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Parenting Autism with Heart: Routine, Connection, and Resilience with Meaghan Murphy · Inchstones with Sarah | Autism Advocacy & Caregiver Stories

• 0:00
  Speaker A: Hey everyone. Welcome back. Season 2 Episode 2 with my dear friend, local Westfield mom and just total feminine baddie as the. As the kids say these days. Megan Murphy. Megan, thank you for being here on the Instance podcast today.
• 0:17
  Speaker B: Yay. Thank you for having me. I don't even know daddy's a good thing or a bad thing, right? I don't even.
• 0:22
  Speaker A: I think it's good I asked Morgan this question. I think it's good. But I think our aesthetic as like, you know, we both love our glasses and our textures. I think our girls call that cringe. Maybe. I don't know.
• 0:36
  Speaker B: Yeah, I've definitely been called cringe by my 15 year old. Definitely.
• 0:40
  Speaker A: Well, Meg, you have lived, breathed, exemplify as a woman and mother in town and then just at large through your work as editor at Women's Day, as an author for your fully charged life. What I believe that my. My mission is in a similar capacity to be a mirror as to what it means to live fully and bravely and big for what that internal humanity is as a woman and mother. Talk to me and to my listeners who, you know, mothers, caregivers of profoundly autistic children. What does that mean for everyday life to you?
• 1:20
  Speaker B: I mean, I think motherhood is hard. I mean, even being a dog mom is hard. Like, I just think parenting in any capacity is just stinking hard. You know, my sister is a mother of four and she's always kind of been my mom role model. And she's like, most of it sucks, but then you have these like moments of pure joy and bliss that makes it all okay and worthwhile. And I think that is so much of it. You know, there's so many challenges to parenting. I just enacted a new rule in my house, okay. Because my kids are now 15, 13 and 12, and I'm starting to enter that mom doesn't matter phase. And I have now, like, they have to greet me in the morning and they have to say goodnight to me. That is all I'm asking of my children right now is say good morning. Goddamn. Say good morning. Before you get. I said to my boys this morning, pretend I'm your phone. Run to me first.
• 2:19
  Speaker A: Run to me. Oh, now that's good, right? That's really good. Run to me.
• 2:23
  Speaker B: Run to me. I want to feel like I'm your phone and you have to. I don't care where, what, when, how, why. Your mom wants to hear the words good night. And if it comes with a kiss and a hug, I'm really doing cartwheels.
• 2:37
  Speaker A: Right?
• 2:37
  Speaker B: Right.
• 2:38
  Speaker A: My Dream just got like orgasmically better because you said I love you and.
• 2:42
  Speaker B: Hugged me like, oh my goodness. Especially from my 15 year old sophomore in high school daughter. Like, just pretend I, you know, we got a puppy, our dog passed away from cancer heartbreakingly at the age of seven. And I immediately got a puppy driven here from Indiana. And like I forgot that a puppy is just adds to the happy chaos immeasurably. But that dog greets me, jumps on me, wags a tail. That's the other thing I'm now saying to my kids.
• 3:09
  Speaker A: Wag your damn tail.
• 3:10
  Speaker B: See how Darby loves me. I just want a little bit of that from you. I just want to pretend that I matter still.
• 3:18
  Speaker A: It's, it is, it's a heartbreakingly one of my favorite combinations of words that Glennon Doyle said years ago, which is brutal and beautiful. It's brutiful. It's absolutely brutal. You know, I, I think that the evolution of it all is part of that brutal nature, right? That, that like as puppies and as babies, the return investment of their coos and their giggles and, and spitting, you know, everything is so damn adorable at first and it looks. And why we've been conditioned to think it gets less adorable, it's because they're testing the nest, you know, they're testing the nest of that. You know, I think that the way in which you've challenged rising and being so deeply vulnerable and emotive about anything in your life and through your career has and in town and what you do for the community is kind of your brand. Like, you know, I remember when we first met, you were like, I'm a crier. I'm sorry. And I'm like, I'm a crier too.
• 4:14
  Speaker B: Such a crier. You know, I think that the thing about it is I don't think a lot about myself, right? So if you say that's your brand, I don't even think about my brand. I have sort of. I live life very present and I, and I attribute that to a couple of things. First of all, I studied acting at Mason Gross School of the Arts. And I'm not acting through life. I'm being present through life. I am very grounded in every moment and I am really listening, which means I feel things intensely. And you know, being on stage, you didn't have to hide all of that emotion and those feelings. And so I don't, I don't, I feel it all. I feel it big, wildly. You know, in my teenage years were very tumultuous. I really, really struggled And a big piece of that was I had a raging eating disorder because I was trying to numb and quiet and stuff. Those big emotions that landed to three hospitalizations, a really long recovery process. My best friend D in the process. So, like, I've been through this.
