Latest / Motherhood Uncut / The Importance of Connection | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 3 Episode 1

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The Importance of Connection | Motherhood Uncut Podcast | Season 3 Episode 1 · Motherhood Uncut

0:00
SPEAKER_03: Welcome to the Motherhood Uncut Podcast.
0:02
SPEAKER_03: Deb Rubin and I, Kate Kripke, started this podcast so that we could bring to the table all things that no one wants to talk about in motherhood.
0:10
SPEAKER_03: Together, both psychotherapists and mothers of teenage daughters, we spent a lot of time, just the two of us, talking about all the stuff that actually shows up behind the scenes in motherhood.
0:22
SPEAKER_03: And we decided it was time that we all joined this conversation together.
0:26
SPEAKER_03: So if you are a mom feeling alone, if you're a mom feeling like you could use more information, if you're a mom looking to laugh about the things that are so ridiculous about this job, and quite frankly, if you're a mom needing to cry about the things that are more vulnerable and tenuous and heartbreaking, we've got you.
0:44
SPEAKER_03: Pull up a chair, put in your earbuds, grab a cup of coffee, grab a glass of wine, whatever you need, sit down and mother with us.
0:53
SPEAKER_03: Our conversations are gonna be filled with laughter, probably some tears, hopefully some eye-opening insights.
1:00
SPEAKER_03: And between our conversations and the folks that we interview to help us learn a little bit more and grow a little bit more together, we're gonna create a system of mothering that helps us all feel a little bit less alone.
1:12
SPEAKER_03: Thank you for being here.
1:14
SPEAKER_03: Let us know what you think.
1:15
SPEAKER_03: We've got you.
1:16
SPEAKER_03: Come mother with us.
1:29
SPEAKER_02: We are so excited for this next season.
1:31
SPEAKER_02: We're gonna do a really nice blend of interviewing amazing people and then having quite a few conversations with just Kate and I, bantering back and forth.
1:40
SPEAKER_02: Um, this episode, we are diving into one of our favorite topics, which is connection.
1:46
SPEAKER_02: How to connect, what to do when we're not connected, how to understand what connection needs are all about.
1:53
SPEAKER_02: I hope you enjoy the show and we're so excited to be back.
1:58
SPEAKER_03: Hey friends, it's Kate.
2:00
SPEAKER_03: Motherhood is draining, it's depleting, it's heartbreaking, and it's often so overwhelming that we have a hard time seeing our way through.
2:10
SPEAKER_03: Imagine for a moment if you felt like you could weather those storms.
2:15
SPEAKER_03: Imagine if you felt creative and open and easy to connect with your kids and yourself and a little more in flow with all of this chaos.
2:29
SPEAKER_03: This is what I do in my work.
2:30
SPEAKER_03: I help moms stabilize, find the parts of themselves that are really wise and curious and able to connect even in the deepest, darkest moments.
2:43
SPEAKER_03: Come on over to my website, KateCripkee.com.
2:46
SPEAKER_03: Let's work together.
2:48
SPEAKER_00: Hey there, this is Deb, and happy summer.
2:51
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna be taking a little break from my workshops this summer, but I will be offering a ton of new stuff in the fall.
2:57
SPEAKER_00: And if you want to stay updated and connected, you can do so by joining my newsletter.
3:02
SPEAKER_00: Just go to motherdaughterjourney.co.
3:05
SPEAKER_00: It's very easy to sign up, and you'll receive monthly newsletters that will keep you informed and offer tons of tips and strategies to keep your connection with yourself and your daughters alive.
3:17
SPEAKER_00: I hope you have a wonderful summer and I look forward to working with you.
3:21
SPEAKER_04: Hi Dad.
3:23
SPEAKER_04: Season three.
3:24
SPEAKER_04: Here we go.
3:25
SPEAKER_04: Season three.
3:26
SPEAKER_04: That's actually a big deal.
3:28
SPEAKER_01: Three seasons of Motherhood Uncut.
3:30
SPEAKER_01: It is.
3:30
SPEAKER_01: It's been three good seasons.
3:32
SPEAKER_01: Well, it hasn't been three yet.
3:34
SPEAKER_04: Oh, this is third.
3:35
SPEAKER_04: Sure, right.
3:36
SPEAKER_04: It will be starting at the end of the third season.
3:39
SPEAKER_04: We will say it has been three good seasons.
3:41
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
3:42
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
3:43
SPEAKER_01: What are we talking about today?
3:46
SPEAKER_04: Well, I think where we wanted to start season three was jumping right in to what matters most in our experience of feeling like a good mom.
4:00
SPEAKER_04: Right?
4:01
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
4:02
SPEAKER_04: In that, and this is like absolutely your shtick.
4:06
SPEAKER_04: This is what you teach in your mother-daughter workshops, in your father-daughter workshops.
4:10
SPEAKER_04: Like you are all about connection and relationship.
4:14
SPEAKER_04: And I am all about what is needed for us to get ourselves to the place where we're capable of connecting.
4:21
SPEAKER_04: Now we both do both, we all overlap, but I think we get to combine those perspectives today and really address to me what is the crux of quote unquote good mothering.
4:35
SPEAKER_04: And we have big quotes around that because it can look a million different ways.
4:40
SPEAKER_04: But what if I think back to the times that you and I bitch and vent about our mothering experience the most, it's when we feel disconnected from our children.
4:50
SPEAKER_04: Right.
4:51
SPEAKER_04: And I know from postpartum and now all the way through adolescence, which is such a big part of your work, we struggle in times that we feel so when we feel disconnected to ourselves or our kids.
5:02
SPEAKER_04: So let's dive in.
5:04
SPEAKER_04: Let's do it.
5:04
SPEAKER_04: Let's, I like one of today, I want to talk about um what it feels like to be in connection with our kids, what it feels like to be in disconnection with our kids, the traps we fall in that get us less connected, farther away from connection, and things that we can do when things get really uncomfortable to reconnect.
5:23
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
5:24
SPEAKER_02: And I think before we do any of that, we have to actually start to identify what connection even means beautiful for us.
5:31
SPEAKER_02: So I'm gonna actually ask our listeners to if you're have a moment where you can take a pause and think about it or write it down.
5:38
SPEAKER_02: But I think it's really important to identify the stories we have about what connection looks like.
5:45
SPEAKER_02: And the reason I ask this is because so often people think, at least in relationship with partner or child, that it has to mean, you know, holding hands and follicking through a field of sunflowers.
5:58
SPEAKER_02: Like that's kind of the idea.
