Latest / The Catholic Current / Does the Pope Understand Europe? (Michael O'Shea) 4/7/26
Transcript
- 0:00This is The Catholic Current, with Fr. Robert Mottaig.
- 0:04The insight for our time that we need to gain from Augustine is if we're not returning to
- 0:09Christ as individuals and families and communities, then we're just wasting our time.
- 0:15Absolutely, yeah.
- 0:16And I think that that's the real relevance of the City of God today is that you do have
- 0:20this scramble among Christians right now trying to find the next hot ideology that's going
- 0:26to save us all.
- 0:28What matters for you is the salvation of your soul.
- 0:31That is what needs to be your priority.
- 0:33Praised be Jesus Christ, this is Fr. Robert Mottaig of The Society of Jesus, your daily
- 0:37host for The Catholic Current, where we'll bring Christ to the world and the world to
- 0:40Christ.
- 0:41You're listening to us from the station of The Cross Studios, your local radio station,
- 0:44the iCatholic Radio mobile app, where we proclaim the fullness of truth with clarity and charity.
- 0:50As always, let's start with prayer.
- 0:51In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit.
- 0:54Almighty God, through the intercession of St. Ignatius of Loyola, we ask that you pour
- 0:57forth your Holy Spirit upon us, a spirit of discernment, that we might hear your voice
- 1:01and obey your command.
- 1:02In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit.
- 1:04Amen.
- 1:05Hey, friends, here we are in the octave of Easter.
- 1:07I hope you've had a very blessed celebration of Easter, and I hope you received many graces
- 1:13throughout the Easter season.
- 1:14I want to ask a hard question for this timely Tuesday.
- 1:19Does the Pope understand Europe?
- 1:21And you say, well, Father, that's kind of an odd question.
- 1:26Why would you ask that?
- 1:27Well, there's a lot of reasons why.
- 1:29And one of the reasons I would ask was because I found a recent article in an online journal
- 1:34called the European Conservative, and it's called Pope Leo Lampedusa, which is the name
- 1:39of an island, and the Camp of the Saints, which is the name of a French novel.
- 1:46And I have the author here with me today.
- 1:49He writes for the European Conservative.
- 1:52He's a writer and a translator in Polish, and he's a former visiting fellow at the Dan
- 1:56Yoube Institute in Budapest.
- 1:59Michael O'Shea, welcome to the Catholic Current.
- 2:01Hey, thank you, Father.
- 2:02Happy Easter.
- 2:03Happy Easter to you.
- 2:04I notice in your article, you point out some, I didn't connect the dots at first.
- 2:09You know, the United States is celebrating its 250th anniversary this July 4th.
- 2:15I was a boy, an early teen, 50 years ago when the Bicentennial of America was a very, very
- 2:24big thing.
- 2:26Everybody was caught up on it.
- 2:28Everybody was excited about it.
- 2:30Fifty years later, the vibe seems to be very different.
- 2:33And I know that Vice President J.D. Vance invited Pope Leo, the first American pope,
- 2:39to be in the U.S. on July 4th.
- 2:43I can understand the pope apparently declining that invitation, not wanting to be used for
- 2:50political reasons, but he's got to be somewhere else that I, I don't think he talked to
- 2:56another American about this.
- 2:58Can you fill us in on this, please?
- 3:00Yeah, so the pope's schedule came out recently and Lampedusa appeared on the schedule for
- 3:05July 4th.
- 3:06So immediately, people made that mental leap.
- 3:09And of course, I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.
- 3:11I'm sure the pope does not even make his own schedule.
- 3:15But it's hard not to make the mental leap to the symbolism there.
- 3:20As I state in the article, I think it's very reasonable to skip the United States at that
- 3:24time.
- 3:26In this era we live in, no matter which party is in power, something like that is going
- 3:30to be deeply politicized and uncomfortable for a pope.
- 3:35But Lampedusa seems to be a rebuke on that very day.
- 3:41It's hard not to interpret it that way.
- 3:43I imagine there are a lot of people who don't get what Lampedusa is.
- 3:47It's not, I don't mention Lampedusa every day before breakfast.
- 3:52Fill us in on that, please.
- 3:53Yes, it is an island off the coast of North Africa.
- 3:57I believe it's the southernmost of a string of small islands that is Italian sovereign
- 4:02territory off the coast of Africa.
- 4:05And so for decades now, many decades, it has been a destination for migrants from Africa
- 4:12and the Middle East trying to enter Europe.
- 4:14And of course, once you set foot on Lampedusa, you are on European Union soil.
- 4:19And the process of removing a person, the legal process, the political process of removing
- 4:28a person once he or she is there is a year's long one and probably is never going to take
- 4:33place.
- 4:34Right.
- 4:35So, I mean, it seems to me, popes haven't been enthusiastic about America in a while,
- 4:41except when Peter's Pence arrived and then all is forgiven for at least a couple of days,
- 4:45it seems to me.
