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In the Valley of Sin: Bittersweet Ending · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. Group sex with little children,
0:15
Speaker 1: mothers and fathers in groups of adults, molesting children literally
0:24
Speaker 1: in the church on the altar. Well. That sounds like
0:29
Speaker 1: a horror film to me, a horror film. In all
0:34
Speaker 1: the child molestations I have ever investigated or prosecuted to trial,
0:40
Speaker 1: I've never heard of anything like that. You know why,
0:45
Speaker 1: because it didn't happen. And it pains me, as an
0:50
Speaker 1: officer of the court, to believe this investigation went all
0:55
Speaker 1: the way to trial. People's lives ruined forever. I am
1:02
Speaker 1: talking about the one Natchee, Washington witch hunt crime stories
1:14
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. Every day when I get up at
1:24
Speaker 1: five in the morning, I've got one thing on my mind,
1:27
Speaker 1: and that is getting through the day. When I bring
1:30
Speaker 1: my children back home, when we have dinner together, we
1:33
Speaker 1: have supper and we talk. It's the best thing. And
1:37
Speaker 1: I have imagined over and over after speaking to these
1:40
Speaker 1: mothers and fathers, being dragged away from that supper table
1:44
Speaker 1: with my children and arrested for child rape. As we
1:49
Speaker 1: tell you, a story like no other, except it's not
1:53
Speaker 1: a story. This is not a show. This is your
1:57
Speaker 1: real This happened to real people. And they are suffering
2:02
Speaker 1: right now. But through it all, they are joining us
2:07
Speaker 1: here today. Let's kick it off with this. Listen, brand
2:10
Speaker 1: me through it. You're gonna see this, this, and this happened.
2:13
Speaker 1: You've seen this happened at the church. You've seen these
2:16
Speaker 1: kids were involved, you know, and you just stick to
2:21
Speaker 1: basically stick to the script, right, Just say what we
2:26
Speaker 1: want you to say, and you'll see your parents again.
2:28
Speaker 1: But if you don't say what we want you to say,
2:30
Speaker 1: you're never gonna see them again. And that just kept praying, Lord,
2:41
Speaker 1: let her tell the truth. We raised her right and
2:45
Speaker 1: let her tell the truth. Let the truth come forward.
2:48
Speaker 1: That is just breaking my heart to hear. The voices
2:51
Speaker 1: are Rebecca Osbourne and Connie Robertson talking about the horrible
2:57
Speaker 1: things that have happened to them. Miles and dads being
3:00
Speaker 1: realroaded for tom molestations and rapes that never happened. Little
3:05
Speaker 1: children being literally forced to give statements against their own parents,
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Speaker 1: landing their parents behind bars, and living the rest of
3:14
Speaker 1: their lives carrying around a sack of rocks on their
3:19
Speaker 1: shoulders that they sent mommy and daddy to prison. We're
3:25
Speaker 1: only now learning the truth of the Wenatchee witch Hunt
3:29
Speaker 1: joining me right now. You were hearing Rebecca Osbourne and
3:33
Speaker 1: Connie Robertson speaking with me, Amber Dogget, Sam Dogget, John Dogget,
3:39
Speaker 1: Carol Dogget, Mark Dogget. A family torn apart literally by
3:44
Speaker 1: this event, Pastor Robbie Robertson, his wife Connie, Rebecca Osbourne,
3:52
Speaker 1: you just heard her speaking and award winning journalists to Grant.
3:57
Speaker 1: You can find him at doctor Thomas Grant dot com.
4:01
Speaker 1: Award winning journalist and the co executive producer of In
4:05
Speaker 1: the Valley of Sin. Enough from me, Let's go to
4:08
Speaker 1: the stars of today's program. Let me start with you,
4:12
Speaker 1: Rebecca Osborne. We were just hearing your voice where you
4:16
Speaker 1: were told you either say this or you're never seeing
4:19
Speaker 1: your mom and dad again. And you know what, Rebecca.
4:22
Speaker 1: Until I spoke with you and Sam and Amber and John,
4:28
Speaker 1: it was hard for me to believe that all these
4:31
Speaker 1: children had claimed child molestation but that none of it happened.
4:37
Speaker 1: I'm so used to defendant's trying to worm out of
4:39
Speaker 1: a child molestation charge and children being coached to say
4:43
Speaker 1: it didn't happen. It was hard for me to believe
4:47
Speaker 1: it didn't happen. It just it's against cultrary to everything
4:51
Speaker 1: I've ever known. When you hear and have to think
4:55
Speaker 1: back on what happened, Rebecca, what comes to mind? Well,
4:59
Speaker 1: you know, and it's it's just kind of the trauma
5:01
Speaker 1: we all went through. And I know all of us
5:03
Speaker 1: kids experienced something different, especially dependent on the ages we
5:07
Speaker 1: were at at the time, but just those sessions that
5:11
Speaker 1: I know we all would go through where we were
5:13
Speaker 1: coerced and brainwashed and told what to say. And it
5:17
Speaker 1: wasn't that we were allowed to tell the truth, you know,
5:19
Speaker 1: we were only allowed to say what they had dictated
5:22
Speaker 1: or what they had put in front of us to say.
