Latest / Beheaded / Not Like a Regular Executioner, But a Cool Executioner | Bohemian Revolt

Transcript

Not Like a Regular Executioner, But a Cool Executioner | Bohemian Revolt · Beheaded

0:04
SPEAKER_00: Hello and welcome to Beheaded.
0:06
SPEAKER_01: Welcome to season four, episode twelve.
0:08
SPEAKER_00: I'm Megan Moore.
0:09
SPEAKER_01: And I'm Elizabeth Black.
0:12
SPEAKER_01: Go ahead, Megan.
0:14
SPEAKER_01: You say something now.
0:16
SPEAKER_00: Why don't you say that?
0:17
SPEAKER_00: Should I say something now?
0:18
SPEAKER_00: I'm always at like a You that's how it goes.
0:21
SPEAKER_01: I know when I can stare at you and But usually you have something witty to say.
0:27
SPEAKER_00: Um, I ate Chipotle for dinner.
0:30
SPEAKER_00: That's incredibly witty.
0:32
SPEAKER_00: We both ate Chipotle for dinner.
0:34
SPEAKER_00: What do you have at Chipotle, Megan?
0:36
SPEAKER_00: I love a good burrito bowl.
0:39
SPEAKER_01: Well, okay, you gotta be more specific than that.
0:41
SPEAKER_00: I mean chicken and Tahita mixed, black beans.
0:47
SPEAKER_00: Black beans, brown rice, pinto beans, hot sauce, what do you get?
0:50
SPEAKER_00: I will say Chipotle has really good merch.
0:53
SPEAKER_01: Okay, this is not the question I asked.
0:55
SPEAKER_01: We can go back to this, but first just tell the people you order.
0:58
SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
0:58
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
0:59
SPEAKER_00: A burrito bowl with white rice, black beans, pico, de gallo.
1:03
SPEAKER_00: Uh, how fast can I say this?
1:05
SPEAKER_00: Lettuce, corn, fajita, uh, easy cheese, easy sour cream.
1:10
SPEAKER_00: Does easy mean light?
1:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like light.
1:13
SPEAKER_00: Oh.
1:13
SPEAKER_01: You say that to them and they know what you're talking about?
1:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's restaurant lingo.
1:17
SPEAKER_00: Oh, you've never worked in a restaurant.
1:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I've used it.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: In Hawaii I did.
1:22
SPEAKER_00: Oh, as a server.
1:24
SPEAKER_00: Are you a server?
1:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:26
unknown: Okay.
1:26
SPEAKER_01: I was a hostess upstairs on a server downstairs.
1:29
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
1:29
SPEAKER_00: Well, when you say like easy something's like, go light on it.
1:32
SPEAKER_00: Go easy on the cheese.
1:33
SPEAKER_01: Alright.
1:34
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna try that next time because they did not go easy on my hot sauce today.
1:37
SPEAKER_00: You gotta say easy hot sauce.
1:38
SPEAKER_00: I said light, I said little.
1:41
SPEAKER_01: Well, Jake did.
1:41
SPEAKER_01: He ordered for both of us.
1:42
SPEAKER_00: I cannot speak for what my husband did during the ordering process.
1:47
SPEAKER_00: To be clear, we weren't there.
1:48
SPEAKER_01: It's not like he ordered on our behalf.
1:50
SPEAKER_01: We were I was getting wine, you were staying home, and he was getting food.
1:54
SPEAKER_00: I was comfortably at home and I had everybody running around town getting things for me.
1:59
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:59
SPEAKER_00: Elizabeth was out getting the wine, my husband was out getting dinner.
2:03
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
2:03
SPEAKER_00: I was just ordering them all about.
2:05
SPEAKER_01: I was because I like, you know, had to get off of work and come across town.
2:08
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, all right, Megan, I'm gonna get wine.
2:11
SPEAKER_01: And of course, where do I stop?
2:12
SPEAKER_01: And like this may be an Arizona problem, but in certain places in Arizona, it's like Native American land and they don't sell alcohol on the land.
2:21
SPEAKER_01: So there's like there's like a Target or a Walmart or a grocery store or like, I don't know, a bunch of stuff on the Native American land.
2:30
SPEAKER_01: And you go there, because like Target sells wine, and then you're like, hi, like where's your wine?
2:35
SPEAKER_01: And like, oh no, we don't sell it at this location.
2:37
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to my life.
2:38
SPEAKER_00: That's what I did.
2:39
SPEAKER_00: So I live on the border of the um indigenous territory.
2:44
SPEAKER_00: Do you know what it's called?
2:45
SPEAKER_00: Like, what is that territory?
2:46
SPEAKER_00: Uh it's the Indian River.
2:49
SPEAKER_01: No, no, no, no.
2:51
SPEAKER_00: Indian river Kima.
2:53
SPEAKER_01: Maybe we shouldn't speak to that because I don't know what it is.
2:58
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, there's no alcohol sales, which is weird because they sell it in the casinos.
3:03
SPEAKER_01: They sell it in the restaurants, but you can't.
3:06
SPEAKER_01: But you can't go to a like a liquor store or a grocery store.
3:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
3:10
SPEAKER_00: If I had known this before I purchased my house, this was something the real estate agent should have made me aware of.
3:15
SPEAKER_00: I had I remember my first excursion to the Target down the street.
3:19
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
3:19
SPEAKER_00: Same same scenario.
3:20
SPEAKER_00: And they just kind of like, I think they actually enjoy watching people wander around looking for the very typical Target alcohol aisle.
3:29
SPEAKER_00: And they'll have mixers, non-alcoholic mixers.
3:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
3:33
SPEAKER_00: But no alcohol.
3:34
SPEAKER_00: It's a problem in my life, trust me.
3:36
SPEAKER_01: You feel like an alcoholic because you like to ask for them.
3:39
SPEAKER_01: Like it's not like when I shop for alcohol, I usually go just for alcohol.
3:43
SPEAKER_01: Like, especially when I come to your house, it's like, oh, I'm going to podcast, I'm gonna go buy wine.
3:47
SPEAKER_01: Like, it's not like part of my regular Sunday grocery excursion doesn't include alcohol, usually.
3:53
SPEAKER_01: It's like if I'm going to a store for alcohol, it's usually just for that.
3:56
SPEAKER_01: So, of course, again, you wander around, they know you're what you're there for because you're walking around looking, and then you up and down the soda aisles and the juice aisles, and you're like, there's gotta be something.
4:06
SPEAKER_01: And then you finally just like I'm gonna ask, and you're like, hi.
4:09
SPEAKER_01: And they love that question.
4:10
SPEAKER_01: And they judge you.
4:12
SPEAKER_01: I don't say like, where's the bourbon?
4:13
SPEAKER_01: Or like, where's your liquor?
4:15
SPEAKER_01: Where's the booze?
4:16
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, I'm like, hi, do you have a wine section?
4:18
SPEAKER_01: Like, I try to be polite, and they like you could see it in their face.
4:22
SPEAKER_01: They're like, no, we don't sell alcohol here.
4:25
SPEAKER_00: You know, they probably get that question like 10 to 20 times.
4:28
SPEAKER_00: And they make you feel like the alcoholic.
4:30
SPEAKER_00: I'm I I'm so glad this wasn't just me.
4:32
SPEAKER_00: No, I hate it.
4:33
SPEAKER_00: I had the same exact experience and I felt like such a dirty lush.
4:37
SPEAKER_00: It's like, I'm so sorry.
4:38
SPEAKER_01: I'm just I just want the you just leave because it's like it came for nothing else.
4:42
SPEAKER_01: So you're like, it's like a cart full of other stuff.
4:45
SPEAKER_00: I grab like some chips, like, oh, I'm just gonna have a dry night then.
4:49
SPEAKER_00: It's fine.
4:50
SPEAKER_01: I didn't need the wine, I just need my Cheetos now.
4:53
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I you know, it's so funny.
4:55
SPEAKER_00: I forget that that's an issue because I I feel like I guess there are other areas.
4:59
SPEAKER_00: Well, there's certain states that don't do that.
5:03
SPEAKER_00: I think Colorado, right?
5:05
SPEAKER_01: Colorado doesn't sell alcohol on Sundays at liquor stores, but that might have changed because I've moved away a long time ago.
5:11
SPEAKER_01: It feels so archaic.
5:13
SPEAKER_01: It does feel kind of weird.
5:14
SPEAKER_01: I think certain states they still don't sell it in grocery stores because I know I've had people like come visit us in Arizona, and I'm like, oh, like I need to go to Target to get wine, and they're like, oh, like grocery stores don't have wine.
5:26
SPEAKER_01: No, not like any day.
