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Are the Tigers building a case to hold their ground at the trade deadline? · Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast

0:09
Speaker 1: And welcome into another episode of Tiger Territory, part of
0:11
Speaker 1: the Foul Territory Network.
0:13
Speaker 2: Tiger's podcast. I'm Karen Steckley with.
0:15
Speaker 1: Me as always is a man who's getting a raw
0:17
Speaker 1: deal and being turned down at Madison Square Garden this weekend.
0:22
Speaker 1: He's Cody Stevenagen.
0:23
Speaker 2: How are you doing?
0:24
Speaker 3: Hey, I'm doing all right. The Tigers are back, baby,
0:28
Speaker 3: never left right. Never a doubt, never.
0:30
Speaker 2: A doubt, never a doubt.
0:33
Speaker 1: If only that were the case, always a doubt would
0:37
Speaker 1: be a good way to describe this team.
0:40
Speaker 2: And you know what's funny, we went.
0:44
Speaker 1: Through a lot of repetitive podcasts and viewing experiences and
0:48
Speaker 1: I'm sure for you interviews with the managers and the
0:51
Speaker 1: players and all that stuff about just like what was
0:53
Speaker 1: going on with this team.
0:54
Speaker 2: And since we talked Cody in.
0:56
Speaker 1: A good way, kind of more repetitiveness on what day
1:00
Speaker 1: is it? On Tuesday? You know, Tarik Schoogle had himself
1:04
Speaker 1: a tax school day, give the home run and the
1:06
Speaker 1: Tigers like gave him home run run support, which was
1:11
Speaker 1: fun to see, and you know, had that game in
1:13
Speaker 1: hand pretty much the entire way.
1:15
Speaker 2: And then Wednesday.
1:18
Speaker 1: They kind of did the guardball thing again, which I
1:20
Speaker 1: joked about on Monday when we had Austin on, like
1:23
Speaker 1: it was kind of the old gritty guard whatever, like
1:27
Speaker 1: find a way to win, put pressure, make them break,
1:29
Speaker 1: and and that's the only really way to explain a
1:32
Speaker 1: game that even though you had it, you know, seven
1:37
Speaker 1: eighths of the way through, you still blew the lead,
1:40
Speaker 1: you still were in prime position to lose it, and
1:43
Speaker 1: in the first inning of extras, and then you just
1:46
Speaker 1: keep I think Andy Dirk said it best. It's so
1:49
Speaker 1: I love listening to Andy.
1:50
Speaker 2: Man.
1:51
Speaker 1: You just keep playing baseball, That's what he said. You
1:53
Speaker 1: just keep playing baseball, keep playing baseball what you know
1:56
Speaker 1: how to do, and good things will happen. And that's
1:58
Speaker 1: exactly what this what this series was for the Tigers.
2:01
Speaker 1: Just keep playing baseball and a lot of good happen.
2:03
Speaker 1: They get out of there with this week.
2:08
Speaker 3: It just continues to be a weird season. Man. I
2:10
Speaker 3: don't know. Credit obviously to the Tigers. I said, like,
2:14
Speaker 3: are you really going to go into the Bronx and
2:15
Speaker 3: sweep the Yankees? And I didn't think they could do it,
2:17
Speaker 3: and they did it. They got stellar pitching performances obviously
2:22
Speaker 3: from the three guys who started cater Montero continues to
2:25
Speaker 3: come up and do big things. You zoom out, and
2:28
Speaker 3: their June as a whole was very productive. They were
2:31
Speaker 3: sixth overall in ops, they were second overall in EER,
2:37
Speaker 3: so they played for the month of June like a
2:40
Speaker 3: really good team. Obviously, they are still making up for May,
2:45
Speaker 3: and it's funny. It seems like the narrative has now
2:48
Speaker 3: shifted to like, oh, don't count out the Tigers. Here
2:50
Speaker 3: they are and again we've kind of been saying that
2:53
Speaker 3: for a while. Things are still too wide open. But
2:56
Speaker 3: they also swept the Yankees and gained all of a
2:59
Speaker 3: half game in the American League Wild Card standing, so
3:02
Speaker 3: there is much work left to do. You need to
3:05
Speaker 3: continue playing at this level. I am. I continue to
3:08
Speaker 3: be impressed at like the elite pitching, though, because that's
3:10
Speaker 3: what we've been talking about since January February. The Tigers
3:14
Speaker 3: path to being good, to being a playoff team, to
3:16
Speaker 3: being more than just a playoff team was always going
3:20
Speaker 3: to be about their starting pitching, and right now they
3:22
Speaker 3: are getting it, and not just from Cherik Scouogle. Casey
3:25
Speaker 3: Mice continuing to do the best baseball of his career,
3:27
Speaker 3: Troy Melton. I just man continues to make you wonder
3:31
Speaker 3: how high that ceiling could really be. Even from Bravaldez
3:35
Speaker 3: has been better if you look at the overall numbers lately.
3:38
Speaker 3: So the Tigers remain interesting, man, they remain interesting.
3:44
Speaker 2: Yeah.
