Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / MISSING MOM'S SHOES, SOCKS, JACKET FOUND: WHERE'S FLORENCE? | Featuring "Up and Vanished" Host Payne Lindsey

Transcript

MISSING MOM'S SHOES, SOCKS, JACKET FOUND: WHERE'S FLORENCE? | Featuring "Up and Vanished" Host Payne Lindsey · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 0:06
  Speaker 2: A missing mom's shoes, socks and jacket found, But where's Florence?
• 0:14
  Speaker 2: Good evening, I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank
• 0:17
  Speaker 2: you for being with us.
• 0:19
  Speaker 3: Missing in Alaska, young mom vanishes in the middle of
• 0:22
  Speaker 3: the day. Her family on a restless quest for answers.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: Where is missing mom of Florence? Her disappearance haunting locals. Listen,
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: We load ourselves supports and take off.
• 0:37
  Speaker 4: No Miss.
• 0:38
  Speaker 5: One of those unforgettable spots in history.
• 0:41
  Speaker 3: It sits along the beach of the Baring Sea, just
• 0:43
  Speaker 3: under the Arctic Circle.
• 0:46
  Speaker 4: There's a lot of red flags waving, and they're not
• 0:50
  Speaker 4: choosing to recognize.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: That red flags waving is certainly an understatement. That's where
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: our friend Payne Lindsay's podcast up and vanished The Midnight Sun.
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: How did the whole thing start?
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: Listen?
• 1:05
  Speaker 6: Just a few days after her thirty third birthday, Florence
• 1:08
  Speaker 6: goes to see her sister Blair at work. It isn't
• 1:11
  Speaker 6: unusual that Flow ignores Blair for a few hours after
• 1:14
  Speaker 6: their conversation, but concern grows when Blair learns Florence didn't
• 1:18
  Speaker 6: come home that night. Over the next two days, Blair
• 1:21
  Speaker 6: texts and calls Florence dozens of times, but all of
• 1:24
  Speaker 6: them go unanswered.
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: Joining me in All Star panel to make sense of
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: what we know regarding Florence's disappearance. But first straight out
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: to our friend Payne Lindsey, executive producer of Up and Vanished.
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: I've got a question, ka.
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: When Florence first goes missing, the sister is the one
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: that raised the alarm. She said it was very uncommon
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: for Florence to ignore her calls and texts.
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: Is that true?
• 1:54
  Speaker 7: That's very true. Yeah, she just fell off the map
• 1:57
  Speaker 7: completely and that was odd.
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: Joining us is Aila Johnson, a very close friend of Florence's.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: When the sister.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: Says how unusual it was for Florence to ignore calls
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: and text did you find that to be true as well?
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Initially not entirely.
• 2:18
  Speaker 8: I kind of thought maybe her phone had died, but
• 2:21
  Speaker 8: you know, after several days then it was a deep,
• 2:25
  Speaker 8: true concern.
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: De Ailah Johnson joining us, very close friend of Florence.
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: I'm trying to get a handle on Florence's personality now
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: she's a mother.
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: Would she often just vanish for days on end? I
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: mean so often?
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: Do Ailah I have her police tell anguished family of friends,
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: Oh she's at with her boyfriend or her new boyfriend.
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: There's not one, or she just wants some alone time
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: away from her children. From what I know of Florence,
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: I find that very hard to believe.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: Was that her pattern. Would she go off for alone time?
• 3:08
  Speaker 8: No, But growing up in the nome geographic location, I
• 3:13
  Speaker 8: would say that, you know, sometimes people will go out
• 3:16
  Speaker 8: camping and you don't have reliable connection to communicate with
• 3:22
  Speaker 8: people that maybe.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: Haven't heard from you in a day.
• 3:25
  Speaker 8: It's not uncommon for people to maybe kind of be
• 3:30
  Speaker 8: off grid, especially during that time of year. It's kind
• 3:34
  Speaker 8: of like the end of the summer, so people want
• 3:36
  Speaker 8: to try to get out of town as much.
• 3:38
  Speaker 9: As they can. So at first it wasn't super.
• 3:40
  Speaker 8: Alarming, but I know that a lot of people, mostly
• 3:45
  Speaker 8: the police department, would want to just kind of brush
• 3:50
  Speaker 8: it off, like it's no big deal.
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: So d'alla have you ever known Florence to go camping
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: or hiking ever her children behind where nobody knew how
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: to reach her.
• 4:03
  Speaker 8: No, I mean, she would have given someone a heads up.
• 4:07
  Speaker 8: This isn't routine for her to just disappear the way
• 4:10
  Speaker 8: that this had occurred.
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: So, Deilah, when you state that it wouldn't be uncommon
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: for people to go hiking or camping, actually it would
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: be uncommon for Florence to go hiking or camping without
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: her children, or leave at the very least, leaving them
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: with no idea where their mother was.
• 4:29
  Speaker 9: Correct.
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: How old are the children, may I ask Dihilah.
• 4:32
  Speaker 8: She has one daughter who is about to be eleven.
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: So Deilah, you're referring to her daughter, Aleithia. Did you
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: ever know of a single time, even once when Florence
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: left Alithia without knowing where she was not there to
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: take care of her, and people had to come over
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: and get the daughter.
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: No, never, So Payne Lindsay joining me the star of
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: up and vanished pain.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: I'm trying to get a handle on the beginning of
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: the timeline, because, as you know, I like to start
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: all investigations with that. It could be from the last
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: time a text was received, if that's truly a text
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: from the victim, or in the oj Simpson case, it
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: could be where the neighbors hear the dog wailing in
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: the middle of the night when Nicole Brown was murdered.
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: So timelines are very tricky, but it seems like all
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: we've got to go on here, pain is when the
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: sister realized after a period of time that Florence wasn't responding.
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: Would you agree that's where we start the timeline.