5:27
SPEAKER_01: Oh they're like grocery stores don't sell alcohol.
5:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, yeah, they do.
5:31
SPEAKER_01: There's a whole freaking section divided by region.
5:34
SPEAKER_01: I can get Spanish wine, French wine.
5:37
SPEAKER_00: It is weird.
5:39
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, it is kind of strange because you just forget, depending on where you're from, like what sells what.
5:43
SPEAKER_01: But I'm glad because I was texting Megan throughout this, and I was like, hey, I'm late because I'm out of like I went to I hate even going to Walmart.
5:50
SPEAKER_01: Walmart.
5:51
SPEAKER_01: So some shitty Walmart.
5:52
SPEAKER_01: I don't even go in that store.
5:53
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, I'm at some shitty Walmart trying to find shitty wine, and they don't even.
5:57
SPEAKER_01: But then I was like, hey, I might go to either the next grocery store over or like Trader Joe's.
6:02
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, but I have to tell you, Megan, like the Trader Joe's parking lot like makes me anxious.
6:07
SPEAKER_01: It makes me anxious.
6:08
SPEAKER_00: And I'm glad you I didn't know you felt that way.
6:10
SPEAKER_00: It's so compact.
6:12
SPEAKER_00: It's scary, it's scary.
6:14
SPEAKER_00: And then the one specifically by my house is surrounded by nice restaurants.
6:19
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
6:20
SPEAKER_00: So if you go certain during certain hours, it's packed.
6:23
SPEAKER_00: So I live in a very interesting spot.
6:26
SPEAKER_00: I'm right smack in the middle of either the indigenous territory, and then on the other side of me, on the west side bougie, it's called, I don't want to give my exact location.
6:38
SPEAKER_00: I feel like I'm getting very specific here.
6:41
SPEAKER_01: What streets do you live on?
6:44
SPEAKER_00: And it's where like the celebrities live and like the millionaires live, the athletes live over there.
6:51
SPEAKER_00: And the target is right on the cusp of that.
6:54
SPEAKER_00: So the parking lot in itself is all like outie, outie, Mercedes, you know.
6:59
SPEAKER_00: And everyone's in a hurry.
7:01
SPEAKER_00: Everyone's in a hurry, yeah.
7:02
SPEAKER_00: And super just like dressed up looking.
7:05
SPEAKER_00: And then there's these really nice steakhouses in the parking lot.
7:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
7:08
SPEAKER_00: So if you go during certain hours, it's these families, especially on a weeknight, that's just their normal dinner spa, and they're dropping 200 bucks on a casual Wednesday night dinner.
7:19
SPEAKER_01: Nice places to dine.
7:20
SPEAKER_01: And then if it's not a place to dine, it's like a consignment shop or like an antique store.
7:26
SPEAKER_01: You know, it's all very nice.
7:27
SPEAKER_01: And when you have the Trader Joe's in the middle of all of it, so it's like there's only like 12 parking spots for Trader Joe's.
7:34
SPEAKER_01: And there's always people like coming and going, and again, everyone's in a hurry.
7:37
SPEAKER_01: So I hate that parking lot because it's hard to get to in the first place.
7:40
SPEAKER_01: And then when you're there, you're like, I'm gonna crash into an Audi.
7:44
SPEAKER_00: It's just like it's so much a lot of people.
7:47
SPEAKER_00: I know.
7:47
SPEAKER_00: I thought it was just me.
7:48
SPEAKER_00: I thought I hated that parking lot.
7:49
SPEAKER_01: Because I know you love Trader Joe's and I know you love going there.
7:52
SPEAKER_01: So I always thought you just like thought of it like, oh, I love going to this location.
7:56
SPEAKER_00: There I feel safe once I'm inside.
7:57
SPEAKER_00: But the parking lot is fucking madness.
7:59
SPEAKER_00: Like, I hate it.
8:00
SPEAKER_01: Like anytime we would be like, okay, who's driving to Trader Joe's?
8:03
SPEAKER_01: I'd be like, please drive, Megan.
8:04
SPEAKER_01: I can't drive there.
8:06
SPEAKER_01: I hate that place.
8:08
SPEAKER_00: Oh, anyways, guys.
8:10
SPEAKER_00: Hello, welcome back.
8:11
SPEAKER_00: We always learn something new about our friends.
8:13
SPEAKER_00: We've been so spotty this season.
8:15
SPEAKER_00: You went on two trips.
8:17
SPEAKER_01: I know.
8:17
SPEAKER_00: You've been traveling like crazy.
8:19
SPEAKER_00: I know.
8:20
SPEAKER_01: Slippery one of the scheduled catchy.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: Um, no, I did.
8:24
SPEAKER_01: I had a couple trips, and it was tough because when I got back from the trips, we were trying to coordinate, didn't work out.
8:29
SPEAKER_01: Uh, but I had a trip to Montana, which was fabulous.
8:32
SPEAKER_01: It was Whitefish, Montana, just outside of Glacier National Park.
8:35
SPEAKER_01: But what Montana was beautiful.
8:37
SPEAKER_01: We hiked uh Glacier National Park.
8:40
SPEAKER_01: Uh we went fishing.
8:41
SPEAKER_01: I caught three bass.
8:43
SPEAKER_01: It was wonderful.
8:44
SPEAKER_01: Um, and then gosh, literally yesterday, where was I yesterday?
8:48
SPEAKER_01: I was in Colorado because we drove from Colorado.
8:52
SPEAKER_01: Literally yesterday, you know, to um to South Dakota.
8:55
SPEAKER_01: So I did a marathon in South Dakota.
8:57
SPEAKER_01: Deadwood, which is a cute little mining mountain town.
9:00
SPEAKER_01: It was a trail race.
9:01
SPEAKER_01: So again, I don't want to talk excessively about my races or my runs, but the places I went were beautiful between like Glacier National Park and then the Black Hills National Park in South Dakota.
9:11
SPEAKER_01: Like very beautiful places in America.
9:13
SPEAKER_01: If you've never been, highly suggest going to.
9:15
SPEAKER_00: I really want to go to both Montana and South Dakota.
9:19
SPEAKER_00: I've heard they're gorgeous.
9:20
SPEAKER_01: It's super pretty.
9:21
SPEAKER_00: Shout out to any listeners in either of those states.
9:24
SPEAKER_00: We have some.
9:25
SPEAKER_00: I know.
9:26
SPEAKER_00: I know.
9:26
SPEAKER_00: You know, I just want to say well done on your trees.
9:28
SPEAKER_01: Beautiful on your trees.
9:31
SPEAKER_01: We don't have those in Arizona.
9:33
SPEAKER_00: Trees where you are.
9:34
SPEAKER_01: It is such a weird because it's like again, like like what Monday morning.
9:38
SPEAKER_01: I don't know what day it is.
9:39
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, are you okay?
9:41
SPEAKER_00: I actually didn't realize you just got in.
9:43
SPEAKER_00: I'm not okay.
9:44
SPEAKER_01: I'm fine.
9:45
SPEAKER_01: I'm fine.
9:45
SPEAKER_01: It's okay.
9:46
SPEAKER_01: No, but I uh like just like the course of the like the the change of what you see, because it was like I woke up in South Dakota, it's like the Black Hills National Forest, so we drove through Wyoming, which is like flat land, mostly green, a lot of cows, and then like into Denver, which is where I'm from, like which is more of a city slash suburbia, then like flew to Phoenix, and it's like you're back in the desert and it's 110 degrees, and just like literally from like one tip of the country to the other, it's just it's wild.
10:15
SPEAKER_01: It's like you don't appreciate it when you're a kid, I think.
10:17
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
10:18
SPEAKER_01: Because when you're a kid, you're just like, whatever, I'm in a new place.
10:20
SPEAKER_01: And when you're an adult, you almost like appreciate the vastness of like where we are more.
10:25
SPEAKER_00: It is interesting, the variance throughout the country.
10:29
SPEAKER_00: I know.
10:30
SPEAKER_01: And just like, yeah, talking to other travelers and where they're from and all, it's just wild.
10:34
SPEAKER_00: Cool.
10:35
SPEAKER_00: Well, I had um a really shitty week.
10:37
SPEAKER_00: I'm not so sorry.
10:38
SPEAKER_00: No, it's all right.
10:38
SPEAKER_00: It's like it's all good.
10:40
SPEAKER_00: Um tell me about your week.
10:43
SPEAKER_00: My husband got the flu really bad.
10:45
SPEAKER_00: Which we talked about last episode, so he got sick again.
10:48
SPEAKER_00: Because remember he was sick in Mexico.