5:26
Speaker 1: But looking back on it now, you know, I'm just
5:29
Speaker 1: so thankful for the grace of God for showing me
5:32
Speaker 1: the truth in those moments. Praise the Lord that the
5:39
Speaker 1: parents have been exonerated, and I hate what they have
5:46
Speaker 1: been through. Rebecca, When you saw your mother and dad
5:53
Speaker 1: for the first time after you had made the claims
5:58
Speaker 1: that they molested you, what happened? Are you referring to
6:04
Speaker 1: when I saw them in court? Yes, yes, I remember
6:08
Speaker 1: seeing them in court that day. And pardon me, I'm
6:11
Speaker 1: a crier when I start talking about all this, but
6:13
Speaker 1: I'll try my best not to be a blubbering cry baby. Also,
6:17
Speaker 1: you gotta remember Rebecca Nancy. Rebecca was only four years old.
6:22
Speaker 1: The first time in a restaurant had ever been issued
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Speaker 1: in the state of Washington. Her four year old minor
6:28
Speaker 1: child them trying to find her when she was running
6:31
Speaker 1: before the state got a hold of her. Yeah, I was.
6:34
Speaker 1: I was literally arrested when they when they took me
6:37
Speaker 1: into custody. But when I saw my parents for the
6:40
Speaker 1: first time in court, I remember kind of having the
6:46
Speaker 1: thought process like, Okay, well, they said that if I
6:50
Speaker 1: said what they wanted me to say, that I would
6:52
Speaker 1: see my parents again. So I'm seeing them, so I
6:55
Speaker 1: guess I have to say what they want me to
6:58
Speaker 1: say to go home with them. I knew again, absolutely
7:03
Speaker 1: a hundred only the grace of God when I was
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Speaker 1: all that stands and they swore me in and they said,
7:10
Speaker 1: tell the whole truth is nothing but the truth. That
7:13
Speaker 1: stuck with me right now, even though I was only four,
7:17
Speaker 1: that steament stuck with me. And I just remember when
7:22
Speaker 1: they started asking me questions, I just I just started
7:25
Speaker 1: telling the truth, be honest to God truth, and the
7:28
Speaker 1: prosecutor was just upset. He didn't know what was going on,
7:32
Speaker 1: because they had already talked to me right before I
7:34
Speaker 1: went on the stand, and already had me, you know,
7:37
Speaker 1: geared up with my script everything I was supposed to say.
7:40
Speaker 1: And the prosecutor was just flabbery accid. He's like, I
7:43
Speaker 1: don't even know what to do here, you know, like
7:46
Speaker 1: he was. He was in an uproar, and everybody on
7:48
Speaker 1: that side was just dumbfounded. And I just I just
7:54
Speaker 1: looked him all straight in the face and I said,
7:56
Speaker 1: my parents never did anything. They never did anything. You got,
8:00
Speaker 1: I said, happened to me. And I'm not going to
8:02
Speaker 1: sit here and lie because I know the difference between
8:04
Speaker 1: the truth and a lie, and I'm not going to
8:07
Speaker 1: lie too. Pastor Robbie Robertson, do you remember that moment
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Speaker 1: in court only too well? My wife Connie was holding
8:20
Speaker 1: my hand and almost broke broke my hands to squeezing it.
8:24
Speaker 1: She couldn't look up, she couldn't look at Rebecca. We
8:26
Speaker 1: hadn't seen Rebecca in almost nine months, never was able
8:29
Speaker 1: to talk to her all this time. They kept her
8:32
Speaker 1: totally away from us. But yeah, I kept looking at
8:35
Speaker 1: her and I just smiled, and every once in a while,
8:38
Speaker 1: she would look over and and didn't say anything. Mister
8:43
Speaker 1: Ban Sicklin told Connie's that whatever you do, do not cry,
8:47
Speaker 1: do not cry. And we were sitting there first time
8:50
Speaker 1: we've seen her and Nancy. It was the hardest thing
8:52
Speaker 1: in the world to just sit there like a bump
8:55
Speaker 1: on the log with no emotion that. It was amazing.
8:58
Speaker 1: I'll tell you what. It was amazing watching her. I
9:02
Speaker 1: don't know, I can't even explain it. And when she
9:06
Speaker 1: said that what she's telling you, they flipped out and
9:10
Speaker 1: it was unbelievable. You could see it in the jury
9:13
Speaker 1: space every one where like Glance olvera while she was talking,
9:15
Speaker 1: and then mister Benn stickling around lawyer. It was pretty
9:19
Speaker 1: obvious that Captain he talked to her. It was an
9:22
Speaker 1: unbelievable She had them wrapped around her little figure. Becky
9:28
Speaker 1: wanted for though all of us. I'm telling you, Rebecca,
9:31
Speaker 1: she was the trooper, a four years old, the boy.
9:33
Speaker 1: It was amusing. Connie Robertson, pastor Robbie Robertson's wife, do
9:40
Speaker 1: you remember the moment your daughter took the stand and said,
9:44
Speaker 1: this did not happen. Yeah, what happened, Connie, right now
9:50
Speaker 1: I'm quiet, so me too. And I wasn't even there.
9:56
Speaker 1: Tell me what happened. Well, when she began to sing
10:02
Speaker 1: her ABC song, I thought I would die. I thought
10:08
Speaker 1: I would never hear my child again, or a Walter
10:15
Speaker 1: birth in my arm, and I just I wanted to cry,
10:22
Speaker 1: but Boss said don't cry. So I knew that if
10:26
Speaker 1: I looked her in the eye, I would cry it.
