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Tom Petty: a timeless rock-and-roll legacy (with guest Brad Johs) · Hangin' Out with Bob

• 0:07
  Okay, welcome to “Hangin’ Out with Bob,” a podcast
• 0:10
  hosted by me, Bob Edholm. Thanks for joining
• 0:16
  us, and let's get started. Well, on this podcast
• 0:21
  episode of “Hangin’ Out with Bob,” we're going
• 0:23
  to talk about the music of Tom Petty. And joining
• 0:26
  me to talk about this legendary rocker is a friend
• 0:29
  of mine who, I'm convinced, is one of the most
• 0:31
  knowledgeable persons around when it comes to
• 0:33
  anything that pertains to Tom Petty. He's Brad
• 0:36
  Johs, last name spelled J-O-H-S, Brad Johs.
• 0:40
  I've been waiting a long time to get together
• 0:42
  with Brad to record this podcast episode, but
• 0:44
  he's here with me now. So Brad, thanks for bravin’
• 0:47
  the afternoon rush hour traffic and endurin’
• 0:50
  the sunny, hot and muggy weather just to be here,
• 0:52
  and welcome to “Hangin’ Out with Bob.” Thanks,
• 0:58
  Bob. It's my pleasure to be here. Just a quick
• 1:00
  bio on Brad Johs. He's originally from Fargo,
• 1:03
  North Dakota. He's a graduate of North Dakota
• 1:06
  State University. Go Bison. What's the other
• 1:08
  thing you say? “Cows and Plows.” It was originally
• 1:12
  an agriculture college, so we called it “Cows
• 1:14
  and Plows.” I like that. Brad and I have known
• 1:17
  each other for about a quarter of a century.
• 1:19
  We met while both of us were working at the Prudential
• 1:21
  office in Suburban Plymouth that was located
• 1:23
  at the southeast corner of Interstate 494 and
• 1:26
  Bass Lake Road. While Brad and I worked together,
• 1:29
  I learned from the get-go that he and I were
• 1:31
  into music. And when Brad first started talking
• 1:33
  about Tom Petty, I knew right away that he was
• 1:36
  the man to ask if you had any questions about
• 1:39
  Tom Petty. Sadly, the jobs Brad and I had at
• 1:42
  Prudential were eliminated in June of 2003. In
• 1:46
  fact, that Prudential office in Plymouth, where
• 1:48
  we worked, is even gone now. All that land that
• 1:51
  Prudential owned there was sold, and the building
• 1:53
  was torn down over the winter and spring of 2024.
• 1:56
  Now, all kinds of things are being built on where
• 1:59
  that office used to be. Apartment units, a grocery
• 2:02
  store, a medical facility, restaurants, a convenience
• 2:06
  store, gas station, and so on. There's an entirely
• 2:09
  new look to that site. But fortunately, Brad
• 2:11
  and I have managed to stay in touch in the years
• 2:14
  that followed. And each time we do get together
• 2:16
  for lunch or dinner to catch up on things, we
• 2:18
  usually manage to talk about Tom Petty at some
• 2:20
  point too, right? Brad himself is a musician,
• 2:24
  a guitar player. He's played in several bands
• 2:26
  over the years. He's also a collector of vintage
• 2:29
  guitars, if I remember right. Brad, how many
• 2:31
  guitars do you think you've had over the years,
• 2:33
  and how many do you have right now? Probably
• 2:34
  have about 30 right now, and I've probably owned
• 2:37
  a couple hundred over the years. The most expensive
• 2:40
  was about $70,000, the least expensive, you know,
• 2:43
  a couple hundred bucks or whatever. Okay, that's
• 2:45
  amazing. That's amazing. Brad's wife, Wendee,
• 2:48
  who is also here out of mic range, but is with
• 2:50
  us, is also a huge Tom Petty fan. I met her for
• 2:53
  the first time when I had the pleasure of attending
• 2:55
  Brad and Wendee’s wedding in September of 2025.
• 2:59
  They got married at Canterbury Park in Shakopee,
• 3:01
  Minnesota. They reserved a room, a suite at Canterbury
• 3:05
  that had a special meaning for both Brad and
• 3:07
  Wendee. And I'll let Brad tell the story on that
• 3:09
  a little bit later. Brad and Wendee live in Savage,
• 3:12
  Minnesota, right? Not all that far from Canterbury
• 3:14
  Park, in fact. Brad has a daughter Ashley who's
• 3:17
  a nurse. She's married, has a two-year-old son
• 3:19
  named Oliver. Yep. He’s Ollie. Okay. He’s 16 months.
• 3:23
  16 months. Okay, and I know that when I saw him,
• 3:26
  he never stopped smiling the whole time at your
• 3:28
  wedding last year So it was great. Yep, and having
• 3:30
  a grandson like that makes you feel like the
• 3:32
  luckiest grandpa in the whole world, right? Absolutely.
• 3:34
  Yeah, that's wonderful. Okay on to Tom Petty when
• 3:40
  you Google his name for a brief overview you'll
• 3:43
  find something like this. Quote, “Tom Petty was
• 3:45
  an iconic American rock singer, songwriter, and
• 3:48
  guitarist. Best known as the frontman of Tom
• 3:51
  Petty and the Heartbreakers, he defined roots
• 3:54
  -oriented guitar rock with timeless anthems like
• 3:57
  “Free Fallen’,” “American Girl,” and “I Won't Back
• 4:00
  Down.” Unquote. Pretty succinct, right, Brad?
• 4:04
  Mm -hmm. Define “roots-oriented rock” for me,
• 4:06
  and “heartland rock.” I've heard those terms both
• 4:08
  applied to his type of music. “Heartland?” Well,
• 4:11
  it's more, I mean, a lot of it. A lot of it.
• 4:14
  Originally, Tom Petty kind of stemmed from the
• 4:16
  country stuff. If you listen to the old Mudcrutch
• 4:18
  stuff, it was a lot of country based. And when
• 4:20
  we talk country, we're not talking Hank Williams
• 4:22
  country or old-style country. We're talking more
• 4:25
  like “Southern rock” country, that kind of feel
• 4:27
  to it. So, you know, that's what they're referring
• 4:30
  to more than anything. It's like a blues roots-
• 4:33
  based rock and roll. So it's based on a lot of
• 4:35
  feel, a lot of emotion, a lot of good songwriting.
• 4:38
  And it's more tailored towards the songwriter
• 4:42
  than so much worrying about the pop charts and
• 4:45
  popularity and that kind of stuff. Thanks, Brad.
• 4:48
  But that overview of Tom Petty that I just read
• 4:50
  barely scratches the surface. Brad, I want to
• 4:53
  know how you got to know about Tom Petty. Was
• 4:55
  someone talking about him or did you hear his
• 4:57
  music on the radio or on someone's stereo? Well,
• 5:00
  I heard his music on the radio, of course, back
• 5:03
  in the 80s and seeing him on the MTV Generation
• 5:06
  and so on and so forth where you first saw him.
• 5:11
  And then a buddy of mine actually my friend Dave
• 5:14
  more than anybody when I was working at Schmitt
• 5:16
  Music in Fargo, I, my friend Dave got hired there,
• 5:19
  who was my best man at my wedding or whatever,
• 5:21
  and he really turned me on to Tom Petty, not only
• 5:24
  just the regular stuff but the deep cuts, you
• 5:27
  know, and at the time I bought my first vintage
• 5:29
  Guitar, which was a 1951 Telecaster and, you know,
• 5:34
  that's just like what Mike Campbell played for
• 5:36
  his instrument, and that was kind of my inspiration
• 5:38
  behind it because I saw what he was playing and
• 5:40
  I want, I want to sound like that. And then my
• 5:43
  old mentor goes, well, that's a Black Guard Teles (Fender Telecaster).
• 5:45
  And this is what they sound like. And this is
• 5:47
  what they are. And this is what they cost. And
• 5:49
  I'd never played one in my entire life. But I
• 5:52
  bought one. I cash advanced my credit card at
• 5:54
  31%. I paid $3 ,800 for a 51 telecaster. And
• 5:59
  then my friend Dave got me, you know, made mixed
• 6:02
  tapes of all kinds of stuff of Mike playing Black
• 6:06
  Guard Teles, and that kind of a tone. And that's
• 6:08
  kind of really what launched me into it more
• 6:10
  than anything. I was going to ask you how you
• 6:12
  got into music. Was it Tom Petty or Mike Campbell
• 6:14
  or both? Or that really got you to? You know,
• 6:17
  I got into music. I grew up. I mean, I grew up
• 6:20
  a child of the 80s. So when I really started
• 6:23
  out, the big stuff was, and my brother was playing
• 6:25
  in a hard rock band. So I really got into more
• 6:28
  of the hard rock stuff first. OK. You know, and
• 6:31
  then I later discovered the Tom Petty stuff and
• 6:33
  I learned to appreciate that more for what it
• 6:35
  was for the songwriting and for the tone and
• 6:37
  for the, you know, all that stuff. Okay. And
• 6:40
  then how soon before you bought your first Tom
• 6:43
  Petty album? This was before streaming, right?
• 6:45
  So if you want to hear it, it means you had to
• 6:46
  buy it, right? It's CD or... Finally, when did
• 6:49
  you buy it? You remember the first album you
• 6:50
  bought? Back then it was cassette. Okay, cassette,
• 6:54
  right? Yeah. And the first one I bought was,
• 6:56
  I think it was “Damn the Torpedoes.” That was the
• 6:58
  first one I bought. Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah. All
• 7:01
  right. So you, and once you started listening,
• 7:02
  you were hooked, right? I mean, this guy is great.
• 7:04
  Okay. Absolutely. Yeah. Okay, Brad, from the
• 7:09
  books and the articles and stories you've read
• 7:12
  about Tom Petty, and the conversations you've
• 7:14
  had with other Tom Petty fans over the years,
• 7:17
  tell us a little bit about the man himself, where
• 7:19
  he was from, where he grew up, how he got into
• 7:22
  music himself, what were some of his influences?
• 7:25
  Well, his influences, Elvis (Presley) was probably credited
• 7:28
  as his biggest influence because he got to meet
• 7:30
  Elvis when he was eight years old, and that whole
• 7:32
  persona and that whole magnetic personality of
• 7:36
  Elvis, he got hooked on that because his uncle
• 7:38
  was... you know, working for, um, the movie studios.
• 7:41
  Yeah. Movie set that Elvis came to town in his
• 7:43
  hometown and film there. And, um, that was kind
• 7:47
  of the big opener for him. And then he, like
• 7:49
  he said, he bought some magazines about Elvis,
• 7:52
  and he started listening to Elvis records and
• 7:53
  he started getting into all that stuff. They
• 7:56
  started listening to all the Fifties, you know,
• 7:58
  music and all, all that kind of stuff. Yeah.
• 8:01
  And then, you know, he was from Gainesville.
• 8:03
  Bo Diddley was, um, a resident there or was from
• 8:06
  there. So. He's buried just 30 miles outside
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  of Gainesville or whatever. So that had a huge
• 8:15
  influence on him. And that was a big music town
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  also. Gainesville was a great music town. And
• 8:20
  it's kind of funny because people don't think
• 8:22
  about it, but Fargo back in the day was a great
• 8:24
  music town also. You know, I mean, we had guys
• 8:27
  like Jonny Lang that came from Fargo. You know,
• 8:29
  Shannon Curfman came from Fargo. There's all kinds
• 8:31
  of great bands. The Newz, you know, people like
• 8:34
  that. Those guys all came from Fargo. And so
• 8:37
  that was, you know, when it's 30 below most of
• 8:40
  the year there, you really just focus on playing
• 8:42
  music, you know? Stay warm inside and listen
• 8:44
  to music. Exactly. But in Gainesville, you know,
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  he had all those influences. those blues artists
• 8:49
  and so on and so forth. But then he also grew
• 8:50
  up in a music town where Don Felder was teaching
• 8:53
  guitar lessons at the local music store. From
• 8:55
  the Eagles? From the Eagles. Yeah. Okay. Then
• 8:57
  Bernie Leadon was from there. Okay. And, you
• 8:59
  know, that was the original guitar player from
• 9:01
  the Eagles also. Yeah. And then it was a college
• 9:05
  town. It was a music town. There was Don Felder
• 9:07
  from the Eagles. There was Bernie Leadon, the
• 9:09
  original guitar player from the Eagles was from
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  there. Tom's original band with Mudcrutch was
• 9:14
  Tom Leadon, which was Bernie's brother. And then
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  the cool thing about Gainesville is every year
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  now, you know, since he passed, they have a birthday
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  party every year and, you know, used to be end
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  of October. Now it's about middle of November
• 9:27
  or whatever, because of the hurricanes and stuff.