• 5:19
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 5:19
  Speaker B: And I understand that not feeling numbing that pain, whether it was with an eating disorder or some people with alcohol or drugs or whatever, like, that's not a way for me to live. When I am vulnerable, the best things happen. When I make my mess, my message, the world opens up to me, you know, so I live with my cab light on, ready for whatever adventure is in store for me.
• 5:43
  Speaker A: I love that. I mean, I think that the use. There's so much pain that is associated with just what you, what you shared about your own journey right through. Through young adulthood and, and your specific experience with eating disorder. And we all have these mountains that we climb and they are so painful. I always share that. Like, I wish that we could all take each other's pain away and just have it dissipate. Part of it is using the emotional guide rails. Being vulnerable to the pain that does allow you to sort of sail through it in a way that reorganizes it in your body so that the next time that comes, it's a little bit more doable and with a little more like present consciousness to this is a season. This is going to transform me in some way. And the mothers that I talk to and coach and speak with all the time are looking for this decisiveness of the answer. And I think what you're sharing like, is, again, it's. Yours was. Yours was X, mine is Y. It can. There's never a prescriptive formula for moving through it. Vulnerability acts as a way to expand your idea of what that pain is.
• 6:53
  Speaker B: Yeah. And the other thing about being vulnerable or open is that it creates connection. And we need each other. We need to be fee. Feel seen, we need to feel heard. We need to feel like connected to other people. It's how we can create mentors in the process. Right. Like, oh, they did that hard thing. I can do it too. They made it through that hard thing. I can make it too. You know, when I'm open, I connect. And connection is the. Is the biggest through line for anything. Like, we just need each other to march through this really tough life.
• 7:24
  Speaker A: Right. You know, when I. When I think about what you've been, you know, you're an author, you're a host, you're forward facing on, on in, in the world, in Media and you have such a again presence about being present. You write about in your book and I, sorry if I. Because I. It's now been, I guess how long's the book? It's been two years I guess since your book.
• 7:50
  Speaker B: So the hardback came out five years ago. Oh my God, years ago. And the audible has been out five years now. So like which is time to me out in February 2000 and it'll be five years in February.
• 8:06
  Speaker A: I guess this is what happens as we age. Time just condenses. But you know you speak a lot about joy and that alignment with like discipline because you have a very disciplined outlook that also incorporates your daily joy. Yeah. And I love, so I would say.
• 8:21
  Speaker B: I hate the word discipline because it feels like rigid. Yes, rigid about me. I'm very fluid. But I would say routine and I think people thrive in routine. Kids thrive in routine. Families thrive in routine. Companies thrive in routine, thrive in routine. And I, I know that there are certain non negotiables throughout my daily routine that help me prioritize joy positivity and live what I call fully charged. And it's silly things like I, I can't not make my bed. We could be on a 4am flight and I will get up at 3:30 in the morning, kick my husband out of bed and make the bed.
• 8:58
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 8:59
  Speaker B: Because that sense of order and calm amongst all of the chaos brings me peace and I know that about myself. Yes, I have to move my body. It is non negotiable. Movement is my greatest medicine. I will move my body every day in some capacity, whether that's snowshoeing or a bar method class or walking the dog. Like it is a non negotiable because I know that that movement is my medicine and it's essential for my mental health.
• 9:26
  Speaker A: I always say like for me that it's like what? How can nighttime Sarah help morning Sarah? That's been like, that's been the phrasing I've used. Like how is morning Sarah setting nighttime Sarah up? Well that means that morning Sarah doesn't look at her phone for the first 30 minutes since waking up. Because that tone of that, that not touching that for it's probably more like 20 to be honest. But like not touching that, that sets up the whole Sarah for the whole day. But that's very, but that's precise, that's precision in that routine and that choice.
• 9:58
  Speaker B: But I think and it's like it can just be micro actions that calm like people think, oh I have to do this big sweeping Overhaul. Like, that's the mandate. And no, like, is there one thing you can do today? Could you like hydrate before you caffeinate? Like maybe that's. I know, right? Or you sit and you eat breakfast without any noise, without any distractions, without the telephone in your face, without the TV on and just like sit and be present and like chew and swallow and drink your coffee hot. Like, can you give yourself five to seven minutes to do just that? Right. Like there are micro actions that we can take that set us up for big success.