3:44
Speaker 1: Well, look, it is kind of a situation where you
3:49
Speaker 1: have to be honest with yourself. And I like, we
3:52
Speaker 1: got a little pushback on you know, we were so
3:54
Speaker 1: positive after our Monday episode and you know it's like, hey,
3:58
Speaker 1: it's one game. You still bat in Jami and you know,
4:00
Speaker 1: number six in the batting order, you know, blah blah blah. Ironically,
4:03
Speaker 1: and you know, I say this tongue in cheeks. I
4:05
Speaker 1: hope you don't get mad. Ironically, the Twitter account was
4:08
Speaker 1: looking for a win. That was the name of the
4:10
Speaker 1: Twitter account, and we're talking about a win and got
4:13
Speaker 1: pushed back for that. So, you know, just a little
4:15
Speaker 1: just a little irony for you and your in in
4:17
Speaker 1: your Friday morning breakfast Cereal. But if you want to
4:22
Speaker 1: see if you truly did believe in this team preseason,
4:27
Speaker 1: there's no reason to not think this is possible and
4:31
Speaker 1: what moving forward could be like a real competitive baseball team.
4:36
Speaker 1: What does that mean, I don't know, you said the
4:37
Speaker 1: only game, like what a half game in the standings,
4:40
Speaker 1: So like it could just be I want to say
4:43
Speaker 1: old for not, but it could just ultimately mean the
4:47
Speaker 1: same thing as if this past month didn't happen. Like
4:50
Speaker 1: we all understand that that's possibility. But I'm having fun
4:52
Speaker 1: watching the team that I anticipated watching the whole season
4:55
Speaker 1: play like this right now. I'm having I'm having fun
4:58
Speaker 1: seeing Kevin mcgonagd historic rookie year. I'm having fun seeing
5:01
Speaker 1: Dylan Dingler be by far the best catcher in baseball.
5:04
Speaker 1: I'm having fun seeing Riley Green find his powerstroke.
5:07
Speaker 2: You know, I'm having.
5:08
Speaker 1: Fun seeing guys like hyu Lead just kind of come
5:10
Speaker 1: out of nowhere and just like and just like slap
5:13
Speaker 1: and play hard and you know, make plays all of
5:15
Speaker 1: the field. Hell, James Outman, a guy that's like, okay,
5:18
Speaker 1: cool James Outman, Well, I mean he's got a couple
5:21
Speaker 1: of three run home runs to his credit, you know,
5:23
Speaker 1: alf of LEPTI too, like like this is kind of
5:26
Speaker 1: the the Tigers machine.
5:28
Speaker 2: Is what we're watching.
5:29
Speaker 1: We're not just watching like a team just kind of
5:31
Speaker 1: a good stretch here, which Andy, maybe I'll have to
5:34
Speaker 1: eat my words on this, but we're watching the Tigers
5:36
Speaker 1: team operate as designed, as functioned as intended, and for
5:41
Speaker 1: way too long this season, hence the record, we haven't
5:44
Speaker 1: been able to do that. So then the question becomes
5:47
Speaker 1: is it sustainable? Obviously you hit like five home runs
5:52
Speaker 1: in a game or whatever, that's like not sustainable, quote unquote.
5:55
Speaker 2: So I understand all.
5:55
Speaker 1: Of that, But the style is The style is in
6:00
Speaker 1: the managerial like input is the starting pitching. You know,
6:05
Speaker 1: injuries obviously, you never know what can happen, but the
6:08
Speaker 1: starting pitching sustainable, Like that's they built this team with
6:14
Speaker 1: these players.
6:15
Speaker 2: With these ethos.
6:18
Speaker 1: Because it is supposed to be the most sustainable way
6:21
Speaker 1: to win games. So now that they're winning games, we're
6:23
Speaker 1: supposed to just like we were not. It's not that
6:26
Speaker 1: we should forget May, absolutely not, but we should also say, like,
6:30
Speaker 1: just because May happen doesn't mean this can't happen too,
6:33
Speaker 1: because this is actually more along the lines of what
6:36
Speaker 1: we expected than what happened in May. So like, there
6:40
Speaker 1: are a lot of I don't say naysayers, but just
6:42
Speaker 1: kind of Debbie downers out there where it's like, oh,
6:44
Speaker 1: whatever doesn't mean anything. You're more focused on terror school's
6:48
Speaker 1: trade value. So congratulations, he had a great game of
6:50
Speaker 1: Yankee Stadium, was on national TV. His trade value just
6:52
Speaker 1: went through the roof. I hope you guys are really
6:53
Speaker 1: happy about that. But to me, this has to be
6:58
Speaker 1: something to be taken serios out if it's sustainable, but
7:02
Speaker 1: you have to take it seriously.
7:04
Speaker 3: I would take it more seriously if the bullpen was
7:06
Speaker 3: still not a major concern and almost blew that finale
7:10
Speaker 3: at Yankee Stadium. So many other things about this team
7:13
Speaker 3: are good. I guess even the bullpen's overall numbers in
7:15
Speaker 3: June were okay. But we see it like the blown
7:17
Speaker 3: saves are a huge issue. Who are you even turning
7:19
Speaker 3: to in the ninth Do you even still trust Kinley Jansen?