6:00
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
6:01
SPEAKER_02: Or it's like me and my person, we sit and we have these long, deep, powerful conversations.
6:07
SPEAKER_02: Or maybe my connection way is, you know, that on a birthday, there's like you knew exactly what to get me.
6:18
SPEAKER_02: And so I think that sometimes we have to start to unpack those ideals so that we can realize there's so many different ways to connect.
6:26
SPEAKER_02: And when we get stuck in idealistic thinking, we just we do exactly that, we get stuck, and we don't actually get to see the forest of the trees when there might be moments of connection that are actually happening and we don't know it.
6:38
SPEAKER_02: So useful.
6:40
SPEAKER_02: So I ask you, what when you think of like idealistically your best way of connecting?
6:46
SPEAKER_02: What does it look like?
6:48
SPEAKER_04: Like the fairy tale version?
6:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, let's start there.
6:52
SPEAKER_04: My fairy tale version of connecting is giggling and laughing on the sofa with my girls, or having a dance party in the kitchen where we're all dancing.
7:08
SPEAKER_04: Or I am a lover in connection, meaning touch and like physical body closeness.
7:18
SPEAKER_04: So hugging my daughters or being close to them side by side, or I love you back and forth.
7:27
SPEAKER_04: Those are all things that if I think about my perfect vision of connection, those sort of give me an effervescence in my body.
7:36
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I get like bobbly and giddy when I think about those things.
7:40
SPEAKER_02: Beautiful.
7:41
SPEAKER_02: Now tell me, what does disconnection look like for you?
7:47
SPEAKER_04: Disconnection feels like an energetic porcupine, like there's no way in, you know, and and it can be as loud as you know, um actual words that are like I don't want to hug you, or I don't want to come sit next to you, or you know, I don't want to answer that question.
8:11
SPEAKER_04: So it could be literal, tangible, physical like that, like rejection, like rejection, like like clear rejection, or what's harder for me than that is that energetic, like you can just feel it when you walk in the room, right?
8:28
SPEAKER_04: The lack of eye contact, that sort of like edgy feeling that oh, I can feel my body right now when I'm thinking about it because I happen to have a teenager and a husband who tend to show up this way when they're not wanting to connect.
8:42
SPEAKER_04: It's so subtle, yeah, but so deeply painful.
8:46
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, I really don't like that feeling.
8:50
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
8:50
SPEAKER_02: What about you?
8:52
SPEAKER_02: So um a lot similar.
8:54
SPEAKER_02: I think my idealistic way of thinking about connection is also that it's like it's like high energy.
9:02
SPEAKER_02: And um conversation that's engaging, that you know, ever like you said, everyone's involved.
9:09
SPEAKER_02: Um that's the really big one that I'm learning to let go of because what I'm realizing is that someone's proximity, regardless of their language, is just as valid.
9:20
SPEAKER_02: And I'll give you an example.
9:22
SPEAKER_02: So if I chair a little closer, yeah, I have a kiddo that sometimes just wants to be close to me, but doesn't actually really want to engage.
9:34
SPEAKER_02: And I think that's the thing I'm learning to appreciate is that she might not need to be part of the conversation, but she needs to me to know that she's there.
9:47
SPEAKER_02: Yes, on some level.
9:49
SPEAKER_02: And so, you know, but everything you said, I can agree with.
9:52
SPEAKER_02: I think a lot of people can that we have these ideas that connection feels like it is alive and kind of the way you describe this connection feels kind of cold in the body.
10:05
SPEAKER_04: Can I say one other thing?
10:06
SPEAKER_04: Please, please.
10:08
SPEAKER_04: I also think if I think about the postpartum mom, if I think about that new mother, connection is often felt when we're getting it right.
10:19
SPEAKER_04: Do you know what I mean?
10:20
SPEAKER_04: When we know what to do, when we feel competent, right?
10:23
SPEAKER_04: When our baby cries and we can soothe them.
10:26
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
10:27
SPEAKER_04: Right.
10:28
SPEAKER_04: I and I think if I think about the the postpartum moms I work with and the times in which those moms feel so disconnected from their babies, which of course brings about so much fear when you're a new mom.
10:42
SPEAKER_04: Yes, it's often when they don't know what to do.
10:45
SPEAKER_04: And if I fast forward, I would say, and I'm sure we'll get into this, my biggest learning as a mom of teenagers that I've had to develop over the last 16 years is how to stay connected when I don't know.
11:00
SPEAKER_04: But I think when we're new moms, those two things come so hand in hand.
11:05
SPEAKER_02: Does that make sense?
11:06
SPEAKER_02: Yes, absolutely.
11:08
SPEAKER_02: And I think that kind of theme can trickle into so often as when we're parenting any age of not knowing what to say.
11:16
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
11:16
SPEAKER_02: And so I'm gonna digress for one sec, but come back that when you said for the kiddo that's like rejecting you and saying, I don't want to talk about that, I actually would give that a win because that's a kid that is still telling you how she feels.
11:30
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
11:30
SPEAKER_02: Right.
11:31
SPEAKER_02: And then it's up to you to sit with that feeling of rejection, but actually recognize that there's still a line there, there's still a thread of connection.
11:40
SPEAKER_02: And what you said when there's like actually nothing, that void, that is true disconnection.
11:46
SPEAKER_02: Yes, that is real, and that is it feels awful.
11:49
SPEAKER_02: You said you can feel it in your body.
11:51
SPEAKER_02: I can feel it right now as I'm saying it.
11:52
SPEAKER_02: There's like a contraction and a coldness that comes in.
11:56
SPEAKER_02: And I think it's really important to recognize that relationships are constantly in this flow of connection, disconnection, reconnection all the time.
12:05
SPEAKER_02: That is actually what they have to do.
12:07
SPEAKER_02: So, in the moments of disconnection, it's like, I guess I want to invite us all to think of that as, oh, that's all this is.
12:15
SPEAKER_02: It's a disconnected moment.
12:17
SPEAKER_02: And it's part of the process, and to actually lean into that by naming it, feeling it in your body, and then coming back to self to reconnect with self in order to invite the reconnection with other.
12:33
SPEAKER_04: So you're bringing up the theme here, I think, which is that what's required for us to stay in connection with our children, whether they're babies or teens or young adults, is to stay steady in moments of discomfort.
12:53
SPEAKER_04: Because, you know, I just want to bring in a little brain science here.
12:57
SPEAKER_04: It's really always helpful for me.
12:59
SPEAKER_04: In moments of connection with ourselves, other people in our environments, yeah, our parasympathetic nervous system turns on.
