Latest / The Breakfast Club / Tamron Hall On Black Women In Daytime Talk, Nick Cannon, Wendy Williams, Prince, Her New Book + More

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Tamron Hall On Black Women In Daytime Talk, Nick Cannon, Wendy Williams, Prince, Her New Book + More · The Breakfast Club

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Wait that as up in the morning Breakfast Club Morning,
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: everybody is DJ Envy, Angela Yee Scholamine the guy. We
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: are to Breakfast Club. We got a special guest in
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: the building daytime Talk Royalty. What where did you get that?
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Who wrote that? I love my mom for sending that
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: in thank you? She listens to the Breakfast Club. Good morning, mama,
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: good morning. How are you? I'm wonderful. How about yourself?
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: And bless I love that I am feeling the same way.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely good to see you. Thank you. This is
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: my first time in your studio. I know it's ganulation overload. Yeah,
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: we did zoom so I'm I wanted those people because
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: it's the clean, latest thing, underwhelming, ories behind everything. That's right.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah DIDJV You and your wife are going to
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: be on my show soon. I can't wait. We're excited.
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: I love this. There's a lot of alcohol. It's all
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: for props. Yeah, but you don't Oh oh oh you
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: do have the puffy send me a monogram vodka. I
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: never opened it. You guys have fun? Yeah, I think
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: you have one too. Yeah. So yeah, I've had your
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: name on it. You know you kind of got to
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: I guess you're not supposed to drink those. I didn't
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: drink it. I just left it there, said it's for
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: a prop like y'all, but it's cute. How was it
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: for you doing the show during a pandemic without an audience? Oh,
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: it's terrible. I mean it was terrible. I know. I
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: had Seth Meyers on the show the other day and
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: he said he enjoyed it because it allowed him to
• 1:21
  Speaker 1: connect more with viewers in the way he didn't expect.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: I think the first half of it, I said, just think, God,
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: we're on air, like we're on air because we would
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: be canceled otherwise, so we have a chance to stay on.
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: And then when we went back in and had to
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: go back out this last round when Amar I'm a journalist,
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: and I'm a journalist, I should know better. But that
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: second wave and December, I had to go back into
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: my home and do the show and it was miserable
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: and I realized, and you all know this, and Charlottage,
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: especially with your shows, it is having an audience is
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: It's like the team in commandments. It's one of the
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: rules of daytime. You have to have an audience. I
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: my first time even attending a daytime talk show. I
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: went to Temple University and I came to see Haraldo
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: Rivera wow in person, way back when he had a
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: talk show. And it's just it's a part of the energy.
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: So yeah, it was rough. I did not like it.
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: I wonder when you went to go see Haraldo back
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: in the day, does that when the bug hit you?
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: Did you totally not know show like people throwing chairs? No? No, no.
• 2:27
  Speaker 1: I was a college student at Temple and they, you know,
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: they would always recruit young audiences to come in and
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: we were here. Two of my best friends are from
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: Brooklyn and they went to Temple, and so we just
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: did what college kids do. You come to New York,
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: You hang out in Times Square, You got free tickets
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: to go to a show, and it happened to be
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: Horaldo Rivera's. So when did you get the bug down?
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: When did you see yourself? When did I get the bug?
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: When did I get the bug? Well? Um, I would
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: I was born. If I if you ask me what
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: I would be doing right now other than this, I
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: jokingly say blackjack dealer. But I don't even not play cards.
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: I didn't have a I don't even have to play cards.
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: I can't play spades, and I'm from the South. I'm embarrassing.
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: I I amn't. I don't know how to play dominoes.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: I'm an embarrassed. Can you at least I don't play
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: board games? Out a board game? What is it? A
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: card game? I don't play cards. I don't. I was
• 3:18
  Speaker 1: never one of those people. I don't. I don't play monopoly.
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: I think I do. What did y'all do fun in
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: college though, because that's a lot of good stuff. But
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: we played spades, we played cards, not me. You didn't
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: go to class. I did not not a lot. What
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: was going on a temple house music parties. We used
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: to hang out a pen a lot uh the pen
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: parties and Mittenhall parties. But no, I never played cards,
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: so I don't even know we got on that one.
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: But yes, i'd say blackjack dealer, But no, I never
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: had a backup plan. If this was always uh what
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: I wanted to do. I think early on Johnny Carson's
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: show was something that was in the background. But I
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: quickly realized I wasn't a white guy and named Jimmy
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: or James, and so that Late Night World throughout my
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: entire career was really just a white guy into our Sineo,
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: and I think I think maybe seeing our Sineo obviously Rolanda,
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: obviously Oprah Phil Donahue, but they all had different Do
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: you remember Rolando Watch people forget how important she was
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: in the marketplace. So it was there wasn't a moment.
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: It was just I felt like I didn't have a choice.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: It was that I was this was what I was
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: going to do, and I didn't know it's gonna be
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: a talk show. I knew I was going to be
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: a journalist. I love writing, I love reporting. The talk
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: show thing happened, as you know, because I got fired,
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: and so I had to figure out how was I
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: going to get back into TV and not feel as
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: owned as I had previously. If you hadn't have gotten
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: fired from the Today Show, do you think you'd ever
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: gotten into daytime talk? No, because in daytime talk any shows,
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: you know, that's just with y'all show people. It's almost
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: like the Rocky syndrome. People need to root for you,
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: and in talk show world, they need to root for you,
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: they need to fee yel a connection with you. And
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: so while I did have a great run, I feel
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: at the Today Show and even before that in Chicago
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: for ten years because I was recruited to come to
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: the Today's Show after being on air in Chicago. But
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: uh no, because you have to have an arc every
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: you know, it's it's like a superhero. You need like
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: I had the ultimate nemesis in the person that they selected,
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: even though I never met her and never crossed path
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: with her. You have that just a position. Clearly, I
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: watch a lot of superhero things, but you have so
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: you have a juxtaposition of a villain, you have your story,
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: your origin story. So what was my origin stories? I
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: got fired and as a black woman, being forty eight
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: years old and being fired, that hit a nerve with people.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: What is she going to do? How does she come back?
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: And that gave me opportunities to get in rooms. But
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: if I'm being honest with you, and I always will be,
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: Harvey Weinstein got me in rooms that I was never
• 5:52
  Speaker 1: going to be able to get in. He was the
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: most important person in Hollywood and he decided he wanted
• 5:59
  Speaker 1: to produce a talk show with me, and so people
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: started taking meetings to hear the pitch because of Harvey
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: Weinstein and then midstream Harvey was accused of rape, and
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: which I learned over a text message. Someone anonymously text
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: me and said there's an accusation of the R word,
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: and I was like, R word? What does that mean?
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: And then it all what happens there? Because he helped
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: you with your career, he helped me get meetings. I
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: helped me with my career, helped you get meetings. But
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: on the other end, he's, you know, accused of sexually
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: terrifying all to the place. So do you just step
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: back and say, look, I'm a mom of my businesses,
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: I don't know, and he's helped put me in I
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: didn't know what to say. It was like an emotional grenade. Well,
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: I'd never been in a room along with him, So
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: the first part was thank god right then the second
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: part was, wait a minute, did the people who came
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: with me in a room did they know? And is
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: that why they didn't leave me in the room. So
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: there were these many, many questions, and then I'll be honest,
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: came the moment where I I was worried about my
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: own survival and then I felt guilty. Not It wasn't
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: that I didn't care. I would never say that but
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: there was a moment where you think my career, Oh
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: my god, what happens to me? I don't have a job.
