Latest / Behind The Village Podcast / Nixon Boyd on Creativity, Struggles, and The Grind of Being a Musician

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Nixon Boyd on Creativity, Struggles, and The Grind of Being a Musician · Behind The Village Podcast

0:00
I started writing a solo record shortly after
0:03
my band retired. And I finished writing it. And
0:08
I just about finished recording it a couple of
0:11
years ago, actually, when my computer and all
0:15
my hard drives were stolen out of my car. And
0:18
I had to redo the entire thing. Yeah, so talk
0:22
about overthinking. It's not exactly overthinking,
0:24
but it's overproducing because I had to completely
0:28
recover everything. You're listening to the Behind
0:31
the Village podcast. Our guest today is local
0:34
artist and producer Nixon Boyd. Tell me a little
0:40
bit about yourself. You're a musician, right?
0:43
Yeah, primarily. I was in a touring band for,
0:46
gosh, 15 years more. Through making records with
0:52
that group, I started to learn how to produce
0:55
records myself. And for the last, geez, almost
0:59
10 years, I've been producing other artists in
1:01
addition to continuing to play and continuing
1:05
to make solo work. Cool. And what is it, I guess,
1:09
that you... You do within that context. Like,
1:12
do you also like are you a musician in terms
1:14
of like instruments and singing or both or all?
1:17
Sure. I'm a guitar player primarily. And on top
1:20
of that, I'm a songwriter. So I was one of the
1:23
main songwriters in my band. And since then,
1:28
since transitioning to doing a lot of production,
1:30
I work on songs with other artists a lot as well.
1:34
So, yeah, instrumentally, guitar player, I can.
1:41
Do very basic stuff on other instruments as well.
1:44
But that and songwriting mainly. And yeah, and
1:48
singing. I mean, I'm a singer, like I sing my
1:53
own solo work and I always sing kind of backups
1:56
and a few sometimes leads on songs when I was
2:00
touring with my band. Right, cool. And you're
2:03
a local artist, right? Like you're from here,
2:07
Orillia. Yeah, well, I moved to a really in 2019,
2:10
basically when my band retired. Now, that being
2:16
said, my band is just about to get back together
2:18
and put new music out. While I've been only been
2:20
here for five years, I definitely have grown
2:22
to love it a lot. We're so glad we're here. We
2:26
love it so, so much. And I set up a studio here
2:28
and I've been connecting more and more with the
2:33
musicians who live in this town and just. just
2:36
being more and more amazed at what is going on
2:39
here and more impressed with the talent and the
2:43
hard work that people are doing in the arts as
2:45
well. It's all so, so amazing. And just how much
2:48
art there is around here, around this area. Like
2:50
there's a lot. Yeah, it's pretty great. It's
2:55
way, way more than it should be for a city this
2:58
size. I think it punches way above its weight
3:00
and not just the amount, but the quality of it,
3:04
the talent. uh, that exists here is, is really
3:08
undeniable. It's super cool. Tell me a little
3:11
bit about, you know, how you got started as a,
3:14
as an artist, right? You said you started with
3:16
your band. Is it Hola, Colorado? Colorado was
3:20
the name of the band. We got started because
3:22
we were best friends living on the same street,
3:25
uh, our whole lives pretty much. Well, um, our,
3:28
our, our, like as young teenagers. and then grew
3:31
up and all went to to college together we went
3:34
to mcgill and being in montreal uh was was an
3:40
you know an inspiring thing uh because there's
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so much music there as well and it looked like
3:46
just about everybody was in a band so we decided
3:50
to as well and we basically wrote a record and
3:57
while we were all still in school we recorded
4:00
that record and shortly after we went on our
4:05
first tour and we sort of left school behind
4:09
because we were so busy. We got very busy with
4:13
playing and making more records very shortly
4:17
after. We got really lucky with some of our early
4:21
recordings just working. And that's just absolute
4:26
pure luck because you don't know what you're
4:28
doing at all when you're starting out. You're
4:31
firing from the hip and going with your gut in
4:34
terms of the music you write. And, you know,
4:39
sometimes you stumble onto a few things that
4:43
just work. And I think that was the case with
4:45
us. We had some help. We connected with a really
4:50
good producer. Who helped just like iron out
4:53
some of the some of the kinks or some of the,
4:56
you know, help trim the fat of some of our early
4:58
ideas and distill them down to a really good
5:02
version of what they were. Just distill the idea
5:04
and bring all the good parts of our ideas to
5:06
the surface, which is always what I think a good
5:09
producer should do. And I always think back to
5:12
those early days of how producers helped us when
5:16
doing my own work as a producer now. So they
5:19
helped us immensely. And it was still a grind.
5:22
We made that record or some of those recordings
5:28
as early as 2006, 2007. And then we didn't put
5:32
our first record out until 2010 because nobody
5:36
wanted to put it out. Nobody wanted to distribute
5:38
it. Nobody knew us. So we toured and toured and
5:41
toured until finally we were able to get distribution.