• 5:46
  Speaker 7: Yeah, the timeline is money because it took several days
• 5:49
  Speaker 7: to realize that she's not responding, and then days have
• 5:53
  Speaker 7: gone by from likely the moment that she went missing.
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: Joining me is the director.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: Of the Cold Case Foundation and more important, former homicide
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: detective who has worked over.
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: Three hundred homicides.
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: By the way, he trained the very first Native American
• 6:10
  Speaker 2: homicide task Force. He is the star of the YouTube
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: channel The Interview Room. Chris mcdonnah, thank you for being
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: with us. Explain in simple terms why establishing the exception
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: of the timeline is so important in cracking a missing
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: person or homicide case.
• 6:27
  Speaker 10: Yo, Nancy, So, what we would call that is an
• 6:31
  Speaker 10: initial victimology. So what we want to do is kind
• 6:35
  Speaker 10: of create this fact pattern in relationship to her life.
• 6:39
  Speaker 10: And we know for a fact that she has a
• 6:43
  Speaker 10: daughter at the time who's very young, and we can
• 6:46
  Speaker 10: take a look at that timeline of how she handled
• 6:49
  Speaker 10: that child and if there were any anomalies. We're raising
• 6:53
  Speaker 10: the girl, and then we get to that muddy timeline
• 6:57
  Speaker 10: that you're talking about.
• 6:58
  Speaker 2: Chris McDonough I said, terms no offense.
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: I mean.
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: We got to get out of inside ball and focus
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: on why the timeline is so important. I see it
• 7:11
  Speaker 2: like this, and tell me if I'm wrong. If I
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: could place her alive on a certain day, then I'm
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: not looking at who she was with the day before
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: or the week before. I need to know where she
• 7:22
  Speaker 2: was last seen, who she was with, where she was going.
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: I need to find pings on her phone starting then
• 7:30
  Speaker 2: that's where you start the investigation. Who was she with,
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: what was she doing? Was she in her car somebody
• 7:36
  Speaker 2: else's car? You can't spin your wheels in the wrong timeline.
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: Would you agree with that much?
• 7:45
  Speaker 8: Oh?
• 7:46
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I agree one hundred percent with everything you just said,
• 7:49
  Speaker 10: because that's the starting point that you can move forward,
• 7:52
  Speaker 10: and quite frankly, you can go backwards as well.
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: Take a listen to Crimalline investigator Sydney Sumner.
• 7:58
  Speaker 11: Unable to get in touch with their sister, Blair posts
• 8:01
  Speaker 11: a Facebook asking if anyone seen Florence and starts looking
• 8:05
  Speaker 11: around town. Florence hasn't been to work or the grocery
• 8:08
  Speaker 11: store in neither a Lithia's father or her friends have
• 8:11
  Speaker 11: seen or heard from her. Whair feels like she's exhausted
• 8:14
  Speaker 11: all of her leads. When Naomi, a bartender at bored
• 8:17
  Speaker 11: In Trade, messages Blair, Naomi says she last saw Florence
• 8:21
  Speaker 11: on her birthday, but that a man in the bar
• 8:23
  Speaker 11: says he saw Florence on West Beach with a minor
• 8:26
  Speaker 11: the night she didn't come home.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: Let's talk about the bar, joining me and you know
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: him well, our friend Payne Lindsey star up up and vanished,
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: who has focused on the disappearance of Florence. Tell me
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: about the bar. Why do so many of our cases
• 8:43
  Speaker 2: start at a bar?
• 8:44
  Speaker 7: Pain It sure does seem like it Innaom. This is
• 8:48
  Speaker 7: one of the few gathering places. Gnome is not a
• 8:52
  Speaker 7: huge place, but this bar is super old. It's been
• 8:56
  Speaker 7: there a long time and is right there on Front Street,
• 8:58
  Speaker 7: right near the water right downtown, a popular spot for
• 9:02
  Speaker 7: locals to go and even tourists to go. And she
• 9:06
  Speaker 7: was seen there and we know that because I went
• 9:10
  Speaker 7: myself with my team and I talked to patrons. I
• 9:14
  Speaker 7: also talked to the bartender who works there and she
• 9:18
  Speaker 7: recalls seeing her, and people have multiple witnesses have placed
• 9:23
  Speaker 7: her having been there before.
• 9:24
  Speaker 4: Leaving that night.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: Can you tell me, Payne, was she there to meet
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: a friend? Was she there with girlfriends? So many things
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: can go wrong at a bar. What do we know
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: about what occurred at the bar? Did anyone notice anything
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: at all out of the ordinary?
• 9:42
  Speaker 7: Having talked to Florence's sister, it seemed like during the
• 9:47
  Speaker 7: time of her disappearance, when she would have been at
• 9:50
  Speaker 7: this bar, she was kind of going through her own
• 9:53
  Speaker 7: personal life struggles and was you know, expressing that to
• 9:58
  Speaker 7: other people around her friends Fai and she was there
• 10:01
  Speaker 7: by herself, but we know that she was also surrounded
• 10:04
  Speaker 7: by other individuals, all men who are gold miners, who
• 10:11
  Speaker 7: are essentially traveling through and they go in and they
• 10:16
  Speaker 7: go out and aren't from Nome, but are therefore Oh no.
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: Pain, you're telling me they're transience.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: Absolutely okay, you're giving me a chill down my spine
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: yet again, Pain, You're famous for giving people chills down
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: their spines. Because I'm thinking of a case that you
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: and I have both covered out of Florida, Jennifer KESSI
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: because Kessie goes missing, You go into her place. The
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: parents go into her place the next day when she
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: doesn't answer calls, just like in this case, they find
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: where her clothes are laid out to go to work
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: the following morning, the showers actually still damp.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: No sign of Jennifer. Where do transience fit into this?
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: You know where?
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: Because surrounding her condo was a lot of development down
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: in Florida and a lot of transience building the condos,
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: I mean, when they're gone, they're gone. Nobody has their name,
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: they're LKA last known addresses by.