10:50
SPEAKER_00: We he Yeah, we just like keep getting sick.
10:55
SPEAKER_00: I didn't knock on wood, I didn't get sick this time.
10:57
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
10:58
SPEAKER_00: Um, he got the flu, and it we went to urgent care because like his fever wasn't going down.
11:07
SPEAKER_00: And they thought it was something more serious.
11:08
SPEAKER_00: They thought it was sepsis.
11:10
SPEAKER_00: Really, I think it's because we went right before it was closing, and they were like, you need the You need to go to the ER.
11:15
SPEAKER_00: Get out of here.
11:16
SPEAKER_00: And God, it just really showed me how freaking terrible the ER system, like the emergency medical system is.
11:22
SPEAKER_00: Well, just like the health system in general.
11:24
SPEAKER_00: In general.
11:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:26
SPEAKER_00: We waited, we got there at like 9 p.m.
11:29
SPEAKER_00: We waited until almost 1 a.m.
11:32
SPEAKER_00: They brought us back.
11:32
SPEAKER_00: So we're sitting there waiting for three hours.
11:35
SPEAKER_00: I felt so bad.
11:36
SPEAKER_00: I was like in between a lady who had like a broken face and was crying for three hours and there's lots of blood.
11:42
SPEAKER_00: Broken face.
11:43
SPEAKER_00: And she just kept crying, and then another girl who just kept puking.
11:46
SPEAKER_00: And Jake was like, I don't, I'm not that sick.
11:49
SPEAKER_00: I need to like This isn't that serious.
11:51
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:51
SPEAKER_00: So I was like, they I don't know.
11:52
SPEAKER_00: They said we need to go.
11:54
SPEAKER_00: They they kept using the terms life threatening.
11:56
SPEAKER_00: Oh god.
11:57
SPEAKER_00: And again, they kept saying it was life threatening.
11:59
SPEAKER_00: This could be sepsis, it could be an infection.
12:01
SPEAKER_00: And um poor Jake.
12:03
SPEAKER_00: We were, I know we were in the hospital, and I was with them until six in the morning.
12:07
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
12:08
SPEAKER_00: And it was the flu.
12:09
SPEAKER_00: It was a really, really bad case of the flu.
12:12
SPEAKER_00: And they did the test wrong originally, which brought us to 6 a.m.
12:15
SPEAKER_00: in the ER.
12:16
SPEAKER_00: Oh, come on.
12:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I felt really bad for Jake.
12:18
SPEAKER_00: I've never, yeah, he he had it really bad.
12:20
SPEAKER_00: I'm not gonna lie.
12:21
SPEAKER_00: It was pretty, I felt pretty bad.
12:23
SPEAKER_00: Anyways, um, okay, we are back on track.
12:28
SPEAKER_00: What track?
12:29
SPEAKER_00: Our execution track.
12:30
SPEAKER_00: Hi, it's me.
12:32
SPEAKER_00: We are the problem.
12:34
SPEAKER_00: We're back to executions.
12:35
SPEAKER_00: No, it's not about witchcraft, it's not about sorcery.
12:38
SPEAKER_00: Shoot.
12:38
SPEAKER_00: Why am I here?
12:41
SPEAKER_01: Today is about a very public and very large execution.
12:47
SPEAKER_01: So it's not one execution-e today.
12:50
SPEAKER_00: Those are our favorites.
12:51
SPEAKER_00: And we love a good mass execution.
12:53
SPEAKER_00: Oof, that I gotta roll it back a little.
12:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, someone's gonna snip that.
12:59
SPEAKER_00: I don't love mass executions, but I can appreciate a good historical mass execution.
13:05
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
13:05
SPEAKER_01: Better.
13:06
SPEAKER_00: That's better.
13:06
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
13:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we were going down um scary rabbit holes on YouTube today.
13:11
SPEAKER_01: Stuff we didn't necessarily want to come across.
13:13
SPEAKER_01: Very modern day.
13:14
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, this one is called the Old Town Square Execution.
13:20
SPEAKER_02: Ooh.
13:20
SPEAKER_01: We live in Arizona, next to Old Town.
13:23
SPEAKER_01: I told Megan, should we go out and like cause some havoc?
13:26
SPEAKER_01: So a little bit.
13:31
SPEAKER_00: So on the east of me is indigenous country.
13:34
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
13:35
SPEAKER_00: On the west of me, execution auto show tomorrow is Paradise Valley.
13:39
SPEAKER_00: And then if I just go a little bit south, it's called Old Town, and that's where all the party people go, and it's downtown party district.
13:46
SPEAKER_00: If you want to party in Scottsdale, that's where you go.
13:49
SPEAKER_00: Just by Megan's house.
13:51
SPEAKER_00: I'm right in the middle.
13:52
SPEAKER_00: Anyway.
13:52
SPEAKER_00: Hit me up.
13:53
SPEAKER_00: Hit me up.
13:54
SPEAKER_01: Cowboy.
13:55
SPEAKER_01: This old town is actually in old Bohemia in the 1600s.
14:01
SPEAKER_00: Tell us where that is.
14:03
SPEAKER_00: What?
14:04
SPEAKER_00: It's in Austria.
14:06
SPEAKER_00: It's okay.
14:07
SPEAKER_00: Is it Austria?
14:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's Austria.
14:10
SPEAKER_01: Okay, because of the one of the documentaries we were looking at showed a picture of Germany, and they're like, this area used to be Bohemia, which was like old Czechoslovakia.
14:20
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
14:21
SPEAKER_01: So I think that's what it is.
14:22
SPEAKER_01: I still don't know.
14:23
SPEAKER_01: We've talked about this before.
14:25
SPEAKER_01: But yes, I believe it's Eastern Europe.
14:28
SPEAKER_01: That's better, yes.
14:29
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
14:30
SPEAKER_01: Let's just call it Eastern Europe.
14:31
SPEAKER_01: Um, so old Bohemia.
14:34
SPEAKER_01: So let's give a little bit of like context as to what's going on first.
14:38
SPEAKER_01: Um, because the way this execution came about was through a revolt.
14:41
SPEAKER_01: So we want to talk about the buildup to this revolt.
14:44
SPEAKER_01: So we're going to talk about the early 1600s in Bohemia.
14:49
SPEAKER_01: We have the Holy Roman Emperor whose name is Emperor Matthias, and at this point he knows he's aging, he's getting ill, and he doesn't have any heirs.
14:58
SPEAKER_01: Boo-hoo.
14:59
SPEAKER_01: What's he gonna do?
15:00
SPEAKER_01: He's the Holy Roman Emperor.
15:02
SPEAKER_01: So he starts to look around to say, okay, what is the next path for this country, for this area, and for the, you know, Roman Catholic Church.
15:12
SPEAKER_01: So at this point, and I'll let you kind of speak to this, Megan, but up to up to his reign, there was this a set, is it of like a law, a rule?
15:21
SPEAKER_01: It was a policy.
15:22
SPEAKER_01: A policy, I think we can call it.
15:24
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
15:24
SPEAKER_00: The name of the policy, I'm not going to because it's Latin.
15:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm not even gonna try to pronounce it.
15:30
SPEAKER_00: It's in Latin.
15:31
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
15:31
SPEAKER_00: But basically it the what the policy or not a policy, a principle.
15:37
SPEAKER_00: What the principle was was it allowed the prince of that region to determine the religion.
15:43
SPEAKER_00: Right.
15:43
SPEAKER_00: Really, it was like King Catholic VIII.
15:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I wasn't as Catholic or Protestant.
15:48
SPEAKER_00: Right.
15:49
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, exactly.
15:50
SPEAKER_00: Like in England, whoever was on the throne determined what everybody else was gonna practice.
15:55
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
15:56
SPEAKER_00: And everyone was cool with that.
15:57
SPEAKER_00: They were fine with that.
15:58
SPEAKER_00: It was primarily Protestant in Bohemia.
16:01
SPEAKER_00: Right.
16:01
SPEAKER_00: And that was all under Emperor Matthias, and they were totally cool with that.
16:05
SPEAKER_00: Um the Habsburg kings were the Protestants.
16:13
SPEAKER_00: You're shrugging.
16:14
SPEAKER_00: I'm looking at you like, yeah, that's that's fine.
16:16
SPEAKER_00: Yep, yep, yep, yep.
16:18
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
16:18
SPEAKER_00: Yep, just say it confidently.
16:20
SPEAKER_01: I believe you.
16:21
SPEAKER_01: Um, so so Emperor Matthias at this point thinks the next person in line that makes the most sense is actually this Catholic named Ferdinand of Syria.
16:31
SPEAKER_01: He's later known as Ferdinand II, who's a Holy Roman Emperor.