5:49
And, you know, get our record in stores and finally
5:55
play to more and more people to finally get on
5:57
the radio and stuff like that. Interesting. So
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you can actually go on tour. I guess it makes
6:02
sense. I don't know anything about being a musician,
6:04
but you can go on tour and start playing and
6:07
stuff like that without, I guess, being on the
6:12
radio. Oh, definitely. I would say the vast majority
6:15
is. vast majority of bands out there touring
6:19
are probably not on the radio. They're playing
6:22
in basements and dive bars for years and years
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before they get on the radio, if they even ever
6:32
get on the radio. I'd say easily 95 % of live
6:36
music is being played by bands who we've never
6:41
heard of. Wow. Yeah. So that was us for, again,
6:45
three or four years. We toured really, really
6:47
hard to the extent where we did one tour where
6:50
we played every single day in the month of February.
6:53
So Montreal one day, Boston the next day, New
6:56
York, La Cole, which is a town in Quebec, Hamilton,
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Ottawa, Toronto. And that was our week. And then
7:04
we did that four times in a row for a 28 day
7:07
month of February. So that just about killed
7:10
us, but it made us really good at playing. And
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it allowed us to play in front of more people
7:17
than we've ever played in front of before. Say
7:19
there was 15 people per show. Well, you multiply
7:24
that by 28 and you're playing in front of, I
7:27
don't know, close to 500 people in the course
7:29
of a month. That was crazy for us. What was that
7:33
like in those early stages of just trying to
7:37
make things happen and touring? You know, you'd
7:40
get home from a tour like that and you'd be totally
7:42
broke and you'd have to go back to your job at
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the telemarketing agency or, you know, the warehouse
7:49
or Home Depot or wherever we were working to
7:52
save up money before the next one to save money
7:55
to record. So, yeah, it was a bit of burning
7:58
a candle at both ends for a long time. Wow. Yeah.
8:03
Wow. So how did you kind of. kept going right
8:09
like you said like we we you were there for three
8:12
four years or you were kind of trying to figure
8:14
out three four years until you got your record
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um actually out and into mainstream radio like
8:20
into stores and stuff like that what happened
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then what happened it started after that point
8:25
uh yeah it was still like it still felt kind
8:30
of gradual at the time looking back you know
8:34
if it took two or three years um The way I feel
8:38
about two or three years now is that it's almost
8:40
no time. But I didn't then when I was 21. It
8:46
got to a point where our song started playing
8:50
on the radio. And all it meant is that we had
8:53
to tour more. We had been very much... You know,
8:59
in Ontario, Quebec and some parts of the eastern
9:02
U .S. as far as our touring went up to that point.
9:06
But that allowed us to go further in Canada and
9:09
a little further in the States as well. Because,
9:14
yes, our song, some of our songs got picked up
9:16
across the country and our record was finally
9:19
being distributed across the country. So there
9:21
were going to be audiences finally all over.
9:26
And, you know. you think great our songs on the
9:30
radio we're going to be playing to a thousand
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people everywhere but it wasn't it was still
9:33
50 people in calgary you know 80 people in victoria
9:38
25 people in halifax uh for years um until you
9:45
know maybe even a couple years after that so
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say we're five years into it before we're playing
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to a few hundred people all across canada and
9:52
a couple hundred people here and there in some
9:54
us cities as well And then we put our second
10:00
record out and things continued to build. And
10:03
maybe around the time of our third record, we
10:06
were about 10 years into it when we were finally
10:10
playing to maybe 1 ,500 people, most of the bigger
10:15
cities in Canada. And but yet you're still touring,
10:19
you know, you're still playing like Red Deer
10:21
to 150 people. You're still playing Saskatoon
10:24
to 200 people. So it's not like we never stopped
10:28
playing, you know, to a couple of hundred people,
10:31
small clubs, even though on the same tour you
10:34
might be playing to many more. You we never got,
10:38
you know, we never got to the point. And, you
10:43
know. Maybe because we just liked it so much
10:48
playing to a few hundred people, we would continue
10:51
to stop in those places and play those smaller
10:52
shows. It was an absolute grind. And I mean,
10:56
it kind of still is. I still perform and I work
11:02
with artists that I produce, both in the studio
11:05
and there are times where I will perform with
11:07
them. And I'm still playing shows to 60 people.
11:11
And fewer sometimes, depending on the, you know,
11:17
the needs of the people I'm working with. Or
11:20
if I'm playing solo shows, I still play to 50
11:25
people and I love it. And how does that, you
11:30
know, transition? Because you said at some point
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the band kind of retired and then you started.
11:35
you know, operating more as a songwriter and
11:37
doing that for other artists. Right. And being
11:40
producing and doing stuff with other artists.
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How does that transition kind of work? Yeah.
