Latest / The You Project / #1608 Olympian To Inmate (To Inspiration) - Michael Katsidis

Transcript

#1608 Olympian To Inmate (To Inspiration) - Michael Katsidis · The You Project

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: I'll get a team. It's you project. What else would
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: it be? It's Jumbo, it's Harps. I hope this finds
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: you well, Michael cat CDIs Hi, mate, how are you well?
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Thanks? Craig, how are you?
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: I'm good, buddy. Did I fuck up that pronunciation? I
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: didn't get it right?
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: It's yeah either either.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: Either or well. I should have told you before we
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: went live. Mate. We're a very liberal, laid back conversation.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: We're a very sweary affair. So feel freedom, you know, swear,
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: but well you know, if you you don't need to.
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: You don't need to moderate yourself here or with this audience.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: My audience are very familiar to colorful language. So I
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: know where you are. But tell my audience where we find.
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: You today, Brisbane Queen's Land.
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: Have you been up there forever you're born? There? Is
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: that where you're from?
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: Or did you born in Timba? Yes? I was in
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: Twimba most of my life and then with my career
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: to went to the States. So I was in the
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: States for six years. Then the later part of my
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: career started progressing back to Australia. You know, I did
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: like a bit of time training out of Melbourne, and
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: then of course training Sydney with Johnny Lewis, and then
• 1:15
  Speaker 2: back to my roots again, back to with my very
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: first trainer, and then it's been Gold Coast Brisbane.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, when you were a kid, did you want to
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: be an athlete? Did you want to be a boxer?
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: Did you like a little kid? Did you have aspirations?
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: Is that what you wanted to do?
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like a genetical kind of like it's well, my
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: brother and I will both be the same. But for me,
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: I would watch the Rocky movies. I was like seven
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: years of age, and I saw like this guy's overcoming adversity.
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: He had nothing, much like when I grew up as well,
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: like we had nothing and come you know, and you know,
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: I just said to myself from the age of seven,
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: I want to be a champion. I planned the seed.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: Then I planned the seed then and it wasn't until
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: I was about the age of eleven. I was eleven
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: and a friend of mine took me down to the
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: local PC y C. I put on a put on
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: a set of gloves and ipp two black eyes and
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: then I love that, you know, I want to get better,
• 2:20
  Speaker 2: you know, so instead of the glass being half full,
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: half empty. It was half fulled, you know, And I
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: was keen to get back there and make sure next
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: time that I didn't get beat up as badly. And
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: I went back in the next week, I only got
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: one black eye. I was like, I'm doing better.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: That's fifty percent improvement. Yeah that's hilarious. Yeah, well that's
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: I mean that means you build for boxing, right, because
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: most kids are going to get punched in the face
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: and two black eyes and go fuck that. See you later.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: I'm going to take up fucking running or something.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I didn't see that.
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah did you have Obviously you had an innate talent,
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: but how much and you ended up being a world
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: ampion and all of those things and Olympic athletes or
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: fucking amazing. How much of your success do you reckon
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: was innate talent? And how much do you reckon was work, discipline,
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: self control, sweat?
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: Yep? So, like world champions aren't made overnight. And then
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: you asked any businessman, any successful person, whatever they do,
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: it didn't happen overnight. And you know, and you know,
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: some people look at other people that are wealthy and
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: they say, oh, look, you're just lucky. You know, but
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: it's not luck, you know, Like they'll tell you there's
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: a strategy, there's certain things, there's certain things in their
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: their genetics, so to speak, as I said earlier, the
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: things that they're in their makeup that brings them to
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: being that. Like I wasn't just born being able to
• 3:42
  Speaker 2: cop hits in the head, like I just told you earlier.
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: You know, I got two black eyes, you know, but
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: it was my my will to want to go back
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: and be better at doing that. Like I found I
• 3:52
  Speaker 2: found a love for it. I found an interest and
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: as like an addiction, like I wanted to keep on
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: doing so whatever whatever people I surrounded myself with, or
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: was the people that were going to better me because
• 4:04
  Speaker 2: I took an interest in what they do that we
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: were interested in the same thing. We had like minded
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: interest and and I want I want to growth and
• 4:11
  Speaker 2: that was just naturally within me. Yeah, what was the.
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: I'm always interested? Like I reckon, if I had been
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: you mate and I went down, I got punched in
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: the face, I would have been fucked that, Like I know,
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: I would have been right. I don't have whatever you have,
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: I don't have. That doesn't mean that, you know, it's yeah,
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: but it's what was the driver for you. Did you
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: did you associate being a boxer with well, if I'm
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: a boxer, I can look after myself and I'll be safe,
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: or did you associate it with getting out of you know,
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: like poverty or you know, financial hardship and thinking boxing
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: might be a ticket to some kind of financial freedom.
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: From from the get go. Okay, So if you want
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: to get into boxing to make money in the wrong
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: business and ain't a money business, like only the very
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: few slipped through the cracks, only the very few can
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: make it to the top end. It's a really hard,
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: long road. And I wouldn't really recommend it to anyone
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: but the psychological battle and this is the thing that
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: you know, psychological side of things, and you would agree
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: no doubt. But the I planted a seed from the
• 5:21
  Speaker 2: age of seven, and like, over years, like I always
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: took an interest, like I love the rocky, so soon
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: as I see the box and stuff, I took a
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: bit of an interest, you know, so you know, like
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: I would, I would slowly progressively get used to being hit,
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: used to see if you see me now, and then
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: there's something moving towards me, and I moved towards up
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: for the understubled the power. But that's coming from the
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: I'm the target and I'm moving away. So you learn,
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: you learn, okay, so roll with the punches. It's the
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: saying you're going to roll with the punches, and same
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: as in life, you know, you roll with the punches.
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: And that's something that I became adapted to adapt too.
