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59. Raquel Schlosser on Transgenerational Trauma and Family Constellations · Constellations and all that...

• 0:00
  Kiona and welcome to Constellations and all that. I'm your host, Tracy Cartwright, and together we will be exploring the world of family constellations with facilitators for and clients from around the world, looking at different perspectives and experiences in the work, having a cup of tea, and just chatting with some friends around their experiences in constellations. Tracy Cartwright: We'd love for you to join us. I hope that you enjoy Raquel Schlosser: this series as much as I have loved making it. Tracy Cartwright: Kiata, everyone. Welcome to Constellations and all that. Today is the 13th of January as I'm recording this, and I'm so excited, so excited to be chatting with this amazing, beautiful woman in front of me here today. Raquel Schlosser. Welcome Raquel. Thank you so much for agreeing to be here with me today. Raquel Schlosser: Thank you. Thank you. And it's, um, it's a pleasure. It's a really
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  honor to be so far and so close at the same time. Tracy Cartwright: Uh, isn't technology amazing, isn't it? Oh, I'd love for you to introduce yourself to everyone. Uh, just tell them a little bit about you, whatever's there for you so that the listeners and the viewers, 'cause this will also be on YouTube as well, um, can get a little hint of who you are. Raquel Schlosser: I'm very far, I'm in Mexico and one day behind. By the way, here, it's like four o'clock or three 30 of the. Tracy Cartwright: 12th Raquel Schlosser: of January and you have the 13th of January, right? Tuesday. So it's amazing what we can do on time. I'm Mexican. I am a pioneer in Mexico. The family constellations, professional constellations had been honored with a lot of gratitude in my life because I work in my fashion, which is the a
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  constellation field I developed. Raquel Schlosser: When I was looking at the constellation field, I understood that it was so wide, what was happening there that I started to find beside the great, my great master Henninger that I was for 10 years traveling with him. I was one. His, um, close circle. I translated for him a lot of, uh, documents, books. There's one book that we were sitting Palm Majorca and they were very hard constellation and that book it's called, it was very nice. Raquel Schlosser: He says that Rachel, weak thing for her children. In that one, um, he asked me to write, to correct and to write things inside of the book. I said, no way. I mean, you did the constellations. I will not touch it, but I will put, I will write
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  edit notes to explain more because I was already into the topic of the perspective and the dynamics between victims and perpetrators and yeah. Raquel Schlosser: Domestic violence and I was, uh, working with very hard. Situations in Mexico and abroad with survivors of G with people that were running away from political persecutions with children's, uh, children and grandchildren of Nazis, or people that were. Third or fourth generation of the Civil War. So I started to specialize in how the social and cultural fields have their dialogue in our bodies, on our, uh, behavior, in our feelings in, I started to see that
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  systemic is not enough, because this is not about interaction. Raquel Schlosser: This is about the big inheritance. Of the novels of other people talking and feeling. So sometimes it's not about the language, it's about what's not said, what was hidden, what, what's silent, and it comes out in different language. So I made myself a translator.
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  systemic is not enough, because this is not about interaction. Raquel Schlosser: Of the hidden dynamics. Sometimes not of love, but of the confusions of love, the jail of love, the closed doors of love. Tracy Cartwright: The closed doors of love. Exactly. Those are the ones that we don't recognize. Right? Raquel Schlosser: Exactly. We, we try to go through and we always get hit by them. They're transparent, but they agree.
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  And, and sometimes, uh, and, and I, I trained many interesting groups. I trained groups here with a ministry of, of, uh, justice Forum, domestic Violence Institute of of Women. Raquel Schlosser: And I work with, um, survivors. There was Gorilla, uh, like 80 years ago. So survivors of, of, of Gorilla? Of the Gorilla. Oh, the gorillas. Tracy Cartwright: Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: The Tracy Cartwright: gorilla. Um, Raquel Schlosser: on the mountains. Tracy Cartwright: Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: Yes, on the mountains. So I have a lot of experience in, Hmm. Political pain, the pain that it's caused for political reasons, cultural reasons, and gender perspective. Raquel Schlosser: No gender violence reasons like abused children and abused
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  women. So it's, um, and then everyone ask me if I don't get depressed after what I work and I say, no, no, no. You can't imagine what is being in a field. That you know that you can open hope. That's the most important thing. And they asked me, well, will they heal? Raquel Schlosser: I said, I'm not looking for healing. I'm looking for advancing.