- 4:47I know that I wanted to talk about not only, gosh, where is the pope here on July 4th in
- 4:532026, but the attitude of, on the air I refer to, there's a club called the People Who
- 5:02Should Really Know Better Club.
- 5:03And from time to time, I refer to the senior Catholic cadres of the People Who Should Really
- 5:09Know Better Club.
- 5:11And when it comes to unrestricted immigration into Europe of military age men from hostile
- 5:19cultures from North Africa and elsewhere into Europe, the senior Catholic cadres of the
- 5:26People Who Should Really Know Better Club are very enthusiastic.
- 5:31And the people who pay for it in blood and treasure are not so enthusiastic.
- 5:35Could you fill us in on that, please?
- 5:38Yeah.
- 5:39I think in the Catholic Church, we desperately need a recalibration of the way that we look
- 5:44at this, which is why I've written articles like this one and others.
- 5:49And if we think about who is the stranger in our midst, well, in reality, it is the
- 5:55European man whose culture and neighborhoods have been changed beyond recognition, whose
- 6:05daughters and wives and sisters are now in danger of walking out alone on the street,
- 6:11who's subjected to crime, to real estate prices that are unmanageable, whose children are
- 6:18having to move abroad because finding a home and a job to support a family is simply not
- 6:24in the cards.
- 6:25And to make matters worse, this person, this European man, is often shunned and criticized
- 6:35and rebuked in the media and among the politicians.
- 6:39This person can go to the voting booth and make his decisions known, but it's a facade.
- 6:45There's really no ability to vote against this.
- 6:50It's been done against the will of the European people.
- 6:53And so, you know, I think we need to have some deep soul searching and ask ourselves,
- 6:58you know, who is the stranger?
- 6:59Is it the person who's being emphatically welcomed by the politicians and the media
- 7:05and the NGOs and the bureaucrats, or is it the person who's been left behind?
- 7:12And, you know, I hope that that soul searching is something that we can manage as a church
- 7:18in short order here.
- 7:19Jeffrey Averbeck Well, you know, by analogy, because I've
- 7:21talked about immigration issues in the United States, a couple things come to mind.
- 7:28Jeffrey talks about the young men in the United States who can't start businesses or
- 7:35buy homes or families because their economic opportunities are being crushed by low wage,
- 7:43low skill labor, and whose housing markets are being priced out of existence because
- 7:50of the floods of people who shouldn't have been in the country in the first place.
- 7:55And likewise with emergency rooms and medical services, et cetera, et cetera.
- 8:01Nobody gets misty-eyed about that.
- 8:03And nobody, nobody, nobody ever, ever, ever, as far as I know, goes out of their way to
- 8:09be photographed with the families of Americans who've been raped and murdered by people who
- 8:17should not have been in this country in the first place.
- 8:20I remember a very prominent member of the Catholic hierarchy had mass at the southern
- 8:27border of the United States, and he's photographed, you know, putting a consecrated host through
- 8:33the fence.
- 8:34Oh, you know, look at me, I'm being dramatic, look at how pastoral I'm being.
- 8:40But he's, as far as I know, never buried a murder victim, someone who had been killed
- 8:46here in the United States.
- 8:47Now would it be cynical of me, I know we've just got about two minutes left here in this
- 8:51segment, to say that one of the reasons there's so much enthusiasm for welcoming the right
- 8:55kind of stranger is because that's where the money is?
- 8:58Yeah, I do believe that the vast majority of cogs in the machine make these short-term
- 9:05decisions for financial reasons.
- 9:07Now of course there are powerful people, billionaires, who do have ideological reasons.
- 9:13That's a real thing, I don't deny that for a second.
- 9:16There are people, you know, among the NGO class who have ideological reasons.
- 9:20But I think in the vast majority of cases, it's people making short-term financial decisions
- 9:27for their own benefit.
- 9:28They're not thinking about the inheritance for their children and grandchildren.
- 9:33In many cases, they probably, you know, don't recognize any God greater than themselves
- 9:38or anything along those lines.
- 9:40So it's all transactional.
- 9:43And I think decades of that, you know, decades of this late-stage liberalism that we are
- 9:48living in right now has led us to this point where people will gladly mortgage away the
- 9:54future for some very petty short-term financial gains.
- 9:58Well, you know, I'll close up this segment with an observation that someone in a position
- 10:03to know told me several years ago.
- 10:04He says, Father, you have to understand, there's no money in fighting abortion.
- 10:11There's a lot of money to be made in promoting open borders.
- 10:16And I don't want to sentimentalize the opening of borders.
- 10:21I don't want to demonize people.
- 10:23But there are causes, there are effects, and there are consequences.
- 10:28And innocent people suffer as a result.
