Latest / GEL & Tell / Ep 19 - Why Is Making Female Friends as an Adult So Hard?

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Ep 19 - Why Is Making Female Friends as an Adult So Hard? · GEL & Tell

• Nora: We're back! G: We are welcome back to episode 19 of Gel and Tell. Nora: Chao and Cal. G: Are we ever going to be able to say it in synchronous? let's try again. Welcome back to Nora: Welcome back to episode. Welcome back G: Welcome back to Nora: to episode G: wait, I should say welcome, you say back, and I say to episode. Okay, so we do like Welcome to nineteen of gel and tell. Like one more time. Nora: Okay, okay. Go go go back episode off you that was my turn, G. 19 off chill. Okay, go back episode off and G: Welcome to nineteen Jell. Nora: Good. G: Yeah, Nora: Ha ha ha G: what is today's episode about Nora? Nora: We're talking about female friendships, aren't we? and navigating making friends in your twenties, thirties. well, basically as an adult, 'cause I do think it changes quite significantly, doesn't it? Yeah. G: Yeah, as we get on. So the title is Why is making female friendships in adulthood so hard? Nora: It is tough, isn't it, at times? G: All the time. before we jump into the episode, give us an update. How is prep going? How are you doing? Did you have a great time in Greece? Nora: yeah, I'm excited. I can't believe I am 3.5 weeks out. G: What less than a month to go. Nora: Yeah, I know, which is a bit crazy. but yeah, I'm feeling good, energy's good, body is responding, holding a bit more inflammation this week just because I'm a bit more tired. yeah, I couldn't I couldn't be happier with with How far I've come, to be honest. I've been very reflective of how it's gone. I've been on prep for almost six months now, which is crazy G: Wow. Nora: to say. But I've enjoyed every every single aspect of it. stepping on stage, I think it's gonna be that thing that I'm like, I do it and I'm so proud of it because it's such a scary thing to do. So I'm looking forward to that. Greece was fantastic, so wholesome. I went for one of my best friends, Hendus, who's getting married soon. we had the best time. and then obviously I then met you in Rhodes for a client content trip as well. So yeah, that was such a good week Just also a very good trip to reflect on our progress so far this year, which I think we both like needed that. I think we had some really nice conversations whilst we were out there about like how far we've come and yeah, I'm just feeling very good coming back from that. So yeah, how are you? You are also three and a half weeks out from your next com. G: yeah. so always good. Greece was lovely. Agree. Sun Food Company, 10 out of 10. also so proud of you. You're so close now. It's really exciting. Nora: Yeah. G: but I'm doing so I'm doing my first Athex competition on yeah, the 22nd of August as well. we had a sim on Saturday. and I'd say like some parts went really well, some parts got some room for improvement. You know, when you're just like a bit tired and you haven't feeled well and like it's been like I drank quite a lot last week and sleep wasn't good. So I think going into a Saturday morning trying to get like max lifts was always gonna be like a bit of a stretch. we'll just see what happens and try and enjoy the day, I think, is the main thing. But life is good, business is good. we've unboarded a new client this week, which is really exciting, and then we're running a special offer actually, aren't we? that launches on Monday. so we've been working busily behind the scenes on getting everything prepped for that. so if you are someone that has been tuning in, watching our content, you know, you're a bit curious, keep your eyes peeled for Monday because we are launching something brand new that we have never done before. and it's an exclusive opportunity to work with us for a special, special offer. So yeah, keep your eyes peeled, limited spots. Nora: That's gonna be yeah, that's gonna be quite cool. so am I right in saying that Dexter has heard the start of the podcast and yap and he's left the room. G: You would be right in that. Nora: I just saw his tale and just like Yeah. Yeah. G: He just thought, fuck this, I'm out of here because yeah, to be fair, my little Dexter baby is not feeling a hundred percent today. So he probably doesn't wanna listen to this big girl chat yap. Nora: Yeah. Like too girly for me. Sorry girl. Bye. love that. G: Yeah, bless him. so today's episode is a bit of a girl chat one, really, isn't it? in the last episode, we did speak Nora: Yeah. G: a bit, well, a lot about how relationships can help or hurt business, ambition, Nora: Yeah. G: success. But today's one is a bit different. We're talking specifically about female friendships because they are different breed. And how to make and maintain friendships as you go through life and adulthood in different chapters. because it is really hard. And and we've both spoken about it in quite a lot of detail, very vulnerably to each other. the people don't talk about it enough. So we thought we'll just open this can of worms together and sh bear our vulnerabilities to the world. Nora: Yeah. I think it's yeah. I think a lot of people will relate. I think G: Mm. Nora: when you get older, like it almost feels like a bit too risky to be vulnerable and like, you know, show emotion and try and put effort in relationships. 