Latest / This Week On ICE / Agents raid Ilhan Omar’s home, ICE shoots a man in the Bronx, and deportations to Africa

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Agents raid Ilhan Omar’s home, ICE shoots a man in the Bronx, and deportations to Africa · This Week On ICE

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[music]
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SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to This Week On ICE for October 14, 2026.
0:09
SPEAKER_00: I'm Matthew Kendrick.
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SPEAKER_01: And I'm Kelly Kimball.
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SPEAKER_00: Last Thursday,
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SPEAKER_00: ICE agents once again shot a man during a traffic stop
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SPEAKER_00: in New York City's Marble Hill neighborhood near the Bronx,
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SPEAKER_00: leading to large protests.
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SPEAKER_00: The victim,
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SPEAKER_00: Oscar Belgal,
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SPEAKER_00: a 28-year-old Dominican man,
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SPEAKER_00: sustained injuries to his neck but survived the assault,
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SPEAKER_00: which occurred while his five-year-old child was in the car with him.
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SPEAKER_00: ICE agents claim not to have been aware a minor was in the car and blame Belgal
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SPEAKER_00: for endangering the child.
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SPEAKER_00: New York Mayor Zoran Mandani has called for ICE to withdraw from the city and for
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SPEAKER_00: a full investigation into the latest senseless shooting of an unarmed civilian.
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SPEAKER_00: Kelly and I will discuss the incident and ICE's continuous use of violent escalation.
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SPEAKER_01: But first,
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SPEAKER_01: the US Supreme Court made an emergency ruling on Tuesday last week that will allow
0:53
SPEAKER_01: the Trump administration to continue its rapid deportations of people
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SPEAKER_01: to countries other than their places of origin.
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SPEAKER_01: The court intends to issue a final ruling in December.
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SPEAKER_01: But the damage continues in the meantime,
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SPEAKER_01: as detailed in a new report by Human Rights Watch looking into the terror tactics
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SPEAKER_01: the administration is using to push migrants to leave the U.S.
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SPEAKER_01: before they face potential removal to countries that are completely unknown to them
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SPEAKER_01: and, in some cases, deeply dangerous.
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SPEAKER_00: Kelly's just back from a reporting trip to Costa Rica,
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SPEAKER_00: where she spoke with people undergoing the experiences described in the report,
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SPEAKER_00: and will bring us insight onto the conditions they face.
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SPEAKER_00: And after the break,
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SPEAKER_00: we'll chat about the federal raid on Representative Ilhan Omar's home in Washington,
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SPEAKER_00: D.C.,
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SPEAKER_00: which has occurred amidst a racist furor by the White House against Somalis,
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SPEAKER_00: of whom Omar is the most prominent and powerful member of the community.
1:43
SPEAKER_00: Stick with us.
1:46
SPEAKER_00: All right, so Kelly, I mean, all of these could be lead stories this week.
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SPEAKER_00: We really have quite a lot to get through here.
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SPEAKER_00: I want us to start with third-party deportations,
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SPEAKER_00: because I feel like that's where you and I have the most to add to the conversation,
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SPEAKER_00: given that you're just back from Costa Rica.
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SPEAKER_00: Can you tell us a little bit about the Supreme Court ruling and what it means
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SPEAKER_00: for people who might be detained by ICE as they face deportation?
2:09
SPEAKER_01: Right.
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SPEAKER_01: Last month,
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SPEAKER_01: the Supreme Court agreed that the Trump administration can,
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SPEAKER_01: for now, resume the deportation of immigrants to countries other than their own.
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SPEAKER_01: Otherwise known as third country deportations.
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SPEAKER_01: So the court is going to speed up the process of ruling on this particular case.
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SPEAKER_01: They're going to pick it back up in December and issue a final ruling early next year.
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SPEAKER_01: There are three liberal justices,
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SPEAKER_01: as we know, Sonia Sotomayor, Elena Kagan, and Ketanji Brown-Jackson.
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SPEAKER_01: All three of those judges noted that they would have denied the government's request
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SPEAKER_01: to resume deportations had they ruled late last month when they discussed this case.
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SPEAKER_01: When they pick this back up in December, lawyers are going to have to defend three major things.
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SPEAKER_01: One, they have to discuss whether lower courts had even the jurisdiction to rule on
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SPEAKER_01: the issue of third country deportation.
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SPEAKER_01: The only reason this was brought up was because there was a Boston-based U.S.
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SPEAKER_01: District Judge,
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SPEAKER_01: Brian Murphy,
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SPEAKER_01: who said that third country deportations is illegal and should be stopped.
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SPEAKER_01: And he has fought that three times in total since the start of the Trump administration.
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SPEAKER_01: And it has been batted back down by the Supreme Court three times.
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SPEAKER_01: The second thing is they have to debate whether this policy is legal at all.
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SPEAKER_01: And the third thing is, if it is illegal, did they violate due process?
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SPEAKER_01: Did they allow these deportees enough time to defend You know,
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SPEAKER_01: I just wanted to
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SPEAKER_00: say like this, like all the issues bring up are pretty thorny.
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SPEAKER_00: And one of the reasons that this is not quite as clear cut as we might hope is
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SPEAKER_00: that there have been situations in the past where it is desirable and legal
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SPEAKER_00: to deport someone to a third country.
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SPEAKER_00: So like an example just off the top of my head,
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SPEAKER_00: let's say someone gets out of North Korea,
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SPEAKER_00: goes to China and then flies to the US and attempts to live in the US
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SPEAKER_00: without papers.
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SPEAKER_00: Obviously, we don't want to send that guy back to North Korea or to China necessarily.
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SPEAKER_00: So it should be legal to send them,
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SPEAKER_00: for example, to South Korea or to a country that will accept them.
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SPEAKER_00: But this is in extreme cases.
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SPEAKER_00: And as we've discussed in the past on this podcast,
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SPEAKER_00: there's an exhaustive list of conditions that usually the U.S.
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SPEAKER_00: government has to meet in order to be able to deport someone to a third country.
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SPEAKER_00: And that country should be a safe one, right?
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SPEAKER_00: It can't be,
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SPEAKER_00: as in many of these cases,
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SPEAKER_00: a place like Iswatini, Democratic Republic of Congo, the Gambia or Ghana.
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SPEAKER_00: All of which have security problems,
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SPEAKER_00: especially for people who might be from the LGBTQ community or who might be
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SPEAKER_00: from ethnic minorities or ethnic groups that are looked down upon
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SPEAKER_00: in those countries.
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SPEAKER_00: Even though it seems perhaps from a moral level,
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SPEAKER_00: a superficial moral level,
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SPEAKER_00: like this should never happen,
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SPEAKER_00: there are precedents that make it particularly difficult.