• 9:29
  Right. But every year they have a music festival
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  there. And there's a lot of local artists, you
• 9:34
  know, some of the guys you play with Mudcrutch
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  perform there. They get a lot of local people.
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  They get some national acts and so on and so
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  forth. Like last year, Stan Lynch's band, The
• 9:43
  Speaker Wars, the original drummer from Tom Petty
• 9:45
  and the Heartbreakers. Yeah. What was it called?
• 9:46
  The Speaker Wars. Speaker Wars. OK. He's got
• 9:49
  a new band or whatever. And so they were there
• 9:51
  last year. Wallflowers were there last year.
• 9:54
  Performed down there. And you've been to those
• 9:56
  haven't you? We've been to that three times now.
• 9:57
  Three times. Wow. OK. That's where I proposed
• 10:00
  to Wendee. Was that the... Was it down there?
• 10:02
  Oh, cool. Oh, that's great. That's great. That's
• 10:04
  great. Wasn't he also influenced by, because
• 10:07
  of the time, like watching Ed Sullivan, seeing
• 10:09
  the Beatles and the Rolling Stones and all that
• 10:11
  too? Absolutely. The Beatles, everybody was influenced
• 10:15
  by the Beatles when they performed on Ed Sullivan,
• 10:17
  you know, in 64. everybody was influenced by
• 10:20
  that. But yeah, Tom Petty was hugely influenced.
• 10:22
  That was my music epiphany. I saw Ed Sullivan and
• 10:24
  saw the Beatles that Sunday. I was 10. Yeah,
• 10:26
  when that came out, I thought, Whoa, that changed
• 10:28
  everything for me. I just I hadn't been into
• 10:30
  I had not been into Elvis. But when I saw the
• 10:33
  Beatles, yeah, just so yeah, interesting. Interesting.
• 10:38
  Let's take the deep dive into Tom Petty's music
• 10:40
  career. Okay. He must have been about what 19
• 10:43
  or 20 when he formed that band Mudcrutch. Yeah,
• 10:46
  Mudcrutch, I believe he formed that when early
• 10:48
  70s is when he actually. Well, he was born in
• 10:50
  1950. Yeah, because he was in the Sundowners
• 10:57
  before that. And then that changed to Epics. And
• 11:00
  then he changed it to Mudcrutch or whatever.
• 11:02
  Yeah, what's the story behind the name? What
• 11:04
  does it mean anything? It doesn't mean anything.
• 11:06
  They just thought they, you know, they thought
• 11:08
  they would change the names to something cool.
• 11:10
  And they went with Mudcrutch and psychedelic
• 11:13
  influence or something? No, they had no idea.
• 11:15
  I don't know how they came up with that. Or they
• 11:17
  just, I know the first time I remember you told
• 11:20
  me about this band a few years ago, and I thought
• 11:21
  it was Mudcrunch, like Cap’n Crunch, the cereal.
• 11:25
  And then as I was reading go with Mudcrutch.
• 11:27
  So yeah, and that was the original band, you
• 11:29
  know, that was. Who were some of the guys that
• 11:31
  made up that band? That was Benmont Tench, same
• 11:34
  keyboard player from Montage. Okay, Montage.
• 11:36
  Okay, who played with Tom, Mike Campbell, you
• 11:39
  know, Rand Marsh was, Randall Marsh was the drummer.
• 11:43
  Okay. And then Tom Leadon was the other guitar
• 11:45
  player, and then Tom played bass. Bass, okay.
• 11:48
  Tom played bass. He's mostly played guitar once
• 11:51
  he got with the Heartbreakers, right? Like 12
• 11:53
  strings. Yeah, he played rhythm guitar mostly
• 11:55
  with the Heartbreakers. But he started out as
• 11:57
  a bass player. Okay, okay. Now, what happened
• 12:00
  with the Mudcrutch, though, because I was doing
• 12:03
  some research, and we'll get to this a little
• 12:04
  later. There were a couple of albums that they
• 12:06
  released, but they were like years later. What
• 12:10
  motivated, because you said they're from Gainesville,
• 12:12
  what motivated him to move to LA? A chance to get
• 12:15
  a record deal. Okay, that was the whole basis
• 12:17
  for them was to move—to get a record deal. And
• 12:20
  so when they, they're right now selling merchandise
• 12:23
  for what they call the “Road Trip 74,” which is
• 12:25
  when they moved out to LA or whatever, took off
• 12:27
  in Benmont Tench’s mom’s station wagon and
• 12:29
  they had a, you know, a cube van or whatever,
• 12:31
  and stuff. But that was their whole thing is
• 12:34
  they were going to LA to get a record deal. So
• 12:36
  is Mudcrutch still together? No. Okay, they
• 12:38
  disbanded, okay. What happened with Mudcrutch is
• 12:40
  Tom went out there and then, basically, the record
• 12:43
  Label, Shelter Records, said that “we only want
• 12:46
  Tom.” And so the rest of the band was like, okay,
• 12:50
  okay, you know, what do we do now or whatever?
• 12:52
  You know, and so that's what happened to Mudcrutch.
• 12:54
  So the whole story is that they only wanted Tom.
• 12:57
  Tom was trying to record a demo He really wanted
• 13:00
  to be part of a band. They wanted him a solo
• 13:02
  artist, and then Benmont was recording a demo,
• 13:06
  and he had a bunch of guys together. Stan Lynch
• 13:08
  was playing drums with them. Okay. You know, Mike
• 13:10
  and all the other guys, and so that's how the
• 13:13
  Heartbreakers, Tom went, “I want that band.” Okay. Those
• 13:16
  are the guys. That's how they became. Okay, and
• 13:19
  they all knew each other They are all from Gainesville.
• 13:22
  So they all kind of got to LA and they kind of
• 13:23
  all, you know. Yeah. Stuck together or whatever
• 13:26
  because they knew, you know, it's. How did they,
• 13:28
  I get I get the feeling that once Tom Petty moved
• 13:32
  to LA, he pretty much stayed there, right?
• 13:34
  Yes. Did the rest of them acclimate as well as
• 13:36
  he did or did they? Okay, LA was the place
• 13:38
  to be. LA was the place for them to be. Nice
• 13:41
  weather. Nice weather and an active scene. And
• 13:45
  yeah, I mean, he loves California and he loves
• 13:47
  LA or wherever. He came from Gainesville.
• 13:50
  He didn't have the best time in Gainesville.
• 13:52
  You can comment on that throughout his life or
• 13:54
  whatever. He didn't have the fondest memories
• 13:57
  of Gainesville for a lot of reasons. Sure, sure.
• 13:59
  So when he got to LA, yeah. absolutely loves
• 14:01
  LA. That was his new home. You've already mentioned
• 14:07
  most of the Heartbreakers then. Who else would
• 14:10
  comprise that group then—the original Heartbreakers?
• 14:12
  You’ve got Campbell and Benmont Tench and Tom
• 14:15
  Petty and Stan Lynch was the drummer. Was he
• 14:18
  from Gainesville too? Stan was from Gainesville
• 14:19
  originally. And who are we missing? There were
• 14:22
  five guys, right? Petty, Campbell. Tench, Blair.
• 14:26
  Well, then there was Ron Blair. Okay. He was the
• 14:28
  bass that was the bass player, and he was he was
• 14:30
  from Gainesville originally. Oh wow, okay, okay, all
• 14:32
  right, all right, okay. So let's see, they produced,
• 14:36
  according to my research, and you can confirm if I’m
• 14:38
  Wrong, they actually produced, like, 13 albums as
• 14:41
  Heartbreakers Yes. Does that sound about right? Yep.
• 14:44
  Okay. We're not going to go through all
• 14:45
  of them because there's too many. But of all
• 14:48
  those, did you at one time own most of those?
• 14:51
  Or did you? Oh, I have them all. I have them
• 14:53
  all. Okay. And then some. Yes. Is it fair to
• 14:56
  ask what's your favorite? Is that just too hard?
• 14:58
  Well. Or is that like saying who's your favorite kid? You
• 14:59
  know, I mean, just, well, you know, that I figured
• 15:02
  you've, I knew this question would come up and
• 15:05
  I've been pounding this question for a while
• 15:07
  at the last month and It's really hard to come
• 15:10
  up with an answer for that because they're all
• 15:12
  so good in their own little way. Right. I guess,
• 15:16
  you know, of the old stuff, you know, “Long After
• 15:19
  Dark,” I think, is probably one of our favorites
• 15:21
  just because, you know, that's, you know, got
• 15:23
  “Straight into Darkness” on it. But just what's
• 15:26
  so great about is, you know, right off the bat,
• 15:29
  it comes into one, you know, one story town or
• 15:32
  whatever. That's the first, you know, song off,
• 15:34
  off the album or whatever. And it's just a rocker,
• 15:36
  and it's just great. And the words are just, got
• 15:39
  great imagery, and it's got, you know, great dynamics
• 15:43
  to it. What was probably the biggest or was
• 15:46
  there a release single from that album “Long After
• 15:48
  Dark?” It came out in 82. “Straight into Darkness”
• 15:50
  was on that, and um. Because “Tom Petty and the
• 15:54
  Heartbreakers,” the self-titled, that was the first
• 15:56
  one that came out in ’76. and then “You're Gonna
• 15:59
  Get It,” I'm showing in ’78, then “Damn the Torpedoes.”
• 16:01
  “Change of Heart.” I even have. “Change of Heart” was on there
• 16:04
  on the one you're talking about. Okay. “Hard Promises”
• 16:08
  came out just before that. Yeah, and then the
• 16:10
  other thing was that, like, “Keep a Little Soul”
• 16:12
  was something that he just that got released
• 16:14
  posthumously after he passed away or whatever.
• 16:17
  That was originally slated for that album, but
• 16:19
  it didn't make the cut. Okay, and that was a
• 16:21
  great song. Okay, okay The thing about Tom is
• 16:24
  he wrote so many songs, and he wrote so many good
• 16:27
  songs. And, you know, he had to police his own
• 16:30
  stuff because he only had so much space to put
• 16:32
  on an album and so on and so forth. I was going
• 16:34
  to do double albums all the time. Yeah. And that
• 16:36
  was the thing back then. They said, no, double
• 16:38
  albums won't sell. We're not going to do a double
• 16:40
  album, which was part of his argument with “Wildflowers.”
• 16:43
  He wanted “Wildflowers” to be a double album. They
• 16:46
  recorded 25 songs for Wildflowers and they had
• 16:48
  to cut it down to 11. So when they finally released
• 16:51
  the “Wildflowers” and all the rest that came out
• 16:53
  a couple of years ago They put everything that
• 16:56
  he had originally recorded for “Wildflowers” into
• 16:58
  a double album. And of course, it's sold like,
• 17:01
  you know, hotcakes Back then they said well, nobody
• 17:04
  wants to spend that much for an album and, you
• 17:06
  Know, he kind of got, you know, shut down on that
• 17:09
  or whatever. All righty. Well, so then you said
• 17:12
  each one is unique. You love each one of them.
