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TMP304 RED ROCKERS: ROAD TO CHINA · Troubled Men Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker A: Greetings Troubled Listeners, welcome back to the Troubled Men podcast. I am Rene Coman, sitting once again in Snake and Jake's Christmas Club lounge in the heart of the Clempire with my co host, the original troubled man for troubled times and future mayor of New Orleans, Mr. Manny Chevrolet. Welcome, Manny.
• 0:33
  Speaker B: Hey, good to be back here.
• 0:36
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 0:36
  Speaker B: In this dump.
• 0:37
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 0:38
  Speaker B: They call Snake and Jake's Christmas, right? Lounge, you know, but it's nice. It's okay.
• 0:45
  Speaker A: Yeah, same as it ever was. Hasn't changed much over.
• 0:47
  Speaker B: Smells worse than me.
• 0:48
  Speaker A: Okay, well that's. That's good, that's positive, man.
• 0:53
  Speaker B: Speaking of lounges, did you know that a lounge that we used to go to a lot, the Mylan Lounge, closed down?
• 1:04
  Speaker A: You know, I saw that in the newspaper today.
• 1:05
  Speaker B: Yeah, after like, I don't know, 60 years or something, they closed down.
• 1:12
  Speaker A: Now, Now, I didn't read why they were closing down, did you?
• 1:15
  Speaker B: I did not see that either. I don't know why they closed down. Maybe it was just time to call it quits. Maybe, you know, they were like in a residential little area.
• 1:24
  Speaker A: Well, and you know, it was one of the last. Least the last time I went there was probably 10 years ago. But they still. It was a buzzer bar, right? You know, you go and you knock on the glass and they look at you and if they recognize you and they buzz you in, if they don't wave you off.
• 1:39
  Speaker B: Well, we used to go there, I think when I first met you. And we would go there and they'd buzz us in and those were good times. Yes, I remember because I lived right around the corner. Remember I lived on General Pershing and they were right on Milan Street.
• 1:54
  Speaker A: Huh. I kind of forgot that.
• 1:55
  Speaker B: Yeah, my friend, I was roommates with my friend who kill Casey Butler. He died about a year ago with the, with the rope around the neck thing.
• 2:04
  Speaker A: Oh, geez.
• 2:05
  Speaker B: They wouldn't let him into the club.
• 2:07
  Speaker A: Oh, wow.
• 2:09
  Speaker B: They wouldn't buzz him in, so he decided to call it quits.
• 2:12
  Speaker A: That's no way to handle that kind of information, man.
• 2:15
  Speaker B: Yeah, he's a good guy.
• 2:16
  Speaker A: Just go to another bar.
• 2:17
  Speaker B: Yeah, well, he did.
• 2:18
  Speaker A: They'll let anybody in that. That Monk, that.
• 2:20
  Speaker B: But yeah, they would buzz you in. There was a. It was a Chicago Cubs bar. Okay, I remember, but those were good times when we were up going in there and having fun.
• 2:32
  Speaker A: Yeah, I remember being there a few times. But. But yeah, yeah, it's. It was always nice.
• 2:37
  Speaker B: So they closed down. Speaking of lounges. They closed down. I don't know why. I really don't I haven't been there in years.
• 2:43
  Speaker A: Right.
• 2:43
  Speaker B: I don't do h anymore.
• 2:45
  Speaker A: Sure, sure.
• 2:45
  Speaker B: So I don't go there anymore.
• 2:47
  Speaker A: Everything in its time.
• 2:48
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 2:48
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 2:48
  Speaker B: So what else is going on?
• 2:50
  Speaker A: Oh, you know. Well, what else is going on? Let's see. I played a gig with new artist Cole Williams at the Congo Square Festival this week. Had a couple of other club gigs with the great Lynn Drury, and now I'm going into rehearsal marathon in the, you know, with French Quarter Fest coming up. But. But, you know, that's. That's kind of neither here nor there. You know, we've been seeing all the stuff in the news about the. The deportations and everything. Well, it didn't take long for it home hit close to home already. Some people that I know. Yes, yeah, yeah. Have. One of them was. Was deported under some. Some. Some dicey circumstances where his. His kids were coming into the country or something with valid visas and they, they Custer or passport control, they kind of held them. They said, well, you need to come pick up your kids and everything will be fine. They did, and they had him and the two girls on a deportation plane two hours later back to his home.
• 3:54
  Speaker B: Who is this person?
• 3:55
  Speaker A: No know, but.
• 3:56
  Speaker B: Well, then why bring it up?
• 3:58
  Speaker A: Well, because. I don't know.
• 3:59
  Speaker B: You're not gonna name names?
• 4:00
  Speaker A: No, I'm not gonna. No, I'm definitely not gonna name names.
• 4:04
  Speaker B: Nobody cares if you don't bring it up.
• 4:05
  Speaker A: Well, it's a. It did. I don't think the names are important. I think that.
• 4:08
  Speaker C: Was he a musician?
• 4:09
  Speaker A: No, no, no, he was a. A contractor carpenter. And. And then his. His roommate saw that that was already happening and decided, well, I.
• 4:21
  Speaker B: To rent his room out.
• 4:22
  Speaker A: I need to go back to my home country. And another guy is in the. Of the. Another roommates in detention, so, man, oh, man, like, you know, and all these guys are people that like, you would let in your house, give them a set of keys. They could be there while I was gone. They would. Wouldn't, you know, like, trust them with, With. With anything with my life. But there you go.
• 4:45
  Speaker B: There was no reason for this.
• 4:47
  Speaker A: Well, I guess, you know, they're.
• 4:48
  Speaker B: They're whatever have some kind of record.
• 4:50
  Speaker A: Their immigration status was. Was. Was not, you know, I don't know. It made them a target. Made them all targets that, you know.
• 4:59
  Speaker B: And I think we're all going to be targets whether citizens are not.
• 5:02
  Speaker A: Well, particularly you and I. Yeah, yeah.
• 5:04
  Speaker B: We'Re all going to be targets, so. Well, if you don't name names and I don't really care.
• 5:08
  Speaker A: All right, well, no, I'm not gonna. I think that would be not very wise to, not that it would make any difference to you.
• 5:15
  Speaker B: Well, maybe a lawyer out there would try to help them.
• 5:17
  Speaker A: You know, it's a, you know, an immigration lawyer, I think, in these, these, these days. Well, you know, hopefully they have all that, but, you know, naming people's names over the radio.
• 5:27
  Speaker B: So what country do you think they're going to? One of those El Sorvidarian prisons?
• 5:31
  Speaker A: Well, well, I don't know. I mean, I think one guy went back to his home country. The other guy, volunteer, was deported back to his home country. Other guy voluntarily left before they could, they could nab him here. And because, of course, you know, if they, if they pick you up in some kind of circumstance, these guys are so incompetent, you don't know what they're going to do. They could send you to, yeah. El Salvadorian prison that, you know, even if you're only there for a few days, you know, it's, you're there with rapists and killers, man. You know, you're, it's, your life could end in a matter of hours. Being a mom.
• 6:05
  Speaker B: Well, did you say to them, nice knowing you as they got.
• 6:08
  Speaker A: Didn't even get to see it. I just, I only heard the, the aftermath of the thing that get used.
• 6:13
  Speaker B: To a lot more people, you know, are going to be deported. That's, that's terrible. It's a horrible thing. But, you know, I wouldn't mind getting seen in the country. I haven't traveled in years.
• 6:21
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 6:22
  Speaker B: You know.
• 6:22
  Speaker A: Well, you're talking about Guam, but maybe, you know, you get a free ride somewhere else, man.
• 6:26
  Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. North Dakota. That seems like a good place.
• 6:30
  Speaker A: Okay. I don't think that's where they're gonna.
• 6:31
  Speaker B: Deport you to North Dakota, you know, but, yeah, so I, I, you know, what I, I, I did, I've been doing lately, since Mardi Gras is, and this is something we can all do, it might help you out, you know, for Lent. I've been telling people, like, I bump into, you know, I've been bumping into people the last couple weeks. People that I can't stand, you know, I really don't care for them.
• 6:57
  Speaker A: Sure. Well, that could be almost anybody.
• 6:58
  Speaker B: Yeah. And they go, hey, Manny, how you doing? And I, and I pull out this card saying, I've given up talking for Lent.
• 7:05
  Speaker A: Ah.
• 7:06
  Speaker B: So I said, I can't talk to you. I've given it up for Lent. See you later, Wave.
• 7:10
  Speaker A: Taking A vow of silence.
• 7:11
  Speaker B: Yeah. Just say, I can't do this.
• 7:12
  Speaker C: You know, I think I'm gonna try that.
• 7:13
  Speaker B: Yeah, you should. It works, man. They're like, oh, wow, that's amazing. And, you know, and they. You can't have a conversation because I don't carry a notepad with a pen or anything. I just say, see you later.
• 7:26
  Speaker A: Bye.
• 7:26
  Speaker B: Bye. And it works with people you can't stand, which for me is pretty much everyone.
• 7:31
  Speaker A: Right.
• 7:32
  Speaker B: You know, so I take. I've used that card the last few weeks since Mardi Gras.
• 7:36
  Speaker A: All right.
• 7:36
  Speaker B: And it's been working okay. You know, and it hasn't worked on my wife, though.
• 7:41
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 7:42
  Speaker B: Hasn't worked on that.
• 7:44
  Speaker A: It's not taking the hint.
• 7:45
  Speaker B: No, no, no. But anyway, so that's been going on. What else is happening with you?
• 7:50
  Speaker A: What else is happening with me? Well, I went to a big social event that I thought you perhaps might be at, but. But, alas, you were not there. It was over at our good friend Jeff Treffinger's house. It was a wedding party for Glenn Hartman and his new bride, Jen. And it was a great collection of New Orleans musicians. And it's a lot of fellowship, getting to talk to some people I don't normally see in those kind of relaxed situations. And, you know, it's funny. You can know somebody for years, you know, know who they are, be around them, but never get in a big conversation. Then you finally do, and you realize.
• 8:32
  Speaker B: You can't stand them.
• 8:33
  Speaker A: Well, no, no, no. You realize that they have all these super interesting things in their past that. That, you know, that really resonate with you, and you go, wow, now I see you in a whole new light. So you never know until you start asking people. It's one reason I like having this podcast, you know, because even people I feel like I know well, once I prepare for the. To come in here and do a deep dive, they, you know, I find out all kind of other really interesting things about them.
• 9:02
  Speaker B: Oh, okay. Well, good for you.
• 9:03
  Speaker A: All right, well, you know, you know, it's a. It's a special day today. I thought you might have had some. Some special bit prepared for this. No.
• 9:13
  Speaker B: What day is today? Tuesday.
• 9:15
  Speaker A: Well, it's the first of April, Manny.
• 9:17
  Speaker B: Oh, no, I don't do that. Come on.
• 9:19
  Speaker A: Well, you've done it before. You've done it before on the podcast. Yeah, okay.
• 9:24
  Speaker B: Exactly. All right, well, you know, maybe this will coincide with April Fools, you know, a story I read in the state of Texas.
• 9:32
  Speaker A: Oh, okay.
• 9:33
  Speaker B: Now that's a crazy State. That State.
• 9:35
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 9:36
  Speaker B: You know, they got all sorts of problems going over there, but a woman. They discovered this woman a few months back, I think it was over the holidays. And she. They found her chopped up to pieces. Chopped up into, like, a hundred pieces or something. And this was a town, I think, right outside of Galveston. Galveston, yeah, Galveston.
• 9:57
  Speaker A: Okay. Sure. I guess that's an alternate pronunciation.
• 10:02
  Speaker B: Well, hey, listen, they say. What do they do down here Instead of burgundy, they say burgundy.
• 10:07
  Speaker D: Sure.
• 10:07
  Speaker A: Okay. Taking the me off pronunciation.
• 10:10
  Speaker B: It's a burgundy thing.