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SPEAKER_00: And we really have to look out for how the Supreme Court thinks its way
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SPEAKER_00: through this case by December.
5:20
SPEAKER_01: Yes, to your point,
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SPEAKER_01: third country deportations have been done before, but only in a safe country.
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SPEAKER_01: What makes this unprecedented is the pace at which decisions are made
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SPEAKER_01: when somebody arrives to the United States,
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SPEAKER_01: undocumented,
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SPEAKER_01: non-citizen,
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SPEAKER_01: and then they're processed in a matter of days and then sent to a third country.
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SPEAKER_01: That is a very swift decision,
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SPEAKER_01: and there is no sense of due process in Trump's version
5:48
SPEAKER_01: of third country deportations.
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SPEAKER_01: The second thing is that the countries that deportees are being sent to are some of
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SPEAKER_01: the most insecure and conflict-ridden countries in the world.
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SPEAKER_01: A Human Rights Watch report that we are going to discuss in a little bit Talks
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SPEAKER_01: about this in great depth when it comes to the 12 separate countries
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SPEAKER_01: that are reportedly receiving third country deportees from the United States.
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SPEAKER_01: These 12 countries from across Africa include Eswatini,
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SPEAKER_01: Ghana, South Sudan, Equatorial Guinea, DRC, Rwanda.
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SPEAKER_01: Some of these places are literally declared by the State Department,
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SPEAKER_01: the U.S. State Department, as level four do not travel countries for Americans.
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SPEAKER_01: So if we're sending deportees to these countries,
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SPEAKER_01: and then when they're in these countries,
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SPEAKER_01: some of these deportees are even sent in a maximum security prison and treated as
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SPEAKER_01: if they are criminals and are not given the opportunity to see other people,
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SPEAKER_01: It is a very significant departure from the original concept
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SPEAKER_01: of what third country deportations should be and have been historically.
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SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
7:10
SPEAKER_00: And, you know,
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SPEAKER_00: I think this is a good point to dive into the Human Rights Watch report,
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SPEAKER_00: because the theme of this report is the reason the U.S.
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SPEAKER_00: is doing this is greater than the idea of third party deportation.
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SPEAKER_00: They're creating an environment of terror,
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SPEAKER_00: hoping that journalists like Kelly and I will report on this kind of thing and
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SPEAKER_00: the conditions that people are being subjected to,
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SPEAKER_00: such that migrants facing possible detention and deportation just choose to leave.
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SPEAKER_00: It is a deliberate policy of terror.
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SPEAKER_00: So let me read A really moving and disturbing quote from the report.
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SPEAKER_00: This is a man named Tesfai T. He's 35 years old.
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SPEAKER_00: He was tortured in his home country of Ethiopia,
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SPEAKER_00: came to the United States after first going to Mexico.
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SPEAKER_00: He was tortured in Mexico.
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SPEAKER_00: He was kidnapped,
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SPEAKER_00: crossed the U.S.
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SPEAKER_00: border to escape that sort of abuse,
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SPEAKER_00: then was detained and deported to Cameroon, where human rights spoke to him.
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SPEAKER_00: So this is what he said about the flight.
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SPEAKER_00: Quote,
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SPEAKER_00: End quote.
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SPEAKER_00: He then says while he was being transported,
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SPEAKER_00: he kept asking where he was being sent,
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SPEAKER_00: but quote,
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SPEAKER_00: they didn't tell us anything about where we were going,
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SPEAKER_00: what we were going to do there, nothing.
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SPEAKER_00: Then we found out when we landed in Cameroon, end quote.
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SPEAKER_01: This is not a rare detail.
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SPEAKER_01: What you just mentioned is something that nearly every deportee has shared
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SPEAKER_01: with Human rights organizations, NGOs, journalists, lawyers.
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SPEAKER_01: That is a common experience, which is what makes the system so unprecedented and so cruel.
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SPEAKER_01: What is really significant here is the speed at which
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SPEAKER_01: the third country deportation agreements with African countries was brought about.
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SPEAKER_01: I mean, one of the earliest third country deportation agreements,
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SPEAKER_01: these MOUs that the U.S. signed, was with Costa Rica.
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SPEAKER_01: That was signed in March of this year,
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SPEAKER_01: and that agreement maintained that the Costa Rica will receive 25 deportees per week
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SPEAKER_01: from the United States.
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SPEAKER_01: So, so far, if you do the math, they have about 600 deportees from the U.S. so far.
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SPEAKER_01: But in some of these countries,
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SPEAKER_01: including Ghana, Ghana has agreed to receive up to 1,200 deportees.
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SPEAKER_01: Some other countries have already received at least 100, upwards of 80.
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SPEAKER_01: This is a much faster pace of MOU2 deportee recipient pipeline that we're seeing
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SPEAKER_01: in this expanding network.
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SPEAKER_01: It's happening very quickly and with not enough time for lawyers
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SPEAKER_01: and human rights watchdogs to really brace for impact here.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
9:53
SPEAKER_00: And let's turn to Costa Rica in just a moment.
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SPEAKER_00: One more thing about the MOUs is that we really don't know the full extent
10:00
SPEAKER_00: and details of these agreements in many cases.
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SPEAKER_00: We don't know what kind of money was being exchanged.
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SPEAKER_00: We don't know what kind of visa policy was offered.
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SPEAKER_00: So, so.
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SPEAKER_00: This is in no way reflective of the idea of a safe third-party country,
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SPEAKER_00: and there's no restrictions or assurances on the part
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SPEAKER_00: of these countries receiving deportees from the United States
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SPEAKER_00: that they will be treated humanely and that they won't be subjected
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SPEAKER_00: to eventual removal to their home country that they are fearful of staying in.
10:48
SPEAKER_01: And one last thing before I move on to my trip to Costa Rica is
10:51
SPEAKER_01: that it is very clear that this is a classic violation of the principle
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SPEAKER_01: of non-refoulement.
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SPEAKER_01: So that's a core principle in international law that effectively bans countries
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SPEAKER_01: from expelling,
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SPEAKER_01: deporting,
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SPEAKER_01: returning people to a territory where they may face a high risk of torture,
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SPEAKER_01: persecution, and other irreparable harm.
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SPEAKER_01: That is happening here.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_01: At least some of the deportees that have been sent
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SPEAKER_01: to third countries have already been protected by a US judge from not returning
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SPEAKER_01: to countries in which they face heightened risk.
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SPEAKER_01: That is already happening.
11:28
SPEAKER_01: The US sent at least a dozen people who identified as lesbian, gay,
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SPEAKER_01: bisexual,
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SPEAKER_01: or transgender to African states that criminalize same-sex relations, LGBTQ people.
