Latest / The iAlign Podcast with Flint Mitchell / #8 - Talks With a Mentor: Professional vs Collegiate Soccer, Identifying Successful People, and Building a Network That You’re Proud to Be a Part of With Mike Graczyk.

Transcript

#8 - Talks With a Mentor: Professional vs Collegiate Soccer, Identifying Successful People, and Building a Network That You’re Proud to Be a Part of With Mike Graczyk. · The iAlign Podcast with Flint Mitchell

• 0:09
  SPEAKER_01: What's up y'all?
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Seeking Authenticity.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_01: My name is Flint Mitchell, and I get absolutely psyched by having conversations with authentic people that I admire about the things they value.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: Their stories and perspectives don't just make me smile, laugh, and think.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_01: They inspire me to wake up earlier, listen better, focus, and work harder, and help make me a better version of myself.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it's my hope that sharing these conversations through this podcast might do the same thing for you.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: In this episode, I talk with a good friend of mine, Mike Grayzak.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_01: Mike was a goalkeeper for the University of New Mexico before being drafted to play professionally.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: After several years in the MLS, he coached at Stanford, Harvard, his alma mater, the University of New Mexico, New Mexico United, the state's first professional soccer team, and now at Notre Dame.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_01: Mike was a coach for one of my club soccer teams, and his leadership, along with the guys on those teams, played a large role in who I became as an adult.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_01: This is a guy I really look up to and one that I always feel was trying to help us, those teenage soccer players, not just succeed on the field, but succeed in life and become good men.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's interesting in this conversation that he mentions how when he looks back at our team, his best memories don't really have to do with the soccer, but more about the connections and the bonds that our team had.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: Because in reflection, that's the same with my memory.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: Looking back, it was about the team and the network formed through it.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: And in this conversation, we talk a bit about that experience of creating a strong network that you're proud to be a part of and serve in.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_01: About his transition from college to professional soccer and then into coaching.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: About recruiting young players, and about the interest which sparked his PhD studies, looking for the flags that might predict a person's success.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_01: I had a blast listening to Mike, and I know you will too.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: Enjoy.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: I think the difference in the best coaches and in the ones that I've been around is they have an ability to narrow that specifically to a certain aspect or trait that they can look at and see and just be like, yep, that's it.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like, of course, everyone wants someone to be brave, of course, everyone wants someone to be competitive.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, everyone wants someone to be, but what are things that you can look at that guarantee you that that's what this kid is?
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: I don't need the most talented player, I need guys that are gonna fight for each other.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: I need guys that are gonna be there for the cause because it's cliche, but if you that's the first step, and then from there you build them.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_00: The bigger picture.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: That's why I coach college, I think, is because for me the bigger picture is man, if you guys end up like good husbands and good fathers and um good employees, then I can kind of feel like okay, like these I can be super proud of the time you know that we had.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I am who I am because of how people have invested in me as a person.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: Uh so I just I I see the power in that.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for doing this with me, Mike.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: I really appreciate it.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, dude, I was pumped.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: I had to show Sydney as soon as soon as the email came through, she was excited.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, it's it's I'm pretty amped for this discussion because as long as we've known each other and you've been playing kind of a mentor role in my life, the discussions have tended to be aimed a little more towards how I'm doing, and now I get to flip the table a little bit.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um and there's a I I guess the only un unfortunate thing with that kind of context is that there are so many things I would like to ask you about.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: But the first of which is I'd love to hear a little bit more about your experience um transitioning from collegiate soccer at the University of New Mexico into the MOS.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_01: Could you tell me a bit about what that experience was like and maybe what it taught you?
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it was it was unbelievable.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think for you know, growing up my whole life in Albuquerque, New Mexico, you're kind of always told what you can't do.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_00: So that just provides this extra motivation uh to push you a little bit.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think my my family, you know, my background, my dad was a cop.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, he's a retired cop.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_00: My mom was kind of the first uh to to kind of graduate from college, went to a two-year college, and she became a general manager of you know a pretty big uniform company.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_00: And my grandparents, my my grandpa is from Buffalo, New York.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: His whole family's from Italy.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they immigrated here, and he had a paving company that wasn't doing well in Buffalo, so he moved the whole family down to Albuquerque.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: And it's a family business, it's fully Italian mafioso style.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, he's got the white v-neck and the red sauce splattered all over the gold chain.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: But uh it's just, you know, so much of my background is embedded in my family and kind of the values I've grown up in in the city and state that I grew up in.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: We were kind of a very underlooked state, you know, growing up playing soccer.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: You you always went to California, you went to these other places, you were kind of seen as the underdog and um just motivated you and pushed you.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I think my whole life I'd kind of always been told I wasn't gonna be able to do it.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_00: I was told I wouldn't be able to play D1 soccer um by regional coaches, ODP coaches, all that kind of stuff.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_00: I was told by my college coach I wouldn't be able to play in the MLS.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_00: And um so it was just it just kind of added motivation to to keep pushing.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um I wasn't still to this day, I don't know if you know, if I was actually good enough to be in the MLS, but I know that my work rate kind of pushed it, I think, as far as as far as I could go.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I was humbled, excited, but at the same time ready and I knew that I belonged there.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um so it was uh it was it was a pretty surreal experience.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um I found out I didn't even think I was gonna get drafted.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: I was on my way to go try out for an A-League team uh during the MLS draft while it was going on.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: I found out I got I was connecting in Denver and I actually found out I got selected by the Rapids.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um so ended up just kind of staying and uh giving it a go.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: But it was it was a great experience.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: I think what what I learned most in that transition was one, it was it was an unbelievable opportunity to be able to, you know, do what you love for a living.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_00: But two, it it was it's a business too, you know, it's it's it is different when money's involved.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that was one of the things that I love most about college soccer was you're playing at such a high level and you're you're doing it in a way that's still pure and that's still you know for something a little bit bigger than yourself.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, the minute you get into that next level and money's involved, it's it's a business.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: It really is.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's it's not necessarily about development.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's not about, you know, you either have it or you don't.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um so you know, uh at one hand I loved it and it was amazing and it was an incredible experience.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes I look back and I gotta pinch myself, but on the other hand, I I think the best experience I've ever had in my life playing soccer um was definitely at the University of New Mexico.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have any examples of of kind of what that means by soccer was turned into a business?