• 10:11
  Speaker A: CL10.
• 10:12
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 10:12
  Speaker A: Instead of Clio.
• 10:14
  Speaker B: Yeah. Houston and Houston.
• 10:16
  Speaker A: Right, right, right.
• 10:17
  Speaker B: Anyway, no, but anyway, in this Galveston town, they found this woman. She was chopped up to, like, 128 pieces.
• 10:27
  Speaker A: Oh, more. More than 100.
• 10:28
  Speaker B: And they. The corner. They still don't know who did this or whatever, but the coroner. This is how crazy this is. The coroner ruled it a suicide. So I don't know what that's about, because I guess, you know, one of those government operations, I don't know, ruled it a suicide.
• 10:47
  Speaker A: Yeah, suicide. He shot himself three times. Crazy. Yeah. So two of them were kill shots.
• 10:54
  Speaker B: I don't know if that's an April Fool's joke or anything like that. I have no idea.
• 10:58
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 10:59
  Speaker B: But you know what's April Fools is this guy RFK Jr. Sure.
• 11:04
  Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah.
• 11:05
  Speaker B: Unhealthiest people I've ever seen in my life.
• 11:07
  Speaker A: In charge of the Department of Health.
• 11:09
  Speaker B: And he looks like one of those old California raisin guys.
• 11:12
  Speaker A: Yes, he does.
• 11:13
  Speaker D: Right, right.
• 11:14
  Speaker B: And he speaks like. I don't know what the hell he speaks, but he's telling people, you know, he's taking away all these vaccinations and stuff like that. I found out this is part of his whole program. You know how, you know, people change their toothbrush, they change their car oil or their AC filter. He's demanding that Americans change their toilet seat every three months.
• 11:40
  Speaker A: Wow.
• 11:40
  Speaker B: Have you heard about this?
• 11:41
  Speaker A: Seems excessive.
• 11:42
  Speaker B: Yeah. Every three months, he's saying we got to change our toilet seats.
• 11:45
  Speaker A: Huh.
• 11:46
  Speaker D: You know, he must have stock in a toilet sheet company.
• 11:49
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 11:50
  Speaker B: I have no idea, but I never heard. I don't know. It seems. All right, maybe. How often do you change? I do it at least three. Once every three years. I think. I do mine. Have you ever changed your toilet seat?
• 12:01
  Speaker A: I mean, I have sometimes they'll. They'll break. You know, the.
• 12:04
  Speaker B: Yeah, no, I change it every about three years.
• 12:06
  Speaker A: Huh.
• 12:07
  Speaker B: Yeah, it's just to be safe.
• 12:08
  Speaker A: Well, you know, they say that, like, you know, the toilet seats actually, like, if they go and they do like a swab. Like your cutting board in your kitchen is. Has more germs than the toilet seat.
• 12:22
  Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Well. Yeah, Well, I like to put the. I have those in my bathroom. Those little liners you put over your toilet.
• 12:28
  Speaker A: Oh, really?
• 12:29
  Speaker B: Yeah. That's why I can wait three years.
• 12:31
  Speaker C: Like at the airport.
• 12:32
  Speaker B: Yeah, the airport. Or, you know, public places. I have those liners that you put, like. But it's kind of waxy kind of thing.
• 12:39
  Speaker A: You like those?
• 12:39
  Speaker B: Yeah. Oh, yeah.
• 12:40
  Speaker A: It's just you and your wife, though. I mean, I don't know.
• 12:43
  Speaker B: Well, she doesn't know where I've been, and I know where she's.
• 12:46
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 12:47
  Speaker C: Do you remember in the 70s when they had the. The padded seats?
• 12:50
  Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah.
• 12:52
  Speaker C: Vinyl.
• 12:52
  Speaker A: Those are weird, right?
• 12:54
  Speaker C: They were weird.
• 12:55
  Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah.
• 12:55
  Speaker B: What about the. Some people, it was. It was invoked to have, like, a wooden toilet seat. You ever remember that? The wooden toilet seat?
• 13:02
  Speaker C: Oh, yeah, that was.
• 13:03
  Speaker D: That was for style, comfort.
• 13:05
  Speaker A: But. But also, I think I've seen, like, a fur toilet seat, which seems like a terrible idea. I mean, it's a. Yeah, I think.
• 13:12
  Speaker C: Elvis had that in the Graceland Jungle room.
• 13:18
  Speaker B: I remember I had a fur sink. That didn't work out. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that didn't work out.
• 13:25
  Speaker A: Seems like a. Like an April Fool's joke because.
• 13:29
  Speaker B: It was purple.
• 13:30
  Speaker A: Okay. Right.
• 13:31
  Speaker D: There was something growing in your seat.
• 13:33
  Speaker A: Okay. Oh, it could be. It could be some Lysol.
• 13:38
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 13:38
  Speaker D: All right.
• 13:39
  Speaker A: Well, anything else, Manny?
• 13:42
  Speaker B: Yeah. Okay. I've got tons of stuff here. That guy hexifies. You hear about him again? You know, he's always in the news.
• 13:50
  Speaker A: Sure, sure, sure.
• 13:51
  Speaker B: He's our leader of. What is he, the Defense Department?
• 13:54
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 13:54
  Speaker D: Secretary Defense.
• 13:56
  Speaker B: Yeah. Well, I heard. Just today. I heard this, that he wants to have steep cuts in the number of steps. Steps it takes to recovery.
• 14:07
  Speaker A: Okay. I cut it down from 12.
• 14:09
  Speaker B: Yeah. Like, maybe you want six or seven. Cut it in half. The steps to recovery.
• 14:14
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 14:15
  Speaker B: I don't know. You know, the ninth step is always the hardest for people, I guess. I guess that's the one he wants to get out.
• 14:20
  Speaker A: Which one is that? Making amends.
• 14:21
  Speaker B: Yeah, it's the one who apologized to people.
• 14:23
  Speaker A: Right. Well, that's the one all of our friends leave out. You know, they. When they have to pay you the money that they. That they stole from you, they. For. They forget that step.
• 14:30
  Speaker B: Yeah. So he's trying to get that. It's. It's. It's going to go to the Senate or to the Congress, and I don't know what's going on.
• 14:39
  Speaker C: Isn't he a prop. Reported alcoholic?
• 14:42
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 14:42
  Speaker A: Well, that's why he wants to cut down on.
• 14:44
  Speaker C: Oh, I see. To make it more efficient.
• 14:45
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 14:46
  Speaker A: Right, right, right. Yeah.
• 14:47
  Speaker B: So just like, one. I surrender, I guess, is the one.
• 14:52
  Speaker A: Admit you have a problem and move on the problem.
• 14:54
  Speaker B: Move on and make it someone else's problem.
• 14:57
  Speaker A: Sure, sure.
• 14:58
  Speaker B: But he seems like a good guy.
• 15:00
  Speaker A: Okay. Well, I don't know. Jerry's still out.
• 15:02
  Speaker B: Yeah. I don't know. We'll see about him again.
• 15:05
  Speaker A: I'm still.
• 15:06
  Speaker C: His tattoos.
• 15:07
  Speaker A: Still trying to. Oh, yeah. Yes. Yeah. The white nationalist tattoos are quite inspiring. Yeah. Well, you know, I think most of our guests that wind up here. Maybe it's an age thing, but don't have any tattoos. I know. I don't. I don't think Manny has any. I'm guessing you don't have any. I'm guessing you don't either. All right, four out of five.
• 15:26
  Speaker D: I had an opportunity to get one when I lived in Los Angeles.
• 15:30
  Speaker A: Well, yeah, we all have opportunity.
• 15:31
  Speaker D: And it was. It was going to be a surprise to you. Yeah. My wife at that time said, we're going out tonight. We're going out, but you got to put on a blindfold. I said, okay. So she's driving around la, and she drives me up. I don't know where it was. We're just driving here, driving there, and she stops and she says, okay, I'm coming to get you. Out of the car. She takes me out of the car and leads me up the stairs at some place, and I hear the door open and the bell dingle on the door, and it closes. And she takes the blindfold off and goes, surprise. And sitting in front of me was a tattoo artist with a. With the needle ready to work on me.
• 16:09
  Speaker A: Oh, geez.
• 16:11
  Speaker C: Was there a design already planned?
• 16:13
  Speaker D: Yeah. I kept talking, you know, because I'm, you know, I'm half Sicilian, so I was talking about having an olive with a pimento on my arm for a number of years. And it just goes to show, my wife at that time was listening to me.
• 16:29
  Speaker A: All right.
• 16:30
  Speaker D: But anyway.
• 16:31
  Speaker A: But you dodged that bullet. You decided.
• 16:34
  Speaker D: I just said to her, can we talk outside for a minute, please?
• 16:38
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 16:39
  Speaker D: I got in the car and I said, sorry, no way.
• 16:42
  Speaker A: Right, right, right.
• 16:43
  Speaker D: Chickened out.
• 16:44
  Speaker A: Right, right. Well, anyway, that hexath, he's. He's covered in him.
• 16:48
  Speaker B: I would. I see, the thing is, I've had plenty of opportunity to have tats and stuff, but I just don't know What I'd want there for the long, you know, for my lifetime. I just could never, you know, I don't know what I'd put there.
• 17:01
  Speaker A: Right. Well, you know, some. Someone compared getting a tattoo.
• 17:04
  Speaker D: I mean, some of them, I've seen t shoes on some people, I go, wow, that is a. And I have to tell them how cool the tattoo is. Some of them, I sell some women, I said, they're absolutely beautiful stuff. I mean, work is. It's, it's beautiful. Tattoo artists are really that artists.
• 17:20
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 17:20
  Speaker D: They do some beautiful work.
• 17:22
  Speaker A: I heard someone compare it to. If you liked platform shoes so much in the 70s, you had them nailed to your feet. That's what, that's what getting a tattoo.
• 17:32
  Speaker D: I actually had a pair of shoes.
• 17:35
  Speaker A: I'll never not want to wear these.
• 17:39
  Speaker D: I had, I had a pair. They were two tone green and red.
• 17:42
  Speaker A: Aren't you sorry you didn't have them stapled to your feet permanently?
• 17:45
  Speaker D: I'm kind of glad I did.
• 17:46
  Speaker C: Pete Davidson just have all his tattoos turned off?
• 17:50
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
• 17:51
  Speaker C: And wasn't it, like, excruciating?
• 17:52
  Speaker A: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. No.
• 17:53
  Speaker B: Oh, yeah. I've known Pete Davidson. I've known people to have young comedian guy tattoos removed and it's more painful than the tattoo.
• 18:01
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 18:02
  Speaker B: You know, but he's. I think he's into all that pain.
• 18:05
  Speaker A: That guy who hacks out.
• 18:06
  Speaker B: Yeah, no.
• 18:07
  Speaker A: Oh, Pete Davidson.
• 18:08
  Speaker C: Of course he is. Didn't he date Kardashian?
• 18:10
  Speaker B: He did a Kardashian.
• 18:11
  Speaker C: So he's in the pain.
• 18:12
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 18:13
  Speaker B: And you know, his father died at 9 11.
• 18:16
  Speaker A: Yeah, it was a fire.
• 18:17
  Speaker B: Fireman.
• 18:18
  Speaker D: Oh, man.
• 18:19
  Speaker B: So there's deep regret, but one of his funniest bits I've ever seen him do, and this is, you know, pain, I guess, but is that he's, you know, he said, you know, my dad died in 9 11. That was like eight years ago. Whatever. Whenever I saw this bit, he goes, and I'm really trying to get my mom laid. She needs to get badly. Who out there will. My mom. He did a whole 10 minutes about someone fucking his mom.
• 18:43
  Speaker D: Nah.
• 18:43
  Speaker B: And it was the funniest thing. And then the next act, I forget what the comedian's name was. His first line was, I'll. Your mom, Pete.
• 18:54
  Speaker C: He wins.
