Latest / Hunger & Thirst / Revival Isn't What You Think It Is - Ep. 3

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Revival Isn't What You Think It Is - Ep. 3 · Hunger & Thirst

• H&T: Welcome back, everyone, to another episode of the Hunger and Thirst Podcast. I'm your host, Joshua. Joining me again today on the podcast is our lead pastor, Pastor Jeff. Hey, glad to be here. Can we have a fun conversation for today? It's gonna be a good one. And last week was so much fun. The last time we talked about the Noah's Ark scans, lot of fun developments there and just really enjoy chatting with you about it and learning as well. So hope people check that out. but yeah, very different topic for today. A hundred percent. Yeah. So I'm in a different direction today. So absolutely. I kept it broad for a reason. just something weighing on me as far as things that I notice. today we're gonna be talking about revival. Dude. Such a broad topic, but something that really need to be addressed because I've heard a lot of people say that, you know, today we're in a revival. We're talking about, you know, tent revivals, all the fun stuff. So fun topic to jump into. It's such a personal topic for me because it goes all the way. All this started back in my childhood. And as you're listening along, you're probably starting to notice a pattern where I have this c misconception, not really misconception per se, but I have this image in my mind of how I was raised through Christianity and, you know, specific denomination. And it's as I'm reading the Bible now, all of these things are kind of taking shape. Think it's more like a nostalgic thing. You watch T V shows or movies when you're a kid and then you grow up and you're just like, Airbud doesn't hold up like it used to. I mean, Airbud's great. I don't know what we're talking about. It's fantastic. I still cry every time. I have two golden retrievers, so it is the best movie. I don't care what Toy Story is actually the best childhood movie. That's not a debate. No, here they were there. But d the topic of revival, when I was a kid, it meant You know, people coming in from out of town, you know, pastor friends visiting or even staying with us in our house. And then I would get extra coloring books and we'd have Taco Bell at 10 30 for a week straight. That was revival. It's just a lot of church all week. And then, you know, by the end of it, everybody's all revved up, ready to go. But I feel it's taken so much of a different shape nowadays of that was 90s, early 2000s revivals. Now I'm hearing it. mention you know revival the term the word itself mentioned in songs mentioned you know in news stories and things of that nature just different generations so yeah it's really hard to understand you know what actually is revival what does that mean? Yeah no excellent question so I think this is where we got to kind of clarify a few things. So like what you're talking about is revival used in the terms of like an event but Revival itself is not actually an event. Revival is an outcome. Right. And so we'll see like tent revivals where they're gonna get together and they're gonna have, you know, like you said, seven days, and we're gonna have worship and pastors, and and really what the goal there is, is to begin a revival, right? That the revival's not the event, that's us gathering together, that is us making room for the Holy Spirit to do what only the Holy Spirit can do. But revival itself is just when God reaches the masses, and so. I heard it said like this that God is continually saving people, convicting Christians, strengthening believers, and transforming lives, right? Revival is when God does those same things among many people at once. And so it's not that it's it's a certain event. Revival is really the things that take place, what the Holy Spirit is doing. And so we can have something like a tent revival or a revival meeting, but in reality, the meeting isn't the revival, it's just making way for the revival to come. And so I think it was yeah, on gutquestions.org, they said revival refers to spiritual reawakening from a state of dormancy or stagnation in the life of a believer. And so that's one of those one of the things the goal of the revival is to bring us is specifically about Christians. So revival is for Christians, spiritual awakening is for like new believers or unbelievers coming to faith. And so revival is really about bringing people back into a boldness for the Lord. And one of the things that we see happen is Whenever a a revival starts, it may start in a small group or it may start at a at a tent meeting, it may start in a church. but then it grows from there. Like when the Holy Spirit starts to move and when s when Christians are strengthened, they naturally start reaching more and more people. And so it begins to grow. It's almost like the, you know, the avalanche effect, right? Like it it it may start small, but it or the snowball effect, that's what Dave Ramsey says. And so it's like it may start small, but it continues to build upon itself over and over and over again as people are getting more. on fire for Christ. And if you're on fire for Christ, you're gonna start reaching people. That's one of the prerequisites of following Jesus and obeying Jesus is to reach more and more people. And so revival works in the same way. When people get on fire for God, more and more people get brought in. And so it just snowballs and gets larger as it grows. Yeah. That's such a fascinating concept. It feels like I mean, do we still see this nowadays? Like I can't remember the last time I saw a tent revival. Like I've heard my uncle write about it in his book. And you know, that he was healed at one of those or, you know, prophesied over. I feel like those, you know, we even talked about this on the the first episode of the podcast of like things feel different now as far as I hear my parents' story and the stories of the elders talking about, you know, we had this revival breakout. And I'm just like, I don't know when I'd have time for a revival. Like is that a Sunday? Like can we just have them on Sundays? Like how does this work? Because I want how it works. I want all those things to happen. Because it's just, you know, and I've even been around them. Even as a kid, you still see like these things break out and people just becoming overwhelmed with the Holy Spirit and Holy Ghost, as they like to say, and still not quite sure what all that means. But that's another topic for another day, possibly. A whole whole episode on the Holy Spirit. That could be good. Yeah. but yeah, it's it's one of those things of Are we so busy now that revivals are just not gonna happen period or not gonna happen like they used to? Is that happening now? Yeah. So it actually is so kind of talking about like a tent revival. That like those still happen all over the place. That's very denominational. certain denominations have tent revivals and then and it's a really big thing. I've been to one tent revival my entire life, and that was last year I was preaching at it. Nice. and so like I was invited to preach revival, which I thought was awesome because I've only ever heard about I've never been at one. but yeah, so I got to go preach one. So they're definitely still happening. Now, do we actually see revival? And so whenever I'm thinking of revival, there's a lot of examples in scripture. But I like to think of Pentecost as like the main one, you know. Yep. the Holy Spirit comes, Peter goes out, he preaches a message, three thousand people get saved. They hear the word of God in all their own languages, and there's like, you know, tongues of fire. you know, like it that's what I think of when I think of revival. Yeah. Is this I'm here for that. That sounds cool. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I mean, speaking of so in in twenty twenty three, I mean as recent as twenty twenty three, a revival broke out at Asbury, I think it's Asbury Bible College. True. and and like the crazy thing is it was nothing dramatic. And and if you look at revivals over the years, it it's very rare that you have like a a mega pastor come up and you have the worship band and everybody's just like they're they're top tier, you know. It it normally, like at least what I've seen historically speaking. It is just people that are overcome with the Holy Spirit. And so in Asbury in 2023, it was they were having chapel. Like I mean, they're their weekly chapel. They do this all the time, right? they go, they go sit, they're they're in chapel. The someone gives a message. I watched the message. I mean, the guy was an okay speaker, but like not to the level of what happens, you know, is only God. And pretty much the students just didn't leave. Chapel ended, they didn't leave. They stayed, they prayed. They confess, they started confessing their sins. They prayed for each other. Someone grabbed a guitar, got up, started worshiping. Let's go. And it this went on. They canceled classes for like two weeks straight to make room for this revival that was taking place. Because everyone was just gathering. People were coming from all over. I mean, people came from out of the country to go to Asbury for this revival in twenty twenty three. And like they were coming from all over to go experience what's happening here. and I mean it wasn't it it just broke. I mean, but it wasn't anything spectacular. It wasn't like The work of man, it was clearly the work of the Holy Spirit because man had nothing to do with it. Kids just stayed around to pray. And whenever they did, like God just poured out his spirit upon them. And and you had revival break out. And I think that we've actually seen the ripple effects of that. there was a similar revival at like Ohio State, like their football team led it. They were having baptisms in the back of pickup trucks in the parking lot. And yeah, it's just like but it it starts this kind of rolling effect and and all of a sudden starts making Like Asbury made news, news like headlines, and then we have the stuff at happening at Ohio State, and then we had some stuff in like Georgia, and like so this slowly, like maybe not even associated with Asbury, but that move of the Holy Spirit, people started seeing it and it just had a ripple effect. And so yeah, we're absolutely still seeing it today. and I do think that we're in a day and age that is primed for revival. in that where that's that mass, you know, reigniting the flame for Jesus. Yeah. And and I think we're just seeing that all over the place. I would agree. I find myself on both sides of the coin of we're so busy, we're not making it's great that the the younger generation is having that fire. Right. But I feel like in my everyday life I'm having trouble seeing that because all of these negatives do get pushed to the front of your mind at all times. It's hard to afford You know, to have kids nowadays is hard to afford to buy a house. So that means you have to work a lot harder. You have to pick up sometimes a second job. And it feels like, you know, that millennial Gen Z like kind of difference is really starting to grow as far as you know, I I was born in ninety two. So like I I don't know where I fall. I think millennial is that. Yeah, I think so. Sure. congratulations. I'm a millennial. If you're listening, I'm one of you. yes, I know. Podcasts are overly millennials, so it's very possible. There's a lot of millennials watching. We yeah, we like to just sit here and listen to people talk. Yeah, yeah, exactly. For whatever reason that's a thing now. I love to do it. Every day I listen to one. But getting back to that, I feel I've read so many articles about just how the mindset of millennial is is we just feel like we kind of got the short end of the stick in a few areas. And this is not me going, woe is me. Like I'm I'm alive and I'm breathing. I I'm very grateful and blessed. Like I have a lot of things to be thankful for. But when you circle back on the thought of faith and revival breaking out, I'm just like when when would we have time to do all this? Like I would love to stand in that sanctuary and just keep going. But it's gonna feel weird when, like, all right, we gotta go home, we got lunch, like the dogs need to be let out. And it's it's mind blowing to hear it that people are coming from another country. Yeah. Like I can't even imagine, like, honey, where's my passport? I gotta go to this college. Like, there's a revival going on. Like that concept is very strange to me, but it's enticing. It's very exciting. What could lead to that. I mean, you're hearing all this saying like, yeah, you know, everyday life, you know, we got kids, they gotta go get some food. You know. During a revival, do we take lunch breaks? Like how does this work? Like Yeah. I I mean, I don't know. I've never necessarily been in one, but I think it's one of those situations where when God is at work, you recognize it and you obey it. You know, and it's it's everything else kind of works itself out. Now, with the Asbury revival and the revivals over the years, I I don't know that people literally just stayed there for two weeks straight, or if they're like, Hey, you go, you you pray, you spend those times, then you you leave, you go do the stuff you gotta do. And then right as soon as you're done, you get back over. You know, I I don't necessarily know. How how it works. I know that there was a bit of like, you know, with the Asbury things, students were coming and going. They weren't, there were probably some that were there the entire two weeks. Yeah. And someone's bringing them in like chicken nuggets or something, right? But nice. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So the way that it happens today, I I I don't know. And it's one of those things, I think that when God moves, I think you recognize it and you obey it, you know. And so I how you do it today, I don't know. I my my best guess, I mean, what I've seen throughout scripture and throughout what do We've seen historically is faithfulness to God. Faithfulness to God will lead to revival. And and it's one of the things I'm really happy to see is that churches are are being more faithful to God. because we went through a a long time where Churches really weren't preaching the Bible. They were, you know, preaching self-help talks with a little a couple of Bible verses thrown in. And but the more I look, I see so many other churches, you know, expositionally going through the Bible, opening up God's word, allowing God's word to be the topic. We're not trying to teach on parenting and make God's word fit parenting. Rather, we're opening up the text and we're teaching what God's Word says. And I believe that kind of obedience is what leads to revival. And I think that's what what we're seeing right now is, you know, within like Gen Z and stuff, because we're at colleges and stuff happening. most of the things we've seen in the news lately have been colleges and so it's our Gen Z. And I think they're looking for truth. And you find truth in the Word of God. And and I think that's so much more important to be in the Word of God and teach what the Word of God says rather than just, you know. What what's the word? Tickling people's ears, you know? And and so I think that faithfulness to God i is what leads to revival, that we are in the word, we are teaching the truth, that we are allowing the Holy Spirit to surround us, to lead us, and we obey it. Yep. And whenever those things happen, I think when those things come together, it's like that perfect storm, right? When you're obedient to God, you're in the word of God, you're in the prayer of God, you're obedient to the Holy Spirit. That revival is the natural reaction to that. That seems like such a A heavy thing. Like it's it's hard not to want that every day of your life, every time you walk into a church of just like I want to just give everything to God to God to the point where like a revival breaks out. But it feels like you're kind of putting yourself out there on a limb by yourself. Like I I hope that after this like I'm able to start talking to people about it, like in my everyday life. But it seems like a strange topic that I don't recall it ever coming up in church. Like and maybe it has, and I've not been in those conversations because I'm focused on, you know, all right, I gotta do, you know, we're doing worship today. Like I gotta go check in on this thing, make sure my wife has snacks 'cause she gets hungry around about this hour. Yeah, exactly. and then we like have the dogs. But yeah, I do wanna know like how can I I mean, how can I bring this up to people to where like maybe they're feeling the same way too? Like it's a weird concept, like, hey, do you feel like having a spiritual reawakening today? Yeah. Like I want that. I know God's the one who's gonna make that happen, but I feel like just like John was adamantly preparing the way for Jesus and not equating it, but like at a certain point we're called to, you know, create the way, make some space. Like how can we get out of our own way? And then how can we kind of corral people in to get them excited about the thought? It's so easy to show up, get the attendance points on Sundays, and then just go right back to daily lives. And we've all done it. Right. Whether you're teaching or you're in the pews, we've all done it because that's just how life goes at some point. But There has to be a a moment where you flip the lights on and you tell everybody around you, like, hey, wake up. Like this is, you know, let's start getting back on fire for God. Like, let's bring this back up to the surface. Yeah. So I what I would say to that is I believe that if every person who attended church on Sunday morning walked out of that church Sunday evening and obeyed what they learned that morning, we would have a spiritual awakening that we've never seen before. But the problem is, as Jesus says, there that we have a lot of lukewarm Christians. Yep. And what I mean by that, and I'm I'm not even meaning that to be as like negative as it sounds, is like we can show up to church on Sunday mornings, we get the attendance points, we turn around and we walk out the doors and pretend like it never happened. Yep. Right? Like we can walk in, the pastor can say, Hey, you know, don't drink too much. Don't get hateful with your coworker. Don't flip that dude off in traffic, right? Yeah. That's all great, a great idea Sunday morning. Monday morning's a whole different story. And I think that's really what it looks like is that we have to get out and we have to actually live out our faith. Don't let it be a Sunday thing. Don't let it be just something you do once a week, but it has to actually shape the course of your life. And that's what we see when Jesus calls the disciples. He didn't say, Hey, Peter, come follow me. And Peter's like, Yeah, I'll follow you, but in 10 minutes I got to get back to the boat, you know? No, he he left everything behind and he followed Jesus. Now, I don't think in 2026 that's necessarily what following Jesus looks like. I mean, Jesus didn't most people, Jesus isn't saying, hey, quit your job and and do ministry the Rest your life. Maybe is what he said to me. So here we are. And right, but like for the most part, it's if you just go and live out your faith. And I don't think that like walking up to someone Hey, are you ready for spiritual awakening? It's probably not the right line. I'm gonna try it because you never know. Hey, go hit up Cracker Bro after this and ask the lady if she's ready for I mean, maybe. But like I honestly I think that that the truest form of evangelism is is living out your faith and then showing people what God has done for you. it says in Revelation that That they'll be saved by the the blood of the lamb and the word of your testimony. That's not even close to being verbatim, but it's you get the idea, right? Cliff notes. The word of the testimony, blood of the lamb. My editor will put it in there somewhere. He loves when I say that. shout out to Michael. Yeah, exactly. We love you. but yeah, so I mean ultimately, like if we can go out and we can show people what God is doing in our lives and not being ashamed of the gospel, right? That we're not ashamed of the gospel, we actually go out and we live out, live a life for Jesus. Like we As Christians should look different than the rest of the world. That we should be those people that when people are going through hard times, you're the person they want to call because they know you have something they don't. And and that doesn't come from showing up do you know where you're going when you die? people do that. I'm a pastor and it still makes me awkward when people ask me that question. Yeah, I I'm with you. I'm like, I don't know, Bilbrey's is my guest, but I don't know, But To actually just live out your faith. And and I really and I I truly, I say this wholeheartedly. If every Sunday the people of God would walk out of church looking like the people of God, we would have a spiritual revival in America. Yep. But the problem is we go to church on Sunday morning and Monday morning we look like the rest of the world. And that that's where we are seeing that disconnect. Because we're not actually living out the thing we say that we believe. We want Jesus as savior, but not as Lord. And until we receive him as Lord, we will never see a change. And that's that the power of the Lordship of Christ. I I think you're spot on with that because I feel it in myself of there's nights when I go for worship practice and That that is strictly to kind of get ourselves, you know, prepared. And I love it because that's my my private time for