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think you know, when it first hit me was I think it was the first game of the season.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_00: I think we opened up against the LA Galaxy and Beckham was there, and you know, it was a big home opener.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: We were sold out.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I think we're I think we were winning the game three or four-nil.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think they scored pretty late to make it 4-1.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um we get into the locker room, pumped up, everyone's excited.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, you know, I was excited.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: It was my first you know, pro game to be a part of, uh member of the team, all that kind of stuff.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: And there were some guys that were kind of pissed and they were bummed and I had no idea what was going on, but it was, I think it was some of the defenders, maybe one of the maybe the starting goalkeeper.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but they had a they had a bonus, they had a shutout clause.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_00: And because they didn't get that bonus, um you know, they they were pissed.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I was like, okay, this is a little different.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then the one that really, I think the one that really got me was one year um when I was playing for a team, I don't want to say who, but we we had a guy on our team who was on nine goals on the year and started every game, and he had a clause in his contract that if he got to double-digit goals, he got a big bonus from the club.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: The club had to pay out, and all of a sudden we get towards the end of the year, and um, they just started benching him and they wouldn't play him for no reason, no one knew.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: And it was great.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: He actually subbed on towards the end of the year, and uh one of our players got taken down for PK, ran up, grabbed the ball, gave it to him.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_00: Uh um, and he buried it, and everyone was just pumped.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: So he ended up getting his double-digit goals.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: But it's just moments like that where you realize that you know it's it made me realize like when wide receivers are crying about not getting the ball from the quarterback or whatever, all these little things that you kind of think about when you're growing up that seems selfish.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: You you understand that there's a greater story behind it that you're not quite thinking about.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: So to have empathy for those kind of players when you don't really know what's going on.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: But no, I've never heard that perspective before.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_01: That's actually pretty wild.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_01: It it's interesting because my entire experience with any sort of sport was your coach or whatever the management of in the team is it's 100% just support, whereas that kind of puts a barrier in between uh, right?
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like the coach has to make that decision to bench that guy, even if the management is the one pushing him, and that inherently puts some block in between the coach and the players.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's kind of wild.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's super interesting.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_01: And so does that make you did that is that why you looked only towards college soccer as far as coaching was concerned?
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_00: A little bit, yeah.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I I grew up most as a person as a player in in college.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I love the development aspect of it.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: I think coaching in that time is you know some of the most formidable years of of a person's life.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: They're growing and changing so much.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: First time they're away from home for a lot of people.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: And um education is different.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: You're around uh for a lot of people, depending on the university that you go to, you're you're surrounded by different people from different areas and different backgrounds.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: So I think naturally you just you grow so much, you question so much, you doubt so much.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh your your brain's just moving.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so from a development aspect, I think, you know, um from a soccer perspective too, I think people can grow in in those areas as well.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: And it was the most that I ever grew.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, you have four years with someone during the most formidable years of their life, and that's why I got into the coaching.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I I wanted to explore that a little bit.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I'd been an assistant coach for a long time in college soccer, and then this past year in 2019, I got an opportunity to coach uh at New Mexico United for the professional team out there that had just started up.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: So it was it was I never thought I would coach professionally, but because it had you know ties to my home and ties to the city and stuff, it was it was one of the most incredible coaching experiences I ever had in my life.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but it's still it's it is different.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's why you know I I knew after doing that that you know my home was was in college soccer.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_01: No, and I want to touch on or maybe just go straight into that aspect of coaching being helping players and pe and and young men develop as people, but I'd love to hear a bit more about that comment.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: How uh coaching professionally last year was one of the most it sounded like interesting or incredible coaching experiences you had.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, I was I was born in Albuquerque, New Mexico, and like I said, it is uh I will always have that place in the back of my heart, and it's a special place to me.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I think to be born and raised in that city and to to play youth soccer, starting at AYSO to club, to high school, to college, to coaching at the college, to now have the opportunity to coach for the first professional team there.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: It it was just something that I just couldn't not be a part of when asked, you know.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: Um we uh we led the league in attendance our first year to to see 15,000 people packed in a in a stadium.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_00: Oh just all for the single, like people who don't even like soccer.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_00: So seeing the Mexicans all band together when you know we're typically on the bottom of the list for so many things, yeah, to see them come together and be a part of something that helps unite them instead of drive them apart was was again like kind of the reason why I coached just something for a little bit bigger than yourself.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: So um, so it was an unbelievable experience for me.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I think it was one of the coolest experiences I've had in my life.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: At the same time, coaching professionally is it's you're it's a 10-month season and I'm away from my family a lot.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_00: And with the with the addition of my daughter Audrey, um, you know, it that can just take a toll uh on family.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_00: So I've uh you know, when I was single and I was by myself, soccer was my number one passion the minute I got married.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_00: That passion changed to my wife, and you know, the minute I have a daughter, my passions changed to my family.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I think as incredible as it was by itself, um, the overall part, I just feel like I'm I'm probably better fitted for college soccer where I can be impactful in both areas and not just really good in one and and not great in the others.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_01: So no, and that's that's awesome.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uh it's kind of wild to also hear that from the coach's perspective, too, because you only typically hear that about the players, right?
