Latest / The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast / Episode 237. Tips for New Technicians Getting Into Supermarket Refrigeration with Aidan Lucey

Transcript

Episode 237. Tips for New Technicians Getting Into Supermarket Refrigeration with Aidan Lucey · The Refrigeration Mentor Podcast

• 0:00
  Trevor: Super excited that you're here. Always trying to share a little bit of knowledge to get you to the next level.
• 0:01
  And this week we have a really Smart technician who has been training, developing himself for many, many years, has tickets in many countries and been doing supermarket CO2 supermarket for quite a while now, building up his knowledge, growing his knowledge, always train, always learning, uh, his name's Aidan Lucey, and he's been, , in a few of my courses, , and he always is diving deeper to learn about refrigeration.
• 0:02
  And And also, check him out on social media because he's been sharing lots of great tips and tricks, you know, on LinkedIn and different platforms where he's sharing all, we'll dive into a lot of that stuff. Eden, how you doing, brother?
• 0:03
  Great, Trevor. It's great to be here. Thanks a lot for having me on. Well, no, thanks you for taking the time to, to chat with us because I really believe that the more, We talk about how service calls go, how refrigeration is, how we got into the industry.
• 0:04
  It's going to help more people out because everyone's journey is a little bit different. You started out in, uh, Ireland, correct?
• 0:05
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, originally I applied for a plumbing apprenticeship, but I didn't get it. So I didn't have a vehicle at the time. So every year, every summer, I'd go on holiday down to Southeast and have a lot of family there.
• 0:06
  So my uncle was busy and I asked, you know, work with him for a few weeks. He said, yeah, sure. Like, I had no idea what he did. I told refrigeration was just, you know, the fridge in your kitchen. So I apprenticed with him and my first job was like 80 split units and a car dealership. So it was a learning curve, you know, and everything's very different over there.
• 0:07
  Like here, it's all, um, Unistrut and pipe clamps, right there. It's a lot of cable trade. Yeah. So you're running trays, zip tying everything. So it's more prep, but then it's easier in the long run. And then everything is different names too, right? You come here and someone's like, Hey, pass me the Crescent Ranch.
• 0:08
  Yeah. It's crazy rich. I'm like, you mean the shifter? They're like, what's a shifter? Like, and then you get caught up in that, right? So yeah,
• 0:09
  Trevor: a
• 0:10
  Speaker 4: lot of
• 0:11
  Trevor: differences. Yeah. Yeah. No, I did the same thing when I was in Australia. There were so many different terms that they use versus what we do here in Canada. So it's just learning those terms.
• 0:12
  And when you do that, that really helps that integration when you do travel to another country. So you were doing, you were doing refrigeration there. , and how long did you do it?
• 0:13
  Speaker 4: I started in 2005 there and finished my apprenticeship there in 2009. And it's much the same as the Canadian system.
• 0:14
  You're with your employer, you go to school back and forth. You have to serve four years, but it's seven phases instead, you know, level one, level two, level three. But your phase two, which would be your first going to school is six months. Which is good. I like, I like
• 0:15
  Trevor: that actually, but a lot of people don't like that.
• 0:16
  You know what I mean? Cause school is, can be a little bit tough. What was your thoughts on that? Cause that was back in 2006, maybe 2000. Yeah,
• 0:17
  Speaker 4: 2006. It was, it was very good. Like you walk in and like, this is your cubicle. If you need a light, if you need a receptacle, you have to wire it, but you have to do it to code.
• 0:18
  You have to pull your own pipe, your own wires, your own breakers.
• 0:19
  And
• 0:20
  Trevor: that's how you learn, right? It's that, that experience, even now, like when you, you've been into lots of my trainings, but it's when you go out and you actually apply that, that's when you really, the learning happened. So you were doing that and you were doing your apprenticeship and, uh, six months.
• 0:21
  That's, that's why I think here was two months across the board in Canada for apprenticeship. Most places is two months, then 10 months of work, two months, 10 months, pretty much. But that's a good, I like those apprenticeship styles that way. There's different ones here in Ontario. I learned that there's blocks.
• 0:22
  So you, you work four days a week and then you go to school one day, not blocks, but a day. Day school. So it's one day a week you go to school and then four days you work. But either way, getting into that study is very important. Uh, did you have a lot of people over there just challenging and trying to skip school and stuff?
• 0:23
  Like, like skip the school portion?
• 0:24
  Speaker 4: No, honestly, never came across it or heard of challenging anything until I came to Canada. I don't even know how you go about it, to be honest.
• 0:25
  Trevor: Yeah, yeah, I know. So here in Canada, a lot of people, even. And, , like level one, level two is like, Oh, let's just, you know, jump.
• 0:26
  Like I'll challenge it. I'll write the exam on past, but there's a lot of stuff that I learned from taking those blocks. Even though I remember back that I didn't really always enjoy it, but here, you can get, , unemployment insurance where you don't want other countries, so that helps out the guys, you know, the time off, but I've found a lot of value just in, you know, Meeting with the techs, talking with different, , teachers and doing different projects, kind of like you did.
• 0:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it was definitely worth it. I found like originally, like, I didn't want to go back to school and redo the apprenticeship again. Cause I was like, I mean, I already did this. I already want to do it again, but I was like, well, this is the only road forward. So it's either this or do something different.
• 0:28
  So this is what I want to do. So I redid it definitely found value. Like there's, yeah, some days they're like, you know, This is a drywall anchor. This is a drywall screw. They can be slow. Then other days you get a different perspective and you get a different electrical instructor's perspective of, you know, this is how I draw my ladder diagrams.
• 0:29
  I think it does bring a lot of value to you overall to grow.
• 0:30
  Trevor: And I think after you have experience, like now when I read refrigeration, I understand it 90 percent of the time. Like, and I look at stuff like that. I remember I read hundreds of time. I didn't understand. But now after doing it, touching it, feeling it, seeing it, hearing it from different people, when I read something, watch something, I, I get a really good grasp of a refrigeration.
• 0:31
  So anytime I take a course or anytime I'm in a, at a manufacturer's training or whatever, whoever's training, it's, it's, I I'm getting that understanding just because I've done it so many times.
• 0:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 0:33
  Trevor: So when you came to Canada, you had to do, redo your whole apprenticeship. There was no, nobody talked to you about trade recognition.
• 0:34
  Or anything like that, you could
• 0:35
  Speaker 4: do trade recognition, but what I found was, you know, they're like, okay, to fill out a bubble sheet or what's a bubble sheet. You know, I'd never done multiple choice tests before over there. It's, they ask you a question, you just short answer, long answer. You just need to know.
• 0:36
  So it was very different. I found. So I figured there's no, if I'm going to do it, let's do it properly. I don't want to, you know, challenge May as well just do it over. And I'm trying to remember when I finished my final exams there, it's three or four exams, not just one red seal. There's like separate electrical, separate air conditioning exams.
• 0:37
  You have full exam week. Yeah.