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: And it was the plant, the seed that I planted
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: in my mind from such a young age, and then
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: I've gone into actually physically doing it. At the pc YIC,
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: I thought it was so great. I thought it was
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: amazing that, you know, these kids into getting there and
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: having a crack. I thought I could do this. I
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: can have a crack at this and I can actually
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: you know, neutralize their attacks and I can start, you know,
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: cop the damage. And it looks pretty good. It looks
• 6:26
  Speaker 2: it looks it feels pretty good to do this thing.
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: Because when I first walked in there made it was intimidating,
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: It was very intimidating. But to overcome that, to overcome
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: that intimidating and to be that guy in there doing it,
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: and then then to train to the point where you
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: have your first fight which I did. It doesn't matter
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: what age are. You can be fIF fifty years old
• 6:46
  Speaker 2: and have your first fight. But for an eleven year
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: old kid to get in there, and I was so look,
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: I'll go on it. I was so scared to throw
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: my right hand. I was just so scared, scared kid,
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: because I was at the Wilson and Pub in Timba
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: and everyone's watching it. It's like a real packed environment.
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: And I was that guy on that stage, you know that,
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: you know, doing doing the thing, and yeah, I had
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: overcome some real fears to get through that bite.
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: Can you tell me you were eleven years old when
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: you had your first fight?
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what the fuck in a pub? In a pub?
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: That's right, that's right.
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: That's surely that doesn't happen now. Like they're not. They're not.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: They're not putting eleven year olds in boxing rings in
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: pubs in twenty twenty four, are they?
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: You don't have to be ten, to be honest with
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: you only have to be ten, and they are they are,
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: And it's a it's a real look, it's a real
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: you know, well back in the day o case they
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: growing up, you know, got that you know, like like
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: guys would have a scrap, right and that you know,
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: they'd have the differences and they might have a scrap
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: and you know they do the old old English, so
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: you know, they a punch and they.
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: Shake hands after it, you know, yes, yes, hiding in.
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: Backyard boxing, it become like a part and part of
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: the parcel. And these days it's like kids don't even
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: know what they're doing by the time they get in
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: the fight. They don't even know how to control these emotions.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: They don't know how to match the physical with the
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: emotion they're feeling, and they just go stupid to pick
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: up a knife and stab someone or kick them in
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: the head when they're down. And there's a lot to
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: be said about the old school method of learning and
• 8:17
  Speaker 2: that and I really respect that. Yeah maybe, you know,
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: the psychological side is, you know, the's a lot to
• 8:22
  Speaker 2: be desired, but there is like you know, maybe they
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: didn't go a bit too far, but there is some
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: good that was taken from that. You know, like to
• 8:31
  Speaker 2: learn it in the boxing and you know, to learn
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: a bit about the art of art of war. And
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: you know, I really did like the old school way
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: of doing things.
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, look, I mean I'm a big fan of martial
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: arts and boxing and all the various forms of training
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: in that space. And I mean the only the only thing.
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: There's only one thing I don't like about combat sports,
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: and that's potential brain damage that comes with it, right,
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: and that's just because that's because of who I am
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: and my job than like I work. I've worked with
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: lots of people that have gotten the CTA and one
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: of my one of my athletes that I trained, I
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: won't mention his name, but he ended his own life
• 9:12
  Speaker 1: and because of that, you know, so that I hate
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: that part of it, but I fucking love you know,
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: the discipline, the structure, the accountability, the environment where you're
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: learning how to use your body in a different way.
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: You're learning how to defend yourself if you need to,
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: you know, And you're right, Like you make a really
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: good point, Michael, and that is that you know, kids
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: growing up like they've still got all the same emotions
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: that we had thirty years ago, you know, like when
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: I was a kid fucking two hundred years ago, but
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: like you're growing up, you've got all these emotions. If
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: you're a boy, you've got testosterone fucking running around your
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: body and you're a like you're a fucking idiot, You're
• 9:53
  Speaker 1: full of testosterone, you've got the IQ of a wombat,
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: and you're trying it and you're trying to figure shit
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: out right, And yes, but you're getting back in the day,
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: and I'm not recommending at anyone, So don't send me
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: an email. But back in the day, you know, we
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: were always in scuffles and you know, like not necessarily
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: punching each other in the head, but just like minor
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: altercations and disagreements and everyone, you know, all of my
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: group survived and it's all okay. But but now that
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: because we've kind of and I'm not suggesting you know
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: that people resolve problems by punching each other in general society,
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: I'm not recommending that, but having an outlet, having an
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: environment where you can go and learn to hit a
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: speedball or a floor to ceiling, or hit a heavy
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: bag or hit some pads, you know, and move around
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: and feel what it's like for somebody just to you know,
• 10:47
  Speaker 1: throw a punch at you, and just I mean, it's
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: good on so many levels other than boxing.
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: Right, Yes, well, you say what you will about it,
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: you know, like people have their own opinion however, look
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: at the youth crisis these days and look at like
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: the way kids are reacting when when when they're confronted
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: with stuff at home and the trauma that they're not
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: dealing with, they have no outlet, there's nothing, So what
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: is the better alternative? But you look at the way
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: of the old, the way that we were, and then
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: the way that people have. It's just it's just an
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: unsaid thing. You don't like. They don't they don't carry
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: on the way they're carrying on now. And this is
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: part of my mission now, like I see, like you know,
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: I've gone through what I've gone through. We can speak
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: about that, but you know, I can't wait any longer now, Gary,
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: I'm at the point where Craig.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: That's all right, Brian, you got you got here one too.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: Many times, son, I know because I speak so good,
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: so good, carry on, Yeah anyway, Yeah, say what you will,
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: but you know I can't wait any longer. And you know,
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: I like to, you know, empower others. I like to see,
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: you know, like to see kids out having to crack
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: and doing something with their lives and have an audverts
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: you have something they can have the energy, you know,
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: spent on.