• 10:41
  Speaker A: Yeah. I mean that's always been, you know, obviously it comes from more of the developmental timeline. But why Inch Jones was so important to me is like, I, I knew that value in the smallest developmental success that Millie and Mac had was to be seen, like celebrated and just honestly just simply acknowledge. So to your point about carving out. Even if it's five minutes, I mean, I'm notoriously like, Alexa, set a timer and she's gonna respond now if I don't say anything. But like, that's exactly what's.
• 11:09
  Speaker B: What Would you like to set the timer? I love it.
• 11:14
  Speaker A: Goodbye, Alexa. But that's, but that's what I do so much because I'm so. I. I love that we have. There are tools that we can use to carve out those moments that are small, that are intentional, and that really set the trajectory of. Of our very packed motherhood schedules and lives. There was something that I posted.
• 11:34
  Speaker B: Thanks for sharing that.
• 11:35
  Speaker A: Have a great day. I'm not going to continue the conversation. The. There was something online that said, you don't have to go on the 30 hour excursion. You can go on the 30 minute walk and it will shock your. It'll create a mismatch and disrupt whatever thought process you're having that is maybe going down a more worrisome, anxiety, sad path. It truly does not matter how long you do. You know, when people are like, I have to get that vacation away. Or you can take a 30 minute walk and let the cold hit your face.
• 12:15
  Speaker B: Yeah. And like take yourself off autopilot. So like walk on the opposite side of the street. Pick a different route. You know what I mean? Like, just do something different to break.
• 12:27
  Speaker A: So where did you learn this then, Meg? Where is this? Because this is. You're. Again, I. You're right. It's not a brick. You are. It's the humanity behind it. But this is really what you integrate and show others all the time. Where does that. Where is the root of that?
• 12:41
  Speaker B: So I've been a service journalist for 30 years. You know, like, I was the deputy editor of self magazine for nine years, nearly 10 years, where like my entire job was to teach people how to live their best lives, be their best self. So like, I have interviewed every expert, I have done all the research and, and you know, then on to Good Housekeeping. I've been the editor chief Performance day for six years. Like, my whole job has always been to give you news that you'll actually want to use to talk to the experts, to read the extracts, but then to fun filter it in a way that is accessible to the masses. Right. Because like, science may say this, but how does that apply to Sarah and Megan? And that's kind of been. That's my skill set is distilling the science fun, filtering it, and giving people actionable, doable advice that's actually going to make a difference in their everyday lives. I am kind of a walking magazine in some ways for having done this for so many years. And I'm very, very curious. And I often joke that I have a lot of problems that I have to solve and if I solve those problems, I'm an evangelist for information. My job. So like, oh my gosh, like, you're.
• 13:52
  Speaker A: A walking encyclopedia to that answer because.
• 13:55
  Speaker B: Yeah. And like I have this problem that like, if I know it and like it and care about it, I feel like somebody else might too and I have to share.
• 14:03
  Speaker A: Absolutely. Yeah. I think we're built as, as women to do so. I think tendon befriend is, is innate in the most primitive of ways. You, you shared about your acting background. And I was asked a question recently in a social networking scene and I loved it. And it's going to deep dive. And so there's two questions. If you really, really knew me, you would know that. Fill in the blank.
• 14:35
  Speaker B: I'm very quiet.
• 14:39
  Speaker A: Tell us more.
• 14:41
  Speaker B: I am. I'm an extroverted introvert. So I have a very easy time being on stage, being on television, being on camera, but I need a lot of quiet to kind of keep my energy reserves protected and high. I, A lot of, you know, I don't have a lot of friends, but I have one or two really good friends. I'm not super comfortable being all things to all people. I am very protective of my energy and I, I am quiet in many moments.
• 15:21
  Speaker A: When did you realize that about yourself?
• 15:23
  Speaker B: You know, I just turned 50 and I am relentlessly me at this point. I've outgrown all vanity. I don't have a big ego. Like, I just kind of Know who I am and what makes me tick, and I've become unapologetic about it. And I really feel very strongly that our energy is our only non renewable resource. My time can get it back. So I really spend that very wisely. If you, you know, if you invite me to a party I don't want to go to, I'm saying no.
• 15:55
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. It's just. Yeah.
• 15:57
  Speaker B: Like, it's just, you know, I protect my time above all else and I need quiet.
• 16:03
  Speaker A: Me too. Which is. I don't think anyone would guess that about either of us if they jumped on this. And the second question is, the number one gift my family of origin gave me was.