13:08
SPEAKER_04: We feel good, rest and digest.
13:11
SPEAKER_04: In moments of quote unquote disconnection, our sympathetic nervous system turns on.
13:16
SPEAKER_04: Fight, flight, freeze, right?
13:18
SPEAKER_04: We think we're in danger.
13:19
SPEAKER_04: We think we're in danger.
13:20
SPEAKER_04: And that's because we're biologically wired to need to be in connection and community to survive, right?
13:27
SPEAKER_04: So I think that anytime we literally are in periods of disconnection, right, where there's that eggshelly, unspoken disconnect that we're talking about, or perceived disconnection when a child says, I don't want to sit next to you, our bodies can perceive that as dangerous.
13:46
SPEAKER_04: Right.
13:46
SPEAKER_04: Because rejection can feel like a threat.
13:48
SPEAKER_04: Exactly.
13:49
SPEAKER_04: And so one of the things I want us to go through today is how do we stay steady?
13:55
SPEAKER_04: How do we stay in the moment when we're feeling that kind of discomfort?
14:00
SPEAKER_04: Because we can, I can, if I'm not paying attention, play into that by reacting to that discomfort in ways that like co-contributes to this bigger disconnect, right?
14:12
SPEAKER_04: If, like, for instance, if my 13, for now 14-year-old comes in and comes home from school and she's all prickly, right?
14:19
SPEAKER_04: If I can't stay in the room with that discomfort, I'm gonna be like, fine, if you don't want me here, I'll leave.
14:24
SPEAKER_02: Right.
14:24
SPEAKER_02: Now I've created the disactly because you've taken it personally.
14:28
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
14:29
SPEAKER_02: One thing we know is that the moment we take it personally outwardly, yeah, we lose them.
14:35
SPEAKER_02: That's right.
14:35
SPEAKER_02: We lose any chance for connection because we have become somewhat in our own adolescent mind.
14:41
SPEAKER_02: And then the child has no idea who's in charge.
14:45
SPEAKER_02: Right.
14:45
SPEAKER_04: And the only way for me to stay in that living room with this prickly ass porcupiney teenager, right?
14:53
SPEAKER_04: Is for me to stay steady with my own internal discomfort.
14:58
SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
14:59
SPEAKER_02: And I think one thing I want to say before steady, that I think is so important to recognize is the sadness that can come.
15:07
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
15:08
SPEAKER_02: Yes, and it's like that, and you know, I like to use the word grief, that it's like there's a moment of grief right there.
15:15
SPEAKER_02: And, you know, grief has these waves of big emotion.
15:21
SPEAKER_02: And so it's like that's where, and of course, it does take some steadiness to be able to see that that's happening.
15:28
SPEAKER_02: But I I really want our listeners to understand that there's not this expectation to be steady eddy all the time, right?
15:35
SPEAKER_02: It's more this idea of like, how do you actually tend to those feelings and feel them, you know?
15:43
SPEAKER_02: That's there's steadiness in that, as I think you're saying too.
15:46
SPEAKER_02: Well, I would say that's the way to get steady.
15:49
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
15:50
SPEAKER_02: That's the way.
15:51
SPEAKER_02: And and then it's like whatever you need to do to come back into full body, right?
15:58
SPEAKER_02: And this is a conversation we've had many times, and this is not new information, but I think it's so important for all of us to have like a cheat sheet.
16:07
SPEAKER_02: Some people call it like a fire escape plan or you know, a re-entering body plan, and then have it on your phone, you know, pull it up.
16:15
SPEAKER_02: Like, what are five steps I need to do to tend to my emotions and return to my body?
16:21
SPEAKER_02: Because in those moments, we often don't remember, we just get mad, like I did this morning.
16:26
SPEAKER_02: I like went into my car and was like, which actually did help.
16:32
SPEAKER_02: That could be something, but it was it took me a lot longer.
16:35
SPEAKER_02: What I kind of wish I had done was like sat in my car, maybe screamed, and then actually taking five deep breaths, felt my the texture of my skin, looked in the reflection of the rear view mirror to look into my own eyes, turn on the radio to like listen to some sound, you know, really waking up the senses.
16:57
SPEAKER_02: That is like a really nice way to kind of transition into entering back in.
17:03
SPEAKER_04: I had a really awesome conversation with Patricia Gipple this week for my membership, and she came in and we talked about polyvagal theory, and she shared this really incredible image.
17:19
SPEAKER_04: Maybe we can find a way to tab the PDF somewhere for our listeners, but she was really talking about how there's three stages of nervous system, right?
17:29
SPEAKER_04: And I'm not going to go into the clinical names here, but there's the stage where we feel really frozen and heavy and low and hopeless.
17:40
SPEAKER_04: That's quote unquote freeze response, right?
17:42
SPEAKER_04: We we feel paralyzed, right?
17:45
SPEAKER_04: There's also the stage which we would call fight and flight, where we feel activated, right?
17:50
SPEAKER_04: We feel frenetic, we feel feisty.
17:53
SPEAKER_04: That's when we yell fuck, right?
17:55
SPEAKER_04: And then the the stage that we're kind of going for is that stage where we feel balanced and grounded and quote unquote steady, just to use that word again.
18:08
SPEAKER_04: The the sort of interesting thing about this piece that I want to bring in now is that the whole theory of this is that our nervous system states create our stories.
18:20
SPEAKER_04: So when I'm in that state of freeze where I feel like I, you know what I mean?
18:25
SPEAKER_04: Like my body, I could do this here.
18:26
SPEAKER_04: No, people can also, but my I'm like hunched over.
18:29
SPEAKER_04: You know, you know that feeling it's just like heavy.
18:32
SPEAKER_04: My stories are of hopelessness.
18:34
SPEAKER_04: I can't do this.
18:35
SPEAKER_04: I'm a terrible mom.
18:36
SPEAKER_04: I can't get anything right.
18:37
SPEAKER_04: This is never gonna work, right?
18:39
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
18:40
SPEAKER_04: The the next stage of like fight and flight is something's dangerous happening, right?
18:46
SPEAKER_04: I have to defend myself, right?
18:49
SPEAKER_04: And then that last grounded, steady feeling, that's when our nervous system is just working for us.
18:56
SPEAKER_04: The story is of connection.
19:00
SPEAKER_04: The story is of capability.
19:02
SPEAKER_04: And the other thing that she talked about, and we'll put a link to her work because she's amazing, um, is that at you just said this at each stage, we need to do a different kind of self-care to develop steadiness.
