Latest / The Occult Rejects / When Music Becomes Magick: Sound, Spirit, and the Occult Body with Aerik Arkadian

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When Music Becomes Magick: Sound, Spirit, and the Occult Body with Aerik Arkadian · The Occult Rejects

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: You see something's going to happen. What? What's going to happen? What?
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Occult Rejects. In this episode, we
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: have a returning guest. We had him on in the
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: past for Fluid Condensers, had a book. I don't come
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: on to talk about it. If you haven't checked that
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: episode out, I highly suggest there you go. Yep, there
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: you go the Fluid Condensers. If you haven't checked out
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: that episode, I highly suggest after this one to go
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: back and check out that one. Rather interesting stuff and
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: it was a good time. And uh, he's begin to
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: music and I love music, and I do think music
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: is very very important when it comes to the occult sciences.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: Just put it that way. And I want to hear
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: what he's done and like kind of what he's looked
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: at with that stuff in his experience. So we got
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: him back on again, and I guess that's enough out
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: of me and we'll let the man introduce himself. Eric.
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: Please let everybody know where they can find any of yourself.
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: Anything you want to promote, your YouTube, your other show.
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: Please, Well, thank you for having me back on. My
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: name is Eric Arcadian. You can find me pretty much
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: anywhere online under that name on YouTube at eric Arcadian.
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: I have a similar podcast interview show I do that
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: is called Music, Myth and Magic, where I interview people
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: from the occult or witchy community and I've talked to
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: some really cool people, so you should check that out.
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: I also put out some videos on well, you know,
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: the topics of music or magic. Write a blog where
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: I cover a whole huge range of topics from alchemy
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: to wika one on one and you can find that
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: at eric Arcadian dot com. And if you didn't here
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: just a minute ago, I've got a book out called
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: Fluid Kndensers. You can grab from my publisher a Crosscrow,
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: or at an Amazon near you.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, good for you, man, good for you. And uh,
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: you know, in the future, he will be putting out
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: some more work, so definitely keep an eye out, so
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: I highly suggest just doing that. Especially I'm not trying
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: to blow the topic out, you know, telling the topic,
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: but the one that he's working on now I'm very
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: interested on, so hopefully I'll get him one for that,
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: So I keep an eye.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: On from Oh, you can talk about it.
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I didn't know, Well, I don't know. I
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: don't want to, you know, I let you do that,
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: not mean you know what I'm saying.
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: So I've I've got another book that is in the
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: process of being published with Weisser, and that one is
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: going to be on Elder footh arc runs kind of
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: like a more practical, slightly reinterpreted use cases for you know,
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: modern life.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: Love it, man, love it. Not too many people do
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: want work on that, really, so I appreciate that. That's great.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: I guess I'm a niche topics.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I mean that's I mean, I get that though, totally.
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: I like it. So yeah, music, now, I know music
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: was a big thing for you. I mean you were
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: in music. Well you you were into music before you
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: got into the occult actually correct, Oh yeah, yeah.
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's that's my first My very first memory actually
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: is I'm in a car seat and my mom is
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: driving somewhere and she is teaching me to harmonize with
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: some song that she's singing me. And I think we
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: were going to the bank or something like some Little
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: Aaron's trip. But that's the first thing I can remember.
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: So that's awesome. That's well, she was having you harmonized
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: with her. That's pretty cool.
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So when.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: I don't remember, like when you started getting in, did
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: you see things maybe that had to do with music
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: when you're into music that kind of maybe thought your
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: magic or occultism was maybe attached or did you kind
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: of see that more you got as you got into
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: being witchcraft and stuff, whatever you consider what you do.
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: That's an interesting question. I don't think so I've never
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: really thought about that in depth before. But if I
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: had to just take a quick, surface level answer to that,
• 4:30
  Speaker 2: I'm going to say no. I think a lot of
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: what I was accustomed to surrounding music in the beginning,
• 4:38
  Speaker 2: like way before I got into occultism was the worship
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: experience at church. And I mean my whole I can't
• 4:48
  Speaker 2: remember if we talked about this before, but just to
• 4:50
  Speaker 2: kind of like sum up, my whole family pretty musical,
• 4:54
  Speaker 2: Like everybody sings or plays an instrument or something, so
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: that was always with me. And they are also super
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: into the Christian church. So like we were at church
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: multiple times a week Sunday morning, Sunday night, Wednesday evening,
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: and I was in the church choir. I would play
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: with the church worship bands, So I always had this
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: musical worship spiritual relationship. I guess that I saw them
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: both as one thing in the beginning, but I think
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: I kind of took it for granted, which is a
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: weird thing to say, but I think I kind of
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: took it for granted that so much music was utilized
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: as a tool, like in the church experience, you know,
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: like you're always singing or playing something, and then when
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: you get into the occult world, sometimes that completely goes away.
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: And sometimes we're so we're so serious that we're silent,
• 6:08
  Speaker 2: you know, and we've got to just stand and say,
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: are are else? So I don't think that I really
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: I really linked that until much later when I got
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: out of the Christian Church. And what happened was I
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: was doing magical things. I don't know, it's probably I
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: can't tell you like the exact time that I made
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: this connection, but I was doing like a ritual or something,
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: and I realized that the sensation was familiar to me,
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: and what I was feeling the connection with the other
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: people and the ritual was the same feeling that I
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: got when I would be jamming with somebody or improvising.
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: And it's kind of like that in between liminal space
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: when things are not yet written. They're currently being manifest
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: around you, and you have control and you're co creating
• 7:13
  Speaker 2: with other people and with the universe, and it's that
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: same wavelength. So that's when I was like, these are
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: the same thing.
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: I like that, Yeah, well I would even something I
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: had even noticed when I was researching other topics is
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: that I don't know how it is by yourself, but
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: you know, especially like in a church setting when you
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: have multiple people, like in synchronization, it actually sucks like
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: the release dopamine into your system to a certain extent,
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: So there is actually like physical change that goes on
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: within somebody that actually like makes them even feel good anyway.
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it can happen by yourself.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: Too, Yeah, well I'm sure yeah yeah. Or even like
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: when some people get goosebumps from music, I mean something's
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: going on to make that happen, right, Yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: You know, I think that was really good what you
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: even said too with the ceremonial magic. I will say,
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: like from my experience with church, which I have you know,
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: gone to Christian and Catholic church, but especially with Christian
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: because probably the last thing I was going to was
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: a Baptist church. You know, the last time I went
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: to church was that experience. And you know, unless like
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: there was some people I knew that were very musically gifted.