'cause it is harder. When you're younger, like you make friends because of like the distance as well. Like you are either either in school with them or like, you know, like your parents meet up with other people's parents and like you get to know them and then you become great friends. Whereas like I think with adult friendships, it's not the case, is it? Like, you know, you live far away from friends typically and there's a lot more effort that has to go into into G: Mm. Nora: friendships as you get older. G: Hundred percent. It's like when you're younger, they're built into your life, aren't they? And then as you get older, you define and choose who you want to be friends with. And whether you start a new job, move country in your case, or go to a different city, change your environment, you're always gonna have to like make new friends. But it is definitely harder than people admit. So maybe like let me ask you, why do you think from your perspective that it feels so awkward to make new friends as an adult. Nora: I think for me, as I have grown up also away from my family, like away from like what I was used to, and become my own person and realize what I stand for, like my values, what I want around me, like the energy that I want around me, the people that I want around me. I think I've been more reserved and hesitant than like making friends because of like you don't know who you're gonna gel with. but yeah, because of that and because of how I am as a person, I give a lot to friendships, A G: Mm. Nora: lot of energy, a lot of effort, in I've put a lot of intention into any relationship in my life, I think there's an element of like fear if I put all this effort and like it doesn't turn out to be meaningful and I can depend on on that person then maybe it's not worth and maybe that's the wrong mindset to have, but I think it comes from fear, really. How about you? G: I think this is quite interesting because we're very different in this sense. Nora: Right. G: So like I think that like I view kind of like friendships slightly differently. I have different people that I would surround myself with and I put in different amounts of effort with different people. not every friend of mine gets the same amount of energy and effort and intention, which possibly a bad thing, right? I'm not saying like that's something to be proud of, it's just a fact of what I do. But like some of my friends are more high maintenance than others, some are low maintenance. some of my oldest, bestest friends are super low maintenance. So I don't have to talk to them all the time. I don't have to even make plans with them all the time. But when we do see each other make plans speak, they're like my deepest relationships and they're the people that I can trust with anything. I could ring a drop of a hat and they'd be there. But like they're not necessarily the people that I speak to the most frequently or make the most effort with, which maybe is wrong. but I think different people are in different life stages and Different proximities mean that you put in different effort in different ways. So, like some of the people that I make the most plans with are good friends of mine, but we have similar interests. So we want to do the same shit. Like we might want to go and play paddle, we might want to go train, we might want to go on a run, we might want to go to the pub or whatever the thing is that I like doing, which some of my like really good friends just don't enjoy those things. So my plans will look different. So then arguably I could be putting more effort into friendships that are not my like strongest friendships necessarily, but they're the people that I want to spend more time with at the moment. And I don't Nora: Yeah. G: know if that's a really bad thing to admit, but it's just how I operate. Nora: No, I don't think it's a yeah, I don't think it's a bad thing. I think that's very interesting. I am completely different to that. 