16:35
SPEAKER_01: So obviously we kind of know how this plays out.
16:37
SPEAKER_01: He is actually the one that takes over.
16:40
SPEAKER_01: But at this point in our story, like Matthias is just thinking about Ferdinand as, oh, I think he could be my successor.
16:46
SPEAKER_01: And then he tells him he wants to elect him to separate thrones in both Bohemia and Hungary.
16:51
SPEAKER_01: So again, Holy Roman Emperor is one thing because it means you're like kind of head of the church, the Roman Emperor type thing.
16:58
SPEAKER_01: But, you know, you can also still be king of Bohemia or King of Hungary or whatever these other titles are.
17:04
SPEAKER_01: So he's wanting this guy to kind of run all of this.
17:07
SPEAKER_01: So the Protestants now start to kind of look like look around suspiciously because they've been told, you know, for a while now that yes, whoever's in charge, that's the religion you should practice, but it's still okay to be Protestant.
17:21
SPEAKER_01: Just because you have a Catholic, you know, as the Holy Roman Emperor or sitting on your throne doesn't mean you have to be Catholic.
17:27
SPEAKER_01: But now that they see kind of the power grab that the Catholics are taking at this opportunity, the Protestants start to get a bit uncomfortable.
17:34
SPEAKER_01: And they get to, you know, the feeling that they're gonna really start to lose their religious rights.
17:38
SPEAKER_01: So they start thinking, well, what if we decide someone else should be elevated to maybe the king of Bohemia?
17:45
SPEAKER_01: And the first person they think of is this person named Frederick V, who, and I'm gonna butcher his title, but at this point he's called the elector of the Palatinite.
17:54
SPEAKER_01: Palatinate, which means he's like the king of Protestant.
17:59
SPEAKER_01: So it's basically Ferdinand the Catholic versus Frederick the Protestant.
18:04
SPEAKER_01: Um so by 1617, though, Ferdinand the Catholic is elected by the Bohemian Estates to become the Crown Prince of Bohemia, and as soon as Matthias dies, which he does, he becomes the king of Bohemia.
18:16
SPEAKER_01: So they say, okay, we solved that problem.
18:18
SPEAKER_01: We're gonna be Catholic for a little bit.
18:21
SPEAKER_01: But in May 1618, um, Ferdinand, the new Catholic king, he sends two of his Catholic counselors to the Prague castle and he says, Hey, like in my absence, just go kind of govern the Prague area, please.
18:35
SPEAKER_01: And he sends these two guys off.
18:37
SPEAKER_01: But uh just a few days later, after they arrived, there's like this assembly of Protestants who are there, and because they're so angry and they're so fearful of like what's gonna happen to the future of Protestantism in their country, they seize these two Catholic counselors, plus like a little apprentice guy or a little secretary.
18:57
SPEAKER_00: He's like a secretary, I don't know.
18:58
SPEAKER_00: Just happen to have been there.
18:59
SPEAKER_01: People joke that he wasn't even supposed to be there, he was like a fill-in or something, but they take the two counselors and this like poor secretary and they throw them out of a window in this palace.
19:09
SPEAKER_01: It's literally 56 feet off of the ground, 17 meters, and and they just are like, haha, like we're gonna show you, we're not Catholic in this country, and they throw them out the window.
19:22
SPEAKER_00: Well, what this is called is a defenstration.
19:25
SPEAKER_00: This was the third defenstration of Prague.
19:28
SPEAKER_00: So this was a trend where if they did it, if it was a form of protesting, right?
19:33
SPEAKER_00: Where they would throw, quite literally, throw the people out the window that they were against.
19:39
SPEAKER_00: Uh the first defenstration was in 1419, the second in 1483, and now here we are in 1680.
19:45
SPEAKER_00: They're like, well, it worked before.
19:46
SPEAKER_00: Was it the same window?
19:48
SPEAKER_00: I don't think so.
19:49
SPEAKER_00: Or is it just like the concept of taking the counselors or somebody who's representing what you're against, you throw them out the window.
20:00
SPEAKER_00: I try to do that to Penny once.
20:02
SPEAKER_00: My dog, thank you.
20:03
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that makes sense.
20:05
SPEAKER_00: Anne Boleyn's dog was also thrown out the window.
20:08
SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's devastating.
20:09
SPEAKER_00: Wow.
20:10
SPEAKER_00: We wouldn't do that to dogs.
20:11
SPEAKER_00: All comes full circle.
20:13
SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, this was this was a thing in Prague.
20:16
SPEAKER_00: Right.
20:17
SPEAKER_00: And what what's interesting, so they should not have survived that far of a drop.
20:23
SPEAKER_00: That's a big drop.
20:24
SPEAKER_00: They were injured, rightfully so, but nobody actually died.
20:28
SPEAKER_00: And the reason why is the realistic reason that the Protestants believed in was that they fell into a giant pile of horseshit, like a pile of dung, which nicely padded their fall.
20:44
SPEAKER_00: But the Catholics believe that an angel, or even more specifically, Mother Mary, brought came down and swooped down and and landed their fall with her wings.
20:54
SPEAKER_00: Right.
20:55
SPEAKER_00: So you hear two different stories, but in the end they survived.
20:58
SPEAKER_01: Which is shocking.
20:59
SPEAKER_01: That's a big hype for all three of them, too.
21:01
SPEAKER_01: They were like fine, they like walked away.
21:04
SPEAKER_00: Like slightly injured.
21:05
SPEAKER_00: One fell on his saber, and that's what hurt him.
21:09
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
21:10
SPEAKER_00: But the others just kind of hobbled off and they're like, You cool?
21:12
SPEAKER_00: You cool?
21:13
SPEAKER_00: Okay, let's just and then they ran away.
21:14
SPEAKER_00: And they like parted ways.
21:16
SPEAKER_00: Get out of here.
21:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, ran away.
21:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, so this is what kind of uh began what was called the Bohemian Revolt.
21:23
SPEAKER_01: So all of a sudden you have these Protestants all over starting to again get very suspicious of the Catholic rule, and there's this feeling of like, okay, a war is brewing, like we have to make sure that these Catholics are stopped.
21:35
SPEAKER_01: And this starts spreading throughout Bohemia, and I'm gonna say some countries that no longer exist, but go with it, please.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: Um, but also through Cilicia, Upper and Lower Lustasia, and Moravia.
21:48
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
21:48
SPEAKER_01: All these countries we know.
21:49
SPEAKER_00: I feel like I'm in the Princess Diaries.
21:52
SPEAKER_01: Sounds like the Broomhilda episode.
21:54
SPEAKER_01: What was the country from um God?
21:57
SPEAKER_01: I should know that.
21:58
SPEAKER_01: I was thinking about it when we were reading.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: Researching.
22:02
SPEAKER_01: No, no, no.
22:02
SPEAKER_01: Genovia.
22:03
SPEAKER_01: Genovia.
22:04
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
22:04
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, this is welcome to Genovia.
22:06
SPEAKER_01: Welcome, to Genovia.
22:08
SPEAKER_01: So all these weird countries.
22:10
SPEAKER_01: Um, and then it does all um also spread into France, into Sweden.
22:14
SPEAKER_01: So at this point, Ferdinand the Catholic, who's still on the throne, he's still the Holy Roman Emperor, he looks to his cousin, who's the King Philip III of Spain, obviously very powerful, and he's like, Help, cousin, like I don't know what to do at this point.
22:28
SPEAKER_01: All these Protestants are trying to take me down.
22:30
SPEAKER_01: They threw my counselors out the window.
22:32
SPEAKER_01: I'm poor.
22:33
SPEAKER_01: Help me, I'm poor.
22:34
SPEAKER_01: And so, what does rich King Philip III do?
22:37
SPEAKER_01: He says, Here's a bunch of money, dude.
22:39
SPEAKER_01: And he starts to hire a bunch of like mercenaries, essentially, just like soldiers for hire to um aid the Catholics in their fight against the Protestants.
22:50
SPEAKER_01: Um, so the Bohemians get more worried, the Protestant Bohemians, and they start to say, okay, what if we make Bohemia a part of the Protestant Union, which is essentially like a protestant German state coalition.
23:03
SPEAKER_01: Um, so they kind of do, you know, they do this, and then they also ask Ferdinand V, who is our Protestant person we were talking about earlier, and they say, Hey, if you help us and bring us into the Protestant Union, you know, you will be the king of Bohemia.
23:17
SPEAKER_01: Like we're gonna overthrow this uh Ferdinand guy, you will be on the throne.