7:23
Speaker 3: Will vest Is now on the il He was such
7:26
Speaker 3: a key component of being able to navigate the back
7:29
Speaker 3: end of games. I think the bullpen is still a
7:31
Speaker 3: real concern, probably the key reason I would have. It's
7:35
Speaker 3: hard for me to fully buy in, just because they
7:37
Speaker 3: still have so much ground to make up and such
7:40
Speaker 3: little time to do it. You're probably going to continue
7:43
Speaker 3: playing close games. One thing that's really wonky is the
7:46
Speaker 3: Tigers you know, they're run differential well in the green,
7:50
Speaker 3: and yet their record is what it is. Entering the
7:55
Speaker 3: first game against the Rangers. The Tigers are twelve and
7:57
Speaker 3: ten in their last twenty two games. All ten of
8:01
Speaker 3: those losses came by two runs or less. So you
8:03
Speaker 3: would like to think you start winning some of these
8:05
Speaker 3: close games. I guess they kind of have recently. But
8:09
Speaker 3: the reason I stn't trust this team to win a
8:11
Speaker 3: lot of close games is because it's hard to have
8:13
Speaker 3: a lot of faith in the bullpen, certainly in the
8:16
Speaker 3: depth of the bullpen. I think that's what they're still
8:20
Speaker 3: swimming upstream against. And maybe that's their undoing, or maybe
8:25
Speaker 3: they get it figured out. I don't know, but I,
8:28
Speaker 3: like I said weeks ago, like I still have the
8:29
Speaker 3: bullpen circled. This lineup can do it. They can hit,
8:33
Speaker 3: We've seen it a little bit. The rotation, I believe
8:36
Speaker 3: is really good. But if you have a weak bullpen
8:39
Speaker 3: and zero margin for error, that's not a great recipe.
8:43
Speaker 1: So to me, I think it is obviously you're humstent
8:48
Speaker 1: correct there. I think it is also fair to say
8:52
Speaker 1: that if this run which let's just say they made
8:57
Speaker 1: the playoffs, to just put that out there as the end,
9:00
Speaker 1: how did we get here?
9:01
Speaker 2: You know, looking back?
9:03
Speaker 1: That would involve some sort of like man, this came
9:06
Speaker 1: out of nowhere hero from the bullpen, right like that,
9:09
Speaker 1: That would have to be one hundred percent part of
9:10
Speaker 1: the story. Now, Drew Sommers perhaps is one of those
9:14
Speaker 1: guys that could that will qualify with. You know, he
9:17
Speaker 1: did kind of have a nice little bounce back after
9:18
Speaker 1: giving up the home run on Monday night.
9:21
Speaker 2: But it's gonna have to be more.
9:23
Speaker 1: It's gonna have to take like a resurgence of bow Briski,
9:28
Speaker 1: you know, Kellthy Jansen had like really you know, bouncing back.
9:31
Speaker 1: It's gonna take a couple of those kind of like man,
9:34
Speaker 1: didn't see that coming stories, And that's baseball and you
9:39
Speaker 1: can't really like bank on that manage it that way.
9:42
Speaker 1: But that's really one of the things that's gonna have
9:43
Speaker 1: to happen, or as we'll get to a little bit later,
9:46
Speaker 1: maybe you'd take a little bit more power into your
9:49
Speaker 1: own hands. All right, Cody, I wanted to remind everybody
9:52
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11:05
Speaker 1: See all right, coming back here, I did have a
11:11
Speaker 1: quick announcement, Cody, if you could just kind of bear
11:13
Speaker 1: with me for a second. We we're gonna do a
11:19
Speaker 1: lot of trade deadline discussions over the course of the
11:22
Speaker 1: of the next month, and you're gonna be on interviews
11:25
Speaker 1: and radio shows and you know all this stuff because
11:27
Speaker 1: everyone's gonna want to know what the Tigers are doing.
11:29
Speaker 1: I am here to tell you right now, the Tigers
11:32
Speaker 1: cannot trade Tarrek schoogle to the New York Yankees. It
11:37
Speaker 1: will not like I am nixing the trade. I am
11:39
Speaker 1: detelling any trade. It doesn't matter. Doesn't matter if you
11:42
Speaker 1: get like a portion of the Yankees revenue, like it,
11:45
Speaker 1: like nothing. It is not allowed because the Great Michael
11:50
Speaker 1: k cannot say Tarrek Schooble's name correctly. And if you
11:53
Speaker 1: got your main TV play by play guy who's been
11:57
Speaker 1: doing it for decades, he's a legend in the business,
12:01
Speaker 1: and he just can't say the two time reigning Cy
12:04
Speaker 1: Young winner's name correctly.
12:06
Speaker 2: He's an employee of the team.
12:08
Speaker 1: It's over like like the Yankees are not allowed to
12:11
Speaker 1: trade for Trek Schooble.
12:13
Speaker 3: If you guys, look, he is he watching it that badly?