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: Obviously, the players are are very committed in professional sports and in college sports too, but uh you don't really, I guess, hear it from the people managing them and helping them become those performers, that it is the exact same commitment, right?
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: Um but also that's so kind of cool the way you put it.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's really exciting to say you're I mean your entire you span the entire uh soccer profile in New Mexico, in in Albuquerque, um and bringing that kind of excitement to the city is bringing it to your hometown.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's pretty awesome.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's I think it's remarkable when people can not only create a connection to where they're from, but give back through themselves.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's that's really important.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think what's unique about soccer too is and interesting, it's been cool to see the wave of growth in the United States is now when people ask who I support, I can just say New Mexico United.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: I don't have to say Arsenal, I don't have to say NMS team because I I really is like that's my favorite team right now.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: That's the team that I follow the most out of any team that I watch.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'll try and watch every single game.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I know friends and family who who do the same thing that have never been a part of soccer.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: So it's it's just great to see you know what the sport can do in in cities like that.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and that's even kind of true with just the history of soccer in the United States as a whole, right?
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: 20 years ago, people, if you ask soccer players what their favorite teams are, they're probably all barring the really close fans, they were all talking about European teams.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: And now it's much more common for people to be supporting whoever their local team is.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um that's pretty cool.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_01: It's cool that it's become so much more ingrained in in American society just because it is such a remarkable sport.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um that actually leads to a kind of interesting thought.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have any stories of ways where soccer has helped maybe connect you with people that you wouldn't have otherwise had the chance to?
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, soccer, I mean, like many uh other forums, I'd imagine, is it's such a small world and the connections that you can create within them is is unbelievable.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I've always, you know, I've been told by some like some influential people in my life that one of the best things you can do is just constantly invest in your network and know what that is.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: And not necessarily money, not necessarily just invest in your network.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: And as long as you can do something that helps that grow, um, and you can be a part of a good company, be around good people and work for good leadership, then man, like you can you can be in a great spot.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to find all of those things, right?
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but I feel like I've been super fortunate and blessed to be able to expand that network of soccer.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: And um I'm very much a man of faith.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I I very much believe that, you know, as far as you know, God has given me this platform of soccer to invest in.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: And he's given me these environments to um live in and to be a part of.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, this past year when I was talking about potentially leaving coaching and and maybe doing something else after United, I looked at other areas, other platforms.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but uh it was really hard for me to leave this idea of like, man, like he's given me this community that spans in in a massive fashion.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: Like I mean, I I've I've gotten to coach at some of the best universities in the world.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um and you know, in playing in the MLS, I've gotten to expand my professional network there.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_00: In playing in the USL, I've gotten to expand my network there.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_00: I uh I know agents, I know I like I my connections within the world of soccer is is unbelievable.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_00: And that only comes through the things that he's given me.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: And it's it's not through like yes, maybe some of us to work in my own, but a lot of it's through the fact that I, you know, I I I was able to just play for some very influential people who really helped me.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um and that's not necessarily that's not me, that's just being a part of it, right?
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's happening to be under a really good coach that you didn't really know much about.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, absolutely.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I I feel super fortunate to be a part of those networks.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: And um when it's it's unbelievable if people ask, like, hey, do you know so and so from this from this professional team?
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Or can you connect me with so and so?
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: Or people can call, like, hey, do you know someone from the galaxy?
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, do you know someone from this?
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I could just I can use my web and use my connectors and just be like, Yeah, I can get you in touch with someone there.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, um, but it's unique and it, like I said, it's a small world and um it's it's my it's my life now, it's my environment.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's my niche.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's the like I said, that's the world that God's given me.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to try and give everything I can to it and invest as much into it as possible.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: No, and I like the way you sh the way you think of that question really is not necessarily individual people, but it's more of the the greater network that is that that soccer has given you, right?
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's not necessarily one or two people that you've met, it's the fact that you've found yourself in this web of people that have all been kind of brought together through soccer.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's one of the reasons why soccer is so powerful is because it's a worldwide network, it's something that people connect with all over the world.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not only, it's really common for soccer players to be like, oh, well, if I go to another country, I'll find a pickup game.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_01: But what that inherently means is that you're going to a new place and finding common ground with someone off the bat.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: You're like creating a community of creating connections in a new place without any other uh input or information.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um what kind of things were you looking at then after coaching professionally?
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: Were you thinking, was this the PhD?
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah, I mean, thinking about, I mean, once once things finished at the University of New Mexico and the program got cut, um, my like academic stuff got cut as well, which is unfortunate.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_00: So you think about okay, do I want to take this time to finish?
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I have 23 hours left, 18 dissertation hours.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: It seems like it's a ton, but really in the grand scheme of things, I'm pretty far down the road.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_00: So, do I want to do that?