• 18:59
  Speaker B: Forget that guy. What's his name? Anyway, yeah, shout out to Pete.
• 19:05
  Speaker A: Right on, right on.
• 19:06
  Speaker B: You know, you know, he's. To me, he doesn't seem like the most attractive of a man, but he gets chicks, man. Yeah, Women, man. Kind of like me. Because Chicks dig me. Yeah, right, right, so. But good. More power to him.
• 19:22
  Speaker A: Right on.
• 19:22
  Speaker D: But it's interesting. I mean, I'm just thinking, Darren, both. We both played in. In what you could call. At the beginning of our career, music was punk bands.
• 19:33
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 19:34
  Speaker D: And as a punk band, you know, you'd think the first thing you do is go out and get a tattoo.
• 19:39
  Speaker B: Right. Yeah.
• 19:39
  Speaker A: It was a different era.
• 19:41
  Speaker D: Anybody else in your band had tattoos?
• 19:43
  Speaker C: No. John got one when he was under the influence, but it was really small. It's a red star. That's it.
• 19:49
  Speaker D: Oh, yeah.
• 19:50
  Speaker C: The only other one.
• 19:52
  Speaker D: Yeah. Rick. Rick, our lead singer got one.
• 19:55
  Speaker B: Yeah. I don't know, there's just certain cats who are, you know, have that feeling that they want tattoos. I mean, I grew up with tons of cats in. In the late 70s and 80s who were all in bands and stuff. And some of them had tats and a lot of tats, and some of them just didn't bother, you know. I don't know. I mean, I guess it's a way for a lot of people. I knew back then it was a way for them to not to spend their money on that than on dope and stuff like that, you know, it's like. Because they were. They want that. That feeling, you know, that feel.
• 20:29
  Speaker A: Endorphin rush.
• 20:30
  Speaker B: Yeah, something like that. Yeah. And, you know, and that I. And I guess you could get addicted to it. Getting tats.
• 20:38
  Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
• 20:38
  Speaker B: You know, you can get addicted to it. You see these people with, you know, tattoos on their face right.
• 20:45
  Speaker D: Too far on their necks.
• 20:47
  Speaker C: And my nest from Social Distortion.
• 20:51
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. That guy's nuts about the tats. Yeah, yeah. Social Distortion, Social D. Yeah.
• 20:58
  Speaker D: You can't even wear a shirt anymore with a collar. You know, Tattoos look like something growing out of the back of your neck.
• 21:03
  Speaker A: You know, we're sounding old now, only.
• 21:08
  Speaker D: I know, but, you know, hey, look, more. It's whatever anybody wants to get more power, you know. But, you know, look, tattoos I think are on. Like I said, I think they're. Some of them are really beautiful to look at, interesting to look at, but I don't know, man. Marking up your neck and your throat is, you know. I don't know. All right, that's like prison stuff.
• 21:29
  Speaker A: I hear you.
• 21:29
  Speaker D: I hear you.
• 21:30
  Speaker C: I managed a rockabilly band and the singer was Jewish and he had full sleeves. And whenever he went to go visit his parents, he had to cover them all up. They lived in Connecticut. It's probably like 101 degrees there in humid. Full long button down. Long sleeve shirt.
• 21:48
  Speaker A: Well, at least he still had a sense of shame. He wanted to hide it from his parents. I appreciate that. You know, shouldn't have done it in the first place.
• 21:54
  Speaker B: See, when I did that, when I'd visit my parents, they said, are you shooting up still?
• 21:57
  Speaker A: Right, right. If you don't have short sleeves on. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it's because of track marks.
• 22:02
  Speaker D: Yeah, we, I couldn't do that. My dad was a pharmacist by profession. Oh, and he's still around?
• 22:08
  Speaker A: No, no, but man, he wanted to get his number.
• 22:11
  Speaker D: He knew he worked for the. He worked, Did a sideline job, unbeknownst to most of us at the time, for the dea.
• 22:20
  Speaker A: Oh.
• 22:21
  Speaker D: Because they, they, they needed somebody to, to, to mix the drug that heroin addicts take to get, to get off of the methadone. Methadone?
• 22:32
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 22:33
  Speaker A: Liquid handcuffs. They call.
• 22:35
  Speaker D: They put a huge, they had a huge safe in the back of that and we had a back room built for us to play music in. And there was a huge safe back there. I mean it was like a six foot safe. Hey, Pop, what is that? Oh, that's not. I'm just keeping all our records in there and everything. But that's where they kept the dope.
• 22:57
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 22:58
  Speaker D: DEA agents would come over every now and then. These guys would show up.
• 23:02
  Speaker B: This is back in the 70s.
• 23:04
  Speaker D: Yeah, yeah. My dad was have to get up, go to back and say, okay, you kid, y'all can't come back here right now. I have some business to discuss. And. And yeah, he was, he was mixing methadone for heroin addicts.
• 23:18
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 23:18
  Speaker B: Well, that was a big program. Nixon administration. The Nixon administration started the methadone program. That was one of the things that Nixon tried to do is get junkies off the street.
• 23:28
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 23:29
  Speaker B: You know, and more he wanted than junkies.
• 23:33
  Speaker A: Well, it keeps everybody's TV safe. That's the thing that methadone does. You know, you're still on, on drugs, but at least, you know.
• 23:40
  Speaker B: Well, I always thought, you know, you're.
• 23:42
  Speaker A: Gonna steal it, break into your house.
• 23:44
  Speaker B: Yeah. But at that time, I remember in the 70s, early 80s, I, I knew people who would steal TVs, but they were no good because they forgot to steal the remote.
• 23:54
  Speaker A: Oh, shoot, shoot.
• 23:56
  Speaker B: So it was no good.
• 23:57
  Speaker A: Right, right, right.
• 23:58
  Speaker B: You know, anyway.
• 24:00
  Speaker A: Yeah, can we get, get to our guests here? We're going long in this, this front half here and we got, got two guests.
• 24:06
  Speaker D: Oh, yeah.
• 24:07
  Speaker B: Okay. Yeah, let's get to the.
• 24:08
  Speaker D: I, I didn't know if you wanted us to start talking or not. I was kind of waiting sort of an introduction.
• 24:15
  Speaker A: Introduction is coming.
• 24:16
  Speaker D: People here just to go.
• 24:18
  Speaker B: Right, right.
• 24:20
  Speaker A: They'll be able to. Your name will be in the title. They'll be able to puzzle it all out. Yeah, well, so. So we have a. It's a very special night. We have two guests. We have a returning guest. He's founding bassist in the Great. The legendary New Orleans punk group the Red Rockers, formerly the Rat Finks in their first incarnation. He's. He's also been. Been affiliated with. With groups like the Rain Dogs, Paul Westerberg. He's a founder of Ten Pin Artist Management. He's been the manager of Replacements, New York Dolls, all kind of other bands. Rocky Erickson, Royal Crowns, Combustible Edison. And he's a proprietor of his own pop emporium in Providence, Rhode Island. A great antique and performance shop gallery. And he's back in town for the second annual, or second anyway, hopefully annual New Orleans punk rock family reunion with his band the Red Rockers, as well as a terrific foundational punk rock band in New Orleans. The Contenders hasn't played in 40 years. I think they're reforming to open the show. And Lenny Zenith is also on the bill. Big show at Tipitina's and he brought in as his special guest a fantastic cinematographer, director, producer, writer, actor. His work includes Wild Hearts Can't Be Broken, Xena, the Warrior Princess, Silk stockings, the controversial 1994 Roger Corman production of the Fantastic Four. But most importantly, he's the director of the Red Rockers hit MTV video for their 1983 hit single China. And besides that, he was also a guitarist with another foundational New Orleans punk era band, Sex Dog, which had members Dave Clements, czar of the Clempire, as well as his brother Cranston Clements. Also the great Scott Gudo on guitar. Also the dearly departed Nicky Sonzenbach, who we had on the program a couple of months before he passed away. And also Rick Wigginton is our singer. Anyway, so.
• 26:35
  Speaker D: And our final drummer, Dave Landry.
• 26:38
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 26:38
  Speaker D: Who passed away.
• 26:39
  Speaker A: Oh, so sorry. But.
• 26:41
  Speaker B: So you think he could still do the show though?
• 26:44
  Speaker D: Say again.
• 26:46
  Speaker A: So. So without further ado, we have Darren Hill from the Red Rockers, original founding bass player with the Red Rockers and the great Oli Sassone. Welcome, Darren and Oli.
• 26:58
  Speaker D: Happy to be here.
• 26:58
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Great to have you all here.
• 27:01
  Speaker D: I was really happy that Darren called me out of the blue to ask me if I wanted to do a podcast and I said absolutely. Okay, I Mean, I just. Because I just felt. Because of the invitation and for Darren and the respect I have for him and the band, the Red Rockers, and, And you know, and I heard you guys were going to be. I just had to do this.
• 27:23
  Speaker B: Well, the night is young, my friend. Respecting you might lose some of it tonight.
• 27:30
  Speaker A: Well, you know, only like, like in. In show business in general, you know, the, the people that say yes, that's. The people that wind up succeeding, people that say no to things, they stay on their sofa. Nothing ever happens for them.
• 27:42
  Speaker D: Right, good point.
• 27:44
  Speaker A: Okay, so.
• 27:45
  Speaker D: No, that's a good point.
• 27:47
  Speaker A: No, I'm just saying.
• 27:48
  Speaker D: See, I see a lot of those kind of. I saw a lot of those people when I was in LA for 20 some odd years.
• 27:53
  Speaker A: Right.
• 27:54
  Speaker B: I had so many girlfriends that I said, come on, say yes to this. And they never did.
• 27:58
  Speaker A: And where are they now? Not married to Manny Chevrolet, I don't know.
• 28:03
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, they're not in the business and I know what kind of business.
• 28:06
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 28:09
  Speaker B: Business, you know.
• 28:10
  Speaker A: Well, well, Darren, you were on a earlier show, maybe like November of 2023.
• 28:19
  Speaker C: Yes, yes.
• 28:19
  Speaker A: Right, right, right. And. And that was. That was right around the time that. That the Red Rockers did the. The first one where you. You performed the entirety of. Was that Condition Red? Right, right. And this time around, you guys are performing your second record.
• 28:37
  Speaker C: Yes, Good as Gold, our major label debut.
• 28:40
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 28:40
  Speaker C: And case in point, bringing Oli on board.
• 28:44
  Speaker A: Right, right. So. Well, and so anybody that wants to go back and hear the deep dive on Darren, you can go back to that one. It has his name in the title, Darren Hill. I think it has Red Rockers Revisited or something like that. Something in the title.
• 29:00
  Speaker C: Did you see on. I made this big deal out of. Because Spotify had me listed as the writer for China, but they put me as Daryl hall, you not. And it took a year to get it changed.
• 29:16
  Speaker A: Was Daryl hall getting your publisher?
• 29:18
  Speaker C: That's what I was wondering.
• 29:19
  Speaker A: Yeah, like he needs it, you know?
• 29:21
  Speaker B: Right.
• 29:22
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. Well, maybe if you could get some of his. If you get some of his.
• 29:26
  Speaker C: I said I'd gladly trade.
• 29:27
  Speaker A: Trade. Yeah, yeah, sure.
• 29:29
  Speaker B: Now, is China on Condition Red or was on the.
• 29:33
  Speaker C: No, it's on Good as Gold. So that was.
• 29:34
  Speaker B: You do China this.
• 29:36
  Speaker C: Oh, yes, we will.
• 29:37
  Speaker A: That's China.
• 29:38
  Speaker C: Every song off that record. Yeah, well, I just.
• 29:41
  Speaker B: No, you just said it wasn't.
• 29:42
  Speaker A: No, no, it is. Condition Red was the. The first LP that they performed in its entirety.
• 29:47
  Speaker C: That was last year and a half ago.
• 29:49
  Speaker B: And that was. China was on that.