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  women. So it's, um, and then everyone ask me if I don't get depressed after what I work and I say, no, no, no. You can't imagine what is being in a field. That you know that you can open hope. That's the most important thing. And they asked me, well, will they heal? Raquel Schlosser: And they conquer of more faith for freedom, for free choice. So this is what I'm looking for. So maybe. You are not ready to change everything, but you're ready to advance. Maybe you cannot look for, you know, you, you, we are very contaminated by the psychology, where every week you're looking for changes. Raquel Schlosser: Sometimes conscience has
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  its own speed, so it's very important that you see what you see. You understand it. The multi-generational field. One day you find yourself doing things differently. It is not cause effect. It is the conscience of peace is what we work in. The institute I'm the head of and founder of the. Raquel Schlosser: Institute of Transgenerational studies. As I told you, I'm the pioneer. I didn't know really. I didn't look for it. It, it became an information for me when I did it. But we, I'm the pioneer in the professional field and constellations, and I'm pioneer in many ways because we are not exchanging one diploma for one master degree. Raquel Schlosser: We really have all the system. In a new, um, career that we form when we
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  have it in Mexico, it's called transgenerational psychology. Wow. So the people that come out of my institute, which is. Um, a very broad one because it's multi multidisciplinary. The people that go out from my institute, they go out as transgenerational psychologists. Raquel Schlosser: Oh. And we have four master degrees. One is in transgenerational and psychology on family and couples.
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  have it in Mexico, it's called transgenerational psychology. Wow. So the people that come out of my institute, which is. Um, a very broad one because it's multi multidisciplinary. The people that go out from my institute, they go out as transgenerational psychologists. Raquel Schlosser: The other one, transgeneration psychology. For organizations and institutions. Mm-hmm. Transgeneration, psychology. The other one, which is amazing for health and psycho genealogy, and the first one has to do with a specialization, which is the first year of all of them. Raquel Schlosser: And it's amazing to have like all the different approaches. Tracy Cartwright: Yeah. Raquel Schlosser:
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  Brought in a big career and they can have. Different, um, knowledge of this, uh, amazing field. I'm a psychologist for 45 years, 46 years, Tracy Cartwright: boy. Wow. Raquel Schlosser: And in the transnational field, I'm already 30 years. Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Raquel Schlosser: And so that's amazing. Every Monday for the last 27 years, I'm here at the institute every Monday from five to nine. Raquel Schlosser: I have. Workshop of Constellations. Wow. And I'm so happy that I will be with you in April. Very happy. Uh, before COVID, I traveled a lot. We export a lot. Also knowledge. I was in Austria, Spain, Israel, um, where was I? Germany and South America, central America. And in many states
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  of Mexico. After COVID, you know, all the world like stopped and now we are starting again. Raquel Schlosser: So I am really honored that you invited me to your country and to share and to spend time and to see the marvelous, um. Society that you have built. Tracy Cartwright: Thank you. We are so excited that you're coming as well. So excited. I had the pleasure of meeting you in Mexico and um, there's just so much radiance and knowledge and um, I was just sitting there and awe of, and listening to you. Tracy Cartwright: I could have listened to you for days and days. Yeah. Really, really grateful that you've said yes to coming to our immersion in April this year. That's really cool. Lemme jump into a question here. How did you first meet constellations? You know,
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  I, 'cause I, for me, I feel like Constellations finds you, right? Tracy Cartwright: I think the field, Raquel Schlosser: well, I, it's very interesting because I was not even thinking on that. I came to mix, uh, um, in, I was, uh, studying in an, in a very interesting institute. They gave co energetics. A friend of mine calls me and said, you know, they're going to be here with IE. Kremer. She was the one that brought first constellations into Mexico City, ie. Raquel Schlosser: Kremer. Very interesting because she had an institute and I was studying I some DI diploma there, and they invited me to the group and I said, well, you know, for. I'm a Mexican, but I am a Jew and uh, my father is an Auschwitz survivor, so the one thing that I don't want is to study with Germans. You know, it was like very hard at the beginning. Raquel Schlosser: So, but I decided to go because I love to be in the first
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  groups of everything. I studied with the first group of systemic and very entrepreneurs. So first group of psychoanalysis that had to do with. More with the social field. I was in a university that was just funded in the four generation. I was the, in that university with a very social vision. Raquel Schlosser: And so I said, well, let's see what it is. So when I saw the first time what they were working, I said very interesting because I had separate my, my humanitarian and political work. That was, uh, I was one of the pioneers in sex education in Mexico. So in an institution I was one of, we were 30 or 20 people doing it, and for a whole country, and I was in that group also. Raquel Schlosser: I was only. 24 years
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  old and Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Raquel Schlosser: Well, I, I, I think I like challenges in my life. So that was a big one in a very Catholic country. Starting sex education in institutions was a great thing then. Tracy Cartwright: Yes. Raquel Schlosser: And, and going through prejudice and understanding what what's happening in with the groups, so. I was working also in NGOs.