11:47
While I was making records with Colorado, I learned
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how to produce myself, just watching and getting
11:55
a little bit more involved in the production
11:57
process to the point where I started producing
12:00
other artists. I think I said, yeah, like 10
12:02
years ago. So that gave me the confidence to
12:08
help people with their songs, to help people
12:11
with their recordings. And I mean, the other
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part of the grind is songwriting. Initially,
12:21
I mentioned that we got kind of lucky with some
12:23
of our first initial ideas. But then, you know,
12:27
after those first... things that you make uh
12:29
they've been kind of probably bubbling up inside
12:32
you for your whole life yeah so that when you're
12:34
at the point of finally saying something making
12:36
a statement for the first time you have something
12:38
to say and it's right at the surface but then
12:41
once you've said that thing what do you say next
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uh so you really you really have to think about
12:46
it for your next statement and the statement
12:49
after and the thing that comes next. And there
12:51
always has to be something else. And you're always
12:53
sort of growing as a person. So there will always
12:56
be things to say. There will always be new experiences
12:59
to talk about in a song. But they're not always
13:04
as accessible as they are that first time. You
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learn that you have to dig a little deeper and
13:11
you have to throw a lot of ideas away because
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maybe you're not being succinct enough or you're
13:16
not being clear enough or what you thought was
13:17
meaningful to you one day might not feel super
13:21
meaningful to you the next day. So you have to
13:24
learn. grind of digging for those ideas and sitting
13:28
down and writing songs, some of which are never
13:31
going to see the light of day. And you have to
13:33
learn to be okay with that. You have to learn
13:36
to be patient for the really important ideas
13:38
to come along. So that's something that I try
13:44
to help people with, that idea of songwriting
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also being a grind. And in doing it, in having
13:54
sort of beat my head against the wall enough.
13:56
I'm at a point where I can look at another person's
13:59
song or somebody else's initial idea and help
14:03
them decide, A, is this song worth working on?
14:05
And if yes, how do we get it to the finish line?
14:08
And how do I help them sort of dig for those
14:10
meaningful aspects of their experience? So that's,
14:15
I guess, how I am now, quote unquote, qualified.
14:21
as a producer and as a songwriter to help other
14:24
people with their work is just having done it
14:26
so, so much and being in those places where I've
14:29
been stuck, but also being in those places where
14:32
I've had, where I've finally broken through and
14:35
have ideas that completely work. So I know what
14:38
that looks like. And I know what being stuck
14:40
looks like as well. Yeah. Are you able to share
14:43
what your songwriting process looks like? Maybe
14:46
not like. Or the creative process. Or the creative
14:48
process, yeah, of songwriting. Yeah. It can look
14:52
a lot of different ways. I noodle around on guitar
14:56
a lot, like I'm a guitar player first. And my
15:02
mind, when I do that, goes to melodic ideas pretty
15:05
quickly. And I think just from having written
15:08
so many songs, I naturally, when I think of a
15:13
melodic idea, it's a vocal idea. It's going to
15:18
be set to lyrics. So I'll often come up with
15:20
melodies that way. But when it comes to like
15:24
the title of a song, I've just got thousands
15:27
of notes in my phone that eight times a day I'll
15:32
jot down a little idea. And often in the middle
15:34
of the night, I'll jot down a little idea because
15:36
I've been. I've had that moment of where I have
15:41
an idea for a song. It just happened to me last
15:43
night. And then I don't write it down and I forget
15:45
it. I wake up the next day and it's totally gone.
15:47
And I'm like, well, that one's not a song that
15:49
that one's not happening, which is kind of funny
15:52
because it just takes the remembering those little
15:55
ideas in the moment. I almost never at this point.
16:00
And I was thinking about this the other day.
16:02
I never at this point sit down and say, OK, now
16:05
I'm going to write a song and I'm going to come
16:06
up with. an idea from scratch, just sitting down,
16:10
just with my guitar, and I'll come up with a
16:14
lyric. It's almost 100 % of the time the kind
16:17
of thing where I'll dig through my notes and
16:20
look for a lyrical idea, and I'll dig through
16:23
my voice memos, and I'll look for a chord progression
16:26
and a melodic idea. Basically, because I don't
16:31
have the time anymore to sit there and force
16:35
something to come out. I have to start with...
16:37
uh ideas that have come to me just in the course
16:41
of my day so i'll dig kind of through my pockets
16:44
and see what kind of loose change i have for
16:46
ideas and see what i can turn that into is the
16:49
inspiration in terms of those ideas that kind
16:52
of come to you do they just pop into your head
16:54
while you're doing kind of everyday things or,
16:56
you know, is it that kind of? Yeah, pretty much.
16:59
Like I find, you know, having moved here, I do
17:02
a lot more yard work and shoveling. So a lot
17:05
of ideas come to me while my mind is just completely
17:08
wandering, doing that stuff. And then I'll walk,
17:12
I'll walk to the studio or driving, you know,
17:16
to another studio. And if I'm traveling, if I'm
17:20
on a plane, if I'm walking my dog. If I'm at
17:24
the park with my kid, you know, sure, I'm paying
17:29
attention to him. But your mind also starts to
17:32
wander and you see things and you see whatever
17:34
kids playing or you see, you know, an older couple
17:37
walking by or you'll see a boat in the water.