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but now we also we have our daughter, and it's not exactly like I can just take a back seat.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: And my wife and I have chosen a path of nonprofit and coaching.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_00: So um we're not just kind of decided that that's the life that we want, and we want to be able to serve in the areas and realms we're gonna be most impactful.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: And we feel like those are the realms that again are our biggest, you know, sphere of influence.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_00: Um so uh long story short, I don't think I was gonna be able to take time off to be able to pursue a PhD in that manner.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's something that's a goal of mine, that's a lifelong goal that I know that I'll finish.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and just kind of waiting to find the right time to kind of put back into it because right now I have to invest in her and and with everything going on with you know, obviously coronavirus and everything, it's it's a tough time to to step away.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, absolutely.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um so yeah, so I thought about that uh everywhere, man.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_00: I looked everywhere.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_00: I looked at um financial advising, I looked at tech companies.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_00: I think the the things that I wanted to narrow down the most was I knew that I wanted to work for a good company, I knew that I wanted to work with good people, I knew I wanted to work, I knew I wanted to work under good leadership, and I felt if I could find those three things that I could be happy anywhere.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um I know my I know my skill sets, I know what I'm good at, so I narrowed it down from there and kind of got into the interview.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: Processed a lot of different places.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_00: I had a a couple different opportunities at some other places, and I think when it came down to it, I just couldn't I couldn't necessarily fully commit to it.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think there was something about soccer that just kept me wondering and thinking.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_00: And and then this opportunity came up and um I wanted to make sure that it was right for my family.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, my wife and I have had tons of conversations.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: She's just a big she's just as big as a part of the you know the decision as me.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I wanted her to feel comfortable with it, and she was really excited about it.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: So I think for us, and it ended up being a no-brainer.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: What was your now?
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: And and that makes sense.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: It makes sense that you would have, at least for now, chosen a path through soccer.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_01: I can understand that and I can appreciate that.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um what was your PhD kind of focused on?
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_01: Actually, before that, was it you said it was a lifelong goal?
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_01: Was that that kind of graduate study always in the back of your head, or was there an experience that kind of pushed you into it?
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: I think it was an experience.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think I wanted to get my masters, I knew that.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_00: And then once I finished, um, I knew I wasn't done studying or wanting to learn.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because I was enjoying it a lot.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think when you you go to school the first time and you leave, you've gone through your whole life, you're kind of ready to get out.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um, having that break and being able to come back, and your mind is kind of like reset, refocus, it's narrowed.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_00: You have a better idea of what you're doing in life, what your passions are.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_00: So it was easier for me to hunker down and um narrow my focus and and really enjoy the process instead of just getting through it.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_00: So by the time I finished with my master's, I knew I wanted to keep going and it was a step program.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I I just kept going and I was loving it.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um I was enjoying like every little facet of it of trying to figure out what it was that I wanted to, you know, study of the the people that you're surrounded by are you know, like-minded people who have similar goals and similar aspirations.
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um and it was just a different realm of thinking outside of soccer that I really enjoy.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_00: I really enjoy having good conversations with people, learning from people, um, sitting down and just talking about things that I have no idea about, but still asking questions.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like I I I relish those those moments.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I love being around people that are way smarter than me.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um so yeah, I I just loved it.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I wanted to be a part of it.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: So I kept going and all of a sudden I knew I was like, okay, two and a half, almost three years into that.
• 24:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um that I was like, yeah, let's just do this.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_00: So now it's just kind of turned into this thing that okay, I'm this close.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_00: Like I really want to finish.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and what exactly are you are you what did you kind of narrow it down to in your in your research?
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so this is um, so it was in sports administration.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_00: It was gonna be a concentration in psychology because they didn't have a sports psychology uh um concentration in New Mexico.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_00: So it was gonna be in sports administration, but I was gonna be able to go through the psychology department to kind of help with the concentration there.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_00: And um what I was really curious and and wanted to study was just predictors of success.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_00: I had read so many uh just like studies and books on you know people's idea of what it means to be successful.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: And sure.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um obviously in the field that I'm in, and I feel like in any field, those are just great things to try and identify in recruiting and figuring out what personalities work with cultures.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, obviously, there's so many things that come along with that.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_00: Your definition of success, you have to define.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many different areas they have to go.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: But I was I wanted to specifically concentrate and narrow in the field of soccer um and to try and come up with some form of a uh a scale, a test um that people could use to help narrow their recruiting and identification methods.
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so when they go to the field, instead of having five or six or eighteen coaches looking at, you know, all of them have different ideas.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_00: And if you ever get coaches in the room, you know that every single one of them has a different opinion on the game or a different opinion on the player.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: So in an effort to narrowise and centralize all of that, um, you know, come up with a scale that fits essentially at the end of the day, it ends up coming down to the head coach, but like what what the program wants and and what they feel is successful for each position and each player and and each program so that when you're sitting down watching a player, you can more narrow, you know, what you're looking at, what you're looking for.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have kind of overall categories that you've been players into, like type of type of player?
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_01: Not position-wise, but more mindset-wise.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think so.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think the longer you go at it, you you know, I I've like anything, I haven't figured anything out.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm still learning.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_00: I I've learned from some really I've been fortunate to be around some unbelievable coaches who have just taught me how to refine what it is I'm looking at.