23:22
SPEAKER_01: He's kind of interested in this offer, but then he finds out that they're also going to other leaders, like other members of the Bohemian estates and offering them the same thing.
23:31
SPEAKER_01: So they're literally going all around to these like influential men in Bohemia saying, Hey, you get the throne, you get the throne, you get the throne.
23:38
SPEAKER_01: All you have to do is help us get into this Protestant union.
23:41
SPEAKER_01: So because they were so duplicitous and deceitful, this all became very public, and now nobody would admit them into the union, and they their odds are even less.
23:51
SPEAKER_01: So this is what begins um the 30-year war, 30 years war, which is essentially a war between like Catholics and Protestants and the like long and short short of it.
24:02
SPEAKER_01: It was mostly in your Eastern European though, uh, or Eastern Europe, because England tried to stay out of it.
24:08
SPEAKER_01: Like a lot of countries were like, hey, we've like seen all of this happen before.
24:11
SPEAKER_01: They weren't really about it, but it did devastate Europe for a long time, this war.
24:15
SPEAKER_00: Fun fact 30 years war was actually only 29 years, 11 months, and I forgot how many days, but it's it was like right under 30 years.
24:26
SPEAKER_01: So we're yeah, we're being hyperbolic.
24:30
SPEAKER_00: I just wanted to put my two cents in.
24:32
SPEAKER_00: That's good.
24:32
SPEAKER_00: I like it.
24:33
SPEAKER_01: 29 year war.
24:35
SPEAKER_01: Um, but at this point, defeat is somewhat eminent for the Protestants.
24:40
SPEAKER_01: So the Spanish finally get a large enough army, they have like two fronts of their army, and they're invading Bohemia.
24:46
SPEAKER_01: So Ferdinand II officially defeats Frederick V in battle, and this is called the Battle of White of White Mountain, which is near Prague.
24:54
SPEAKER_01: And this takes place in uh November 8th, 1620.
24:58
SPEAKER_01: So at this point, like the Protestants lost.
25:01
SPEAKER_01: Bohemians officially become like a Catholic uh, you know, people, a Catholic country.
25:08
SPEAKER_01: Um, the League of Evangelical Union was dissolved, which I assume is similar to like the Protestant Union we were just talking about.
25:15
SPEAKER_01: Frederick V, the Protestant, was outlawed from the Holy Roman Emperor, and all of his lands were essentially seized and given to Catholic nobles.
25:23
SPEAKER_00: And he just fled and he just got seized out, which I think is funny because at the beginning of his reign, his nickname was like it translated in some way to I don't budge.
25:33
SPEAKER_00: Don't budge.
25:34
SPEAKER_00: But then he easily got his wife and picked up and left.
25:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
25:37
SPEAKER_00: And this battle, too, the battle of White Mountain was apparently like two hours ago.
25:41
SPEAKER_01: Oh, it was quick.
25:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:43
SPEAKER_00: Easy.
25:43
SPEAKER_00: So easy.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: In and out, done by lunch.
25:47
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
25:47
SPEAKER_01: They said literally that Frederick was having lunch and like someone came to him and was like, Hey, the battle's over.
25:53
SPEAKER_01: Like, you lost.
25:54
SPEAKER_00: He's like, Oh, okay, I should get it.
25:56
SPEAKER_00: I guess I'll leave.
25:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
25:57
SPEAKER_00: After that, they called him the winter king because he was only on the throne for one year.
26:03
SPEAKER_00: And it like he didn't, I don't know, something like he'll make it through winter or something, I guess.
26:08
SPEAKER_01: Winter is coming.
26:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
26:10
SPEAKER_01: Winter left.
26:11
SPEAKER_00: Winter left and didn't he did budge.
26:13
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
26:14
SPEAKER_01: Um, so so that was essentially the end of the bohemian revolt.
26:18
SPEAKER_00: Okay, thank you.
26:19
SPEAKER_00: So we know why people are in trouble.
26:22
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
26:23
SPEAKER_00: Because they they did bad, they revolted.
26:26
SPEAKER_00: Don't revolt, don't start battles, you will lose within two hours.
26:29
SPEAKER_00: Unless you believe in your cause.
26:31
SPEAKER_00: You gotta believe strong.
26:34
SPEAKER_00: So in the end, there were 47 people who were put on trial.
26:38
SPEAKER_00: 27 of the 47 were executed in Old Town Square.
26:43
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
26:44
SPEAKER_00: Um, I'm I'm gonna go into the execution, but really, like, I think where Elizabeth and I were the most fascinated with this whole story is actually about the executioner.
26:55
SPEAKER_00: Right.
26:55
SPEAKER_00: So it's gonna be this is gonna be kind of a unique episode because yes, there's the execution story, but we're gonna take a little side path and go into the executioner's life.
27:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, in a bit more detail than we usually do for executioners.
27:09
SPEAKER_00: There's a lot on him, which is cool.
27:11
SPEAKER_00: So let me explain the execution because we don't want to miss the good stuff.
27:15
SPEAKER_00: No.
27:16
SPEAKER_00: There were three nobles, seven knights, and seventeen burgers who were kind of like delicious.
27:23
SPEAKER_00: Upper middle class, you want to say?
27:24
SPEAKER_00: Like they were like the city officials, they weren't lower class, they weren't nobles, but they were working productive class.
27:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was like a step beneath the noble, like not quite a merchant class either.
27:36
SPEAKER_01: It was like you were, again, like Megan said, a city official or someone who might be involved in politics, but you weren't just, you know, a noble sitting around doing nothing or owning lands.
27:46
SPEAKER_01: You were kind of like working for your coin a bit.
27:48
SPEAKER_00: Good for them.
27:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
27:50
SPEAKER_00: On June 21st, 1621, they like we said, they were being executed in Old Town Square.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: So very big public execution, of course, intentional.
28:02
SPEAKER_00: They wanted to make a large scene to make a point of do not do this, do not cause an uprising because look at look at your friends, this is what's gonna happen.
28:12
SPEAKER_01: They also went in order of nobility.
28:14
SPEAKER_01: Yes, so key leaders started.
28:17
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
28:17
SPEAKER_01: So the noble, and I'm gonna again apologize for the name uh pronunciation, but no uh the first noble was Joaquim Andreas von Schlick, and he was beheaded first.
28:30
SPEAKER_00: Just a very quick simple just to start off the scene.
28:33
SPEAKER_01: Right.
28:34
SPEAKER_00: And then the next person, they wanted to make it even more traumatic.
28:41
SPEAKER_00: They wanted to make it an even longer drawn out situation because he was the one, he well, first of all, he wrote a pamphlet.
28:49
SPEAKER_00: What was the what was it called?
28:50
SPEAKER_01: It was something about like so yeah, so he wrote a pamphlet, it was a political pamphlet called Can a Tyrant Be Overthrown by People?
28:57
SPEAKER_01: Or in Latin it was pro I know, I wrote it down.
29:01
SPEAKER_01: Wow.
29:02
SPEAKER_01: Pro vindicius contra tyranos.
29:06
SPEAKER_00: I avoided the Latin earlier.
29:08
SPEAKER_00: Good for you.
29:09
SPEAKER_01: Also, it should be on a mug that we have, because I feel like that's a good sneaky thing to put on your mug at work.
29:13
SPEAKER_01: Can a tyrant be overthrown by people?
29:16
SPEAKER_00: Just make that like your little like mantra on your desk.
29:19
SPEAKER_01: Like every time you're mad at your boss, you just stare at that and you just kind of grit your teeth and get through your day.
29:25
SPEAKER_00: Well, he made that but didn't end up so well.
29:28
SPEAKER_00: Uh he also persuaded Hungary to break away from the Emperor, so he wasn't completely innocent here.
29:34
SPEAKER_00: No.
29:34
SPEAKER_00: They had him get his tongue cut out first, then beheaded.
29:40
SPEAKER_00: Let me just say as well, this was an unusually brutal execution for what Prague has seen up until this point.
29:48
SPEAKER_00: Right.
29:49
SPEAKER_00: I think it was really jarring for the people.
29:50
SPEAKER_00: They hadn't seen anything so violent.
29:53
SPEAKER_00: And yes, they've had beheadings and they've had hangings, but they've never really had a mass execution where they were torturing people ahead of their beheading.
30:02
SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
30:03
SPEAKER_00: Ahead of their beheading.
30:04
SPEAKER_00: Ahead of their beheading.
30:05
SPEAKER_00: Ahead of the being Megan.
30:07
SPEAKER_01: After his beheading as well, he was quartered.
30:10
SPEAKER_01: Um, and uh his his limbs were impaled on different spikes like around the area, too.
