Latest / In the Valley of Giants / The Past Lives Through Us | Rabbi Mordechai Becher | ITVOG Ep. 31

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The Past Lives Through Us | Rabbi Mordechai Becher | ITVOG Ep. 31 · In the Valley of Giants

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  The fact is that I'm sure the men of the great assembly were
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  120 rabbis, amongst them a number of prophets.
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  These are the only three quotes. I mean seriously.
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  I mean, obviously everything in perky avant a selected quotes
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  got a person who's who God's speaking through, so to speak.
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  You've got a person who is telling you what's your goal in
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  life, your unique goal of your soul.
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  So it was a very different type of situation and manifestation
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  of Hashem's presence. There's so much that religion
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  has to offer if only people would live.
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  And I, I fear that the people that do not embrace their Jewish
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  identity as much, they're people that were never really, you
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  know, learned. Their knowledge of Judaism is
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  from is from Seinfeld or Larry. What's his name?
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  We all have been watching, but you study how the Jewish history
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  is unfolding and each chapter is being written.
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  What is a message that we are learning and what's 1 message
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  that we just seem to not really get?
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  Hello everyone. Today we're joined by Rabbi
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  Mordecher. Rabbi Mordecher is a Jewish
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  historian and rabbinic scholar. We discussed today three really
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  important things #1 the evolution of Jewish history, 2.
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  The evolution of prayer and practice within Jewish observant
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  thought. And lastly, we discussed the
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  difference between assimilation and adaptation and what that's
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  looked like for our culture and our religion throughout the
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  ages. I learned a lot and hope you do
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  too. Enjoy.
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  Thank you so much for joining us here today.
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  Pleasure to be here. Thank you of.
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  Course, so you have a very long list of amazing accomplishments,
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  but one thing that really shines, at least for me, is your
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  incredible expertise in decoding and explaining quite clearly the
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  historical progression of the Jewish people.
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  And so I'd like to start there with your permission.
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  Jews have been a very resilient people, but the particular
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  tragedy of the Roman occupation and the Roman onslaught that
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  followed the Second Temple period is something that I don't
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  really understand easily how we could have survived and thrived,
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  especially since we were a society, a theocratic government
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  and culture that was surrounded around the temple service.
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  So in your humble opinion, how did, how did Jews be able to
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  survive that sort of transition? And by the way, for our for our
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  listeners, this happened once before with the fall of the
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  First Temple. And I wouldn't say that the
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  Jewish people easily survived at all.
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  In fact, that large portion of them were sent into exile and
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  never came back. So please.
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  So it's a, it's a great question.
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  There was obviously a major national trauma, losing our
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  land, losing the Temple, losing the aside from centralized
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  worship, also centralized Torah. We had a Sanhedrin, we had
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  authority, etcetera. So I think a lot of the survival
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  can be attributed to the foresight of the rabbi's.
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  At the beginning of the Second Temple era, the men of the great
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  assembly, Ansheh, Nessat, Abdullah were aware.
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  Amongst them there were prophets.
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  They were aware that the Second Temple era was not going to be
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  permanent. They knew it would come to an
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  end. Ruby Yakov Kamenetsky has a
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  fascinating essay in his book Ms. Yakov on Pique Ovis on
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  ethics of the Fathers in which he points this out and that that
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  they knew this was temporary. Which is, by the way, why when
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  they built the second temple, they did not follow the plans
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  given in the Prophet Yekheskil for the temple because they knew
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  that the Prophet Yekheskil was giving plans for the ultimate
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  final temple that we are praying for.
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  This was a temporary one, 420 years granted, but temporary.
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  And so did they. How did?
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  How did we know that? How was there a way to know that
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  that wasn't the final temple? They again, amongst the men of
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  the Great Assembly, the Talmud tells us that amongst them were
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  a number of prophets, Kagai, Zakhar, Zaki, et cetera.
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  Prophecy is not something I understand, but certainly part
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  of prophecy is that they can see and they know the future.
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  And so this incredible foresight and prescience prompted the men
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  of the Great Assembly to already begin preparation for exile 400
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  years before the exile. How did they do it?
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  Number one, they enacted prayers and blessings.
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  An entire service of prayer that we still use was enacted by the
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  man of the great Assembly. And that meant that now, even
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  though there was no centralized temple offerings and so on, Jews
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  would be able to gather in what we, if Heskel called Migdashmat,
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  the minor temple, IE the baked Knesset, the synagogue,
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  etcetera, and would have the opportunity to serve God and
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  prayers would unite the Jews because they're all in Hebrew.
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  The Rambam points us out in the beginning of the laws of filler
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  of prayer that part of the part of the problem was that the Jews
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  were picking up foreign language already in Israel.
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  There were Jews speaking Greek and Aramaic and other languages
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  and so on. And so, so by enacting the
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  prayers, it also was a preservation of the Jewish
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  national language, Hebrew. So, so number one, with the
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  format of prayers, that's one thing that the that that helped
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  us circumvent or or have some type of solution to the problem
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  of not having the temple. Secondly, the men of the great
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  assembly. And this is this is the theory
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  of a galk of Kamenetsky that in the first Temple Torah study was
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  much less emphasized and was much less the inheritance of the
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  entire Jewish people than during the Second Temple era.
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  During the Second Temple era, there was a deliberate attempt
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  to democratize, universalize the study of Torah.
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  There would be, it would be something that everyone who was
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  capable would do. And the Men of the Grave
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  assembly made a deliberate attempt at doing that because
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  they realized that it was through that, that the Jewish
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  people would be able to maintain their integrity, their identity,
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  their national identity, even in a state of exile.
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  So that was the second enactment, the man of the great
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  assembly that was extremely effective in preserving the
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  Jewish people. There was a German poet,
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  Heinrich Hein Heiner, who was actually born Jewish but
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  assimilated, got baptized even. But Heinrich Heiner referred to
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  the Torah very, I think accurately, as the portable
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  homeland of the Jewish people, portable homeland of the Jewish
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  people. And he was totally correct.
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  I mean, it's surprising that someone who was so distant from
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  Judaism should have such an accurate insight.
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  But the Torah became our homeland.
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  Where do we live? Where do Jews live?
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  If you're a Russian Trois, or if you are a Rabbitsk al Fazi in
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  Cairo and Tunisia, you both lived in the, you know, in the,
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  in the, in the Torah. That's where they lived, right?
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  And that became the homeland. And it's type of interesting.
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  I can't prove this, but after many major tragedies, I
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  certainly know this is true. After the 1st Crusade 1096 and,
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  and other events, there was an explosion of Torah publications,
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  Torah reactions. And, and one of the reasons for
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  that, I mean, look, on the simple level, you might say that
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  it was people were panicked that this is a tragedy, we're going
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  to lose Torah, so we have to publish more maybe, right.
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  But also part of it is when your physical homeland is crumbling
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  and disintegrating, you turn back to your spiritual homeland,
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  which is the Torah. And so I think those were two
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  factors that were extremely central in the survival of the
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  Jewish people throughout our exile. 1/3 is somewhat
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  evolutionary adaptation. The Jewish people were able to
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  adapt themselves to various environments.
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  You know Arnold I. Don't know what you mean.
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  I'll, I'll, I'll try to explain Arnold Toynbee, author of the
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  book The Rise and fall of 29 civilizations.
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  He points out that civilization don't are not don't die, but
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  they commit suicide because they cannot adapt to changing
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  conditions. They were they, they were
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  developed in one specific type of environment and they come to
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  a different environment, different socio economic.