• 0:38
  Trevor: And so when I went to Australia, it was. Similar. So I didn't have to go back to full school, but I did have to do a six week program, five or six week program. And one was on electrical. Cause it's different there. The wire color is different. You know, it's no different where, where you were at, we're at in Ireland versus Canada.
• 0:39
  Right. Wiring color could be different. Codes are a little bit different. So it's really going in and redoing that and testing yourself. And what's good about that is I have actually went and I'm starting to add more like red seal questions, challenging questions to my training programs. And reading the questions from like 20 years ago, I'm like, wow.
• 0:40
  I still got to go back and learn how to do these equations, you know what I mean? Get back to how to calculate how much watts versus amp versus volts, you know what I mean? Something that you don't do all the time, you don't do in the field. But just that knowledge of knowing how to do it and putting it on paper and be like, this is how you do it.
• 0:41
  This is what size of contactor I need, or this is the size of wire I need. You may not do it every day. But it's a huge amount of value at some point in your
• 0:42
  Speaker 4: career. Yeah, just crucial small steps. Like when I first went to school here, you know, it'd been almost 10 years since I'd written an exam or done anything, right?
• 0:43
  So like, okay, today we're going to do, uh, fractions and long division. I'm like, oh, no, like don't remember that at all. Right? Like bomb your first test, 30 percent in your first math test. Then your last one you're hitting 80s, 90s.
• 0:44
  Trevor: Yeah,
• 0:45
  Speaker 4: because it comes back, right?
• 0:46
  Trevor: Yeah. And it's putting the work into you spend the time on it.
• 0:47
  I notice more now When I do a course or I do training I put way more work into it than I did 20 years ago for some reason, you know, and even I did I did well then but I think now I value the learning now because now I can I'm passing that information on to people. So I really want to make sure I'm correct.
• 0:48
  So I'll dive in a little bit deeper because to help other people's, I need to know, I want to know a hundred percent and accuracy of what I am talking about. If not, I say, I don't a hundred percent. No, let's go find it out and dive into it deeper.
• 0:49
  Speaker 4: Well, that's the difference. Come more self aware because I remember doing like secondary school back home, which is high school here.
• 0:50
  I remember being in math class and I'm like, man, like, None of this is going to apply, I'm going into the trades. I don't need to know math, sitting in refrigeration and thermodynamics and physics, but you enjoy it because you can relate it to something you're passionate about. It's not just the train is leaving station A, when will it get to station B, right?
• 0:51
  Trevor: That, that's the thing. A lot of people say, Oh, I'll go into a trade of, uh, you're no good at, uh, math or, you know, good at school, man, I know that some of the top people that I know that know numbers that know equations are in refrigeration. You know what I mean? I'm not going, I'm not going into university.
• 0:52
  I'm not, you know, because I just don't know the numbers. I'm not good at school, but man, the skilled trades workers are way better than a lot of people, especially refrigeration technician, a lot of different numbers we need to know equations, you know, controllers, we need to know so much airflow volts, all that stuff.
• 0:53
  So I think we, we do more school work that we don't know. You know what I mean?
• 0:54
  Speaker 4: Like that applies. Well, big time, right? To give you the question, you know, you got ice at minus eight Fahrenheit. How many BTUs is it going to take to get it to steam at 224? You know, it's like a full page of equations by the time you're done.
• 0:55
  But once you do them a couple times, it's just step by step and you, you can apply it and you can picture it.
• 0:56
  Trevor: , and I like that it's applying a picture because I really feel now that I can look at a system and I can just listen, I can touch it, I can see the temperatures and pressures, and I understand what's going on inside that, like, I look at an evaporator now versus 15 years ago, I'm like, what's actually happening there?
• 0:57
  Well, we know it's boiling off. You know, I can actually picture what's happening, and then if we don't have the temperatures or pressure, well, that's not happening. There's no boiling off, or if it's boiling off at the beginning right at the TX valve, versus flooding where you got liquid going all the way back to potentially the compressor.
• 0:58
  Speaker 4: And that's the big difference, right? You'll see a more junior technician right away, they're going to the board, they're going to the controller. Because that's where they think they're skipping past the basics, whereas you'll get a more senior tech, and they'll be like, well, your honeycombs are plugged, your fan's not running, the drain is backed up into the coil, now the coil's frozen, right?
• 0:59
  Like, you gotta do the simple steps first.
• 1:00
  Trevor: Yeah, that's a great point. Like how often you've been, you worked on all over the world now you work in different countries and how often is it a super complex and you do a lot of supermarket, um, how often is it the controller or a super complex problem at a store?
• 1:01
  Speaker 4: Rarely, like just last week I had two calls at the same store, one was 20 feet produce case, open case, two shelves. And they're complaining it's warm here, it's cold here, it's too cold here, and you know, all over the place and spotty. So right away I look and I see there's growth coming through the honeycomb to the customer side.
• 1:02
  So, you know, it's plugged on the backside, you pull that, you see the baffle is plugged, you pull the baseband, the drains are plugged. So, you know, your day isn't anything complex. You're just washing out a case. But that
• 1:03
  Trevor: comes from experience, because what you said earlier, a lot of tech, junior techs, and even more senior techs that have maybe a couple years in, but Haven't really been in the supermarket industry, , or maybe been on construction for an example.
• 1:04
  Now they go into the supermarket, uh, like a service calls, , it's controller or it's an electrical. It's like this thing that you got to use your senses. Like you said earlier, you go in and you take a look, you listen, your first. Thing was like, you seen the growth coming out of the honeycombs. , and I remember the first, one of my first calls that I got caught on where I didn't even know there was the honeycombs was, it would be an issue.
• 1:05
  So I go up and I wash out the coil, I clean it all out and then I get it back up and running and pulls down to temp, but all the air is, you know, it's coming out the back product in it yet. And so everything's fine. You know, so then they loaded up a product and then I get a call back the next day or a couple of days later to go to the store and I'm like, what's going on?
• 1:06
  And then it's the honeycomb that's plugged up, you know, but then you never forget, right now it's drilled in your brain forever. Yeah, but it's always, it's always the, uh, the, the base, mostly the basics, you know what I mean? For sure, but we'll get, I've seen it even with me, I would get caught up. I got a call here and there is warm.
• 1:07
  I start thinking about all these crazy things, the racks out of gas, but 90 percent of the time it's not.
• 1:08
  Speaker 4: Oh, for sure. Like there's one particular store and I know they'll call and say the five deck meat wall is warm and it always happens, you'll go check. They've one satellite compressor beside the rack, it's tripping on high head.
• 1:09
  Just cause you've seen it that store so many times, I know right away, the condenser is plugged and this is the first one to trip. So you go up and check, put your hand over the fan. It's all pushing up the sides on the roof. You know, you need to wash and it's just simple stuff, right? You can put your hand on your dropleg, your dropleg smoking hot.
• 1:10
  Or is it dumping on the receiver from the A9 and just all those little simple checks. You don't even have to take your tool bag out for, but you then verify with your data.
• 1:11
  Why don't
• 1:12
  Trevor: you explain what a satellite, unit is satellite system to everyone?