12:16
Speaker 3: How bad is it?
12:18
Speaker 2: Butch it at all? Is that bad? Dude? What are
12:21
Speaker 2: you talking about?
12:21
Speaker 1: He like like he's not so rookie al right, like
12:25
Speaker 1: he's he it's like Taric is how he's saying it,
12:28
Speaker 1: Like Taric Schooble is how he's saying Tarik's name. And
12:32
Speaker 1: it's like, dude, the guy's been the league since twenty twenty,
12:34
Speaker 1: He's won two cy Youngs, and everybody in your freaking
12:38
Speaker 1: city has spent all off season. I know it because
12:41
Speaker 1: I listen talking about how the Yankees of the MESSI
12:43
Speaker 1: the trade for schoob al all right, So it's not
12:45
Speaker 1: like he's something like foreign concept of a name here,
12:49
Speaker 1: So Yankees, I don't.
12:50
Speaker 2: Want to see any trade offers.
12:51
Speaker 1: I don't want to see any like reports about what
12:54
Speaker 1: you know, there's nothing can't happen.
12:56
Speaker 2: It is, it's done. It's a done deal.
12:58
Speaker 1: So like it's just there are certain things that shouldn't
13:01
Speaker 1: be allowed and a just society, and that would be
13:04
Speaker 1: one of them.
13:05
Speaker 3: So yeah, I don't know. I'm gonna chalk it up
13:07
Speaker 3: just like a New York accent or something like that, right.
13:10
Speaker 3: I think the bigger point here, though, talking about the
13:13
Speaker 3: trade deadline, which we've been talking about for forever, what
13:17
Speaker 3: we just saw in Yankee Stadium is a terrific reminder
13:20
Speaker 3: of why the Tigers aren't going to start pulling the
13:23
Speaker 3: trigger on deals like after the All Star break. It's
13:26
Speaker 3: a reminder of why they're going to take this as
13:29
Speaker 3: long as they realistically can. The value of Schoogle maybe
13:33
Speaker 3: that's a little bit of a different conversation. But when
13:36
Speaker 3: you have the sixth best ops and the second best
13:39
Speaker 3: er for an entire month, and you're playing well, and
13:41
Speaker 3: then you sweep the Yankees and you're even though you
13:44
Speaker 3: didn't grain that much ground, you're only six games back.
13:47
Speaker 3: I think they're going to push for as long as
13:50
Speaker 3: they possibly can. It is interesting, as much as the
13:53
Speaker 3: vibes are high right now, as much as Kieran Steckley's
13:56
Speaker 3: drinking the kool aid, the math hasn't changed a lot
13:59
Speaker 3: from where it was two weeks ago. Your six games out,
14:01
Speaker 3: your playoff odds are twenty three point three percent. It's
14:05
Speaker 3: been relatively stable. You're kind of tread and water. You're
14:08
Speaker 3: staying in it, and that is good. Maybe you're getting
14:11
Speaker 3: hot enough to start making some real moves right now.
14:15
Speaker 3: So everyone who said, you know, the Tigers should have
14:17
Speaker 3: traded the Schoogle two weeks ago, I don't know. I'd
14:19
Speaker 3: be curious if people still feel that way. Maybe they do,
14:22
Speaker 3: you know, if they believe this is a fake run.
14:24
Speaker 3: But I actually think it's the correct decision by the
14:27
Speaker 3: Tigers to take this thing into the August first August second,
14:32
Speaker 3: you know, you there's you don't have to decide what
14:35
Speaker 3: you were going to do, especially if the standings don't
14:39
Speaker 3: if you don't feel there entirely clear, given the quality
14:42
Speaker 3: the baseball team you believe you have.
14:47
Speaker 1: So given that there this is our first episode published
14:51
Speaker 1: in the month of July, which you know used to
14:53
Speaker 1: be trade deadline month. Now you know it's pushing the August.
14:55
Speaker 1: But you guys understand what I'm saying. I did kind
14:58
Speaker 1: of want to dip my toe into something a little
15:01
Speaker 1: bit where it's like, is there and I actually think
15:05
Speaker 1: this is not out of the remal of possibility, Like
15:08
Speaker 1: is there a way to kind of softly buy and
15:14
Speaker 1: maybe and maybe even have like a mixed bag trade deadline.
15:18
Speaker 1: And so let's just say you have to trade school
15:20
Speaker 1: Ble generational opportunity blah blah blah.
15:22
Speaker 2: Let's just say.
15:22
Speaker 1: And so you decide to do that because you just
15:24
Speaker 1: you're not gonna resign them and you're not gonna have
15:26
Speaker 1: this sort of like opportunity ever again. So you just
15:28
Speaker 1: kind of do that. Could you also trade for a
15:32
Speaker 1: guy in the bullpen? Could you trade for a right
15:34
Speaker 1: handed bat that could be a little bit more consistent,
15:36
Speaker 1: someone who could play center field. Could you like try
15:38
Speaker 1: to upgrade your roster on the on the margins a
15:42
Speaker 1: little bit that could kind of shure up, Like, let's
15:44
Speaker 1: just in case the offense remains hot like Schoolble as
15:47
Speaker 1: gray as he is the only pitches every once every
15:49
Speaker 1: fifth day. And and I I believe that when you
15:53
Speaker 1: have opportunities to win games, you should still be trying
15:57
Speaker 1: to win games. And I think no one's talked about
16:01
Speaker 1: this because it's you know, the team sucked. You gotta
16:03
Speaker 1: trade Schoolble, trade Miz, trade Flaherty, tray dorres see if
16:07
Speaker 1: you can get anything.