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: Now I've been in the room with him. Now I'm
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: tied and linked to him, and this show will never
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: get off the ground because ninety nine percent of the
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: people we were pitching too were white males of his level,
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: if you will, who were not necessarily open to an
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: idea of a talk show with me and black woman
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: because there hadn't been one, right, Wendy had the longest
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: running talk show outside of Oprah. There've been here and there,
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: But if you look at the long list of daytime
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: talk shows, just largely white men and women who these
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: syndicators believe could appeal to quote unquote mainstream. And so
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: even though the best who had ever done it and
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: the most successful in daytime was a black woman who
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: actually didn't have children, she knocked off all of the
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: stereotypes of what's relatable. So now I'm linked to him.
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: I'm worried about my own survive all I am my
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: backup plan. I am thinking this, I'm screwed. And then
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: I had to take a step back and say to myself,
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: what about these women? Who are making these allegations. And
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: I know, just like with Bill Cosby, who spoke at
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: my graduation, who I replaced on the board of trustees
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: at Temple University, even if you don't believe all of them,
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: if you half half and then half that half, you
• 8:22
  Speaker 1: have at least one or two. Yeah, and if there's one,
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: that's one too many. And that's how I looked at it.
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: So I had to take a step back. In the
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: minute that I started thinking about what it must be
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: like for them, It's like the floodgates open my confidence.
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: I said, I'm going back in these rooms. I'm going
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: to rewrite letters to all of these people and say
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: you let me in the room with him. Now, let
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: me in the room by myself and let me pitch myself.
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: And so some of them said yes, some said no.
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: As a spiritual woman, that had to like, really psychologically,
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: that's God working in a really mysterious way, right, It
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: wasn't so mysterious. I actually felt like it was a
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: clear sign that, you know, Lena Horn had a quote
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: that was in this book Stormy Weather, and I have
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: a great obsession with Lena Horne. She said something about
• 9:09
  Speaker 1: white men getting you in rooms that you can't get
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: yourself in. And that's how she felt at the time,
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: and ultimately that's not true. People will let you in
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: the room. I think you have to just keep beating
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: down the door over and over. You. We are all
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: in this business that we know. You walk in and
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: you're instantly stereotype, You're instantly assumed to be something. Yes,
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: And so I wrote back notes and I'd learned how
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: Also I used to tell people I definitely channeled fifty
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: cent a couple of times in I became no longer
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: afraid to brag on myself. Yeah, you know, you have
• 9:44
  Speaker 1: your own merit and you deserved it, but we shrink
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: it down. I mean we all do, but women we
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: especially do in these meetings. And so then you defer
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: to laughing at jokes that aren't funny, or your presentation
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: changes a lot. And so I said, I'm thirty years
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: in this business. I'm going to run my resume down.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: And I really did channel every hip hop artist at
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: you mail that you can imagine, and I specifically zeroed
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: in on men because they get a pass at saying
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: some of the things that women can. And I went
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: in very, very hot. I was like, this is who
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: I am and this is what I did, and if
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: I have to explain myself. And I'm sure that was
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: a turn off to some people, but other people received
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: it with the intention of I don't stand up for
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: myself who is and that's how I played it. I
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: always wondered about daytime television, like, even though Oprah should
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: be the bar right black woman who defied every stereotype,
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: weird name, some would say, you know, looks everything, why
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: didn't they continue to look for more of that instead
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: of just going cookie cutter like they did. I don't
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: understand it. It is something that I goodness, it is
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: they wanted daytime I believe not they Some people want
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: it daytime to be white. It's like I call it
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: the Fort Green cyndrome, and it is that you have
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: this neighborhood and for it to be of value, some
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: people believe that it has to be white. And so,
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: as a result, even though the audience is largely all
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: women of all different backgrounds, our show is almost fifty
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: fifty fifty percent African American, Latino Asian, fifty percent white.
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: So we have this beautiful diversity just straight down the
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: middle of this show and though we have to happen
• 11:31
  Speaker 1: to have one of the highest income earning daytime shows.
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: So these are people, mostly women who buy, who have
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: huge purchasing power. But there will be people who say,
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: fifty percent African American, that's not the audience we want.
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: And you know they still say that. You know that
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: there is still the conversation, and I have it all
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: the time. I've had people call in and say, oh, well,
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: why is this why do they have so many urban
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: guests this week? And then you have other people claim
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: I don't, which is obviously not true. But it's a
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: fascinating thing and I think it still remains part of television.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: I don't want to get into this whole thing, but listen,
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: when I grew up watching TV, it was almost more
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: diverse than it is now. You know Martin in Living Color.
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: I mean the list of you go through some of
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: the breakout shows and television, the fresh prints and on
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: and on. Oh my god, Damon Wayne's show, Bill dil
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: hugely show. I mean, we go to Bill Cosby and Oprah,
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: but there was a we just had guy Torreon for
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: their documentary about Fat Tuesdays, and they talked about this
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: night that was created because TV executives would not go
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: to Compton to hear comedians, so they brought the comedians
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: to Sunset Strip, and almost every show you watched during
• 12:48
  Speaker 1: the nineties and two thousands was because of a black
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: comic performing on that night and being seen by executives
• 12:55
  Speaker 1: who would never have gone to Compton to hear them.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: So it's fascinating. But I think, you know, I think
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: it's a valuable landscape. That's why every year you see
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: more shows launched, because there's money in daytime, but it's
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: not always seen as a value when that money is
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: coming from us. Sadly, yeah, because we saw a Nick
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: Cannon show only six months and then they canceled it
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: rather quickly, and we were saying up here, we feel
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: like he really didn't get a fair shake. What's what
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: do you define as a fair shake? Like not enough
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: time to really like make a mark and establish It
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: feels like you need a little bit more time than
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: six months. What do you think? No, I think that
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: he is brilliant and he is one of the best
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: interviewers I have ever sat in the room with. I
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: think the show wasn't him. I don't know what the
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: show was, but it wasn't him, and I think that's
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: I think they needed a reset, but it was too late.
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: But I also think he got an incredible chance because
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: he came in after a scandal that would have broken
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: most people. I would not have gotten on TV had
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: I said the comments about whatever he said. Would he
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: apologized for and he deserved forgiveness for and he deserved
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: to be on air. I believe that was a big chance.
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: A lot of people would not have been able to
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: get back on air, and I think that may have
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: taken him off of who he is, Right, could you
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: come in with such pressure? You've now just said this thing,
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: You've apologized, but you know people are swirling and they're
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: looking for you to fail. And so I didn't always
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: see like the Nick that I love on that particular show.
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: Could you beat that on daytime? No? Because what you said,
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: how do he want you to cater a Middle America?
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: I think he's got Nick Cannon is one of the
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: most successful people in entertainment bar none. I mean think
• 14:52
  Speaker 1: about all of the shows, so he has a huge
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: fan base. I think coming in under that pressure was
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: never going to change, right. He was coming in with
• 15:01
  Speaker 1: a cloud of people thinking oh right, he got a shot.
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: Look what he said, Look what he did. And then
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: I feel, you know, his personal life, which he was
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: so honest and open about, was used against him. I mean,
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: why he has, you know, kids or whatever. It was
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: these storylines that became overshadowing of his talent, and he's
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: so talented. No, that's true, because it's like you can't
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: even really get into discussions about the show because you
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: gotta dig to all the exactly and so all the
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: articles became about his personal life, not about he had
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: Jamie Fox on. They had this amazing segment. I'm a
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: TV junkie. I watch everybody's show. I listened, So I
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: never watched him as competition. I watched as a fan.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: But I feel like people didn't talk about the content.
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: So I don't know how that was ever going to change,
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: That's what I mean. So if you give him another year,
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: another six months, were they going to be able to
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: change what people were talking about, sadly, which was his
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: personal life? And he owned it, he smiled about whatever.
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: I don't. I just I thought, why aren't we talking
• 15:55
  Speaker 1: about his interviews or his content? And so that's what
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: I mean by it. I don't know if a year
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: would have changed that. But if anybody's going to be
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: back on TV with sixty thou shows on TV, right,
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: he still is. He's got more shows and more millions
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: than I'll ever have. Does Tamarin Hall feel like a
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: successful talk show Hosha? Yeah, okay, I do? I do?