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: I mean mean I knew how to play the guitar,
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: but I mean I wasn't gonna start jamming out. I
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: just I didn't have an acoustic whatever. I wasn't gonna
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: start you know, jamming out and stuff during a ritual.
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: But you know, other people I knew would play instruments.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: But so for me, that aspect was totally gone unless
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: I played something off my phone. When I did it,
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: there was nothing. You're totally right. I didn't realize. It's
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: kind of completely you know, depending on what kind of
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: a you know, denomination of Christianity, I guess you're going
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: to that whole musical aspect is totally gone unless you're
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: incorporating it into your ritual.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd like to expand it though, because it's not
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: just like music as we think of composed and recorded music.
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: I also just think of it kind of a sound
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: in general. So anytime you are like intentionally using your voice,
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: like your magical voice, you know, not like you're talking voice,
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: but when you're speaking with intention, and you're vibrating, and
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: you're you know, you're speaking the commanding way anytime you're
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: talking like that, which can just which can be the
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: text of a ritual if you are thinking about it
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: that way, so there's sound there, or it can be
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: any sort of rhythm or ambient stuff that you do
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: to kind of put you in a trance or meditative state.
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: Like even if you can't play something, you can always
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: make make a drum beat, even if you're just like
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: making a beat on your chest like a heartbeat rhythm,
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: and that can still put you in the moment the
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: same way that oh yeah, you're a super classically trained
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: musician and you're playing a beautiful sonata or something. Same thing.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: Oh no, I totally agree with that. I can help
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: you get in a trance if you know, obviously because
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: of the way the song goes. Yeah, for sure. I
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: even uh, I was covering a singing bowl for uh,
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: you know, the mechanics of magic, because there's actually been
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: scientific studies done on those things. And they were saying,
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: and I find it interesting because when I used to
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: go to the Oto, I'm sure it's just coincidence. Maybe
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: they understood that you know how it worked, but I mean,
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: I don't think every place uses a singing bowl for this,
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: But before they would do any of the rituals, they
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: would always hit a singing bowl and let it ring first.
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: And you know, the whole thing behind that is that
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: they're saying because the singing bowl, the way the sound dissipates.
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: When you first hear it, it catches your attention and
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: you're focused on it. And then since it slowly dissipates
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: the sound goes away, you're not focused on the sound,
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: not anymore, but you're still focused because it was such
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: a gradual change that you never came out of being focused.
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: So like you were even saying, I mean, the music
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: can help you kind of get focused and in like
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: almost like it, you know, stuck in the cadence of it,
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: you know, and kind of I think almost maybe get
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: you in a flow state as well.
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, One, I love singing balls. I think they are
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: such great to generate a beautiful calming sound. But that
• 11:28
  Speaker 2: action of playing a singing bowl or a bell or
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: some other sort of simple musical device right before a
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: ritual also is a conscious trigger. And so like when
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: you when you do that, and then you go under ritual,
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: you say your prayers, you say your chance, you do whatever,
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: and then the next time you hear the bell thing,
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: then your mind's like, oh, the next thing that's happening
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: is we're going into ritual state. And so you do
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: that over and over and over again, and then well
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: sometimes you gotta be careful because then you just hear
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: a bell and you're like, uh, I'm in ritual. But
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: it really it helps to drop into that mindset.
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: You're totally right. I covered that actually. Yeah. Then, like,
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: depending on how you end your ritual, if it's a
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: consistent thing, you have that sound from the singing well
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: telling you it's begun, Like in your mind, your body
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: now knows we're in the ritual, and whatever way you
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: used to end it, that's how it knows. Like, Okay,
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: now I can integrate whatever I did to move on
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: to the next thing. Literally is like telling your brain
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: it's begun and now it's stopped. And that's you know,
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: and that separates it from ordinary life, which makes it
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: more important, you know, one hundred percent.
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I like to mix that with other
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: conscious cues too, like maybe a repeated scent of an
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: oil or incense, even you can you can try to
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: get like almost all of the senses involved if you
• 13:00
  Speaker 2: want to, like a familiar sight like a candle that
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: you use regularly, or just like dimming the lights to
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: a particular illumination level or color if you have like
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: an LED light bulb. So you can employ all these
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: things to get you into that state of mind really easily.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: No, I totally agree. I think that's great that you
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: said that, especially with the incense for sure. I mean
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: even with smell a memory. Yeah. Yeah. So like when
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: it comes to music, do you see it, do you
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: employ that it kind of has like a technology and
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: your ritual work or your your magical workings.
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean expand it to because all right, here's
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: the thing. If you try to go to technical with
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: music during the ritual, you can take away from the ritual.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: I've done that, so yeah.
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: And sometimes it's it's like, oh, I have this, I
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: have this lovely song I want to play during ritual,
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: and you go to play it and then like there's
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: too much thinking in required to perform that song. So
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: it just it takes you right out of the ritual mindset.
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: So there's a balance there, and I feel that usually
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: it's just got to be as simple as possible. It's
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: just got to be as simple as possible. And it
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: might just be like a drone, like one tone repeated
• 14:31
  Speaker 2: over and over again. It could be like a just
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: pounding on a frame drum for a while. But so
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: we do that and a lot of our rituals, right.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: But but the awesome thing is that it doesn't have
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: to be it doesn't have to be a nice noise.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: Depending on what you're doing, it can be a complete
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: cacophony of just banging randomly on stuff and making you know, yelling.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: This is like historically, right, we used to like bang
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: on pans and bells to drive out spirits.
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they used to do that to the eclipse. In
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: some areas. They would do that thinking it was scaring
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: the eclipse away. So on the left they're like, all
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: that worked.
• 15:15
  Speaker 2: So there's there's tradition which is terrible noise during during
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: your spell work. But you can pretty much do anything
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: as long as I think, like, as long as you
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: cue yourself in to the fact that your sound has
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: spiritual value, and when you start to look at it
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: that way, then you can start to kind of unwrap
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: like what what is the value? What is it doing,
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: and what's it adding to the ritual?