• 1:13
  Speaker 4: Um, well, we found is usually you just have a system added on after the fact and the rack doesn't have enough capacity for it.
• 1:14
  So they'll put a satellite system on. So this conventional compressor is going to run, say just this lineup. As opposed to a booster where you're piping it to the rack and boosting the rack capacity specifically.
• 1:15
  Trevor: Yeah,
• 1:16
  Speaker 4: excellent.
• 1:17
  Trevor: So that's a good way to put it because people around the world are going to have different terms for it.
• 1:18
  So thank you for, for sharing that with us. You've started doing on call years and years ago. Talk about some of your experience on call because this is something that I used to not like taking all the time.
• 1:19
  I used to stress out about it because I wasn't experienced at it. I was actually, here's the keys. You're on call this week and I was doing construction for years. I wasn't doing service. So that's super stressful. I remember the first time walking into rack room and it was down, I was on call all by myself in the middle of the night and it sucked.
• 1:20
  Um, but over time, over years, I got better and better at it, but I didn't have any coaching. I didn't have a lot of people just dive in and most people get thrown in on call. If you figure it out, if you don't figure it out, call me that's, you know, that's the way it is, but I'm trying to change that in the industry, right?
• 1:21
  Getting more coaches and mentors and giving advice before you go out there. Let's talk about some of your experience on call when you first started doing versus now and some of the tips maybe we can share with the audience.
• 1:22
  Speaker 4: I think you just need to learn to prioritize your calls for sure. Like when you first start on call, like you said, you're thrown in and that's usually the make or break of a person at a company, which sucks, right?
• 1:23
  You're thrown to the walls and it's like, Hey, make it through the weekend. We'll see you Monday if not. Oh, well, we'll give you a reference, right? Like it can be crazy. Like you walk in the racks down or you walk in and there's a big cloud of gas and there's oil everywhere and you don't even know what circuit to go to first.
• 1:24
  Right. It can be pretty stressful, but I find if I get say four or five calls the weekend, I'll look and be like, okay, well, three of them are self contained units. They can empty them. One's a bunker. Okay. Well run there, shut the ball valves off, frozen up, empty it. I'll prioritize, you know, this store where it's saying I got 40 feet of casewarm.
• 1:25
  Okay. And you'll go to that first and then work your way back, depending on what comes in. But the really good thing at Rack where I'm at now is you have a backup. But guys are really good at coming in and helping and people always answer the phone. So you're never on your own, which is nice.
• 1:26
  Trevor: And that's building relationships.
• 1:27
  That's huge building relationships because you, you help them out, they'll help you out. And that's building actually a team and the way it should be, you know, because, um, anybody, and I give a lot of tips to, to technicians is like, the more on call you take, The better you're going to get quicker, right? So if you take on call every month or every couple of weeks, which is hard, it's, this is not easy, but you're going to learn fast.
• 1:28
  And I know I'll ask you a question, Aiden. If you had someone new couple of years in five or four or five years in getting the supermarket and they say, Aiden, can I take your on call this week? But can you be my backup? If I get stuck, what are you going to say? I'd be a hundred percent. I'd be impressed.
• 1:29
  Right? Like it's the only way you learn. And not enough people do it that way there, because it is a stressful thing. Oh, I always think in the worst, but really, if you, I, I, I keep, uh, teaching some of my students and technicians, like think about as a normal workday, instead of getting a call from dispatch, you're getting called maybe from a store, you know, and you've got to think about, okay, maybe this is dispatch and dispatch you to call and they're not stressed out because it's not there.
• 1:30
  It's not their product. They're just like, Oh, you got to call. That's a warm case. The service manager calling. He's like the world, the whole building's coming down. You know, my self contained is not working two doors. Like, okay. Just like you said, prioritize your call. Okay. Let's go there. We'll, we'll check it out.
• 1:31
  And I always say, don't be afraid to, to talk and be honest with the customer. Say, yeah, you know, this is a two door. I totally understand. We got to pull this product, but we can be back here on Monday. I have a whole store that has no gas in the rack. I need to go there and I'm going to try to come back or get someone to come back here.
• 1:32
  Just be honest with them. You know, what are your thoughts
• 1:33
  Speaker 4: on that? You have to be honest with them. It's the only way they'll trust you. Because then later on when you go back and say, Hey, you got a fan motor out. I need you to bring a work order. They'll do it. Because they believe what you're telling them, right?
• 1:34
  So I've had that with a lot of stores. You go in, like I said, it's a two door, to you it doesn't seem like a big deal, but maybe to them it's their top merchandising case on the weekend. I'm there freaking out. And if you just let them, you know, have their stressful moment, we all need it, and then just say, okay, well, this is what we can do to fix it.
• 1:35
  This is what we're going to do. And does that work for you? Because that's kind of where we're at right now. And here's my cell. If things get worse, call me. We'll keep, we'll keep in touch. We'll figure it out.
• 1:36
  Trevor: And that's what a lot of, uh, end users just want, just some feedback. Cause I've heard of people just, you know, they get a call or they called out and they never heard back anything for like three hours.
• 1:37
  And so say it's the three hour callback minimum, you know, and some companies have different things. Yeah. So the technician will call back at two minutes, two hours and 59. So. You know what I mean? But that's, if they call and you have time, make that phone call, just say, Hey, listen, I'm on a call right now.
• 1:38
  I seen that you call. Can you text me the thing or email me the thing so I can understand, I can read it. And then I can go back to your call, leave a message, just get that conversation going with them so that you're thinking of them and that you're, you're aware and they're, they're on the list.
• 1:39
  Speaker 4: And that's what I do in our answering service.
• 1:40
  Instead of having them call me, I have it set up so they'll text me. So I'll get the customer name, phone number, address, and the issue. And all I have to do is answer, Okay, yes, I got it within 10 minutes. Or if I don't, then they'll call me. So I'm not trying to, you know, I'm in a walk in. I'm not going to get your call.
• 1:41
  I'm defrosting a coil or something. As soon as I come out, I'll get all the text messages. So I'm not trying to get a notepad and write down the customers and Then I can check it off on my list. I can copy it to my notes app and here's who I called. Here's what I didn't call. I love
• 1:42
  Trevor: that. And that's efficiency and a lot of companies may not have this, but this is something that you could probably set up on your own Aiden, right?
• 1:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah. Like I started doing it. Like our operations manager is great. If anybody has new ideas or tips, bring them to her and she'll see are they feasible to do. And you know, it just makes everyone's day easier.
• 1:44
  Trevor: Yeah. I love that. And so. On call once again is a, is a, is a hot topic for a lot of people because it does take, I remember work, you know, work in my.
• 1:45
  40, 50 hours during the weekend and working 40, 50 hours on call. You know what I mean? And it's just, you're running and running, , but I like what you said earlier, it's prioritizing your calls, and. You gave a good tip, you know, a two door versus a 40 foot lineup.
• 1:46
  Uh, can you give a couple more how technicians can prioritize calls when they're coming in, if you get six, seven, eight? And when, when should you make that phone call to another technician for that backup?