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SPEAKER_01: And so even if the non-refoulement is not happening in a return to their country
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SPEAKER_01: of origin,
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SPEAKER_01: The non-refoulement is happening in the country that they are being sent to
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SPEAKER_01: in this third-party scheme that we're discussing right now.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
11:53
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
11:53
SPEAKER_00: Well, so we're fortunate here that Kelly went way out of her way to Costa Rica
11:58
SPEAKER_00: to give us some firsthand accounts.
12:00
SPEAKER_00: Now, I will say...
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SPEAKER_00: If you're going to get deported to a third country,
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SPEAKER_00: Costa Rica might be the best one to get deported to.
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SPEAKER_00: And I would love to open up now, Kelly,
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SPEAKER_00: talk to us about some of the deportees you met,
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SPEAKER_00: the conditions they're in, and what people told you about their experiences.
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SPEAKER_00: Can you tell us where are these people being kept once they arrive in Costa Rica?
12:20
SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely.
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SPEAKER_01: And I really want to bridge the gap here between the worst case scenario,
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SPEAKER_01: which is the deportation to many of these countries across Africa,
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SPEAKER_01: where many of these These African countries are facing their own armed conflict,
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SPEAKER_01: their own human rights abuses and human rights violations.
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SPEAKER_01: That is the worst case scenario.
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SPEAKER_01: Costa Rica is,
12:43
SPEAKER_01: for lack of a better phrase,
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SPEAKER_01: the best case scenario because
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SPEAKER_01: when Costa Rica receives their approximately 25 deportees per week from
12:52
SPEAKER_01: the United States in accordance with an MOU that
12:54
SPEAKER_01: the two countries signed earlier this year,
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SPEAKER_01: They are placed in hotels and they have freedom of movement and they are assigned
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SPEAKER_01: an immigration caseworker from Costa Rica's own immigration system called the DGME
13:09
SPEAKER_01: and they are given translators,
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SPEAKER_01: they are given food,
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SPEAKER_01: they are given an identification card that gives them a right to work and from
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SPEAKER_01: a cultural standpoint they are also treated just like any other Costa Rican At
13:25
SPEAKER_01: the same time,
13:32
SPEAKER_01: when I spoke with lawyers and caseworkers and human rights researchers,
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SPEAKER_01: Costa Rica is a fascinating test case in which the MOU did not brace for
13:43
SPEAKER_01: the massive administrative and financial burden inherent
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SPEAKER_01: in receiving third country deportees.
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SPEAKER_01: San Jose,
13:51
SPEAKER_01: Costa Rica is where these deportees are landing and Costa Rica and
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SPEAKER_01: the United States both expected that this would be a transit hub for deportees
14:00
SPEAKER_01: to eventually return to their country of origin or maybe even
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SPEAKER_01: a fourth country near Costa Rica like Colombia,
14:07
SPEAKER_01: Venezuela, Mexico, something like that.
14:09
SPEAKER_01: What ended up happening and what lawyers and caseworkers have told me is
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SPEAKER_01: that nearly half of deportees that are coming to Costa Rica are applying
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SPEAKER_01: for some sort of permanent status,
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SPEAKER_01: a humanitarian protection,
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SPEAKER_01: or to keep their asylum cases and have them apply to Costa Rica.
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SPEAKER_01: That is putting an immense financial and administrative claim on the country.
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SPEAKER_01: Costa Rica's asylum system is at the point of collapse.
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SPEAKER_01: One lawyer who spoke to me on condition of anonymity told me
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SPEAKER_01: that there are only 10 administrators total, 10 people in the Costa Rican government
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SPEAKER_01: Now, how many asylum cases do you think Costa Rica is currently processing,
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SPEAKER_01: aside from the 25 deportees per week coming to Costa Rica from the U.S.?
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SPEAKER_01: How many do you think?
14:59
SPEAKER_00: Gosh, well, Costa Rica is one of the only safe countries in Central American region.
15:03
SPEAKER_00: I think there's probably a bunch of Venezuelans,
15:05
SPEAKER_00: a bunch of Mexicans and Guatemalans who are trying to find a way to get in there.
15:11
SPEAKER_00: Let me guess, 10,000?
15:14
SPEAKER_01: Right.
15:15
SPEAKER_01: So to your point,
15:17
SPEAKER_01: why the reason Costa Rica has so many cases is because it is one of
15:21
SPEAKER_01: the most stable countries in Central America.
15:24
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of people in the region are fleeing their own lived experience
15:30
SPEAKER_01: of persecution or violence, etc.
15:34
SPEAKER_01: The 10 administrators responsible for processing asylum claims have to process
15:38
SPEAKER_01: over 177,000 asylum cases as we speak.
15:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:44
SPEAKER_00: Oh, my God.
15:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:46
SPEAKER_00: I was not aware of that.
15:47
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
15:48
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
15:48
SPEAKER_01: And so when we look at the quote unquote best case scenario, that is Costa Rica.
15:54
SPEAKER_01: This is the best possible case for third country deportees leaving the United States
15:59
SPEAKER_01: or forcibly being transferred from the United States.
16:01
SPEAKER_01: Rather, even then,
16:03
SPEAKER_01: there is a massive bottleneck in terms of
16:07
SPEAKER_01: when their own asylum cases can be processed.
16:10
SPEAKER_01: When their temporary humanitarian protection statuses can be processed.
16:14
SPEAKER_01: And so because of this,
16:17
SPEAKER_01: even though they are promised a government ID that gives them a right to work,
16:21
SPEAKER_01: even though they are processed a translator from
16:24
SPEAKER_01: the Costa Rican government's immigration system
16:26
SPEAKER_01: to help them move along their immigration cases,
16:29
SPEAKER_01: even though they are promised food stipends and a right to move about, many, many,
16:36
SPEAKER_01: many cases that immigration lawyers have identified
16:38
SPEAKER_01: for me They are not getting their IDs in a swift manner.
16:42
SPEAKER_01: So a lot of people are languishing in these hotels, unable to work.
16:46
SPEAKER_01: And the key piece here,
16:47
SPEAKER_01: the piece that I uncovered when I was in Costa Rica,
16:51
SPEAKER_01: is that quite a majority of people are not even from a Spanish-speaking country.
16:56
SPEAKER_01: The second highest quantity of deportees that are coming to Costa Rica are
17:00
SPEAKER_01: from China and Central Asia,
17:03
SPEAKER_01: where there couldn't be A greater difference linguistically and culturally
17:07
SPEAKER_01: between two countries,
17:09
SPEAKER_01: perhaps,
17:10
SPEAKER_01: than Costa Rica and China and Costa Rica and many countries in Central Asia.
17:14
SPEAKER_01: So I'm happy now to talk about the deportees,
17:17
SPEAKER_01: but I really had to preface the fact that when we even invite the idea
17:21
SPEAKER_01: of quote unquote best case scenario,
17:24
SPEAKER_01: Costa Rica still has many,
17:26
SPEAKER_01: many challenges to overcome in order for third country deportees to have
17:31
SPEAKER_01: the experience that they were They were agreed to have.