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  old and Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Raquel Schlosser: Well, I, I, I think I like challenges in my life. So that was a big one in a very Catholic country. Starting sex education in institutions was a great thing then. Tracy Cartwright: Yes. Raquel Schlosser: Raquel Schlosser: Uh, so I have a lot of grassroots information of what was happening in our country. I travel in all the countries, so I said it's when I saw what was happening in the field of constellations, I understood since the minute one, that my professional work as systemic psychologist. My understanding of psychoanalysis, my experience in grassroots and NGOs with a
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  social vision and my gender perspective as a very open feminist, but, uh, what gender perspective of what was happening of injustice in this world through violence in the families convinced me. Raquel Schlosser: To be in this path. Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Raquel Schlosser: So I, during my, these two years, I didn't connect totally with the group because I had like my, I connected very nicely, but I had my own agenda that had to do with human rights also. So once I finished the two years, I remember one day I woke up. I said my, to my husband, it was like that I'm changing my life. Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Raquel Schlosser: My professional life. He said, what, seven o'clock in the morning? Yes. I'm changing because,
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  you know, I was innovator. So they hire me in the institutions to create new projects. To do new things. Mm-hmm. And I got international fundings for that. So I made a very interesting, very big, um, soap opera radio, soap opera in those days. Raquel Schlosser: It was a digital, it was radio soap, opera, opera. And I had a script writer and writers, and it was a, I had a crew of like 170 people. The project just finished. I said to my husband, I close here my international path with I had funding from un, from wow, from unicef, from many, many International MacArthur Foundation Path. Raquel Schlosser: I said, I'm going full-time into
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  family constellations. So it was very interesting because I had my NGO, so in the building that I had, that I lived before I was married, I had my, my neighbors that I was renting in, and they called me and they said, you know, Raquel, we need to leave. They were from Spain. We need to travel back. Raquel Schlosser: Said, don't worry, I have a notary here. So I came that morning. He received me without an appointment. I said, I want to change the name of my NGO. And my NGO was center of Center of Research and studies for sexuality to center of family constellations and health. So I changed the NGOI started to work and it was not like, what is today? Tracy Cartwright: Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: Do you know what it. According to 100 people, I had a very, very big, uh, group of people. I've been working in institutions
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  in NGOs, so, and I was 30, my daughter was a year old. I was 39 or 40. So I had a whole, um, a lot of experience in groups before. So during the month, I call like 100 people. I had like eight coming to Constellations. Raquel Schlosser: No. And next month the same, and next month the same until it is what it is today. So I don't announce my Mondays, they're full. Always. I get cases. No one pays for coming to help. The only ones that pay us, the ones that I'm working, I receive six people. We work. Sometimes I have 40 people coming 30, 20. If it drains too much, 10. Raquel Schlosser: But for the last 27 years, I always have a group to work with people. Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Wow.
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  Raquel Schlosser: So that's how it started. And then it was amazing how I met BET Inger. Tracy Cartwright: Yes. Raquel Schlosser: That was my Tracy Cartwright: next question. How did you meet Raquel Schlosser: Hellinger? I know it was without planning. Started to see that in that group, the person who was giving it all the time repeated the same end, the same end, the same end. Raquel Schlosser: And I was very curious. So, you know, internet, it was not like it is today. So what I did. Is my husband went. He was very organized. He went to sleep at 11. My daughter, my baby, she was less than 1-year-old. She went to sleep. One, one and a half. Yes, one and a half when I started to study, so she was maybe two years old. Raquel Schlosser: When I started to go every night at 11 o'clock, I sat in the internet looking for more information for me was not enough.
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  What we were seeing. It was good, but not enough. Everything was in German, so I started to write to everyone. To everyone. Do you have information in English? Do you have information in English? Raquel Schlosser: So Don asked me how I came. It was a very private, I came to the private, um, email of Susie Tucker that was the editor. Of the first book in English in in of Hellinger. She's in New York, and she writes me back and says, how did you get my private email? I said, I answered, I don't know, and just writing to everyone. Raquel Schlosser: So she said, hon Honing, which is a person that we have to honor in this field, was driving. I'm sorry, who? Tracy Cartwright: Can you say that again? Raquel Schlosser: Harold? Harold Honing. Tracy Cartwright: Harris Honan. Okay. Raquel Schlosser: Har Honan. I'm, I'm te I will tell you why. He was traveling
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  with Heener everywhere with his camera, and he was making videos of everything that Bert was teaching every workshop around the world. Raquel Schlosser: So Harold was going to go to New York to open the East coast for Hellinger for the next. He was first going to open, Susie was going to organize a workshop, so she tells me, why don't you come to the workshop? I said, are you crazy? I already did two years. I thought that I knew a lot, and then I called a friend of mine that I love her, and I said to her, you know. Raquel Schlosser: You have some shit going on in your life, so why don't you go to this workshop? It will help you. And she said, she calls me back and she said, why don't you come with me? I said, are you crazy? Who has money to go to New York for four days and back and forth.