17:40
And just being open to what the world is, I guess,
17:45
showing you is what I what I try to be. And and
17:49
ideas come that way. That's really cool. Because
17:52
we've talked a lot about that in terms of creative
17:55
process and what that looks like. And it's different
17:57
for everybody, but there seems to be that commonality
18:00
of, like you said, your mind is just allowed
18:02
to wander. You're not thinking, you're not focusing,
18:05
you're doing something maybe mundane or, you
18:08
know, you're not. Absolutely. And there's an
18:10
openness, I think. And like you said, a reception
18:12
of what's either been happening or is happening.
18:16
Totally. Yeah, it's cool. I listened a lot to
18:21
Rick Rubin, who's a producer, like major producer.
18:24
But in Pharrell Williams and stuff like that,
18:27
just major, major producers. And I love the way
18:30
that, you know, especially Rick talks about it
18:33
in his book about the creative process. But it's
18:35
that idea of planting seeds. All you do throughout
18:39
your life or as you as you're going through is
18:41
like you're just planting seeds and then just
18:43
letting and seeing what comes out of that seed.
18:47
Totally. And sometimes it's like it hits you
18:50
out of nowhere and you're just walking down the
18:52
street or you're doing whatever. And boom, you
18:55
don't realize that it feels like it comes out
18:56
of nowhere. But it's from like you mentioned,
18:58
it's the experiences that you've had. It's the
19:01
you know, the the the wanting to go in and see
19:05
the world or the wanting to let experiences or
19:08
let things come into you. Yeah. Being open to
19:12
that. Absolutely. And I think it's a habit thing.
19:15
I don't think there's any magic to it. I think
19:17
if you plant enough seeds, one of them is going
19:20
to grow into something. And you can control,
19:24
you can shape things once you have an initial
19:27
idea. And there is a lot of craft to that. And
19:30
that takes a lot, you know, a lot of experience
19:32
and listening to other songs or, you know, no
19:37
matter what you're doing, taking ideas from other
19:41
people is a huge part of it. But it's also just
19:47
a habit. And if you do it enough and you just
19:49
get into the habit of, you know, jotting down
19:54
in my case, jotting down every little musical
19:57
idea or or concept for a song idea that I can
20:02
during the course of the day, in the course of
20:04
a month, I'm going to get a couple of things.
20:06
that are going to work in the longterm and that
20:08
I know I can shape. And then that I know I have
20:11
the ability and the skill to, to shape into a
20:13
finished product basically. Yeah. That's really
20:16
cool. And I, I especially like the idea of being
20:18
a, as a producer, right? Just the main, the main
20:23
thing that I think a producer brings is taste.
20:28
Right. Knowing what like as soon as you hear
20:30
something or as soon as you you you understand,
20:33
like you're bringing a new music or there's a
20:35
new artist or there's something like that. And
20:36
you're like, oh, there's something there. That
20:38
song right out of all the seeds that are out
20:41
there, that one in particular is going to. Like
20:44
we can work with or we. Yeah, yeah. That one
20:46
or, you know, that takes, I think, being open
20:49
as well, having an emotional openness so that
20:51
when you're listening to other somebody else's
20:53
ideas, being in tune with what you connect with,
20:58
being in tune with what hits you and and gives
21:03
you an emotional response as well. And then there's
21:08
also just knowing what's catchy or liking, you
21:12
know, being, which I think most people are. I
21:17
think everybody has the skill to know what they
21:20
like as far as just how something sounds or the
21:24
colors on a canvas. I think everybody has that
21:27
ability, which is I think one of the coolest
21:31
things about this job is that. It's about it's
21:37
more about like opening up to what you like and
21:42
what moves you as opposed to really learning
21:44
it. Anything. I like that idea. Yeah, because
21:48
it's true. You're you're you're you're allowing
21:51
yourself to feel right. Totally. And allowing
21:54
yourself to just. Is this something that feels
21:58
like me? Is this something that moves me? Is
22:00
this something that, you know, because chances
22:02
are, and I talk about this in marketing a lot,
22:04
but the chances are, if you feel something about
22:08
what you're putting out, chances are other people
22:10
are going to feel something about it too. Totally.
22:13
Yeah. And the only metric you have to go by is
22:17
what you react to. It's silly to go into something
22:21
like this. trying to guess what people are going
22:24
to like. That's just such a backwards way of
22:28
thinking about it to me. But I mean, music is
22:31
made that way. We all know music is made that
22:33
way of sort of by committee where, you know,
22:36
eight songwriters are trying to come up with
22:38
a hit for the new teen idol. And great music
22:43
is made that way too. It's certainly not my process,
22:47
but I, we, there's. I'm sure pop songs out there
22:51
that are pretty undeniably great that have been
22:54
made that way, too. So that's not wrong. But
22:56
it's it's well, and it's not an approach that
23:01
most people have access to. Yeah, that's a very
23:05
sort of top down, big budget approach. And a
23:10
lot, you know, and the artist or the singer or
23:12
the pop star is in a bit of a different role.