16:08
Speaker 2: For you know, like all these things.
16:10
Speaker 1: What if it's just all right, we gotta do like
16:12
Speaker 1: the long term thing because it's just irresponsible not to.
16:16
Speaker 1: But we could also do the short term thing too
16:17
Speaker 1: and just kind of see what happens.
16:19
Speaker 3: Is that is that it's not the craziest idea. I
16:25
Speaker 3: don't hate you throwing it out there. My personal opinion,
16:27
Speaker 3: I would say a hard note to that. I would say,
16:31
Speaker 3: if you think you can make the playoffs, then you
16:33
Speaker 3: should not trade Trek Scooble. Although it might be an
16:36
Speaker 3: opportunity to get a great return, it could also be
16:39
Speaker 3: a great opportunity to win the World Series. If the
16:41
Speaker 3: Tiger's shown enough that they're going to win the World Series,
16:44
Speaker 3: best play with this bullpen I keep talking about, like no,
16:46
Speaker 3: but one reason like a team could get hot and
16:50
Speaker 3: have a chance is having the best picture on the
16:52
Speaker 3: world on their side. So if the Tigers are going
16:54
Speaker 3: to buy at all, I think they have to keep Schooble.
16:56
Speaker 3: That's one reason, Like they do have to be decisive
17:00
Speaker 3: and realistic about their chances, and that's why every game
17:03
Speaker 3: matters right now. But I think it would be a
17:05
Speaker 3: mistake to trade Schooble and then soft By, like what
17:09
Speaker 3: are you really trying to accomplish there? If you trade
17:12
Speaker 3: tex Scouble, you admit you're not your main goal is
17:15
Speaker 3: not winning the World Series this year. If you're gonna sell,
17:19
Speaker 3: I think you gotta sell. And if you really want
17:22
Speaker 3: to get aggressive, if they don't know there are four
17:24
Speaker 3: games out at the deadline, and you buy. If they
17:28
Speaker 3: end up not making the playoffs, they're like the Angels
17:30
Speaker 3: a couple of years ago. Sho heeo Tani. It would
17:33
Speaker 3: be catastrophic. It would be a terrible decision. But you
17:36
Speaker 3: can sign me up for it. It'd be a lot
17:37
Speaker 3: of fun to see how that goes. Oh, that's how
17:41
Speaker 3: I feel. I think it's got to be one or
17:42
Speaker 3: the other.
17:44
Speaker 1: Well, you know, there's there's an element here where it's
17:50
Speaker 1: a flaw in the system. If a team is in
17:54
Speaker 1: playoff contention and trades away the best player at his
17:58
Speaker 1: position is I don't think that's Like the whole point
18:02
Speaker 1: of expanded playoffs is that that doesn't happen, right, like,
18:05
Speaker 1: as you're supposed to have more teams go for it
18:07
Speaker 1: in general, and and I'm also a firm believer in that, Like, look,
18:11
Speaker 1: you have, you know how many seasons of Riley Green
18:17
Speaker 1: being this healthy? You know, are you gonna have how
18:20
Speaker 1: many seasons of Dylan you know, you just never know,
18:23
Speaker 1: Dylan Dingler, could.
18:24
Speaker 2: You know get hurt?
18:25
Speaker 1: You know, Kevin McGonagall, Like you know how many guys
18:27
Speaker 1: have had stellar rookie years and then just kind of
18:29
Speaker 1: flat lined.
18:30
Speaker 2: Like these things happen over and over again.
18:32
Speaker 1: Everybody thinks their window and whatever the definition you have
18:36
Speaker 1: for the window, everybody thinks their windows a lot longer
18:40
Speaker 1: or taller, depending on how you wanted to find it
18:43
Speaker 1: than it is.
18:44
Speaker 2: A lot of times are.
18:45
Speaker 3: Not look at what they did last year.
18:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so like like like part of me is
18:51
Speaker 1: thinks like like these opportunities are pretty precious, you know
18:55
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like like like if there's a way
18:58
Speaker 1: to kind of do both, I just don't think it
19:00
Speaker 1: should be shut down because the alternative is you start
19:04
Speaker 1: turning into the twenty twenty one Tigers real fast, where
19:08
Speaker 1: you just like where you just trade everybody and you
19:11
Speaker 1: just got a bunch of journeyman's and never never.
19:15
Speaker 3: Was I don't think. But the difference between these teams
19:18
Speaker 3: and that team is that you still have a foundation.
19:21
Speaker 3: You still have a Kevin McGonagall, Dylan Dingler, you have
19:25
Speaker 3: Troy Melton, Jackson, Job Cater Montero, Like you have real pieces.
