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FireFox · State of Play

• 0:01
  SPEAKER_02: You better download Google Chrome now because it's time to fire Fox.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's Stay to Play.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to Stay to Play.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_02: Today we're going to discuss the Knicks and the Spurs, a day late and a dollar short, but hey, we're going to do it anyway.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_02: We're going to do a look back at the season, winners and losers.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_02: And Trump is turning the White House lawn into the front yard of an Oklahoma trailer park.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_02: But first, we are going to discuss the NBA finals.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: And the Knicks won.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_02: And they're the champs.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: I am very upset about that, as you know, I'm a Spurs fan.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, I know you have a personal stake in this one.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_03: So lots to discuss.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like I'm the only Spurs fan in the world.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_02: We're in DC.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_02: All these like closeted Spurs uh New York Knicks fans are all of a sudden coming out of the woodworks.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_02: My own wife, who's a new born and raised, or born in Brooklyn, raised in Jersey, New Jersey, was trolling me uh after every game.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you don't know this, but she would play um uh the the I got a hundred million I'm from New York.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_02: She would play it literally bum chch bum chum bum.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_02: Play it after every game, bro.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I get a litany of text messages, uh, a constant barrage of them trolling me constantly, and I feel so alone.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I feel so alone.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'll ask you to come for me later, but uh in in terms of obviously the the what can we do next as a Spurs?
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, they certainly have a bright future.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_03: Well, both teams have bright futures moving forward, um, different things to um to think about though.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_02: So obviously I'm disappointed, but what were your uh overall thoughts uh overall for the finals?
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I would say, you know, beyond the X's and O's, it's been I don't know that I remember any NBA finals that was this sort of spectacle, I feel, in the community, the energy surrounding um surrounding it.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_03: So that was interesting to me where I happened to be at a sports bar watching um watching game five.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and just the responses, there were groups of people, um groups of ladies in particular that were there specifically to watch the game, very much so engaged.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_03: Wow.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_03: And at the conclusion, people were crying and hugging, shut up and very emotionally invested.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like it's become like a a cultural thing for New Yorkers because I heard one of the ladies say that she was a New Yorker.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_03: So um just that um that energy, I don't recall even when the Lakers have been in the finals, I don't feel I didn't feel that same energy.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe it's because I'm an East Coast um person, but just the the level of interest, the um respectable surrounding it was um noteworthy.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's been a it's been a long time.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: And look, um, New York, I'm happy for you.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: Henry, uh, you can back me up on this.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I I on our last or episode or two episodes ago, I said, you know, I had uh Spurs in seven.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_02: Spurs in six or seven, I can't remember.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_02: Six, seven.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um I had him in I I had the Spurs winning.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I did pick the Knicks and six.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_03: He didn't, you did it took um one fewer game.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: But but I also texted you in the the day of the first game, and I said, Do you remember what I said?
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_02: I said, you know what?
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_02: The the Spurs are gonna lose.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_02: It's not their year, it just feels like this is New York's year.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I said that because um specifically because I do not think they will make it back.
• 4:05
  SPEAKER_02: I think if the Spurs didn't do it, I mean if the Knicks didn't do it this time, I don't see a universe and maybe they'll overcome because I think Jalen Brunson is just that dude.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um I don't see a universe where maybe they get back, yes.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: Do they win it?
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_02: I do not think they will win it again.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I think it's hard to say because it appears as though everybody greatly underestimated the um the Knicks, you know.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_03: I think starting with Jalen Brunson to be a um a second round pick and to perform at that level.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_03: And what I thought was very interesting was overall he didn't play his best in this finals.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_03: So I would have had questions.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_03: I'll say for the first couple of games, I would have said um it was kind of inefficient scoring and some mistakes.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_03: I would have said Carl Anthony Towns was the best for the first game or so, but then um Anobi became really the glue.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_03: So I'll say before game five, I felt like Ananobi really probably deserved finals MVP because Brunson played so well in the closeout game that I think you have to tip your cap to him and uh and give it to him.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_03: That's it.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's absolutely facts.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you know, Brunson being a second round pick.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you know, um, I think he's a winner, and he's been a winner everywhere he's gone, and he's at the Knicks, and and I think there was an expectation that eventually I thought, and again, that's why I changed my mind.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, you know what?
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: They have to they have to do it this time.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um Jalen Brunson, this is like your biggest opportunity in the world.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: Same thing for Kat.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_02: I just thought like, yo, you gotta you gotta do this now because the Spurs, young core, um, with with Castle and Dylan Harper, who showed out as a rookie in the NBA finals, had had no conscience about him like whatsoever.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_02: Showed out.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: He's a superstar in the making, I think.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_02: Because you're talking about someone who's like 20, 21 years old, yeah, playing in the NBA finals game like it's nothing.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and then you have uh obviously Wemby, who uh is uh in his own right a great player.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_02: I think I think people got it over the little over their skis a little bit by saying, by trying to crown these guys king just because they came out of the West Conference, they beat the reigning champion Oklahoma City Thunder.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um and I think that should have been kind of a I don't want to say so much of a warning sign because the the Spurs had a fantastic season.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think they they definitely um overachieved.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_03: For sure.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_03: I don't think anybody was thinking I I my expectation was that they would make a valiant playoff run, maybe win one or two series, or maybe you know, get to the second round and then bow out because of inexperience.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_03: So they were um they were great, they greatly exceeded that, and I'm sure they will address some things with roster construction as well.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um what I found to be more interesting though, and I'm I'm interested in your view of this, was I feel like it almost took on um sort of a Rocky Four vibe, where um, you know, my view that um I don't like how Wimby conducted himself over the course of the the season of the series, rather.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_03: I felt like overall it seemed like the public sentiment was with the Knicks, not just because of that story, but kind of the some of the um and I know I'm not alone in this with respect to the um the reporting.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: I I I disagree.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_02: Here's why.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: Did you see um what's the guy who played for the Knicks and he played for Cleveland?
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um that's the ESPN analyst.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so sorry I forgot his name all of a sudden.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um Schumper.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: Schumper, yes.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um he gave a uh he he said it best.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: He said, look, y'all can talk all you want about Wemby, but big men aren't nice.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_02: Shaq was not a nice man on the court, he was a dog and he was a bully.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_02: Schumper said it way better than I could have, but that's the attitude that sort of you you need to have.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: And and and I can hear your I can hear your brain talking right now.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: I can hear you talk, I can hear you thinking right now.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: Shut it off.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_02: What I'm gonna say is he was like, look, and y'all, you're you're and he's uh I'm not just talking about him on the court being like dribbling around.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, he threw a man.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_02: I can't remember what he said.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_02: He uh well, he was talking about throwing someone somewhere uh in the middle of a game.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_02: Uh uh, I heard another one about Charles Barkley throwing a guy through a window.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_02: And then like, what was your he said, what was your biggest regret?
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: Do you regret anything about throwing that man through the window?