• 17:14
  Do you find now that, do you listen more to the
• 17:17
  older material or newer or just kind of whatever
• 17:19
  your mood is? Kind of whatever the mood is, for
• 17:21
  the most part. You know, we, you know, we, we
• 17:24
  sit down when Wendee and I sit down, we'll listen
• 17:26
  to vinyl like on Friday or Saturday nights and
• 17:28
  one of, you know, music night or whatever. And
• 17:30
  we always, we put other stuff on, but we always
• 17:32
  end up listening to Tom Petty at the very end
• 17:34
  of it. There's always a couple Tom Petty albums
• 17:35
  that we play throughout, you know, in addition
• 17:37
  to all the other stuff that we play, but it just
• 17:40
  kind of depends on the mood or whatever, you
• 17:41
  know. Yeah, I mean the old stuff is great, you
• 17:45
  know, the classics are great But you know, once
• 17:47
  in a while, you're kind of in the mood for just
• 17:48
  something blue So you put on the “Mojo” album or
• 17:51
  Whatever, or you know, you're in for you know
• 17:53
  you have the urge for something else, you know,
• 17:55
  you just, there's so much, like I said, there was
• 17:57
  so much good stuff, and he, and that was part of,
• 18:00
  the thing is, he wrote so much good stuff it was
• 18:02
  hard for him to release everything a lot of stuff.
• 18:05
  They wrote, you know once in a while he would
• 18:07
  sell it, you know, give it to somebody else or
• 18:08
  do whatever, you know, a good, good example that
• 18:12
  is “Lost in Your Eyes” that he wrote in 1974 with
• 18:14
  the original Mudcrutch. Okay, now he never released
• 18:17
  that himself. But Jeff Healey had a hit on it
• 18:20
  1986. Don Johnson had a hit on it 1986. They
• 18:24
  both released the same song in the same year,
• 18:26
  whatever. And it was, it was showed how advanced
• 18:30
  and how good his songwriting was at the time
• 18:32
  for such a young, young guy. He was that far ahead
• 18:36
  of the craft or whatever, but he didn't think
• 18:38
  it was good enough, or it wasn’t right for the band
• 18:40
  or for whatever, so he never released it himself.
• 18:44
  You know, unfortunately, with a lot of artists,
• 18:46
  everything they record, they release, which isn't
• 18:49
  necessarily the way to do it because not everything
• 18:51
  is good. You know, and it's just, you know, that's
• 18:54
  the frustrating thing where he was the opposite.
• 18:56
  He recorded all kinds of great stuff. He had
• 18:58
  too much good stuff. Exactly. And he's going
• 19:00
  to have stuff for years to come. They're going
• 19:02
  to find stuff and redo stuff and remaster stuff
• 19:05
  and, you know. I'm going to go in chronological
• 19:10
  recording order, Brad. So now, let's talk about,
• 19:13
  we've talked about his Heartbreakers albums.
• 19:16
  There were 13 combined. I'm going to talk about
• 19:18
  The Traveling Wilburys of which Tom Petty was
• 19:21
  one of the five members. And there's a reason
• 19:23
  why the band has been called a super group. Why
• 19:26
  don't you tell us who the five members were besides
• 19:28
  Tom? Well, besides Tom, they had George Harrison.
• 19:33
  Bob Dylan, Jeff Lynne, and Roy Orbison. It almost
• 19:36
  sounds made up. It's like, how can you get five
• 19:39
  superstars together? But they did, right? George
• 19:41
  Harrison put it together. George Harrison's one
• 19:44
  that you know the story behind it, right? Yeah,
• 19:45
  tell that, tell that how that how it even came
• 19:47
  to be. George. Well, okay. So Jeff Lynne was working
• 19:52
  on George's album or whatever. “Cloud Nine,” right?
• 19:54
  “Cloud Nine,” yep, which had the big hit “Got My
• 19:56
  Mind Set on You,” or whatever, for George Harrison
• 19:58
  at the time. It was kind of a, yeah, I hadn't
• 20:00
  heard from George Harrison for a while, and it
• 20:02
  brought him back or whatever. And of course,
• 20:05
  Tom was there and George is, like, we should form
• 20:07
  a band. Let's do this. And, you know, Jeff Lynne's
• 20:10
  like, yeah, let's do this. And George Harrison
• 20:12
  is like, well, I want Bob Dylan, you know, and
• 20:15
  Jeff, you know, Tom said, they're going, you're
• 20:17
  not going to get Bob Dylan. He goes, watch me.
• 20:18
  And he gives a call and, you know, there's Bob
• 20:21
  Dylan. He gets Bob Dylan. He goes, let's get
• 20:23
  Roy Orbison. Okay. You know, they call Roy Orbison.
• 20:25
  It's like, okay, let's do this. You know, and
• 20:29
  It's kind of interesting how all these things
• 20:31
  tie together and how all these people are associated,
• 20:33
  you know on, on the second Wilburys’ album There's
• 20:35
  a song called “My Girl,” and there's a guitar lead
• 20:39
  played by Gary Moore on that. Who's, who's Gary
• 20:41
  Moore again? Gary Moore of Thin Lizzy. Oh. You know,
• 20:44
  plus, plus, he was a virtuoso player in his
• 20:47
  own right, you know, great player, phenomenal guitar
• 20:49
  player, you know, his own right, and had a lot
• 20:53
  of other groups and so on so forth. But the funny
• 20:56
  thing is, is that you know, Gary Moore and George
• 20:58
  Harrison were hanging out at the time in England
• 21:00
  or wherever, their wives were friends and so
• 21:02
  on and so forth. So when they wanted somebody,
• 21:05
  you know, we want a rippin’ solo on that. George
• 21:07
  Harrison asked Gary Moore to do it. And so, you
• 21:10
  know, it was just like I said, it's all that
• 21:12
  little inter-, all these guys are interconnected
• 21:15
  somehow. Did they all know each other before
• 21:17
  they got together as the Wilburys? They knew
• 21:19
  each other, yeah. He worked with Jeff Lynne a
• 21:22
  lot, Petty, didn't he? But did he know George
• 21:24
  Harrison before then? He'd met George Harrison.
• 21:26
  He knew Bob Dylan. Yeah, he knew Bob because
• 21:30
  he toured with Bob. That's right. He was here
• 21:33
  in the 80s. That's right. That's right. And then
• 21:35
  George Harrison he knew, but he'd met previously
• 21:37
  and so forth. I mean, these were his idols and
• 21:40
  stuff. Tell me if this is more of an urban legend,
• 21:43
  but I thought that... While Harrison was making
• 21:45
  that album, he said over in Europe, he was supposed
• 21:48
  to put out a single or release a single for a
• 21:51
  song. And he wanted to have like a B-side single.
• 21:54
  So he got these guys together and they came up
• 21:56
  with “Handle with Care,” like, in a day. And it's
• 21:59
  like, this is way too good to put on a B-side,
• 22:02
  a single. Let's form a band. Who came up with
• 22:06
  the name Traveling Wilburys? Whose idea was that?
• 22:08
  I think they were just writing stuff down and
• 22:11
  that's how they, I believe they came up with
• 22:13
  it. Yeah. I know they came up with two albums,
• 22:16
  Traveling Wilburys Volume 1 and the second was
• 22:18
  Traveling Wilburys Volume… 3. You know that song,
• 22:25
  I'm gonna talk just for a second about “Handle
• 22:27
  with Care.” Mm-hmm That's, uh, that's the song
• 22:29
  I've always loved and I always loved watching
• 22:30
  it. It came out in October of 1988, which is about
• 22:34
  a month after my daughter was born in September
• 22:36
  of 1988. She'll be 38 next September—the time
• 22:41
  flies by. But it's a great video because you get
• 22:44
  these five guys, plus this anonymous drummer.
• 22:46
  I don't, you never. Jim Keltner. Well, he did it on
• 22:49
  the record, but is he in the video? Yes. Okay,
• 22:51
  I thought they got it. Well, the Ringo was in
• 22:54
  the “Handle.” No, wait. You're thinking of? Yeah,
• 22:57
  no, no, no. I was thinking the other one. “I Won’t
• 22:59
  Back Down.” Yeah, “I Won’t Back Down.” I think it
• 23:02
  was Jim Keltner that. Well, he did the…
• 23:04
  What I read, Brad, is he did the recording. Okay.
• 23:07
  But when they did the video, obviously it wasn't
• 23:09
  live, they were lip syncing. Right. They just
• 23:11
  got some guy who was a drummer, they never gave
• 23:13
  him credit. That's what he's trying to find out
• 23:15
  who's the guy. And maybe you can dig and find
• 23:17
  out who it is. But what's great about the video
• 23:19
  is they're in this large industrial warehouse
• 23:23
  type thing that's a drummer kind of off to the
• 23:25
  side and then these guys are kind of like shoulder
• 23:27
  to shoulder, almost like in a huddle. They got
• 23:29
  this big boom mic hanging down from the ceiling
• 23:31
  and they all take turns singing. They're using
• 23:34
  the same mic. Right. But it's great, because when,
• 23:36
  when Dylan and Petty are singing and they come
• 23:37
  up to the mic, and when Roy Orbison, he comes up
• 23:40
  to the mic, and George comes up to the mic, and
• 23:42
  it just was a great video. It's just fun to watch.
• 23:45
  I thought that was Jim Keltner, though, in that
• 23:46
  Video, too, because I know he was in the “End of
• 23:48
  the Line” video. Yep. Well, what it says here, and
• 23:51
  again, I'm getting this off an AI overview or
• 23:55
  something, but it says, “Video Appearance: None
• 23:59
  of the credited drummers, including Keltner
• 24:02
  and overdub percussionists appear in the music
• 24:05
  video.” Oh, weird. So interesting. They just got
• 24:07
  some guy that plays drums and he's kind of, go
• 24:10
  along with it. But anyway, I love the video.
• 24:12
  Yes. Yeah, I think when we get done watching after
• 24:14
  the recording, I'm gonna watch it again for the
• 24:15
  millionth time. Yes. It's, you know, there's so
• 24:19
  much stuff and it's so, it's like overstimulating.
• 24:23
  There's so much, you know, it's like, it's just
• 24:26
  amazing. That's just amazing that they got those
• 24:28
  five together. That's just that, that to me is
• 24:30
  like the epitome of a supergroup. Well, that's
• 24:33
  the thing is when you listen like Tom Petty's
• 24:35
  music, there's so many layers to it. Also, you
• 24:37
  know, you have to listen to it a couple of times
• 24:39
  to catch ever, all the layers and all the cool
• 24:41
  stuff that's going on. And even though they separate
• 24:44
  it really well in the recordings, the recording
• 24:46
  stuff that they do, you know, with Jimmy Iovine,
• 24:49
  and all that stuff was legendary. I mean, was
• 24:51
  just that was the gold standard for that kind
• 24:54
  of stuff or whatever, and so you really have to
• 24:56
  listen a few times but you get those layers and
• 24:58
  you get all that cool stuff that's going on in
• 25:00
  between there and you hear all these little subtleties
• 25:02
  that are, you know, in the background and all that
• 25:04
  kind of stuff and it's just it's amazing it's,
• 25:07
  like I say, it's almost over stimulating because
• 25:09
  you just can't all take it in at one shot at
• 25:13
  the first time you know I thought of something
• 25:15
  too in that video was ever a guy That looked
• 25:18
  cooler than Tom Petty wearing a top hat? Right.
• 25:21
  Who else would wear that? I can't picture Dylan
• 25:23
  or George Harrison wearing it, but on him it
• 25:25
  just looked perfect. Well, that's the thing,
• 25:27
  you know, he was 38 when he got into the Wilburys.
• 25:30
  38? Good Lord, you know, I don't even want to
• 25:33
  say what I was doing when I was 38, you know,
• 25:36
  it's like, jeez, you know. I was at the Columbia
• 25:39
  Heights VFW or something, you know, it's like,
• 25:43
  jeez. That was amazing. Okay, let's talk about
• 25:48
  his solo albums that Tom Petty released. There
• 25:50
  was “Full Moon Fever” in 1989, “Wildflowers” in 1994,
• 25:55
  and then “Highway Companion” in 2006/ There was
• 25:57
  some space between the three. Why did he do solo
• 26:00
  albums? Would he just want to try something a
• 26:02
  little different? He wanted to try something
• 26:03
  different. You know, he wanted to do his own
• 26:05
  thing. You know, he kind of didn't want to involve
• 26:07
  the band in it, but then he ended up involving.