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: Could they be witnesses?
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: Could they be perpetrators? They could be either of those.
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: So you're telling me many people in the bar that
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: night are a mail and don't fight with me about
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: this pain. We all know that the perp, if there
• 11:35
  Speaker 2: is one, is likely a male. Statistically, don't start with
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: women can kidnap.
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: And murder too. I know that, But I'm telling you
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: that's not what happened. So she's at a bar pain.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: According to you, you've been to the bar that night.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: She's surrounded by a lot of guys, and many of
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: them are transient miners. Is that right?
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: That's a recipe for disaster.
• 11:58
  Speaker 7: Pain, lindsay, that's absolutely correct, and it was a recipe
• 12:01
  Speaker 7: for disaster because that's the last known place.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: Hey, Pain, when you went in the bar. Tell me
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: about the bar. It's what's it like? I mean, honestly,
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: it's a super small place. It's old, it's dusty. You
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: have some locals in there who seem like they spend
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: you know, half their days in there.
• 12:20
  Speaker 7: You have a couple random people who are visiting, and
• 12:24
  Speaker 7: it seems like a consistent bar clientele that circles in
• 12:29
  Speaker 7: and out.
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: Pain. I like that part because, yeah, that means if
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: you see the same people like Cheers, right, yea Cheers,
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: you know everybody, and they would know her and they
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: could give me some leads.
• 12:43
  Speaker 7: Right, you'd think, so yeah, unless that person was harboring
• 12:46
  Speaker 7: a secret.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: You know, Pain, I've come to be very suspicious when
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: you say things like you'd think, so, okay, who is Florence.
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: Let's look at that. Who is Florence?
• 12:56
  Speaker 2: Can looking at her at her standard routine, her personality
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: even give me a clue. Listen Florence's flow.
• 13:06
  Speaker 6: Akpilook is the youngest of seven siblings, raised in the
• 13:09
  Speaker 6: small village of Wales, Alaska. Florence learns to practice subsistence,
• 13:13
  Speaker 6: just as inu ancestors lived off the land.
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: But when Florence.
• 13:17
  Speaker 6: Learns she is expecting a baby girl, she decides to
• 13:20
  Speaker 6: move about one hundred miles south to the larger city
• 13:23
  Speaker 6: of Nome so her daughter has better access to healthcare
• 13:26
  Speaker 6: and education.
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: Her daughter her whole world.
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: She's even willing to maybe one hundred miles away for
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: a better life for her daughter.
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: What more do we know?
• 13:36
  Speaker 12: Lawrence gets a job working in the hospital with Norton
• 13:39
  Speaker 12: Sound Health Corporation and is a wonderful mother to a Lithia,
• 13:42
  Speaker 12: now six years old. Florence is well known and well
• 13:45
  Speaker 12: liked in Nome and becomes close with siblings that live
• 13:48
  Speaker 12: in Nome, a brother and a sister, Blair, who is
• 13:50
  Speaker 12: now expecting a baby of her own. Florence has plenty
• 13:53
  Speaker 12: of friends to celebrate with her for her birthday, stopping
• 13:56
  Speaker 12: in at Board of Trade, one of the oldest bars
• 13:58
  Speaker 12: in town.
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: Authorities on a desperate mission to find a missing Alaskan mom.
• 14:10
  Speaker 3: As the FBI joins.
• 14:11
  Speaker 6: The search, Blair reports Florence missing at six fifteen PM
• 14:15
  Speaker 6: that evening, two days after she last saw her sister
• 14:18
  Speaker 6: two days after the report, searches begin for the young mom.
• 14:22
  Speaker 6: Nome PD and dozens of volunteers go up and down
• 14:25
  Speaker 6: West Beach searching for any sign of Florence. FBI agents
• 14:29
  Speaker 6: and canine units eventually join the search, and one more
• 14:32
  Speaker 6: piece of Florence's clothing is discovered, but there's no other
• 14:35
  Speaker 6: leads on Florence.
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: Ocpolok socks and ses left behind of a missing mom.
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: But where is Florence?
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: You may be.
• 14:43
  Speaker 1: Sitting down, but you may need to lay down.
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: Wrote what you're about to hear the working theory of
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: the local PD. Brace yourself, listen well.
• 14:54
  Speaker 12: There are many theories on what happened to Florence Akpelock.
• 14:57
  Speaker 12: Nome PD has released very few details on their investigation.
• 15:01
  Speaker 12: Their only official theory is a bear attack and they
• 15:04
  Speaker 12: simply haven't found the body. The public has very little
• 15:06
  Speaker 12: trust in the department, which struggles remain staffed. Chief William
• 15:10
  Speaker 12: Crockett agrees to an interview with Payne Lindsay, but isn't
• 15:13
  Speaker 12: in the office at the agreed upon time, then fails
• 15:16
  Speaker 12: to return any calls afterwards. The FBI assisted with searches
• 15:20
  Speaker 12: shortly after Florence's disappearance, but agents now direct anyone looking
• 15:24
  Speaker 12: for information on her case back to nome PD.
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: Okay, let me understand this. The working theory is that
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: Florence died of a bear attack. Well, let me get
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: straight out to a veteran trial lawyer, Randolph Rice, joining
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: us former prosecutor, current criminal defense attorney, no stranger to
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: a courtroom, and what that means is he knows evidence, really, Randolph,
• 15:51
  Speaker 2: So you're going to defend a case like this, And
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: the theory is what that mommy took off for socks
• 15:57
  Speaker 2: before the bear ate her.
• 15:58
  Speaker 13: Yeah, this looks like the non police apartments attempt to
• 16:01
  Speaker 13: sort of push this under the rug because they can't
• 16:03
  Speaker 13: seem to put together the evidence that they need to
• 16:05
  Speaker 13: ultimately say what happened to Florence. You know, nobody leaves
• 16:09
  Speaker 13: the scene with their socks and their shoes and their
• 16:12
  Speaker 13: clothes just it doesn't make sense, which leans to the
• 16:15
  Speaker 13: probability that this was foul play, and therefore the known
• 16:18
  Speaker 13: police department needs to follow that foul play trail of evidence.