10:32
Speaker 1: When when when mister when mister van Sick, when started
10:37
Speaker 1: cross examining Rebecca and he says, you know truth from
10:41
Speaker 1: a line, Becky obviously yes, and you know your ABC's
10:46
Speaker 1: and she says, yes, I do, and he says, help
10:50
Speaker 1: let me hear it. And well, Becky goes, well, pehead,
10:55
Speaker 1: becky 's your show, do it. I just started seeing
11:00
Speaker 1: in my ABC's just happy, go lucky as can give
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Speaker 1: me this a b CD E F that one yea yeah,
11:10
Speaker 1: that one. Yeah, that was it. And when mister van Sicken,
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Speaker 1: I was talking to Bob yesterday, as a matter of fact,
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Speaker 1: our attorney yesterday, and he said, when he looked and
11:20
Speaker 1: watched that jury, when she said that, that right there
11:25
Speaker 1: was what totally totally took that jury. They just wanted
11:28
Speaker 1: to run over and grabbed Rebecca and hugger. But he said,
11:32
Speaker 1: that's what absolutely just quenched it for us and destroyed
11:37
Speaker 1: the prosecutors and what they had done. Take a listen
11:40
Speaker 1: to this. They handed the judge Chip Small the verdict,
11:50
Speaker 1: and they said on discount, not guilty, on discount not
11:56
Speaker 1: guilty through twenty sometimes not guilty, not guilty. And they said,
12:01
Speaker 1: is that the verdict of the jury. And the jury
12:06
Speaker 1: head of the jury stood up and said, yes, your honor,
12:09
Speaker 1: that's what it is. And so I sat down and
12:12
Speaker 1: lifted my hands and praise the Lord, my husband. But
12:20
Speaker 1: I thought he was going to pass out, and I
12:23
Speaker 1: stood up to hold him up because I thought he
12:25
Speaker 1: was going to fall. And anyway, the crowd went wild
12:31
Speaker 1: more or less, you know, because it was not guilty.
12:38
Speaker 1: You were hearing the reactions to a not guilty verdict
12:45
Speaker 1: for Pastor Roberson and his wife Connie to Rebecca Osborne,
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Speaker 1: their daughter. Can you remember the moment that you guys
12:58
Speaker 1: were reunited? I did, Yes, I do. It was actually
13:03
Speaker 1: just a few days, if I remember correctly, before Christmas.
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Speaker 1: Um and I would get my aunt and uncle's house,
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Speaker 1: and I remember it was kind of later at night
13:14
Speaker 1: and they came through the door and I just jumped
13:20
Speaker 1: in board and I was just so happy. I mean,
13:26
Speaker 1: I didn't even cry. I wasn't even sad, I wasn't
13:29
Speaker 1: even upset. I was just so happy to see by Paris.
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Speaker 1: It was just happy, pure joy, pure joy. Crime Stories
13:53
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. Oh, you're talking about the so called
13:59
Speaker 1: when Natchi witch hunt and the way it has devastated lives.
14:06
Speaker 1: I want to go to who I now considered to
14:09
Speaker 1: be friends, the Doggett family, Amber, Sam John Carrol, and
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Speaker 1: Mark Amber. How has being forced to give testimony, to
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Speaker 1: give a statement against your mother and father, landing them
14:30
Speaker 1: behind bars? How has that affected your life? First of all,
14:36
Speaker 1: let me ask you this, did your parents ever molest you? No, Nancy,
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Speaker 1: they did not. And what happened the night that I
14:50
Speaker 1: was interrogated by Tim Abbey and Ball Perez is Immediately
14:54
Speaker 1: after that interrogation, my little sister, Megan and I were
14:58
Speaker 1: placed in foster care and Bob Pryce went to our
15:03
Speaker 1: home and arrest my parents. And for a large majority
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Speaker 1: of my life since that moment, I carried the guilt
15:13
Speaker 1: of my parents being arrested, and I blamed myself for
15:19
Speaker 1: the whole thing. And if I just would have been
15:21
Speaker 1: strong and told the truth that night, then none of
15:25
Speaker 1: us would have ever happened, and my family would have
15:27
Speaker 1: stayed together. I disagree, Amber, As much as I have
15:32
Speaker 1: grown to care for you, I disagree, Tom Grant. I
15:37
Speaker 1: don't think anything would have stopped her parents getting arrested,
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Speaker 1: not even the truth. Now we can see looking back
15:46
Speaker 1: that the truth did not stop things. They refused to
15:50
Speaker 1: listen to anybody who told them the truth, and they
15:53
Speaker 1: kept pressuring people until they told the police and CBS
15:58
Speaker 1: got the lies that they wanted. And just want to
16:00
Speaker 1: say that these two families were great families and great
16:05
Speaker 1: families before this happened. That they were destroyed by what
16:09
Speaker 1: Child Protective Services then when actually police did to them.
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Speaker 1: And I'm so sad that that happened. Amber. Your life
16:16
Speaker 1: has been altered like everyone's because of this, the guilt
16:22
Speaker 1: of thinking as a little girl you somehow sent your
16:28
Speaker 1: parents to jail. You do know it wasn't you, correct,
16:32
Speaker 1: You do know you were just a tool of someone
16:36
Speaker 1: else using you. I do know that, Nancy, and I
16:39
Speaker 1: do understand that I was manipulated and used, But I
16:43
Speaker 1: still felt guilty for a long time, and that guilt
16:46
Speaker 1: did the too addiction and very poor health choices, very
16:51
Speaker 1: poor relationship choices, and I was a miserable human being
16:55
Speaker 1: for a long time. And it's taken a lot of
16:58
Speaker 1: work to pull myself out of that and to a
17:01
Speaker 1: lot of hours in therapy and to finally be able
17:06
Speaker 1: to accept, um, you know what what happened to me?