19:13
SPEAKER_04: At that low stage of frozenness, the only thing we're capable of doing is connecting with ourselves, hand on heart, yes, deep breath, gaze in the mirror, stand in the sunshine.
19:24
SPEAKER_04: Those soft, kind, compassionate connections will help us move through that stage.
19:29
SPEAKER_04: When we're in the like feisty, anxious, we actually often have to move.
19:33
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we have to shake it off.
19:35
SPEAKER_04: We have to call it for an event, we need to go for a run.
19:38
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, right.
19:39
SPEAKER_04: But we can't expect ourselves to shake it off and go for a run when we're in that heavy frozen state.
19:44
SPEAKER_04: So it's like we have to go through these stages.
19:48
SPEAKER_04: And again, what we're going for is that experience that allows us to connect.
19:53
SPEAKER_02: Right.
19:54
SPEAKER_02: And when our nervous system is grounded, is working for us, then we can understand that connection has so many different ways of looking.
20:05
SPEAKER_04: And yes, let's talk about that.
20:07
SPEAKER_04: And I think part of the thing in this sort of polyvagal theory and this nervous system um description is that in order to connect, we need to feel safe.
20:18
SPEAKER_02: Right.
20:19
SPEAKER_02: So then it brings up a great question of how do we become the safe person that our kids want to connect with.
20:27
SPEAKER_02: Take taking around with it, Deb.
20:30
SPEAKER_02: Well, we talk about so much of it already, right?
20:32
SPEAKER_02: We've talked about nervous system regulation, we've talked about tending to self, we've talked about um not taking things personally, right?
20:41
SPEAKER_02: Those are really like some of the big ones.
20:44
SPEAKER_02: I want to actually put a little emphasis right now on that often we parents get stuck in um connecting kind of on our terms and how tricky it is to really flip the script to go into their world.
21:03
SPEAKER_02: And this has been, it's so interesting because I think this really shifts around adolescents.
21:08
SPEAKER_02: I mean, actually, it really shifts.
21:10
SPEAKER_02: Actually, I'm gonna take that back.
21:12
SPEAKER_02: It's always there because so here's we'll talk about littles for a minute, right?
21:17
SPEAKER_02: We know that if there are 20 minutes of uninterrupted time with your kiddo that's in their world, that is actually enough for them to feel a sense of safety.
21:27
SPEAKER_02: And that might mean like you're, you know, playing magnetiles or you're like dolls.
21:34
SPEAKER_02: If dolls are the thing, maybe it's Legos, I mean, whatever it is.
21:38
SPEAKER_02: But it's like when we think it's 20 minutes or coloring or something that's going into their world, it does so many things.
21:44
SPEAKER_02: For one, it's just this invitation of literally going into their little magical world, which I think is so important for us to remember that we can resist it and feel like that is so annoying.
21:55
SPEAKER_02: I don't want to play pretend, you know, or whatever.
21:58
SPEAKER_02: But what a cool experience.
22:00
SPEAKER_02: Experience if you actually like let yourself be little again and see things through their world.
22:07
SPEAKER_02: And if it's just, you know, and I might even say 15 minutes, you know, it's like set a timer, know that there's a beginning, middle, and an end, right?
22:16
SPEAKER_02: There's something really grounding about that, but it gives a child so many messages.
22:20
SPEAKER_02: It gives a message that you care, it gives a message that you're interested in their world.
22:25
SPEAKER_02: And they, when they feel that undivided time, they co-regulate and they match with your system and you match with theirs.
22:33
SPEAKER_02: That those little daily bite-sized habits actually are what help for when the moments of disconnection happen because you have a foundation.
22:42
SPEAKER_02: Okay, I'm gonna jump ahead to adolescence for a minute because I I want to share a personal story.
22:47
SPEAKER_02: I the other day I was trying so hard.
22:50
SPEAKER_02: I was like, God, I haven't hung out like one-on-one with my older daughter in a little while.
22:54
SPEAKER_02: And so I was like, let's go on a walk.
22:56
SPEAKER_02: No, let's go do this.
22:58
SPEAKER_02: No, you know, we really should clean out your closet.
23:01
SPEAKER_02: I mean, every and I really didn't want to be like, let's go shopping, let's do nails, because that's just not how I wanted to do it.
23:08
SPEAKER_02: And everything I offered, let's, I mean, everything was just being shut down.
23:11
SPEAKER_02: And I was just like so annoyed.
23:14
SPEAKER_02: I was annoyed, I felt rejected, I felt hurt.
23:16
SPEAKER_02: I did all the things.
23:17
SPEAKER_02: I went and laid down in the spot that I love to lay down in and regulate.
23:21
SPEAKER_02: It's kind of my thing.
23:22
SPEAKER_02: And then in my house, everyone knows when I'm in that spot, it's really in the center of the house.
23:26
SPEAKER_02: No one bothers me.
23:27
SPEAKER_02: But then I looked up and I saw Sage out on the hammock looking at her TikTok.
23:32
SPEAKER_02: And I was like, that is her world right now in this moment.
23:37
SPEAKER_02: And I walked over and I was like, Can I check out people's TikToks with you?
23:42
SPEAKER_02: And she was like, totally.
23:44
SPEAKER_02: And I made a point to have no judgment in my mind.
23:48
SPEAKER_02: I was like, go in with total curiosity.
23:51
SPEAKER_02: And I laid on the hammock with her for 20 minutes and we looked at all these other people's TikToks and we were cracking up, laughing.
23:58
SPEAKER_02: And it was just such a reminder of like, all I have to do is go into her world every now and then and really understand it and let go of my own agenda, you know, not all the time.
24:10
SPEAKER_02: I have a big agenda and I hold on to that sometimes.
24:13
SPEAKER_02: But if I have the moments of letting go, there was so much room for beauty and connection, and the rest of the night, just food.
24:22
SPEAKER_04: God, I love this example so much because what you're saying so clearly is that in order to access those moments of connection, that's we're going for, right?
24:35
SPEAKER_04: Is to is to pilot the moments of connection.
24:37
SPEAKER_04: In order to access that, we need to prioritize the relationship over everything else.
24:44
SPEAKER_04: That's secure attachment right there.
24:46
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
24:46
SPEAKER_04: Right.
24:47
SPEAKER_04: That if you had been like, well, I don't want her to think that I love TikTok and social media for her, or I don't what do you know?
24:55
SPEAKER_04: I want her to know that, you know, she should be off exercising rather than on her phone, right?
25:01
SPEAKER_04: That's a agenda.
25:02
SPEAKER_04: Exactly.