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: Somebody needs to put a fire under their rear.
• 16:24
  Speaker 8: End.
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: Angela Arnold, excuse me, doctor Angela Arnold joining us renowned
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: psychiatrists out of the Atlanta jurisdiction, whose expertise is focusing
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: on the mental and emotional welfare of women. Doctor Arnold,
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: do you ever get tired of police investigators? Ellie in
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: general law enforcement? And I am former law enforcement. Okay,
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: so this is a bitter peal for me to swallow.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: When a woman goes missing, they say, oh, she's having
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: a time. She is with her whoever, you can fill
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: in the blank. Ex boyfriend, lover. What hold up in
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: some hotel having a great time while her daughter's sitting
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: at home trying to find something to eat.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: But here they really take the cake, doctor Angela.
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: They say, a bear ate her. I mean, if I
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: were her family, I would want to go burn down
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: the police department a bear. Yeah.
• 17:23
  Speaker 14: And you know, Nancy in they're wasting time, And everybody
• 17:26
  Speaker 14: knows how important those those first minutes and days are
• 17:30
  Speaker 14: in finding someone that has gone missing. Why don't they
• 17:35
  Speaker 14: If that's all they have to offer to the situation,
• 17:38
  Speaker 14: then they just need to keep their mouths shut, because Nancy,
• 17:41
  Speaker 14: that is the least helpful thing that anyone could have
• 17:44
  Speaker 14: said in this Okay, So, now this poor woman has
• 17:48
  Speaker 14: been missing, any kind of evidence is gone, and all
• 17:51
  Speaker 14: the police can come up with.
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: By the minute.
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: Yes, hey, the evidence is evaporating. Pain. Lens that you
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: heard what doctor Angela Arnold had to say. Pain. Is
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: this really a working theory?
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: No wonder the share of hid?
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: What was he under his desk when you went.
• 18:07
  Speaker 7: To interview, he was back there hiding somewhere. I mean,
• 18:12
  Speaker 7: I just wish that they would shoot me straight. The
• 18:15
  Speaker 7: job of just talking about this case with a journalist
• 18:20
  Speaker 7: isn't that complicated, But they made it complicated because I
• 18:24
  Speaker 7: think that they're embarrassed so pain.
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: Hey, guys, if you don't know, Payne Lindsay, got to
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: listen to his podcast Up and Vanished. He was incredible
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: on the Tara Grinstead case. And here's his new one
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: in the Midnight Sun, referring to, of course this case
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: in no pain. How can they say with a straight
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: face a bear did it?
• 18:47
  Speaker 7: Well, they don't say it with a straight face.
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: They hide their face.
• 18:50
  Speaker 7: Actually, if you try to ask them that question in person,
• 18:54
  Speaker 7: they'll say, yeah, i'll meet you tomorrow and then they'll
• 18:56
  Speaker 7: dodge you. I don't know how anyone.
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: Could say that with a straight face.
• 19:01
  Speaker 7: Bears don't eat jeans and shoes and cell phones and
• 19:07
  Speaker 7: stuff like that.
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: That's ridiculous, Paine. I'm sorry I have to correct you
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: on air, but this was a very picky bear.
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: He took off her shoes and socks. He didn't eat them, right.
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: I mean how they can say this with a straight face.
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: Of course, as Payne Lindsay accurately points out, they don't
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: say it with a straight face. They hide when they
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: say things like.
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: A bear ate her.
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: Deilah Johnson joining us, a very dear friend of Florence'silah,
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: did you hear this wacky zany theory that a bear
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: ate her? Unfortunately?
• 19:44
  Speaker 8: I hear that as a resolution to several missing people,
• 19:49
  Speaker 8: because it seems as though that's a really easy way
• 19:54
  Speaker 8: to put a resolution on any missing person in our area.
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: Well, Deilah Johnson is exactly correct. A bear eight fill
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: in the blank seems to be the go to for
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: local law enforces. This would be laughable if a mother
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: wasn't missing, and I suspect very strongly that she has
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: been murdered. Does the name Joseph Baldaras ring a bell?
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: If not, it will now listen.
• 20:26
  Speaker 11: Joseph Baldaras works a gnome as the law clerk and
• 20:30
  Speaker 11: is an avid outdoorsman who loves hiking, running, and fishing
• 20:33
  Speaker 11: out in the country. Joseph always responds to his fiancee,
• 20:37
  Speaker 11: Meghan's text as quickly as possible, but Saturday morning, Joseph
• 20:41
  Speaker 11: stops answering her. When Joseph doesn't show up for work
• 20:44
  Speaker 11: Monday morning, his family knows something is seriously wrong. That afternoon,
• 20:49
  Speaker 11: Joseph's truck is found backed into a pullout forty four
• 20:52
  Speaker 11: miles from town. Searches turn up nothing, and Joseph's roommate
• 20:56
  Speaker 11: is caught lying to police about his whereabouts Friday and
• 21:00
  Speaker 11: on Saturday night, but authorities truck is disappearance up to
• 21:03
  Speaker 11: a bear attack.
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: Okay, apparently the bear can drive because the bear backed
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: the victim's vehicle into a pullout.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: And there's more.
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: Take a listen to our friends at ktv F.
• 21:17
  Speaker 5: A search dog unit alerted to bowl there is sent
• 21:19
  Speaker 5: about a mile down the road from his truck, but
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: lost the trails soon after. Search pilots reported a noticeable
• 21:24
  Speaker 5: amount of bear activity in the area, but his family
• 21:27
  Speaker 5: suggested that they suspect fellow play pain.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: Help me, How can this stand?
