Latest / Executive Careers with Fexingo: VP, C-Suite, and Senior Leadership Career Strategy / How Senior Leaders Use Reference Calls as Strategic Leverage
Transcript
- Lucas: Most senior leaders treat reference checks as a box they have to tick—a bureaucratic step that happens near the end of a search. They hand over three names, hope for the best, and wait. That is a missed opportunity. Luna: A missed opportunity for what exactly? I mean, you're already through the interviews. The offer is usually on the table. Lucas: Exactly. And that's precisely when you have the most leverage. The reference call isn't just about verifying your past—it's about reinforcing your narrative and, critically, it's a chance to gather intelligence on the company you're about to join. If you approach it passively, you're leaving valuable information on the table. Luna: So you're saying the candidate should be using the reference process to vet the employer, not just the other way around. Lucas: Precisely. I worked with a VP of Product at a mid-size SaaS company last year. She had three final-round offers. One company was her top choice on paper—great title, twenty percent comp bump, exciting industry. But something felt off in the interviews. The CEO was a bit evasive about strategy, the team seemed siloed. Luna: And the reference call changed her mind? Lucas: She decided to offer up a reference who was a former board member at her last company—someone she trusted to be candid and strategic. But before she gave his name, she called him and said: 'I'm considering Company X. When they call you, I need you to be honest about my strengths, but I also want you to ask them about team dynamics and strategic clarity.' She turned her reference into a two-way intelligence channel. Luna: That's a subtle but powerful move. Most people would just say 'please say nice things about me.' Lucas: Right. Her reference called her after the conversation and said: 'The CEO couldn't give a clear answer about how product and engineering collaborate. He kept talking about 'alignment' in vague terms. That was a red flag.' She ended up declining that offer and took the second choice, which turned out to be a much better fit. She later told me that reference call saved her from a miserable year. Luna: So she used the reference to decode the culture in a way that interviews couldn't. That's smart. But how do you choose which references to offer? Not every former boss is going to be that strategic. Lucas: You want to select references who can speak to specific, relevant strengths—and who understand the context of the role you're going for. A former CEO who can talk about your strategic vision is great for a VP role. A former peer who can speak to your cross-functional collaboration is useful for a COO position. But you also want someone who is trustworthy enough to feed you honest feedback about the company. Luna: So you're essentially curating a panel of character witnesses, each with a different angle. Lucas: Exactly. And you should prepare them. Not script them—that would be obvious and could backfire. But you can give them a one-page summary of the role you're pursuing, key talking points about your accomplishments, and the company name. You want them to be armed with context so they can speak naturally and confidently. Luna: What about the risk of over-preparing? If the reference sounds too polished, the recruiter might smell something. Lucas: That's a real risk. The key is to brief them on facts, not on opinions. Send them your updated resume, a link to the company, and a note saying 'I'm being considered for X role, and I think my work on Y project is relevant.' That's not coaching—that's providing context. A good reference will use that to give specific examples, which is exactly what recruiters want to hear. Luna: And what about when the company asks for references early in the process? Before you've even had a serious interview. Lucas: That's a red flag. A responsible search process doesn't check references until the final stages. If they ask early, you can say: 'I'm happy to provide references once we're both serious. I'd like to make sure there's mutual interest first.' That sets a boundary and protects your network. Luna: I like that. It also subtly signals that you have options and you're not desperate. Lucas: Exactly. And when you do provide references, give three to four names—not two, not five. Three is the sweet spot. And make sure they represent different relationships: a former boss, a former peer, maybe a former direct report if the role involves managing a team. That diversity gives the recruiter a 360-degree view. Luna: And you should always ask permission before listing someone, right? I've heard horror stories of people listed without being asked. Lucas: Absolutely. Not only is it common courtesy, but it also gives you a chance to gauge their enthusiasm. If they hesitate, find someone else. You want references who are genuinely excited to speak on your behalf. A lukewarm reference can do more harm than a missing one. Luna: Let's talk about the actual call. What should a senior leader listen for when their reference is being interviewed? Lucas: Well, you won't be on the call, but your reference can debrief you afterward. And you should ask them specific questions: 'What did they seem most interested in? Did they ask about any weaknesses? Did they seem to have any concerns about my fit?' That intelligence is gold. It tells you what the company is really worried about. Luna: And if the reference says the company seemed disorganized or asked weird questions? That's a signal. Lucas: Huge signal. I had a client whose reference reported that the hiring manager spent half the call complaining about the previous person in the role. That told my client the culture might be toxic. He pulled out of the process before even getting to the offer stage. Luna: So you're using the reference call as a final due diligence step on the employer. That's a complete reframe of the traditional dynamic. Lucas: It is. And it's especially important at the senior level, because the stakes are higher. A bad hire at the VP level can cost a company millions in misdirected strategy, not to mention the personal toll on the executive. You owe it to yourself to use every tool available. Luna: And that includes following up with your references after the process, right? To thank them and let them know the outcome. Lucas: Critical. Always send a handwritten note—email is fine, but a physical card stands out. And keep them in your network. These are people who have vouched for you. They are now invested in your success. A quick quarterly check-in or sharing an article they'd find interesting keeps that relationship warm for the next time you need them. Luna: That's good career hygiene. And it's also just respectful. Lucas: Exactly. Look, we talk a lot on this show about negotiating offers and managing your reputation. Reference calls are part of that ecosystem. They're not a passive step—they're an active part of your career strategy. Luna: And we're able to have these conversations because this show is ad-free. We don't run commercials, and that's a deliberate choice. If you find value in episodes like this, you can support the show at buy me a coffee dot com slash fexingo. It's a simple way to keep us independent. Lucas: Yeah, we hear from listeners that they appreciate not having ads interrupt the flow. And every contribution helps us keep doing deep dives like this one. Luna: So back to references—one more thing. What about when a company insists on talking to your current boss, and you haven't told them you're looking? Lucas: That's a tough one. Most professional recruiters understand that you don't want to jeopardize your current position. You can say: 'I'm happy to provide references from previous roles, and I can make my current manager available later in the process, once an offer is extended.' If they push, it's a red flag about their respect for your situation. Luna: So you're essentially negotiating the reference process itself as part of the overall deal. Lucas: Exactly. And that's the mindset shift I want listeners to take away. References are not a formality—they are a strategic tool. Choose them carefully, brief them thoughtfully, debrief them strategically, and use the intelligence they gather to make better decisions about your next move. Luna: And if you do it right, you might just avoid a role that looks perfect on paper but is a disaster in practice. Lucas: That's the goal. When you treat reference calls as leverage rather than a hurdle, you take control of the final mile of your search. And at the senior level, that's where the most important decisions get made.