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  Said, I'm going to, I have an apartment for you in New York from a friend of mine and you have point, you know, to fly. Raquel Schlosser: We arrange everything. She came from Washington to New York. We went to the workshop. I get into the workshop and we are in the first round with Harold, and I said my name and he says, what are you a schlosser? I said, what did I do wrong? Said Every place we get with Hellinger, they ask us if we have something in English because there's a Mexican all the time intensely. Raquel Schlosser: For information. So you are the one I said, yes. Har, this is me. So he said, I have a present for you from Hellinger. We just came back from Chile and this is the transcript of the workshop in Spanish on organizations in Chile. And this is the
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  transcript of something else somewhere else in Spanish. Here you have it. Raquel Schlosser: Boom. He gave me. Booklet very well organized. I said, I can't believe this is a treasure. This is through Harold that was traveling with Bert, um, is how I met him. But I didn't mean, I mean, what happened is that when we finished the workshop, I said to her, I've been studying for two years and I never seen anything that you are what you did here. Raquel Schlosser: Every conation was different. He said to me, because I'm traveling with Bert all the time, I see many different things he's advancing all the time. And so I said to her, so why don't we sit and you come to teach in Mexico? So he always, um, was
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  laughing at me because he said, he said to my groups. Once Raquel wants something, it's impossible to say no. Raquel Schlosser: She offered me anything I wanted. Anything I needed. So it is not an intensity, but it was the group. So we sat, we do it, da, da, da. And one day he asked me by if I have my curriculum, I said, yes.
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  laughing at me because he said, he said to my groups. Once Raquel wants something, it's impossible to say no. Raquel Schlosser: Why? Because Bert wants to know who you are. So nice. You know, it was not easy then, but don't ask me why, but I had just translated into English, my curriculum in fax. Raquel Schlosser: Remember the faxes? Tracy Cartwright: Yes. Yeah. Your, your cv. We would, yeah. Raquel Schlosser: So I sent my 12 pages of just translated I was
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  a nerd. Always learning, working. I had two jobs at the same time, plus patience, plus I had a lot of work. I loved what I do, so I had, my days were off 29 days, not 29 hours. So few sleep and a lot of passion. Raquel Schlosser: And so I sent it to him and I told him my project was. To try to bring this word to underprivileged people because I understood it doesn't need, not as charity, but as a project that will last long term and have an impact. So I had a design for that and told you that 11 o'clock to one o'clock in the morning and at. Raquel Schlosser: Seven, I was already quarter to seven, waking up my girl to take her
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  to school or to whatever nursing school, and I receive an email from Bert. I will support your project. So he came to Mexico the first time. I didn't organize the first day, first time. But he decided to spend his two free days with me and my family, which I was honored. Raquel Schlosser: He met my father and as an Auschwitz survivor. And I had the most impressive moment because let me see if I, I have the book here. I will show you in a minute if I have the book here, bring it to you. But, uh, it was amazing because. I was sitting with Harold, me, it was my husband there, and Bert my father, and suddenly I hear my father talking to Heger in German. Tracy Cartwright: Mm.
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  Raquel Schlosser: I said, what? See? My father said, do you speak German? He said, yes. That was my mother tongue with my mother. She spoke German better than Polish. And I said. I'm more than 40, and I never knew you speak German. Wow. You can understand why. Tracy Cartwright: Yeah. Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: It was a very touching moment, and Harold took us the picture of that moment, which is in a book for children. Raquel Schlosser: That I wrote after going to, to, I was invited with Remar for the Congress in, um, the first big, big Congress that it was done in. It was the second one in Germany. And before that, har told me, you know, why don't we take your father to Auschwitz? Wow. I will cancel to everything and take Tracy Cartwright: you, yeah. Raquel Schlosser: So
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  my father, his wife, me, Carl, and a Polish guy that spoke different languages, German also went with us and it was a very, very touching, very touching trip. Raquel Schlosser: On the way back, I kept on writing things about that Congress, what I was going to give in my speech. In my conference, and it was amazing because just before I left, I had for the first time here a cons. The second time, a constellation related to victims and perpetrators of the war of the Nazis. And it was an amazing experience. Raquel Schlosser: I saw what was happening with the representatives, so before they stood and they start to talk, I gave to each one a paper and asked them to write down
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  what was going on. When they were in silent, they were all victims, and it was so amazing. So amazing because the first victim said that he was in silence, scared but listening to the screaming of the third person that was there. Raquel Schlosser: And when I saw the paper of the third one, she was saying. I was screaming like hell because I was burning alive. Wow. Tracy Cartwright: Wow, wow. Raquel Schlosser: So I had the testimony for me in a case study for me that this field is very powerful, brings a lot of information that was hidden silent, and then I decided that this is my path of life. Raquel Schlosser: That was the first conference that I gave
