Latest / Minnows Football / Matchweek 7: Deep trouble at Deepdale. Plus, Wrexham woes, the game of the season, and Imps4Eva.
Transcript
- Sam: Welcome to the Minnows Football Podcast. I'm your host, Sam Martins. Thursday, September seventeenth, and we've got a lot of news to process this week. There's managers fired, CEOs resigning, and absolute madness on the pitch. And some burning questions coming out of the championship this week for a number of big clubs. So let's get to And we're going to start today in Deep Dale, widely recognized as the oldest continuous professional football ground in the world, of course. And the burning question coming out of detail this week, was firing Paul Heckingbottom the right move for Preston North End? Will it change anything? And if not, what will? And I want to start here with just a small reading from the BBC to give us the the factual points in this story. Preston Northend have sacked Paul Heckingbottom with the Lillywhite's second bottom of the championship after six defeats in seven games. Their latest loss came at Deepdale on Saturday as they were beaten 1-0 by Lincoln City as the final whistle was greeted with boos and jeers. The club statement said, Football is a results business, and despite significant investment in the playing squad since Paul joined, the results during 2026 and the start of this current campaign have not been acceptable. Paul leaves us with our thanks and best wishes, his professionalism and work ethic during his time with us. Have been second to none. Assistant Stuart McCall's also left the club, while coach Jason Ewell has been placed in interim charge with a trip to QPR looming on Saturday before the three-week international break follows. Let's take a look at Paul Heckingbottom's career record. I went and pulled this, and he's obviously managed at a number of clubs. Preston, before that. Sheffield United, both as caretaker and full time manager, Hibernian in Scotland, Leeds and Barnsley. His high watermark across that time was November twenty-one to December twenty-three, when he managed ninety-eight games as full-time manager of Sheffield United, won forty-eight, drew 18, lost 32, a forty-nine percent winning rate. And everything else at every other stop in his career, thirty five percent or less. And this latest stop at Preston, thirty point six percent. He was in charge for a hundred and eight games, which in the championship, of course, is just an absolute eternity. a hundred and eight games, thirty three wins, thirty five draws, forty losses, a thirty percent success rate. And it's kind of a shame in a way, this firing. I think. it's always a shame when anyone loses their job, but it's a shame because they were looking there's just been so many points this season where Preston has looked really good. And this weekend was no different. The first half and even the first, you know, fifty five, sixty minutes, were very positive. They had the better chances in front of goal, but in a pretty familiar story for this season and also for the end of last season for Preston, they didn't take those chances. And so Here we are. And so what does this mean for the club? well, first of all, let's look at that statement that I just read. The club says we did significant work over the summer and he didn't execute. Is that a true statement? Well, first of all, they did spend fifteen million pounds in signings, but they lost a number of key players on in the team and key roles within the team as well. Key center forwards. they lost five center forwards, only had two replacements. You could definitely say at this stage, and I've I've gotten this not just from looking myself, but also listening to some really educated people on the topic, that they've been a defensive nightmare. They've had one clean sheet in the last 27 league matches under Hacking Bottom, an average of two goals conceded per game. You just look at it. a side like Lincoln right now, for example, we'll get to Lincoln City in a second, but they've had five clean sheets in a row. They've figured out how to defend at a higher level in the championship. That's just something which the numbers point to with Preston that Hacking Bottom has just not figured out. And it's not just being seen in the results. It's also seen in things like he's had nine different defenders for the first four league matches this season. They just never gotten there on defense. and fans have kind of had enough. I I went and watched a really great breakdown of this from on YouTube, P N E H D, Ben, a Preston North End, fantastic YouTube follower. And he talked about how fed up fans were of this, the fact that they've been on relegation pace over the last 40 games, three points from an available 21, despite a really kind start of of in terms of their opponents. You know, they've played in these first seven games here, they played two newly promoted sides plus Watford, Blackburn, Chel Charlton, and Bristol City. The only tough club, as Ben pointed out, that they've played is is Wolverhampton. Now some of those clubs like Charlton have obviously had a really good season to start and Bristol City