• 29:50
  Speaker A: No, no, China.
• 29:51
  Speaker B: You didn't perform China last time.
• 29:53
  Speaker C: We did, but we did a. A messed up version of it just to like, just kind of as a people. Yeah, exactly.
• 30:01
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 30:02
  Speaker D: All right, well, that's a great song about how many songs on. On that album good as gold.
• 30:07
  Speaker C: 11.
• 30:08
  Speaker D: 11. Cool.
• 30:09
  Speaker A: Well, so let's. Let's go back, Oli, you know, so you are from New Orleans, right?
• 30:14
  Speaker D: Right.
• 30:14
  Speaker A: You grew up here. What, What? Just to give people background, what high school did you go to? What neighborhood you grew up in?
• 30:20
  Speaker D: Metairie.
• 30:21
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 30:21
  Speaker D: I went to Rummel High School.
• 30:24
  Speaker A: I was gonna guess that. Archbishop Rummel.
• 30:26
  Speaker D: Oh, God. Okay, look at the time we hated.
• 30:30
  Speaker B: Rape is a major, right?
• 30:31
  Speaker D: Yeah. All boys. It was all boys. Yeah. You know, Christian brothers. But, you know, sometimes I look back and I say, you know, it's a good thing I went someplace where they beat the out of you when you were bad. Because we were bad. You needed. And I think, you know, we needed.
• 30:49
  Speaker A: Discipline, needed a good beating.
• 30:50
  Speaker D: I mean, yeah, I mean, I. I was. You know, I was too skinny and they didn't really beat on me. My older brother was. He played football and they wouldn't beat on him because he was. Have knocked the out of them. All right, but, you know, I. But look.
• 31:04
  Speaker B: And these are the priests, instructors.
• 31:06
  Speaker D: But at that time, it was. This is when the movie Easy Rider came out. So we were. We were radical. And. And I'll try to make this story quick, but another friend named Arthur Brands and I, we. There was a big assembly in the. In the student assembly in the gym. The entire. The entire student body in the gym. And we stopped on the way into the gym. We ducked into the men's bathroom. He put on a pair of stars and striped bell bottoms, and I put on a blue jean jacket with the American flag on the back.
• 31:42
  Speaker A: Oh, just like Easy Rider.
• 31:44
  Speaker D: Yeah, dude. And the whole student assembly, the body, everybody's in there and they're just getting started. And it was. Gotten quiet and it was in the gym and we crashed the doors open and make a big entrance and the whole place just went wild. Erupted. And here we were, man.
• 32:05
  Speaker B: And then they all beat the. Out of you. The whole assembly just came down. Not the students, man.
• 32:13
  Speaker D: The Christian brothers came after us, man. And we just knew we were going to get our asses kicked, but we didn't care because, you know, they were. They were honest about how long our hair was. And your hair's touching the collar of your shirt. You gotta cut it. And people have to realize that the Point of the story is, I guess, in a way, in a sense, if you look at what's happening in this country today, you start pushing people too hard, they're gonna fight back.
• 32:39
  Speaker A: Okay. All right.
• 32:41
  Speaker D: And that's what we did.
• 32:42
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 32:43
  Speaker B: Like our last election, this past weekend, you know, where those amendments that our governor thought would just go right through, through, they all failed, cuz parishes all over the state where he won, they said, no, man.
• 32:57
  Speaker D: Yeah, I got to give power to the people. Give a little credit to Mick Jagger.
• 33:02
  Speaker B: Yeah, Mick Jagger.
• 33:04
  Speaker D: He put. He put. He put Governor Landry down big time.
• 33:08
  Speaker B: Oh, yeah, I heard that.
• 33:09
  Speaker C: That was great.
• 33:09
  Speaker D: It was. I was there, brother. It was so good.
• 33:12
  Speaker A: I was. I was there, too.
• 33:13
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 33:14
  Speaker A: Well, so at this time in high school, were you already playing music? Were you bands and stuff?
• 33:19
  Speaker D: Yeah. Oh, yeah.
• 33:20
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 33:20
  Speaker D: Playing guitars and actually doing both things. Playing music and making Super 8 movies.
• 33:27
  Speaker A: So is that how you got just. Your family had a Super 8 camera and you just started around?
• 33:32
  Speaker D: There was a. There was a teacher in. In. In our school who was a photographer and a filmmaker, and he showed us his pictures when. When he was. Before he came to. To Rummel and he was a hippie.
• 33:46
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 33:47
  Speaker D: But, you know, he came to Rumble to teach, you know, the arts and photography and so on and so forth. And he had to cut his hair and look. But we looked at this guy and he said, damn, that's you, brother. He goes, yeah. And then. Then he said, we just, like, you know, we went to hang out with the guy we thought was the coolest guy in the. In the faculty.
• 34:04
  Speaker A: Right on.
• 34:05
  Speaker D: And he had this really cool Super 8 camera where you could literally focus the lens.
• 34:10
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 34:10
  Speaker D: It wasn't just like something you just go pick up automatically. Shoot. This is like a real movie camera.
• 34:15
  Speaker A: What was his name? You want to give him a shout out?
• 34:17
  Speaker D: Oh, damn. I wish.
• 34:18
  Speaker A: I can't remember.
• 34:19
  Speaker B: All right, well, Martin Scorsese.
• 34:21
  Speaker A: Could be.
• 34:21
  Speaker D: Yeah, could have been. I wish. No, but that's how it all started.
• 34:27
  Speaker B: But the whole time.
• 34:28
  Speaker C: Yeah.
• 34:29
  Speaker D: Who went to Rumble? Scorsese. Yeah, he. For like, a while. He was Catholic boy, so. Yeah, yeah, Italian Catholic like me, but.
• 34:36
  Speaker A: Right.
• 34:36
  Speaker D: Anyway, so that's how that started, and then we started making Super 8 films. And, you know, I go on vacation with my parents, like, to the. To Pensacola, Florida, and I make beach. Beach blanket bingo type movies at Super 8, you know.
• 34:49
  Speaker E: Yeah.
• 34:49
  Speaker D: I was playing music. You know, I started playing music before I got interested in shooting film, but. And it was really because of a hard day's Night, you know, when I was a kid, went to see A Hard Day's Night. And I mean, first of all, it was the Beatles, but secondly, the theater was filled with screaming girls. And I said, oh, my God, I gotta do something like that. Screaming for me. Anyway, that was a movie. Still, today is like a. It's. It's. It's compared to, like, French New Wave and the handheld. The style of the whole movie, black and white, you know, it's just beautifully done.
• 35:30
  Speaker B: Who directed that film?
• 35:31
  Speaker D: Richard Lester.
• 35:32
  Speaker B: Yeah, Richard Lester.
• 35:33
  Speaker D: He's an American.
• 35:34
  Speaker B: Yes.
• 35:34
  Speaker D: It wasn't a Brit.
• 35:36
  Speaker B: Yes.
• 35:36
  Speaker D: But, yeah. I mean, and then to. To this day, the film is still running on TCM and. Right make. And the people that talk about it, it holds up, talk about it as the French New Wave, you know, And. And Right. You know, like the movies of Godard.
• 35:52
  Speaker A: Right.
• 35:52
  Speaker D: You know, like Breathless and those kind of.
• 35:53
  Speaker A: Right, right. So you were in Sex Dog. So I'd known Cranston since I'm a little kid. He played my father's band as a guitar player. And. And then. And so did Scott Gudo also. And, you know, he'd wind up taking over the chair for Cranston's doing. Going off and doing something else. And so then when Cranston says, oh, we got. We have a punk rock band. I was like, really? Because I was, you know, I was into the Pistols and stuff and, you know, already hearing that music. And so. And then he said, well, we have a gig at Luigi's, so. And as far as I know, that might be your first public gig. That's how I always think of it. And I was at that gig.
• 36:36
  Speaker D: Wow. And we have a tape of that gig.
• 36:40
  Speaker A: No, kid.
• 36:40
  Speaker D: Oh, yeah, yeah. So I know Cranston does.
• 36:43
  Speaker A: Right on.
• 36:44
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 36:45
  Speaker A: Well, so.
• 36:45
  Speaker D: So Luigi's is down by Uno.
• 36:48
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. By the lakefront. Right, right, right. So. So I was at that gig. So at that time, were you already doing commercial film work?
• 36:57
  Speaker D: Yeah, we were shooting. I was shooting TV commercials for Louisiana Power and Light. We were doing political commercials. I'd shot some commercials for the governor. Louisiana.
• 37:10
  Speaker A: Do you have your own production company or something?
• 37:12
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 37:12
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 37:13
  Speaker D: Yeah. But I worked for other production companies too. When I was just starting in the business, you know, I started assistant cameraman, and then I got into the cameraman's union as an assistant cameraman. And I worked on Pretty Baby that they shot here. And I became an assistant to Sven Niekvist. And then Sven. And in case people out there don't know Sven Nickvist was shot all the Amar Bergman movies, right? Academy Award for Cries and Whispers and so on and so forth at the Swedish Film Institute. And. And he asked me to. To. To start. He called me in his office. He said, in fact. In fact, the first time he called me, I thought it was somebody playing a joke.
• 37:51
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 37:52
  Speaker D: He said, oh, hello, Ollie, this is Van Nickvist. And I said, really? He said, yes, I want you to come see me at the Puncher Train Hotel. And I went, really? He said, yes, I want you to come shoot the film for me. And I said, hey, Ricky, go yourself. Because he knew I was trying to get a gig on a movie.
• 38:11
  Speaker A: Huh?
• 38:11
  Speaker D: And he. Luckily, Sven Nickvis called me back. He called me back and said, hello, Oli, don't hang up. Really, this is Fann Nickvist.
• 38:21
  Speaker B: And I went, oh.
• 38:23
  Speaker D: So, sure enough, he hired me to come over and shoot film behind the scenes of the making of Pretty Baby. And the reason he, He. He did that is to bring his surviving son back over from Stockholm because his other son, right before the movie started or right after the movie started, his. His other son had committed suicide.
• 38:42
  Speaker A: Oh, man.
• 38:43
  Speaker D: So, but he. So he brought Charlie Nikvus back and. And Paramount Pictures paid for that. And anyway, they needed somebody to shoot it, so they hired me to shoot it. So I went to Sweden that summer and hung out with them and went to the Swedish Film Institute where they were making movies with all these great Inmar Bergman, you know, ensemble cast members. But the one thing that they really loved when they were in New Orleans, they loved listening to wyld.
• 39:12
  Speaker A: Okay?
• 39:13
  Speaker D: Wyld, you know, the black radio station. And back then, that station was locally owned. It wasn't owned by some big conglomerate someplace. So therefore, the commercials and things that they ran on WYLD were all these really cool homegrown commercials.
• 39:29
  Speaker A: Right? Right.
• 39:30
  Speaker D: You know, and they would. And they would whack them out with reverb and you know, and all kind of crazy stuff in these commercials. So before I went over to Stockholm, I recorded four hours straight across of wyld. And I brought it to him and I said, here, man, there's WYLD on his cassette tapes with all these wacky commercials right in between the really cool New Orleans music. So they're listening to this and I get. I'll go, oh, Ollie, you have to. We have to get the voice of it of, like this for the opening of our film. This is the behind the scenes movie for Pretty Baby. And I said, yeah, great. That's a really Good idea. And he looked at me and I said, you're going to do it? He said, what do you mean, I'm gonna do it? He said, yeah, you got to do it. So we go into the screening room of frickin Ingmar Bergman's personal screening room where he just finished doing a movie called the Serpent's Egg. And I'm sitting on there with a microphone and a little script that I made up. And they said, okay, Oli, let's do it. And I go, hey, y'all, where you at? It's 83 degrees in the breeze, baby, down your knowledge well, you better take that shirt off. It's hot as out there now, you know? And I did this whole black thing for the. For the movie, for the opening of the film. And I even said, W Y L D D D D D. You know? And sure enough that my voice opens the movie.