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: I do? What talking about you? Man? That's an interesting question.
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: Why did you ask me that? Um? Just because it's like,
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: you know, you came in and then everybody's like, oh,
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: we don't know if it's gonna last, But then you
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: got another season. Now you got renewed for two. So
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: now do you breathe aside relief and like, okay, no,
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: but if everything was end now, you'd feel successful if
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: everything were to end? Now, how do I guess? How
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: do you define success? What is success? It's objectives? Right?
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: So I think for me, success is, yeah, I did
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: something to your point that people didn't think could be done,
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: and now we're about to go on our fourth and
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: fifth season. I don't know how I listen. I was
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: a success The day that I was born. My mother
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: beat the odds. She was a nineteen year old single
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: mom with no husband. My grandfather brought me home with
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: a second grade education, he could not read. So I
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: was a success when I the day I came out
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: of my mother's body because no one expected her to
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: be able to be a great mom as a teenager,
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: this country girl who then moved to a bigger city.
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: So I don't measure it by the talk show. I
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: really don't. I know that sounds all. I Oh, I don't.
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: I do not. I don't because you you know, you'll
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: define yourself by it. There's a book that I recall,
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: a Path of Light, and it says are you what
• 17:30
  Speaker 1: your card says beneath it? So right now, whoever's listening,
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: you all take out your occupation. Are you still you?
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: And I had to, very early on in my life
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: measure my life by that because none of the people
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: who I raise even had a business card to have
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: a title underneath it, so they didn't measure themselves. So
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: I wasn't raised to measure myself by that. So and
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: even doing things you're passionate about, like your new show
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: on court, to me, someone they knew, Yeah, that has
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: to feel good because that's something that you really wanted
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: to do. Yeah, right, because now, so that going back
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: to your question, you know, the success. The success is
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: being able to choose your projects right and choose the
• 18:06
  Speaker 1: things you want to do. So now I do have
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: that option. So Court TV came to me and they said,
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: we want to do a show someone they knew, and
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: we would like for you to do it. I did
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: a crime show called Deadline Crime for six seasons, including
• 18:19
  Speaker 1: when I was pregnant with Moses, and I couldn't do
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: it anymore because it was just I was an emotional wreck.
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: And you talk a lot about mental health. Imagine reading
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: a script about, you know, a mother being murdered and
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: I'm pregnant and I hadn't told anybody, and I'm thinking,
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: can I baby here this way? Is he going to
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: have anxiety? Like? What am I doing? And so I said,
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: once I finished that last season, I would never do
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: it again. But I missed talking to people and giving
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: them an opportunity to be comforted and giving them a
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: chance to tell what happened to them. And this show
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: is fascinating to me because the common denominator is someone
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: they knew. I mean, the crime show I did before
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: was random crimes across the country, which were all compelling,
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: but this is right now, someone in this room could snap.
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: And these aren't like people who who you're looking at,
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: I'm not looking at Wait a minute, it's the guy
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: back there with the cap on. No. But we talk
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: about crime, especially in New York, of randomness. You know,
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: somebody jumping out of an alley, or someone following you home,
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: or a fender bender and two people get into it.
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: But these are people that were brought into the lives
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: of the victim through no fault of the victim. And
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: it tells you a lot about greed, envy, jealousy, passion,
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: displaced passion, and what can happen. So the common thread
• 19:31
  Speaker 1: is and I always tell people this is shore is
• 19:32
  Speaker 1: not meant to scare you, but it is to say
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: that there is someone in your sphere, in your universe
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: who could turn into a different person, who could go
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: from the friend to a murderer. And that's what these
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: stories are about. It's it's amazing and we see it
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: all the time on the news. You know a guy
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: who works in the building where you live and he's
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: a superintendent. No, no, these are people in their world,
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: like for women and one and four women are the
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: victims of a domestic violence crime and are sat that
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: person is in their life. So it's not the guy
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: who's you know, the door guy or the guy who
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: parked the car who suddenly gets fascinated with These are
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: like intimate individuals in the lives of these people, and
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: you wonder what drives someone. You know, remember that movie
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: Sleeping with the Internet. If you're lying in bed with
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: someone and you believe that they love you, in with
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: the same mouth and voice that they say I love you,
• 20:29
  Speaker 1: they can say I hate you, right, And that's what's
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: so fascinating. So this show, um really is it's it's
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: a head trip because you do wonder how did that
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: person go from being we use that phrase ride or die.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: They go from being your ride or die to wanting
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: you to die. And it's crazy because I watch them
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: like on the weekends, the shows on me and the
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: wife cleaning or whatever we're doing, and this you always want.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: It's just so interesting they are, and I can't watch
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: them at night. I watch all it's like watching a
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: horror movie. So I do it all before, Like my
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: son wakes up at five thirty AM and I will
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: turn on the TV and my huse was like turning,
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna watch this and I will binge you like
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: six am, seven am. They're so interesting, but from a
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: human nature perspective, I mean, we're all by what we do.
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: We're kind of kind of like an archaeologist. We're studying
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: human behavior. So like, for example, when I walked in
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: this room, I could see you studying me, and I
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: was studying you. I start to look at body and language.
• 21:26
  Speaker 1: I hug Angela, but I didn't hug you. I get you.
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: And then you watch how people respond. No, no, you're
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: watching how people respond. I could even tell when my
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: answer went too long because I can see it in
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: your eyes, Charlottagne, so you can I can see it. No,
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: you got your body shifted, so you know. And you
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: we all are like little investigators, right, and so these
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: shows turn you into investigators because you're wondering, Hey, how
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: do I avoid being a victim? Be? Could I prosecute this? See?
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: How would I investigate it? Which is also why I
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: wrote my crime book I've a crime series Jordan Manning
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: as The Wicked Watch. I'm actually fifteen chapters into the
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: follow up to that and that book, like this show
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: all inspired by human nature, and I'm no professional ethicist
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: I'm a journalist who doesn't talk show, but I am
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: deeply fascinated by how people can take someone else's life,
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: especially someone they love. Especially you know, when you talk
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: about human behavior, the only reason all of us are
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: safe every day is because of human behavior, because we
• 22:29
  Speaker 1: make a choice not to go crazy on somebody. Yes,
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: could you be pushed to it? Right? Could you be
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: pushed to a point of no return? I think I could.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: You could never felt like I wanted to. You know,
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: somebody told me one time that, and I totally disagree
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: with this. But I've had a woman say on my
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: podcast that if a man doesn't ever feel like he
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: wants to kill you, he doesn't love you. Well that's
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: a lie. Um no, And I was like, that's not true.
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: What I mean by that is not passion love. When
• 23:01
  Speaker 1: I had my son, they talk about the mama bear thing.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: I didn't know that was real until I had my son.
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: I could have. We were walking one day and we
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: lived in the city and this man was just demonstrative
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: and walking and my baby was just learning to walk,
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: and he nearly knocked him over. I saw stars, I
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: saw I mean, it was one of those moments like
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: Oprah's to be brought Opra and color Pro was like,
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: hold my baby. I was like, I was ready to
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: kill this man and I had I turned and before
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: and I'm like cursing, and my husband is like, what
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: is this? And it was a rage from the bottom
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: of my feet. I can't believe I'm admitting this to
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: the top of my head that I could have. I
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: could see that I could. When's the last time you
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: wanted to kill somebody as well? Never? It was just
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: at one time. Don't try to see this is what
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: you do. Don't you try to make me man like
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: Kamala Harrison will not fall for this nonsense. Not gotta
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: y already, gotta have Nick Cannon mad at me like
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: Stamardall said, he didn't even that is not what I said.