- 10:32And I fear that we've got so sentimental about this issue that we can't think about it clearly,
- 10:38which is one of the reasons why we want to have this kind of conversation.
- 10:44It's important, it's critical, it's a moral obligation, and it's another example of us
- 10:49trying to be more than merely relevant.
- 10:52Friends, we come back.
- 10:53We are going to continue our conversation with author Michael O'Shea.
- 10:57We're asking the question, does the Pope understand Europe?
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- 13:27On this timely Tuesday, I'm asking the hard question, does the Pope understand Europe?
- 13:32My guest today is author Michael O'Shea, who wrote a very stimulating essay, shall we say,
- 13:37recently in the European Conservative.
- 13:40Michael, we both admire Theodore Dalrymple, and as we're talking about what's being done
- 13:47to Europe, I think of a book that he published, oh gosh, 2015, 2011 or so, called The New
- 13:55Vichy Syndrome, here we go, 2011, Why European Intellectuals Surrender to Barbarism.
- 14:02Now there was a cautionary but sunshinier book by George Weigel called The Tube and
- 14:08the Cathedral that said, yes, Europe is forgetting its identity and its Catholic heritage, but
- 14:14with just a little bit of tweaking, and if we Vatican II extra hard, we're going to be
- 14:20fine because John Paul wrote strongly worded letters.
- 14:24But there's another book that called shenanigans that was prophetic in a way that most people
- 14:30could not have imagined today, and it goes all the way back to 1973, it's a very controversial
- 14:37novel.
- 14:38I'd probably get booted off college campuses for even mentioning its title.
- 14:42It's called The Camp of the Saints, you've read it in English and Polish, I know the
- 14:46original work was in French, can you tell us about that please?
- 14:50Yes, it's a dystopian novel from the 70s and it envisions a European civilization that
- 14:57is too tired and too nihilistic to propagate itself, and at the same time, the desperate
- 15:05poverty in India, specifically the Ganges River Valley, leads a fleet of 1 million
- 15:12migrants to migrate to the French Riviera.
- 15:18And the story traces the reactions among the French intellectual class, among the average
- 15:25people on both continents, and the European civilization's complete inability to come
- 15:34to terms with this or to take any steps to stop it.
- 15:39And well, you know, I won't give away the ending in case listeners haven't read it.
- 15:44I haven't read it myself, I got the new English translation, it was very highly recommended.
- 15:51But he was calling this in 1973, and this brings me to George Weigel's analysis going
- 15:58back to 2004-2005, where he said, you know, Western Europe, after 1945 and the rebuilding
- 16:05from the war, entered into a period of peace and prosperity really arguably unparalleled
- 16:15in human history.
- 16:17And it was precisely then that the Europeans said, you know what, we're not going to have
- 16:23kids.
- 16:24And he said people like that, in peace and prosperity, decide not to have children, see
- 16:29themselves as having no debt to the past, and no obligation to the future.
- 16:36What do you make of that analysis?
- 16:38Yeah, yeah, it's absolutely true.
- 16:42And one of Satan's tricks, I think, is that in comparison to the regimes of the last century
- 16:50that we know are hideous, the Nazi regime in Germany, and the Stalin's regime in the
- 16:55Soviet Union, and various other communist regimes, they really didn't try to hide what
- 17:00they were very much.
- 17:02It was so clear on the surface that these were hideous regimes.
- 17:07And liberalism, specifically the variant of liberalism that we are living through right
- 17:13now in the West, I think is equally evil, equally contemptuous of human dignity, equally
- 17:21contemptuous of truth, beauty, and goodness.
- 17:23But it speaks in terms of openness, and tolerance, and human rights.
- 17:29And like I said, it's one of Satan's tricks, I believe.
- 17:36History will make clear how hideous liberalism has been as well.
- 17:42But in the current time that we're living through, I think we still very much need to
- 17:47come to terms with it.
- 17:48Well, you know, I think of, you know, people talk about, in the United States, you know,
- 17:54they talk about both open borders and stolen land.
- 17:56And I said, well, if borders don't mean anything, and they're just lines on a map, then you
- 18:00really can't talk about stolen land.
- 18:03And when we talk about preserving native cultures, apparently that never refers to native European
- 18:09cultures, for example.
- 18:13That just strikes me as odd.
- 18:17And I think ultimately, one of the reasons why there seems to be a disinclination to
- 18:24defend Europe is because of Europe's history as a Catholic venue, as the root of Christendom.
- 18:33I remember some years ago now, you know, when they're putting together the Constitution
- 18:39for the European Union, and the preamble was talking about the roots of European identity,
- 18:46it was the Polish delegations who said, hey, you know, you haven't mentioned Christianity
- 18:52at all.
- 18:54And that would be like trying to have a history of China never mentioning the emperor.
- 18:58You don't have to like the emperor, but you got to acknowledge he's got a role to play.