30:17
SPEAKER_01: So it was a torture before, a beheading, and then also the public spectacle of the quartering afterwards, which is also uh something Prague wasn't used to.
30:27
SPEAKER_00: Love that for him.
30:29
SPEAKER_00: Most were beheaded by sword.
30:31
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
30:31
SPEAKER_00: Um, again, we're gonna get into the executioner, but he did come prepared with four very sharp swords.
30:38
SPEAKER_00: Very handy.
30:38
SPEAKER_00: It was very uh well equipped and resourceful.
30:42
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
30:43
SPEAKER_00: Um, there was 12 folks who are part of what was called the the Unity of Brethren.
30:49
SPEAKER_00: They were basically like part of a church, a little congregation, I suppose.
30:53
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
30:54
SPEAKER_00: They were all hanged, which is actually a disgraceful execution in comparison to being beheaded.
31:00
SPEAKER_00: For them.
31:01
SPEAKER_00: For them.
31:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
31:02
SPEAKER_00: Hangings, again, hangings were slower.
31:05
SPEAKER_00: This wasn't, um, they didn't have the drop.
31:09
SPEAKER_00: What do we call it?
31:10
SPEAKER_00: The drop and a sudden stop.
31:13
SPEAKER_00: What is that?
31:14
SPEAKER_00: The trapdoor thing?
31:15
SPEAKER_00: The trapdoor, thank you.
31:16
SPEAKER_00: The trapdoor.
31:17
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
31:17
SPEAKER_00: It wasn't necessarily that technology technologically advanced.
31:20
SPEAKER_00: Right.
31:21
SPEAKER_00: So it would have probably been more of putting them on a ladder and kicking it out with them.
31:25
SPEAKER_00: And I I know we've talked about this in past episodes, but that meant that they were actually strangulated.
31:30
SPEAKER_00: There wasn't a breaking of the neck.
31:32
SPEAKER_00: Right.
31:32
SPEAKER_00: So it was a longer, slower, drawn out versus a nice swift beheading with a sword.
31:39
SPEAKER_00: Right.
31:39
SPEAKER_00: Like Ambolin was given that mercy.
31:43
SPEAKER_00: The headless bodies were given to the families, and then twelve of the heads were put into what they called as iron baskets.
31:51
SPEAKER_00: And it that didn't really make sense to us until we saw a visual of it.
31:54
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
31:55
SPEAKER_01: I because I when I heard iron basket, I assumed it was literally a basket full of heads.
31:59
SPEAKER_01: But what this means is it's actually like a mini gibbet.
32:02
SPEAKER_01: And we've talked about gibbeting before, like in our gosh, early episode with William Kidd, the pirate.
32:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:09
SPEAKER_01: But a gibbet was essentially a big steel like cylinder.
32:15
SPEAKER_00: Can you say like a cage?
32:17
SPEAKER_01: Like a cage.
32:18
SPEAKER_00: That is human-shaped.
32:19
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
32:20
SPEAKER_01: To squeeze you into.
32:21
SPEAKER_01: And you would be like thrust into the gibbet and you would usually die of exposure.
32:25
SPEAKER_00: Swing around.
32:26
SPEAKER_01: You would just swing around, get pecked at by birds.
32:29
SPEAKER_01: It's a long, slow death because you're just starving and dehydrated and just wither away, essentially.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: Um, so this looked like a tiny gibbet for just your head.
32:39
SPEAKER_00: So it's like a head-sized gibbet.
32:40
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:41
SPEAKER_01: Like the head's cut off.
32:42
SPEAKER_01: And it's just in a tiny little cage.
32:44
SPEAKER_00: Imagine being the um like blacksmith, and they're like, got an order for you, boss.
32:48
SPEAKER_00: And he's like, What's a mini gibbet?
32:50
SPEAKER_00: Like, just the head.
32:51
SPEAKER_00: Just the head.
32:52
SPEAKER_01: Like, we just wear an iron basket, and he makes them just like a standard iron basket.
32:56
SPEAKER_01: And they're like, No, you misunderstand, sir.
32:58
SPEAKER_00: You have to put the head.
32:59
SPEAKER_00: So they're kind of like lanterns.
33:01
SPEAKER_00: Like imagine like nice paper lanterns during a festival, but they're made of iron, and there was bloody decapitated heads inside of them.
33:12
SPEAKER_00: It's much different feeling.
33:13
SPEAKER_00: So they hung those up on the on the bridge.
33:15
SPEAKER_00: Beautiful.
33:16
SPEAKER_00: They were hanging there for ten years.
33:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
33:21
SPEAKER_00: Everyone just walks past them.
33:23
SPEAKER_00: Every day.
33:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
33:24
SPEAKER_01: It took them ten years, like, to take them down, which is a lovely choice of decor.
33:31
SPEAKER_01: Um, one noble actually evaded all of this.
33:34
SPEAKER_01: He committed suicide right before.
33:36
SPEAKER_02: Oh, geez.
33:37
SPEAKER_01: And he jumped out of the White Tower of Prague Castle, which is the same place where the Catholics like jumped out of the building.
33:44
SPEAKER_01: So it's like just a little bit.
33:44
SPEAKER_01: Oh, was it?
33:45
SPEAKER_01: I didn't get together.
33:46
SPEAKER_01: I didn't think it was.
33:47
SPEAKER_01: I mean, it's not the same window, but it's also kind of funny because it's like they survived that.
33:52
SPEAKER_01: So if you're trying to commit suicide, probably not the best place to go.
33:54
SPEAKER_00: Maybe he thought that he couldn't like also land into a pile of dung and run away.
34:00
SPEAKER_00: Maybe, maybe it was like a mislabeled suicide.
34:04
SPEAKER_00: Oh.
34:04
SPEAKER_00: He tried to escape.
34:05
SPEAKER_00: And they're like, oh, he thought he could.
34:08
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:08
SPEAKER_00: Um, a city clerk.
34:10
SPEAKER_00: So just to put into perspective the scope of how many people they were targeting.
34:15
SPEAKER_00: Yes, 27 were executed.
34:17
SPEAKER_00: Right.
34:17
SPEAKER_00: Yes, 47 were put on trial.
34:19
SPEAKER_00: This poor city clerk, all he did was wave to to Frederick V when he came in.
34:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
34:26
SPEAKER_00: He like welcomed him into their their neighborhood.
34:30
SPEAKER_00: He had to get his tongue nailed to the gallows.
34:34
SPEAKER_00: Which to get out of that, you have to either pull your tongue out.
34:39
SPEAKER_00: Cut off your tongue.
34:41
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
34:42
SPEAKER_00: Or have someone try to get the nail out.
34:45
SPEAKER_01: Which would you go with?
34:46
SPEAKER_01: Nail out?
34:48
SPEAKER_01: Right?
34:49
SPEAKER_01: That's the least amount of damage if someone pries the nail out, but then if they do it botched, then you lose your tongue.
34:56
SPEAKER_00: Versus if it's your tongue either way.
34:58
SPEAKER_01: We we should ask our friend who had her tongue pierced.
35:03
SPEAKER_01: Does that hurt?
35:06
SPEAKER_01: Anyway, um, so so yeah, so that was simply for welcoming Frederick V at that tongue situation happened.
35:12
SPEAKER_01: Uh but it was it was uh overall a very gruesome scene.
35:16
SPEAKER_01: Oh, and we didn't mention this too, but a few of the people that were beheaded before they were beheaded too, some of their right hands were cut off.
35:23
SPEAKER_00: Oh, they did cut off some hands.
35:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, as like a another symbolic gesture of like you gesture of like you guys were in charge of this, like you were the right hand men, you know, of this rebellion.
35:34
SPEAKER_01: Um, thus you should lose your right hand before you are beheaded.
35:37
SPEAKER_01: Interesting.
35:38
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
35:38
SPEAKER_00: So now starts the 30 Years' War because of all of this.
35:42
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
35:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, okay, let's talk about the executioner.
35:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
35:47
SPEAKER_00: So we almost wanted to do an episode on just the executioner, but then we like heard about this most famous executioner.
35:54
SPEAKER_00: Like, okay, we gotta too much good content.
35:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there's a lot of good stuff here.
35:58
SPEAKER_00: So his name is the pronoun the correct way to say is Jon Midlash.
36:04
SPEAKER_00: Nice, nailed it.
36:05
SPEAKER_00: I was originally it's spelled out for us Americans as Jan Midler.
36:11
SPEAKER_00: Like Bet Midler.
36:12
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, not the same.
36:13
SPEAKER_00: But M-Y-D-L-A-R.
36:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, with like an accent and a V on top of the R.
36:18
SPEAKER_00: But then we heard other people say it, and it's Jonas Jon Midlash Midlash.