• 1:47
  Speaker 4: I would look at it as if I'm on a call and it's simple, like, say, cleaning out a case. It's not like a leak or a compressor and I got two or three waiting.
• 1:48
  I know I'm good, but if I'm on, say, a rack down and I got two or three waiting, then I'm calling someone. If I'm going to be tied up for more than three hours and I got two to three waiting, then I'll call someone. But a lot of times, right, it can be, okay, I'm setting up sprinklers or you got one fan out.
• 1:49
  Okay, I can pull this end fan, drop it in the lead and get you through the weekend. And then in there, I'll shoot off the email to dispatch to get the parts ordered on Monday. Because if I don't do it then and there, it's gone out of my brain because I got more calls coming. So it's a lot of, you need to just do it as it's happening and not be like, I'll do it later because later you're going to be sleeping.
• 1:50
  Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 1:51
  Trevor: How often this is a good question. How often can you move a call to a Monday? Because this is expensive. You know, it's on call. Sometimes it's overtime, double time, triple time, depending on where you're at. You know what I mean? Yeah. How often can you move that call to a Monday to get it on a normal, normal hour call?
• 1:52
  Speaker 4: I think it depends on your relationship with the customer and if they trust you to tell them, it'll be okay. We'll empty it. You know, we'll empty the case. I'll shut it down. We'll take the alarms out so you don't get woken up in the middle of the night and we'll move it to Monday. But if they, if they're new or they, they're not sure, you know, some customers a little more worried than others, then they'll want you down in there.
• 1:53
  But then a lot of times as a technician, you just have to be a bit more assertive and be like, Like, no, this, this is not a major emergency. It's an emergency for you, but it's not the end of the world. We're going to shut it down. I'll try and come back tonight. If I can, we'll be back here on Monday morning. I think that comes in with working with your office, right? You have to help your office and give them the information so they can in turn help you and make sure things get looked after because, so you work till three or four in the morning. You're not coming in that Monday morning at eight for that customer, right?
• 1:54
  So you need to make sure you close, close all the, uh, loose ends. And I
• 1:55
  Trevor: think this is important because it all depends. Every customer is going to be different. , but prioritizing your calls is very, very important. , and if you can, uh, especially in the summertime is when you've got 10 calls hold and it's just you, you don't even have a backup.
• 1:56
  You're going to have to move some calls to the Monday, whatever you can do. And yes, I don't like using the bandaid word, but get it in a situation where you can wait till Monday. For example. You know, sprinkler, you know, if you need the sprinkler and set it up, it's not, that's not a permanent solution, this is to get them through that night or through that day until you can get someone else there, because you might already work 30 or 40 hours in the last three or four days, you know? So maybe it's, you need to get that next guy the next day up there to do it. But that's not a permanent solution.
• 1:57
  I think I really like that. And everyone's going to have their own, uh, own opinion, right? Like, Oh, well, the customer, some customers that you build a good relationship and they trust you, you'll be honest with them. Like, okay, we can move this on to Monday and we'll get you up and running then. And some other ones is no, you're going to have to be there and do it or have someone go there.
• 1:58
  I love that.
• 1:59
  Speaker 4: And that's what it is when you're busy, right? You're triaging your calls. You're like, okay, I got this down. Well, I can shoot there. I can do this and get you by, or. No, I'm going to push it or it has to be done. But I think a lot of that, knowing what you can and can't push, there's going to be a lot of nervousness if you're newer, right?
• 2:00
  Cause you're like, man, what if I push this and this goes down or they lose five grand in product or, you know, I think a lot of that comes with just being more confident in yourself as a technician and experience.
• 2:01
  Trevor: And that's, that's the thing too. Is it like, uh, is it a pop bottle, you know, a pop bottle case, like a cooler, you know, versus meat.
• 2:02
  You know, you got to know that meat's going to be a lot more money than they can, if the pop warm up, the pop warm up, you know, a two door bridge. So understanding that call when, when they talk about it, you're going to, and this comes with experience as well, you know, um, because on the weekend they want their meat up and running, they're selling barbecue season, it's summertime, you know, pop now, okay, that can wait.
• 2:03
  You know, so they're just asking questions,
• 2:04
  Speaker 4: well, and that's the thing, like, you know, when you're as a tech trying to make the decision, just either way, make a decision. Whether you think it's the wrong one or the right one, just make a decision, decision and move to the next call, because you got to keep going.
• 2:05
  Trevor: Exactly. And that's the thing, you just got to keep going and don't stop. And just, uh, and if you can get help, get up. If not, then you just. You know, push through, because one thing that's what I see more and more, not all businesses are like this. If the technician has just worked a 12 hour night shift, you know what I mean?
• 2:06
  They worked all day, then they had to do alcohol and they, they're not forcing them to go to work that day. And if you did it right, you send, just like you said, send that information to dispatch. Here's the calls that I got last night. These are the ones that I got to. These are the other ones that are still old, and I reach out to them, this is what I said to them.
• 2:07
  We need someone to go there this morning or with it by noon. You know what I mean? Um, there's some companies that aren't, aren't like that. So maybe think about finding companies that are willing to work with you like that, because you're putting a
• 2:08
  Speaker 4: lot of work in.
• 2:09
  Well, and our offices are great with that, right?
• 2:10
  Like, I'll have a list and I'll email it off then and there, and they'll see it, and they will get someone back there. But I'll just never tell the customer, Hey, 8 a. m. Monday, I'll just say Monday at some point we'll be here. I don't want to tell you a time because I'd be lying to you because I have no idea what time the dispatch was played.
• 2:11
  I can only see my side of the calls. I don't see the other 19 things they have going, right? So I can tell you Monday at some point and that's kind of all I can do.
• 2:12
  Trevor: how long have you been in the industry when you started getting confidence taking service calls?
• 2:13
  Oh, it takes a while.
• 2:14
  Speaker 4: Like, you know, I qualified in 2009, but I mean, when you're qualified, you're still You're still five years post qualified till you really know what you're doing.
• 2:15
  Trevor: I totally agree. I was the same way. , and there's, I've talked with lots of people Oh yeah, no, I'm really good at doing service calls, you know, under three or four in, yes. But honestly, for me, I think it was six, seven years in when I really like felt comfortable taking on call, any call that come in, I go challenge it, like not saying that I knew all of them, you know what I mean, but It's, I wasn't, you know, I had that confidence level.
• 2:16
  What are some of the things that you did to, to build that confidence over the years, , in refrigeration?
• 2:17
  Speaker 4: So just looking for the information where I could find it and say, I'm working on a call and I have an issue and, you know, you think you got it, but you're not sure, well, just Google it or write out what, you know, what is happening, you know, you're troubleshooting this transformer.
• 2:18
  Well, just draw it down, put your KVA. Rating and, you know, put your, you only have the amperage, one side, the voltage, the other, you can figure it out and then you can size your new one. Just small steps. I feel like when you can write it and you can see it, then, you know, you're like, okay, it's not just in my head.
• 2:19
  This is what's happening.