and Watford are and even Blackburn are playing quite well, but that's not like a murderous row of teams that they've played. His particular gripes around it were around team selection and in-game management. It's hard to kind of disagree with that. if you go back and he he breaks this down really well, the number of times that Preston have conceded goals after tactical changes and substitutions is crazy and points to the fact that Hacking Bottoms either his decision making isn't sound or the strategy that he's put in place isn't sound. He also pointed to the fact that he wanted to see Alfie Devine in a more of a central position in number ten and everything going through him because he's unequivocally your best player. Hard to argue with that as well. When you look that Preston's created a lot of half chances over their their first seven games, but haven't had that kind of clinical finishing. It just points to kind of things coming to an end here, quite naturally. And I think this is obviously a firing, you know, some firings take you from by surprise And other ones just feel like they're kind of inevitable. And that was what we had here with Hacking Bottom. So th th there are two big issues that the club is facing now, really big existential kind of questions. Who is the new manager? And kind of everything, all this sort of sub questions that go along with that. But then there's the second question, which is impacted by Hacking Bottom moving on and potentially in a positive way, but certainly in a way that that impacts it, which is what's going on with this club sale. The club sale's at a at a certain point right now where it's it's fairly opaque in terms of what's going on. But there are two enormous questions that are facing Preston at the moment while they're in this existential state of only having three points from twenty-one. So let's start with the manager piece. and just to pull apart the Preston's score on MinnowsFootball dot com, you can go and check that out and see where they sit in terms of belief. But entering the season, Preston's institutional trust score sat at minus two, which is not a terrible score. It's slightly negative, but when compared to other clubs out there, West Ham, Watford, those kind of clubs have a score closer than minus 50, minus 60 in terms of the the trust that fans have in, in the in the ownership. And so their their ownership trust score is not super negative. But what's really interesting about Preston and working out their history and and the kind of scar tissue that that fans bring to the Preston experience is that they have this modifier to their performance, which can really cut both ways. What I mean by that is that this is a fan base that has real memories of both winning and losing in a way that not many other clubs have that. You look at a Rexham, they've got a Rexham has a a memory of Almost continuously losing with a couple of little blips over the years. This is Preston is a club that has this incredible history of being, let's not forget, they were one of the original clubs in the league. They have this crazy heritage in terms of detail being the longest continuously played stadium and and field. and at the same time, they still have they also have this memory of the third tier and a real memory of of being lower than the championship. And so when you're living on a knife edge like that, these big decisions of when you're moving on from a manager and certainly when you're considering who your manage new manager might be, they feel really fraught and they're really loaded in terms of of what could go on next. And so what I think they're looking for in a new manager is someone who can look at this squad, a bit like Ben was saying on on YouTube, look at this squad. And think, how can I maximize this squad and how can I build a scheme around what I've been given? You know, how can I put in place a plan that matches that rather than just putting in place my plan and hoping that everyone can snap to it? You look at the Reuben Amarum experience, for example, last year at Manchester United. You know, the mistakes that managers make when they think I do things my way and I'm gonna force this down the throat of my squad. You're midseason here, you've had a terrible start. You're facing definitely facing a relegation fight of some sort this year. How can we maximize the fifteen million pounds that's been put into the club to get it back to a point and make it make it so that we stay up this year? And so there's a few names being thrown around for that manager position. There's people like Bradford City boss Graham Alexander, obviously a former Preston captain, 400 games for the club. That's kind of like an identity hire option. For Preston, which could obviously lift supporters' mood very quickly. We know this guy, we trust him, we believe. but it also raises the stakes if the results don't follow. You know, the the fall will be higher. the fall will be longer, deeper for for a a hire like that. Other candidates that have been mentioned, Dave Chaloner, who's obviously had great success at Stockport and left there over the summer. Rob