17:36
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
17:36
SPEAKER_00: And let's turn to some of the deportees.
17:39
SPEAKER_00: I was lucky to be involved in one of the interviews you did with
17:43
SPEAKER_00: a Chinese family living now in San Jose, because I speak Mandarin as well.
17:49
SPEAKER_00: So I was helping to translate that interview.
17:51
SPEAKER_00: And in many cases,
17:54
SPEAKER_00: like in this specific case,
17:55
SPEAKER_00: they had received a card that they knew was some sort of identification,
17:59
SPEAKER_00: but they weren't entirely clear about on exactly what it entitled them to
18:04
SPEAKER_00: or how they should go about using it.
18:07
SPEAKER_00: They had spent,
18:07
SPEAKER_00: I think they said,
18:08
SPEAKER_00: $4,000 of their own money attempting to just buy the necessities of life there.
18:13
SPEAKER_00: And again,
18:13
SPEAKER_00: they were in a fairly lucky circumstance because they had people
18:16
SPEAKER_00: who could support them and who could help them while they're in this area.
18:21
SPEAKER_00: But now imagine you're from Kazakhstan and you speak a Turkic language
18:26
SPEAKER_00: that is spoken by very few people to begin with and now you're in a country On
18:30
SPEAKER_00: the other side of the world,
18:31
SPEAKER_00: where basically nobody speaks your language, how are you going to end up?
18:35
SPEAKER_00: So Kelly,
18:36
SPEAKER_00: tell me a little bit about what these folks who you spoke to,
18:38
SPEAKER_00: how their life was affected by this linguistic barriers put up in front of them.
18:45
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
18:45
SPEAKER_01: So I'll talk about two separate parties that I interviewed.
18:48
SPEAKER_01: One was the Chinese family that you had helped translate for me when I was there.
18:52
SPEAKER_01: And then the other was an individual from Vietnam.
18:55
SPEAKER_01: I'll begin first with the family from China.
18:58
SPEAKER_01: So this family were, they were Hui, which is a Muslim minority in China.
19:03
SPEAKER_01: And the incentive for this family to leave China was because of the immense level
19:09
SPEAKER_01: of persecution,
19:11
SPEAKER_01: intimidation, and violence they were facing while they were in China.
19:15
SPEAKER_01: On top of the fact that they had severely limited economic
19:18
SPEAKER_01: and professional opportunities because of their identity.
19:21
SPEAKER_01: And Matt,
19:22
SPEAKER_01: you were able to speak at greater length with this family in their native language
19:26
SPEAKER_01: than I was.
19:27
SPEAKER_01: So I'll let you discuss that part.
19:29
SPEAKER_01: But let me talk about the administrative challenges first,
19:32
SPEAKER_01: is that this family,
19:33
SPEAKER_01: they said that the food that they were given at the hotel that they were staying at
19:36
SPEAKER_01: for several months was not halal.
19:39
SPEAKER_01: So they had to then go out of their way to find money to get food
19:43
SPEAKER_01: that is more conducive to their religion.
19:46
SPEAKER_01: On top of the fact that they have a small child,
19:49
SPEAKER_01: a three year old child,
19:51
SPEAKER_01: And the money and the administrative support that they were getting was for adults.
19:58
SPEAKER_01: So they had to find a stroller.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: They had to find, you know, baby shoes and toys and coloring books.
20:05
SPEAKER_01: And they had to find a way to find,
20:08
SPEAKER_01: you know,
20:08
SPEAKER_01: bedtime stories and little books for their child in their native language,
20:13
SPEAKER_01: which is exceedingly difficult in Costa Rica, which is a Spanish speaking country.
20:18
SPEAKER_01: On top of the fact that when they are on these deportation flights,
20:22
SPEAKER_01: they are stripped of all of their belongings and are given shoes without laces
20:26
SPEAKER_01: that look astonishingly like Crocs.
20:29
SPEAKER_01: They are a Croc knockoff.
20:31
SPEAKER_01: I had a good look at them myself.
20:33
SPEAKER_01: And so they're just given these like the single pair of shoes.
20:36
SPEAKER_01: And then they have to kind of find a way to navigate what their own pursuit
20:41
SPEAKER_01: of happiness is, what their own sense and definition of dignity is.
20:45
SPEAKER_01: And this is where it is quite, quite difficult.
20:48
SPEAKER_01: And if you want to discuss a little bit more as to what the father
20:52
SPEAKER_01: of this family had told you about experiences that they were having in China,
20:56
SPEAKER_01: that would be really helpful for me as well.
20:59
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
20:59
SPEAKER_00: So, you know,
21:01
SPEAKER_00: I'm just going to preface this by saying that I am attempting
21:03
SPEAKER_00: to keep any identifiable details associated with his story anonymous.
21:08
SPEAKER_00: So if it sounds slightly vague at points, it's out of an abundance of caution on my part.
21:13
SPEAKER_00: But basically, as you mentioned, the Hui are an ethnic minority.
21:15
SPEAKER_00: They have historically faced some discrimination,
21:17
SPEAKER_00: but I think of the ethnic minorities in China,
21:20
SPEAKER_00: historically,
21:21
SPEAKER_00: they've been Relatively well treated in part because Hui derived their roots
21:27
SPEAKER_00: from ethnic Han, who are the majority in China, who converted to Islam.
21:31
SPEAKER_00: And they mostly live in sort of central western China rather than like
21:35
SPEAKER_00: the other Muslim ethnic minorities who live in the far west of China
21:39
SPEAKER_00: in Central Asia.
21:40
SPEAKER_00: And so...
21:42
SPEAKER_00: Anyway, this specific family was targeted and had an extra hard time even compared
21:46
SPEAKER_00: to other Hui people because of the husband's father who had in some way angered
21:53
SPEAKER_00: the Communist Party in the 1980s, right?
21:56
SPEAKER_00: So like back when Deng Xiaoping was in charge.
21:58
SPEAKER_00: And this had resulted in them losing their ability to stay in Tianjin,
22:02
SPEAKER_00: which is a large coastal city near Beijing.
22:06
SPEAKER_00: And they'd been deported internally within China to what's now called Xinjiang,
22:11
SPEAKER_00: the area most commonly associated with China's Uyghur minority and
22:16
SPEAKER_00: a heavily Muslim area,
22:18
SPEAKER_00: but also one that lacks a lot of development, especially in the 1980s and 1990s.
22:22
SPEAKER_00: It was very underdeveloped,
22:23
SPEAKER_00: very difficult economy,
22:25
SPEAKER_00: and they are not part of the But anyway,
22:29
SPEAKER_00: you know,
22:34
SPEAKER_00: after their father passed, the husband's family was able to move back to Tianjin.