• 40:56
  Speaker A: Oh, okay.
• 40:57
  Speaker B: Well, the documentary.
• 40:59
  Speaker D: The documentary. The. Not pretty, baby.
• 41:01
  Speaker B: Right.
• 41:01
  Speaker A: Obviously.
• 41:03
  Speaker D: But anyway, that was a trip. So, you know, that's it. And then that's what sort of snowballed, you know, My career started to snowball and I started doing directing jobs and so on and so forth.
• 41:12
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 41:12
  Speaker D: But always keeping music in the mix.
• 41:15
  Speaker A: Right.
• 41:15
  Speaker D: You know.
• 41:16
  Speaker A: Right.
• 41:16
  Speaker D: I don't know.
• 41:17
  Speaker A: It was a very fertile time in the New Orleans rock and roll scene. Had bands exploding and. And, you know, like, when you say punk rock, people always think of, like, the jackhammering eighth notes, but, you know, that's. Punk rock was way broader palette than that. It had all kind of different bands playing different kind of variations on weird style. And certainly Sex Dog was. You know, it had a lot of Zappa damage in there, you know, that. That. And a lot of weirdness that. That was thrown in along with all the heavy guitars and everything. So.
• 41:46
  Speaker D: But I'm guessing, you know, they're in the same way we would. We love New Orleans music.
• 41:51
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 41:51
  Speaker D: I mean, absolutely. I mean, the Meters, you know, the Neville Brothers, the Wild Chop of Tulas, you know.
• 41:58
  Speaker A: Right.
• 41:59
  Speaker D: I mean, and. And not just the. Those guys who were high profile. I mean, I used to go to a place called the Glass House.
• 42:06
  Speaker A: Oh, sure.
• 42:07
  Speaker D: You remember the Glass House.
• 42:08
  Speaker A: Yeah. Glass House was a dirty, Dirty dozen home club.
• 42:11
  Speaker D: Yeah, that's it. And Central City, you know, I was talking to. And I guess I can mention his name. Wynton Marcellus.
• 42:18
  Speaker A: Sure. Yeah. Yeah.
• 42:19
  Speaker D: Because my. My wife was. Is. Was the executive director of the Noka foundation.
• 42:25
  Speaker A: Oh, okay.
• 42:26
  Speaker D: For 25 years. So she knew all the people, all these great musicians and people and went to Noka. So, you know, we're in New York, you know, we went to see Wenton, and we went out to dinner afterwards, and we're sitting with Wenton and, you know, we're talking about stuff and talking about New Orleans and. And, you know, he's just looking at me, and then I don't know how the conversation got to that, but I said. I said, oh, yeah, man, you know, yeah, like. Yeah, the glass house, he says. And he looked at me good. He said, what do you know about the glass house, man? I said, well, we used to go there and. Because it was. It was off the path, man.
• 43:01
  Speaker B: Sure.
• 43:01
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
• 43:02
  Speaker D: And we'd go there and just. And listen to the Dirty Dozen. And it was like me and maybe two other white people in the whole club, you know, but it was cool, right?
• 43:11
  Speaker A: Nobody gave you a hard time. That was cool.
• 43:13
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 43:13
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 43:14
  Speaker D: Just dug the music, right? You know, and then we'd do these. We go on Chopatoulas and where they do, like, the Mardi Gras Indians would come out and do their ritual dance before Mardi Gras. And the ritual dance back in the old days where they'd really go after each other and beat each other up with bats and clubs. And some of them would bring axes and shit. But we'd go to this and go watch this. The ritual dances of the Mardi Gras Indians.
• 43:39
  Speaker B: Why did they get rid of that? See, I was going out for Marty Gr. To see that.
• 43:45
  Speaker D: Cut the population down.
• 43:47
  Speaker B: I guess I would go see that.
• 43:49
  Speaker D: But, man, but that was also. It was. It was very tribal. The music was intense. The. The. The whole thing was really intense, you know, where they would just do these moves and dances like that.
• 44:02
  Speaker B: A real battle of the bands.
• 44:04
  Speaker D: Like, right. There was a battle.
• 44:06
  Speaker B: It was battle. Literal violence. It was all symbolic, literally, a battle of the band.
• 44:10
  Speaker D: But the tambourines.
• 44:11
  Speaker B: I'm going to kill you.
• 44:12
  Speaker D: And the. And the rhythms and the drums and everything were just. I mean, all that stuff was very influential. When you grow up in New Orleans and you want to pick up on the music and as a bass player, especially, Darren, I would think, you know, bass players, you know, that's the rhythm.
• 44:28
  Speaker A: Sure, sure.
• 44:29
  Speaker D: You guys keep the bottom going, man. That's. And that's just stuff. It gets.
• 44:33
  Speaker A: It's.
• 44:33
  Speaker D: It's in your blood, you know?
• 44:35
  Speaker A: Right. You know, this time is flying by. Ola. You see, I told you. You're like, are we gonna have enough time. Stuff to talk about? Holy cow.
• 44:42
  Speaker D: That's your fault, man.
• 44:43
  Speaker B: Holy cow.
• 44:45
  Speaker A: Holy cow. It's, it's, it's, it's about that time. Looking at my. Our drinks. It's. Manny, tell the people.
• 44:50
  Speaker B: Yeah, we need to take a break. We'll be right back.
• 45:05
  Speaker E: A day living on the edge and you ask for another drink so the pain will go away. But no matter where you turn there is no place to hide from a burning agony of a world that's lost its way. Childhood dreams, they seem to slip away. You pass through time fading further each day frustration choose your thoughts it's draws and then you lose control and our minds will lose their soul. Dreams fade away. Dreams just fade away.
• 46:26
  Speaker A: And we're back, back with Mr. Manny Chevrolet. Yeah, I am Renee Coleman. You are back with our guests, Mr. Darren Hill and Mr. Oli Sasson. Now, I know Darren, you're familiar with the, with the podcast, only less so. But Oli, I will tell you that this is a listener supported operation. We don't have any corporate sponsorship. Not that we would refuse it, but, you know, hasn't happened for us so far. But, but we do have a PayPal link and a Venmo link and we have devoted listeners who contribute to the podcast through those links. They buy us rounds of cocktails, underwrite our operating costs, the hosting, podcast hosting costs. You can see we use a lot of notebooks. It's a very analog operation here. We do. Thank you everyone who's doing that and, and have a shout out to a couple of people. Last week's guest or a couple of weeks ago, Tony Tocco. Very generous support. Also we have the Patreon link there. We have a handful of patrons that are supporting us week in, week out. Also we have the Troublemen podcast T shirts and we have a link there where you can purchase those for you and, and your family, loved ones, neighbors. And we had somebody bought a T shirt this week, Charles. I'm not sure what Charles's last name is, but I know what size he wears. But, so, so the. But I won't divulge that on the podcast. It's nobody's business but your own. And you know, if you want to jump in on those T shirts once that, that campaign, once somebody buys one, it's the windows open for you. You can get one much quicker. Quicker. So if you're, if you were just waiting your time, the time is now. Time to strike while the iron's hot, right, Darren?
• 48:16
  Speaker C: That's right.
• 48:16
  Speaker A: Also, let's see. Follow us on social media, Instagram, Facebook and rate, review and subscribe to the podcast, wherever you're listening to it, give us five stars. Helps us a lot. Cost you nothing. I have a slew of French Quarter Fest gigs coming up. Go to the Renee Coleman Facebook page and you can see all my lists will be there. Well, you sure? You know, it's a free gig.
• 48:40
  Speaker B: It's not like they have to pay to it.
• 48:41
  Speaker A: You know, I would like to see people show up. You know, I have a whole more than one handful of artists I'm playing with at French Quarter Fest, so you can check those out on the. The links to the Renee Coleman Facebook page or in the podcast as well. And here I always. Sometimes I forget. But let me have the presentation of the Troubleman podcast. Stickers to both of our guests. Oli, thank you. One to stick and one to save. Or you can stick them both. Cool.
• 49:13
  Speaker C: We have one of these up at the entrance to pop.
• 49:15
  Speaker A: Nice. Nice. I love it. I love it. Thank you. Thank you. We appreciate that.
• 49:19
  Speaker B: Don't put it on your bumper, because you'll get pulled over. Right, okay.
• 49:23
  Speaker A: Right, right. And if your papers aren't in order, it could be tough. You could be on your way to El Salvador in prison somewhere, whether you deserve it or not.
• 49:32
  Speaker D: I know we're laughing, man, but it's really horrible.
• 49:36
  Speaker A: Laughing to keep from crying.
• 49:37
  Speaker D: It's horrible what they're doing.
• 49:38
  Speaker A: But back to our guest, Mr. Darren Hill from the Red Rockers and Mr. Olie Sasson. Now, Olie, you're talking about your. Your film career. And. And I remember when I was still at Ben Franklin and walking next door and you were shooting. You were directing a commercial right there on. On Carlton Avenue, right next, like, in front of the. The Burger King or something. There probably a commercial for Burger King. It might have been. But I remember saying, oh, look at Oli. He's got a big, giant production.
• 50:08
  Speaker D: It's a Burger King commercial.
• 50:10
  Speaker A: Oh, it's. But, you know, it's like, oh, look, he's legit, man. Yeah. Yeah. And so that must have been, like 1981, I'm guessing.
• 50:17
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 50:17
  Speaker A: So at the same time, Red Rockers are their careers taking off. Your. You had the. The first record, which is very successful. Successful, you know, put you out on the road with a lot of. A lot of big international and national acts, you know, And. And then the second record comes out, and. And, you know, I guess they had the. The company had one idea of, like, what the COVID was going to be, and then you. They had this. They picked a single. Now, how did you. How did you. How Did Ole wind up directing that, that China video?
• 50:49
  Speaker D: Well, Darren, can I just ask you have a question?
• 50:52
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
• 50:53
  Speaker D: To set, get. Do the setup, though, on how you guys got signed and how it became a record, if you don't mind, because you guys, you guys took off. You guys went to, to the west coast, right?
• 51:04
  Speaker C: I think we probably covered this in the last. We had to leave New Orleans, you know, if we had any hopes of making it. So, yeah, we packed everything we owned in a truck and moved out to California, and we weren't coming back till we had a record deal. And we did it. We got. We got it.
• 51:26
  Speaker A: And indeed, 415 record.
• 51:30
  Speaker C: Yeah, it was 415. And, and then through them, Columbia Records signed us and, you know, I, they had high hopes for us. They really loved the record, and they probably spent our whole budget on Annie Leibowitz taking our album cover photos.
• 51:49
  Speaker D: So that's pretty big time.
• 51:51
  Speaker C: You know, MTV was just coming up and they wanted us to make a video, but they probably blew their budget. So luckily, Oli stepped up. And you want to take over from here and tell them, like, what happened?
• 52:05
  Speaker D: Well, I don't mind hearing your perspective of it, but, but I don't remember who it was exactly you or, or, or John or James. I mean, all of a sudden we were, we were, I was holding the album. You guys had already recorded the album.
• 52:21
  Speaker C: Yeah.
• 52:21
  Speaker D: Right. And I'm looking at it and I'm going, wow, man. And, and I don't even know how it came up, but maybe I said, you guys doing a video? He said, yeah, why don't we do it? We can do it. And I kind of felt like it was like a Andy Hardy movie or something, you know, like, let's put on a show. Put on a show. Exactly. You know, we don't have, we didn't have any money.
• 52:39
  Speaker A: Well, at that time, if you, if you think about mtv, they were starved for content. They didn't. There was not a ton of videos in existence then, so absolutely. If you, if you had one, you, you had a, A, a leg up in, in getting played. And if you had a good one with a, with a great song, you really had a good. You really had a good shot. So, so they had the great song. And then you, you talk about.
• 53:05
  Speaker D: I always. And I used to say this always, because I've directed probably over a little over 100 music videos in my career, but I always used to say, you know, good videos come from great songs.