Edwards is available. Steve Evans was mentioned from Bristol Rovers if you're going to go deeper into the EFL pyramid and pull someone up from below. Sean Dyke's available. I'm not sure that he'd want to come and do this. He seems to be doing really well. I think he's a fantastic pundit on television. And so, you know, would you want to come back and take on a project like this? Bo Henriksen has been mentioned and is interesting. He's he's got more kind of Scandinavian experience and Most recently in the Bundesliga steered mains away from relegation and and got them back to a European spot in the following season. But the goal here is clearly avoid relegation. And so the the reason to make the move on Hacking Bottom now and get him out of the way is pretty a pretty clear one from a a squad and performance perspective. You've got one more week, a game against QPR this weekend, and then it's gonna be the three-week international break. In that time you think you can probably get you would think you could probably get one of these guys or someone else hired in and starting to set up the way in which they want to attack the rest of this season. And there's a lot of promise within this squad if they can work out how to defend, given the way they've approached and been playing the first halves of games this season. So when you go and you you listen to Preston supporters, that it's not all doom and gloom in the way that they're being we're playing on the pitch. It's Doom and gloom in terms of of the results. So if that can move around and turn around really quickly, you could see a lot more belief starting to rush back to the club in pretty short order. But the other thing that's looming is this sale. And the sale of of any club. I mean, sales of clubs are just it's just the hottest topic right now. It's funny, it's almost like you move out of the transfer window and into the club sales window. it feels like in in kind of the the autumn of of each year now. And this sale in particular is at an interesting point in that it's been confirmed by the owners, but we're not exactly sure. We have some suspicions about who it is, but we're not exactly sure who it is. And so there's just a lot of uncertainty around who is going to come in and how they are going to want to put their imprint on the club. And if you've ever tried to negotiate a sale as performances are declining, That could be a really complicating factor for the owners. You know, imagine if you were trying to sell the club right now and they were 12 points out of 21 or or or higher. You know, you're pointing to, well, you're going to have championship revenues next year. You're definitely staying up. Look at all this positivity in the squad. Instead, you're chop you're working through that negotiation and that sale, saying, Well, we're crossing our fingers. We think that the getting moving on from hacking bottom is going to be the answer. But there's a lot of unknowns. And so it's a complicated time to try and complete the transaction as all these things are taking place. And we don't know who it is who's going to come in and and ultimately buy this club and what that's going to mean for the supporters. You know, what the structure's going to look like and how much they're going to care about the history of this ing this club with with maybe the greatest history playing in the championship today. So just so much unknown. Hopefully, though, some the horizon for a club like this as opposed to a club, for example, like Sheffield United that we talked about last week is that there's going to be some resolution here on hopefully both these points in the next few months. You know, a a manager presume presumably will be hired before or during this international break. They'll get up and running and we'll see how that manager performs. The ownership thing could potentially it's it's in progress as opposed to just being mooted. They've found a buyer, they've agreed to broad terms and Presumably that'll be that will be able to be keep moving along and then we'll have an understanding of who that is and and what their motives and aspirations for the club might be. So dark days for now in deep day, but potentially a new dawn around the corner, with the word potentially doing a lot of work in that sentence there. Okay, burning question number two. What exactly is going on at Burnley? And I started to put some thoughts together on this and I'm working on a bigger piece and a deeper dive into Burnley. And that's gonna come next week. I just wanted to mention it here that that, you know, we're very aware of that. And of course, it's it's a bit of a dumpster fire. I don't think it's the same dumpster fire. I don't think it's exactly the kind of dumpster fire that people are classifying it as right now. I think there's actually some different problems that we're not paying quite as much attention to in terms of the the structure of of how ALK Capital has not just bought the club but is running the club right now. And so I'm wanting to do a bit more research on that. And I'll have more on that next week. Part of the problem with trying to write this