• 16:17
  Speaker B: Number one gift, probably my. My second dog. Really? Yeah. Our Samoya passed away tragically, like, drowned in the swimming pool. Terrible. I know. And for Easter, my parents surprised me because I was the most vocal about having to have another dog immediately. I'll never forget, they came with Yogi onto the beach at my grandmother's house and got a second samoyed. And it was like. I mean, I felt like the sky was opening and there were rainbows and, you know, it was like, really the most magical. Like, I was so heartbroken when that dog passed and I was like, that was beyond.
• 17:03
  Speaker A: And do you feel like your family of origin, that is almost like the. One of the examples, it exemplifies where you come from?
• 17:12
  Speaker B: Probably.
• 17:13
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 17:14
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 17:14
  Speaker A: What. What do you hope to instill from, like, an experience like that and a gift in your own children's lives? Oh, my gosh.
• 17:22
  Speaker B: We just lost our dog to cancer in. In September. And I had a dog driven here from Indiana like 10 days later.
• 17:31
  Speaker A: And my kids, little Meg, still exists in there. Like I always say, we are all just like older versions of our childhood cells and we just have to lean into it because you just said this. It's like the same story. You're like, no, we're getting that dog. And now I'm in charge.
• 17:45
  Speaker B: Yeah, the dog. No one even had to ask.
• 17:50
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, listen, motherhood has a way of. Of revealing those things to us. And it. And it also just is. Is, as you said, humbling to say the least. We learned. It's. It's brutal. It's hard. What. At what point do you think that as the evolution grows and grows, that you find greater peace in that process? Because I know having children that. That sort of defy all the, like, tight and narrow, you know, routes of and journey of. Of what I expect with. My oldest has a sort of Freed me in some ways. Like, it's sort of just like shattered any orientation I had to what I expected. Where do you feel you've been shattered based on what you expected? And land in a place that like, because you, you seem to embody that. Yet we have totally different motherhood lives.
• 18:35
  Speaker B: Yeah, I think so. I think the hardest thing for me with motherhood right now is having a daughter who's 15. And I feel like I'm reliving some of the horrors of my own high school years. And I'm working very hard not to put that on her because she's a very different person than I was. But I am reliving some of the really hard parts of my life through watching her journey. So that's highly challenging for me right now.
• 19:06
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 19:06
  Speaker B: And also kind of knowing she's gone in two years, I find myself really wanting to caretake and nurture. I mean, my worst habit is I make my kids beds. Like, I know how bad it is.
• 19:18
  Speaker A: It's like self satisfying to you though, because you're like, but don't you love looking into their rooms and you don't see a messy bed? Yeah, well.
• 19:25
  Speaker B: And it like, makes me feel like they need me. I'm taking care of them. So, like, you know, like, I'm in that, like, hold on. Like my little guy doesn't look at me when he scores a basket on the basketball court anymore. Right. Like, he doesn't want to hold my hand. Like, you know, it's like I, I think that's the, the letting go, I think is so hard.
• 19:54
  Speaker A: It's, it's, it's transformative. It's hard. It's, you know, having. Having to experience like different kinds of motherhood has allowed me to see sort of this really, really bright silver lining. And some things that are really painfully typical that, you know, friends, you know, that have typical children are like, oh my God, like, this is brutal. And I'm think sometimes I think to myself, but it's also so predictive. Like, I can you could we predict. We knew this was going to happen, so let's embrace it because we absolutely knew that they were going to find their voice and test the nest and push back. But I find myself similarly saying, you know, or seeing my oldest go through some things and say, I see so much of what she's going through in myself. And I'll share with, you know, her doctor, her therapist and say I know how she's going to respond to that. And I get reminded a lot, you, she is not, you she has, she was raised differently in a different state, in a different town. Like, I know that you think that you know how she's going to respond. Part of that might be true.
• 20:56
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 20:57
  Speaker A: But there's a but she's a totally fully different person. And so it's that nature nurture that always comes back.
• 21:03
  Speaker B: I think the other thing, my dad passed like 10 years ago. And seeing now what it's like to parent a teenager, there's so many conversations that I wish I could now have and some apologies.
• 21:16
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 21:18
  Speaker B: So that I think this is a very interesting moment for me just kind of being like, wow, that's what I was like when I was 15, 16.
• 21:26
  Speaker A: Like, there's never no. Oh, I know. My mom and dad look at me, they're like. My dad actually will sometimes call my Morgan Sarah because he's like, Sarah, she sounds like the way that intonation As a 13 year old, I'm like, but that was awful. He's like, well, yeah.
• 21:43
  Speaker B: And so Charlie has a lot of that. But she doesn't have the worst parts of me, which is a blessing. But I'm always braced for the worst parts of it. And. And I just have a deeper empathy for what I put my parents through with all the shit that I pulled and would love to just like go back and apologize.