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, for sure. Eventually, once I did start incorporating
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: some music into my stuff, there was definitely things that
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: I realized after the fact. I was like, that wasn't
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: it wasn't a good thing to incorporate, because it did
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: it had me stuck on the music too much instead
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: of actually in the in the zone. And like you said,
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: I ended up going with like ambient synth stuff like
• 16:03
  Speaker 1: Steve like Steve Roach or you know, Liquid Dream of
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: Liquid Mind whatever his name is that way, Yeah, going
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: with that stuff instead.
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: There's I just I gotta say, like there have been
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: rituals that, like big public rituals I've been a part of,
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: and they were beautiful rituals, and then they want to
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: go and like throw like you know, like it's part
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: of a typical wicked ritual. We do kicks and wine
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: or cakes and nail or whatever towards the end. And
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: if you're in a big ritual, that takes a while
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: to like go around and give everybody that stuff.
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: So sometimes they'll play background music and occasionally they they'll
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: pick a song and it's almost like the song is
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: trying too hard and it just pulls you right, it's
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: almost laughable and it breaks the vibe completely. So there's
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: there's like a really delicate balance I think when you
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: choose music.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, right, yeah, to transition from one to the nights
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: and keep you focused. I like that. I like that.
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: I know you're you're also big into beraneuro Beach. Correct,
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: Am I wrong on that? Oh? I love Yeah, yeah,
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: I know. I think you have talked about that on
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: your own and your own stuff, So I don't know
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: if you want to maybe tap, you know, talk about
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: that a little bit. So sure.
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: I mean, I think it's fascinating, right, because it is
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: part of the science that goes behind some of the
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: spiritual or occult work. And I discovered this probably like
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: when I was sixteen, I think I found I had
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: this program that I downloaded called brain Wave Generator, and
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: it all it was was a tone generator. You'd have
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: one tone generated for your left ear and one for
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: your right ear, and there was a setting called out
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: of body Experience.
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: Oh. I definitely was like, it's like, all.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: Right, I'll try that out. I had no idea what
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: to expect from this. I just had like heard people
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: say it was interesting. So I turned the lights out,
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: I laid down, I plugged a headphone cable into my computer,
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: and I started the program. It was like a ten
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: minute binural beat program that went through a whole bunch
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: of different series of tones. And man, I think that
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: was like my first trancy induced hallucination that ever happened
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: to me. Oh wow, it was crazy. So if you
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: don't know what a binural beat is, it's essentially tones
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: are measured in hurts. It's basically like how many times
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: the frequency oscillates per second. So if you play two
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: tones that are similar in pitch or infrequency, but not
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: exactly on the same pitch, and you only listen to
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: one in your left ear and you listen to the
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: other in the right ear, your brain kind of splits
• 19:08
  Speaker 2: the difference between the two tones and it generates a
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: new frequency internally, and if you're listening to it, it'll
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: sound kind of like a warbling like wow, But it's
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: really interesting. And they say that these internal frequencies that
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: your brain is generating have like sympathetic resonance to specific
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: states of mind, like the alpha state or the data state.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: So you can use binural beats in the background when
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: you're meditating to kind of help you trance out essentially, yes.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: And do you use that often? Do you use it
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: like a meditation and ritual or or you know only
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: one of them.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: Or sometimes you know. I don't. I don't do it
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: all the time, but when I where I find it
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: is especially helpful is when you are trying to do
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: something that requires another sense, like if you are scrying,
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: oh so trying to because if you have a dark
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: mirror and you're trying to scry, that can be like
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: that takes a lot of focus, and it's hard sometimes
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: to get your mental state away from the fact that,
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: like you are just staring into a mirror and your
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: eyeballs are hurting from opening your eyes for so long.
• 20:48
  Speaker 2: But if you have like a binural beat playing in
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: the background, it can kind of take over.
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: I like that. I didn't have a thought of using
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: that as kind of an enhancement when you're doing something
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: else totally. That is interesting. I like that idea you
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: mentioned before, kind of about you know, people using music
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: or banging on pots and bands in a lot of traditions,
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: specific rhythms of songs that used to call like specific spirits,
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: gods or ancestors. You know, sometimes what do you think, uh,
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: spirits then? Or I guess still now as so often
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: approached through sound.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: Of music, you know, that is a really fascinating topic
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: and it's something I wish I knew more about too.
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: And it's it's it's not just like certain tones or
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: some certain songs. Sometimes it is certain rhythms themselves are
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: used to call down like specific deities. And if I
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: had to venture a guess as to why this is,
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: I think I think intrinsically and intuitively, we know that
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: sound is linked to spirit, and so this is like
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: just a natural tool. Now, obviously it's going to be
• 22:15
  Speaker 2: completely different across the world, like a certain culture will
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: use this rhythm to this deity and another might do
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: something completely different. But it's within the intrinsic and intuitive
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: human experience of understanding that, you know, sound is spirit,
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: then we have the cultural context of exactly how we
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: develop those ideas.
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: Mm man, I had I had an idea in my
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: head that I was going to ask and I just
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: totally lost it. Fuck yeah it was oh uh yeah,
• 22:53
  Speaker 1: it was with music obviously about music. Damn it. I
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: just had it again and just listed Oh yeah, you're well,
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: you're losing a connection already. Back to all right with
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: music in uh have you ever like looked at in
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: the past how other people, like even the Renaissance would
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: like incorporate that into their stuff. Like Michael Meyer. I
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: don't know if you ever heard of him. He was
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: a guy who made the emblems, and it had emblems,
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: and then it had I had like not like a
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: paragraph of shit that I guess was probably kind of
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: explaining the emblem, and then I had music you were
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: supposed to have playing with it. Yeah, I guess you
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: haven't heard.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I would definitely want to look into that.
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: What are the emblems the Atlanta Fugians or something like that,
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: very close to uh the Fuji's Yeah, the Atlanta Fugia Fujians. Yeah,
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: I think FuG I E n s. Yeah, I can
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: send you something about afterwards. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: just that has a lot of music in it, and
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: you know it's interesting too. You mentioned before about like
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: the harmonizing you know what. Saint Hildegard came up with
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: that actually, and she was like kind of had had
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: very mystic experiences and was huge into music.