17:10
Speaker 1: And I think it's also important to understand, Nancy, is
17:13
Speaker 1: that those five years that I was in the system,
17:15
Speaker 1: I was being treated. I was in therapy that that
17:18
Speaker 1: entire time, and I was being treated for trauma that
17:21
Speaker 1: never occurred, And the trauma that was occurring during those
17:26
Speaker 1: five years was being dismissed, ignored, and um and completely
17:33
Speaker 1: uh just brushed aside as if as if none of
17:37
Speaker 1: the trauma I was experiencing was happening. I was being gaslighted,
17:43
Speaker 1: and so I was being treated for a trauma that
17:45
Speaker 1: didn't occur, while my trauma that I was experiencing was
17:49
Speaker 1: being ignored, and that had a very large impact on
17:53
Speaker 1: how I was able to deal with things as an adult.
17:57
Speaker 1: To your sister, Sam, Sam, how did your part and
18:04
Speaker 1: this witch hunt affect to you the rest of your life?
18:10
Speaker 1: I felt guilt in a different way. I felt guilty.
18:14
Speaker 1: I never said that my parents had ever did anything
18:18
Speaker 1: to me, but I felt guilty that because I ran away,
18:23
Speaker 1: I had the easy way out. I took the easy
18:25
Speaker 1: way out. I didn't stay in the system. I wasn't
18:29
Speaker 1: abused by the system because I ran away, so I
18:33
Speaker 1: didn't have to deal with the trauma and the abuse
18:36
Speaker 1: that my siblings did by being stuck in that system.
18:40
Speaker 1: And so the guilt I felt was because I took
18:43
Speaker 1: the easy way out. And I still I still feel
18:47
Speaker 1: that today. I feel I feel really bad that it's
18:51
Speaker 1: just it's very disheart to mean that my siblings had
18:55
Speaker 1: to go through that in a system that's supposed to
18:57
Speaker 1: protect children, and I had to run away and essentially
19:01
Speaker 1: live on the streets just to get away from it.
19:04
Speaker 1: You know, it sounds a lot like survivor's guilt. The
19:08
Speaker 1: one person that didn't, for instance, die in the car
19:12
Speaker 1: crash or the one person that escaped from the house fire,
19:16
Speaker 1: you somehow feel guilty, like it's your fault what happened
19:20
Speaker 1: to the others. Hey, who was just jumping in? That's smart?
19:24
Speaker 1: Jump in, Mark and everybody, if you're listening or watching
19:27
Speaker 1: right now, Mark and Carol are Amber, Sam and John's parents.
19:31
Speaker 1: Go ahead, Mark, Yeah, Sam, Pine crist that's abuse. I
19:39
Speaker 1: hear you, Sam, Sam didn't escape everything. Sam, tell me
19:43
Speaker 1: when you decided to run away, where were you and
19:47
Speaker 1: how old were you when you ran away from all
19:49
Speaker 1: of this? I was sixteen, I had only been in
19:52
Speaker 1: the system for a few months, and I was I
19:56
Speaker 1: believe I was in a foster home, and I just
19:58
Speaker 1: I finally just had enough. Just kept lying to me.
20:01
Speaker 1: They wouldn't allow me to go to school. They wouldn't
20:03
Speaker 1: allow me to I had put myself on independent study.
20:06
Speaker 1: They wouldn't allow me to turn in my homework. They
20:10
Speaker 1: kept lying to me about my siblings. In what way?
20:13
Speaker 1: What were the lies? Well, they told me that my
20:16
Speaker 1: sisters were very mad at me. They wanted me to
20:18
Speaker 1: tell the truth. They were very upset with me, and
20:23
Speaker 1: it hurt my heart. It hurt my heart that my sisters,
20:27
Speaker 1: my siblings would be upset with me. And I just
20:31
Speaker 1: didn't understand why they kept lying to me, and they
20:33
Speaker 1: just kept saying, you know, like everybody else says. They
20:35
Speaker 1: just kept saying, we know your parents did this to you,
20:37
Speaker 1: we know your dad raped you. Why don't you just
20:39
Speaker 1: admit it? And it just disgusted me when you ran away, Sam,
20:43
Speaker 1: where did you go? I bounced around a lot. I
20:46
Speaker 1: went to various family friends, homes, family members, friends I
20:53
Speaker 1: met along the way. I just moved around a lot.
20:56
Speaker 1: And how long were you basically on the run until
20:59
Speaker 1: I turned eighteen two years? And then I didn't have
21:03
Speaker 1: to run anymore. And that whole time you did not
21:05
Speaker 1: see your parents. No, when I ran away, I stuck visits.
21:14
Speaker 1: I can't believe that having to snake visits with your
21:17
Speaker 1: mother and father. I mean sometimes I literally count the
21:21
Speaker 1: hours so I can pick the twins up from school.