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: Somebody clear that up. I said that too many people
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: weren't distracted by things that didn't matter, which were Nick's
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: great interviews Angela, I said, don't try to screw me
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: with him. So no, I, um no, Honestly, it was
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: only when I had my baby that it was this
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: mama bear when they tell you don't get any midd
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: of a bear cub and the Mama bear I understood
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: and understand that snap because I never felt that away
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: and it doesn't Please don't tell of that. I got
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: six You know, it doesn't go. You feel like you're
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: on guard constantly. I'm ready to do it, really, I'm
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: ready to kill somebody with my kids. Yeah, I'm not lying,
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: could you? Because we see so many stories all the time,
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: but people doing things and kids, I'm like, and you know,
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: we are the wishing wishing Nigga wood type of people.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: I wish the mother And that's okay, you said it.
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: I won't say it, but that's how I feel with
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: my son. I feel like about your husband, do you
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: feel like, No, he's grown, he's fifty three, but if
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: somebody did something in him, you wouldn't be like, I'm
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: gonna kill that person. Oh no, we would get it going.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: Though it's my husband's different. He better my hole of course.
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: Of course, this funny story. I was once engaged to
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: a man uh and we went on vacation together and
• 25:08
  Speaker 1: we parasled and we were out in the ocean and
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: Cosamelo somewhere this is many years ago, and the parasel snapped,
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: I can't swim. I flew into the ocean. He was
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: still on the boat. I called off the wedding. Absolutely,
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: that's a true story. The guy on the boat, who
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: didn't even speak English, was like swimming, Hey, did it move?
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: He was a lifeguard growing up, so I may have
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: told too much that he goes sum me now what
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: I'm just trying to look at all. And last weekend
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: I think it was Miami fiance fell in the ocean.
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: The guy jumped in after her chop the boat. That
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: was very sad. I'm I'm just that would happen. I'm
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: just saying like, that's not no. And all they did
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: was through the life rap for her and got hurt.
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: But he died for love. Yeah, but he should have
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: let the people want to bolt. Do they jack? No?
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: I can I could excuse after I didn't speak to him.
• 26:15
  Speaker 1: We flew all the way back and I said this
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: is not gonna work. And what was his explanation? I listen,
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: I did not. I did not. I did not. I
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: was so upset and so disappointed. He frozed, you know,
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: black Panther was She was like, don't freeze. Maybe he froze. Well,
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: we'll never know. Somebody else wasn't concerned about no, not
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: that worked, but no, no, what I know? So first
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: of all, the parasel I was terrified it was going
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: to come down over my head, but it fell behind me.
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: I had a life jacket on. I can't swem. So
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: now I'm thinking two things. Thank god the parascel did not.
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: Then I'm like, Jaws is gonna eat my legs because
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: I'm in the deepest part of the ocean. He might
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: be thinking that too, So who she were like, I
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: can't I lay it in Jim there, You're like, wait
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: a minute, what if there's Jaws? Um No, my legs
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: are dangling and how far is the boat? They had
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: to turn around because I flew it snapped and I
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: flew out and pow hit the water because like submit,
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: I could have died. And then they flew back around,
• 27:21
  Speaker 1: came back, and then I realized I wasn't gonna go under,
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: and I locked eyes with him and I was like
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: doging battle for him. And you know, it's so long ago,
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: but whatever he said wasn't suffice. It wasn't It wasn't
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: enough because I remember getting on that boat and I
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: was like, this man will never ever bur What if
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: it was like World Star. I'm trying. Yeah, you've been
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: taking lessons, right, I've been. I still can't. I can't.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: You should come in what my son can swim? I'm
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: still learning. Isn't that terrible? Your son can swim him
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: and your legs love building people up in that terrible.
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: That's how I feel when little kids be swimming circles
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: around me and I'm like, why can't I still He's
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: a part of my motivation, going back to that Mama bear.
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: So when when we got our got our kid, when
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: I had him and he's I said, okay, we have
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: this pool, and you know, we'd do so many stories
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: and it is so important. And I did a report
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: on you know, there's this whole study on why people
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: of color don't swim and it has nothing to do
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: with an inability to swim. Um. It was a fascinating
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: study from USA Swim that basically said two things. Um,
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: when they asked young black girls, it was about our hair. Yeah, um,
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: it was about our hair. But more important than that,
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: because that was a very small percentage. You don't want
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: to put your child in a situation where you can't
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: save them. So so many black parents and parents of
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: color can't swim and so you say, I know you
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: can swim, but I need to be able to save
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: my baby. And so as a result, it has nothing
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: to do with like a lack of swimming programs. You
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: know a lot of people pointed to pool closing and areas.
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: It had nothing to do with that. It was I
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: cannot bring myself to put my baby in a position
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: where they would be harmed. And I can't going back
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: to Mama Bear, Daddy Bear, can't go in and save them.
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: So that's been a part of it. So when I
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: had Moses, I was like, I cannot possibly be here
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: and not be able to launch into the first class
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: I took. They taught me diving, so they would put
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: these things and they said first class was diving to
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: get into order. Well, no diving and retrieving, because they said,
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: we won't call it anything. We'll say a piece of
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: something falls on and so we would never use that,
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: you know that visual And so they were five or something.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: I needed it though, right, so they would put it
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: in and I dive, and they taught me how like
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: you know, your instinct is when you would dive in,
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: you'd hold your breath, so you're panicking and something is underwater,
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: go you dive in, well, you're gonna run out of air.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: So they taught me how to push the air out
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: going in so that I could go in. And so
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: it was intense and it was terrifying. But going back
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: to what you will do for love, that was one
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: of the things. I respect you breaking that off door
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: because it's like you can't really do those vows sickness
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: and in in health. And you respect me now because you
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: first were defending him and you said he could have
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: been killed by random sapped him. That what I needed, though,
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: because you can't. You can't with confidence say those vows
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: knowing that you almost let your woman drown. Or I
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: couldn't be confident in hearing him. What about my perspective?
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: He could probably have said them, because I'm sure now
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: I got to go find him on Facebook and I'll
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: ask him why didn't he jump in? But have you
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: ever been at a crossroad? I met your wife too.
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: I met Charlomagne's beautiful wife at the Tyler Perry studio. Um,
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: is there any have you been in a moment our
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: crossroad where you had to say I gotta jump it?
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: Was there ever a confrontation with a God looking at
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: her already not yet hopefully never too old now to
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: be doing Yeah, you gotta gets push ups? You ready?
• 30:49
  Speaker 1: How old is Moses? Moses will be three in April.
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: Three in April. When you when you're teaching one thing
• 30:53
  Speaker 1: about swimming, just remember sometimes it doesn't matter that he
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: can swim, but if kids are around him and grab him,
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: even though if you could swim, so they teach you.
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: If that's the case, tell Moses to go down under
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: the water because when you go, okay, my heart is racing.
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: Now you got my heart racing, I know. That's that's
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: why I tease the kids swimming. And the reason I
• 31:10
  Speaker 1: didn't never know how to swim is and in Queens
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: we didn't have swimming pool. Do you swim now? Swim
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: to swim team? Oh you were yeah, So I took
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: that even with the Beijing and your bid you still
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: jump in the shut up? Is that that okay? But
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: it's just the kids are young, like six seven months.
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: I put them in the water. That's what we did
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: so that when he learning all my kids how to swim, great,
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: see that's good. We did that with Moses. We started
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: at he was a few weeks old. And actually I
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: saw a Gabrelle union as a friend and I saw
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: a copy on the one and I was like, Okay,
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: look at her, she's doing it. I'm showing my infant
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: these pictures like that, and she is a phenomenal swimmer,
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: and I wanted him in the water. But it is
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: truly one of those intimidating things even still for me.
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: But it is so important and there are so many
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: misnomers about why black people don't swim in it. Just
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: when I got involved with this organization and USA Swim
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: and started studying it was after I think it was
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: three and I don't want to quote it wrong, but
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: there was an incident in Louisiana where there was a
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: sand bar and the children fell in and they drowned,
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: and as adults were going out to save them, they
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: were drowning. It's like three generations of a black family died.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: This was about ten years ago. I did the story.