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_02: He said, Yeah, I regret uh that uh that the I'm I'm messing this up.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_02: But he said, I regret that the window wasn't higher off the ground.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I agree, but I mean Barkley was a real tough guy in those days.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_03: It's like I think the sentiment or the perception is that Wimby's kind of cosplaying into that role when it's not authentic to him.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_02: I disagree.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: I just the reason why I disagree is because you know he and there's a I think you and I sort of understand this.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe I understand a little bit better.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_02: Like there's this idea um that if there's a projection of softness on you, that you become a target, and people can just come at you any kind of way.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_02: And people were doing that to Wimmy.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: They were they were fouled.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, he was he gets constantly fouled.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: Uh he's constantly pushed, he's constantly chopped on, he's con like he takes a beating and a pounding all the time.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_02: Um, uh nowhere near, obviously, where I think Shaq did because they didn't call it.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I think, but I think like, look, you gotta start learning to fight back, and that learning to fight back has to sort of mature a little bit.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but you also cannot just simply be a doormat in the especially in the NBA, is so much tough.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_02: I'm telling you, as someone, if you played against any NBA player ever on any level, uh you can the level of intent, like nonchalant toughness that they have is like it's an unspoken thing.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_02: And if you are soft, they try to smell it on you and they'll just attack you.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_03: And it's like I understand the tough guy thing, but I think more with me, it was behavior I would describe as obnoxious.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_03: In particular, um, there was a um a sequence where I think he baited Mitchell Robinson into an offensive file, then he's like pointing at his head like I'm in your mind, and they were uh uh the trolling effect of it seemed like obnoxious.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_03: And then and then you're talking about me, you I feel like you set yourself up to criticism because then your team had a catastrophic mental failure, series of mental failures and your trolls.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_03: So you if you're I feel like it's you know, if you're going to present yourself in that light, you have to back it up.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_03: If you're going to antagonize others for mental mistakes, then you can't make as many mental mistakes as you made down the stretch.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_03: I would agree with that.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_02: He missed the two free throws.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: You gotta be mentally tougher than that, and again, you're yes, a learning experience.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_02: So, first of all, I think do you don't think you're I asked you to think like maybe I'm projecting that onto Wimby because I'm thinking of other big men in the league, and I think Embiid would have done B would have acted like that, Joker would have acted like that even.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I don't know about Anthony Davis.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Giannis for sure would have acted like that.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_02: Um there's a lot of big sort of big guys in the league who I think there's a projection of you know, Wimmy's the Frenchman, he's the philosopher, he plays chess in the park and draws pictures, and like, you know, and there's this like idea that he is supposed to have this sort of persona, walk this persona on the court, but there's a switch that turns on.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_02: When you go into court, there's no more Mr.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: Nice Guy.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_02: I told you uh uh uh in personal conversations that you know you know, I was a kid who made good grades in school, and um and you know, people thought I was soft and they pushed me around in school.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: But when we went on that basketball court, I'm gonna tell you, do you know what my nickname was?
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: Evil Twin.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_02: The Evil Twin.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because they knew I was not to be messed with.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: I was going to dog you out and I was gonna talk all the trash in the world to you.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: I was gonna make you want to fight me when we were done.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: And that's what happened.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_02: Because when you're on the court and you're and you want to be a winner, there is no there is no room for like guessing which version of you there is.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: Again, if they smell it on you, they're gonna come get you.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_02: And you have to, I would say he has to learn how to channel that toughness into action and sort of like strategic thinking, and he'll learn that the older he gets.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_02: But uh I think there's a projection of like this Mr.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_02: Frenchman, nice guy who draws pictures in the draws pictures of statues and plays chess in the park.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_02: You know, everyone wants to put that on him as a player.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: The the um and I I just that that I don't consider that to be derogatory.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_03: My advice would be be you and then you can be your best self, whatever that means in terms of authenticity.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I do acknowledge that he's 22 years old and it's a lot of pressure for anybody to be in that kind of spotlight.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_03: But I think beyond that, I I think the I think he played well enough for the Spurs to win the championship.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_03: I really feel like the mistake was um continuing to go with De Aaron Fox instead of prioritizing Dylan Harper.
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: What a trainer.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like had they pivoted and done that.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_02: I want to I want to address that, but I will say before I go into to Fox, uh I like I think Wemby he'll he'll get a little bit better um between this year and next year, he'll he'll put a little weight on.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um but you know, this whole philosophy of like uh in his head, he thinks he's I don't even want to say Kevin Durant, but I think in his head he still thinks he's like a guard or something, because all that tween-tween outside nonsense.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_02: Dude, the the older you get, the more you'll realize that it's the easy stuff that you need to take, the easy wins.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_03: I understand that he can make three-pointers.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I don't get that to be his go-to.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_02: No more three.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_03: Bro, move.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, at the end of the game, I mean he didn't even hit the rim, I think, on his three-point.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_03: Should they really have even been game planning?
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_03: I don't I question that they I understand he's your best player.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know that you want a game plan for Wimby to be shooting fall away three-pointers to win the game.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_02: What's what is so bad by about a uh uh Wimby, like what is so bad about turning and shooting eight to ten feet from the basket, even if it's a fadeaway.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_02: If you did that ten times a game, who is who is stopping?
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: Who is stopping that, bro?
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_02: If you did it 15 times a game, Michael Jordan figured it out, he figured it out.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: Triangle offense, catch the ball, back to the basket, turnaround, fade away.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_02: And he did it religiously because you couldn't stop it.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_02: You had no answer for they send their double team from the backside, he'd he'd fade away to the opposite angle, and he was so successful at it that it was kept leaving three-pointers, three-point shooters like Steve Kerr open, and it was a wrap.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_02: It was a wrap.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: So Wimby, like, like, what is so wrong?
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_02: And I think this is obviously coaching Mitch Johnson.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_02: Like, come on, bro.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you got Wimby outside not being a threat, it it puts fear into the hearts of the player that who's your defenders.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_02: If you are rim running, turning, and not uh you he's more than just a live threat.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_02: He can catch the ball back to the basket, have guys cutting because he's a he's a pretty good passer.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what is so wrong with that, bro?
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_02: And are you he thinks that brand of basketball is boring right now, but that's what I mean about experience.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_02: You just gotta get better at it.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, he'll be fine.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_02: The one who won't be fine is is is in very apparent, is uh is De'Aaron Fox.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I don't know if he was still injured, but the the injuries to me don't don't cut the muster when it comes to they don't snap, they don't pass the sniff test when it comes to the fact that you were miss he was missing like wide open three-foot bunnies, which are for an NBA player, that's like a hundred percent shot.
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_02: Jalen Brunson didn't miss him, he didn't miss any.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_03: I would imagine I don't know the details of his injuries.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_03: It seemed like he was obviously not healthy.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_03: I would imagine that would throw off your rhythm in the moment.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_03: Nah, man.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_02: After a while, after a while, like that close.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_02: Now, I'm if you're shooting threes with that have no, they don't that requires a little bit of like foot, you know, leg and foot push-off and strength.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: Like, yes, you're missing wide open bunnies.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_02: I think he had seven points and five assists in the game.
• 17:31
  SPEAKER_02: And then Castle, there's no room for if Castle's there, there's no if Darren Fox is gonna play bad, there's no room for Castle to play back.
• 17:38
  SPEAKER_02: And then Castle had a terrible game.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: I'm glad you uh terrible brought up Castle.
• 17:42
  SPEAKER_03: He's been what he certainly is wildly inconsistent where he has games that, like you said, are terrible.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_03: There was a stretch, I think, earlier in the playoffs where he was a turn off turnover machine.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and it's funny, there was a time as a Wizards fan.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_03: Well, my view before the draft was that the Wizards should have taken Stefan Castle over um over Tsar.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_03: Based on the current record, um, I'm glad that we have Thar uh moving forward as a um um as a piece.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: I'll take a note at um at this stage.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_03: Are you sure about that?