23:14
They're going to deliver the song and maybe they're
23:16
going to help write it. And a lot of stars, as
23:19
we know, write their own songs. And that's, you
23:21
know, amazing. Like Taylor Swift famously is
23:25
an amazing songwriter. But, you know, that yeah,
23:29
that process of eight pro songwriters, quote
23:32
unquote, sitting around and writing a hit for,
23:35
you know, a massive whatever, you know, an arena
23:39
style singer is just it's just a totally different
23:43
process. And it's. You know, there's there's
23:46
no point in trying to teach that or trying to
23:49
work with people in that capacity in a one on
23:51
one capacity because it just does not apply to
23:53
99 percent of musicians. Which is important and
23:57
that's good to know. And I think for people that
23:59
are looking to kind of explore being a musician
24:02
or people that are nervous maybe to step into
24:05
it is to have just that candid understanding
24:08
of the process of totally start where you're
24:12
at and you know that. Like you said, the group
24:15
of songwriters is not the norm for most. No,
24:18
exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Cool. So, you know, we
24:24
haven't talked about it, but, you know, I know
24:28
from, again, listening a lot to Rick Rubin, but,
24:31
you know, a producer has certain genres that
24:36
they kind of lean into because that's their style.
24:38
That's, you know, their... I guess, their thing
24:41
or what they're known for, right? Sure. So what
24:43
kind of producer or songwriter or even from your
24:47
band when you started, what was your band's sound?
24:51
I think it was rock -ish. Yeah, basically rock,
24:54
rock indie, and definitely writing pop songs,
24:58
but... Pop songs with guitars. And now I basically
25:05
cover the same ground. I do some folk. I do some
25:09
rock. I do some pop and country, basically. And
25:14
yeah, I don't really shy away from any particular
25:18
genre. Like I had a job, for instance, where
25:22
I had to write a fake 90s boy band hit and produce
25:27
it for a TV show. last year. And I was like,
25:32
I guess I can do that. And then when I started
25:34
to do it, I realized how ingrained that sound
25:38
was into me because I had a blast and I totally
25:41
did an awesome job making a fake kind of Backstreet
25:45
Boys -esque song. Making, you know, I don't know
25:49
if you know the name Max Martin, but he's another
25:51
massive producer. He wrote and produced a bunch
25:55
of the Britney Spears stuff. Backstreet Boys,
25:59
you name it, he's worked with them in that world.
26:03
So I have a blast working in just about any genre,
26:07
for sure. That's cool. It makes sense, though,
26:10
based on what you were saying about the connection
26:12
and that emotional connection to the work, it
26:14
almost makes the genre somewhat irrelevant if
26:18
you're connecting to what it is that... You're
26:20
working on. It can. I think you can get to that
26:23
point. And I'm constantly trying to be at that
26:26
point because you can you can slip away and you
26:29
can lose perspective sometimes where, you know,
26:34
you feel like you need an arrangement or you
26:39
need a certain sound or a number of instruments
26:41
in order to have a song connect. And probably
26:45
if you're in that point with a song. It may not
26:50
be working as a song where if you feel like it's
26:53
not going to work without big guitars or it's
26:55
not going to work without heavy drums. There's
26:58
something that I've heard be described as the
27:01
campfire test, which is if you can sit around
27:04
a campfire and just strum a guitar and sing a
27:06
song and it works and people like it, then it's
27:08
a good song. That's cool. Yeah. I know I had
27:12
like a few pop into my head of like, oh, yep.
27:15
Heard many as a campfire song. Yeah, exactly.
27:18
And if you can translate it just in that bare
27:20
bones way and it still works, then you've got
27:24
a great song. Yeah, no, I try to get away. I
27:29
try to get away from genre, but also as a producer,
27:32
I have to be up to date on what each genre sort
27:38
of instrumentation is. and sort of song structure
27:42
and lyrical style. So because while as a producer,
27:48
genre might be irrelevant for listeners, it's
27:51
very relevant. People identify either with country
27:54
or rock or R &B or indie or folk. And a lot of
28:01
listeners out there sort of pick a genre and
28:03
that's just what they listen to, especially as
28:05
a teenager. I only listened to punk and I thought
28:08
everything else was lame. Yeah, June knows what
28:13
that's like. So I keep that in mind. You have
28:19
to sort of tell people a little bit. I think,
28:24
you know, this is in the country genre. And also
28:26
when it comes to artists playing with other artists,
28:29
if an artist I'm working with is hoping to get
28:32
on a tour with another country artist, then they
28:36
want to sound like a country artist and they
28:38
want. at that show that audience to love them
28:41
as well so you're picking instrumentation based
28:44
on that and of course um that informs the language
28:48
like you're gonna uh your uh your diction is
28:52
going to be a little bit different if you're
28:53
writing a country song as opposed to a rock song
28:55
um as well and depending on like the age of the
29:00
artist and you know do you want Even with the
29:03
same message, you could write a completely different
29:05
song if it was for a 21 -year -old versus a 45
29:09
-year -old. If that makes sense. And in a different
29:12
job sense. What is that, I guess, producing process?