19:29
Speaker 3: You still have Max Clark, Bryce Rayner coming up in
19:32
Speaker 3: the farm. You have a lot more in the cupboard
19:34
Speaker 3: than you did in twenty twenty one. Trading guys who
19:37
Speaker 3: are on expiring contracts. Doesn't that that doesn't set you
19:41
Speaker 3: back at all.
19:44
Speaker 1: I mean it sets you back in the sense that
19:46
Speaker 1: it sends the message to these kids that you know,
19:49
Speaker 1: like you know that we're okay with uh, we're okay
19:52
Speaker 1: with punning on a season. I mean, that's that that
19:54
Speaker 1: that's what does you know what I mean like, yeah,
19:57
Speaker 1: and and then well next time we'll we'll be able
19:59
Speaker 1: to do it, Okay.
19:59
Speaker 2: Well I don't know. Will there be a next time?
20:02
Speaker 3: All right? And I think I think that's important. There's
20:04
Speaker 3: not always a guaranteed next time. That's why I'm saying
20:07
Speaker 3: you can't buy and sell at the same time. If
20:09
Speaker 3: you really believe, you got to go for it. And
20:10
Speaker 3: they probably should have done more than they did this
20:13
Speaker 3: time a year ago, and they and they didn't, and
20:15
Speaker 3: we all know what happened.
20:16
Speaker 2: Now.
20:17
Speaker 3: One thing that's always been in the background, what's.
20:20
Speaker 1: That sell everything? Like if you're a tree, if you're
20:23
Speaker 1: a cell, do you sell mice? Do you sell flair.
20:25
Speaker 2: Do you sell yes, trus yes, you just everybody?
20:30
Speaker 3: Okay, so you're gonna keep a guy to have fun
20:32
Speaker 3: for two months like or are you're gonna build one thing?
20:35
Speaker 3: That's in the back drop of all of this. Has
20:37
Speaker 3: always been my perception that the Tigers front office has
20:42
Speaker 3: had more confidence, more optimism in twenty twenty seven, twenty
20:46
Speaker 3: twenty eight, twenty twenty nine, and they maybe ever did
20:50
Speaker 3: in twenty twenty five or twenty twenty six. See how
20:54
Speaker 3: things are going. That doesn't feel as misplaced as it
20:56
Speaker 3: did when you were talking about this in the off season. Now, granted,
20:59
Speaker 3: that's still a lot of wish casting and hoping every
21:01
Speaker 3: player player's development goes according to plan, and that how
21:05
Speaker 3: you lead is an every day guy and Max Anderson
21:08
Speaker 3: is an everyday guy and all of these things like that.
21:10
Speaker 3: It is far from guaranteed, and it could be very
21:12
Speaker 3: dangerous to bank on the future. But if that's your
21:15
Speaker 3: plan and you already feel good about your future, and
21:19
Speaker 3: you can trade Scoogle for a hefty return, Miz for
21:22
Speaker 3: a pretty dang good return to whereas you will get
21:24
Speaker 3: something who knows you know you see what you can
21:28
Speaker 3: get for flarity and maybe even Jansen some of your
21:31
Speaker 3: bullpen pieces, and then you're really setting yourself up better
21:34
Speaker 3: for the future. This season has also shown how how
21:36
Speaker 3: thin their farm can be, how much they lack pitching,
21:40
Speaker 3: So there are things to build for in the future,
21:43
Speaker 3: even though that future is not guaranteed. And I wonder
21:45
Speaker 3: if that may factor into the calculus. Let's say, if
21:48
Speaker 3: it gets to a situation where they're within three to
21:51
Speaker 3: five games and there's no there's no right answer for
21:54
Speaker 3: what to do.
21:57
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, obviously the potential lockout plays into
22:01
Speaker 1: this in both ways, where it's like, if you think
22:03
Speaker 1: the CBA is going to go in this direction, maybe
22:05
Speaker 1: that changes, like how you approach things, you know, whether
22:09
Speaker 1: it's the max contracts or the salary cap or you
22:11
Speaker 1: know whatever. Like if you think that's part of the
22:15
Speaker 1: gamble too, it's par of the calculus. Be irresponsible not
22:18
Speaker 1: to sort of like have a you work for the owner,
22:22
Speaker 1: so like you should know where this is going and
22:26
Speaker 1: where they think they can.
22:27
Speaker 3: Get, you know, you know what. I also think there's
22:29
Speaker 3: kind of the thing and player development, like players tell
22:32
Speaker 3: you when they're ready. Let's get to August first, the
22:38
Speaker 3: last week of July, even I think the game will
22:41
Speaker 3: show the Tigers what they have to do. I think
22:44
Speaker 3: it'll probably be pretty clear one way or another what
22:46
Speaker 3: needs to happen based on how the team plays between
22:49
Speaker 3: now and then. That's why I've always I get a
22:51
Speaker 3: little irked when we have to talk about these things
22:54
Speaker 3: in June. And even though we've spent plenty of breath
22:56
Speaker 3: on it already since since probably the first part of June,
23:00
Speaker 3: it's all just kind of irrelevant. It's all just speculation
23:03
Speaker 3: because you still have to play the schedule. You have
23:05
Speaker 3: to play the games on the field, and the next
23:07
Speaker 3: what twenty to twenty five games. I've bet a couple
23:10
Speaker 3: of weeks from now, we're going to be able to
23:12
Speaker 3: sit here and it's all going to be a little
23:14
Speaker 3: bit more clear.