'cause I get full like I get I get a lot of energy from good conversations. I like talking with people that I can resonate on a deeper level with. And that's where like I consider someone like a really good friend of mine, where G: Mm. Nora: I can resonate to that level. I don't have as many friends, I would say. I keep my circle quite small because I am that person that does value that more than like having the friends that I go out with more often, if that makes sense. I think it's just different G: Yeah. Nora: personalities and I think that's okay. G: Do you think maybe that like I say do that more because obviously Josh works away quite a lot? So like you and Geo get to do a lot of things together frequently. Like I don't Nora: Yeah. G: know, I'm kind of psychoanalysing this, but like, so like you guys can like go train at the weekend together and do the things that you enjoy. Whereas like if Josh is away for a month I could be by myself or I could make plans with my friends that want to do the things that I would want to do, arguably Nora: Yeah. G: with Josh, or that I would do by myself that I'm not going to do by myself. Like I don't know, I do wonder whether that plays a part in my kind of behaviors around friends because I don't want to just not do the things that I want to do. Like I know this weekend, like I want to go train, I want to go on a run, I want to play some paddle, and then I've got my friends 30th. So I need to like fit all of these things in and then I'll invite or ask people that I know will enjoy those things to do them with me because Josh isn't here to do them. Nora: Yeah. I think that's an interesting point. I do think it makes sense now that you explain it, 'cause I do spend a lot of time with Geo. G: Hm. Nora: we don't see each other when we're working, but like everything else, we're pretty much like, you know, we have the same interests. I enjoy being, around him and like spending time and like our hobbies are G: Similar. Nora: Pretty much the same or similar. so yeah. G: Possibly. Possibly does impact it. if you think about though, like making new friends as an adult, because I can think of there's been a few times over the last few years where both of us have felt maybe slightly lonely, and that we needed like, you know, some new people around us, basically. You know, we have each other, but we don't live that close. Like for people that don't know, it was like a three hour trip between us, really, end to end. So it's not like we can just go and grab a coffee. Obviously, we're lucky in that we do see each other as much as we can. But like we're long distance besties, arguably. Nora: Yeah. G: have you ever maybe wanted to make friends with someone? Specifically, let's go into the female friendship. So, like, you know, there's like there's a girl, you're like, she's a bit, she's a bit nice. Like, I feel like we could be friends. Have you ever had that feeling of like, I want to make friends with her, but I feel a bit weird asking her, one, does she want to be my friend? Two, if she wants to do something, or like even how to like open up that door of conversation. Have you ever been in that situation? Nora: yeah, I have. found myself asking someone in a setting that I'm more comfortable in. So like the gym for me is like a very safe space. Like I feel very comfortable. I feel confident when I'm in the gym. like in that setting, I have previously gone up to, you know, another woman and I started a conversation and like that's how I made quite a few friends that I have here, really. G: Love the Nora: I think confidence plays a big role in how much you put yourself out there to make friends. so yeah, in that setting, yes. The other thing that I did tell you randomly, like the other day, didn't I? Was like when I have other people around me that are more social than me, I feel more safe to do that as well. So like when when we're together, you're very social. You make friends everywhere. Like I it's one of the things that I love so much about you is like wherever we go. I remember once, like when we started getting clothes, we were catching a flight to South Africa, weren't we? And we went G: Yeah. Nora: in the lounge like you made friends with the man eating on the table next to us. We're like, how does she do this? Like it was such a G: Well he was so interesting. He was flying to India. Nora: Yeah. But yeah, when I'm in a situation where I have someone close to me that is more social than me, I also build up my confidence and get more social as well. so yeah, it depend it depends on the setting for me, I think. G: Yeah. What would you say when you're going over to these women in the gym? What would be your like one liner? What would be your chat up line? Nora: I always compliment their outfit and like, yeah, just ask them where their top is from or something like that. And then I was like, what are you training? And like it's that's the thing though, like I feel very comfortable in that context. G: Mm. Nora: So I know how to like start a conversation without being awkward or overthinking it, And then it turns into like a going for a coffee and you know that's how I met one of my closest friends now. and we train together every week now. And it's like it's such a cute thing 'cause I did meet her in the gym. G: It is kind of like dating, though, isn't it? Nora: Yeah, I think so, isn't it? Yeah. G: Yeah. Well it's like, you know, you have to kind of like start the conversation. So like are you gonna like go up to them somewhere, slide into their DMs, like start the chat, figure out if there's a vibe, if