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and and not just, you know, you you begin to search for different details within a detail, you know.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so I think that's what's really helped me.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: I I think there's certain characteristics that I've seen over the year that I've known to be true that kind of withstand the test of time that you can just look at.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_00: And if it checks all the boxes, you can be like, okay, this kid's gonna be successful.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_01: Um could you say what a couple of those are?
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, I think uh there's general characteristics that I think home with everybody, but you then learn how that translates to the game of soccer specifically.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so one, like being brave.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, that's a general characteristic.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_00: What does that mean to be brave?
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_00: You can narrow that in so many ways.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um in soccer, there's small ways that you can look at to see if a kid's brave.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_00: You know, when watch him go into a tackle um and see if he really goes in or if he pulls out, you know.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um watch someone in a big game.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_00: Do they do they do they want the ball?
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: Are they shying away from the ball?
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know, are they are they up for it?
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, being brave is also like doing the right thing all the time, um, no matter who's looking, no matter when someone's looking.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: So you show up to warm-ups early, you watch people as they interact.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, you watch it when things going against the grain, you know, when you know it's the right thing.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there are so many different ways to identify that.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think just over the years, you've everyone has these categories of what they feel is successful, and a lot of the characteristics are very similar.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think the difference in the best coaches and in the ones that I've been around is they have an ability to narrow that specifically um to a certain aspect or trait that they can look at and see and just be like, Yep, that's it.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: Um, the best way I can explain it is that have you ever seen the movie Trouble with the Curve?
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so it's great.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's Clint Eastwood uh movie, great movie.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: Justin Timberlake, fantastic, right?
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_00: But anyways, he's an old school scout.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, he's a baseball scout.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: And this is when analytics are coming into play.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I don't want to ruin the end of the movie, but at the end of the day, there's tons of scouts there saying that this kid is an incredible hitter, and he's trying to figure out if the kid's actually an incredible hitter.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_00: The guy hits a home run and everyone's going nuts saying, See, I told you what an incredible hitter this guy was.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: Clint Eastwood's going blind, so he can't really see it, but he hears the sound of the bat when it hits the ball.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: And he's like, kid's not gonna make it.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: And he just walks away, and his daughter's like, What are you talking about?
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_00: And you're like, Can you did you hear it?
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: Like, it's a sound that you hear.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, he's not gonna be able to hit a curve, like he pulled up too early.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so everyone's saying the same thing.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: They know this kid's a good hitter, but there's these fine details within the characteristic that help the great people identify those certain characteristics and really help them know what's true and what's not true.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_00: Like, of course, everyone wants someone to be brave, of course, everyone wants someone to be competitive.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, everyone wants someone to be, but what are things that you can look at that guarantee you that that's what this kid is and that you know that?
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I think that's what again, these are areas that like I'm constantly trying to hone.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_00: And yeah, um, I've failed so many times at it.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_00: I think through those failures you learn, you know, from your mistakes.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_00: But that's what intrigues me most about um recruiting, about being in this game, this competitive game, especially in the game of soccer, like your results are right in front of you, you can't hide from them.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: So every every week it's right up in front of you.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_00: So it's uh it's interesting.
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_00: What are those predictors of success?
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: You know, um lead to.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_01: And it's I that makes sense than why that interest would lead directly into what you were studying in your PhD.
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: And it makes sense kind of from my memory of club soccer.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um it for me, your coaching style was more founded on or based on uh I mean it was a lot about soccer, but it felt also like it was a lot about character building, um, from what I remember.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_01: And also, actually, this is kind of a funny note.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: The way I describe you when I talk about coaches or mentors of mine, is the way you speak is like the dialect of motivation.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: It's like uh when we're getting on the bus in the Bay Area to drive down to Southern California for a tournament, it wasn't all right, guys, get on the bus.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_01: It was like, see that bus.
• 31:52
  SPEAKER_01: Getting on the bus is the first step to success.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_01: And that's true.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, but it it right, it makes sense.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like your perspective is kind of it from my perspective, it's it's uh founded on what are the what are the determining factors in creating the successful adventure or successful journey, right?
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, I think in everything with those little things, I always you want to control the controllables, right?
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many things that are out of your control that the more you can have an attention to detail to little things and control the things that you can control.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_00: Um just the more you're setting yourself up to be successful.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't mean that you are gonna be successful, you're just getting yourself ahead of the curve a little bit.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I knew with our group, and and I believe it to this day, no matter what team I coach is, I I don't need the most talented player.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: I need guys that are gonna fight for each other.
• 32:49
  SPEAKER_00: I need guys that are gonna be there for the cause because it's cliche, but if you that's the first step, and then from there you build them, and from there it's up to you to guide them.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: But if you don't have that first part, then um as far as how I coach, like that's just it's gonna be tough to continue to move forward.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that was but it's also your job to build that.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_00: Not every kid's gonna have that right away, and that's what I love about college and what I loved about coaching club was you know, in pros, it it becomes harder and harder to develop the person because as time grows, you know, they they slowly become kind of that person.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I don't I don't think anyone's above change, I just think it takes a little bit longer time, and yeah, that's what's great about those times in in high school and in college is you have those moments to to continue to build and see that growth and and really help someone get on board, you know, help someone learn what it means to be successful.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: They they think that it means this, but you can show them that it might mean this.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what I loved about that group that we had was it, you know, I'm not gonna lie, you guys weren't the most talented group.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but you guys believed and you know, you guys were you guys were bought in and um every single game, you know, you guys put your best foot forward and and you really asked questions of the other team.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I think that was the most impressive thing and and the most, I mean, from when we started when you guys are freshmen to seeing you guys, you know, in Hawaii, you know, that last that last go was was a special moment for me just seeing the growth that you guys took.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_00: Because it's one thing to be a coach.