25:03
SPEAKER_04: And by the way, it may be accurate, totally, but it's like in that moment, you were like, what is more important to me than those things is to be in connection with my daughter.
25:13
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
25:14
SPEAKER_04: Because it's the connection with her that's actually going to give you access to, you know, influencing on her those other things anyway.
25:22
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
25:22
SPEAKER_04: Right.
25:23
SPEAKER_04: But in that moment, you just wanted closeness.
25:25
SPEAKER_02: That's right.
25:26
SPEAKER_02: I love that.
25:27
SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
25:28
SPEAKER_02: That's cool.
25:29
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
25:30
SPEAKER_02: Um, how are we doing on time?
25:31
SPEAKER_04: We're okay.
25:32
SPEAKER_04: I want to say, um, I want to bring something up for a moment before we um go anywhere else, is that I think one of the things that you and I are saying here, you mentioned it and then moved on to your story.
25:44
SPEAKER_04: So I don't want to get too far, is that co-regulation between mothers and parents and children, but speaking of mothers on this podcast, mothers and children is so important because they actually really rely on us to feel safe in the world, right?
26:02
SPEAKER_04: So if I'm walking around with a really dysregulated nervous system all of the time, my kiddos is are gonna feel that from me and their bodies are gonna interpret that as something's not okay, something's not safe, the relationship's not safe or the world isn't safe.
26:18
SPEAKER_04: And I really want to pause for a moment on our new moms, those brand new moms who are mothering infants and babies and the like little people who can't speak yet, right?
26:32
SPEAKER_04: And how easy is that it is for us to think that in order for us as a new mom, in order for me as a new mom to feel good, I have to make sure my kid is okay, right?
26:44
SPEAKER_04: Where my attention and my focus goes outward, right?
26:47
SPEAKER_04: What does my kid need?
26:49
SPEAKER_04: What does my baby need to be stimulated?
26:51
SPEAKER_04: What does my baby need to sleep?
26:52
SPEAKER_04: What does my baby need to want to eat?
26:54
SPEAKER_04: Right.
26:55
SPEAKER_04: And our when our focus goes outwards, we forget that what our babies need most is our nervous systems to regulate from, right?
27:06
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
27:06
SPEAKER_04: And that's where I think some of the deepest connection between moms and babies come from is that when we begin to see that happen, when we begin as a new mom to really understand that if I slow down my breath, I connect with myself.
27:21
SPEAKER_04: You said this in the very beginning.
27:23
SPEAKER_04: If I slow down my breath, if I go outside and feel the sun on my face, if I put my hand on my heart and my nervous system settles, my baby's nervous system will settle.
27:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
27:35
SPEAKER_04: Because that baby's borrowing from me.
27:37
SPEAKER_04: That's right.
27:38
SPEAKER_04: And it's in that moment of co-regulation in that direction that I'm going to feel so connected.
27:43
SPEAKER_04: That's right.
27:44
SPEAKER_04: And so it's not about, you know, the activities I'm doing with my baby or whether or not I'm pushing them in a stroller, wearing them on my chest, or whether or not they're sleeping with me or sleeping in their I'm feeding them breast milk or format.
27:58
SPEAKER_04: That stuff is not the point.
27:59
SPEAKER_04: Right.
28:00
SPEAKER_04: The point are those moments where I can learn how to settle to the best of my ability in that moment.
28:07
SPEAKER_04: And then I watch my baby settle on with me.
28:10
SPEAKER_04: And that's just biology.
28:11
SPEAKER_04: Totally.
28:12
SPEAKER_02: And of course, we see it in our teenagers as well.
28:14
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
28:15
SPEAKER_02: But you're reminding me there was a time where Tess, my little one, needed help going to sleep.
28:22
SPEAKER_02: Like it was just hard to settle.
28:25
SPEAKER_02: And I remember when I actually would just lay down with her and take five breaths, she would fall asleep.
28:32
SPEAKER_02: I mean, it was crazy.
28:33
SPEAKER_02: That might have just been like lucky, but it was like I would try to like rub her back.
28:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you're quote unquote doing all the things for her.
28:41
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
28:41
SPEAKER_02: I was like doing rather than being.
28:44
SPEAKER_02: And then when I like it clicked to just take in five deep breaths, you know, can take a little bit, but it was actually so efficient at the same time.
28:53
SPEAKER_02: It was just I could, it was just magic, actually.
28:57
SPEAKER_02: And there's some, were you gonna say something?
28:59
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but I'll go after you.
29:00
SPEAKER_02: Um one thing I also want to also remind for the mamas that don't have talkers yet is that when we think about proximity, okay, and that's like an energetic term I use, because it's like there's proximity in when they're really little, there's actual real proximity and energy and physical connection or space between.
29:20
SPEAKER_02: And then as they get older, that proximity starts to change, right?
29:23
SPEAKER_02: As they start to separate and individuate, but we're still keeping the energetic proximity attuned.
29:30
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
29:30
SPEAKER_02: But in the most kind of superficial, and I don't mean that in a bad way, but superficial level of proximity for the youngest brains, it is all about senses.
29:41
SPEAKER_02: And so I think rather that those are the things we can rely on, is like when you're tuning into your senses and the baby is too, it just connects whomever you're close to.
29:55
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
29:55
SPEAKER_02: And so it can even just be with a new baby, like laying outside and even inviting them to look at the clouds.
30:02
SPEAKER_02: And they might not know what a cloud is, but you're just looking at the clouds, you're and then smell the flowers, right?
30:09
SPEAKER_02: Feel the grass, bring some grass to their face.
30:13
SPEAKER_02: Like those are actually the most simplest forms of connection in those in those moments.
30:18
SPEAKER_04: Well, you're also actually reminding me that the times I feel most connected with my daughters is when we're doing something in nature.
30:28
SPEAKER_04: And we're not even talking.
30:29
SPEAKER_04: Yes, we're hiking, we're camping, we're whatever the thing is.
30:34
SPEAKER_04: And that's when our senses are so heightened when we're in nature, right?
30:37
SPEAKER_04: Because it's in our face.
30:38
SPEAKER_04: So I had never made that connection.
30:41
SPEAKER_04: I love that so much.
30:43
SPEAKER_04: Um, I had a realization the other day where my youngest is very, very empathic and in tune, like she's an energetic being the way I am.
30:57
SPEAKER_04: My older is sort of more preoccupied.
31:00
SPEAKER_04: But my but Bridger is very sensitive to shifts in energy, right?
31:06
SPEAKER_04: And I am coming out of this month where I have felt really disconnected from with myself, with my environment, my world, with other people.