you're kinda liking them, if you think you could get on, then you make a plan and then you've got a follow through with the plan and then you gotta like you Nora: Yeah. G: know what I mean? Like you it is building from like nothing. It's very much like dating, I think, making friends Nora: Yeah, I I think so as well. G: Hm. Have you ever had an example of where it's gone wrong? Nora: if you go and approach someone and you you're getting one word answers I'm the kind of person that will be like, you know what, okay, I tried. Bye. G: Yeah. Nora: yeah, I have had people that were like a bit more closed up, just didn't seem to be interested. I was like, okay, fair. G: Yeah, fair. I had one last year where we were at the pub and we were having like a really nice like girly chat. There was like a few girls around the table. Can't remember how it came up in conversation, but it was like, ooh, like, basically, like, would you would anyone like want to do like a book club? And it was like there was like a lot of interest in having like a girl's little book club. And I was like, my god. How amazing would that be? Like meet once a month, discuss the book, have a few drinks, like gorgeous. So I made the group chat, added everyone in, thought, this is so proactive of me. Like, I'm not very good at making plans. So I like quite proud of myself. What happened? Ghosted. Nora: Well G: Yeah. Yeah. Like so rude. And I even Nora: That's not G: followed up on it. And then I just thought, you know what? Fuck this. I'm leaving it. Like, How rude. Like, don't sit there and all to my face, be all like, yeah, that sounds so great. Would love that. Giving the number. There was a selfie, Nora, on this group chat of like the girls around the table. And there was an active conversation saying how difficult it is to make friends as a female. Look, I'm very direct and there's a reason that I actually have a lot of male friends because I feel like boys are easier to be friends with. Like they say what it is. If they're pissed off, they tell you you can communicate easier. You just make a plan. There's nothing weird. It's just done. Girls can be bitchy and like girl group chats are like a breeding ground for like nastiness, to be honest. And I I've never really like vibed very well in like big groups of girls. possibly growing up with brothers as well. I don't know. Nora: Yeah. G: I just get uncomfortable and then just dismiss it and just kind of step back. So like this was quite a big thing for me, like to make this. And my friend basically said to me, When you first became friends with me, G, you said to me, don't remember it because I probably was drunk, but she said, if you ever have a problem with me or like I do something that upsets you or pisses you off, please just tell me and don't go and speak to someone else about it so I hear it from them. Like I would rather you just be really direct with me. So we've just got like an open friendship that's very honest and transparent because I Nora: Yeah. G: value that from my friends because I'm not perfect. Sometimes I don't think before I speak. And like I don't want to like go into this friendship knowing that like there could be anything like behind the scenes kind of thing. And she was like, I respected that so much. and we had this conversation in front of this group of girls that she'd brought up, and they were all like, Yeah, yeah, that's so great. Love that. I'm exactly the same. I'm so direct, da-da-da-da-da. Made the group chat, invited them all in, tried to put a date in, completely ignored. And I just think, look, if you don't want to do it, it's fine, just say no. But the fact that you can actively sit there and ignore and these messages being seen. And then my friend that was in the chat as well, she follows up and she's like, yeah, sounds great. I can do this today, can't wait for it or something. And then still no response from these other girls. Then I tried again. And I thought, you know what? Fuck this. I'm just leaving this and I will make zero effort with you now. Nora: Yeah. G: And I just think it was so rude. And it really could have set me back on this path of making friends as an adult. and I haven't done anything like that since, to be honest, because I felt really embarrassed. Nora: Hm. G: I was like, I'm giving myself the ick that like I was being proactive and thought this was a really nice idea and everyone was bought in. And I've just been now completely ghosted and made to feel like a bit of a tit, to be honest. Nora: Yeah. But that shouldn't be the case though. Like I'm a huge believer. Like like no matter how people treat you, you should be proud of how you treat people yourself. So like, you know, when you put in effort, you should be proud of that. You've done something that's out of your comfort zone. it doesn't matter if that's reciprocated or not. G: Yeah, and it obviously didn't pay off. And I would have loved to have set up a book club, but anyway, I'm not