36:22
SPEAKER_00: Good job.
36:24
SPEAKER_00: Uh do you want to start with his like back life?
36:26
SPEAKER_00: His back life, his his early.
36:29
SPEAKER_01: I love talking about back life, his early life.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: Um, so he was actually the son of a wealthy burger, which we mentioned, burgers are like the higher class, not quite noble.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: Um, but he was born into privilege.
36:42
SPEAKER_01: And so he decided at a young age that he wanted to study medicine.
36:47
SPEAKER_01: So he was training to be a doctor.
36:49
SPEAKER_01: That part we know for sure.
36:51
SPEAKER_01: The part that's a little bit more, I would say, mythical, perhaps, that might be true, is that he fell in love with a distant cousin of his who was essentially accused of poisoning her husband and her newborn baby.
37:06
SPEAKER_01: So apparently this lover slash cousin was going to be executed because of uh what she did to her husband and newborn, allegedly.
37:15
SPEAKER_01: But then he decided to leave his like essentially doctor studies to become an apprentice executioner so he could figure out a way to like save her.
37:24
SPEAKER_01: Like he was gonna like act like he wanted to be an executioner so he could sneak in and like set her free in the middle of the night.
37:30
SPEAKER_01: But apparently, regardless of who this woman was or what the story was, like it didn't work out.
37:35
SPEAKER_01: Like she was beheaded or executed either way.
37:38
SPEAKER_00: She was burned at the stake.
37:40
SPEAKER_01: Really?
37:41
SPEAKER_01: I didn't remember.
37:42
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
37:43
SPEAKER_00: I actually just ordered the book The Executioner of Prague.
37:47
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
37:47
SPEAKER_00: So I may have been a little bit premature in doing this episode because I'll look I'll come back later with the full story.
37:54
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think she was burned.
37:55
SPEAKER_00: Her name was um Dora Dorotha.
37:58
SPEAKER_00: Good job.
38:00
SPEAKER_01: Something like that.
38:00
SPEAKER_00: Dor Dorota.
38:01
SPEAKER_00: Dorothea Dorota?
38:03
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
38:04
SPEAKER_01: So um so apparently his like a uh you know, escape or not escape attempt.
38:10
SPEAKER_00: Like an an an accessory.
38:12
SPEAKER_00: What what do they call it when you're like an accessory to murder?
38:14
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like an accomplice.
38:16
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
38:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
38:17
SPEAKER_00: I don't know, he's gonna help her escape.
38:20
SPEAKER_01: So instead of being an accomplice, you know, for her escape, uh, it was kind of a failed situation, and so she ended up being executed and he ended up being an executioner.
38:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like apparently you can't go back to medicine, now you're just like stuck being an executioner.
38:36
SPEAKER_01: She just really liked it.
38:37
SPEAKER_01: I well, he already had a fascination with the human body, so perhaps this was just a natural extension of like I'm more curious to see how they die.
38:45
SPEAKER_00: The story of Jan Midlash reminds me a lot of the story of the one of my favorite book series.
38:51
SPEAKER_00: I always, I'm sorry, I'm always talking about it, but um, The Hayman's Daughter.
38:56
SPEAKER_00: Yes, like his profile is almost identical to the profile of the protagonist of this book series.
39:03
SPEAKER_00: So I don't I I wonder if there is some influence there.
39:06
SPEAKER_00: There might be.
39:07
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but I mean, not so much the story of how he became an executioner, but what we're gonna learn after this.
39:14
SPEAKER_00: So the role as an executioner, and and I realize that some of this is repeat information, but for those who this is new to you, I I find this the history of the career, the occupation of an executioner in itself, yeah, is incredibly fascinating.
39:31
SPEAKER_00: Right.
39:32
SPEAKER_00: They were very isolated from the rest of society.
39:35
SPEAKER_00: So it was it was so odd because they were a crucial part of their society.
39:41
SPEAKER_00: They wanted the executioner to be there to for crime and punishment and to have the structure of civilization should look like and what punishment should look like.
39:51
SPEAKER_00: Right.
39:52
SPEAKER_00: But on the other hand, they were isolated and they were almost like cursed, and you couldn't associate yourself with an executioner.
39:58
SPEAKER_01: It's kind of like bad luck, really.
40:00
SPEAKER_00: You couldn't shake their hands.
40:02
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
40:02
SPEAKER_00: If it they're almost like a black like a black cat.
40:05
SPEAKER_00: It was bad luck if they walked in front of you.
40:09
SPEAKER_00: He was only allowed to go to one pub in the city or in the town, and he had his own table that was reserved for him that was so that people couldn't really see him, but he could go and enjoy his libations.
40:22
SPEAKER_00: I would like that.
40:23
SPEAKER_00: I wouldn't mind that either.
40:24
SPEAKER_01: You're like, hmm, what's the downside to all this?
40:27
SPEAKER_00: His family was allowed to attend church, but again, they had their own segregated section because it was curse, bad luck to have them in view of while you're trying to get the word of God.
40:39
SPEAKER_01: So you're a VIP everywhere.
40:40
SPEAKER_01: VIP everywhere you still don't see the problem.
40:43
SPEAKER_00: You walk around when people like walk past you, they kind of like do the the sign of the cross.
40:49
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the sign of the cross on themselves, or they'll say a prayer.
40:52
SPEAKER_00: Because again, bad luck.
40:54
SPEAKER_00: Um and that that's a very kind of like a sad life to live.
40:59
SPEAKER_00: Right.
40:59
SPEAKER_00: So that was the traditional way to be an executioner.
41:02
SPEAKER_00: It was also handed down throughout the family.
41:04
SPEAKER_00: So your father was an executioner, your grandfather would have been an executioner.
41:08
SPEAKER_00: It was whether you wanted that role or not, you just kind of got shoved into it.
41:12
SPEAKER_00: Right.
41:13
SPEAKER_00: We also grew up with that lifestyle, so you knew what it was like, you knew what you were getting.
41:17
SPEAKER_00: Used to the isolation, the whole family's kind of already shunned.
41:20
SPEAKER_00: Right.
41:21
SPEAKER_00: So you just kind of go with the flow.
41:23
SPEAKER_01: Which is interesting that he was not raised from by an executioner.
41:27
SPEAKER_00: He was an anomaly.
41:28
SPEAKER_00: Not only was he not raised, and this was a fresh role for his his lineage, yeah.
41:34
SPEAKER_00: People actually liked him.
41:35
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
41:36
SPEAKER_00: He was actually a very likable character.
41:39
SPEAKER_00: He had friends.
41:40
SPEAKER_00: Um, and I think part of that is because he did go to school and he was training to become a doctor, and um, people would go to him, especially poorer people if they had like broken bones or an illness, they would go to him for help.
41:53
SPEAKER_00: Right.
41:54
SPEAKER_00: Um, and I'm gonna circle back to our fellow who was one of the link the ringleaders, and he had his tongue cut out before, and he had one of the more brutal executions.
42:06
SPEAKER_00: This guy, his name was uh Zazinski.
42:10
SPEAKER_00: Yes, he was one of his best friends.
42:15
SPEAKER_00: Could you imagine?
42:16
SPEAKER_00: No, so you're told it is your duty and your job, or you will be fired and you will not be able to work again.
42:25
SPEAKER_00: Work again in this area to not only execute your best friend, but to tell them make it long, make it torturous, draw it out.
42:36
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
42:36
SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's like I just think of me having to cut your tongue out.
42:40
SPEAKER_00: You would.
42:41
SPEAKER_00: I would do it.
42:42
SPEAKER_00: Like if I had to, I would.
42:43
SPEAKER_01: For money?
42:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you got paid pretty good for it.
42:48
SPEAKER_00: So that's pretty good.
42:49
SPEAKER_00: It's okay.
42:49
SPEAKER_01: I'd make it tough on you.
42:50
SPEAKER_01: I'd haunt you for a long time.
42:53
SPEAKER_00: I would deserve it.
42:54
SPEAKER_01: It's okay.
42:55
SPEAKER_01: Ghost in the tower.
42:57
SPEAKER_01: Ooh, I like that.
42:58
SPEAKER_01: I know.
42:59
SPEAKER_00: Um, let me see.
43:01
SPEAKER_00: I'm just reading my notes here.
43:02
SPEAKER_01: Uh well, he was also what they called a, and I'm gonna say this wrong too, uh, utrequist.
43:11
SPEAKER_01: Good job.
43:12
SPEAKER_01: Did I say it right?
43:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
43:13
SPEAKER_01: So that essentially meant that he himself was from like a reformist Christian movement similar to Protestantism.