31:15
SPEAKER_04: I've just been in that weird, distracted, kind of frenetic place.
31:20
SPEAKER_04: And she and I have been so disconnected.
31:23
SPEAKER_04: And I realized the other day that she's feeling my prickly disconnected energy, right?
31:32
SPEAKER_04: And Mother's Day, I sort of made this point of really, you know, I have just like everyone else listening, you have to move through these periods, they all pass, but I made this point to really intentionally like commit to being as grounded as I could that day.
31:50
SPEAKER_04: I was the most connected I felt with her in forever.
31:53
SPEAKER_04: And so that you're saying this about the littles, and we're saying this about babies too, but it really always starts with us.
32:00
SPEAKER_04: Like my my tending to my nervous system created a space for her to come towards me.
32:08
SPEAKER_04: Because when I'm feeling icky, she feels icky, right?
32:11
SPEAKER_04: So fascinating.
32:12
SPEAKER_02: Totally.
32:13
SPEAKER_02: Thank you for sharing that.
32:15
SPEAKER_02: Um, okay, so let's let's switch gears for a minute and talk about what kind of invites more connection.
32:23
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
32:23
SPEAKER_02: And this is um a theory that I borrow from John and Julie Gottman that is research-based.
32:28
SPEAKER_02: That I rely on this all the time with couples, with parenting.
32:33
SPEAKER_02: It is so important.
32:34
SPEAKER_02: And it's called it's called bids for connection.
32:38
SPEAKER_02: Have we talked about on this podcast yet?
32:39
SPEAKER_02: Not yet.
32:40
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
32:41
SPEAKER_02: So the thing I love about this is that this has been studied for a very long time around how often all humans make these unconscious bids.
32:52
SPEAKER_02: And all that means is that they are trying to bring someone into their world.
32:56
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
32:57
SPEAKER_02: And so bids can look as simple as someone telling you like a dumb joke.
33:02
SPEAKER_02: It can be, you know, someone actually sharing something of substance, but it can be so subtle too, like, you know, mom, do you like my outfit?
33:12
SPEAKER_02: You know, or something like that.
33:14
SPEAKER_02: When, and we actually have, I think the research said, and do not quote me on this, but in a course of an hour, there's like 20 bids, maybe or something, in when they are watching partners.
33:25
SPEAKER_02: So according to this research, there's three ways to respond to a bid.
33:28
SPEAKER_02: You can either turn towards the bid, which is the most preference, that's the good one, okay?
33:34
SPEAKER_02: Meaning you actually acknowledge that the bid happened.
33:38
SPEAKER_02: You could turn away from the bid, which is simply ignoring it.
33:41
SPEAKER_02: This is actually the most common one because we don't even realize we're doing it.
33:46
SPEAKER_02: It's not malicious, it's just it went right over our head because our minds are preoccupied or we're doing something else.
33:52
SPEAKER_02: Or you can turn away against the bid.
33:55
SPEAKER_02: And that is when there's aggression that comes with it too.
33:57
SPEAKER_04: So in a give an example, let's play, let's play right here for the moment.
34:01
SPEAKER_02: Okay, ready?
34:01
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
34:02
SPEAKER_04: Deb, I love your sweater.
34:03
SPEAKER_02: So turning towards, be like, thank you.
34:06
SPEAKER_02: I really appreciate that.
34:07
SPEAKER_02: That's enough.
34:08
SPEAKER_02: You could go above and beyond with a turning towards and be like, thank you.
34:12
SPEAKER_02: I got it at Common, you know, you can borrow it sometime.
34:16
SPEAKER_02: Think straight, not necessary.
34:18
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
34:19
SPEAKER_01: Deb, I love your sweater.
34:21
SPEAKER_01: It's almost dinner time.
34:24
SPEAKER_01: Right.
34:25
SPEAKER_01: Or try to silence or say it again.
34:27
SPEAKER_01: Deb, I love your sweater.
34:30
SPEAKER_02: Click, click, click, I'm on my computer.
34:32
SPEAKER_02: Right.
34:32
SPEAKER_02: Type, right?
34:34
SPEAKER_02: So it's actually not, it's again, I'm repeating myself, but it's not harsh.
34:40
SPEAKER_02: It's just a miss.
34:42
SPEAKER_02: I have to say, this one is hardest for me.
34:45
SPEAKER_02: It's hardest for everyone.
34:47
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
34:47
SPEAKER_02: It's the most common thing that happens.
34:51
SPEAKER_02: And actually, when a bid gets missed, it actually increases stress levels and decreases confidence.
35:00
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
35:01
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
35:02
SPEAKER_02: So let's do a turning against just to keep up the examples.
35:05
SPEAKER_04: And I just want to say one thing about the the um the second one is that it really creates this experience of not being seen.
35:13
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
35:14
SPEAKER_04: And not being heard.
35:15
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
35:16
SPEAKER_04: Which is really something most of us struggle, struggle so much with.
35:19
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
35:20
SPEAKER_02: I think that is actually the ultimate wound.
35:22
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
35:23
SPEAKER_01: That every human person can really do.
35:26
unknown: Okay.
35:26
SPEAKER_01: Dad, I love your sweater.
35:30
SPEAKER_01: Whatever.
35:32
SPEAKER_01: I don't even know how to do that.
35:35
SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't have time to talk to you right now.
35:38
SPEAKER_04: It's like, or like, why are you suddenly being so nice to me?
35:42
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
35:43
SPEAKER_04: Or like, or even I imagine, even if you were to say, you know, this is such a disgusting sweater.
35:51
SPEAKER_04: What do you mean?
35:51
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
35:52
SPEAKER_04: Exactly.
35:52
SPEAKER_04: Something negative and aggressive.
35:54
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
35:54
SPEAKER_04: Exactly.
35:55
SPEAKER_02: And although that we just stumbled in the I think that, and that is like the most uncommon, but of course it happens.
36:05
SPEAKER_02: And then I'll just remind all of us that when that happens, because of course it does, there's always an invitation for repair.
36:11
SPEAKER_02: And repair, put it in big capital letters in your brain right now.
36:15
SPEAKER_02: Repair, repair, repair.
36:16
SPEAKER_02: It's always going to override a disconnected moment.
36:19
SPEAKER_04: Can I say something?
36:20
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
36:21
SPEAKER_04: If we were to replace this sweater example with one of the examples we used earlier with our kids, like, hey, you want to come sit next to me on the sofa?
36:30
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
36:30
SPEAKER_02: Let's play with that one for a moment.
36:32
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
36:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
36:33
SPEAKER_02: And then I actually also want to do one that is not directed towards you.