• 26:10
  Didn't a couple of them play anyway? They all
• 26:12
  played on everything. But he also got George
• 26:13
  Harrison to play. Yeah, absolutely. He got George
• 26:16
  Harrison. You know, I mean, he got Lindsey Buckingham
• 26:19
  singing on one of the songs he had Brian Wilson
• 26:21
  singing on, you know. on one of his songs or
• 26:25
  whatever, you know, “Hung up and Overdue” or whatever
• 26:27
  that was on that, you know. Was Stevie Nicks with
• 26:30
  his albums or did he sing on her albums? I always
• 26:32
  kind of got those two mixed up. More he sang
• 26:35
  on her albums and wrote stuff for her you know
• 26:37
  because she was, yeah, at the time, you know,
• 26:40
  Jimmy Iovine was doing both of their albums or
• 26:42
  whatever. And I think he was dating Stevie at
• 26:44
  the time or whatever. So he was able to get Tom
• 26:46
  to do some stuff for her that way. And okay,
• 26:48
  so on and so forth. Okay. Okay. But yeah, I mean,
• 26:50
  they kind of that musical whatever, you know,
• 26:52
  camaraderie throughout the year. And they did
• 26:55
  some incredible stuff. Now, do you have all three
• 26:58
  of the solo albums, too? Oh, yeah, okay. Absolutely.
• 27:00
  Okay. Do you have a favorite among those three?
• 27:02
  Is that easier to pick? No, well, I mean, You
• 27:05
  know, “Wildflowers,” everybody, you know, I do
• 27:08
  love the “Wildflowers” album, the concept and the
• 27:11
  sound and the quality and everything like that
• 27:13
  is great. Obviously, I've, you know, as a working
• 27:17
  musician, I've played a lot of stuff off “Full
• 27:19
  Moon Fever” because they had a lot of hits on
• 27:21
  it. And that's when you're playing at a club,
• 27:24
  that's what people want to hear. They want to
• 27:25
  hear all that stuff, you know. So from that standpoint,
• 27:29
  it's great. You know and, and, yeah, I mean, “Highway
• 27:32
  Companion” was a great album You know, there's
• 27:34
  some great stuff on there. “Square One” is one of
• 27:36
  my favorite songs of all time on that, and, you
• 27:38
  know, there's, I thought it was interesting, um,
• 27:42
  the music video, um, I watched a lot of music
• 27:45
  videos. I realized now as I'm talking about it,
• 27:46
  but when “I Won’t Back Down” came out the video,
• 27:50
  I remember, I think he had George Harrison and
• 27:52
  Campbell playing with him on that, but he had
• 27:54
  Ringo starting the drums. But I read that it
• 27:57
  really wasn't him on the album with some guy
• 27:58
  named Cliff Jones, a session drummer. So Ringo
• 28:01
  was basically “lip-syncing” the drums on the video
• 28:04
  Then? Well, you just, well, he did play on some
• 28:06
  other stuff, though, you know. He did. Okay, yeah,
• 28:09
  absolutely. Yeah, you know because I love the
• 28:10
  video. Yeah, I thought, is he really playing or
• 28:12
  oh, yeah. No, no. Yeah, ‘cause it, there's a cut off
• 28:16
  of off the “Wildflowers” and all the rest or whatever
• 28:19
  where Ringo is. He has Ringo count him in or whatever.
• 28:22
  Okay, and yeah, so he had Ringo counting him
• 28:24
  in on “Wildflowers,” so if you hear it, you know,
• 28:26
  he starts out, he kind of screws up a little bit.
• 28:28
  He goes You know, he laughs about it.” He goes,
• 28:31
  “Ringo, count me in,” so Ringo counts him in one
• 28:33
  two three, you know He starts, you know, he starts
• 28:36
  clicking them off or whatever Ringo starts providing
• 28:38
  the, the beat for that or whatever, you know,
• 28:40
  which you know, that's pretty amazing It's like
• 28:42
  hey, I'm working an album. Hey Ringo You want
• 28:44
  to come over and you know do this with me and
• 28:46
  it's like, oh sure, you know, it's like, okay
• 28:49
  So I put gas in a car, but yeah, I'll be over
• 28:51
  late. And “Hung Up and Overdue” or wherever, which
• 28:53
  is another one of his solo or one of the songs
• 28:56
  off “Wildflowers” that didn't make the original cut.
• 28:58
  Like I said, that's got Lindsey Buckingham on
• 29:00
  it. That's got Brian Wilson on it. That's got
• 29:02
  Ringo playing drums on it. And it's got this
• 29:04
  big free-flowing drum part and it sounds just
• 29:08
  huge. And it's just, it was so cool. You know,
• 29:10
  it was so cool, but it was one of those songs
• 29:12
  that was maybe too slow. And there was so many
• 29:14
  songs. Like I said, they wrote 25 songs for the
• 29:16
  album, they had to cut it down to 11. So that
• 29:18
  was one of those that didn't quite make it or
• 29:19
  whatever, but great song, you know, great song.
• 29:25
  Okay. We talked earlier about Mudcrutch, which
• 29:27
  was his first group. Um, but their two albums
• 29:29
  came out in one 2008 and, uh, 2016 or something
• 29:33
  like that. Talk about those a little bit. Cause
• 29:35
  I really don't know much about those. Well, the
• 29:37
  first stuff actually came out in the 70s
• 29:39
  or whatever. ‘Cause they originally, like “Depot
• 29:41
  Street” was originally a Mudcrutch song, you know,
• 29:43
  that that was originally a song okay from Mud
• 29:45
  crutch or whatever, so there was some stuff that
• 29:47
  was recorded in the early 70s you know didn't
• 29:50
  get wide press or a lot of release or whatever
• 29:52
  from that standpoint but the stuff that came
• 29:54
  out in 2008, um, it was just self-titled right?
• 29:56
  It's called “Mudcrutch,” yeah, okay, yeah, and the
• 29:59
  Mudcrutch or one in Mudcrutch two or whatever
• 30:00
  what I said they just called the second album
• 30:03
  the number two number two yep just on there. Yep,
• 30:06
  absolutely. So are those older songs that they
• 30:08
  finally released? Or did they create some new
• 30:10
  ones for the for the albums? Yes, and yes. Okay.
• 30:13
  You know, there's some stuff about their stuff
• 30:14
  that they originally wrote, they kind of revised
• 30:16
  or whatever, and then released it, there was
• 30:18
  some new stuff that they, you know, re recorded
• 30:20
  for that, and so on and so forth. Like I said,
• 30:23
  he got together with the original members. Because
• 30:24
  like I said, the whole time Tom has worked with
• 30:27
  Benmont, he's worked with Mike Campbell. And
• 30:30
  that's part of the magic of his sound, is to
• 30:32
  have those two guys. Because what they do is
• 30:34
  so tasty and so musically talented, it's on a
• 30:39
  whole new, it's on a totally different level.
• 30:42
  Tom came with a great idea. you know, Mike put
• 30:47
  some music to it or whatever, or Tom already
• 30:48
  had the music to it. Benmont just figured it
• 30:51
  out, you know, added his touches to it or whatever.
• 30:54
  And the most important thing is that they didn't
• 30:56
  overplay on the stuff. They made it about the
• 30:59
  music. They didn't make it about themselves overplaying.
• 31:01
  They made everything tasty and fit into the song.
• 31:05
  And, you know, that's the hardest part to do.
• 31:07
  You know, when you have a guitar player, most
• 31:08
  of the time a guitar player wants to play 10
• 31:10
  million notes a second to try to impress somebody.
• 31:13
  But when you look at something like “Straight
• 31:14
  Into Darkness,” where it's the lead part goes...
• 31:18
  You know, that's the whole lead part. That's
• 31:23
  just tasty beyond belief. That's some of the
• 31:25
  coolest stuff that you can possibly do. As far
• 31:27
  as the Mudcrutch stuff, what they did in 2008,
• 31:30
  2016 or wherever they released those or whatever,
• 31:34
  you know, that was Tom was playing bass on that.
• 31:37
  Of course, Mike Campbell, he had Benmont, you
• 31:39
  know, Tom Leadon was the other guitar player.
• 31:42
  He played a little bit of lead stuff on that.
• 31:43
  They had Rand Marsh, who taught percussion and
• 31:46
  drums at the University of Florida, whatever.
• 31:48
  That's, that's what he did after, you know, after
• 31:50
  his music, you know, road career or whatever
• 31:52
  was over and so on and so forth. And I had the
• 31:55
  Fortune, I actually saw Mudcrutch, the, I saw Mud
• 31:58
  crutch at the Fillmore in San Francisco in 2007.
• 32:02
  I was actually out there at the time. I was living
• 32:04
  out there at the time and I bought tickets and
• 32:06
  got in there and got right to the front of the
• 32:08
  stage. It was right there, you know, for the
• 32:09
  whole thing or whatever. So cool. But yeah, but
• 32:12
  there's some great writing on that, and they've
• 32:14
  all contributed. They all contributed songs on
• 32:16
  that. Each guy contributed their own songs to
• 32:18
  that and wrote something on there. Here's a song
• 32:19
  by Benmont. Here's a song by Mike. Here's a song
• 32:21
  by Rand Marsh. Here's a song by, you know, so
• 32:23
  on and so forth, you know. Did you get a lot
• 32:26
  of commercial play though? I guess that's probably
• 32:28
  why I don't know that much about it. I don't remember
• 32:30
  hearing songs played on like on The Current or
• 32:34
  something like that I just I don't know if they've
• 32:35
  got a whole lot of commercial play. I hadn't really,
• 32:38
  you know, I kind of gave up on radio with you know,
• 32:40
  I it's been a long time since I actually sat
• 32:41
  down and actually listened to radio because of
• 32:43
  the fact that a lot of stuff is the same and
• 32:46
  a lot of, you know, it's hard to do that. Um,
• 32:48
  I know there was some videos like, you know,
• 32:50
  off the second album, “I Forgive It All.” There
• 32:52
  was a video released for that, which had Anthony
• 32:54
  Hopkins in it, which was a great song. Um, just
• 32:57
  doing the video or whatever. Um, you know, there's
• 32:59
  a lot of stuff that was, you know, “Scare Easy.”
• 33:01
  I think he did a video for that and so on and
• 33:03
  so forth. So there was a bunch of stuff that
• 33:05
  he released on video and so on and so forth.
• 33:08
  Um, but I don't know what it got for radio play.
• 33:11
  Like I said, that's the frustrating thing about
• 33:13
  radio. They play what they play and it's hard
• 33:16
  to get something different on there. Now, in
• 33:22
  addition to the 13 original albums, the two albums
• 33:26
  he recorded with the Traveling Wilburys, Volume
• 33:28
  1 and Volume 3, his three solo albums, and then
• 33:32
  the two albums we were talking about from Mudcrutch,
• 33:34
  there are seven additional albums that are out
• 33:37
  there that came out between the years of 2018
• 33:39
  and 2024. And are those more like kind of like
• 33:43
  greatest hits-type things? Yeah, they're compilations.
• 33:45
  Okay, it wasn't a lot of original stuff. Well,
• 33:49
  especially when it was released. Well, it's, it's
• 33:51
  compilations. And it's stuff that was not previously
• 33:53
  released. Okay, okay. So there's stuff that didn't
• 33:56
  make this album or didn't make that album. But
• 33:58
  they released it like the playback box set that
• 34:00
  came out. like 96 or 95 or something like that.
• 34:04
  You know there was stuff on there that hadn't
• 34:06
  originally been released and so he put it out
• 34:09
  at that time or whatever. Do you own any of those?