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I feel good about it.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_03: I thought Tsar was doing a good job this season, making a lot of progress, and I feel like they shut him down so that they wouldn't be too good.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I sure.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_02: Uh well, Fox though, like, you know, there's not a lot they can do.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, people are float floating the idea of moving the mountain as much as I thought, like that was an absolute going to happen.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: The more I'm like, What's the market though?
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_02: That becomes my that's the problem.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_02: The market is he's he's already he's got like max level money.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: Uh he's the only one on the real sports teams have making that type of money.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_02: He's already got that money, and a team would have to be like, yeah, you're good enough, we're gonna swallow that salary up.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it kind of reminds me of Vak Levine situation.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_03: It's like he's a good a player, I guess you would probably like to have, but the money is such that like it's getting in that business.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_02: The money, the money is a problem, and I they someone would have to perform a miracle.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_02: Someone would have to perform a miracle for De'Aaron Fox to be traded.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, the best really the only thing you can really do at this point is is uh this is obvious, is start Dylan Harper, have Castle, uh keep Vassell, obviously.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_02: Keep everybody.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_02: Harrison Barnes is leaving already.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_03: Um I forgot uh Vassell's expendable if you have to get rid of things.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you gotta keep him though.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: He already got Carter Bryant, he's a young court, but he made a lot of mistakes.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_02: He's young, he's a rookie and didn't get a lot of playing time, had to sort of work his way into the rotation at all.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_03: I'd rather keep Carter Bryant than Vassel.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_02: Well, Carter Bryant's not going nowhere.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_02: He's a rookie.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_03: Um uh I'm gonna say you might have to sweeten a pot to get rid of De'Aaron Fox, so they might have to do things that they can choose on.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe you let, you know, obviously the Spurs need um, you know, so yes, maybe if you because you're in a rockin' hard place with Fox.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_02: You made a gamble, the gamble only went so far, maybe he'll get healthy again.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_02: Because, yo, I was watching clips of uh young De'Aaron Fox, sort of like, hey bro, this man was fierce at the rim.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: You did not want to be in front of him and become a poster.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_02: Well, even earlier in the playoffs, five years.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_03: So I know there's a recency bias.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_03: He played well earlier in the playoffs, and then there were injuries, so um, he's certainly not chopped liver.
• 20:48
  SPEAKER_02: He's not but his decision making is the thing that gets me is like, you know, there was a couple of times where they had shot.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, uh at some point you gotta be a leader, and I De'Aaron Fox is an intelligent person.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: If you ever heard him speak, you know, like you have good, like he has very good, very conventional thinking, very good sort of like you know, reasoning skills the way he does.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: You gotta become, he's gotta, he didn't become a true leader on that team that needed real leadership.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_03: And I don't feel like that's his brand, really.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_03: It doesn't matter fine locker room influence.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_03: You're the point guard.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_03: What people think doesn't matter.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_02: You're the point guard on the championship team.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: You're the point, they need you to cross half court with the basketball and not turn it over by throwing it, having these lapses in thought and like literally just having lapses.
• 21:45
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, there's a couple of times where he, because the coach didn't, he should have reined in the team and said, When we get your big butt down there, post up, let me throw the ball down to you, instead of their team shooting and missing 10 straight three pointers.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_02: As the Knicks came back from a 29-point lead.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think the Spurs coach have the gravitas to really get the most out of Wemby, or do you need somebody with a little bit more renowned?
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_02: He's in the rockin' a hard place.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_02: I think he's got the gravitas, but he doesn't have the experience.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_02: And the problem is with a young core, and we saw this with um we saw this with uh I can't remember who was the coach with um Shaq and Kobe, and they didn't win it.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and they immediately fired him and they brought in Phil Jackson and the rest is history.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, you gotta have you gotta have um some experience to bring these guys along.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_02: And Mitch, I mean Mitch Johnson is a great he is a good coach.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: He's a decent coach, he is a guy who's competent enough to coach a um an NBA team.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_03: Do you think Pop is really pulling the strings behind the scenes?
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_03: I know he's in contact.
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: I think a little bit of that, but I I think he let go a little bit too much, even in my opinion.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um because it's uh and who can say?
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_02: Who can say, but I do know like uh this is this is a freaking wild thought I had uh uh just yesterday.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, bro, the because of Oklahoma City, because of the the new Spurs, because of um, you know, uh Denver is still alive, um, the Clippers aren't going away.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um uh the the the Golden State Warriors haven't picked up, they haven't made any changes.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, Jimmy Butler's coming back off of ACL tear.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um they haven't done anything to say to Steph Curry that they are going to win.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_02: And so uh I know this is an impossible thought, but just walk this path with me.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_02: What if they said, what if Steve Kerr said, I'm done, I'm gonna go coach the San Antonio Spurs.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_02: There are ties to the organization.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_02: There are ties to the organization, right?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_02: So what if what if he was like, hey man, however we can get it done, however we can get it done, let's get Steve Kerr or someone of that level, someone of that ilk with that sort of pedigree.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I don't want Tom Thibodeau, Thibodeau, Thibodeau, I don't I don't know how to say it.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want him.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: I think he's gonna like run them into the ground.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_02: They already play hard defense, which is uh probably partially another factor that I don't think anyone's talking about, by the way.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_02: By the by the second half, you saw the Spurs sort of wear out offensively because their legs were tired, I think a little bit.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but they tried to mitigate that by giving Wimby and Castle and Dylan Harper a lot of rest in the game, which I think was an actual mistake.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: They should have played the crap out of it.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_03: They should have been resting De'Aaron Fox.
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, yeah, they should have been resting De'Aaron Fox.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, hey, homie.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_02: Uh hey, hey, man, we just hey, just sit down, chill, bro.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_02: Like, we just want to make sure your ankle is okay.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_03: Also, also careful if you get the sense that he's in one of his down games.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_03: So if you have a player who's streaky or inconsistent, you know, maybe you pull the plug, you know, one.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you let you let Johnson play, man.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_02: He was he was at least forceful and like he was killing.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, but you gotta have someone.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_02: It's like Castle, look, you're out there to for really one reason.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's to stop Jalen Brunson.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: And you did a terrible job at that in the last game in game five, bro.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, how many I forgot how much he finished with.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_02: I stopped 45.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_02: 45-point game, and and he scored like over half the points.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_02: Your job is to stop Brunson.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_03: It's crazy because if I'm recalling correctly, um, Kat didn't really have his best game.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_03: So, yeah, he really, it was Brunson on Brunson.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_02: It was Brunson, Brunson, Brunson.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_02: Brunson Burners.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_02: That's what it was, that's what it was.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_03: So it's it's funny.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_03: I think he being nice, and I guess he said what he should have, he said, I think something to the effect, or his father basically came out of his camp that they still think Patrick Ewing is the um the greatest Nick Um ever.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_03: After that performance, as as well.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_03: I don't Patrick Ewing didn't accomplish anything as outstanding as playing at that level in a um obviously having not won the championship.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_02: Jalen Brunson, I I don't care what anybody says.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_02: He's the greatest Nick of all time at this point.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you got okay arguments.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_03: The modern era commodity, modern era.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_03: In the modern era, and I don't want to offend school Knicks that I don't know as um as well.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_03: But yes, I feel like over people like Patrick Ewing, um Jalen Brunson has has now had a more accomplished career.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, um you gotta have I I mean it's arguable.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_02: I don't you can you can say Willis Fried, Clyde Frazier, I don't Patrick Ewing, I don't uh I no, I think you brought a championship since those guys to New York.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_02: You gotta, I mean, this man is deservant of a statue honestly, and that's not hyperbolic, like that is like a thing where I just think I just think New York, because they're insufferable freaking fans, bro.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_03: Like you're they're going to build I can see momdhotty in the next the the statue thing though, I think is hard because I really do feel like it was an overall team effort where again going into the game, I think so.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_03: I think Kat led them at first, then Ananobi and Brunson finished it off.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: And because it was so distinctive the way that he did it, um, he gets probably an outsized share of the on the credit.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_03: But that's why I feel I feel like the Knicks certainly should feel good because all of their players are still in their prime, also.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_03: So it's like it's not as though I understand the Spurs are young and have the potential to get better.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_03: I don't see reason why their stars would go into decline.