36:37
SPEAKER_02: Towards me.
36:38
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
36:38
SPEAKER_02: Okay, let's do this one first.
36:39
SPEAKER_02: This one's going to go fast.
36:40
SPEAKER_02: Do you want me to do it to you?
36:41
SPEAKER_02: Sure.
36:42
SPEAKER_02: You can try it out.
36:43
SPEAKER_02: Um, hey, come sit with me on the sofa.
36:45
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I'd love to.
36:47
SPEAKER_02: I want to come hear about your day.
36:48
SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
36:49
SPEAKER_01: Hey, come sit with me on the sofa.
36:51
SPEAKER_02: Making dinner on the phone.
36:55
SPEAKER_02: And you could even say like one sec.
36:57
SPEAKER_02: It's still an acknowledgement, but it's putting them off.
37:00
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
37:00
SPEAKER_02: And then that one sec doesn't have to happen.
37:02
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
37:03
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
37:03
SPEAKER_02: Want to come sit with me on the sofa?
37:05
SPEAKER_02: I have no time for you right now.
37:07
SPEAKER_04: I what do you what are you asking me to sit on the sofa with you right now?
37:10
SPEAKER_04: I'm over here cooking dinner.
37:11
SPEAKER_02: I'm always cooking every you know, something exactly.
37:14
SPEAKER_02: You always need exactly.
37:16
SPEAKER_02: Okay, good.
37:17
SPEAKER_02: So I think you get the point.
37:19
SPEAKER_02: Um, but I think what the thing I want you to remember is that when, and I'm saying you too are listeners, that um when bids are met consistently, even just the slightest meeting of them, when the milk spills at dinner, it's it's actually relatively calm.
37:38
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
37:38
SPEAKER_02: Because this is how you're actually putting emotional deposits into the bank account of the connection bank account, right?
37:46
SPEAKER_02: These are little deposits you're putting in.
37:49
SPEAKER_02: And then when something big happens, there's just more of a foundation to work with.
37:54
SPEAKER_02: It also invites for that moment when at nine o'clock your teenager is having a hard moment and she wants to communicate, you have already kind of showed her that you are safe and receptive.
38:07
SPEAKER_05: Yes.
38:07
SPEAKER_02: And this is where I get really stuck on that this connection is not about the big moments.
38:14
SPEAKER_02: It's about these little daily things that happen that are pretty effortless, actually.
38:20
SPEAKER_02: And when we can actually consciously turn our brains on to paying attention to when a bid is happening, we might not feel so annoyed with the bid.
38:29
SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna ask a question on behalf of our listeners.
38:31
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, because I know there are people who have toddlers or young children, school-aged, who are like mommy, mommy, mommy, mommy, like constantly, constantly, constantly trying to connect.
38:43
SPEAKER_02: What would you say to that person?
38:45
SPEAKER_02: So I think that's an amazing question.
38:47
SPEAKER_02: And yes, those are lots and lots and lots of bids.
38:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
38:52
SPEAKER_01: Um, so I have two thoughts.
38:57
SPEAKER_02: One is this kind of goes back to this possible 15 to 20 minutes a day of before the witching hour, if there's room to sit down and read a book or sit down and go into their world for 15 to 20 minutes to prevent all those needs later.
39:16
SPEAKER_02: Because I think that mommy, mommy, mommy is just like, I need more attention.
39:20
SPEAKER_02: I need you, I need you, I need you.
39:23
SPEAKER_02: Another thing is that kids do need to learn, you know, that to wait, right?
39:30
SPEAKER_02: And so we are actually bigger than them at that time for a reason, okay?
39:35
SPEAKER_02: Because it's as even though it's so important to come down to their eyes and like tell them, hey, I'm I see you, I love you, I'm doing something, I need you to wait.
39:44
SPEAKER_02: Um, it's also okay to be like, wait, you know, like stand up tall, kind of look down.
39:52
SPEAKER_02: It sounds so minimizing, but it's actually about hierarchy.
39:56
SPEAKER_02: They kind of need to know that you are in charge, yeah, and that they are okay if they wait.
40:01
SPEAKER_02: And then there's also something to be known of that in those toddler years, that's just sort of part of it, right?
40:07
SPEAKER_02: And that we can just say, I see you, I love you, and then come back to whatever you're doing.
40:13
SPEAKER_02: You know, so you're just feeding the bids as much as you can.
40:16
SPEAKER_04: And I think there can be, you said this in my earlier example.
40:20
SPEAKER_04: I think there can be a way to meet a bid, to receive a bid with the explanation that I'm not gonna keep receiving your bids.
40:29
SPEAKER_04: Right.
40:30
SPEAKER_04: So if you if I were to turn to my child who's like that and say, Hey, I see how much you want my attention right now.
40:37
SPEAKER_04: I'm not gonna be answering for I'm gonna cook dinner, I'm gonna do this phone call, I'm gonna talk to this friend, I'm gonna do this thing, I will circle back to you whenever, you know, that that then we've sort of set ourselves up to not have to receive every single bid between now and the next 20 minutes.
40:55
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
40:56
SPEAKER_04: You know what I mean?
40:57
SPEAKER_02: So you kind of you can kind of name it.
40:59
SPEAKER_02: I think that's wonderful.
41:01
SPEAKER_02: And I think that works for some kids.
41:02
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you know, that we when again, when the relationship is, you know, that built on a foundation of trust, that kind of direct like, hey, I'm gonna come back because then they can trust that you are gonna come back.
41:13
SPEAKER_04: And I think I'm saying, I'm asking this question not just on wanting to tend to the nervous system of the child, but also to give the mom permission to not feel after this conversation like she's damaging her child.
41:27
SPEAKER_04: Totally if she if she is does number two over and over, ignores, ignores, ignores.
41:33
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
41:33
SPEAKER_02: Well, and I want to say that number two turning away happens.
41:38
SPEAKER_02: Yes, it is a hundred percent happens all the time.
41:40
SPEAKER_02: So this is really just an invitation to pay attention, yes, to like just notice when they have been, you know, this is really incredible for partnering as well.
41:50
SPEAKER_02: Like when you start to and and and with parenting as well, but when you start to think about the bids that are not directed towards you, so this is what I wanted to give an example before of like let's say your kid is like let me even give an example.
42:09
SPEAKER_01: Um sorry, I'm brain farting.
42:14
SPEAKER_02: They're just like talking about something that happened that day.
42:17
SPEAKER_02: Yes, okay, but you don't really care.
42:18
SPEAKER_02: It's not it's quite boring.