- 19:01So you might even be an atheist, but you can't meaningfully speak of European culture without
- 19:07mentioning Christianity.
- 19:10But that seemed to be the determination.
- 19:12Is it too much to say, on your view, that one of the reasons for the hostility, the
- 19:18disinclination to stand up for Europe is precisely because of Europe's close association with
- 19:27the faith?
- 19:28Oh, yes, I think that's fair.
- 19:31And I think that the church over the years has made a lot of accommodations to the ideology
- 19:38of liberalism.
- 19:39And I think it's also fairly uncontroversial to say that the church is at its best when
- 19:45it is countercultural.
- 19:46And so when you see that we are lining up on the same side as governments and politicians
- 19:53and NGOs and corporate interests, and corporate journalists, I think we should ask ourselves,
- 19:59why is that?
- 20:00Is that not a red flag?
- 20:03If we are lining up on the side of the most unrestrained forces of capitalism, are we
- 20:11really thinking about people's human dignity in the right way?
- 20:14And I hope that within the church, we will have those conversations and undergo that
- 20:18kind of soul searching.
- 20:19Well, I do think there does need to be some soul searching.
- 20:24I think we have been frightfully, frightfully naive about anti-Catholic bigotry in the United
- 20:34States and also in Europe as well.
- 20:42There seems to be a lot of corporate guilt being thrown around.
- 20:46Recently, Doug Wilson, who's been a guest on this show, has written some things about
- 20:51Christian nationalism.
- 20:52And he was asked a hypothetical question of, you know, 500 years from now, if America were
- 20:57a Protestant republic, would you allow Marian and Eucharistic processions?
- 21:02And he said no.
- 21:04And people lost their minds.
- 21:06And I said, he's talking about a hypothetical of 500 years in the future.
- 21:10You know what Doug Wilson's not doing?
- 21:11He's not burning down churches.
- 21:14And he's not slitting the throats of priests.
- 21:18And we do know who is inclined to burn down churches and slit the throats of priests,
- 21:22but we're not allowed to mention that by name.
- 21:26So I think that we are facing a tremendous, again, the European anti-Catholic bigotry
- 21:32is rooted in an animus towards Christ.
- 21:36And that's why we're in the situation that we're in.
- 21:39But wouldn't you expect, you know, the hierarchy of the Catholic Church to have a little bit
- 21:45more sympathy towards Europe?
- 21:48Yes.
- 21:49I understand in, you know, in the Pope's line of work and some of the cardinals in the Vatican
- 21:55that it's not possible, reasonable to expect them to walk around the cities of Europe on
- 22:01a daily basis.
- 22:03But I do want to, in my small, humble way, to bring to people's attention just how bad
- 22:09it has gotten.
- 22:11And maybe from that standpoint in the, hopefully I will live a long life, but maybe in the
- 22:17fairly near future, we could have a European Pope again, and that will be beneficial.
- 22:22But yes, I mentioned in my article how bad it was in Rome even 10 years ago.
- 22:27And with each passing year, it gets unbelievably worse.
- 22:34And you can throw a dart at a map of Europe, really, and find the decay, the crime, and
- 22:40the squalor, and the antisocial behavior.
- 22:46And yeah, I do think, especially over a certain age, there's an element of not understanding
- 22:50how bad it has gotten.
- 22:52And I do, it's not, there's a long story to be told, but I do still hope in my heart that
- 22:58Pope Leo will be a bridge to a younger generation of priests.
- 23:02And this young generation of priests gives me tremendous confidence.
- 23:06And yeah, I hope and pray Pope Leo will be that bridge.
- 23:10Well, I, yes, I would like that very much as well.
- 23:16I happen to like civilization, and I happen to like truth, beauty, and goodness.
- 23:22And I'm going to say something very unpopular that we're going to be kicked off of college
- 23:25campuses.
- 23:26Truth, beauty, and goodness are embodied in the God-man Christ.
- 23:32The Logos, the eternal word of the Father, is Christ.
- 23:36So if you want a civilization that lasts, that doesn't sacrifice children to demons,
- 23:43for example, and provides for the education of females, and is not enthusiastic about
- 23:49slavery or rape, then by golly, you're going to need to promote Christ, and you're going
- 23:57to need to win people over to the kingship of Christ.
- 24:01And I think our generation really does depend on that.
- 24:06And for reasons I cannot fathom, the clerical members of the People Who Should Really Know
- 24:12Better Club are not willing to make statements like the statements that I just made.
- 24:19And I find that surpassing strange, and I think we're all very, very ill-served by that.
- 24:28And I'd also say that there are people who think that the Catholic view of economics
- 24:33is more free stuff for everyone to infinity is mathematically not possible.
- 24:40And also, if you kill the goose that lays the golden egg, you have one big dinner, and
- 24:47then you starve.