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_03: And if Ananobi kind of cements himself, uh basically in those two games, I felt like he played kind of in the two games where he's had his best, he played basically like Kawhi Leonard.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_03: Uh you have no argument for me.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean, if you have him coming back, then they have reason to be, I think, optimistic about their fortunes moving um moving forward.
• 28:26
  SPEAKER_03: Especially in the East.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_03: In the East, yeah.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_02: In the East, I will give you that.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um the East isn't gonna get any worse.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_02: Uh uh Giannis could really change some some some like the dynamic of the entire Easter conference, depending on, you know, I I don't think it will happen, but let's just say he's healthy and he goes to the Celtics and Jalen Brown's out of there.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um, not in a bad way, I'm just saying hypothetically, you'd have to give up someone like Jalen Brown.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I don't think they're gonna give up Jason Tatum.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um give up Jalen Brown.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_02: Uh hypothetically, that team would on paper be insane.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_03: Well, um, you know, there's there's scenarios we don't know what will happen, but as of right now, yes, as of right now, you have to go out and actually beat the Knicks at this point because they're so I would say in terms of hot takes, I think the Knicks have a better chance of making it back to the finals next season than do the Spurs because the Spurs have more competition in the West and it's harder to call what it's gonna look like.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_02: That's as of right now.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_02: We know that for sure, like for the Knicks, for instance, it is a run it back situation.
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_02: You don't mess with this group at all.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_02: At all, right?
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_02: So you're like run it back.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_02: The the Spurs have some some moves to make.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_02: They have the what 20th pick in the draft?
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_02: And if they what how whatever it takes, if they get another big boy They need five in the draft to help win big if they get like Jaden Quaintens from Kentucky, uh he was hurt like a lot of the year and just sort of came back.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_03: But whatever I saw out of him, they get someone like that, it's hard to trust rookies at the highest level, so it takes time.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_02: Really, says that says the team that just got a rookie to the NBA finals and was a high leading scorer in the uh Well, those are elite prospects.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_03: That's when you're talking about elite prospects that are just gonna be good.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_03: Like, um, but um, but we'll see.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_03: We'll see how how all that plays out.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_02: But if the Spurs get, which I think they will, they're gonna get a better.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_02: Again, they have you know holes in their roster um that are more glaring.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you already got your shooters, you already got your defenders, you already got Wemby, you already got Harper.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_02: You just need like a big stretch power forward guy, like uh Aaron Gordon type, like that kind of guy.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you know, who can still shoot but is tough, big, can rebound, can play defense, like get another big boy like that, uh, and it'll it will be a rap.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_02: It will, I promise you, bro.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like, ain't nobody competing with them for the next.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: I I imagine within a five to ten year period, I fully expect them to be in the finals three to four times.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_03: I can see it maybe because I would think what I would most like to see in the um OKC trades for Giannis because I feel like they have the most assets to do so, and then they try to counter Wemby with Giannis, and that makes it interesting.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_03: Russell could become the coin flip.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_02: Adam Silver, he he better do you remember that time when um when uh uh prime Chris Paul was about to go go to play with Kobe Bryant and the in the NBA with uh uh the commissioner David Stern at the time was like, nah, we're not having that's unfair.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_03: Well, I know there were there were some complications where I think they were trying to sell the clippers and the clippers.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_03: My specific I think that there was a business justification where they were trying to protect the value of one of that's what the stated reason was.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_03: There were financial you believe that um they created some legalese they were keeping the franchise in transition, and my perception was that they were trying to protect the value of the um the franchise for the um for the new owner.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: They created some legalese to try to keep to try to keep Chris Paul from playing with Kobe because they knew that they were gonna write I don't know that that's the flaming championship for sure.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_03: Kobe's always benefited from outstanding postplay.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_03: That is you haven't seen what it looked like, I guess, with him having a lot of things.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_02: You must have forgotten, you must have forgotten how good Chris Paul was at Charlotte, bro.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_02: You must have forgotten.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_02: He was he was a terror.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_02: He gave, and the reason why I know this is because I'm I'm a Spurs fan, and him and Tony Parker.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_02: The only reason he lost was Chris Paul lost was because Tony Parker and Tim Duncan were that they were the dudes, they were that good.
• 33:26
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and they were young, young, strong, fast, powerful.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_02: All that they were a great team, and Chris Paul absolutely showed out, he looked like the best player in the NBA for like every like, and you're talking about in the era with Shaq and Kobe and uh you know Tim Duncan and all these guys, and he was out there balling, and they said, No, you can't.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_03: I know this is a point on which we don't agree.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_03: I still feel like Kyrie Irving was better than Chris Paul, or has been better than Chris Paul.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_03: Like, I prefer to have him if I were trying to think that kind of Irving didn't really doesn't really guarantee he hasn't always guaranteed a championship.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm just saying, I don't know that plugging that play.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_03: I'll say it this way.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like Kobe, Kobe was well served to get people like Pyle Gasall.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_03: Powell Gasol put Kobe in a better position to win a championship, I think, and he actually did than it would have been had he played with Chris Paul.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_03: I think I would say it that way per um perhaps.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_02: You are a prisoner of the moment.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_02: Prime Chris Paul's handles underrated, an underrated thing.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_02: Passing underrated, and uh and and dare I say, leadership matters.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_02: Shout out Sean Harris, but leadership matters.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Sean Harris in Georgia.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_02: Uh he says this all the time.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_02: This is his motto.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_02: Leadership matters.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_02: And in this case, leadership matters.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_02: There's no argument which one of them is a better leader.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_03: Now, I do have to acknowledge that um Chris Paul was the most recent commencement speaker at my beloved Morehouse College.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_03: So I will give that to him.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_03: And I do understand that he does.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_03: And you still won't give Miss Flower.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_03: That's the head.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_03: Shame on you.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_03: Shame on you.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_03: So not trying to begrudge, but we're comparing all-time great level kinds of people, I think, at this this stage of the um um of the conversation.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_03: But it should be interesting the next week or so leading up to the draft.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_03: I guess that's where we where we are.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_02: I was gonna go into uh biggest losers of the draft, biggest losers of the NBA season.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but I I think we'll we'll probably blow past this for the sake of time.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_02: But I was just thinking, like, the Mavericks, bro, gave up Luca.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's true, gave up Brunson.
• 35:48
  SPEAKER_03: And it it raises the question.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_03: I heard this, um, I saw this positive earlier on social media.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um, somebody asked, Do you think it was a greater loss to the Mavericks losing Don Trick or losing Brunson?
• 36:02
  unknown: Bro.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_03: And it play makes it both.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_03: But I know, you know, with maybe, you know, potato, potato.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_02: Who do you think who do you think had it worse?