doing it now. I would love to know because I think what's really interesting about your story and like how you've had to like restart is like you move countries. you know, at what age was it when you moved to the UK? 18? Nora: I was eighteen, yeah. G: Yeah. So like talk us through what's it actually like to move countries and have to like build your life and friendships from scratch? I know you may knew a couple of people maybe, but not really, right? Nora: I only knew one person when I G: Wow. Nora: moved. I moved when I was 18 it to Glasgow. that's where I studied my first degree. and yeah, I moved and basically I stayed in like this uni accommodation when I moved, I knew this one guy that was actually like my parents' friend's son, who was also Cypriot, also moving for the first time, first year. G: Wow. Nora: it was a nice thing to like know someone and have you know have that familiarity. But yeah, it did feel quite lonely at first cause i restarting your life is not easy. Like as much as I was 18 and like I didn't have everything figured out. I did have some really good friendships. had stability, you know, back home. but I wouldn't change it because I it's taught me so much. I think making friends, it was just the the normal uni experience, wasn't it? Like, you know, going at parties, you know, meeting people at the course I didn't have as many friends in my course. I met a lot of my friends outside of yeah, just uni, just a parties or like at the accommodation that we had, they were hosting like this like social st stuff like on different days. so that's when I actually met my best friend who's also one of my bridesmaids, at my wedding. and again, like I'm very good with like putting effort into few friendships rather than a lot of people. So like I met that girl and we got on and we were very similar. So that's how I kind of like spend my uni years was like one really good friendship and then our circle around that. was really nice. We got a studio and it was next to each other. So I used to like live next to her. you know, like we always talk about like when we like have kids, like imagine living next to each other So I've I've lived that with my best friend at uni. we would have our studios next to each other and it would be like so nice just having that person that you can count on away from your family. G: Mm. Nora: yeah, next to you whenever you needed that. it was so special. And then I moved to London. I spent like five, six years in Glasgow and then I moved to London, which was another restart for me. Cause again G: Yeah. Nora: We had like a bit of family from Geo's side. and one of my friends who I met at uni, also moved to London for work. So we did have one or two people that we knew, but again, it was a bit of like restarting. yeah, and that's where I really leaned on making friends in the gym because that's where I felt more comfortable. And then obviously obviously work and that's where we met G: I love it. It shows a lot of like resilience, I think, to be able to just start again and put yourself out there. And I think uni is a great opportunity to meet people. It's it's different to making friends as an adult actually, isn't it? 'Cause you literally get sort of thrust into these situations where there's like groups of people you can meet that are the same age and at the same point in life. So I do think making friends at uni is a lot easier than making friends as an adult after uni. Nora: Yeah. I was naturally exposed to social situations because I was at uni. You know, whereas like G: Hm. Yeah. Nora: I think when you have a job and you've got responsibilities it's just it's a lot harder because you don't G: Yeah. Nora: have as much time available as, you know, having, I don't know, three lectures a day. yeah, so G: Hundred percent God, three lectures a day. I had like three lectures a week. but I also think when you're working, like you can end up having friends that are like in very different life stages. Like I can think of some of my favorite people that I've worked with over the last ten years and like some of them would be in their like fifties or already have kids and be in their forties or be like, you know, like different people from different walks of life because you just work closely with them. it's still really nice friendships, but they either don't live near you or you only see them at work. And then when you leave that job, you may stay in touch a little bit, but you don't necessarily keep the friendship. Nora: Yeah. G: It's a bit of a strange one. And I feel sad about that for some of the friends that I've made over the years because like you get really close to people when you work with them because you see them all the time, especially when you're in an office. Like you see them Nora: Mm. Yeah. G: every single day. And then when you leave, and like the office I'm thinking of, I left just around COVID because went on furlough and then didn't go back. Nora: Yeah. G: and like I