- 24:49And when I look at the economic collapse of Germany that's taking place, for example,
- 24:56this bodes very ill indeed, and I think that Europe is going to be entering into a very
- 25:03hard demographic winter, and the Church will suffer catastrophically if that is allowed
- 25:11to happen.
- 25:12And I really, really am praying against it.
- 25:15Friends, we come back.
- 25:16We're going to continue our conversation with author Michael O'Shea.
- 25:20We're talking about whether the Pope understands Europe, whether or not Europe can be saved
- 25:25from itself.
- 25:27I think those are not unreasonable questions.
- 25:29After the broadcast today, go to thestationofthecross.com, get our resources list, download our audio
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- 26:51This is Fr.
- 26:52Robert McTague of the Society of Jesus, your daily host for The Catholic Current, where
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- 27:27My guest today is author Michael O'Shea.
- 27:29We're talking about a recent article he wrote for the European Conservative.
- 27:33Michael, I preach.
- 27:35I've been preaching for a long time, and part of the charm of parables is that you have
- 27:40a make-believe story that succinctly puts together a lot of necessary truths all in
- 27:49one place, and real life is a lot messier than that, but there's a news story that
- 27:56I think perfectly, in its details, encapsulates everything we've been saying about the ongoing
- 28:04collapse of Europe and the failure of church leadership to defend Europe, and it has to
- 28:10do with a young lady in Spain.
- 28:14It's one of the most tragic stories I've seen in many years.
- 28:18Twenty-five-year-old Noelia Castillo, can you tell us about that horrible story, please?
- 28:23Yes.
- 28:24So, first of all, may God grant repose unto this young woman's soul.
- 28:28Amen.
- 28:29May He hold her in the palm of His hand, and I hope that her memory will inspire some good,
- 28:35and maybe in our own humble way, we can help inspire that, but yes, this young woman was
- 28:41taken from her parents when she was still a child, and the state put her in a setting
- 28:47where she was gang-raped by migrant men, and then, in her despair, afterwards, she attempted
- 28:55to take her own life, and suffered some severe injuries, was partially paralyzed, if I'm
- 29:00not mistaken, and then accepted the state's offer for euthanasia, and then her father
- 29:08was fighting against it, and there are some murky details about potentially she had changed
- 29:16her mind near the end, whether she had or not, apparently the state had already determined
- 29:23where her organs would go, and was not willing to have her change her mind, even if that
- 29:27were the case.
- 29:28So, it really is just an encapsulation of the moral depravity of Western liberalism.
- 29:36Virtually every single inhumane element of this prevailing ideology captured in this
- 29:43one real-life news story, and again, God bless this poor young woman's soul.
- 29:48Oh, it is heartbreaking, I know that in her second suicide attempt, I think she had thrown
- 29:55herself out a window, and she ended up in a wheelchair as a result, and found life to
- 30:01be unbearable, but apparently, everyone, except maybe her father, failed her.
- 30:08They failed her, and I say, where are the feminists, where are the people having rallies
- 30:17and yelling, say her name?
- 30:21The church leaders rhapsodize about the vulnerable, but I haven't heard lots of people speak about
- 30:30that.
- 30:31I haven't heard anything about the visiting cultural enrichers who violated her, I haven't
- 30:38heard anything about them being held to account, and I haven't heard anything from the government
- 30:44of Spain to say, gosh, you know, did we do this wrong, are we the bad guys on this one?
- 30:52Has anyone in charge offered to reconsider anything?
- 30:55Oh, well, the government of Spain is bleak right now, let me tell you.
- 31:02Think back to what we were discussing earlier about the stranger in our midst, this young
- 31:06woman, Noelia, if she is not the stranger in our midst, I don't know who is, and I urgently
- 31:14implore any fellow Catholics who will listen to think about it in these terms.
- 31:21This is a young woman who urgently needed support and needed charity, and it would
- 31:30have been deeply counter-cultural for the church to take up her cause, and I hope in
- 31:36the future, well, maybe in her small way, she will inspire that kind of prioritization
- 31:42in the future.
- 31:43Right.
- 31:44I hope this is a tragedy that can be redeemed, and we do want to pray for the repose of her
- 31:50soul and the consolation of those who mourned for her, and also, candidly, that all who
- 31:56failed or violated her will be brought to swift justice.
- 32:03This is an outrage.
- 32:04I mean, if there's ever, you know, we talk about crimes that cry out to heaven for redress,
- 32:10certainly her voice reaches the heavens as well.
- 32:13So it seems to me that we've got really a kind of cult of sentimentality, you know,
- 32:21welcoming the stranger, welcoming the other, hospitality, and yet people who are inconvenient
- 32:30to the narrative are brutalized or silenced.