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  They cannot cope and he says therefore they die.
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  Now Judaism very differently right here we are in Israel,
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  agricultural environment, et cetera.
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  We find ourselves now in urban environments in Europe.
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  We find ourselves separated from agriculture and other but but
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  the Jewish people and Judaism was able to to adapt.
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  So just for you know, to give you some, some examples of this
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  would be that we find ourselves in a foreign country that speaks
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  German. Most of the Jews are not
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  familiar enough with Hebrew to be able to speak Hebrew.
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  So we take German and we develop it into our own language.
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  It's not that's that's a very radical thing thing that you're
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  saying it. If I make it, can we just do a
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  small recap and ask a few questions?
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  OK, so this first theory of that, the minor prophets were
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  already very aware of what was to come, and therefore they
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  started to enact these three. Well, they're really two
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  enactments. Third thing is adaptation.
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  First thing being prayer. Second thing is an increase in
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  terrorist study. So #1 perhaps there's some
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  verses that you can quote to me in my, in my limited and humble
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  study of the minor prophets, I don't remember the minor
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  prophets ever referring to a period to come that that the
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  temple would be built and it not be and not be messianic age.
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  My, my personal feeling, and I could be wrong about this if I'm
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  more learned than I am, is that it's, there was always an
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  understanding that a coupling of things have to go together.
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  In other words, it could be 30 temples from this one that the
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  temple that we're waiting for is the temple that comes with the
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  Messiah, with Mushiah. It's those two things that have
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  to come together. And that's when we enter the
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  Messianic Age. And that's going to be the last
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  temple. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, we
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  have records of 1/3 temple even being built a few 100 years
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  after the second temple was built and there was an
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  earthquake and many people died. So you know, it's, it's all
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  about getting the, the temple with the Mushiya.
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  So I guess #1 is how do you know that the minor prophets were
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  aware of this? Like we just what record do we
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  have within them? So maybe it's a Gemara that I'm
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  just not remembering. 2 is I think prayer is a great idea
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  whether we're going to have a temple or not.
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  In fact, we see by Hannah we see by Hannah that she already
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  weighed a pre even first base in Mektosh is already giving the
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  the underpinnings of the most valuable.
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  I would say a prayer that we have, which is the Shimon Astra,
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  the 18 blessings that we pray to God a multiple times a day and
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  and lastly, increase of terrorist study.
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  I think I think that definitely is the backbone of the survival
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  as certainly my best guess. However, I feel like we see that
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  far more poster destruction. You know, 10 Yavin of Akamai as
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  a Serviokhanan that the city of Yavin, which had terrorist
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  scholars and he he asked Titus and perspasion to spare that
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  city and and where do we have in the Talmud of the explosion of
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  of Torah opinions and exegesis. That's that's post, you know,
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  Second Temple destruction. I, I feel like we don't really
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  have money quotes of, of of ribbon and before how far can we
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  go back earlier than I would like to see a lot more hell and
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  Sha Mai fighting or their predecessors.
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  So if you could respond to some of those points, that'd be
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  great. And then I'll, I'll, I'll
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  address the adaptation bit that that you brought up, which I
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  think it's its own deserves its own discussion.
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  So first of all, the the the Messianic time, one of the
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  primary predictions of the times of the Messiah is the in
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  gathering of the Exiles. At the time of the Second Temple
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  we did not have that. In fact, the majority of the
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  Jewish people were still in Babylon.
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  So it was pretty clear. You don't have to be a genius or
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  a great prophet to know that the Second Temple was not it #1 we
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  didn't have the in gathering of the Exiles #2 there were wars.
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  One of the other major predictions of the ties of the
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  Messiah is loyisa goyil goyharev loyolmador odnil Hama.
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  Nations not raise sword against nation.
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  They shall not teach war anymore.
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  So these are explicit verses which were not fulfilled during
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  the time of the Second Temple. And so I think you don't even,
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  you know, I mean. Like the temple, the second
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  temple was for 400 plus years. I mean, I understand the
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  beginning that it didn't look like it, but but you know, the
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  temple, that second temple period was, was long.
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  At the beginning, it did not look like it.
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  And therefore I think they realized that that was not, this
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  was not the predicted final redemption.
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  So again, you can look at the, you know, I don't remember
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  specific verses, but the essay of of Yaakov Kaneski is based on
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  the beginning of Pirke Ivo where you see that the the the man of
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  the great assembly beginning of Pirkeova already said at that
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  you have to do three things Hamidou tell medium Harbay set
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  yourself up with many students, set up many, many students,
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  right? They said, they said have a
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  matunimbadin be very slow to come to judgement.
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  Set up many students associate La Torra make fences around the
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  Torah. You look at those 3 commands,
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  right? You realize that they were
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  confronting a situation. This is the guy here of Hein
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  Volosen understands it in the rule, but this is.
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  But this is But this is the tradition from Moses, right?
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  No. No necessarily it's the
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  tradition from Moses, but I mean it has its source there.
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  The the fact that it's certainly, you're right,
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  everything in perky Avas ultimately has its tradition.
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  No, no, the the the fact that it's cited in Perky Avat is
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  selected quotes. The fact is that I'm sure the
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  men of the Great Assembly were 120 rabbis, amongst them a
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  number of prophets. These are the only three quotes.
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  I mean seriously, I mean, obviously everything in Perky I
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  bought a selected quotes. The fact that was all right.
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  So, so the question you got to ask yourself is why are they
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  saying these are the three things that the men of the Great
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  Assembly said? Because they saw these as
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  necessary for their time. Prophecy was ending.
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  They realized prophecy was ending.
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  They knew that because they had the last of the prophets amongst
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  them. Right?
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  Shimanat Sadiq, hey, I'm Shayari, I'm Sheikh nested
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  Abdullah right? He was the last remnants and it
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  was him. If you look in the Maharao
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  discusses based on the Gomorrah Numa summit test, where where
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  Shimanat Sadiq makes Alexander, you have a change a, a, a, a
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  massive sea change in the world. Prophecy is ending.
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  Wisdom is taking over on the Jewish side, the Hochmaster
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  Shabal pair on the opposition side, Hochman Ivanit, Greek
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  wisdom. That's the new battleground, so
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  to speak, and to confront this new situation and this, even
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  though we're in Israel, but to confront this idea.
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  And they knew they had a premonition that things would
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  not be continuing in a wonderful way.
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  You look at the rise of Alexander, the rise of Hellenism
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  and so on and so forth. So they said, they said we don't
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  have prophecy. So you have to do maternium,
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  heavy maternium within. Take it slowly.
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  You're not going to have this sudden inspiration, say this, is
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  it not? You're going to have to work on
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  this. Think about it.
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  And you need lots of students because it's by discussion and
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  by argument and by question, answer and the Socratic method,
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  you know, so to speak, right? You are going to increase your
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  chances of getting things right. So how many to tell?
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  Medium, Harbay? Lots and lots of students.
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  Lots of students. That's a type of a bit of a
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  change, right? Don't go for the elite, go for
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  everyone now. And finally, even with all of
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  your introspection and study and thought, and even with the
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  discussion amongst many students who still may make a mistake,
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  what do you have to do? Yadla Torah Make fences around
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  the Torah. That's point number one point #2
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  during the time of the Second Temple, that was the Tanoim.
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  That was the rise of the Tanoim. The authors of the Mishnah,
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  right? The genera, no, the, the mission
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  was written in 170 to 200. That is correct.