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, when was the first time somebody said to you
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: you might be really fucking good at this, like you
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: you could like when did somebody first encourage you and say,
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: you know, it's good that you're doing all this, but
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: you actually are talented.
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I had really good support from my parents,
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: you know, like they we my brother and I both
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: chose to be in the sport of kings, you know,
• 12:34
  Speaker 2: racing and boxing. So whatever we wanted to do, they
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: didn't say this, and you're going to boxing today. I
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: chose to go to boxing, you know I did. My
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: brother wasn't made to get up at three o'clock in
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: the morning to start picking up shit at the stables.
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: You know that he chose to do that. That was
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: his decision. You know, he chose to leave school before
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: grade ten. He chose to becoming a fan of Shocky.
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: He would run up and get the newspaper every weekend,
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: especially the know in Timber when we had the big
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: wheat Wood Cup every year. You know, he would get
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: that every time without fail. You know, that was his drive,
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: you know, like he wanted. So we were very self
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: driven and we had support from our parents, but they
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: did answer your question. I didn't really care, you know,
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: I didn't. I didn't really care. It's just like I
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: took my like I look and and there's another question
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: as well, like I like, you know, was I just gifted?
• 13:27
  Speaker 2: You know, did I have the talent?
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: No?
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: I didn't, you know, I didn't. I chose to, you know,
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: I chose to get better. I wasn't the fastest guy
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: in the world. I wasn't the most skilled person in
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: the world.
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: But but I I built on those those strengths, you know,
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: you know, and then my weaknesses and you know, like
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: I was looking at some guys you know when you're
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: a kid, and then you're watching this when we never
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: went Fox Fox TV, I still come out still and
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: Fox Sports, and I went first to.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: Pay TV and you're watching a five season. I saw
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: these guys fighting, and I was like, Oh, we're ever
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: going to be that good. These guys are amazing. And
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: then eventually I was looking at this guy called Joel
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: Psmas are three times on MPI and gold medalist, and
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: he's a Hall of Fame and he's all this and
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: all that. Then one day I've gone from this fifteen
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: year old to this twenty eight year old twenty seven
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: year old was he was standing across me on the
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: other side of the ring. You know, we're about to fight,
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: and wow, I know and like I said to myself,
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: and I knew this, look, my best way to shorten
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: these guys boxing the ability was to hit them really
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: fucking hard. You know, that's a really fucking hard like
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: you know, I know you guys can do all these
• 14:35
  Speaker 2: moves and you've been brought up and learning all these
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: fancy things and that. But I'm going to hit your
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: real fucking hard and put the fear of life into you,
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: and then we're going to see how good your boxing is.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: And that's that's just that was my way of overcoming
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: their fancy skill things. I just get right in their face.
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: Given the room, that was my psychology, that was my mentality,
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: you know, like you want to be tough, you want
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: to be heardache, I'm going to go harder, you know,
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: and I'll just keep on stepping it up and stepping
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: it up. So I do the same sort of thing
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: in training as well. I'd get really, really really get
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: a big role and I get really really tired. But
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: have I got any more? And I dig a big deeper. Yeah,
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: I got more. I got more, and dig deeper and deeper,
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: and I keep going and have I got Yeah, I
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: got more. I just keep pushing it and keep pushing it,
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: and then eventually that I'll become this thrashing machine.
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: I reckon. You know, that's interesting. I reckon in life,
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Like a lot of it is about in boxing, but
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: in other sports, in building a business, in building a brand,
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: in getting through some of the ship that you've gotten
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: through in the last few years, which we'll talk about, yes,
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: but it's like about how much pain can you deal with?
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: How much?
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: How much? How uncomfortable can you get and.
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: For how long? Right?
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: How much? Because you know, here's the here's the My
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: listeners are sick of me saying this ship, but you
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: and I are talk him for the first time. So like,
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: where we grow is in the pain, Like where we
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: get better is in the discomfort. That's where you develop
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: awareness and in a boxing sense, skill and competence, understanding windcraft,
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: all that. Like, but you can't get good at boxing
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: without going through the two black eyes you got on
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: day one, right, Like, you can't get good at what
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: you won't do. And there are so many talented people
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: in boxing outside of boxing, you know, in business, in
• 16:19
  Speaker 1: fucking singing, in music, in whatever. They just won't get
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: uncomfortable for long enough. Like you and me sound a
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: little bit the same, like in that I'm not very well.
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: You're definitely a much better athlete than I would have
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: ever been. But what I mean is, I'm not the smartest,
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: I'm not the most creative. I'm not the most physiologically gifted.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: I don't have, you know, all that stuff. And you
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: get to the point where you go, well, I can't
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: wake up tomorrow with more talent or better genetics. So
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: I better just fucking work hard, you know, like, because
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: that's the one thing I can control. I can control
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: how hard I work, and I can control to an extent,
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: how strong I get, how fucking aerobically fit I am.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: I can develop my skill, you know, and I can
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: be courageous because that's a choice as well.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: Right, that's right, it is, it is. And look, look
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: I did get like I did get a lot of
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: the warning signs, you know, like like some people said
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: to me, Look how long did they say? In American
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: I think it was Max Calluman who would interview on me.
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: And yeah, and a lot of interviews. I've seen my style.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: I was just in that face. I'm just pushing up,
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: pushing up, pushing up.
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: Always it's been right in the face. ID like top
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: three hitches to given one and they would say, how
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: long I can't see this? How long do you think
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: your career will last like this? You know, like you know,
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: and looking back hindsight, it's such a wonderful thing. And
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: that's where I'm in this position now where I can
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: pass on the message to other people, know, you know,
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: like how long can you keep on doing that for?
• 17:48
  Speaker 2: Because you need to you need to also, you know,
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: think smarter, not harder. You know, there's one thing to
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: be hard, but there's also some guys, you know, they
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: get in the gym and they want to be harder.