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, she's amazing. Yeah, yeah, that's back when, back when
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: we were uh okay. So here's the interesting thing, right,
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: like our conception of music and what music should sound
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: like and music theory is like so different than what
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: it was in the you know, first few centuries, right,
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: because they had they just had like one one melody
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: line and it was chanted by a monk, and there
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: was no harmony. And the first harmony that developed was
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: a drone note. It would be just one guy singing
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: one note and then another guy singing the other notes
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: on top of it. And eventually music theory, a lot
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: of music theory actually came because the monks needed a
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: way to write down their chance because, like I think,
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: I don't remember which pope it was, around sometime before
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: the year one thousand. I believe he was upset that
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: if you went to one church, they sang the song
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: one way, and if you went to another church, they
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: sang the song their way. So he went in consistency
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: among all the churches, all the monasteries. So they had
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: to figure out a way to write down their chance
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: and to keep them consistent. And that's why we have
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: musical notation, and that's why music theory happened, So we
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: owe we owe a lot to the Christian Church actually
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: for for music and music theory and how music did that. Yeah,
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: you're talking about Hildiguard, right, Yeah, pretty awesome composed so
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: many tunes that oh yeah, yeah, probably like most people,
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: maybe they wouldn't hear the name and recognize the name,
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: but there's there's probably a few you might recognize.
• 26:25
  Speaker 1: Believe it or not. My my intro song, it's I
• 26:29
  Speaker 1: don't know who it was, but the guy who made
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: it told me because I had, I guess he knew
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: I liked Saint Hildegard. He pulled like her music being
• 26:38
  Speaker 1: done by somebody else and that woman in the background
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: is actually singing her ship, Like yeah, she's actually my intro.
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah I had. He's like, Yo, that's Saint Hildegard. By
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: the way, in your intro, I was like, it's.
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: A fun haunting, right. A lot of that stuff is
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: like it's eerie, you.
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: Know, even was her images. I mean they were cool
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: as ship, but they do have like a like an
• 26:58
  Speaker 1: earringess to him a little bit. I think, yeah, yeah,
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: you know, I always joke around like if it wasn't
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: for her we wouldn't have had Iron Maiden because that's
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: what they did, was hormonize. They would have sounded very different.
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: It would be very different.
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, now and now I remember Also what I wanted
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: to ask you was on voices. You know, we're talking
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: about music and using all the instruments, but how do
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: you look at it, like you think like mantras and
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: repeated stuff. I mean that becomes basically music in itself
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: using the voice. Oh yeah, do you think that's that's
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: very powerful and magic? I think witchcraft are the ecult.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: I think your voice is your most powerful instrument and
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: and sometimes it's hard to get there mentally. And I know,
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: like with a lot of people, they it goes against
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: everything you know, core and there being too to make
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: that kind of sound and let that kind of sound
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: come out of their mouth, you know, like a magical
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: vibratory into a nation. But I think that's the power
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: of the voice. It's it's the magical tool you always
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: have with you, and it's always there ready for you
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: to use, whether it be a quick whisper chant recitation
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: of a prayer or spell.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: So I like how you said that you think it
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: might be a kind of like you know, most know,
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: the voice could be the most powerful one because like
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: I mean, obviously all the music's going to, you know,
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: affect your body, but I mean when it's coming out
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: of yourself, I mean you're resonating your head, your body.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: I mean, there's a lot of stuff you're actually affecting
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: when you make a sound, especially repeated. Yeah, do you
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: think you go ahead?
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: I was just gonna say, you kind of you're tuning
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: yourself to other frequencies when you do that, like literally
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: you're vibing.
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: I thought that, Yes, I thought, if you do manches
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: long enough, basically, I think you're just going to tune
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: yourself to the sounds you keep on repeating over and
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: over again, throw out your body or get something like
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: maybe some binarial beeat effect where it's like you know
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: you get them, you know, in between somewhere. But yeah,
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: I know, I definitely think vocalizing is huge and even
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: it's funny. I don't know if this is how you
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: meant it, but I know there was times like when
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: I first started like vibrating the god names, and I
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: was like I cannot believe I'm doing this right now,
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: Like I was like, well, I finally made that step.
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: No, it's so it's it's funny, right like. And I
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: don't know if if your take on that at the
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: time was I can't believe I'm doing this because it
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: feels it feels.
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: Silly, it feels stupid.
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: I mean, it felt stupid. So the first time, I'm
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: I came across like the lb r P and and
• 30:06
  Speaker 2: I got the I got the text of the ritual,
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: and I did not understand what in tone meant or
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: vibrate meant. I was just like facing the directions and
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: just saying the like in a talking voice, and that
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: did I don't really think it did anything. I think
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: it might have done a little bit. And you know,
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: I'm not here to knock anybody who who does it
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: that way. I just like, for me, I didn't really
• 30:40
  Speaker 2: feel much. And then I I I read somewhere that
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: the proper way to you know, proper way, proper way,
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: well right, the proper way to do it was to
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: vibrate the word so that you extinguished in entire breath.
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: You know, you fill your lungs with air and you
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: vibrate until you have no more air left in your luck.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: And you should do it with the amount of energy
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: so that like you are tired after like with your
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: whole body clinching and pushing that out. Yeah, And so
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: I was like, Okay, well, maybe I've been doing it wrong.
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: I'll try it that way. But the thing is like
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: when you when you sit, even when you're in your
• 31:35
  Speaker 2: own house, and you're vibrating and you're intoning loudly, it
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: feels so foreign and strange. And I used I had
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: I had this ritual that I used to do and
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: it required vibrating these divine names like until you kind
• 31:58
  Speaker 2: of got into a trance state. And you know, my
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: wife is a witch. There's like nothing that I can
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: do magically that I need to be self conscious of
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: in front of her. Right, I would go downstairs and
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: I would vibrate, but I know she's she's upstairs and
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: she can hear me, and it's still like it feels like,
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: for whatever reason, I still feel a little self conscious.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: Oh no, no, my wife and she.
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: Knows what I'm doing and she understands what I'm doing
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: and why I'm doing, and there's absolutely no reason that
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: I need to feel self conscious. But it's just like
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: there is often this huge mental block. It just goes
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: so much against what we're comfortable with. I recommend for
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: people that they find a quiet place where they are
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: truly alone, so that they can actually feel what it
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: feels like, like what the muscles feel like, and what
• 32:57
  Speaker 2: your chest feels like, and what your lungs feel like,
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: in your face, in your head when you are actually
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: vibrating at that intensity, Because if you're shy about it
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: and you're around somebody and you're going to be self conscious,
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: you're probably holding back a little bit.