23:17
Speaker 1: Well, I said, all right, we are going to take
23:19
Speaker 1: a quick break and then afterward, Yeah, throw a name
23:23
Speaker 1: out there that's maybe been a key for this Tigers turnaround.
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24:34
Speaker 2: You know, Cody, I.
24:37
Speaker 1: Spoke about this, and we spoke about this a couple
24:40
Speaker 1: of weeks ago when it looked like McKinstry was Zach
24:43
Speaker 1: McKinstry was starting to kind of douce a little bit
24:45
Speaker 1: more Zach mckinstrye things, And it's like, is this kind
24:49
Speaker 1: of the is this kind of the I don't know
24:51
Speaker 1: if he's the engine, but is he kind of maybe
24:54
Speaker 1: he's the igniter, like when Zach McKinstry's the guy going well,
24:58
Speaker 1: it seems like a lot of things.
24:59
Speaker 2: For the Tigers go well.
25:01
Speaker 1: Uh and right now on Baseball Reference, he's at a
25:05
Speaker 1: zero point zero war which that was negative for a
25:08
Speaker 1: long time and uh, not kindly negative, I would say,
25:12
Speaker 1: And then.
25:12
Speaker 2: I look at it.
25:13
Speaker 1: He had a seven thirty ohps And in June, Dan
25:17
Speaker 1: Diggerson's been really good about talking about the uh, the
25:20
Speaker 1: line drive raid and uh and you know, just kind
25:23
Speaker 1: of Zach's just kind of finding something little, little little
25:29
Speaker 1: flaw in his swing that he had to kind of
25:30
Speaker 1: just like work through, and and.
25:32
Speaker 2: It seems like he has.
25:33
Speaker 1: And I just don't think it's a coincidence that that
25:36
Speaker 1: wacky play happens on Wednesday and he's at the center
25:39
Speaker 1: of it, like like like like you can't tell me
25:42
Speaker 1: that that's not like relevant to the situation that Zach
25:46
Speaker 1: McKinstry's up there and think and good things just happened,
25:49
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. So, uh so I just
25:51
Speaker 1: wanted to point that out, like, you know, we talked
25:53
Speaker 1: about things that have to keep going right, Zach McKinstry.
25:56
Speaker 1: Keep going right is maybe underrat even though we talk
26:00
Speaker 1: about I still think it's underratedly important.
26:05
Speaker 3: Well yeah, I mean we know the spark plug, the
26:07
Speaker 3: engine he can be for this team. I do think
26:09
Speaker 3: Dan has shared some very interesting things on the radio
26:12
Speaker 3: that mckinstrey had said something to the effect of like
26:15
Speaker 3: he was dealing with some knee pain that was kind
26:17
Speaker 3: of altering his swing, not allowing him to drive the ball.
26:19
Speaker 3: And that's kind of been my opinion watching Zmac for
26:22
Speaker 3: a while is he just hasn't looked fully healthy since
26:25
Speaker 3: he came back from the IL with kind of that
26:27
Speaker 3: weird injury after a couple of collisions. I mean, a
26:30
Speaker 3: sprint speed is still down. Things like that that just
26:33
Speaker 3: indicate he doesn't seem quite right. So maybe he's starting
26:36
Speaker 3: to feel a little better. He has been driving the
26:39
Speaker 3: ball a little bit more, has found the line drive's
26:41
Speaker 3: stroke a little bit better. You go look at the
26:44
Speaker 3: stack cast page and the overall numbers are not at
26:47
Speaker 3: all encouraging, but just the last even week or so
26:51
Speaker 3: more line drives, he just looks a little more engaged.
26:54
Speaker 3: He looks to me like he is feeling better physically.
26:57
Speaker 3: That is my theory for why he has been playing better,
27:00
Speaker 3: and maybe that is encouraging for what could be ahead
27:03
Speaker 3: for a guy who had really struggled at this point
27:05
Speaker 3: in the year.
27:08
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know, like if you look at his
27:11
Speaker 1: savant page, eighty three percent fielding run value, ninety four
27:15
Speaker 1: percent tile and rain. I think the sprint speed has
27:18
Speaker 1: ticked up a little bit as he's gotten healthier, and like,
27:22
Speaker 1: you know, twenty seven percent base running run value. We
27:25
Speaker 1: just know that that's not real. When Zach McKinstry's good,
27:29
Speaker 1: Like we we just like throw that.
27:31
Speaker 3: He's been picked off three times. That wasn't physical, that
27:36
Speaker 3: was that was mental.
27:37
Speaker 1: Well, well everything's connected, it's baseball, you know what I mean.