21:24
Speaker 1: I can't imagine sneaking visits with them. Jump in. This
21:30
Speaker 1: is Carrol, and I do remember one time we got
21:33
Speaker 1: Mark and I got a phone call saying that Sam
21:37
Speaker 1: wanted to see us before she left town. And he
21:40
Speaker 1: this friend had arranged a secret meeting between us up
21:45
Speaker 1: in the mountain that somebody's cabin, and so Mark and
21:48
Speaker 1: I drove up there late at night. It was scary,
21:51
Speaker 1: like literally, we were so afraid that we would get caught,
21:55
Speaker 1: and we were just out on bond. Bond I think
21:59
Speaker 1: it was before sentencing, and so we were getting ready
22:03
Speaker 1: to go, you know, we were going to be sent
22:05
Speaker 1: to prison, and Sam was on the run, and here
22:07
Speaker 1: we were having this this late night, surreptitious meeting up
22:13
Speaker 1: in some cabin in the woods, just scared that we
22:17
Speaker 1: were going to get caught, and just hugging and you know,
22:21
Speaker 1: like just trying to cling to each other as long
22:23
Speaker 1: as we could until we were all separated again. When
22:26
Speaker 1: you heard the verdict, Carol, what happened? What went through
22:34
Speaker 1: your mind? I was furious, literally furious, and I just
22:37
Speaker 1: wanted to scream at the jury because we were convicted
22:41
Speaker 1: on Megan, the only child that hadn't even made any
22:44
Speaker 1: accusations against us until after trial started, and we were
22:49
Speaker 1: expecting for her to do what Rebecca did, get up
22:52
Speaker 1: on the stand and tell the truth, because she had
22:55
Speaker 1: not made any accusations against us, but after the trial started,
22:59
Speaker 1: they had gotten to her because she had had a
23:02
Speaker 1: coposcopic examination that showed she had a notch on her
23:05
Speaker 1: hymen and a notches and evidence of abuse at all.
23:09
Speaker 1: But they told her that it was they convinced her.
23:12
Speaker 1: They convinced her after the trial started that she had
23:15
Speaker 1: been abused and if she would just say it, on
23:18
Speaker 1: the witness stand. If she would just say that she
23:20
Speaker 1: had been abused, then we would get treatment. That's what
23:24
Speaker 1: they told her. Her parents would get treatment for six
23:26
Speaker 1: months and then she could go home. And this little
23:29
Speaker 1: girl wanted to go home so badly that she had
23:33
Speaker 1: run away from her foster parents at one point, trying
23:36
Speaker 1: to chase a friend down the street to get her
23:40
Speaker 1: to take her home. Like Megan had literally climbed into
23:43
Speaker 1: a friend's van and begged her to go home. That's
23:47
Speaker 1: how badly she wanted to go home. And they got
23:49
Speaker 1: her to finally cave in and say that we had
23:54
Speaker 1: touched her between the lakes. When she got up on
23:56
Speaker 1: the witness stand. I was devastated, And so when we
23:58
Speaker 1: were convicted by the jury, I just wanted to scream
24:01
Speaker 1: at them. I just wanted to scream, don't you see
24:04
Speaker 1: what you've done? Like, didn't you believe her when she
24:07
Speaker 1: said she wanted to go home and that she didn't
24:09
Speaker 1: remember until after they had just there. There's a word
24:14
Speaker 1: for this what they did to those kids, manipulation, showing
24:17
Speaker 1: them those dirty books, and it's called grooming. That's what
24:20
Speaker 1: they did. They were the offenders, they were the abusers.
24:24
Speaker 1: And they groomed these kids and it's it's the most
24:28
Speaker 1: horrible thing I could imagine in life. Robbie, here, Nancy.
24:32
Speaker 1: The thing that made the difference between Megan and Rebecca
24:35
Speaker 1: was one person, their attorney, mister Van Sicklin, had an
24:41
Speaker 1: opportunity to speak to Rebecca just before she went on
24:45
Speaker 1: the witness man and mister Van Sicklin more or less
24:48
Speaker 1: kind of just had a good rapport and it was obvious.
24:53
Speaker 1: Bob told us that he had a good visit with
24:55
Speaker 1: her and he was hoping things would go right. And
24:58
Speaker 1: I can tell you with all the people, I mean,
25:00
Speaker 1: I talked to all the kids, that all the family,
25:02
Speaker 1: and that's why a lot of the lawsuits that were
25:04
Speaker 1: settled afterwards were against public defenders, and money was obtained
25:08
Speaker 1: by some of these folks because they didn't have a defense.
25:11
Speaker 1: None of these attorneys bothered to I guarantee you Mark
25:15
Speaker 1: and Carol Dogget's attorney did not go and sit with
25:17
Speaker 1: Megan and say, Megan, this is really important, your mom
25:20
Speaker 1: and dad really love you, and blah blah blah. I
25:21
Speaker 1: can guarantee you that did not happen. And I'll bet
25:24
Speaker 1: you Mark and Carroll will actually validate that. Speaking of
25:28
Speaker 1: Carol and Mark dogget the mother and father who really
25:33
Speaker 1: bore a brunt of this. Mark, can you remember when
25:37
Speaker 1: the jury verdict was announced, what happened? What went through
25:40
Speaker 1: your mind? You're already in la la land because this
25:45
Speaker 1: shouldn't all be happening, and then it was just unreal.