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, oh for sure. I could even say that
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: from my own experience. For sure, you're doing stuff and
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: knowing you know, my now my ex wife is in
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: the other room. Yeah, of course, you're like, I'm going
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: to probably be quiet this time because I don't want
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: it to name. Yeah. I totally think though from my experience,
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: totally different experience vibrating the God names, and I think
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: you're like, there are times that, like, you know, obviously
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: because my work schedule, there was times where I was
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: home alone whenever I did rituals alone and didn't have
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: to worry about anybody or anything, and I really put
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: myself into its. Definitely feeling different after the fact, different experience.
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: I think Yeah, it's pretty wild, and I think there's
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: something behind that. You know, even then that I was like,
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: obviously something's up, but this vibrating the sound in my body?
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, what do you think is behind it?
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: I don't know, I was, you know, I I mean,
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: obviously I do think there's something going on just from
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: affecting yourself, probably, but that I don't know. Maybe maybe
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: a body gets put into a frequency that's more open
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: to contacting stuff. I don't know. I have no idea
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: or the sound that I'm creating. I've often wondered, is
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: it like linked to like something older from the.
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: Well, there's there's actually a pretty cool thing in science.
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: It's called sympathetic vibration.
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: Oh let us know.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: So this is and and it sounds new age, but
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: it's it's an acoustic phenomenon in physics.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: I'm all about this. I've been covering a lot of
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: science early.
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: So what happens is if you have let's say you
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: a tuning fork nice over here, and it is set
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: to a specific frequency. If that frequency is being played
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: in the air, the tuning fork will pick up the
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: vibrations sympathetically and it will start to vibrate itself. So
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: this is like a this is a demonstration that they
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: do in elementary schools to like get kids into physics
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: and into science.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: So they have two tuning forks and there may be
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: like a couple feet apart, and they're attached to wooden
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: blocks so that they resonate a little bit louder. And
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: you'll strike one tuning fork and it will resonate, and
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: then the other one starts to vibrate as well. And
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: you can put your hand on the first tuning fork
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: and mute it, and you can hear that the second
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: tuning fork. Even though the first one that generated the
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: tone has stopped playing, the second one's still ringing.
• 35:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: So this this tells us that if you're vibrating at
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: a certain frequency, you cause other things around you to
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: vibrate at that same frequency. So there's like, I mean,
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of spiritual concepts we could draw from that,
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: but one of the biggest one that I usually look at.
• 36:24
  Speaker 2: Everything in the universe has a frequency. Everything has a vibration, right, total,
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: and emotions have a So this is also the interesting thing,
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: right because like frequency, wavelength, vibration, these are all such
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: new age terms, right, like we got to get on
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: the same wavelength, just not on the right frequency. But
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: it's also science, and it's like this is.
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: It's real science said Unfortunately, people may be misconstrue and
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: make it look silly.
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but it's like it's also how waves work,
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: and like it's real. It's how sound works, and it's
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: I think it's how our energy actually works on a
• 37:04
  Speaker 2: metaphysical level totally. So we say we need to get
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: on another frequency. Like emotions have wavelengths and vibrations, and
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: so if you want to raise your vibration, you can
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: do that, and you you can do that through through sound,
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: and you can change your vibration to another frequency that
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: is more positive. And when you do that, you vibrate
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: sympathetically with the other things at that level and with
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: the universe. So it's like this resonance back and forth
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: when you can change your frequency that way. So there's
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: a lot of there's a lot behind that.
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: You know, I've even wondered, is that kind of even
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: like with like sympathetic magic, are you using all those
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: like little tools that you're attributing things to actually like
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: and is you know, affect your own sympathetic nerves.
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: Really, yeah, I think. So there's an interesting thing in
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: the world of fluid condensers. It's called a symbolic fluid condenser.
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: So we have these like classical this classical idea of
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: what a fluid condenser is, like maybe a potion somebody
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: makes or a block of gold or something like that. Right,
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: but there are these are things that vibrate like that
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: can accept the magical energy. That's why we use them.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: That's what a condenser is, right, But there are symbolic condensers,
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: and these are things that resonate in the mind the
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: same way as like the magic wand would resonate outside
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: of your body. So these are magical words, sounds, tones, images,
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: they're all things that create something in your mind. So
• 39:05
  Speaker 2: when you do that, you are vibrating. You're basically creating
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: that same idea of sympathetic resonance and sympathetic vibration on
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: a purely mental or energetic level. And I think this
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: is how all of our correspondences work, because we say
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: red is fire, now, like somebody had to be the
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: first person to say that, right, Red is the elemental fire,
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: that's what it reminds me of. And then we all
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: kind of got on that wavelength and we're like, that
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: makes sense, and we all fed into that, and every
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: person who has used a red altar cloth for a
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: elemental fire ritual has fed into that and almost became
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: like this collective consciousness thing. But it's it's on that
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: same vibrational level that it works, in my.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: Opinion, No, I totally yeah, I totally agree with that.
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of the stuff that we use
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: and ritual and everything is to kind of like get
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: us into some sort of frequency specific or you know,
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: to like I said before, open up to something maybe
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: or whatever. But yeah, especially the colors. I think that's
• 40:20
  Speaker 1: extremely important too as well, colors sense even like candle flickering,
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: we'll do stuff. And then the music.
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, let's use all the senses, right, all
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: the ones.
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: We can might as well? Right, go how to go home?
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: Do you think you think music might have been kind
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: of one of the older forms of magical technology, like
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: you know how we were talking about it earlier with
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: like even Hildegarde. Do you think like back in the
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: day that was like a part of that. That's kind
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: of I think what I was getting at with the
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: other question too. It was like part of like to them.
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: Like you even said, we don't think we really kind
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: of look at the music like we do anymore today.
• 41:00
  Speaker 1: I do think it was when it just my opinion,
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: I think music might have been kind of considered sacred
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: in itself to begin with, and I do think it
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: was more of an actual tool for some sort of experience.