• 34:27
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, really, I'm just I'm there to get like you guys are the ones that really take it and it becomes yours.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think that's the cool thing is those last that last year and a half, it was it was really just me just not screwing it up and letting you guys lead the ship a little bit and trying to give you guys some pointers and helping you out.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_00: But by that time, you guys had taken so much ownership of it that it was I had to coach differently at that point, you know.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: So sure.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_01: Now, and and that's kind of an interesting thing, is how do you what kind of mindset does it take then, knowing that you're not really just coaching soccer, that you're also kind of coaching the direction these kids are playing in or they're going in in life.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_00: You just I think you always have to have the bigger picture in mind.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you have to.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_00: It's not about Saturdays, you know, it's about it's about after college, it's about when you guys get on your own.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_00: What is life gonna look like for you?
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and feeling the weight and responsibility of I understand that I'm not your parent.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_00: I'm by no means that, you know, you guys uh most of the success is gonna be, you know, a lot of it's gonna be drummed on, you know, uh kind of situation you have at home.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_00: But I also know that I can be a big part of things too, and and and help guide you in the right way.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_00: Uh to hopefully, whenever I leave you, you know, I I feel confident that you're gonna be successful.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that's kind of the weight that I put on myself as a coach, is it's not necessarily the wins and losses.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_00: Those are great and those are part of the learning process on the way.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: And you, of course, you want to be successful.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I wouldn't be a coach if I wasn't competitive, but at the same time, like the bigger picture.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's why I coach college, I think, is because for me, the bigger picture is man, if you guys end up like good husbands and good fathers and um good employees, then I can kind of feel like okay, like these I can be super proud of the time you know that we had.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_01: So no, that's that's really not only awesome, but it's cool to hear because from the player's perspective or going, you have no there's no vision of that.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_01: There's what am I gonna do next?
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_01: Where am I gonna play next?
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_01: Or you know, you're thinking about Saturday, you're thinking about the game playing that weekend.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's really admirable to have the and it's important.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's not and I would push back a little bit to say that parents and family life is very important, I agree, but there's a very large role that your friends and the people around you make on who you become as a person.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_01: And a team setting, right, is inherently this really close group of guys or girls or whatever.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and but that setting, that environment is created by the coach, right?
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_01: And so you you and your position kind of dictates the environment that these these guys are put into.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, dude, those scavenger hunts and those uh uh, you know, those those plays and those, you know, music, you know, videos and all that kind of stuff.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_00: That wasn't just to keep you guys busy, man.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_00: That was that was a greater purpose um to see you guys work together and getting you guys, you know, the groups that you put in were thought out, you know, the the exercises were thought out, um, the questions and those scavenger hunts were thought out.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_00: Like it was all to um it's it's again with the bigger picture in mind, knowing that you know, when we went on away trips, you guys were gonna dress the part and you guys were gonna always look people in the eye and shake their hand.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_00: And that was because in you know, when you go on business trips, you you never know who you're gonna meet, you never know who you're gonna be around, and you're representing something bigger than yourself.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_00: And we were on away trips, we were representing our club, yeah, and that means something.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that's that's a big thing.
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_00: And uh, you know, I think now when you look back, you can look at certain clubs and certain soccer clubs and see how they conducted themselves, and you have a certain perception of them for the good and the bad.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_00: So you you can understand that now from a greater aspect.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, those were always things.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't just to get your guys' mind right for the game, it was, you know, just thinking, I mean, that's a part of it, of course, that gets you in the right mindset, but uh more importantly, uh hopefully helps you understand the importance of um, you know, being being a part of something bigger than yourself.
• 39:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, that's a good way of putting it is being a part of something that's bigger than yourself.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think there are too many experiences that people get unless they really seek them out or their parents push them into them, where your actions really show uh about more than yourself.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_01: There aren't too many activities that people do.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's any sort of, I guess, sport or some sort of club aspect you get into in high school.
• 39:32
  SPEAKER_01: But those are really the only experiences where you get to go out and, or maybe when you're traveling and show other people through your actions are a reflection of the people around you as well.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_01: Did you ever have you ever reflected then or had had a moment where you looked back and kind of saw that you had taken on the shoes of maybe your own mentors in soccer?
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_01: Like seeing the ex seeing successes in in players as at that have gone forward that you coached and and look back and been like, oh wow, my coach did that for me.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think so.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I I think I think what I've you know, I think I look at it a little bit differently.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_00: I I think I can look at all my former coaches and I can see certain things that I do that reflect them that I kind of laugh at sometimes.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and the mentors that I've been around.
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I definitely have that experience.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think with my players is I'm proud of them, but I and I know maybe I there's there's moments where maybe I was a little part of it, but I also I'm just more proud of them.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_00: I don't necessarily see myself and then they're their own person.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_00: They're you know, they're doing their thing, they're they're part of a larger group of you know why they're successful.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I don't ever look at it as like I don't ever think that I was, you know, I guess uh you know, a part of I I think I was a part of it, like um, but I don't really know the extent of it, and I don't really think too much about it.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm more just really proud to see the people that they've become.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um and and and that realms from so many different types, you know, guys that are obviously playing professionally now, but guys, like I said, that are just man, I look at them and they're just they're good people, and they're you know, they're doing great at what they're doing in whatever it is that they want to do.