never really saw them again. Nora: Yeah. G: And it's like because really we were work friends. Nora: Yeah. That's the thing with work, isn't it? Like you spend so much time with all these people and you're like because you are in that setting, you have a lot of things to talk about. G: Mm. Nora: But then on the grand scheme of things, like a lot of the people that you consider friends at work, you don't necessarily have as much in common outside. G: side of that. When you lose that common thread, you have nothing to talk about. Yeah, we've definitely seen that. Nora: Yeah. G: so work friendships can be great and they're really important, I think, to have good friends when you're at work, but they're not the same as like a really close, like a really good like female friendship, like where you feel really connected to someone and you feel safe and you've got that like person or people around you. So what would you say defines a really good like female friendship? Nora: just like with many things in my life, intention. Like when you see someone is intentional and putting effort within you don't have to be the same people. You don't have to like the same things. But like if they show that they care and they're there, Yeah, that's that's a good person to have around in my opinion. when you're an adult, you need that. you cannot, you know, rely on like seeing them like every single day or like talking like if someone needs you to be talking to them daily to know that you're a good friend of theirs, like I think that's not a good what's it called, like metric to judge a friendship on. yeah. G: No, can't be after that. That's not it, is it? No. Nora: What do you think 'cause obviously like we we met at work, but now we're obviously really good friends. If we reflect on our friendship, what do you think makes our friendship good? G: I think we have so many positive things in our friendship. I think we are incredibly honest with each other. Nora: Mm. G: Like we always call each other out if we think the other person's behaving in a certain way, which is painful at times, but I think really powerful for how we can communicate and be closer. We care deeply about each other's goals. And one thing that stood out for me years ago, and you probably don't even remember this, but In 2023, I was training for a marathon after my brother got diagnosed with cancer. And it'd been a really difficult time for my family. And I was training for this marathon having not even run a 5K before. I just decided at Christmas. My brother said he was going to run a marathon because he was going to prove the doctors wrong. And I said, All right, I'll do it with you. And all throughout that year, Nora would say to me, on probably a weekly basis, I'm really proud of you. Or it's really inspired me how much you've stuck to this plan. And like, you know, really just like out of nowhere, completely unprompted, kind comments about how like hard I was working and like really noticed the effort that I was putting into doing something totally out of my comfort zone, totally new. And like I just felt really seen. And like I think that that was a moment for me where I was like, that's what a friend should be like. It's not competitive, it's supportive, it's championing your effort and Nora: Yeah. G: your goals and your wins. And like, There was never any like judgment on it or like, you're running so much, or like, why are you doing it? Or I I know I was doing it for a really good cause, so maybe no one would have ever said that. But it was very much just like, yeah, ongoing support and like kindness that I felt from you that I didn't really get from other people in my life. so like for me, that was like a really pivotal moment where I felt more connected to you and I was like, I feel like we are more than just work friends. Nora: Yeah. that's very cute. That made me smile. Aww. G: Move on, move on. Nora: love it. I think that's that's a big part of our friendship though. We are both very kind to each other. We are very different and like we have different interests, but we also respect that and we Like you said, we want to see each other win, and be happy in their life, you know, like with any aspect of our life, you know, like we've both had difficult times across the years. and I know for a fact if I call you, you'll be there. G: hundred percent, no doubt, any time of day. And I know Nora: Yeah. G: that I know that wholeheartedly too. And if I said to you, I need you to travel to see me this afternoon, you would get on a train immediately. Nora: yeah. G: And it is like three hours. So it's like a big distance, but you would do it. And like I just think that that's really important and holds so much like power to why we've got such a strong friendship. But I do think that like us being able to tell each other the truth kindly in those way moments where like, you know, one of us has done something that the other didn't like. Being able to like say that and not just