25:50
Speaker 1: I don't I was probably in shock to some extent
25:55
Speaker 1: because I remember they say the sentence in the yeah,
26:02
Speaker 1: the verdict. It was like unbelievable. But I still believe that,
26:07
Speaker 1: you know, nothing happened. So eventually this has got to
26:10
Speaker 1: be cleared up. Crime stories. With Nancy Grace joining me,
26:29
Speaker 1: is John Doggett, this is Carol and Mark's son. John,
26:35
Speaker 1: tell me your story what happened? And Nancy, that's a
26:40
Speaker 1: that's a big question. A lot happened, um, a lot.
26:46
Speaker 1: Like my sister Amber, I carried the guilt because I
26:51
Speaker 1: sat on the witness stand looking at my parents and
26:56
Speaker 1: and said they did things to me that I knew weren't.
27:00
Speaker 1: I stared at the ground and told the lies that
27:07
Speaker 1: I had been groomed to tell, and knowing that that's
27:12
Speaker 1: one of the things, well, now I know that it
27:15
Speaker 1: didn't send them to prison. But at the time, I mean,
27:18
Speaker 1: this was front page news every day in our town.
27:22
Speaker 1: I was going to school. I just I sent my
27:27
Speaker 1: parents to prison, and living with that has been hard
27:31
Speaker 1: ever since. It's it's a horrible way to live with
27:39
Speaker 1: that guilt from such a young age. Do you remember
27:42
Speaker 1: looking at your parents during the trial? Briefly when I
27:46
Speaker 1: when I first got in and sat on the witness stand,
27:48
Speaker 1: I looked at them and I actually remember thinking that
27:53
Speaker 1: my dad was my mom's lawyer, because he had shaved
27:56
Speaker 1: so that he could look presentable in court and not
28:00
Speaker 1: like himself, and I didn't even recognize him. How long
28:04
Speaker 1: How long had you been apart? Oh, at that time
28:07
Speaker 1: it had been months already. I don't remember exactly how
28:12
Speaker 1: long it was. Let me ask you a question. How
28:14
Speaker 1: old was Megan was she was put on the stand?
28:17
Speaker 1: She was nine? But nine? Yeah, guys, take a listen
28:22
Speaker 1: to this. And then one day, while we were in prison,
28:27
Speaker 1: we got word that Sam was in a terrible car
28:29
Speaker 1: accident in California and she was injured and she was
28:35
Speaker 1: in a coma, and I was frantic. I remember strapping in.
28:47
Speaker 1: I remember driving a little bit, and it was rainy
28:50
Speaker 1: and stormy and that's it. So as you were hearing, Sam,
28:57
Speaker 1: isn't a crash a horrible crash? Can you imagine being
29:00
Speaker 1: behind bars and you find out you're a girl, the
29:05
Speaker 1: one that you risked everything for the secret meeting in
29:09
Speaker 1: a mountain cabin while you're out on bond and you
29:12
Speaker 1: swore you wouldn't get in touch with your children, but
29:15
Speaker 1: you want to see you're so bad and hold her
29:17
Speaker 1: one more time? You do it anyway, that daughter horrible crash.
29:23
Speaker 1: Listen to this. She won an insurance settlement after that accident.
29:30
Speaker 1: That accident was a miracle. It honestly was a miracle.
29:37
Speaker 1: Sam got the settlement money and I was like, don't
29:39
Speaker 1: spend it on us, So why don't mom to stop.
29:41
Speaker 1: I'm getting you out. That's what's good for me. And
29:44
Speaker 1: I was like, what's good for you? This is good
29:47
Speaker 1: for me getting my parents back. I was like okay,
29:51
Speaker 1: And the next thing I know, she was hiring us
29:55
Speaker 1: an Appellet attorney from New York. Sam, you're in this
29:59
Speaker 1: horrible crash, and guys, I want to remind you of
30:02
Speaker 1: something for the Robertson family, they are still struggling horribly
30:11
Speaker 1: in so many ways. There is a PayPal for them
30:16
Speaker 1: Robertson Recovery PayPal. You can go to Robertson at telvar
30:22
Speaker 1: dot com. I want to go back to Sam Dogget.
30:27
Speaker 1: You have the crash, you lived through the crash, you
30:32
Speaker 1: get an assurance settlement. How did you decide? No question,
30:38
Speaker 1: You're using the money to get your parents out of
30:40
Speaker 1: jail if that can be done. Like you said, there
30:43
Speaker 1: was no question about it. As soon as I found
30:46
Speaker 1: out that I was receiving this sum of money, I
30:49
Speaker 1: was like, yes, I didn't get my parents out. I'm
30:51
Speaker 1: going to hire a real attorney and get my parents out.
30:55
Speaker 1: And I did not go to the state of Washington.
30:57
Speaker 1: There was no way in heck I was letting that happen.
31:01
Speaker 1: And I did not go to the state of Washington.
31:03
Speaker 1: There was no way in heck I was letting that happen.
31:07
Speaker 1: You know, I'm really overwhelmed. Carol, Guys, Carol is Sam's mom.
31:13
Speaker 1: Carol says she tells her daughter, don't spend it on me.
31:20
Speaker 1: Don't you know a mother's love, Carol, There's nothing like it.