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean, and it again, the way we
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: look at music has really really changed over thousands of years,
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: and what we look at now as something that most
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: people would see purely as entertainment, a few thousand years ago,
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: it was divine. There are I think there are several
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: cultures that that believe music came from divinity. It was
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: the gift of the gods. And as far back, there's
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: a story, it's a theory. They believe that some of
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: our oldest ancestors, when we were still dwelling in caves,
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: we like to go deep into the caves for our
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: meeting rooms or whatnot, but it was dark, and there
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: are some theories that we used our voices as a
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: form of almost like echo location in order to navigate
• 42:30
  Speaker 2: the caves. So as you would walk down the tunnels,
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: you might be I mean, maybe not singing, but maybe
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: making clicking noises or shouts, and depending on how it
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: bounced off the walls, you would be able to see, oh,
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: you're about to come up into the chamber or whatever
• 42:50
  Speaker 2: to find your way to the ritual fire. But I
• 42:53
  Speaker 2: like to think of our ancestors walking around in these
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: caves singing to find their way around. So that's like
• 42:59
  Speaker 2: as far back as as we go, I think there
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: was elements of music and sound, and you can see
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: that in the archaeological record. Some of our oldest things
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: that that we find our bone flutes, really really primitive
• 43:19
  Speaker 2: bone flutes, right, So somebody thought it was pretty important
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: to make that.
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's interesting. A couple of months ago I had
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: I can't remember the name of it. I covered some
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: archaeological find that had I think bone flutes in it.
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like six there's there's one from like sixty
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: thousand years ago, maybe maybe older than that.
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: It might have been even the one I was talking about,
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: I can't remember it was. It was a part of
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: some stuff that was like found not too long ago.
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: I was like really old, and they were like, oh wow,
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: look at this one thing. I did want to ask too.
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: I don't know how you look at music or the
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: way that you've covered it, But I was just wondering
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: have you ever looked at it or talked about how
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: unfortunately it can be kind of used against people for
• 44:09
  Speaker 1: bad reasons, more of like a propaganda level or a manipulation.
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: Oh man, I mean, I don't know if.
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: You look at it like that, but I have you know,
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: kind of.
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: Cover sure, but like, but can't anything I like, so
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: can writing. You know, we have we have language, we
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: have words. I can write bad words on on a
• 44:36
  Speaker 2: you know, propaganda leaflet and drop that on a foreign
• 44:40
  Speaker 2: country and make everybody freak out right. So like anything
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: anything we we have is it too. If you can,
• 44:50
  Speaker 2: if you can curse, you can heal. So anything we
• 44:54
  Speaker 2: have magically or otherwise is a tool, and it just
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: depends on how you frame it.
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah. No, you are right on that. That is a
• 45:04
  Speaker 1: good point. Yeah, I was just wondering if you ever
• 45:06
  Speaker 1: looked at it from that. Yeah. I was just recently
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: only because I thought about that. I was covering how
• 45:14
  Speaker 1: like they kind of used the music a lot to
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: get World War two kind of accepted but among certain people. Yeah,
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: so just southing you think about that, uh, kind of
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: like with the sound with like certain I mean even
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: believe it or not even that the Nazis even kind
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: of put time into studying it scientifically, about kind of
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: getting people pumped up and excited into almost like accept
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: going into war. Like the music that they were using
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: was like for some reason getting people like kind of
• 45:46
  Speaker 1: amped and okay with it. Yeah, So that just made
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: me think about that, that's all.
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: I think. It's crazy, how like when I mean, I'm
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: sure there's legit reasons for it, but it's just like
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: World War One, World War two, you have these countries
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: opposing each other and everything about them becomes evil. So
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: you know, like Germany outlaws American music, America outlaws German music,
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: and it's like we can't have any of their culture
• 46:19
  Speaker 2: interacting with us because it's gonna infect our key, you know,
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: and it's like come on, man.
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: No I get to that's oh that was even that's uh.
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: That was one thing you did mention something about World
• 46:34
  Speaker 1: War One. Recently I did cover Uh, I covered the drum. Oh.
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: It hasn't dropped yet though, as I have a series
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: called Mechanics of Magic, and I've been covering like kind
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: of like scientific studies on certain things that we use
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: a lot, and I didn't realize that like they even
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: were like kind of using they knew back in World
• 46:50
  Speaker 1: War One with studies on the drum to actually use
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: that as a cadence to keep people in a repetitic
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: like a repetitive form. So, like, I guess this is
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: how they're explaining it. When you're kind of locked into that,
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: like if you're going to start to exhibit fear, there's
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: almost like a little bit of a buffer of your
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: mind thinking needs to stain some cadence, And I can't
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: really think about that now because I'm focused on this,
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: and it becomes like a buffer to actually get you
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: to kind of, you know, walk into work.
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the marching rhythm, right, I mean they've you know, yeah,
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: left right, they've been doing that since long time, right, yeah, yeah,
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: march with the drama. You get the little beat. Yeah yeah,
• 47:34
  Speaker 2: And that's that's such a cool thing too, because they
• 47:37
  Speaker 2: use like sound as a signal on the battlefield and
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: and everybody acts and responds.
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: To oh yeah yeah. Yeah.
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: Drum is a good example of it, like the marching
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: the beat, how fast you're going to go? Onto the field, right.
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: But then also like the Romans used horns like kind
• 48:01
  Speaker 2: of like these curved horns, and I think similar to
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: like a corno, I think, but you'd have one tone
• 48:13
  Speaker 2: that they would play so that everybody knows like advance
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: attack or you have another tone they play and you
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: know that's the retreat noise. So it controls the group
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: mind of the whole fighting force on the battlefield. And
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: then there's also like the Carnix, which was like a
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: Celtic battle horn, and they've they've uncovered a few of
• 48:41
  Speaker 2: them there. They are tall, they go instead of like
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: coming out, they go up, okay, and they are they
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: are usually shaped like a terrifying animal or creature, so
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: they're very decorative. They're huge, and they're ornate, and they're
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: supposed to have made these terrible sounds. So not just
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: to command troop movements on the field, but like if
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: you saw an army of Celtic warriors coming at you
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: carrying these giant things that look like terrifying animals making
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: horrifying noises, it's also to instill fear and terror in
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: the people that you are attacking.
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: You're like, what the hell is yeah? Seeah? And you
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: get this is a perfect example of what you were
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: saying before. You could have that repetitive drum beat to
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: go into a trans state to have a positive experience,
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: or you could be using it to go into battle.
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: So yeah, but then again, I mean even though you know,
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: battles is you know, shitty experience. Maybe it was good
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: for a good reason anyway, but whatever, it doesn't doesn't
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: sound like the same outcome, you know. Yeah, but uh,
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: what else when it comes to music, what is like
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: kind of like the biggest thing with you with with
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: music and magic, like kind of like what's uh what
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: do you like to nerd out on when it comes
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: to that?