like hold or harbor any resentment is really important. And I think a lot of friends don't say those things to each other. But then what do they do? They go and tell someone else. Don't Nora: Yeah. G: say it behind their back to someone else. And then it's like, okay, so like you've not dealt with it, you're harboring some like negative energy and feelings towards each other. You're not working through it or building the relationship. You're just slagging each other off. Nora: Yeah. G: Which we don't do. So that's Nora: No, no. That's the other thing that I think like forms part of a good friendship is like when you talk highly about someone else behind their back. Like people that l literally call people friends but then talk badly G: And Nora: about them. Like I'm just like, what are you doing? Like what's the point? G: What's the point? Yeah. Nora: Like it's not cool. and G: Yeah. Nora: I know for a fact the people that I have around me, I can trust. And like G: Yeah. They'd build you up in a room that you weren't in. Yeah. Nora: Yeah. Yeah. G: So important. And I do think that, you know, we said it the other day, but like sad people or people that aren't happy shit talk others. Nora: Yeah. G: and I know that there's been phases of my life where I look back and I'm embarrassed by like I would be like bitchy or like getting involved in gossip and talking about other people. Like you can fall into that if you're in the wrong circles. And I I can see that I've been there at different points and I don't like that, but I've learned from it. And that's why I think surrounding yourself with friends that Have other things to talk about than other people is so important. And I know we Nora: Yeah. G: we spoke about that a little bit last week, but I do think that being able to celebrate someone when they're not there is such a green flag in a female friendship. and Nora: Yeah. G: just being able to be fully yourself and not like putting on a front or masking or whatever, like just being yourself without having to perform. Nora: I do think that's a big part though, putting on a front in female friendships. I do think sometimes women have the need to make life seem like bigger than you know is, almost have the the need to like share that they're more successful or happy or overexaggerate things. Whereas I don't think that builds a good friendship. I think being vulnerable and sharing the things that you know, worry you or make you overthink. Like that's what builds good trust within a friendship. G: Mm-hmm. Nora: and don't get me wrong, I'm all about celebrating wins and we're, you know, we celebrate our wins with each other all the time. But like that's not what formed our friendship. What formed our friendship and got it to the point now where, you know, I do like I always tell you like I do see you like family and we have that like sisterly bond. G: Mm. Nora: It's because we had the harder conversations, the deeper conversations, the ones that we both got quite vulnerable sharing things that we wouldn't share with a stranger, you know, that we just met. G: Yeah. Nora: Yeah. G: But that takes time, right? Like you can't share that kind of stuff Nora: Yeah. G: with someone that you've only just met. And like it's, you know, you've got to almost earn your stripes a little bit in a friendship. You've got to build Nora: Yeah. G: trust over time to be able to feel vulnerable enough to share without getting anxious. Cause I know I've had this in the last couple of years where there's been times where I've like gone somewhere and I would say to you after, I'm really anxious today. And you'll say, Why? And I say, I o I feel like I overshared or I was too vulnerable. And you're like, gee, that's a good thing. And I'm like, I don't feel good about it, even though maybe it's okay, but because something in me feels really like insecure about like oversharing or like telling people about my trauma or whatever, you know, like I just feel like like it's not easy to be seen fully and vulnerable. Nora: Yeah, no, it's not easy a at all. G: right, this is quite an interesting one. what kind of things can you do in your friendships or relationships, whether it's someone you've been friends with for years, whether it's someone you've just met? That can show and exhibit the traits of you becoming a better friend. Nora: Have one and I it's one that I want to practice more as well. Call them. I think we are like in a phase in our life where like everyone's on their phones, texting, being on social media, da da. Like, we don't call people anymore to just chat. And I remember that's where we got closer. We started having phone calls like for hours, and like we would share, and that's what built up our friendship, I have been trying to put more effort, especially because my best friends are all long distance best friends. Like it's just how it is because of how my life has been the last couple of years, moving abroad. you know, we are not living near