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: It was devastating, and nobody in the family and so
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: the others were forced to stand at the shore and
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: it was just like it blew my mind. It blew
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: my mind, and it was that was also a part
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: of the catalyst for me wanting to help them get
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: the message out about the swim. But you can come over.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: We'll help you. I know, I gotta learn how to swim.
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: You do. How old are you? H's too old to
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: not know how to swim. I should have never been
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: a Disney World. I never saw The Lion King either.
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: I saw the play, the Broadway play The Lion King.
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: What okay you judge me for not playing uno. I
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: have seen the Broadway play, though I know that you've
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: never seen the movie. And I not even been with
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: Disney work Disneyland. I've been at Disneyland in California, never
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: Disney World in Orlando. Why don't you guys take her
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: for her birthday? No? Thank you. I will go with
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: you in Disney World. No we will not. No, we
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: will not do that because they have a lot of
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: kids in that water and everything else there. It is,
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: you know what, It's very very fun. It is truly magical,
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: and you have to get that iconic picture where you're
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: right in the middle and it's behind. Do you have
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: any nieces or nephews or anything. I have a lot
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: of younger cousins. You got you should do a family trip.
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: It's expensive. I think I will go with my friends
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: at this point now and my kids. I have three
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: guid children. You know you should go. I know you
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: give great financial advice. Just it is expensive. I start
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: it is go get the tour. You gotta get out
• 33:55
  Speaker 1: to Orlando. She's already set it up. So when I
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: go there next she's like, we're gonna go. It's it's
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: it's a lot. You want to get a fast pass,
• 34:02
  Speaker 1: you want to get a tour, you want to and
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: then it's gonna it's a lot. How to go next month?
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: Am I too old to be in Disney time? No? Listen,
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: do you know that Disney is the number one destination
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: for couples to honeymoon? I could never honey that's too muchress.
• 34:19
  Speaker 1: And they have the whole Disney wedding collection like people,
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: you know, like they had the Gucci Disney collaboration. They
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: have people go and they design beautiful gowns inspired by
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: the princesses. Yes, is that a worst Yeah? My oldest
• 34:34
  Speaker 1: daughter the childing. So they have the Chilian competition there
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: every April. No, it is, it is, it is truly.
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: You mag it there. I'll let you know you're gonna
• 34:42
  Speaker 1: make it there You're like, you're gonna Mars with Big David,
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: gotta make it there. See, I'm gonna you could go
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: to Morrow. You own like half of Brooklyn. I read
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: every time about you buying another house another town. You
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: should get on playing tonight and right back, just fly
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: right there and go. You know what fascinated me. You
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: had some of the a couple of the women from
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: tendaswin there on this terrifying. Yes, that was terrifying to me.
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: But I feel like people didn't have a lot of
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: sympathy for them. They didn't. People don't have sympathy for
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: We do a lot of shows on UM this type
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: of crime, this type of fraud that takes place, and
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: we did one season, I think this season one or
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: two of our show a woman she was a CIA
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: spy and a man swindled her out of over a
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: million dollars and people had no sympathy for her, and
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: I don't. It breaks my heart. And I try to
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: explain to folks cons are good because they're cons and
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: when people say, oh, that wouldn't have ever happened to me, like, yes,
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: that's what they do. It's like that's their home. They
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: spend their entire day trying to figure out how to
• 35:50
  Speaker 1: get you to get you don't think you could do it.
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: You've never felt taken it. That was Rob Vegan. I
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: saw that you've never taken advantage of ever in in
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: a romantic sit Remember you bought the fake leather jacket jacket.
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: I bought a fake leather jacket. But that was two
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: hundred dollars. You bought a fake It was on the train,
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: but that's the beginning. It wasn't even on the train.
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: But he put the fire against the left and tell
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: me leather doesn't but you, okay, look at under stand
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: out crazy. That's else. I bought a leather jacket with
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: a guy with a flame torch. He gave me a test.
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: It was a great story. It is a great story.
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: Was but that's what. That's how it starts. There's only
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: two hundred dollars to fifty, doesn't that's a lot of a
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: a lot of money, A lot of money, A lot
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: of me that you buy seven my whole life. But
• 36:37
  Speaker 1: two fifty is the beginning. So if he first of all,
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: two fifties a lot of money again, to buy a
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: jacket on a subway with flames with a flame torch,
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: fifty dollars. I could see two fifties a lot. So
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: if you bust some fake sneak, look what you just said.
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: He said it was real and that's what you got
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: got and fake? Shut up? Do you do? You do?
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: You die? I don't do nothing to it. You you
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: got us die? You know? Don't try to? Are you
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: a pitch person for them? No? He's not mentioned it
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: three times, but like any name I mentioned three times,
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: he gets him. Do you have a No? People always
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: ask about your skin. Everyone always talking about beautiful and
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: thermatologist doctor Natasha Sandy. But it's beautiful. But I don't
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: use bejing tammy. Have you ever been swindows? Have I
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: ever been swindled? Like anything? He's talking about the flames like, no,
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: have yes? Fake? I've never bought anything fake? But you
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: get Oh. I can't tell the story no, because it
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: involves the legal stuff. Now because I I know how
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: much did you lose? Just say that much? I didn't
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: lose it. I got it back. But how much did
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: they take before you got it back? Uh? They I
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: had deposited five thousand dollars. Wow, And and then uh
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: because of her service related to my child. And then
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: the service turned out not to be legitimate, and then
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: I had to go and get it get it back,
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: and he could have but twenty I'm like, I hate
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: being caging, but it did get legal, so I can't
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: should be watching like you really now I want my
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: money back. Um. But it's you know, with the dating thing,
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: it's about getting someone when they're vulnerable, and love makes
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: us so vulnerable going back and man, I don't want
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: to make this a thematic show. The love of your child,
• 38:28
  Speaker 1: the lack of love with the guy didn't jump in
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: to save me any of these things. It's it's love
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: and they zero in on it. I had the tender
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: swindler women on and to your point, you think, like
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: at the point they're asking for oh my check didn't
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: come in. If you front me this, i'll give it back,
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: they just nibble away. At the same time, they're love
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: bombing them, they're showering them with gifts, and in that case,
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: he was buying gifts with the money from other women.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: So you're thinking, oh, he just took me on a
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: four thousand dollars you know, dinner, so he's got to
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: have them. Honey, I'm on a private jet. He'll give
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: it back. But yeah, it is a huge problem. And
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: think about it. These are the people who come on TV.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: Do you know how many others that you know who
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: stay silent, right, and who don't tell how they've been
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: taking advantage of It's crazy, but I see how it can.
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: Thank god, it's never happened, but I see how it can. Yeah,
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: why that I saw how it could happen because he
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: was definitely doing a lot of things. He's falling up
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: in a Lamborghini. You don't think he has stolen it,
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: and he's taking them on trips on private plane and
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: then you're believing that his life is in danger because
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: people are acting. Well, that's when he lost charity, got
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: beat up too much. We always remember when they start
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: adding on like so that they say they're the tells
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: with a lie, and so obviously you watch the eyes.
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: If the eyes go down and go up, they're different tells.
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: When people start adding on too much detail, right, that's
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: when you know simple they keep keep your life simple.
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: If you ever. I hate to give you this advice,
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: but when doing a crime show, and I do, I
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: view a lot of interrogation video and looking even with
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: my new show, you know we have a one guy.
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: We have his interrogation video, and I was sitting there
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: the whole time. I'm like, please stop. He just kept going.
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: And you know they say talk yourself into a lie.
