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JUST SA Polokwane — Kashrinda Mailula · TIPS Podcast

• 0:09
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the Trade and Industrial Policy Strategies official podcast, Tips Talk, the show where we delve into the fascinating world of economics and its impact on global development.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Tobani Kaye, and today we are asking why is it important for local and provincial government officials in the Limbopo province to understand the impact of climate change and the imperative to decarbonize our economy as well as make the transition just.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: We are finding ourselves in Bologuane today.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_01: We see how government officials can turn policy into action.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: I have a lovely guest with me today.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: Can you please introduce yourself to the audience?
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: Good morning, Kabani, and thank you so much for the opportunity to speak to you.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: My name is Kashrinda Mailula.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: I am a senior environmental practitioner for Mopani District Municipality here in Nobo, and my work mainly focuses on air quality management, climate change response, and environmental compliance.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_00: I oversee the implementation of the key sector plans of the municipalities' environmental management division, which are the air quality management plan, as well as our recently approved climate change response strategy, which I am responsible for.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_00: So on a day-to-day basis, I am responsible for managing compliance of the atmospheric emission licenses that we issue to them, as well as ensuring that the district, municipality, both from government and our communities, are working towards promoting clean air, sustainability, and resilience to climate change.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: All right.
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: Seems like you look after the air.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, definitely.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: We're trying our best.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: I see, I see.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: So in the past day and a half, what would you say your experience has been?
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_01: What has stood out for you in the training?
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so the training so far has been an incredible experience for me.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I have an understanding even before the training of just transition, but I still needed to learn more specifically on the green economy, just understanding what it's all about and how it links to just transition.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: So it was kind of beautiful to be able to see how the two concepts merge and how we can implement them in the municipal level, and also how we can incorporate to the issues of just transition and green economy in the implementation of our climate change strategy at the district.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: When it comes to just transition policies, how do you infuse them just in your day-to-day basis, in your line of work?
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so as I said in my introduction, I'm responsible for the climate change response in the municipality.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: So Mubani has recently approved the climate change response strategy earlier this year.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: And in our climate change strategy, we have aspects of just transition.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: We have some implementation or activities that we hope to implement through the climate change strategy, such as emission reduction strategies and ensuring that all the activities that are undertaken within the municipality drive towards low carbon emissions and also hopefully moving towards net zero emissions.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_01: So this is a coal-based province, if I'm not mistaken.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_01: By that I mean there's a lot of coal that comes from this province.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, definitely.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: If you're saying there are strategies that you are implementing or trying to implement that mitigate emissions, can you just name one strategy?
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so the coal reserves are mainly located within the Waterberg district municipality around the areas of Le Palale.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: So in the area where I'm working within Mopani, we do not necessarily have any coal mines, but we do, however, have the industrial processes like your metallurgical industries and the mines.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: So the main commodities that side are your copper, your phosphate, and your magnetite.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the largest commodities that we have in the mining sector of Mopani.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: And in those processes, there is a lot of emissions that are generated.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: They generate a lot of greenhouse gases, and most of the operations obviously do make use of fossil fuels such as your coal.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: So our approach in the strategy is to ensure that in using the atmospheric emission licensing system, we actually drive the industries in a direction of being more sustainable in the way that they run their operations.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: So our licenses would normally require the industries to implement cleaner production strategies in their operations.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: So, as I've said, we do monitor them on an ongoing basis, and they are also required to submit to us the improvement plans that they have in areas where there may potentially be or where there are exceedances of the emission standards or of the greenhouse gas emissions.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: So we don't necessarily have emissions from coal, we don't have coal reserves, but it's secondary use of coal and the emissions from the metallurgical processes or the operations from the mining activities that I've mentioned.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: In Moban, when we talk about this just transition, what challenges or opportunities do you see?