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_02: Uh Minnesota gave up cat.
• 36:16
  SPEAKER_02: Go two years later, wins the championship.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_02: Anthony Edwards getting double teamed constantly and with no cat to like bail him out.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_02: And then, and on top of that, so minute so Minnesota Timberwolves did that, right?
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_02: And they let go of Cat.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, it was gonna be hard to keep him with a salary, right?
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so they had a problem with that.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_03: I do think Randall had been playing great leading into the he's not cat, though.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_03: He's not understanding, but I'm saying I feel like he he was at his high point in terms of value, such that it made more sense then than it might have in hindsight.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_02: No, uh, no, no, no, no.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_02: That was a money thing.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_02: They should they shoulda, could've tried to make it work.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_02: But then uh on another note, freaking Minnesota uh lets Sam Darnold go, and then literally the next year it wins the Super Bowl, bro.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you can't Minnesota, man.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, what it what do you guys think right now, bro?
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you you gotta be you gotta be, you know, you just gotta like, I guess, look in the mirror every day and put a foot forward, put your next foot forward, because the past is the past, let's be solution oriented.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, like because man, the fumbles, the fumbles, man, epic fumbles from Minnesota, but equally epic fumbles from freaking the Maverick, Dallas Mavericks.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_02: And in this regard, because we're talking about basketball, it's like much worse.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's much like who could have seen it, you know.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_02: Second round pick Brunson was playing his ass off in in uh um in Dallas, and I do think people did see like Brunson when as soon as he got to New York, they'd like, oh, he's gonna start winning some games.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_02: I think that was an automatic thing.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and it did, it started happening.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and then you know, the rest of the now the Mavericks to their credit went back to the finals with Kyrie and um and Luca.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and then they fumbled that.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_02: So um, yeah, it remains to me, Steam.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_02: We'll we'll we'll have some more NBA talk, but I wanted to throw this at you real quick.
• 38:23
  SPEAKER_02: Um did you did you see the news from Nintendo unveiling their two new Switch games?
• 38:30
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, I I meant to call you about this.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_03: I think one of them was Kingdom Hearts 4.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_03: Is that right?
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_03: All all the Kingdom Hearts.
• 38:36
  SPEAKER_03: All the Kingdom Hearts, okay.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_02: Kingdom Hearts 1, 2, and 3.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know about four, but one thing.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_03: I think my recollection was that they were announcing a new one.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe I misread that, and that was the big news.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, well, you need to look that up.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_02: But my my before you while you're looking that up, did you see they're they're bringing out the Ocarina Zelda Ocarina of Time, the remake, and which is one of the greatest games of all time.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_02: And they're bringing out one of my personal favorites, Star Fox, the original Star Fox on Nintendo 64.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_02: Incredible game.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_02: They're remaking that.
• 39:09
  SPEAKER_02: I cannot wait.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_02: I have I look at my kids' Switch every day, and I'm like, I should throw that in the trash.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_02: It is a useless video game system, at least for me.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_02: For me.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_03: And now and that's why I'm kind of against the remakes where I understand the nostalgia and making them.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_03: I would prefer more of the focus beyond um new games.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_03: I understand how great the old ones um were where for um um for me, I was always um a fan of the um the Super Nintendo Zelda was the last one I would say that I truly loved.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_03: Wait, let me ask.
• 39:49
  SPEAKER_03: I felt like that was the best one.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_02: Did you play Ocarina in time?
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, I played Ocarina Intime.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_02: And and you're not you're not excited about that?
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_02: Are you serious?
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_03: For a remake, I feel like I've had the experience.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_03: It doesn't present to me like uh Breath of the Wild is something you read.
• 40:03
  SPEAKER_03: It's so good.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's so good.
• 40:05
  SPEAKER_03: Once you've still once you've done the adventure, I I personally um have not been motivated to.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_02: I played the the um the last Zelda, and I I hope the style is a little bit different, but I'll play the last Zelda remake, which was um uh uh uh why am I forgetting the freaking name?
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_02: The last Zelda remake, um, where where uh Link popped up on the beach and they had to play through the whole dream situation, all that nonsense.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_02: Uh that was a fun game.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_02: It was a very fun replay.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I'll I it's so fun, I would do it again.
• 40:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I I expect this game to be good, but did you play Star Fox?
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, yes, yes, I played Star Fox.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_02: You are barrel roll and then the froggy guy was.
• 40:54
  SPEAKER_02: So the characters are great for yeah, the characters are great, great characters.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_02: I knew there was a little bit of an Easter egg, I thought, after um when I saw the Mario movie, yeah, Galaxy movie, and Star Fox just pops up.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'm like, why is Star Fox randomly in this movie?
• 41:09
  SPEAKER_02: Are they getting ready to come out with a I thought they were gonna come out with a Star Fox movie because he's a great character?
• 41:13
  SPEAKER_02: Character, but um but but when I saw this news come out, bro, I can't I can't wait to play uh both of these.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, but it says here, so finally get off Arc Ratus.
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_03: Uh Nintendo Direct from June 10, 2026.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, part of it says also revealed during the presentation was return of Disney and Square Enix's story to action RPC um RPG series with Kingdom Hearts 4.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_03: That's one of the titles that's included.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_03: So that's what stood out too um to me.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_03: I still haven't played Kingdom Hearts 3 because as much as I love Kingdom Hearts.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_03: And you've recommended it in some ways, but as much as I love Kingdom Hearts 2, I feel like they waited way too long for a mainline sequel, and then it was a lot of um essentially shovelware in the in-room that sapped my enthusiasm for the um the series.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_03: But it is interesting, I think, to see Kingdom Hearts 4.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_03: That's what stood out to me.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_03: So I'll tell you, did you play three yet?
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_03: You say you didn't play.
• 42:11
  SPEAKER_03: No, I have not, I've not played it.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_03: I started it, but I haven't played it through.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_02: Three was a very fun um, but very like it was just so the character like Sora was so OP in this game, like it almost became not fun because of how powerful Sora got.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like, now it was fun because you could fly and do all these like moves and all that kind of thing.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_03: It's colorful and bright.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's yeah, always cool.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_02: But um, anyone who's ever played Kingdom Hearts, I I uh it's one of my favorite game.
• 42:48
  SPEAKER_02: Kingdom Hearts 1 is one of my absolute favorite games of all time, all time, and that includes any Mario game, Metal Gear Solid, any of the Metal Gear Solids.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um Metal Gear Solid Force are like way, way on my list.
• 43:01
  SPEAKER_02: Any Zelda game, uh Kingdom Hearts 1 is right up there with me.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_02: The final boss sequence of that game and two, by the way, were phenomenal, phenomenal.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: But threes was meh very, very mundane, anticlimactic.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_02: It was like brought down to this like almost this personal level.
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_02: It didn't have the the majesty, the like it didn't have the big the big like stuff happening that was literally cataclysmic, and it was earth-shattered, like world universe shattering stuff.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_02: And this game did not have that.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_02: Kingdom Hearts 3 did not end with that whatsoever.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: Look it up, I promise you.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_02: I promise you, it did not.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm like, how are they gonna bring this back?
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_02: Because it didn't even seem like a thing that was even possible.