worship. I'm not worried about, you know, putting on a show or anything. And not that like it is on Sundays either. It's just different when you have eyeballs staring back at you. But when it's truly just you on stage in an empty sanctuary practicing, playing, that's where I get into it the most. Like I feel just it's indescribable. And I feel the music take over and the words that I'm singing. I truly do feel like I'm worshiping God. Yeah. But there are some days where it just been a hard week and I'm I'm practicing and I'll go home to Steph and I'm just like, I just wasn't feeling it today. Yeah. I couldn't get in the rhythm, my guitar was messing up, something was wrong. And that distraction takes away from truly benefiting from that interaction with God of truly worshiping him, having that mini little revival. Yeah. I'm gonna start using that for everything now. Like I'm just having a revival day. Spiritually awakened. Yeah. But I feel like on Sundays it's so easy to fall into that routine, that trap to where we don't make any room for that, even if we aren't going to the extreme of saying like, yeah, we're not making room for revival to break out. Like even just your own personal growth. And I feel that, you know, it's been kind of touched on in the most recent sermons that we've done about the chronological life of Jesus. And we're now at the point of Judas betrayal and going that route of, you know, it's so hard to think of how much of a betrayal Judas had for Jesus. Right. Or, you know how much he betrayed him. Yeah. But it's I think it was last Sunday you were talking about like Jesus or Peter was willing to die for Jesus. We may have to cut that part out. But backing up to your message last Sunday, Peter was ready to die for Jesus when he knew he was going to be portrayed. Or then when he knew he was going to be arrested. Whatever. You preach a sermon, not me. So you're going to But, you know, Peter be willing to die, but are we willing to be a little uncomfortable for him? I think that answer like you said, y you could fight a dragon in the parking lot. You could say you're gonna fight a dragon in the parking lot because it's likely never gonna happen. Right. Like that's where I feel like I'm at personally of just, you know, I want to get people back on fire. 'Cause I see many of my close friends, families like, maybe they do go to church, maybe they don't go to church, maybe they live in the same town and I can't invite Or maybe they live a couple hours away and I can't invite them to church. I want them to be able to feel the the joy that I have in my heart and yeah, I have my bad days. Everyone. Yeah. Yeah. But when that joy hits, like that little feeling that I get in that private worship where I'm just actually lifting that voice up to God. Like that's the the part where I feel could change more people's lives. Like that's where I feel if I could just grab you out of your seat. I see you sitting there on the second row. Like if I could grab you and just make you feel what I'm feeling right now because it's truly life changing. Right. I think that could lead to, you know, more people would do that could lead to, you know, a bigger movement or, you know, revival. I hate to even keep using the word because it's gonna get Yeah, yeah. No, it's okay. It's okay. Yeah. No, I mean absolutely. And that's what that's what people need. And so I I get the same thing. So I I I study the Bible a lot, obviously. My job. Right. And so like there's a difference when I'm studying the Bible for a sermon and I'm studying the Bible for Jeff. You know, like when I'm just studying for myself, it's like it's like your your practice time, right? Yeah. Because I can study the Bible because I'm preparing a sermon, but I'm writing that for two hundred other people, right? Whenever I'm just opening up the word of God and I'm like, Well, God, what do you have to say to me today? Right? What do you have for me today? Like that, that's kind of that time for me. And then I can, I can deep dive and I can ask questions and I can study. And it's not for anyone. It's not, it's not because I'm trying to write a sermon or it's not. And so I I get that. And that's one of those important things is we all need a personal time with God. If the only time that you spend with God is one hour on Sunday morning, it's not enough. Yep. It's not enough because you got to think, what is pouring into you? If something is always pouring. into you. Is the word of God pouring into you or is the world of Satan pouring into you? Because one of them is pouring into you. And I heard a a metaphor, an old Native American tale. And it was like this grandfather is talking to the to his grandson, and he tells him that, you know, I have two wolves fighting inside of me. He's like, one wolf is good and one wolf is evil, and they're just continually fighting. And this the grandson asks him, He's like, Well, which wolf is gonna win? And he says, The wolf that I feed. And the same thing's true. We each have good and evil inside of us, and the one that's going to win is the one that we continually feed. And so if we are continually taking the world and the things Of the world and we're entertaining ourselves with the world and we're dipping our toes in the things that are sinful. And we're we're just saying, you what, I'll follow God on Sunday, but on Monday and Friday night, I want to be at the bar, right? Like if we're we're continually saying that, you know, I'm I'm gonna follow Jesus Sunday morning. I mean, we don't say that with our words, we say it with our lives. But I'm gonna follow Jesus Sunday morning, but then on Monday night we're back to the world. Well, we're gonna look more like the world, and we're not gonna have that spiritual wedding, we're not gonna have that joy like you're talking about, because the only time that we have with With God is the one hour a week we give him. But God's never once asked for one hour a week. He's asked for your life. When he said, Follow me, that means everything you have. So when a disciple would follow a rabbi, this was a life-changing event. A rabbi would walk up, he'd say to a disciple, follow me. Right? Jesus wasn't the first rabbi. This was very common. A rabbi would walk up to a disciple and he'd say, Follow me. What he meant is, walk in my steps. Do everything that I do, say everything that I say, imitate me perfectly. And so there was an old phrase that was called being covered in the dust of your rabbi. And that was because you were walking so close that whenever he was walking through the sand, dust would fly up from his sandals and it would coat you head to toe because you were on the tail of your rabbi, listening to everything he said. And that's why to be Christian means to be an imitator of Christ. We will never be Jesus, but we should be following him so closely that those who don't know him will see him in us. And that is where we see that that spiritual awakening is when we are actually following Jesus. And that's one of the things that kind of aggravates me about American Christianity is because American Christianity's got toned down so much that we're like, hey, do you want to not go to hell? Sweet, you're in. That's not what Jesus called