31:27
Speaker 1: Is there? Oh no, no, there's nothing like it. I
31:31
Speaker 1: love my children more than anybody on the planet. And
31:36
Speaker 1: and I just I just always want what's best for them. Seriously,
31:40
Speaker 1: I have to say that, um, that I didn't want
31:44
Speaker 1: Sam to spend the money on me. I wanted her
31:46
Speaker 1: to get herself, you know, started in life. And I
31:50
Speaker 1: knew that I would get out of prison eventually. And um,
31:53
Speaker 1: but when she did make the decision to hire an attorney,
31:58
Speaker 1: told me about it afterwards, she said, I hired this attorney,
32:01
Speaker 1: and I was. I was so proud of her. And
32:05
Speaker 1: it wasn't because she was getting me out. Is because
32:09
Speaker 1: she would do that with her money, that she would
32:11
Speaker 1: spend her money to get an innocent woman, her mom
32:14
Speaker 1: out of prison. And I was just really proud of her.
32:17
Speaker 1: I just thought she was so generous and and and
32:21
Speaker 1: beautiful and that she that she loved me that much,
32:26
Speaker 1: and it just really it was it was a beautiful
32:28
Speaker 1: thing for her to do, and it worked. He did
32:30
Speaker 1: get us out. Take a listen to this. I wheeled
32:34
Speaker 1: out with all of my possessions and I was out
32:36
Speaker 1: of there. I'm happy to be out. Other nearby prisoners
32:43
Speaker 1: were yelling to Mark, we see your wife. We see
32:48
Speaker 1: your wife. She's out. She's out. You're gonna be out,
32:52
Speaker 1: You're gonna be out. I'm going to be reunited with
32:55
Speaker 1: my husband and my children, and I'm very happy to
32:59
Speaker 1: be released. You walk out the gate, you know, and
33:05
Speaker 1: there's all cameras and all this stuff. Yeah it's bizarre. Yeah,
33:12
Speaker 1: you know, it's the beginning of the second phase. And
33:15
Speaker 1: we got our freedom. Now we get our kids. Time
33:31
Speaker 1: stories with Nancy Grace. I'm happy to be out. Other
33:38
Speaker 1: nearby prisoners were yelling to Mark, we see your wife.
33:44
Speaker 1: We see your wife. She's out, she's out. You're gonna
33:48
Speaker 1: be out, You're gonna be out. I'm gonna be reunited
33:51
Speaker 1: with my husband and my children, and I'm very happy
33:55
Speaker 1: to be released. You walk out the gate, you know,
34:01
Speaker 1: there's all cameras and all this stuff. Yeah it's bizarre. Yeah,
34:08
Speaker 1: you know, it's the beginning of the second phase. You
34:12
Speaker 1: we got our freedom, Now we get our kids. It
34:14
Speaker 1: wasn't that easy getting their children back. Guys, you've heard
34:20
Speaker 1: about Megan, Megan who took the stand at just nine
34:26
Speaker 1: years old. I want you to take a listen to
34:29
Speaker 1: our cut thirty three. Unfortunately, Megan came out of things
34:34
Speaker 1: very confused. Megan was our younger sister and she was
34:40
Speaker 1: nine at the time that my parents were arrested. She
34:47
Speaker 1: finally got to a point where she felt safe enough
34:55
Speaker 1: to tell the truth. Megan bro a letter to this
35:02
Speaker 1: teacher that she trusted and recanted. She said that she
35:13
Speaker 1: had never been abused by her parents. Every time a
35:20
Speaker 1: child told the truth, they got in trouble, almost without exception.
35:30
Speaker 1: After Megan recanted in that letter, her foster parents kicked
35:37
Speaker 1: her out of their house. The repercussions that Megan faced
35:48
Speaker 1: after recanting were so severe that she quickly went back
35:58
Speaker 1: to saying that she had been abused um and and
36:04
Speaker 1: she stuck with that. To Tom Grant, the co executive
36:07
Speaker 1: producer of In the Valley of Sin, what repercussions did
36:12
Speaker 1: this little nine year old girl face when she writes
36:16
Speaker 1: a letter to the teacher saying this never happened to me.
36:20
Speaker 1: She's living in a home with foster parents who have
36:24
Speaker 1: who thrive and because and rewarded, because she's of sexual abuse,
36:32
Speaker 1: and when she when she recants, you know, it undermines
36:36
Speaker 1: their whole belief about her and everything, and they can't
36:39
Speaker 1: just accept her as a person, and so they have to,
36:43
Speaker 1: you know, punish her. And it's the system punishes her
36:47
Speaker 1: because they feel it well, if these foster parents weren't
36:50
Speaker 1: maintaining the the you know, their version of the truth,
36:54
Speaker 1: and then she must there must be something wrong with them.
36:58
Speaker 1: So you understand how the round has punished every time
37:02
Speaker 1: that the system finds some kind of disappointment. And this
37:07
Speaker 1: is tremendously troubling because our system should be there to
37:11
Speaker 1: protect the children, and instead they're harming them and causing
37:17
Speaker 1: them immense amounts of pain and trauma. And I just
37:21
Speaker 1: this is this is Amer speaking, and I just need
37:25
Speaker 1: to jump in here because it is more insidious than
37:27
Speaker 1: that Nancy. The foster home that she was at. I
37:30
Speaker 1: lived in that home with her for a short amount
37:32
Speaker 1: of time after our parents were sentenced and sent away
37:34
Speaker 1: to prison, and I the father, and that foster home
37:39
Speaker 1: was a state trooper and friends with many police officers.
37:43
Speaker 1: They would have police officers over to their house for barbecues.