22:38
SPEAKER_00: But again,
22:38
SPEAKER_00: because of that political background,
22:40
SPEAKER_00: they continued to face repression, discrimination.
22:42
SPEAKER_00: He's a fairly well-educated man.
22:47
SPEAKER_00: He had graduated from high school but had not been able to enter
22:49
SPEAKER_00: into higher education from there.
22:51
SPEAKER_00: And so a combination of sort of lack of education at
22:54
SPEAKER_00: a very high level plus his political background plus his ethnic background had
22:59
SPEAKER_00: conspired to create a situation in which he felt
23:01
SPEAKER_00: that his family could not support themselves in China.
23:06
SPEAKER_00: And he said something to me that really broke my heart
23:10
SPEAKER_00: but I think is really It's true of many migrants I've spoken to,
23:14
SPEAKER_00: which is that he wanted to come to the United States because he thought of
23:17
SPEAKER_00: the United States as a country of freedom that respected religious freedom,
23:21
SPEAKER_00: that respected ethnic minorities,
23:24
SPEAKER_00: and where the political crimes of his family wouldn't mean anything material.
23:29
SPEAKER_00: So he first went to Japan.
23:31
SPEAKER_00: His wife and his very young daughter went via a different route that I'm going
23:36
SPEAKER_00: to keep anonymous for their sake.
23:39
SPEAKER_00: And then they eventually met in Mexico.
23:40
SPEAKER_00: They had to spend a year in Mexico.
23:42
SPEAKER_00: They get to the United States.
23:44
SPEAKER_00: Within a month, they're detained, separated, and on their way to Costa Rica.
23:48
SPEAKER_00: And the last thing I'll say about it is when we asked him
23:51
SPEAKER_00: So
23:55
SPEAKER_00: even despite this incredibly traumatic incident,
24:01
SPEAKER_00: he's determined to create the future for his family.
24:04
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
24:05
SPEAKER_00: I just couldn't believe that he still believed in the American dream in some way
24:09
SPEAKER_00: after going through what he'd gone through.
24:11
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
24:12
SPEAKER_01: And I wanted to mention something about religious persecution is that the U.S.
24:16
SPEAKER_01: has unfortunately reached a historic number.
24:21
SPEAKER_01: Fiscal year 2026 marked the first year on record in which the U.S.
24:25
SPEAKER_01: Refugee Admissions Program resettled precisely zero Christian
24:30
SPEAKER_01: or religious minority refugees from the top countries known
24:33
SPEAKER_01: for religious persecution.
24:35
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely zero people were resettled in the United States
24:38
SPEAKER_01: who were fleeing religious persecution.
24:41
SPEAKER_01: And so this family,
24:42
SPEAKER_01: this Hui family from China fits directly into that unfortunate data point here.
24:48
SPEAKER_01: On top of the fact that for those who may be center or center right asking,
24:52
SPEAKER_01: why didn't this family from China go to some other country to claim asylum,
24:57
SPEAKER_01: to seek opportunity?
24:59
SPEAKER_01: The United States,
25:00
SPEAKER_01: in case people may have forgotten,
25:02
SPEAKER_01: has historically been the best possible place to resettle and to have a new life.
25:08
SPEAKER_01: That's the founding moral clarity of this country.
25:11
SPEAKER_01: On top of the fact that, Matt,
25:12
SPEAKER_01: I think you could probably take this away better than I can,
25:15
SPEAKER_01: is that the countries that are proximate to China,
25:18
SPEAKER_01: South Korea, Japan, they don't have the same...
25:22
SPEAKER_01: The same image of refugee resettlement or human rights protections as the United States.
25:29
SPEAKER_01: But do you want to explain that a little bit deeper?
25:31
SPEAKER_00: Sure.
25:32
SPEAKER_00: And I'm going to say some stuff that might come off as a little bit shocking,
25:35
SPEAKER_00: but know that this is a subject that I've studied for more than 15 years now.
25:41
SPEAKER_00: And I don't say it with any kind of...
25:46
SPEAKER_00: I don't look down on South Korea or Japan for holding attitudes
25:49
SPEAKER_00: that are very different from my own.
25:50
SPEAKER_00: But basically, South Korea and Japan tend to see themselves as monoethnic countries.
25:55
SPEAKER_00: In other words,
25:56
SPEAKER_00: to be a true citizen of Japan,
25:58
SPEAKER_00: it is somewhat widely accepted that you must be of Japanese heritage.
26:01
SPEAKER_00: At least you got to speak really good Japanese.
26:03
SPEAKER_00: At least you have to understand how Japanese culture works
26:06
SPEAKER_00: and how respect is offered and received in that country.
26:09
SPEAKER_00: And very much the same for South Korea in many regards.
26:13
SPEAKER_00: I will also clarify that the The cultures are vastly different.
26:30
SPEAKER_00: And I believe about 150 people from Yemen managed to take this route.
26:45
SPEAKER_00: South Korea makes it quite difficult to clarify.
27:00
SPEAKER_00: Claim asylum once you arrive there.
27:01
SPEAKER_00: Same thing with Japan.
27:02
SPEAKER_00: We also have the very right-wing prime minister of Japan currently who kind
27:06
SPEAKER_00: of embraces this image of monoculturality and sees that as a strength of Japan.
27:13
SPEAKER_00: Not making a value judgment on that.
27:15
SPEAKER_00: That's just how it is.
27:17
SPEAKER_00: So in order for this Kwe family we met to claim asylum,
27:21
SPEAKER_00: doing so in Japan, doing so in South Korea would be very difficult.
27:24
SPEAKER_00: Other countries in the region,
27:26
SPEAKER_00: say Vietnam,
27:27
SPEAKER_00: for example,
27:28
SPEAKER_00: maybe Thailand,
27:29
SPEAKER_00: you know,
27:30
SPEAKER_00: they're probably a little safer than China were not necessarily offering him
27:35
SPEAKER_00: the quality of life and economic opportunities that he sought, you know.
27:39
SPEAKER_00: Guy wants to work.
27:40
SPEAKER_00: He really, really wants to work hard and build a better life for his family.
27:44
SPEAKER_00: And this gets back to the very first interview he did on this show,
27:47
SPEAKER_00: just how much migrants,
27:49
SPEAKER_00: including migrants who arrive in the United States without any documentation,
27:52
SPEAKER_00: contribute to our economy.
27:53
SPEAKER_00: They are essential.
27:55
SPEAKER_00: So I'm getting into a value space there.
27:57
SPEAKER_00: But basically,
27:58
SPEAKER_00: that's why he could not have gone to Japan or South Korea
28:02
SPEAKER_00: or other highly developed countries in East Asia and wanted to come to
28:04
SPEAKER_00: the United States.