each other either. so all of my closest people, for me to keep those friendships, I have to be more intentional with them, which is something that I'm willing to do, but s part of that is just making time to call them, you know, and ask them G: Yeah, lock Nora: and not when I need something from them. Right? Like that's the other thing. It's like you can be sometimes falling into the loop of like only messaging someone when you need something and it's not a good thing. G: No. Nora: you should be checking in on people just to see how they're doing, not because, you know, you need G: You need something. Nora: something. G: Yeah, overgreed. I love that. I think phone calls are really powerful. And whenever you have a phone call catch up with someone, it feels great. Like you feel like, it's so nice. Nora: It feels amazing. G: But it's something that you're right, we don't think about as much. Nora: Yeah. G: Voice notes, however. Nora: This is the thing though, right? You say you hate voice notes, but you voice note me all the time. I do enjoy them. Yeah. G: Yeah, but you like voice notes, so I can voice note you but I don't want voice notes from other people. Nora: I'm an exception. yeah. G: You are. Sorry, Dexter's barking. I think one thing that I'm trying to work on is making more plans. So I'm a yes man. I'll always say yes to the plan, but I won't always make the plan. So I'm trying Nora: Yeah. G: to be more intentional with making plans and putting stuff in the diary with friends so that I'm not just waiting for someone else to make a plan. I think that's a sign of a good friend as well. Nora: Yeah, I think that's definitely something that shows intention as well. G: Mm-hmm. nice. Okay, Should we do a quick friendship green flag, red flag? So I'll Nora: Okay. G: read one, you reply. No, yeah, and then you read one, I reply. Okay, so the first one is she watches every story but never likes your posts. Nora: Red flag. It doesn't take much, right? Like it takes one second to double tap. Even if you don't spend time looking at the post, you should be liking the post. Support your friends regardless. That's my opinion. G: Mm-hmm. Nice. Nora: Only messages when she has drama. G: Red flag, boring, next. Nora: Okay. G: She says we need a catch up but never actually makes a plan. Nora: red flock. Ooh, gets into a relationship and stops messaging or like calling or G: Red flag, you were in the right place at the right time. Nora: Ha ha. G: okay. she's always honest with you. Nora: that's a green flag. Not be nasty though. Like don't G: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Nora: be like rude. But like if you're a good friend, you would share something honestly with the other person there's always a way to say it. G: Yeah, nice. Nora: Yeah. Hypes you up when you're not there. G: Green. Definitely. she tells you when you're being a dickhead. Nora: Green flag. We do that with each other quite a lot. G: Yeah, we do. Nora: she can go months without seeing you, but it always feels exactly the same when you do. G: Green flag. okay. She sends a twelve minute voice note after disappearing for three weeks. Really? I think that could depend what Nora: Red flag. Yeah. I think No, it's like over G: Compensating. Nora: compensating for the fact that y they've not been there. G: Hmm, interesting. what have female friendships in adulthood taught you? Nora: I know. I've read this and I resonated so much with it. when you're an adult, you cannot expect each other to stay the same. You know, you won't be the same person that you are ten years from now. And like the right people will stick by you and won't expect you to be the same person, but will love you and be kind and be intentional with you no matter what and how you change and will, you know, celebrate the wins and and be there for the, you know, the hard times, regardless if you have changed. G: Love. Nora: What about you? G: I think it's okay to be vulnerable and ask someone if they want to do something and make plans. And like that's okay, even if it goes wrong, like my pear-shaped story earlier. so it's okay to put yourself out there and meet new people as an adult. So yeah, friendships obviously change as you get older. Doesn't mean it's wrong, just means it's different. sometimes just entering new chapters, meeting new people, but as long as you stay true to yourself and put intention in. Nora: Stay true to yourself. be there for your people. The grass is isn't always greener. That's another thing. Like we sometimes crave new friendships but don't realise what's there already. G: the grass is greener where you water it. Nora: There we go. Love that. But yeah. G: Bosch, mic drop, have a good day. Thanks for tuning in as always. Send us your thoughts, questions or reflections on how you best make friends as a female in your adulthood. We'd love to hear from you. And don't forget to drop us a follow, subscribe and five star review, bitches. Nora: See you on the next one.