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: How can one case after the next be attributed to
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: quote bear activity. There's no evidence. You recall you and
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: I have discussed me to many times the case of
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: Susanne Morphew, where it's claimed that a while animal dragged
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: her off. There's no sign of animal activity. There's no blood,
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: there's no drag marks which you would find if this
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: had happened. There is no half eaten carcass, there are
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: no bones, there's no other clothing, nothing to suggest that happened.
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: In any of the three cases we're talking about right now,
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: specifically with.
• 22:13
  Speaker 7: Florence, it's just an easy cop out response. I mean,
• 22:17
  Speaker 7: the thing is, like you said, if this is their theory,
• 22:21
  Speaker 7: usually a theory is backed by some sort of information
• 22:24
  Speaker 7: that supports that. I would entertain the bear theory if
• 22:27
  Speaker 7: there was any evidence at all that suggested that.
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: But there isn't.
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: There's nothing, So.
• 22:34
  Speaker 7: That's just a blanket excuse answer for basically, in other words,
• 22:41
  Speaker 7: I don't know, or we screwed.
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: Up Florence our pe luck. Last scene leaving a tent
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: on Alaska's West Beach, her family desperate for answers.
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: Leaving a tent on the beach, Well, that's odd because
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: when does it say she was last seen at a bar?
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: Or was she with a ba Listen.
• 23:01
  Speaker 11: Payne Lindsay, host of the Up and Vanish podcast, travels
• 23:04
  Speaker 11: to Nome to investigate Florence's disappearance. Lindsay gets in contact
• 23:09
  Speaker 11: with Naomi, the bartender from Bored and Trade, who got
• 23:12
  Speaker 11: the tip from a patron that Florence was last seen
• 23:15
  Speaker 11: on West Beach. Naomi says the man came to know
• 23:18
  Speaker 11: him as a freelance gold miner, but also drove a
• 23:20
  Speaker 11: taxi in town for Checkers Cabs. The man resided in
• 23:24
  Speaker 11: a tent on West Beach. Naomi only knew him as
• 23:28
  Speaker 11: Oregon John to a very.
• 23:30
  Speaker 2: Dear friend, Florence's Jailah Johnson, author of One on One Dailah,
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: is that common that the transient miners that come to
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: them live in tent villages?
• 23:46
  Speaker 8: Yes, the entire summer. The population of No Malaska fluctuates
• 23:51
  Speaker 8: probably two thousand during the summer, so that people think
• 23:56
  Speaker 8: that they're going to know him to get rich.
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: Okay, that's not helpful at all, Dilah. I'm not saying
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: it's not true. I know it to be true what
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: you just said. But to Chris McDonough joining me veteran
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: homicide detective, not helpful at all that there is an
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: entire transient village and that's not the first place police
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: went or sheriffs went. Everyone else in that bar, according
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: to Payne Lindsay, is likely a local except for the transience. Okay,
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: So when you throw into a situation Chris mcdonoughh one variable,
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: and that being transience at the bar that night, that's
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: where you go. The rest of the world doesn't understand
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: that this is normal. For no and other mining areas.
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: People flood in for a mining season and then they disappear,
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: just like transience disappeared from the Jennifer Kessey scene.
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: They're there for the work.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: And then they leave, and once they leave, you'll never
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: find them again.
• 25:06
  Speaker 9: Yeah.
• 25:06
  Speaker 10: Absolutely, And that point of contact I e. Where these
• 25:10
  Speaker 10: old transients go, I E. The bar potentially. But more importantly,
• 25:16
  Speaker 10: one of the things I want to point out, Nancy,
• 25:18
  Speaker 10: that you mentioned is there's a witness that says, you know, well,
• 25:22
  Speaker 10: she was last seen on the beach with a minor
• 25:26
  Speaker 10: coming out of a tent. Well that individual just put
• 25:28
  Speaker 10: themselves at the beach watching her come out of a tent.
• 25:33
  Speaker 10: So that's a huge red flag. If it's the same
• 25:35
  Speaker 10: guy there, you go, let's start from there.
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: Man, you are so right, Payne Lindsay joining me, host
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: of up and Vanas, who has been investigating Florence's disappearance,
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: even traveling to know to find out what he could
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: and trying to confront local La who basically hid from him.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: So the bartender, the female bartender, Naomi at the Board
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: and Trade, get's a tip that Florence's last seen on
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: West Beach. What else did she learn?
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: Pain?
• 26:07
  Speaker 7: She learned that she was with a specific individual who
• 26:11
  Speaker 7: she knew by a nickname, a pseudonym. Oregon John was
• 26:16
  Speaker 7: his name.
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: What can you tell me about clothing? About Florence's clothing
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: being found?
• 26:23
  Speaker 7: So, Oregon John was a minor like several others who
• 26:27
  Speaker 7: were camped out on this area of West Beach, and
• 26:31
  Speaker 7: at nighttime they would kind of have parties and stuff there,
• 26:34
  Speaker 7: and they were all transient people. Flows items, her personal items,
• 26:40
  Speaker 7: her clothing was found outside of this man's tent. And
• 26:46
  Speaker 7: when someone goes missing and you have her things in
• 26:50
  Speaker 7: your possession, it would be common sense to ask this
• 26:56
  Speaker 7: person what the hell happened? But that was never done
• 27:00
  Speaker 7: in an official capacity. In this case, pay.
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: When you say her items are you talking about the
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: socks as we've heard about, Are you talking about her
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: bra and underwear?
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: What was found?
• 27:10
  Speaker 7: There's mixed conflicting reports of that because initially it was
• 27:14
  Speaker 7: FLOE's family who was out there searching, and they're the
• 27:17
  Speaker 7: ones who discovered that any of her items at all
• 27:21
  Speaker 7: were in this man's possession, but he willingly gave it
• 27:25
  Speaker 7: over to the police and to the family. The fact
• 27:30
  Speaker 7: that he has anything of hers at all is strange
• 27:34
  Speaker 7: because that's the last place she was. Why would she
• 27:37
  Speaker 7: not leave with her clothes on?