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: They want to be hard man. They want to be
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: hard man. But look that the fights don't Like I
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: relate boxingto life in a lot of ways, but like
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: they get in there and they start sparring, and they're
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: doing a show right there in the gym, and by
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: the time they get their first fight out of the bad,
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: they're already construct they're just pissing up the war contest.
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: His ego contests, you know, like work on your skills
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: in other ways and smarter ways. There's definitely a lot
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: smarter ways to do things. And that comes back to,
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: you know, like you've done a lot of work in
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: the sport sports physiology and that look, I actually speak
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: to a doctor every every week. I'd meet up with
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: him because we'd have some really interesting conversations and he'd
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: work on the psychology side of things with me. And
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: I was as this ego kid, you know, I had
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: this ego, like you said, testosterone young gumfuller, come. You know,
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: you could tell me things a thousand times and unless
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: I actually respected you, you know, like, and I knew
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: back now now thinking back talking to this doctor that
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: I sort of thought I knew a bit better than him.
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: I don't know, I just thought.
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: I just I just know that I had that little
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: chip on my shoulder. And he was saying, now, Michael,
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: because I'm undefeated, right, twenty three fights, twenty three wins,
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: twenty one knockouts, like I'm thinking on the ship, right,
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: And then she says, how are you going to react
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: when you have your first loss? You know, like just
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: asking the question. He just went and I'm like fucking
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: how do you consider that I'm to have a loss
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: like that? That was my attitude fucking now like I did.
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: I didn't see that one coming, and not only to
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: have my loss, like I lost my brother as well,
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: so it's just gone crash boom boom boom. And he
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: was like, you need to prepare yourself. Don't prepare yourself.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: He was saying, basically, don't prepare yourself for failure, but
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: prepare yourself for things not always go the way that
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: you're plan you know, but they're not always going to
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: go the way that you're plan. Like I just recently
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: spent a couple of days with George Cambosas for those
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: who don't know who is he's a unified lightweight world
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: champion of the world and he's just he's lost his
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: title again recently. The bloke has done things that you know,
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: no other Australian fighters have done, like very if you
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: have done anyway, and he's a big name, you know.
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: But I see the way that he does things. He's
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: just like he does things so neatly and so everything
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: is accountab like he puts everything neat in the place
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: and has like a structured way of doing things, but
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: there also comes this other part where you've got to
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: roll with the punches and you've got to adapt and stuff.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: And like I'm just I'm telling you our harps, you know,
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: Like I wish I listened to guys like you a
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: bit more now. So if it's any message I can
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: pass on to these these kids and everyone's well wherever.
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: The psychological state of mind is so powerful in everything
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: we do every day. I can't even express it enough.
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, you know, some of us are slow learners, mate,
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: I am you are. That's okay, but we're still fucking learning.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: But I think also, you know, like obviously no one'm
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: wants to lose, but life gives Life gives no fucks
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: about your feelings or my feelings, right, Life doesn't give
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: a shit about you. Doesn't mean nobody gives a shit,
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: But life doesn't care about your feelings, or your outcomes
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: or your boxing record. Life doesn't care if I have
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: three listeners or three million listeners, or if I'm making
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: a few bucks or all the bucks. Life doesn't care.
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: And it's like that, even though it was painful that
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: first loss, and even though you wish you never had it,
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: I guess, but you learn something about yourself, right, and
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: it might not be something you want to learn in
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: the short term. But like if you don't know how
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: to deal with disappointment or failure or pain or grief,
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: fucking good luck trying to live because disappointment, as you
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: know with your brother, grief, loss, pain, tragedy, fuck dude.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: I mean that's just like this is just stuff that
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: the human experience means that we've got to deal with
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: that eventually, right.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, I'll tell you now, like had I prepared
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: myself to deal with things when it happened, maybe my
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: life wouldn't have taken the road that it did. But
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: you know, when I had that first loss, you know
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: I was I look back and I can look back
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: now and I can tell you clearly like I planted
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: that seed in my head for that loss back when
• 22:19
  Speaker 2: I was a kid watching watching TV. Think when I
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: said to myself, I'm never going to be that good,
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: I said, I said it to myself there and then,
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: and I was punching these guys all that come before me.
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: They would fall, and I thought I was this olter
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: ego god, this Achilles warrior, half Greek, Rah rah rah
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: blah blah and believe in my own lies and just
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: and and then then comes the problems with addiction. You know,
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: then you find something and you're like, you like picking
• 22:47
  Speaker 2: up a drink, and then you start swinging into the drugs,
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: and then your life just starts tumbling and falling and
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: it just becomes like an avalanche and just one thing
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: leads to another, and like you're looking in this this
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: spot and look, yep, I tell you I landed in jail.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: You know, I've got myself for two years jail, and
• 23:03
  Speaker 2: I'm sitting there and I'm thinking to myself, well, fucking
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: how great is this? You know, how great is this?
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: Because I have gratitude. I'm thankful I'm here now, and
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: I know I know the only way I'm going to
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: get out of the ship is by looking up and
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: forward and don't look back, and just share my story, okay,
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: talk about where I've been and tell other people that
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: I don't want to go there. It's a fucking ship place,
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: you know. And I have gratitude that I'm alive, I'm well,
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: and I've had the luxury of having the support that
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: I've had, and I've have so many people that do
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: care about me. I'm thankful for the life that I've had,
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: and I'm going to get out and I'm going to
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: tell my story and I'm become a much better person
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: than I was before.
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: Good on your man. I love that. I love to
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: hear that. And you look amazing. You look clear and clean.
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: It's sober and articulate, and for a bloke who's been
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: punched in the head a lot, you can even string
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: up a few words together. Now, there's no there's no
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: obvious cte. So well done. You must have a head
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: like a fucking coconut.
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I don't know about the CD yet. We'll find out.