27:40
Speaker 1: But like when he's good, when he's right, like, that's.
27:42
Speaker 2: Just not a thing.
27:43
Speaker 1: So uh so, yeah, I just if you want to
27:47
Speaker 1: look at a list of encouragement, that is something that
27:51
Speaker 1: is near the top of the list because of what
27:53
Speaker 1: he can do in the trust that AJ has in
27:55
Speaker 1: him to uh to do a lot of things right.
27:58
Speaker 2: So in addition to.
28:00
Speaker 1: To him, he's seen you know, good things behind you, Lee,
28:02
Speaker 1: how about Torque taking some walks Lee taking a walk
28:06
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, like like.
28:07
Speaker 3: That, can't believe you intentionally walk Rightley Green and then
28:10
Speaker 3: your picture walks how you Lee? It was rough.
28:15
Speaker 2: I mean, look, it was a fun series.
28:19
Speaker 1: And in full disclosure, we're recording this before the Rangers
28:22
Speaker 1: game because I am going to said Rangers game and uh,
28:26
Speaker 1: I'd like to like to enjoy a few pops before before.
28:31
Speaker 3: You should have mentioned that earlier. If the Tigers get
28:33
Speaker 3: throttled like eighteen to two. There are people who've been
28:35
Speaker 3: listening this the whole time, like, why why are they
28:37
Speaker 3: talking about like the Tigers being good again?
28:40
Speaker 4: Yeah?
28:41
Speaker 1: That was that would be unfortunate. Maybe or maybe they
28:43
Speaker 1: win eighteen to two and we just missed.
28:45
Speaker 3: And we were on it all right, Well those listening live,
28:48
Speaker 3: let let us know how we.
28:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, if TORQ hits five home runs, I'll come on
28:55
Speaker 1: the five.
28:55
Speaker 3: We'll do we may be doing an emergency episode off
28:58
Speaker 3: he hits five home.
28:59
Speaker 2: Runs game, But it's gonna be a fascinating series.
29:03
Speaker 1: This is you know Texas team that like doesn't feel
29:06
Speaker 1: that great about itself, but they're like when you know,
29:09
Speaker 1: winning or near winning the division. On the exit up
29:11
Speaker 1: to the minute standings are and like, but they're obviously beatable,
29:15
Speaker 1: They're obviously gettable. And that's the schedule now is like
29:19
Speaker 1: teams that have a better record than you but are gettable,
29:22
Speaker 1: can you go get them that? And if they can't,
29:26
Speaker 1: then everything that I said is move. But if they can,
29:30
Speaker 1: now it's got it gets more interesting.
29:33
Speaker 3: Yeah, Rangers are tied for first place. Somehow, they're only
29:36
Speaker 3: in one game above five hundred. The American League remains terrible,
29:39
Speaker 3: but there are some similarities between the Tigers and Rangers
29:41
Speaker 3: in terms of I think kind of the vibe. I
29:44
Speaker 3: think Rangers fans have not loved how the season has gone.
29:47
Speaker 3: I think the Rangers' front office has believed in this team,
29:51
Speaker 3: you know, ever since the World Series, and they haven't
29:54
Speaker 3: replicately did that the past two and a half years.
29:57
Speaker 3: But the front office has still thought it was in there,
29:59
Speaker 3: and they've just wanted to see this team get hot
30:01
Speaker 3: and wanted to see this team get hot, and it
30:03
Speaker 3: hasn't quite happened, but they did have. They're seven and
30:07
Speaker 3: three in their last ten. They've played a little better lately,
30:09
Speaker 3: like they've made a case for themselves in the AO West.
30:12
Speaker 3: Now it's like, okay, can they turn on the get ass?
30:14
Speaker 3: Can they turn on the Jets? Can they really get going?
30:17
Speaker 3: And I think obviously that's how we and how a
30:20
Speaker 3: lot of people feel about the Tigers right now. You
30:22
Speaker 3: think the team and the roster is a little bit
30:24
Speaker 3: better than its record, You think you have premier starting pitching,
30:29
Speaker 3: and you just want the bats to heat up. You
30:31
Speaker 3: want to overall play a more cohesive brand of baseball.
30:35
Speaker 3: So yeah, one of these fan bases will probably feel
30:37
Speaker 3: pretty good about their direction, and one of them will
30:40
Speaker 3: That's how the sport works.
30:43
Speaker 1: And we'll be there to cover it all. So yeah,
30:46
Speaker 1: we'll cover this series in its entirety on Sunday for Monday,
30:51
Speaker 1: and then and then as we get into All Star
30:54
Speaker 1: and MLB Draft, we'll have all that covered here. You
30:57
Speaker 1: can follow us on next probably know his Twitter at
30:59
Speaker 1: Cody Stavenhagen. I'm at here in Underscore Stecley pot page
31:01
Speaker 1: at Tire Territory, Underscore, YouTube, Apple, Spotify, you guys know
31:05
Speaker 1: what to do. We appreciate all of you. So for
31:07
Speaker 1: Cody Stapenhagen, I'm Pierre Steckley. Everybody have great dead