28:05
SPEAKER_00: He thought it was his best shot.
28:07
SPEAKER_01: We will talk about this family again.
28:09
SPEAKER_01: I wanted us to talk about this family through the lens of third country deportation,
28:13
SPEAKER_01: but there is a whole other conversation to be had about what this family went
28:18
SPEAKER_01: through and their pursuit of happiness and their lived experience in Costa Rica.
28:22
SPEAKER_01: There is a slew of administrative difficulties that I touched on in this piece here,
28:29
SPEAKER_01: but also what their life is like raising a small child in a hotel in San Jose
28:34
SPEAKER_01: in Not knowing when the next shoe will drop,
28:37
SPEAKER_01: not knowing when their immigration cases are going to move forward,
28:40
SPEAKER_01: not knowing when they can make their next move.
28:42
SPEAKER_01: You know,
28:43
SPEAKER_01: we're already like,
28:44
SPEAKER_01: you know,
28:45
SPEAKER_01: already a half hour into this podcast and I haven't even touched on
28:47
SPEAKER_01: the Vietnamese gentleman that I spoke with.
28:49
SPEAKER_01: And I really want to because it perfectly dovetails with
28:53
SPEAKER_01: the Supreme Court decision made last week.
28:55
SPEAKER_01: And so for everyone wondering more about this Hoi family,
29:00
SPEAKER_01: We will pick this back up,
29:01
SPEAKER_01: ideally with an immigration lawyer to have kind of a roundtable conversation
29:05
SPEAKER_01: or some type of immigration law expert because there is so much more to be said
29:10
SPEAKER_01: about what this father went through,
29:12
SPEAKER_01: what his wife went through,
29:13
SPEAKER_01: and what their young child is also going through,
29:16
SPEAKER_01: not knowing what is going on and when they're going to get home.
29:20
SPEAKER_01: So the Vietnamese individual completely is kind of the end result of what
29:26
SPEAKER_01: the Supreme Court ruled.
29:27
SPEAKER_01: So as a reminder,
29:29
SPEAKER_01: the Supreme Court ruled So this
29:39
SPEAKER_01: particular man worked at a factory in Vietnam
29:42
SPEAKER_01: and was making about $400 a month.
29:44
SPEAKER_01: He saved for three years thousands of dollars in his savings in order to make
29:49
SPEAKER_01: the journey to the United States to seek a better life for himself,
29:53
SPEAKER_01: not unlike the Hue gentleman that we just spoke about.
29:56
SPEAKER_01: This man left Vietnam and traveled to Taiwan.
30:00
SPEAKER_01: And then Amsterdam and then Suriname.
30:02
SPEAKER_01: And then he continued from Suriname to Panama and then to Nicaragua.
30:06
SPEAKER_01: After Nicaragua, he traveled by car with three other individuals to Mexico.
30:12
SPEAKER_01: He spent about two months in that country before crossing the river via boat
30:17
SPEAKER_01: between Mexico and Texas.
30:20
SPEAKER_01: And from that border in Texas, he was immediately apprehended.
30:25
SPEAKER_01: And this is the crucial thing here because before
30:27
SPEAKER_01: the Trump administration's executive order,
30:30
SPEAKER_01: he would have been allowed to have due process and argue a claim for asylum.
30:36
SPEAKER_01: But this is what this individual told me is that he was not given
30:40
SPEAKER_01: a meaningful opportunity to explain his reasons for seeking protection in
30:44
SPEAKER_01: the United States.
30:45
SPEAKER_01: He spoke exclusively to ICE agents, not a lawyer.
30:50
SPEAKER_01: And they never asked him to discuss asylum.
30:54
SPEAKER_01: They never gave him a credible fear interview,
30:56
SPEAKER_01: which would have established an asylum claim that he could have processed in the US.
31:01
SPEAKER_01: He was only given a translator that would help officials communicate with him
31:06
SPEAKER_01: about processing his return to Vietnam.
31:08
SPEAKER_01: That was the only conversation he had after traveling to nearly half
31:13
SPEAKER_01: a dozen countries, spending two months in Mexico, coming to the US port of entry.
31:17
SPEAKER_01: That is the reality faced by Many,
31:20
SPEAKER_01: many people just like him who are at the receiving end of
31:24
SPEAKER_01: the Supreme Court decision.
31:26
SPEAKER_01: When I asked him what he was going to do in Costa Rica, this man doesn't speak Spanish.
31:30
SPEAKER_01: He didn't even speak English.
31:31
SPEAKER_01: We had to very quickly arrange a translator to speak to him.
31:35
SPEAKER_00: Thank you to Nam Nyen who helped us out with that.
31:39
SPEAKER_00: Really came through in a clutch time.
31:40
SPEAKER_00: Thank you, sir.
31:41
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
31:42
SPEAKER_01: And when discussing even the possibility of finding work in Costa Rica,
31:48
SPEAKER_01: he said that This is not a country that is making it easy for people like him
31:54
SPEAKER_01: to even get the paperwork to get work,
31:57
SPEAKER_01: let alone get Spanish classes or a translator to help him work.
32:01
SPEAKER_01: It's simply impossible.
32:03
SPEAKER_01: And when I asked him how much money it took for him to do this entire journey,
32:07
SPEAKER_01: he said that he spent approximately $9,000 to travel to all
32:11
SPEAKER_01: of these different countries, get the boat to travel from Mexico to Texas.
32:17
SPEAKER_01: And it...
32:18
SPEAKER_01: He said that he would be hesitant to make that journey again.
32:22
SPEAKER_01: And at the same time,
32:23
SPEAKER_01: he expressed a sense of regret for,
32:28
SPEAKER_01: and also a sense of,
32:31
SPEAKER_01: and this is the part that is difficult because when you're in a room with somebody,
32:34
SPEAKER_01: you can feel it even if they don't say it.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: But I felt this tense rock in his chest and in his throat
32:41
SPEAKER_01: when describing what he had gone through and not knowing what he can do now.
32:46
SPEAKER_01: And so when we think about these decisions made in the highest court in the land,
32:52
SPEAKER_01: when we think about the calculus that the Trump administration is constructing
32:57
SPEAKER_01: with his immigration crackdown and enforcement of immigration executive orders,
33:04
SPEAKER_01: we also have to think about the rock in the throat of this man who doesn't know what
33:09
SPEAKER_01: to do next.
33:10
SPEAKER_01: We have to think about the Hui family with their young child who doesn't know
33:14
SPEAKER_01: when they're going to get their next halal meal.
33:16
SPEAKER_01: Or if they're going to have books in their native language to read to their child,
33:20
SPEAKER_01: how they're going to explain to their child why they're in a hotel for
33:23
SPEAKER_01: the sixth consecutive month.