• 43:57
  SPEAKER_02: It didn't seem like it was even possible, yeah.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: So for them to come back with four, I'm like, oh no, bro.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_02: This game is.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_02: And by the way, the story on three was so convoluted.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_02: It was so confusing.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's been the case for the last 20 years.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_02: And then all these like Kingdom Hearts 2.3 or you know uh Kingdom Hearts, you know, 1.1375 slash B index 2.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_02: Like I have no I didn't play any of those.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_02: All I did was I went straight from Kingdom Hearts 2 just to Kingdom Hearts 3.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_02: And that was enough.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, that was enough for me.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_02: And but uh again, the gameplay was phenomenal.
• 44:45
  SPEAKER_02: It was just that the story was very convoluted, and the final boss was meh at best.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_02: At best.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_02: Definitely the worst final boss playthrough sequence I can think of in a in a um in a big video game like that Kingdom Hearts is supposed to be.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, the the I just think I think Zelda Ocarina of Time uh will get a lot of millennials back into the mix uh looking at the Switch 2.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and and then Star Fox by itself as a replay.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_02: I've been wanting this for years, and so I can't wait.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I hope they don't change obviously you change the graphics.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_02: But the sequence, the the controls, I I hope they keep all the the the bosses were fantastic on that game.
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_02: Keep it all the same, keep it the same.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_03: And and I love it.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think I differ from consensus, um, where I feel like I had more fun when I played the Wind Waker for the first time than when I played Arcanine for the first time.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_03: So I understand it was more innovative.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like it was more innovative than the world.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_03: The views and I like the art style better.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_01: The views expressed by Henry uh on the City Way podcast is not necessarily reflective views of any.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_03: And I played part of that remake and they streamlined it and took out some of the pieces that were irritating a little bit, like dynamics and those kinds of um of things.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_03: So so it is good.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_03: Remakes can improve games, but I would prefer that they focus on coming out with new ones, especially for the Switch 2, that which still needs, you know, um frontline games to support it.
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you know, where we do have consensus is is our discussion today, which is the 250 UFC 250 thing.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_02: But let's look at it from a 30,000-foot view.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's been a couple of days.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_02: And uh it was, as expected, a spectacle, a circus.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, never would have thought we would have ever seen the uh nation's capital dawn with, you know, which is dawned with huge majestic columns and its grandeur and its fresh manicured landscapes, its beauty, its prestigiousness.
• 47:01
  SPEAKER_02: We never see it cosplay as a rural Arkansas trailer park.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and just trust me on this, I know because I'm from them thar parts.
• 47:10
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and now I live in DC.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_02: I've been here for 15 years.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_02: By the way, the the noise from the event could be heard from Maha Isles.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_02: I live five miles from the White House, and I could hear the music, I could hear the EDM country hybrid music very clearly from my house.
• 47:32
  SPEAKER_02: I can see Russia from my house.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_02: I can hear them from my house.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, there was this other loud noise.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_02: It turned out to be like a B-1 bomber lancer or something like that flying through.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_02: Freaking loud as hell, bro.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, anyway.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_02: Look, the whole thing was overshadowed by the comments about Michelle Obama uh being a man out of nowhere, disgusting, yuck, out of bounds, out of pocket.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I wouldn't say that about Melania Trump.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't say that about anyone.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think anyone should.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_02: It ain't cool, it ain't funny, you know, especially in the bet using the backdrop of the White House, uh where you did it at after you just won the fight.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's all over social media, don't need to go into it.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone's got an opinion, blah, blah.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_02: Dana White condemned it.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_02: Great.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_02: Uh probably shouldn't be in bed with this stuff, but okay, I get it, you know.
• 48:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um what will you do going forward though?
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_02: That's the question.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_02: Dave Portnoy, Barcel Sports, Trump supporter, rightly condemned it.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_02: Other Republicans have condemned it.
• 48:42
  SPEAKER_02: The whole fiasco, by the way, Joe Rogan said nothing.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, he egged him on.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_02: Josh Hockett egged him on, um, but seemed not to dissuade him.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_02: He could have sort of diffused that right then and there, but maybe he's blindsided and I'm not a host, and so I don't know.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_02: But more importantly, the White House was asked and completely deflected from it um more than once.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_02: Uh they said nothing.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_02: I just think that the optics of hurling insults at any woman, let alone the first lady of the United States, former First Lady of the United States, using uh the White House as a backdrop, a background is flat out new low abysmal, bargain basement.
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_02: And the the biggest travesty of it is that there'll be no consequence, there'll be no reprimand from the administration, nothing at all, except praise, because that's what they do.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_02: That's who they are.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_02: America, colon, anything but normal.
• 49:45
  SPEAKER_02: That's the new catchphrase.
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_02: That's our motto.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_02: That's the new that's the new motto.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_02: America's new subheader.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_02: But let's zoom out, you know, I'm saying like um even more, and and I'm gonna bring Henry in on this, on some of this, because you know, once again, like it or not, Trump has signaled to the bro culture, to the Manosphere, to the Rogans, to the Barstools, to the Shangillis's to the De Ovans, he has signaled to them that we see you.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_02: We we hear you.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_02: We're here for you.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_02: And and that's the thing, isn't it?
• 50:19
  SPEAKER_02: That's the thing.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_02: A lot of young men till this day still feel invisible.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_02: Uh not all young men, not every young man, not all men, but enough that it's really starting to shape our politics.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_02: And so what do we get?
• 50:37
  SPEAKER_02: We get Trump uh with this event sort of embodying and encapsulating everything about that's sort of targeting men, right?
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_02: The there's motorcycles jumping uh everywhere.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_02: There's uh a UFC fight where well I I mentioned earlier where the whole thing gives off like this, you know, giving it's giving trailer park.
• 51:05
  SPEAKER_02: Like what's next?
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_02: Are we gonna have a um are we gonna have a uh a monster truck rally in front of the national monument?
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like what are we doing?
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_02: What are we doing?
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and it's remarkable that it may or may not be temporary.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_03: Where I saw a reporting this past week that um I think something to the effect that Trump Trump likened the physical structure that they built um for this event to the Eiffel Tower and said the Eiffel Tower was intended to be temporary, but they liked it so much they decided to um to keep it.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_03: So let's just hope that I'll say cooler heads prevail.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_03: Can you imagine that just being like uh a standing fixture, you know?
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: Is that is is the bud is the Bud Light truss is that like optional?
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_02: Do we get to keep the light branding?
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_03: Again is on top of the fact that the whole the entire East Wing, I believe, has been unceremoniously demolished.
• 52:01
  SPEAKER_03: So, I mean, what do they really have going on down in the White House?
• 52:03
  SPEAKER_03: It really is it's sad.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_03: It's a mess, it's a mess.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_02: It's a goddamn mess.
• 52:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like, uh, but look, like forgetting the the politics, like politics aside, like just from uh a branding perspective, it's like it's sort of like right on brand with sort of Mega and like all that kind of stuff.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_02: And but you know, just from a branding standpoint, you gotta like at least from from the whole thing.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, it's it's you know, I I see that we talked about this a little bit earlier.
• 52:33
  SPEAKER_02: The media, I don't know why they don't say this.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_02: It's like, oh, it's it just so happens to coincide.
• 52:38
  SPEAKER_02: The 250th anniversary just so happens to coincide with President Trump's birthday, which is June 14th.
• 52:43
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, was there the United States born on June 14th?
• 52:46
  SPEAKER_02: No, it was 17, it was born in July 4th, 1776.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_02: That's America's birthday, right?
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_02: So, what is it?
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_02: It's flag day, right?