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: He just keep your lie first. I'll always commit the
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: crime by yourself. Never because if you're gonna do any
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: with anybody're gonna tell every crime. What else should we do? Angela,
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: don't do it at Disney, no cameras everywhere. No I
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: do a crime show. So again going back to a
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: Charlotte and say you study people. And one of the
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: things I always tell people everybody you get caught when
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: you do it with somebody else. If you're gonna rob
• 40:39
  Speaker 1: the bank, just leave the car out front and don't
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: take anyone because they're going to tell on you. That's
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: the first thing. The second thing is keep it simple, stupid.
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: Keep it simple, stupid. Do not go into the interrogation
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: room believing that you can trick them. You cannot trick
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: those investigators. That's all they do all day long, is
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: here people lie. It's just like I know, you know
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: when people are lying in an interview I do. I
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: interview people and I'm like, this is not a true story.
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: Or this is a TV version of the story. They
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: know right. I want to ask you something because you
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: use this word a couple of times throughout the interview journalism.
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: Do you think there are still such things as objective journalism?
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: Are as everything? It was never objective? It was never objective.
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: How can it be? We're humans. We go home to
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: our lives. We go home. So you're telling me it's
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: like when you know, going back to my show, um,
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: when they say to the jury strike what you just heard?
• 41:34
  Speaker 1: How do you how? So we go in with our biases,
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: we go in with our beliefs, we go in with
• 41:41
  Speaker 1: our perspective, and how you extract that would make you
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: one of the most incredible people ever in That would
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: be Jesus, because I don't think it's possible. And now
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: you can try to suppress some of it. But going
• 41:55
  Speaker 1: back to you know, the book that I wrote, and
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: when we talked about missing black and brighton, people pick
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: white blonde women to leave for a reason, that's not
• 42:05
  Speaker 1: that's a bias, because you'll believe that the audience values
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: that life more or will not turn it from that story.
• 42:14
  Speaker 1: That's the reason why people I was on a couple
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: of shows and people, Well, why do you think this
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: continues to happen? We know the answer, why so then
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: why does that happen? Because people have biases. They see
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: that looks like my daughter, That could be my kid,
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: she looks just like my daughter's friend. Oh my gosh,
• 42:30
  Speaker 1: that could happen in my neighborhood. Reporters are just people.
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: It's impossible, And I know a lot of my colleagues
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: will greatly disagree with me and may not be happy
• 42:42
  Speaker 1: with me saying that I've been in newsrooms for thirty years.
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: I'm in the newsroom with people, not robots, and you
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: hear and see every day. And that doesn't mean it's
• 42:52
  Speaker 1: a negative, right, because sometimes your perspective and bias can help.
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: But there's no way, there's no How do you trust
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: any of these networks CNN, MSNBC, Fox, because it's all
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: opinion based. How do I know that it is giving
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: me the facts as they know them? You don't. I mean,
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: you're asking me a beginning of time question that this is.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: I mean, journalism didn't start with MSNBC. I know people
• 43:14
  Speaker 1: believe that, but it did not. I mean the history
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: of journalism, muck raking. You know, look at we even
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: talk about dirty politics. I won't bore you, but take
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: a second and look at the Thomas Jefferson attacks. I mean,
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: just it is. It's incredible. So I feel like, not
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: to oversimplify, but just even Alexander Hamilton and everyone loves Hamilton,
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: when I bring that up, that was a dirty politics.
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: I mean, this isn't new journalism being used to demean
• 43:42
  Speaker 1: Look at some of the people love cartoons, you know,
• 43:45
  Speaker 1: political cartoons. You've seen some of the political cartoons of
• 43:49
  Speaker 1: Irish people, Italian people, black people. We talk a lot
• 43:52
  Speaker 1: about how we were made to look in political cartoons,
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: these exaggerated, you know, monstrous ways. This is a part
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: of political agenda since people could pick up a pin
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: in a paper without words. So the idea that CNN,
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: MSNBC or fix started this is ridiculous. And the idea
• 44:11
  Speaker 1: that human beings who come in from very different worlds
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: and sometimes the people they're reporting on. I just saw
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: a whole conversation about monetizing journalism. We know people you
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: and I in journalism who make sixty million dollars. What
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: are you going to do to keep that sixty million
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: dollars hit? You're not You're gonna do what you need
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: to do. You're gonna go on TV and say some
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: crazy things if that's what you're paying to say. Anything
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: that's monetized is corruptible. Anything that's monetized is tainted. And
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: when you make millions of millions of dollars as a journalists,
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: which I hope too, it's going to impact you. It is,
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: and that's a lie. And when people say that it
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: doesn't you make eight million dollars a year, what are
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: you going to do to keep making that eight million?
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: First of all, why why And I say that knowing
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: again that I want all of us to have eight
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: to twenty thirty million dollars contracts? But why if you're
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: not a war correspondent, right, because those people are putting
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: it in on the line. What you see out of
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: Ukraine is incredible reporting that I don't and I couldn't
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: ever do. But I do think that that's not though
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: to say that there aren't honest journalists. I think most
• 45:19
  Speaker 1: journalists are honest. Honest and bias are two different things.
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: So what is a journalist because I feel like all
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: of them are bias? Oh, what is a journalist? It's
• 45:27
  Speaker 1: somebody who reports what they see and what they hear,
• 45:30
  Speaker 1: and that's what we're supposed to be doing. Now, what
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: is opinion? That's different. But a journalist. I just did
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: an interview with Cheek and Cootie. They did the documentary.
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: It's phenomenal. It's phenomenal documentary. They are journalists to me.
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: They picked up a camera and they journaled and chronicled
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: the rise of Kanye West into what he is now,
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: which I believe is a genius. So they follow that.
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: That's journalism to me. Anybody that can pick up their
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: phone and the citizen reporters half of the crimes again
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: black people related to police or because one person, George Floyd,
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: she picked up the camera, you know what I mean,
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: she's a journalist. She's also brave and a transformational person
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: in this conversation of police brutality. But at the end
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: of the day, she was a journalist. She picked up
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: that phone and chronicled what she saw in an unbiased way,
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: but then turned it over from the perspective of being
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: black and knowing that that could have been her too.
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: So I think anyone can be a journalist. Opinion is
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: very different, and that's you know, after seven PM or whatever, yeah,
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: I feel like everything is opinion based. Man, No, I
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: don't think that's true. I don't think there's a clear
• 46:43
  Speaker 1: difference I feel between what happens from nine until five
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: or whatever, and then after five. I think I think
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: it's I think so that's part of my representation matters
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: so much, because we do have our own biases that
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: we bring with us. Like you said, but she went,
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: people that also have a similar experience because of the
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: way they tell the story is different. Well, I think
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: if someone is from the outside that maybe doesn't understand
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: cultural things. Well, I think it's a complicated answer because
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: I just had somebody on recently who said, you know, well,
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: as a white guy, I was in over my skis
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: to talk about George Floyd, and I said, wait, but
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: you can't view it that way either, because I don't
• 47:22
  Speaker 1: need to walk in your shoes to tell you that
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: it's wrong. So, for example, I'm a kid from you know, Texas,
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: rural Texas. The only Jewish person I knew growing up
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: was Jesus. Right when I first learned about the Holocaust,
• 47:34
  Speaker 1: I think it was in the fifth grade. My teacher
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: didn't have to tell me that was wrong. My teacher
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: didn't have to say, oh my god, I didn't need
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: to be Jewish, practice the faith, practice the culture, go
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: to a sad or dinner or any of that. I
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: knew what I saw on there was wrong. So I
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: don't personally need to walk a white colleague through why
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: George Floyd was wrong. And you can't let people off
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: the hook by saying, oh, well, no, I think you
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: still have responsive ability to report and know when something's wrong.