• 27:40
  Speaker 6: Blair and several family members canvas West Beach, asking anyone
• 27:43
  Speaker 6: who will talk to them about Florence. Eventually, a man
• 27:47
  Speaker 6: says he saw Florence leaving a nearby tent a round
• 27:49
  Speaker 6: four pm. The man asks Blair to wait a moment
• 27:52
  Speaker 6: and rummages around inside his tent. He returns with Florence's socks, shoes,
• 27:56
  Speaker 6: and jacket. Bewildered, Blair asked where Florence is and why
• 28:00
  Speaker 6: he has her things. The man seems to clam up,
• 28:03
  Speaker 6: but insists he did not bring Florence to West Beach
• 28:06
  Speaker 6: and he found her belongings outside his tent.
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: Where is Florence? Uck pluck, the mom last seen leaving
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: a gold miner's tent before vanishing into the Alaskan wilderness.
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: At the bar on the beach in a tent. Then
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: we hear disturbing reports about a very eerie phone call
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: made by Florence that night.
• 28:34
  Speaker 11: Listen Gnome Pedi also follows up with the man who
• 28:37
  Speaker 11: gave Blair some of Florence's clothing. The man gives cops
• 28:41
  Speaker 11: the same story of finding her belongings outside his tent
• 28:44
  Speaker 11: and turns over one more item, Florence's cell phone. Law
• 28:48
  Speaker 11: enforcement never publicly divulges if anything found on the phone
• 28:51
  Speaker 11: provided new leads, but according to a local with friends
• 28:54
  Speaker 11: on the search and rescue team, Florence made a troubling
• 28:57
  Speaker 11: call to a friend that night, saying, I'm in the
• 29:00
  Speaker 11: bushes with some people. They're passing something around and I
• 29:04
  Speaker 11: don't feel safe.
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: With my close friend of Florence's, her confidant Deilah Johnson,
• 29:10
  Speaker 2: author of one of our own Danna, thank you for
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: being with us. What do you know about this phone
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: call made by Florence?
• 29:19
  Speaker 8: That it's terrifying that it does kind of provide more
• 29:25
  Speaker 8: than just speculation on what maybe had occurred, that evening to.
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: Payne Lindsay, who has been investigating Florence's disappearance. Payne, what
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: do we know about the call? Who did she call?
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: And how do you decipher what she said? She was clearly.
• 29:42
  Speaker 7: Scared, she was in a state of distress, and she
• 29:47
  Speaker 7: names being with multiple individuals. Now I know these people's names.
• 29:52
  Speaker 7: I have not publicly stated all of them because sometimes
• 29:56
  Speaker 7: I'm still talking to but collect actively. Here you have
• 30:01
  Speaker 7: a group of men who were the last people to
• 30:04
  Speaker 7: see Florence alive and then she simply vanishes. These people
• 30:10
  Speaker 7: need to be questioned by law enforcement. The fact that
• 30:13
  Speaker 7: they haven't been is ridiculous.
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's like the Terry Grinsday case all over again. Well,
• 30:21
  Speaker 2: can you tell me about another conflicting story? Pain a
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: story that another witness states that Florence was with his
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: neighbor the night before, driving on the beach on an
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: ATV all terrain vehicle, and then the witness sees the
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: neighbor returning and Florence wasn't there.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: It was just the neighbor.
• 30:45
  Speaker 7: Bottom line is you can sit here and look at
• 30:47
  Speaker 7: all the different conflicting stories and theories. When you whittle
• 30:51
  Speaker 7: it all down, which I've done my best to do here.
• 30:55
  Speaker 15: What stays true is that she was at the bar,
• 31:00
  Speaker 15: then she left and went to West Beach, no matter
• 31:03
  Speaker 15: how she got there, and she has never been seen
• 31:06
  Speaker 15: since then.
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: Do you believe those witnesses pain?
• 31:08
  Speaker 7: I believe that the timing of everything may not be perfect, right.
• 31:14
  Speaker 7: I think that the bottom line is she was there.
• 31:17
  Speaker 7: There's physical evidence that she was there. Her stuff is there,
• 31:20
  Speaker 7: so we know for the fact that she was there
• 31:22
  Speaker 7: and people saw her correct and it was outside of
• 31:26
  Speaker 7: a specific tint, not just any tent.
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: We know whose tint it was. Why do you have
• 31:32
  Speaker 2: her stuff?
• 31:33
  Speaker 7: I don't have any missing person's stuff outside of my tent.
• 31:37
  Speaker 2: To make matters even more heartbreaking. In addition to what Payne,
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: Lindsay accurately points out that none of these witnesses have
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: been questioned, much less under oath. Many of them gone
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: dispersed at the end of the season. The family, they're
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: the ones that are out searching for Florence. Listen.
• 31:58
  Speaker 12: After two weeks with no leads from West Beach, law
• 32:01
  Speaker 12: enforcement agencies suspend their searches. Florence's family returns to beach
• 32:06
  Speaker 12: every day for eight months, refusing to give up on Florence,
• 32:09
  Speaker 12: but felt that someone didn't want them searching there. Family
• 32:12
  Speaker 12: members have several videos of two men in a black
• 32:15
  Speaker 12: truck following them as they search along the beach. In
• 32:18
  Speaker 12: one incident, the passenger sticks a gun out of the
• 32:20
  Speaker 12: window and fire shots in the air. Nome PD seems
• 32:23
  Speaker 12: to brush off their concerns and ask the family to
• 32:26
  Speaker 12: back off and let them do their job.
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: Payne lindsay, in addition to the time that the local ELI,
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: I guess the sheriff didn't show up for an interview.
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: It's an eerie reminder for me the Natalie Holloway case.