- 32:33I remember it was a summer or two ago where a young girl was arrested, I believe it was
- 32:41Ireland or Scotland, I forget which now, because visiting misunderstanders of the religion
- 32:49of peace were following her younger prepubescent sister and menacing her and filming her and
- 32:58so on, and she produced weapons to defend her child sister against her would-be assailants.
- 33:07And the thing to do was immediately to arrest the child for defending her little sister.
- 33:16Is it only ideology that's taking place here?
- 33:20Is it just a form of madness?
- 33:22Or do you think there's a form of wickedness that's at work here as well?
- 33:27Oh, absolutely.
- 33:28Well, I believe liberalism, especially in its modern iteration, is a satanic ideology.
- 33:35So, to the degree that our leaders are conforming to the ideology of liberalism, yeah, absolutely.
- 33:43You know, at the end of the day, I think it can probably all ladder up to the idea of
- 33:47a society that rejects God, and we could argue about when that started in Europe.
- 33:55I think it's safe to say at least one century, you know, a lot of people would say back to
- 34:00the French Revolution.
- 34:02We could argue all day about when it started, right?
- 34:05But I think these are all natural effects of a civilization that has rejected God.
- 34:11And there is some reason for optimism if you look at all the news reports on conversions
- 34:17of young people in countries like France.
- 34:21France is always at the cutting edge, isn't it?
- 34:23But I have optimism for what we're seeing with young people.
- 34:32I hope and pray that the upheavals that are coming will be peaceful and mostly peaceful.
- 34:40But certainly, it's safe to say that if we continue kicking the can down the road and
- 34:47making it some future generation's problem, it's less and less likely that those upheavals
- 34:53will be peaceful.
- 34:54Right.
- 34:55Well, you know, as we're recording this, I'm looking at a news, you know, there is the
- 34:59famous Notre-Dame de Chrétien pilgrimage from Paris to Chartres.
- 35:05And it's usually held around May, around the Pentecost season.
- 35:09And when they opened up registration last year on the first day, 6,000 young people
- 35:15registered.
- 35:16Today, 14,000 people registered on the first day.
- 35:24And again, this is primarily young people.
- 35:28And it's an arduous walk from Paris to Chartres.
- 35:31And they pray the Stations of the Cross and the Rosary and have devotions.
- 35:36And this is a real old-school, arduous, sacrificial pilgrimage with Mass and Confession and Eucharistic
- 35:44adoration every day.
- 35:46And you know what?
- 35:49It's not like Mass on the beach on World Youth Day, you know?
- 35:54The Blessed Sacrament is not kept in Tupperware like World Youth Day.
- 36:00So anyway, I'll just leave that there.
- 36:02So there are these very great glimmers of hope.
- 36:06You know, certainly in France, the majority of ordinations now are among traditional communities.
- 36:14That's also true in Germany as well, which is hemorrhaging Catholic membership.
- 36:19I mean, I think the German churches are losing 500,000 members a year.
- 36:25So you know, we just celebrated the resurrection of our Lord.
- 36:29Christ the King cannot be defeated.
- 36:33Fidelity to him is vindicated in the resurrection.
- 36:37Make no mistake about it.
- 36:39I really hope that we can let people know that Catholicism in general, Europe in particular,
- 36:52has a culture and a heritage and a people worth defending.
- 37:00Catholics used to be able to say that without hesitation.
- 37:04Now not so much.
- 37:06So I'm going to ask you a huge question with only three minutes left.
- 37:10Why is that?
- 37:11And again, the exact date of when we went wrong, is it 1789, is it 1517, is it 1914?
- 37:18I don't know.
- 37:19But what's it going to take for us to wake up?
- 37:22Well, God.
- 37:23Well, yeah.
- 37:24Divine intervention.
- 37:25Otherwise, we're hosed.
- 37:26Yeah, for sure.
- 37:27Yeah.
- 37:28God willing, as I mentioned, this young generation of priests, they seem like they are equipped
- 37:38if God should call many of us to be martyrs, this upcoming generation of priests seems
- 37:45well equipped to lead us down that path.
- 37:48And hopefully it will not be, you know, something very fraught like that.
- 37:54But yeah, I think it will probably, if you look at history, if you look at the history
- 37:59of our church, these kind of societal changes tend to come with great suffering.
- 38:05And so let's pray that we'll all be equipped to handle it gracefully and courageously if
- 38:11that's what it should come to.
- 38:13Well, you know, I'll say something now in the air that I've said from the pulpit for
- 38:17years.
- 38:18If we're entering a time in the life of the church, we're going to find, to the surprise
- 38:25of many, that even lukewarm Catholicism will be as too costly as it is insufficient.
- 38:35You know, the idea that at St. Typical's, their business model is, you know, we sell
- 38:40a subscription to anti-hell insurance that has to be renewed weekly.
- 38:45But if you let God interrupt your weekend on Saturday or Sunday for 49 minutes and you
- 38:49throw a couple of bucks in his tip jar, then if you die that week, God owes you heaven.