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  there loss. All the reflections that I had, all the ideas coming back from Auschwitz to the family Constellation Congress, you know, I was the only Latin Mexican they gave me. Very nice. That invite me. When I had the last, uh, participation conference before the dance, before, you know, the opening, the, the closures closing. Raquel Schlosser: Yeah. With the dinner. So it was amazing for me because there were not many people, so it was good. It was the first time that I was going to give a conference in English in Germany, and my father was there. My father came with me to the conference. I. Talked and the conference was from Auschwitz to Family Constellations. Raquel Schlosser: Mm-hmm. And I gave information about
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  what I told you, and at the end, well, I was like, what's happening here? Because no one moved. I started to hear people crying. I cried everything before, so not to cry in the conference. Mm. So I was very professional. When he attended, no one applaud because at the end I said, and it's an great honor for me that my father's alive and he's here. Raquel Schlosser: So they all stood and bow to him. It was very impressive. So we went to the conference, to the dancing and the, um, buffet was, the dinner was a, not the, the closure. And I get there. There were only like 30 people in the group. 40 maybe. But I didn't know that they were recording in those days with cassettes. Raquel Schlosser: They were recording all the conference, all the conferences were
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  recording and immediately an amazing company you could go and get your cassette of the conference that just finished. Wow. Amazing. Amazing work, Albert. So I get to the dinner end. As Mexicans, we were on time. No, we were at eight o'clock sharp. Raquel Schlosser: But Germans, when they get eight o'clock sharp, that means seven 30, so we were the last ones. So there was no space for us. We ended up in amazing place. Hellinger made for us. We were sitting with him. No, he was chatting with my father. It was a very nice night. And I start to get, people get close to me to sign a cassette. Raquel Schlosser: I said, what's going on? So I think I signed like 100 cassettes of that conference. Wow. Yeah. And at the end, Mar came to me and he said, I'm going to make
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  the book from the, I think 20 t uh, participations that have to do with peace and. So I would like you to give me your paper. You are going to be included in that book. Raquel Schlosser: I was writing with Inces, Baren and Mathias. Ve and they were very interesting colleagues. Very interesting colleagues. So I was very, do you have the name of that Tracy Cartwright: book? What Raquel Schlosser: was the name of the one? Oh, not that I'll send you the photograph.
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  the book from the, I think 20 t uh, participations that have to do with peace and. So I would like you to give me your paper. You are going to be included in that book. Raquel Schlosser: I was writing with Inces, Baren and Mathias. Ve and they were very interesting colleagues. Very interesting colleagues. So I was very, do you have the name of that Tracy Cartwright: book? What Raquel Schlosser: It's a, it's, it's not a book, it's from the congress, the memories of the Congress. Tracy Cartwright: Oh, okay. Yep, yep. Raquel Schlosser: I will send them to you. I will photography everything in case we can get it. And if not, I will try to make, um, digital for you because I think it's in English. I don't know if it's in German or in English, but I have two copies of it. I will do it for you. Tracy Cartwright: Okay. Raquel Schlosser: And so it was an amazing
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  experience, very opening to victims and perpetrator dynamic. Raquel Schlosser: With my own view, which includes social responsibility, which is very important. It is not a magical approach. It is not an approach that everyone is the same. It is an approach that it's very close to what Eva Mandel wrote in a very interesting article, said the. Dignity of a victim is that he would take his responsibility, not that he's excused or pardon, is that he will take the his responsibility in order that it won't go to the further generations. Tracy Cartwright: Is that for the victim or the perpetrator? Raquel Schlosser: The perpetrator, the victim doesn't, you see a victim at Tracy Cartwright: the, at the
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  start, so I was like, hmm. Raquel Schlosser: Oh, sorry, sorry, sorry. Thank you for the correction. No, that's okay. The perpetrator, Tracy Cartwright: yes. Raquel Schlosser: Yeah. Has to recognize his responsibility. It's not the task of the victim to forgive, it's the task of the perpetrator to recognize his responsibility. Raquel Schlosser: And that is a whole. When you have grounded variations about it, then the method and the techniques of the method are aligned with the theory that you are working and with the vision of humankind that you have. Tracy Cartwright: Because often in those situations, people, people, you use the word humankind because often in those situations, perpetrator becomes blurred and they become a monster and they become all of that, right? Tracy Cartwright: So when we remember the humanness in all of this as well. Raquel Schlosser:
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  Yes, but that doesn't, that doesn't prevent him from his responsibility. Innocent when you look the multi-generational, but you are responsible and guilty also of what you have done. If not, there's no stop. And you know when you do it in the right way, the person that has been harmed. Raquel Schlosser: And looks at it more, more than the feeling that comes out, but it comes out naturally by seeing the suffering behind. But that doesn't mean that it has the forgiveness he needs to make his own work, which is responsibility because then you guarantee. The pos. No, you can't. We don't have a guarantee. But the possibility of
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  transmitting the consequences are less Tracy Cartwright: you. Tracy Cartwright: Well, you create that space, isn't it? It's opening to something when they are able to own, own it. Can you Raquel Schlosser: Exactly. Tracy Cartwright: Can we take a step back? I'm curious to know, how was that for your dad? How did he, how was his experience? Or understanding of constellations. If you feel that you can speak in the conference in Auschwitz. Tracy Cartwright: And Raquel Schlosser: I will tell you one anecdote. He was an intellectual, he was a man of this experience in his own way and life. But I will tell you one anecdote and you will answer, it will be answered that question. Um, years after I was studying and years after he came with me to. Bert Hellinger to that Congress specifically. Raquel Schlosser: And also I organized many things here for Bert Hellinger and also a Congress in 2 0 0