• 34:11
  Oh yeah. Okay the list I'm seeing says an “American
• 34:14
  Treasure” in 2018, “The Best of Everything,” “Wildflowers
• 34:18
  & All the Rest,” “Finding Wildflowers: Alternate
• 34:21
  Versions,” excuse me. “Angel Dream (Songs and Music
• 34:24
  from the Motion Picture. ‘She's the One’.” Yep.
• 34:27
  “Live at the Fillmore 97,” “Long After Dark (Deluxe
• 34:30
  Edition).” So those were the ones they listed is
• 34:32
  the seven albums. Yeah, absolutely. Okay.
• 34:35
  Okay. And that was, um, you know, like I said,
• 34:37
  when the, the “Wildflowers,” was they put out the
• 34:40
  deluxe box set that had everything that was,
• 34:41
  you know, the 25 they had originally planned
• 34:43
  record the “American Treasure” box set, you know,
• 34:46
  that was, you know, put out, um, his fan club had
• 34:50
  release parties all over the country September
• 34:52
  27th of 2018 when they put that out or whatever.
• 34:55
  Okay. And that's got 60 tracks, you know, some are
• 34:58
  different versions, some are the original versions,
• 35:00
  and all that kind of stuff and okay there's multiples
• 35:02
  like that yeah but that was the thing like I
• 35:04
  said he had so much stuff you know so much stuff
• 35:08
  and that's what I'm learning how prolific he
• 35:09
  really was oh he was phenomenal yeah he read
• 35:12
  a lot so he wrote a lot so he had all these great
• 35:15
  lines and he had you know he was, he was very
• 35:18
  intelligent, you know, he's a wordsmith when
• 35:19
  it came to all that kind of stuff or whatever,
• 35:21
  you know, everything's always from South about
• 35:24
  not very smart, but you know, he comes up with
• 35:26
  great lines like, um, you know, from “Into the Great Wide Open,”
• 35:29
  you know, “He met a girl out there with a tattoo
• 35:31
  too.” Now who can do that? You know, how do you
• 35:34
  come up with that? You know, or “Honey Bee,” you
• 35:36
  know, I love, you know, um, you know, “she kissed
• 35:40
  my third cousin twice,” you know, “her juju beads
• 35:42
  are so nice. She kissed my third cousin twice.”
• 35:45
  you know, Who can do that? And that's some of
• 35:48
  the beautiful poetry that he wrote. That's amazing.
• 35:56
  I'm going to refer to what you said a moment
• 35:57
  ago. Listening to albums is one thing, and that's
• 36:00
  great because you can listen when you want to
• 36:01
  want to. Talk about times you've seen them live
• 36:03
  Then, the venues. Well, first time I actually got
• 36:07
  to see them, it was, was ‘95 of the Dogs with Wings
• 36:11
  tour and saw them in because I was living in
• 36:14
  Fargo at the time. So drove down to Minneapolis,
• 36:17
  saw them there, drove down to Ames, Iowa, with
• 36:19
  my buddies. Dave saw them there. I've seen them,
• 36:23
  you know, all over the country. I saw them at
• 36:25
  the one of the cooler shows was at the Berkeley
• 36:27
  Theater in or at the Greek Theater in Berkeley,
• 36:29
  California, because I was living out there at
• 36:31
  the time. So I was able to see that show. What
• 36:34
  year was that? 2006. That was the 30th anniversary
• 36:38
  tour. Oh, okay. You know, and obviously I've
• 36:40
  seen them, I saw them a lot of times in between
• 36:42
  there with, you know, different, you know, when
• 36:44
  they came to St. Paul or when they were, you
• 36:47
  know, within driving distance of the area. Did
• 36:49
  you see them at the Metrodome with Dylan? I never
• 36:51
  saw them at the Metrodome. I heard that was a
• 36:52
  terrible concert anyway, for acoustic reasons, at least. Right.
• 36:55
  That wasn't a good place to have concerts. So
• 36:56
  yeah. Yeah. And that was the thing I said, you
• 36:58
  grew up in Fargo, you didn't get a whole lot
• 37:00
  of opportunity to see a lot of great shows or
• 37:03
  whatever, you know, so I wait till I was a little
• 37:05
  older until I could travel and I could do stuff
• 37:07
  and, you know, have the means and all that kind
• 37:09
  of stuff. But yeah, I saw a lot of I, I don't
• 37:13
  know, I probably 10-12 times the concerts, you
• 37:16
  know, that's, that's great. Do you know what
• 37:20
  your favorite one that when they're all they're
• 37:23
  also trying to say what's the best album? Yeah,
• 37:26
  special. So yeah, I mean, they're, you know,
• 37:29
  That's one of those things where if you knew
• 37:30
  how things were going to end up, I definitely
• 37:32
  would have gone to a lot more of them. Oh, that's
• 37:37
  cool that you've seen that many times. I didn't
• 37:38
  realize you'd seen them that often. That's great.
• 37:41
  So yeah, I've been lucky to, you know, like I
• 37:43
  said, I saw a lot of, a lot of Tom Petty, I saw
• 37:45
  Tom Petty, I saw Mudcrutch, you know, Mike
• 37:47
  Campbell has a new band called Dirty Knobs. I've
• 37:49
  seen those a bunch of times, you know, I mean,
• 37:53
  so I've been fortunate enough to see all that
• 37:54
  kind of stuff and be, you know, for sure, for
• 37:56
  sure. Tom Petty sold over 80 million records
• 38:01
  worldwide, according to my information. I'm just
• 38:04
  going to list some of these hits and you'd know
• 38:05
  these like the back your hand, but the heartbreakers
• 38:08
  hit some thinking like “American Girl,” “Don't Do
• 38:11
  Me Like That,” “Refugee,” “The Waiting,” “Don't Come
• 38:15
  Around Here No More,” “Learning To Fly,” and then
• 38:18
  with the solo albums, “I Won't Back Down,” I think
• 38:21
  of that one right away, “Free Fallin’,” huge song,
• 38:24
  “You Don't Know How It Feels.” I remember when
• 38:26
  that song came out, there were some stations
• 38:29
  that wouldn't play the words correctly, because
• 38:31
  It was something like, “roll another joint.” And they
• 38:33
  made the “joint” sound like “noidge.” It was like,
• 38:36
  yeah, it was like a nonsense. Oh, gosh. And then
• 38:41
  along with those millions and millions of records
• 38:43
  that he did sell over the decades, he also received
• 38:46
  numerous awards, honors, and recognition. I was
• 38:49
  surprised to learn he even has a star on the
• 38:51
  Hollywood Walk of Fame. Have you seen that?
• 38:53
  Oh, we've been there many times, taking a couple
• 38:55
  pictures at that. And then he's in the Rock and
• 38:58
  Roll Hall of Fame. The Heartbreakers. And he's in
• 39:01
  the Songwriters Hall of Fame. Given all you said,
• 39:03
  I can see why he would be named to that as well.
• 39:07
  And then he won a really nice award. What was
• 39:09
  it? 2017. It was called the MusiCares Person
• 39:12
  of the Year, a combination of music and philanthropy.
• 39:16
  Yeah, absolutely. Each year they give it to a
• 39:18
  different artist. I'm sure that must have been
• 39:19
  a big thrill for him as well. Well, he was good
• 39:22
  friends with Norm Harris, who owns Norm's guitars,
• 39:25
  Norman's Rare Guitars in California, which was
• 39:27
  the vintage dealer for all the stars or whatever.
• 39:29
  Oh, he's been doing it for 40 plus years or 45
• 39:32
  years or how many years it was wherever. And
• 39:34
  Norm was works a lot with the Midnight Mission.
• 39:38
  in Los Angeles or whatever, which is, you know,
• 39:40
  the homeless shelters and stuff like that. And
• 39:43
  so I remember for fundraisers, I know, Tom's
• 39:46
  always given his time to that. Like they did
• 39:48
  three concerts, you know, or they did three nights
• 39:50
  in a row and all the money went to the, you know,
• 39:54
  the Midnight Mission or whatever, you know, for
• 39:56
  Norm or whatever. So he did a lot of stuff like
• 39:59
  that. He was always involved with Pride stuff,
• 40:02
  you know, because, you know, he was, you know,
• 40:05
  Tom, you know, I mean he doesn't care about that
• 40:07
  kind of stuff, you know, there's always you know
• 40:09
  I mean, that's one of the things where you look
• 40:11
  at the political state You know the state of
• 40:13
  the political system that we're in now I could
• 40:16
  only imagine what Tom would be doing if he was
• 40:18
  still with us, you know I mean, I'm sure he'd
• 40:20
  be writing songs and sure protesting and doing
• 40:23
  whatever that he needed to do But he did a lot
• 40:25
  of great humanitarian stuff and he was very generous
• 40:28
  with his time did a lot of stuff like that and
• 40:32
  So yeah, like I said, Norm Harris did a lot of,
• 40:35
  it's like Tom and Norm were great friends or
• 40:37
  whatever. One of his best friends. I wasn't aware
• 40:40
  of Norm Harris. Norm Harris. Norm Harris. Norman's
• 40:43
  Rare Guitars. If you look him up online,
• 40:45
  you'll see all the big stars that are there and
• 40:48
  all the people that go in there and stuff. It's
• 40:51
  a cool place. There's pictures of Tom all over
• 40:52
  the wall in there. You know, all kinds of stuff
• 40:56
  and all kinds of cool stuff. Yeah, you know,
• 40:58
  in addition to the Hollywood Walk of Fame and, you
• 41:00
  know, the Rock and Roll Museum, there was also
• 41:03
  actually a display for him at the Country Music
• 41:05
  Museum. And I hope that's actually still up.
• 41:08
  Yeah, because he was a huge, there was a couple
• 41:11
  of years ago they came out with a Tom Patey country
• 41:13
  album. They call it Petty Country. And so a lot
• 41:16
  of country artists remade Tom Petty songs, or
• 41:19
  they covered the Tom Petty songs or whatever.
• 41:22
  Oh, I didn't know that. Absolutely. I mean, Dolly
• 41:23
  Parton did, you know, Southern Accents and, you
• 41:26
  know, Dierks Bentley and all these guys or whatever.
• 41:29
  Chris Stapleton, of course, who's a huge fan
• 41:31
  of Tom Petty, remade that. But also, like I said,
• 41:34
  there was there was actually a display up at
• 41:36
  the Country Music Museum or whatever in Nashville
• 41:39
  also that also had Tom Petty in there. Let's
• 41:46
  take a little break from the music and talk about
• 41:48
  Tom Petty's appearances in film and on TV. For
• 41:51
  example, Brad, did you see his first appearance
• 41:53
  in a movie called “FM”? A very forgettable movie,
• 41:58
  but it had a great soundtrack. Well, the Steely
• 42:00
  Dan “FM” song is one of my favorite songs of all
• 42:03
  time, but he got his song, I think “Breakdown”
• 42:05
  was featured in that. He had just a real small
• 42:07
  part, that was his first cameo, I guess. But
• 42:10
  I wanted to get into the appearance, especially
• 42:12
  on TV. “It’s Garry Shandling’s Show,” he was in that, “The
• 42:16
  Simpsons.” Yep. “King of the Hill.” Yep, “The Larry
• 42:18
  Sanders Show.” Yeah, and then the Super Bowl 42.
• 42:21
  I mean we'll talk about that in a moment because
• 42:23
  that's still one of my favorite halftime shows
• 42:26
  one of all the Super Bowl halftime shows and
• 42:28
  Garry Shandling was his neighbor. So that that's
• 42:31
  how they were real close together or whatever.
• 42:32
  So Garry was actually his neighbor at the time
• 42:35
  And then the other thing you forget to mention
• 42:37
  though is “The Postman,” which was with Kevin Costner,
• 42:40
  which came out that was that post-Apocalyptic
• 42:43
  show or whatever, you know, yep. He was the postman.
• 42:46
  Oh, yeah. He did some great stuff. Yeah, I want
• 42:49
  to bring a point because I watched it today.
• 42:51
  I just needed to see it on YouTube, but It was
• 42:54
  that series finale to “The Larry Sanders Show.”