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: Beth Twitty and I went back, as you know, to
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: Aruba to try to scare up some more leads, and
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: it was there we drove by a structure pain and
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: she said, yeah, I sat in there for five hours
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: waiting to speak to the chief of police. They told
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: me he was at the barber shop. They told me this.
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: They told me that after five hours, he walks out,
• 33:06
  Speaker 2: not realizing she's still sitting there rubbing his stomach because
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: they had just brought him food so he wouldn't have
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: to see her.
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: He ate in his office and then ran into her.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: I mean that sounds like what's happening now with them
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: ducking you. As a matter of fact, you're not the
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: only one he's ducking.
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: Listen pain.
• 33:27
  Speaker 11: Months into the search for Florence, Aunc Piollok, her best
• 33:30
  Speaker 11: friend to Aila, and sister Blair hold a march for
• 33:33
  Speaker 11: missing and murdered Indigenous people through downtown Nome, ending in
• 33:37
  Speaker 11: a local genesium for several speakers to highlight their loved ones.
• 33:41
  Speaker 11: While Blair speaks expressing concern for the lack of police
• 33:45
  Speaker 11: investigation through heart wrenching sobs. The Nome PD chief makes
• 33:49
  Speaker 11: an appearance, shocking the crowd, but the chief isn't there
• 33:53
  Speaker 11: for the event. He calmly walks past the crowd to
• 33:56
  Speaker 11: the gym equipment for his workout.
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: Geolo Johnson tell me what.
• 34:01
  Speaker 9: That was A.
• 34:03
  Speaker 8: I mean, when we gather to support and honor any
• 34:07
  Speaker 8: mmi w G or m MIP individual as natives, you know,
• 34:13
  Speaker 8: we it's a It's already a challenging time because we
• 34:16
  Speaker 8: are having to honor those that aren't with us anymore,
• 34:19
  Speaker 8: and a lot of the time there's a lot of
• 34:20
  Speaker 8: systemic injustice. But when we were specifically honoring managing Florence Socpiollock,
• 34:28
  Speaker 8: and then we also noticed that the chief is there
• 34:31
  Speaker 8: for a workout. That was also just heartrenching for us,
• 34:38
  Speaker 8: because we would love.
• 34:40
  Speaker 9: To have.
• 34:42
  Speaker 8: The entire community, all law enforcement, search and rescue, all
• 34:45
  Speaker 8: community leaders, all people within the community come together because
• 34:50
  Speaker 8: we all it's an isolated area, and so if we
• 34:52
  Speaker 8: can all help one another and support one another, I
• 34:56
  Speaker 8: think there would be there would be better relationships, and
• 35:01
  Speaker 8: the lack of trust probably wouldn't be such a stain
• 35:05
  Speaker 8: on the community.
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: Members PAYLUSA just having a horrible time understanding the sheriff.
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: While family and friends are out there bringing awareness to
• 35:14
  Speaker 2: Florence's disappearance, he walks up like he's going to the
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: vigil and it just keeps walking and goes to the
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: gym to work out.
• 35:24
  Speaker 7: I mean, come on, bro, even if giving him the
• 35:28
  Speaker 7: benefit of the doubt, that is just the biggest lack
• 35:31
  Speaker 7: of awareness I've ever seen. Clearly, you do not care
• 35:35
  Speaker 7: about this case. Clearly, if you didn't know this was happening,
• 35:38
  Speaker 7: you're not actively investigating it. All that tells me is
• 35:42
  Speaker 7: that hand over the damn case file then, because you're
• 35:45
  Speaker 7: not doing anything about it and you're comfortable being rude
• 35:49
  Speaker 7: in public and sending this strange message to people who
• 35:53
  Speaker 7: are fighting for justice right here out in the open
• 35:56
  Speaker 7: in your own town.
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: Take a listen to up and banished the midnight Sun.
• 36:02
  Speaker 9: There we are.
• 36:04
  Speaker 16: He took a beautiful person from this earth. I hope
• 36:08
  Speaker 16: you feel horrible and you feel guilty. I love you.
• 36:13
  Speaker 11: Okay.
• 36:17
  Speaker 4: There's actual facts that need to be run to ground,
• 36:20
  Speaker 4: that need to be looked into because they're very.
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: Suspicious crime stories with Nancy Grace. Who is this so
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: called Oregon John, his moniker that was last scene with Florence.
• 36:43
  Speaker 1: Well, this is what we've learned about him.
• 36:45
  Speaker 11: It turns out Oregon John has ninety three arrests in Gnome.
• 36:50
  Speaker 11: The charges include everything from disorderly conduct, criminal trespass, harassment,
• 36:55
  Speaker 11: probation violation, and cruelty to animals to theft's assaults and
• 37:00
  Speaker 11: two rapes. Oregon John appears to be very dangerous, and
• 37:04
  Speaker 11: with John having Florence his socks, shoes, jacket, and cell phone,
• 37:09
  Speaker 11: he may very well be the last person to see her.
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Pay Lindsay joining us, who has spent so many months
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: investigating Florence's disappearance.
• 37:19
  Speaker 1: Where is he now?
• 37:22
  Speaker 7: I know exactly where he is I'm not going to
• 37:24
  Speaker 7: say it on live air right now because mostly because
• 37:28
  Speaker 7: you have a lot of listeners and viewers, and so
• 37:30
  Speaker 7: do I. I don't want the Good Samaritans to go
• 37:35
  Speaker 7: spook this guy anymore. But I'm in communication with them,
• 37:40
  Speaker 7: and I have maintained that he has questions that need answers,
• 37:46
  Speaker 7: and everything points back to Oregon. John. You can dive
• 37:50
  Speaker 7: down a million rabbit holes, but you must explain why
• 37:55
  Speaker 7: he had her things. And look at who we're talking
• 37:57
  Speaker 7: about here. Ninety three and offenses, rape, cruelty to animals.
• 38:03
  Speaker 7: These aren't petty offenses. This is a big This paints
• 38:09
  Speaker 7: a character of somebody who is dangerous.