• 41:20
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't mean that they're again, it's it's everyone's different perception of success.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: But um man, there's so many guys I look back on on that club team that I look at that man, they're just they're guys are doing so well.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just so proud of you guys.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_00: And there's so many, like I said, there's just so many factors that lead to that.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um I know that like obviously I know that you know you're part of it, but at the end of the day, there's just so many pieces, but I don't focus on that.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_00: I'm just so proud of you guys.
• 41:51
  SPEAKER_01: No, and it's that's an interesting, I think that's a reflection on more than just that experience, which is in life when you it's it's easy maybe to see the ways you have become someone or that or the the habits you have or the way you act.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's easy to kind of see where those come from, but it is much more difficult to see then uh how those have passed on to other people.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe maybe it's not even important that you do see that.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's just it's then it's a different experience, it's just being proud of whoever those people you've impacted that they are doing well themselves or being good people.
• 42:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like I just I think I just feel grateful that I was able to be a part of their lives um in in a small way, you know.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, no, absolutely.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_01: What would be then I guess one of the it's not necessarily asking what are the ways that that uh that these guys have acted that make you the most proud, but it's what kind of actions do you see in in in past players or current players where it gets you most excited about them?
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: What kind of things do they do or people characteristics do they have?
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to say because they all have their own characteristics.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think I just get proud.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_00: One, that like I have a continued relationship with them.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's really cool.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um two, again, like you guys are all being successful in so many different ways, you know.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_00: And some of it's you've you've you know you've gone to college for the first time, and you know, you've gotten you're the first in your family to get a degree, and and now you have a great job and you're doing really well, and you're getting ready to get married, you know.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_00: For for others, it's um they just finished at an unbelievable school, and now they're just trying to sort out their life, figure out what's going on, but it's talking with their parents because they're still emailing me and telling about what's going on in their life and hearing about you know all the great things that they're doing.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I just think it's it it it's others, it's you know, former like you know buddies of mine in college that just call me up and say, hey, you know, so and so yeah, they are like they were unbelievable.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like they were, I wasn't sure what to expect, but when they got here and they left, they ended up being a captain.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they're one of the best one of the best guys on the team.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like again, like they talk about them as a player, but those are the things that you become proud of is just hearing again, it comes in so many different ways, but um hearing how well all of you are doing, uh just makes me really proud.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_01: So it sounds like it's really and and I I I I I understand that perspective, right?
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's hard to choose one kind of character trait because everyone's like you're all just you're good people, like you're good men, like you guys are ser like whether it's you're serving your community, whether you're just a good husband, whether you're a good employee, like you guys are all just good people, and that makes me really proud.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, and and that I think ties back into something we talked briefly about at the beginning, which is it's really about this importance that you place on the network that you've created, right?
• 45:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's like that's the having connections with former former players or or with a variety of people and in a bunch of different organizations throughout soccer.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_01: It you is you really have an um you place an importance and you really value creating those kind of connections and that kind of community around you, right?
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean I'm a I'm a coach because I love investing in relationships.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: I mean that's that's why I coach.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_00: I don't I don't coach to coach at the highest level.
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_00: I've been fortunate to be able to coach at some good levels, but really it's it's the relationships for me that that mean everything.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's what ties back to networks, that's what ties back to everything else is the ability to invest in people's lives.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um why why is that so why is that so important to you?
• 46:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um I think it's really important to me because I've always come from a background of like service, um, providing just serving others and investing in others.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: I've I do feel like one of the best ways you can lead is to serve.
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I think in my life, I know some of the best and hardest times of my life have been been met with relationships and been met with um being there for others and others being there for me.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, I am who I am because of how people have invested in me as a person.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um so I just I I see the power in that, and it makes me want to do the same thing.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, it's all it all comes back down to my faith too.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think there's something that's that when I look at some of the best leaders and mentors and everything in the world, like I can list off a bunch of people.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of the day, for me, like um, you know, I look at I look at the works of Christ, I look at him as a leader and as a person, not just not just as God as who he is, of course, but like you look how he interacted with people and you look how he led.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_00: And you start to understand him as a leader and as a person and his where he met people where they were at.
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_00: He didn't treat everyone the same, like he had a desire to not be the first to always speak, but like he looked into people and really tried to understand who they were before he responded.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, those are ways that I try and lead.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like uh everyone's different.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you were on that team, that's what it was.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: There wasn't, I mean, we had two different groups of people coming together, and everyone was so different, but you you can't coach people and invest in people's lives if you're constantly just about yourself, like you have to try and understand where the other person is.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_00: And um I've I've just seen the power, and I've seen the power, and people again, like you, you, you're you're here for something greater than yourself.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um every time you enter a conversation, are you trying to get your point across, or are you actually trying to think about where the other person's coming from?
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_00: Are you actually trying to know where the other person's at?
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think those are that's that's that's why I invest in relationships.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's why it's such a big thing for me.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_01: No, you said it pretty concisely, which is the best way to what was it?
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_01: The best way to lead is to serve, right?
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_01: And the way you found that she can serve other people is by investing in them.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_01: And that's powerful because I think one of the strongest probably aspects of the human experience is the bonds that we form, right?
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: No one can really truly live in solitude.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_01: And even more than that, I guess that ties into the way you talk about being proud of seeing former players as good men, is because it's not only about forming connections, but when you invest in them, you create good relationships, right?