• 2:20
  Trevor: Yeah. And I like that. I think that we're in our industry refrigeration. Most of us are visual, you know, if we see it, we touch it, we feel it. That helps us. And there's lots of us in the nom theory. Now, like we all learn. In all the different ways, by touching, audio, visual, kinesthetic, all these different, we're all, we all have it.
• 2:21
  Some people are more visual than kinesthetic versus audio, you know, cause this is on the podcast. A lot of you are listening. Some of you are, while you're listening, you're visualizing what he didn't say. Uh, and, but the big thing is for what I like, what you said there is that write it down. Okay. So you get a better understanding.
• 2:22
  So you're, you're listening. to the unit run. You get your pressures and temperatures on that. You draw it out of that, that circuit. Okay. Well, my pressures are this, this, and this, what should they actually be? And I think that that's one of the big things that, um, when I started doing, I got better as like troubleshooting systems that work totally fine, you know, and it's really just doing a, doing an assessment.
• 2:23
  It's not really troubleshooting, but I like to say, troubleshooting, you're troubleshooting a system that doesn't have any issues with it. So then you start to recognize, Oh, well, this should be the pressure. This is what happens when the soul night closes. This is what happens when it opens. This is what happens with the EPR, uh, sport valve, you know, sort valve, sorry, um, energizes
• 2:24
  Speaker 4: things like that.
• 2:25
  Yeah, just understanding what a component is and what it does. Like, I know I've been back to calls, say, previous, someone had been there and they just didn't know. They're like, Oh, well, the compressor keeps tripping off. And you look and you're like, well, the CRO is not opening. It's a close on rise of outlet, not open on rise of inlet.
• 2:26
  But it's just experience, right? .
• 2:27
  Trevor: And, and, uh, for shorts, taking more measurements, air flow measurements, electrical measurements, pressures and temperatures. And honestly, I know now from working with manufacturers, working in the field, working with technicians all over the world is that if you're a great technician and somebody sends you all the right information, as long as they know the information, you can troubleshoot most systems or help guide them to the direct spot that they're running into issues.
• 2:28
  It's probably a condenser issue. It's a valve issue. It's, you know what I mean? It's a, it's a compressor issue at this point. Um, but the biggest thing I find that a lot of newer technicians, and when I, when I say newer is within first five years, you know, because a lot of people start out maybe in construction, like myself, they don't all get into service or they're in HVAC and they move over to supermarket refrigeration, or they're in another trade and you get in the supermarket refrigeration, so they do have.
• 2:29
  Experience, field experience. , but what are some of the things that technicians starting out should be, , taking down kind of like a checklist, like when they're doing a service call?
• 2:30
  Speaker 4: I would say a lot of times someone will call and say, Hey, this is my pressures. I'm like, okay, but what's your saturation?
• 2:31
  What's your saturated condensing? What's your saturated evaporation? Cause then you really know, and you can compare it to airflow and then you know, what's actually happening. Because if you're just checking pressures, it's like, but what does that mean? What's it doing? Always check your superheat, just
• 2:32
  Trevor: the basics.
• 2:33
  Oh, superheat's good. Well, what does that really mean? What does good mean to you versus good mean to me?
• 2:34
  Speaker 4: Exactly. Yeah. No, it's a freezer. It should be this range. It's a cooler. It should be this range and just the basic thing and you're like, well, I don't have my probe. I can't check. Well, okay. Can you check the outlet of the TX?
• 2:35
  Is it a freezer? Is the outlet minus 21? Can you go get your stuff? Come back? You know, things are ballparked. .
• 2:36
  Trevor: And that, and that's the thing in refrigeration, it's facts. This is what I learned after working with some gurus. They're like Trevor, and I gave them all this information. That's just generalized, information that is guessing or assuming.
• 2:37
  Yeah. Refrigeration is facts at the end of the day, you get the numbers. , you know, just like you said, the saturated condition, that's, that's huge. How many refrigerants are out there today? 70, 80, a hundred. I don't even know. There's so many, but if I said, Oh, the suction is 55 PSI. What does that mean to you?
• 2:38
  Aiden.
• 2:39
  Speaker 4: I mean, I need to know what refrigerant it is. I need to know saturated, like there's so much more follow up questions you need to know. So,
• 2:40
  Trevor: okay. So we'll get into this, this checklist. So the S S T. So the saturated suction temperature is a good one. That's for your evaporator or your S C T saturated condensing temperature or S D T.
• 2:41
  Some people call it saturated discharge temperature. So that's, so that's two checkpoints that you want to know right away. You said also, uh, superheat, you know, superheat at the outlet of your, , evaporator as well as the inlet of your compressor. What else information that you would like to see?
• 2:42
  Speaker 4: We'd check compressor.
• 2:43
  Check what it's rated for, check what it's amps are actually pulling, you know, check across the contactor. Do you have any voltage drop? Is the contactor actually pulled in all the way? Yeah. Is the crankcase heater shutting off when the compressor runs? Because I've had ones that's, you know, the auxiliary stuck and now the compressor is tripping on internal because it's sticking on the auxiliary.
• 2:44
  That's huge. Like just lots of basic steps and, um, You know, make sure your voltage is good. If it's three phase, make sure, you know, you're within your range. You don't have like 480 on one and 575 on another one. I did, uh, I did a podcast
• 2:45
  Trevor: with, um, Bitzer a few weeks ago with Dean and we were diving into that.
• 2:46
  There was one thing on one slide that he did was, is how to size a contactor properly. And I never really thought about this, but there's two ratings on the contactor. Do you get, you need to get the amps, but you also need to make sure it can handle a locked rotor. On it rating. And you know what I mean?
• 2:47
  It's just going through those steps that you may have never done before. But that contactor is one of the key things for a compressor. If you have a failed compressor, even if it's a 300 contractor, you should replace it because that compressor is probably 10, 000. You know what I mean? Oh, a hundred percent.
• 2:48
  You always change your stack components, right? Cause like you said, they're a fraction of the cost of a compressor. Yeah. And you want that compressor for your customer. If you're replacing it to last for decades, hopefully, and they should last decades. I'm sure you've seen compressors out there that last a long time.
• 2:49
  So what are the things on a service call that you would like to see checked by a technician? I
• 2:50
  Speaker 4: mean, a lot of times I'll download the case manual and I'll check what airflow should be for manufacturer and you know, I'll put the velometer against the honeycomb, make sure it's actually moving the correct amount of airflow, you know, check if the case has been washed recently, check the plenum and the fan and everything is put back in properly.
• 2:51
  Because I've seen a lot where the top coil cover is over top of the back wall lip and then you get a bunch of bypass. And on low flow cases, it's, it's a killer, right?
• 2:52
  Trevor: Yeah, no, exactly. So with the velometer, when you're checking, just say it needs to be 400 feet per minute, doesn't even matter to units.
• 2:53
  When it's a low flow, just say you're going up and you're just checking it, what are some of the things that you would like to check or tell that, say that guy on call, things to check?