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: Between him walking free with ninety three offenses and the
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: shriff hiding under his desk when you try to interview him.
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: Chris mcdonnad joining me, veteran homicide detective and star of
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: the Interview Room on YouTube.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: Chris.
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: In any other universe other than Nome, Alaska, this guy
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: would be alone in a jail cell under the jail,
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: but instead he's out free having long chats with Payne Lindsay.
• 38:40
  Speaker 10: Yeah, and he's dangerous, And the fact that this guy's
• 38:43
  Speaker 10: an apex predator is what we'll call him. And I
• 38:47
  Speaker 10: think if they took cadaver dogs within probably fifty yards
• 38:51
  Speaker 10: of that tent, they they may really want to focus
• 38:55
  Speaker 10: very clearly in that particular geographic type of profile.
• 39:00
  Speaker 9: And by the way, he hasn't stopped.
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: Chris, please spare me any evidence that would have been near.
• 39:07
  Speaker 2: That tent is long gone. It's on the beach number one.
• 39:11
  Speaker 9: Except for except for except for her body.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: Yes, yes, but I guarantee you the body is.
• 39:17
  Speaker 9: He's he's not taking a book.
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: Okay, that's a really good point.
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: And another thing I'd like to point out, this is
• 39:22
  Speaker 2: by far the first time that someone disappears in Nome,
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: and usually they blame it on a bear.
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: But take a listen to this.
• 39:32
  Speaker 17: Case brought a greater accountability to the police department in
• 39:37
  Speaker 17: the city of Nome. You now have a records management
• 39:41
  Speaker 17: system and it'll be a little bit harder for a
• 39:45
  Speaker 17: police officer to do it. Owens was able to do
• 39:50
  Speaker 17: to the city of Nome and to the known police department.
• 39:57
  Speaker 16: So we thought, hey, I wonder if always picked up
• 39:59
  Speaker 16: a gun from the HEAVI and slacker, they could always
• 40:02
  Speaker 16: return it, presumably so nobody would know send it to
• 40:06
  Speaker 16: Bob Sham at the crime lab and like a eighty
• 40:10
  Speaker 16: ninety percent match somewhere in there. So we're fairly confident
• 40:13
  Speaker 16: that we had the right gun.
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: So many people missing out of Nome, Alaska accounted for.
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: That's where our friends at Oxygen Payne lindsay, is Florence's
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: case going to end up like all the others out
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: of known know where there is no resolution and they
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: end up just saying bear attack. No, it's not.
• 40:35
  Speaker 7: Mostly because of people like Deila in the community and
• 40:39
  Speaker 7: our team and you keeping this case alive. The bottom
• 40:43
  Speaker 7: line is I try to talk to local police. They
• 40:47
  Speaker 7: didn't want to. They're not going to be able to
• 40:48
  Speaker 7: help me anyways. I bet you their case file is
• 40:51
  Speaker 7: literally a paragraph on a page. They haven't done anything actively.
• 40:57
  Speaker 7: We don't need them to help us. The bottom line
• 41:00
  Speaker 7: is at this point, based on their history, I mean
• 41:04
  Speaker 7: a known police officer killed a woman one time, they
• 41:07
  Speaker 7: don't have a good track record here. Someone from the
• 41:11
  Speaker 7: state agency or even the FBI, because they do this
• 41:14
  Speaker 7: in small towns like this in Alaska, needs to step
• 41:18
  Speaker 7: in and look at this objectively and say, hey, let's
• 41:22
  Speaker 7: try to figure this out. There's a lot of red
• 41:25
  Speaker 7: flags waving, but they're doing nothing about it. If anything,
• 41:29
  Speaker 7: they're hindering journalists like myself from uncovering more truth.
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: You know, you mentioned one of the la they are
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: actually being responsible for a disappearance. That was Sonya Ivanoff
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: that we were just discussing. Who vanishes but pain there
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: are so many others as you are uncovering guys his
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: podcast Amazing up and vanish.
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: This is the Midnight Sun.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: Many people attribute pain to cracking the case of Terara Grinstead,
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: and I pray to God this case will also be cracked.
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: Dailah Johnson joining us, a very dear friend of Florence's,
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: her little girl still wanting mommy. I don't want Florence's
• 42:18
  Speaker 2: case to just be another statistic in No Alaska where
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: they end up a year from now going oh yeah
• 42:26
  Speaker 2: close case bear did it me?
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: Neither?
• 42:30
  Speaker 8: And I'm so grateful for all of the platforms available
• 42:35
  Speaker 8: to raise awareness around this case, because oftentimes it is
• 42:40
  Speaker 8: not well covered in the news and in any media.
• 42:45
  Speaker 8: So it has been wonderful because I know that law
• 42:47
  Speaker 8: enforcement feels the pressure, and there has been a lot
• 42:49
  Speaker 8: of tension within the community based on a lot of
• 42:53
  Speaker 8: the talk around town now, and I think that it
• 42:56
  Speaker 8: has brought a lot of other conversations where previously community
• 43:01
  Speaker 8: members were nervous to speak about this, and now it's
• 43:05
  Speaker 8: becoming more of a comfortable conversation.
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: If you know or think you know anything about the
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: disappearance of Florence or about so called Oregon John, I
• 43:18
  Speaker 2: beg you dial nine zero seven four four three five
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: two six ' two repeat nine zero seven four four
• 43:27
  Speaker 2: three five.
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: Two six ' two.
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: If you want to make a change, contact the Governor's
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: office in Alaska. Do they not know that Gnome law
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: enforcement blame one disappearance after the next on bear attacks?
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: How can that stand?
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: How can the governor show his face number nine zero
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: seven two six nine fifty one hundred, call him by name?
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: Greg Taylor. We waked as justice unfolds God willing in
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: the disappearance of Florence. Nancy Grace signing off, goodbye friend,