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_01: You create good connections.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_01: And that's an exciting thing, right?
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_01: To like scroll through your contact list and be excited about the people that you're that you're interacting with or that you know, or that will contact you and hit you up every once in a while.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_00: I think uh I mean, yeah, I think one of the coolest experiences I had coaching you guys was that last trip to Hawaii, it was awesome.
• 49:34
  SPEAKER_00: Not because uh obviously it was fun, it was Alaska, we did well, you know, and we were winning games, but it was to see you guys hanging out with each other and like you guys all genuinely like loved being around each other.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and everyone was just so different.
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_00: Like it was you can look at all of you now, and it's um, but it was so great to see two teams that hated each other kind of come together and realize like how much they can enjoy each other.
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um and it's cliche.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, everyone always talks about it's not you don't necessarily remember the games, you remember the people, but I look back back on that as a specific example of I can remember some of the games, but really the the memories that I have most of that trip and that group is like seeing you guys laugh together and hang out together and play volleyball together and just the scavenger hunt, like all the random stuff.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um that made me really pumped.
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, especially because I'm sure maybe even just in reflection, you see in that kind of your own experience and that being the start of all of our you know networks growing, right?
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_01: Like I've you know, it was 25 guys on that team, and it was it's kind of hard to get 25 guys that close, and even though that groups kind of form within that, there was a really close bond, but there's a respect between pretty much everyone on that team, and right now so now I have 25 friends that I could easily contact at any point and have a great conversation with.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's a a good way to put it.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's like building those connections is something that serves you for life, right?
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_01: So no, that's that's powerful.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_01: I guess the the last question I kind of have is looking back over this discussion, um, a bit about your soccer your experience through soccer and PhD and coaching and all that, and then talking about the joy that is found through creating a solid network and community and and and relationships.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_01: What is one thing that you think people listening could take away from this conversation?
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_01: One message.
• 51:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, hopefully, you know, uh, sometimes the best way to lead is to serve.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I think we come from a culture, and and I I came from a culture as well, especially within soccer and within coaching of you know, this authoritative style of coaching that leads to success always.
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_00: You can look at certain so many examples that you can point in that direction.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_00: But I also I'm of the mold and I I strongly feel that there's so much strength and vulnerability.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_00: And if you want to be, you know, great and incredibly successful, especially the way I view it, is you have to have this unbelievable balance of like authority and vulnerability.
• 52:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's not just being a dictator and it's not just being completely vulnerable.
• 52:30
  SPEAKER_00: I think if you have a good combination of both and you can strive to that, and um, you know, you you're not just leading, but you can serve as well, then I think that can lead to having a great amount of success.
• 52:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the way I hear that is honesty, right?
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_01: It's a I think that is a way that's the embodiment of honesty is standing up for yourself, but also standing up for yourself is more the dictator side, but also um being honest about things that need to be said and not holding back on those.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_01: That's the kind of the vulnerability side.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome, man.
• 53:08
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, man, of course.
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate it.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I do.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_01: I want to thank Mike for that conversation.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_01: The first thing I'd like to say about it is that there will be several more of these types of episodes where I talk with mentors of mine.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_01: These are important conversations to me.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_01: They're a great time to sit back and reflect on not just where I came from, but also the people that influenced me in those times.
• 53:37
  SPEAKER_01: And if this episode gets just one person to reach out to a mentor of their own and to have a similar conversation, that would be all time.
• 53:45
  SPEAKER_01: There's a reason you look up to that person, a value system they hold, or a way they act that you want to emulate.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_01: So reach out to them again.
• 53:52
  SPEAKER_01: Ask them what they value and why.
• 53:55
  SPEAKER_01: Second, I think that Mike's words give an easy-to-understand example of the success and fulfillment we can find through our connections.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_01: I found this theme repeated by a lot of people that I look up to.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_01: They find some of their worth, or maybe some of their fulfillment, via their friendships and the strength of the relationships in their network.
• 54:15
  SPEAKER_01: For example, Mike isn't just proud of the network he's a part of, but also that he is able to help others by connecting them through it.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_01: Or that former players and players' parents still get in touch with him, or that he can help guys in their youth, like me, start to form those networks.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_01: We're social people.
• 54:32
  SPEAKER_01: We need companions and friends to share this experience with, to laugh with and to build with and to love.
• 54:38
  SPEAKER_01: And that's fantastic.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_01: Making great relationships is fun.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's a rad part of life.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_01: And it makes me wonder what relationships I have in my life right now, and what relationships I'll form in the future that I might look back on and find pride in myself from, and what people I will help and support and interact with, so that they might also be their best.
• 55:00
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe it makes you wonder the same thing.
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for listening.
• 55:07
  SPEAKER_01: If you liked this episode of seeking authenticity, that's freaking awesome.
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_01: All I want to ask of you, the listener, in return for the time and effort I put into making it, is that you take a deep breath.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_01: I mean really breathe.
• 55:21
  SPEAKER_01: Breathe so that it stretches out your shoulders and your back and your chest and pushes out your stomach.
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_01: No more of these shallow, bullshit breaths.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_01: They're barely keeping you alive, my friend.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_01: And after you exhale, go out and soak up today.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_01: Because in the end, your actions and the way they interact with the world and the people around you right now are all you have in this life.
• 55:43
  SPEAKER_01: So be authentic with them.
• 55:45
  SPEAKER_01: Peace.