02: It makes me think I don't know where I'm going with this.
51:35
SPEAKER_02: It it makes me think that women are just seen so little in history, maybe that they can't even carve out enough.
51:43
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
51:44
SPEAKER_01: Well, that's what's frustrating, I think, when we look back at these episodes about specifically witches, a lot of them are widows.
51:51
SPEAKER_01: Because I mean, think about like Isabel Buck in this story.
51:54
SPEAKER_01: Isabel Isabel Buck could have been very much a protagonist in the story where we talk about her life, her death, her execution.
52:02
SPEAKER_01: But guess what?
52:02
SPEAKER_01: She had like a husband who was willing to bribe the investigators, and she got off and no one knows what happened to her.
52:08
SPEAKER_01: So it's unfortunate that a lot of the witches and women executions that we've covered have been widows.
52:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, because they have no one to stand up for them, they have no man on their side to speak up for them, which is awful.
52:20
SPEAKER_01: Like you think you should be able to speak to yours for yourself.
52:23
SPEAKER_01: And this isn't that long ago.
52:24
SPEAKER_01: This is only a few hundred years ago.
52:26
SPEAKER_02: It's a little, I mean, it's like 500 years ago.
52:28
SPEAKER_01: No, but in terms of like the history of the earth, the fact that women are like, you know.
52:32
SPEAKER_02: Think about just a hundred years ago, not even think about today this is happening.
52:36
SPEAKER_02: No, yeah.
52:37
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
52:38
SPEAKER_02: I think I'm not shocked, I guess is what I'm saying.
52:41
SPEAKER_02: But there's still a wage gap, let us not forget.
52:45
SPEAKER_02: It's still an issue to this day, but um, they do think that they, the inevitable them out there, yeah, potentially Locker, his his her employer, Locker, the John and Agnes.
52:58
SPEAKER_02: There's gotta be more going on because they think that they egged a lot of this on.
53:03
SPEAKER_02: Because they were the ones that sounded the alarm six months later.
53:05
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, six months later.
53:06
SPEAKER_02: Like, what were you like festering for so long that you came up with these allegations?
53:12
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and they yeah, they threw her out under the bus about it.
53:17
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
53:17
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's one thing to like do it as soon as she did the fast.
53:21
SPEAKER_01: Like, hey, we we we suspect something fishy here, let's like sound the alarm.
53:26
SPEAKER_01: But the fact that they waited a while, and like who knows if they didn't have a vendetta against the Buck family, like they don't know, and they must have really hated her.
53:35
SPEAKER_02: I think really hate someone to do this, yeah.
53:38
SPEAKER_01: And in these days, again, I mean that's why they call it a witch hunt, right?
53:41
SPEAKER_01: Because you could just say, like, hey, witch, and immediately everyone's drawn to that person, yeah, you know, in a negative way, and they hunt them down.
53:50
SPEAKER_02: They're burning all of the witches, even if you aren't one.
53:53
SPEAKER_02: So light me up.
53:56
SPEAKER_02: Light me up.
53:57
SPEAKER_02: Go ahead, light me up.
54:00
SPEAKER_02: Welcome to my life, everybody.
54:01
SPEAKER_02: I can probably speak in only Taylor Swift.
54:04
SPEAKER_02: It comes back to this all the time.
54:05
SPEAKER_02: It's a talent.
54:08
SPEAKER_02: I have a shirt that says that.
54:09
SPEAKER_02: It says light me up.
54:10
SPEAKER_02: No, it says they're burning all of the witches, even if you aren't one, and then there's like skeletons in the middle, and they're like meh, and they're on fire.
54:19
SPEAKER_02: And then no, there's like in the corner on the side it says so light me up.
54:23
SPEAKER_00: So then there's this like iridescent like LED light that shows up and it says so light me up, and the back says, light me up.
54:31
SPEAKER_00: That would be cool.
54:32
SPEAKER_00: I should make that.
54:34
SPEAKER_01: It only cost$150 on the Taylor Swift website.
54:37
SPEAKER_01: It's called Taylor Nation, first of all.
54:40
SPEAKER_01: I'm sorry, I don't know any of this.
54:41
SPEAKER_01: I'll educate you.
54:42
SPEAKER_01: It's okay.
54:43
SPEAKER_01: I like that people think I'm a Swifty, by the way, because of my association with you.
54:47
SPEAKER_01: Like that as a compliment.
54:48
SPEAKER_01: Everyone's like, oh my gosh, have you heard this thing about and I'm like, oh, this and this about Taylor Swift?
54:53
SPEAKER_01: And like, yeah, oh my gosh, do you know because you're Swifty?
54:56
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, no, I'm like, I personally, you know, I don't dislike Taylor Swift.
55:00
SPEAKER_01: I like the lady who doesn't.
55:03
SPEAKER_01: But Megan is my Taylor Swift aficionado, so I'm always like, oh no, I just know this because my friend tells me every tiny detail about what she was whispering at the Golden Globes.
55:13
SPEAKER_01: That's important shit.
55:14
SPEAKER_02: And I won't get into it.
55:16
SPEAKER_02: I'm not a new Swifty, I've been a Swifty since 2013.
55:20
SPEAKER_02: So Congratulations.
55:21
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
55:22
SPEAKER_02: Congratulations.
55:23
SPEAKER_02: The same year I lost my shoe and my my bracelet.
55:25
SPEAKER_02: Thought you were gonna say something entirely different.
55:28
SPEAKER_02: I guess I got married.
55:31
SPEAKER_02: How was it year before?
55:33
SPEAKER_01: Secondary to the praying to France, St.
55:35
SPEAKER_01: Francis.
55:36
SPEAKER_01: We should also double check that it was Saint Francis, because I'm gonna feel like a jerk of this whole episode we referenced him and he doesn't get the credit.
55:42
SPEAKER_02: Saint of Lost Items.
55:46
SPEAKER_01: Saint Anthony of Padua.
55:48
SPEAKER_01: Saint Padua.
55:49
SPEAKER_01: Padua.
55:50
SPEAKER_01: Um city in Italy, I think.
55:53
SPEAKER_02: We were wrong.
55:54
SPEAKER_02: St.
55:54
SPEAKER_02: Anthony is the one she wrote to you.
55:56
SPEAKER_02: If if you were listening to the top of the episode and you were screaming, these dumb women don't know anything.
56:02
SPEAKER_02: These dumb Americans don't know.
56:03
SPEAKER_02: We can now correct ourselves in the same episode.
56:06
SPEAKER_02: It is Saint Anthony.
56:07
SPEAKER_02: As you all know, we learn over time.
56:10
SPEAKER_02: Patron saint of lost and stolen articles.
56:13
SPEAKER_02: Not just lost, but also stolen.
56:15
SPEAKER_00: Oh, powerful Franciscan preacher and teacher.
56:18
SPEAKER_00: Excellent.
56:19
SPEAKER_02: Elizabeth.
56:25
SPEAKER_02: We we I'm trying to finish here.
56:28
SPEAKER_02: Any final words.
56:31
SPEAKER_02: So let me uh let me uh