• 53:19
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 53:19
  Speaker D: And China was a great song.
• 53:22
  Speaker A: Right.
• 53:22
  Speaker D: And just the imagery Just starts to flow when you hear a really good song, I mean, it inspires you, frankly, you know? And it did. And luckily for me, I knew these guys because they would. They would open for us when, as the Rat Finks, we were Sex Dog, right, at Jed's. And you guys weren't even old enough to get into a bar.
• 53:44
  Speaker C: No. You guys were like our big brothers. We used to joke about that.
• 53:48
  Speaker D: We did this video for absolutely no money from the record company. Because I called them to tell them I wanted to do the video. And I talked to somebody at cbs. I don't recall. They said, yeah, well, fine, you know, but if you can do whatever the hell you want, we're not giving you any money for it. And you only have, you know, X amount of time. I don't remember what it was, a month or two months or so to get something done. And that's how it started. So I just laid out my credit card and borrowed money from a guy who ran Mushroom Records at Tulane. And we did it.
• 54:18
  Speaker A: So it was all on spec.
• 54:20
  Speaker D: Totally on spec. And I called the lady up at cbs. You can jump anytime.
• 54:28
  Speaker C: I. I think her name was Shelly Sellover. Yeah, she was head of it. She was like the publicist out of Spinal Tap.
• 54:35
  Speaker A: Oh, okay.
• 54:36
  Speaker C: But she was put in charge of.
• 54:39
  Speaker D: As I recall, she had a New York accent.
• 54:42
  Speaker C: Yes, she was very New York.
• 54:44
  Speaker D: New Yorker. And she said. And she was on the phone, I said. And I called her, I said, okay, we got a video done. And she was like, silence. And she said, I'm going to come down there and I'm going to sit down and you're going to show me a video. And I better be you. You got a video? I said, yeah, we got a bit. We did it. All right, I'm coming down there. You better have something for me to look at. Because there was no way at that time to even send a file.
• 55:14
  Speaker A: Right, right, right.
• 55:14
  Speaker D: We shot it on 16 mil, 16 millimeter film. There was no Internet. There was none of that. So, sure enough, we got the thing set up at wys, the public television station, here with my friend Dave Landry, who was our drummer, right? And we set the thing up on the flatbed machine. She comes marching in. She doesn't say boo. She just said, okay, where am I going? She just, you know, typical, you know, executive type, you know, not going to be nice to us until she sees the product, you know. So she sits down, we hit play, and we're all standing behind her. There it is on the screen, on A flatbed. And she's just watching it. And this is before we could even do any of the video effects and turn it off. And she sits there for a second. She goes, I'm buying it.
• 56:04
  Speaker A: Oh, nice. Nice.
• 56:05
  Speaker D: I'm buying it.
• 56:07
  Speaker A: Well, I like that.
• 56:09
  Speaker B: You know something?
• 56:10
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah.
• 56:10
  Speaker D: Oh, yeah. I just want to say that started and launched my film career right there and then. That was the pivotal moment of my career right there.
• 56:21
  Speaker A: Nice.
• 56:22
  Speaker B: Wow.
• 56:22
  Speaker D: Because CBS called us, called me and my production company in New Orleans and started sending us out to where the bands were on the road.
• 56:33
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 56:33
  Speaker D: And we. We were doing. And then we went out to. They had me go out to la, and I'd never really been out there, so we go to Los Angeles on their dime. Even though it wasn't a whole lot of money, nonetheless, it was the Romantics.
• 56:49
  Speaker A: Oh, okay.
• 56:50
  Speaker D: And I was doing commercials here locally for ad agency here called Fitzgerald. And the guy at Fitzgerald, Joe Del Papa, one of my best friends ever. He was a beautiful guy. He was brilliant guy. He said, well, when you go out to la, you got to call this production company that I work with called Film Fair. They're out there. They do. And it was a big commercial production company. They had offices in la, Chicago, London, you know, Paris. I mean, it was huge. So I called him, said I was. Joe Del Papa, said to come and. Okay, they send a rep over to the set while we're shooting the Romantics video. They. He says nothing, just. I'll just sit over here. I'm okay. You want some water? Said, no, I'm fine. Just go ahead. Go do your job. I'm sitting here and watch. And he said nothing. And he's there for like 20, 30 minutes. And then he gets up to leave. He comes over, he says, here, just call us before you leave la. And I call and that was it. And I called the dude and he said. And I said, okay, you know, go over there. And they said, I mean, I'm sitting down from like, 10 minutes, introduced me, they're bringing me water, Coke, whatever I want, you know. And they, you know, like a special guest or something. I said, yeah. They said, well, how would you like to move to Los Angeles? I said, well, I don't know. I never thought about it. He said, well, I'll tell you what, you know, it's kind of like, because I was naive about it, they. Maybe they thought I was playing hard to get, okay. But I really just didn't know. I said, no, I don't know. I might, you know, and they were like, well, how about we pay you.
• 58:27
  Speaker A: To move to LA to sweeten the pot for you?
• 58:30
  Speaker D: I said, oh, okay, you pay. Yeah, that's okay. That sounds pretty good. How's 2500 sound? I said, oh yeah, that'll cover it. Okay. And I'm not showing too much excitement. And I said, well. And I'm just kind of quietly sitting there, you know. And they said, well, tell you what. And they go talk and then they come, come back. We, we'll pay you, we'll put you on a retainer. We'll pay you $4,000 a month whether you work or not.
• 58:56
  Speaker A: Okay?
• 58:56
  Speaker B: Oh sweet.
• 58:57
  Speaker D: I said, okay, well I'm moving to. I guess I'm moving to la.
• 59:00
  Speaker B: And that's when the drug habit started.
• 59:01
  Speaker D: That's when it all started. Everything went downhill from there.
• 59:04
  Speaker A: Now the Romantics, was that when you're talking in your sleep, was that the video?
• 59:10
  Speaker D: It was called One in a Million. Yeah, that one.
• 59:14
  Speaker A: I remember that band. That was a band that had the, the drummer was the singer.
• 59:17
  Speaker D: Right.
• 59:19
  Speaker B: What I like about you, the Romantics. What I like.
• 59:22
  Speaker D: Yeah, that's what I like about you.
• 59:24
  Speaker B: Now you said that great song, makes a great video. I don't agree. I've seen many great songs with really bad videos.
• 59:31
  Speaker D: Well, I'm just talking about personally because I, I haven't made great videos either, man, because some of the songs were.
• 59:37
  Speaker B: But, but I did make great. But the videos were just awesome.
• 59:41
  Speaker D: But other than, other than the Red Rockers, China, I did broken wings for Mr. Mr.
• 59:47
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 59:47
  Speaker D: That black and white video. And that turned out to be an award nominated award.
• 59:53
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 59:53
  Speaker D: Once again the song, man, you know, inspiration. You know Darren, you get inspiration from wherever, wherever you can get it. You get it and you take it. You know.
• 1:00:03
  Speaker A: Now I remember the China video. The most memorable part to me is, is the beautiful John Thomas Griffith. He's kind of coming down a. And we were looking at a video of the making of China today. And you see John there and his fresh faced, young, handsome form. We were all young. We were all young. Yeah, we were all a lot prettier then. But he's kind of coming down a market kind of market scene and he's kind of doing the new wave dance from side to side.
• 1:00:35
  Speaker D: You know, Pirates Alley.
• 1:00:37
  Speaker C: Pirates Alley, yeah. China.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker A: Right, right. So it's, it's. I could remember like it's yesterday, man. That's. And, and that was a. Again, that was. There was so little content on, on MTV or. I mean maybe it's just because this was super popular, but it played, like, on repeat.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker C: Yeah. Because again, like you said, they didn't have that much content, so, I mean, it was literally like on a loop.
• 1:01:01
  Speaker A: Right.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker D: It's crazy, but it was a great song, man. But it's a great song. Memorable tune. I mean, the tune, it just. It was.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker C: It made us.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker D: It really. It had a hook. It was. It was catchy. It was beautiful, melodic lyrical. Melodic. I mean, I'm not. I mean, I'm. I'm telling you the truth. It was a really great song, man.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker A: So. So that. That winds up catapulting y'all into this whole other level where you're out there touring with you two and the Kinks, you know, all these. All these people. It's. It was crazy.
• 1:01:33
  Speaker C: And then you did our second video, too.
• 1:01:36
  Speaker D: Yeah, so.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker A: So, yes, on the. On the. At the same time, like, I guess the record company was so happy with. With China and. And China. Like, you're saying you did it on spec, but you did, like, all the storyboards yourself. Everything was all in house. That was all. You know, you had control over all of it completely.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker B: So.
• 1:01:53
  Speaker D: Well, with me and the band, I mean, we talked about it. We all. We all commiserated, you know, about ideas and. And. And what do you think of this? Or what do you think of that? Oh, that's cool, man. You know, and I remember talking to you, and I'm sure it was you and John, everybody about, hey, what about we get some school kids, you know, to come dance alongside, you know, And.
• 1:02:11
  Speaker C: I'm trying to remember, where did you find those kids?
• 1:02:14
  Speaker D: And New Orleans, their mothers.
• 1:02:16
  Speaker C: You can see them on the. On the side, like, New Orleans East.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 1:02:20
  Speaker D: The Viet. Vietnam. The Vietnamese community out New Orleans east.
• 1:02:25
  Speaker A: And still a powerful community out there.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker D: Oh, God. Yeah. They're well entrenched there, hard working, you know, very successful people that were, you know, brought over because of the Vietnam War.
• 1:02:37
  Speaker A: Essentially a great addition to our community.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker D: We called. I think my. Actually my mother or somebody said, well, you. You want to get. You want to get some kids in? Call. Call the schools and the churches, right? And we started making phone calls to. To them and. And they.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker B: They couldn't do that today, though, because they'd wanted to, you know.
• 1:02:56
  Speaker D: Oh, no. I mean, yeah, you're right. But they just said, oh, that's. Oh, that sounds beautiful. That sounds beautiful. Really? My kid's gonna be in a. On film and tv, whatever. Yeah, yeah, they're gonna be. We're shooting a film and they're Gonna be in it.
• 1:03:08
  Speaker B: Sign this waiver.
• 1:03:09
  Speaker D: Yeah. And they. Yeah, well, they had to. Everybody did.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker A: Sure.
• 1:03:14
  Speaker D: You know, that was. That was the way the business was run.
• 1:03:16
  Speaker A: But, yeah, well, and so it's interesting so that, again, the fact that this is, like, the pivotal point in your career that launches you into this whole thing where you wind up having this huge, not just commercial career and video director career, but television and movies and all. And, you know, I have so much to talk to you about, but maybe we don't have time to get into all of it, but I am interested in the Roger Corman part because I'm always fascinated by the. The. This kind of underbelly of. Of showbiz, you know, so can. Can you give us any. Any pearls of, you know, like, interest on that subject of. Of this. This 1994 production of Fantastic Four?
• 1:04:03
  Speaker D: Yeah, well, the Fantastic Four. Well, you know, and just the lead up to that was I directed 100 videos, you know, and I became friends with. Who are. These guys are still very. They're very big directors now. David Fincher and Michael Bay, we were all doing videos at the same time. And. And that. That's. We can save that for another story. But they're both great guys. I mean, really, I've got to be pretty good friends with Fincher at the time. And then another girl who was producing for me by the. All. All my videos, she was producing all the videos with me. It was Cali Corey, who was sitting at a. At a old computer in the office, working. After we'd leave, I said, what are you doing, Kelly? She's, well, I'm working on the script. I got to get this thing done. I just. Just got to get this thing done, so. Okay, cool. Didn't think about it. You know, she's working on it. Working on it. Six months later, she's got the script. I said, and she. And she's pulling the paper off of the printer. It's like dot matrix, you know, with the perforated pages. And she puts it together and she staples it all together. And she says, olie, do me a favor. Read this, would you, please? I'd love to hear what you think. And I read the script, and I said, callie, it's frickin great. This is a great script. She goes, you think so? Really? I said, hell, yeah. So one thing led to the next. You gave it to this person, who gave it to that person. They got the movie made. The movie was Thelma and Louise, and she won an Academy Award.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker A: All right, well, you were right.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker D: First screenplay.