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  But the authors of the mission, the contributors to the Mishnah
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  were during the entire time, from the men of the Great
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  Assembly all the way through till Rebuta Nazi.
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  As you can see, Pierquet Avat follows that chain all the way
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  through chronological chain. And it was during that time that
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  there was a propagation of Torah.
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  Of course, it flowered greatly after the writing down of the
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  Mishnah, but it was very clear that there was a, that there was
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  a, a, a tremendous increase and in, in both in Torah and in, in
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  the intera banana and and so on and so forth that that took
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  place during that period. So these are some of the
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  features of of that time and these are some of the features
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  of the man of the great assembly who who had were prescient in
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  this understanding. So of course I'm, I'm, I am
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  leaving out the obvious elephant in the room, which is God's
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  divine Providence and God's Hashem's promise to the Jewish
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  people that he would preserve us.
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  But, but the, the, the mechanism, maybe the mechanism
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  through which he did that was, this was, was, was, was the man
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  of the great assembly, Anshek Nexa dollar Torah filler and so
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  on and so forth. And now as you mentioned that
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  filler, of course prayer existed beforehand, but there were no
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  set prayers beforehand and there was no standardized form of
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  prayer, as the Rambam very clearly states.
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  You look at the very beginning, chapter 1, Hilhot Phila Rama
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  says before the man of the great assembly, you pray when you
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  wanted, what you wanted, how you wanted, and there was no set
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  form of doing that, right? The establishment of set
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  prayers, standardized prayers took a standardized service of
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  the Bait Hamid Dash. The temple and now transferred
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  that into every synagogue type of interest.
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  If you look in the collected writings of of Sanson of Faial
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  Hirsch, forget which volume maybe volume 3, I don't
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  remember. He actually goes through the
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  structure of the prayers and shows they actually follow the
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  structure of the carbon not and the avoid in very, very
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  detailed, very detailed fashions like amazing.
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  I don't remember the details of it, but that's, but he does show
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  that. And, and what they were doing
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  was preserving this, this, this Avada, right, Which by the way,
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  the men of the great assembly said one of the three things
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  upon which the Torah stands, Torah Shimanat Sadiq, right,
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  Torah, the study of Torah Avada, which generally then was worship
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  of hash, which worship through the offerings, but became
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  worship through filler. Una Shalma Paris Paseno as as a
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  prophet I share says we will pay for the lips of what the, the
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  English term lip service comes from there, right?
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  That's how we will pay. And so that's how we're going to
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  do it. And of course custody, which we
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  didn't discuss yet, but the mutual communal responsibility
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  and kindness and philanthropy of the Jew community is what is a
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  major factor in the Jew people's preservation.
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  So, so all these things indicate that idea.
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  And of course, yes, people prayed beforehand.
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  Abraham prayed, right? Not, not saying no one prayed,
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  but what I'm what, what is clear is that there was not a communal
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  prayer and a set prayer. And that has done a tremendous
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  amount for preservation of the Jewish people.
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  Do you think that? No, Yeah.
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  Please no. Continue.
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  Continue. And, and not just to preserve
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  the, the Jewish, but it also preserves sense of community,
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  which is very powerful, a very powerful mechanism for
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  preserving people, preventing assimilation.
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  It provided opportunity for connection even for people who
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  are not scholars, even for people, right?
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  People can connect through prayer.
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  You even have people. And this is a phenomenon that
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  was not new. The people who are quite distant
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  from Judaism will nevertheless are attracted sometimes.
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  How many people come to call Nidre right, to hear that,
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  right? How many far didn't go to
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  Slihot, right? Even if they're disconnected to
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  some degree. And how many people you know,
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  it's, it's, it's, it's really something which was able to
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  attach itself on a mystical level or sometimes even on a
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  psychological up to the heartstrings of the Jewish
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  people and, and keep us intact in that way.
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  And and. We would, what would we have
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  benefited? Would we have benefited in the
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  first temple times for having instituted prayer or was it not
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  needed? The implication and what you
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  said before is that it it's a saving process.
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  So this was our saving through. Does that mean that we didn't
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  need it in the first temple times?
• 23:04
  Yeah, I mean, people still have to pray according to the Rambam,
• 23:07
  according to Maimonides of it's a mixture of the Torah to pray
• 23:10
  every day. So you still did that during the
• 23:13
  First Temple era, but it was not as necessary.
• 23:15
  First of all, one major difference.
• 23:18
  First Temple era, until the exile of the 10 tribes, the
• 23:22
  majority of Jews lived in Israel.
• 23:25
  Those who were exiled quickly assimilated, right?
• 23:28
  But the Jews were primarily focused in Israel with the
• 23:31
  Temple. And very important, we had
• 23:33
  prophecy. Now having prophecy is not just
• 23:37
  that there were individuals who had prophecy, which I'm at the
• 23:40
  Talmud says there were thousands of prophets, right, right.
• 23:45
  Thousands of prophets. And and the inspiration that I
• 23:49
  might get from going to a caliber minion Friday night,
• 23:54
  which is why I love it, etcetera, is nothing compared to
• 23:58
  the inspiration I might get from contact with a prophet, right.
• 24:02
  You know, so, so, so it wasn't as necessary.
• 24:05
  You want to be connected to spirituality.
• 24:07
  You've got a person who's who God's speaking through, so to
• 24:10
  speak. You've got a person who is
• 24:12
  telling you what's your goal in life, your unique goal of your
• 24:16
  soul. So it was a very different type
• 24:18
  of situation and manifestation of Hashem's presence.
• 24:21
  The miracles, the 10 miracles mission empirical of us.
• 24:24
  Hey, hey, of the of the of the temple that occurred, right,
• 24:28
  that people could there's a feeling of a time presence.
• 24:31
  So we get a little bit taste of that sometimes in so, but First
• 24:36
  Temple era wasn't as necessary. So we have a fork in the road
• 24:40
  here because this is the perfect introduction to two questions I
• 24:43
  want to ask you, but they're very different.
• 24:45
  So I'm going to leave my question to feel of Alexandria
• 24:47
  actually for the sigh for a moment.
• 24:49
  And I'm going to, I'm going to say ask this.
• 24:51
  I have a theory and I want to know you think about it.
• 24:54
  You know, there's this Talmudic idea of your Rita Sadharose,
• 24:58
  which is that as time goes on, as we move farther away from
• 25:02
  Moses at Sinai, the Jewish people deteriorate.
• 25:06
  Which of course begs the most basic philosophical question,
• 25:09
  which is if we're constantly deteriorating, then how are we
• 25:12
  ever going to enter the Messianic age?
• 25:15
  But I think a possible answer to this, which I think fits very
• 25:19
  well into your theory on Philo and prayer, is that you read a
• 25:23
  Sedaris means that we are less fervorous, meaning we have this
• 25:29
  less of this burning emotional and spiritual connection with
• 25:36
  God that we would see. And that's dripping out of the
• 25:39
  out of the pages of of Isaiah of Yeshaya and Ezekiel and Yahesko
• 25:44
  and the rest of the prophets. But what I think that we do have
• 25:47
  that I think was certainly not the case.
• 25:50
  And it, it gets worse. I think if you go into the past,
• 25:52
  it only gets better if you go into the future, is the
• 25:54
  observance of God's laws in the study, if it's ever.