37:47
Speaker 1: We you know, they socialized with Bob Perez. And I
37:53
Speaker 1: ran away from that foster home. And when they picked
37:58
Speaker 1: me up and brought me back, and they asked me
38:00
Speaker 1: why I had run away, I told them that it
38:02
Speaker 1: was because I hated Bile Perez, and they immediately threw
38:06
Speaker 1: me out of their house and said, I don't want
38:08
Speaker 1: this girl in my house anymore. And so it's not
38:14
Speaker 1: just that that Megan, you know, their excuse for kicking
38:19
Speaker 1: Megan out of the house was that she had led
38:22
Speaker 1: to them and all of that, But it was it
38:25
Speaker 1: was very, very obviously eight years earlier, and they were
38:32
Speaker 1: they were in close ties with the police officers involved
38:37
Speaker 1: in the case. I'm just thinking about my own children
38:39
Speaker 1: at age nine and how tender and naive and innocent
38:45
Speaker 1: they were at nine and still are at thirteen. This
38:49
Speaker 1: nine year old girl tries to tell her teacher I
38:52
Speaker 1: was never molested. She's immediately she's already been torn away
38:56
Speaker 1: from her parents, groomed. Then she gets it thrown out
39:01
Speaker 1: of the foster home because she's trying to recant her stories.
39:06
Speaker 1: Almost too much for a child to undergo. And I'm
39:10
Speaker 1: heartbroken to state that Megan was never the same after that.
39:16
Speaker 1: Listen never did get her back as Megan. They were
39:20
Speaker 1: able to pretty much completely brainwash her to the point
39:24
Speaker 1: where she didn't know if she had been abused or not.
39:30
Speaker 1: She never called me mom again, never threw her arms
39:34
Speaker 1: around my neck, she never bonded again. It pretty much
39:42
Speaker 1: broke me and to make matters worse, there will never
39:50
Speaker 1: be a chance to fix it. Listen, I got a
39:55
Speaker 1: phone call out of the blue one afternoon that Megan
39:58
Speaker 1: had an accident. She was swimming with a youth group.
40:06
Speaker 1: She was twenty one, and a couple of the younger
40:10
Speaker 1: girls that they were with started drowning, so Megan jumped
40:14
Speaker 1: in to rescue them. The two girls were okay, and
40:21
Speaker 1: Megan ended up dying. I had to call my dad
40:33
Speaker 1: and my sisters and told them that she was dead.
40:49
Speaker 1: They felt very, very strong feeling inside. Megan killed me.
41:08
Speaker 1: She knew a good truthful to Sam Dogge, the daughter
41:12
Speaker 1: that ran away Sam. When you look back on what
41:19
Speaker 1: Megan endured, the fact that she never rebonded with her parents,
41:24
Speaker 1: she didn't know whether she had been molested or not molested.
41:29
Speaker 1: The years she spent in foster being told over and
41:33
Speaker 1: over and over, this happened to you, this happened to you.
41:35
Speaker 1: Kicked out when she tried to recant, and now she's
41:40
Speaker 1: gone and it can never be fixed. It's just so
41:49
Speaker 1: hard to take in. I want to hear your thoughts.
41:55
Speaker 1: It's heartbreaking. It's heartbreaking and infuriating that they took her
42:01
Speaker 1: from us and we'll never get the chance in this
42:05
Speaker 1: lifetime to have our Megan back. She was our Megan,
42:10
Speaker 1: she was our baby. We all loved her. She was
42:13
Speaker 1: the youngest. And it disgusts me and just makes me
42:18
Speaker 1: so mad what they did to her, how they messed
42:21
Speaker 1: with her mind and her memories and her heart to
42:25
Speaker 1: turn her against us like that. It just makes me sick.
42:28
Speaker 1: Carol Dogget the mom When you think about Megan, now,
42:38
Speaker 1: how do you feel? What do you think? It might
42:42
Speaker 1: sound kind of crazy, but I just I can't stop
42:47
Speaker 1: trying to bond with her. You know, I have pictures
42:51
Speaker 1: of her everywhere, and I have her artwork, and I
42:55
Speaker 1: just I'm looking at one of her pictures right now
43:00
Speaker 1: and I just always I just want her with me.
43:05
Speaker 1: And um, and I asked if she'll come to me
43:10
Speaker 1: in dreams, and I just I would do anything to
43:12
Speaker 1: see her again. Does she come to you in dreams?
43:16
Speaker 1: She has, Actually she has a couple of times. What
43:20
Speaker 1: happened and um, and she's been she's been happy and uh,
43:24
Speaker 1: and acts just normal, you know, like bringing in the
43:27
Speaker 1: groceries and it's and it's just normal. And I wake
43:30
Speaker 1: up I wake up feeling very very happy like she
43:35
Speaker 1: has reached out to me and that and that she
43:38
Speaker 1: does still have a connection. What about e Mark. Oh,
43:42
Speaker 1: I'm I'm convinced. I had a moment that at the
43:47
Speaker 1: end uh Megan's wake, it was pretty much over, and
43:54
Speaker 1: I was sitting in my friend's backyard and I felt,
44:03
Speaker 1: I felt made and I felt she was tom me
44:10
Speaker 1: She's okay. So all hold onto that. And it's much
44:22
Speaker 1: like Carl said, she's she's reaching out, she knows, she's
44:26
Speaker 1: letting us know she's okay, and we'll see her again,
44:30
Speaker 1: God willing. When an injustice occurs, the wake it leaves
44:43
Speaker 1: behind never ends. Nancy Grace Crime Story, signing off Goodbye friend,