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_02: Uh June 14th was flag day.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_02: It was also happened to be the birthday of the of the the founding, sorry, the official founding of the United States Army, which they were also equally celebrating.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_02: And there was some like jostling on how to sort of with the media, like how to like I guess brand it.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_02: But what this is is a is a damn birthday party.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_02: It no who when was the last time you celebrated Flag Day, bro?
• 53:23
  SPEAKER_03: No, understood, understood.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_03: And um, well, at least within my circles, I know that's broadly understood.
• 53:30
  SPEAKER_03: I imagine it's being conflated within MAGA um um potentially, but um, but again, it's funny, a funny anecdote.
• 53:37
  SPEAKER_03: So I don't even know the the main UFC people, like in terms of the top fighters.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_03: I do recall, this was years ago, maybe a decade ago, I was at one of the um casinos in Maryland, and um there was this guy walking around saying, you know, essentially, hey, you know, um I'm in I'm a UFC fighter.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_03: He was like just voluntary information to people, and people like, oh, okay.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_03: He's just walking about saying it, hey, right.
• 54:05
  SPEAKER_03: And while the noteworthy was he was kind of short, but he was really stocky, so I remember he was he was um really muscular.
• 54:12
  SPEAKER_03: And then he finally got around to me and he said, Um, he was like, Yeah, you know, I'm a UFC fighter.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_03: And I said, Um, I said, Oh, really?
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_03: Um, that's interesting.
• 54:19
  SPEAKER_03: What's your fighting style?
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_03: And he said, Oh, he said, What'd you say?
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_03: What'd you say?
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_03: At first he was offensive, and then I said, Really?
• 54:25
  SPEAKER_03: You know, I asked, you know, I said, What's your fighting style?
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_03: Don't the fighting people?
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_03: And then he described something.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_03: I forget the details, but it was funny.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_03: After he described it, he tapped me on my shoulder and said, You're all right, man.
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_03: You know, it was funny.
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_03: I guess he got to share whatever it was that's he was looking for somebody.
• 54:40
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, Hey guys, look at me.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_03: That's so funny.
• 54:44
  SPEAKER_03: But um, but yeah, I don't know the main UFC um fighters.
• 54:48
  SPEAKER_03: I do know it didn't matter, but it's contributed to making um boxing more of a I don't want to say fringe because I know there's a lot of money.
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_03: There's more eyes on ultimate fighting currently than there is boxing.
• 55:00
  SPEAKER_03: That's my understanding understanding at least.
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_02: I mean it kind of, you know, I was trying about to say earlier, it kind of leans me into something, but like that that Trump and MAGA and all these guys sort of like understand and seem to grasp that I think Democrats seem to not grasp a little bit, and that's that you know Trump is taking advantage, obviously, of a of a situation by having this party for himself and this big old, you know, this big old hoop-de-doo fight.
• 55:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but the bottom line is like, you know, you know, and uh not to get heavy here, but young men sort of like feel invisible still.
• 55:36
  SPEAKER_02: And that sort of was Trump's sort of thing during the campaign, and he's still like leaning into this thing today.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_02: Not all young men, but you know, not not every young man, but enough of them that it shapes, you know, and has a a a feeling into politics, and this is where this sort of overlap between like sports and politics starts you know like uh sort of like intersecting a little bit more.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_02: And in in this case, this play with UFC for young men seems to just uh really encapsulate the the story.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_02: So for years we've um been talking about the demographic roups uh from the last game.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about this all the time, where yeah, Kamala courted women, Trump courted men, and one big with them, uh especially suburban voters, um, seniors.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh uh meanwhile, you know um millions of young men, young guys are just sort of sitting in their apartments eating like DoorDash and you know, playing video games.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_03: I I think that's I think that's um part of it where certainly I believe they're trying to court certain constituencies.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_03: I also think another part of it is more directly cultural, where I think they're trying to normalize conservative-coded um cultural experiences.
• 57:00
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely.
• 57:01
  SPEAKER_03: That's what that's what America is like presenting it, you know, in that in that light, and they um believe they realize certain benefits, you know, from um yeah.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well, here's the smart part about the like this fight, right?
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_02: This thing that happened, like you know, somebody noticed the Manosphere noticed, uh, fitness influences, clavicular, like those guys who follow them, the crypto bros, they're selling like a freaking coin because of this.
• 57:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I've already highlighted this like last week because of the illegal nature of making money, uh profiting off of something this this public federal land event uh being used to make money, lots and lots of money.
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_02: And uh um, but those guys have said, you know what, screw it, we're leaning hard, put all their chips on the table.
• 57:56
  SPEAKER_02: We're leaning hard into this because um there's this sort of you know, people I've heard people, by the way, say, especially on the left, where they're like this whole made up long male loneliness epidemic is just BS.
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, Young keep saying that all you want, but dude just had motorcycles flipping in front of the White House, and he's holding a cage fight, a UFC fight on the White House ground.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_02: Like, not that I'm saying that that's a great thing, but all I'm saying is at least they're making the effort to court this group, not with speeches and white papers and political like maneuvers.
• 58:39
  SPEAKER_02: There it's just cool stuff.
• 58:41
  SPEAKER_03: Well, what what I would say, I'll say in my experience, and based on conversations that I have, um the um the issue is not just a political one, you know.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_03: I guess it it requires a political response, but we have I we have what I believe and understand to be a crisis in mental health.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_03: Well, yes fundamentally.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_03: So there are specific issues where people are in need of structured supports um and things along those um along those lines, but instead, you know, it gets packaged in different um different ways.
• 59:12
  SPEAKER_03: So it does they're not getting what they need in reality to function, right?
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_02: And it's because like you know, the this whole like mental health thing where we're seeing the signs of it, right?
• 59:26
  SPEAKER_02: We're seeing like young men have fewer friends, they're hanging out more alone, they're talking more online with regular people, they're joining fewer organizations.
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_02: Um you know, they have there's just so many signs that are out there, and I'm not even saying that MAGA's addressing the problem.
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_02: Have you ever seen them address an actual issue?
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_02: All they're doing is saying, Hey, I feel seen, all they're doing is saying, Hey, we see you, and um it has sort of changed the entire political landscape for ill or better.
• 1:00:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and somebody on the other side, all I'm saying, somebody on the other side besides Scott Galloway, who is more of a centurious, by the way, he's a businessman.
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_02: But at the very least, he's somebody I pay attention to a lot because I think he is spot on.
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_03: I do believe he makes I'll say I believe he makes a lot of valid points, and then maybe one out of four videos he has, I have some questions about what he's saying.
• 1:00:29
  SPEAKER_03: So I feel like I agree with him more often than not.
• 1:00:31
  SPEAKER_03: You have to disagree with him all the time.
• 1:00:32
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you have to agree with him all the time.
• 1:00:34
  SPEAKER_03: But on a change.
• 1:00:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so I mean the verdict is uh I mean, I don't, like I said, I don't care much for I don't care about UFC.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_02: I don't care about um the whole thing.
• 1:00:52
  SPEAKER_02: I don't watch UFC fights.
• 1:00:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um I I I know obviously who Dana White is.
• 1:00:58
  SPEAKER_02: Um I don't care for the whole spectacle of it personally because I don't like that sport.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um my computer's dying, and I was like, I thought because where I plugged it up.
• 1:01:07
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I just don't like that sport.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_02: And um, but lots of people do.