• 25:57
  I think that we are in a golden age, a golden age of Torah study
• 26:02
  and of observance. I'm not to say that everyone is
• 26:04
  observant and not to say that people that are observant are
• 26:06
  perfect, but I think that we're in a Torah revolution that the
• 26:10
  world has never seen. Would you agree with to this
• 26:12
  sort of theory and understanding of the Rita Sedaris Ravi backer?
• 26:15
  Do you understand it differently?
• 26:18
  I, I don't see it necessarily as a steady slowed down.
• 26:23
  I think there have been plateaus.
• 26:25
  I think there are ages. I don't think it's, you know,
• 26:28
  just for example, the period of the tenayum was 500 years, 600
• 26:33
  years, right, And a later Turner could argue on an earlier Turner
• 26:37
  because it's all in the same period.
• 26:39
  The same is true in the Gemara, right, Rishonium.
• 26:42
  And so it's not I don't think it's as clear cut as people make
• 26:45
  it that, you know, from a Torah perspective, you know, they have
• 26:48
  the old famous statement which attributed to them a bit, but it
• 26:52
  goes earlier than that is that we are we are dwarfs standing on
• 26:55
  the shoulders of giants. Sometimes the dwarf can see
• 26:58
  further. I have have the benefit of, of
• 27:03
  all the rashonium and the Acronium.
• 27:06
  I don't know them all, but I can access all of that thought all
• 27:10
  of that. So, so you're right, right.
• 27:12
  We are in a, a situation which is amazing, right?
• 27:17
  We have this incredible advantage, right, of of access
• 27:22
  to so much material, to so much Torah.
• 27:25
  And we have luxuries that other generations didn't have.
• 27:29
  We have the luxury of most people being able to learn
• 27:33
  Torah. Yeah, most like men and women.
• 27:37
  Unbelievable amount of opportunities.
• 27:40
  You know, we what whatever the opportunity is not going to go
• 27:43
  into the details, but we all know that we have a level of
• 27:46
  luxury that our ancestors forget answer, just go back to
• 27:50
  generations, our grandparents, great grandparents to work like
• 27:56
  the amount you got. I mean, think of it this way,
• 27:58
  right? They wanted water to wash.
• 28:00
  Go go to the well, like 15 minutes, right, You know, slip
• 28:05
  in the ice, go get the water out of the well, bring it back to
• 28:07
  the houses, freezing cold, etcetera, etcetera.
• 28:09
  Wait for it to to get to the level you don't get frostbite,
• 28:13
  then you can wash. I can turn on a tap.
• 28:15
  Bam, it's unbelievable, right. Bread go to the store like you
• 28:22
  know, so we have, we have time, luxury of time.
• 28:25
  We have, we have luxury of money, resources, etcetera.
• 28:30
  So I don't think I, I think to a great degree, we have this
• 28:33
  incredible, incredible advantages.
• 28:35
  And, and not only that, but you know, Saddock and others talk
• 28:40
  about this idea of Sutter soon for Bunim Shishka before him.
• 28:44
  Andrew Saddock is imprisoned by if he he talks about this idea
• 28:49
  that that it that, that it may be that we are on a lower level,
• 28:54
  But he says, he says there is an idea that our inner power is
• 29:02
  greater because we have we have far greater challenges on a
• 29:07
  spiritual level than other societies may have had because
• 29:11
  of the walls of the ghetto coming down, because of our
• 29:14
  increased the increased influence and so on and so
• 29:17
  forth. From outside external sources,
• 29:19
  he says we are, we have certain, you know, the fact that anyone
• 29:23
  who's still Jewish, anyone who's still, you know, observing the
• 29:26
  Torah, that's tremendous merit which may know who knows, he
• 29:31
  says. And he says not only that, but
• 29:34
  he points out that our ancestors have achieved great levels of
• 29:37
  Gadusha even in the midst of exile.
• 29:40
  And he says that that the fact that we are the ones who are
• 29:43
  going to the Azure Hashem getting closer and closer to the
• 29:47
  Mashiach is is certainly something significant.
• 29:50
  There's the quote. I've got a quote here from Riv
• 29:53
  riv riv sinchabunni mapshiska, 19th century Hasidic rabbi.
• 29:58
  He says Afshana fascia MIT cut Nimb holder Nikol Mokamhat
• 30:04
  Nakuda shall believe nitar beholder of adorio tear.
• 30:09
  It could be that our souls, so to speak, become more limited,
• 30:13
  but the inner spark has become purified more and more over the
• 30:18
  generations. And so so yeah, I I think I
• 30:22
  would agree with you here. And and there's this rapinous of
• 30:28
  courts. Just one more Hasidic point.
• 30:31
  No, it's not a Hasidic yeshiva, right?
• 30:33
  But nevertheless, right I'm. I'm Litfish.
• 30:36
  You're litfish. OK, so I'm Hasidic.
• 30:38
  So he says this is in in repentance of Kuritz.
• 30:41
  He says the following. He says that.
• 30:46
  Where is it? Oh, here we go.
• 30:47
  How Tanoim Bamaroim. The Tanoim Amaroim.
• 30:50
  How you smoking Lahuruban bait Hamidash were very close to the
• 30:55
  destruction of the temple and but there was still the light of
• 30:58
  the temple that somehow had just receded and they were still
• 31:02
  basking in that light. He says righteous people in our
• 31:06
  generation smooching La Ora shall Messiah Messiah are are,
• 31:11
  so to speak, benefiting from the light not in the past, but the
• 31:15
  light of the future, right we are.
• 31:18
  So we have that benefit of the light of the machine.
• 31:20
  What exactly this means unclear, but and also you find this in to
• 31:25
  give you a lip fish sorcerer Schlama al Yashev, the leshem
• 31:28
  Shvoyev Akhlama known as the Leshem.
• 31:33
  He says a similar idea. He says just to to quote this is
• 31:38
  in in safer Akhalim called base. He says that that even when the
• 31:46
  darkness is greater than he says each person's light is much,
• 31:51
  much brighter. And he says that that the the
• 31:56
  because the darkness and the tumor is so great in our times,
• 32:01
  He says the light and the brightness of each person
• 32:03
  individually is that much greater because it's glowing in
• 32:07
  the dark. So anyway, that's but that's
• 32:10
  apropos of the urethra Sidoris idea.
• 32:14
  Well, let me ask you and then purely curiosity question if you
• 32:16
  had to guess, do you think that people are more fervent now in
• 32:19
  their beliefs than they were in the temple times or less?
• 32:23
  I, I have no way of knowing that I, I, I, I don't know if I would
• 32:27
  be able to even venture a guess at that.
• 32:31
  You know, it because also is very, very individual, very
• 32:37
  difficult to know. You know, I the way I see it, I
• 32:42
  think it might be easier to have a muna when you can see miracles
• 32:47
  every day in the temple, right? We still see miracles every day
• 32:51
  in Israel, but they are miracles which are somewhat more hidden.
• 32:56
  They're not open changes of nature, right.
• 32:59
  So we still have miracles. But you know, there's a
• 33:02
  fascinating Haz on Ish in in Yoradaya on on Thomas Echus of
• 33:08
  Otazaro, the Gomorrah says that certain people like minim that
• 33:11
  Jews who are trying to seduce people into idolatry.
• 33:15
  So the Gomorrah says, you know, such a person would be allowed
• 33:18
  to be killed by the community. Like wow, right, Moridian Valle
• 33:23
  Marlin, you know, so the Hazen is says, and it sounds very
• 33:28
  radical. The cousin is says this.