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, so obviously, speaking of challenges, I will relate it back to the response that I just gave now to say moving towards a cleaner future will have an impact on livelihoods.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_00: There are some job cuts that will be experienced when now we are trying to transition to a cleaner economy and moving to a greener economy.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_00: There will be some jobs that will be lost.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_00: And obviously, that affects a lot of people.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: Now we will have to go back and try to reskill those people.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_00: And that's something that may take a long time, and we don't know the impact that it will have on the economy and on the livelihoods of these people while we move into the transition.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: As good as the transition is, we need to unfortunately also consider these risks, which are highly prominent in our district, looking at the fact that we rely mainly on the mining sector.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I've also indicated that our economy is also dependent on the agricultural sector.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: So our climate change strategy identifies or it recommends some of the activities that you know will benefit the agricultural sector, such as your climate smart agriculture, where we still need to be transferring skills to the majority of the community so that they are able to cope with the transition.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_00: And with on the side of the opportunities, of course, moving to a greener future will have a number of opportunities for the municipality.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_00: Mopani, as you will know, we have an abundance of sunlight.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: So that is an opportunity for us to maybe venture into building solar farms.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_00: We already do have some solar farms that are built within the district that are contributing to the grid.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's one of the opportunities that we can actually venture into.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_00: I'm looking at things like solar, and because we are an agricultural municipality, things like biogas, you know, from your farm waste or your animal waste is one of the viable opportunities that we could potentially get to benefit from.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I've already mentioned the issue of climate smart agriculture.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: Although it will need a lot of reskilling and maybe some training and resources for our communities to eventually adapt, it is one of the ways that will help us to be able to cope in the face of climate change.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: The issue of water scarcity is a major one for the whole country.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: And Mopani is not exempt from that.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: We do face issues of water scarcity.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_00: So the sooner we get our people, you know, acclimatized to climate smart agriculture, the better it is for them to be able to sustain themselves, whether it's from subsistence farming or commercial farming.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: And we also have opportunities for public-private partnerships.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: As I've mentioned, that, you know, for transition to be just, it needs to be inclusive.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: So this essentially means that as we transition, we need to involve all stakeholders that are involved in the change or that are affected by the change, whether directly or indirectly.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_00: And this means that government must find a way to work along with the private sector, whether it's you know, industry, your NGOs, your research institutions, to work towards, you know, ensuring that everyone is included in the transition and ensuring that all the skills that are required for us to be able to cope in the face of the transition are transferred to our people.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_00: And lastly, I'll just mention the issue of empowerment of our communities.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's a very big opportunity, you know, looking at the work that we're already doing in the municipality to empower our communities.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_00: The issue of just transition, it gives us an opportunity to be able to train and retrain our communities to be able to adapt to the changes in the climate, to be able to cope and find ways to still make a living in the changing climate and in the just transition.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: The municipality is already doing a lot of work in terms of community awareness and involvement.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: One example that I can just mention is the schools competition that we run in the municipality.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: We call it the Clean Earth School Competition.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: It's under our Clean Earth campaign.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_00: The competition is run annually, and the aim of the entire competition is to get learners, particularly looking at high school learners, to get involved in the issues of environmental sustainability.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: We are also hoping that, you know, with these lessons that they learn, that they take with all the projects that they are implementing in their schools during the competition, they will be able to take those lessons and, you know, share them widely within their communities.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_00: And also for the learners themselves to develop themselves and actually become world leaders and leaders in issues of the just transition and sustainability.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Kashinda.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: No, that's interesting.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_01: And as you are speaking, I won't lie, just also in conversation with other people, right?
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_01: I'm wondering as a whole, as a country, what is our take on technology?
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_01: Whether it be in agriculture, I mean, when I read up on modern technology about agriculture, you will find that they have drones, you have AI involved somehow with uh monitoring crops.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: I've heard at an event like a G20, whereby it was an Indian um scholar or professor.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: He was saying that solar farming isn't just restricted to a specific land, but they double up in a sense that you have an agricultural field, but above it, you have solar panels.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, absolutely.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: That is very true.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: You do need energy, which is one of the components of climate smart agriculture.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: But in terms of when we install or when we build our solar farms, we also need to look at, you know, the availability of land and how to optimize the land that we do have.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_00: That is why you will find even in some areas where the existing parking lots will be fitted with your solar panel, yeah, to kind of optimize.
• 13:13
  SPEAKER_00: So in the face of just transition, we need to ensure that it does not necessarily alter the way that people live, but we need to try and see if we can find a balance so that people, we do not compromise the resources that people will still need to use, like land, as you have correctly mentioned.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_00: We have the farms that people are already working on.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: If we are now going to introduce the issue of climate smart agriculture, it should not necessarily inconvenience them.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: So we need to find optimal ways to be able to input elements of renewable energy or just transition in a way that it will still be usable for them and that they can still make a profit or make a living from the work that they were doing already.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Krasindra.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have any final remarks before we leave?
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: I think I don't have much to remark on, but the issue of just transition is widely spoken about.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: We do have, you know, a lot of platforms that discuss the issues around just transition and moving towards cleaner fuels, renewable energy and the likes.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: But the biggest thing for me is just that as we transition, we need to ensure that the transition is inclusive.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: We need to ensure that our communities are not left behind.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: Working for a municipality, I understand better how the work that we do, especially from government, affects our communities.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: So we need to actually ensure that everyone who is involved in the work of the just transition understands the need for including the community.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: Also finding a balance between economic benefits as well as preserving livelihoods, both from industry and the private sector and the government sector.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: It won't benefit us if we just wake up one day and we are forcing people to transition.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: We need to allow them the time and we need to assist them in transitioning.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_00: So there must be mechanisms that are set in place that will help people transition as we move forward.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you very much.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_01: A huge thank you to our guests for sharing their expertise and time with us and also for attending this training.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_01: We hope you will continue to champion the mandate of greening the economy in a just and equitable way.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: And to our listeners, your support means the world.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for joining the Trade and Industrial Policy Strategies official podcast.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_01: Remember, sustainable growth is not just a goal, but a path to a more resilient and prosperous future.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: Don't forget to subscribe, leave a review, and connect with us on YouTube, Apple, and Spotify.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_01: Until next time, I'm Tobanike signing off.