• 1:01:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and there seems to be somebody tapping into something somewhere.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_02: Uh again, it's just a symbol at this point.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's just uh saying, pointing the magnifying glass at what just happened on the trailer park, I mean the White House lawn and saying, hey man, obviously this is crazy and silly, illegal and stupid and tacky.
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_02: What are we doing?
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_02: But hey, other side, what do you have plan that isn't something that's just preachy and and and lame, you know, giving the energy of Karen from HR like all the time?
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_02: Like, can we be cool about something?
• 1:01:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what what are we actually doing?
• 1:01:55
  SPEAKER_02: What are y'all actually doing?
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_02: What do you have the power to do?
• 1:01:58
  SPEAKER_02: And not maybe this goes for everyone in every community.
• 1:02:01
  SPEAKER_02: What do you have the power to do to to to sort of reintroduce men to society and bring them out of the shadows of UFC and Call of Duty?
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_03: And like I feel like young men need like mentoring and role models more than that kind of cultural experience, but that requires an infrastructure to be built up around.
• 1:02:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, how do you do that with no infrastructure where everything is just digital, everything is an online thing, and at the very least, like this UFC thing brings people out, it brings people out on IRL, as the kids say.
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_02: Uh like what and obviously I think me and you will be probably discussing this more and more.
• 1:02:42
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but I just thought it was interesting that how this whole thing played out, and that was this obviously, people are gonna have their their arguments on the left and right about how the fight went and all this like dumb stuff.
• 1:02:55
  SPEAKER_02: I don't I don't care about any of that.
• 1:02:56
  SPEAKER_02: All I care about is the fact that there was this effort, whether it was purpose or purposeful or not, to sort of still lean into the brand of pulling men in and saying, Hey, we see you, we feel you, we understand you, uh, continue to engage us in our podcasts and all this other stuff.
• 1:03:19
  SPEAKER_02: Like, um, be engulfed in our world, come into our echo chamber, live here, stay here, so we can lie to your faces daily about why we're having this spectacle in the White House while your gas prices are still five dollars a gallon.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_02: So, like what um, and again, I'm not asking for an answer from you.
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just simply saying, what are we doing?
• 1:03:42
  SPEAKER_03: No, it's tough because I feel like I feel like one of the more fundamental divides between, I guess maybe what I might say progressive and conservative um politics is it's almost like progressives are trying to encourage people to be their higher selves and it requires thought and effort.
• 1:04:00
  SPEAKER_03: Whereas on the conservative side, it plays to the base instincts where there's a primal instinct towards power, being the tough guy, those kinds of things.
• 1:04:09
  SPEAKER_03: And if you present yourself as modeling that, then you're going to come across as more relatable to people that don't want to do the exercise of being their higher self.
• 1:04:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because for the most part, and I agree with that, like for the most part, besides obviously the white nationalists and the Christian nationalists and all that kind of stuff, like you have there's not a huge focus on the demographics.
• 1:04:31
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I said this, I've said this many times from Dems that everything needs to be neatly categorized into like this demographic box.
• 1:04:39
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, you're a black person, oh, you're a woman, you're a minority, you're this and that, and we need to pay special attention and focus to you.
• 1:04:49
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and there wasn't a on the Alisa Dems platform, um, which I've pointed out a couple of times, like there's all these different demographics that Dems will pay that Dems have something for, but there's nothing for men.
• 1:05:04
  SPEAKER_02: Every demographic under the book, nothing for men.
• 1:05:08
  SPEAKER_02: This again, spectacle at the White House says, Oh, oh, you want men?
• 1:05:13
  SPEAKER_02: We got man stuff.
• 1:05:15
  SPEAKER_02: We got motorcycles and beer and monster trucks.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_02: They didn't have monster trucks, and and fights and adrenaline and the main theme monster energy drinks and Red Bull, like the entire administration.
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, um, renaming the Department of Defense as the Department of War, all the practical surroundings, all that.
• 1:05:35
  SPEAKER_03: So it's all on brand with that kind of messaging about um, and I do think it's central to the conservative ethos, the messaging that the um if you're the strongest, then you deserve to get whatever it is that you want, and the more humanistic considerations aren't real things.
• 1:05:55
  SPEAKER_02: That mindset, it's definitely like, and I'd say it's like it's almost.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_02: like a surfy surfacey performative thing that that promises you you know entertainment but doesn't actually give you a product uh that you can lean on and and and I mean they'll give you a a a a fight product obviously but they won't give you anything that's useful for your daily life and that's sort of also the point right like it's it's a thing that doesn't like was your life was your life changed by the fight like the world is gonna go on the uh uh they announced that the Strait of Remozy is gonna open we'll see if that's gonna happen.
• 1:06:35
  SPEAKER_03: Uh your gas prices probably still won't uh your healthcare is still in shambles uh your inflation is still high people still can't find jobs uh and it's a shame that obviously me we're sports things and we're gonna talk about sports and help you escape from all that but that is the reality that we live in now uh I I face all that stuff on a head in in different ways and I encounter the weight of all these issues all the time uh and but you know sports helps us and even this sport helps some people get a little bit of an escape from that uh and that's also sort of the name of the game distraction anyone distraction distraction you know what I'm talking about you know you know what I'm talking about distraction so you know more distractions to come so uh all right we've been talking for a long time uh so we're gonna wrap it up um any more thoughts on the on this or the NBA oh I do I do I would be remiss if I didn't mention the role of the Wu Tang clan in the uh oh yeah I thought that was the the coolest thing so I think the folklore will reflect that um that was awesome broad bad energy to Madison Square garden and they weren't at their best and then they were down big going into halftime there'll be books written about this and the um the the energy of the Wu-Tang clan um I guess galvanized the support of the city absolutely they made a historic um comeback so I thought that was fantastic and very uh very cool um because as you know um the Wu Tang clan is my um favorite rap group um of all time so it was great to see them be part of the story I was obviously rooting for the Spurs but when the when Wu Tang came on I found myself reaching for a pair of Tim's I was I was of course singing every line I was like ah they got me they got me dollar dollar bill y'all uh that was freaking cool bro that was cool and keep Charles Barkley by the way um I heard he's in trouble but probably not uh that was fun that was fun so I'm glad you actually mentioned that that actually that brought back can you imagine being at that game like after paying$200,000 for your ticket and then you're like you know what I got a good basketball I got a basketball game but uh what I really got was the freaking Wu Tang clan it was irritating because they didn't televise it so I had to find it elsewhere you know I I had to go online for the halftime show because they were like talking about highlights and I'm like I'm tuned in for the Wu Tang clan so I felt like they could have given them the respect of giving them that national audience in the broadcast but it is what it is.
• 1:09:33
  SPEAKER_02: They played some of it which is why I still said I was like watching some of it.
• 1:09:37
  SPEAKER_02: I do agree with that.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_02: I think they should have played the whole thing I mean it wasn't that uh it's it's the nostalgia of the Wu Tang clan and they just sort of are that they already own because you know them just standing around being still you know those poor guys but you know it's all about the music and and the feeling uh and that they invoke that again encapsulates all of New York City and you know the nostalgia for that music for that time just came roaring back.
• 1:10:05
  SPEAKER_02: That was freaking cool bro that was awesome.
• 1:10:08
  SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah thanks for mentioning that all right y'all thanks for uh Henry thanks for joining me on stay to play again obviously oh of course it's my pleasure thank you for having me and thank you guys for joining us again uh if you enjoy the podcast share it uh download it um listen to it wherever podcasts are listened to and we'll see you next time on stay to play thanks