• 1:05:35
  Speaker A: Yeah. Okay. Well, that's.
• 1:05:36
  Speaker D: Anyway, and that led up to me.
• 1:05:37
  Speaker B: She hasn't worked since.
• 1:05:39
  Speaker D: I don't know. She did. Well, she did. No, she did the series. The TV show Nashville.
• 1:05:44
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 1:05:45
  Speaker D: She wrote and created that. Among other things, but.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker A: Right, right.
• 1:05:48
  Speaker D: She was great. Really great. Love.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker B: That's Hollywood, baby. Early as, you just.
• 1:05:52
  Speaker D: Yeah. You never know when the work and.
• 1:05:54
  Speaker B: You win an award and then you're out of work.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker D: Well, you're right. A lot of people regret that they've won big awards.
• 1:06:01
  Speaker B: To an apartment in Venice. Exactly.
• 1:06:04
  Speaker D: Yeah. I've heard stories where the people use the Academy Award for a doorstop.
• 1:06:08
  Speaker A: Sure. Yeah, sure.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker D: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's a blessing and a curse. But then.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker A: So you got involved in this Corman.
• 1:06:16
  Speaker D: Well, I. Then I wrote up a film that got made. Co wrote it with a friend of mine who I met at uno who became a big television writer. Producer. Matt Williams. He did. He created Roseanne and he created Home Improvement. Okay, so.
• 1:06:34
  Speaker B: Well, Roseanne and Tim Allen created those shows. He just.
• 1:06:38
  Speaker D: Well, well, yeah, that's true. Well, you know, but he had to. He had to take what they created and turn it into a. Into the.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker D: To a telephone for television. For sitcom.
• 1:06:48
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker D: Because he was writing for the Cosby show, you know, as a staff writer. But he. We met at the UNO in theater, so we got that done.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker B: And he was writing plea deals for Cosby, wasn't he, too?
• 1:07:01
  Speaker D: He's what? Anyway, look, everybody I know that's done what they've done, including myself. It's. And you guys know, I mean, it's hard work. You work, and it's very competitive. And believe me, if you. If you. If you're not up in the morning working on something out there, you're left behind. You just.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker A: Somebody else is.
• 1:07:21
  Speaker D: 20 freaking years of my life every single day.
• 1:07:24
  Speaker A: See, unlike New Orleans.
• 1:07:26
  Speaker D: Focus, focus, focus, focus.
• 1:07:28
  Speaker B: Nobody works.
• 1:07:29
  Speaker A: Unlike New Orleans, where if you get up and you do one thing in the day, you're ahead of everybody else.
• 1:07:35
  Speaker C: Look, that's all right.
• 1:07:36
  Speaker D: That's part of the charm, you know, but that's just that business. That's, you know, look, anyway, when you.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker A: Laugh, you gotta laugh at the mic, man. Every time you laugh, you pull a mic away from your face.
• 1:07:52
  Speaker B: Well, now.
• 1:07:53
  Speaker A: Now. Sorry.
• 1:07:55
  Speaker D: So then I go. I go to my manager, says, look, you know, we get. Get your movie right now because everybody out there has to have a feature. And, you know, Steven Soderbergh is from Baton Rouge.
• 1:08:06
  Speaker A: Right.
• 1:08:06
  Speaker D: You know, auteur, though he wrote Something that really took off. And I got to be friends with Stephen and he was talking about it, you know, and after he won the Palm Door, he had freaking no idea that the movie was going to do any business at all, much less win the highest award at, you know, at Cannes. But, you know, I kept struggling with that thing. And I still, to this day, you know, I've written a few movies that got made, but there weren't those big breakout movies. You know, if you want something to happen, it seemed like in a music business, right, Darren? I mean, if you want to hit it, you got to have a hit.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 1:08:40
  Speaker C: Oh, yeah.
• 1:08:40
  Speaker D: A hit is a hit, you know, whether it's a film or a song.
• 1:08:45
  Speaker B: But movies and music, I mean, you probably experienced. You had a hit with China here, but maybe China wasn't big in South America, maybe it wasn't big in Europe. Like, films are like. Some American films are hits in Europe. Like A Weekend at Bernie's.
• 1:09:01
  Speaker C: Right, Right.
• 1:09:01
  Speaker B: I mean, huge hit in Europe.
• 1:09:03
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 1:09:03
  Speaker B: Here in the States they called it, you know, everything from. To, you know, you know, so it all goes, you know. You know.
• 1:09:13
  Speaker D: Yeah. So, you know, my manager says, you know, I can get you a gig with Roger Corman. And I knew who Roger Corman was from being in the movie business. He gave that first job to Francis Coppola, to Martin Scorsese, James Cameron, Spielberg. Spielberg didn't do a movie. Gale Anne Hurd. I mean, Ron Howard. Ron Howard.
• 1:09:36
  Speaker A: Right, right, right.
• 1:09:37
  Speaker D: And it's interesting because out of that group of people we just mentioned, I got to be. I met James Cameron because he was directing a video for Bill Paxton, because Bill Paxton was in a band called Martini Ranch. And they used our production company in LA to produce the production company I was working with, they used that company to produce the video with James Cameron and Bill Paxton. So I got to be friends with Bill Paxton and then he agreed to do a short film with me. So I did my first short film. And then that short film called the Roommate was shown to some people in town and Roger Corman said, okay, hey, you want to come make a movie for me, you're welcome. And I. My first movie was with Richard Roundtree, who was the original Shaft.
• 1:10:27
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Tremendous.
• 1:10:29
  Speaker D: Yeah. And he was so damn good.
• 1:10:32
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 1:10:33
  Speaker D: And man, he was great to work with, and went. And it was a prison film and it took place in one location, a prison. So it. And that sounded redundant, but the point is, when you have an 18 day shooting schedule and you don't have to move the circus. And you're in one location. It gives you more time to make the movie.
• 1:10:55
  Speaker A: Right, right, right.
• 1:10:56
  Speaker D: And the script was really good because one of the script writers did eight years in prison for bank robbery.
• 1:11:02
  Speaker A: Okay. So he knew the subject.
• 1:11:04
  Speaker D: Oh, it was the real deal, man. So that movie did really well. So then I made a couple more movies for Roger. And then Roger calls me out of the blue and says. And he had an interesting way of speaking, you know, rest in peace, Roger. But he said, oh, Lehi, it's Roger. Would you like to do a movie based on the comic, the Fantastic Four? And I went, fuck, yeah. And because I was a big. I was a comic book kid, you know, and Marvel was the comics that I loved. I love Spider man first and foremost, but Fantastic Four was right up there. So I said, yeah, I'm gonna do the movie, man. Let's go do the movie. Of course, no money. I mean, and we, but we made a good movie. And we come to find out after we make this movie, we go through all of these machinations of making the film. And I'm not going to get into all the gory details. Roger's getting ready to released the film at the Mall of the Americas. And we're all excited. Yeah, we're having a movie. All right. It's going out and then at the last minute, they pull the plug. We're like, what the fuck happened? Roger calls me on the phone. I'm never forgetting. I'm on San Vicente Boulevard in la. It's Roger. I'm sorry, we're not going to be able to reach the film. They paid me an extra million dollars not to release it. Thank you for making a good film.
• 1:12:25
  Speaker A: Click.
• 1:12:27
  Speaker C: That was it.
• 1:12:27
  Speaker A: It got buried. It got buried. Yeah. All right.
• 1:12:31
  Speaker D: But what the happened? Well, turns out, and now it's known all over the Marvel Universe and the rest of the universe that the film was just made for contractual obligation to the production company that own the rights to the Fantastic Four. They had it in their contract with Marvel to make a movie about the Fantastic Four.
• 1:12:51
  Speaker B: Before been a 10 minute movie. It could have been.
• 1:12:53
  Speaker D: Yeah, well, anything. Just get it into production. Because we started the production in December, at the end of that year.
• 1:13:04
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 1:13:04
  Speaker D: But finished it in January of next year. Yeah, but they. So but they satisfied the contractual obligation to keep the rights. Yeah, but we didn't know that.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker A: Right.
• 1:13:16
  Speaker D: We thought we were everybody, the cast crew. We thought we were just making a movie.
• 1:13:20
  Speaker B: Do you own a print of it? Do you have a print?
• 1:13:22
  Speaker D: They would never give Us a print? No, but it got bootlegged, so it's out there. And for years it's been horrible because it's been VHS to VHS to vhs. But somebody with the new technology with AI and such cleaned up the print and it's pristine and it looks freaking fabulous. And I'm not blowing smoke or. Okay, making its up every just nine out of 10, I'd say 95% to 98% of the fantastic Four. Marvel fans like our movie better than all of the other movies they've made up to now.
• 1:14:01
  Speaker A: Wow.
• 1:14:02
  Speaker D: And there's a new one coming out now this summer. But I'm not kidding, if you go online and you just type In Roger Corman 1994 Fantastic Four movie, you'll see the clips of the film and became such a big deal that the casting director and another guy made a documentary about what happened to us.
• 1:14:22
  Speaker A: Right, right. What's that called?
• 1:14:24
  Speaker D: That movie's called Doomed.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker A: Yes.
• 1:14:26
  Speaker D: And that. That movie right now is on Amazon.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker A: Okay.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker D: On Prime Video.
• 1:14:31
  Speaker A: All right. I might have to put a link to that in the. The show notes of this show.
• 1:14:35
  Speaker D: Yeah. I mean, it's. It's a nutty story.
• 1:14:38
  Speaker A: I love that.
• 1:14:39
  Speaker D: Here we are 30 years later, and people are still talking about our movie.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker A: So cool.
• 1:14:46
  Speaker D: Our movie they're still talking about.
• 1:14:47
  Speaker C: It's like an underground cult classic.
• 1:14:49
  Speaker D: It's a cult film, man. I get caught.
• 1:14:51
  Speaker C: Any.
• 1:14:52
  Speaker B: Anybody in the film that's now still relevant, you know, any actor.
• 1:14:55
  Speaker D: Well, look, I think all these guys are. And, well, there's the other thing. I still work everybody in the film where all the cast members. And this is totally unheard of in la. We're like a family.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 1:15:10
  Speaker D: We are so close to one another to this day.
• 1:15:12
  Speaker A: It's like me and Manny.
• 1:15:14
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 1:15:14
  Speaker A: Just kidding.
• 1:15:15
  Speaker D: But I'm just telling you, man, get.
• 1:15:17
  Speaker A: A rise out of what happened to us.
• 1:15:19
  Speaker D: Just, just, just melded a relationship with us, like, like our brothers and sisters. Like, how dare they come with our family.
• 1:15:26
  Speaker A: Right, right, right.
• 1:15:28
  Speaker D: You know, and anyway, it was Joseph Culp, whose dad was Robert C. Robert C. Oh.
• 1:15:35
  Speaker B: I went to school with a daughter, Rebecca, and. With Robert C. Yeah, with Robert.
• 1:15:41
  Speaker D: The one that's got to be a sister.
• 1:15:43
  Speaker B: I went to high school with Rebecca.
• 1:15:46
  Speaker D: Dude. Joe's.
• 1:15:47
  Speaker B: He's got around. Let me just tell you that.
• 1:15:49
  Speaker A: Yeah, well, you know.
• 1:15:50
  Speaker D: Well, she was tall. Glass.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker A: Glass of water. Okay.