story right now is that every day something new happens. Like today it was reported that Kyle Walker went and met the a fanboard and and the management and talked about that and and so there it's it's kind of many layers to this thing that are just kind of peeling apart right now. And what we do know though is that Clarice fans are are starting to get really upset and really rowdy. And that came through in a couple of the stories this week. And part of the trouble with these financial stories is that they're all slightly different. They all have this y this common thread, which is if not poor management. management with misaligned ideas in terms of w how they want to run the club versus how the fan base would really like them to run the club. But the way in which that's happening is all slightly different across the board, across all these different stories. And there's a bunch of learnings that I think we can pull out of each of these different pieces. So this one's very particular. As I said, more on this next week, but Burnley fans are very upset right now. They got a huge game this week, which we'll get to at the end of the pod. But Yeah, not looking good in Burnley. Burning question number three. Is the Ryan Reynolds and Rob Mack Fairy Tale over at Wrexham? And this burning question came directly from Gold.com, which had an article which was titled The Ryan Reynolds and Rob Mack Fairy Tale Is Over. Why Wrexham's Premier League dream could already be on hold for another year? So the question is the fairy tale over at Wrexham? Complicated question in my perspective. If you gave me that question though, I would and you say you have to answer this question in the way that it's structured. I don't think it's quite the right question. But anyway, if I had to answer it, I'd think I'd say no. And I think I'd say rather it's hit a road bump or it's stalled in some way. But the fairy tale is still it's to my to my extent based on how Wrexham. the the pain that Rexham supporters have gone through over many, many, many decades and and years is unequivocally still going. And so let's just let's visualize, let's start by zooming out a little bit. And visualizing like what the experience of the Wrexham fan is. If you zoom out and you think about how Wrexham fans are feeling today, you're still compared to half a decade ago or a decade ago for that club, you're still flying high. It's just that you're starting to get a little more comfortable at this altitude and this level. Your expectations are starting to shift up. We've talked about this in previous weeks. But as a Wrexham supporter, when you went from the National League to League Two, a few years ago, if you said, we're gonna be in the championship for a few seasons in just a couple of years, you would have lost your mind. That is still very much on the table. That idea is still very much on the table for Wrexham. They are not in imminent danger of relegation. It does not look like the wheels have completely come off the entire project. They've just received a walloping from West Ham 6 0, which exposed in that one game The gap between pr the Premier League, West Ham, and Wrexham. But it was just one game. And so that dream from five years ago is still very much alive. The dream of last year of just going up from National League to League Two, next year, League Two to League One. Next year, League One to the Championship. The dream of last year going from the championship straight into the Premier League, that ended that fairy tale. That ended a little while ago. That actually ended at the end of last year when they failed to qualify for the playoffs in the final week. That was a seminal point because that halted the kind of runaway train momentum that Wrexham had up until that point and replaced it with this idea of being at the right level for them. And the right level for them, as we set out their expectations to start the season, was really challenging to make the playoffs and threatening to make the playoffs and pushing for a promotion again this year. What's struggling right now is that those plans seem to be they're not falling apart yet, but they seem to be a little bit a little bit more challenged at this stage of the season that that than fans would like. So if that fairy tale, if the fairy tale of promotion after promotion after promotion is over and was actually over at the end of last season, then what phase are we in right now? Well, we're probably in the same phase with Wrexham. That every other championship club is in, especially some of the championship clubs that are perennially near the top of the championship, which is the grind, the grind of championship football week in, week out. If you look at the successful clubs this year, and historically over the last few years in particular, outside of maybe the clubs that have come down, like or at least West Ham and Wolves, if you look at clubs though, like Middlesbrough, Millwall, Southampton, What have they done for sustained success? They've built a plan and they've ground out wins in this league over and over and over again. That's what successful teams have done. It