us to. Never once did he walk up to Andrew and go, Hey, let me save you from hell. No, he said, follow me, be my disciple, imitate me, teach for me, and one day you will be killed for me. me. That was the calling of Jesus. But we've dumbed it down to something that like no one's committed to because it doesn't require anything of you. And that's not Christianity. Following Jesus is a lifelong commitment and it should be lived out every day of our lives. Now, not perfectly, as we've both said. We have bad days. True. We have people in traffic that make us angry. I got kids that are absolutely wild. Right. And none of us are going to be perfect. And that's never the goal. But the goal is to follow Jesus as best that we can. Yeah. And if we mess up today, let's do a little bit better tomorrow. Right. And so I think that when we have that, we have a real personal relationship with Jesus. We'll see revival in our own life. And then if we continue to live that out, we'll start to see revival everywhere we go because the people will see the Jesus in you and they'll be curious about it. Maybe not immediately. Yeah. Maybe they'll even be resentful or negative about it in the beginning, but one day they will ask questions because one day they'll need that Jesus that you have. I think it's so easy to let that that thought just really take hold in the very beginning of a you know, a walk of faith. Right. I felt that in my own journey of I knew I was living in a life of sin. I wanted to turn things around. It wasn't a night and day difference. It was a dimmer switch that over time as I started to cut these things out of my life, I started to feel my energy, my happiness, my joy go up. And I was living on top of the world for a good while. Yeah. And then eventually my morning scripture time started to feel like a routine. My evening scripture time started to feel like a routine. I I just gotta get through this verse so I can go to bed. And you know, you've called me out on it too. You're just like, if you can't tell me what you just read, you didn't actually read it. You just kind of looked at words on the page. And I think that's so important to really drive home because of what was said. today of and I think Josh Howerton's also said it too eventually you know sin can lead to a foothold which leads to a stronghold which basically that starts to control your life. And you know, Judas his stronghold was greed and that ultimately led to him betraying Jesus and feeling so much shame over it that he ultimately took his life in the scripture. Like I think that is a extreme representation. It it's sad it does happen out there as far as, you know, writing your own story in that way, ending it in that own way. But it's so easy for us to let sin become a foothold and then eventually turn into a stronghold to where you end up in this cycle of I felt on top of the world when I was early in my journey. But after keep trying these same coping mechanisms over and over again. My prayers feel a little bit more like I'm talking to myself again versus I'm talking to God. My scripture time feels more like I'm just reading these pages again and not necessarily studying the scripture. Right. do you even you as a pastor, do you ever feel like that? Like, you know Just going through the motions again, like, God, please, please get me back up to here. Like, cause we're talking about all this reawakening. Well, you don't reawaken from something that you never fell asleep to. So, like, I want to get into the, hey, what happens when you start feeling yourself on that decline, you know, falling asleep a little bit, spiritually speaking. Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, and it's one of those things it's funny as a pastor, you can find yourself in that exact same point while opening up the word of God and diving deeper than like anyone else. Which is crazy. Because like I'll I'll ask myself sometimes at the end of the week, it's Saturday night and I have a sermon ready, but I'm like, hey, did God say anything to you? You know? It's like God gave you a lot for for them, but are you going to God for yourself? And and I've told this, I've told this story numerous times now. Is like I'll I have to catch myself, is that like I will pray for everyone else in my life except myself. And it's like it's one of those things, it's almost pride. It's pride. It is. I won't it's almost pride, it's pride. Is that like I think I can handle my stuff. Yep. Everybody else needs God. No, no, I need God. But it's one of those things, like you can find yourself, especially when like you said, whenever it gets mundane, like when it gets kind of routine, when it's like, okay, I've been going through this Bible study for 62 days, and you know, on day 63, I just need to get done because I'm tired. You know? Yeah. It's like I just want to brush my teeth and go to bed, man. You know? And so it's one of those things. I and for me, someone with ADHD, is like I do have to find new ways to commune with God, right? Like so for me, I found what works best for me that I'm actually in the moment with God. Like right now, you're holding you have a Bible beside you. I have a computer. And and and this is just this is my it's so weird. I know some people really say it's wrong. I I spend more time with God on a computer because that's just the way my brain works. I like to have the Bible open with three other passage tabs open and then six commentaries open in other tabs. And I like to deep dive and study. And it's like if I just sit down and read, I'll read that and then I'll close it and I'll be like, I don't know what I just read. Cause I was already talking, I was thinking. About three other things while I was reading it. Yep. And so for me, I've yeah, no, I and I've found myself. So what I do is I like to deep dive. I like to read a verse and I'm like, well, what's that mean? Where was he talking about here? This had a little footnote in it. What'd that footnote mean? And like, so I like to kind of deep dive. But okay, going back to the original question, right? Sure. you can't be spiritually reawakened if you never fell asleep. And so yeah, even as a pastor, I've definitely had those seasons where it's like you go through the motions and you you read the Bible, you write the sermon, and you go preach the sermon, and then sweet, I don't have to think about it for three more. days. now it's Wednesday. Now I gotta write a sermon. And then I gotta like it's easy to fall into those same motions all the while studying the word of God. And I think this is where intentionality comes out and and discipline, which is one of those things that I don't think people love discipline. They love it like martial arts, but in Christianity we're like no no, right? Yep. People are like I'm disciplined in the gym but not in the Bible. Like dude, you're strengthening the wrong part of your life. Okay. And so it it takes discipline but it also takes that intentionality because like I can force myself to read the Bible. But am I spending time with God? Yeah. Right? And so I think sometimes we have to get our mind right. Sometimes we need to sit down with the word of God and we need to turn the TV off, we need to put the phone away, we