43:21
SPEAKER_01: So he could actually hear um the victim's prayers before the execution.
43:26
SPEAKER_01: So some of them did come to him almost in like, you know, solidarity or whatever, like, hey, as a fellow Protestant, like I want to pray to you before I die.
43:35
SPEAKER_01: And he was able to hear those prayers and offer them some semblance of like console, I suppose.
43:41
SPEAKER_01: Um so he in the little bit of like what that means, his like his specific sect of Protestantism, was he believed that um laymen should also get wine with Eucharist.
43:54
SPEAKER_01: So, like in you know, the Roman Catholic Church back in this era, I believe, and you can correct me.
44:00
SPEAKER_01: If I'm wrong, or someone can.
44:01
SPEAKER_01: I but are you talking to me?
44:03
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, anyway.
44:03
SPEAKER_01: Oh, okay.
44:04
SPEAKER_01: But but I believe what happened in this era was like you were allowed to get the bread of Christ, like the communion, but the blood of Christ, like the holy you know, sacrament with the wine, was only reserved for like priests at the time.
44:17
SPEAKER_01: So they had this belief in the Protestant church, which is funny because obviously nowadays it's very different.
44:23
SPEAKER_01: But they believed that if priests could get the wine, that laymen could also get wine.
44:28
SPEAKER_01: So a lot of the like that.
44:30
SPEAKER_01: Wine all around.
44:31
SPEAKER_01: Drinks for everyone.
44:33
SPEAKER_01: Drinks on the house.
44:34
SPEAKER_01: Um so speaking of.
44:36
SPEAKER_01: I know, there you go.
44:37
SPEAKER_01: You still have to have your wine.
44:38
SPEAKER_01: Mine's gone.
44:39
SPEAKER_01: I finished my sacrament over here.
44:41
SPEAKER_01: I've got a sip left.
44:42
SPEAKER_01: Um, so so that was part of what he believed was uh again that the wine should be with the Eucharist for for people that weren't just priests.
44:50
SPEAKER_01: So he was able to at least like hear some of the prayers before the executions and offer them a little bit of that again.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: Like, and I'm sure Zzinski really loved that.
44:58
SPEAKER_00: Like, hey, I wonder what his sentiment was.
45:00
SPEAKER_00: Like, you're like, hey, buddy, or it was like, fuck you.
45:03
SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't know.
45:04
SPEAKER_00: No, that's a conflicting I don't know.
45:07
SPEAKER_00: Also also with Zazinski.
45:09
SPEAKER_00: So they met in medical school.
45:12
SPEAKER_00: Right.
45:12
SPEAKER_00: And Zazinski was one of the first people to do an autopsy.
45:17
SPEAKER_00: Like in the area, I think.
45:18
SPEAKER_00: Oh, in the area?
45:19
SPEAKER_00: I thought or maybe every I don't know.
45:20
SPEAKER_00: But either way, groundbreaking.
45:22
SPEAKER_00: Anyways, yeah, so they did away with him.
45:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
45:25
SPEAKER_00: Um, and and again, he made a lot of money from this, and that's not necessarily why he did it.
45:30
SPEAKER_00: He was he he ended up going through with it and doing it because he respected the position, he respected the government, and he saw it very much as just his job.
45:40
SPEAKER_00: Right.
45:40
SPEAKER_00: But he did get paid a lot of money for it because he was Protestant and he was executing the the other Protestants.
45:51
SPEAKER_00: He was seen as a traitor.
45:53
SPEAKER_00: And while he was a likable guy and people were like, hey, I know you're the town executioner, but we still, you know, like you're you're cool, you're with us.
46:00
SPEAKER_00: They ended up really seeing him as a traitor, and he wasn't cool anymore.
46:05
SPEAKER_00: They actually he had all this money, he got pretty rich from this 27 executions.
46:10
SPEAKER_00: Imagine, because they got paid per execution, and that's like a couple years worth probably of one execution done.
46:18
SPEAKER_00: Right.
46:18
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it was a long day.
46:20
SPEAKER_00: He started at 5 a.m., but he got it done.
46:23
SPEAKER_00: Um, and people wouldn't accept his money, so he'd go to the pubs and he would try to buy things and they saw it as like blood, yeah, it was like blood money to them.
46:30
SPEAKER_00: Like these are our this is our family that you murdered.
46:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
46:34
SPEAKER_01: It was said too that his wife even committed suicide after um this was all done because of the shame that was like brought upon her family.
46:42
SPEAKER_00: Completely ostracized all of them.
46:44
SPEAKER_01: And more so than a regular, again, like executioner and his execution family.
46:49
SPEAKER_01: It's like, you know, because he was so well liked before, and now this big fall from grace, like his fa his wife couldn't even take the shame.
46:57
SPEAKER_00: But I love a story with an ironic ending.
47:00
SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
47:00
SPEAKER_00: So he actually ended up getting married again and having a lot of kids.
47:05
SPEAKER_00: And some of those kids did become executioners, which he so he did start the lineage of executions.
47:11
SPEAKER_00: Like it did he was the root of it.
47:14
SPEAKER_00: Right.
47:14
SPEAKER_00: His grandson was also an executioner.
47:18
SPEAKER_00: His grandson was charged of arson that lit the city on fire.
47:23
SPEAKER_00: Krog.
47:24
SPEAKER_00: Was sent to death, yeah, beheaded on the same scaffold at Old Town Square.
47:33
SPEAKER_00: Poetic justice.
47:35
SPEAKER_00: Interesting.
47:36
SPEAKER_00: I d I wonder if he was still alive for that.
47:39
SPEAKER_01: Probably not.
47:40
SPEAKER_01: With your grandson, not if his grandson was older, but who knows?
47:44
SPEAKER_01: Probably not.
47:44
SPEAKER_00: If it was the lifespan wasn't as long.
47:47
SPEAKER_01: That would be so interesting.
47:49
SPEAKER_00: Love a story with like a twist ending.
47:52
SPEAKER_01: And one thing we didn't mention too about uh our good friend Jan is that he also wore a signature red hood as an executioner.
48:01
SPEAKER_01: Because again, we talked about this, but executioners, and you've probably seen a bunch of this in movies and you know, uh book depictions, but they always wear a black hood.
48:10
SPEAKER_01: That's like the symbol of the executioner.
48:12
SPEAKER_01: But he wore a red hood, which isn't exactly.
48:14
SPEAKER_01: Do you know why?
48:15
SPEAKER_01: No, it never said why in my readings.
48:18
SPEAKER_01: His signature look.
48:19
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if that's him being, again, like slightly because he wasn't a traditional executioner, like his mark of being different.
48:25
SPEAKER_00: Like a regular executioner.
48:27
SPEAKER_00: A cool executioner.
48:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:29
SPEAKER_01: Or like, you know, is it because, you know, red was the color of martyrs, so somehow he felt like what he was doing was important.
48:37
SPEAKER_01: I don't know what it was.
48:39
SPEAKER_00: I will give you double credit because our wine for the evening intentionally had a red like wax on top.
48:49
SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
48:50
SPEAKER_00: And you're always very so see when I buy wine, I just like go for the second to the bottom shelf and whatever looks mediocre.
48:58
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
48:58
SPEAKER_00: You always find something that is kind of relevant or symbolic story.
49:02
SPEAKER_00: So you found the wine that was like the red hood, the red-hooded wine.
49:07
SPEAKER_01: The red hooded wine.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: The red waxed wine.
49:09
SPEAKER_01: Red waxed wine.
49:10
SPEAKER_01: I do my.
49:10
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I like that name, the red-waxed wine.
49:12
SPEAKER_01: I almost suggested we eat burgers tonight because of the whole burger class.
49:18
SPEAKER_00: Stop.
49:19
SPEAKER_00: Said we got Chipotle.
49:21
SPEAKER_01: I know.
49:21
SPEAKER_01: Chipotle was fine, but in indeed, I thought burgers and um red-hooded wine would be the play tonight.
49:29
SPEAKER_01: We couldn't just say we did.
49:31
SPEAKER_01: Oh, erase everything we just said.
49:33
SPEAKER_01: We definitely had burgers and red wine tonight.
49:37
SPEAKER_01: Oh, jeez.
49:38
SPEAKER_01: Red hooded wine.
49:40
SPEAKER_01: That sounds I don't like saying hooded over and over.
49:42
SPEAKER_00: It makes me think of uh you know what your mind is.
49:49
SPEAKER_00: I'm not just not gonna repeat it.
49:50
SPEAKER_00: I wanna say.
49:51
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god, Elizabeth, any final words?
49:54
SPEAKER_00: Oh god, just shut me up.