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  3. That was in Oaxaca. There was like 750 people. We were expecting 500. So yeah, I had a, a wonderful time with Bert and I also in a big theater. I organized for him many things and all the time my, my, he was around my family. Raquel Schlosser: He loved to be around my family. So that time my father had a, a stroke. Fortunately, he recovered because everything was very fast. He lost a little bit of movement of one side, but he recovered, but we didn't know if he was going to recover. So he was sleeping intensive care and I was by his bed. There were two magical moments there. Raquel Schlosser: One, I was crying and crying and crying by his bed. He was my best friend. I didn't want to lose him. I didn't, we didn't know how the damage was. So he's, he was not a, he was very
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  practical. No. After what he went through, he was very practical. But in that moment, he sort of wakes up and. She tells me my mother is here to take me. Raquel Schlosser: It was not in the spiritual path I have to tell, but I told her, you are not ready to become an orphan. I will stay here as long as I need to be with you. He flipped and the next day he start to move his toe and immediately he was taken to rehabilitation. There was another magical moment there when he wakes up and he said, what you are doing is a good work? Raquel Schlosser: Bless Hellinger and tell him that he's doing a good job and send him my
• 39:00
  blessings and keep on doing what you're doing. And he went to sleep again. So now I can tell you what he. Maybe he didn't understand the work itself. He never asked me of a big explanation, but he was Tracy Cartwright: very Raquel Schlosser: connected. I was traveling with Bert like four times a year, sometimes five. Raquel Schlosser: I was all the time for 10 years related to him. I translated also the book, the piece, um, cards in the Family or something like that. I don't know in English, what's the name? No, in the Soul piece Starts In the Soul in Spanish, and both have notes of my notes in both books. And I was with him all the time when he was discovering things and understanding more. Raquel Schlosser: And you
• 40:00
  know, he finished a constellation in Colombia, Nicaragua. I was with him in Mexico all the time. I traveled with him. I went to Spain, to Germany, to Venezuela, to anywhere what he was. Teaching that he was translated to any language, to English to or speaking in English, or translate from English to Spanish. Tracy Cartwright: I was there. Raquel Schlosser: He started with MyFi, this selling of he Garcia. Then I maintain my self. He decided to split and I decided to maintain myself in the academic field and. The institute become what? You know now I started in 2 0 0 5, the first, the first career, and in 2 0 0 10 I amplified to five more. Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Okay. Tracy Cartwright: Wow.
• 41:00
  It's quite a, um, Raquel Schlosser: a journey. Tracy Cartwright: A journey, yeah. I was like, wow. He, because he, he, my understanding and, and um, was, he spent a lot of time in, in South America, didn't he? In the different. And he had a, a deep love for the country and countries. Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Tracy Cartwright: I remember you telling us a story, um, at the Iska conference around something that your daughter had said to him that really made him, really made him go, wow. Tracy Cartwright: Yeah. Can, are you able to share that? Raquel Schlosser: Oh, yes, I would love to. It's an amazing anecdote, you know. Um, and I also wanted a, a, um, an education like I was living my life to my daughter, so I took her to a Montessori school. And when she was in fourth grade, fourth year, she
• 42:00
  was like 10 years old. Um, all the school wanted, had each child is, each student had to choose a person of the world that has given something and change with something the world. Raquel Schlosser: So. Every child in that, uh, primary school. So I was very, very, I felt so nice. My daughter, it was a time that I was working with Institute of Women and training people and, and she heard what I was doing. I never took her to a constellation. Of course, she was 10 years old. And so, and there's another anecdote that I will tell about her father. Raquel Schlosser: So I went, um, so she heard all the time. So she decided that she will be the director of the Bert Hellinger Institute, that she will be the founder. So
• 43:00
  she did all her work, did she, uh, in the web, and then she, she looked for information of telling her what he did. She asked me about the orders of love, so I explained the orders of love, everything. Raquel Schlosser: She had to give the, the conference and ex explain everything in her group each, each child had to do it. Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Raquel Schlosser: So she looks for everything and one day she comes and she said, I think I already, I heard you talk about the, the movements of the soul. I also, it was the name that Helen in those times gave to pit and perpetrator dynamic. Raquel Schlosser: So I explained to her everything in her understanding. So it was the 10th of May, Bert comes to have dinner. To my house late and my
• 44:00
  daughter tells him, for dessert, I will show you your work. So she brings all her things out and explain to Bert everything that she was he she was talking about. And then Bert says, well, you know very well the orders of love, but can you explain me the movements of the soul? Raquel Schlosser: Daniella looks at him and she, and she said, of course, is when one bullet kills, Bert looks at me and she, what and how is it Daniella? Yes. One bullet kills two kills, one Tracy Cartwright: bullet kills two people. Raquel Schlosser: The body of the victim and the soul of the perpetrator. Tracy Cartwright: Wow. Raquel Schlosser: So Bert looks at me. And I said, oh, I didn't tell her that. Raquel Schlosser: It's her synthesis. So Bert looks at Daddy and says, you are the next generation of constellations.