• 2:54
  Speaker 4: Check the honeycomb, check if you got ice in the back wall, you know, check a bunch of those plastic price tags are after falling down in around the fan or in the return.
• 2:55
  Because lots of times it can be small silly things and, or I found sometimes on micro thermo, the valve is set up, you know, the way you can pick your valve, is it axial or radial, the flow, the flow is the wrong way. So it's communicating incorrectly to the valve, which again, the valve is fine. The board is fine, it's just the wrong one is picked.
• 2:56
  Trevor: Yeah, I did a podcast with Charlie Cunliffe from MicroThermal, and he showed me that too. He's like, you go on MicroThermal, and well, if it's piped this way, You got to put it in radio if it's piped this way. So, you know what I mean? So it's just little tips and tricks that you may not have thought about.
• 2:57
  Um, but it shows it right on the screen too. So when you look at it, here's your inlet, this is how it should be, which is, which is good, but that's a little tip. That's a great tip. Um, I've seen it also too. And I'd done this when I was in the field, all the fan blades are a little. Little bent, you know, the ice banded, let me just bend it back to that 42 degree.
• 2:58
  What are
• 2:59
  Speaker 4: your thoughts on that? Because that was the wrong way to do it. I mean, if you need to do that for the night, you get them bites. You can get the right fan blade. Sure. But not as a permanent fix. Yeah, exactly. Cause
• 3:00
  Trevor: you'll notice, then you get your velometer, put it up. It's, it's the wrong thing.
• 3:01
  Cause I used to, Oh, I'll just bend this one a little bit this way, this one, that one, and you're totally messing up the airflow, which. Which could lead to issues. Another one that I, uh, seen for cases was the wrong, um, shelves. Have you ever come across that? Somebody put in the wrong shelves.
• 3:02
  Speaker 4: I've seen the right shelves, but they're at the wrong angle.
• 3:03
  So they're actually breaking the load line. Yeah. Yeah.
• 3:04
  Trevor: And that's, that's the one, that's a tough one too. It's like, why is this case never working properly? But all of a sudden you have that, that the load line, it's just like putting product over the load line. And now instead of your air going into your return, your supplier is going out onto the floor.
• 3:05
  Speaker 4: I'll always look for when I think it's humidity or an air, you know, an air curtain issue. I'll always look at the product. Say if it's a meat, you know, with the saran wrap over top, is there water droplets under the saran wrap inside the packet? So you know it's getting warm, the cold air is hitting it, or if it's solid, is it sweating inside?
• 3:06
  Then we know we got a warm air issue, whether it's the AC in the store, something's not dehumidifying, and the air curtain's pulling in more humid air than it's rated for, or is there actual warm air penetration in the case, or is there piping penetration not sealed? Or those big rubber knockouts in the back on and we're losing a ton of our air at the bottom.
• 3:07
  Trevor: . And I love that one too. A lot of refrigeration technicians don't understand humidity enough or don't check it. You actually send me some screenshots, uh, last week or a few weeks ago, but one of the stores that you were checking the humidity level, what do you want to talk about the importance of that at a store?
• 3:08
  Speaker 4: I mean, go to any case and look at the sticker beside the data plate. This case is designed to work in a store, no more than 75 degrees Fahrenheit or 55 percent humidity. So if you go past that, your outside design parameters, same as going outside the operating envelope on a compressor, it's not going to do what it's meant to do.
• 3:09
  . And this is so
• 3:10
  Trevor: important because you, customers will be like, there's something wrong with your refrigeration case. There's something wrong with your refrigeration cases. There's issues, issues, issues, sweating the water on the floor from it. Actually it's their HVAC system that's not working, or their dehumidification or recoils gone or whatever it is.
• 3:11
  Um, so it's important to understand that airflow and humidity are some of the things that I really believe that we need to understand a little bit more. As technicians, until you see it in an habit, you, it's, it's hard. It's hard to, to say, oh, well the store feels comfortable while we're in here, but it doesn't mean it's the right for those cases.
• 3:12
  Speaker 4: Yeah, like look at the glass door freezers. Are they sweating? Or your open multi deck cases, look at the top pan behind the honeycomb. Is there water droplets everywhere? Because the reason it came up at that particular store was they'd um, self contained cases, two back to back, and they had a condensate pan below, no floor drain.
• 3:13
  But the condensate pan was heated by the discharge line. And the store was way too humid. So there was way more moisture in those condensate pans than they're rated for. And then the compressors aren't running long enough to build up any heat to boil that off. So they're like, well, can you put a pad in?
• 3:14
  I'm like, well, no, you're no breakers are rated for it. You'd have to get new breakers. You have to pull new conductors or you're going to chase the floor from 10 feet away at the case and dig the whole floor up. There's the fixes, the humidity, the cases are doing their job. So, I mean, the best I can do right now for you is to get the shop back.
• 3:15
  I can pull the water out. Or we can put in, you know, a bigger bucket behind there. But I mean, we're not, we're just kicking the can down the road. We're not fixing the problem. And I love
• 3:16
  Trevor: that. That's where you go and dive and find the root cause of the problem. This is what business owners and contractors, service managers, operation managers are looking for, as well as the end users.
• 3:17
  Because there are so, I work with so many people and especially the, A lot of the newer techs who don't know, who are thrown to the wolves, you know, they go and de ice the case, which they're doing the right thing, they de ice the case, or they fix a plugged drain, you know, this one case is frozen up, the rest of them, they took a look, it doesn't, they don't look frozen up, but this one here is plugged up, but this one here is the one furthest away from the drain, so they blow out that drain, they wash it out, oh, it's all great, But the other three could be plugging up as well.
• 3:18
  So they didn't blow out those drains and that just comes from experience. And all of a sudden case two freezes up because they didn't fix the root cause. The root cause is that all the drains are plugged up with slime. We'll say, and you got to clean all of them. What are your thoughts on frozen up case?
• 3:19
  And that, because it happened to me before I've washed out case before. And three weeks later, I was back there. For an element issue or a relay issue or an issue. What are your thoughts on, uh, on
• 3:20
  Speaker 4: washing out cases on cases? I mean, it goes, it's compressor. I was giving you advice on, but it applies to them too.
• 3:21
  It's like a fail compressor is a symptom, like a frozen up case is a symptom. It's not a cause. So do you have a bad relay? Do you have a bad fan delay? Do you have the right, uh, heating elements in there? Are they all working? Or is it hot gas or cool gas? Do you have the right split across it when it goes into defrost?
• 3:22
  Is your differential set correctly?
• 3:23
  Trevor: And one great thing is, like you said earlier, you can look a lot of this stuff up. You can go down rabbit holes very quickly. Yeah, there's a lot of stuff that you can look up. Do this on your own time. I know you do a ton of training and learning on your own time outside of work, as well as, you know, It's in work because trying to train people, educate people, because the more people you'd share your knowledge with, the more it's going to make your job easier and help them share the knowledge with other people.
• 3:24
  Um, one of the things that, uh, that I really like about, uh, the service is hanging at, like talking with other technicians as well as talking with customers. What are your thoughts on working and, uh, with the customers and building relationships with them?