• 33:30
  He says that's only true then when Divine Providence was
• 33:34
  obvious, Hashka Hashem Galuya, Divine province was obvious and
• 33:39
  people could see that the ebud were shot in Rena.
• 33:42
  With the death, the death of the evil came joy.
• 33:46
  He says Nowadays when the divine Providence is hidden, he says
• 33:51
  any act of aggression towards these people is a hill Hashem, a
• 33:58
  desecration of God's name and produces the opposite effect of
• 34:01
  what it's meant to do So instead, what do we have to do
• 34:05
  embrace them and bring them close.
• 34:08
  So the cousin is this sounds you talk about radical.
• 34:13
  The Gomorrah says kill him. The cousin is says give him a
• 34:15
  hug because we live in a time where we don't see divine
• 34:20
  Providence to that same degree. So at least from the cousin is
• 34:24
  it sounds to me like it was easier to it was easier to
• 34:29
  embrace Amuna back then when you when divine province was very
• 34:33
  open, when you had miracles happening all the time, you had
• 34:36
  prophecy, right? Were there other challenges?
• 34:39
  Yes, of course you had the supernatural desire for
• 34:42
  idolatry, which we don't have any more.
• 34:44
  So there were challenges because you have to have challenges
• 34:47
  because of Bahira. With the way the way that Tomba
• 34:50
  talks about even layman is just that they were so fervent and by
• 34:54
  the way, neither direction whether they were for anti
• 34:57
  terror. There's so much more of a
• 34:59
  polarization. I do feel that there's a certain
• 35:02
  spirit that that is that has darkened in in some way, but but
• 35:07
  I digress. OK, let's, let's let's move over
• 35:09
  to the other thing that you talked about, which is
• 35:11
  adaptation, which obviously is very different than
• 35:14
  assimilation. So Hellenistic Judaism was
• 35:17
  rampant and the second Temple times.
• 35:20
  And it is absolutely no secret that when the Second Temple was
• 35:24
  standing that there was a tremendous war of belief.
• 35:27
  The scenes, the Sadducees, the Pharisees, and even it's one of
• 35:33
  the things that perhaps makes me the most saddened about
• 35:37
  remembering the destruction of the second Temple for those that
• 35:39
  study it. And we were so busy fighting
• 35:42
  each other and killing each other within Jerusalem walls.
• 35:46
  In fact, if John of Gershom versus Simon Bardiora to say the
• 35:52
  names in English were literally killing each other while the
• 35:54
  Romans were attacking them on the other front, which is just
• 35:57
  an insane thing to think about. But you know, adaptation.
• 36:01
  I'm assuming what you mean is, is that instead of assimilating,
• 36:06
  which is losing our identity within other things, is that the
• 36:11
  Gentiles, of course, you know, there are blessings for seeing
• 36:14
  righteous or wise Gentiles. So what we have learned or what
• 36:19
  we're trying to we've been trying to implement for the last
• 36:21
  couple thousand years is see the wonderful things that the
• 36:24
  Gentiles do add to the universe. And there's many, many things
• 36:28
  that they do add that are absolutely wondrous.
• 36:30
  And we try to absorb that and, and give it back to to the
• 36:34
  world. And the easiest example I think
• 36:36
  would be Maimonides and his absolutely unbelievable works
• 36:40
  that clearly are influenced by Recitalian thought.
• 36:43
  Is that is this what you meant, Rabbi Backer?
• 36:46
  Yeah, not only that, but yes, that part partially that.
• 36:50
  In other words, it's over. Like in, in certain martial arts
• 36:54
  like Aikido and judo, one of the principles is to use the
• 36:59
  opponent's strength in order to the strength of his attack in
• 37:06
  redirect his power so that you can, you can easily overcome
• 37:11
  him, so to speak, right. So there's a certain spiritual
• 37:14
  aikido that we have utilized in which we, we take this idea and
• 37:21
  we elevate it, we incorporate it and we, we, we sanctify it.
• 37:27
  And we've done that not just with ideas, but in many other
• 37:30
  areas. You look at the tunes that we
• 37:34
  use for our prayers and for our songs, right?
• 37:40
  You know, you could have a group of ultra Orthodox, I use that
• 37:45
  and like that term. But you can have a group of
• 37:47
  Hassidim in Maharim 1000 of them sitting around at a rebel's tish
• 37:53
  on a Friday night singing a song that comes from a drinking song
• 37:59
  of Ukrainians 300 years ago, right?
• 38:04
  They are unaware of it. Maybe they're aware of its
• 38:06
  origin. I don't know.
• 38:07
  But that's, that's no, I don't think there's anything wrong
• 38:10
  with that. I think it's great.
• 38:11
  I think I'm taking something and we've we've now incorporated,
• 38:15
  adapted it and utilized it for something positive, right?
• 38:18
  In the same way, you know, you've got the Spartic, uh,
• 38:23
  tunes, macam and, and, and different poems that they use,
• 38:27
  which are certainly based on Arabic poetry and Arabic meter
• 38:30
  and Arabic music. Yeah.
• 38:32
  And and one of the greatest Sparty Hassanim today is
• 38:35
  Heimlich Loki. That's my grandfather.
• 38:39
  I'm very familiar. What?
• 38:41
  Really. He's my great, yes, Yeah.
• 38:44
  Whoa. Really, I'm a hybrid.
• 38:45
  I'm a hybrid. I'm not just litfish.
• 38:48
  So his Hassanut is incredible. Beautiful and delusion, yeah.
• 38:52
  Andalusian and and he has given concerts for non Jews in
• 38:57
  Morocco. That's why he missed my he he
• 39:00
  was not at my wedding because I was told that unfortunately
• 39:05
  before I got engaged, he already set up with the King of Morocco.
• 39:09
  So he was. There you go.
• 39:10
  Yeah. So, so.
• 39:12
  Well, I'm I'm I'm very whoa, I'm honoured.
• 39:15
  But anyway, but but but crime Luke prime Luke.
• 39:19
  Obviously the tunes that he has are are something which are
• 39:22
  familiar to to Moroccans and Andalusian right.
• 39:26
  So, so in that way we've adapted, you know, the OR Haheim
• 39:30
  Raheim, even Attar, who probably also related to I have no idea
• 39:33
  right in in schmut you'd Ted. He actually points out that the,
• 39:39
  the, the, the, the, the fact that the Jews have been spread
• 39:44
  out amongst the nations. He says part of it is that that
• 39:50
  there are sparks of holiness that are embedded in the world.
• 39:53
  He puts us in Kabbalistic language, as you'd expect, and
• 39:57
  is our job. Our our part of our goal is to
• 40:00
  take those sparks and to elevate them and we draw the, the
• 40:06
  holiness that is, that is there. We do this in a number of ways.
• 40:10
  But one obvious way is through converts, righteous converts
• 40:13
  from various nations. Absolutely.
• 40:16
  We do this with music. We do this with food, Right.
• 40:20
  So, so the, the Tajin is not something we I I love Tajin, but
• 40:26
  it's not the same. We don't right.
• 40:28
  Problem Tajik. Right.
• 40:29
  So there's. So what we've done is yeah.
• 40:31
  I mean, gefilte fish, by the way, is actually an old Russian
• 40:35
  recipe. There's not that that wasn't
• 40:37
  invented by the Jews. We adapted it and we thought
• 40:40
  great idea boy rare, right? You know, either either you can
• 40:44
  do borough which you know a lot of select bones, fillet fish on
• 40:47
  Shabbat also. However, we want to avoid the
• 40:51
  Heimlich manoeuvre, right? So therefore give filter.