• 42:57
  Mm -hmm. I'll set it up for our listeners So
• 43:01
  there's a scene, it's like a backstage scene, on
• 43:04
  “The Larry Sanders Show,” and he, and he learns that
• 43:08
  both he and country singer Clint Black had been
• 43:11
  Picked to sing the final on-air goodbye song
• 43:14
  for Larry, kind of like when Bette Midler did
• 43:16
  it for Johnny Carson. But then the producer,
• 43:19
  what was his name again? Artie? Rip Torn played
• 43:22
  Artie. He was kind of the Ed McMahon type. He
• 43:24
  had to tell him that actually, you know, it was
• 43:27
  going to go to Clint Black. And he says, “I thought
• 43:30
  I was your Bette Midler.” And then, um, and then
• 43:35
  Clint Black, he says something about Petty's trying
• 43:37
  to patronize him or something and then Petty
• 43:39
  Goes, “Quiet down, cowpoke.” And then Greg Kinnear
• 43:43
  steps in he goes, “Hey, let's remember, this is
• 43:46
  Larry Sanders’ last show. Let's be respectful. Petty
• 43:50
  just looks at him goes, “Was I talking to you?”
• 43:53
  And then, and then, Clint Black goes, hey, Kinnear
• 43:55
  just got nominated for an Academy Award, and he (Petty) said,
• 43:58
  “For what, ‘Talk Soup’?” And then they start
• 44:02
  scuffling, you know, and then Rip Torn, or
• 44:05
  not Rip Torn, Artie, he breaks it up, he goes,
• 44:07
  “That's the most violent thing I've seen since
• 44:10
  Altamont.” Like when the Rolling Stones had the
• 44:14
  Hell’s Angels as security. And then Petty goes to
• 44:18
  Artie. goes, “Then you don't need me, you already
• 44:20
  got Roy Rogers here.” That was Clint Black, Roy
• 44:24
  Rogers. And then you see “To be continued” across the screen,
• 44:28
  but I thought that was just a classic gem. That
• 44:30
  was almost 30 years ago now. It was in 1998.
• 44:35
  But that was similar. He was good, though. He
• 44:37
  was good in front of the camera. He wasn't stiff,
• 44:40
  very believable, and just a talented guy, I guess.
• 44:44
  Well, that's the sad thing. I always say there's
• 44:46
  human years, there's dog years, and then there's
• 44:49
  entertainment years. And when you look at how
• 44:51
  long ago this album came out, out this movie
• 44:53
  came out, I know if you use that as your point
• 44:55
  of reference you know it's like, “Oh my god, I can't
• 45:00
  believe that came out this long ago I can't remember
• 45:01
  this was this long ago,” you know, it's just, and
• 45:04
  you look back at where you were in life at that
• 45:06
  time and it's like, yeah, my daughter was just
• 45:10
  a little girl then. It goes back a long way.
• 45:14
  That's the thing. You buy these albums, you throw
• 45:17
  them on, and then they take you back to that
• 45:19
  point in life also. That's part of the joy of
• 45:21
  music and so on and so forth, and vinyl, and
• 45:24
  listening to that old crackly album. I like the
• 45:28
  hisses and the pops. Yeah, absolutely. They should
• 45:32
  put out CDs to just stick that stuff on there
• 45:34
  so you can hear pops and hisses. or repeats,
• 45:38
  it gets stuck on some dust or something, just
• 45:40
  keep seeing the same lines. Or you're on your
• 45:41
  second album because you wore the first one out
• 45:43
  or whatever, you played it so many times. I remember
• 45:48
  I kept some albums in my car one day on a summer
• 45:50
  day and it actually warped my albums. I remember
• 45:53
  putting the album on the turntable and they played
• 45:54
  it but you could see the needle jump up and down.
• 45:58
  Hilarious stuff. Okay, I'll put it off long enough,
• 46:04
  Brad, but we need to talk about something I wish
• 46:06
  hadn't happened. Tom Petty passed away on October
• 46:09
  2nd, 2017 at age 66, just 18 days short of his
• 46:14
  67th birthday. It was due to an accidental overdose
• 46:18
  of prescription medications following years of
• 46:20
  battling various health issues. But it should
• 46:23
  be noted that Tom Petty continued to tour and
• 46:26
  record until his tragic passing. Wasn't he literally
• 46:29
  touring on that 40th anniversary tour like a
• 46:32
  week or so before he passed away? Yeah, his last
• 46:35
  show was September 25th of 2017. Wendee was actually
• 46:39
  at that show. Where was it, Wendee? Hollywood
• 46:44
  Bowl. Oh, okay. Okay. Wendee’s off mic, she said
• 46:46
  It was Hollywood Bowl. Okay. Yeah, so you did three
• 46:48
  shows there Hollywood Bowl or whatever. And that
• 46:50
  was wrapping up the 40th anniversary tour. Well,
• 46:53
  the thing is, I from what I understand, and what
• 46:55
  I what my understanding is, is that he had a
• 46:58
  fractured hip when he started the tour. And then
• 47:00
  by the time the tour was over, he had a broken
• 47:02
  hip. And so he was on a lot of meds, and you
• 47:05
  could see when he was trying to get up the stairs,
• 47:09
  it's like you could tell there was something
• 47:10
  wrong. You see these videos, it's like, oh my
• 47:12
  God, I can't believe he's doing this or whatever.
• 47:17
  One of the most tragic things in music was the
• 47:21
  loss of Tom Petty, just because of not only what
• 47:24
  he... did what he could still do. I mean, I can
• 47:27
  only imagine, you know, in that time, the music
• 47:30
  he would have put out and the artist, you know,
• 47:32
  even if he wasn't touring or doing whatever himself,
• 47:34
  the stuff he would have done to help other artists,
• 47:37
  the stuff he would have wrote, you know, written
• 47:39
  with other artists. And like I said, there's
• 47:42
  so much material that never got released, you
• 47:45
  know, I mean, it's just amazing or whatever.
• 47:49
  So yeah, unfortunately. Yep. For the record,
• 47:52
  Tom Petty passed away at 8:48 p.m. Pacific time
• 47:55
  on Monday, October 2nd, 2017, which would have
• 47:57
  been 10:48 p.m. here in the Central time zone
• 48:00
  and even later on the East Coast. So it was probably
• 48:03
  the next day, Tuesday, October 3rd, when most
• 48:05
  of us got the news. I know it was for me. I found
• 48:08
  out Tuesday on the radio or whatever. But do
• 48:11
  you remember, as big a fan as you were and still
• 48:14
  are of him, where you were when you first learned
• 48:17
  that you had passed away? I was in Baltimore,
• 48:20
  Maryland. Baltimore. I was out there for my job.
• 48:23
  I had just gotten hired for a new position or
• 48:25
  whatever, and I was out there for three weeks
• 48:27
  of training. And the thing is, when Tom passed,
• 48:32
  it was, first they said he passed, then they
• 48:35
  said he was alive, then they said he passed,
• 48:36
  then they said he was alive. It wasn't confirmed
• 48:39
  right away or it was kind of going back and forth
• 48:41
  or whatever. But, um, yeah, I ended up, uh, I
• 48:45
  went to the, uh, I was out there. I went to the
• 48:47
  Hard Rock or whatever. And, uh, you know, there
• 48:50
  was a display for Tom Petty sitting there and,
• 48:52
  you know, I sat there and, you know, cried. Yeah.
• 48:55
  I had a few drinks and cried and, you know, and,
• 48:59
  you know, and we're on the, on my employer's
• 49:01
  dime and, you know, but it was, it was true.
• 49:05
  You know, all my friends were, all my band guys
• 49:07
  were texting me and, I'm so sorry. And, you know,
• 49:10
  sure. You know, I mean, it was by far the worst
• 49:12
  day ever. That was a tough one. I remember on
• 49:15
  that Tuesday afternoon, it was October 3rd, I
• 49:17
  went to Keegan's Irish pub. Yeah. I think you
• 49:19
  went there once with me. That was, that was my
• 49:20
  local. And I remember that afternoon, there are
• 49:22
  all these fellows sitting at the bar and we're
• 49:24
  all talking about that. And, and the bartender,
• 49:26
  his name also happened to be Tom, but he was
• 49:28
  just playing Petty the whole time, you know,
• 49:30
  just sitting there drowning our beers in Guinness
• 49:32
  and listening and talking about Petty. So it was
• 49:35
  funny because yesterday we were at, we went to
• 49:37
  Cub and I was, I had my Tom Petty shirt on or
• 49:39
  whatever. and I was loading stuff in the car,
• 49:41
  and the guy gives me a thumbs up. He goes, Tom
• 49:44
  Petty, man, gone way before his time. What a
• 49:49
  horrible loss. And I said, absolutely. I go,
• 49:51
  man, that's the worst ever. So this long nine
• 49:55
  years past or whatever now, it still registers
• 49:59
  with people and still people. I mean, it's. All
• 50:02
  right. You know, I can remember you used to post
• 50:04
  stuff like on the anniversary of his death, like
• 50:06
  four or five years later, you were still saying,
• 50:08
  I believe he's gone. I still do, you know, it's
• 50:11
  just, yeah, yeah, you know. It's tough. It is
• 50:14
  tough. You know, like I said, it was one of the
• 50:16
  greatest, in my opinion, it's one of the greatest
• 50:18
  losses in rock and roll, you know, because like
• 50:21
  I said, what he contributed, what he did, and
• 50:23
  so on and so forth. And what he still had left.
• 50:25
  I mean, if he could have gotten his hip fixed,
• 50:27
  who knows? Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. I want
• 50:32
  to do a quick sidebar, Brad. I want to talk about
• 50:35
  Tom Petty's lead guitarist with the Heartbreakers,
• 50:37
  Mike Campbell, which you've mentioned before
• 50:38
  already. But I knew you saw him recently in downtown
• 50:41
  Minneapolis with his band Mike & The Dirty
• 50:43
  Knobs at the Pantages Theater. First of all,
• 50:46
  how was the concert? And second, where do you
• 50:48
  think Mike Campbell should be ranked among the
• 50:50
  greatest guitar players of all time? Well, Mike
• 50:53
  Campbell's concert was great, by the way. and
• 50:56
  Sarah Guthrie, the granddaughter of Woody Guthrie
• 51:00
  and daughter of Arlo Guthrie, I think that's
• 51:02
  the order of them, was opener the show or whatever.
• 51:05
  And she was very good too. She was entertaining
• 51:07
  to watch and she was, you know, a true folk songwriter
• 51:09
  and continuing on with the tradition. So that
• 51:11
  was great to see. As far as concert, concert
• 51:14
  was phenomenal. How long did he play? A couple
• 51:17
  hours? An hour and a half, I suppose. Yeah, something
• 51:20
  like that. About an hour and a half. That's pretty
• 51:23
  standard. The year before, we saw them with a
• 51:26
  band called Blackberry Smoke. We saw them at
• 51:28
  the Ryman in Nashville or whatever, where they
• 51:31
  opened for Blackberry Smoke, played about an
• 51:32
  hour and a half. And Blackberry Smoke came out
• 51:34
  and played about an hour and a half. And then
• 51:36
  they came out and played about six Tom Petty
• 51:38
  songs together or whatever at the end of the
• 51:40
  show. But the concert's phenomenal. I mean, it
• 51:44
  sounds great. I mean, he's got top-notch musicians
• 51:47
  with him. I mean, he's got Lance Morrison, who's
• 51:49
  the touring bass player with like Don Henley
• 51:51
  and was on all kinds of different albums with
• 51:53
  the last Morisson album, you know, top notch
• 51:56
  guys, he has Steve Ferrone now playing drums
• 51:58
  with him. Steve Ferrone took over for Stan Lynch,
• 52:01
  right? We didn't know. Wait, yes. Heartbreakers.