• 3:25
  Speaker 4: You have to, you have to spend the time and go in and they might not know what's wrong, but you need to ask them, say like, you see this case every day.
• 3:26
  So I know how to fix it, but you know what your normal is for this case being like, well, it's warm in this section, but this one always runs a couple degrees warm. It's like, okay, well, maybe we need to check. Is there a TX issue? You know, they know their store, they know what happens. So, I mean, you need to spend the time because then you're going to turn around and be like, actually, I want to get your case to wait till Monday, or I need to run this sprinkler line through your roof hatch.
• 3:27
  Is that okay? You know, they're only going to be so inclined if you're going to be so. Polite and helpful for them.
• 3:28
  Trevor: . And I think it is once again, building the relationship with them. And I, I talked to lots of technicians, these customers, they don't want to do any work. They don't want to, they don't want to spend any money.
• 3:29
  Well, maybe they can't spend any money. Maybe they're, they're strapped. Do you know what I mean? It all depends on that customer, but you need to know that sometimes it's not the store owner. So there's going to be a different relationship to. A manager to a different manager every week versus someone who owns the store.
• 3:30
  So you've got to have a different relationship like that. What are your thoughts on, on, uh, building the relationship with the store owner? Cause I know you work with some that, you know, this is their store versus someone, you know, that they're every month there's a different, or every couple of months there's a different, uh, manager.
• 3:31
  What are your thoughts on that? I
• 3:32
  Speaker 4: mean, honesty is number one. If you make a mistake, tell them. If you got something fixed, you tell them and they'll trust you. Like, I have stores where it's, if it's under a thousand bucks or two thousand bucks, they tell me just fix it. Don't even let them know, because I've been working there for years and I've seen the issues and they know I'm going to look after them.
• 3:33
  And if this needs to be done, we'll do it. If this can wait, we'll wait. Because like you said, we don't know what's going on in the background. At the end of the day, we're just advisors. We find the problem, we fix it, and we give you the advice of, Hey, you should fix this. And then we cover our ass and put it in our service report.
• 3:34
  But if they don't choose to do it, that's like, I mean, it's like when the transmission goes in your vehicle and you don't have the money to do it. It's like the mechanic would love you to do it. You don't have the money. What can you do?
• 3:35
  Trevor: And that, and that's, uh, I like the point that you bring up to your service ticket.
• 3:36
  Let's talk about that a little bit, because I think that's something that nobody really talked to me about. Oh, just put what you can down on there. What are your thoughts on the service ticket and how important it is to, to fill it out properly? Oh, the
• 3:37
  Speaker 4: more detail, the better. Like if you can get a picture of the model serial number, because how many times they'll say, Oh, Hey, someone just looked at this a month ago.
• 3:38
  You go check. It was a case 20 feet away, six months ago. You know, you got to put as much detail in as you can. Cause a lot of people reading them, they've never seen these cases. They don't know what they are. So they need the detail. Like if you've been somewhere for eight hours, you can't just put case fixed.
• 3:39
  Yeah, who's going to pay that? Okay, cool. What did you do? What did you change? It's like, you know, got to site, checked airflow, checked the drains, they were okay. Checked, found the coil was frozen, de iced the coil, reassembled case, ran the case, went to the rack, ran it in, defrost. Checked the differential, let it run a full defrost.
• 3:40
  And then, you know, you do a second one because chances are, it's a couple of PSI out again, but you got, you got to write all that down. And, and like,
• 3:41
  Trevor: what you need to do is be detailed on that. It's not like. Oh, well, I was driving and it took me 20 minutes to get to the store and I walked around the store for 10 minutes, you know, looking at the different keys and I talked to this service man or this, uh, deli manager.
• 3:42
  And then I talked to this that don't, you don't need to put that stuff. You need to be detailed in what you did and you need to, you need to write in their terms as well. You know what I mean? You can't get all technical on them and saying, I checked the SCT and the SCT was low, so I had to go and check this flex combiner.
• 3:43
  You know what I mean? He don't, don't dive into that. Be right. The stuff that they're going to understand and then talk to them about that service ticket and ask them a question. Do you do that? Do you know, ask them, do you have any questions on this? Do you know when I said this here, like I had to change the oil filter, do you know what that means?
• 3:44
  You know what I mean? Do you go through that, your service ticket with some of your, customers?
• 3:45
  Speaker 4: I do, yeah, and I find a lot of them really appreciate it because, you know, you're talking to them as an equal, you're not talking down to them, and then they'll know, and I'll say, hey, you know, if you get, I had an alarm a couple weeks ago, it was drain monitor for a freezer, the, it had gone too cold, and they had no idea, so I said, hey, like, Let's go to the, let's go to the walk in and I show them, you know, this is your heat trace.
• 3:46
  It should be warm. If it's not warm, you see an alarm for this call right away. Cause otherwise we could split the pipe. And then instead of changing a heat trace, you know, we're pulling the product, we're warming the freezer up. And you know, they're very appreciative because it's not their job to know it's your job to know and help them to understand.
• 3:47
  Trevor: Yeah.
• 3:48
  And I like what you said earlier, we're advisors for them. Finding that root cause that meat issue, all the compressors failed. Uh, change of compressor, 10, 000, you know what I mean? That's not a, that's not a good deal report. You got to explain, well, we, we didn't, the compressor wasn't getting oil. The compressor wasn't getting oil because it had a blown oil separator and the oil filter was plugged, uh, because of the oil, the blown separator.
• 3:49
  And, you know, and you talk to them, you don't, you know, you don't have to be. Exactly what technically you did, but you've got to explain why they're going to pay 10, 000 and what you did to fix that problem, you know, just saying, Oh, well, 10, 000 did their look. That's why some customers like you were just an expense.
• 3:50
  These guys coming in are just the expense, but when you build that relationship with them. They're like, Oh man, I'm so happy that you came here. , one of the things that I, I took me a little while to learn this, but I remember is every call that you go to is a brand new call. So don't take your baggage from your last call.
• 3:51
  If that store manager was not very nice to you, you don't know what they they've been through all that day. Somebody could have quit. Someone could have stole from the store. Someone could have got hurt, whatever at this, you know what I mean? You don't know what they do. So maybe they did take some stuff out of you, but you got to listen.
• 3:52
  You got to listen, like you said earlier, you got to listen to them. They know their stuff better than you do, but you got to listen to what they're saying. And sometimes you'll get the store managers that are, that they're angry. They're having a bad day. Have you ever come across that?
• 3:53
  Speaker 4: Oh, so many times.
• 3:54
  But I mean, we get like that sometimes too, right? We're having a bad day. We're angry too. It happens to everyone. Not that it isn't frustrating at the time, but I find a lot of times if, you know, if they're not getting overly aggressive or rude, you know, let them say their piece, get it out. And then they tend to almost.
• 3:55
  Take a breath and calm down, you know, maybe they just needed to vent like we all do they're having a bad day And it's just don't take it personally.