• 40:54
  So we took a so that's what I mean by adaptation.
• 40:57
  OK, so which is the which is not the same as assimilation.
• 41:01
  You are correct. As we mentioned, out of
• 41:02
  stipulation would be very different.
• 41:05
  But but adaptation, I think, is part and parcel of what what
• 41:08
  Judaism has done. And I wonder, I wonder how I'm
• 41:12
  sorry, there's lag. I don't mean to interrupt you,
• 41:13
  but I wonder how on where people are.
• 41:17
  For example, I have a Talmud, I have a people who is a fairly up
• 41:22
  and coming family singer. And he submitted, I thought was
• 41:26
  a very nice song to a particular organization.
• 41:30
  We don't have to say which one. And they reject it because they
• 41:32
  said, oh, we recognize that tune.
• 41:33
  That tune is from a secular song and I I didn't know like am I
• 41:39
  supposed to break it to them that so is 99% of all the songs
• 41:43
  that they have? 100 percent, 100%, Yeah, Right.
• 41:47
  And look at language, the impact of language, Right?
• 41:50
  I mean, that was the first thing I mentioned with the adaptation.
• 41:53
  Jews took foreign languages and Judaized them.
• 41:58
  Ladino is Spanish, but it's written in Hebrew letters with
• 42:02
  lots of Hebrew thrown in. OK, I was a Masada Kedushin.
• 42:07
  I, I was the marriage celebrant for a, for a family who the
• 42:12
  actually my niece, her husband comes from the family is
• 42:15
  originally from the Isle of Rhodes.
• 42:17
  So I, I, I, I contacted a cousin in Rhodolisi synagogue in, in
• 42:24
  Seattle to find, what are the customs they have at the Hoopa.
• 42:28
  And I found a beautiful prayer which the father and
• 42:31
  father-in-law say in Ladino as they put the talit on the, on
• 42:36
  the groom under the Hooper. So I had them say it my, my
• 42:40
  brother-in-law and the, and the beautiful it's in, but it's
• 42:43
  Latino, it's in Spanish, right? You look at for example Judeo
• 42:47
  Arabic. The Rambam who you mentioned
• 42:50
  before wrote most of his works in Judeo Arabic.
• 42:54
  Judeo Arabic means Arabic written in Hebrew letters with
• 42:58
  lots of Hebrews shown in. I'm sure if you'd ask most Shiva
• 43:01
  students which book am I referring to when I say Al hidya
• 43:05
  Illa Farid al Khulub? Even got me.
• 43:12
  Klavan Talvarot was written in Arabic as well.
• 43:14
  You know, someone once told me, he says, I just wrote a new
• 43:17
  translation of of Shara Be Tahan, The Gates of Trust of
• 43:23
  Clovis Halvovos. I said, really, I didn't know
• 43:25
  you knew Arabic. And he looked at me like, like,
• 43:28
  I'm crazy. I said, well, he said, what do
• 43:30
  you mean? I said, did you translate from
• 43:32
  the Arabic? He said it was.
• 43:34
  He didn't even know it was written.
• 43:35
  He wrote a translation of. What Dave and Gabriel?
• 43:40
  Of of the left of translation and the left of translation is
• 43:46
  not from the Arabic. It's translated from Ibn Tibon
• 43:50
  translation. So it's a translation of a
• 43:52
  translation translation. Seriously, right.
• 43:55
  So we did, we did that. We adapted their languages and
• 43:59
  we created our own. That's an adaptation, right?
• 44:03
  And, you know, the, the extent to which Yiddish is, is, is
• 44:08
  looked at with with reverence and, and, you know, but, but
• 44:14
  that's part of that adaptation process that we had.
• 44:17
  And, and obviously, and, you know, it expresses herself in
• 44:21
  halacha as well in different areas.
• 44:25
  But sure. So we'll get to that if you
• 44:27
  want. But yeah.
• 44:29
  Well, before that, I, I just want to make sure I, I've been
• 44:32
  really dying to ask a historian this question, which is, what's
• 44:36
  your view of Philo of Alexandria?
• 44:39
  Is he, is he a Hellenistic Jew? Is he, is he an adapter or is he
• 44:45
  an assimilator? I have not read much of his
• 44:49
  works, but from what I have read, which is maybe, you know,
• 44:55
  maybe 100 pages or so seems so he's she's such an amazing
• 45:01
  thinker. And look, from what I've seen a
• 45:04
  lot of the times he seems to say a lot of things that cause I'll
• 45:07
  do say in other places. Yet I do know that it said, as
• 45:11
  we say in Yiddish in the veldt, OK in the world, it is said that
• 45:14
  he is a he is a dissenter. So I'd love your small review if
• 45:19
  you would, on Philo of Alexandria and his thoughts.
• 45:22
  I don't have expertise in Philo of Alexandra Alexandria.
• 45:28
  I have read his his commentary on the on the Torah and and and
• 45:33
  you are right. One of the, one of the most
• 45:35
  delightful components aspects of his commentary of his great work
• 45:41
  on the Torah is that he is a source for early statements of,
• 45:46
  of Hazel and testimony about practices that were going on.
• 45:51
  Then he talks about visiting the temple in Jerusalem.
• 45:54
  He was a tourist, you know, first centuries, you know, I, I
• 45:59
  think there's a, it's a huge debate.
• 46:01
  It's a major debate amongst historians.
• 46:03
  I don't have the expertise to come down on either side.
• 46:05
  Is he a, a Hellenist who is Jewish or is Jewish, Helen, You
• 46:10
  know what I mean? What what is he?
• 46:12
  I don't know look as as as with any source of that sort.
• 46:18
  We take what he what he says with a grain of salt and we use
• 46:22
  but but to utilize him as a interesting source.
• 46:27
  I I was so recently one of the he talks about Los Sasig
• 46:34
  Gvulrayeka. The Torah says do not overtake
• 46:38
  the border of your neighbor. Now, on a simple shot level,
• 46:44
  that refers to don't change the border markers of by encroaching
• 46:48
  on someone else's land, et cetera.
• 46:53
  And Philo says what it means is to have respect for the customs
• 47:01
  of the ancients, as a Gov Lewis showing in the borders that our
• 47:06
  ancients did, which are not written, but which we are handed
• 47:10
  down. And and by the way, that is
• 47:11
  something which you find in Hazel, that idea.
• 47:15
  So it was, it was interesting to me to to see that.
• 47:19
  I think I even have the quote here.
• 47:21
  I feel like you're looking at like the secret Pandora's box of
• 47:23
  all of the quotes that you wish to well.
• 47:26
  I I, I have on my screen a couple of sheer and I've given
• 47:29
  on subjects that I figured we might be discussing, so I was
• 47:33
  unable to look at them. It's that you know which is
• 47:36
  what. What about what about Josephus?
• 47:38
  What's your what's your interpretation of of his works?
• 47:41
  Is he I see Pharasitic or or or not I see more Hellenistic.
• 47:47
  I think he seems to be more of a Sadducee type, but you know not
• 47:55
  a great fan, so to speak of of our sages, but nevertheless
• 48:03
  quoted by the Rashonim and others as a as a historical
• 48:08
  source. You know in certain the Ramban
• 48:12
  quotes him quite a bit and when there's no reason to look the
• 48:17
  very fact he was a deserter literally deserted his post from
• 48:22
  yacht Fatah as a as a commander of a Jewish Garrison that that's
• 48:28
  that automatically makes him somewhat suspect he's working
• 48:33
  for the Romans. He's paid by the Romans, right.