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: Okay, all right, you want to hear my crazy, my
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: crazy way of thinking about things. Okay, I'm going to
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: try to figure out where to start. I look at
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: I look at this a lot through the lens of the.
• 50:15
  Speaker 1: Tree of life.
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: So we have the thee off or the spheres. Right,
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: let's let's do this conversationally. What how do we represent
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: the spheres like? What things are usually associated with them?
• 50:36
  Speaker 1: Numbers, colors, planets, yes.
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: Yes, okay, color and things that we can see. Right,
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: So this is color is wavelengths of light, yes, okay.
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: In between the spheres are paths, and how do we
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: represent the paths.
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: Lines? Oh? Uh, Taro? I mean I always think of.
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: Taro tarah no Tara, Okay, Taro is a great is
• 51:07
  Speaker 2: a great correspondence, but also that corresponds to a letter
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: in the heat. Oh yeah, right, Sorry, I wasn't trying
• 51:18
  Speaker 2: to like pop quiz. I hate when people ask me
• 51:21
  Speaker 2: questions on my show and I'm.
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: Like, no, no, no, which way I always say that.
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: I think Lon Milo de Cat's book on Chicken Cobala,
• 51:26
  Speaker 1: I think that's the one is great because he actually
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: covers the letters and not too many people cover that. Yeah,
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: he covers.
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: Amazing book, one of my favorite Cabala books. He talks
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: about all that stuff.
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: So that's interesting, which has a sound attached to.
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: It letters sounds exactly phonetics. So the tree of life
• 51:49
  Speaker 2: is like our road map for how energy manifests from
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: source to this plane of reality, and it is a
• 52:03
  Speaker 2: ship ton of colors and sounds.
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: I totally agree with you on that. Okay.
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: So if we look at myths and creation stories, it's
• 52:19
  Speaker 2: probably the one everybody is familiar with. Starts off in
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: Genesis and it's and God said, let there be light.
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: So here's the conclusion I have made for myself. Source
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: is light. The action that source takes is sound. Yeah.
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: So if you look at a lot like like I said,
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: if you look at a lot of creation stories, it's existence,
• 52:52
  Speaker 2: and then existence does something.
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: About sounds or speech or something other.
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: Was the word or in the beginning was the word,
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: and the word was God. Yeah. Yeah, So there's lots
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: there's lots of these little things in the Bible and
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: in other religions as well, because you know, I'm not
• 53:12
  Speaker 2: saying like the Bible is our one stop shop cool
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: occult stuff. But you know, there's like there's an Egyptian
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: deity who spoke itself into existence. So there's a lot
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: of action that goes into set. It's like spiritual action,
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: spiritual sound. It's it's the doing, and light is being.
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: And they are all frequencies. They are all wavelengths and vibration,
• 53:50
  Speaker 2: and so so are we. And so when you understand
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: that and you you can mentally manipulate that, I think
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: it unlocks the life of potential. Anyway, that's my that's
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: my crazy lens to.
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: Like, no, it's not crazy at all. Man. I totally
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: on that with you. Man. I thought that myself. There's
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: something up with the colors, is frequencies and sounds. Yeah.
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: I think it's like a prisms of like light and
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: stuff and somehow we end up getting like crystallized into
• 54:19
  Speaker 1: what we're in now. Yeah.
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like reflections of things, things do different lenses. Yeah,
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: I think. I think it's really cool because like we have,
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: like the spears are almost like states of existence on
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: the tree of life. Yeah, and then or they're different
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: like levels of moving moving up through different planes, right,
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: and then in order to get to them, you have
• 54:45
  Speaker 2: a letter that you have to go through. So it's
• 54:47
  Speaker 2: like you have you have to use that action of
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: spiritual sound to move around the tree, and when you
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: get there, it's a different color. It's it's spiritual light,
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: it's being in existence.
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: I really like that how you're attributing the letters. There's
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: the frequency in between the spears kind of I never
• 55:08
  Speaker 1: thought of that.
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's that's the kind of thing that I
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: will lay in bed and trip out on later. That's
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: trying to fall asleep.
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: I totally forgot. I don't know if you mentioned the
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: last time I didn't know. You're big into the Kabbala.
• 55:26
  Speaker 2: I mean, I am, in no means an expert. I
• 55:31
  Speaker 2: like that refer to other people for my kabbala questions,
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: but I think it's it's one of the most powerful
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: tools that I have come across, and not just I
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: don't want to say like unifying, because they're there's not
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: one thing that ties everything together. But I think that
• 55:58
  Speaker 2: like the Kabbala is the close I've found that, especially
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: in Western magic or Western occult studies. It gives me
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: the reason for doing things. And it's almost like this
• 56:10
  Speaker 2: big rolodex of like correspondences and I can use this
• 56:15
  Speaker 2: for that, or we're doing this, so I can also
• 56:17
  Speaker 2: relate it to that thing, and it was that underlying
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: so I also, you know, for I will always ask
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: the question, why do we do it that way? Why
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: do we use that? And if you say I don't know,
• 56:30
  Speaker 2: then I get I get kind of annoyed, like from
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: from a teacher's perspective, like if I like trying to
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: set the ritual up this way, like why do we
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: do it that way? Well, I don't know, that's that's
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: what somebody told me to do it. I want the reason. Yeah,
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: Kabbala has given me the most reasons and the most understanding.
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: WHOA, Okay, that's great. You know, I'm very much of
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: a fan of the Kabbala myself. I think there's a lot,
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: like you're even saying. I think there's like the science
• 57:02
  Speaker 1: aspect behind it, and then with the colors and ship.
• 57:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's something there we'll get we'll get to it
• 57:10
  Speaker 2: one day and it'll link metaphysics and science. Yeah, finally
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: we'll understand.
• 57:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, hopefully, hopefully in our lifetime. That would be nice
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: to see. We could tell all the people who don't
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: like the science aspect, but like we told you, we
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: were right. Yeah, right, So as you ever noticed that
• 57:28
  Speaker 1: there is a lot of you know, not how good
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: it is what it is, a lot of witches or
• 57:31
  Speaker 1: I guess so many magicians. You don't really like adding
• 57:33
  Speaker 1: the science to it. It's like it doesn't take a
• 57:36
  Speaker 1: wool the way the wool woo with the magic. For me,
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: I don't know, for me it doesn't. Maybe it does
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: for other people's, but that for me.