sounds simple and stupid, but they've built machines that can do that. And that's what historically works in the EFL, as opposed to prodigious rises through multiple tiers season after season to get to the Premier League. Like that's not a history, there's not a history of that happening and having sustained success. And so at a high level, this is not necessarily alarming and the fairy tale is not necessarily over. It's I would say it has been over and we're now in this new phase, which is still exciting if you're talking to a in a time machine to a Wrexham fan from five years ago. but because we're still so far over expectation. But what isn't easy to handle, I think, at the moment for Wrexham fans is the way they lost to West Ham, the way they kind of rolled over, the fact that it was six nil, not four nil or three nil, how clueless they looked, how overmatched they looked, and it then how much that stinks for real supporters who, you know, drove to London on a Tuesday to watch this game and paid a lot of money and then drove back and didn't get home until three o'clock in the morning. Like if you did that and you went and watched that game, that sucks. And and that's a that's a tough position to be in, but it's not a particularly unique position for Rexton to be in in terms of other clubs. It's just one that they they haven't experienced for for a little bit of time. When the grind becomes even more real and when the fairy tale and and things start to potentially become really troublesome for Wrexham fans is if things like this happen. If they fire Phil Parkinson and they decide to go in a different direction with a new manager. Not saying I'm not like sitting here saying you've got to support this guy. He's the best manager in the world. Just saying if they make that change, he's so critical to the identity of that team and the identity that they've built through documentaries and marketing and all these other things and Rob Mack coming out I think and and said, or maybe it was Ryan, one of the two, came out and said this guy's got a job for life. You know, if you decide to move on from that manager who has such a big identity within that club, that's a big deal. If they start sliding further towards the relegation battle in later this year and early next year, that's a really big deal. If they don't regroup, if this club doesn't regroup, this squad regroup and come out after the international break and start to live up to the standards that they set by making so many acquisitions and so many changes to the side. Then a lot of those questions will come out. And right now there's an excuse for Parkinson and the team of sorts, which is that there was massive turnover in this this team in August. And we're just here in September and we're trying to get our feet underneath us. And the international breaks been moved back a bit this year. And so et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. We're in a position where we just need this time. We've got to get it under underneath ourselves. I think that's fine to say that, but then you got to come out and have results. So a lot. for people to think about this is the eleventh highest value squad in the championship. So like it's not a cheap squad that's been assembled and people will obviously be watching incredibly closely with a club like this. Burning question number four. Are Lincoln City definitely staying up this year? The Imps, Lincoln City, Lincoln City won Bristol City's zero in their last game. It was all Bristol City. This is a familiar story for Imps fans and for the fans of teams who've played and lost to Lincoln City over the first few games of the season. All Bristol City in the first half, you know, peppering them with crosses, good set pieces, but just not not finishing. And during that time, Lincoln did this really critical thing that they've done so well this season, which is bend, don't break, you know, continue to press, continue to scramble at the back, and be aggressive, be ready to seize on an opportunity when it comes your way. And in watching that game, I was kind of struck with the fact that of how just how relentless the players on on this team are. And I had the same observation when they played Middlesbrough in the first game of this of this year, that it was just it's a team that's just just constantly around and on the ball. And even when they're making mistakes, and mistakes could be because of slightly lower skill or or whatever it might be against their opponents, they are just then then there's no flamboyance, there's no getting upset. They're just right back. It seem to be really well coached, honestly. They they're just right back to doing what they have been told to do. And what that means is that when Bristol City has a brain fade, which they had at the back and they they give the ball up in the box, they're ready to pounce and they score the only goal of the game. Bristol City had more opportunities, they had better opportunities, and still yet they lost one nothing. And so Lincoln City is just doing so many good things to start this season. They're keeping clean sheets, four out