need to make sure no one's coming home for the next thirty minutes. And we need to sit down and we need to read it until it makes sense to us. That's the discipline. Because real easy to read a chapter of the Bible, it takes four minutes on average and be done. I did take me at least 10 minutes because I start I do what you do. I start thinking like, that that's weird. I wonder what they, you know, why do they wear shoes like that? And then I snap and I'm like, yeah, like I'm I'm reading. Yeah, I'm I'm gone. Like I think of yeah, a thousand different things. So yeah. No, my mind's all over the place. And so it's one of those things I think sit down. down, no distractions, no technology, no one home. And and spend moment with spend time with God in prayer. And and that's one of those things I think cover everything you're doing in prayer. and that's one of the things like I Some days I will rarely bow my head and pray, but I'm constantly praying, right? I'm in the car and I'm talking to God. I'm in the shower, I'm talking to God. I'm on my way to talk to someone else and I'm talking to God. But it's like cover those things in prayer and and then just open up the word and and read. And and and I I don't like to say so. I've heard someone say once before that they read until God speaks with them, but speaks to them. But I also feel like that could be a cop out. Yeah. It's like, man, I'm tired today. Good thing he spoke to me in the first two verses. Right. Like what I'm saying is like read whatever you said you're gonna read. Yep. And then if you can't write down what you just learned, read it again. And read it again. And so I'm going through the that memorization book that I I gave to you and Antonio. Yep. And I I I started last night and so I I decided I was gonna read through until I got to a verse I didn't have memorized. That didn't take too long. but I made like three chapters in, and then I found a verse I didn't have memorized, and so I read it and I read it again, and I read it probably twelve times. I was reading my kids asleep too, so they like, Why are you saying the same thing over and over? And I'm Don't worry about it, go to sleep. Just go to sleep. Yeah. And so I read it over and over and over. it still didn't stick. I tried to repeat it this morning. I don't have it. But I but it was funny, like every time I read it, it was almost like God spoke to me again in a different way. And again in a different way. And again which is funny because I don't always get that. But it's like the fact that I just sat there repetitiously just reading it and reading it and reading it. And I think sometimes there's power. I mean, I talked, I think, on our first podcast, the the one of the times I felt the Holy Spirit in mo in the most like life-changing way, I went into my quiet time with one Bible verse and I probably read it 200 times. And like God just every time started to talk to me more and more and more from that one piece of scripture. And so I I don't know if that helps or not, but like, yes, even as pastors, we have those times of of you know fear spiritual. Spiritual sleepiness. Yep. And and in those times we have to find ways to connect with God. I mean, prayer, scripture, worship, just find the thing that makes you feel in the presence of God and do it again and again and again. It's so weird. Like I feel like it's similar to how you feel when you know a cold's coming on, or you know, like you're getting s you're catching sickness, like you throat starts to feel weird. I can I for Like recently when I've had to go through those seasons of, you know, spiritually kind of lulling to sleep, I could feel it coming on of just like, ooh, I I snapped a little bit. I was a little bit more angry than I typically would be. And it helps to know like I'm first of all, obviously not alone on that. Everybody's every dog's gonna have their day. Like every every day's gonna be, you know, either up or down. Like it's trying to figure out how to level things out a little bit and understand how to navigate best when you're not only at the mountaintops, but also the way back down to the valleys. And I think it was you that we were just in a passing conversation that had a great s quote. Pick up if you where I'm going with it as far as like basically being battle tested through the valleys or the valleys where you find yourself like truly does that ring a bell? No, but I say I say lots of stuff that I I sometimes don't remember immediately afterwards. Yeah, yeah. I I don't know if I go that far, but sometimes I say stuff and people are that was good. I'm like, was it? I what'd I say? Like, I don't remember. I think my favorite quote from the last episode was, you know, you accidentally stumbled upon it. You're like, just open the Bible, read about it, and then Go digging. I was like, man, that's some Joe Dirt stuff. I was saying I'm gonna jump back because I I just remember something. Yes, and I can't really forgot it. have I ever told you the phrase Gaigo? No, okay, so that sounds like a video game. Yeah, yeah. So, okay, all right. So almost every kid that's been in my youth group could have told you what Gaigo means because I say it all the time. And so whenever I was in school for IT, I went to school, majored in cybersecurity, minored in programming. And when you're writing code, there's a phrase called Gigo, and it means garbage in, garbage out. out. So you you put in garbage code, you're getting garbage results, right? And I found the same thing spiritually, is that if you're constantly putting in garbage, and so in in this sense the garbage would be Sinful behavior, secularism. if you're constantly listening to music with profanity in it, there's no wonder your v your vocabulary has profanity in it. Right? If you're constantly watching a TV show that has obscenities in it and has profanity in it, has nudeness in there's no wonder you can't quit thinking about pornography because you are feeding your mind and your soul with those things. And so if you continually put garbage in, you will have garbage results and you will feel like garbage. And so I go on the other side and I made up the phrase hi-ho, and I think it's pretty good. Yeah, yeah. Snow white. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so it's it's holiness in and holiness out, right? If you if you surround yourself with holy things, right, if if I'm constantly listening to worship music and I'm constantly in the word of God and I'm cr constantly surrounding myself with the people of God, and if I'm constantly, you know, in in conversation with God, when we allow holiness to fill us, holiness will be the result that comes out of us. And so it's it we can choose. Is it Gaigo or Hiho? Right. Like in and so that that's my little that's my little phrase and I I like it. It it's stuck for a while. I love that. Yeah. And I've actually picked up something just from watching a TV show that is fa The Chosen. Yeah, yeah. Love it. So good. Yeah, it's such a good show because I'm such a visual learner. So I've been reading along through the gospels and watching the chosen. And that's kind of how things started making more sense. Yeah. So much better. But I noticed. It was just kind of a it wasn't like a big scene or anything, but I noticed when they were waking up in the morning, they were staying at, you know, an inn and Jesus said the the prayer in the morning before his feet hit the ground. The Shema. Yes. Yeah. So thank you. Yeah, yeah. I don't know. I just like that word. It's it's it means to hear. And so it's hear, O Israel, the Lord your God is one. And then so it's the the Shema. And I said every morning and every evening. That's where they're all like sitting up in their beds and they're praying together. That's the Shemat. Yeah. Well in Jewish traditionally, I'm assuming that's the one you're talking about. Yeah. Yep. But I I took away from that. I was like, man, that's such a good idea. Like when we're prepping for worship night, which we do like 12 songs, so I have to listen to it all the time. I noticed myself on the last go round. Waking up singing Christian song like I'm dead asleep. I've slept through four alarms and my wife is now kicking me saying it's time to get up. And I'll find a and I'm the worst because I am also like partially deaf. So it's even worse. But y I I found myself just waking up and kind of yeah, I'm still in a groggy state, but I'm already humming a worship song. And then before my feet hit the ground, I say my prayer and it's cold. Like it is so cold in the mornings 'cause we like to, you know, bundle up and, you know, crank the A C. best way to fall asleep. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Stand going, it's great. That's why I don't want to get out of bed. Yeah, no, me either. I hate getting up when it's cold. I love being on the blankets. Yep. but That is a big difference maker when you start I just saw it from watching a T V show and that makes a difference of how my day starts and it's not easy every morning. Some days I'm like, Lord help me. Like, please, I need you right now. Yeah. And like just to get going. But I can feel a complete difference and like you're talking about garbage in, garbage out, you know. Is holiness in holiness in, holiness. Holiness out. Yeah. And it it makes a difference of just getting that day started. And the reason I even bring that is that up is because I've also heard on you know, different podcasts I have a doctor on and one of I can't remember to quote it directly and I'm sorry not giving credit where it's due, but he talks about how your blood pressure can stabilize a little bit. If you wake up in the morning and you don't immediately jump up out of bed. You take a minute and kinda let your after you get vertical, let your system kinda calibrate. And I just thought it was neat to see that parallel of something that's reserved for God is also beneficial for your body. And I already have a future episode planned about all the different parallels between what the Bible tells us to do and how science and, you know, neurologists, physiologists will say, that's actually great for your body. That's actually great for your mind. Right. Yeah. So many I just didn't mean to go off on that tangent, but it's so neat. And it's exactly what you're saying is when we're focused on whether it's building a good body in the gym. Mm-hmm. or building your, you know, eternity here in church or in your own home. Like it is vital how you start your day and how you focus your attention. Mm-hmm. That's where the results are gonna yield. Yeah. So absolutely. And we're gonna see that in everything in life, right? Anything we we focus on, that is what's gonna consume us, right? Like and and that's it, you know, what do we tell teenagers all the time? Like, you know, show me your five friends and I'll show you your future, right? Yep. And the same thing's true for adults. We like to say, No, it's just for kids, but no, like show me your five interests, show me the five things you're listening to, show me your calendar, show me your bank statement, right? We'll we'll show you what's important to you. Yep, you know, and that's the same thing. Whatever you surround yourself with is what's gonna impact your life the most. And so if we want God to impact our life the most, then we have to make God the most important thing in our life. And that part's not easy. Showing up to a building on Sunday morning's easy. Yep. Making God the most important thing and the priority in your life is not easy though. I will say not sh showing up to the building every Sunday is not easy. I am late quite often. I am sorry. Yeah, no, I do. man. I yeah, I I don't always show up like fully awake. Some of them show up with a monster in hand and I'm like, it's it I was up too late, you know? Yeah. And but no, absolutely. But I mean, kind of going back to the topic at hand with with like revival and things, like all the things we're talking about right now, this is what leads to revival. Is that when we start actually living out the principles of God. Is that that will lead to revival. Now maybe it may not be like a huge, massive hundreds of thousands of people saved. Like maybe it will. Because a lot of the like historical revival started out as like something no one thought was a big deal and then like it just blows up. And and so I think that's really what it is. It's when people become faithful. Like in I think it was 1857, there was a a businessman in New York and he decided that he just wanted to have a prayer meeting in in like he was a businessman in New York. Wants to have a prayer meeting for his lunch break, 30-minute lunch break. That's it. And so he goes, he gets this little prayer meeting going. Six people show up to the first one. Like, yeah, that's not a revival. That's you know, yeah. A few friends that felt sorry for you, right? And so it's like he he goes to Susan heated up her salmon in the microwave. Now we're over to pray for her. Yeah. So stop doing that. Stop doing that, salmon. It smells terrible. Right. But like he he begins this. And next thing you know, these pop-up prayer meetings start meeting start spreading all over New York City. Wow. And then it expands to other cities and like other other states. And before you know it, the the final calculations in the hundreds of thousands of people got saved. through that one lunch break prayer meeting. That was the start of revival. That didn't look like revival. It looked like a weird way to spend your lunch break. Yeah. Right. But it it spread from that moment. And that was just the faithfulness of God. Right? He was faithful to God and God was faithful through it. And these, I mean, ended up being just this huge revival and it was like nothing fancy, you know? It's like, I mean, what what would happen if Christians today lived out their faith for the Lord? Right? What would happen if we had a break room prayer meeting, right? Need a big break room. Need to break break probably knocked in hundreds of thousands in there, right? But like, but how could that spread? What could happen? What could come from that? I don't know. But if Christians are faithful, God is faithful, right? And and and if we are faithful with what we've been given, right? Think of the parable of talents. If we're faithful what God has given us, he'll be faithful to us, right? And I mean God's always faithful to us. I'm not saying he's not, but like he'll if you take