42:20
SPEAKER_02: Or let's say your partner is, and like if they're talking about the MBA, you know, like that's happening in my house a lot right now.
42:26
SPEAKER_02: You're like, I don't care.
42:27
SPEAKER_02: I do not give a fuck about Masquel, but I really give a fuck about my husband.
42:31
SPEAKER_02: Oh, and your relationship connectively.
42:34
SPEAKER_02: So like I'll be I'll just be like, oh, you're psyched that your boys won, you know, or whatever.
42:39
SPEAKER_02: That's all I have to say.
42:40
SPEAKER_02: That was five words.
42:41
SPEAKER_02: Your sense, your boys won.
42:43
SPEAKER_02: Okay, five words, and that was a bid.
42:46
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and so sometimes it's really kind of fascinating when you start to notice that people in the home are just talking to the air, yes, and they're just saying something, and to feel sent seen and heard in those little moments actually is what creates really the central nervous system of the home to settle, you're bring more room for connection.
43:07
SPEAKER_02: So I think I made my point.
43:08
SPEAKER_02: That was a lot of information.
43:09
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but so information helpful.
43:12
SPEAKER_04: All right, Deb.
43:13
SPEAKER_04: Yes, we we've already said said this, but as we summarize right now, as we kind of come to a close, let's just take two minutes to reiterate why connection with our children is so important.
43:29
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
43:31
SPEAKER_02: Okay, yes.
43:32
SPEAKER_02: Um I mean, I think the number one thing here is that our kids need to know that when they're home with us is where they rest.
43:44
SPEAKER_02: Right?
43:44
SPEAKER_02: They're working really hard out in the world, no matter what age they're at.
43:48
SPEAKER_02: You know, if they're home all the time, they're not working that hard.
43:50
SPEAKER_02: But to be out in the world is hard, and home is where they rest, and that is where they feel seen and heard.
43:57
SPEAKER_02: And when they feel that sense of connection.
44:00
SPEAKER_02: Connection with us again, regardless of how it looks like, just some ability to feel settled with us, they will develop a stronger sense of self, more confidence.
44:12
SPEAKER_02: There's a feeling of purpose, it feels like they matter.
44:16
SPEAKER_02: And that's what we want to help them go out and be more resilient in the world when really hard things happen.
44:22
SPEAKER_04: Totally.
44:22
SPEAKER_04: I think when I the way I would answer that question, just right along with what you're saying, but saying it just a little bit differently, is that what we want for our children, because it's the healthiest place psychologically and emotionally for them to be, is to feel safe.
44:41
SPEAKER_04: And we feel safe in connection with others.
44:44
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
44:44
SPEAKER_04: And so providing our kids, whether they're newborn babies or adults, right, that sense of safety and connection within the relationship, we are literally um bolstering them for all the things that they need to do as your point to be resilient and successful in the world, right?
45:06
SPEAKER_04: And so that sense of safety, again, if we go back to like biology, right?
45:12
SPEAKER_04: If we feel disconnected, our nervous systems go into fight, flight, or freeze because historically that's dangerous to be left alone.
45:20
SPEAKER_04: Right.
45:20
SPEAKER_04: Right.
45:21
SPEAKER_04: It's not necessarily dangerous to be alone in the world anymore in 2023, but our nervous systems don't know that, right?
45:28
SPEAKER_04: And so providing that safe container of connection sets our kids up to be able to, as you said, go explore the world and come back and trust that they're okay and trust that the world is a safe place.
45:41
SPEAKER_04: And of course, the world has lots of things that are unsafe.
45:44
SPEAKER_04: And in lots of situations, our kids may not be quote unquote okay, but we want that baseline.
45:49
SPEAKER_04: We want that sense of safety for our kids.
45:52
SPEAKER_02: Beautiful.
45:53
SPEAKER_02: So let I want to leave with one thought for us to consider.
45:58
SPEAKER_02: And I'd love for our listeners to like really meditate on this.
46:03
SPEAKER_02: You already kind of identified how you idealize connection.
46:06
SPEAKER_02: The next step would be to start to pay attention to ways you think your kid feels connection.
46:13
SPEAKER_02: And like, and that's just you becoming a little bit of a detective.
46:17
SPEAKER_02: So the and take note of it.
46:19
SPEAKER_02: Like it might be something so simple as you like, you know, helping them clean out their backpack at the end of the day, or going into their TikTok world, or listening to a silly story about drama at the lunch table, you know, putting in an earphone and sharing music with your kids.
46:38
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
46:39
SPEAKER_04: Watching a TV show they love.
46:41
SPEAKER_04: Exactly.
46:41
SPEAKER_02: So start to kind of keep a little running list, either physically or in your mind, around what connection looks like for them, what you think connection should look like, and then all the different ways that connection happens, even when it's not, you know, loud or high energy.
47:01
SPEAKER_02: And then you start to like savor in those moments.
47:04
SPEAKER_04: I want to start a conversation on our Instagram uh page about this, because I think this is a great place to learn from other mothers.
47:13
SPEAKER_04: Please share.
47:13
SPEAKER_04: So we will put when when this um, well, now that people are listening, it is live, but you know, once it's live, it will be live.
47:22
SPEAKER_04: Come on to our Instagram and DM us or share in comments the different ways you connect.
47:27
SPEAKER_04: Because I think we are often looking for that.
47:29
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, we learn from each other and what a great conversation to have as a community.
47:33
SPEAKER_04: Absolutely.
47:34
SPEAKER_04: Yay! Deb, I'm so glad I'm in connection with you.
47:38
SPEAKER_04: Thank you.
47:38
SPEAKER_04: I love your sweater.
47:40
SPEAKER_04: Thank you.
47:41
SPEAKER_01: I love you.
47:42
SPEAKER_01: I love you too.
47:43
SPEAKER_01: Bye.
47:44
SPEAKER_03: Hey you guys, it's Kate.
47:46
SPEAKER_03: We really hope you enjoyed this week's episode.
47:49
SPEAKER_03: And if you did, go ahead and share it with a friend.
47:51
SPEAKER_03: It also would mean the world to me and Deb if you would take a minute and write a review.
47:56
SPEAKER_03: If this podcast makes you laugh, makes you cry in the best of ways, helps you feel less alone, gives you information that's useful to you in your mothering journey.
48:05
SPEAKER_03: If you write a review, it will make this more accessible to other mothers like you.
48:09
SPEAKER_03: So take a minute.
48:11
SPEAKER_03: We'd be so grateful.
48:12
SPEAKER_03: Thanks for being here.