• 48:01
  Speaker 1: But I also feel like somebody that can relate to
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: something more when I watch that type of reporting. Yes,
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: it's important to have absolutely like if you have somebody
• 48:11
  Speaker 1: who's from say they're talking about our mayor Eric Adams,
• 48:14
  Speaker 1: and you have somebody that's from here that as opposed
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: to somebody that's from Texas. Yeah, yeah, I agree, it
• 48:21
  Speaker 1: is a little bit. It is absolutely different. I think though,
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: what what what happens though, is people then use it
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: as an excuse not to know right. Right. So I'm
• 48:29
  Speaker 1: a reporter from Texas. It was my job to learn
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: New York. It was my job to learn Flatbush or
• 48:35
  Speaker 1: Crown Heights. It was my job. So I can't go
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: into my newsroom and say, oh, I'm from Texas. So
• 48:41
  Speaker 1: I'm bowing out. And when it comes to race and gender,
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: I watch a lot of people bow out and use
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: that as an excuse. Well, I'm not a woman, so
• 48:49
  Speaker 1: I'll never know. Well, you know a woman, I'm not block,
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: so I'm in over my ski. So I really am
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: gonna I can't talk about that because I don't know.
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: You're a human. You're a human, You're a human, and
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: so I just I am always careful of when people
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: talk about you know that, because they use it as
• 49:07
  Speaker 1: an excuse for them not to know. Our diversity is
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: important in the room for exactly what you said. It
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: sometimes is used against us in the sense that it
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: lets people off the hook for them not to learn.
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: That's why guy loves seeing the conversations where they have
• 49:23
  Speaker 1: panels and different people, different perspectives can talk about the
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: same Well, that's why this show works. I mean, that's
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: why you're a hugely successful show because you come in,
• 49:30
  Speaker 1: you bring your perspective, DJ and you guys bring your perspective.
• 49:34
  Speaker 1: And that's why a show like this And I'm not
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: just saying it because I'm here as a guest, this
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: is what one day. People might not agree with something
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: you say. They like what he says back. That's why
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: The View was such a hugely popular show. That and
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: that's why everyone tried to do panel shows. The key
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: those you have to have the right components, and you
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: have the ability and agency to speak up just as
• 49:53
  Speaker 1: much as they do, which makes the show compelling. You're
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: not just the woman they're representing us. You're a strong
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: voice representing us. We see Williams last week. I was
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: important for you to do that. Wendy has done something.
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: There are there's a morgue of dead daytime careers, you
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: know where people yea, I can tell you listen to rappers.
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: You in the morgue of dead daytime me. I was
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: like COURTV slash rappers, I'm leaving. I'm taking Drake my
• 50:32
  Speaker 1: bad bird Man flap. No what I said, no, because
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: I really it's not the kind of show I would
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: have done. I'm gonna be very honest. But she did
• 50:48
  Speaker 1: it so brilliantly and did it for over a decade,
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: and when people would say, oh she was this, she
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: was Nobody should be feeling sorry for um. Howard Stern, No,
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: A list celebrities still go on his show despite things
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: that he said, and he's the king of media. And
• 51:06
  Speaker 1: I would hear people say I don't want to go
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: on Wendy, but they would go on his show. And
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: I thought, this is a double standard. She is doing
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: the shocking style of performance, which is exactly what he did.
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: But she was somehow penalized in the eyes of some people.
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: But she stayed on for thirteen years, she survived. Google
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: how many failed daytime shows happen while she was on
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: doing more with less. It was a chair and a
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: woman who was an excellent performer in that style of television,
• 51:46
  Speaker 1: and she deserves that acknowledgement. I'm getting out hot now bad.
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: I just feel like people, like I said, listen, there
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: are a lot of things that I did not agree with,
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: and they're the Whitney Houston think bugs me to this day. Um,
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: and there are a lot of other things, but that's said.
• 52:05
  Speaker 1: I felt there was an unfair level unfair, a level
• 52:08
  Speaker 1: of unfairness directed at her style when a comparable peer
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: who did a similar show was still seen as a
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: list what do you what do you think she'd be next?
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: For her? She'd do it. I've been hearing about the view.
• 52:20
  Speaker 1: Maybe I don't know. I don't know because I don't
• 52:24
  Speaker 1: know what it is, right. I mean, she was on
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: with t J. Holmes. I commented only because she came
• 52:28
  Speaker 1: out on with t J. Holmes and and talk with
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: him on Good Morning America. I don't know, I don't know,
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: I it. You know, I've I've only met her a
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: couple of times, and I'm the last time I saw her,
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: we were in Philadelphia and she was at the train
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: depot with some friends. I guess they were her team,
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: some members of her team. And you know, she was like,
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: I look terrible right now, you know, don't look mine.
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: And she started telling me about the the thyroid and
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: what and I you know, I don't know. It breaks
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: my heart. It breaks my heart, it really does. And
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: I don't know as well as you do, Um, but
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: it does. And I'm I don't know, I don't everybody knows.
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: You were close with Prince. Do you feel like his
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: legacy is being represented correctly? Well? I think he had
• 53:21
  Speaker 1: a choice, um to map out a better plan, and
• 53:25
  Speaker 1: he chose not to map out a better plan. And
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: he's very the smartest human being I've ever met. Second,
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: and Nick Cannon. Don't try to say about Nick Cannon. Um,
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: it's brilliant and princes second, And I'm kidding, I said
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: Nick Cannon was second. No, he thought out everything, every detail,
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: and I cannot imagine that it did not once cross
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: his mind that he did not have a plan for
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: what happens. So I guess I choose to zoom that
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: he didn't care what was going to happen. Well, maybe
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: sometimes you don't know the end is coming. You think
• 54:05
  Speaker 1: you have time. That's all he talked about. Was then, really, yeah,
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: the afterlife? What is that like? Yeah? No, he talked
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: about a lot that this is not the end game place, right,
• 54:20
  Speaker 1: that there is much more for us to know spiritually
• 54:27
  Speaker 1: and to be connected to spiritually. I don't think he
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: was as tied to these things as we believe, and
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: that's why he left these things for others to deal with.
• 54:37
  Speaker 1: I don't believe he was as tied to it as
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: people thought. With the show, someone they knew, there was
• 54:45
  Speaker 1: a personal incident that kind of made you gravitate towards
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: this series as well. Right, Yes, we've talked a little
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: bit about it before. My sister was murdered in an
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: unsolved crime and the person of interest, the only person
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: of interest was someone in her life, and so that
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: goes back to what we were talking about, who amongst
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: you could turn into somebody that you don't recognize, and
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: so I don't. I was not there on the night
• 55:15
  Speaker 1: that she lost her life, but it was very much
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: aware over our years. My sage was extremely beautiful, so
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: vibrant and fun like she know how to player, you know,
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: and just like the really a life of the party
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: kind of person. But she had in her past had
• 55:36
  Speaker 1: some very violent relationships and it wasn't just one. And
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: so what I started to talk about more than the
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: night that she lost her life with things that I
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: was present too, and I was there when things happened
• 55:51
  Speaker 1: to her that were horrifying, and it did make me
• 55:54
  Speaker 1: wonder about safety as a woman and all of those things.
• 55:59
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, what's what's your experience been like, you know,
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: hosting the Tamarin Also, what's been the biggest challenge? Oh?
• 56:09
  Speaker 1: Standing standing up for yourself? You know, I mean we
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: all have shows that we had ideas that we want
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: to do and then people start coming in the room,
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: they try to change you or change how you handle
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: the show or what I think that I'm I'm happy
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: that I have the show now in that my back
• 56:27
  Speaker 1: was against the wall when I started it, so I
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: navigate more strategically and more confidently. What I mean by
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: that is sometimes people don't agree with decisions that are made,
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: but I stand up for myself. I'm not going to
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: shrink down, and I'm not going to I went into
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: rooms with people and fought for this show to be
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: on TV, so I'm not going to lean out of
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: that for anybody. But I'm always open to ideas. But
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: the hardest part, really, other than a global pandemic, has
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: been just expectations, right, expectations of myself and what I
• 56:59
  Speaker 1: have of my staff. And when you talk about double standards,
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: when you boss up in that way, oh my gosh,
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: you types. It's crazy. I read things. It's an ongoing
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: joke now with me and my team. I walk in,
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: I go, am I scary as they say, I am there.