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, No, let's keep our fingers crossed. It's it's it's
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: I mean, I only just met you, but I'm I'm
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: kind of proud of you, even in this short term
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: of where you were to, where you to, where you've come,
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: and where you're heading. So I want to So one
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: of my roles, which I didn't tell you before we
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: went live, is for quite a while, about four or
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: five years, I worked as a consultant for a drug
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: and addiction rehab Yeah. Yeah, so I spent a lot
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: of time working with people battling booze and addiction in
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: gender broadly. Right, So I'm interested, And so for you,
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: do you think that, like for a lot of people,
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: using using whatever it is they're using, is a mechanism
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: to get out of psychological and emotional pain, like to
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: escape that because you just don't want to fucking sit
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: in that feeling all that sit in that mindset and
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: when you use, all of a sudden, now I'm in
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: a better place in inverted commerce, right, yeah, was that
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: part of it for you is to get out of
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: that pain of having to deal with stuff?
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, so yeah, looking back, I can say that
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: because but before I could even realize that. So if
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: you're sitting there right now, listen to this and you're
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: pissed off, your brain, off your high as a kite,
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: you know you might not be able to see this,
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: but leave me when I say it. You know you're like,
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: you need clarity to really see you need clarity. You
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: need to have the clarity. And look like, I had
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: a lot of pain. You know, I was dealing with loss.
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: I was dealing with you know, I'll tell you, I'll
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: tell you what I dealt with. You know, I lost
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: my brother and I grew up, very very close. We
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: talk all the time. He was Australia's leading jockey. He
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: was racing in the Melbourne Cup and it was a
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: week till he rode in the favorite shoot out in
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: the Melbourne Cup. And I was fighting in three weeks.
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: In three weeks, I was fighting against to count the
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: pound best fighter in the world. So this is a
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: fight that would make my household name. I'm on the
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: phone with my brother and you know, like we're talking
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: about his right next week in the Melbourne Cup. He's
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: going to win the Melbourne Cup. Like the times present.
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: Him and that horse have good relationship. My brother was
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: going to be after all these years, all these worker,
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: was going to be the best writer in Australia. And
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: when the Melbourne Cup, it's a big thing. And we
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: had a long conversation at least a couple of hours,
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: and then you know, in the morning, I get a
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: phone call from from Brendon. He says, meet me at
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: the gym. Get on your motorbike, because we get around
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: the scooter motorbikes in Thailand. I was in training camp
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: and I get it and I knew something. He said,
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: turn your phone off, So I did exactly what he said.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: I get on the motorbike and I go down and
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: meet him. I said, Brendon, what's happened to someone who's
• 26:44
  Speaker 2: died having a and he said, yeah, it's your brother.
• 26:47
  Speaker 2: And I just fell to the ground and started crying, mate,
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: and just even talking about it now, it's just really
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: living like his face. You know, he was the same
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: as me. He's just found to picture. It seems the
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: media hard about Stathi and I it was a hard thing,
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: and but look, I want to share that because I
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: want to share that because you know, when you look
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: at like, you know, I got close with a lot
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: of athletes and people like Mick Fenning. You know, just
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: just the reason why I mentioned Mick Fenning's name is
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: because he's the guy that lost his brother as well,
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: and he had a choice on which way he wanted
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: to go, what he wanted to do, and I just
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: decided to start masking the pain immediately, and in three
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: weeks time, I'm fighting the pound for pound best fighter
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: in the world. I decided to stop drinking and doing
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: drugs ten days before the fight because I, you know,
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: I just thought I'm not going to be able to
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: have the fight, you know, in the first place, if
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: you don't pass a drug test, and you know, and
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: I've just the media couldn't mention his name to me
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: because I would burst out crying. Is they they put
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: a media ban on that? But I've dropped the pound
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: for pound best fighter in the world. I put him
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: on his arse. And then as I've gone to finish him,
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: I could hear the complicators yelling, and he's thinking of
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: his brother. And for the first time my fucking life,
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: I've hesitated when it come to finishing. I just went
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: in my own head and I started like thinking too
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: much or maybe I shouldn't shure know, I just went
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: to that wow, and I would never give a fuck
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: what was going on outside. I was My eye was
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: on my poont what his hands were doing, what his
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: legs were doing, what his eyes were doing, What is
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: and where do I need to execute to finish this guy?
• 28:20
  Speaker 2: Like what I need to do? And my mind was elsewhere. Mate. Anyway,
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: he's recovered, he's come back later in the fight, and
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: then they stopped the fight in his favor. You know,
• 28:28
  Speaker 2: we could be having a different conversation today, but I
• 28:30
  Speaker 2: can tell you now I won the fight. I was
• 28:33
  Speaker 2: fighting Shane Maizy. It was it Shane Mozy, but I
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: was I set the fight MANI Pacio. I set the fight,
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: Shane mazi I was on the list for Mayweather a
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: few times, you know, as a four through guy. But
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: I was that guy. I was one of the most
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: exciting fighters in the world. And I can tell you
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: in now half if I'd become that world wide household name,
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: all that would have happened, as the plot would have thickened,
• 28:55
  Speaker 2: the money would have been higher, and my might tumble
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: and fora would have been barg greater than what already was.
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: So I have gratitude. I have gratitude. I'm asting funny
• 29:05
  Speaker 2: and now saying I'm glad I went to jail. I'm
• 29:07
  Speaker 2: glad I learned the hard way because that was the
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: only fucking thing that was going to bring into clarity.
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: It was the only thing that was going to bring
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: bring me into recovery. And one thing that I learned
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: in recovery is the best way to keep something is
• 29:18
  Speaker 2: by giving it away. So I'd start my level NA
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: narcotics anonymous and aa AA groups. There is talking with
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: groups and prisoners in jail and stuff, and I really
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: related to a lot of people. I really a lot
• 29:31
  Speaker 2: of people there. And there's a lot of people that's
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: dealt with a lot of trauma in their life, a
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: lot of abuse, a lot of sexual abuse and violence,
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: and they had problems with addictions. And I could relate
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: to a lot of these people because guess what, I
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: was one of those kids that was sexually abused. That
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: happened to me, and that changed your whole fucking mindset.