29:17
Because we touched on the songwriting process.
29:19
And in terms of the producing side of things,
29:21
do you typically have to sit down with people
29:23
ahead of time and just to kind of figure out
29:25
the vibe and who they are, as you mentioned?
29:28
Yeah, a little bit. Totally. And what's really
29:31
useful for that is to listen to reference tracks.
29:33
So either other songs that the artist has made
29:37
that they really like, they like the sound of
29:38
or songs that they like and want to sound like.
29:43
I spend a lot of time doing that. And you you
29:45
can learn a lot just doing that, just sitting
29:48
there for an hour and a half, listening to other
29:52
stuff that either you or you and the artist you're
29:55
working with just really love that are getting
29:57
close to. What they have in their head, what
30:00
they're imagining and what you think would work
30:03
for them. Really, really useful part of the process.
30:08
That's cool. Yeah. I have a question for you.
30:12
When do you know as you produce a song or produce
30:16
a record and stuff like that for an artist? When
30:18
do you know when a song is ready to be released?
30:23
When it's like there's enough editing, enough
30:26
producing is ready. How do you know when that
30:28
happens? It's yeah, it's a lot of work before
30:32
you even start recording to make sure the lyrics
30:34
are all there. And again, does the song pass
30:36
the campfire test before you even hit record?
30:39
Can you sit there and just play it? Like, does
30:43
it pass that test? So hopefully the song, as
30:48
far as the content, as far as the lyrical and
30:50
melodic content goes, is done before you even
30:52
record anything. So that's. That's a box that
30:57
you tick before you even record. And then you're
31:02
laying stuff down. Let's say you're laying down
31:05
drums. Make sure that they completely work. Make
31:08
sure that the rhythm of the drums completely
31:10
connects to the vocals and whatever the basic
31:13
instrument is. You know, often a keyboard or
31:16
guitar is the main instrument plotting out the
31:19
chords. Do those all completely connect? And
31:22
if not, maybe you have to rethink the drum groove.
31:27
Because that's vocals and drums and bass, you
31:32
know, the low end are three absolutely essential
31:35
things to get right. They're super fundamental
31:37
to the feel of the song and they inform the genre.
31:40
So those three things have to be done. And then
31:44
it's just about how much space you have for other
31:46
things. We don't maybe realize it, but there's
31:50
a ton of space in some of the best recordings
31:53
and most of the best recordings that we all love
31:55
and listen to. There's tons of space for the
31:59
vocals. Nothing is stepping on anything else.
32:05
you know, registers are covered differently by
32:08
different instruments. So maybe guitar will cover
32:10
an upper register, maybe piano more of a middle
32:13
register and bass, a bottom register. And it,
32:16
you know, if it's a pop song, maybe you'll have
32:18
some synths like really high up and gluing things
32:23
together. If it's a country song, maybe you'll
32:26
have like a lap steel doing that or backup vocals
32:31
doing doing harmonies sort of filling in the
32:34
glue. Yeah, I guess I feel like hopefully you
32:39
start to get a sense for when an arrangement
32:42
is done. And and definitely you learn that there
32:48
is a. It is possible to do too much production
32:52
on a song and to mix for too long and to totally
32:55
lose perspective. Getting it to a point where
32:58
it sounds awesome involves a lot of restraint.
33:05
Because that's sort of what I was thinking. Again,
33:07
I'm not in the music industry, but I'm assuming
33:09
that it works in a similar manner, which is the
33:11
concept of overthinking, right? Of like, okay,
33:14
I have this song and I'm adding this and I'm
33:17
doing that. Like you said, you're mixing and
33:18
mixing and mixing and you're trying to keep adding
33:20
because you want to make it perfect, right? As
33:22
somebody, like, let's say a new artist or I'm
33:25
going to start, I'm going to create a song or
33:27
whatever. It needs to be perfect because I want
33:28
this to be like the best of me, if you will,
33:31
right? Yeah. So you can get into that rut where
33:33
you keep. trying to change it and never actually
33:35
release anything because you don't know if it's
33:37
good enough yet right totally yeah you have to
33:39
let go i think i heard the story um uh of the
33:43
mixing engineer i think this song he was working
33:45
on was billy jean he was mixing it and he showed
33:50
The producer, it was a different mixing engineer
33:52
from producer. So the mixing engineer showed
33:54
the producer the 85th mix of Billie Jean. And
34:00
then they scrolled back and they listened to
34:02
mix one. And it's like, OK, it's pretty good.