• 48:36
  So, so I, I I think we have to just just those that those two
• 48:41
  facts need to tell us that. Well, let's slow down.
• 48:46
  Josephus says doesn't mean that it's, you know, gospel truth to
• 48:51
  bad turn to use, but OK, whatever, right.
• 48:54
  I I'm having trouble figuring them out.
• 48:56
  So because you know, he wrote this work, I forget exactly what
• 48:59
  the name of it is now it it it escapes.
• 49:01
  Me. Is that it?
• 49:04
  What in his his response? His response?
• 49:06
  Yes. You're thinking of Contra
• 49:07
  epicon. OK, yeah, so I probably know it
• 49:10
  by the translation, But in any event, so in there he discusses
• 49:14
  a few laws and he uses what sound like Talmudic exegesis.
• 49:19
  So I'm trying to figure out is, you know, is he a sad you cider
• 49:24
  a sad, you see? Excuse me?
• 49:25
  Or no, maybe he's just like early Proto, you know, Pharisee.
• 49:30
  But he's certainly an interesting.
• 49:33
  Yeah, I think he's opportune. I think he's opportunistic.
• 49:37
  Yeah, that's for sure. In other words, if he feels, if
• 49:40
  he feels it can help. Because I thought, I thought
• 49:42
  that was you're referring to contrapion, but because there is
• 49:45
  his book in which he is refuting a Greek anti-Semitic historian.
• 49:51
  Yes, yeah, I. Believe and he is using he is
• 49:54
  using yeah. So you know, rabbinic exegesis,
• 49:58
  so to speak that style in order to do that.
• 50:01
  And I think because he was at the end of the day proud of his
• 50:05
  Judaism and his ancestry. So and he was he wrote this book
• 50:11
  fighting against this this anti semite.
• 50:14
  So so that's to his credit, right.
• 50:17
  And he'll use every tool, every weapon that he can.
• 50:23
  Krav Maga, you know what I mean? There's a stone there.
• 50:25
  There's a pen in the whatever. I mean, whatever he's using my
• 50:28
  another martial arts reference. OK, but that's that's what I
• 50:31
  think he's doing here. Yeah, right, right.
• 50:34
  OK, So let's move forward a little bit.
• 50:35
  And I wanted to ask as as someone who again has been
• 50:38
  watching, we all have been watching, but you study how the
• 50:41
  Jewish history is unfolding and each chapter is being written.
• 50:44
  What is a message that we are learning and what's 1 message
• 50:48
  that we just seem to not really get?
• 50:52
  Very, very broad question. I mean, I think when you say we,
• 50:58
  that's hard to in other words, what I mean is there are
• 51:02
  segments of the Jewish people who have learnt some lessons and
• 51:08
  are incorporating them. I think something you mentioned
• 51:12
  before, people recognizing the importance of Torah literacy of,
• 51:17
  of learning, this is something which is widespread.
• 51:22
  I think a lot of people are recognizing this.
• 51:23
  And by the way, not only religious Jews are recognizing
• 51:26
  this. There's a somewhat of AI don't
• 51:29
  know if if it's large enough to call it a movement, but in Tel
• 51:31
  Aviv and in parts of Israel, they have these secular yeshivas
• 51:35
  where people are studying. They said, why is why is the
• 51:38
  Talmud belong to you religious Jews?
• 51:39
  We also want to study Tana Talmud and there are people who
• 51:42
  are studying this, which is I think a wonderful development.
• 51:45
  And, and the, the spread of Daffy Yami, which has been
• 51:52
  enhanced and facilitated by Internet and apps and so on and
• 51:58
  so forth in incredible ways is something which I think people
• 52:02
  have realized that to be a good Jew, you need to be a
• 52:05
  knowledgeable Jew. That's something which has
• 52:11
  become more widespread now than it than it than it was for a
• 52:14
  long time. So I think that's a good thing
• 52:17
  we have learned from history, I think.
• 52:21
  And a second point, which is, is a pride in who we are.
• 52:32
  A lot of Jews don't have that. There are a lot of Jews who
• 52:35
  believe that if they, and this is, I'm not talking about
• 52:38
  generally not religious Jews, but observant Jews, but Jews who
• 52:43
  believe that if they the more they are not Jewish, the less
• 52:49
  anti-Semitism, the more they are similar.
• 52:52
  And and of course we've seen again and again in history that
• 52:54
  that doesn't help. And On the contrary, the way to
• 52:58
  combat anti-Semitism is with is with pro semitism, Judaism,
• 53:03
  Jewish pride and so on and so forth.
• 53:07
  Someone asked the Lababa Cherubi once many years ago had a cat of
• 53:10
  combat anti-Semitism and on campus and he said don't combat
• 53:16
  it. He says bring Jews to Judaism,
• 53:21
  right? Encourage Jewish pride, Jewish
• 53:25
  identity, Jewish national religious identity, et cetera.
• 53:29
  That's something. But I think there's a lot of
• 53:31
  Jews, maybe them, I don't know if the majority, a lot of Jews
• 53:34
  don't realise this and still have fallen into the trap that
• 53:40
  if I look like, speak like a gentile, et cetera, they will
• 53:47
  embrace me and us. And I don't know if that's
• 53:51
  that's something we have not learned from history.
• 53:54
  Not all of us. Some of us have, but.
• 53:57
  I think that this goes back to something which I find so odd as
• 54:01
  a phenomenon, which is that us as as sages, as rabbis, as we
• 54:06
  teach our students, and especially if we're involved in
• 54:09
  outreach, we're competing with a world that's so interconnected.
• 54:13
  So I'm, I'm trying to sell the world the words of Maimonides or
• 54:18
  the medieval commentary of Rashi, someone who is watching
• 54:22
  movies and playing video games and smoking, which is, if if you
• 54:25
  think about it, at first blush would not seem very attractive
• 54:28
  to a teenager or a young adult. And yet, and yet a lot of them
• 54:33
  do hear these words. It's, it's because of that
• 54:38
  thought and sensitivity. It's because of that Jewish
• 54:41
  identity, which I think you're talking about.
• 54:44
  There's so much that religion has to offer.
• 54:46
  If only people would let it in. I fear that the people that do
• 54:51
  not embrace their Jewish identity as much they're people
• 54:54
  that were never really, you know, learned it.
• 54:56
  They were teen Ocean Ishbas, as we say, they were children that
• 55:00
  that did not that they were lost, that did not have the
• 55:02
  opportunity to be open to, to such Judaism.
• 55:06
  I, I, I'm thinking of all of the people that I know that have
• 55:10
  left the faith or our faith and, and I don't know any of them
• 55:15
  that were incredibly, you know, learned and I don't even meet
• 55:18
  Talmud Hakam status. I just, you know, that, that
• 55:20
  they took their study of Jewish philosophy serious to any.
• 55:25
  But I'm sure there, there's probably a choice few, but a
• 55:28
  choice few. I think that people leave
• 55:30
  because because they don't understand the beauty that we
• 55:34
  have, which is the last thing I wanted to bring up with you,
• 55:37
  which is, is that Judaism has bled physically and spiritually,
• 55:43
  unfortunately for many generations.
• 55:45
  As we face oppression, be that physical oppression, be that
• 55:49
  spiritual oppression, be that philosophical oppression in in
• 55:54
  the world like today where we're we're trying to bring people, as
• 55:57
  we always are, close to the faith.