• 29:49
  Speaker 2: That fucks you up, you know, And I would love
• 29:51
  Speaker 2: the chance. I've just recently found out the name of
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: the guy that did it to me, and I would
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: love the chances to sit in front of me and say, hey, mate,
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: you really fucked my life. Not only my life, but
• 30:00
  Speaker 2: my brother like because he too found masking of the
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: pain and at the end of drugs and alcohol, and
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: now he's dead as a result. And it's affected my
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: family and my career. My entire empire has crumbled. And
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: these predators are predators that are out there. Listen to this.
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: You fuck the society, You fuck people's lives. Because most
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: of these guys in jail that are fucked up have
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: done these suba things. I don't even know where they
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: are and what they're doing because of that out of
• 30:27
  Speaker 2: their brain. They just want to master pain. And that's
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: due to a lot of this. And like you've been
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: really really surprised how many people are victims of sexual abuse.
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: I don't know how we even got onto this.
• 30:38
  Speaker 1: But made it's relevant, it's in it. It's I mean,
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: it's like he's like I said to you before we started, mate,
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: I don't care where we go, let's just change. And
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: I think, but here's the thing, right, it's is it
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: a comfortable conversation with people?
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: Know?
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: But is it real? Yes? Is it necessary that? Yes?
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: Do we need to china light on this horrible fucking
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: thing that happens, Yes, we do, you know. And the
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: thing is that you what I love about this moment
• 31:08
  Speaker 1: right now is here's this tough guy, this fucking world
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: champion box of this Olympic athlete who's done some great
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: shit and some dumb shit, like all of us, haven't you.
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's true, right, I do dumb shit every day,
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: you know.
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: So.
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: But in the middle of all of that, you're being
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: raw and real and vulnerable, and you're telling us about
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: stuff that a lot of people understandably would struggle to share.
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: But you're not doing it because you want glory or attention.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: You're doing it because you want to help other people
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: not go through what you went through. You want to
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: stop the fucking morons that do it. And also you
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: want people to realize I'm putting words in your mouth,
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: correct me if I'm wrong, but that it can happen
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: to anyone.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: Right, yes, and it can. It can. Yeah. Look, I
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: just needed to ask the question to my brother's last
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: partner that he had, and I said, my memory doesn't
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: certain me so good, but I said, we're getting babysat
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: At the same time, I said, did start there saying
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: anything to you? And she goes, oh, I just started crying.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: It really a lot of burst out crying. She said,
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: he told me inever to tell anyone. Yeah, you never
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: tell him, but yes, yes he did, you know, because
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: I had this dream that that something happened. And it's
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: just common sense, right, we're both being baby sat and
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: then he's and he's one kid that would the same thing,
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: and he would just keep everything in. He'll keep everything
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: all bottled up, and it's no one of the drugs
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: end up killing him. Because if I had an out first,
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: like more physical absertion, not saying that jockey being a
• 32:43
  Speaker 2: jockey isn't a physical desertion. But now, first, I'm a
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: bit more outgoing than what my brother was. He was
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: very much an introvert, and then when he found something
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: that he loved it, it just killed him. You know.
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: He loved riding, he loved horses, loved it, loved it,
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: loved it. But then when the pain of what happened
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: was still, we're still there and ultimately that's yeah.
• 33:03
  Speaker 1: Wow, yeah, and that was what was that like twenty.
• 33:08
  Speaker 2: Or yes, October nineteen twenty ten, So.
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: It's like fourteen years ago, but it's really like three
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: minutes ago, isn't it.
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: Hey, I can tell you I procrastination prolongs the pain because,
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: like I said, with Mick Fenning, with what he did
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: with his life, you know, like he just he we
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: would have went home. Look, we all have hard days
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: at work and stuff, and then some guys want to
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: get home and they want to pick up a beer.
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: Fucking wear it on a chim mate. It's been a
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: hard day, Wear it on a tin. Do it you've
• 33:34
  Speaker 2: got to do and go to bed and get up
• 33:36
  Speaker 2: fresh in the morning. You don't have to piss, you know,
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: drink drink it away and it will do the drugs
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: or whatever, whatever you do, whatever your masking agent is,
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: you know, just yeah, you just got to move forward.
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: And that's a route. Like, look, what could have At
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: that time, I said to myself, I want to you know,
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: I want to do what my brother would have wanted
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: me to do. My brother would have wanted to fight
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: the pound for pound best fighter in the world. My
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: brother would have wanted to knock out one. And you're
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: markets and being this glorified champion. But guess what, STARTHI
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: wasn't with me anymore. STARTHI was gone. And really, really,
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: when you think about it, STARTHI would have wanted me
• 34:09
  Speaker 2: to do what was best for me. And when we're
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: flying in an airplane and the air hostess says, you
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: fixed in the case of an accident, fix your mask
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: before you fix your childs because you can't fix anyone
• 34:21
  Speaker 2: else's anything if you can't help yourself, like I really needed.
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: What I'm saying is I needed to look after me.
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: You look, you need to look after number one and
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: looked and as I think you said earlier, you know
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: some hard truth that I was told no one really
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: gives a fuck. No one really does. It's just until
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: you've got life minded people and they are for what
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: you are for and it all comes together and then yeah, okay,
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: then you know, then people can care because you are
• 34:45
  Speaker 2: full the same sort of thing. But you know, I
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: should have dealt with that. I should have not taken
• 34:50
  Speaker 2: that fight, because by doing so, and then by taking drugs,
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: by drinking alcohol, I have procrastinated, and it's prolonging the pain.