33:25
SPEAKER_01: This is what we mean.
33:27
SPEAKER_01: And this is surprisingly just the tip of the iceberg.
33:30
SPEAKER_01: We have other things we have to talk about, unfortunately.
33:33
SPEAKER_01: And we welcome your comments and questions if you have them
33:35
SPEAKER_01: because we will pick up this conversation again.
33:38
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
33:38
SPEAKER_00: Remember, our email is thisweekonice at gmail.com.
33:42
SPEAKER_00: That is the easiest way to reach us, the best way to reach us.
33:45
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, gosh, we've recorded almost an entire episode just about this.
33:48
SPEAKER_00: When we come back,
33:49
SPEAKER_00: we are going to talk about the latest shooting in New York City,
33:53
SPEAKER_00: as well as this raid on Representative Ilhan Omar's home.
33:56
SPEAKER_00: It is a busy week, folks.
33:58
SPEAKER_00: Please stick with us.
34:03
SPEAKER_01: Hey guys, Kelly here.
34:04
SPEAKER_01: We founded This Week On ICE in February of this year,
34:07
SPEAKER_01: and in just a few short months,
34:09
SPEAKER_01: we've been incredibly grateful for the response we've received so far.
34:13
SPEAKER_01: Many of you are listening from across the U.S.
34:16
SPEAKER_01: and in countries like Mexico,
34:17
SPEAKER_01: Germany,
34:18
SPEAKER_01: Colombia,
34:19
SPEAKER_01: and the U.K.
34:20
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34:24
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34:29
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34:34
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34:39
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34:56
SPEAKER_00: Welcome back to This Week On ICE.
34:58
SPEAKER_00: We are here discussing the shooting of Oscar Belgal in New York City this week.
35:04
SPEAKER_00: Kelly, thank God Mr. Belgal survived, but what a traumatic incident.
35:09
SPEAKER_00: His five-year-old child in the car, some horrendous.
35:11
SPEAKER_00: Terrific video of the child screaming and asking his father not to die
35:16
SPEAKER_00: while he's being restrained and held by this ICE agent, the child is.
35:20
SPEAKER_00: Can you just tell us a little bit about what it's like to be in New York while
35:25
SPEAKER_00: the protests or the shooting has been going on
35:27
SPEAKER_00: and what local officials have been saying about it?
35:29
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
35:30
SPEAKER_01: So there has been an immediate and daily response from New Yorkers to this shooting.
35:37
SPEAKER_01: The important piece here is that the ICE officer who shot Mr.
35:41
SPEAKER_01: Belgal was in one of those highlighter construction vests,
35:47
SPEAKER_01: and he was masked,
35:48
SPEAKER_01: and he was holding a semi-automatic rifle,
35:51
SPEAKER_01: like one you would see Like a military, like a member of the military holding.
35:57
SPEAKER_01: And so there was absolutely zero indication that this man was ICE simply
36:01
SPEAKER_01: by how he dressed and presented himself, first of all.
36:04
SPEAKER_01: And that is actually one of the biggest sources of outrage among New Yorkers.
36:09
SPEAKER_01: Protests in the Bronx were a mad fury, for sure.
36:15
SPEAKER_01: There were police barricades that crowds of protesters were pushing
36:18
SPEAKER_01: against local law enforcement.
36:19
SPEAKER_01: There has been criticism.
36:21
SPEAKER_01: And allegations that local law enforcement were present to protect ICE officers and
36:26
SPEAKER_01: to protect ICE enforcement.
36:28
SPEAKER_01: Now that is a bit ambiguous,
36:29
SPEAKER_01: but it is mostly a source of pathos and a source of outrage among New Yorkers.
36:34
SPEAKER_01: On a daily basis since that shooting last week,
36:37
SPEAKER_01: there has been mutual aid and community organizing.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: People are going to show up at the detention facility
36:43
SPEAKER_01: that this man is being held right now for a Kind of like a vigil or another protest
36:47
SPEAKER_01: or a show of support for this man.
36:49
SPEAKER_01: At the immediate outset of the shooting,
36:51
SPEAKER_01: there was also a press conference held among local political officials,
36:56
SPEAKER_01: including Mayor Zohra Mandani himself.
36:59
SPEAKER_01: Mandani had said that he was on the phone with President Donald Trump for
37:02
SPEAKER_01: over two hours, in which he demanded that Trump release this gentleman.
37:08
SPEAKER_01: That was a failed conversation.
37:11
SPEAKER_01: He was not able to release this man from ICE custody.
37:16
SPEAKER_01: And it really defines the extent of the mayor's power and influence in this exchange.
37:21
SPEAKER_01: Ultimately,
37:22
SPEAKER_01: there is a point in which he cannot do much of anything if ICE puts somebody
37:27
SPEAKER_01: in custody.
37:28
SPEAKER_00: I would just say that I think that we've heard a lot of commentary about kind
37:32
SPEAKER_00: of Mayor Mamdani's magic touch with Trump,
37:35
SPEAKER_00: that Trump thinks he's really cool,
37:36
SPEAKER_00: that Trump thinks he's kind of sexy and wants to be around him,
37:39
SPEAKER_00: wants to be associated with him.
37:41
SPEAKER_00: I mean sexually in a non-prurient sense.
37:44
SPEAKER_00: In like a suave way.
37:45
SPEAKER_00: He's like a suave guy, right?
37:47
SPEAKER_00: People think he's cool.
37:49
SPEAKER_00: And so Trump loves to surround himself with these kind of people.
37:51
SPEAKER_00: As we all know, he's kind of a sponge for that aura, for that magnitude.
37:56
SPEAKER_00: But...
37:57
SPEAKER_00: I would say that this is a very clear example of Trump's absolute hate for migrants
38:02
SPEAKER_00: and for people of color,
38:04
SPEAKER_00: that despite this very strange but weirdly close relationship
38:11
SPEAKER_00: that Mirabam Dhani has cultivated with President Trump, probably smartly.
38:16
SPEAKER_00: I would probably do the same thing if I felt,
38:18
SPEAKER_00: because I have to represent my city and work with this very cantankerous
38:22
SPEAKER_00: and difficult president to do so.
38:24
SPEAKER_00: And we just see in this incident...
38:27
SPEAKER_00: Trump doesn't give a shit about that relationship and is standing behind ICE 100%
38:32
SPEAKER_00: on this, even though we are, as we see, like, what is this?
38:36
SPEAKER_00: The fifth time this year that we're talking about ICE shooting unarmed people?
38:40
SPEAKER_00: The fifth time that they're coming out in unmarked clothing?
38:44
SPEAKER_00: Like, if I see a guy with an assault rifle in a highlighter vest with a mask on
38:48
SPEAKER_00: in New York City, I'm not thinking police.