• 52:04
  Yes. And Heartbreakers, Steve Ferrone took over
• 52:05
  for Stan Lynch. And then they had Matt Laug
• 52:08
  or whatever that was the drummer with the Dirty
• 52:10
  Knobs. He's out touring with AC/DC is who he's
• 52:14
  playing with. And then they brought in Ferrone.
• 52:17
  Now, originally when the Dirty Knobs formed,
• 52:19
  it was actually, originally, Ron Blair, you know,
• 52:22
  Steve Ferrone, you know, and Jason Snyder, and
• 52:24
  they're like, he's like, well, you can't, you
• 52:26
  know, too many members from the Heartbreakers
• 52:29
  or whatever. So that's when, you know, Ferrone
• 52:31
  stepped out and he got different musicians or
• 52:33
  whatever. But that's originally the Dirty Knobs
• 52:36
  was just a side project that Mike was doing when
• 52:38
  Tom wasn't touring. And they come and they play a
• 52:41
  few shows in LA like they played a couple
• 52:43
  of concerts that they're after the NAMM show,
• 52:45
  which is a big music trade show. And so they
• 52:47
  would play some of these private parties afterwards.
• 52:49
  And that's, that's where I first saw them like
• 52:51
  as early as 2007 is when I would see them at these
• 52:54
  little venues or whatever they are and stuff.
• 52:57
  But to answer your question, where's Mike Campbell
• 52:59
  says guitar? Where would you say he should be
• 53:02
  ranked? He should be ranked, you know, as far
• 53:05
  as, he's by far one of the top guitar players
• 53:08
  and it's not from, like I said, a lot of guitar
• 53:12
  players will play 10 million notes in a second,
• 53:14
  you know, and they'll do whatever and they'll,
• 53:16
  you know, and that's, you know, like my old mentor
• 53:19
  used to tell me, he goes, you know, people just
• 53:21
  think fast is good. Well, no, fast isn't good,
• 53:24
  fast is fast. You know, what makes Mike such
• 53:28
  a great guitar player is he always plays what
• 53:31
  fits. And it can be the simplest lick, it can
• 53:35
  be a complicated lick, it can be whatever. But
• 53:38
  whatever he's playing fits musically. It's not
• 53:41
  coming from his head, it's coming from his heart.
• 53:43
  And he's not trying to show anything off or he's
• 53:46
  not trying to do whatever. And so that's the
• 53:48
  thing about Mike. He's got the feel and the taste
• 53:51
  and the tone. And that's something you can't
• 53:54
  teach. Taste you can't teach. When you show up
• 53:57
  in a guitar, you know, when we saw him at the
• 54:00
  Hollywood Bowl a couple years ago when the Dirty
• 54:02
  Knobs were down there in Nashville or whatever,
• 54:04
  you know, he goes, I bet there's a lot of guitar
• 54:06
  players in this room and everybody's like, yeah,
• 54:08
  you know, but he didn't. Change what he was doing.
• 54:11
  He still kept it tasty and he killed still kept
• 54:14
  it clean and still, you know, it was all about
• 54:16
  the song and it was all about the feel and it
• 54:18
  was all about playing the right note And if it's
• 54:21
  one note he played the one, you know, if it was
• 54:23
  only one note that needed it That's what he played.
• 54:25
  Yeah, and that's such a great thing. That's such
• 54:28
  a hard thing to, to for a lot of people to understand
• 54:32
  or for a lot of guitar players to understand
• 54:34
  so on and so forth because like I said, they think
• 54:36
  fast is good. Well, you know, we look at all these
• 54:39
  virtuosos, Joe Satriani and Steve Vai and, yeah,
• 54:42
  those guys are great at what they do and so on
• 54:44
  and so forth. But there's no way they would survive
• 54:46
  playing a Tom Petty band because even though
• 54:49
  the licks they're playing would be simple enough
• 54:52
  to play, they wouldn't play it with the same
• 54:54
  feel. They wouldn't have the same emotion behind
• 54:56
  it. They wouldn't have the same release and so
• 54:58
  on and so forth. So it wouldn't sound the same
• 55:00
  from that standpoint. But Mike Campbell's way
• 55:02
  up there towards one of the best guitar players
• 55:04
  in the world, like I said, because of what he
• 55:06
  does tastefully and so on and so forth. He toured
• 55:09
  with Fleetwood Mac. Oh, wow. A couple years ago.
• 55:14
  He's worked with Don Henley too, hasn't he?
• 55:15
  Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. “Boys of Summer,” he
• 55:19
  wrote that song originally and then he offered
• 55:21
  it to Tom. Tom passed on it and Don came up with
• 55:24
  a bunch of lyrics and said, here's what we got.
• 55:26
  It was a phenomenal hit for them. And that's
• 55:29
  another example of how tasty Mike's playing is,
• 55:33
  you listen to the, you know, how he plays a solo,
• 55:35
  you know, you know, just real smooth, real cool,
• 55:41
  just fills it perfectly for what he's doing.
• 55:45
  And like I said, that's hard, that's hard to
• 55:47
  do and that's hard for, I mean, more guitar
• 55:51
  players tend to appreciate that. It's kind of
• 55:52
  like when you listen to David Gilmour, you know,
• 55:54
  he's not playing anything super-fast or super-
• 55:56
  Flashy. What he's playing is tasty, you know,
• 55:59
  it fits the song and it's really cool and it's
• 56:01
  tasty That's same thing with Mike what he's playing
• 56:03
  is really tasty. It really fits. So yeah, he's
• 56:07
  way up there You know, like I said when I saw
• 56:08
  him with Fleetwood Mac Yeah, he was playing the
• 56:11
  Fleetwood Mac parts, playing the lines, and so
• 56:13
  on and so forth. It had better guitar tone than
• 56:15
  what he did with Fleetwood Mac or whatever. And
• 56:17
  it had more feel than what was played through
• 56:20
  Lindsey or whatever. And I know Lindsey fans
• 56:22
  are going to kill me or whatever. But the way
• 56:25
  Mike played, it was so smooth and such a good
• 56:28
  feel. And it was interesting to see him playing
• 56:30
  a whole other band's entire song list and so
• 56:34
  on and so forth from that standpoint. You know,
• 56:37
  Mike always likes to do a surf song, you know,
• 56:39
  every time he does a show, he always does like
• 56:41
  a surf song either with Tom Petty or with the
• 56:43
  Dirty Knobs. He always loves playing some sort
• 56:44
  of a surf song. And he loves that kind of stuff.
• 56:47
  And that's what he grew up on also. Learning
• 56:50
  the old Ventures, you know, stuff like that,
• 56:53
  you know. Oh, great. Yeah, it's great. Well now,
• 56:58
  at long last, Brad, tell us how the music of Tom
• 57:01
  Petty brought you and your wife Wendee together
• 57:04
  And why you selected that party room at Canterbury
• 57:06
  Park as your venue to get married Well, like
• 57:09
  I said the, the, night, you know, Tom Petty Tom
• 57:12
  Petty's official fan club is called Tom Petty Nation,
• 57:14
  and they're on Facebook and they got 60-70 thousand
• 57:18
  members right currently or whatever. They're
• 57:19
  part of the fan club. On September 27th, 2018,
• 57:23
  they hosted parties all across the country that
• 57:26
  particular night. There were some in LA, Denver,
• 57:29
  of course, Minneapolis, you know, all across the
• 57:31
  country for a listening party for, you know,
• 57:35
  that album. It was kind of a celebration or whatever
• 57:37
  when that came out. Well, they had the party
• 57:40
  here at Canterbury Downs in Shakopee, Minnesota.
• 57:45
  I decided to go to that and she decided to go
• 57:47
  to that and we didn't know each other. And even
• 57:49
  though we'd been at many of the same concerts
• 57:51
  throughout the years, we never actually met at
• 57:53
  that point. And so that's where we actually met,
• 57:56
  you know, was at this concert and or at this
• 57:59
  at this venue or at this event or whatever. And
• 58:02
  So, so, well, we'll go here, you know, at that.
• 58:05
  And I took a chance, you know, with the help
• 58:07
  of a little Jack Daniels, I thought I would,
• 58:09
  you know, take a shot and, you know. go up and
• 58:13
  introduce myself. And then, like I said, we've
• 58:17
  been together ever since. And when we got married
• 58:20
  on September 27th, 2025, exactly seven years
• 58:27
  later, the room that we got married in was the
• 58:31
  exact same room where I met her in. And that's
• 58:33
  where they had that party. It was supposed to
• 58:36
  be, it was intended to be a rock and roll wedding,
• 58:38
  you know, for more of that, but it ended up being
• 58:40
  more of a Tom Petty-themed wedding than, you
• 58:43
  know, anything else, you know. But, you know,
• 58:47
  because we started doing this and it's like,
• 58:49
  okay, well, let's do this and let's have the
• 58:51
  cake say some sayings from Tom Petty. You know,
• 58:53
  I have some of the song quotes and so on and
• 58:55
  so forth. And so, you know, I had my Tom Petty
• 58:58
  t-shirt on and my jeans and my black coat. You
• 59:01
  know, that's, you know, everybody showed up in
• 59:03
  their favorite rock t-shirt and their pair of
• 59:05
  jeans. Oh, right, right. No, that was a fun wedding.
• 59:07
  I loved it when I opened the QR code on the wedding
• 59:10
  invites you guys have sent to me and it said
• 59:12
  on there, I'm going to read it because I thought
• 59:13
  it was really clever: “There is no need to be
• 59:16
  formal. Please wear your favorite band shirt
• 59:18
  in support of our love for music.” I thought that
• 59:21
  was a great idea. When did you guys come up with
• 59:23
  that idea to just say wear band shirts? I, you know,
• 59:28
  well, OK, so I. We, I proposed her, stumbling, I
• 59:33
  proposed to her, and, uh, at the Tom Petty weekend,
• 59:36
  just a few months early, or yeah, a few months
• 59:39
  earlier or whatever in Florida or whatever. And
• 59:42
  so we came up with the idea to have a rock t
• 59:44
  -shirt. I don't know, we came up with that kind
• 59:46
  of right away when we were planning the wedding.
• 59:48
  It's like, what do we want to have? And we go,
• 59:50
  and then we thought about what we hate about
• 59:51
  weddings. And we, you know, we hate dressing
• 59:53
  up. Tuxedos. And the women have to buy another
• 59:57
  dress and you have to do this and you have to
• 59:59
  do that and so on and so forth. So we just thought,
• 1:00:02
  you know, it's about music. It's not about. We
• 1:00:04
  want everybody to be comfortable. We want everybody
• 1:00:06
  to be relaxed. We want everybody to have a good
• 1:00:07
  time. We wanted people to wear your favorite
• 1:00:11
  rock t shirt, express yourself, wear a pair
• 1:00:14
  of jeans, wear whatever is comfortable to you.
• 1:00:18
  We had a nice dinner. We had a decent dinner
• 1:00:21
  or whatever. We didn't do just ham sandwiches
• 1:00:23
  or whatever. We went with the good stuff or whatever
• 1:00:27
  and went a little more top notch on that. But
• 1:00:30
  that was, that was the thing. We want people
• 1:00:32
  to enjoy ourselves. And my friends, you know,
• 1:00:34
  they're, they're still like, man, that was the
• 1:00:35
  best wedding ever. I got to wear jeans, you know,
• 1:00:38
  and one guy's like, man, I love that meat. That
• 1:00:40
  was such a good dinner. You know, it's like,
• 1:00:42
  yeah, that's pretty good. Great. You know, this
• 1:00:45
  is an, this is an audio-only podcast, of course,
• 1:00:48
  but Brad, you can verify it for our listeners.
• 1:00:50
  As we're recording this, I'm actually wearing
• 1:00:52
  the band shirt that I wore to your wedding, to
• 1:00:55
  You and Wendee's wedding. It's the, it's black. On
• 1:00:57
  the front cover of the shirt or on the front
• 1:00:59
  of the shirt is the front cover of the Beatles'
• 1:01:01
  Rubber Soul album. It's printed on, you can see
• 1:01:03
  it's that iconic close-up fish-eye style portrait
• 1:01:06
  with George and John and Ringo and Paul on there.