of the last five. Clean sheets, back-to-back one-nothing wins against Preston North End and Bristol City. Talk about like taking care of business. That's that's what taking care of business looks like. And that can be and is often the difference between relegation and and staying up. They have this identity, which is press high, be hard to beat, but also be ready to pounce on the counter. And that's easy to say. It's really hard to do. And so And it's it's especially hard to do at a higher level of competition, moving up from League One to to the championship. And so fans are ecstatic about how they're how the imps are going and and particularly how hard they're working. The word that keeps coming up in fan forums that I'm reading is grit. and a couple of quotes here. We win as a team and fight for each other for the full ninety plus minutes. Totally unexpected start to the campaign. It's not pretty, but the way these players back each other up is exceptional. These are all great things that you'd love to hear if you were owner of Lincoln City right now. And this experiment to put in two managers or two coaches, Chris Cohen and Tom Shaw, so far, seems to be working out well. They've successfully communicated to their squad the way they want to play. And the way they want to play seems to be able to win games in the championship or at least at least enough games to stay up in the championship. And the squad seems to be put together to meet the way they want to play, which is with fit, high work rate guys who are also ruthless and pouncing on mistakes. You just got to look at how Freddie Draper has kind of finished a couple of opportunities, half chances or or just opportune moments over the last few games. It's fantastic. And also, it should be mentioned and has to be mentioned, they've been lucky. And that luck is not going to last the whole season. You know, the luck will at some stage over a forty-six game season Dry up and some of those squeaking wins of one nothing will invariably, through the luck of a bouncing round ball and a game based around that, will turn into negative outcomes for them, one nothing losses rather than one nothing wins. But just to look at where they're at, they're on eleven points right now from twenty one available. There's still a hundred and seventeen points available from the remaining games for each team. And the baseline to avoid relegation over the last decade is 46 points. If you get to 50 points, you're pretty much almost guaranteed safety. So taking the 46 points, they're at least 35 points. That's at least 35 points from 117 available. And so right now they're getting 55% of the points available to them. Even if that drops to less than 30%, they can still make it and still be safe, which would be like winning one in three, Of their remaining games or winning 10 more games from 39 and drawing five? When you put it that way, it feels that feels achievable, you know? And still, we know things can go haywire and have gone haywire for thousands of clubs over thousands of different individual seasons up and down the EFL. So lots still to come. Early signs are good. And just on the manager, the co manager piece, I do wonder is there something too? having two managers. And it's incredible in terms of the coherence that we see to have two managers instill such a coherent product on the pitch. I went and looked up who the most successful manager duos were across history. John Solette and George Curtis came up, Coventry City nineteen eighty six, nineteen eighty seven, widely considered the ultimate success story for a managerial pre pairing. Appointed as a duo at the end of the 1985-86 season. They successfully kept Coventry from relegation and the very next year famously guided the club to victory in the 1987 FA Cup final against Tottenham Hotspur. And then Curtis moved back to a boardroom role later that summer. And then another one that I had th heard of and thought of in my memory, which was Roy Evans and Gerard Hoollier, Liverpool 1998, maybe the most famous two manager experiment, but didn't work out. super well. They Roy Evans was kind of the the boots on the ground manager, Joulier the tactic like tactical strategic partner in that pairing. However, it was confusing and it didn't last very long, lasted just a few months before Evans resigned. But anyway, it's it's just interesting. It's interesting to see two people down there talking. It's interesting to think about during a game, like having a partner to talk to, who a trusted partner who's not a assistant, not someone who you're in a power dynamic with, but someone who's an equal and a peer, being able to talk to that person during the game and and you see the two guys talking constantly and and figuring out what's going on. Two minds, are two minds better than one? Who knows? But it's it's exciting times for Lincoln City fans. Last burning question for this week. Was Middlesbrough for Norwich City 3 the game of the season? What a crazy An insane game. Norwich City, I I just they are so awesome. I just love as a neutral. You just love watching those guys guys play. Middlesbrough too. You