34:04
And then they listened to mix two. And it was
34:06
Quincy Jones. And he's like, that's the mix.
34:07
It's mix two. We're using mix two. Forget all
34:10
the other mixes you did after that. Yeah. Wow.
34:14
Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. So I try to keep that
34:17
in mind. Yeah, it's true. Like you can see, though,
34:20
like how quickly things would get away. It's
34:22
like, well, what if we added? Well, what if we
34:24
added? Oh, yeah, we tried. And then we had 85.
34:28
Yeah, I've I've gone gotten more and more as
34:32
time has gone on a respect for space in an arrangement
34:35
where you can where you can hear everything.
34:38
And each instrument in the arrangement makes
34:41
a statement because you get. Too much stuff going
34:46
on. Nothing makes a statement anymore. Yeah.
34:49
Well, it becomes muddled. Yeah, for sure. Yeah.
34:53
I like it. Yeah. So tell me about your because
35:00
I read this on the Mariposa Folk Festival website,
35:03
which, by the way, you are going to be a part
35:06
of the Mariposa Folk Festival, right? Yeah. Yeah.
35:08
I'm playing playing there. Yeah. Awesome. And
35:12
I saw that you are preparing to release your
35:14
first. solo record. Yep. Tell us about that.
35:18
Sure. I started writing a solo record shortly
35:23
after my band retired. And I finished writing
35:28
it. And I just about finished recording it a
35:31
couple years ago, actually, when my computer
35:35
and all my hard drives were stolen out of my
35:37
car. And I had to redo the entire thing. Yeah,
35:41
so talk about overthinking. It's not exactly
35:44
overthinking, but it's overproducing because
35:46
I had to completely recover everything. I actually
35:50
had one song that I had finished and that I had
35:52
emailed to myself. So there was one song which
35:55
I didn't have to redo. And I put that out last
35:57
year as the first song. And then last fall, I
36:01
just put out the second song, which had been
36:04
redone. That was the first song that I redid
36:07
that I put out. And I just like behind the screen
36:11
that we're talking on, I have sort of a final
36:14
mix that I'm just about done of one of the last
36:18
songs on the record. So I'm very, very nearly
36:20
done completely redoing everything. And that
36:24
has been a good lesson and not over over mixing
36:26
or over producing as well, because, you know,
36:30
every I'm just. sort of trying to recapture what
36:34
I had. And nothing is going to be exactly the
36:37
same. And it would be a mistake to try and get
36:40
it to be exactly the same. It's just another
36:42
version of good. So that has been a good lesson
36:47
in realizing that, you know, something just because
36:51
something sounds different doesn't mean it's
36:53
wrong. There's lots of versions of good. And,
36:56
you know. mixes, sure, can technically be either
37:02
good or bad, but there's lots of ways to come
37:07
up with a great arrangement and a cool way of
37:11
producing songs that might be different from
37:13
each other, but they're equally valid. Yeah.
37:16
Well, congratulations on almost being done after
37:19
having to redo it. Cause I, I think about the
37:22
tiniest projects that we do and when I have to
37:24
redo something, just how heartbreaking it is.
37:26
And I can't even imagine. Totally. The entire
37:29
whole thing. Yeah. It's, it's been a grind, uh,
37:32
that, that may grinding the grind has been maybe
37:36
the operative word of my career is just sticking
37:38
at it, you know? so that first song that you
37:42
that you emailed yourself was it like uh the
37:44
every time we turn a corner yeah yeah that was
37:46
the song love that song thanks thanks i just
37:50
listened to it yeah it's amazing it's totally
37:52
my vibe now oh like it's really chill really
37:55
like you know meaningful lyrics and stuff like
37:57
that i love that yeah um and i'm gonna shout
38:00
out the video too if you didn't see the video
38:02
you should check it out uh my wife made it uh
38:05
she shot it in uh my studio which is a converted
38:09
auto shop so it's got a lot of extra space and
38:12
we do little video shoots there so yeah it was
38:14
made there very cool pretty cool yeah that's
38:17
cool to know so now i want to re -watch it yeah
38:19
because i didn't watch the video but i didn't
38:20
know that right so now i want to re -watch it
38:22
yeah yeah yeah let's check it out yeah yeah But
38:24
it's true, though, like what you were saying
38:25
about listeners having a vibe or identifying
38:27
with a certain thing. True. Yeah. That song.