• 22:03
  Speaker A: Yeah. Well, I think that that's also one of the things that life reveals to us as we age and why, for better or for worse, you can't force anyone to see something that their body and system is not literally capable of integrating. Like, at 15, neither you nor I, nor any typically developing little girl in the 80s and 90s was able to integrate what our parents were going through as we challenged them. And I'm glad that we're mothering in this day and change. For as tough as some things are, I'm really glad. What do you think that you can, and I asked you this before, to leave the listener and audience of mine of women who are tackling things that they never thought were going to be on their bingo card. As I say, what is something that you could charge us with and allow us to just release or embrace? What would that be as a directive from you?
• 22:58
  Speaker B: I feel like it's so, it's so challenging because there's so many things that come to mind. I know I really should have a quick answer for this.
• 23:12
  Speaker A: No, but that's good because you're a beautifully complex person.
• 23:15
  Speaker B: Also, like, you know what? I. I can't fathom what it's truly like to parent A child with so many challenges. Right. So, like, I have this deep empathy that I don't want to give some trite answer that is like, stay in your day. You know, protect your time. Like. Like, I feel like it's. It's so complicated, but I think it's really, like, about embracing each day as this unique challenge. And I just was talking to this person who was, like, looking at the word challenge, and he's like, if you take the cha and the eng, you just get change. Oh, I love that. What if, like, all of those challenges were just about change and how do we react to those changes and try to embrace them as best as possible?
• 24:09
  Speaker A: That's beautiful. And I love that I'd never thought of that before. The syntax of that word. Yeah, that there. The power of now and the power of presence. Regardless of what you're going through in life, whether it's specific to women and mothers like mine or the own journey that you're on or anyone else that is in our community, close friends, acquaintances, all these things, at the end of the day, if you have your health to survive that day, you are so damn lucky. What a gift it is. And I think that the more that that becomes a mantra for any one, the more it becomes so integrated that you just end up living like that 100%.
• 24:52
  Speaker B: The other thing I. I always say to people is, like, listen, like, don't compete in the Hardship Olympics.
• 24:58
  Speaker A: Like, so true.
• 25:00
  Speaker B: Like, everybody's hard is hard. Like, I'm not giving out gold, bronze, and silver medals here. Like, your heart is hard. Regardless of how hard you think anybody else's or how easy you think anybody else is, your hardest. We are not competing in the Hardship Olympics, and I think sometimes we all need that reminder. Right? Like, whatever you're doing, and it feels hard. It's hard.
• 25:23
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 25:24
  Speaker B: Validate everyone's heart.
• 25:25
  Speaker A: Well, as. As president of the I Hate small talk fan club, I love that you and I always dive deep like this because we, like, you know, but that's. But that's true to us. That's true to us. And I. And I deeply, so deeply appreciate what you model and how you live and how you are. Your best version, not as to say, be me, but as to challenge everyone to rise to the best versions of themselves, which is always what I hope to do on this platform. Meg, thank you so much for being who you are. I appreciate you. Yay.
• 25:54
  Speaker B: Thank you for having me.
• 25:55
  Speaker A: Yay. Thank you. And a final note. Meg went through a wild journey of cancer, breast cancer, and the reason she's in this sweater today is because, you know, when you have reconstructive surgery, you can't move your arms that much. And I remember her talking like a T. Rex like this all the time. So it's a wonderful example of actually your resiliency and getting through that big pain.
• 26:17
  Speaker B: That's a very good resilience tool. I had a preventative double mastectomy, and as I was leaving, the surgeon said, you can't raise your arm, so you have to be a T. Rex. So I made it my mascot, and you gave me a cookie cutter, and my daughter and I made T Rex cookies. But the funny bone is a. You know, humor really is the best medicine. And, like, when you can learn to laugh at your circumstances when they're really, really hard and challenging. I had lice. Recovering from a double mastectomy. Embracing the T. Rex and making it my mascot, like, really, really, really flexible. You have to.
• 26:53
  Speaker A: I mean, there. Yes. As. As there have been multiple times where there's been fecal matter on the wall, and I'm like. You're like, what a shitty life. Get it, guys. Get it, you know? Anyways, appreciate you. Thank you so much for being here. One of my first guests for season two on the Inchtons podcast. And I'm deeply grateful for all that you do for not only just our community, but for the world. You're the best. Yay.
• 27:15
  Speaker B: Thank you.
• 27:16
  Speaker A: Thanks, Megan. All right, and until next time on the Inchtones podcast.