know, two phenomenal sides who are doing fantastic things so far this year and and lots of ups and downs. I think if I was a a diehard supporter of either team, but particularly Norwich City, there'd be reasons for me to be a little nervous at least and and concerned at times. But as a neutral, just a phenomenal game. Let's just do the TikTok real quick. So, first of all, Burroughs should have scored inside thirty seconds. Like they went down and almost scored. And then straight away, Norwich City goes the other way. And inside a minute, Motore has this awesome shot across the front of the goalkeeper into the far corner, off the post, one nil inside a minute, even after Middlesbrough should have scored in the first thirty seconds. So that happens. Then Sebastian Baerthalter evens it up at the three minute mark. After Norwich has a blunder at the back, too many Norwich blunders at the back is a theme so far this season. Got to talk about that at some stage. Then the sixth minute, we're only six minutes in here. Cozio Duberry scores in the bottom corner for Middlesbrough to cap this move that he started way back up in the field. and so it was kind of a crazy goal. There were Norwich bodies everywhere in the box, chaos, classic Norwich football. So six minutes to two one. After Norwich so Norwich scores first. Middlesbrough then scores two inside six minutes. We settle in for thirty minutes or so. Then Bearhalter scores from an what I thought was an offside position that was definitely on the fence. it's close either way, puts Bor Burrah up three one at the half. You think gee, Burra could just be taking this game over. But in the second half, Philip Clement rings the changes, brings on Makama, who scores in the sixty ninth minute. Set up by Jacob Wright, who was also a change in the second half. And then Jacob Wright, six minutes later, evens it up. And Clement on the sideline, you watch him, he's not even celebrating. He's just, he's urging the side on. He's saying, Come on, keep going, finish, finish, finish. And that hand motion of his on the sideline to say, keep going, keep going, keep going, that's how you feel he wants to run this side. He wants them to just keep on pushing, which is just. So refreshing and so exciting to see a manager running his team that way. And so the shots just keep piling up. It's three-three at this stage, both sides, and just when you think it's going to end as a draw, another set piece from Bearhalter, who had an awesome game, 91st minute, Messi in the box, Will Langshire cuts it back, and Ash Phillips scores the winner. And it for me was easily the game of the season. So far, there've been some really great performances. In blowouts this year, like Southampton's performance against Millwall comes to mind of like teams that have really blown a team off the park. What was crazy about this was that it looked like it was going to be another one of those games, and then Norwich found this way to to kind of claw claw itself back. And so thoughts on both teams, but maybe Borough first. I've been harsh on Bearhalter the first part of this season. I'm not quite sure why. I think it's there's just something about him that that rubs me the wrong way. Maybe his Americanness or something. I'm not sure what it is. But he was so influential in this game. And you can just see he he's getting put in a position to really be the best version of himself by Kim Helberg. So when when Burra is organized and they're flowing through him, he looks fantastic and Burra looks fantastic. So he's really an an incredibly immensely influential player on the on the pitch right now. And I thought he had a great game. Great attacking performance from them. you also saw some vulnerabilities for Burrow. It's actually a vulnerability for both these teams who want to play in this expansive, fast-moving way that you're going to expose yourself against an opponent like Norwich in particular. That's kind of what happened when Burrow was up three-one. They didn't probably have to still be pressing in the way they were. That's their identity and that's what they do. but it created opportunities for Norwich. I also th I also thought Will Langshear had a great game in showing that he doesn't need to be scoring goals to be effective. Like the first couple of games, you thought this guy's a just an out and out natural goal scorer. But he's shown in the last couple of games that there's a way for him to be effective, setting guys up. So that was exciting. Norwich, I mean, you gotta love what they're doing right now, I think. I think I love what they're doing, but I think it's tough for Norwich fans who see so much potential in this way of playing. Which if you had to describe it as kind of live and die by the sword. But the problem with live and die th by the sword is it's not the live part, it's the die part. he's so gung ho, Clement, he's so attacking. You have to admire that. But could some small t tweaks at times, or just some better organized defense, or dialing down the aggression a little bit, you know, could that lead to more wins, which is ultimately what we're trying to do here. And The