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: And fourteen years later, I'm here telling a story which
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: which I'm thankful for too. I'm thankful that I can
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: share this story, and I hope that anyone listening doesn't
• 35:09
  Speaker 2: go down the same road that that I go, and
• 35:11
  Speaker 2: can actually listen to what I'm saying, so that if
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: you like watching my fids, if you like what I've done,
• 35:15
  Speaker 2: you liked my career, and you like that, then maybe
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: you can take some respect and you can you can
• 35:21
  Speaker 2: maybe you can respect what I say and that you
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: know it can happen to anyone. As you said earlier, yeah.
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: Exactly exactly, mate, What so, if if anything, what what
• 35:33
  Speaker 1: did you so? Like you said earlier, you spent two
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: years life job, what did you what did you take
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: away from that? Did you you know? Did you I mean,
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: I know nobody wants to be in jail, but did
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: you learn? Did you grow? Did you get clarity? Did
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: you get awareness like what happened?
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: Yes, I got clarity because I got sobriety. You know, Well,
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: it's just before I went to the job, when I
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: found out that there was a wearing out for my arrest,
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: that there was an investigation, and on when my fingerprints
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: were down on bags of cocaine and the safe at
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: the house that was a raid was done on. Look, look,
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: you know that was it. I said, right, that's it. Okay,
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: I quit, okay, and that's it because it was so
• 36:16
  Speaker 2: fucking real, like when you get that phone call Ado Michael,
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: it's the it's the handred police here. And I was
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: going to let you know, look, I followed your career
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: and I supported Green. I followed your brother's career. Right, yeah,
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: this this is how the conversation went. You know, Like
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: I was, I was high as a kite. I was
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: sitting there. I'll tell you this. I was high as
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: a kite and I was like sitting on sitting on
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: the poker machines, and I just said like I was
• 36:39
  Speaker 2: just like I was just really lost my life. I
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: wear my life going to and I've gone through shiploads
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: of money and I've gone through the last cent just
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: literally the last ten cent bet one cent bet. And
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: then the phone call wrings it's a private number. Hello,
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: this is Detective David Brooks from the handred of PlayStation
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: just kind of let you know that. You know, first
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: of all, it was very polite and respectable and the
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: way that he said things, and you know, very you know,
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: and then friendom my career. But it's going to say
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: that your parole has been revoked and that you were
• 37:10
  Speaker 2: remaining in jail until these matters are dealt with and
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: blah blah blah blah blah. And I just went, you
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: know what, I said, thank you very much for letting
• 37:19
  Speaker 2: me know. I appreciate the phone call.
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, And then they came and collected you or
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: what happened?
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: No, I went handed myself in there. Oh wow, yeah
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: you want to there just here go yeah, hand up me.
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: I've got to get off drugs. I got to stop
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: drinking alcohol. Like man, like when you're a three time
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: world boxing champion, when you're saying you come from the
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: same your brother, and know you're both like rubb and
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: shoulders with the likes of Oscar the la Joie. You know,
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: I got Australia's best athletes as well, like I got
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: some great mates here in Australia and the successful business
• 37:51
  Speaker 2: people I always love talking about. Made a trip vis
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: the owner of the Melbourne Storm, like I love being
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: able to have these people lean on for support. And
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: I rang him and I told him, I said, I'm
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: going to get hid myself in, like I put my
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: hand up in you and you and I went and
• 38:06
  Speaker 2: and you know, I just owned it. I owned it.
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: What else can you do? Like you I own it,
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: like you pull your head in, you know. That's what
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: I had to do.
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: And was it after two years inside? Was it a
• 38:18
  Speaker 1: big adjustment coming out? Yeah?
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: Wow? Like the technology, like the way they do, like
• 38:23
  Speaker 2: you can do everything's on the phone now everyone's always
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: on their phones. By the way. Now I've noticed, like
• 38:28
  Speaker 2: you know, there's the big changes with a lot of
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: that stuff. And everyone looked a lot younger.
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: That's hilarious and I've a lot.
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: Older, you know, But things and a lot of changes
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: happened within me, like things slow down a lot. Yeah,
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: you know, like my wanting to run as much as
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: you know, always like running, always like being active and
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: all that logo. I just feel like I need to
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: take my time with everything that I do. And I
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: still I'm still a very active person. Look, look I am.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: I'm finding a lot of pleasure, Like I find a
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: real I find a lot of passion and want to
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: help people. You know. So I've got now on my Instagram,
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: like I'm advertising I'm doing a bulletproof mindset course, so
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: you know, people, I just want to really want to
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: help people find their best. That's what I'd love to
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: be able to do this full time for work and
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: help people and get something out of that. But you
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: know there are other people out there that that do
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: need help and want help. And you know, I guess
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: I found a lot. I love what I love doing,
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: and you know, like I've got business on the side
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: as well, Like I've got a foreign company, you know.
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: You know, I like I like giving everything that crack.
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: You know, it's just you know, you want to make
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: the most. I've got beautiful kids out there, and I cried,
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: you know, I missed my daughter, and you know I
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: got married when I was in Vegas, and I had
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: a daughter when I was in Now she's in Japan,
• 39:46
  Speaker 2: and well, look, I made a lot of mistakes and
• 39:49
  Speaker 2: love a lot of Like I spent a lot of
• 39:52
  Speaker 2: time now like basically unraveling and fixing everything I did
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: with for the time that I was in addiction, like
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: a big mess that I created for myself. But like
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: you know, every day it's getting better, you know. And
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: it's what people may not forgive me straight away, and
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: I have to accept that because it's part of the
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: actions that we do when we do and you know
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: about all this being and the treatment of addiction all
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: that like this, and look a look, I'm no scholar,
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: Like I'm no good with the twelve steps, so I
• 40:20
  Speaker 2: couldn't turn the order that they come in and that.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: But I do know that there's growth in myself. I
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: speak to my sponsor, you know, and I'm not someone
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: that can sit down and go through the twelve steps
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: of how that all works. But I'm very adamant and
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: firm on recovery and how important it is to have
• 40:37
  Speaker 2: that clarity.