care of what he's given you, he'll give you more, right? That's what the promise is. Yep. I think that's where it starts We talked a a lot about the micro level, the individual level. Yeah because that is truly where it starts. Like a hundred percent. How can you pour into somebody else when you have an empty cup? That's one thing that you know I debate with my wife about all the time because she's such a giving person and such a loving person that she will give and keep giving and not, you know, refill her tank until, you know, she crashes and then she's like, All right, it's it's time to, you know, recoup a little bit here. Right. But I think that why it's so important of yeah, you could have great aspirations to want to spread the joy and love, but like you gotta make sure it starts within yourself first and within your household. Because you may be great, but is your spouse right, you know, okay. Are they on the same level or your children or your parents, grandparents, who whoever it is starts within you, then your household then, you know, in your own community. Outside that, yeah. And it it's Personally, it is scary to think about nowadays because, you know, I think about just what if I were to start a, you know, prayer meeting in my workplace. Like, is is that okay? Am I gonna get in trouble? We live in a different time now. We do. And it's it's scary to think about. And it's you wanna have that boldness of faith, but then you're like I got a mortgage. I can't risk losing my job. Like my faith is important, but I got all these bills. Like we're scraping by. We're we're hoping to, you know, get to the next paycheck. I I can't, you know, I can't do that. It's so easy to to have that. But having faith in God of, hey, if you did lose your job over a prayer meeting, you don't think God can take care of it. Like you don't think he can do something out of it. what would you say to that person that might feel that way? Of I don't want it to be awkward in the break room now. Like I you know, they they feel that conviction in their heart of like I love the Lord, He's done great for me, but I'm not ready to pray in the break room. Yeah. And I would say let's be careful that we're discerning between conviction and excuses. Sure. Right. And so there's a difference when the Holy Spirit's telling you like to do something. And and so one of the things I've talked about before, the Holy Spirit will lay things on your heart to do. If you feel like God's calling you to do it, you are free to ignore it. God has given us free will. Yeah. Right. You are free to ignore it. But keep in mind every time that we stifle the spirit, the spirit's voice becomes less and less and less. And so this is one of those things. Okay, maybe don't run out and lose your job. Maybe ask your boss if it's okay if you do that. If your boss says no, then okay, maybe that's not the route. if you still feel a conviction of the Holy Spirit, then I would still trust God in that. And and so I mean, it was one of those things that we've all I don't know, like even before I came on full time here at Grace, like I I had to tell, like I I did when I was working at Kohlinks, I did forty something interviews to get a position office position. And one of my key things was is that I will leave here by 4 p.m. every Wednesday because I am a youth leader and that is my priority. That's awesome. And so it was just one of those things. And like I did 40-something interviews. I'd like to have not done 40-something interviews, but I got really good at interviews. Okay. And I I finally got one of the positions I wanted. But it's one of those things that, like, if you're following God, I think that faithfulness to God is so much more important than faithfulness to the world or to work or to a boss or literally anything else. Because at the end of the day, the most important like I I heard someone say it once, that we need to live for the applause in L Pierce hands, right? If we're living for the applause of humans, we're we're probably never gonna serve God fully. But if we're living for the applause of God, then that will cu that'll sustain everything that we need. And so I this is what I would say. Don't listen to this podcast and think now that you need to go start a prayer thing in your lunch room. Maybe you are. Pray to God. Let the Holy Spirit speak to you. And if that's what the Holy Spirit is leading you to do, then I would highly suggest being obedient to the Holy Spirit because He can do so much more than we can think, dream, imagine. Like, I mean, God's gonna do way more with a little bit of faith. We talked about in the first episode. Say yes to God. God will do incredible. things with a yes. And and that's why I'm saying like be careful between conviction and excuse. Because it can be like, maybe I should start a thing in my lunchroom. But I don't want to be weird. I don't want to be awkward. I don't want to do this. I don't want to do that. And it's like, well, do you want to obey God? Because sometimes, now I take it back all the time, God will call you outside of your comfort zone. Boy Willy. Yeah, absolutely. 100%. He's both of us too. Yep. Yeah. So that's what I would say is just pray about it. Pray about it. And I would I would encourage faithfulness to God above Yeah. Yeah. I love that answer. And I think it rings very, very true of just being that faithful servant. That's what we want to hear. At the end of our life, yeah, well done, good and faithful servant. Absolutely. So I can't think of a better place to land the plan than right there. Pastor Jeff, it's been an another great conversation. if you wouldn't mind, go ahead and pray aside again. Yeah, I would love to. All right, Father, we thank you, Lord, for this day. We thank you for your mighty works. We thank you for revival, God, the for revival among the masses and the revival among the individuals, God. I just pray, God, for this nation right now that you would surround the people of God, that you would surround the people of this nation, that you would draw them near to you, that their eyes would be open to what you have for them, Lord. I just pray that you would speak boldly and proclaim your goodness everywhere that it is, God, that you would raise up a generation of followers of Jesus that are not just Sunday church. Goers, but people who actually live their life to honor and serve you and obey you, Lord, that they would be bold enough to take your word, your goodness, and your grace into the streets and into the workplace. And God, wherever you're calling them to go, that we would say, like Isaiah, Lord, here I am, send me. God, I just pray that you would be with us, Lord, that you would be with Josh and myself and Michael and their families, Lord, and our family life. God, I just pray for your presence over us, God. I pray for you to be with our church and our friends and our family. We just pray, God, we pray for a revival, whatever that looks like. like God. Not not for headlines, not for numbers, Lord, but for a general reawakening of people to receive you, to know you, and to be saved by your glorious grace, God. We lift it all to you today, God. We love you, Lord. We trust you. In Jesus' mighty name. Amen. And amen. Amen.