flip side of that argument is that you can't see many teams coming back from three one down against a side like Middlesbrough in the way Norwich City did and really making a game of it. but you know, what is the sustained appetite for Norwich City fans to be able to have to have the team playing this way? Like how long can you live on that knife edge? And because after a while it starts to look at the beginning of the season, it starts to look like promise. It's like, my gosh, they're so promising the way they attack. They've got such phenomenal, you know, players who can really finish and guys like Motore or or, you know, really set up an attack and move incredibly quickly down the pitch. It's such an exciting way of playing. But if you don't have the results, does that start to look reckless over time? And so that's going to be really interesting to watch. Great game. Great work by both sides. So That was our burning questions. What are we looking forward to this weekend, the last weekend of football before the international break? The top of the of the dock, it has to be Millwall versus West Ham. Saturday's Dockers Derby. And the dispersal zone has been announced by London police. It's quite a large zone where if you do anything, you'll get dispersed and s and sent out of there. this is the hundredth meeting of these two teams, which is fantastic. The record is Millwall's 138, West Ham 34 with 27 draws. They haven't played in 14 years, haven't played since February 4th, 2012, when West Ham beat Millwall 2-1 in a championship game. And it comes at in sh at an interesting time for both clubs where Millwall's kind of hanging tough and West Ham is, I think you'd have to say, you know, red hot. Like they're red hot after that that Wrexham win. Which is sometimes, honestly, when you want to meet a club. It's like they're can be flying a little too high. Millwall obviously had an incredibly hot start to the season, cooled down with some injuries, but they've been finding ways at to sometimes get the result. You know, they had the tough loss to Blackburn, a couple of weeks ago, but they've been finding ways to get wins in which they other clubs might have been wilting. And so Alex Neal's kind of at the peak of his powers there. This game's gonna mean a lot to a lot of fans and it's Just gonna be very exciting to see what happens there. So all eyes will be on that derby. Other big games, Lincoln City versus Swansea. We talked a lot about Lincoln City. Maybe too much for neutral fans this episode, but I I find the story fascinating. Up against Swansea, great test. And they haven't really been tested by a team like that since the game against Southampton. And that was a game that they maybe should have. you know, should have won and got a result at. So, that's gonna be exciting to watch. How high can those guys fly? Wrexham takes on Southampton. Really tough follow-up after losing six-nothing at West Ham. they're home, at least. They're gonna need fans to show up, show out. They're testing the resilience. The 70 million pound cop stand is just continually getting a lot of attention in the media. And they need to they're gonna need to fill that stand. And, you know, as we said, they're still in a great position in terms of the club, but this is a really big bounce back opportunity for them against South Hampton Southampton who just have looked so classy. Like in terms of class on the pitch, they've looked about as good as maybe West Ham and and a couple of others, but they've looked one of the top clubs when they're playing well this year. So that's gonna be a great matchup. And then a couple of other ones, Cardiff City takes on Charlton. It is it pan is it panic stations for Cardiff City? Like what happens if they don't win this week going into that break? Like there'll be a lot of soul searching at that club. And it's a club that doesn't have a strong a lot a hell of a lot of trust in just having making sane, rational decisions over and over again, with Vincent Tan. So, you know, how much rope is there? Like Th it's gonna be a r it's a really big game, obviously, for Cardiff City. And then Charlton looking to round out this first part of the season, in s with in strength and and a an incredible season. But we talked last week about Nathan Jones and some of his ups and downs. Like this is a a couple of of kind of a tempestuous owner meets tempestuous manager and let's see what happens. So that'll be exciting to watch. And then I can't finish without talking about Burnley and Taking on Derby County and kind of a seller dweller battle with huge stakes. And one of these, both of these clubs desperately need a win. We know they're both not going to get one. it would mean a lot for Burnley to to get a victory here and peel themselves off the bottom of the table going into that international break. So great football this weekend. We will be back. It's gonna be a break for a few weeks in terms of football, but we will be back next week, same time. talking about Burnley and some of the other big stories coming out of the championship. So with that, thank you for listening and see you next week.