• 40:38
  Speaker 1: Well, and I think also mate that you know, as
• 40:42
  Speaker 1: we said before, it's like there's no three steps to
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: even though there it is a twelve step program. I
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: think that, like different things work optimally for different people. Yes, yeah,
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: And it's not like everyone. It's like with boxing, Not
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: everyone should fight the same way, Not everybody should eat
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: the same diet, Not everybody will work with the same psychologists, right, Yes,
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: not everyone should fucking run on concrete. Someone's going to
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: run twice and get injured. Someone's going to run a
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: thousand times and not get injured. Right, So it's trying
• 41:17
  Speaker 1: to in the middle of all of that, it's trying
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: to figure out how do I get clean and sober,
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: how do I stay clean and sober, how do I
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: become a better human? How do I create a new
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: operating system that works? And what are my values? And
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: how do I live my values? Right? And that process
• 41:35
  Speaker 1: is going to be different because we're all fucking different, right.
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: Yes we are. So. Look, Look, if you want something
• 41:41
  Speaker 2: more than you want to breathe, I think that you're
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: going to get it. Look, if you want a good life,
• 41:45
  Speaker 2: if you want a good life and a better life,
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: you're going to get it. And if the problem is
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: standing in front of your ways out pole or it
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: is drugs, just say for example, it might be something else,
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: it might be other things. Okay, let's just say but
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: there is the support out there if you want to
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: get it, you don't have to sign up to some
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: government thing will do that. Then there's not a big
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: brig morale of things like that. What I found was
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: this is, for example, if you want to get on
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: to a meeting and alaholics anonymous meeting or narcotics anonymous meeting,
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: there's one every thirty minutes all over the world. You
• 42:13
  Speaker 2: can get online and these people you don't even know,
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: you're never seen them again, say share whatever the funk
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: you want, talk about whatever you want, because they're just
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: been actually hearing yourself talk and say things. So that's
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: what I started doing. What I decided to get clean
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: before I even went the handle myself in. It took
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: me eleven days to let all my kids know and
• 42:31
  Speaker 2: you know, and just get things sorted. So my time
• 42:33
  Speaker 2: actually went in there. But like I did, you know,
• 42:36
  Speaker 2: and I was dragging my ass around made Dragonmark. But
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: every spare chance I got, I jumped online and I
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: would start learning about this because if I want to
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: have a good life, I've got to get clean. That
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: was my problem. That was my thing. That was my
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: thing that I either deal with, but the other people
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: have other things. Yeah, yeah, I totally get that, but
• 42:52
  Speaker 2: that was me at that particular point in time. Anyway,
• 42:55
  Speaker 2: the resources are available if you want them there and
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: then look at and you know, and if you do
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: need some help, you know, well guess what you know,
• 43:03
  Speaker 2: this is what I found really too. Like you know,
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: when you get when you put out in your gars
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: and you get out of jail, they give you a
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: Vinni's card and they give you like a train together.
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: That's what you've got.
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: Hilarious.
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you've got your flip flops and you like you're
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: just and you know, like you can you can call
• 43:23
  Speaker 2: like and as and as. People might not see this,
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: but you might have money, or you might have a career,
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: you might have a lot going for you. But if
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: you don't want to call lifeline, you know, you know
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: you can call lifeline and that they'll tell you whatever
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: it is, doesn't matter what it is. They will some
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: people that are trained in this ship. They'll tell you
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: which way to go and what to do. And you
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: don't have to be but you can be anyone. But
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: just got to drop your fucking ego, you know, like
• 43:47
  Speaker 2: just yeah, there's always resources available that will put you
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: in contact with someone. This is one big, one big
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: network the way the whole world and technology the way
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: it works. You can't use it, but just people need
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: to drop the fucking ego. And there's a lot of
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: shit out there and it is, it is available. I
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: really find happiness and enjoyment and working with people that
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: help me move forward, you know, move forward and going
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: on on and upwards.
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, the best way to look after yourself in some
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: ways is to have a purpose bigger than you, you know,
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: because when you're all, yes, you need to look after
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: number one from a mental and physical health point of
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: view because that helps you do But in terms of
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: having a purpose, you know, part of the reason I
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: do this show is like we're sixteen hundred plus episodes
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: in and I did. I did two and a half
• 44:38
  Speaker 1: three years of this show losing money, but I still
• 44:41
  Speaker 1: enjoyed it because we were still helping people and having
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: good conversations. You know.
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I made it.
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: Your ace, I think your fucking ace love you. How
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: do people? How do people connect with you? Follow you?
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: Find you? So give us a shout out to whatever
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: your web side or your social media or however liple
• 45:02
  Speaker 1: can connect.
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Michael Catz this Instagram, Just Michael Cats. This is
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: my name. Cat's he k A T s I d
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: oh yes, Michael. Yeah, that's the best way. You know,
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: I've got a bulletproof, bulletproof mindset of course what I'm doing,
• 45:18
  Speaker 2: and I have the great blueprint with people to want
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: to learn the boxing, but if they want to learn
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: the mindset, you know I've got I've got different modules
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: about mental clarity and where I've got my strength from
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: a different stages in my life. So yeah, yeah, Michael
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: kat on Instagram.
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, mate, you're you're a gym. Now, I'm just going
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: to tell you a little interesting story before we go. So,
• 45:41
  Speaker 1: the one of the girls who's on the podcast with me,
• 45:44
  Speaker 1: her name is Tiff. She's she sometimes sits in and
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: she edits for me. She's a boxer. And you've said,
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: you've said Rolling with the Punches a lot, and she's
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: got a podcast called called Roll with the Punches. Oh yeah, man,
• 46:00
  Speaker 1: it made It's been great. I appreciate you. Thanks for
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: coming on the you project. You're a gun. Good luck
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: with everything moving forward, and maybe we'll chat again.
• 46:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that'd be great. Harps. And I appreciate you
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: mate and everything that you do. Thank you.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: You're a good man.