• 57:14
  Speaker 1: I learned by the second season. I just learned that
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: it was a template, right, this is what they do.
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: It's like, Okay, now the show is popular, she's out there.
• 57:25
  Speaker 1: What are we gonna say? Difficult? Angry? This that toxic
• 57:30
  Speaker 1: blah blah blah. And don't get me wrong, to someone
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: working as hard as we do may be their definition
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: of toxic. I don't know, so I would never tell
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: someone how to feel, and if that's how you feel,
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: I always listen to the staff. I'm there to have
• 57:45
  Speaker 1: the conversation. But if you believe that we are going
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: to give our audience a product that is beneath them,
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: we're not doing that. I mean we call our audience
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: the tam Fam. I work every day to make sure
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: that when guest like you come, I said, Charlemagne's coming out,
• 58:02
  Speaker 1: I don't want people just to think that he is
• 58:04
  Speaker 1: a shock jock or whatever their perception. He has layers.
• 58:07
  Speaker 1: He's a husband, he's a dad. That's why we brought
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: you on on the show that you were on, because
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: I said in a room and said, he's not one dimensional.
• 58:15
  Speaker 1: I don't want him on for two minutes to come
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: on and talk about some headline that he said this
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: about somebody and got into it or somebody. No, I
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: want the audience to know him. You know, people still
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: come up to me now and talk to me about
• 58:27
  Speaker 1: that episode episode about mental health people, I mean random
• 58:30
  Speaker 1: people in an airport. I saw you on tammeron Hall
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: talking about mental healthy. Well that's interesting. Because I actually
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: had and i'll take you behind the scenes. I had
• 58:37
  Speaker 1: not a clash, but I had to sit down a
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: producer and say, this is what we're doing with him,
• 58:42
  Speaker 1: because it was important to show you as the multidimensional
• 58:47
  Speaker 1: human being that you are not Oh, this guy on
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: the radio that I may or may not have heard of.
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: You are internationally famous. This show is internationally no. But
• 58:56
  Speaker 1: that said, everybody don't know you. So you got to
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: take him through the journey. And so for me that
• 59:01
  Speaker 1: was important. Now, that might have been a hard segment
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: for that producer because it took more time, but it
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: paid off and they loved the segment, and I was happy.
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: You love the segment and the audience resonated. So you
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: know nothing. You don't get to do something easy and
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: just expect there to be rewards. You go looking at
• 59:18
  Speaker 1: her watch. I know you got to know. Damn. You
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: could have just said the man who would have jumped
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: in the ocean for me, you know how to swim now,
• 59:33
  Speaker 1: so you don't know you think you wouldn't take you.
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: We just don't know how. Don't you said something earlier?
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: We're fools and we'll punk them, Like what does that
• 59:41
  Speaker 1: show you said something earlier that made me think because
• 59:45
  Speaker 1: you said it was something about loving fear, and I
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: was like, well, what I fear overpowers love. I think
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: it's better to be feared. But I'm saying, in that moment,
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: you could love this person. Quit trying to make excuse No,
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: I can't saying. It's just like, oh, I need to
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 1: hear both sides. You need to hear an objective journalists.
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: It's an opinion of journalist. What other side? What could
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 1: he tell you? I was terrified that jumping in as
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: a trained lifeguard to save her, he didn't even have
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 1: to go reach for me. Maybe just peddle around me
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: and say, babe, it's gonna be okay. You're they're gonna
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 1: pull you out. What if you threw a rope, rope,
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 1: go get your If it throws on rope, okay, I'm
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: gonna wrap it around my waist, pull me in. No
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: damn it. Before you leave. I had one more question,
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 1: because if you know you're looking at your watch, I'm
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 1: not looking at my watch. My husband call um. So
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: what do you do when somebody tells you there's a
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 1: guest coming on and they don't want to talk about
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 1: a certain topic, right, do you? Oh? I think about that.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: I do, because, for example, some guests don't like talking
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 1: about XS and thearing the current relationship. I agree with that.
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: I would never have DJ Envy on about another relationship
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 1: because he's not his wife is there. I always tell
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: people like they'll have a we'll have a guest on
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 1: and they'll say, let's ask about you know the man
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: she dated three years ago that happened to be famous
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: or whatever, And I said, but she's not with him now.
• 1:01:15
  Speaker 1: Imagine going to a dinner party and I ask you
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: in front of your new guy about the guy three
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 1: times back. That's rude. And so I feel like there's
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: got to be some decency for me, right, And I
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 1: don't want anybody to feel ambushed. I mean, we had
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: Andrew Gillman. I mean that was a tough one and
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: people were mad that I didn't say, well are you gay?
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: And I'm like, why did I need to ask that question?
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: That wasn't He told me what he wanted me to know, right,
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: And I can still do a thoughtful interview. There are
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: certain things that I'm happy we didn't talk about here
• 1:01:53
  Speaker 1: because it's just I'm not afraid of any answer. But
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: we know we live in a clickbait work, right, and
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 1: so you both are going to be guests on my
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 1: show very soon. I could have my team dig up
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 1: all kinds of well once I read on the Shade
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: Room and I saw this, and dada, what purpose does
• 1:02:11
  Speaker 1: that serve any of us? So for me, I want
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 1: you to feel safe. I want you to feel that
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 1: there's grace and mistakes. That's why I said with Nick
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 1: Cannon being able to get back on air, he deserved
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: that shot. I want to interview Kanye West. I don't
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: agree with some of the incoming traffic that's coming his way.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: I think people deserve grace. I think they deserve space.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 1: But that said, when you have a high profile individual,
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: they should be prepared to answer tough question. Yeah. I
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: thought you gave Andrew a lot of grace and I
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 1: liked how you handled that because it didn't feel exploitive.
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 1: And that's what I don't want to do, right And
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 1: even when people and you guys do a great job,
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: when folks come in here and they're in the midst
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: of a scandal, they should be prepared. Oprah says, you
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: cannot tell me what to ask you. You are in
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 1: charge of how you answer right, and so I always
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: come in knowing that people might ask me something that
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: I'm not like. I don't fully talk about prints for
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: a lot of reasons, but I don't. But I'm always
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: prepared um for it. So they should be prepared. We're
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 1: big kids, We're on a big stage. You got a
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: big stage, and if you want to stand on that stage,
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: you got to be ready for the questions. And so
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: that's how I approach the show. Some people have been
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: nasty about it, and I just decline their appearance. I
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: just say, we can't. We can negotiate, and I some
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 1: people will say, oh, I can't talk about it for
• 1:03:28
  Speaker 1: legal reasons. I know when they're not telling the truth
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 1: about that, and I'll say, okay, well let what about this.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: But if there's a hard know and it's important to
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: the audience to know, then I would rather pass. And
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: I have said come back when you're ready to talk. Okay,
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 1: And congratulations on everything too, last seasons and new show
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: Sunday nights, Sunday nights, UM and Sport TV. I'm super
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 1: excited about that, the Tamerin Hall Show, the book. But again,
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 1: thank you guys. This is my first time. I was
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: a little bit nervously, not scared nervous because none of
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 1: you would jump in the water to say, man, I
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 1: knew that I can't many. Well, I'm happy because now
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 1: it's gonna be ill and I went one and be like,
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 1: there's gonna be a number. We're in the middle of
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: Mexico and the ocean. All I can do and Ngel,
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: I love you. You're gonna be on my show soon.
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: DJ Envy, Charlamagne come back anytime. Thank you so much,
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: and please do not start any static with me and
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 1: Nick Cannon. I have nothing to do with that. Whatever
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: comes to, it will come to. All I can do
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 1: is ask the questions, camera, give me my bag, bron James.
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 1: I'm calling it the Breakfast