• 55:59
  Is it that they're lacking information or is it that
• 56:02
  they're lacking a feeling? And I'll explain what I mean.
• 56:06
  So I definitely think that if a person really seriously,
• 56:09
  philosophically understands aspects of Judaism, that they
• 56:13
  will, they will embrace it and will follow it.
• 56:16
  But it's very hard to sell someone on that.
• 56:18
  What I think is most common when people leave is that they don't
• 56:21
  have that philosophical basis just yet.
• 56:23
  And the reason for them to take a leap of faith to believe in
• 56:25
  God or to not believe in God, to be religious and not be
• 56:28
  religious is how they feel. And it's, it's, it's almost as
• 56:32
  even though the core of Judaism is, is the, the understanding of
• 56:36
  God, but the leap of faith has to be for at least a large
• 56:39
  portion of someone's life, an emotional desire, a, a seeing of
• 56:44
  the beauty of the Shabbat table, et cetera.
• 56:46
  In your experience and in your understanding, what is the, this
• 56:49
  generation missing? Is it more the feeling or is it
• 56:52
  more the study? So I, I think, I think it's both
• 56:57
  and I think in the approach of people who are involved in
• 57:01
  outreach, a lot of the most popular talks and speakers are
• 57:08
  what I would call inspirational, not informational,
• 57:11
  inspirational, the sense of getting the feeling, giving
• 57:15
  people the feeling, giving people the inspiration, an
• 57:17
  amazing story and emotional connection and people need that.
• 57:21
  But I don't think it that's sufficient because even if a
• 57:25
  person is in now inspired and emotionally somewhat attached,
• 57:28
  they now need to process information that is both the
• 57:33
  the, the the heart and the mind have to be engaged in in Torah.
• 57:38
  And I think we're missing both. I think first of all, it's very
• 57:42
  obvious that Jews are missing huge amounts of information
• 57:46
  about Judaism. Like there are people who
• 57:49
  literally know nothing and and not not just know nothing.
• 57:55
  What they know is wrong. It was that they put their their
• 57:58
  knowledge of Judaism is from is from Seinfeld or Larry, what's
• 58:05
  his name right, etcetera. You know, their information
• 58:09
  about Judaism is what they've seen on popular media, which is
• 58:12
  almost inevitably rot not true and or they've picked it up at a
• 58:18
  course in Judaism, maybe at a college, which is taught by
• 58:22
  someone who doesn't believe in it, doesn't know it, et cetera.
• 58:26
  And this is this is very problematic.
• 58:28
  But no one I I think it's very unlikely that someone is going
• 58:33
  to want to fill the gaps in their information or correct the
• 58:36
  misinformation if they don't have an emotional inspirational
• 58:40
  connection. So the first, the first element
• 58:44
  is that that connection and then it has to be advanced,
• 58:51
  supplemented and through through also the information component.
• 58:57
  I think something you mentioned before about a students we have,
• 59:00
  and I've, I've seen this with my students, people who come from
• 59:04
  backgrounds which are very secular, disconnected from
• 59:07
  Judaism. And, and you learn with them,
• 59:11
  you study with them and teach them some, some, some
• 59:14
  traditional texts written in the 11th century in France and it
• 59:18
  resonates with them. So there's a spiritual component
• 59:21
  to that. You know, the, the Jewish soul
• 59:24
  we believe has Torah is not something foreign to it.
• 59:27
  Torah is something embedded to it, embedded in the Jewish soul
• 59:31
  from before birth, right. And, and it's very much like
• 59:35
  tuning forks, which we call the, you know, you set off 1 tuning
• 59:42
  fork and if it's the same frequency as now that, that will
• 59:44
  start vibrating sympathetic vibrations.
• 59:48
  So since the tuning fork in the Jewish soul is tuned at the
• 59:52
  frequency of Torah, when when you when you you know, set off
• 59:59
  another tuning fork, IE Torah. There'll be a sympathetic
• 1:00:03
  vibration there. It'll sound familiar.
• 1:00:05
  I've heard people, people have said this to me straight up,
• 1:00:08
  that I've never heard this before, but it does.
• 1:00:10
  It resonates with me. It sounds familiar.
• 1:00:12
  It's like it's speaking to me. That's true.
• 1:00:14
  Because, you know, if a person's Jewish, this is part of their
• 1:00:20
  spiritual heritage. And you know, even if you don't
• 1:00:23
  want to get into the mysticism of it, but they may have heard
• 1:00:26
  ideas like this as a child, or they may have, you know, heard a
• 1:00:30
  speech by a rabbi sometimes, etcetera.
• 1:00:32
  You know, you never know. But but I think on a spiritual
• 1:00:34
  level that certainly that certainly will resonate the
• 1:00:37
  Torah, Talmud Torah. But to get someone to the stage
• 1:00:41
  of learning Torah requires emotional inspiration
• 1:00:48
  beforehand. Right.
• 1:00:50
  Absolutely. Just right before you go.
• 1:00:53
  Why? Why this fascination with Jewish
• 1:00:57
  history? I mean, it's kind of an unfair
• 1:00:59
  question because you are so multifaceted, dynamic, but you
• 1:01:02
  are well known for your deep understanding of Jewish history.
• 1:01:05
  So why does Jewish history speak to you so much in particular?
• 1:01:09
  It's a good question. I, I don't know.
• 1:01:12
  I don't know if I've ever thought about why I'm
• 1:01:16
  interested. I'm interested in a lot of
• 1:01:17
  things, but I, I, you know, I, I in, I enjoy it.
• 1:01:22
  Why do I enjoy it? I, I don't know.
• 1:01:24
  I don't know if I could give you an answer to that.
• 1:01:27
  I guess it makes me feel connected when I see a
• 1:01:32
  manuscript of the Rambam from the Cairo Genesa in which he
• 1:01:35
  doodled. So I feel a connection to the
• 1:01:38
  Rambam. You know, I occasionally doodle
• 1:01:40
  as well, you know, he. So when I, when I, when I see
• 1:01:48
  Jews in some foreign country and they are observing the same laws
• 1:01:53
  of kashrut that I am, albeit with very different styles of
• 1:01:57
  food, right, I feel connected. So I think it, it, I think it's
• 1:02:00
  the fact that I, the people myself, I like to feel
• 1:02:04
  connected, right? And, and, and history, Jewish
• 1:02:08
  history definitely makes me feel very connected to our ancestors,
• 1:02:12
  our past and to, all the way back to, to my source.
• 1:02:16
  You know, it's sometimes it's like if you go back to the
• 1:02:20
  household, the, the, the, the house that you were raised in as
• 1:02:24
  a child, you go back and visit it, you feel embraced by the
• 1:02:29
  warmth of your origins. And, and so I think to some
• 1:02:33
  degree, Jewish history is, is like that for me.
• 1:02:36
  You know, I feel I'm going back to the, you know, the house in
• 1:02:41
  which I was raised in which in which my answer it's, it's I'm
• 1:02:46
  going back home, right? And that's, you know, goes goes
• 1:02:51
  all the way back, you know, you feel that that incredible
• 1:02:53
  connection and something, something warm and fuzzy about
• 1:02:56
  that. Those are those are beautiful
• 1:02:59
  words, everybody better. I really want to thank you so
• 1:03:01
  much for joining us today and imparting so much of your
• 1:03:03
  wonderful wisdom. Thank you very much.
• 1:03:05
  My pleasure, Thank you very much for having me.
• 1:03:07
  Sure. See everyone?