• 3:56
  Trevor: Yeah, you
• 3:57
  Speaker 4: just happen to walk in at the wrong time and say hey your compressor's gone
• 3:58
  Trevor: and I like that because they're, they could be like, well, someone was here two days ago and there's someone three weeks ago and this, and they all pinpointed back to that, that call that you just did.
• 3:59
  But really it's not, it has nothing to do with the call that you just did. And don't take that baggage from them and bring it to your next customer. That next customer, you know what I mean? Doesn't didn't know about that. If you can, and it's hard, you know what I mean? It's hard because maybe you've been working 70 hours that week and it's Friday night at five o'clock at that same store that they only call on Friday night at five o'clock when they get called on Wednesday, which is super frustrating.
• 4:00
  But you go in and you talk to them about it, and when you build a good enough relationship with them, you say, I know the problem, I'm looking it up here in the microthermal or E2, you gotta pull that case. , and if you got a good relationship, you can explain what they need to do, you know what I mean?
• 4:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's frustrating, it's not fun sometimes, but at the end of the day, you gotta remind yourself, you're getting paid. And then you're going to your next call. You're not the one that has to sit here and pay for this repair. You're not the one that has to empty the case. You're still getting paid. And yeah, it's frustrating, but you're being looked after.
• 4:02
  Trevor: Yeah. And then when you build that relationship with them over and over again, because this is what I think some, uh, stores are frustrated with is because every time it's a different technician, you know, not the technician's fault, but if you're at a bigger company in a big city where there is a lot of, you know, there's a lot of issues that happen at big stores, you know what I mean?
• 4:03
  Especially if they weren't. , they're not maintained properly, not proper maintenance because the end user may not want to do it or the contractor doing the maintenance don't do it correctly. There's many different factors. We don't need to dive into that. , but when they see it, one technician come in and a different technician come in to a different technician to get frustrating for them, right?
• 4:04
  Especially if it's the same problem or the same case. What
• 4:05
  Speaker 4: I find in those, like say it's a new tech going in, you know, send them with the, one of your more senior people for a couple of weeks and then introduce them to the store manager, be like, Hey, this is so and so, you know, he's new, he's, he's learning, he's doing his thing.
• 4:06
  And then they at least know they can, if there's an issue, they can bring it to them or they can ask you and you can talk to them and say, Hey, you know, what's your side, what happened? And, you know, try and figure it out.
• 4:07
  Trevor: No, and I, I really liked that because that once again shows faced with the, with the new technician gives them a little bit more confidence, you know, going into the store.
• 4:08
  Cause I meant to, so I've been to so much, just like you, so many service calls, very first service call to that person from the company, maybe. So you have to do a good, great introduction. And you, you, um, And you want to have a good rapport, right? Yeah, you just have to win them over. Yeah, exactly. And it takes time sometimes on certain customers, right?
• 4:09
  Because maybe they had a bad experience with two or three other contractors or different technicians. Um, but for me, what, what I started doing is like, I wanted to be the technician that they called. Every time they wanted me to go back to that store, that's when, you know, you got a good relationship and you're doing a good job because we need to be technical.
• 4:10
  We need to know a lot of technical stuff. We have to be technical savvy, but that's not the only part of our role. It's about building that relationship. Like you said, you build enough trust where you can go and, , fix stuff at, you 000 was a certain customer for an example. You know, just go and fix it.
• 4:11
  We trust you because we build that relationship, but that's more the communication side. That's more of the soft skills. If that was the first time you're strolling up, there's no, just go fix it. You know, it takes time to build these relationships. And I, I love that.
• 4:12
  Speaker 4: That's the thing we found, like we had one big customer and independent and they kept getting lots of roof leaks.
• 4:13
  So we're like, we're going to be up here for four days doing your maintenance. We have a magnet roller at the shop. Do you want us to go over your old roof and pick up all the nails for you? They were like, That's an option? Like, yeah, we're already up there and I mean, obviously it's chargeable time to like, yeah, have at it.
• 4:14
  You know, we got two boxes of nails and screws and staples and off the roof. And, you know, they're over the moon.
• 4:15
  Trevor: that's where the biggest difference is between a great technician and someone who's just trying to get by. And a lot of people are going to say, Oh, well, that's not my job.
• 4:16
  That's a general, they should call somebody else to come and do that. But that's how you bring more value to your customer, which leads into making more money for your business as well as yourself, because now they want you to go there for all the calls. That's huge. I love that. Uh, cause I always hated going up on a roof and I see two or three compressors laying on the roof or that, that drove me and still drives me nuts when I see pictures online and there's someone just.
• 4:17
  Leave the old compressor up there. Like, what are you doing? Like that's not bringing value to your customer. And there's some people that, Oh, well, they're not paying for me to remove it. What? Like, it doesn't matter. You got to, you got to be the value
• 4:18
  Speaker 4: add for your customer. But you got to have some respect in yourself because great.
• 4:19
  They don't want to pay for it, but that's a reflection on you. Maybe they don't want it taken away. Okay. But take it off the roof and put it by their garbage can and seal it, take the oil out, right, and leave it by their garbage can, and then at least. You've done the most, you know, the oil is not going to eat their roof membrane and rust all over the roof or another company comes behind and they're like, Oh, Hey, you know, whoever was here before a bunch of hacks.
• 4:20
  Right? Like,
• 4:21
  Trevor: yeah,
• 4:22
  Speaker 4: I have some respect in yourself and your company too.
• 4:23
  Trevor: Yeah,
• 4:24
  Speaker 4: no, I love that, man. This is
• 4:25
  Trevor: a, we can go for our, I can talk with you for hours about this because this is awesome because it's really important to understand the different dynamics of the oil. Of doing a service role. Like you've been doing it for a long time.
• 4:26
  What are, say one or two tips? Like if someone's starting out, they're in it three or four years, they're doing service calls or they're working on supermarkets, uh, what are two or three tips that you could give them? Besides all the, like the 25 tips you give already, what are two or three tips you could, uh, give a few technicians out
• 4:27
  Speaker 4: there who's just getting started?
• 4:28
  I'd say the key refrigeration is anytime you make a change, whether it be set point or you adjust a flow con, whatever it is. Patience. They say wait 15, 20 minutes, wait a half hour. If you adjust an EPR, come back in a couple of days, because chances are it's off by 5, 6 PSI if you adjusted it. Take your time.
• 4:29
  Refrigeration is just, the hardest part is patience, because it's never instant, instantaneous change.
• 4:30
  Trevor: And it's so true. It's so true. Oh, I just adjusted the TX valve. Oh, five minutes later, I got to adjust it again. It's not at that point. Oh, I got to adjust it again. You know what I mean? Just, yep.
• 4:31
  So, Aiden, we're going to do this again for sure. How can people get connected with you if they want, they want to learn more from you or, , or just have a conversation with you? I'm on LinkedIn. So, I mean, message me on there. We'll have to talk to and help anyone. I love that.
• 4:32
  Aiden, thank you so much for taking the time to chat with us. And, uh, we'll see you all again at the Refrigeration Mentor Podcast. Thanks Trevor. Great being here.