• 45:00
  And Daniella looks at you and said, don't even think about my mother works like crazy. We were laughing. It was an amazing time. It was very nice. And. It was amazing and I love that story. And he, after he decided to separate, to do his things with the, uh, franchises and yes, it's amazing. Raquel Schlosser: It's amazing. She remember sto and it's, uh, it was amazing. Amazing. No, no, no. Don't even think about My mother loves the works like crazy. I will not work like her. So then you don't even think about me as a constellation here. Yeah. Tracy Cartwright: Did she, did she eventually come to some of your workshops to understand the work when she got older? Raquel Schlosser: Yes. Yes, very much. And also it was very interesting because the next year, um, each one, it, it was, there's an that were very nice anecdotes with her because, you know, when you
• 46:00
  raise children. With this open mind and open field we were in, I remember we were traveling in Europe and we were in a restaurant, you know this small restaurants that it's very open the Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: Place where you go to the bathroom. No. So she kept on sitting in a, in a table. I was washing my hands and a lady that spoke Spanish, she said, oh, are you Mexican? Yes, yes, yes. And you are waiting for your mom. Yes, yes, yes. And she said, oh, I'm, do you have siblings? And she said, oh, yes, I have one. So I go out of the my, the bathroom, I sit with her. Raquel Schlosser: The ladies left. I said, one sister. She said, mommy, I cannot give the explanation to everyone about the
• 47:00
  configuration of my family. I have two half sisters and I already know mathematics. So half it and half is one enough information for them. And there was another one when, you know, the, the teacher decides to, um. Raquel Schlosser: Make the family trees of all the families. So they have to work on who, nothing to do with me. It was a work for all the children in this, in her year. So she comes, she was like, she 11 or so. She comes and says, mommy, I have a great idea. Can we make a person and do her family tree and talk about. I said, what? Raquel Schlosser: Why? Said, well, mommy, you know, no one will understand our family. I have to have sisters. You are the second
• 48:00
  wife. I'm the third child. I have to explain too many things. I said, look, mama, today, you think that all of them are the same. Four years. Divorces will start new marriages and other things will happen. Raquel Schlosser: You'll do your family tree. It's a very interesting family tree. Tracy Cartwright: It is a very interesting, yeah. Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: So we did a family tree. It was very nice. And she comes back and said, you were right. I said, why? Because there was one of my friends. I saw his family tree and his father died not long ago, and it was not in the family tree, so I went out, took a leave, and told him, maybe your father is in one of those leaves, so put your father here. Raquel Schlosser: So it helped him. Mommy, he felt better, said very nice.
• 49:00
  So she also comes one day back from explaining what's Family constellations, and she was the director of the Birth Healing Institute. She comes angry back home. I said, what happened? Wasn't good. Mommy orders are of love, are so simple. They didn't understand me. Raquel Schlosser: Why did they understand? The teacher calls me and she said, it's so.
• 49:00
  So she also comes one day back from explaining what's Family constellations, and she was the director of the Birth Healing Institute. She comes angry back home. I said, what happened? Wasn't good. Mommy orders are of love, are so simple. They didn't understand me. Raquel Schlosser: What she knows. Can you come and complete the knowledge? I said yes. So I was thinking, what will I do? What will I do? I went with small, uh, mirrors for the four, the 30 children, and Daniella was my assistant. So I start to look at your face. Raquel Schlosser: This is your face. This is what you have. But behind in that color of eyes that it's
• 50:00
  maybe of your grandmother, maybe her story is there that, so the children started to understand and then they asked for Daniella to Daniella, and Daniella asked me, why don't you show them my family? I got the great idea representative of the first wife, the two half sisters. Raquel Schlosser: The father, me the third child, and Daniella comes to me very quietly and she said, mommy, the first daughter is dizzy. Stop the constellation. So I stopped the constellation very nicely. They understood. They were very happy. They was very nice. And in the afternoon comes Daniella. She said to me, mommy, you are the weirdest, the weirdest job in my school. Raquel Schlosser: I said, why? One has a shop of books. The other one has sales these, the other one is this. I said, mommy, the three women that you have just talked about them, they were in my Mondays of constellations. So stop doing. Stop feeling that your mother is weird. And then it was very interesting because she didn't tell me anything, but her father comes in the night after the job, after work and he said, why don't you call your my sister and ask her how she feels? Raquel Schlosser: I said, he said why? She was a little bit dizzy in the constellation. So he calls her and she had the UM, syndrome, you know that you get dizzy verica that have to be vertical. Raquel Schlosser: So it was a, it's, it's a very interesting what happens. Mm. Tracy Cartwright: Don't you love it when kids recognize that
• 52:00
  you're, you're doing something different and it's all of a sudden it's just Raquel Schlosser: weird moment. Well, now it was, now she's 30 years old. Every time she has a very hard, you know, she has a friend that has broke with, in. Raquel Schlosser: Stop after three weeks, uh, weeping from someone, or one month she said, I go and see my mom. Stop talking to me. Go and solve it. No, no, today is different. But she was, it was 28 and a half years ago that I started Constellations. She was one and a half year old. Tracy Cartwright: Yeah. Raquel Schlosser: So today we have done a great job in every country. Raquel Schlosser: You are doing a great job in yours. Thank you. Doing all you can to expand. This is a very, you know, when you know that every time you work with one person,
• 53:00
  so many people will change their lives. Maybe not the way they want, but they will give one step forward. And if it's two, it's great. If it's five, it's great, and if they change, it's better. Raquel Schlosser: But one step forward is the only way to go through the very hard ways. You give exactly one step at a time. Tracy Cartwright: Absolutely. And this work is such a good tool for that, isn't it? Such a good time? Raquel Schlosser: Yes. Tracy Cartwright: Oh, oh dear. Beautiful stories.