38:30
And I was like, this is totally that's. That's
38:32
funny. Yeah. Like you just you just proved my
38:35
point, basically. exactly yeah i feel like i
38:40
feel like the stuff that you produce i'd probably
38:42
like like you're like you know you went from
38:44
punk like only listening to punk as a teenager
38:46
yeah away to this kind of song like that's that's
38:48
totally my trajectory that's really funny yeah
38:50
we're on the same like taste path so yeah so
38:53
that's the record and uh mariposa will be my
38:57
first uh full band show i've played solo shows
39:00
uh but uh i have conscripted some guys in town
39:07
they're in a great band called domicile which
39:09
is a great aurelia band uh which you should check
39:12
out um i'm producing the record but also i like
39:15
hanging out with them so much that uh i'm hiring
39:18
them to be my band uh going forward yeah so so
39:22
mariposa will be our first show i'm excited we'll
39:24
be there so when you're you're performing so
39:26
you can for sure yeah friday at seven o 'clock
39:29
in the in the pub tent oh perfect nice Is there
39:32
a time frame for when your album will be released,
39:34
I guess? Oh, I thought you were going to say,
39:36
when do you think you're going to retire? No.
39:39
Be done with this. There is a time frame. I'm
39:47
going to start releasing the rest of the record
39:49
this year, and then the record will come out
39:51
early next year. Nice. Cool. Do you, I guess
39:55
it's too early to know, but do you know how it'll
39:57
be released yet? Or like, is it just going to
39:59
be online for sure? And probably on, on vinyl
40:04
as well. Ooh. Ooh. Yeah. You know, since you
40:09
are. I just I just had this question that came
40:13
up after I asked my other one. But like since
40:15
you're, you know, you've been doing this for
40:17
a long time, you're a songwriter, you're a producer.
40:19
I'm just kind of started wondering, like, what
40:21
would be your advice for somebody that is just
40:23
starting like their music career or wants to
40:26
start their music career? What would you advise
40:27
somebody to kind of, you know, how to get started
40:30
or how to get going? Yeah, I would say listen
40:34
to a ton of music and. If you stumble upon something
40:40
that you really like, try to make your version
40:42
of it. That's a great way to write your first
40:45
song. It's like listen, listen, listen to tons
40:48
and tons and tons of stuff. And when you get
40:50
obsessed with a song, which will happen, something
40:54
will hit you and will be the best thing you've
40:55
ever heard. Try to do your version of it. Like
40:59
figure out what they're saying and figure out
41:00
how they're doing it, what language they're using,
41:04
how they're writing a chorus, how they're structuring
41:06
things. what kind of chord progression they're
41:09
doing, and see if you can come up with something
41:14
that is sort of moving in the same way or exciting
41:18
in the same way while keeping it a little bit
41:22
different. I think that's an awesome way to start
41:24
out as a songwriter. Awesome. Is there anything
41:28
that we might have missed that you wanted to
41:30
talk about? No, I mean, it's fun to talk about
41:34
this stuff. I go about my day sort of doing this
41:38
stuff, but I don't really stop to think about
41:40
it. So it's fun to be asked all this stuff. I
41:43
really appreciate it. Yeah, awesome. No, it was
41:46
amazing to actually learn about the music industry
41:50
just in a more personal way, just how you got
41:53
started with your band and how the progression
41:55
goes and the producing and songwriting, just
41:59
stuff that obviously we just listen to the finished
42:02
product, right? Right. a little bit more of an
42:05
insight as to how much work there is behind for
42:10
sure that right and how yeah yeah and i'm sure
42:13
there's people out there who uh achieve just
42:16
as much and more than me by by not having to
42:19
work as hard but yeah in my case it's uh it's
42:23
a lot of it's a lot of habits and uh it's a lot
42:26
of trial and error uh before i get to a finished
42:29
product that i feel is fit for people's ears
42:33
I think that's just, you know, averagely how
42:35
everything works. Right. Just trial and error.
42:37
Yeah. Hopefully until you find something that
42:39
actually works. Right. Because you don't know
42:42
what's going to work until you actually start
42:44
doing it. That's totally, totally. Yeah. And
42:47
just I mean, maybe that's the other good piece
42:49
of advice is just do it. Just throw yourself
42:53
into it. Yeah. Yeah. There's a certain. leap
42:57
of faith that we've been talking about recently
43:00
too or you just gotta just just gotta do it big
43:03
time yep definitely definitely awesome you know
43:06
for people that want to i guess follow you and
43:10
you know check out your your your your songs
43:13
or your solo songs the things that you're releasing
43:15
where can people find you your website social
43:18
media yeah for sure they can find me on the internet
43:21
my name is nixon boyd That's my Instagram handle.
43:25
And that's what I'm releasing this music under,
43:28
just my name. And it's available everywhere.
43:32
People go to stream the music, Apple, Spotify,
43:35
Tidal, YouTube, what have you, all of it, all
43:38
of it, all of it. Well, thank you very much,
43:41
Nixon, for being part of our podcast. It was
43:44
amazing. I learned a lot. Awesome. Such a pleasure
43:46
to talk to you guys. Thank you so much for having
43:48
me. Thank you for listening to the entire episode.
43:52
All the links and info you heard in this conversation
43:54
will be featured in the show notes on our website,
43:57
villagermagazine .ca slash podcast. If you enjoyed
44:00
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44:05
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44:08
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