- 38:54And I think a lot of people are not inclined to take that bet anymore.
- 39:00And when things get really difficult and painful, as we saw with COVID, a lot of people who
- 39:08should know better are going to fold.
- 39:11So my hope, again, especially with the example of someone like Noella Castillo, please dear
- 39:17God, let it be that she did not suffer and die in vain, but that people will say, the
- 39:24world has lost its mind.
- 39:27Alexander Solzhenitsyn was right all those decades ago.
- 39:31We have forgotten about God.
- 39:33Now is the time to return to Christ.
- 39:37What the world needs now is for the church to be the church, the church militant, and
- 39:44not an NGO with its people.
- 39:46You know, somebody said, you know, the bark of Peter is meant to be a battleship rather
- 39:51than a cruise ship.
- 39:52So I think if we put aside the cult of self-esteem, and I think if we put aside our interest in
- 39:59performative virtue signaling, then I think things will be a lot better.
- 40:04But ultimately, we're going to need the grace of God in a big way.
- 40:09Michael Asche, God bless you, your very good work.
- 40:12Thank you for a fascinating conversation.
- 40:14And I really do look forward to next time.
- 40:17Thank you, Father.
- 40:18Happy Easter.
- 40:19Have a great day.
- 40:20Likewise.
- 40:21This is Jesuit Father Robert McTigre, your host every day of the Catholic Tarot, and
- 40:23you want to stay with us for the rest of the hour.
- 40:25Coming up next, you know how we end Timely Tuesday with timely thoughts, you and me reflecting
- 40:30on what we've heard today.
- 40:32Be part of the conversation.
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- 40:39The channel is The Catholic Current, and you can influence a conversation.
- 40:43You can contact us at thestationofthecross.com slash askfather.
- 40:48Comments, questions, suggestions, recommendations, we want to hear from you.
- 40:54That's thestationofthecross.com slash askfather.
- 40:58Let's do this good work together, because here at the Station of the Cross, we are so
- 41:02much more than merely relevant.
- 41:04Be back in just two minutes.
- 41:06Please do stay with us.
- 41:31If you have a question or feedback about today's episode, want to suggest a guest
- 41:36or a future topic, go to thestationofthecross.com slash askfather, and help influence the conversation.
- 41:51Praise be Jesus Christ.
- 41:52This is Father Robert McTigre of the Society of Jesus, your daily host for the Catholic
- 41:55Current, where we bring Christ to the world and the world to Christ.
- 41:58If you're listening to us from the Station of the Cross studios, your local radio station,
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- 42:06Hey friends, if you value thoughtful Catholic analysis rooted in clarity and charity, help
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- 42:15Here on the Catholic Current, we engage the issue seriously and faithfully, and that intellectual
- 42:20and moral freedom exists, because we are listener funded.
- 42:26Support us please at thestationofthecross.com.
- 42:29Well here we are, the last segment on a Tuesday.
- 42:31You know what that means, you and me sharing timely thoughts, reflecting on what we've
- 42:35heard today.
- 42:36I was talking with Michael O'Shea, who wrote a very provocative essay in the European Conservative,
- 42:42but whether or not the Pope understands what's going on in Europe.
- 42:47So two things, in brief, Europe is in a mess, and Europe has been a mess in a long time,
- 42:54because it's betrayed the faith, and senior Catholic cadres of the people who should
- 42:59really know better club, have not been helping, and time is running out for Europe.
- 43:06That having been said, hey you know what, it's also Tuesday in the octave of Easter.
- 43:12I don't think we need to go full gloom and doom mode just yet.
- 43:19I'm willing to put my Irish melancholy on a leash, if not a shock collar, and you know
- 43:26there really is some good news.
- 43:29The Nigerian army just rescued a bunch of Christians who had been abducted by misunderstanders
- 43:41of the religion of peace.
- 43:44There's an uplifting story from a new website I've discovered called thegoodnewsroom.org,
- 43:49and I asked Mr. Engineer to bookmark that for us, and it's about how the Franciscan
- 43:55Friars of the Renewal in Manhattan have a movement called the Catholic Underground,
- 44:00which features Eucharistic adoration once a month, standing room only, filling the church
- 44:06month in and month out.
- 44:08So God, our Lord, continues to be at work, and he does good work among good people, and
- 44:18he continues to work for the conversion of sinners like me.
- 44:24I will say that I had a very, very blessed Holy Week with solemnity and dignity and reverence
- 44:34and beauty, and I had much of Holy Week with a community that really prizes beauty and
- 44:42reverence, and their music was exquisite.
- 44:46Their genuine joy on Easter Sunday morning was incandescent, and it was a very great
- 44:53healing consolation for me as a priest to be with people who walk through our Lord's
- 45:01final days with him with tears and with ashes, and then greeted him in his victory on Easter
- 45:09Sunday morning, and they plan to live accordingly.