• 1:15:54
  Speaker D: And the other, the guy, the guy who played Breed Richards. Alex Hyde White. His dad is Wilfred Hyde White, the English actor who's in the musical My Fair lady with Rex Harrison. Oh, yeah. Anyway, he's done a lot. You'd recognize me if you saw him. But anyway, that's. Check out the documentary Doom. That'll tell you everything you need to know about what happened to us.
• 1:16:17
  Speaker A: Fascinating story.
• 1:16:18
  Speaker D: I became really good friends with Stan Lee. And I used to go up to the Marvel office of his. His office on Wilshire Boulevard near Westwood. And I'd go hang out with Stan Lee. And this is before all the big Marvel movies came out. And he pulled out a comic book called the Femazons. That was an unpublished Stanley Jack Kirby comic. And he said, here, check this out. I said, wow, this is cool, man. This is like. Like it's kind of like a Xena thing where women ruled the earth. And I said, what do I do with it? He says, well, I don't know. Well, let's do something with it, man. I said. So we went and got meetings. I called my agent and my manager and said, we have to look, man, I got this Stan Lee comic and they set up meetings for us at Paramount, Universal, Warner Brothers Television. And I went to meetings. Stan Lee and me went to meetings to all these fucking studios and not one of them picked up the fucking idea to make it into a TV show. And Stan and I would go to a restaurant and Westwood and Stan Lee would be sitting at the table with me complaining about how come nobody wants to make my stuff into a big movie or TV show. He was bemoaning that to me, right? And we're trying to get his comic book made into a. A TV show. And these out there, didn't they. Didn't, you know, they just wanted to meet Stan. Oh, we're so happy to meet you, Stan. Can I. You. You need something? You want. Get you a coffee, a little cup? You want some water, you know. No, you, man. We want to make a TV show.
• 1:17:53
  Speaker A: Right. Well, they finally caught up with.
• 1:17:56
  Speaker B: Now they've made so much Marvel bull crap last 20 years. It's unwatchable, this stuff.
• 1:18:02
  Speaker D: Well, some of it is not too.
• 1:18:03
  Speaker B: Good, I have to say.
• 1:18:05
  Speaker D: It's hard for me to say.
• 1:18:06
  Speaker B: Restaurant in Westwood, was it? Mustache Cafe? You said you had a restaurant. You were a one of those.
• 1:18:13
  Speaker D: It was. Right. What's the other street that goes in there? Westwood and Gaylord.
• 1:18:18
  Speaker B: Yeah, Gaylord and Rayburn, right on the corner there. So you're probably at the Mustache Building. Oh, the brick building.
• 1:18:23
  Speaker D: Yes, all brick on the corner. There's a restaurant right across the street.
• 1:18:27
  Speaker B: From the Village Theater.
• 1:18:28
  Speaker D: Yeah, that's where we used to go with Stan.
• 1:18:30
  Speaker B: Yeah, that's an Italian place.
• 1:18:32
  Speaker D: His office, if I'm not mistaken, was in the Oppenheimer Building on Welsh.
• 1:18:37
  Speaker B: That's why they didn't want to make his film. Anyway, speak to this other guy.
• 1:18:45
  Speaker A: So we're right on the. The down slope of the podcast. And I'm. But, Darren, I'm so excited about, you know, if. I don't know if you recall, last year, it was a Saturday night again that, that, that, that the. The first Red Rockers reunion happened, and someone called me for a gig that night and I turned them down. And this year, the same thing happened. I turned him down. I was like, no, I have somewhere I have to be that night, man.
• 1:19:10
  Speaker C: There's no greater honor than that. Turned down a gig. Can you believe it?
• 1:19:14
  Speaker A: I know, I know. Sacrilege. Right now. I just love to play, man. That's it. I don't care about money. I'm not doing this for money. Clearly.
• 1:19:25
  Speaker D: Thank you.
• 1:19:26
  Speaker A: But. But, man, I'm so excited. And, you know, my thought is that, well, a lot of people came last year and had a blast, and they're all going to come back. And then there's a lot of other people that couldn't come last year and they heard about what a great time they missed, and they're all going to come if they can.
• 1:19:42
  Speaker C: Yeah, it's going to be a great night. It really is.
• 1:19:45
  Speaker A: Yeah, man. And you know.
• 1:19:47
  Speaker D: Yeah, last year was great.
• 1:19:49
  Speaker A: Oh, yeah. You were there. Okay. Yeah, I was there. It was.
• 1:19:52
  Speaker B: I wasn't there.
• 1:19:53
  Speaker A: Tremendous. No, no. Well, you won't be there again, right?
• 1:19:55
  Speaker B: No, I'm not going unless I get on the guest list.
• 1:19:57
  Speaker A: Well, I think we might be swing.
• 1:19:59
  Speaker B: That, you know, can you put me plus nine? I only go if you put me plus nine.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker C: Nine?
• 1:20:05
  Speaker B: Yeah, nine.
• 1:20:06
  Speaker A: He doesn't have nine friends. He'll just find nine people out on.
• 1:20:09
  Speaker B: The street to bring, like this guy right there.
• 1:20:11
  Speaker A: Yeah, just that glue head sitting out in front tonight.
• 1:20:15
  Speaker B: It's gonna be. I will, but.
• 1:20:22
  Speaker C: You got it, Manny.
• 1:20:23
  Speaker B: All right, thank you.
• 1:20:25
  Speaker A: Darren's a soft touch, man. Well, I know this. This was originally scheduled for November of this year.
• 1:20:34
  Speaker C: Yes.
• 1:20:35
  Speaker A: And then. And. But. But then I think you thought, well, I'm not sure how this election is going to turn out. It might be a good idea. Tough season. Speaking of blue heads, here we go. There he is. There's your. There's your guest. Manny, there's your plus, plus nine.
• 1:20:55
  Speaker B: Oh, I'll be there. You. I guarantee.
• 1:20:57
  Speaker A: And anyway, so you thought Better of you thought, let's see, maybe reassessed it. Whatever happens, it'll maybe die down by then. Well, it shows you how wrong you were.
• 1:21:09
  Speaker C: How wrong I was.
• 1:21:11
  Speaker A: In fact, I heard that there was rumors swirling that there were going to be protests outside of Tipatinas. I don't know where that came from, but. But that's not true. That's.
• 1:21:22
  Speaker C: No, that's not true.
• 1:21:23
  Speaker A: Not true. It's gonna be all rock and roll.
• 1:21:28
  Speaker C: I think that was antifa.
• 1:21:29
  Speaker A: That. Oh, okay.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker B: All right.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker D: Yeah.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker A: You know, you see, you gotta watch this as troublemakers all around, man. But. But that night. It's gonna be great.
• 1:21:37
  Speaker C: It's gonna be so good. And we have two great opening acts from. Yes, actually were on bills with us in 1982.
• 1:21:45
  Speaker A: So, you know, we had. We had since. Since the time you were on, actually. Because I saw him. Brad Ozgeron, saw him perform at. At the Red Rockers reunion. I was like, I gotta get this guy on, man. He came on. He was great. I mean, he came on with Damien Youth and. But. So he's performing with the contenders, I imagine. And then.
• 1:22:08
  Speaker C: And Mike Saravola, who was in the Models, the contenders. But he. He's the CEO of Schecter Guitars.
• 1:22:16
  Speaker A: Oh, is he.
• 1:22:17
  Speaker B: Oh, dude.
• 1:22:18
  Speaker D: Is he gonna be there Saturday? Yeah, that cat, man. Is he still with Schecter? Is he still. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God.
• 1:22:29
  Speaker A: So, man.
• 1:22:30
  Speaker D: Oh, that's so cool.
• 1:22:32
  Speaker A: It's gonna be a hell of a night, people.
• 1:22:33
  Speaker C: It is.
• 1:22:34
  Speaker A: This will come out after that. So we're not actually promoing it.
• 1:22:37
  Speaker C: Yeah, well, you. You losers. You missed it.
• 1:22:40
  Speaker A: If you weren't there. You missed it.
• 1:22:42
  Speaker B: You missed it. Yeah, well, all right. I think we've got a show.
• 1:22:44
  Speaker D: Yeah, well, this time, don't miss it.
• 1:22:46
  Speaker B: That's right.
• 1:22:47
  Speaker C: Yeah, well, and we're gonna have Manny here.
• 1:22:49
  Speaker B: Yeah.
• 1:22:52
  Speaker A: Plus nine glue heads.
• 1:22:55
  Speaker C: We're doing a small tribute to David Johansson, too.
• 1:22:59
  Speaker A: Yes. We lost David Johansson. I know you were good for friends with David. And, man, I. When. When. When he passed, I went back and listened to that first Dolls record and. Holy, man.
• 1:23:13
  Speaker C: Holy is right.
• 1:23:14
  Speaker A: The. The guitar tones on that record, this, the songs, everything is so powerful, you know?
• 1:23:20
  Speaker B: He'll always be Buster Poindexter to me. Sure will be. I understand other stuff, like, you know, whatever, but he'll always.
• 1:23:28
  Speaker A: He could take her.
• 1:23:29
  Speaker D: Le know very well. You knew him, Darren? Yeah, Yeah.
• 1:23:32
  Speaker C: I managed David Johansson for 12 years, and then dude did the Dolls reunion. Yeah.
• 1:23:39
  Speaker B: Wow.
• 1:23:39
  Speaker A: Yeah, he facilitated all that stuff, man. All that. That. The. The Meltdown Festival performance and. And the subs.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker D: I tried to do one of the videos for him for the song called Hot, Hot, Hot.
• 1:23:53
  Speaker A: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:23:54
  Speaker B: Buster.
• 1:23:54
  Speaker D: That was. That was his.
• 1:23:55
  Speaker C: That was his big hit.
• 1:23:56
  Speaker D: Big hit. Yeah.
• 1:23:57
  Speaker C: He had done that. Yeah, I tried.
• 1:23:59
  Speaker B: I saw him at the Buster. I saw Buster the Greek Theater in la, and Gilbert Gottfried opened for him. You talk about a great double bill.
• 1:24:08
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 1:24:09
  Speaker B: Wow. Open for Buster at the Greek Theater in la. One of the best shows I've ever seen in my life.
• 1:24:17
  Speaker A: Wow.
• 1:24:17
  Speaker B: Really? Gilbert was, you know, Gilbert, sure. And then. And Buster came out and he would talk between songs and this one fucking woman. Because I got great seats in the orchestra and all that. This one woman's like going, why don't you start singing? He's like. And pissed him off big time. I'm doing my gig here. I'm doing my act. And he railed into her big time. And then he went into a song, and this last song, he walked into the audience and he walked by that woman who was giving him shit. He went like this.
• 1:24:50
  Speaker A: Shook his fist in the face.
• 1:24:51
  Speaker B: I'm gonna punch you the face, bitch. Was brilliant. It was brilliant. But, yeah, it was a good show. Anyway, we gotta go. Well, I've gotta go find nine people.
• 1:25:03
  Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Nine. Nine people you can pretend to be friends with. Thank you so much, Darren and Oli. This has been tremendous, man. My life is really coming full circle here. It's all coming together.
• 1:25:15
  Speaker D: Thank you, man.
• 1:25:16
  Speaker A: And. And as always on the Troubled Men podcast, we like to say trouble never.
• 1:25:20
  Speaker B: Ends, but the struggle continues. Good night.
• 1:25:23
  Speaker A: Good night.
• 1:25:24
  Speaker E: Danced with wind and danced with fire Killed the truth and called the liar Leaving in its mystery and the moon began to fall Dreamers are not all they seem Sleeping in her silent dream she walks it all inside it hides it all away China China Is that the way you always be? China China Questions rise my hand begins to call Called you right and called you wrong Time shadow Saint your soul don't lock it all inside and hide it all away Come on. And is that the way it will always be? Walk us through China.
• 1:28:27
  Speaker D: Walking FL.
• 1:28:45
  Speaker E: Join.