38:50
SPEAKER_00: I don't know what I'm thinking.
38:52
SPEAKER_00: Like, that's one of the weirdest things I've ever heard of.
38:54
SPEAKER_00: It's something you might hear about In a country where kidnappings are very common,
38:59
SPEAKER_00: where some sort of violent crime, organized crime is very common.
39:03
SPEAKER_01: Yes, and not only at the city level, we also saw that limitation at the state level.
39:07
SPEAKER_01: So New York Governor Kathy Hochul also demanded
39:11
SPEAKER_01: that ICE cease their enforcement operations in the state of New York,
39:15
SPEAKER_01: and especially in New York City.
39:17
SPEAKER_01: And during a press conference Friday morning,
39:20
SPEAKER_01: State Department Secretary Mark Wayne Mullen said verbatim,
39:23
SPEAKER_01: we are not putting a pause on enforcement.
39:26
SPEAKER_01: Full stop.
39:27
SPEAKER_01: And so that is the extent of the story so far.
39:32
SPEAKER_01: We're going to continue to monitor it as news develops.
39:35
SPEAKER_01: There is going to be a visual tonight,
39:37
SPEAKER_01: Tuesday, October 13th, outside the detention facility where this man is held.
39:42
SPEAKER_01: And I'm sure we'll have updates from that.
39:45
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
39:46
SPEAKER_00: And not to cut this short, but we do have a very important last story to talk about.
39:51
SPEAKER_00: And we're running just so short of time.
39:53
SPEAKER_00: Again, all three of these could have been lead stories,
39:55
SPEAKER_00: but Basically,
39:56
SPEAKER_00: earlier this week,
39:58
SPEAKER_00: federal agents from the Department of Homeland Security conducted a raid
40:01
SPEAKER_00: on Representative Ilhan Omar's home in Washington, D.C.
40:05
SPEAKER_00: Like I mentioned at the top,
40:06
SPEAKER_00: she is by far the most prominent and powerful Somali-American in the country,
40:11
SPEAKER_00: and she has been the target of repeated attacks from Trump.
40:16
SPEAKER_00: Who has indicated in the past that some sort of investigation is being done
40:22
SPEAKER_00: into her immigration status.
40:24
SPEAKER_00: She arrived in the United States as a 12-year-old refugee,
40:26
SPEAKER_00: became naturalized as an adult,
40:29
SPEAKER_00: and has gone on to a very successful I would just point out as well that as well
40:36
SPEAKER_00: as this being an example of targeting a prominent minority,
40:41
SPEAKER_00: this is against the Department of Justice's own policy.
40:46
SPEAKER_00: Usually within 60 days of an election, the DOJ does not touch anything.
40:52
SPEAKER_00: Any sort of investigation that has to do with any sort of politician.
40:57
SPEAKER_00: It's not the law.
40:58
SPEAKER_00: It's not the law.
40:59
SPEAKER_00: I want to clarify that.
41:00
SPEAKER_00: But it is a longstanding policy of the Department of Justice.
41:05
SPEAKER_00: And Trump says that he has nothing I just would also say this reminds me a lot
41:09
SPEAKER_00: of what Turkish President Erdogan does to his opposition,
41:11
SPEAKER_00: arresting people like Ekremi Mamoglu or the supporters of the CHP.
41:22
SPEAKER_00: From that party, we saw Orban do similar things in Hungary.
41:26
SPEAKER_00: We see China do this all the damn time.
41:29
SPEAKER_00: And it's happening here in the United States,
41:31
SPEAKER_00: a prominent opposition leader from an ethnic minority having her house raided amid
41:36
SPEAKER_00: the encouragement of a racist pogrom against Somalis that
41:39
SPEAKER_00: the president has been undertaking for years.
41:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
41:42
SPEAKER_01: Well, thank you, Matt,
41:43
SPEAKER_01: for really drawing up not only the news,
41:46
SPEAKER_01: but also the analysis behind it on Ilhan Omar's story.
41:50
SPEAKER_01: We want to end with some good news for once on this podcast.
41:53
SPEAKER_01: It's a rare happening, and when it happens, it sure is nice to share.
41:57
SPEAKER_01: But on October 7th,
41:58
SPEAKER_01: last week,
41:59
SPEAKER_01: Martin Soto was released from ICE detention In the facility in Elizabeth,
42:05
SPEAKER_01: New Jersey.
42:06
SPEAKER_01: And for those who may not remember,
42:07
SPEAKER_01: Martin Soto was the leader of the hunger and labor strike
42:11
SPEAKER_01: in Delaney Hall earlier this year in the spring.
42:14
SPEAKER_01: He was in ICE detention for eight months.
42:17
SPEAKER_01: And three,
42:19
SPEAKER_01: I'm sorry,
42:19
SPEAKER_01: four of those months, he was in solitary confinement in the facility in Elizabeth.
42:26
SPEAKER_01: And so ICE gave no reason as to why he was placed in solitary confinement,
42:29
SPEAKER_01: but I'm sure it is pretty clear for everybody why he was placed
42:33
SPEAKER_01: in solitary confinement after shortly starting a hunger and labor strike.
42:37
SPEAKER_01: Because of that hunger and labor strike in Delaney Hall,
42:39
SPEAKER_01: It created a national movement across the country.
42:42
SPEAKER_01: There were a number of hunger and labor strikes that happened
42:45
SPEAKER_01: in ICE detention facilities in California, in Montana, in Texas, in New Mexico.
42:50
SPEAKER_01: He started a movement and he was released on an ankle monitor.
42:53
SPEAKER_01: We have talked about the legality or lack thereof of the ankle monitor system,
42:58
SPEAKER_01: this new tech surveillance mechanism that ICE is using on people that they release
43:03
SPEAKER_01: from ICE detention sites.
43:05
SPEAKER_01: And I wanna leave with something that Martin said during a presser a few days ago.
43:10
SPEAKER_01: He said, we will share our story and everything that has happened to us.
43:15
SPEAKER_01: We will fight until this bad government is out.
43:18
SPEAKER_01: And so I wanted to leave you with what Martin said.
43:20
SPEAKER_01: There's obviously more to this story,
43:22
SPEAKER_01: but some good news for a leader of a movement that incited a nation.
43:28
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
43:29
SPEAKER_00: And our heartfelt congratulations to Martin for sticking
43:32
SPEAKER_00: through what must have seemed at times an unbelievable ordeal.
43:37
SPEAKER_00: That's it for us this week, folks.
43:38
SPEAKER_00: Thank you for sticking with us through this very long but very important episode.
43:42
SPEAKER_00: As always, stay safe.
43:44
SPEAKER_00: Look out for your neighbors.
43:45
SPEAKER_00: We'll see you next week.
43:47
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