- 45:13And really, you know, I want to do that too, and I'm pretty sure that you do also.
- 45:19You know, St. Paul said, if Christ has not been raised, then we're still dead in our
- 45:24sins and we are the most pitiable of men.
- 45:26The fact is, the fact is that Christ is risen, sin and death and the whole earth could not
- 45:36contain him.
- 45:38Now the challenge for us is that we live in and through time and space.
- 45:46Our vision is limited, our experience is limited, our will is weakened, our intellects are darkened,
- 45:53you know, we're still suffering, we're still the church militant, not the church triumphant.
- 45:59But we know by faith, we know by testimony, we know by St. John said what we have seen
- 46:05and heard, that Christ our Lord is victorious.
- 46:11Our risen King is our crucified King.
- 46:14He drained the bitter chalice, he took on the consequences of all of our sin and rebellion,
- 46:20he defeated death and Satan, and, and this is the part we overlook which makes me crazy,
- 46:28and Christ reigns now.
- 46:33He is sovereign now.
- 46:37And he surrenders none of his sovereignty, none of his authority, none of his kingship
- 46:45to his enemies.
- 46:48And Christ our risen and reigning King, he will certainly return to judge the living
- 46:54and the dead and the world by fire.
- 46:57And he will bring to perfection those who have been good stewards of his grace.
- 47:04So meanwhile, as we continue our pilgrimage on earth, we follow in the footsteps of our
- 47:10risen and reigning King.
- 47:14And we have to invite other people, come along with us.
- 47:18You really do want to go where we are going.
- 47:24Because when time runs out, this is the only place that you want to be.
- 47:30The path to God through Christ is not one of many.
- 47:34It's not merely a privileged way to the Godhead.
- 47:39Friends, we have been entrusted by our Lord with something so very precious.
- 47:46The fullness of the deposit of faith is the continuation of his ministry as priest, prophet,
- 47:53and king through the sacraments, and a very great, great cultural heritage.
- 48:03Over 2,000 years of Christian witness.
- 48:10Let's savor that.
- 48:12Let's delight in that.
- 48:14Let's marvel in that.
- 48:15Let's give thanks to God Almighty for that.
- 48:22Think of the treasures, the treasures that have been entrusted to us.
- 48:28And let's have the good sense to ask for the grace to be good steward of all those
- 48:35gifts, all those treasures, all those graces.
- 48:39You know, along the way, there's going to be ups and downs, and speed bumps, and divots,
- 48:45and illness, and death.
- 48:48All those things.
- 48:51Not everyone who's on the higher rosters of the people who should really know better club
- 48:57will reform with a speed or in a manner that will satisfy me.
- 49:02And you know, that has to be okay.
- 49:05God is still God.
- 49:07The important thing, friends, is we have a good reason to live and a good reason to die.
- 49:14And God, our Lord, loves us so much that he decides to save us from ourselves at a very
- 49:24terrible cost to himself.
- 49:28And he offers us a share in his victory, his joy, and his glory.
- 49:32So let's say yes to that.
- 49:37Let's say yes to that.
- 49:38You know, St. Paul wrote to the Corinthians about driving out, purging the old leaven
- 49:45in our lives.
- 49:46I had a glorious, wonderful celebration of Holy Week and Easter.
- 49:52I'm still a sinner.
- 49:53I still need discipline.
- 49:55I still need the sacraments.
- 49:57I still need to repent.
- 49:58I still need Catholic fellowship.
- 50:02And I take on all those tasks and disciplines and challenges with a gladder heart than when
- 50:08I started on Ash Wednesday of 2026.
- 50:13I really do hope the same will be true for all of you.
- 50:19So friends, let us count our blessings.
- 50:22Let's rally the troops.
- 50:24And let's take another foot in the footsteps of Christ our King.
- 50:29I'm Jesuit Father Robert McTague, your host here every day of The Catholic Current.
- 50:32Join us tomorrow for another round of The Catholic Current, a hot topic, great guests,
- 50:37lively conversation.
- 50:39After the broadcast today, go to thestationofthecross.com, get our resources list, download our audio
- 50:45podcast.
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- 50:51We need to attract the attention of the listeners so that these conversations get the attention
- 50:55they deserve.
- 50:57Everything you need to take to your family and friends, we give to you.
- 51:00Together, let's take it around the world.
- 51:01We can do it with you.
- 51:03We cannot do it without you.
- 51:05Let's do this good work together.
- 51:07Let's make sure that we are more than relevant.
- 51:09Through the intercession of Our Lady of Mount Carmel, may mighty God bless you, Father,
- 51:13Son, and Holy Spirit, go in peace and please do pray for me, for I am a sinner.
- 51:21Amen.
- 51:22Amen.
- 51:23Amen.