• 1:01:10
  And I got a lot of nice comments from your friends.
• 1:01:12
  That's my favorite album. I'll get you a Tom
• 1:01:15
  Petty shirt, Bob. Branch out a little bit here.
• 1:01:22
  But I saw this one, it's always been one of my
• 1:01:26
  favorite photos of all time, with that lens and
• 1:01:28
  that stuff, so I got that, so. Oh, and then I
• 1:01:31
  wanna mention this too, because this is great,
• 1:01:33
  when Wendee walked down the aisle, tell us the song
• 1:01:35
  that was playing as she walked down the aisle.
• 1:01:37
  She walked down the aisle like, “Here Comes My
• 1:01:39
  Girl,” you know? That was great. Now, personally,
• 1:01:41
  I wanted her to wait until they got to the bridge
• 1:01:43
  in the middle where the girl goes, “Watch her walk,”
• 1:01:44
  you know? She don't wanna wait that long, so,
• 1:01:47
  you know? I thought that would've been great,
• 1:01:49
  you know? That worked. That worked out really
• 1:01:51
  well. It was a fun wedding, you guys. I really
• 1:01:53
  enjoyed that song. And then we danced her first
• 1:01:55
  song, it was “The Wild One, Forever,” which was her
• 1:01:56
  song. That's the song that she related to for
• 1:02:00
  her. I asked you this earlier, but you said it's
• 1:02:05
  hard to say you've got one favorite album or
• 1:02:08
  one favorite song, but say you had to for whatever,
• 1:02:11
  you can only listen to one album or one song
• 1:02:13
  ever again from Petty, what would you want it
• 1:02:15
  to be? One album. Like I said, I kind of like
• 1:02:18
  the “Long After Dark” because it's got a little
• 1:02:20
  bit of everything. It's got cool rock stuff,
• 1:02:22
  it's got some deal, you know. Like I said, one
• 1:02:26
  thing is, you know, “Straight Into Darkness,” he's
• 1:02:28
  got so many great lines, you know, and one of
• 1:02:31
  the great lines was from “Straight Into Darkness,”
• 1:02:32
  I actually used in my wedding vows, you know.
• 1:02:35
  Oh, I didn’t know that. Yeah. “Real love is a man's salvation.
• 1:02:38
  The weak ones fall the strong carry on.” you
• 1:02:40
  know, and so that's one of the great lines that
• 1:02:42
  was in there. Southern, you know, “Rebels” on “Southern
• 1:02:45
  Accents,” that, for some reason, that song just
• 1:02:47
  kind of resonates with me. I don't know why,
• 1:02:49
  you know, it's another great line, “Yeah, with one
• 1:02:51
  foot in the grave and one foot on the pedal I was
• 1:02:53
  born a rebel,” you know, and that kind of goes
• 1:02:55
  back to some of the crazy stuff, you know, when
• 1:02:57
  you're younger and some of the stupid stuff you
• 1:02:59
  do and stuff, you know, so that's part of the
• 1:03:01
  fine. That's part one of those great songs that
• 1:03:03
  really resonates, you know. Yeah, it's hard to
• 1:03:06
  say because like I said, it kind of, it's whatever
• 1:03:08
  motion kind of grabs you at that particular time.
• 1:03:10
  And so there are certain times where a certain
• 1:03:12
  song really does grab you or a certain album
• 1:03:14
  really does grab you, depending on what's going
• 1:03:16
  on in your life. And that was part of what was
• 1:03:19
  so great about Tom is what he wrote was what
• 1:03:22
  was going on in his life also. You know, you
• 1:03:26
  know, they talk about, you know, echoes and stuff
• 1:03:28
  like that you know they always say that's the
• 1:03:30
  “divorce album,” and you know that was, you know,
• 1:03:32
  he's going through that tough time and so on
• 1:03:34
  and so forth and addiction issues and so on and
• 1:03:36
  so forth and so you can kind of see how his life
• 1:03:38
  progressed as he writes the stuff also you can
• 1:03:41
  kind of feel that how he's emotionally tied some
• 1:03:43
  of the stuff and what's going on and, you know,
• 1:03:46
  you look at the influence of, you know, look listen
• 1:03:48
  the first album you know the very first album,
• 1:03:50
  Shelter Records, you know, they were working with
• 1:03:53
  the Dwight Twilley band and so on and so forth and
• 1:03:55
  a lot of stuff, you know, Dwight Twilley, the guy is
• 1:03:57
  saying on some of that. You can hear some of
• 1:03:59
  the Dwight Twilley influence on that first album
• 1:04:01
  and stuff. That's just how it was written, and
• 1:04:04
  how some of the stuff, how the sound came about.
• 1:04:07
  It's really interesting to see his life and perspective
• 1:04:10
  of how he wrote as he went along. And that's
• 1:04:13
  the thing about being a real songwriter, too,
• 1:04:16
  which is what something Tom was great about.
• 1:04:20
  He actually wrote real songs. He wrote from the
• 1:04:22
  heart. He didn't think, well, how's this going
• 1:04:24
  to sell? How's this going to go? What's going
• 1:04:26
  to happen? You know, from this standpoint, he
• 1:04:28
  wrote what he was feeling and he recorded what
• 1:04:31
  he was feeling and not all of it made all the
• 1:04:33
  albums, but whatever he put down, it was it was
• 1:04:35
  honest and it was true of what was going on with
• 1:04:37
  what he was doing. And that's one of the greatest,
• 1:04:39
  you know, that's one of the greatest things about
• 1:04:41
  him. You know, guys like Chris Stapleton acknowledged
• 1:04:45
  that, that he was such a great songwriter. And
• 1:04:47
  I know Chris Stapleton tries to write in that
• 1:04:49
  same kind of feeling of what he's feeling is
• 1:04:51
  what he's writing about also from that standpoint.
• 1:04:53
  And there's other artists that, you know, really
• 1:04:55
  are true songwriters that approach it that way
• 1:04:59
  also, you know. Because it's like, if you write
• 1:05:02
  something you believe in, you know, the success
• 1:05:06
  is going to come after the fact. But you got
• 1:05:08
  to really write what you feel and what you really
• 1:05:10
  honestly believe, and make sure you stand behind,
• 1:05:13
  you're proud of what you're doing. And I think
• 1:05:15
  that was the biggest thing. He was real proud
• 1:05:17
  of what he was doing. And if you ever get a chance,
• 1:05:20
  you know, to watch, like, “Wildflowers,” you know,
• 1:05:24
  the documentary that came out of “Wildflowers,”
• 1:05:27
  wherever it's on YouTube, where you can buy it
• 1:05:29
  or whatever, that's a great example and a great
• 1:05:33
  representation of how he wrote from what he was
• 1:05:35
  feeling and so on and so forth. How do you listen
• 1:05:38
  to his music these days now? Do you still use
• 1:05:41
  the stereo or are you streaming stuff? whatever.
• 1:05:45
  When I'm, when I'm working, I have it on my iPod.
• 1:05:48
  And at my wedding, everybody gave me a lot of
• 1:05:49
  crap for still having an iPod. You know, I mean,
• 1:05:52
  it still works. Thank God it hasn't died yet.
• 1:05:56
  But you still have a turntable? Oh, yeah, absolutely.
• 1:05:58
  Most time we listen to it on turntable. If I'm
• 1:06:00
  working, I got my headphones on, I'm listening
• 1:06:02
  into an iPod. But when I sit down and actually
• 1:06:04
  relax, you know, we sit on the couch downstairs,
• 1:06:06
  but on stereo, you know, turntable or whatever.
• 1:06:09
  That's how we listen to it, because that's how
• 1:06:11
  it sounds best. You know, And like I said, with
• 1:06:15
  Wendee, she's been a Tom Petty fan longer than
• 1:06:18
  I have. She's got the original albums from the
• 1:06:22
  70s and stuff like that with all the crackling,
• 1:06:24
  popping and hissing. I've got some of those, too,
• 1:06:28
  and I've got some of the later 180-gram pressings
• 1:06:31
  and whatever is mixed in there. But we always
• 1:06:35
  put some Tom Petty vinyl on and that's how we
• 1:06:37
  enjoy our evening. That's how we spend our winters.
• 1:06:40
  When you live in this Arctic climate, it's all
• 1:06:42
  you can do. Cross country skiing. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:06:47
  So I was in my 20s. I was too old for cross country
• 1:06:49
  skiing. Too much work. Too much work. Yeah. Well,
• 1:06:56
  this has been fun, Brad. I'm sorry, it's taken
• 1:06:58
  as long as it has for us to finally get together
• 1:07:00
  to record this podcast about Tom Petty. But it's
• 1:07:03
  True—"the waiting was the hardest part.” Absolutely.
• 1:07:08
  Okay. And because of that, I'm going to give
• 1:07:11
  you the last word. What is it about Tom Petty's
• 1:07:13
  music that has made you listen to it for decades
• 1:07:16
  now? And what is it that you want others to know
• 1:07:18
  and appreciate about Tom Petty? The thing about
• 1:07:21
  Tom Petty's music is, like I said, it's timeless.
• 1:07:24
  It truly is timeless. And there's going to be
• 1:07:28
  something in his songs. One of his songs is going
• 1:07:30
  to resonate with somebody, you know, and at whatever
• 1:07:34
  point he was writing. I guarantee if you actually
• 1:07:36
  sat down and listened to it and actually listened
• 1:07:38
  to the words and so on and so forth the music
• 1:07:41
  would resonate you. There would be something
• 1:07:42
  that would hit you and go oh yeah I know that
• 1:07:45
  or I feel that or I've been through that or I'm
• 1:07:48
  going through that now or whatever and so that
• 1:07:53
  I think is what, what made his stuff so great,
• 1:07:56
  and why he continued to listen to it because
• 1:07:58
  it was the stuff that he did 50 years ago is
• 1:08:04
  as relevant and as good as it is today. You listen
• 1:08:08
  to how good the recordings were and the quality
• 1:08:11
  of the sound and the taste of the playing and
• 1:08:13
  all that stuff that goes into that. Those are
• 1:08:17
  timeless too. “Damn the Torpedoes,” you know, Jimmy
• 1:08:23
  Iovine says that's, you know, that album still
• 1:08:25
  holds up as far as the sound quality and the
• 1:08:28
  mix and the way the drums sound. And I don't
• 1:08:30
  know if it's true or not, but Jimmy Iovine said
• 1:08:31
  that when, you know, Jimmy Iovine started
• 1:08:33
  Beats headphones or whatever, and him and Dr.
• 1:08:36
  Dre have started that. Jimmy Iovine says, I used
• 1:08:38
  “Damn the Torpedoes” to mix, to make sure the headphones
• 1:08:42
  sounded right. I used that to tweak the sound
• 1:08:44
  of the headphones, you know. And so that says
• 1:08:47
  a lot about, you know, the quality and stuff.
• 1:08:50
  Like I said, it's just the timeless. It's the
• 1:08:53
  feel. It's all that stuff. And it's like I said,
• 1:08:56
  it just registers. And that's the biggest thing.
• 1:08:59
  That's why you can just sit back and just listen
• 1:09:01
  to it. Listen to the same album over and over.
• 1:09:04
  Listen to a new album or listen to something
• 1:09:05
  that you've never heard before. Somehow, it's
• 1:09:08
  still going to register with you because of the
• 1:09:10
  feeling and the emotion that's behind it. That's
• 1:09:13
  well said, Brad. And thanks for sharing your
• 1:09:15
  thoughts and insights into Tom Petty. I really
• 1:09:18
  appreciate it. Thanks again. Thanks, Bob. And
• 1:09:23
  again to our listeners, thanks for hangin’ out
• 1:09:25
  with me, Bob Edholm, and my guest, Brad Johs.
• 1:09:28
  We hope you’ll join us for the next episode of “Hangin’
• 1:09:30
  Out with Bob,” wherever you listen to your podcasts.
• 1:09:33
  And until then, bye-eee!