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: Somebody I think I heard somebody say recently that science
• 57:47
  Speaker 2: is a religion in an unto itself, or it can be,
• 57:54
  Speaker 2: and so It's interesting because when you go back, uh
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: in the days of Isaac Newton, who was a chemist,
• 58:06
  Speaker 2: he was also an alchemist, and alchemy and chemistry were
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: the same thing. They were science, yes, And to go
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: further back, we have astrology and and like astrology is
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: the science of the day. Now we have astronomy is
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: the science of the day, and astrology is the wou
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: woo shit that people do. But back in the day
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: it was science.
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: Oh, astrology was incorporated in like everything. Yeah, it was
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: no joke.
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: Back in the day, it was cutting edge science, right,
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: and this was the explanation. But then we kind of
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: like then we got what we understand as science today,
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: and it kind of dismissed the other things, and you know,
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: stating through observation, like things have to be done through
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: this form of observation, which we can't really do in
• 59:02
  Speaker 2: the metaphysical world, and cut all that out as pseudoscience.
• 59:07
  Speaker 2: And so if you have this very narrow minded science
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: view of things that we can only believe in what
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: we see, then it's really easy to dismiss all the
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: other stuff that goes around that we haven't been able
• 59:24
  Speaker 2: to explain yet. Lots of cool stuff you just dismiss
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: and write off and it's almost like it's almost like
• 59:34
  Speaker 2: you're indoctrinated with that type of mindset, just like you
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: would be in a religion.
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I get that though. I hear that. That
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: is interesting to think about though. How kind of science
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: did kind of like cut off magic in a sense too? Yeah,
• 59:55
  Speaker 1: And I think it's just really recently they're start to
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: entertain a lot of it now.
• 59:59
  Speaker 2: So yeah, and it's it's really recent that we cut
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 2: all that stuff out too, because like astrology worked for
• 1:00:07
  Speaker 2: thousands of.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: Years yo, right, that is a good point. They used
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: that for so long if you're to look at like, yeah,
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: probably the history of like science and stuff, astrology was
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: used probably eighty percent of the time we've had it.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 1: You know, science.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: Alchemy worked for thousands of years too, and then maybe
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: around what the Renaissance is when we really stopped and
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: started changing to go another way. And then so for
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 2: the past what two three hundred years, maybe we've been
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: doing things differently, but thousands of years we had our
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 2: completely different way of doing things and it worked.
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Have you even mentioned before, even though you know,
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: I always going about this guy tycklebrahe it's fine and
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 1: very interesting. He uh, he was in a you know,
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: he he was looking at the stars and stuff, and
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 1: he had had things set up and he had like
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 1: a huge he had the Isle event and I think
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: that was the place. I think that was the name
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: of it. And he was kind of like in charge
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: of the thing, and he even had to like keep
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: the people there like if they were sick or whatever.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: He was in charge of it. And he used to
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: make tinctures, but he would do it along with the
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: you know, the stars and everything, and he had stuff
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 1: that was in pharmaceutical books. Up until like the late
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: eighteen nineties, they were still entertaining his stuff that he
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 1: did with like herbs mixed together, mixed under the stars
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: at a certain time. So, I mean we're looking at
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 1: a you know, small little kind of really blip right
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: now that we don't even look at that stuff. Yeah.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: So yeah, it's like what happened?
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 2: We know better now. Yeah.
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we're gonna give your bullshit chemicals instead.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Oh man, Yeah, I mean I don't want to get.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a whole other topic in itself.
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 2: But what makes the money, yeah, keep sick?
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, we're giving you medicine that makes you sick
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 1: and then go Now, we got a medicine for that too,
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 1: Jesus No, I know, ideah, that could be a whole
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 1: other show man, but uh, you know what, I think
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 1: we'll I think we'll even wrap it up here about
• 1:02:17
  Speaker 1: an hour. And I thought that was a really good chat.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 1: I would love to get you back on again in
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 1: the future.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 2: Man.
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 1: We always have good talk to.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: You whenever you want.
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 1: Man. Oh no, definitely, Yeah, helly, you always have good
• 1:02:25
  Speaker 1: talks with you. Why don't you let everybody know what's
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: up with your book again and let them know where
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 1: they can find anything else of yours. Would you like
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: to promote?
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so again. I've got this book, Fluid Condensers that
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: is published by Crosscrow. I'm sure they'd be delighted if
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 2: you order it from their website Crosscrow dot com. I
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: think that's their website or it's crosscrowbooks dot com. Sorry
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: for the for the mental uh mental block there, but
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: you can find me online pretty much anywhere at Eric
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: Arcadian And if you're listening, that is spelled a E
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: R I K as Eric and Arcadian is a R
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: K A D I A N. Because I know that
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 2: trips a lot of people out. But you can go
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 2: to Eric Arcadian dot com to find my website, my blog.
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: You can go to at eric Arcadian on YouTube to
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: find my channel and my podcast series Music Myth and
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: Magic and other than that. You can sometimes find me
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: around South Florida at a festival, teaching a workshop.
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 1: Oh nice, Oh you're in South Florida. Yeah, anywhere near
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: claud Castle.
• 1:03:37
  Speaker 2: We're like an hour away, I think, Yeah, I think, no,
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: it's it is on our to do list. Definitely want
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 2: to go, but you know the thing is it's hot
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: as hell here and that is at outdoor walking around
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: hot experience.
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 1: So yeah, it might go during like you know, winter something. Now. Yeah,
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: I went. It was pretty pretty interesting. But thank you
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: again Eric for coming on. Like I said, I was
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: a blast last time. Definitely like to get you on
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: in the future. For the listeners, definitely go check out
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 1: his book and check out Crosscrow Books. I deal with them.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: They send me some people every once in a while.
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: I have to say, they're probably like the coolest motherfuckers
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: I ever spoke to so far.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: Great.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, they're actually really down to earth and like, yeah,
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: they're really cool to deal with. When they do send
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: me people when I talk to them, So go check
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: them out. They seem like a really good crew of people.
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 1: I'm sure they got something on print that might interest people,
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: So yeah, check that out. And everybody in the chat,
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 1: thank you. That's what's up. I appreciate you. Some of
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: us we're here on the other lives, so that's what's up.
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: For coming back, I appreciate that. And that's the end
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: of another recul rejects and until the next one, everybody
• 1:04:41
  Speaker 1: be well Later