• 53:00
  so many people will change their lives. Maybe not the way they want, but they will give one step forward. And if it's two, it's great. If it's five, it's great, and if they change, it's better. Raquel Schlosser: But one step forward is the only way to go through the very hard ways. You give exactly one step at a time. Tracy Cartwright: Absolutely. And this work is such a good tool for that, isn't it? Such a good time? Raquel Schlosser: Yes. Tracy Cartwright: Beautiful sharing. So you are coming to New Zealand in April. And you are also gonna be traveling, um, to Israel. Tracy Cartwright: You've got a few thing other things going on 'cause I've got listeners and viewers from all around the world that listen to this podcast. So would you like to share a little bit about what else you've got on offer in case people wanna Raquel Schlosser: come see you Tracy Cartwright: in another country? Raquel Schlosser: Oh, that's amazing. Thank you. I
• 54:00
  will be the fourth and 5th of May in Israel with, um, Yael. Raquel Schlosser: I'll send you the information of her podcast, of her website and in Israel. I will work on relationships that hurt and we will see the inheritance of the relationships that hurt, and we will see the multi-generational or origin of that. You know, when you are in the first relationship path and then the second relationship path, you start to think that you are the one that it's guilty. Raquel Schlosser: And maybe it's a repeated pattern from a dialogue with stories that come from behind that need to be update because you know. In the families and in the couples, there are contracts, hidden contracts, and you know, like in every contract, the small
• 55:00
  letters are the most important and it's where the traps are. Raquel Schlosser: So we will be reading the small letters of those contracts that really, um, are painful in the relationships and repeated now as a pattern that will be in Israel. And I will go to Argentina too. I was just with a very interesting group. The group that was from Pope Francis, and they are spiritual coaches. Raquel Schlosser: An amazing group, amazing group of people. I will be training them, um, with the institute in working with couples in our, uh, model. And I was just there. To teach them how to build the maps with our vision, the family maps, and there are more to come. We are
• 56:00
  maybe planning to go to Greece. We have to talk with them and we have other countries to visit and we are open now to travel wherever we can to bring this knowledge. Tracy Cartwright: Fantastic. Wherever we Raquel Schlosser: can. Tracy Cartwright: Fantastic. Well, we'll put your contact details in, in the thread below and, and they can have a look at your website as, most of it's in Spanish though. Hey, Raquel Schlosser: but today with ai they can translate anything. It's very easy. That's, and very soon we will do it in English also. We will have it because we're going more to the English speaking countries. Raquel Schlosser: In Israel, I will be speaking in English, but I speak Hebrew fluently, so I might drop here. And there some phrases I was, uh, very happy to talk with in I, and so it's, uh, it's amazing, but we can do
• 57:00
  together and I really thank you. Thank you. Thank you for invitation. Tracy Cartwright: You are welcome. Yeah. Yeah. I always, uh, follow the Paula back. Raquel Schlosser: Amazing. Tracy Cartwright: Field and, um, yeah, really grateful that you were able to, to follow and to say yes to our invitation as well. So thank you so much. Raquel Schlosser: No, I didn't even think about, I moved and, you know, I, at the beginning I was like, oh, because they were the same date, Israel and New Zealand, and then boom. Yeah, I moved it to one week later. Raquel Schlosser: So. It helped me a lot. Fantastic. I will be both. I will. It'll be around the world and I will be in airplanes around the world. Gardening, because reading a lot I like to read in the plane, so Tracy Cartwright: Nice, nice. Wow. Raquel Schlosser: It would be a Tracy Cartwright: pleasure How lucky, how lucky. Lucky is the world to have this ability to be able to, A, be online, but also to travel and to be able to share your knowledge